Up in Arms

Ralph welcomes Ben Cohen (anti-war activist and ice cream entrepreneur) to discuss his new campaign, "Up in Arms," which advocates for a common-sense Pentagon budget. Then, Ralph speaks to Guardian columnist Arwa Mahdawi about her recent piece: "When will we finally admit: the Gaza death toll is higher than we’ve been told."

Ben Cohen is an entrepreneur, philanthropist, and longtime anti-war activist. He is a co-founder of the ice cream company Ben & Jerry's and a prominent supporter of progressive causes. He is co-founder of Up In Arms, a public education and advocacy campaign pushing for a common-sense approach to military budgeting. In May of this year, Ben was arrested by Capitol Police after he interrupted Robert F. Kennedy Jr.'s testimony by screaming,”Congress kills poor kids in Gaza by buying bombs and pays for it by kicking kids off Medicaid.”

We're up in arms because the government has taken the kindness, the heart, the soul of the American people and essentially replaced it with so many bombs that there's no rational use for them. They've turned us all into mass murderers.

Ben Cohen

You know, politicians starting from Reagan are fond of saying “a nuclear war cannot be won and must never be fought.” And then they turn around and spend $100 billion a year on a nuclear arsenal that's capable of blowing up the entire world several times over. So they say one thing and they do another. I mean, a nuclear arsenal capable of blowing up the entire world several times over? That's not deterrence. That's delusion.

Ben Cohen

I just go back to the moral issue of our time, which is Gaza—two-thirds of the American people don't support continuing to arm Israel. And we need to make our politicians pay the price for continuing to arm Israel… We have a midterm election coming up. If your guy voted to continue to essentially facilitate the genocide, vote them out.

Ben Cohen

When you have more money than is needed, you tend to invite corruption, cost overruns, machinery that doesn't work, and I would advise that you look into why the GAO and the Pentagon auditors are being asked to do fewer audits of the military budget. Because there's almost a direct correlation between throwing money at a government program (especially at that scale) and corruption. And corruption is understandable to everybody. It's the number one political issue all over the world, when the pollsters poll.

Ralph Nader

Arwa Mahdawi is a columnist for the Guardian and author of Strong Female Lead: Lessons from Women in Power. Here is her recent piece on the genocide in Gaza: “When will we finally admit: the Gaza death toll is higher than we’ve been told” (The Guardian, August 8, 2025)

To be fair, the New York Times, Washington Post, and Wall Street Journal have published some pretty devastating reports from their reporters in that area. They've put out some devastating features on what's going on [in Gaza], but it doesn't translate into editorial denunciation by these papers. And it doesn't translate into taking the next step and doing what they would do in other conflicts around the world where there isn't so much prejudice and domestic pressure

Ralph Nader

I'm an opinion writer, but as journalists, you're always supposed to report facts. And the fact is: we have absolutely no idea how many people are dead in the Gaza Strip. But there are plenty of studies (which I reference in the article—one Lancet peer-reviewed study, one letter to the Lancet by a highly-respected scientist, one empirical study by Michael Spagat) which show that the death count is a lot higher. So I truly believe that unless you're saying “the official figure from the Ministry of Health is around 60,000 but studies show it is probably much higher,” then that's just journalistic malpractice.

Arwa Mahdawi

I think there's just this instinct to believe that Palestinians are lying and Israelis are telling the truth. And it also goes back to…this isn't just Israel's war, this is America's war as well. And this desire to see America as the good guys—we're the good guys, the Palestinians are the bad guys. And to have this black-and-white narrative where, obviously, we're the good guys, you know, and so if the Palestinian narrative casts doubt on