January 2, 2025 • 24 mins
In this episode of the Play Therapy Parenting Podcast, I respond to an insightful email from Laura in the UK, who is navigating challenges with her 10-year-old son. Laura shares concerns about his lack of intrinsic motivation, his struggle with self-worth, and their morning routine battles. I explain how to encourage intrinsic motivation by using neutral encouragement paired with reflective statements, and how to avoid praise, which can often backfire.
For improving self-worth, I discuss strategies like coupling affirmations with validations and addressing the internal dialogue that drives resistance. Finally, I outline a step-by-step approach to transforming the morning routine, using choices tied to immediate, meaningful consequences. This episode offers practical, actionable tips for empowering children while building their confidence and autonomy.
Ask Me Questions: Call (813) 812-5525, or email: brenna@thekidcounselor.com
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Common References:
Landreth, G.L. (2023). Play Therapy: The Art of the Relationship (4th ed.). Routledge.
Bratton, S. C., Landreth, G. L., Kellam, T., & Blackard, S. R. (2006). Child parent relationship therapy (CPRT) treatment manual: A 10-session filial therapy model for training parents. Routledge/Taylor & Francis Group.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:02):
You're listening to the
Play Therapy Parenting Podcast with Dr. Brenna Hicks.
Hi,
I'm Dr. Brenna Hicks,
The Kid Counselor.
This is the Play Therapy Parenting Podcast where I give you insight,
awareness,
and enlightenment about your parenting
and your relationship with your kids.
In today's episode,
I am answering a question from Laura in the UK.
(00:24):
Laura,
thank you for emailing and hello from across the pond.
And Laura's question is about
how to help her son find his own motivation.
A really helpful question.
I'm really glad that you
wrote in Laura.
And so I'll read part of her email
together and then we'll dive in.
(00:44):
Before I do that,
if you would like to email me with your questions or
comments or a hello,
a greeting of sorts.
brenna@thekidcounselor.com is my email address.
I do check all of my own email.
I get a lot of questions about,
do you have someone that filters them or vets them or aggregates them in some way.
(01:04):
They all come directly to me and I do read
every single one and I do respond to everyone.
So if you would like to reach out to me,
I would love to hear from you.
And you can also leave a voicemail on our line if you're in the states,
which is 813-812-5525.
You can leave me a message and then I can respond
in an episode that way as well.
(01:26):
OK,
so let's read parts of Laura's email and then we'll dive in.
I'm fairly new to your podcast and I'm so grateful to have found it.
Our son has had it much harder than our daughter
in a way he educated us
that we needed to do better for him.
So consequently,
our daughter entered the world to parents who were more aware.
(01:46):
What we're struggling with now is the legacy we created
before we began thinking about how we were parenting.
Our son,
who is 10,
is almost allergic to us directing him in any way.
He does not have intrinsic motivation for self-care
or anything he doesn't want to do.
It has been a major challenge for him to get to sleep since he was 3,
and he's very reluctant to get out of bed in the mornings.
(02:09):
I've begun to reflect feelings,
give choices and limits if necessary,
and sometimes it helps,
but sometimes he doesn't seem to be listening.
The thing that he kicks back about at times is encouragement.
It almost seems as if he's cringing.
I guess my questions are how can I help him find his own motivation,
improve his self-worth in a way that doesn't make him cringe,
(02:30):
and change the mornings.
Currently we have to tickle him awake as the alarm just gets switched off.
We have to keep coming back to check if he's up,
which usually he isn't.
Sometimes put his clothes out on his bed,
remind him about every stage of getting ready.
We're doing far too much,
but if we don't,
he just stays in bed.
I hope that you can help us navigate this.
(02:51):
OK,
Laura,
thank you so much and this is something that I think all of us
face.
It's not always a bedtime or a morning routine,
but I think all of us as parents face a scenario where it's just the constant battle.
So I think this is going to be really helpful.
And then to talk about
his own motivation and improving his self-worth,
also really relevant for all of us.
(03:13):
So thank you so much for the email,
Laura.
OK,
so let's dive in.
Laura,
you mentioned that you have started reflecting feelings,
giving choices,
and providing limits,
and then
the thing that he pushes back about is encouragement.
So,
for those of you that might be new to the podcast,
for those of you that have only listened to a couple of episodes,
What Laura just described were the four pillars of child-centered play therapy.
(03:35):
So if you are not familiar with the foundational components of
this child-centered play therapy approach to your parenting,
I would encourage you to go back and listen to season 1 episodes,
and if at the very least,
go back and start at the beginning of season
2 because it really does serve as the foundation
for everything about which we're going to talk
(03:57):
and it's just helpful to make sure that
you understand the undergirdings and the philosophy behind
these skills and why we use them.
So Laura,
I'm really encouraged to hear that you have been using the four pillars.
To answer your first question,
how do you help him find his own motivation?
An internal locus of control,
(04:18):
and an internal source of motivation
comes from a child
that has been encouraged.
And I understand that you're saying he's kicking back on encouragement.
Here's what I think is probably going on.
When a child pushes back against encouragement.
There's usually a couple of potential reasons or sometimes a combination thereof.
(04:41):
One is
the way that it's delivered.
In other words,
The child is struggling with something,
working on something,
and in an attempt to encourage,
we say you can do it.
But they have been struggling for 5 minutes,
and that feels dismissive and ignorant in their mind.
(05:02):
What I mean by that is.
In their head,
they can't do it.
They've already been trying and failing.
And so to have someone say you can do it,
their perception is,
no,
I can't.
Have you not seen that I've been trying to do this for 5 minutes and it isn't working.
So sometimes it's in the presentation and the delivery,
because if we say an encouragement phrase
(05:24):
and it doesn't seem to pair up with the child's experience,
that is irritating to them.
So that's one consideration.
The second is,
he has such a low sense of self-worth and identity and self-esteem.
That
his
internal mantra and his internal self talk
is so negatively skewed.
(05:47):
That someone saying something positive about him.
Seems like
a lie.
In other words,
if all day long,
all I say to myself is you're dumb,
you're stupid,
you're ugly,
you have no idea what you're doing,
you're always a failure,
you're such an idiot,
whatever,
if those are the kinds of things that he's internally,
and I'm not saying that he is,
I'm just trying to paint a picture.
If you have that kind of mentality about yourself,
(06:09):
if someone says
you'll figure that out.
It's so foreign to them
that it seems like an untruth,
and they push back against it.
Or the third option is
that the child
is trying to wrestle internally with
the looking glass self concept,
and I,
I've shared this before,
(06:30):
but it's worth repeating if you're new to the podcast or you don't remember.
So the looking glass self concept is that you figure out who you are
by what people reflect back to you.
If every single time you're out somewhere
in some kind of social situation or engaging with conversation,
people say,
you're funny,
or oh my gosh,
(06:51):
you make me laugh.
You're going to have a decision to make.
You have to say,
everyone is reflecting back to me that I'm funny,
so I'm going to internalize that as part of my self-concept.
So I believe that I'm funny because lots of people have told me that I'm funny.
Or
(07:11):
you say,
lots of people say this to me,
but I actually do not think I'm funny,
so I'm rejecting that sense of self-concept.
Or you figure out how to integrate the fact that you don't really think so,
but other people do,
so maybe it's a partial truth.
And so you internalize that you're
a little bit funny,
(07:31):
but you're not really sure about it,
but it's at least a small portion of who you believe yourself to be.
So that's the looking glass self concept.
Now,
let's get back to your son Laura.
So if he has been thinking all of these things
for so long and now you are saying something else,
it could be that he is pushing back because he doesn't really know
(07:53):
which he wants to be.
Do I want to be capable or do I want to continue to believe that I'm incapable?
Do I want to
believe that I can problem solve,
or do I fall back on what I've always told myself,
which is that you can't figure anything out?
So there's a wrestling that can take place which
can cause some pushback as well and I,
as I mentioned before,
it could be a combination of all three.
(08:14):
So you said,
how do I help him find his own motivation,
you continue to encourage.
But often encouragement needs to be coupled with a feeling reflection.
Because,
or at least an acknowledgement of
what's going on.
So here's what that would look like.
Oh,
you're frustrated,
(08:35):
but you'll be able to figure that out.
OK,
so I can't do it is maybe something he says,
oh,
you're frustrated,
there's the feeling reflection.
But you'll be able to figure it out if you keep trying.
So that would be one option.
Or sometimes the child doesn't necessarily express an emotion,
and so we would want to acknowledge the status of things.
(08:56):
So,
wow,
that's really tricky,
but you're not giving up.
So often an encouragement is most well received when it's paired
with an acknowledgement of sorts.
Because if all the child hears is,
you'll figure it out.
They can very easily say,
(09:17):
no,
I won't because they're already emotionally charged.
But often it's softened
in its delivery
if we acknowledge what's happening or we reflect a feeling.
So Laura,
to answer that first question,
how do you help him find his own motivation?
You continue to encourage an esteem build as often as possible.
You have a plan,
you know what to do.
(09:37):
You didn't give up,
you kept trying,
you figured it out.
You got it,
you did it.
All of those things
are ways that you help him
develop an internal locus of control.
The antidote to that,
meaning what we would not want to do is praise.
And if you are not familiar with praise versus encouragement,
please go back and listen to those episodes.
(09:59):
That is a foundational piece of the child-centered parenting approach.
So,
we absolutely do not want to praise and Laura,
I don't know if you and your husband
are
in the habit of praising or not,
but you need to replace all value laden words
with encouragement and esteem building phrases instead.
That will really truly help
(10:20):
an internal locus of control be built.
OK,
second question,
how do we improve his self-worth in a way that it doesn't make him cringe?
You're going to have to do what I mentioned before,
where you couple those things together.
So,
for example,
if you say.
Wow,
you know a lot about.
(10:41):
Robotics.
I have no idea what your son's into,
but I just had to make something up that a 10 year old might like.
So you know a lot about robotics.
And
he goes,
oh no,
I don't.
OK,
if that's the cringe worthy moment that you're speaking of,
then
we respond to that.
Oh,
(11:01):
you don't feel like you know a lot about them,
but it sure seems like you do to me.
You want to validate,
you want to acknowledge,
you want to help the child feel heard and understood.
It's uncomfortable.
It's uncomfortable to be told
about yourself.
It's uncomfortable to have your feelings reflected and acknowledged.
(11:21):
It's uncomfortable to have someone point out strengths if you
don't believe that you have a whole lot of them.
So there's a discomfort going on,
but that doesn't mean that we stop.
We continue to do it and sometimes we have to acknowledge that it's uncomfortable.
Hmm,
you don't like it when I say that you can figure that out,
but you can.
(11:42):
So there needs to be some validation that is the preface to
the
motivation and
the
esteem building and encouragement phrases,
because those are going to be the opportunities where
he starts to change his internal self dialogue.
All right,
and then 3rd question,
how do we change the mornings?
(12:02):
You already sort of identified
the solution in your own words.
We're doing far too much.
Yes,
you are.
So here's what's here's what has happened,
and I get it.
It's been conditioned and it has just been a slow fade
over time
because you said from 3,
he's had a difficult time getting to sleep.
Now it has also become a difficult time waking up.
(12:22):
So we know that sleeping
is kind of the,
the bane of the existence right now and it has been for a long time.
So that what that means is we learn to
make concessions,
and we learn to pick our battles,
and we learn that,
well,
this is the lesser of two evils,
so I'm gonna do this instead of
the other thing.
All right,
so what has happened is
(12:43):
you all have been conditioned to fall into this pattern.
Where
you do absolutely everything for him
and good intentioned,
but here's what he has learned.
I don't have to regulate anything.
I don't have to have motivation to do anything.
I don't have to have ambition or desire.
I just sit and wait and other people will take care of it for me.
(13:06):
I don't have to fall asleep.
I'll wait till someone comes in and soothes me to fall asleep.
I don't have to wake up,
I'll wait until someone comes in and wakes me up.
I don't have to get dressed,
I'll wait till they put my clothes on the bed.
So,
no fault of yours,
it's just kind of the natural evolution of things in a family dynamic,
but at this point you're aware of it now.
You disclosed it yourself,
(13:26):
we're doing far too much.
OK,
so now that we know that
we make changes.
We don't know what we don't know,
but once we know it,
we can change.
So moving forward,
what needs to happen is you're going to
start providing choices about the morning routine,
but you're only going to change one thing at a time.
So it can't be overwhelming,
it can't be an overload,
(13:48):
so one thing at a time.
So you mentioned.
The alarm gets turned off,
he does not get out of bed,
he does not get dressed.
All right,
so these are all different scenarios.
You're going to have to choose which one
is
the most important to change first.
What would make the morning routines easier?
(14:08):
Not that it's completely easy
and completely resolved,
but what will make it easier?
Is it just that he would get out of bed on his own?
Then that becomes the
basis of your choice.
Is it that he would
get dressed on his own?
OK,
then that becomes the basis of your choice.
You have to decide which one's the priority,
and you're gonna go with that one first.
(14:30):
So I'm gonna go with
him getting out of bed on his own because that was the first in the list,
not because I think that's the priority.
So here's how this looks.
I'm gonna say your child's name is Jack.
I don't know,
but
I'm going with Jack.
So,
Jack,
in the mornings,
sometimes it's hard for you to get out of bed without our help,
but you're 10
(14:51):
and you can do this on your own.
OK,
so notice,
if you're not familiar with limit setting,
it's a 3-step process.
We have to reflect the child's feeling,
we have to set the neutral limit,
and then we move into the choices.
So what I've done there is the first two steps of that.
I acknowledged the scenario and the feelings and I set a neutral limit.
So essentially,
(15:11):
hey,
I get it.
You don't like getting up in the morning,
but you're capable of doing so.
That's essentially what I said,
but in a more age appropriate and child-centered approach.
Jack,
sometimes it's hard for you to get out of bed in the morning,
but you're 10 and you can do that on your own.
OK,
so there's your first two steps of limit setting.
(15:32):
Now we're going to move into choices.
Before I get into choices,
I want to make it very clear,
and I know I've said this a lot,
but I,
I feel like I need to make sure it's sinking in.
Choices are most effective when it involves the child's currency.
So Laura,
I have no idea what matters to hypothetical Jack.
So I don't know
(15:53):
what would motivate him.
Is it time with friends?
Is it ice cream after dinner?
Is it
TV time in the evening?
I,
I'm not sure what that might be.
Lego kits,
who knows?
I,
whatever really,
really truly motivates and matters to him.
That becomes part of
(16:13):
your choice.
So
When there is a pattern of behavior established,
you want to provide some time
before you implement the choices.
If it were me,
I would say January 1st is proverbial D-Day.
So Laura,
I might say,
Jack,
it's hard for you to get up sometimes and you
like us to help you and be involved in that,
(16:35):
but you're 10 and you can do that by yourself.
So starting on January 1st,
there's going to be some new expectations in our household.
Now you can choose a different date.
I'm just saying there needs to be a futuristic D-day of sorts.
So hey,
this is when this is going to be implemented.
He needs time to adjust.
He needs time to think about it.
(16:56):
He needs time to process it.
He might need time to get mad or scream or cry or argue or negotiate or whatever.
We're not sure how he's going to take it,
but the point is he needs to be prepared emotionally and mentally
for the fact that there are changes coming.
So,
you go through the first two steps,
you give him the date,
(17:17):
and then you say,
When you choose
to get up when the alarm goes off on your own.
Without anyone helping you get out of bed.
You choose
positive consequence that he really likes.
Currency.
Whatever that is,
you choose to have dinner that night.
(17:38):
Uh,
no,
don't starve your child.
You
it's not what I meant to say.
You choose to have dessert after dinner
that night.
Or you choose to have time with your friends after school that day,
or you choose to
get to build your Legos before bed
that day.
Notice that I'm saying that day because
(18:00):
the consequence is only tied to that day.
This is a huge gap in parenting knowledge.
We think that we need to have consequences that span
long stretches of time.
That makes no no sense to a child,
means nothing to a child.
So
it's for that day and that day only.
(18:22):
So Jack,
when you choose to get out of bed on your own with no help from anyone else,
you choose positive currency consequence
later that day.
If you choose not to get out of bed when your alarm goes off and
you choose for someone to come in and help you get out of bed,
you choose to lose
consequence for that day currency related.
(18:43):
So you choose not to have dessert after dinner,
you choose not to have time to build your Legos that day.
OK,
so you share this with him several times leading
up to January 1st or whatever date you choose.
And then your only job,
Laura.
This is our only job.
All of you out there with kids in this scenario,
(19:04):
this is our only job.
We enforce the choice that the child made.
Without emotion,
without charge,
neutrally.
So,
Laura,
January 1st comes New Year's Day,
start of a whole new life.
So,
so much context there.
(19:25):
So January 1st rolls around.
Jack's alarm goes off and you go in and you see
that Jack has gotten out of bed on his own.
You neutrally say.
Jack,
I see you've chosen to have
time to build Legos this afternoon.
And you walk out of the room.
Or
(19:45):
Jack is sound asleep in bed with the covers pulled
up over his head and has shut the alarm off.
You pull the covers back and you say,
Jack,
I see that you chose not to get out of bed,
so you choose not to have Legos today,
but you can choose to have Legos tomorrow,
and you walk out of the room.
And here's what happens.
(20:05):
Child develops an internal
locus of control.
child develops a sense of actions have consequences.
And child develops
the ability to self-regulate.
What has been happening,
Laura,
is that you all regulate for him.
And we need kids that can self-control.
(20:27):
We need kids that can regulate themselves.
And the way that we do that is giving them choices.
If you choose to get out of bed
on your own,
you choose to have this thing that really matters to you.
If you choose not to get out of bed on your own,
you choose to not have the thing that really matters to you,
which do you choose?
But here's the beauty of it.
He gets to choose another option tomorrow.
(20:49):
And we need to reinforce that.
You can try again tomorrow.
You can choose to have that tomorrow though.
And here's what will happen.
There will only be so many mornings that he chooses to
not get out of bed when the alarm goes off.
Because if that currency matters to him,
it's not worth it.
Staying in bed is no longer worth losing.
(21:10):
Fill in the blank,
whatever matters.
So Laura,
thank you so much for the email.
I hope that
that is helpful.
One final thought on that.
You said we're doing far too much.
What you need to think about is
all you're doing at this point now that you've implemented these choices,
is you're enforcing the choice that he made.
(21:31):
And let's be real,
we would always choose for our child to have the things that they love.
Do you understand what I'm saying there?
I,
Jack,
I would have chosen for you to have Legos tonight.
I would have chosen for you to have dessert.
I would have chosen for you to be able to play with your friends,
but you chose not to
(21:53):
when you chose to stay in bed when the alarm went off.
And we say it exactly like that.
Let me,
I'm gonna take a side turn really quickly,
but it's,
it's necessary.
If we say,
Jack,
you chose to get out of bed this morning.
That's not neutral.
And you know what that's communicating?
(22:13):
You just made me happy because you,
you did what I wanted you to do.
That's no longer a choice.
That's coercion.
Likewise,
if we say.
Well,
Jack,
I see that you've chosen not to have Legos tonight because you chose to stay in bed.
(22:34):
Also not neutral.
And also coercion,
because you did not do what you were supposed to do.
The neutrality is how this works.
If you are charged on the positive or the
negative end of the emotional spectrum when you respond.
It is no longer a choice.
(22:55):
We have to be really careful
with remaining completely indifferent about this
because all we're doing is enforcing the choice that the child made.
I see you've chosen to have dessert tonight.
I see you've chosen not to have dessert tonight,
but you can try again tomorrow.
If we stay calm and neutral.
The child fully
(23:15):
absorbs the weight and the consequence of their decisions.
And that's how all of the things that you want for him are developed,
his own motivation,
his internal locus of control,
his sense of who he is,
and the fact that he will self regulate all of those things will come
if we are neutral in our reactions.
All right,
Laura,
thanks again for,
(23:36):
for the email.
I really appreciate it.
Thank you all for hanging out with me each week.
Thank you for taking me on your runs and walks and car rides and
laundry folding and whatever else you do with me.
I,
I love that you are
really in
this parenting journey
and you're really working to,
to be the best that you can be.
(23:57):
That's,
that's what this is all about.
And so I appreciate that we're in this together.
My son is now 15,
so we're,
we're kind of in the
high school years,
but I know many of you have much younger kids and this is a process
and we can always become a better version of ourselves as parents
and that's what this podcast is about and that's why you're listening.
(24:18):
So I really greatly appreciate you all.
Have a great week.
We'll talk again soon.
Bye.
Thank you for listening to
the Play Therapy Parenting Podcast with Dr. Brenna Hicks.
For more episodes and just subscribe to our newsletter,
please go to www.playtherapyparenting.com.
You're listening to the
Play Therapy Parenting Podcast with Dr. Brenna Hicks.
Hi,
I'm Dr. Brenna Hicks,
The Kid Counselor.
This is the Play Therapy Parenting Podcast where I give you insight,
awareness,
and enlightenment about your parenting
and your relationship with your kids.
In today's episode,
I am answering a question from Laura in the UK.
(00:24):
Laura,
thank you for emailing and hello from across the pond.
And Laura's question is about
how to help her son find his own motivation.
A really helpful question.
I'm really glad that you
wrote in Laura.
And so I'll read part of her email
together and then we'll dive in.
(00:44):
Before I do that,
if you would like to email me with your questions or
comments or a hello,
a greeting of sorts.
brenna@thekidcounselor.com is my email address.
I do check all of my own email.
I get a lot of questions about,
do you have someone that filters them or vets them or aggregates them in some way.
(01:04):
They all come directly to me and I do read
every single one and I do respond to everyone.
So if you would like to reach out to me,
I would love to hear from you.
And you can also leave a voicemail on our line if you're in the states,
which is 813-812-5525.
You can leave me a message and then I can respond
in an episode that way as well.
(01:26):
OK,
so let's read parts of Laura's email and then we'll dive in.
I'm fairly new to your podcast and I'm so grateful to have found it.
Our son has had it much harder than our daughter
in a way he educated us
that we needed to do better for him.
So consequently,
our daughter entered the world to parents who were more aware.
(01:46):
What we're struggling with now is the legacy we created
before we began thinking about how we were parenting.
Our son,
who is 10,
is almost allergic to us directing him in any way.
He does not have intrinsic motivation for self-care
or anything he doesn't want to do.
It has been a major challenge for him to get to sleep since he was 3,
and he's very reluctant to get out of bed in the mornings.
(02:09):
I've begun to reflect feelings,
give choices and limits if necessary,
and sometimes it helps,
but sometimes he doesn't seem to be listening.
The thing that he kicks back about at times is encouragement.
It almost seems as if he's cringing.
I guess my questions are how can I help him find his own motivation,
improve his self-worth in a way that doesn't make him cringe,
(02:30):
and change the mornings.
Currently we have to tickle him awake as the alarm just gets switched off.
We have to keep coming back to check if he's up,
which usually he isn't.
Sometimes put his clothes out on his bed,
remind him about every stage of getting ready.
We're doing far too much,
but if we don't,
he just stays in bed.
I hope that you can help us navigate this.
(02:51):
OK,
Laura,
thank you so much and this is something that I think all of us
face.
It's not always a bedtime or a morning routine,
but I think all of us as parents face a scenario where it's just the constant battle.
So I think this is going to be really helpful.
And then to talk about
his own motivation and improving his self-worth,
also really relevant for all of us.
(03:13):
So thank you so much for the email,
Laura.
OK,
so let's dive in.
Laura,
you mentioned that you have started reflecting feelings,
giving choices,
and providing limits,
and then
the thing that he pushes back about is encouragement.
So,
for those of you that might be new to the podcast,
for those of you that have only listened to a couple of episodes,
What Laura just described were the four pillars of child-centered play therapy.
(03:35):
So if you are not familiar with the foundational components of
this child-centered play therapy approach to your parenting,
I would encourage you to go back and listen to season 1 episodes,
and if at the very least,
go back and start at the beginning of season
2 because it really does serve as the foundation
for everything about which we're going to talk
(03:57):
and it's just helpful to make sure that
you understand the undergirdings and the philosophy behind
these skills and why we use them.
So Laura,
I'm really encouraged to hear that you have been using the four pillars.
To answer your first question,
how do you help him find his own motivation?
An internal locus of control,
(04:18):
and an internal source of motivation
comes from a child
that has been encouraged.
And I understand that you're saying he's kicking back on encouragement.
Here's what I think is probably going on.
When a child pushes back against encouragement.
There's usually a couple of potential reasons or sometimes a combination thereof.
(04:41):
One is
the way that it's delivered.
In other words,
The child is struggling with something,
working on something,
and in an attempt to encourage,
we say you can do it.
But they have been struggling for 5 minutes,
and that feels dismissive and ignorant in their mind.
(05:02):
What I mean by that is.
In their head,
they can't do it.
They've already been trying and failing.
And so to have someone say you can do it,
their perception is,
no,
I can't.
Have you not seen that I've been trying to do this for 5 minutes and it isn't working.
So sometimes it's in the presentation and the delivery,
because if we say an encouragement phrase
(05:24):
and it doesn't seem to pair up with the child's experience,
that is irritating to them.
So that's one consideration.
The second is,
he has such a low sense of self-worth and identity and self-esteem.
That
his
internal mantra and his internal self talk
is so negatively skewed.
(05:47):
That someone saying something positive about him.
Seems like
a lie.
In other words,
if all day long,
all I say to myself is you're dumb,
you're stupid,
you're ugly,
you have no idea what you're doing,
you're always a failure,
you're such an idiot,
whatever,
if those are the kinds of things that he's internally,
and I'm not saying that he is,
I'm just trying to paint a picture.
If you have that kind of mentality about yourself,
(06:09):
if someone says
you'll figure that out.
It's so foreign to them
that it seems like an untruth,
and they push back against it.
Or the third option is
that the child
is trying to wrestle internally with
the looking glass self concept,
and I,
I've shared this before,
(06:30):
but it's worth repeating if you're new to the podcast or you don't remember.
So the looking glass self concept is that you figure out who you are
by what people reflect back to you.
If every single time you're out somewhere
in some kind of social situation or engaging with conversation,
people say,
you're funny,
or oh my gosh,
(06:51):
you make me laugh.
You're going to have a decision to make.
You have to say,
everyone is reflecting back to me that I'm funny,
so I'm going to internalize that as part of my self-concept.
So I believe that I'm funny because lots of people have told me that I'm funny.
Or
(07:11):
you say,
lots of people say this to me,
but I actually do not think I'm funny,
so I'm rejecting that sense of self-concept.
Or you figure out how to integrate the fact that you don't really think so,
but other people do,
so maybe it's a partial truth.
And so you internalize that you're
a little bit funny,
(07:31):
but you're not really sure about it,
but it's at least a small portion of who you believe yourself to be.
So that's the looking glass self concept.
Now,
let's get back to your son Laura.
So if he has been thinking all of these things
for so long and now you are saying something else,
it could be that he is pushing back because he doesn't really know
(07:53):
which he wants to be.
Do I want to be capable or do I want to continue to believe that I'm incapable?
Do I want to
believe that I can problem solve,
or do I fall back on what I've always told myself,
which is that you can't figure anything out?
So there's a wrestling that can take place which
can cause some pushback as well and I,
as I mentioned before,
it could be a combination of all three.
(08:14):
So you said,
how do I help him find his own motivation,
you continue to encourage.
But often encouragement needs to be coupled with a feeling reflection.
Because,
or at least an acknowledgement of
what's going on.
So here's what that would look like.
Oh,
you're frustrated,
(08:35):
but you'll be able to figure that out.
OK,
so I can't do it is maybe something he says,
oh,
you're frustrated,
there's the feeling reflection.
But you'll be able to figure it out if you keep trying.
So that would be one option.
Or sometimes the child doesn't necessarily express an emotion,
and so we would want to acknowledge the status of things.
(08:56):
So,
wow,
that's really tricky,
but you're not giving up.
So often an encouragement is most well received when it's paired
with an acknowledgement of sorts.
Because if all the child hears is,
you'll figure it out.
They can very easily say,
(09:17):
no,
I won't because they're already emotionally charged.
But often it's softened
in its delivery
if we acknowledge what's happening or we reflect a feeling.
So Laura,
to answer that first question,
how do you help him find his own motivation?
You continue to encourage an esteem build as often as possible.
You have a plan,
you know what to do.
(09:37):
You didn't give up,
you kept trying,
you figured it out.
You got it,
you did it.
All of those things
are ways that you help him
develop an internal locus of control.
The antidote to that,
meaning what we would not want to do is praise.
And if you are not familiar with praise versus encouragement,
please go back and listen to those episodes.
(09:59):
That is a foundational piece of the child-centered parenting approach.
So,
we absolutely do not want to praise and Laura,
I don't know if you and your husband
are
in the habit of praising or not,
but you need to replace all value laden words
with encouragement and esteem building phrases instead.
That will really truly help
(10:20):
an internal locus of control be built.
OK,
second question,
how do we improve his self-worth in a way that it doesn't make him cringe?
You're going to have to do what I mentioned before,
where you couple those things together.
So,
for example,
if you say.
Wow,
you know a lot about.
(10:41):
Robotics.
I have no idea what your son's into,
but I just had to make something up that a 10 year old might like.
So you know a lot about robotics.
And
he goes,
oh no,
I don't.
OK,
if that's the cringe worthy moment that you're speaking of,
then
we respond to that.
Oh,
(11:01):
you don't feel like you know a lot about them,
but it sure seems like you do to me.
You want to validate,
you want to acknowledge,
you want to help the child feel heard and understood.
It's uncomfortable.
It's uncomfortable to be told
about yourself.
It's uncomfortable to have your feelings reflected and acknowledged.
(11:21):
It's uncomfortable to have someone point out strengths if you
don't believe that you have a whole lot of them.
So there's a discomfort going on,
but that doesn't mean that we stop.
We continue to do it and sometimes we have to acknowledge that it's uncomfortable.
Hmm,
you don't like it when I say that you can figure that out,
but you can.
(11:42):
So there needs to be some validation that is the preface to
the
motivation and
the
esteem building and encouragement phrases,
because those are going to be the opportunities where
he starts to change his internal self dialogue.
All right,
and then 3rd question,
how do we change the mornings?
(12:02):
You already sort of identified
the solution in your own words.
We're doing far too much.
Yes,
you are.
So here's what's here's what has happened,
and I get it.
It's been conditioned and it has just been a slow fade
over time
because you said from 3,
he's had a difficult time getting to sleep.
Now it has also become a difficult time waking up.
(12:22):
So we know that sleeping
is kind of the,
the bane of the existence right now and it has been for a long time.
So that what that means is we learn to
make concessions,
and we learn to pick our battles,
and we learn that,
well,
this is the lesser of two evils,
so I'm gonna do this instead of
the other thing.
All right,
so what has happened is
(12:43):
you all have been conditioned to fall into this pattern.
Where
you do absolutely everything for him
and good intentioned,
but here's what he has learned.
I don't have to regulate anything.
I don't have to have motivation to do anything.
I don't have to have ambition or desire.
I just sit and wait and other people will take care of it for me.
(13:06):
I don't have to fall asleep.
I'll wait till someone comes in and soothes me to fall asleep.
I don't have to wake up,
I'll wait until someone comes in and wakes me up.
I don't have to get dressed,
I'll wait till they put my clothes on the bed.
So,
no fault of yours,
it's just kind of the natural evolution of things in a family dynamic,
but at this point you're aware of it now.
You disclosed it yourself,
(13:26):
we're doing far too much.
OK,
so now that we know that
we make changes.
We don't know what we don't know,
but once we know it,
we can change.
So moving forward,
what needs to happen is you're going to
start providing choices about the morning routine,
but you're only going to change one thing at a time.
So it can't be overwhelming,
it can't be an overload,
(13:48):
so one thing at a time.
So you mentioned.
The alarm gets turned off,
he does not get out of bed,
he does not get dressed.
All right,
so these are all different scenarios.
You're going to have to choose which one
is
the most important to change first.
What would make the morning routines easier?
(14:08):
Not that it's completely easy
and completely resolved,
but what will make it easier?
Is it just that he would get out of bed on his own?
Then that becomes the
basis of your choice.
Is it that he would
get dressed on his own?
OK,
then that becomes the basis of your choice.
You have to decide which one's the priority,
and you're gonna go with that one first.
(14:30):
So I'm gonna go with
him getting out of bed on his own because that was the first in the list,
not because I think that's the priority.
So here's how this looks.
I'm gonna say your child's name is Jack.
I don't know,
but
I'm going with Jack.
So,
Jack,
in the mornings,
sometimes it's hard for you to get out of bed without our help,
but you're 10
(14:51):
and you can do this on your own.
OK,
so notice,
if you're not familiar with limit setting,
it's a 3-step process.
We have to reflect the child's feeling,
we have to set the neutral limit,
and then we move into the choices.
So what I've done there is the first two steps of that.
I acknowledged the scenario and the feelings and I set a neutral limit.
So essentially,
(15:11):
hey,
I get it.
You don't like getting up in the morning,
but you're capable of doing so.
That's essentially what I said,
but in a more age appropriate and child-centered approach.
Jack,
sometimes it's hard for you to get out of bed in the morning,
but you're 10 and you can do that on your own.
OK,
so there's your first two steps of limit setting.
(15:32):
Now we're going to move into choices.
Before I get into choices,
I want to make it very clear,
and I know I've said this a lot,
but I,
I feel like I need to make sure it's sinking in.
Choices are most effective when it involves the child's currency.
So Laura,
I have no idea what matters to hypothetical Jack.
So I don't know
(15:53):
what would motivate him.
Is it time with friends?
Is it ice cream after dinner?
Is it
TV time in the evening?
I,
I'm not sure what that might be.
Lego kits,
who knows?
I,
whatever really,
really truly motivates and matters to him.
That becomes part of
(16:13):
your choice.
So
When there is a pattern of behavior established,
you want to provide some time
before you implement the choices.
If it were me,
I would say January 1st is proverbial D-Day.
So Laura,
I might say,
Jack,
it's hard for you to get up sometimes and you
like us to help you and be involved in that,
(16:35):
but you're 10 and you can do that by yourself.
So starting on January 1st,
there's going to be some new expectations in our household.
Now you can choose a different date.
I'm just saying there needs to be a futuristic D-day of sorts.
So hey,
this is when this is going to be implemented.
He needs time to adjust.
He needs time to think about it.
(16:56):
He needs time to process it.
He might need time to get mad or scream or cry or argue or negotiate or whatever.
We're not sure how he's going to take it,
but the point is he needs to be prepared emotionally and mentally
for the fact that there are changes coming.
So,
you go through the first two steps,
you give him the date,
(17:17):
and then you say,
When you choose
to get up when the alarm goes off on your own.
Without anyone helping you get out of bed.
You choose
positive consequence that he really likes.
Currency.
Whatever that is,
you choose to have dinner that night.
(17:38):
Uh,
no,
don't starve your child.
You
it's not what I meant to say.
You choose to have dessert after dinner
that night.
Or you choose to have time with your friends after school that day,
or you choose to
get to build your Legos before bed
that day.
Notice that I'm saying that day because
(18:00):
the consequence is only tied to that day.
This is a huge gap in parenting knowledge.
We think that we need to have consequences that span
long stretches of time.
That makes no no sense to a child,
means nothing to a child.
So
it's for that day and that day only.
(18:22):
So Jack,
when you choose to get out of bed on your own with no help from anyone else,
you choose positive currency consequence
later that day.
If you choose not to get out of bed when your alarm goes off and
you choose for someone to come in and help you get out of bed,
you choose to lose
consequence for that day currency related.
(18:43):
So you choose not to have dessert after dinner,
you choose not to have time to build your Legos that day.
OK,
so you share this with him several times leading
up to January 1st or whatever date you choose.
And then your only job,
Laura.
This is our only job.
All of you out there with kids in this scenario,
(19:04):
this is our only job.
We enforce the choice that the child made.
Without emotion,
without charge,
neutrally.
So,
Laura,
January 1st comes New Year's Day,
start of a whole new life.
So,
so much context there.
(19:25):
So January 1st rolls around.
Jack's alarm goes off and you go in and you see
that Jack has gotten out of bed on his own.
You neutrally say.
Jack,
I see you've chosen to have
time to build Legos this afternoon.
And you walk out of the room.
Or
(19:45):
Jack is sound asleep in bed with the covers pulled
up over his head and has shut the alarm off.
You pull the covers back and you say,
Jack,
I see that you chose not to get out of bed,
so you choose not to have Legos today,
but you can choose to have Legos tomorrow,
and you walk out of the room.
And here's what happens.
(20:05):
Child develops an internal
locus of control.
child develops a sense of actions have consequences.
And child develops
the ability to self-regulate.
What has been happening,
Laura,
is that you all regulate for him.
And we need kids that can self-control.
(20:27):
We need kids that can regulate themselves.
And the way that we do that is giving them choices.
If you choose to get out of bed
on your own,
you choose to have this thing that really matters to you.
If you choose not to get out of bed on your own,
you choose to not have the thing that really matters to you,
which do you choose?
But here's the beauty of it.
He gets to choose another option tomorrow.
(20:49):
And we need to reinforce that.
You can try again tomorrow.
You can choose to have that tomorrow though.
And here's what will happen.
There will only be so many mornings that he chooses to
not get out of bed when the alarm goes off.
Because if that currency matters to him,
it's not worth it.
Staying in bed is no longer worth losing.
(21:10):
Fill in the blank,
whatever matters.
So Laura,
thank you so much for the email.
I hope that
that is helpful.
One final thought on that.
You said we're doing far too much.
What you need to think about is
all you're doing at this point now that you've implemented these choices,
is you're enforcing the choice that he made.
(21:31):
And let's be real,
we would always choose for our child to have the things that they love.
Do you understand what I'm saying there?
I,
Jack,
I would have chosen for you to have Legos tonight.
I would have chosen for you to have dessert.
I would have chosen for you to be able to play with your friends,
but you chose not to
(21:53):
when you chose to stay in bed when the alarm went off.
And we say it exactly like that.
Let me,
I'm gonna take a side turn really quickly,
but it's,
it's necessary.
If we say,
Jack,
you chose to get out of bed this morning.
That's not neutral.
And you know what that's communicating?
(22:13):
You just made me happy because you,
you did what I wanted you to do.
That's no longer a choice.
That's coercion.
Likewise,
if we say.
Well,
Jack,
I see that you've chosen not to have Legos tonight because you chose to stay in bed.
(22:34):
Also not neutral.
And also coercion,
because you did not do what you were supposed to do.
The neutrality is how this works.
If you are charged on the positive or the
negative end of the emotional spectrum when you respond.
It is no longer a choice.
(22:55):
We have to be really careful
with remaining completely indifferent about this
because all we're doing is enforcing the choice that the child made.
I see you've chosen to have dessert tonight.
I see you've chosen not to have dessert tonight,
but you can try again tomorrow.
If we stay calm and neutral.
The child fully
(23:15):
absorbs the weight and the consequence of their decisions.
And that's how all of the things that you want for him are developed,
his own motivation,
his internal locus of control,
his sense of who he is,
and the fact that he will self regulate all of those things will come
if we are neutral in our reactions.
All right,
Laura,
thanks again for,
(23:36):
for the email.
I really appreciate it.
Thank you all for hanging out with me each week.
Thank you for taking me on your runs and walks and car rides and
laundry folding and whatever else you do with me.
I,
I love that you are
really in
this parenting journey
and you're really working to,
to be the best that you can be.
(23:57):
That's,
that's what this is all about.
And so I appreciate that we're in this together.
My son is now 15,
so we're,
we're kind of in the
high school years,
but I know many of you have much younger kids and this is a process
and we can always become a better version of ourselves as parents
and that's what this podcast is about and that's why you're listening.
(24:18):
So I really greatly appreciate you all.
Have a great week.
We'll talk again soon.
Bye.
Thank you for listening to
the Play Therapy Parenting Podcast with Dr. Brenna Hicks.
For more episodes and just subscribe to our newsletter,
please go to www.playtherapyparenting.com.
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