Best Of Query & Company - Wednesday 10/1/25

Today’s Best of Features:

(00:00-11:29) – James Boyd from The Athletic and Fan Morning Show joins the program from the Colts complex to provide an update on some injuries for the Colts, highlights some players that he’s interested to see how they bounce back from a poor outing against the Rams, and shares what the status of Adonai Mitchell for this week is. 

(11:29-23:20) – Indianapolis Indians President & GM, Randy Lewandowski, makes an appearance on the program to discuss the decision to change their logos and uniforms to honor the baseball heritage of the franchise. He explains the thought process that went behind designing the logos, why right now was the right time to do it, and teases some other things that they are working on.

(23:20-44:16) – Zach Osterman from the IndyStar joins Query & Company to discuss IU football and basketball. Jake asks Zach about what he has seen from Darian DeVries leading up to the start of the season and what type of style of basketball he wants to play. Zach also accesses if the Hoosiers can make the College Football Playoff with a loss at Oregon but recording a win at Penn State. Finally, Zach points out something he finds intriguing about next week’s game against Oregon.

(44:16-59:14) – Sam King from the Lafayette Journal & Courier makes an appearance on the program to preview this weekend’s game for the Boilermakers against Illinois and give his perspective on how the team has grown game to game in Barry Odum’s first year. Sam also discusses what he has seen so far from Purdue basketball in some practices, evaluates all the different options that Matt Painter has with lineups, and how Painter operates in the early parts of the season in practices.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
James Boyd talked about it this morning along with Kevin
Bowen and Jeff Rickard. He joins us now on the
program me. Hear him on the Fan Morning Show, but
we want to get as we talked about his boots
on the ground down at West fifty six, Shane Steichen
talking to the media today, and then everything gets back
underway to now shift and kind of turn the page
towards the Las Vegas Raiders. James, I'll begin with this.

(00:21):
We just talked about it. Kenny Moore, Alec Pierce looks
like both of those not going to be Alec Pierce
kN kind of go through some things. Will we see
Alec Pierce on the field against the Raiders.

Speaker 2 (00:33):
Yeah, it does sound like that is trending in the
right direction. Shane told us today that Alec Pierce will practice.
He's on the protocol, but that's usually normal, just because
they usually don't clear the guy until.

Speaker 1 (00:44):
The following week.

Speaker 2 (00:45):
And so if things go as planned, I would expect
Alec Pearce to be cleared sometimes whether it's Friday or Saturday.
And then when it comes to Kenny Moore, he said
that he remains out. I did ask him, Hey, is
this like a week's a week thing, and he was
just saying, hey, when he's progressing well, And that's about
all the update we got on him. And so those
are the two big, you know, injury updates I have for.

Speaker 1 (01:06):
You, James. When you look at the defensive backfield for
the Colts, which is clear and look, I'm not even
saying this as a knock on the Colts. I mean
it's their achilles right now, but attrition is a huge
part of that. And Exavier Howard, I mean it does
feel I mentioned last night the Fever were good to
the last drop. I feel like they've gotten the last
drop out of the career of Xavier Howard. And again

(01:27):
it's just it's time, right Do they continue to go
that way or does lou An Arumo now say, you
know what, we've got to experiment and go somewhere else.

Speaker 2 (01:36):
That's an interesting question because we were able to follow
up with Shane today and again they basically are saying, hey,
those are two elite receivers last week and Devonte Adams
and Puka Nakula. So it's gonna be a tough matchup
for anything. But I do feel like you look at
the numbers, man and you can look at any site,
whether it's pro football focused, ProFootball reference, true media, which

(01:57):
we use all these different you know languages speak right
now who cares all of it?

Speaker 3 (02:02):
Says that he's been bad.

Speaker 2 (02:02):
And if you use your regular eyes, you can tell
that he has been bad. And he's a pretty you know,
porous on defense. It's giving up yards, giving up catches.
I think the thing that's probably most concerning when you
look at this Jake is some of the effort at
the end of he's plays. You go back and watch
some of the tape. Man, I'm not like a bidy
linguage expert, but you know, there's a couple couple of
times where a pass gets caught in his vicinity and

(02:23):
he's a last guy rallying to the ball. He's a
last guy trying to make a tackle, and so those
things are concerning to me. So I do think that
personally it's time to possibly try something else, because it
really cannot get any worse than what you're.

Speaker 3 (02:36):
Seeing right now.

Speaker 2 (02:37):
I mean the passer rating when you're targeting xaving Howard,
I believe through the first four weeks of the season
is like above one twenty and for those listening. A
Percasser rating is one fifty eight point three, and usually
if you're above one hundred, that's really good, So for
it to be one twenty is ubsurd.

Speaker 1 (02:53):
Yeah, it's just you keep going to that side, right,
and then you know the other thing that comes into play,
and James, you tell me or kind of spell this
out for people. I guess if you will, we forget
that Jalen Jones was out, then you have Kenny Moore
going out, which is your nickel primarily, but you have
to start kind of reshifting guys around. Okay, the Kenny

(03:17):
Moore absence, how relative, Obviously it's relevant, but does it
change or move around the pecking order, if you will,
of the corners in terms of having to put people
then out of normal position to be able to fill
in where Kenny Moore was.

Speaker 2 (03:36):
Yeah, I don't think it's necessarily that too much. Because
they did bring in Mike Hilton. It's got to fill
that role. I thought he was fine in his cold debut,
and so the other cornerbacks that we're able to kind
of stay where they normally line up. But you know,
if Kenny Moore were healthy, I think that there would
be some conversation being had, like, Hey, is this the
guy we want to play outside a little bit and

(03:57):
perhaps have Mike Hilton playing the slot, but having Kenny
as an option really just kind of I think puts
a spotlight or a magnifying glass on just how depleted
your cornerback room is. And look, I understand that Xavion
Howard is struggling.

Speaker 3 (04:11):
And he wasn't their first choice.

Speaker 2 (04:13):
I'll give them some grace there because they've dealt with
the limney of injuries in that room. But now that
you've seen this for a month, I think you do
have to make an adjustment.

Speaker 3 (04:20):
And if you don't, I mean, what.

Speaker 2 (04:21):
Are you preaching to your guys. I mean, we heard
when lou and Romo got hiring all he doesn't care
about resume. He's hard on all his guys. He's tough,
he's hard knows now it's time to be tough. You
believed in this guy you brought up here. He isn't performing,
and so now I'm looking at him and saying, Okay,
you told us you didn't care about resume when people
got here. You shouldn't care about Xavion Howard's resume because,
as you alluded, to Jake he was a great player.

(04:43):
I do not believe he is a great player anymore.

Speaker 1 (04:45):
James James Boyd is our guest of course with the
Athletic but also on the morning show, The Fan Morning Show,
along with Kevin Bowen and jeff Rickord. Do you hear
him on this radio station talking about the Colts James
Ady Mitchell when he came into the league. The question
mark on Adie Mitchell was about maturity. And as I
mentioned yesterday, I don't mean maturity like he's making fart

(05:08):
noises with his armpits right, just focus in general, right,
like attention to detail type stuff to me, And I
want you to tell me if you disagree with this statement.
I'm going to make a statement, and then I want
you to tell me if you agree with the statement.
The maturity of Ady Mitchell is going to be more
tested now than ever because the toughest thing for an

(05:30):
athlete is to be able to carry on and move
forward from a negative experience. And he not had one,
but two negative experiences. And this is going to be
the ultimate test of his resolve and we're going to
find out a lot about him against the Raiders.

Speaker 2 (05:47):
Your thoughts absolutely and I think the hardest part, Jake,
is that we might not find out what it looks
like on the field for the Raiders. Because I did
follow with saying stikeen today, now I was able to
ask him, will Ady Mitchell play? It was a direct question.
He said, we'll see how we go. And so that
to me says they're at least thinking about possibly, you know,

(06:09):
benching him, that's.

Speaker 1 (06:10):
Not an injury. There is no injury in play that
we're aware of. Correct, No, he had no injury.

Speaker 2 (06:15):
He's fully healthy. It's just a matter of do we
trust you enough to be out.

Speaker 3 (06:19):
There when we need you to perform.

Speaker 2 (06:21):
And so he kept saying today Shane psyching, that is
that Ady Mitchell has to earn it. And so what
does that mean, Well, we'll find out certainly throughout this
week and what that means for Sunday's status. And so
to your point, Jake, if he is not available, how
do you handle that? You know, how do you come
back from that? How do you act like a professional,
How do you coach up your teammates, how do you

(06:42):
believe in your team?

Speaker 3 (06:43):
And how do you you.

Speaker 2 (06:43):
Know, do all the things that you're supposed to do
when you don't get what you want because right now
he's given what he wants.

Speaker 3 (06:50):
And he's been.

Speaker 2 (06:51):
Proven, at least through the first you know, stages of
his career in the NFL that he can't be trusted
in the big moments, and so it's unfortunate for him.
But also it's not a career ender. I'm not staying
benching for the rest of the year. No one's saying that.
But they sit them down for you know, a week.
Considering that Alex Pearce is also back in the lineup.
Assume that happened, It wouldn't be the worst thing in
the world, I think, to get his attention and also

(07:12):
to kind of let them know we have a higher
standard here.

Speaker 1 (07:15):
James. You ever you grew up in northern Illinois, did
you ever find yourself in a situation as a kid
or whatever it might be, when you were playing on
a frozen pond and you were on ice, You ever, like,
you know what I'm talking about, when you're out on
the ice and then all of a sudden you hear
that like and you realize that ice y, you know
what I'm talking about.

Speaker 2 (07:32):
Yeah, I feel like every kid in America probably did
that when their parents sold.

Speaker 1 (07:35):
Not to correct, right, So so you hear that noise
and you know, like, oh my gosh, you know the
ice is not near as solid underneath me as I think,
and you immediately retreat to get off of the ice.
What player for the Colts right now is hearing that
ice and is starting to wonder just how stable things
are underneath them if they don't get things going.

Speaker 2 (07:56):
That's a great question. I think one we already hit
on with Ady Mitchel. Another one is Daven Howard. For sure,
those two are the ones that really stick out to me,
and for different reasons. I think for Ad it's all
about focus and finishing and being a professional and all
the things that go into you know, making plays on Sundays.
And then for Xavin Howard, you know, it's like the
reaper coming from you is basically he's looking at U,

(08:17):
see like can I be the player that I used
to be? Can I still be an NFL starter at
this point? Because right now I believe that is the case.
And so those two players stand out for sure in
my eyes. And then you know not to say like
this is some red you know, flag or some alarm,
but I do think you want to see Bernard Ryman,
the left tackle, bounce back from a poor showing last week.
I got beat multiple times on the edge, had a

(08:40):
couple of penalties. Now he's on the hot seat. I'm
not saying he's going to be in the doghouse, but
you do want to see him bounced back as well
against the Raiders team that's struggling right now but still
had the great pass rusher in Max Carlsey on the
other side.

Speaker 1 (08:50):
You know, it's interesting, left tackle is the one position
to me, James that even the very best of the best,
it feels like that's the one position. And I think
so much of it is just like it's a timing
field position. The very best of the best at left tackle,
it seems very few of them go sixteen for well
and now I guess it would be seventeen go seventeen

(09:12):
for seventeen in a season of a game where you go, yeah,
they were there. They always. It seems like it is
a position very prone to an off day. The elite
ones are simply the ones that make sure that that's
the one off makes sense, oh oh yea.

Speaker 3 (09:28):
One hundred percent.

Speaker 2 (09:29):
But I think the reason why my eyebrows are raised
and again not a bad way, just in a Hey,
they gave you one hundred million dollars, you have to perform.
And I get that. You know you're going up against
the best in the world and you weren't an All
Pro or Pro Bowl caliber player, and you might not be.
But I still consider Barnaara ramis you one of the
better left tackles in this league. And he even said
of himself, he's got to play better, he's got to

(09:50):
bounce back. And one thing I do love about Bernie
He's never, you know, mince his words. He says it
like it is. He takes ownership and usually he responds
pretty well. So I'm excited to see how he performed.
Perhaps and they'd better like come Sunday against the Raiders.

Speaker 1 (10:03):
Okay, what else are we looking for today? Or that
could be big topics for you tomorrow in the morning.

Speaker 2 (10:09):
I think one of them is just looking at Maganzalvez.
They were saying they were going to work him out
today to see if he can practice later on. That
is the starting white guard for the coach.

Speaker 3 (10:18):
Al thought they.

Speaker 2 (10:18):
Really missed him last week. He's played really well this season,
especially in past protection. So he's someone that you want
to have out there against the Raiders, really want to
have out there every week obviously as a starting offensive lineman.
So that's an other injury update. And then from there,
I think, you know, looking at this offense as a whole,
how do you kind of bounce back from your first
sort of dud. You know, you only score twenty points
to the twenty seven, or perhaps more than that given

(10:41):
eighty Mitchell's blunders. But uh, Daniel Jones, how do you
respond to your first game where you did not play
lights out, You weren't at an MVP level, you had
two turnovers.

Speaker 3 (10:49):
You know, we've sort of.

Speaker 2 (10:51):
Bought into you here in Indianapolis, But how do you
solidify it? And you go out there and you bounce
back and you play well against the bad Raiders team.
So to me, the coach are very fortunate to be
three and one on oh some people are saying, oh,
they should be four and oh, well, you could just
easily be towing two given how the Denver game ended.
So you take a three and one, you come back
home and ITA's a bad Raider of team. You've got
the Cardinals coming to town the week after that. They're

(11:12):
not a great team either, so you're in a great
position to still control your destiny when it comes to
winning the division and get into the playoffs.

Speaker 1 (11:19):
All right, James, appreciate it. We'll be listening in the morning.
All right, appreciate it, brother, have a good one, James
Boyd joining us from the Athletic and the Fan morning show.
Summer indeed is past, and now we move on to,
of course October, because September is ending. That's not to

(11:39):
say the boys of Summer are not a topic of conversation.
And I noticed it, whether it was I think it
was two days ago on social media, the new look,
if you will, the new branding of the Indianapolis Indians
joining me now to talk about it. He is the
president and CEO of the Napolis Indians. He is also

(12:01):
the twenty twenty four Minor League Baseball Executive of the Year.
Randy Lewandowski joins us on the program. And Randy, I
am prepared to cash out the four oh one k
and come to the gift shop because I love every
aspect of it. But then I thought to myself, the
new look of the Indians, what went on behind it?
I thought we could talk about exactly that. How are you.

Speaker 4 (12:21):
I'm great, Jake, thanks for having me on. And yeah,
it's normally a pretty quiet time of the year for
our gift shop, but we're open and swing on buy
and we'll help you out.

Speaker 1 (12:32):
Okay. So there's a rich and I talked about this yesterday, Randy.
I think people may I think most people know this,
but there is a really rich tradition of baseball in
Indiana beyond just the years, you know, the century of
Indianapolis Indians baseball and some of the great players that
have come through here, but also great players that are

(12:53):
native to hear I mean everything from Oscar Charleston, you know,
and the Negro League teams and the ABC team and
the clowns. You guys have kind of paid homage to
all of them in different periods. And this particular new
look for the Indians, getting away from the red and
black and kind of more into a navy color scheme,
seems to kind of tie a lot of that in.

(13:15):
But maybe I'm overthinking it. What was the motivating factor
here of the rebrand?

Speaker 4 (13:20):
No, I mean you're exactly right, the black and the
red again, that this is I just finished my thirty
second season with the Indianapolis Indians, and it's been the
same look and feel for all thirty two because it
started the year before me. So a good portion of
your listeners and Indianapolis in general think, oh, Indianapolis Indians,

(13:41):
red and black. But if you go prior to that,
we had some exposed colors for the six or eight
years we were at the expos in the late eighties
and very early nineties. But prior to that, most everything
that we had was a red.

Speaker 5 (13:53):
And or a navy look.

Speaker 4 (13:55):
And when you harken back to the twenties, the forties,
the fifties, the sixth that was prominent. It's also the
city's primary colors being navy and red. And really that's
what we were leaning into, is the heritage, the nostalgia,
the history, as you said, that we have in the

(14:16):
city of Middiapolis. Again, we've been around since nineteen oh two.
That's what we're Indy's original home team. You're going to
see and hear that a lot because we've been around
longer than anybody else. And that's really what we leaned
into as we started to look into this three or
four years ago.

Speaker 1 (14:29):
In terms of and for those that are unfamiliar Randy,
the you have a and all baseball teams do this.
Now I realize like kind of multiple logos, right, So
there's one I've already seen somebody wearing it today of
the interlocking I in d Y that goes it's almost
like a New York Yankees, New York Fire Department kind
of look. That spells out India on the hat. There's

(14:50):
another that uses simply and I'm going to speak generically
here like an old script letter I that's on the hat.
Which one, first off, will the primary look.

Speaker 5 (15:02):
We're gonna wear both.

Speaker 4 (15:03):
The Indie monogram will be primarily at home. We call
it a black letter I, primarily on the road. That
they are interchangeable. We felt like we wanted to do
both to give us some flexibility to see how they
all fit and come together. But that is the primary

(15:24):
focus on those can you talk about and we'll still continue,
you know, we're focusing on what you've just mentioned, Jake.
We'll still continue with our Circle City brand. We're still
going to continue to honor the negro leagues. We've got
something exciting coming from a Native American perspective.

Speaker 5 (15:40):
Those are all.

Speaker 4 (15:41):
Things that will roll out in the spring, but Right now,
we're focused on our primary which is we did a roundel.

Speaker 5 (15:48):
That's the circle that you.

Speaker 4 (15:51):
Might see, oh gosh on a piece of paper when
your sponsor and event kind of is your classic look.
That's on the sleep of all of our jerseys.

Speaker 5 (16:01):
So that's our primary logo.

Speaker 4 (16:03):
And then we have the monogram and then the black
later eye that you had mentioned. So we're excited about
all of them and really looking.

Speaker 5 (16:09):
Forward to getting them out in the public.

Speaker 4 (16:10):
And we're being more visible than we ever have been
in what we would call the fourth quarter of the year.
We usually go pretty dark, but we're out there with
an ad campaign. We ran a spot during the Indianapolis
Colts game believe it or not, on Sunday, and you're
going to see us in some other non traditional spots
for us here this fall and winter.

Speaker 1 (16:29):
Why the timing on it just I mean, and I
don't mean that in a bad way, you know, I mean,
like you said, it's been a long time, But was
there a significance of the year. Did somebody in marketing
just get bored? Is it a I mean, obviously it's
going to sell out of merch as well. Any specific
reasoning for that?

Speaker 5 (16:45):
I think a couple things.

Speaker 4 (16:47):
The first one, as we entered in our partnership with
the Miami Nation of Indians of Indiana in twenty twenty three,
we certainly learned some things about their perspective. And the
old logo had a Southwestern look and feel to it,
and that's not really proper to where we are in

(17:08):
the Eastern Woodlands and with the tribes represented here. So
if you look at the roundel, it's got some ribbon
work and that's more native to this area. So that
was important as well. And candidly, the other logo is
thirty three years old and we felt it was outdated
and it was time to give it a fresh look,
and we put all that stuff together and we've worked

(17:29):
on it for Like I said, it's always a long process,
and for us, it's been three to four year of
a journey with lots of input from Native American tribes,
from our staff, our board of directors, season ticket holders.
We've done gallery sessions, jam sessions, lots of different community

(17:49):
audiences to give input. It wasn't just cooked up by
our marketing and creative departments. They led the process, but
we certainly was inclusive and we tried to be as
thoughtful as because we made the adjustment for what we
hope is the next thirty years.

Speaker 1 (18:05):
You know, Randy, this will stun you, I know, but
I was looking at the you know, I guess now,
the recently retired logo, if you will, of the Indianapolis
Indians and one of the things that was worn on
the hat. You know, I guess it's the facsimbile of it.
It resembles an arrowhead, right, that particular logo that I'm

(18:25):
talking about. You'll be stunned to know that I was
fifty three years old, and however, many months now when
I realized that that actually is two letter eyes that
are up against each other for Indianapolis and Indians to
form that I never knew.

Speaker 5 (18:38):
That.

Speaker 1 (18:39):
Is that stunning to you that I didn't figure that out.

Speaker 5 (18:41):
No, it's not stunning. Most people did.

Speaker 4 (18:43):
And I would tell you that it was cleverly done
and probably too cleverly done back in the early nineties
because that we referred to it as a double eye,
not an arrowhead. But I mean, I certainly see how
everyone you know, how that has been portrayed and thought
of over the years.

Speaker 5 (18:59):
But that was it was two eyes.

Speaker 4 (19:02):
That formed together and then with a little some other
marks in there as well. And but it was a
little too clever, I think, So, Jake, you're you're not
alone in that regard.

Speaker 1 (19:11):
Well, usually on the last to figure stuff out.

Speaker 5 (19:13):
Oh it's stunner.

Speaker 4 (19:15):
Never.

Speaker 5 (19:15):
Never, you're mister Indianapolis. You've been You've been looking at
that thing for a long time.

Speaker 4 (19:19):
But it is funny when you start to look at things,
how you just look past.

Speaker 1 (19:23):
Well and then once you see it, you don't unsee
it right once you see it, Like how in the
world did I never know that I wanted to before
we let you go, Randy, and I appreciate it. Randy
Lewandowski is our guest from the Indianapolis Indians. You touched
on something I wanted to touch on a little bit more,
and that is, you know, we live in an era
and a time, and I know that the question had
been brought up of would Indianapolis ever deviate from the

(19:45):
name Indians, And obviously the Cleveland Indians come to mind
a little bit different in the caricature nature of Chief
Wahoo versus say, the way that it's been branded in Indianapolis.
But obviously I and I didn't realize this so I
appreciate you expanding on that. There obviously has been a
very concerted partnership amongst a Native American tribe to make

(20:09):
sure that all of this is done within the proper respect,
if you will, of that group of people. And so
therefore the name I would assume continues for another one
hundred years as well.

Speaker 5 (20:21):
We certainly think so.

Speaker 4 (20:24):
And yes, again, as we forge that relationship with the
Miami Nation of Indiana that has been it's been it's
just like any other partnership and relationship, and this one
is built on trust and respect and cheap Buchanan and
his tribal council, they're based up in Peru, Indiana.

Speaker 5 (20:46):
It's been a wonderful relationship. We've learned a lot.

Speaker 4 (20:48):
It's going to allow us to better educate and further
educate and use our platform to do so. We will
not be the spokespeople for the Miami Nation. We can't
be and we won't be. But we can provide a
platform for them, and that's something that we have done
with our Native American Heritage Nights where we recognize Native

(21:10):
American veterans. We've got a scholarship program, just other things
that we can build in regards to that relationship and
that partnership, and it's been fantastic. There were here Friday
night from when we did the unveiling. We're going to
be super excited when we do again. I mentioned we've
got something else coming that is even more Native themed
in the spring, and they're fully behind all of that

(21:32):
and they've been a great partner of ours and we're
excited to see where that goes in the future.

Speaker 1 (21:36):
And lastly, the partnership with you know, obviously now being
the parent club, being the Pittsburgh Pirates, I'm always fascinated
with how those dynamics contractually speaking, work. That partnership extends
for how long.

Speaker 4 (21:48):
That is through two thousand and thirty, so we've got
another four or five seasons left in that, and really
that becomes it's changed a lot over the years. Those
used to change every two and four years. Now their
ten year situations via Major League Baseball, they're more involved
than they ever have been. And so yeah, we're going

(22:09):
to be a proud partner and affiliate with the Pittsburgh
Priors through twenty thirty.

Speaker 1 (22:13):
Do they have say in the branding and the color
scheme and that kind of thing They do not.

Speaker 4 (22:18):
We offered them an opportunity to take a look, and
they they're fully aware of what's happening and they're fully supportive.
It'll be a little different when we wear navy helmets
instead of black helmets and everything else, and as players
coming up and down from different levels, but not all
their affiliates are the black and gold, and we didn't
think that was going to be appropriate here. This is

(22:40):
still cold country, a Spacers country. It's Indianapolis, Indians country.
We didn't think to introduce black and gold was going
to make a lot of sense in Indianapolis.

Speaker 5 (22:49):
That's for sure.

Speaker 1 (22:49):
Randy. We certainly appreciate it. I love the look. It
is well done. I certainly also a tip of the cap,
pardon the pun for tying in and letting our listsers
know about the tie in as well with you know,
the Miami Nation and and the tribute to that in
terms of the designs of the look. I'll be over
at the gift shop Friday. My buddy Jeff Ester and

(23:10):
I are coming to break the bank.

Speaker 4 (23:11):
All right, sounds great, Jake, appreciate the opportunity and be well.

Speaker 1 (23:14):
I appreciate it. Randy Lewandowski, who is the president and
CEO of the Indianapolis Indians, joining us now on the
program from the Indianapolis Star. He is the Indiana athletic
beat writer. Zach joins us, Zach, how are you.

Speaker 5 (23:32):
We have?

Speaker 2 (23:32):
Zach?

Speaker 3 (23:33):
I just can't get to the mute buttons fast enough.

Speaker 5 (23:35):
I apologize, no worries.

Speaker 3 (23:38):
I got the I got the dog shuffling around in
the office with me, and so I needed it and
uh yeah, sorry about that.

Speaker 1 (23:44):
Which dog is this?

Speaker 5 (23:45):
Uh?

Speaker 3 (23:47):
So we have? We have two again? Rebel is what
is one of the original that you're familiar with? And
then we have a Pyrenee Porter Collie.

Speaker 1 (23:57):
Mixed name mo now for what I'm thinking? There was one?

Speaker 5 (24:01):
Was it?

Speaker 1 (24:01):
Chewye? Was that his name?

Speaker 3 (24:03):
Chewye was? Chewye was?

Speaker 5 (24:05):
Yeah?

Speaker 3 (24:05):
Chewy was Chee. He cassed away a couple.

Speaker 5 (24:08):
Of years ago.

Speaker 1 (24:08):
That's right, Okay, Chewey made a few radio appearances. If
I'm not mistaken. He was not microphone shy, No, he was.
He was robust, all right, he was. He was very
Rebels football, basketball. I'll let you choose which one you
want to lead with here.

Speaker 3 (24:24):
Well, I'm right about basketball today. Might as well start there.

Speaker 1 (24:26):
Okay, So you know, how is it. It's fascinating. I
was out today at media day for the Horizon League,
for example, Zach and you know AU Indy for that matter,
new coach they've he's brought in. It's very James or
excuse me, it's very Kurt Signetti feeling. Ben Hallett, the
new coach at IU Indy has brought in four players

(24:49):
from West Liberty where he came and you know, you
got this whole new roster, so nobody knows right And
to an extent, Indiana feels the same way of we
just kind of don't know the roster yet, but you've
gotten indication of it because they've obviously had an off
season of some games together. What have you noticed that

(25:10):
is going to be different than a year ago? Aside
from personnel.

Speaker 3 (25:15):
And so far as you're in a very different philosophy
of roster construction. You know, by choice, Uh, Indiana's going
to be a fair bit smaller. And I know it.
You know, I know Indiana fans will say, oh, you know,
thank god, we're not going to you know, be playing
big ball, two big lineups and all that, and it's like, okay,
I get that that. You know, just remember that that
had its advantages right like that, you know, it was

(25:38):
hard to bully Indiana inside and it's not like I
think Indiana the last couple of years has been frust
that there is plenty of quality in the portal if
you go looking for a big man. They chose to
really emphasize guards, wings, shooting, positional interchangeability. You look at
the number of guys on this rosters that are somewhere
between six four and sixth day and can probably guard

(26:02):
you know, at least three, if not four positions, maybe
even a couple can guard all five positions. You know,
the reality is they're starting four man is probably gonna
be six with seven, but they're all gonna shoot the
ball an awful lot better than what Indiana fans have
seen the last few years. They're obviously going to be
a very experienced team, which I think is going to

(26:22):
make a difference. That you could see that in those
games that they had to come back from in Puerto Rico.
I you wanting to say to Bahamas because they went
there twice with Woodson, But you know, it is just
it is a roster that is going to look for
its shots in different ways. Play defense in different ways,
move the ball, share the ball, score the ball in

(26:44):
different ways. I suspect, stylistically in ways that are both
welcome and in ways that might take some adjustment for
some people. The first few games of the season are
probably going to be, I would say, something of a
mild system.

Speaker 1 (27:01):
Shot, okay. And with that, the question I would have
is are they stylistically playing something that cater to what
he was able to put together via the portal or
did he go out to the portal to get people
that stylistically play what he wants to play.

Speaker 3 (27:22):
I think it's probably more of the latter, Like a
lot of what he talked about, you know, when he
talked about kind of his principles and his approach when
he was hired, and certainly if you talk to people
who know him from his time at Drake and his
one year at West Virginia, which admittedly that was a
little bit of a weirder sort of sample sized because
he lost his son early in that season and just

(27:44):
kind of I think had to change the way that
team tried to win games. But I think that a
lot of what Indiana did in the portal was informed
by what Debrees wants. His seems to be and not
the other way around. Now, you are always, especially in
a low volume player sport, And what I mean by

(28:06):
that is there are just a limited number of you know,
compared to football, compared to baseball, compared to soccer, there
are just fewer players on the floor at any given time.
In basketball, You're always going to be a little bit
beholden to your talent, right, You're always going to have
to adjust based on what you're able to you know,
what you're able to acquire, and you know, this year, obviously,

(28:29):
Indiana's needs were fairly extreme because they had to renovate
their entire roster, at least in terms of the scholarship
spots scholarship players. But I do think that a lot
of these sort of floor spacing, high tempo motion offense principles,
sort of vision that degrees laid out, I think a
lot of these players fit that at least at a

(28:52):
basic level. I think I think what he does this
year is going to reflect in some pretty fundamental ways
he wants it seems to be philosophically and structurally, and
again that will always vary somewhat because you will always
be beholden to your talent to a certain degree in basketball,
But I don't think he necessarily just went out and

(29:14):
got to thirteen best players he could find and said,
you know, I'll once I've got my roster, I'll draw
up my plan for next year. You know.

Speaker 1 (29:23):
The it's interesting Zach because we didn't know a lot
about him coming in right talking about coach de Breze,
I the you know West Virginia. I talked to some
people from West Virginia. I don't remember where I was recently.
I saw a guy wear in a West Virginia hat,
you know, talked to him, Oh, yeah, we're from Morgantown.

(29:43):
And the guy said, he said, look, we thought he
was going to be here a long time. I mean
like he had that kind of a feel of really
good coach and whatever else. And he said, I understand
why you would leave to go to Indiana. But so
with that said, you know, when you when you watch
or you're around it, does he seem to be the

(30:05):
lead by example, like kind of quiet leader, just confident
type like what we see in a Kurt Signetti Or
is he more of the you know, high energy, run around,
frantic Tom Creane level coach or is he a Bob
Knight coach.

Speaker 3 (30:22):
So I would say I've gotten to sit in on
I guess three practices now if that's because I got
to see him once out in Puerto Rico, and that
one was I would describe maybe as more of a
workout than a practice, but also obviously been able to
see him coach three games. I think what I have
observed of him in practice is distinct to what I

(30:44):
have observed of him in games, and that is kind
of what I was told to expect with him. He
is very competitive in games. Although someone told me, and
I have not had the bandwidth and the desire to
look this up, someone told me he never been whistled
for a technical foul, and I'm not kind of hard
to believe for somebody who's been head coaches as long
as he has. But he is a very competitive guy

(31:07):
within game like he's a very you know, like I mean,
even those games in the I keeps saying the Bahamas,
even those games in Puerto Rico, which anybody who was
on that trip could tell were probably the lowest priority
of the entire preseason tour sort of apparatus for Indiana.
Once he got into those games, he was fiery, he

(31:27):
was competitive, he wanted to win them. But in practices
he's When I say he's high energy, I just mean
he's kind of all over the place and involved, but
he's not barking in people's faces. There's not a lot
of you know, sort of screaming, yelling. You know, he's
not overly demonstrative. Honestly, his practice is remind me of
Signetti's in how efficient they are. They just moved very quickly.

(31:51):
He's not afraid to cut a drill short if he
feels like everything that needs to you know, everything that
needs to get accomplished, has gotten accomplished. There's not a
lot of wasted efforts. There's not a lot of wasted movement.
It is much more sort of professional and business like
when you are in kind of that teaching learning practice setting.

Speaker 1 (32:13):
By the way, I just pulled this up an article
from this time a year ago, as a matter of fact,
October fourth of twenty twenty four, this from West Virginia.
I mostly calm mostly and by the way, are we
going with the Rezer devrise? I hear both debrees, Okay,
I mostly calm, mostly, Debrez said when asked about his
end game demeanor, I haven't had a technical foul yet,

(32:35):
so that gives you a little bit of an idea.
His son's eyes light up. That is correct. Through two
hundred and five career games as a head coach at Drake,
he had never been given a technical foul. So, assuming
he did not get one last year with the Mountaineers,
than that factoid.

Speaker 3 (32:50):
Is he was close a couple of times in Puerto Rico.

Speaker 1 (32:53):
And swimming well. Listen, there's a long history of Indiana
coaches losing their temper in Puerto Rico.

Speaker 3 (32:59):
So why I hope someday the film of these game
services because the officiating, and I know it was being
played on international rules and that was part of it.
The officiating was remarkable. Some of the screens that were
getting set would be better described as pass blocking.

Speaker 1 (33:14):
It was, and then and.

Speaker 3 (33:16):
But then some of the stuff that wasn't getting let go.
And then you know, there was a play and I'm
taking in the weeds now, but there was a play
where a Serbian, one of the players in the Serbian
team tooked Trent Sisly and then fell down to make
it look like Sisly pulled him down, and the referee
didn't buy it. And blew an offensive foul and Cissely
just just bent over like six inches from his face
and started barking at him. And it's just all this

(33:38):
stuff that you know would never happen in a Big
ten game. That was just absolute sort of summer backtal mayhem.

Speaker 1 (33:45):
I what the mayhem of international play? You know, it
looks like these guys are all playing at the tabernacle
like that with a voight basketball and people are throwing stuff.
It's like being at an Oasis show. Let's go right,
I mean, let's go go bigger, go home. Hey, Zach,
you mentioned Signetti. What is Indiana's I guess schedule or

(34:05):
do they deviate from it in terms of a bye
week and the way that he handles a bye week
versus a regular.

Speaker 3 (34:11):
Week, so he'll pull some some of the load off
of his players, you know, practices, and this is I
don't think this is anything terribly unconventional. Practices might be
a little bit shorter or a lot of what you'll
see a lot of coaches do in bye weeks is
that the guys who get more reps will be the
guys who aren't getting a lot of reps during game preps.
So younger players, backups, red shirts, guys like that. So

(34:34):
you're simultaneously kind of creating some opportunities for young guys
to maybe you know, grow a little bit and develop
a little bit in ways that they wouldn't get in
a game week where you've obviously got to commit most
of your time and effort to preparing your starters. And
then the same time you're also taking some of the
physical load off of your your ones and twos. And

(34:54):
the other thing that that every staff does during the
bye week is, you know, and this is this will
also affect how you structure your practicees. Coaches are in
and out of town because they're out recruiting. I've seen
a host of in particular, I think defensive line offers
that have been tweeted out in the last like twenty
four hours. If that gives you a sense for like
Buddha Williams and Pac Mons probably are right now, they

(35:16):
are probably not on the practice field, or at least
they haven't been in recent days because they have been
out recruiting. Every staff uses the bye week to go
check in on the guys who are committed, make sure
they're still solid, make sure they're still feeling I guess,
for lack of a better term, feeling the love, and
especially because basically all the offers I've seen today and

(35:37):
yesterday have been flats to twenty twenty seven players. You
didn't news to offer juniors this early in the cycle
as often, but now so many of those guys are
committing in March, April, May, June, as opposed to August, October, November, December,
or even into obviously the sort of pre December signing

(35:58):
window era where you we went all the way to February.
You got to start recruiting those kids earlier because they're
committing earlier, and you need to be involved with them earlier.
In the bye week. I think is important for that
because if we're gonna shift the calendar back a few months,
then that means when you when you prioritize where you're
going and who you're seeing in your bye week recruiting visits,

(36:19):
you're gonna need to start really digging into what is
the sort of current junior class as well.

Speaker 1 (36:24):
I want to feel the love, you know what I mean?
Like we all want to feel the love, Like Eddie
Win's the last time you felt the love. I have
no idea Zach, like from the general public, tell me
the last time you felt the love if you're a recruit,
Like you're a recruit, Zach, and people are like writing
you letters and they're telling you how great you are,
and they're they're blowing you up on social media. I mean,

(36:45):
I got one guy that blows me up on social media,
and it's only because he constantly sends a picture of
me and says queer. That's all I get. That's all
that's all I love, I get.

Speaker 3 (36:54):
I see. I mean, I will say, the one time
in my life that I understood a little bit of
the USh that athletes get from the attention is when
I rode Little five and like the whole had, the
whole attorney has to be out there to see you off,
and everybody's cheering you and everybody chant your name, and
I don't get it. I mean, I don't get me wrong.

Speaker 1 (37:11):
It was when you rode Little five.

Speaker 3 (37:14):
I wrote for a frattorney called sigmal.

Speaker 1 (37:16):
Fam Okay, Sammy says, we know it right, yes, correct?
So you were a Sammy and you you were were
you the anchor guy? Were you that like in Breaking Away?
Which one? Were you?

Speaker 5 (37:28):
Well?

Speaker 3 (37:30):
So the thing is like in breaking Away, none of
them do anything except Dave Stoler. I was a lap eater.
I wasn't very fast, but I had an engine, and.

Speaker 1 (37:40):
You know in college I was a lap eater too. Funny.

Speaker 3 (37:43):
Well, I'm gonna leave that one alone, but I was.
I was always like on the heavy side for for
a cyclist. But the advantage in little five is there's
no hills to climb, So, if anything, kind of guys
with a little bit more power had a little bit

(38:04):
of advantage just to be able to sit in and
just just turn over and just just like just you know,
over up. Long stretches of the race, and the men's
race in particular is just like a total war of attrition.
There are long stretches of that race where it's just
about surviving, not trashing, you know, preserving as much energy
as possible, and that was always my strength. You you

(38:25):
guys are finishing last in the average.

Speaker 1 (38:27):
What place were you?

Speaker 5 (38:28):
Jeez uh pack.

Speaker 3 (38:32):
Now we were, well, yeah, we were. We finished in
We finished in the trophy spots twice, eleventh and fourteen.
I'm going to guess I want to say twenty fifth
and twentieth.

Speaker 1 (38:41):
I'm going to guess who won it? Your last year?

Speaker 5 (38:43):
You ready?

Speaker 1 (38:43):
What what year did you run? The Little five?

Speaker 3 (38:46):
Two thousand and nine, two six and nine, all four
of those years.

Speaker 1 (38:50):
Okay, I'm going to guess who won it? You ready?
Uh Fiji, Nope, Cutters.

Speaker 3 (38:58):
The Cutters won it my last three years running. That
was part of a stretch of five in a row.
That was the first. I'm gonna get people totally in
the weeds. Now you've done it, We're gonna this is
give me the rest of the show. That was the
first of the three years of Eric Young, who later
won two i think two USA Criterion Championships and turned
pro and cycling. Won the field sprint for Cutters.

Speaker 1 (39:18):
Ey as he's known with his friends. Okay, so then
there's one other one. I'm gonna go with Pike.

Speaker 3 (39:27):
Now, Pike was never any Pike was never really good
when I was there. It was a fraternity though.

Speaker 1 (39:32):
Okay, so what who was the other one that won it?

Speaker 3 (39:35):
A CEO Alpha Tallen Meager. They had a rider named
Hans Arniston who actually lapped the field, which is especially
difficult to do.

Speaker 1 (39:40):
That's cool. Yeah, they got booted off theres when I
was there, so that's cool. I'm glad to see they
rounded things out.

Speaker 3 (39:46):
I think they've I think they've since gone through that
cycle a few times, so I tried to I try
to stay out of the Greek politics of it all.

Speaker 1 (39:53):
Hey, kid, can Indiana beat Oregon?

Speaker 5 (39:57):
And yes?

Speaker 1 (40:00):
I think, I mean, you know, let's rephrase that. Can
Indiana still make the college football Playoff if they lose
to Oregon and also to and I think they'll beat
Penn State, especially if they're ranked in the top ten.
But if Indiana goes in and is andarrowly is defeated
by both Oregon and Penn State but wins out otherwise,

(40:22):
do they still get in the college football Playoffs?

Speaker 3 (40:24):
I think they've got a good chance. Obviously, that will
depend on what happens elsewhere, you know, like does the
Big twelve have two teams? Certainly doesn't seem like the
ACC has two teams. I think there might be an
a more compelling argument by the end of the year
for two group of five teams in the playoff as
opposed to ACC teams. I don't think that will happen,
but I think that that is potentially there's there's a

(40:45):
potentially more compelling argument forming there. It will depend, like
it did last year, on how much the SEC cannibalizes itself,
you know, and just how many of those can how
many SEC teams genuinely sort of old in above the
rest of the field in that conference. But I think
ten and two, with the wins you're talking the winds

(41:08):
Indiana already has and the losses you're talking about this
year probably actually hands Indiana a more compelling resume than
eleven and one last year because the schedule was just
so bad and it wasn't you know, by and large,
that wasn't Indiana's fault. They did everything they could with it.
You know, they only there are eleven wins. They only
won one by what was it, fewer than two touchdowns?

(41:31):
You know, they they the reason they got in the
playoff was because of how dominance they were against even
a terrible schedule. But it was a terrible schedule. This
schedule is a lot tougher. The losses will improve Let's
let's live in this hypothetically you've laid out. The losses
will improve the strength of schedule just as much as
the winds will. As long as Illinois doesn't go in

(41:52):
the tank, the wins are going to hold up because
Indiana didn't just beat Illinois. Indiana put Illinois through the
four like iron Man and winning at Iowa. Whatever Iowa does,
that's always going to carry a certain amount of weight
because that is one of the most sort of uniquely
difficult places in the country to go relative to its
conference and everything else. Like I said this to somebody

(42:14):
on Sunday, Iowa at Kinnick on a Saturday and Big
Ten play is the closest thing the conference has to
the option anymore. That's how like distinct the challenge of
Iowa football is, especially in that environment. I don't just
mean schematically, I mean like structurally philosophically, that win will
hold up at least to the baseline. Indiana's big thing,

(42:37):
I think in terms of its own playoff candidacy, as
you said, don't go to Penn State or Oregon and
just get completely run out. Now, maybe you could afford
to lose one of those games kind of heavy. Like
if Indiana goes to Oregon and loses thirty five to seventeen,
we said, well, you know what, they had to fly
across the country. It's Austin. Oregon might be the best

(42:58):
team in college football. Maybe you can live with that,
just don't do it against Penn State two. And I
think that's It's interesting because Indiana's not really like last
weekend was the first time Indiana won a meaningful road
game under Kurt Signetty in a difficult environment against a
good team. This not this weekend, but next weekend. This

(43:19):
next game is kind of the first time Indiana's played
a game under kurtz signety where there's relatively little pressure
like that, Indiana doesn't have to win this game. Indiana
doesn't even necessarily have to lose this game on the
last second field goal. Indiana went to Ohio State last
year that Indiana was the team in that game everybody
had eyes on because everyone wanted Indiana to prove themselves

(43:40):
or not. That doesn't exist in this game. There is
there is a notable lack of sort of pressure or
demand on Indiana going into the Oregon game. And I
don't know if that makes Indiana better or worse than
I find it fastening.

Speaker 1 (43:54):
Zach Osterman is with the Indianapolis Star. He is the
Indiana Athletics beat writer. He also was a labed eater
in college. Zach appreciate the time as always and we'll
talk to you certainly as we get closer to the
time when the Hoosiers are going out to take on
the Ducks.

Speaker 3 (44:10):
Absolutely, thanks for having me as.

Speaker 1 (44:12):
Always appreciate it. Zach joining us on the program, joining
us now on the program, and I'm sure probably completely
confused as to where we're going with all of that.
He is the beat writer for Purdue Athletics. He is
with the Lafayette Now is it Journal Courier or Caurier Journal?

Speaker 6 (44:29):
The first one?

Speaker 1 (44:31):
Journal Courier?

Speaker 6 (44:32):
Right, yes, Journal and Caurier technically, but.

Speaker 1 (44:35):
Journal and Courier. And I apologize for that, Sam, it's
a mental block of mind because Louisville is the opposite, right, yes,
and start with an L.

Speaker 6 (44:43):
Yes.

Speaker 1 (44:44):
Okay, well it is, am I correct in saying Illinois
and Purdue this weekend play for a little cannon, right,
that is correct.

Speaker 6 (44:51):
I don't know if it functions.

Speaker 7 (44:52):
I've never seen it actually fired, but it's very small.
It looks like something you would put on your bookshelf
and your den at home.

Speaker 1 (45:00):
Yeah, it's basically a paper weight, is what it is, Eddie. Right,
Can Jake just say the LJC.

Speaker 7 (45:07):
We call it the Jay and c here, But you know,
I'll call it whatever they want as long as they
keep paying me the LJ and C.

Speaker 1 (45:13):
Right, like with so much drama that is written about
in the Lafia. Anyway, Okay, Sam, let's begin with this.
I personally think and this is an intriguing matchup because
I think Illinois is very good. Indiana obviously, you know,
exposed them and ran all over them, but they are

(45:35):
still a stout opponent. But I think Purdue is better
than I know. It sounds ridiculous to say what their
record says, but what I like about Barry Odom's team,
and I want you to elaborate on this. They look
like one that maybe isn't as talented, but plays within
themselves and is disciplined. Now, am I going on too
small a sample side to say that, No, I.

Speaker 7 (45:58):
Think that's fair. I mean, you're a third of the
way through the season. Now, I think that's a uh,
you know, considerable simple side to go on. And you're
right when you look at the team that Perdue had
last year and where some of those players transferred to
and what they're doing at marquee programs around the country.
Purdue was a talented team last year and went one
and eleven and this year, you know, maybe not as

(46:20):
many high end NFL prospect type players, but definitely, you know,
a connected team and a team that you know, at
least offensively, has looked pretty good for the most part
through four games, but you know, it kind of was
punching against their punching above its its way the last
couple of games, and the score indicated as much, but

(46:41):
not a lot of shame. And you know, and having
a chance to knock off USC and then up thirty
at Notre Dame, you would feel like that should have
you in the game. And uh, you know that was
the case of where the defense kind of let Purdue down.
But now you get Illinois. That's you know, has been
the last couple of weeks up and down. Made some
mistakes against USC, but wins it at the end. I
do think Illinois is a better team than what it

(47:03):
showed against Indiana. That was just a case where it
was just a downhill snowball coming and there was no
stopping it. And I think the Indiana realized that was
an opportunity to really show the playoffs.

Speaker 6 (47:14):
Committee how good of a team it is.

Speaker 7 (47:16):
And you know, a school that's not getting in a
lot of respect for what it's done the last couple
of years, took advantage of what was going on there.
But yeah, I think this is going to be It
always is a fight, whether it Purdue's good, Illinois is good.
There's been years where both of them have been bad,
but it's always a game that seems to go down
to the wire, and that was the case even a
year ago where it was fifty to forty nine in overtime.

Speaker 1 (47:37):
I thought, in particular in the USC game, we'll start
with that, Sam, that Purdue was effective and at times
almost impressive, but they had massive problems in the red zone,
and you know, and then Notre Dame they went trickery
a couple of times to get creative, and I think
in that one probably just overall strength and depth of

(47:59):
raw does you in a little bit. But in terms
of taking care of the football or trying to be
more effective in the red zone, Purdue has tried to
do what differently.

Speaker 2 (48:11):
Well.

Speaker 7 (48:11):
I think Perdue did a better job last or I
guess it's two weeks ago now, but you're right that
USC game, Perdue got in the red zone three times
where it came away with zero points. Three interceptions after
getting inside the twenty, it's going to be tough to
beat anybody, let alone an opponent that probably.

Speaker 6 (48:29):
Has more talent than you, and pretty kind of took
care of that. I think. The number one.

Speaker 7 (48:34):
Issue I think, and those two weather delayed games that
they've played as of late, has been the other team
hasn't had to punt. And you're not going to beat
anybody if you don't have a pitcher of punt return
team out.

Speaker 6 (48:45):
On the field.

Speaker 1 (48:48):
And that's the thing, right they You know, it's hard
to judge though for me, Sam, that's what I said
when I said small sample size because you know, Southern
Illinois Ball State. No dis respect to those programs, but
they're not SC and Notre Dame, right. And it's weird
because with SC you look at that game and it

(49:09):
feels like they were in it. I mean, but were
they you know what I mean? Like, do you think
SC ever really thought to themselves that they were in
any sort of jeopardy against Purdue.

Speaker 7 (49:20):
Yeah, it was kind of a weird game because the
weather delay happened in the middle of that game that
took forever, and I think that just threw off probably
both teams. But especially the team that traveled across the
country to get there and thought I was playing a
day game turned a night game.

Speaker 6 (49:37):
But yeah, it never seemed like Perdue.

Speaker 7 (49:39):
Had opportunities where okay, if Purdue scores here, it gets
it to within one score. But it was never to
the point where, okay, this is the game changing drive
where Purdue can take the lead or whatever. And unfortunately
for Purdue, one of those momentum changing possibilities turned into
Ryan Brown getting hit as you throw through the ball
and four hundred pound House taking it off and running

(50:02):
seventy yards for a touchdown, and that kind of just defleated,
deflated everything.

Speaker 6 (50:06):
But yeah, you're right when you look at that.

Speaker 7 (50:08):
And he threw three interceptions down after getting in the
red zone and you lose by sixteen. You walk away
from a game like that feeling like you know what if.
But that said, there were also some plays that work
to produce benefits, one of those being a double lateral
that USC's defense didn't recognize. Was a lateral that the
quarterback just picks up off the ground and Waltz is
in the end zone from twenty six yards or whatever.

(50:30):
It was.

Speaker 1 (50:31):
The I like Devin maccabee a lot, Sam Okay, and
I think he is a he can be even like
a pound you between the tackles back, But they're utilizing
him a lot for Ryan Brown out of the backfield.
Do they need to find better balance in terms of
maybe not getting macaby in the passing game. He's been

(50:52):
very good, but his yards per carry I think has
dipped a little bit in terms of the running game itself.
Do they continue with that versatility for him or do
they start using him more as strictly a running back
versus receiving back.

Speaker 7 (51:07):
What I think is the case right now is the
line has not been very good at run blocking, and
Purdue has masked it well with what it's been able
to do in the passing game or getting creative at times.
But you're right, Purdue has to be able to run
the football to win in this league. And even though
pretty put up a lot of rushing yards against Southern Illinois,

(51:27):
it was still a three point nine yards per carry clip,
which isn't great, especially considering you play in an FCS team.

Speaker 6 (51:33):
And should be able to kind of impose your will.

Speaker 7 (51:36):
Devin Mackabie is a proven talent as a running back
He's picked up a lot of yards, had a lot
of yards per carry.

Speaker 6 (51:42):
Even for some bad teams the last two years.

Speaker 7 (51:45):
But yeah, that's the one area that's most concerning so
far is that Purdue hasn't shown an ability to consistently
run the football and move the chains and stay ahead
of the chains using the ground game. When you have
running back to caliber of Devin Makyby, is.

Speaker 1 (52:01):
Purdue gonna be the best team in the country in
college basketball?

Speaker 6 (52:05):
Man?

Speaker 7 (52:07):
I would say if there's a team better, that team's
got to be mighty impressive, because just seeing a couple
of practices so far, this is crazy. I think Purdue's
you know, second unit or you know whoever they deem
is the second five lineup. That team is probably an
NCAA tournament's caliber team alone. So when you have that

(52:28):
kind of coming off your bench, that's deep, and that's
you know, probably even better for practice, you get kind
of competitive Big ten style games in preparation for a
Big ten game.

Speaker 1 (52:39):
Who has most as you have watched them and I've
watched some practices of Matt Payne or Sam Sam King
is our guest from lof Field. We're talking about Purdue.
I've watched paint or practices, especially at the beginning of
the year, and it is impressive because it's not like
you know, drill sergeant camp type stuff. It's just consistently

(53:02):
going through and kind of setting tempo as to who
and what they want to be. When you've watched it
this year, who has jumped out at you, either that
you were expecting at this point to see a little
more or because you thought to yourself, this guy is
going to break into rotation earlier than we thought.

Speaker 7 (53:22):
There's two guys I'm going to give you, and I'm
not sure how much either of them are going to play,
which is just maybe a testament to how deep this
team is.

Speaker 6 (53:30):
But one is Jack Binter.

Speaker 7 (53:32):
He was a state champion at Brownstown that was the
coach there and he redshirted last year, but even last
year just as a member of the practice team was
having some practices where he was lighting up guys that
were getting major minutes for one of the.

Speaker 6 (53:45):
Top teams in the country. So he's definitely a.

Speaker 7 (53:48):
Talented player and somebody who probably alleviates some of the
loss of Cam Heide going to Texas because he's versatile
enough to know he's a really good shooter. He can
play the three, he can play the four and do
a lot of different things. The other one is Antoine West,
who's a true freshman and he's looked really, really good
in the times that we've got to see him. And

(54:11):
the problem is he's a guard on a team that
has a ton of guards. So you know there's going
to be really good players that maybe play five minutes,
maybe you know, come in and spell a guy for
a couple of minutes, and you have to make the
most of those opportunities. But it's probably not going to
be great for your overall stat line at the end
of the season. But still, if everybody can buy into

(54:32):
maybe whatever role they have, even how small it might be,
this team should be able to win the whole thing,
I would think.

Speaker 6 (54:40):
But that's a long way to go.

Speaker 7 (54:42):
And as Trey Coffman, Wrenn told me last week, you know,
we may be the number one team in the country,
but we haven't played anybody yet.

Speaker 6 (54:48):
So he called it.

Speaker 7 (54:49):
He kind of likened it to participation trophies and told
me how much his grandfather hates participation trophies and that
they're getting all these awards and accolades for things that
haven't even happened.

Speaker 1 (54:59):
Yet stand in terms of you know, because there was
so much praise and expectation a year ago. It's interesting, Sam,
whenever you know Zach Edy was such a great player, right,
and then when he leaves, automatically your people are saying,
who's the next Zachety? You know who is Jacobson has
the injury and then has to sit out the year.
Where do things stand in terms of the center position.

Speaker 7 (55:22):
Well, there's Jacobson is back healthy, has put on some weights.
It still looks like he's thinned, but I think just
being seven foot four and nineteen years old or whatever,
that's probably natural. And between he and Oscar Cluff, you
kind of get all of what Purdue needed last year
out of that position without Zach Edy. Oscar Kluff is

(55:43):
one of the best rebounding big men in the country
a year ago. Granted it was at South Dakota State,
so the caliber of competition will be much different, but
it seems to be a skill that has translated. And
Jacobson is the rim protection you didn't have last year,
being seven foot four, being a shot locker. Both of
those guys also can come away from the basket and shoot,
which is something we saw in the NBA last year.

(56:06):
Zachiet he is capable of, but it would have been
coaching malpractice if Matt Painter did that with him at Purdue.
So he just parked in the paint and had field
days at the rim. But I believe between those two guys,
you moved Trey Coppan Rent to the four, you open
up a whole new world of possibilities with what Purdue
is capable of. Because Trey Kaupman Wren was so effective

(56:28):
at being the five last year offensively that he's got
a lot of different skill sets there, and he kind
of acquired this little mini hook that he took advantage
of last year and now produce doing some things out
of that where it looks like Trey Coupman Wren's going
to take the shot and he just kind of loves
it over the top of the defender and you don't
have to get it too high for a seven foot
four guy to go up and dunk it. So there's

(56:49):
some little wrinkles that produce adding in there. And I
think this is going to be a really tough team
to defend, and when teams adjust, I think Purdue has
kind of the CounterPunch to it.

Speaker 1 (56:58):
Lastly, Sam, I want to know what it is about.
And look, I know they lost you know, Miles Colvin,
I know they lost cam Heidi. I get it. But
take a Trey Kaufman Wrenn. You know, here's a guy
that comes in. He's in the same class as Caleb First,
he red Shirts. He sees first getting minutes right away,
he waits his turn, He's got Edie there, he's kind

(57:19):
of got to play like alongside but also behind him,
et cetera. And it just seems like with Produce, you know,
Braden Smith and Fletcher Lawyer wud be prime examples of
this as well. This is a program that has guys
that could probably cash in literally and figuratively by going elsewhere,
but they seem to kind of what I like what

(57:39):
I was just talking about with the Fever, buy into
this team concept. What is it about that program that
in fact makes it different?

Speaker 7 (57:50):
Well, I think the number one thing is Matt Painter,
and he is brutally honest sometimes and some players don't.

Speaker 6 (57:59):
Want to hear that.

Speaker 7 (58:00):
They want to be told they're great and everything else,
but other people respond well to that. And he'd never
promised these guys anything. He never promised Fresh Fletcher, Lawyer,
Braden Smith they were going to come in and be
starters right away. But he said, if you come in
and outwork the guys who were possibly going to start,
you will get the job over them, and that that
was the case. And then the thing that probably has
helped is the success and guys want to play for

(58:22):
a team that has a chance to win a national
championship and for the last you know, three years anyway,
Produce felt like it was a team that could possibly
be in that mix, and certainly this season.

Speaker 6 (58:32):
So that helped.

Speaker 7 (58:34):
Tray Coffin Wren was one of those guys, like you said,
he red shirted, but he bought in right away that
if I wait my turn and keep getting better, by
the end of my career, I'm going to be, you know,
an All American, All Big.

Speaker 6 (58:45):
Ten type player, and that's certainly been the case.

Speaker 7 (58:49):
So I think it, you know, in a lot of ways,
it was probably easy to buy into the program and
the culture because there's kind of proof in the putting
that what Matt Painter and his staff is doing works.

Speaker 1 (59:00):
Jconline dot Com, where you can read all of the
work regarding Purdue from Sam King from the Lafayette Journal
and Courier. Sam, appreciate the time as always, Man, we'll
talk to you soon.

Speaker 6 (59:10):
Absolutely thanks for having me on.

Speaker 1 (59:11):
Sam King talking Purdue with us