Valerie A. - Bi-Polar - A Resevior of Sadness

Send us a text In this episode, Valerie A. shares her experience, strength, and hope. Podcast Recovery is a forerunner in digitally accessible addiction recovery support. We provide ease and convenience to any and all seeking a message of recovery and hope. By broadcasting the stories of recovering addicts, we act as a complement to all other recovery services. We exist to create a global foundation platform, so that any addict may hear a message of strength and hope. We contribute education...

Episode Transcript

(00:03):
Welcome back to Podcast Recovery, everyone.
We are your host, David O. And Eric V.
And today we're joined again by our very good friend Valerie.
How are you doing? I'm good.
How are you? I'm doing very well.
Eric is dying from the sinus. Outwards, yeah, there's
something going on like. Dude, I'm telling you, I I just
had the. Worst sinus and medi pod thing
that you're talking about, whichI used to take when I did drugs.

(00:26):
I would take water and like literally just like, like, you
know, snort water into my nose. Like I would just get a tissue
and I'd make it wet and I'd justbe like, and then you'd get all
that shit out of there. You know I'm didn't.
No one ever do that really. Discussed it about how you just
snorted into my ear. Yeah, it was horrible.
You hear that? You hear that?

(00:47):
Like, yeah. It is, God damn it.
Gives a lot of There's a lot of sinus stuff getting my.
Ear the Haktu. Oh my God.
I had got that, had to get that reference on the podcast because
we missed all of June and that was very much our June bingo
card. So anyway, anyway, moving on.
Is that is that Yiddish? Did you not?

(01:08):
Shut up. I'm just asking you shut up.
Where are you from though? Perry Hall.
Perry Hall. Yeah.
Oh yeah. First introduced to recovery.
In 2016. And how much clean time do you
have now? In four years, Perfect.
All right, so the topic of our episode today is a little bit

(01:29):
different. We are going to be talking about
mental health issues, especiallyif a very specific mental.
Health. Can I ask a question first?
A fun question? Yeah, I'm going to ask a fun
question first. So what's the difference between
Perry Hall and White Marsh? That's a great question.
I don't know what's the difference between Perry Hall,
White, Marsh, Nottingham, you know what I mean?
They're all. What's the difference?
Between, that's a. Different Dundalk.

(01:51):
There's a big difference betweenEssex and Dunham.
One has this shit planned and one doesn't and nobody wants to
claim. That's the difference.
No. Dundalk has claimed it.
It's theirs. They know they haven't.
But like Overly, I get the difference between Overly and
Perry Hall. Like, there's a big difference,
right? Like.
Mike Rowe went to Overly. Huh.
Mike Rowe, you went to overly high school.
Oh really? My my family was supposed to go

(02:11):
to overly and they all went to like my cousins all went to like
different like tech schools and stuff or Calvert Hall and stuff
'cause overly is like bad. Yeah, cuz you're rich snobs.
No, it's not true, David. How dare you?
OK, you're rich, just not snobs.OK, that's true.
I've always been, I've always wondered like cuz Perry Hall's

(02:33):
like north and then White Marsh is like that, you know, White
Marsh has them all and Perry Hall doesn't.
Is that the difference? I.
Guess honestly I don't really know.
I grew up there, but I don't really.
I don't the difference. Between the city and did drugs.
Yeah, Yeah. OK.
Go ahead, David. That was my question.
OK, fantastic. Thanks for the diversion.
Today we're talking about mentalhealth lower, specifically

(02:56):
bipolar disorder. And you know how you catch it?
How do you catch it? Like if it's a fucking cold?
I meant how do you diagnose it, how you figure it out all the,
all the insurance and outs of, you know, not recovering from
it. I caught the.
Managing. It I caught the mental health
bug back in the In the Alley 1500.

(03:19):
Shut up. And I'm going to turn it over to
Valerie so, you know, take it away.
OK, so I guess I don't know, I've never really like told my
story like out front like with the bipolar, which is like what
I'm really excited about. But but you know, when I was a
teenager, I kind of started noticing certain symptoms or

(03:43):
behaviors that and my doctor started noticing it as well, but
there wasn't really a diagnosis until I was a year clean the
first time. How old were you at that point?
I was like 20, yeah, about 20. So, you know, I'm exhibiting

(04:05):
like certain behaviors, like I'm, I'm depressed and then, and
then I'm manic or I'm exhibiting, exhibiting like
manic, you know, like symptoms. And then, yeah, it wasn't until
because I was so in the drugs and alcohol at that point that
it was kind of hard to distinguish whether or not it
was like an actual diagnosis or whether it was just the drugs

(04:27):
and alcohol. So so I went back to my
psychiatrist. You know, it was around a year
after, you know, I got cleaning this last for the first time and
and she gave me the diagnosis. And when when I was diagnosed, I
was like, damn. But then I was like, like, it

(04:49):
felt like a sigh of relief because like I knew what I was
struggling with on a daily basis, you know, So from that
point on, it's, it's been a lot of, you know, medication, it's
been a lot of therapy, it's beena lot of some psych ward stays

(05:12):
and, you know, even in sobriety.So you know.
And that's actually, it's reallyinteresting.
Another one of my good friends. Yeah.
In the last two weeks I've, I'vetwo people have called me from
psych wards. One of them off the fucking
rails in Utah. What he was saying to me on the
phone. I was like, Jesus fuck.
I was like, I I love you, Stay there for a while, you need some

(05:36):
help. And the other one, you know,
deals with the mental health andlike deep depression, stuff like
that. And they like, they just seemed
like they had gotten burnt out. And then they just, they were,
they were just crossed the line of what they could handle.
And that's when they went in andit was just like 2 completely
different stays. And the other person, you know,

(05:58):
they were out in five days. They were just like, OK, why are
you in here? Oh, well, I stopped taking my
meds. Oh, don't do that.
Don't do that. You hear a lot of people say
that like taking their meds is difficult.
OK, so I've talked to a lot of people, you know, with with
bipolar that say that it's difficult for them to take their
meds kind of when they're in that manic state where they feel

(06:21):
really good and like they don't think they need their meds and
all this stuff. But for me, it was more
difficult to take my meds when Iwas in a depressive state.
Or you. Take it one or two though, 11,
OK. Yeah, and at first I didn't know
what the difference was. And then my doctor was just
like, well, it's just the amountof manic episodes you have in a
year. So like, and I, I cycle very

(06:43):
quickly. So like it'll be a couple of
weeks depressed and then it'll be a couple of weeks manic, then
it'll be two months depressed and then it kind of fluctuates
so. What's your diagnosis there?
2 your your bipolar 2 see like Iso when I was in active
addiction, I had three psych ward stents and amongst those

(07:08):
the first one they were like oh you have borderline personality
disorder. I dude I was on uppers, Downers,
shit tons of hallucinogens. I have one friend who has
borderline and like they have borderline.
Yes, you can tell. I I do not, I do not it like it

(07:29):
was a misdiagnosis just based off the fact that I was in
absolute drug psychosis. And so, you know, a couple I 18
months later when I go back, they're like, yeah, we don't
think you're borderline. We think you're bipolar.
And then, you know, I ran with that for the last two years of

(07:51):
my active using and I like, and eventually it was just like, you
know, fuck these meds and just got off that.
And then, you know, crashed and burned, got clean and did 2-3
years of intensive therapy. And as I went along with that
therapist, they were like withinsix months, they were like,
you're definitely not borderline.
And then like six months after that, they're like, we don't

(08:13):
think you're bipolar either, butyou do have major depression,
which is entirely different. But they were just like, just
like you said, drugs can throw awrench into the whole like
process of diagnosing. Yeah, absolutely.

(08:33):
Back to you, sorry. So, you know, kind of like
talking more about the the mania, like I didn't really
recognize that it was an issue because I liked being manic, you
know, and I you gained. So much shit.
Done. Right.
I felt on top of the world like I could do anything.

(08:56):
I was doing multiple different projects at the same time.
Like, you know, I was talking really.
I actually. Have like a whole bunch of shit
down in manic phases in there and I'm.
Like oh good, check, don't. Have to ask that one.
Yeah. So, so, but now it got to the
point, you know, probably in thepast like 2 years where I
absolutely hated being manic. I, I hated it.

(09:17):
I dreaded it. So what's like, what's the
downside of manic phase? Cause yeah, you've you
technically feel happy and you might be getting a lot of done
be getting a lot done in your life and you seem super.
Productive. It's so unmanageable.
It's so unmanageable. And like for me, it's just this
like overwhelming feeling of being completely out of control.

(09:38):
Like I don't know what's going to come out of my mouth.
I don't know how fast I'm going to speak.
I don't know what I'm going to, you know, get into next.
I don't know if it's going to be, you know, it, it could be
dangerous. You know, I put myself in a lot
taking. Your.
Meds, right, right. And I put myself in a lot of
dangerous situations, you know, with the impulsivity and, and

(09:59):
all that stuff. But it kind of, I was talking to
somebody a couple weeks ago and,you know, she's bipolar too,
and. Bipolar 2 or.
Bipolar also also, yeah, bipolaralso.
And we were kind of talking about how your body almost goes

(10:22):
into this kind of trauma response.
Like once you're stable, like for me, like I'll just talk
about me for once I'm stable. And I start feeling even the
slightest bit of, Oh my gosh, maybe I'm going into a manic
episode. My body starts to react like
it's like it's a, it was a it's a traumatic experience, you
know, like it it, you know, is it's terrifying.

(10:44):
And something that we were kind of talking a little bit about
before this was the hallucinations with that come
along with bipolar. And I did not know that that was
a thing until I started experiencing them.
So until I started kind of like visual auditory, I would feel,

(11:06):
feel like somebody touched me or, you know, I would, you know,
feel my cat kind of graze my legs.
And then I would look over and she's on the other side of the
room and I'm like, Oh my gosh, like, am I, am I losing it right
now? And, you know, not that long
ago, it was like October or November, like I went into a
crisis center because I was like, kind of that same thing

(11:27):
where it's like I was just burntand I, I couldn't function.
I couldn't function so. Interesting.
So I like I actually have a question 'cause I, I heard this
talked about with triggers, how there's kind of like basically

(11:48):
sort of like an anti teaching totriggers right now 'cause you
like the the model beforehand islike, OK, let's identify your
triggers so we can do that. But now there's kind of this
other way of thinking where they're like, we're not going to
identify your triggers because if if you like basically like
inception, your mind with these things to look out for, you're

(12:11):
going to constantly see them everywhere.
And so they're like, well, we'renot going to do that.
And we're just going to react towhatever event happens when it.
Happens. And I'm like and I'm just like,
what are your thoughts on that? You 2, Eric, as like, would you
prefer to like know exactly what's triggering you or like or

(12:34):
if you didn't know and I don't know.
So that makes me think of so it triggers like with meds like
that, that so there are certain medications that I can't, I
can't be on because it will trigger a manic episode.
So I think that. So I think it's super necessary
and helpful to know certain triggers in that sense.
I do appreciate the approach of like, kind of just like taking

(12:58):
it on as it comes because I think it kind of gives you less
time to psych yourself out. Yeah, exactly.
So, so I think I mean, I would prefer to know some of my
triggers or I would prefer to know, you know, what medications
I can and cannot take. But then I think I.
Think that's a whole other. Client level like.
Yes, we do need to know this, right, Right.
Because that's like an allergic reaction almost, right?

(13:20):
Yeah. What?
About you, Eric. So what do you mean by triggers?
I mean like what causes me to have like an outbreak or
something? Yeah, and like, and obviously
it's different for different mental health issues.
Like, you know, I have trauma and PTSD and depression.
So mine is like, OK, Christmas rolls around.

(13:42):
I know David David's going to get sad.
But David likes Christmas, too. I do love Christmas, but I have
a lot. Of times when you you.
Know you know my Christmas story?
You have a, you have a. Saddest Christmas story?
It's just very sad Christmas story.
I don't like Christmas very mucheither anymore.
Ever since my one friend died like a few days before it, it's
always felt a little. But see for like for me knowing,

(14:04):
knowing that I have that like time of year trigger, well, my
brain anticipates it. So like.
You have such a bad core memory.Same.
Yeah, same with same with my birthday.
Like I had really. Shitty.
I had really shitty birthdays. Anyone who thinks birthdays are
cool. So like the month leading up to
my birthday, I just like my bodyreacts.

(14:26):
Can we, Can we rebrand birthdays?
This is like, you know, something for the mother.
I make it Mother's Day. I heard that the other day.
I thought it was a great idea just.
Call it just, you know, one, oneyear closer to the grave or.
Something no, no, no, no you make.
Like one step closer to the grave, you.
Could give more something a metal?
Birthday more about the mom and less about the kids.

(14:47):
Well, I do. Whenever I go to like some one
of my friend's birthday parties,I always say happy birthday to
the mother because she did all the work that day.
Yeah, the baby just, you know. Fell out.
I love that. Well.
Yeah. You should say happy birthday to
the mother. She carried the fucking thing
for nine months, 10 months, and did all the work on that day.
Yeah, like Eric was just like, yeah, OK, send some pictures.

(15:08):
You could. Well, get that shot.
Get that? Shot in your spine.
It's a little more traumatizing than that anyway.
Back to triggers. So like, yeah, when I have those
and people who have seasonal affective disorder, like if
they, if they recognize that like, oh, I get SAD in winter,
is their brain making them SAD? Like are they like, you know,

(15:29):
are they, are they psyching themselves into that event?
It's interesting. It it's, it's really kind of a,
a chicken in the egg kind of thing.
I don't really. I'm not really doing that
anymore. When I was younger maybe, but
not now. I don't really have anything.
Like I feel like it's more organic.
You're like, I'm sad in all seasons, yeah.

(15:52):
Pretty much. I mean, it's just melancholy.
Like that's Type 2, right? So yeah, that.
Makes sense. Well, I mean, did you ever have
any? Triggers that like, I don't
know, I don't really have drug triggers, but like PTSD stuff,
maybe PTSD stuff, but not depression stuff.

(16:16):
There's nothing that's going to be like, oh man, I'm more sad
now. I would just be like.
Yeah. And because that's, that's the
thing about like depression as well as as far as like
recognizing maybe a manic phase or a depressive phase is
sometimes you can't recognize ituntil you're already in the

(16:36):
middle of it and you're like, ohfuck, I've been depressed for a
month. Like I thought I was like, yeah,
you know, there's a little bit off.
And then you like you're you, you follow the bread crumbs
backwards and you're like, oh shit, I've been here for a
while. Like, and so that's it can be
scary. So what are some this is, we're

(16:58):
going to do a round Robin on this one.
Some of the symptoms of your mental health, like you talked
about the auditory and visual hallucinations, like like what
else? So with, with the depression
comes, you know, super, super sad, hopeless kind of.

(17:21):
I can't, I don't take care of myself.
I don't take care of anybody around.
Like I don't, I, I just can't function.
It's really difficult to get outof bed.
It's just that like extreme sadness, irritability comes
along with it. And and I find that I get really
irritable with, with both. So whether it's depressed, you

(17:41):
know, a depressive episode or manic episode, I get really
irritable with both of those things.
But you know, along with the, the way I kind of describe being
manic is kind of like, I feel like a Mexican jumping bean on
the inside. Like, but like really, really
fat. Like I feel like I'm jumping on
the inside. I feel absolutely wired.

(18:02):
I feel, you know, out of control.
I feel, you know, jittery. I'm, I'm hyper.
I'm, you know, I, I get these things where like I, I get these
ideas in my head where I'm like,OK, I'm going to run a marathon.
And then I'm like, and then I start training for that
marathon, right? And then the depressive episode
hits and then I'm like, Nah, I'mnot going to run a marathon.

(18:23):
I'm. Not running to the bathroom.
Right, right, right, right. So I don't know, I think I think
there are general symptoms for everybody, but I think it kind
of differs between, you know, depending on the person.
What about you, Eric? What are the symptoms of Eric?
Well, if I get, if I go into like a depressive state, then

(18:44):
it's just like I sleep a lot. Oh yeah, sleep is.
Pretty much a lot of sleep. Yeah.
Yeah, that's my biggest. What's the biggest way to tell
my sleep? Because I'll sleep like 12 to 16
hours. Now on the on the other side of
it, like do you ever see yourself like, OK, I'm working

(19:05):
even way more than I usually do.I get manic but I don't get
manic very often because I'm type 2.
So like I only get manic for like 3 days maybe like every
once in a blue moon and like yeah I can tell it's great.
I'm, I'm, I'm glad you're just hyping up bipolar too.
You're like, Oh yeah, everybody should get this.
Diagnosis No, no, no, super sweet, no, it's well, I mean I

(19:27):
like I was like wow, what am I saying?
I like I like doll drugs. I was about to be like, I really
liked uppers, but I loved Downers too, so that's.
Gonna be my next question. What what, what?
My what drugs I'm on. Yeah, not like.
The. Yeah, how the because you should
be on drugs if you're if you're have lots of mental health

(19:49):
issues, but. Prescribed medications you.
Can call them drugs they're drugs yeah, it's more fun to
call everything drugs but yeah, I mean that's the bigger thing
is just like yeah, I like the thing.
I think with with manic, I don'tknow.
It's changed a lot though, because when I was younger

(20:12):
mania. It was definitely different than
it is now because now I'm just tired all the time anyway.
Yeah, You know, especially beingeven when I'm manic, I'm just
like, I can pass out right over there somewhere, you know, it's
harder. But yeah, when you used to just
like, you know, DIY your clothes.
I still DIY my clothes. I know, but like there he has

(20:33):
this one pair of jeans that is just covered with just all sorts
of just scribblings and shit, you know, like you can tell like
Eric was going through it. Yeah, really bad.
I loved it. Yeah, that's great.
Yeah, it was pretty dope. Yeah, I still have those pants.
Don't wear them, but you should.They're they are.
No, they're hung on my wall in the basement.
OK. I don't.

(20:54):
I do not. Besides, there's.
A shrine to your sadness. Besides those jeans, I do not
own another pair of jeans. I got rid of all of my jeans.
Oh. My God I love jeans.
Jeans are great. Have you not worn like you know,
like this is this is hemp but. I hate you.
OK, well, all right, so I mean, you guys both like suppose

(21:23):
definitely valid. Like my my shit is is mostly
depression. I don't really get manic phases.
Like I will just get into a place where it's just like, I, I
want to die. Like I like, I don't like, I
don't like this, I don't want tobe here.
And, and that like that's a really dangerous place to

(21:46):
because even driving is potentially dangerous because
you're driving just looking at like, where can I run this off
the fucking road? And, and like people like in the
recovery community, they're like, Oh, you're just not
grateful. And I'm like, it's not fucking
like that, dude. And.

(22:07):
You're not grateful. Yeah, they're like, you're not
keeping gratitude in the front of your mind.
I'm like, you don't know what the fuck you're talking about,
man. But life is overwhelming,
especially nowadays, just with how much just complete utter
chaos is just constantly around us.
And like the combination of, youknow, just American work stress,

(22:30):
just we're we're just, we're just constantly work to a bone
in this country. Yeah.
And then, you know, just stresses about being a father
and a husband and, you know, making enough money and the
future and all this stuff. It it just starts going into

(22:51):
this just basically just a reservoir of sadness and just
it's only a matter of time untillike the.
That's the name of the episode. What a reservoir of sadness.
Yeah. Oh my God, that's a terrible
episode. That's a terrible episode.
Everybody's going to skip this one.
A reservoir of sadness. Until the dam breaks and then
it's just like I and it sucks like because it's not like in

(23:17):
other countries where like in Germany, like if you have like
you're burnt out, you have a mental break.
Your job is like, hey, take six months off and you'll get paid
and you know, get yourself right.
It there's the only option is like I like I have, I have a
kid, I have, I have bills. I have to get up and go do my
shit. I do not have an option.

(23:37):
So like, it's just that feeling of like, I am just trapped in
this fucking cycle and my and, and that's like, and I'm not
single. And I'm not saying like women
are not a part of this equation,but men in this country don't
talk about that shit. And they're just and like,
because they just don't feel like they have anywhere to go,

(23:58):
anyone to talk to and like nobody cares.
Right. And and then there's that
stigma. Yeah.
You know, 100% yeah, it's just, oh, be a man, keep doing your
job, show up and like just show up.
And it's like, that's what we do, right?
Like I talked to my Co workers who aren't in recovery programs
at all and I'm just and they're just like, yeah, I'm going to go
home and, you know, drink a whole bunch of whiskey and do.

(24:19):
And it's just, it's self medication and just because
there's no, there's and luckily now weed is legal.
So it's like, oh, you know, I'm going to go eat some gummies
when I get home. And I'm like, OK, that's way
better. That's a start.
That's a step in the right direction.
Chilling out. You know, one of my tells that I
can like see it is my, my music changes.

(24:41):
Does your music change? Absolutely.
Like I like if, if I'm OK, I canlisten to a variety of things,
like I'm like some Zeppelin, some like whatever.
Just like just an eclectic movieor a music taste.
I'm listening to everything. And then, you know, Mad World
starts coming into the like the,the playlist a little bit more

(25:05):
and like there's some sad LinkinPark songs that start creeping
in and I'm like, well, I'm really feeling these.
And then like the the sad Slipknot songs start coming in
and I'm like, I really wanna listen to corn today.
And then it's just like starts like going down this just darker
and darker rabbit hole to the point where it's just like corn.
Yeah. Oh yeah, like a freak on a
leash. No, when you're talking about

(25:27):
like. Does limp biscuit?
Falling away from me, which is just all about being beaten as a
child, it's like, yeah, let me tap into that emotion.
Because that's. What I want to think about right
now. Can I ask a music question?
Yeah, since you mentioned corn, is limp biscuit still in your
repertoire? Absolutely not.
Well, I mean to be fair. Every once in a while.
Corn and. Every once in a while.
Every once in a while you have to listen to break stuff just

(25:49):
because you're super angry and God damn.
It, I mean, corn and Limp Bizkitwere tied together as a kid.
Like for me as a kid, they were like, yes, they were.
One is a good band and the otherone is Limp Bizkit.
I mean limp. Bizkit, dude, they're coming
back right now, which is so. Weird.
Well, that one, that one album was really good.
That one album. What is it $3 bill?

(26:11):
Might have been $3 bill. Or the one with significant
other. The one with Method Man?
Significant Method, Man. Song Yeah, that had bangers like
on the TRL days, you know, like yeah.
It's a good album I remember, but no, I do not like.
Maybe once or twice a year I'll be like their version on US
Olympus. Their version of faith is pretty

(26:32):
good too. Their version of faith is
amazing. Yeah, yeah.
And OK, so going back like talking about that.
So you know, as a 12 year old I'm listening to Falling Away
from Me by corn. I was listening to a lot of
Eminem. Yeah, but like, it was, that was
kind of a hint to me. I was like, something's wrong.

(26:55):
I was like, I'm identifying withthese things.
Well, really like dark. Yeah, these are.
These are really like. Corn was really popular when we
were 12. Yes, was like absurdly like
corn. Limp Bizkit Blink 182 Like
absurdly popular? Yes, at 12.
But I'm saying. So I bet you were listening to
Blink just as much as you were listening to corn.

(27:15):
No, I was not a Blink fan. Blink was big like all the small
things and stuff like you all said Americano at the Offspring
which was like pretty great at the same.
Time we're we're diverting from our like our point here.
But I like I'm. We're not talking about music
from the the aux talking. No, we're talking about emotions
tied to music. OK, sorry about that.

(27:37):
Damn it. But no, like I'm identifying
with these really like heavy dark things And like at the
time, which still like spiraled me down, I was like, why does
nobody recognize this? I was like, why do there's no
adults seeing this? And it just made me feel even
more alone in the world. I was like, how like why is

(28:00):
nobody seeing this? Like this doesn't make sense to
me. Like, and I'm not saying like
music is everything, but like parents, if you're out there and
your kid is, you know, like all of a sudden buying a shit ton of
like heavy metal shirts and album, like maybe at least have
a conversation about like what'sgoing on.
Like, do you just like the riffs?

(28:21):
Nothing wrong with heavy metal, just.
Popular heavy metal, I mean I. I thought that heavy metal was
not like that like like what depression and stuff.
I thought there was a lot of like, but I thought there was a
lot of like upbeat like, you know, the mosh pits all about
good vibes and like, you know, and I.
Mean a lot of like Christian metal bands that maybe not a lot
but like I have a, you know a good amount in in on my playlist

(28:45):
that it's it's not all like thatwhat.
Yeah. Wait, what do you mean you have
it on your playlist? Like what are we talking about
here? Like.
Back in the day like POD. Like PODPOD?
Yeah. POD was they made some bangers.
Youth of the nation, I. Remember POD, What does it?
What does that stand for? Again, power of.
Payable on death. Payable on death.
Oh I don't really understand how, but they're Jesus band,
right? PODI don't know what was their

(29:07):
most popular song. Youth of the nation, probably.
I don't remember that one, it's a good song.
Anyway, what were we just talking about?
We. Were talking about Christian
rock bands. Oh, yeah, yeah, you, you were
like, oh, I thought it was all positive.
Yes, it is. But it's being positive.
I'm just saying the face of a lie.

(29:28):
I'm just saying, you're like saying like if your kids a
little different, go and talk tothem.
I'm just like. I think it's like, like, I think
we're focusing too much on the genre.
I think like if it's something out of the norm.
Yeah, yes, like if your kids andhome listen to Elliot Smith,
there may be something wrong. Well, I mean, that that's,
that's shit that like Jonathan, like Jonathan Davis was like,

(29:48):
the, the reason he gravitated towards that shit is because he
was raped by two of his fucking uncles.
Like, like he had a lot of trauma.
And yes, it's trying to create something positive in the face
of a lot of inner turmoil, whichultimately like these bands do.
And that's what connects them with people is because like,
there's all these people out there like you and me, They're

(30:10):
like, OK, I feel that way too, like.
He was raped by his uncles, Yeah, at the same time.
No, at separate times. Which is not better.
That's that's worse. Probably that's still bad.
Yeah. Bad.
Just I want it. Context.
Yeah. You know, so like it's, you
know, there's this kid and like what he doesn't, he's from

(30:30):
fucking, you know, Bakersfield, CA.
He doesn't know what the fuck he's.
Doing We know a lot about corn. I love corn.
Corn is. Like talking about little
Jonathan Isaac like. Jonathan.
Davis Davis, son of a bitch. How dare you?
How dare you? Jonathan Isaac, I think, is a
basketball. Player, I think probably, but
anyway, yeah, so music is a tell.

(30:54):
How did which, you know, I'm nowroping this in.
How did your addiction tie in with your mental health?
I mean, it was hand in hand, it went hand in hand, you know what
I mean? Whether I felt, you know,
depressed or whether I was manic, like I used any substance
like drugs, alcohol, whatever tolike.

(31:15):
Did you either? According to your mood.
Well, I would use, I would use to either enhance my mood or to
not feel the way that I'm feeling.
So like when I'm depressed, likeI didn't want to feel depressed.
And then when I was manic, I waslike, oh, this is great.
Let me like, you know, get supertrashed.
I would double down on the depressed, right?
I'd be like, I'm gonna, let's dig this hole deeper.

(31:37):
Yeah, Eric. Eric's 100% that way.
He's like, you know, I'm sad. Gonna bank some dope.
Yeah, or, or I'm gonna, I'm gonna sleep in this closet for a
few days. You've never slept in a closet.
No. OK, you've not been to my level
of sadness, I guess. What?
I've hidden some closet but never slept.
No, I've slept in closets. No, I've.
Never slept in a closet? You've never slept?

(31:58):
No. It's because it's like very
confined and dark. Oh yeah.
It's very, you know it there, there might be a a, you know, a
dash of the tism in there where you know you need your you need
your little safe. Yeah, safe place.
Your little safe place, Yeah, yes.
Was your using to amplify or antithesize your?

(32:19):
Both. Yeah, yeah, it all depended on
my mood. Depends on the mood like.
If I was having a shitty day andI'm like, man, I'm like you
really get because sometimes my cocaine like we.
Like I always needed something, you know what I mean?
Like substance wise, like I always needed something and
whether it was to, you know, diminish how I was feeling or
like, enhance how I was feeling,it didn't.
Yeah. Sometimes you enhance the

(32:39):
sadness. And yeah, I, I'm, I'm, I'm a.
That could be the name of the episode too.
Enhance the sadness. Enhance.
The sadness I'm also like a a a firm believer that, you know,
obviously mental health, just like anything, which I'm glad
the world it OK. The world has gone from a very,

(33:04):
pardon my pun, bipolar view of, you know, it's either black or
white, like you're you're gay oryou're straight, you're crazy or
you're sane. It was very much that just
dichotomy if you're either one or the other, and now and now.
I mean, there's a lot of pansexual people out there, you
know? Well, that's what I'm saying
the, the world has really started to move into realizing

(33:27):
that, you know, life is a spectrum.
Like even amongst bipolar like it, it, there's, there's a
spectrum that we all fall, fall on.
And with people in substance abuse recovery, I think they're,
I think pretty much all of us are on that spectrum of mental
health for sure. I'm pan polar.

(33:51):
Shut the fuck up there. I feel all the feelings.
I feel you, feel no feelings yousociopath.
Fuck you. When was the last time you
cried? I cried this.
Morning, David. We've talked about this like
there's. Often do you cry?
I don't really cry that often, actually.
Oh. God, David.

(34:11):
David cries at like sunsets. And shit, I'll cry at like
little stuff, like I'll look at like on my phone and see
somebody like getting proposed to or like like cute little
stuff like, or like a gender reveal.
I'm like, Oh my gosh, I get all,I get all teary eyed about that.
But David gets teary eyed about that.
But then he also gets teary eyed, like, I don't know, like
let's say, like you say a fucking Falcon flies in front.

(34:32):
Of his face or something. Just say that is nonsense, that
is nonsense. That is nonsense.
That is nonsense sense. That is bullshit, bullshit,
bullshit. No, fuck, I completely forgot
what we were talking about. Again, the custard.
The spectrum shut up. No, like there, there is varying

(34:55):
degrees of, you know, mental health amongst us because like I
don't think anybody who is, you know, putting rails up their
nose or needles into their arm entirely loves themselves or has
a healthy outlook on themselves so.
The world people can at. Least some degree.
Wait, why can't people get piercings or tattoos?

(35:18):
I think, I think all people, I, I think it's the exact same.
I think it's the. Exact same.
It's just the way you said that.I was like I had to say it, but.
That's also kind of like king shaming because you're.
Saying like. Do that because you're like, I
like the. Pains in your nose and needles
in your arms. I was like, where are we talking
about piercing and tattoos? Like, yeah, before this, yeah.

(35:40):
Absolutely. And I think that's a part of it
as well. And.
That would be a cool T-shirt actually.
I like that. OK.
So here's a question was cuz it's a part of both of our
stories? Was self harm part of your story
at all? OK, yeah, that was a big part of
my story. Yeah, for sure.
And like kind of teenage years and then a little bit after

(36:04):
that. Have you figured out a reasoning
as to why you did it? I know what for me it was a way
for me to control. My yeah, that's the big part
about it is control. I wanted to control.
My name, that's why. I was so depressed at that point
and I was so depressed for such an extended period of time that

(36:25):
like I just wanted to feel something.
And then it became, and then, you know, it released, you know,
and then I felt better after I did it.
So then became this like you. Figured out the ritual.
Right. And then it became this, this
addiction that I was that I was addicted to.
Yeah, I mean, it's it's the samething.
It's the adrenaline hit, it's the dopamine, serotonin.

(36:46):
Well, you're a burner too, right?
Yeah. Which is kind of weird.
I'm not really into the burning part, no.
But I've never really got into that.
No, my favorite was a car lighter.
I love the old car lighters and there's and I would usually like
fingertips and like inside of myknees, yeah, or my ankles.
Fingertips. Yeah.
Ow. Because you could always play it

(37:07):
off like, oh, you know, I touched it.
I didn't think it was hot anymore.
Just so like if anybody asked, because, like, no offense to
call you out, your arms are pretty obvious.
So like what? Yeah.
What do you mean? Yeah, when people saw, when
people saw them, you probably got a lot of questions.
I still do get questions. Exactly.
So I was like, I don't want anybody to ask me a fucking

(37:28):
thing. So how can I be as covert about
this as possible? My arms are super obvious.
There's no yeah, there's someonewas like, were you attacked by a
raccoon? I was like, yeah, got attacked
by a raccoon on both my arms. Look at that.
Simultaneously. Yeah, it was.
Just, you know. Two fucking raccoons.
Yeah, it was a possum massacre all over me.
I think the hard one is picking now for me, that's the one I

(37:50):
really I really struggle with mygrandmother.
My grandmother was always she isa picker still like I'll be a
ground stop picking your fuckinglegs.
And she always has, like, scabs all over.
But it's hard. Like, that's the hard one is
picking right now because, like,I can like, not cut myself.
Like, it's easy. But picking is like, you know,

(38:11):
you go in front of the mirror and you're like, I don't really
like that. I don't like that blemish.
I don't like that poor. It's an ingrown hair.
Oh, what's this? Yeah.
And then you flip the mirror because I have a wife.
And then I'm like, look at that.Now we're like, up close.
Let's get all this extra shit. You've never done this.
No, I'm not. I've definitely done this 100%,

(38:35):
yeah. Nope, Nope, not not, not for me.
What else? Do you have any?
Do you have any topics you want to bring up?
Any of you? Can I bring up kind of something
that you mentioned a little bit earlier, You kind of touched on
it and you talked about being inrecovery and having a mental
illness. And I think, I think sometimes,

(38:56):
at least for me, in my experience, I've had negative
reactions from that or like where people just say, like,
I'll be just be grateful or oh, just pray or oh, this or that or
whatever. Some really like old school, you
know, a AERS and, and sometimes like that can be really
dangerous for somebody. Or if like, you know, I've heard
of people, this has never actually happened to me, but

(39:18):
I've heard of, you know, people giving advice on taking their
medication or not. And it's like, no, because like
what a, A can provide for me is like all these things that, that
they provide anybody else, but Ijust need a little extra, a
little extra with that. That's that's all.
And I think it's like, I think it's important to do that in a

(39:40):
Safeway, you know, because I waited a year until I was
diagnosed bipolar because one the the doctor at six months was
like, maybe we should give it a little bit more time to kind of
see like where you're at becauseall the drugs were still, you
know, in my system and. It takes it can take up to like
a year and a half for your brainchemicals to get back to what is

(40:01):
your normal. Right, right, right, right.
Yeah, yeah. And then it's figuring it out
from there. No, I and I think you described
that perfectly. Like there's a lot of us out
there, like all three of us, youknow, we've, we've gone to
therapy, we've different levels of care clinically, medically.

(40:22):
Right. Like I'm not a doctor, you know
what I mean? I'm just another drummer trying
to help somebody else. You.
Know like fellowship recovery isaddressing the social and
emotional and spiritual needs ofthe addict.
Like I'd like, you know, you're,you're getting around people

(40:43):
that are on the same path as you.
You're getting advice and connection with human beings
that are, you know, again on that positive train.
And then you're, you're finding your own spiritual or
psychological path of your ideology of how you want to move

(41:04):
forward morally. And with all that, that is not
medical, that is not medical, that is not clinical.
And and a lot of the old heads don't recognize that.
I mean, Eric and I, we've, we'vealso.
Grew up in such a different time.
Boomers and and Gen. X are a completely different

(41:27):
fucking breed than. Us and they like I've even had
people say like, you know, oh, your sponsor should be able to
take care of that. And I'm like, no, my sponsor
can't take care of my core like fucking mental health issues.
Like it's not they're like, well, wasn't it called no, it
wasn't caused by drugs? No, it wasn't.
I'm sorry. These were like not things that
were caused by drugs, like they were caused by like, you know,

(41:48):
life like, I don't know. Yeah, like that makes me so mad,
dude, when that makes me so angry.
Yeah, your sponsor is probably not going to write you a script
for gabapentin. Well, and they just.
Not gonna have, right? They don't know either.
No, like and they shouldn't theydon't shouldn't have to know
we're. Not fucking dog.

(42:09):
It's the same as like, even though we, you and I have talked
about this where there is like parts of recovery that like this
is part of recovery. You have to take care of it.
Like even with work, you like working is part of like being
better like, but you don't go toyour sponsor to get a job.
Like, you know, you go to like aprofessional to help you, like a
recruiter or whatever. My sponsor's really, really good

(42:30):
with that. She's like, you know, I can give
you my experience, or I've had asimilar experience in the past,
but like, that's all, you know, I can give you.
Like, you know, I'm not a doctor, I'm not your therapist,
I'm not this, but like, I'm herefor you, you know, And I think
that's like a tough balance for some people.
Yeah, and like that, that bringsup two points.
Like first one, you know, I talked about at the at the

(42:52):
midnight meeting last night is Iknow three people that died
clean because of suicide. So mental health is very fucking
real, really. Yeah, Vic.
She was a suicide. Yeah.
I thought she was an OD. No.
Oh yeah, I thought she was an OD.

(43:14):
No, just. That's sad.
No, and fuck, what was her fucking name?
2 dudes. I can't. 2 dudes.
Christian was one of them, and Ican't remember the third.
I didn't know that about Vic. Was it through drugs or was it a
different way? A different way, yeah.

(43:37):
I'll ask after. Yeah.
Anyway, so yeah, like staying clean is absolutely great, but
if you're not doing the clinicalmedical end of it as well, you
can still die. Like you could still die.
And it's interesting how, you know, egotistical people in
recovery will want to play doctor like this.

(43:59):
But if it's like, hey, can you give me advice on this, this
real estate project or, you know, this law, like, like court
case I have coming up? Oh, well, I'm not a lawyer.
Yeah, no shit. You're not a fucking doctor
either. You're not a real estate agent
either. Shut the fuck up like if you
stay in your own. Life.
Well, that's the whole Suboxone thing we talk about all the time

(44:21):
with like where they're shoving people out the door to die.
Yeah, 'cause they're, you know, yeah, they can't handle it.
So different, same ballpark. We had a guy in my Home group
years ago who had. Are you talking about Josh or
are you talking No, not Josh. You're talking about Jimmer's

(44:43):
cousin. Yeah.
He had epilepsy and the medication he was given by his
doctor to treat his epilepsy wasSuboxone.
Which is a clinical way. Which is a clinical way to Yeah,
that is that is actually an epilepsy medication and they.
And so he was, and he was about to celebrate a year dude had.

(45:04):
Bad epilepsy too dude. Like really for like since high
school. Like I remember like watching
like I remember picking up oxy from his cousin one time and
like he had a seizure. Yeah, grandma seizure.
Yeah, legit. And people in Narcotics
Anonymous boycotted his anniversary because they were
like, he's on Suboxone and I'm like, for a complete outside

(45:27):
issue. So how's that different from
being on any other type of anti sexual?
Medication. Exactly dude, it infuriated me.
Yeah. But he.
Fury. He left and he left.
He has never come back to NA since.
Wow, Yeah, that's super dangerous.
That's. Super fucking dangerous.
Well, it's like your opinion. You're fucking with somebody's
life. Rachel left because of she was

(45:49):
on Suboxone and she died. Yep, she's not coming back.
Yep, she's dead. Yeah.
Yeah, inions fucking kill people.
Yeah, all right. Do do do what?
I love your hat, David. I just, I just have to say that
it's, it might be. Your best hat I it is right now.

(46:09):
Right now it is my best hat. I love this hat very much.
So, comically, do you guys know who Taylor Tomlinson is?
I love Taylor Tomlinson. She's fantastic.
She is. She has bipolar as well, and she
has a tremendous analogy. Arm floaties.

(46:31):
Her arm floaties, yes. So your medications are your arm
floaties. Like, you know, we're all going
to the pool. Some people need arm floaties
and that's OK. Just make sure you take your arm
floaties and because if you don't like oh, oh, I'm using I'm
using Michael and it's like no, you're drowning Michael, right?

(46:53):
Like to keep you up, right. You need to take this because
it's your responsibility. And I love how she touches on
people judging and then she's like, well those people don't
give a fuck if you live or die so maybe fuck those people.
Yeah, maybe fuck those people a little bit.
Yeah, it's like. Yeah, she's amazed.
They're just judging on how you look, so fuck them.
Right, I love or that you need arm floaties like some people

(47:15):
just need arm. I 100% need arm floaties.
And when I heard that analogy, Iwas like, this is amazing, yes.
You are fucking. I wanna marry her so bad.
I will divorce my wife tomorrow.Oh my.
God, So. So what's the question?
What? It wasn't a question.
It was just, you know, just touching on like, I wanted to
get that on air for anybody out there.

(47:36):
Like, hey, even if you are bipolar, you can get on Netflix
now. You can get on Netflix, it's not
a it's not a death sentence. You know, you can still be a a
very functional person, but you know, she has talked about how
it's been very difficult for. Her it is really difficult.
And also like when her friends were like when she was telling

(47:57):
her friends she was bipolar and they were like, oh, yeah, that's
kind of like your middle name. I knew you had it, but I just
didn't know what it was. And I was like, Oh my God,
that's. Amazing.
She's so funny. She's so.
Funny that. Type of stuff, yeah.
So I mean, you know, it, it and like some of her Instagram stuff
is like super revealing about like her, how she deals with it

(48:21):
on a mental and like constant basis, right?
And that's part of it as well. Like somebody so famous right
now is just breaking that whole stigma of hey, like we're, we're
out here and we're doing big things and it life is still
difficult, but we can get through.

(48:42):
It right? With our arm floaties.
Absolutely, yes. That's fantastic.
I love the arm floaties. I love that it took me a while
to get my arm floaties though. It's been, it's, it's been
quite, a, quite a ride, you know?
And that brings me to my next question.
What exercises or what things inyour life have you found that

(49:04):
are positive and good for your mental health?
Positive and good for my mental health.
So like things on like a daily basis, like I pray a lot.
I pray a lot. And then also a meditation, like
doing meditation with that as well.
And it doesn't have to look likeyou sit on the floor, crisscross
applesauce, all Zen in your roomfor 20-30 minutes.

(49:27):
It can just look like you sit upon your bed and you kind of
close your eyes and you're just present.
Yeah. And right.
Right. But yeah, little things like
that really help. You should come to my meditation
Home group by the way. I have a meditation Home group.
Oh really? Yeah, it's on Wednesdays.

(49:47):
OK, mine's on Thursdays. OK, perfect.
Come to mine, I'll come to yours.
OK, Deal. Anyway, and then what I've found
really, really helpful is exercise.
Like I've, you know, I've recently started, you know, just
over the past maybe month or twogetting back into working out

(50:08):
and like not putting expectations on it because I
always like struggled with that.Like I always like go and that
that kind of stems from like an eating disorder, you know,
standpoint as well is like pushing myself too hard, not
focusing on what really is to focus on.
So like what I'll, what I'll do is like, I'll go to the gym with
just the expectation of just getting there, like I just need

(50:29):
to get there and then and then whatever I do after that is good
enough. You know, so, and that's been a
really kind of my mindset has has shifted a lot and in regards
to that, but like in regards to to my perspective on just having
bipolar and like dealing with iton a daily basis, you know,

(50:50):
because now I have my arm floaties and that that should be
the name of the episode. I really should be the arm
floaties. Get your arm floaties, get your
arm floaties. Everybody's like get your arm
floaties. See, that's a way more
intriguing title. People could be like, get your
arm. What is that about?
Listen. Yeah, some people.
Will get like arm floaties, yeah.

(51:11):
Yeah, I love Taylor Zaminson. She does have a really big head
though. She acknowledges it, though.
Yeah, she totally I'm. Looking at her IG right?
Now she owns it. She does have a big head,
doesn't she? Yeah, she does, but.
She's super. Adorable or large melon?
And dude, you should watch all three of her Netflix specials
because. They're so funny.
It's and it's such a progressionbecause the first one she's

(51:33):
like, because she was raised like super Christian and you
know, she's kind of dealing withsome of that trauma and
everything because she's also young.
I think she's like just about toturn 30.
She's my age. She's like 27 or 28, yeah.
Yeah, she's very young. Yeah, her first.
Actually, I think she's a year older than me.
I don't. Her first Netflix special she
did it like 22 or something likethat, which is.

(51:56):
Yeah. Was she that young?
Yeah, it. Was like, it's like 5 because if
yeah, she's 27. Her first Netflix special was
like 2/20/18, something like that.
It's like 6 years ago. So yeah, she's super way ahead
of the curve, right for her. But no, like, and then like she
talks about in the second one how she would take like half of
a, a THC blueberry and like justbecause she wants her sleepies.

(52:20):
And then her third one, like she's like, oh, I found out I'm
bipolar. And it's just like, it's such an
amazing progression. Who she is, It's really, it's
really. It's really awesome, I'll have
to watch it. Yes, your exercises.
I haven't been exercising. I talked to my doctor about this
this week. It's it's coming back OK.
I'm slowly building towards it. What else?

(52:42):
That's what I need to do. Just.
Exercise. I need to exercise.
That's the best, honestly, is exercising and walking my dog.
Yeah. Like, which is exercise.
Yeah. You know, I think those are at
least what affects my mood. The best is exercise.
Yeah, absolutely. Like I'm happier, I'm more

(53:03):
awake. I'm not as fatigued like, you
know, like and as like, it just sucks the first like 2 days and
then once you get in the habit it's great, you know?
But well, I've also like been trying not to beat myself up for
like if I don't get to the gym, like I'll just walk around the
neighborhood. And it's like, yeah, yeah,
there's other ways to exercise. Right.

(53:24):
And I. Yeah, just do something right.
Yeah, Yeah. Exercise for me, meditation has
just like continuously like. Meditation is great, it can just
be hard to get in the mood to doit like certain, especially with
certain days like I I want to goto your Home group and then I'm
like fuck it's 8:00 on a Thursday I forgot.

(53:46):
Yeah, it's 7:00 on a Thursday. I know, but I'm saying it's
eight. Oh yeah, I forgot.
So I'm actually the meditation picker now and I've been picking
some really good shit. Not to toot my own horn, toot,
toot motherfucker. But so I unlike, so the the

(54:08):
previous meditation pickers are always like, they're always kind
of picking the same shit, like, oh, you know, body scans, yeah,
breath work. And I'm like, we're gonna do
some shadow work, motherfucker. We're gonna talk shadow people.
And we're gonna talk about fear response.
And I learned about shadow people on a ghost tour the other
week. I am not weird have.

(54:29):
You ever heard about shadow people?
Yes. He's called the fucking.
He's called the fucking hat, man.
He lives in my closet. Let's not talk about this right
now. No, that sounds awful.
No, well, we're not in a safe space now.
No, we're fucking judging me. Was that was that Jonathan
Isaacs we're? Judging the fucking hat man as
this what's happening right now.Was that Jonathan Davis's uncle,
The hat man? Oh God, I don't.

(54:50):
Know. Is that awful?
I don't know. Did I go?
Too far. It was terrible.
I went too far. But no, like I like I've really
gone into like shadow work meditation, which it is, it's it
can, it can get intense. I don't know what that that
means. So what's the difference between

(55:13):
shadow and like regular meditation?
So basically a shadow work meditation, really.
It really makes you focus your mind on like a past trauma,
like, and, and they'll be like, hey, we're gonna like find, find
that, find that event that made you feel the most shameful in

(55:37):
your past. And we're gonna, we're gonna
look at it. We're gonna pull it out like,
we're gonna pull it out of the closet.
Yeah. So that's like some.
That's essentially EMDR, dude. Yeah, that's essentially what
you're doing is EMDR. Essentially, yeah by myself for
free yeah for freezes on YouTube.

(55:57):
And some of them get really intense, like.
That's similar to what my doctortold me my therapist told me to
do recently is I have to go dude.
Shadow work meditation is phenomenal because it's also,
it's it's also emotional identification.
So learning to look at your fearand your anxiety and your stress

(56:21):
and your sadness and basically learn to greet them like a
friend. Be like, OK, sadness, I see you.
You're here right now. And you can sit for a little
while, but then you have to leave, right?
Like you can't stay here. Like I recognize you and pay
attention. Yeah, we're going to be in this
moment and let it be what it is.But then like after this, you

(56:44):
know, 45 minute meditation, we're we're going to let you go
and you're, you're going to go back to where you belong and
you're not going to stay here. And like stuff like that, like
just trying to really right sizeyour emotion and basically dial
in your emotional volume knob emotional.
Volume. Knob Yeah, is is some really

(57:08):
cool shit because most people don't realize that that's what
like everybody thinks meditationis just supposed to be.
Oh, you're right. You're doing mantras and chakra
work and it's like no it it can be a lot of really like digging
to the subconscious parts of your mind through really deep
relax of States and that's like a lot of like Reiki healing and

(57:28):
stuff like that. So yeah, I'm, I'm going to, I'm
like bringing some of that into my meditation and like I'm
starting to like sprinkle it in and people like I've gotten some
wild. I, I did one about basically
greeting your higher self and itlike talked about like the, IT
was, it was like half transcendental, half basically

(57:52):
like like journey meditation. And you go and you meet you, you
go and you meet your higher self.
And it, it like takes the form of like whatever you see.
And like this one dude just started crying.
He was like, I lost my mother two weeks ago.
And when I saw my higher self, the person that was my spirit
guide with me was my mom. And this guy's like crying in

(58:13):
the meeting and I'm like, Oh my God.
And he just got here. Some heavy shit.
Yeah, he just got here from Boston and he's in a he has
super thick Boston accent. Cool dude.
Join, join the joined the Home group.
He was like, this is he was like, I've never been to a
minute. He's like, I've never
experienced anything like that before.
He was like I literally just sawmy mom and got to because I
picked like a 35 minute meditation.

(58:34):
So I'm. Just quiet and this good dude.
Yeah. So yeah, it can be really
profound when you're willing to,you know, kind of look at your
old scars and you're like, OK, we got to open this up.
And there's like, there's some, there's some infection in here.
We got to clean this the fuck out.
And doing it with your mind and your spirit.
This is really, you know, it's it's it's important.

(58:54):
And that's probably the biggest exercise for me right now in my
life. Yeah.
Siding it Taylor Tomlinson person that you guys are both
like obsessed with. Yeah, she has a show on CBS
called after midnight. Yeah, like that's crazy.
She's a late night host. Yeah.
Essentially yeah. Which is should be the only

(59:16):
female late night host right nowI think.
Yeah, I think. Samantha Bee shows gone, I
guess. Yeah, dude, Taylor is amazing.
That's amazing. That's like, yeah.
She's like our age. To have a late night show is
like, absurd because that's, there's only like eight of
those, yeah. She's she's, she's a killer
dude. She is, she is amazing.

(59:37):
So. I want to see her so bad.
Yeah, See her life. She was just here last year, was
she? Yeah.
Her last special was filmed in DC.
No shit. Yeah.
I wanted to go see it but she was here for two or three
nights. Dude minimum ticket prices were
like 200. And 50, Yeah, I couldn't have.
Oh, I bet, yeah. I've seen Elijah Schlesinger
twice though. Nice.
She's awesome. Nice.

(59:59):
Also smoke show Lord. Anyway, all right, I am out of
topics. Does anybody else have anything
they want to bring up? I just think if, if, if you're
struggling, if anybody is, is struggling to, not to give up
hope and to, and to constantly reach out to people, you know,

(01:00:22):
whether it's family, friends, doctors, and, and I think it's
also super important to keep your, you know, recovery.
If you're in recovery, your recovery's separate from your
outside help, but at the same time they all need to work
together as well. But not just not to finding a

(01:00:43):
like a sponsor who can like is aligned with you too, right?
Like and aligned with like outside issues.
Find the right people. Because and the right social
group too, because you can have friends that are, you know,
what? What do they used to call them?
NA Nazis, Right. Like, you know, I don't know.
Do they still exist now? NA Nazis?
Are they still a thing? OK.

(01:01:04):
I'm just making sure things don't change.
Yeah. You know.
In keeping with the round Robin of advice, anybody out there
listening, struggling? You're not broken.
You're like, you're not broken and you're not alone.
I know it might seem that way. It might feel that way, but also
you're not going to feel like this forever, like it will, this

(01:01:25):
will pass. It might be an hour, it might be
a day, it might be a week, it might be a year.
And it's going to be some hard work to get to the other side of
that. But it is doable and you're
loved and, you know, just hold on a little bit longer and, you
know, help find your arm floaties.

(01:01:45):
You know, you're you're. You're treading water right now,
and it's got your You haven't learned to swim quite yet.
It's exhausting. It is.
It is very Treading water is very.
Exhausting, but it's. But arm floaties help.
All right, everybody. Thank you, Valerie.
Thank you for joining us once again.
Yeah, great job. Yeah, that was a fantastic

(01:02:08):
episode. I love that.
Everybody, Thank you for joiningus once again.
Go to all of our social media outlets.
Buy some shirts. Buy some shirts.
Yeah, we have merch. Buy some socks.
Buy. A candle.
I wear socks. I wear the socks.
I still want to buy a podcast recovery candle to see what it
smells like. I just I want to buy the the
doormat I hope part. Of me.
Doormat. Yeah, it says it's.

(01:02:30):
What's it say? Sit down?
Shut. Up.
Listen to the message. Which I need to get for our
home. That's.
So amazing. Sit down, shut up and.
Listen to the message. That's fucking great.
I love that. But also, wouldn't it be
hilarious if like the candle just smelled like a different
drug? Like do I smoke?
Weed are you? Somebody smoking?
Crack. I know crack would be the best 1

(01:02:52):
crack would be the best 1. Crack would be so crack.
Do. It is somebody getting wet in
here. What the fuck the fuck?
What is happening in this fucking apartment?
Who's getting wet? No, anyway, yes, go buy some
socks, candles, doormats, whatever.
Most importantly, wait, no, holdon, no, not there yet.
Go to our Patreon, please send us some shekels because we are

(01:03:14):
self supporting, need help keeping the mics on.
And anyway, yes, our social media outlets, Instagram,
YouTube, Facebook. Everything but tick tock.
Everything but tick. Tock, yeah.
But yeah, I gotta do that, yeah.I know.
Oh God, he's right down. Tick tock.
God damn it. Anyway, everybody out there,
most importantly Eric, if you help me.
Stay safe and stay clean.