July 31, 2019 • 37 mins
Hub Arkush and Arthur Arkush spend some time recapping some of the biggest news stories around the league including some of the holdouts from various players, the passing of the Hall of Famer and NFL Legend Nick Buoniconti, the early injuries around various training camps and other news coming from team camps. Plus the guys discuss some of the win totals around the AFC South and the NFC South.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
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(00:11):
Hi everybody. Welcome back again thisweek to our Pro Football Weekly podcast.
I am the executive editor and generalmanager of Pro Football Weekly Hub Arkish.
I am joined by our managing editor, Arthur Arkish. We have been in
bourbon A with the Chicago Bears sofar. Expect to see some other teams
over the next couple of weeks andtraining camps in full swing now. A
(00:34):
lot of the stories Arthur so farhave been about the the stars who are
not in camp with contract holdouts insituation, Melvin Gordon, I'm sorry,
it looks like he could be downfor a while. With the Los Angeles
Chargers. Zekiel Elliott is apparely inCabo, San Lucas, while the Dallas
Cowboys are in Thousand Oaks, California. He may be staying there for a
(00:55):
while as well. But another oneof the big ones Michael Thomas, the
wide receiver in the New Orleans Saints. He'll be showing up today as we
tape this because he just picked upa cool one hundred million bucks from the
Saints. They made him the highestpaid wide receiver in the NFL. And
what's intriguing to me about it is, I you could argue that he's done
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enough to be considered one of thetop three, top five, maybe worth
being the highest paid. But themoney that the Saints spent. This is
a team that has been battling salarycap problems it seems like twenty four to
seven for the last three, fouror five years, and you just kind
of scratch your head when their quarterbackhas a cap hit of over thirty million
dollars, how they're even able todo a deal like this. Yeah,
(01:36):
it's a good point. I don'tclaim to be a salary cap expert,
so I'll kind of defer to thoseon that. My understanding though, is
that the you know, the payouton this deal, which is the highest
by an on quarterback in NFL historyin total dollars in the first two years.
I believe it's thirty two point sixmillion I saw on Twitter, So
(01:57):
it's not a staggering number right outof the gate, and I'm guessing that
does allow them, you know,to make it work under the cap.
What's interesting to me is to see, you know, Michael Thomas clearly has
earned this deal. I mean,leads the NFL in cutches last season.
He has improved each year in theNFL and just puts up prolific numbers as
the clear alpha number one and youknow, arguably the most prolific passing attack
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in the NFL. So he's earnedit. I am curious to see how
it kind of shakes out with someof the you know, this is what
happens when you draft really well onthe Saints have in recent seasons. You
got other guys to worry about,and of course Albun Kamara, who wasn't
the first round or could be upfor a new deal as soon as this
offseason. You look a little bitfarther down the road, Marshawn Latimore looming
too. But you have to assumeby then, Hube, that Drew Brees,
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they won't be worrying about that salarycap hit that he is absorbing at
that point. Yeah, Ryan rampCheck a couple of the other kids on
defense. That's going to happen.But as you point out, and what's
interesting me about this is, youknow, the thirty two point six million,
some of that will even be treatedas signing bonus, So it's possible
that the cap hit is even lessthan sixteen million a year probably will be
these first couple of years. Butthe flip side of that is, now,
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once again you've really pushed the problemdown the road. There's going to
be a lot of dead money,or potential dead money, I should say,
on the back end of this deal. It's quite possible that Michael Thomas
plays the deal out. He's areally good football player. But what's intriguing
about that to me is they're willingto take that chance knowing that they are
going to spend the next two threefour years in salary cap. Hell.
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I think because they believe this isthe year. I think that they probably
are the best team in the NFCheading into this season. Drew Brees now
on the wrong side of forty andalso, you know, killing your cap.
But you wonder how much longer hecan do this to me? This
says Mickey Loomis, and Sean Paytonsaid, we got to go all in
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right now. This is our year. If we don't get it done this
year, we may not get itdone with this group. Let's get Thomas
in camp. Yeah, I agree, But I mean I think you could
also say, hold last year youmake the bold trade for teddy Bridge Water.
That's not something you do unless you'reall in to fortify the position behind
Breeze, God forbid something happens withhim. So I either have to have
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a situation where you got a TomBrady taking less and it actually appears Drew
Brees did take a little bit lessin his most recent contract extension or revision
or whatever it was, or you'reprobably I feel like, resigned to maybe
some salary cap hell later down theroad when you've got the mix of a
Hall of Fame quarterback and again allthese young studs that need to get paid.
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But as far as the Saints,you know, viewing this as the
season, I mean, why notthey look great. You can't find a
lot of holes on the roster.And if you believe, if you're not
worried, and I actually do havevery very minor reservations that Drew Brees is
you know, postseason, which obviouslywasn't very good, wasn't a red flag
for what's going to happen in hisage? What is an age forty campaign
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that I don't think there's a lotof other concerns you want to have with
this squad. We should very quicklymention though Michael Thomas had a ton of
leverage here. I mean look atthe rest of the same it's wide receiving
corps. We're seeing more players holdout, and there's just no way that
that Saint's offense can run even withthe great Drew Brees without Michael Thomas on
the football field. In my estimation, Well yeah, I mean, that's
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that's a given. And again I'mnot criticizing him for it. I agree
with it. I would be allinto These Super Bowls are really hard to
win. They won one and ohnine. They thought that team was going
to be able to contend for afew more. It never did, you
know. Part of the problem,of course, was the whole bounty gate
thing that tore them up a coupleof years later. But they've been trying
to get back to the super Bowlfor a decade now, and it makes
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perfect sense when when when you've gota Hall of Fame quarterback who's hit forty
every year is potentially the last year. And so I completely you know,
support the move. I understand themove, and I think part of what's
happened here with some of these NFLteams as they've gotten so spoiled with the
cap going up on average almost tenmillion a year since this current CBA started.
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They figured they'll get some real leafthat way as well. And then
there is also the uncertainty of theCBA expiring after next season. You know,
you come twenty twenty one. Fornow, it's the wild wild West.
They have no idea what the futureis going to look like. So
really, with that as the backdrop, it would almost be silly not to
go all in right now. Yeah, absolutely, it makes perfect sense.
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I kind of I really feel bad. I think we talked about him a
little bit on last week's podcast hub. I think the guy who's gonna get
ultimately the short under the stick andthis one is Yannick ingaqway, and I
did work on that pronunciation. Ido believe I finally have it right.
Another guy not drafted in the firstround, of course, the Jaguars great
edge rusher, who has just beena tremendous producer and by all indications is
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he's one of the four holdouts leftand he is not going to get the
deal he wants, so I kindof, you know, he watches Michael
Thomas get paid and there's gonna beI think some form of resolution with Ezekiel
Elliott as well. Trent Williams isgoing to get traded. I think that
leaves Yannick in Melvin Gordon, whocould be on the outside looking in of
these new deals that they're wanting.Yeah, I'm not as confident as you
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are apparently that the Zeke Elliott thingis going to work out so smoothly.
We know Jerry Jones finds a way, but his comments recently have been a
little disparaging as far as being ableto get a deal done right now,
with good cause he's got other peoplehe has to sign and you know,
news flash, bullet and alarms,I'm actually going to agree with Jerry Jones
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on something. Unfortunately, like itor not, it has been proven that
the best running back in the NFLalmost never wins a Super Bowl. It
hasn't happened since Emma Smith was inhis prime with the Cowboys in the early
nineties. And so, you know, knowing how Jones loves his stars and
loves Zeke Elliott in particular, andthe way he went to war for Zeke
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Elliot's when in fact, Elliott probablydeserved the suspension he got and ended up
getting it, you would think thathe'd be the first one he'd want to
pay. But I don't know.I think they're being a little careful here
with that one, and you know, probably with good cause. Well yeah,
I mean, no question, allthe troublic he has run into off
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the field, he has not provento be reliable on the field. I
believe he has proven himself as thebest back in the game. I'm searching
frantically here, Hub because I wantto try and give credit to the person
who first pointed out. But youdo realize the irony and Jerry Jones strong
arming or kind of making his statementabout how you don't need a rushing champion
to win the Super Bowl, Right, there's irony and everything. Jerry Jones
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says, Arthur. You know,as I said, you just had the
one time in what at thirty yearsI've agreed with him on something. But
that's the way the game has changed. I mean, it was Jones who
you know, also pointed out atthe same time he offered that quote.
He said it was Emmett Smith wasthe last time a rushing champion, you
know, won a Super Bowl.So he gets it. But it's a
different game now than it was,you know, thirty years ago. And
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I think that's the point he's tryingto make it is, but I just
want to make sure we're clear onthat. Emmett Smith in fact won the
NFL rushing champion, I believe,in two of the three Super Bowls for
that Cowboys dynasty, and to remember, it was his holdout, I believe
in the third year where the Cowboysstarted out oh and two and didn't get
going on their run until he,uh, well, until frankly Jerry Jones
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caved. It paid the man.So I just had to kind of laugh
at that. There's no question theNFL has changed immensely, but up I
would argue that the Cowboys sort ofoffensive philosophy hasn't changed all that much.
And that's what I mean, whoare you going to slide in and place
Ezekiel Elliott. It's not gonna beMike Weber or Tony Pollard or Tamon Austin.
I don't even know what the backupplan would be. I think the
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Cowboys run one of the few remainingoffenses in the NFL where it doesn't run
through the quarterback. It runs throughEzekiel Elliott. Arthur, You're absolutely right,
and that's why I'm saying, Ijust don't know that this one gets
solved that quickly. Zeke Elliott iscritical to that football team. But this
is another team that's had a bitof a salary cap mess on its hands
the last few years, a lotof it because they had the best offensive
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line in football and some guys hadto get paid, and then they had
to work out a deal for DeMarcusLawrence. But in addition to Zeke Elliott,
they're looking at Dak Prescott and nowAmari Cooper. Now Cooper is not
a guy that I would spend afortune on. I know he had a
good second half of the season forthem last year, but I think he's
still got to establish his number onewhite out creds over the course of a
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couple of years, to be honestwith you, but you know, almost
anybody would agree that that you gotto get the quarterback paid and signed before
you get the running back paid.And they do have some other guys that
they're focused on too, you know. Byron Jones, I think is going
to be coming up for a dealand has become a superstar, so I
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think it will get done. Idon't think Elliot's going to get the money
he expects, And this is kindof the the residual effects of the nightmare
that Levian Bell created for the PittsburghSteelers it lasted for two years, and
the absolute shock around the NFL whenwhen the New York Jets and Mike mccagnen
and Adam Gays and I'm tired ofGays getting a pass on this as if
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it's something mcagnen did without him knowing. Decided to pay Leveon Bell because I
don't think we're going to see anotherrunning back contract like the one Bell just
got. And by the way,the one Bell just got didn't make up
for the money he lost holding upfor a season and a half. So
I look at Zeke Elliot, Ilook at Melvin Gordon, and you know,
godspeed, I think every one ofyou guys should get every penny you
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can. We know the toll thisgame takes on you, but I think
it's tough going to be tough forthese running backs to get done. Yeah,
we're in agreement on that, AndI almost feel how like a Cowboys
are in a bit of a nowin situation here because if you pay Zeke
before Dak, that's not very goodaesthetics. Remember Dak, the former fourth
rounder who I realized he's made alot up sure and endorsements and everywhere else
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off the field, but he hasnot really hit his on field pay day
yet. Of course, Zeke Elliot'sentire first round rookie contract guaranteed. I'm
sure it's already paid him out wellin excess of twenty million dollars. So
such different situations, and it's Dakwho is the leader of that team,
who has not been in the policeblotterer or on the NFL suspension list.
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So I don't, you know,I mv some things that Jerry Jones has
going for him, but how tohandle this situation not one of them.
And that's why I would agree.I don't know if there's many quick resolution,
but I don't think the Cowboys canbe the super Bowl contender that I
think they can be with well,I don't think they can be them without
zek Alien obviously contracts some of thebig stories of early training camp A very
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sad note, and we're just youknow, normally we don't date the podcast,
but we are taping on Wednesday,the last day of July this week.
We wanted to make sure we gotit in before the Baseball trade deadline,
so we could figure out if theCubs are going to do anything to
excite us. But very sad newsthis morning, the news that Nick Buana
Connie, the Hall of Fame linebackerfor the Miami Dolphins, the captain of
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the defense of the seventeen and oAmi Dolphins seventy two Super Bowl champions,
has passed away at the age ofseventy eight. He had been suffering significantly
in recent years from whether it wasjust Alzheimer's or another form of dementia,
I'm not clear, but in Alzheimer'stype affliction. Don't know what the cause
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of death is if that was actuallyit, but definitely one of the biggest
names in the history of the OldAFL is gone. Our thoughts and prayers
to his family. Of course,his son Mark was an outstanding college football
player who suffered a spinal cord injuryand ended up a quadriplegic, and they
have done tremendous work in terms ofmedical research and working for the community of
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folks who suffer from ming, paraplegicsand quadriplegics. So it is given a
lot to the world, you know, and Arthur. The funny thing about
it, there's nothing funny about it. But the interesting thing about it is
that I have always felt that Nickbauan Connie was one of the most overrated
football players I've ever seen. Imean, I was not on the beat
yet, but was a teenager andvery much into the game. Actually went
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to college that first year in seventytwo. And Buanacanie was an undersized inside
linebacker who actually was a perennial Probowler in the AFL before the league's merged,
and was I think probably voted toa couple of Pro Bowls after the
merger, but just wasn't at thesame level of some of the iconic middle
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linebackers. But I think because ofthe impact he had early after the merger,
because the impact he had on thatundefeated team, it kind of sealed
his Hall of Fame credentials. Andhe is someone who's given a lot back
to the game, and it's justterribly sad news to see him gone this
morning. Yeah, no doubt aboutit. I would just you know,
echo your sentiments that we are youknow, our thoughts go out to his
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family and his friends and the entireDolphins organization. It's weird, though,
but I don't feel like his namegets brought up quite a often, or
it didn't. You know, everyyear when a team is flirting with an
undefeated season, and you always hearabout Mercury Morris and some of the more
outspoken guys on the offense of thatgreat Shula squad. I don't feel like
I heard about Bonacani's name as muchfor whatever reason. Yeah, I mean
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he was in the crew. Theywere all hanging around Shula and popping the
bottles of champagne when the last undefeatedteam would lose week ten, Week eleven,
week twelve. But you're right,he wasn't his vocal He was a
class act, absolute class act.He was very involved in broadcasting for quite
some time. I don't know atwhat point the dementia issues became serious enough
to take him out of the publiceye, but he has been far more
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out of the public eye probably,I'm going to say the last seven,
eight, maybe even ten years thanhe was prior to that. He was
at one time a very visible spokespersonfor that Dolphins franchise, but also a
class individual. And you know,the guys that I admire are the ones
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who say records were made to bebroken. Let's let's you know, applaud
and celebrate to you know, ifanother team can do it, as opposed
to the Mercury Morrises of the world, who you know, spent their life
hoping that some everybody else would failto protect his moment of glory. Yeah,
it's a cool way of putting.It was very neat last year when
Drew Brees breaks obviously the all timepassing record and Peyton Manning what's kind of
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the first one had the prepackaged videoready to congratulate drews. I certainly agree
with few class actors to say atleast, yeah, I know that obviously
you're a bit younger. I've beenon the beat this long, and I
think we can wrap that up bysaying that the Manning legacy to the game
is one of class. Some peoplethink that family invented it. Mercury Morris's
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legacy to the game is the hardtime he did in a state penitentiary for
his cocaine deals. So it shouldn'tsurprise us that these guys had different approaches.
And and listen, Mercury Morris isrehabilitated. I don't want to be
too hard on him, but youknow, not necessary the epitome of class
in the history of the NFL.Our thanks to all of our great sponsors
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who make these podcasts possible. Wealso want to give our thanks as we
try to every week and never areable to do enough, to Dan mod
our executive producer, our engineer,the guys that makes all of our podcasting,
all of our broadcast, all ofour TV working videos work, as
well as a lot of the otherstuff you see at Pro Football Weekly dot
com. So Dan, thank youso much. The guys that um frees
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McGee for being good enough to allowus to use some of their special tracks
for our bumps in and out andtheme music coming in and out of the
show. Of course to all ofyou for listening. We really do appreciate
it, and you know Arthur.Fortunately now we're only a few days in
I wouldn't say major injuries a bigstory yet in training camp, but we
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have had a couple that you can'tignore, and probably the biggest is is
aj Green in Cincinnati. I mean, this is a guy who a couple
of years ago was right there inthe conversation along with Julio Jones, is
the best receiver in the NFL.But he has really battled injuries the last
few years, and now he willmiss multiple games. He sprained an ankle
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which ended up tearing a bunch ofligaments. He did require some surgery.
The original report we heard was sixto eight weeks, But now the Bengals
are being a little more careful andsaying that they can't really predict when they
will get their franchise receiver back.Oh, just what a disaster for you
know, a rookie head coach who'salready lost less. We forget his first
round left tackle in Jonah Williams forthe season. I'm talking about Zach Taylor,
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of course, you know, fromthe Sean McVay tree and supposed to
come in and sort of whip thatoffense into shape. And Andy Dalton's lame
duck season as the head coach ofGOSH. I guess we could say this
is certainly a disaster for Andy Daltontoo. Is it season ending? No,
it's not so could it have beenworse? Obviously, But let's not
forget H. J. Green's twentyeighteen season, the shortest of his career.
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Twenty sixteen season also missed ten games, so uh, slowly, it
does appear that you know, perhapsfather time starting about to catch up to
AJ Green a little bit. Andyou hate to see it, because you're
right, he was on that Hallof Fame trajectory and he's just a you
know, an indispensable part of thatoffense. And um, it's tough,
especially for a receiver. You're talkingabout lower leg injuries. You're talking about
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a receiver who uses his size ashis explosiveness as much as AJ Green.
This is obviously a very troubling development. It is you know, it's interesting.
Right to their first four or fiveyears in the league, it seemed
like AJ Green and Julio Jones werekind of joined at the hip, very
very similar in size and stature,both superstar receivers. Green probably not quite
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the athlete, maybe a little littlequicker than Jones, more of a lanky,
possession not a possession receiver, butmore so Julio Jones, who,
of cour this is the freakish athletewho makes the plays that you just can't
believe. And yet their numbers verysimilar through those first rookie contracts. Julio
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Jones for the most part, hasmanaged to stay healthy these last three four
years, and for AJ Green,this is the toll that we see this
game takes on these football players.And you know, this may have something
to do with the fact that Greenalways was a little bit lankier, a
little more sinewy. Jones a muchtighter packed, muscular athlete. But it's
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just very sad to see because AJGreen I do think was on a Hall
of Fame trajectory. But look atthe injuries the last couple of years.
It is going to take a miraculouscomeback in a couple more All Pro selections
in his thirties, and that's reallynot likely to happen. Another report of
note, Buffalo Bills brought in sixnew offensive linemen via free agency. Arguably
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the most high priced was center MitchMorse, who they signed away from the
Kansas City Chiefs. Mitch Morse isnow in the concussion protocol in the first
week of training camp. Now thisis not unusual by today's NFL standards,
but when you're getting concussions in trainingcamp when nobody's even gone live or full
speed yet, that has to concernthe Buffalo Bills a little bit. Yeah,
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no question about it. I meanthat's going to be the well you
just said it. I mean,no offensive line underwent greater sort of rehaul
overhauling. Excuse me, then Buffalo. Everyone knows what a disaster it was.
I thought that that, actually,well, we're here in Chicago,
so you might even argue Mitch Terbiskis, but not a lot of worse sort
of young QB incubators than what wesaw for Josh Allen last year. I
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liked the moves they made. Imean, I love Cody Ford. I
figured they plug him in. Iwould guess that'd right tackle right out of
the gate. I preferred Matt Paradisein Carolina to Mitch Morse in Buffalo,
especially for the money each received.But yeah, I mean he was brought
in I think became the highest paidcenter in the league to sort of be
the glue of that rebuild. Andwe'll just hope that he can get back
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quickly. But this is important time. I know, you're just trying to
keep guys healthy, so they haven'tbeen able to do that. And then,
b when you make that many changesup front, you better believe that
they need time to develop chemistry,to develop trust in one another. And
this is obviously going to be alittle bit of a roadblock in that regard.
A couple of interesting stories out ofthe Miami camp. Arthur, and
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yes, the Dolphins are in arebuild season. Some think they may even
be tanking. I don't think itcan tank in the NFL. You're just
going to get people hurt. Butif you build a bad roster, which
they have done, you're going tolose a lot of football games. But
the announcement earlier this week that offensiveline coach Pat Flaherty had been fired,
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And what's so unusual about that ishe was just hired six months ago when
Brian Flores took over the team andput his staff together. Pat is actually
an old friend of mine. WhenI was still doing the Chicago Bears games
on the radio, Pat was theoffensive line coach here in Chicago, spent
a number of years as the linecoach with the Giants, has developed some
(23:07):
really good football players. He's sixtythree years old. I believe I don't
want to go there because now I'mnot sure this, so I don't want
to say it. I was justgonna say something about some off the field
accomplishments as well, but certainly aquality offensive line coach in the NFL.
And to get to the third dayof training camp and get fired, you
know, pretty unusual stuff. Yeah, I would say so, and let's
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not forget the unusual stuff that wasgoing on. And I don't, I'm
not, I shouldn't. I'm notsaying these things are connected. Of course
they're not. But everyone remembers whathappened in the Dolphins O line room last
year and how that coach was dismissedas well. So in what else is
interesting, Hubb And it's another personthat you've gotten to know pretty well.
Bill Belichick doesn't do a lot oftinkering with his coaching staffs. Obviously,
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Brian Flores a Bill Belichick disciple.So on one hand, if you really
didn't think Flaret he was getting thejob, getting the old line sort of
room marching in the same direction,and that's what the you know they're sighting
is the reason for the switch,then I guess, you know, I
credit him if he's accurately you know, you know, seeing that and is
willing to act on it now ratherthan wasting time. But you correct me
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if I'm wrong. This is theapple falling pretty far from the tree when
we're talking specifically about coaching changes.Quite the contrast between what Bill has done.
And now what Brian Flores is doing, very very early in his first
job. You know, Arthur itis. But I have to add a
note here, and I'm going tobutcher this name, and I apologize.
I just don't have it in frontof me. But what Flores did do
is he replaced him? Is itGoogliazzi the new offense? I'm sorry,
(24:45):
I'm not sure. I apologize.You know my pronunciations. Well, yeah,
look, and unfortunately our internet isdown here, and so I apologize
to him. But I do knowthat he is a friend of Flora's who
worked with him with the Patriots asan assistant offensive line coach. Was either
fifteen and sixteen or sixteen and seventeen, and so again it's very unusual.
(25:06):
There's no really explaining it. Buthe did in fact replace him with somebody
he is close to, and thatis not unusual, especially with some of
these young head coaches around the NFL. Okay, and then, of course,
on the other story, we shouldget to quickly down in South Florida,
Josh Rosen and no one was praisingthat the trade in April more than
(25:26):
I was. And I'm not backingoff that by any means yet. But
what do you think Flora says thatRyan Fitzpatrick it's I'm paraphrasing, but I'm
pretty sure it's something along the linesof it's very clear to the new coach
that the uh, the veteran journeymanfrom Harvard, is well ahead of the
(25:47):
second year player out of UCLA inthat quarterback competition. Is Josh Rosen getting
served some humble pie? Is henot developing as quickly as they would hope
for? Because God, you turnedto Ryan fitz Patrick and that's only going
to stoke the fires of the peoplesaying, you know, screaming tank in
Miami. Yeah, you know,I think again, it's early in camp.
(26:08):
It may be something he's doing tomotivate Josh Rosen. It may just
be the reality that Josh Rosen didn'tget a lot of great coaching last year
in Arizona and so this is almostlike a rookie campaign for him. It
may be that they're all absorbing anew system, and obviously a seventy two
year old veteran like Ryan Fitzpatrick isgoing to do that more quickly than Josh
(26:30):
Rosen is. I think the unfortunatepart about it is that that Ryan Fitzpatrick
was Ryan Fitzmagic for all of aboutfive weeks in Tampa, you know.
And so this is obviously not anykind of long range answer. I still
believe Josh Rosen is going to bethe starting quarterback for the Miami Dolphins for
the better part of this season.But yeah, it did surprise a lot
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of folks. I mean, thefact that even though last year was a
struggle for him, you know,he did as a rookie get I think,
I want to say it was likeeleven starts, and so you would
expect, having made the deal,that you'd want him in there on day
one. But you know, thisis a rookie head coach who spent his
entire coaching career in New England,albeit on the defensive side of the ball,
(27:12):
watching Tom Brady and the last coupleof years going to Super Bowls with
a late thirties something now early fortiesis something quarterback, and so it could
just be that he's more comfortable withthe veteran right now. So we're running
out of time, Arthur, Andone more thing we've been trying to do
each week is get to each ofthe divisions and at least talk about some
(27:32):
of the predictions for the teams inthat division. Unfortunately, as I said,
my internet's not working right now,so I don't have the totals in
front of me. But all we'redoing is taking a look at these teams
and trying to figure out if Vegashas it right with the totals they put
on them and whether they should goover or under. So I guess we'll
start in the AFC South, wherethe defending champion Houston Texans total is only
(27:55):
eight and a half this year,but the Indianapolis Colts, the wildcard Colts,
have a total of nine and ahalf. Those those those are interesting
numbers. I think that Houston probablyis good enough to win nine games.
I did not like what I sawDeshaun Watson in his development late last season.
(28:15):
The offensive line has to get better. They used early picks on two
big offensive lineman, but both smallschool kids who may not be plug in
play type guys. If they're healthierat wide receiver, they're immediately better.
They're going to be very good ondefense. Um, you know, so,
I think probably over on eight anda half the Colts. Nine and
(28:36):
a half is a tough number.I mean, if I'm actually giving advice.
I'd stay away from from from thisat all, but forced to pick
um. I don't know. Ijust look at the Colts roster and I
love Andrew Luck and he appears tobe healthy right now. But I think
they had a lot of guys playingover their head on defense last year.
The offensive line is very good,they still need more weapons. From where
(28:57):
I sit, Marlon Mack is anice running back, but I don't know
if he's a guy you build anoffense around. So I'm gonna say maybe
they only win eight or nine thisyear, all right, Yeah, So
I'm going opposite on both of these. Houston was eleven and five last year,
Hub, and I just have badvibes with the Texans this season this
offseason, from the firing of BrianGaine to the uninspired offensive line rebuild to
(29:21):
the Jadevian Clowney contract in past.So I'm going under on this one.
I just got a weird feeling,and I'm going over on the Colts.
They were ten and six last year, of course, and You're right that
the defense played above its head lastyear, but now they've added Justin Houston
and Rock Yeahsin a couple under additionalunderrated pieces, no reason to believe they're
(29:41):
not going to be better on defense, and I'm excited about a couple of
the moves they've made on offense aswell, with Devin Funchis and the rookie
there in Paris Campbell, and Ijust I really really like Frank Reich and
Chris Ballard. Obviously they need AndrewLuck and and yes, it is a
little concerning that he misspracticed yesterday withthis calf issue that was not a scheduled
maintenance day. But my understanding isafter watching what happened with Kevin Durant in
(30:04):
the NBA Finals, there are acouple of NFL teams that are taking calf
injuries a little bit more seriously.So I don't think it's time to worry
yet on Andrew Luck. And Ijust I'm too high on what they're building
there, So I think they goover nine and a half. And I
have no quarrel with your prediction,but I would just qualify it by saying,
when I do these, I don'tfactor in rookies for what I think
they're going to be based on ourprofittball weekly traft rating. So I mean
(30:27):
you're right Rock, Yeah, Sinand Paris Campbell. These are interesting prospects
that they've added. But if somebodywants me to risk money on it,
I want to see what I'm bettingon before I do. And that's why
I don't bet, by the way, and I hate to put you on
the spot, but as I said, I just can't get our internet up
here. Do you have the totalsfor Jacksonville? I do, Okay,
yes, sir, so Jacksonville tonto see are both at eight and last
(30:51):
year. Of course, A tonof Sea finish nine and seven, the
Jaguars five and eleven. So I'llkick us off and I'm gonna go sor
I didn't give it ton of thoughtyet. I'm gonna go over on Jacksonville
because there's just still so much talenteddefensively, and maybe Leonard Fournette really does
you know, he's ready to wakeup and smell the coffee, and maybe
(31:11):
Nick Foles does interject the type ofleadership and maturity in that locker room that
is so desperately needed. It's notwith great confidence, but I'll go over
on Jacksonville, and I'm gonna gounder on Tennessee because I just I'm not
a believer in Marcus Mariota and nothing. I don't think that defense is going
to be as good again this year. I think it's another unit that played
(31:32):
a little bit over its head.It's got some nice young pieces, but
nothing that really blows my hair back. So I'll go overround the Jaguars and
under on the Titans. All right, So we're going to disagree on all
four teams here, because I mean, you're probably right about Jacksonville. I'll
qualify my prediction by saying I'm probablywrong. But but the way that thing
came apart so completely, the childishbehavior of people like Jalen Ramsey tells me
(31:56):
that locker room may not be anybetter this year than it was last year.
I understand that Tom Coughlin probably hasn'tslept in three months with what he
has been dealt here. And listen, I love Nick Foles, but I
never believe that Blake Bortles was theonly problem with that offense and that team.
Is Leonard Fournette going to be whatwe thought he was going to be.
(32:17):
He's another one who needs to growup a little bit. And in
this division, where I do agreethat Indianapolis is very good, and I
think he may be underrating Houston alittle bit. It's gonna be tough to
be over five hundred, so I'mgonna take them under and then I'm gonna
flip it around with Tennessee. Idid their playoff games last year. I
think that Mike Rabel is one ofthe more impressive young coaches in the league.
We don't talk about him a lot, but I love the job he
(32:39):
did. I don't think it's ahuge loss that Matt Lafleur is now in
Green Bay. You know, hehad the one year as the coordinator there,
but the offense struggled a good partof the season. I agree with
you that I don't trust Marcus Mariota. I don't know why Ryan Tannehill is
here other than the possibility that theydon't trust Marcus Mariota either. But I
love the addition to care Ran Wakeand I know he's another geriatric case,
(33:01):
but he has been since he cameto the NFL, and he rarely slows
down. So I think Tennessee.I'm actually probably gonna pick this division with
Houston and Indianapolis and Tennessee once again, all within a game or a half
a game of each other and Jacksonvillebringing up the rear. What kind of
numbers have you got for us onthe NFC NFC Yeah, yep, the
(33:23):
NFC South, like you know,it's a counterpart of the other. Conference
is going to be competitive this yearclearly, at least that's how Vegas sees
it. But this number, NewOrleans is at ten and a half,
and then you got the Atlanta Falconsat eight and a half. So I
love the Saints that I don't know, I'm kind of torn on that one.
I really do like what they have. We did, we talked at
(33:44):
the top of the program about howthey really are, you know, the
Super Bowl contender of the highest order. And at the same time, I
just that number for some reason looksa little high to me. I'm thinking
the Saints could very easily be tenand six and still go on to a
Super Bowl. I'm gonna go underon the Saints, and I'm going over
around the Falcons because I just thinkthere is way too much firepower there offensively,
(34:05):
you know, the way they rebuiltthat offensive line, all the reinforcements
they get young reinforcements on that defense, and Dion Jones and you know,
Ricardo Allen, and the list goeson Keianu Neil. Obviously, I'm gonna
go over on the Falcons. Ithink they got a chance to be really
good this year. We finally foundone we can agree on. I'm going
over on the Falcons too, notby a ton, but I do agree
that there's just too much talent therenot to be able to be better than
(34:28):
five hundred, so I would takethe over there. Now. I don't
know really much about gambling or betting, but I know that when it comes
to these totals, ten and ahalf is a very big number. But
I'm picking the New Orleans Saints towin the NFC and lose the Super Bowl
to the Chargers. And very rarelydo you have Super Bowl teams with less
than eleven or twelve wins, SoI can't justify that pick and then say
I don't think they're good enough towin more than ten games, So I'm
(34:51):
gonna go over with them. Carolina. Do they bounce back, Tampa Bay,
does Bruce Arians, you know,resurrect that messed down there? And
let me just say, I guessthe Saints. We're thirteen and three last
year, So if I'm going ownedover under on ten and a half.
I'm picking a three game regression.I'm gonna flip flop here, and I'm
gonna say they're gonna go over.I don't think they'll be thirteen and three
(35:14):
again, but let's say eleven andfive. Carolina Carolina, we've got an
eight win sub in Tampa Bay,we've got it six and a half.
Buccaneers are a very easy under forme. The Panthers, they kind of
look like an eight eight football team, So I'm probably gonna just stay away
from that one. I guess ifI'm forced to go in one direction,
(35:34):
I'll go over and say they're morelikely to be nine and seven than seven
and nine. Yeah, I'm strugglingwith that one because Ron Rivera, I
think is one of the four orfive best coaches in the league. But
we don't know who the quarterback's gonnabe. We don't know the situation with
Cam Newton's shoulder, and that's whythat number is interesting. But I'm gonna
go over just based on the amountof talent in Rivera, but probably just
(35:55):
a half game over, and I'mgonna go over in the belief that Newton
may even be better than he's beenin recent seasons with that shoulder repaired.
I'm definitely going under with the Bucks. I don't understand how Bruce Arian retires
from coaching a year ago because ofhealth and family considerations, and then one
(36:15):
year later suddenly his health is fineand his family doesn't care and he's back
coaching the Bucks. Something's weird downthere, and I just don't trust that
organization or the situation with Arian.So I'm gonna take under there. Arthur,
We're gonna cut you loose. Thankyou so much, and we want
to thank everybody else involved with thepodcast once again. It all starts with
Dan Mott every week. To ourgreat sponsors, thank you so much for
(36:38):
being with us, the guys thatHumfrey's McGee for our music, and don't
forget folks. You can download asubscription to these podcasts so you get them
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sure you get our Pro Football WeeklyChicago podcast as well. We will be
making the rounds of these training campsthe next few weeks and we'll get back
(36:58):
with everything you need to know aboutthe NFL preseason next week with another edition
of Pro Football weekly,
Hi everybody. Welcome back again thisweek to our Pro Football Weekly podcast.
I am the executive editor and generalmanager of Pro Football Weekly Hub Arkish.
I am joined by our managing editor, Arthur Arkish. We have been in
bourbon A with the Chicago Bears sofar. Expect to see some other teams
over the next couple of weeks andtraining camps in full swing now. A
(00:34):
lot of the stories Arthur so farhave been about the the stars who are
not in camp with contract holdouts insituation, Melvin Gordon, I'm sorry,
it looks like he could be downfor a while. With the Los Angeles
Chargers. Zekiel Elliott is apparely inCabo, San Lucas, while the Dallas
Cowboys are in Thousand Oaks, California. He may be staying there for a
(00:55):
while as well. But another oneof the big ones Michael Thomas, the
wide receiver in the New Orleans Saints. He'll be showing up today as we
tape this because he just picked upa cool one hundred million bucks from the
Saints. They made him the highestpaid wide receiver in the NFL. And
what's intriguing to me about it is, I you could argue that he's done
(01:15):
enough to be considered one of thetop three, top five, maybe worth
being the highest paid. But themoney that the Saints spent. This is
a team that has been battling salarycap problems it seems like twenty four to
seven for the last three, fouror five years, and you just kind
of scratch your head when their quarterbackhas a cap hit of over thirty million
dollars, how they're even able todo a deal like this. Yeah,
(01:36):
it's a good point. I don'tclaim to be a salary cap expert,
so I'll kind of defer to thoseon that. My understanding though, is
that the you know, the payouton this deal, which is the highest
by an on quarterback in NFL historyin total dollars in the first two years.
I believe it's thirty two point sixmillion I saw on Twitter, So
(01:57):
it's not a staggering number right outof the gate, and I'm guessing that
does allow them, you know,to make it work under the cap.
What's interesting to me is to see, you know, Michael Thomas clearly has
earned this deal. I mean,leads the NFL in cutches last season.
He has improved each year in theNFL and just puts up prolific numbers as
the clear alpha number one and youknow, arguably the most prolific passing attack
(02:20):
in the NFL. So he's earnedit. I am curious to see how
it kind of shakes out with someof the you know, this is what
happens when you draft really well onthe Saints have in recent seasons. You
got other guys to worry about,and of course Albun Kamara, who wasn't
the first round or could be upfor a new deal as soon as this
offseason. You look a little bitfarther down the road, Marshawn Latimore looming
too. But you have to assumeby then, Hube, that Drew Brees,
(02:42):
they won't be worrying about that salarycap hit that he is absorbing at
that point. Yeah, Ryan rampCheck a couple of the other kids on
defense. That's going to happen.But as you point out, and what's
interesting me about this is, youknow, the thirty two point six million,
some of that will even be treatedas signing bonus, So it's possible
that the cap hit is even lessthan sixteen million a year probably will be
these first couple of years. Butthe flip side of that is, now,
(03:05):
once again you've really pushed the problemdown the road. There's going to
be a lot of dead money,or potential dead money, I should say,
on the back end of this deal. It's quite possible that Michael Thomas
plays the deal out. He's areally good football player. But what's intriguing
about that to me is they're willingto take that chance knowing that they are
going to spend the next two threefour years in salary cap. Hell.
(03:25):
I think because they believe this isthe year. I think that they probably
are the best team in the NFCheading into this season. Drew Brees now
on the wrong side of forty andalso, you know, killing your cap.
But you wonder how much longer hecan do this to me? This
says Mickey Loomis, and Sean Paytonsaid, we got to go all in
(03:46):
right now. This is our year. If we don't get it done this
year, we may not get itdone with this group. Let's get Thomas
in camp. Yeah, I agree, But I mean I think you could
also say, hold last year youmake the bold trade for teddy Bridge Water.
That's not something you do unless you'reall in to fortify the position behind
Breeze, God forbid something happens withhim. So I either have to have
(04:09):
a situation where you got a TomBrady taking less and it actually appears Drew
Brees did take a little bit lessin his most recent contract extension or revision
or whatever it was, or you'reprobably I feel like, resigned to maybe
some salary cap hell later down theroad when you've got the mix of a
Hall of Fame quarterback and again allthese young studs that need to get paid.
(04:29):
But as far as the Saints,you know, viewing this as the
season, I mean, why notthey look great. You can't find a
lot of holes on the roster.And if you believe, if you're not
worried, and I actually do havevery very minor reservations that Drew Brees is
you know, postseason, which obviouslywasn't very good, wasn't a red flag
for what's going to happen in hisage? What is an age forty campaign
(04:51):
that I don't think there's a lotof other concerns you want to have with
this squad. We should very quicklymention though Michael Thomas had a ton of
leverage here. I mean look atthe rest of the same it's wide receiving
corps. We're seeing more players holdout, and there's just no way that
that Saint's offense can run even withthe great Drew Brees without Michael Thomas on
the football field. In my estimation, Well yeah, I mean, that's
(05:14):
that's a given. And again I'mnot criticizing him for it. I agree
with it. I would be allinto These Super Bowls are really hard to
win. They won one and ohnine. They thought that team was going
to be able to contend for afew more. It never did, you
know. Part of the problem,of course, was the whole bounty gate
thing that tore them up a coupleof years later. But they've been trying
to get back to the super Bowlfor a decade now, and it makes
(05:36):
perfect sense when when when you've gota Hall of Fame quarterback who's hit forty
every year is potentially the last year. And so I completely you know,
support the move. I understand themove, and I think part of what's
happened here with some of these NFLteams as they've gotten so spoiled with the
cap going up on average almost tenmillion a year since this current CBA started.
(05:58):
They figured they'll get some real leafthat way as well. And then
there is also the uncertainty of theCBA expiring after next season. You know,
you come twenty twenty one. Fornow, it's the wild wild West.
They have no idea what the futureis going to look like. So
really, with that as the backdrop, it would almost be silly not to
go all in right now. Yeah, absolutely, it makes perfect sense.
(06:23):
I kind of I really feel bad. I think we talked about him a
little bit on last week's podcast hub. I think the guy who's gonna get
ultimately the short under the stick andthis one is Yannick ingaqway, and I
did work on that pronunciation. Ido believe I finally have it right.
Another guy not drafted in the firstround, of course, the Jaguars great
edge rusher, who has just beena tremendous producer and by all indications is
(06:44):
he's one of the four holdouts leftand he is not going to get the
deal he wants, so I kindof, you know, he watches Michael
Thomas get paid and there's gonna beI think some form of resolution with Ezekiel
Elliott as well. Trent Williams isgoing to get traded. I think that
leaves Yannick in Melvin Gordon, whocould be on the outside looking in of
these new deals that they're wanting.Yeah, I'm not as confident as you
(07:06):
are apparently that the Zeke Elliott thingis going to work out so smoothly.
We know Jerry Jones finds a way, but his comments recently have been a
little disparaging as far as being ableto get a deal done right now,
with good cause he's got other peoplehe has to sign and you know,
news flash, bullet and alarms,I'm actually going to agree with Jerry Jones
(07:27):
on something. Unfortunately, like itor not, it has been proven that
the best running back in the NFLalmost never wins a Super Bowl. It
hasn't happened since Emma Smith was inhis prime with the Cowboys in the early
nineties. And so, you know, knowing how Jones loves his stars and
loves Zeke Elliott in particular, andthe way he went to war for Zeke
(07:49):
Elliot's when in fact, Elliott probablydeserved the suspension he got and ended up
getting it, you would think thathe'd be the first one he'd want to
pay. But I don't know.I think they're being a little careful here
with that one, and you know, probably with good cause. Well yeah,
I mean, no question, allthe troublic he has run into off
(08:09):
the field, he has not provento be reliable on the field. I
believe he has proven himself as thebest back in the game. I'm searching
frantically here, Hub because I wantto try and give credit to the person
who first pointed out. But youdo realize the irony and Jerry Jones strong
arming or kind of making his statementabout how you don't need a rushing champion
to win the Super Bowl, Right, there's irony and everything. Jerry Jones
(08:31):
says, Arthur. You know,as I said, you just had the
one time in what at thirty yearsI've agreed with him on something. But
that's the way the game has changed. I mean, it was Jones who
you know, also pointed out atthe same time he offered that quote.
He said it was Emmett Smith wasthe last time a rushing champion, you
know, won a Super Bowl.So he gets it. But it's a
different game now than it was,you know, thirty years ago. And
(08:54):
I think that's the point he's tryingto make it is, but I just
want to make sure we're clear onthat. Emmett Smith in fact won the
NFL rushing champion, I believe,in two of the three Super Bowls for
that Cowboys dynasty, and to remember, it was his holdout, I believe
in the third year where the Cowboysstarted out oh and two and didn't get
going on their run until he,uh, well, until frankly Jerry Jones
(09:15):
caved. It paid the man.So I just had to kind of laugh
at that. There's no question theNFL has changed immensely, but up I
would argue that the Cowboys sort ofoffensive philosophy hasn't changed all that much.
And that's what I mean, whoare you going to slide in and place
Ezekiel Elliott. It's not gonna beMike Weber or Tony Pollard or Tamon Austin.
I don't even know what the backupplan would be. I think the
(09:39):
Cowboys run one of the few remainingoffenses in the NFL where it doesn't run
through the quarterback. It runs throughEzekiel Elliott. Arthur, You're absolutely right,
and that's why I'm saying, Ijust don't know that this one gets
solved that quickly. Zeke Elliott iscritical to that football team. But this
is another team that's had a bitof a salary cap mess on its hands
the last few years, a lotof it because they had the best offensive
(10:01):
line in football and some guys hadto get paid, and then they had
to work out a deal for DeMarcusLawrence. But in addition to Zeke Elliott,
they're looking at Dak Prescott and nowAmari Cooper. Now Cooper is not
a guy that I would spend afortune on. I know he had a
good second half of the season forthem last year, but I think he's
still got to establish his number onewhite out creds over the course of a
(10:22):
couple of years, to be honestwith you, but you know, almost
anybody would agree that that you gotto get the quarterback paid and signed before
you get the running back paid.And they do have some other guys that
they're focused on too, you know. Byron Jones, I think is going
to be coming up for a dealand has become a superstar, so I
(10:43):
think it will get done. Idon't think Elliot's going to get the money
he expects, And this is kindof the the residual effects of the nightmare
that Levian Bell created for the PittsburghSteelers it lasted for two years, and
the absolute shock around the NFL whenwhen the New York Jets and Mike mccagnen
and Adam Gays and I'm tired ofGays getting a pass on this as if
(11:05):
it's something mcagnen did without him knowing. Decided to pay Leveon Bell because I
don't think we're going to see anotherrunning back contract like the one Bell just
got. And by the way,the one Bell just got didn't make up
for the money he lost holding upfor a season and a half. So
I look at Zeke Elliot, Ilook at Melvin Gordon, and you know,
godspeed, I think every one ofyou guys should get every penny you
(11:28):
can. We know the toll thisgame takes on you, but I think
it's tough going to be tough forthese running backs to get done. Yeah,
we're in agreement on that, AndI almost feel how like a Cowboys
are in a bit of a nowin situation here because if you pay Zeke
before Dak, that's not very goodaesthetics. Remember Dak, the former fourth
rounder who I realized he's made alot up sure and endorsements and everywhere else
(11:50):
off the field, but he hasnot really hit his on field pay day
yet. Of course, Zeke Elliot'sentire first round rookie contract guaranteed. I'm
sure it's already paid him out wellin excess of twenty million dollars. So
such different situations, and it's Dakwho is the leader of that team,
who has not been in the policeblotterer or on the NFL suspension list.
(12:11):
So I don't, you know,I mv some things that Jerry Jones has
going for him, but how tohandle this situation not one of them.
And that's why I would agree.I don't know if there's many quick resolution,
but I don't think the Cowboys canbe the super Bowl contender that I
think they can be with well,I don't think they can be them without
zek Alien obviously contracts some of thebig stories of early training camp A very
(12:33):
sad note, and we're just youknow, normally we don't date the podcast,
but we are taping on Wednesday,the last day of July this week.
We wanted to make sure we gotit in before the Baseball trade deadline,
so we could figure out if theCubs are going to do anything to
excite us. But very sad newsthis morning, the news that Nick Buana
Connie, the Hall of Fame linebackerfor the Miami Dolphins, the captain of
(12:56):
the defense of the seventeen and oAmi Dolphins seventy two Super Bowl champions,
has passed away at the age ofseventy eight. He had been suffering significantly
in recent years from whether it wasjust Alzheimer's or another form of dementia,
I'm not clear, but in Alzheimer'stype affliction. Don't know what the cause
(13:20):
of death is if that was actuallyit, but definitely one of the biggest
names in the history of the OldAFL is gone. Our thoughts and prayers
to his family. Of course,his son Mark was an outstanding college football
player who suffered a spinal cord injuryand ended up a quadriplegic, and they
have done tremendous work in terms ofmedical research and working for the community of
(13:46):
folks who suffer from ming, paraplegicsand quadriplegics. So it is given a
lot to the world, you know, and Arthur. The funny thing about
it, there's nothing funny about it. But the interesting thing about it is
that I have always felt that Nickbauan Connie was one of the most overrated
football players I've ever seen. Imean, I was not on the beat
yet, but was a teenager andvery much into the game. Actually went
(14:09):
to college that first year in seventytwo. And Buanacanie was an undersized inside
linebacker who actually was a perennial Probowler in the AFL before the league's merged,
and was I think probably voted toa couple of Pro Bowls after the
merger, but just wasn't at thesame level of some of the iconic middle
(14:31):
linebackers. But I think because ofthe impact he had early after the merger,
because the impact he had on thatundefeated team, it kind of sealed
his Hall of Fame credentials. Andhe is someone who's given a lot back
to the game, and it's justterribly sad news to see him gone this
morning. Yeah, no doubt aboutit. I would just you know,
echo your sentiments that we are youknow, our thoughts go out to his
(14:54):
family and his friends and the entireDolphins organization. It's weird, though,
but I don't feel like his namegets brought up quite a often, or
it didn't. You know, everyyear when a team is flirting with an
undefeated season, and you always hearabout Mercury Morris and some of the more
outspoken guys on the offense of thatgreat Shula squad. I don't feel like
I heard about Bonacani's name as muchfor whatever reason. Yeah, I mean
(15:15):
he was in the crew. Theywere all hanging around Shula and popping the
bottles of champagne when the last undefeatedteam would lose week ten, Week eleven,
week twelve. But you're right,he wasn't his vocal He was a
class act, absolute class act.He was very involved in broadcasting for quite
some time. I don't know atwhat point the dementia issues became serious enough
to take him out of the publiceye, but he has been far more
(15:37):
out of the public eye probably,I'm going to say the last seven,
eight, maybe even ten years thanhe was prior to that. He was
at one time a very visible spokespersonfor that Dolphins franchise, but also a
class individual. And you know,the guys that I admire are the ones
(15:58):
who say records were made to bebroken. Let's let's you know, applaud
and celebrate to you know, ifanother team can do it, as opposed
to the Mercury Morrises of the world, who you know, spent their life
hoping that some everybody else would failto protect his moment of glory. Yeah,
it's a cool way of putting.It was very neat last year when
Drew Brees breaks obviously the all timepassing record and Peyton Manning what's kind of
(16:22):
the first one had the prepackaged videoready to congratulate drews. I certainly agree
with few class actors to say atleast, yeah, I know that obviously
you're a bit younger. I've beenon the beat this long, and I
think we can wrap that up bysaying that the Manning legacy to the game
is one of class. Some peoplethink that family invented it. Mercury Morris's
(16:44):
legacy to the game is the hardtime he did in a state penitentiary for
his cocaine deals. So it shouldn'tsurprise us that these guys had different approaches.
And and listen, Mercury Morris isrehabilitated. I don't want to be
too hard on him, but youknow, not necessary the epitome of class
in the history of the NFL.Our thanks to all of our great sponsors
(17:11):
who make these podcasts possible. Wealso want to give our thanks as we
try to every week and never areable to do enough, to Dan mod
our executive producer, our engineer,the guys that makes all of our podcasting,
all of our broadcast, all ofour TV working videos work, as
well as a lot of the otherstuff you see at Pro Football Weekly dot
com. So Dan, thank youso much. The guys that um frees
(17:34):
McGee for being good enough to allowus to use some of their special tracks
for our bumps in and out andtheme music coming in and out of the
show. Of course to all ofyou for listening. We really do appreciate
it, and you know Arthur.Fortunately now we're only a few days in
I wouldn't say major injuries a bigstory yet in training camp, but we
(17:56):
have had a couple that you can'tignore, and probably the biggest is is
aj Green in Cincinnati. I mean, this is a guy who a couple
of years ago was right there inthe conversation along with Julio Jones, is
the best receiver in the NFL.But he has really battled injuries the last
few years, and now he willmiss multiple games. He sprained an ankle
(18:18):
which ended up tearing a bunch ofligaments. He did require some surgery.
The original report we heard was sixto eight weeks, But now the Bengals
are being a little more careful andsaying that they can't really predict when they
will get their franchise receiver back.Oh, just what a disaster for you
know, a rookie head coach who'salready lost less. We forget his first
round left tackle in Jonah Williams forthe season. I'm talking about Zach Taylor,
(18:41):
of course, you know, fromthe Sean McVay tree and supposed to
come in and sort of whip thatoffense into shape. And Andy Dalton's lame
duck season as the head coach ofGOSH. I guess we could say this
is certainly a disaster for Andy Daltontoo. Is it season ending? No,
it's not so could it have beenworse? Obviously, But let's not
forget H. J. Green's twentyeighteen season, the shortest of his career.
(19:03):
Twenty sixteen season also missed ten games, so uh, slowly, it
does appear that you know, perhapsfather time starting about to catch up to
AJ Green a little bit. Andyou hate to see it, because you're
right, he was on that Hallof Fame trajectory and he's just a you
know, an indispensable part of thatoffense. And um, it's tough,
especially for a receiver. You're talkingabout lower leg injuries. You're talking about
(19:26):
a receiver who uses his size ashis explosiveness as much as AJ Green.
This is obviously a very troubling development. It is you know, it's interesting.
Right to their first four or fiveyears in the league, it seemed
like AJ Green and Julio Jones werekind of joined at the hip, very
very similar in size and stature,both superstar receivers. Green probably not quite
(19:48):
the athlete, maybe a little littlequicker than Jones, more of a lanky,
possession not a possession receiver, butmore so Julio Jones, who,
of cour this is the freakish athletewho makes the plays that you just can't
believe. And yet their numbers verysimilar through those first rookie contracts. Julio
(20:08):
Jones for the most part, hasmanaged to stay healthy these last three four
years, and for AJ Green,this is the toll that we see this
game takes on these football players.And you know, this may have something
to do with the fact that Greenalways was a little bit lankier, a
little more sinewy. Jones a muchtighter packed, muscular athlete. But it's
(20:30):
just very sad to see because AJGreen I do think was on a Hall
of Fame trajectory. But look atthe injuries the last couple of years.
It is going to take a miraculouscomeback in a couple more All Pro selections
in his thirties, and that's reallynot likely to happen. Another report of
note, Buffalo Bills brought in sixnew offensive linemen via free agency. Arguably
(20:55):
the most high priced was center MitchMorse, who they signed away from the
Kansas City Chiefs. Mitch Morse isnow in the concussion protocol in the first
week of training camp. Now thisis not unusual by today's NFL standards,
but when you're getting concussions in trainingcamp when nobody's even gone live or full
speed yet, that has to concernthe Buffalo Bills a little bit. Yeah,
(21:18):
no question about it. I meanthat's going to be the well you
just said it. I mean,no offensive line underwent greater sort of rehaul
overhauling. Excuse me, then Buffalo. Everyone knows what a disaster it was.
I thought that that, actually,well, we're here in Chicago,
so you might even argue Mitch Terbiskis, but not a lot of worse sort
of young QB incubators than what wesaw for Josh Allen last year. I
(21:42):
liked the moves they made. Imean, I love Cody Ford. I
figured they plug him in. Iwould guess that'd right tackle right out of
the gate. I preferred Matt Paradisein Carolina to Mitch Morse in Buffalo,
especially for the money each received.But yeah, I mean he was brought
in I think became the highest paidcenter in the league to sort of be
the glue of that rebuild. Andwe'll just hope that he can get back
(22:03):
quickly. But this is important time. I know, you're just trying to
keep guys healthy, so they haven'tbeen able to do that. And then,
b when you make that many changesup front, you better believe that
they need time to develop chemistry,to develop trust in one another. And
this is obviously going to be alittle bit of a roadblock in that regard.
A couple of interesting stories out ofthe Miami camp. Arthur, and
(22:23):
yes, the Dolphins are in arebuild season. Some think they may even
be tanking. I don't think itcan tank in the NFL. You're just
going to get people hurt. Butif you build a bad roster, which
they have done, you're going tolose a lot of football games. But
the announcement earlier this week that offensiveline coach Pat Flaherty had been fired,
(22:44):
And what's so unusual about that ishe was just hired six months ago when
Brian Flores took over the team andput his staff together. Pat is actually
an old friend of mine. WhenI was still doing the Chicago Bears games
on the radio, Pat was theoffensive line coach here in Chicago, spent
a number of years as the linecoach with the Giants, has developed some
(23:07):
really good football players. He's sixtythree years old. I believe I don't
want to go there because now I'mnot sure this, so I don't want
to say it. I was justgonna say something about some off the field
accomplishments as well, but certainly aquality offensive line coach in the NFL.
And to get to the third dayof training camp and get fired, you
know, pretty unusual stuff. Yeah, I would say so, and let's
(23:32):
not forget the unusual stuff that wasgoing on. And I don't, I'm
not, I shouldn't. I'm notsaying these things are connected. Of course
they're not. But everyone remembers whathappened in the Dolphins O line room last
year and how that coach was dismissedas well. So in what else is
interesting, Hubb And it's another personthat you've gotten to know pretty well.
Bill Belichick doesn't do a lot oftinkering with his coaching staffs. Obviously,
(23:55):
Brian Flores a Bill Belichick disciple.So on one hand, if you really
didn't think Flaret he was getting thejob, getting the old line sort of
room marching in the same direction,and that's what the you know they're sighting
is the reason for the switch,then I guess, you know, I
credit him if he's accurately you know, you know, seeing that and is
willing to act on it now ratherthan wasting time. But you correct me
(24:18):
if I'm wrong. This is theapple falling pretty far from the tree when
we're talking specifically about coaching changes.Quite the contrast between what Bill has done.
And now what Brian Flores is doing, very very early in his first
job. You know, Arthur itis. But I have to add a
note here, and I'm going tobutcher this name, and I apologize.
I just don't have it in frontof me. But what Flores did do
is he replaced him? Is itGoogliazzi the new offense? I'm sorry,
(24:45):
I'm not sure. I apologize.You know my pronunciations. Well, yeah,
look, and unfortunately our internet isdown here, and so I apologize
to him. But I do knowthat he is a friend of Flora's who
worked with him with the Patriots asan assistant offensive line coach. Was either
fifteen and sixteen or sixteen and seventeen, and so again it's very unusual.
(25:06):
There's no really explaining it. Buthe did in fact replace him with somebody
he is close to, and thatis not unusual, especially with some of
these young head coaches around the NFL. Okay, and then, of course,
on the other story, we shouldget to quickly down in South Florida,
Josh Rosen and no one was praisingthat the trade in April more than
(25:26):
I was. And I'm not backingoff that by any means yet. But
what do you think Flora says thatRyan Fitzpatrick it's I'm paraphrasing, but I'm
pretty sure it's something along the linesof it's very clear to the new coach
that the uh, the veteran journeymanfrom Harvard, is well ahead of the
(25:47):
second year player out of UCLA inthat quarterback competition. Is Josh Rosen getting
served some humble pie? Is henot developing as quickly as they would hope
for? Because God, you turnedto Ryan fitz Patrick and that's only going
to stoke the fires of the peoplesaying, you know, screaming tank in
Miami. Yeah, you know,I think again, it's early in camp.
(26:08):
It may be something he's doing tomotivate Josh Rosen. It may just
be the reality that Josh Rosen didn'tget a lot of great coaching last year
in Arizona and so this is almostlike a rookie campaign for him. It
may be that they're all absorbing anew system, and obviously a seventy two
year old veteran like Ryan Fitzpatrick isgoing to do that more quickly than Josh
(26:30):
Rosen is. I think the unfortunatepart about it is that that Ryan Fitzpatrick
was Ryan Fitzmagic for all of aboutfive weeks in Tampa, you know.
And so this is obviously not anykind of long range answer. I still
believe Josh Rosen is going to bethe starting quarterback for the Miami Dolphins for
the better part of this season.But yeah, it did surprise a lot
(26:51):
of folks. I mean, thefact that even though last year was a
struggle for him, you know,he did as a rookie get I think,
I want to say it was likeeleven starts, and so you would
expect, having made the deal,that you'd want him in there on day
one. But you know, thisis a rookie head coach who spent his
entire coaching career in New England,albeit on the defensive side of the ball,
(27:12):
watching Tom Brady and the last coupleof years going to Super Bowls with
a late thirties something now early fortiesis something quarterback, and so it could
just be that he's more comfortable withthe veteran right now. So we're running
out of time, Arthur, Andone more thing we've been trying to do
each week is get to each ofthe divisions and at least talk about some
(27:32):
of the predictions for the teams inthat division. Unfortunately, as I said,
my internet's not working right now,so I don't have the totals in
front of me. But all we'redoing is taking a look at these teams
and trying to figure out if Vegashas it right with the totals they put
on them and whether they should goover or under. So I guess we'll
start in the AFC South, wherethe defending champion Houston Texans total is only
(27:55):
eight and a half this year,but the Indianapolis Colts, the wildcard Colts,
have a total of nine and ahalf. Those those those are interesting
numbers. I think that Houston probablyis good enough to win nine games.
I did not like what I sawDeshaun Watson in his development late last season.
(28:15):
The offensive line has to get better. They used early picks on two
big offensive lineman, but both smallschool kids who may not be plug in
play type guys. If they're healthierat wide receiver, they're immediately better.
They're going to be very good ondefense. Um, you know, so,
I think probably over on eight anda half the Colts. Nine and
(28:36):
a half is a tough number.I mean, if I'm actually giving advice.
I'd stay away from from from thisat all, but forced to pick
um. I don't know. Ijust look at the Colts roster and I
love Andrew Luck and he appears tobe healthy right now. But I think
they had a lot of guys playingover their head on defense last year.
The offensive line is very good,they still need more weapons. From where
(28:57):
I sit, Marlon Mack is anice running back, but I don't know
if he's a guy you build anoffense around. So I'm gonna say maybe
they only win eight or nine thisyear, all right, Yeah, So
I'm going opposite on both of these. Houston was eleven and five last year,
Hub, and I just have badvibes with the Texans this season this
offseason, from the firing of BrianGaine to the uninspired offensive line rebuild to
(29:21):
the Jadevian Clowney contract in past.So I'm going under on this one.
I just got a weird feeling,and I'm going over on the Colts.
They were ten and six last year, of course, and You're right that
the defense played above its head lastyear, but now they've added Justin Houston
and Rock Yeahsin a couple under additionalunderrated pieces, no reason to believe they're
(29:41):
not going to be better on defense, and I'm excited about a couple of
the moves they've made on offense aswell, with Devin Funchis and the rookie
there in Paris Campbell, and Ijust I really really like Frank Reich and
Chris Ballard. Obviously they need AndrewLuck and and yes, it is a
little concerning that he misspracticed yesterday withthis calf issue that was not a scheduled
maintenance day. But my understanding isafter watching what happened with Kevin Durant in
(30:04):
the NBA Finals, there are acouple of NFL teams that are taking calf
injuries a little bit more seriously.So I don't think it's time to worry
yet on Andrew Luck. And Ijust I'm too high on what they're building
there, So I think they goover nine and a half. And I
have no quarrel with your prediction,but I would just qualify it by saying,
when I do these, I don'tfactor in rookies for what I think
they're going to be based on ourprofittball weekly traft rating. So I mean
(30:27):
you're right Rock, Yeah, Sinand Paris Campbell. These are interesting prospects
that they've added. But if somebodywants me to risk money on it,
I want to see what I'm bettingon before I do. And that's why
I don't bet, by the way, and I hate to put you on
the spot, but as I said, I just can't get our internet up
here. Do you have the totalsfor Jacksonville? I do, Okay,
yes, sir, so Jacksonville tonto see are both at eight and last
(30:51):
year. Of course, A tonof Sea finish nine and seven, the
Jaguars five and eleven. So I'llkick us off and I'm gonna go sor
I didn't give it ton of thoughtyet. I'm gonna go over on Jacksonville
because there's just still so much talenteddefensively, and maybe Leonard Fournette really does
you know, he's ready to wakeup and smell the coffee, and maybe
(31:11):
Nick Foles does interject the type ofleadership and maturity in that locker room that
is so desperately needed. It's notwith great confidence, but I'll go over
on Jacksonville, and I'm gonna gounder on Tennessee because I just I'm not
a believer in Marcus Mariota and nothing. I don't think that defense is going
to be as good again this year. I think it's another unit that played
(31:32):
a little bit over its head.It's got some nice young pieces, but
nothing that really blows my hair back. So I'll go overround the Jaguars and
under on the Titans. All right, So we're going to disagree on all
four teams here, because I mean, you're probably right about Jacksonville. I'll
qualify my prediction by saying I'm probablywrong. But but the way that thing
came apart so completely, the childishbehavior of people like Jalen Ramsey tells me
(31:56):
that locker room may not be anybetter this year than it was last year.
I understand that Tom Coughlin probably hasn'tslept in three months with what he
has been dealt here. And listen, I love Nick Foles, but I
never believe that Blake Bortles was theonly problem with that offense and that team.
Is Leonard Fournette going to be whatwe thought he was going to be.
(32:17):
He's another one who needs to growup a little bit. And in
this division, where I do agreethat Indianapolis is very good, and I
think he may be underrating Houston alittle bit. It's gonna be tough to
be over five hundred, so I'mgonna take them under and then I'm gonna
flip it around with Tennessee. Idid their playoff games last year. I
think that Mike Rabel is one ofthe more impressive young coaches in the league.
We don't talk about him a lot, but I love the job he
(32:39):
did. I don't think it's ahuge loss that Matt Lafleur is now in
Green Bay. You know, hehad the one year as the coordinator there,
but the offense struggled a good partof the season. I agree with
you that I don't trust Marcus Mariota. I don't know why Ryan Tannehill is
here other than the possibility that theydon't trust Marcus Mariota either. But I
love the addition to care Ran Wakeand I know he's another geriatric case,
(33:01):
but he has been since he cameto the NFL, and he rarely slows
down. So I think Tennessee.I'm actually probably gonna pick this division with
Houston and Indianapolis and Tennessee once again, all within a game or a half
a game of each other and Jacksonvillebringing up the rear. What kind of
numbers have you got for us onthe NFC NFC Yeah, yep, the
(33:23):
NFC South, like you know,it's a counterpart of the other. Conference
is going to be competitive this yearclearly, at least that's how Vegas sees
it. But this number, NewOrleans is at ten and a half,
and then you got the Atlanta Falconsat eight and a half. So I
love the Saints that I don't know, I'm kind of torn on that one.
I really do like what they have. We did, we talked at
(33:44):
the top of the program about howthey really are, you know, the
Super Bowl contender of the highest order. And at the same time, I
just that number for some reason looksa little high to me. I'm thinking
the Saints could very easily be tenand six and still go on to a
Super Bowl. I'm gonna go underon the Saints, and I'm going over
around the Falcons because I just thinkthere is way too much firepower there offensively,
(34:05):
you know, the way they rebuiltthat offensive line, all the reinforcements
they get young reinforcements on that defense, and Dion Jones and you know,
Ricardo Allen, and the list goeson Keianu Neil. Obviously, I'm gonna
go over on the Falcons. Ithink they got a chance to be really
good this year. We finally foundone we can agree on. I'm going
over on the Falcons too, notby a ton, but I do agree
that there's just too much talent therenot to be able to be better than
(34:28):
five hundred, so I would takethe over there. Now. I don't
know really much about gambling or betting, but I know that when it comes
to these totals, ten and ahalf is a very big number. But
I'm picking the New Orleans Saints towin the NFC and lose the Super Bowl
to the Chargers. And very rarelydo you have Super Bowl teams with less
than eleven or twelve wins, SoI can't justify that pick and then say
I don't think they're good enough towin more than ten games, So I'm
(34:51):
gonna go over with them. Carolina. Do they bounce back, Tampa Bay,
does Bruce Arians, you know,resurrect that messed down there? And
let me just say, I guessthe Saints. We're thirteen and three last
year, So if I'm going ownedover under on ten and a half.
I'm picking a three game regression.I'm gonna flip flop here, and I'm
gonna say they're gonna go over.I don't think they'll be thirteen and three
(35:14):
again, but let's say eleven andfive. Carolina Carolina, we've got an
eight win sub in Tampa Bay,we've got it six and a half.
Buccaneers are a very easy under forme. The Panthers, they kind of
look like an eight eight football team, So I'm probably gonna just stay away
from that one. I guess ifI'm forced to go in one direction,
(35:34):
I'll go over and say they're morelikely to be nine and seven than seven
and nine. Yeah, I'm strugglingwith that one because Ron Rivera, I
think is one of the four orfive best coaches in the league. But
we don't know who the quarterback's gonnabe. We don't know the situation with
Cam Newton's shoulder, and that's whythat number is interesting. But I'm gonna
go over just based on the amountof talent in Rivera, but probably just
(35:55):
a half game over, and I'mgonna go over in the belief that Newton
may even be better than he's beenin recent seasons with that shoulder repaired.
I'm definitely going under with the Bucks. I don't understand how Bruce Arian retires
from coaching a year ago because ofhealth and family considerations, and then one
(36:15):
year later suddenly his health is fineand his family doesn't care and he's back
coaching the Bucks. Something's weird downthere, and I just don't trust that
organization or the situation with Arian.So I'm gonna take under there. Arthur,
We're gonna cut you loose. Thankyou so much, and we want
to thank everybody else involved with thepodcast once again. It all starts with
Dan Mott every week. To ourgreat sponsors, thank you so much for
(36:38):
being with us, the guys thatHumfrey's McGee for our music, and don't
forget folks. You can download asubscription to these podcasts so you get them
automatically. Just go to Pro FootballWeekly dot com for information there and make
sure you get our Pro Football WeeklyChicago podcast as well. We will be
making the rounds of these training campsthe next few weeks and we'll get back
(36:58):
with everything you need to know aboutthe NFL preseason next week with another edition
of Pro Football weekly,
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