Karey L. - It Was A Street Life

Send us a text In this episode, Karey L. shares her experience, strength, and hope. Podcast Recovery is a forerunner in digitally accessible addiction recovery support. We provide ease and convenience to any and all seeking a message of recovery and hope. By broadcasting the stories of recovering addicts, we act as a complement to all other recovery services. We exist to create a global foundation platform, so that any addict may hear a message of strength and hope. We contribute education a...

Episode Transcript

(00:03):
Welcome back to Podcast Recovery, everyone.
We're your hosts. David O.
And Eric V. And today, we're joined by our
very special guest, Carrie. How are you doing today?
I'm good. How are you?
I'm doing well, you know. Weather's finally feeling like
fall, not 80° in in November. Oh yeah.
Feel free to curse how much you want as well.
Oh, that's fucking awesome. There you go.
Where are you from? I originally, I can't really say

(00:27):
a pinpoint area, I grew up pretty much being handed between
family members to family membersall over.
So between Baltimore to chase the Essex to Pasadena.
So Maryland generally, but all different counties, OK.
And when were you first introduced to recovery?
I was introduced in recovery back when I was about 36, when I

(00:48):
started dating a gentleman that was an addict.
And we would go every now and again.
Yeah, all. Right.
And how long have you been clean?
I've been clean almost five years.
It'll be five years on November 20th of this year.
Hell yeah. Congratulations.
Thanks. Wait, when was that?
What time? How?
What? What was?
What was that date again? November 20th.

(01:10):
November 20th, Oh, November 26th.
Nice, nice. Hell yes, we're coming off all
right. Well, with all that out of the
way, I'm going to turn it over to you.
Share your story with us. Take it away.
OK so where to start? I as a child was my father was
an active addict. I was handed from family member

(01:30):
to family member from as early as I can remember, starting with
my great grandmother. There was a lot of emotional and
physical and mental abuse throughout my whole childhood.
I went from my great grandmotherto my grandmother to my aunt, to
my aunt to my other aunt. By the time I got to the last,
how many? Aunts, do you have?
Yeah, a lot. I mean, like, technically, like

(01:52):
my the first aunt that I was with was my grandmother's
sister, but yeah. OK, so great Aunt.
Great aunt. So like looking back, I have
like bits and pieces of memoriesthat I have gotten back from
therapy that I'm starting to puttogether as to how I ended up
where I am now. But the most stable home

(02:14):
environment that I had was with my aunt and uncle out in Chase.
I lived with him for about four years in my middle school
career. Where is.
Chase Chase is served by Gunpowder State Park.
On the other side. Yeah, 95 but also during that
time I was molested by a math teacher.
What the like? How though?

(02:34):
Like. Yeah, you know, like skipping
the whole like younger years, like I was molested like as a
child. Like I don't even use the word
molested anymore. At like 9 years old I was raped
by my babysitter's boyfriend. What?
The fuck? So as terrible as terrible as
this sounds like, that one seemsmore feasible.
But like, how does the math teacher like?
The math teacher we would have after school math activities.

(02:57):
I was really good in math back in those days.
So he like fucking pushed you upessentially, right?
Yeah. So like there's a lot of
pictures taken. I was young.
I like of course like I know now.
The pictures. So he's grooming you?
Yes. And like I know now that, you
know, that was because I was craving, you know, the attention

(03:18):
of my father. But I was taking any attention
from any man, even at that youngof an age.
But the rape at nine years old made me very sexually not
available to people. So, you know, like some of my
friends became very active. I became very non active, but I

(03:38):
still did like I didn't realize it was inappropriate or wrong
until later on. Both of those situations
actually Fast forward to like I went to.
When was like so you're not? How old are you?
I'm 47. OK.
So this is early 80s, yes. And, you know, Fast forward,
like, of course, I wound up living with my grandmother.

(04:02):
I had seen my father overdose many times by this point.
I pulled my father out of a bandos in Westside Baltimore,
seen the double track marks where I would never use a drug,
never touch anything, was a straight A student, had an
opportunity to work for the NSA coming out of high school.
Unfortunately, that did not happen because my father was on

(04:22):
a Bender and never got back in time to sign their release
papers. And I know I'm kind of like
jumping all over the place, but it's kind of hard to tell, like
your whole story. Oh yeah, yeah.
Yeah. And like just kind of like give
a brief overview. But yeah, the most stable time I
had was with my aunt and uncle. They they instilled in me the
morals and the values that I carried even through active
addiction. I moved in with my grandmother

(04:44):
in the high school years. She also was very physically and
mentally and emotionally abusive.
But I also know now, looking back again through my journey
and recovery and through outsidetreatment as well, that that
stems from her childhood and howshe grows.
Oh yeah, of course. Yeah, it's just that monkey see,
monkey do. Love, hate relationship with her
right and when she passed it wasdevastating.

(05:05):
But I moved out of her house when I was 16 and started
renting a room in my girlfriend's basement at 16.
Had the same boyfriend all through high school.
Met my ex-husband when I was 18.We were married at I was married
at 19. Had my first son at 20.
Super young. Yeah, had my second son at 24.

(05:28):
What? Wait, so your your kids are
grown? Yes.
Do you have a 23 year old and a 27 year old?
22 and 26. 22 I was close. OK, I almost math.
Yeah, 22 and 26 and you're. Good at math?
I'm not. I'm not good at it anymore, not
as good as I used to be. I prefer history and social

(05:49):
studies in English now. I think my interest in math
stemmed from that math teacher, right?
Like, and I took that class because he was giving me the
attention and he pulled me into that class.
I'm, I'm more interested in likethe other side of things, either
like math or what I've seen social studies or English.
And I like social studies in English.
But yeah, so I mean, like Fast forward, went through the 20

(06:12):
years of marriage, you know, like I had a full time job, I
was working in that time, you know, just kind of put a little
bit of history there. My oldest son was diagnosed with
leukemia when he was 6. I dropped out of school from
getting my bachelor's degree, became a full time stay at home
mom with a 1 1/2 year old son. And my oldest son battled cancer

(06:35):
for several years and he had a primary transplant February 24th
of 2004 and he's been in remission ever since.
But that was a big part of my life.
And then after he was, he had start to get better and get back
into like a regular routine. I started realizing that I
wanted more from my life than where my husband and I currently

(06:55):
were. And he had had a job under the
table for years and I wanted a retirement.
Alright, if you want me to be a full stay at home mom and take
care of our children, I need youto have a job on the books.
He also drank a lot, which I find hilarious now because I
left him because he wouldn't quit drinking and wouldn't get
like, a stable, yeah job on the books.

(07:16):
But the most thing was his drinking and his anger.
And within a year after separation, I was a, you know,
full blown addict. So I find that kind of ironic
looking back on it. Oh, yeah, of course.
But after the divorce, I looked up an ex-boyfriend from high
school, and he wasn't a boyfriend.
He was a guy that I hooked up with back in high school.
Yeah. Yeah.
And what high school did you go to?

(07:36):
I went to Lansdowne Senior High.OK, judge me for that.
I mean, I I went to Catonsville,so naturally I'm judging.
The judge? Yeah, I'm like.
Catonsville. Lansdowne, yeah.
So my ex that I was with for seven years is from Catonsville,
and you probably know who he is,BJ Brooks.
I don't know. I don't know that person.
OK, yeah. So we started dating when I was

(08:00):
like 3637. We hooked up one night.
It was on Halloween, and we never stopped.
And that was the first time thatI did a line on the back of a
toilet, acting like I was. 36. Yes.
Wet Wet 36 is the first time you're blowing lines off the
back of a toilet. Stop.
Yeah, like when I went to were. You in costume when you hooked
up. I was not.

(08:22):
He was. What was he?
What was he dressed? As he was like a skull guy, his
whole face was printed out. But yeah, like we hooked back up
and it was like immediately, like the attraction was there
again because we I had hooked upback in the day back in high
school, and we hadn't seen each other for years.
But yeah, so I was just acting like I was cool.
Like, I'm not going to say I never did any other drugs.
Like in high school, I tripped on acid on my senior prom.

(08:42):
Like my favorite memory ever is like driving home from the prom
listening to Jimi Hendrix and everything turning purple.
Oh yeah. And then getting into the hotel
back when we were, you know, tripping and, like, the walls
were running and all that fun stuff.
And sex was bomb on acid, of course.
So like, I did that when my father sent me to military
school when I was younger. I would go home with girlfriends

(09:04):
and we would just do different pills or, you know, that was the
age of drinking Nyquil to get drunk.
Oh, yeah, so mad drinking of Nyquil.
But I, you know, I didn't think I had a problem then.
I was just feeling fine. Yeah.
Smoked a lot of weed back then. But as I got older, I didn't
really like weed. What military school did you go
to? Randolph making Military Academy
in Front Royal, VA. OK, they seem to all be in
Virginia. Yeah, I'm pretty sure all the

(09:26):
military schools are in Virginia.
Yeah, it was a really fun time because.
It was like there's oh God, whatis it?
I don't know. There's one.
I know there's one near Manassas.
I don't know. Keep going.
There's a boys, all boys one in Manassas.
Yeah. But yeah, let me see.
So into that relationship with my ex, we used we and it was fun

(09:47):
at first, you know, like, of course I finally fit in
somewhere. Like all through middle school
and high school, I really didn'tfeel like I fit in anywhere.
I was always the really pale redheaded white girl that never
really felt accepted. Yeah, never was a part of the
like extremely popular crowd. I was invited to the parties but
was always the one sitting back in the corner.

(10:08):
Once him and I got together, it was like a whole new world for
me. He had major St. cred.
Nobody messed with him. What does that mean?
What does major St. cred mean? He had mad clout.
Like we could walk through Baltimore and people just knew
who he was. And if I walked into Morris

(10:29):
Burgers or any bar in Catonsville, I was served
whatever I wanted, drugs or alcohol, without having to pay
anything. Wow.
So like having free access to all of those things.
And like when the bars would close down at like 2:00 AM, we
would be there till 6:00 AM. Because that's something that's
really not talked about a lot. Like the lifestyle is just as as
addictive as, you know, the drugs themselves.

(10:50):
Like having that like that illusion or feeling that you're
somebody and like you're important is very alluring and
it can keep you trapped for a long time.
It did. It kept me trapped for a very
long time, man. Like, I mean, you just Fast
forward, it went from from, you know, doing lines to smoke and
crack, right, doing lines to smoke and crack.

(11:10):
And we were together for years. The friend group that we had at
that time, that was my first ever friend group, honestly.
Like I had girlfriends from highschool and stuff and I still
have friends with them today, but it wasn't like that group.
It was like street ride or die. It was like, no, it, it was St.
life, plain and simple and. Oh, that might be a title, Eric.

(11:32):
It was St. Life.
It was, it was definitely St. life.
Like we were out every weekend, we were out during the week.
You know, I've had guns put to my head.
I've had people pull me out of cars because, like, deals were
going wrong or I went into town and they didn't recognize who I
was and they thought I was a cop.
And then when I would drop his name, they would, like, back off
real quickly. Yeah, White.
Girl in the city you'd be like what are you a narc?

(11:53):
Yeah, You know, like I've alwaysbeen that like white suburban
looking girl. Of course, never really like had
that. I think I went through like
maybe six months of one full ghetto with like the Braves and
the Thames and shit. But then I eventually was like,
this isn't me. Yeah, Eric, have you, were you
ever held at gunpoint? Once.
Once I was holding on .3 times, yeah.

(12:13):
What was your reaction? I was really high so I didn't
really have a reaction. I was kind of more mad that I
was like losing money at the moment, yeah than anything else.
Like I like it was like 2 days before rehab so like I was in a
pretty bad place so I didn't really care.
Yeah, the first time I totally like froze up.
The second time, like, like the first one literally was like a

(12:36):
surreal moment. I was just like, Oh my God,
because I was in high school, like I'd never been.
I'd never had gun point at me, but I was like, Oh my God, you
can take whatever you want. And the second time I was just
like, fucking annoyed. And then the third time, I
totally called the dudes bluff because it was in a fucking, he
was in the Barnes and Noble parking lot in Longate, like in
this suburb of the suburb. And now it's just like, you're

(12:57):
gonna fucking shoot me at noon on a Saturday in fucking
Ellicott City. I was like, get the fuck out of
here. Yeah, I was like, get out of my
car. You ain't got in the fall.
Yeah, I was like, you're not doing shit.
Yeah, he didn't bitch. Yeah, he didn't do anything.
I I took, I took like the drugs.I took the money.
I was like get the fuck out of here.
Yeah, I was, I I was so high also that I was just like, I
like looked at the guy and I waslike, seriously, bro?
Yeah. He was just like this is.
He was like, yeah, give me everything.

(13:18):
I was like, you know who the fuck I am?
Yeah. And I'm like, I don't give a
fuck to you. Are used to be a little white
bitch. All the shit out.
And I dropped my ex's name and they were like, holy fuck, yeah.
And they were just like here. Yeah, here's your shit.
It's on us. Let your boy know we're sorry.
And I rolled out. But that's also like the level
of insanity that you were. Like we were all in.
It's like we had a weapon. A You know, we were this far

(13:38):
away from death and we're just like, whatever.
Don't care, whatever. Yep, I wasn't.
I didn't even get scared. Like I look back now doing the
step work in the program that I work in the program and they ask
have you ever been in in a situation?
Like mortal danger. Absolutely.
More than one time, right? More than one time.

(13:59):
And it the fact that it doesn't didn't phase me like is is scary
to me now, but. Yeah, I'm just like, wow, I was
really insane. Like, it was insane.
But I did. I loved the lifestyle for a long
time. I embraced it.
I took everything that came along with it.
But eventually, when I got that first hit of crack cocaine, my
whole world changed. And like, all through that act

(14:21):
of using time, we were in and outside of the ruins of
recovery, in and out, in and out.
I still didn't have a problem, by the way, Of course, it was
just my ex who had the problem. If he got clean, I was good.
Yeah, you. Were just having fun doing.
What? He was just having fun.
Guilty. By association.
Yeah, definitely. But once I got like the group

(14:42):
that we hung out with, they werelike, your girl loves coke too
much. Yeah, never, ever let her smoke.
And then one day he went to cop.He was getting some Santis and a
couple other things and I was waiting outside and I was like,
well, don't go in there and fucking come out here.
Hi. Shit on crack, right?
Well, he went in, one of our friends were overdosing.
So he handled that. He was handling that situation,

(15:04):
the ice bags, all that stuff. This is prior to when it was OK
to call 911. It was prior to Narcan.
It was prior to all the. Oh yeah, I've.
Done the ice bath for people. Yeah, Prior to, you know, all
the initiatives that, you know, I know that Marilyn has taken to
help prevent because of the lineof work that I'm in now, but.
And it comes out high as shit. And I was like, really, I was

(15:27):
already high on on powder. So I walked in and I demanded
that my one friend give it to me.
And she's like, so the first time I ever smoked crack was
just to piss off my boyfriend. I'm.
Going to smoke? Crack out of spite spitefully
did, and it was the most amazingfeeling.
Dirty my life. The dirtiest feeling at the same

(15:47):
time though. Yes.
I mean, I was like, Oh my God, Ican't believe I did that.
But at the same time, it was just wonderful.
It got dirty the more I did it. I'm glad I never smoked.
It was the grossest drug I probably.
Oh no dude, no duster. Duster is.
So much. Well, duster, duster's like.
I dude. Duster is that type of drug

(16:07):
where it's like you go into like.
Piece of shit. Like the last time I was going
to do it, I was like, I I hate everything about myself.
I've explained that one story toyou where like, I was at like
the copycat building when I was like 18.
We were going to buy like coke and like, we were doing like
coke and oxys and like someone like, you know, was smoking like
an oxy and then like they start sniffing Sharpies.

(16:29):
And that was like where the group was just like, whoa, wow,
guys, why? What the fuck is going on here?
Sharpies one of these. Fucking reactions.
The same as ours, right? We're smoking oxys and doing.
I'm out of here, the Sharpies and was like, wow, what the
fuck's going? On here, Yeah, Get out.
Of here, like one of the craziest things.
I was like when you think you'relike doing coke and then you

(16:53):
actually wind up doing crystal meth.
That's the worst. Then you're up for three.
Days. I've never had that.
Oh my God, I've had it happen and it's horrible.
It's the worst, it's the worst and you just keep freaking
sniffing the crystal. Meth.
I don't understand why I can't go to sleep.
Yeah, and the next thing you know, everybody's against you,
demons are coming out of the walls and your boyfriend's
throwing you out of where you'reat, and you're like fucked up

(17:15):
for three days and don't know where to go.
It's crazy. Yeah, meth is Yeah.
Glad I never Nope it. Wasn't a it wasn't a choice, you
know, Yeah, luckily I didn't find that fun.
So it was never something that Iwent back to, you know, and like
the bonfires we used to have in my house, we used to have E
parties at my house and like rolling parties at my house and

(17:36):
stuff like that. But.
So you smoke crack out of spite.Yeah, smoke crack out of spite.
And then I went to do a smoke crack powder wasn't good enough
anymore. Really.
Absolutely. See I'm I'm the total I like.
I hated crack so much. I just want it powder like I was
just like. I think it was the sniffing
action though. I loved the the habit of
sniffing anything, so maybe thatwas why.

(17:59):
But I always felt it was dirty. I don't know why.
And it like, you know, when you're smoking crack, there's
like this moment where you're like, am I about to have a heart
attack? Like you don't really have that
with coke as much. You know, you're like, OK, I'm
fine after this line, but after the hit I'm like, wait, am I
going to be able to breathe after this?
Now see, like for me, when I would, I would get that rush,

(18:21):
but then I would be really calm and a lot of people weren't.
Calm. Do you have ADD?
Yeah. OK, there you go.
So a lot of people. You were just self medicating.
You're not at it totally self medication.
I would just be calm. I could like, color, I could
paint. I could just, you know, listen
to music. And then, like, my ex would be
like trying to be through the walls and people were coming
through the ceilings. It was like two different
experiences. But like, eventually it just all

(18:44):
kind of came crashing down. Of course, you know, my house
got raided. He pulled a gun on somebody on
New Year's Eve one year. And I had been clean for I went
on. And I had been abstinent, let me
say, for about two weeks at thatpoint and was really fighting,
not going out because I would struggle with, like, using and
not using, going back and forth like all of us do or everyone

(19:07):
that I've met anyway. And yeah, waking up to a SWAT
team around your house, it's insane.
Sucks. Yep.
Yeah, Yep. And you know, like my youngest
son at the time, he was like 12,and he opened the front door.
Aw fuck. That's, you know, and they
wanted, they went to shoot my dog and and my youngest son not

(19:30):
knowing any better because he's not he very suburban lifestyle,
very quiet, very country. Yeah, do himself on the dog.
Thank God. So he was able to stop them from
shooting the dog because we havea pit lab.
And of course, they immediately catch the dog.
But, you know, at that time, like, my house had no heat.

(19:51):
My furnace had went up. I was it was dead winter.
I was heating my house with a kerosene heater.
I look back now, it was just insanity.
Yeah. With a kerosene heater.
Yeah, insane. Sketchy.
Yep. I mean, that's what you do in a
band. That's some, Yeah.
That's the way my dad one time heated the garage that I was
living in, but the kerosene started to burn too high.

(20:13):
So there were just large amountsof black soot that just started
coming up into my you remember my old place, the entire
ceiling, when I came downstairs,it was black from the kerosene
heaters. Like that's.
Oh, man, you got lucky. That shit's like you.
Just got to change the ring inside that paper ring so, you

(20:34):
know, go away. She knows, all right.
Yeah, that means that paper ringthat's inside is done.
See, I'll let him know that. But yeah, I mean, I don't know,
like, it's just like looking back, trying to put it all into
words is just overwhelming because I never thought that

(20:54):
that would be who I became, and I never thought that I would put
a man or drugs above my children.
And I did for many years. I had a lot to make amends for
with my children. My oldest son was offered a
scholarship to diesel mechanic school and he told me he didn't

(21:16):
want to go and he wasn't interested in it.
And then once I got clean, he let me know that he didn't go
because he had to stay to protect his brother because I
was too high all the time. So that made me feel like shit
as a mom, you know, at this timeI'm like a single mom with a
move in boyfriend pretty quicklywho I thought was the shit who
actually was a piece of. Shit, boyfriend.
I've never heard that before. Yeah.
That's fun. Yeah.

(21:36):
He, like, just moved in and he, like, he came home with me one
night and he never left. He came home with me on
Halloween. You know, now that I'm we never
left. Looking back at it, I I was that
guy a couple. Times he never left, you know
and like. It's kind of just like a stray
cat. It's like, Oh well, he's here
now alright, I guess I have to feed him.
Yeah, I didn't want to believe. I was just like, yeah, finally,
like, you know, But the lifestyle that came with him was

(21:59):
insane. And of course, it wasn't his
choice. It was my choice.
I know that now. I don't blame him for any of it.
But it had gotten so bad that like, we had this.
I got, I don't even know where to get like how many times he
went to rehab, how many times I came back into the rooms of NA
just trying to get it because I couldn't go to rehab.

(22:20):
I had two kids. You know, that's one of the
things in our society today thatI think they're finally starting
to address but hasn't been readily available, is that there
are lots of parents who need help.
Yeah, and can't go and get the help they need because they
don't have place for their children.
That's a good point. So I just went back to the rooms
of NA. I went to a meeting last night,

(22:41):
right? And it was in a small it was
across the street in this old white church, not usually where
it's held. And this little white church is
one of the first rooms that I ever went into.
And one of the first guys that Imet was in that meeting.
And it was like a total flashback of me going to this
meeting and standing outside drunk talking to this guy who
four years later wound up being my boss for a certain amount of
time. Oh, that's funny.

(23:01):
Right. But like just looking back at
like the in and out, in and out,in and out.
And like I told myself I was going to get clean because he
went off to rehab again and I was going to get clean because I
didn't want to be the crackhead when he came home.
You know, I wanted to be that wholesome.
I was a 1950s mom and wife for 20 years.
You know, like I cooked, I cleaned, I, I took care of
everyone. It was my life.

(23:23):
I just it got old after a while like the drinking and the and
the and the anger with my ex andlooking now I'm like that was
cake compared to this shit. I put myself through after that.
So I went back into the rooms that didn't work.
I wound up he came home, we bothused again together.
You know, it was my birthday, my37th birthday.

(23:46):
I had Ravens tickets that morning.
I woke up with 1/5 of Ciroc nextto my bed.
Needless to say within 25 minutes I needed to go cop.
I handed my Ravens tickets to myson said here you go.
I'm just going to stay home and by the grace of my higher power
in some way I went. I ended up sitting on the side
of 695, passed out of my front seat and I got a DUI for

(24:10):
sleeping on the side of the road.
Yep. Yep.
Oh yeah, yeah, that's I've I've heard about that before.
You have to move to the other side of.
The yeah, I know that now. I threw my keys over there, but
I didn't move my ass over there.You've got.
To move yourself over there and then you're OK.
I, I remember when I worked at Sam Goody, I, I went in for a
morning shift one time and like the assistant manager got a DUI

(24:31):
that way and like man that sucks.
See, I always. Sleep in the backseat of my
Pontiac Vibe like said that. You're vibing in the backseat of
the Pontiac Vibe. You had to.
You had to so you could at leastcurl up a little bit.
Yeah, so my ex, he tried to stopme from leaving when I was
using. I became very physically
abusive, so I just kind of like.An abusive redhead?

(24:55):
No way. Really, I got very physically
abusive. I wouldn't you know, and I just
basically beat my way out the front door.
And yeah, I still to this day, it's a blur.
I just remember being taken out of my car.
And you know, this is the tape Iplay back every time I ever
think that I want to use again is the fact that when I was
being taken out of my car on theside of 95 I was covered in

(25:20):
vomit and urine in the middle ofthe winter.
And a tank top and a pair of spandex.
No shoes, my hair and a ghetto ass bun.
I don't remember what the policeofficer looked like.
I just remember the handcuffs being put on and being put in
the back of a car. I still to this day do not know
what police precinct I went to. I still don't know when I agreed

(25:41):
to do a you know a blow. But I blew a .18 like 2 hours
after passing that on the side of the road, so God only knows.
And I had to have my ex boyfriend's mom at that time.
We were still together. She actually came and picked me
up and I was the good one, the one that was going to save her
son. Such a great woman for him that
that was very humbling. Of course I got the DUI, wound

(26:03):
up having to take all the classes, get the blower in my
car and I swore we'd never use again.
And I violated my blower one time.
Finally, I went into the rooms Ihad seen this woman for.
Like, I went back to the room, seen this woman for many, many
years of me coming in and out, and that was it.

(26:27):
I asked her to be my sponsor. And who is it?
Jessica Matthews. Oh.
OK. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Yeah, so I asked her to be my sponsor.
I did have a sponsor prior to her, but we never had that
connection. And that's on me because I
didn't want it. I wasn't ready to surrender yet.
But yeah, once I asked her to bemy sponsor, I just started

(26:50):
digging. He had went off again to jail.
It wasn't rehab this time, it was jail.
And I had like four months clean.
He had came home, he had to do ashort stint that time, and then
COVID hit. So I had like four months clean
when COVID hit and I was still involved with an active addict.

(27:10):
So I lived in addiction clean for 2 1/2 years.
Any and everything that could possibly happen in my home did
the chaos, the drugs, the alcohol, the weapons.
Now mind you all of this my children are being subjected to
the full time. And I forgot to mention that
during that time I did lose my original house that I had on

(27:31):
five acres that I was paying $900 a month for.
I had to sell that due to my addiction.
I was spending all my money and now I live in a townhouse that
cost me $2000 a month. So I did lose like my kids
grandfather built that house andI lost that house, the house
that they grew up in. So that was like something else
that kind of shook me. But yeah, 2 1/2 years into

(27:53):
recovery, you know, I did everything my sponsor told me.
I got a Home group when COVID hit, we created a meeting.
It still runs to this day, Monday through Saturday.
It's a women's meeting. I was of service every morning
in that meeting. I took her suggestions and I've
had like three other home groupsduring that time.
Did you say Monday through Saturday?
Yes. You have a Home group that's

(28:14):
every day. It is no longer my Home group
due to the fact that I've went back to work.
But yes, that was a meeting and I had a service position every
day. There's a women's meeting that
meets every day. On Zoom, yes.
Wow, I, I didn't know that. That's fascinating.
I mean, I knew about like, you know, the old like, noon
meetings that would meet every day, but I didn't know there
were other meetings that did that.

(28:34):
Yeah, they meet Monday through Saturday and then the reason I
didn't meet on Sunday is becauseher and I had a like my sponsor
and I had another Home group on Sunday, but her and I started
that meeting. It's still kicking ass today.
It's awesome. A lot of women are finding
recovery in that meeting. I pop in every now and again,
but I became a service in that like three or four other home
groups because I literally was like in a meeting with my

(28:58):
partner doing the Baltimore leaning 2 feet away from me with
a crack stem sitting on the floor.
So that was it. Was I under talk about it but it
was exhausting yeah I mean the chaos my bedroom always look
like a bomb went off like 3:00 Jada kissed meetings in the
bathroom with himself that's. Hilarious.

(29:20):
You know, like all of it, the, the people coming through my
house at any time, the disrespect, the oh, I can save
him attitude. And then finally like after
doing some step work and after like really, really having a
solid group of women in my corner and then finding another
gun in my home after that my home had been raided.

(29:41):
Like my children went through it.
My oldest one was held when a felony stop in my vehicle that
day. He was held for over 20 hours.
My youngest one was put in handcuffs and and sat in the
house to watch all the drama that went down and his home get
flipped completely upside down when I found that gun 2 1/2
years into my recovery because again, like I didn't want to be

(30:05):
alone. I still wanted that man's
attention. Finally had enough, and I called
my sponsor and we did whatever we had to do.
I wound up having to go and get a protective order on him and
actually show pictures of when he had choked me out and knocked
me out. Like early in our recovery, like
early in our relationship when we were both high.
I had to use those pictures. And luckily, the lady at the

(30:26):
Commissioner's Office, she had seen me there so many times and
I was denied the protective orders that she walked me
through how to do the protectiveorder correctly this time.
And he was removed from the homeat like 3:00 AM on a Thursday
night. And it was the hardest thing I
ever did because I lived life bySt.

(30:47):
Code up to that point. Even in recovery, I still had
certain St. Code values and morals.
You don't call the cops. You don't, no matter what.
But I had to. And then when he was leaving, he
was begging, he was crying, you know, and I was hiding.
I couldn't. I've seen him once since then

(31:07):
and it's been three years. Awesome.
Good. So.
All right. Well, we definitely have some
questions for you. Eric, would you like to start?
Well, just a quick is he the father of your children too?
No. No, OK, that's what I thought.
I was just making sure. OK, I will start.
I I have to ask about the crazy part of it.

(31:32):
You are like really late starter, so you started using at
36. No, she she went that prom on
acid, No. No, no, no, no, no.
There's a huge difference between taking like a flower
drour, flower power drug and then like, you know, smoking

(31:52):
some crap. My hardcore using started
between 36 and 37. Wow.
How old we are now like that just blows my mind.
Dude if I sleep wrong my body feels like shit.
How? Did smoke crack and I'm like oh
God. So.

(32:12):
So Carrie, how do you feel aboutthat?
Because that's like, I can only imagine, like, especially when I
used to go to meetings a lot allthe time, like a lot when I was
younger. Like I would always remember
hearing people who were older and being like, you know, I, I
start using when I was older, I was like, how much would that
fuck you up 'cause like a lot ofit's like, you know, oh man,
I've been doing this for blah, blah, blah.
And like, that's how you build up all your cred and you know,

(32:34):
whatever, you know, I've been using for X-Men number of years.
Like how much did it fuck you uplike that You waited so long
'cause you had to have thought about?
It yeah, I'm grateful one, that I waited so long that my kids
were older and not like six or seven years old and I wasn't
smoking crack when my young whenmy oldest was going through
cancer 'cause he was he had cancer when he was younger.

(32:56):
But you know, when I first came around into the rooms of NA,
that's the program that I work is NAI didn't feel like I really
belong there, that I didn't havethat cred that you were talking
about. But then the more I worked the
program and the more I went to meetings and the more I involved
myself into the fellowship of our program, whether I started

(33:18):
at 36 or 16, I'm still an addict.
And we have the same underliningreasons why we used.
And I'm no different than someone who started at 16 or 17,
you know, But I don't know how Ididn't start using earlier.
I think if I would have had access to those drugs or if I
would have been introduced to them, it definitely would have
happened. But I was so isolated and and

(33:41):
not around those things. What was that inciting incident
like? What do you?
Mean like that first time that you really like started using
hard drugs, like like, was therea sense of relief or was there a
sense that like you found it finally or was there like, you
know, what was that? Because like, it's a much, it's

(34:02):
a much different feeling findinga drug at 36 and it is finding
it at 16. I just like the fact that I
didn't have to feel anything. That's perfect.
I like the fact that like all the drama and the chaos in my
life, if I was high, my boyfriend and I got along
better. Life was great.

(34:23):
It was just the escape. It was.
It was. Yeah.
And finding it later in life andtrying to manage that while
having a career, you know, as anexecutive assistant for an
interior design company and trying to go to work.
And, like, after having, like, aBender for three days, they woke
up on Monday morning, you know, and not even woke up, but the
birds start chirping and you're like, fuck, I got to go to work.

(34:45):
It was definitely different because like, from talking to
other addicts, like I had that responsibility of an adult as a
mom. I had to pay the rent, buy food,
make sure the kids got the school, all while getting high
and smoking crack in the bathroom at work.
So yeah, like starting later. I always feel like, like I when
I first got here, I was telling David, like, I just don't feel

(35:06):
like I have a story. Like, I don't have this amazing
crazy story, but my story was crazy for the short amount of
time that it was. You know, the insanity doesn't
have to take 10 years. Oh, yeah.
You know, the progression of thedisease doesn't have to take
1020 years to hit bottom. For me, it took four or five
years. Yeah.
You can. You can slowly burn a bridge

(35:27):
down or you can blow that motherfucker.
That motherfucker off, like I just went in and just started
blowing shit. Up dynamite.
Fuck this thing. Yeah, like it was just all in
from the moment I got off work to the to the time I, you know,
and then the weekends it was on.I left my oldest son to stay
home with my youngest son. Hey, big one, you got the little
one. Cool.
Yeah, I was gone, Mama, gone. And I always thought too, like,

(35:50):
I always thought, like, crack didn't have a smell, so my kids
could never tell when I was getting high.
And then I found out after I gotcleaned that it has a very
distinct smell. And I was like, shit, they knew
the whole time. Yeah, right.
I got a question because you this just came up.
So you talked about, like, the birds waking you up.
And Erica's talked about this, how he used to fucking hate

(36:13):
birds. He just fucking hated them, just
the sound of them. And now he has, like, window
boxes where he's attracting all the birds to his house then.
Yeah. And so that's my question.
So it like, is there something that, like, you hated doing in
recovery or in addiction that like, your life has turned and
you have a different perspectiveon it now?
And you're like, you know, I actually really like that.

(36:34):
I mean like I would hate when the sun came up and I would hate
when the birds start chirping now.
That's the worst. The birds, The birds talking in
the morning. I'm.
Just like, shut the fuck up. It's not that time.
Like, it's not that time, you know?
No, I didn't go another 24 hours.
Holy shit. I said I wasn't going to do this
again, right? I said I wasn't going to go all
night, you know? Yeah, I hated the fucking birds.

(36:55):
But now, like, I love nothing more than being awake to see a
sun, like a sunrise in the morning, to hear the birds.
And like one of the things that I took for granted, which it may
seem minimal to some, it's just the breeze across my face.
Nice. It's one of the most
exhilarating feelings for me. Like, I just love to stand and

(37:16):
feel Mother Earth blow across myface and I'm alive and I'm not
high. So yeah, for me, like, I hated
the birds. I hated the wind.
I hated all of it. Yeah.
Because the wind blew my coke somewhere.
Ohh Yeah. And you know, if the wind came
through and blew my coke everywhere, I was pissed.
Yeah. So now those are just things I

(37:36):
love. Like I love the beach.
I used to hate the beach becauseI would.
I don't know, but I get. Sand in my lines.
Yeah, like, basically, yeah. Like I know bullshit, like I
just fucking couldn't get with it, but oh.
My God, I couldn't imagine snorting beach beach sand.
Oh. Bird.
Oh my God I think I've snorted way worse than beach sand in my
time. That sounds awful.
Oh God. Wow.

(37:57):
Yeah. Ow exactly what you got, Eric.
I'm sorry, I'm just thinking about that real quick.
Hold on. Snorting beach sand.
Yeah, it would hurt. That's like snorting cat litter
or smoking cat litter so bad. Like I'm pretty.
Like Tylenol hurt. I'm pretty sure I smoked cat
litter, you know, like. I don't doubt that at.
All Yeah, I don't even. Think it was like a choice.

(38:18):
You were like, whatever. Well, no.
You're thinking about it like these drop crack on the ground
and like it looks really close to cat litter, you know?
'Cause you were using like the crystal cat litter weren't?
You is this math or is this? Cat.
I don't know, I'm smart anyway. All right.
So you mentioned that you have achild in the rooms, which at

(38:41):
first I didn't think you were that old to have a child in the
rooms, but. Older or younger which?
Is my oldest. Our oldest.
OK, So what is that like having,you know, like I, I can't even
imagine at this point, but what is it like having a son in the
rooms while you're in the rooms?This is his second time in the
rooms. It's the first time I don't want

(39:03):
to go too in depth in his story so it's not mine to tell and I
respect his recovery and and hisprogram.
But he stayed for a while and hedecided to leave just like many
of us do. And then he had a life changing
experience. He was in a very horrible car
accident with his best friend since pre-K and his best friend

(39:25):
was injured. His car was totaled and he had
to suffer the consequences and he blew a .15.
He was charged with a DUI leaving the scene of an
accident. Several other things I hate that
I see me repeating and my son, you know, like thank God that I

(39:55):
came into the rooms when I did. And I have the knowledge that I
have now to guide him through that process and to help him
through like all his legal stuff.
But one thing that I wouldn't dowas pay for his lawyer.
I showed him how to get a publicdefender, but told him that if
he didn't feel comfortable with the public defender that he

(40:16):
would have to get a lawyer. You know, he's on probation.
Now we have a blower in the car again because his car was
totaled. So he has, he uses mine.
So it's a humbling experience for me with almost five years
keen to clean to get in my car and blow a blower to start.
But like watching like the firsttime he was in the rooms, I was
too involved. This time, like when I came in,

(40:41):
I was on probation. He comes in, he's on probation.
I hear from him what I heard from myself when I first got
here. I'm just doing this to stay out
of jail. I'm hoping that the body keeps
coming in. The mind follows.
I mean, he's got almost nine months clean.
He has his own network, his own program, his own people.
He goes to intensive outpatient.It's very hard as a mom to be

(41:07):
hands off in your child's recovery and then like when they
ask for your for help for something you have to say, do
you want mom or do you want NA mom, right?
Like, do you want mom or do you want me to commit you with what
I've learned in my recovery in the last five years?
That might be the title. Eric, do you want mom or NA mom?

(41:28):
It's just it's like two different things, Like, Oh yeah,
totally. As as a mom, I'm all you
defending you constantly. As an NA mom, I'm calling you
and you're shit and I'm going totell you where you're wrong and
you need to take a check and look at yourself.
But you know, we butt heads, butwe get along great.
We have a bond because of the disease of addiction now that I

(41:51):
was hoping to break before it went to the next generation.
It's scary. It's very scary.
And then like in my area, unfortunately or fortunately or
however you want to look at it, even with almost five years
clean, like you're considered tobe a predecessor.
So then he's coming in behind me.

(42:12):
And we tried very hard to keep him and I separate.
But eventually people started finding out that he was my son.
I mean, you can't deny it. He looks like me.
Oh, you're Carrie son. And like, we had to have the
conversation where I just want to be known as me, right?
I just don't want to be known asyour son.
And so I would introduce him to people, but not as my child.

(42:34):
And if he chose to tell them, that's fine.
I mean, now we have, like, cookouts at the house and things
like that. And most of the people in our
network know that. But people.
But I don't go around and being like, oh, you know, like, you
know, you know, you know. All right.
I did ask you if you knew him, but you said you did.
I didn't give a name. I didn't say anything.
I try to respect his anonymity and his program to the highest

(42:55):
extent because when I put my hands in it and I try to control
it, it's over. So I don't know if that makes
sense, but it's it's a lot to even explain.
Oh yeah. Eric, by the way, why don't we
have tissues on this table? What the hell is the?
Matter. With you, I I don't know.
I pulled it back in. I'm good.
I know you were like looking andI was like, damn it, we don't.
Have any tissues now? I was looking to the side to

(43:16):
tear myself together, so I didn't host it.
We've had so many people crying in those chairs, including me,
and it's like, why don't we havetissues?
Yeah, I could definitely cry about that.
Yeah. Oh yeah.
Like when my son called and toldme that he was in that accident.
Yeah. And I prayed and prayed and
prayed that he would just stop the drinking and stop the

(43:37):
smoking and stop the using and lead by example, right?
So that's all I could do. All right, we're going to switch
to a fun question. Yeah, please.
We're going to do a happy question.
Well, weird, weird question. Happy question.
You are a ginger. I am.
OK. How much of, like, have you ever
been teased for being a ginger? Absolutely.

(43:58):
OK. And so you've heard, like, you
know, all the gingers have no souls.
And it's like all sorts of like,like I said, I made the joke
earlier, like, oh, a violent ginger.
What? Like, I've met a lot of, you
know, very handsy redheaded women.
Like they're like how much like quote UN quote stigma about red

(44:19):
headed women is true because youknow, they're they're feisty,
they're scrappy, they're loudmouth.
Like how? How much of it is true pre?
Recovery. All of it.
OK. All right.
Pre recovery, all of it. Now that I'm in recovery, I'm
completely opposite. I'm calm for the most part.
Yeah, I can get upset, but I have tolerance today.

(44:41):
I can allow grace. But you know, like, you know
Sheila. Yeah, I know, Sheila.
Sheila is still, yeah, like, like very much so.
I love. Sheila, I love.
Sheila is my home grade. I absolutely love her.
But she is still like, sometimesyou're like, OK, let's dial it
from like an 8 to like a six. People tell me all the time that
what they love about me and it'll fall into the typical
ginger thing, is that I don't sugarcoat shit.

(45:01):
Yeah, what you see is what you get.
I don't got time for your drama,your bullshit, or your attitude.
I don't know why it like it is like with redheaded, like
redheaded women, but like they're just intense women.
They are. Yeah, like I've been told by my
network that people aren't intimidated by me.
They're afraid to talk to me. And I'm like, why?

(45:22):
And they're just like, because you say it like it is, and
people don't want to hear that shit.
And I'm like, well, I'm not going to lie to you.
You know, like some of my sponsees don't like when I tell
it like it is. It is what it is.
You know, lying to you is going to kill you.
That's the one thing that I definitely am.
I can be feisty. I yeah, I can do all of that.
But I guess it all depends on the individual that I'm having

(45:45):
that relationship with because Ican become very submissive in
other areas and very quiet. But being in recovery has
definitely changed how feisty. I will never throw in a man
again. I will never fight a physical
fight. And that's absolutely necessary
again. It's just not in me anymore.
You know, like I had someone go off or not go off but say

(46:06):
something personal to me in a group conscience in a Home group
recently. And the old me would have told
that person to go get fucked andshove it up his ass.
And the new me just didn't say anything.
And he realized that he hurt my feelings and he came up and he
hugged me, but I mean, I didn't hug him back.
That was my best way of like. Dude in in recovery.

(46:27):
I told one of the sweetest dudesthat I've known for a dozen
years now to go fuck himself andI threw the the meeting keys at
him. Matt M.
Oh yeah, Matt and Allison. Yeah, and I, I love Allison.
Allison is the one who really got me in the recovery.
You should listen to her. Podcast.
Oh my gosh. Matt and Allison's podcast are
both great. Yeah, she, I was at a meeting

(46:48):
with my ex and it was they were going to 34th St. in Baltimore
at Christmas time. David was celebrating, if you
remember David, and she insistedthat I get on that bus and it
was on like Donkey Kong from there.
Nice. Yeah, Allison, Yeah.
Yeah. My ex was really good friends

(47:09):
with an ex of hers, so we went through some things together
early in my recovery. Yeah, Nice.
I think I might have still actively been using.
Actually, I was. I was actively using when her
friend passed away, so yeah. I'm gonna ask a second question.
Eric, go ahead. OK, so this is a question I just

(47:31):
answered recently, so I'm finishing up my 12th step.
How have you seen the message working in your life?
And for anybody who doesn't knowthe messages that any addict can
stop using, lose the desire to use and find a new way to live.
So how have you like seen that live like working in your life?
I found the desire, I stopped using and I have a new life,

(47:55):
like a whole new life. You know, they say it's a life
beyond your wildest dreams. And sometimes the dreams don't
have to be huge. Like I'm grateful every day to
just wake up, to be making the daily amends to my children, to
be working. See the sunrise, hear the birds.
Oh yeah, all of that. And to be working in a field

(48:16):
where I'm able to take my training and my recovery,
combine the two and make a difference.
You know where I work as a peer recovery specialist for the
county now. Nice.
Never thought I would get that government job they all talked
about out here. Howard County.
Oh nice. I see.

(48:37):
Easier county? Baltimore County.
That's an intense job. I don't know I'm.
Sure, it's very intense. Or Howard.
County. Howard County is like, you don't
see the shit. Exactly.
Oh yeah, Howard, you don't see this shit.
I have a really, really nice rugthat we sweep this under.
Right. You don't see this shit, but I
see this. Shit, I grew up in Howard
County. I know.
I fucking like yesterday had a 67 year old man with three

(48:57):
children who unfortunately lost his job.
He lost his apartment, he's homeless and nobody trying to
help him and I had to help advocate for him and like he's
texted me this morning and like my job is non-stop.
I mean, I do have basic hours, but my clients have constant
contact with me like I've had I've gotten homeless people off

(49:18):
the street to go to treatment, you know, and like you know,
like I said, like the treatment world is changing and thank God,
but not fast enough. But that's why I like the
program has changed my perspective when addicts because
like when I used to look at my dad, I would always ask, why
can't you quit? Why and don't you love me

(49:38):
enough? Ain't I enough?
What is it about me that you can't put down your drugs?
And now like learning that this is a disease and not a moral
deficiency, right? I suffer from the disease of
addiction and being able to takethat and do something positive
with it. That's what the program's given
to me in the time that I've beenhere.
It's giving me back self respect.
It's giving me back the ability to just be myself and I don't

(50:04):
give a fuck if you don't like me.
I'm just me. Love me or leave me, I don't
care. I don't have to fit in with you.
I don't have to people please for you anymore.
There's. There's the gender.
There's not, yeah. There's not enough words that
could. That or or expression that could
say what the program has done for me.

(50:25):
There's no way it has saved my life.
And when I was answering that question, I was like, how do I
answer this? I was like, it's, you know, it's
something in 365 every day for, you know, 12 years.
Like, how do I, how do you quantify that into an answer?
I'm alive. Yeah, I'm, yeah, I'm alive.
I'm married. I have a kid.
Like, I have a job, I have a career.

(50:47):
Like I pay my bills on time. I show up and like people call
me and I'm like want to have me around and like, Yep, it's
there's just, there's too many ways to answer that question.
People help and you help withoutexpecting or wanting anything in
return. Yep.
That's, you know, it's just it'sa different way of life.
Yeah. I mean, like, if our society in

(51:07):
a whole could adapt a 12 step program, I think our world would
be in a much better place. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah.
That's very poignant. Especially this week.
Yep. Yep.
So like, you know, I, I stick very closely to the traditions
and to the spiritual principles of this program, even outside of
the rooms of NAI, won't discuss certain things with family

(51:28):
members. I won't go into depth with
sponsees who want to talk about certain things because I don't
want to not like you because of something.
Some difference, right? I don't want to judge you
because we have a difference of opinion somewhere or somehow
this program gives me a road mapto live a life that I never
thought possible when I was using.

(51:49):
I never thought I would get out of the grips of it all right.
What you got, Eric? This is my last question, so no.
Well, you mentioned that your son is in remission from cancer.
That's obviously a huge fear of any parent.
So how was that experience of going through, I mean, leukemia?

(52:15):
Like I, I, I know our, our host Carly has a situation like that
with her niece right now. And yeah, it has.
It has to be terrifying. She's in remission.
Oh, great, great, great. She is doing very well.
That makes me happy. But yeah, how is how is like
everything now and how was goingthrough that experience back

(52:37):
then? I mean, he is in full remission
now. Any and every time he gets sick,
I get scared, even at 26 years old.
I think that's one of the reasons why, you know, like I
have people in my network that feel I need to push him out of
the nest. But my son almost died and.

(53:08):
That's just really hard for me to talk about because every time
I think about it, like I just thank God that I wasn't in
active addiction during that time.
Like he was in my mission like three times.
And his cancer came back. He had a really rare form and he
got the bone marrow transplant and then he had like graft,

(53:28):
graft versus Toast disease wherehe was fighting the transplant.
Oh, I know that's hurt, you know, and the doctor's telling
you to go and like, I still likethe pain.
It just, it's a lot like I can instantly, I'm sorry, I'm crying
this, I can't hold back. If anybody ever asked me about
that question. Like being told by the doctor
that you need to go home and make arrangements for your 6

(53:49):
year old fucking son. Yeah, doctors suck.
And I honestly believe that the only reason that my son is alive
today is because my ex-husband, who is an atheist, fell to his
knees and begged for my son to live.
This is the one and only time myex-husband ever prayed.

(54:11):
And that gives me a stronger connection with my higher power
today in recovery because like, even my my other son, he's 22,
he has an immune deficiency disorder.
Yeah. And he could have died.
You know, it's like, but yeah, watching.
Which immune deficiency disorder?
It's an immune deficiency disorder.

(54:32):
It's called hereditary angioedema.
So basically any stress or physical harm could cause his
body to swell. He has A1 chromosome immune
deficiency. We found this out because he
woke up and looked like he had astroke at like, I think it was

(54:54):
10 years old. His face was completely draped.
But yeah, like I live in constant fear that.
I hate that you asked this question Eric.
God damn you. Well, I had to ask the question.
I live in constant fear that he that his that like he is
struggling to live a clean life and have a good life and it

(55:18):
would become a good man and thenthen his kids are going to come
back and take him out anyway. And that's my biggest fear, and
that's my biggest reservation. Yeah, but I know that I have a
network of women that this program has given me and a
network of men that using would be my last option.

(55:39):
I mean, it's fair that that's reservation, that's totally
fair. But yeah, like watching like my
son, like went through chemo andradiation.
And I just, like, one of the worst memories I have is like
walking through CVS when he was six years old and this old
fucker making some comment aboutthe way my son looked with all

(56:01):
this judgement. I wasn't a woman in recovery
then. So I told that man where he
could go. But yeah, like going back there
for it's, it's very easy for me to get emotional.
Yeah. And I'm sorry about that.
Don't. Be sorry.
But yeah, like a lot of people. I'm sorry asshole Eric to ask
that. Question A lot of people don't
understand like the bond that I like.

(56:22):
Some people think that I have like this crazy, weird bond with
my children, but like, I've almost lost both of my children.
Both of my children have almost died.
My children have almost lost me.I've almost died several times
in active addiction. I'm grateful to have my children
in my life. Do they need to grow up in
certain areas? Absolutely.

(56:43):
Do I wish there was a man in their life that could guide them
how I can't? Absolutely.
Their father's a piece of shit. I don't ever say that to them.
Yeah, you know, I say you need to love your father, especially
with the oldest one. Work the program and maintain
your relationship the best that you can.
Unless it's unhealthy for you. Yeah.
I mean, he works with his dad. But yeah, that's a loaded one.

(57:04):
Thanks. Yeah, way to go, Eric.
You're welcome. All right.
Well, I held back tears. That was very difficult.
I'm all out of questions as well.
So we'd like to thank Carrie forjoining us today.
Yeah, absolutely. Fantastic job.
We're going to give you one morequick minute to talk to anybody

(57:26):
out there needs to hear a message of hope and a message of
strength. What do you have to say directly
to them? Then any addicts seeking
recovery, you never die. That there is a way out.
Even when we feel that there's no way up, someone is always,
especially in my program, got a hand up?
Throw a hand out to lift me up. And you know, when you're ready,

(57:49):
just find the rooms. We're here to help you.
I'm here to help you. You know I'll do anything to
help anyone. Fantastic.
All right, thank you again for joining us.
Everybody out there saying thanks for listening, go to all
our social media outlets, Facebook, Instagram, Twitter,
Spotify, YouTube, like, share, subscribe.

(58:12):
If you want to, you know, becomepart of the Home group, please
join on Patreon because we are self supporting and need help
keeping the mics on. And here Podcast Recovery.
We're aiming to expand the sport.
So we are aiming to expand the scope and support for recovering
addicts. Accessibility and convenience of
of of services is paramount to combating addiction.

(58:32):
We work to bring the message of recovery to every addict,
wherever and whenever it is needed, and we believe that a
powerful voice of recovery should be obtainable, practical
and at the touch of a button. Every addict deserves to hear a
message of hope, and Podcast Recovery is here to provide it.
That was right off the top of myhead, Eric.
So that's pretty damn good. I wrote that six years ago.

(58:54):
That was pretty good. Yeah.
Everybody, thanks for joining us.
Carrie, love you. Thank you so much.
But most importantly, everybody out there.
Stay safe and stay clean.