Ebony Beggs // Ditching corporate, a dash of Diane von Furstenberg, detective discoveries, and dreaming up Eupheme

I couldn’t think of anyone more special to help us start the year (and to mark our 300th episode) than my very best friend, Ebony Beggs, whose story embodies the idea of new beginnings both in itself and in the fact that this was her first time properly telling it in her first podcast interview ever. Some of you may remember we had the incredible opportunity of doing a live episode at SXSW with All Pacific and Novotel last year and I peer pressured Eb into being my guest promising her it wouldn’t be recorded... but then, as we all knew she would, she absolutely blew us all away and I HAD to re-record it to start your 2025 with a bang.

You may have already heard me talk about Eb and her sister Ashlee’s exquisite women’s label, Eupheme, which is revolutionising the professional woman’s wardrobe with a high quality, slow fashion ethos and life-changing technical fabrics that they have gone to the ends of the Earth to source (think non-crush no-iron shirts, machine-washable silk, literally changing the game). In this episode, we tell the story of how Eb and Ash left high flying careers (in NEW YORK mind you) to bring their dream to life. Even more interesting? There’s a dash of Diane von Furstenberg, chemical poisoning, ex-NYPD detectives and Parisian exchanges (yes, that’s indeed where we fell in love)... Eb still doens’t believe it herself, but it’s the MOST fascinating story and I hope you enjoy as much as I did.

LINKS

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You can check out Eupheme here.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hard work works, yes, and I think the trick is
to apply it to something that comes a bit more naturally.
Everyone thinks, oh, I just want to be happy. I
just want to be happy. But I like to say,
I think you want to be fulfilled. I hired a
x NYPD Oh my God, forensic scientist.

Speaker 2 (00:18):
Welcome to the Sees the YA Podcast.

Speaker 3 (00:21):
Busy and happy are not the same thing. We too
rarely question what makes the heart seeing. We work, then
we rest, but rarely we play and often don't realize
there's more than one way. So this is a platform
to hear and explore the stories of those who found
lives They adore, the good, bad and ugly. The best
and worst day will bear all the facets of seizing

(00:43):
your ya. I'm Sarah Davidson or a spoonful of Sarah,
a lawyer turned funentrepreneur who swapped the suits and heels
to co found matcha Maiden and matcha Milk Bar. CZA
is a series of conversations on finding a life you
love and exploring the self doubt, challenge, joy and fulfillment
along the way.

Speaker 2 (01:06):
Lovely Neighborhood, Welcome to twenty twenty five.

Speaker 3 (01:08):
Oh my God, that doesn't even sound like a real thing.

Speaker 2 (01:11):
How wild that we are a twenty twenty five already.
I hope you all had a wonderful Christmas, if you celebrate,
and a wonderful Holidays, and that your year is off
to a flying start. I worked out a couple of
days ago that the first episode of this show came
out in twenty eighteen, and I never ever dreamed that
we'd still be here in twenty twenty five. So firstly,
just wanted to say the most heartfelt thank you to

(01:32):
all of you who keep coming back every year and
who have made the past few years with CZA so incredible.
It feels a bit like I've grown up with some
of you, having shared moments and milestones in real time,
definitely overshared on most of those fronts, and who have
gone through so many different life chapters since we started,
including of course having our beautiful little teddy Bear, who
you've all embraced so warmly, which I really appreciate. Anyway,

(01:56):
after two blissful weeks off full of very analog playta
and forgetting what day or time it is, which is
exactly what holidays are for, we are back with a
very special episode to start the year. Although, as an aside,
to all my fellow parents out there, how are you
all feeling Christmas? With a little one? Infinitely more magical,
But saying goodbye to nap some holidays or lying down

(02:18):
at all was a root awakening for me, so rips
lost Sundays for the next a while and sending thoughts
and prayers to you all. As for our guest, I
couldn't think of anyone more special to help us start
a new year than my very best friend Ebony Beggs,
whose story embodies the idea of beautiful new beginnings, both
in itself and in the fact that this was her
first time properly telling the story in her first podcast

(02:42):
interview ever, which you would absolutely not know from how
eloquent she is as you will hear, She's just one
of the most inspiring people, and I'm so excited to
have her on the show. Finally, some of you may
remember we had the incredible opportunity of doing a live
episode at south By Southwest last year with all Pacive
and Novertel, and I finally peer pressured Ebb into being

(03:03):
my guest there because as it was live, I could
promise it wouldn't be recorded, but then, unsurprisingly, as I
knew she would, she blew us all away and I
just had to rerecord it to start your twenty twenty
five with a bang. So here we are. You will
already have heard me talk or rave should I say
about Ebb and her sister Ashley's exquisite women's label, uphem

(03:25):
which is revolutionizing the professional woman's wardrobe with a high quality,
slow fashion ethos and life changing technical fabrics that you
will hear. They have gone to the ends of the
earth to source think non crush, no iron shirts, machine
washable silk, I mean literally changing the game for the busy,
modern working woman. In this episode, we tell the story

(03:47):
of how eb and ash left seriously high flying careers
in New York mind you to bring this dream to life.
And even more interesting, there's a dash of Diane von Furstenberg,
chemical poisoning, NYPD detectives, Parisian exchanges, which yes, indeed is
where we fell in love all those years ago back

(04:07):
at UNI. There's pretty much a bit of everything in
this episode. Ebb still doesn't believe it herself, but it
is the most fascinating story and I hope you guys
enjoy it as much as I did. Ebb, my love,
Welcome to the show. Thank you so much for having me.
So we have actually already done this conversation. We've had

(04:30):
this beautiful conversation in Sydney when we did a live
show at south By Southwest and it was the first
time you'd ever done something like that. It was the
first podcast you'd ever done, and it was so good
that I just had to do it again. Like we
didn't record on the day, and I was like, this
needs to live somewhere.

Speaker 1 (04:50):
Expectation management keep it low. Already already close to canceling.

Speaker 2 (05:00):
Well, okay, so before we get into any of the story,
when you're best friends with someone, you can forget how
extraordinary they are. And that was one of those days
where I got to rehear your story in chronological order
and hear you tell some of the incredible things that
you've done with you firm that I didn't even know,
but to hear how eloquent and intelligent and clever and

(05:22):
creative you are, Like, it's such a nice reminder when
you're so close to somebody, but to everyone else who's
going to hear that and going to think the same thing.
I think they really need to remember that we've spent
a lot of today, a lot of the last week,
and a lot of the weeks before that. Are you going,
I don't really think we should do it? Like should
I do it? Even like two hours beforehand?

Speaker 1 (05:44):
Yeah, the old doubt monster you've been shuting on me
the last two weeks just said, just always managed to
find its way to tell you it's just not the
right time or it's not there's just excuses.

Speaker 2 (05:58):
You just can.

Speaker 4 (05:59):
You've got to work hard to put that doubt monster at.

Speaker 2 (06:01):
Bay, an't you? So sometimes it's just like calling a friend.
I'm Sarah.

Speaker 1 (06:06):
It's just monsters. I have my failure today today, got
to cancel. But no, it's yeah, it's been a big,
big doubt monster week for me. I'm just very glad
that I can.

Speaker 2 (06:21):
I'm honored that we made it here today and a privilege.

Speaker 1 (06:29):
No thank you though, for having me on this beautiful podcast.
I've watched you grow and blossom into this incredible, amazing
woman that you are, and I am just on it
to be on your journey in any small way.

Speaker 2 (06:41):
My gosh, Well, I love you so much and I'm
so proud of your story and it is so interesting
to have heard how many times you sort of thought
it wasn't good enough, or that you wouldn't do justice
to the show, or like, and guys, when you hear
the story, you will be so surprised that that's the
dialogue that goes through Ebb's head. And I think it
goes through everyone's head. You just don't hear it that often.

(07:03):
All you hear is like the shiny stuff in the bio,
that's the stuff that makes the articles, or like you're
on the cover of the AFR and like you don't
see how much negative self chatter happens to every person
before those articles come out. So I think it was
important to start with that and how close, like how
many times you sort of like I keep thinking of
reasons not to do it, even though there really were

(07:25):
no reasons not to do it. And I was sort
of like, I want this story to be out in
the world. Not enough of the neighborhood hurt it the
first time around, and I want that to be like
in the interwebs forever, and for you also to then
look back in five years and go, oh my god,
that's how I felt then, you.

Speaker 4 (07:42):
Know, yeah, absolutely terrifying, but let's let's do it.

Speaker 2 (07:46):
Well, I'm proud of it. You've done that the hard thing,
and you've created upham, which is just I mean, I mean,
we'll get to the whole story of it, but first
just have to acknowledge that I am wearing. You've can
do squats, I can lift my child, I can sit
for an hour. I'm so unbelievably comfortable, and yet I

(08:07):
look so chic, gorgeous. You've just created like I don't
just oh my god.

Speaker 1 (08:11):
Oh we that's our organic cotton crepe, which we treat
with a lovely mint botanical that reduces odor.

Speaker 2 (08:20):
I need that right now in summer.

Speaker 1 (08:25):
But yet we don't like to wash out and it's
very often, so why shouldn't we treat it with a
gorgeous mint botanical that can stop you from absorbing sense
on your on your fabrics.

Speaker 2 (08:35):
So, oh my gosh.

Speaker 4 (08:36):
Anyway we can get.

Speaker 2 (08:37):
More of that, we'll get there. And I mean the
way that you've chosen fabrics and been so discerning about
fabrics that work hard for you in ways that I
didn't even know. Now I appreciate that difference so much
because I think you have never smelled in your whole
entire life. It's just not possible. Well, speaking of there
are chapters of our life together where you know I've

(08:58):
smelled Well, okay, let's go back. You know, I love
to go back to the very beginning and trace through
all the chapters were and many many, I mean new
fems a recent chapter for you. So all the chapters
were you were on different pathways or were a different person.
So let's go back to childhood. What was baby Ebony?
Like many little Ebb who you know had that first

(09:20):
dream if I want to be an astronaut or a
space cowboy, whatever you wanted to be, Like, what was
that person? What did you think your future would look like?
And yeah, what were your hopes and dreams?

Speaker 1 (09:30):
I think little eb was she liked a lot of
creative things, Like she was always building things or making things,
little dresses for dolls, or creating. I remember in primary
school doing silkscreen cotton T shirts that said love is
love or choose love or something like that. Like I

(09:52):
had this really obsession with the word love and wanted
it on lots of T shirts. And I think I
made these and maybe in grade six and sold them
to friends and family in my neighborhood and it was
just like a little, really simple play thing, cotton t shirts.
I think I've always really been attracted to fabrics and colors,

(10:13):
and that was what I was gravitated towards when I
was little, and then I think going through school, it
was always about the arts.

Speaker 4 (10:23):
That was what gave me life.

Speaker 1 (10:25):
Sitting in the art room, making pottery or like clay work,
all of that was just what I was really really
drawn to as a young person. As a child, I
think looking at artwork and trying to decipher what the
artist was telling me was absolutely what I would most

(10:46):
connect with out of any other type of subject or
anything in the world.

Speaker 2 (10:50):
Really, Oh my gosh, it is so cool to me
that I met you in a really academic chapter of
your life that was very like commercial fine and it's
law like heavy academia. But now where you are versus
where you started in textiles and fabrics and art, like

(11:10):
Lord is just such a random.

Speaker 1 (11:12):
Dim I know, And it was I think what we
all a lot of us did when you got good grades.
And I think at that stage of my life, I
was like, great, I'm going to go out in the
world and be a businesswoman and make money and support
my family, and that really really drove me for a

(11:32):
very long time. I think that path to riches, which
I think you start to change what riches look like
as you go older.

Speaker 2 (11:43):
Yeah, So when would you say, like I think when
where children, we follow those natural inclinations of I'm interested
in art, so I'll do art, and you kind of
choose your hobbies and you choose the subjects that you
like based on those things, and then at some point
the decision making process gets really convoluted and influenced by
like shoulds and success and objective kind of measures of

(12:08):
what your life is society, Like, when did you decide,
Like I think anyone who's interested in the arts, there
is always this idea of but can you make a
career of it? Treated as something that's not going to
make you money? What age do you think you started
to think that can't be my full time job, like
I've got to have something else.

Speaker 1 (12:26):
I think it was had to be when you're choosing
your Uni degree, really like eleven year twelve, I'm choosing
my subjects. I was definitely art was my strongest subjects,
and all of the arts and humanities were I guess
I didn't know enough about what the pathways were.

Speaker 4 (12:40):
At that stage.

Speaker 1 (12:41):
All I knew was that law you could make money
and art. It was uncertain.

Speaker 2 (12:45):
I can't.

Speaker 1 (12:46):
Yeah, not that you can't still certain, right Like I
think for some people they do, and they do really well.

Speaker 4 (12:52):
But I think it was a slam dunk.

Speaker 2 (12:54):
In the end.

Speaker 1 (12:54):
It was just like, well, of course, let's do arts
law and go on to do a law degree, which
I think was the hardest time of my life.

Speaker 2 (13:04):
Part of that was obviously the best time in your life.
I found the most important person found each other.

Speaker 4 (13:11):
We found each other at each other because we.

Speaker 2 (13:13):
Were literally like we met in this chapter, because we
were wearing like the exact same outfit many times not
on purpose, and before we even really knew each other.
I think I turned up. I ran into you at
Chadstone when you were doing one of your seventeen part
time jobs. We were in the same outfit and I

(13:35):
was like, oh my god, that's the hot, smart, clever
girl from UNI and my best friends with I just
happened to be wearing the same shoes as Smer, but
it was bright yellow ballot for bright yellow. I actually
think they did like it's there's sliding doors moment, and
ours was the yellow Belope.

Speaker 4 (13:49):
What you wear matters in life. It might not have
been best friends.

Speaker 2 (13:53):
Was bright yellow. It all comes back to fashion. I mean,
that's the thing exactly. So I met you in chapter
and you have constantly been one of the hardest workers
that I know. And in the context of you will
find something that you don't find particularly comfortable or that

(14:16):
is a totally foreign entity to you, and you'll just
learn everything that you can about it, and even though
you find it hard, and even though you're like at
the start, you're like, I have no idea about that,
You'll just go and do it, and you'll become amazing
at it. And like I don't always think something might
come as art different so natural that comes to you,
like it's an extension of your body. But things like

(14:38):
certain legal subjects, I would find you wouldn't necessarily find
it easy, but you would excel and be brilliant because
you would just work really hard at it and you
wouldn't stop until you just research the fuck out of it,
or until we went on a study trip together and
just like works so hard that we took our laptops
to the toilet. Because you can take a break, but
you've always applied yourself. And I think it's a great

(14:59):
example of you can be an arty person who's not
necessarily legal minded and still be good at law with
hard work.

Speaker 1 (15:09):
I think it is a huge lesson that we all
know and learn that hard work works, yes, And I
think the trick is to apply it to something that
comes a bit more naturally. Because I think I was
going down that path of law teaching myself to be
a really analytical person. I think those skills have been
so valuable for me in life and business now. But
that was hard, I think, and it is hard to

(15:31):
do it for a long time, even if you do
think you're good at it, or you might be good
at it. I think it is a square peg round
hole situation for me anyway it was.

Speaker 2 (15:41):
I've seen you be a square peg in a lot
of round holes but still be able to fit yourself
into them. But that's an incredible skill and that a
lot of people give up before. They can feel like
we silo ourselves and go, oh, I'm arty, so I
couldn't do this, or I'm academic, so I couldn't do
that creative thing. I think, actually, if you try a
lot of different things. You can do a lot of
different things, and you're amazing at that. But what went
through your mind while you were doing your law degree?

(16:03):
Was there a point where you were like, oh, maybe
I don't want to be a lawyer? Like what did
you do?

Speaker 5 (16:07):
Probably immediately, I probably do the whole degree staying power, No, immediately,
was it really?

Speaker 2 (16:18):
Yeah? I really believe that I really struggled through it.
I really forced myself through it.

Speaker 1 (16:25):
And I feel like the first two years was just
like I was just dragging myself through that degree. And
I loved so many parts of like UNI itself, Like
I love that, you know, the friendships we made, and
the social component of UNI, and the lifestyle I loved.
I had so many part time jobs, and I loved

(16:45):
all of my work, Like I was able to work
in all these different industries that I found and made,
Like from retail, I worked at Chanel, I worked at inw.

Speaker 2 (16:54):
For a while, Like we did the motor shows.

Speaker 4 (16:56):
Motor shows, so many, so random random.

Speaker 1 (17:00):
I liked all of that part of UNI a lot
more than the degree itself, and I think I don't
regret having the degree.

Speaker 2 (17:07):
But I knew from very early on that law was
not going to be for me. I did not know
it was that early. But that's really interesting because I
also think that when you know that something's not for you,
I think a lot of people stop there and they go, well,
i'll quit. But if you don't know what else you're
going to do instead, like you've got to do something, Yeah,
the time's going to pass anyway. Yeah, I knew that.

Speaker 4 (17:26):
I would never have regretted completing it.

Speaker 1 (17:29):
Like I knew that, given that I didn't know what
exactly I wanted to do at that stage, I thought,
this is fine for now.

Speaker 2 (17:34):
It will tick a.

Speaker 1 (17:35):
Few boxes, It ticks a few ego things as well,
you know, it makes a resume look pretty. It was
fine for that time of my life. Yeah, but I
knew it was not going to be a long term situation.

Speaker 2 (17:47):
So when did you decide that you'd try management consulting
and not follow that momentum that kind of like conveyable.

Speaker 1 (17:57):
Yeah, I think I was never really heard of management
consulting before. But I was working as a paralegal at
Free Hills in one on one Collins Street at the.

Speaker 2 (18:06):
Time, Yes, for good Yeah.

Speaker 1 (18:10):
And I so I did that for two years before
finishing my law.

Speaker 2 (18:13):
Degree, and I always used to see some.

Speaker 1 (18:16):
Of the management's consultants from BCG where I worked for
a while, go up to the level fifty two or
whatever it was, and I was just more intrigued by it,
and I was like, what is management consulting?

Speaker 4 (18:27):
Anyone can answer that? No, kidding, I know what it is.

Speaker 2 (18:32):
In fact, most management consultants are like, there's like a
lot of Excel modeling and a lot of business and
I still don't get it.

Speaker 1 (18:39):
Doctors for businesses is the easiest side to explain it,
like doctors for businesses. And that process of going so
going through the interview process for that and then finally
getting a grad job at BCG, I think it was
one of a really proud moment for me in my life.
I never really imagined what a life would look like
outside of the law because I hadn't done a business

(19:01):
degree or anything like that, and my arts degree didn't
really show any open up paths either. So when I
went through that process, which was grueling interview process of
case studies where they test your math skills on the spot,
which is pretty hard for an arts graduate to be

(19:21):
able to do, like on the spot mental math I found.
But yeah, when I will never forget the day I
got a call that I got the grad job.

Speaker 4 (19:28):
I squealed with delight.

Speaker 1 (19:29):
I was on the floor, was crying with excitement, and
I just thought, this is the right step. It's not
maybe what I want to do forever, but this is
such a great step for me right now, and I'm
so glad I did it.

Speaker 2 (19:39):
You're again, like such an amazing reminder that you don't
have to go into something and always think it's going
to be forever for it to be worthy. Like I
think people assume it's a waste of time if you
already know you're not going to be in it forever,
Like why would you do it? Because stepping stones like
that whole staircasing, you don't need to jump to the top.
You just need to take the next step and that
will lead to all of the next things that followed.

Speaker 1 (20:01):
Also, just at that really early stage of your career,
it's just like what do you need to learn?

Speaker 4 (20:06):
Like what else do you want to learn?

Speaker 1 (20:07):
And what we had done sixty year degrees, arts law
and with honors. We had learned so much, and I
still felt like there was still a big gap for
me in terms of learning, but not what I could
learn in a lecture theater. It was more what could
be learned out there in the world, and in this case,
it was just going into big businesses and seeing what
help they needed.

Speaker 2 (20:28):
I think one of the coolest things at that time
was watching you go. I had it to a much
lesser extent of going into commercial law and not having
a commerce degree, but that's very common, whereas going into
management consulting without any commerce or finance background or finance
subjects is much more rare. And I remember distinctly watching

(20:48):
you go, these are the skills I'm going to need
for this interview process and these tests and this like
the grueling process. These are the skills I don't have.
These are skills I'm going to need. And you just
studied so hard, Like I remember you sitting down and
sitting down with like your boyfriend's dad, your boyfriend at
the times of dad, and you know, like just being
like grilled me on these things. As it was so

(21:10):
inspiring to watch you go. I don't have that commerce
brain yet, but I will, and obviously you did by
the time you interviewed for it. But that was like
that blew me away because I hadn't had those leaps
in trying to fit myself into it, Like I was
the round peg for the round hole. I'd started for
seven years to go into law, So it wasn't as
big a jump where as you were, like early you
decided to do something scary.

Speaker 1 (21:31):
Yeah, I think I never really thought about it as
being big and scary at the time, I think, which
is amazing.

Speaker 2 (21:39):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (21:39):
I just I felt like it was just the right
path and it was something that I needed to do
to get through the hurdles of proving myself. I guess
looking back at that time, like with what I know now,
there's this kind of overarching theme of that it's it's
never as hard as it looks or it's never as
hard as as it seems to be. And I think

(21:59):
we do that to ourselves a little bit, just the
same way I did it today with doing this podcast
with you. I'm like, oh, you know, it's in my head,
it's like, oh, it's going to be this really grueling,
difficult thing for me to do, but it's just our
mind playing tricks on us. We really have to, you know,
manage that process a lot more mental rigor.

Speaker 2 (22:19):
Yeah, totally. And I think we also get scared of
the concept in its macro form, like all of the steps,
whereas the only thing you actually have to do is
the first small step. Yeah, if you don't think about that,
you just think about the big thing. Yeah, like oh
my god, the whole thing is scary, but it's like
you only have to do one day's today's worth of it,
or the first sentence and then the rest of it came. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (22:41):
And something I've always said is how do you eat
an elephant?

Speaker 2 (22:45):
And it's one bite at a time. I always those.

Speaker 1 (22:49):
Tasks as like, Okay, how are you going to eat
the elephant? And just like one bite, Just like think
of one bite.

Speaker 2 (22:56):
That's it.

Speaker 1 (22:57):
And that's how I've always thought about these big curly
time where you just like just take one bite.

Speaker 2 (23:02):
Yeah, I heard you say that, but I love that
so much. I thought that about at the start of
MATCHA that it was like I didn't have to And
it's actually Nick who helped me with that, because I
was like, well, how are we going to ship to Afghanistan?
And he was like, well, babe, we're not even we
don't even have a business. You don't worry about that.
Like I was eight bound and steps ahead, and he
was like, you just need to sell one bag. Once

(23:24):
you have enough like infrastructure to sell, you can sell tens,
like just one.

Speaker 4 (23:30):
One, sell one. It's such a good way of thinking
about it.

Speaker 2 (23:32):
It's an elephant. Yeah, it's the elephant. Yeah. So BCG
was a an incredibly formative chapter for you, very very
long hours, very demanding, but hugely like impressive, Like you
worked in some such cool things and you were like
constantly traveling around and like what's a common here and there?

(23:53):
So tell us about that chapter and then how you
knew when there was a chance to jump.

Speaker 1 (24:00):
It was a crazy two or three years, I guess
of you know, those early analysts type days. We were
working ninety hour weeks on projects, often flying to I
was in Melbourne at the time, planning to Sydney for work,
and then I was living in Sydney, flying in Melbourne.

(24:21):
I learned a lot, Like I learned how to use
Excel pretty really well, pretty well. I'm going to have
to say that I'm pretty good at it now and
that all of my colleagues would probably be like, I
can't believe she could use Excel anyway. Yeah, And It
was actually the first time in my life where I
was quite attuned to I know this sounds a bit crazy,

(24:44):
but it's it planned at the seeds for UFEM. This
time of my life, I started to think a lot
about gender inequality. And I know this sounds a bit strange,
but it was my now husband and partner at the time,
and we were both in these professional roles doing really
grueling hours, and I just couldn't help but think that

(25:08):
it was so much easier for him, and what society
expected of him was so different to what society expected
from me as a junior professional. And I could see
him effortlessly kind of not effortlessly, but a ninety hour
week for him was a bit different than a nine
hour week for me because I had a certain level
of grooming that you have to do every day to

(25:30):
be at that standard to be professional in the professional
woman in the workplace we had, you had a lot
more to think about in terms of like what you're
wearing on these days as well, like you're presenting in
senior client meetings, and it's a largely male dominated field.
There was so much complexity to kind of thinking through

(25:50):
the day that I knew my husband. Never never, not once,
so like not showing too much skin, to what color
you should wear, what type of fabrics should I wear,
heels should I not? So many micro decisions that I
think really way down on you, especially when you're really tired.

(26:13):
And that's pre kids realization, because I don't really think
equality gender equality ever came. It was never something I
really considered until that time of my life. And I remember,
you know, once going in and out of running and
out of like senior client meetings, and my pants ripped

(26:34):
because for whatever reason.

Speaker 4 (26:36):
They were not stretchy enough.

Speaker 1 (26:38):
And I remember thinking what a pain act to go
and get them repair and dry cleaners and all of
these things that just added to this to do list
that almost like sends you off the edge. So it's
actually back then the early seeds started planting around this.
This has got to be something better for women that
are professional women in society that want to have a

(26:58):
certain level of the way that they come across to
the world, but also require a high level of comfort functionality.
Even something so subtle as the temperature of a fabric
on your body can make a difference of how you
feel in the day. Is it a cold hand, feel
or a hot hand feel, so all of these little things.
That time at BCG. I thought a lot about those things. Actually,

(27:20):
I was always trying to find what's the edge? How
can I keep on top of this all when I'm
already behind compared to my male peers.

Speaker 2 (27:28):
It just felt like that.

Speaker 1 (27:29):
And I don't know whether that's universal or not, but
I definitely had that, and looking at my partner at
the time, it just felt so much easier. I'd always
wanted to make that leap into a creative field, and
the best combination I think of creativity and then business
and retail was going into this fashion space. And I

(27:50):
knew that having been at BCG for two years. They
kind of talk about is it time to do an
MBA or is it time to do a ce comment
And for me, having done so much study before, I
was like, I'm not the right person.

Speaker 2 (28:02):
For I'm not the right person.

Speaker 1 (28:06):
Everyone who's done them it's so much hard work and
so much fun as well, but it was not for me.
So they're so supportive that the company itself is so
supportive at you trying to craft your own journey in
the business. And at the time I said, I want
to go overseas. I want to get experience in fashion
or retail. Can you help me?

Speaker 4 (28:25):
And they did.

Speaker 1 (28:26):
I had arranged a two week kind of meeting schedule
over there with them, and they set up a bunch
of interviews and I remember going into the airport and
I was kind of, did this all really flippantly in
a way like I'd been thinking? Maybe it wasn't flippant.
Six months of thinking about it, maybe three months of
planning it and telling talking to people about who can

(28:48):
I meet for a job in New York? And I
told my my boyfriend and my husband, and he said, oh,
I'm like, I'm going to go to New York and get
a job.

Speaker 4 (28:58):
And he's like you are.

Speaker 1 (29:04):
I'm like, okay, cool, bye, And I'm getting on the plane.

Speaker 4 (29:06):
I've got to New York and go buy.

Speaker 1 (29:09):
The bookstore at the at the airport and pick up
a book, read it on the way on the plane.
And I get to arrive in New York and it's
all very you know, Alicia Keys, and I was.

Speaker 4 (29:21):
Just Cote Jungle, like I'm here, I'm meant to be here.

Speaker 1 (29:25):
I was just one hundred percent believe, but like I
knew I was meant to be there.

Speaker 4 (29:29):
I was like, this is great. So much energy in
that city.

Speaker 1 (29:32):
I was like, there are so many things here to do,
so much to learn. And I walked into one of
my first interviews, which was interesting because BCG had set
this up for me through a partner in New York.
And she said, Oh, I've got an interview, but I
can't tell you who it's with. And I was like,
how on earth am I meant to prepare for an
interview when I can't even know the company? And this

(29:55):
is obviously me who likes to like over prepare for these.

Speaker 2 (29:57):
Types of things.

Speaker 1 (30:00):
I've walked into the BCG offices and a gentleman walks
in and he was introduced to me as so. His
name was Palla Reva and he was the ex head
of merchandising at Tory Birch.

Speaker 4 (30:16):
And then he sat down.

Speaker 1 (30:18):
And he's like, oh, have you heard of the brand
Diane von Furstenberg.

Speaker 4 (30:23):
And I reached into my handbag.

Speaker 1 (30:28):
And pulled out the book that I bought at the airport,
and it was her memoir, her autobiography, but a complete
and utter coincidence. I was three quarters of the way
through the book, I'm like, well.

Speaker 2 (30:43):
As it happened. It happened.

Speaker 4 (30:44):
I got the job, and it was the best time
of my life.

Speaker 2 (30:50):
It was so much fun. I was just in clover.
It's like the most extrawd improbable but also probable, amazing,
serendipitous story. And I think if you had told yourself,
like back in the T shirt making, you know, six

(31:13):
year old everny days, that you would end up working
alongside a pioneering, like globally recognized leading name in fashion,
like literally not just at Diane von Furstenberg the brand,
but alongside Diane von Furstenburg, the person in New York.

(31:33):
Would never have believed it. No way, But like I
always think, all the dots connect like backwards now they
all make sense, like everything was leading you to that point.

Speaker 4 (31:43):
Yeah, And it was so meant to be so fortunate.
It was so fortunate. It was a dream come true.
It was my dream job.

Speaker 1 (31:49):
I was twenty six, I think, living in New York
in the West Village, wearing my wrap dresses to work
every day, which were just such beautiful garments. I mean,
the story of the rap dress is just so iconic.
It's the seventies, the feminist movement. We wanted to wear

(32:10):
like soft jerseys that feel beautiful on the body but
also feel relaxed and you can move in them and
they're stretch and it's just such a beautiful story and
iconic dress. I was so good to get behind it
and to work in that house of the mass, the
madness and the wonder and the creativity and the color

(32:32):
and the fun and the print, and with such brilliant
people as well.

Speaker 4 (32:35):
I learned so so much there about brand.

Speaker 2 (32:38):
I just remember that chapter being like we'd be facetiming
and you'd just be like, hold on, Dan and wants
to give me some apples from my orchid. I'm like,
what the fuck is your Like, I'm just going to
like an Oscars after party, Like I'm just gonna go.
I was like, who are you? What did you do
with my best friend from the summit.

Speaker 1 (32:57):
It was like a different human and it feels like
a very it's a very long time ago, but it
was great, what an.

Speaker 2 (33:04):
Amazing and we all went to visit you like one
hundred million because it was just a chapter and so
fun but in the true kind of representation of CZDA
and also what we spoke about so much in Sydney,
being a big pillar of an overtell and that difference
and that like some of us have a pivotal moment

(33:25):
between like that fast pace of life and then the
slow life, and like what we think of as success
and the pinnacle of momentum and busy, and I mean
New York is that that's like the fastest you've ever
gone and the fastest you'll ever go again. It's amazing,
But like often there is this inevitable moment where you
can't keep up with it and where things come into

(33:47):
very sharp focus. And again serendipitous moments, not the path
you thought that would happen, totally unexpected, out of the blue.
What happened out of the blue.

Speaker 1 (33:58):
I started to feel unwell, really strange symptoms, which a
lot of people early on.

Speaker 2 (34:03):
Was like stress, it's stress, it's stress, you're working too much. Yeah,
we were just like, it's burnout, babe.

Speaker 1 (34:11):
And it was very easy to believe that for a
long time, and then it just kept going on. I
remember taking I took myself to Miami for a weekend
or something to rest, and it just nothing felt right.
I had all these strange symptoms. I wake up in
the morning, had lost feelings in my limbs, I was
having like strange siezures, like in my eyes, really strange headaches,

(34:36):
all unexplainable, so many other symptoms that I had. I
remember having a long list of them at the time.
It was really really hard to work out what was
going on, and I ended up taking some time off
work because I eventually did some neurological scans and they
had found some lesions on my brain which they were

(35:00):
saying that would lead to a multiple sclerosis diagnosis. And
at the time I think hearing that, I must have
been twenty eight, and I was there with my fiancee
and my family was back in Australia, and I.

Speaker 4 (35:18):
Was super scared.

Speaker 1 (35:20):
I took time off work, I took sick leave, and
I just didn't get I wasn't getting any better.

Speaker 2 (35:28):
I was getting some.

Speaker 1 (35:29):
Treatment at the time in the hospital, and the treatment
didn't do anything. I just started to realize that maybe
it just didn't feel right. Something didn't feel right. So
I started going down this path of you know, I
think when you find out you've got some sort of illness,
you holistically clean up your life, like you start learning

(35:52):
about wellness and you clean up your diet. I was
doing a lot of yoga, all the things that you're
told to do when you're kind of at a burnout,
I guess, but I think I was more burnt out
from the stress of thinking I was really sick. So
one day I think I was reading about maybe mold toxicity,
and I had someone come in test the apartment for mold,

(36:12):
and it wasn't that.

Speaker 4 (36:14):
And then.

Speaker 2 (36:16):
My sister that's right, came over actually and had the
same symptoms.

Speaker 1 (36:20):
Yeah, So Ash moved into our apartment and within about
I don't know, four to six weeks, she starts waking
up with numb limbs and starting having these strange things
in her eyes and sieges, just.

Speaker 2 (36:34):
Strange like neurology urological type symptoms.

Speaker 1 (36:38):
And it was almost the most validating part of the
whole journey and being sick, I was like, this isn't me,
this is external to me. Actually, I hired a x NYPD.
Oh my god, forensic scientist.

Speaker 2 (36:57):
What is your life? Is that?

Speaker 1 (37:00):
What is that even to come in and do it?
So obviously it wasn't mold. Is there some other kind
of substance in the apartment? Because what else could it be? Yeah,
And I vividly remember I was in the apartment on
my own at the time, and he did the test.

(37:22):
He was started to have a reaction even in the apartment.
Stop it yeah, eyes, itchy eyes or something. He's like,
there's something going on in here. And I was like, Okay,
that's scary. I think it was that time. Then I
was caught up Ashley and I called up Matt and
we were like, let's get out of here. Don stick
at an hotel, Let's just get out. Well, let's not
wait a week for these results to find out.

Speaker 2 (37:42):
What this is. It's something something. Yeah, we get out.
We book a hotel.

Speaker 1 (37:46):
At the time, I was very much in my real
health and wellness mode because I was trying to work
out how to get better.

Speaker 2 (37:55):
I have a story about that letter continue.

Speaker 5 (38:00):
I don't know what.

Speaker 2 (38:00):
I don't want to know what that stories. But it
was just our funny trip that we had in that
chapter that was that that's a good one. Yeah. And
I was coming back from Brooklyn. Actually I was.

Speaker 1 (38:13):
I went to a mushroom workshop on a rooftop farm
in Brooklyn.

Speaker 2 (38:19):
That's right, you wanted to do? Oh my god.

Speaker 1 (38:21):
I was reaching in this time. I was getting pulled
towards nature. I was like go hiking, go to farms,
go like it was like some farming.

Speaker 2 (38:32):
It was like remember the Urban Farming Show. I had
a big urban farming chapter. There are many a waiting,
many chapters.

Speaker 1 (38:42):
It was so fun though, but it was like I
needed to be in nature, and I think because New
York was so not I mean, you have Central Park,
but we were in we were in downtown, so it's
not as easily accessible. But Okay, this call from the
forensic scientist from the NYPD and he says, in my pity,
and he says, we've found extremely high levels of a

(39:06):
chemical called methylene chloride in your apartment and wait for it.
Because you're of child bearing age, I highly recommend you
get out.

Speaker 2 (39:19):
And I was like, I don't know that double as
like twenty hild bearing age. Come on. But anyway, that
was not go back and check the numbers to seriously,
I'm busy. I'm busy with.

Speaker 1 (39:37):
So that was a huge, like what the moment for us.
The three of us actually all walked into an emergency
ward in the hospital in New York and.

Speaker 4 (39:49):
They had like the whole team of.

Speaker 1 (39:54):
I don't even know what, like experts, expert, yeah, forensics
that come in and we're doing tests on us to
see if it was going to be something that they
were going to see in the whole building. For example,
they would need to be kind of ready for it
if they're going to have one hundred people come in
from a building.

Speaker 2 (40:08):
Like the CDC comes in and it's like, why is
there not a documentary about you? I actually, let's produce
that twenty five project. Let's do the story. It was
because your vent, your apartment was like over the vent,
so why it wasn't the entire building?

Speaker 4 (40:24):
So we never really got to the cruxit.

Speaker 2 (40:27):
Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (40:27):
In the US, it's like, great, who are you going
to sue? And we found that the building was blaming
the landlord. The landlord was leaving the building. There were
other factors at play. There could have been a meth
lab hot in the building here.

Speaker 2 (40:44):
We love that, We love that, which would have also lucrative,
you know, which could.

Speaker 1 (40:50):
Have completely you know, gone away by the time I
had to shut down the building. I think for the
day that we had announced that there was a leak,
it could have been simple as coming from a dry cleaning.
And that also brings me back to some of the
issues I had with dry cleaning, chemicals and things like that.

Speaker 4 (41:04):
So it was such a.

Speaker 1 (41:07):
Big, huge moment of like, wow, chemicals did this to us.

Speaker 2 (41:13):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (41:15):
I was almost six months into sick leave in the
I had taken a lot of time off and I
was so unwell, and it was such a great finding.

Speaker 4 (41:26):
I was like, this is easy, Like we get out
of this.

Speaker 1 (41:29):
We get better, and that was my time to I
went hiking in Portugal, we went to we did our
wood trip in La so health and wellness and guys.

Speaker 2 (41:44):
We were both I mean, I was like post Africa.
Oh wow. Yeah, it was beautiful that we went through
major health crisis at a similar time, because yeah, you
need your bestie to understand why you're like forensically reading
the ingredients and everything, like it's a buzzkill. Recovery from
a serious health crisis is a full time job.

Speaker 4 (42:06):
It was so much work.

Speaker 1 (42:07):
We were long SMOOTHI long smoothie dolls.

Speaker 2 (42:12):
Like it's it's a drainer. It changes your lifestyle, it's expensive,
you have to do research, and like to be with
someone else doing it firstly normalizes it. It makes it
a lot easier. You're both passionate about the same things,
but you're also going through that whole detachment of your
identity from your productivity, and like both of us, our
brain was reflected, our work was affected. And to go

(42:35):
on this like liberating trip where we both knew we
were getting better as well, it was like so positive
but just so fucking funny that we were like, soa babes,
do you want to go to like Whole Foods? Which
is so much fun? But it was like the only
things that we would do was like Hollo food stores.

Speaker 4 (42:49):
What we really wanted to do.

Speaker 2 (42:51):
That's all we want to do. Sleep well and sleep,
drink water, be in nature, detox and we were just
like health and like all the places we went to
on our list for like, we didn't drink. We were
just not interested. It was beautiful, but it was I
think it's so reassuring for anyone. I think there are
many people who probably have had medical scenarios where something

(43:14):
in their gut is telling them it's not what people
think it is, or maybe no one knows what it is,
and that uncertainty, but you knowing it's something like I
think there's a lot of people who feel quite alone
and isolated when they're in a situation like that.

Speaker 4 (43:28):
So isolating. Yeah, you're so isolating.

Speaker 1 (43:31):
You don't even really have the medical profession on your
side in that sat because you're if there's something inside
of you saying this isn't right, and you've got doctors
telling you no, this is what you need to do. Yeah,
you've got no one. Yeah, like your family obviously want
to listen to what the doctors say, like they don't,
we don't know, we're not equipped. It was such a huge,

(43:51):
like a vindication, Yeah, and just to know. And also
it does show the gaps in just modern medicine too.
It was kind of it's a it's a bit of
a gray area that modern western medicine doesn't really know
how to treat long term chemical exposures at all. There
wasn't really anything that doctors could say apart from time
and be away from the exposure.

Speaker 2 (44:12):
Yeah, and even to think that it's only because you
took it upon yourself, because you were like, I don't
think it's MS. I don't think that's what it is. Like,
a lot of people wouldn't necessarily have that gut instinct
or belief to go and find a detective who could
like help you find the answer and then to remove yourself, Like,
if it's kept staying in that apartment, you would have
kept having the symptanes. So I just remember what just

(44:35):
huge life affirming relief that was for you. So good.
But then it led to this beautiful new chapter of
yours that has embraced the slow life in But it's
been like the most perfect full circle back to yeah,
chemical free, yeah, slow living. Yeah, go back to that
initial observation about what a women missing. Yeah, But before

(44:58):
we actually get to that, what I love is that
you had ideas back at Uni. We were like, we
want to just run a business together. And the names
that you had in your brain were like you day
goddesses in ancient Greek figurines of empowered females. And it's
so funny to me that you had those inklings like

(45:18):
a decade ago. So U day is short for you deneumonia,
which is a Greek term for and I'm not saying
pronouncing it right, but it's a Greek term for the
idea of fulfillment, which I think is a really good
way to think of, another way to think of happiness.
So like we often everyone thinks, oh, I just want

(45:39):
to be happy, I just want to be happy, But
I like to say, I think you want to be fulfilled,
and I think that's so different if you kind of
switch your mindset to thinking about fulfillment. I've always had
a really big interest in classical Greek mythology and the language,
the literature, and there are so many interesting words from
Greek philosophyics that I think we should be we can

(46:03):
bring into our lives. And I think that was some
of the words that we used to talk about back
at Uni. And I love that that thread has been
there and now you've found a home for it. And
I think anyone listening you'll know that threads are coming
up frequently along the way, and you don't have to
necessarily have found where they're going to live yet, but
hold on to them, like write them down. Notice that
that's where your point of interest is, because now you

(46:26):
finally they tie together. Yeah, but you couldn't have had
this idea at nineteen, Like you wouldn't have executed it
the way you have, and the timing all conspires to
work out the way it was meant to. But it's
just so interesting that like even the name you Yeah,
that's the sort of like origins of that name already
in your brain a long time ago.

Speaker 1 (46:43):
So yeah, that's like, if we think about it, that's
sixteen years ago.

Speaker 2 (46:48):
Oh my god, I said a decade. It's like nearly two.

Speaker 4 (46:50):
It's nearly too.

Speaker 2 (46:51):
We keep thinking we're younger. I think I'm not. What
are we were the two kids embarrassing people, stare at me,
Stop looking at me, Stop looking at me. So it's
born about this beautiful about.

Speaker 1 (47:10):
So she is the name itself. She's a Greek goddess
and she is actually one of Zeus's granddaughters, and she
was well known for supporting other women.

Speaker 3 (47:26):
There you go.

Speaker 1 (47:28):
So she was calling out to us, my sister and
I because I think we had always had this idea
that was brewing over the last sixteen or so years
that there was something out there for us to do
that required us to call on new fem and support women.

Speaker 4 (47:48):
And we really.

Speaker 1 (47:51):
We've really started to, I guess, think about how do
we alleviate that very magical moment every day that we
get dressed and make that a moment of beauty and
joy that inspires you to kind of or propels you

(48:12):
into your day with strength and wisdom and magnetism. We
do that with so much. I guess it's a lot
of knowledge that we're building and over time, knowledge about
fabrications and knowledge about the chemicals that we use in

(48:32):
the industry or we don't, but that is that are
being used and or how we can use. I love
the intersection of heritage and innovation, like I love thinking
about these beautiful old heritage mills. Was just at one
that has been around since eighteen forty two, a French mill.

(48:55):
I work with one that has been around since sixteen
sixty three. It's the fifteenth generation, the same family that
makes these most beautiful wool that is from Australia into
the most gorgeous fabrics that just really feel different when

(49:17):
you wear them, and they really there's a certain energy
I think that you can get from being discerning about
those types of things that can bring you into.

Speaker 4 (49:31):
Your best self.

Speaker 1 (49:32):
So the intersection of heritage and then thinking about innovation.
So like the set that you're wearing today. I love
cotton and I love wool. Two favorite by far fibers
to work with this is cotton crape. And one of
my bugbears about knitwear and cotton is that one the

(49:53):
more you wash usually it doesn't really last very long, right,
like they shrink or they change shape. And then also
cotton and it hasn't got the best odor resistance compared
to wool.

Speaker 4 (50:03):
So we worked.

Speaker 1 (50:05):
With a Swiss technology company called high Q who co
developed with Patagonia a botanical treatment. So it's derived from
peppermint and it is a deodorizer for cottons. So we
apply that to our cotton crepes, which mean that instead
of having to wash something maybe every one or two weeks,

(50:27):
if you're wearing it on a weekly kind of cycle,
you can stretcher that out to four to six weeks,
which is so great from so many angles, like from
your usability. You don't have time to wash all the time.
You don't want to have to go to dry cleaners
all the time. You're a busy woman. So I think
for us, it's marrying these two things, and how do
we create the most elevated, timeless, comfortable, functional garments that

(50:54):
we could possibly make for this busy, remarkable woman that
we dress.

Speaker 2 (51:00):
Oh my gosh, it just I beam with pride every
time I talk about it, because I know how long
this has been brewing in your orbit, but how beautifully
and despite a daily doubt monster that I get. The
behind the scenes of what you have created is exquisite.

(51:20):
It is like nothing gets released that hasn't been painstakingly researched,
like you have gone to literally the ends of the
earth in an industry that you had never been part
of to find mills whose supply chain you have complete
visibility over, and the technical nature of fabrics like I
thought I understood fast fashion versus slow fashion before, but

(51:44):
having been alongside and watched you choose fabrics that make
like it sound, sometimes fashion seems really superficial because it
just is like what you look like whatever, And then
you realize, actually, it's so deep, deeply intertwined with your confidence,
but also with the commodity of time. It's so much
about time. And you spoke about this in Sydney and

(52:05):
it blew my mind. I had never thought about the
fact that we're all looking for happiness and wealth and
health and blah blah blah. But actually there's lots of
ways to measure our time on this earth. But actually
the universal thing that we all have that's we have
the same amount of that's limited is time. It's time,
and that's being so weaved into every decision you've made.

Speaker 1 (52:27):
Yeah, time is just the ultimate measure, I think, where
it is all about how we choose our time, what
we do with our time.

Speaker 2 (52:35):
I think.

Speaker 1 (52:38):
That for me, when we talk about that moment in
the morning getting ready, and I compare myself with our
colleague or my partner and how it's ten minutes to
get ready for them, what if it's ten minutes for me?
And what should that look like? And how can I
still feel great and powerful and confident but only taking

(52:59):
tens of time? And I think part of that is
having that uniform for you. What's your uniform in your mind?
Or what does that look like over a week. It's
never going to be as simple as it is for
how men dress. We have a monthly cycle to deal with, yeah,
which changes everything from week to week. So that's another

(53:23):
thing that I'm constantly thinking about. Is, for example, you
know your last week of your cycle, They're the days
where you want to have some stretch in your garments.
You want to have breatheability movement in those days. If
it's a warm weather, in those days, you want a
cold hand feel of the fabric.

Speaker 2 (53:44):
And the temperature of fabric.

Speaker 1 (53:45):
The temperature of fabric you need cold hand, feel so
so much softness in that one week, even the two
weeks so between nobulation and when you get your period.
Knowing that when you're getting ready in the morning, there's
like lots of tricks that we could kind of you know,
you can plan ahead for you, Like I think, I
know I'm going to need that type of outfit if

(54:05):
I'm traveling that week, because I know that I'm going
to feel like that. You ever have those moments when
you're traveling and you've packed the wrong thing and I
wish I had that, Yeah, And that's because of the
tempt to change your cycle.

Speaker 4 (54:16):
There are so many things at play.

Speaker 1 (54:19):
But then you move into the first part of your
cycle and then it's like confidence where there I want.

Speaker 2 (54:25):
Yeah, I want that. I want it to.

Speaker 1 (54:27):
Feel really polished, sharp. Yeah, I don't necessarily care so
much about stretch. Right now, I can deal with that.
I can feel strong and powerful without stretching my garment
on those days. It's a really complicated thought process that
goes into how we get dressed in the morning.

Speaker 2 (54:43):
Yeah, and we take it for granted. I think we
assume we just pick out stuff and then just chuck
it on. But then watching the way that you have
considered every touch point of someone's lifestyle in the development
of each garment, Like the fact that there's washable silk,
Like I didn't buy silk before you because I was, like,
you have to dry clean it every time you have to.

(55:04):
You can't. Like the way that you steam it, like
you can't iron it, blah blah blah. And then like
the non crushed fabrics, like ironing and steaming and dry
cleaning is the bane of my existence, and that you
often sacrifice the clean cut of a look of something
because I'm like, I won't do silk, I won't do whatever,
I won't do woolves because they peel or whatever exactly.
It kind of removed all those obstacles from exquisite fashion.

(55:30):
I mean, ironing is something I think that just has
to go. Yeah, like we can make beautifully cut pieces
and not iron.

Speaker 1 (55:38):
I even believe that, for you know, years, fifty years
even more, men's shirts have got so much more technology
in them to be iron free, non iron but not
in women's shirts. And how just kills me because I
think there's nothing better than a woman in like a crisp,

(56:00):
wide blue striped shirt.

Speaker 4 (56:02):
Just really crisp, lovely. It's very classic.

Speaker 1 (56:05):
It's very elegant and easy, and we have so many
options to my shirts. They're everywhere, but no one wants
to iron their shirt.

Speaker 2 (56:14):
They're high maintenance, high maintenance. I remember you had a
beautiful herring bone shirt when you were I think it
was like one of the earliest times I've ever seen you.
That would have been corporate Freehills days. Yeah, and I
was like, mate, I just saw you in trackies like
gray on gray with food stains and this clean cuts this,
but it was like elevated, like it just transformed. It's

(56:37):
very transforming. A white any type of shirt really I love.
But the effort that went into that shirt.

Speaker 1 (56:42):
Effort had time now once once and then it's.

Speaker 2 (56:45):
Done one and done one.

Speaker 1 (56:47):
And so that's the men's tailor that we work with
on our shirts. And there's so much technology that goes
into this that you can't even We just don't see
it when we're just buying something off the rack. But
what makes a shirt super wrinkly. There's a few things.
So there's like the fabric and then there's the seams,
so you put it in the wash. The cotton and

(57:09):
the seams will pucker, get smaller, get bigger, and that
will course it wrinkles. And then there's the fabric too
that'll just depending on what fabric is, it'll wrinkle or
it won't. And we've selected these fabrics that are low wrinkle.
And the maker actually puts in special fusings in the

(57:31):
seams so that the seams don't fuse the same with
the packets, so the collars and the cuffs. So we
have a shirt that we can sell that you can
put in the wash and hang it up after on
a hanger and you can wear it.

Speaker 2 (57:45):
There's no ironing. I literally like I want to marry you.

Speaker 4 (57:50):
I need more of these.

Speaker 2 (57:54):
No ironing iron It's got to go.

Speaker 1 (57:57):
And it's only really now like after having kids kids
and your to do list becomes immense.

Speaker 2 (58:05):
Yeah, your wardrobe is so low priority, especially with little kids,
that we need to be winning those minutes everywhere, Like
how can we win those minutes in our day? That's
how we win the minutes. Legit, look at this, this
is my like filthy nursing bra. You look beautiful. I

(58:26):
won the minute because this was on a hangar and
I just threw it on gorgeous like but no shit.
That is a real life example. I went from like
zero to hero in fourteen and a half seconds because
of these fabric good I'm glad, like my best friend created.
This blows my mind. I don't know how the doubt

(58:47):
monster like you are just like incredible, Oh like incredible.
Do you look now at what you have created, now
that you've done a few collections and know that there
are incredibly discerning people who wear a lot of a
lot of corporate ware, who can have access to any
brand that they like, and they choose yours now repeatedly

(59:09):
that you've been around for so long, like proper, like
like the governor general proper which amazing corporate like important
people whose suits and appearance really matters and who are
incredibly busy. How does that feel now knowing they choose
your stuff? Like like, it's not us just rebuying it

(59:30):
was you went straight to strangers paying money.

Speaker 1 (59:34):
It's always so flattering, And whenever someone comes back and
does their wardrobe haul, I'm just always so flattered, and
I'm it's always a nice reminder that something's working and
that we can always get better and grow from where
we are. There's not a lot of I guess sitting
around and thinking and reflecting and ceting, celebrating.

Speaker 2 (59:58):
Really yet that's the really hard part of it business.

Speaker 1 (01:00:00):
I think, Yeah, I think we're constantly kind of trying
to refine the offering and finding new technologies to bring
to women. One that is kind of top of mind
at the moment is I've got a bit of a
bug bear with polyester.

Speaker 2 (01:00:16):
As you might know.

Speaker 4 (01:00:17):
Yeah, I love that you get like a.

Speaker 2 (01:00:19):
B in your bonnet and then you're like, I'm just
I'm going to fix this for women everywhere, and I'm like,
I love you.

Speaker 1 (01:00:27):
My polyester bugbear is a lot more I guess about
microplastics in the ocean, and it's also it's such a
big issue.

Speaker 2 (01:00:35):
Every time you watch.

Speaker 1 (01:00:35):
Something with polyester, it's releasing microplastics in the ocean and
we're really hurting our sea life. And I think we're
very accustomed to buying polyester now because of fast fashion,
and there's a certain price point that comes with that.
So there's a what I really hope for going like
going forward, is how can we continue to offer all

(01:00:56):
of the functionality things like with stretches, distance, but also
in natural fibers. So how do we keep leaning into wool,
teaching people about how beautiful wool is, how you can
wear wool. I'm wearing a wool jacket on a forty
degree day in Melbourne.

Speaker 2 (01:01:13):
I actually haven't had to delayer. We haven't have we yet, Yeah,
because it's breathable. Yeah, and I'm not even that shiny.
I don't think we're both shiny. Were a real life example.
We are literally walking bill walls right now. You're the
best billboard on the most beautiful billboard.

Speaker 1 (01:01:31):
So I think teaching about wool those learning more about
natural fibers and going back to that space of quality
of a quantity. Learning a lot from men's wear too.
Men really invest in pieces that they wear over a
long time. We women, we do like fashion, which I
think is normal, but I think there's a lot more
to say that we can do get more longevity out

(01:01:51):
of more investment pieces in our wardrobes.

Speaker 2 (01:01:54):
I think we're moving back to the staple wardrobe. We
kind of cycle in, you know a couple of items
that are more seasonal, but we keep the staple blazers
and the staple, like, you know, longer term expensive investment pieces.
I think that's becoming more of a thing rather over
fast fashion, which is amazing.

Speaker 4 (01:02:13):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:02:13):
But another thing that I just want to touch on
before we finish is, I mean the impossibility of work
life balance at the start of a business, but also
with two kids who arrived very close together, and the
idea that you know you have made some decisions recently,
that there is a constant conflict between what your business
needs and what your like wellbeing needs. I can we

(01:02:36):
do six collections a year? Probably not? No, do we
want to? Yes? Would it be great? Amazing? But like there, Yeah,
what is your take on work life balance and are
you getting any at the moment? I mean, we have
many bees to each other at least once a day.
Gone for women supporting women. Absolutely Ah. I actually I

(01:02:58):
feel like I'm really living my best life at the moment.
Was not hard to say out loud, so hard to
say this for you. I know I can't live. I
just said that I deserve it because you have had
like how many years now, and it was amazing, shit show.
You're my wonder woman. Every time I complain, I'm like,
she has two, she has two, shared them close together,

(01:03:21):
and a business. And I did my business when I
had zero, so.

Speaker 1 (01:03:24):
You have one and a big business too, so like
that's a lot to juggle.

Speaker 2 (01:03:29):
It's a lot of juggle, same babe, I don't it Okay,
So I have probably never felt so fulfilled as I
am right now, you Daimonia.

Speaker 1 (01:03:44):
It's always like something that is never constant. It stretches
and changes every day. Yeah, Like I know for a
fact that what my sister and I are doing, like
we are so driven.

Speaker 2 (01:03:56):
Ashley loves the word ikey guy. I love I'm sure
you love the guy.

Speaker 1 (01:04:02):
It's very isn't it. It's exactly sees the A. Isn't
it finding your what drives you every day?

Speaker 2 (01:04:09):
Yeah, it's like your reason to reason to exist, reason
to be, your reason to be, reason to Japanese guys.
There's a beautiful book about it, Be a Picky Guy.
I love that because I feel like I've definitely found
my ikey guy. You found it, and now it's just
how do you build?

Speaker 1 (01:04:26):
I think with a family, it's kind of building process
and systems and structure and routine. Yeah, which is so
different to pre kid life because you kind of thrive
on spontaneity and doing fun things and just traveling here
at the drop of a hat.

Speaker 2 (01:04:41):
Yeah, but forward to push the boundary because no one
suffers when you do.

Speaker 1 (01:04:46):
Yeah, exactly, I think for now there is I have
a balance. It changes, but there is balance there. But
because I'm so grounded in what I think we're trying
to achieve, it you fem with my like so Ash
and I working together every day for the same purpose.
And then I have I guess owning your own business

(01:05:09):
is good in the sense that I do have some flexibility.

Speaker 2 (01:05:13):
I can pick my kids.

Speaker 1 (01:05:13):
Up from KINDI I love them, and I feel like
I've started to I think you really need to design
your life the way you want it to be.

Speaker 4 (01:05:24):
It's like it's a design project.

Speaker 2 (01:05:26):
It is literally it's an Excel spreadsheets, such as how
I'm going to optimize. So shifted from Excel spreadsheets.

Speaker 4 (01:05:32):
To like a big drawing.

Speaker 1 (01:05:36):
But I think like designing your life, and I feel
like I'm at a in a phase where we're in
a nest bubble with little kids two and four, and
I've got a cute little veggie patch which I love
and that gives me joy on my Sundays, and I
chat to you and my other good friends on the

(01:05:59):
phone whenever I get a spare moment that we're not
with kids, and that's.

Speaker 2 (01:06:04):
Like once a quarter. So yeah, yelling at each other
through like screaming babies.

Speaker 1 (01:06:09):
And yeah, it's the first time in my life where
I haven't felt the need for holidays and things like that,
which is because I feel like I've really designed my
my life at home.

Speaker 4 (01:06:23):
I mean, it's not to say it's no.

Speaker 1 (01:06:25):
It is so hard with kids, right, Like it's unbelievably hard,
but it's still very fulfilling fulfillment.

Speaker 2 (01:06:31):
Oh my god, you found you found your ya.

Speaker 1 (01:06:34):
You are for now I am seizing my AA and
I know it's going to change, but for now I am.

Speaker 2 (01:06:40):
I mean, I need a whole separate episode on working
with your sister, working with family, more on like the
fact that I haven't even mentioned that you also tried
to do medicine at one point. I'll put that in
the in and out it. There's so much more, and
then friendship and then friendship evolutions into motherhood, and then
we could do a whole season baby episode on the
motherhood juggle. There is so much mother whole juggle is big,

(01:07:03):
that's like it deserves we should we should do one
big because you will also allow me through our chat
to expose my shoot show, which I don't always let
all the way out of the bag.

Speaker 4 (01:07:14):
I need it. We need to let that out.

Speaker 2 (01:07:15):
I think we need to do and I can't pull
that out. I think I think we completely think needs
to hear it. I mean they see it sometimes. Yeah,
just let go of the voice notes just published so much. Yeah,
that'd be a great a great time. I need like
at least a five part series within my love, but
that seems like the perfect place to finish it today
because I am just I felt like this needed to

(01:07:36):
live somewhere, and I'm so so you. I'm so honored
that you push through the doubt monster today to tell it.
Thank you, because you're incredible and the journey has been
amazing and you family's exquisite. Thank you.

Speaker 4 (01:07:46):
I'm it's just so honored to be here.

Speaker 2 (01:07:47):
Thank you so much for having me. I love you.
It's funny how when you know someone so well, it's
really easy to forget how brilliant they are, especially when
you're conversing in baby talk among all your kids climbing
all over you most of the time. But I I
really loved hearing this as much the second time as
I did the first airb is just such an extraordinary
human being, so talented and doing such amazing things, So

(01:08:08):
it's just been amazing to finally be able to sing
her praises on the show and to convince her that
it's a story worth telling. Having close friends on the
show also really exposes my own self doubt and internal chatter,
which I love because it is too easy to skate
over that when you curate your own online story, so
I kind of like that it throws me in the
deep end a little bit as well. You all know
it took EB a little bit to quieten the self

(01:08:30):
doubt monster for this one, so even more than usual.
Please share the episode if you enjoyed, tagging at UFM
dot co, eu p h e M E dot co
and check out their incredible range at the link in
the show notes. In the meantime, I hope your year
is off to a beautiful start, and as always, we
love having you involved in planning. So if there's anyone

(01:08:51):
you want to hear from, or anything you want to
hear about in any of the segments, please shoot me
an email or a DM. You may have seen the
very sad, devastating, so crushing news that our dear Ange
has moved into State this week. Oh my gosh, I've
barely spoken about it in this episode just because it's
too painful. It's just too soon, guys, But rest assured
she will still be making yeas of our lives appearances,

(01:09:13):
whether remotely or of course, we will be visiting each other.
And yes, you have definitely not heard the last from
our dear Dear, and seize the baby. We'll be back too.
He is to a big, bright and beautiful twenty twenty five,
and I hope you

Speaker 3 (01:09:28):
Are all seizing your ya