January 18, 2025 • 37 mins
Weekly Update - Highlighting the Annual Leadership Retreat and a Special Introduction to Father James Brzezinski In this week's update for the third week of Epiphany 2025, we are introduced to Father James Brzezinski, the new rector of Grace Episcopal Church in Carlsbad, New Mexico. Additionally, the episode covers the recent annual Leadership Retreat of the Diocese, held at Prude Ranch in Fort Davis, Texas, with visits to local churches and organizations. Key topics include the challenges faced by Border Patrol agents, the concept of Migration with Dignity, (Tool kit here: https://bit.ly/40mSZxr ) and the Oxford Movement's influence on contemporary church practices. Don't miss a detailed dive into the traditions and activities at seminaries like Nashota House, explaining the significance of Anglican vestments, worship practices, and the importance of bringing Christ to the community.
00:00 Weekly Update Introduction
00:32 Diocesan Leadership Retreat Recap
01:08 Exploring the Big Bend
04:09 Migration with Dignity Week
05:22 Meet Father James Brzezinski
06:08 Life at Nashota House Seminary
22:45 High Church vs. Low Church
26:59 The Oxford Movement and Clerical Attire
35:12 Unity in Diversity
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:12):
Hello, Diocese This is your weekly update for the third week of Epiphany 2025.
.999In this weekly update, I am grateful to share with you an introduction to the new rector of Grace Episcopal Church in Carlsbad, New Mexico, Father James Brzezinski.
That'll be coming up shortly.
But before that interview, I want to let you know that just this past weekend, the leadership of your diocese.
(00:38):
That means The Standing Committee of the Diocese, the Diocesan Council, and the Chancellors, along with the staff of the Diocese, had our annual Leadership Retreat, which we do every January.
It's the one time each year when we all get together in person.
The rest of our work since COVID has been done on Zoom, and that will continue to be the case.
(01:00):
We get together for one weekend every year in January to get to know each other and kind of plan the year and do some strategic thinking.
.999This year for the first time we gathered not at Bishop's Ridge or at the Cathedral, we gathered in the Big Bend at Fort Davis.
at a little ranch called Prude Ranch in Fort Davis, Texas.
(01:23):
And we were hosted by St.
Paul's Episcopal Church in Marfa, Texas.
As a part of the visit, we took an opportunity, as we talk about the future strategy of the diocese, we took the opportunity to do that in the context of the Big Bend, where we have five churches in a piece of land that is the size of the state of Connecticut.
(01:45):
And those five churches have now two priests who work to help look after those five congregations.
Mike Wallens and our curate, which is, who is funded largely through the diocesan budget, is in the Big Bend.
Katie Hudak is her name.
And we heard from them about how things are going, what life is like ministering in the rural parts of the diocese.
(02:11):
We also had an opportunity to tour the Blackwell School and to learn about this particular ways in which racism against people of brown skin who speak Spanish has unfolded in the state of Texas and in our diocese.
We also had an opportunity to meet with the Border Patrol in the Marfa sector and to talk with Border Patrol agents about the challenges they face and to learn some unpleasant truths or to dispel some notions that we might have had about the Border Patrol and their work.
(02:45):
As you know, our work with Rio Grande Borderland Ministries continues supporting those who are legally claiming asylum in the United States and also supporting the Border Patrol and pushing for comprehensive immigration reform.
Cause the one thing everybody can agree on is our current system is not working very well.
(03:05):
We also took the opportunity to go on Friday evening to look for the Marfa Lights at the Marfa Lights Viewing Center just outside of town of Marfa.
And we had planned to do a star party at the McDonnell Observatory there in Fort Davis, Texas.
But there was a pipe that burst and we weren't able to do that.
The feedback from everybody, many of the leaders of our diocese had never been to the Big Bend, but always wanted to go.
(03:30):
The feedback was that all of us want to go back and spend more time in Marfa, in Alpine, in Fort Davis, in Terlingua, in Fort Stockton, because it's such a beautiful part of the world and a beautiful part of our diocese.
I encourage you to go and check out the Big Ben, plan your next holiday to go there, drop in and hang out with one of our churches.
(03:53):
The Diocese of the Rio Grande is a vast and beautiful place, and I want you to get to know all of it.
I also want you to know that this coming week, January 20th to 26th, has been named by the Episcopal Church as Migration with Dignity Week.
(04:20):
Migration with Dignity is a concept that talks about making sure that everybody who is migrating be treated as a human being. 31 00:04:28,514.999 --> 00:04:33,635 Now that means if you're a criminal you're going to get arrested and you should do the time and be deported.
But it also means that if you are coming to the country legally for a variety of reasons.
And even if you're coming illegally, you should be treated humanely, no matter what.
(04:44):
And so if you're interested in learning some more about migration with dignity, check out the link below and it will help you learn some things like the fact that a refugee and an asylum seeker are not necessarily the same thing.
And the more we all learn about the border, the more we can help see the places in which it's broken and the places in which we can fix it.
(05:04):
I say this as someone who works regularly with both the Border Patrol and people who are migrating through as seeking asylum in the United States.
This is not a political effort.
This is a Christian effort to make sure that we are treating everybody with the dignity that God gave them when God created them. 39 00:05:22,639.999 --> 00:05:30,580 And now, I want you to meet Father James Brzezinski, the new rector of Grace Episcopal Church in Carlsbad, New Mexico.
(05:31):
.9Go visit him if you get a chance.
Hello there, Diocese of the Rio Grande.
I want to make sure you know the new rector of Grace Episcopal Church in Carlsbad, New Mexico, the Reverend James Brzezinski. 43 00:05:56,619.999 --> 00:05:57,290 Hello, Bishop.
(05:57):
Father James, it's so good to see you.
It's good to see you, and it's good to be back in the Diocese of the Rio Grande.
.02133333Yes, you're back! This is Yes, I am. 47 00:06:08,31.02133333 --> 00:06:25,425 I started my priestly ministry at Holy Faith, and um, in Santa Fe, uh, under, uh, Father, uh, Ken Seaman and enjoyed a two year cur curacy there and, uh, what an incredible parish and, uh, what an interesting place as well. 48 00:06:25,444.999 --> 00:06:41,160 Santa Fe, uh, had some, uh, different food that I hadn't experienced before that, uh, amongst other things and, uh, Um, really, really enjoyed that and learned a lot under Father Ken, um, and you went to Neshota House, is that right? I did.
(06:41):
I attended Neshota House. 50 00:06:42,909.999 --> 00:06:48,950 And how did you find Neshota from Florida? So yes, so I was in the Diocese of Central Florida. 51 00:06:48,965.1 --> 00:06:52,585 And he suggested four places.
He said Trinity School of Ministry, of which he was one of the founders, and then Neshoda House.
And he said, there's two others I'd recommend to you, and that was, uh, Wickliffe in Toronto, and he said, uh, there is an English school, and I, I suspect he was thinking of St.
(07:09):
Stephens, knowing my My background and um, uh, and I thought our daughter was going to uh, College the the same day that we were heading to nishoda house so we we dropped her off in birmingham and continued up to nishoda house and um after we got her settled and Uh, so we had visited trinity and we visited nishoda house and we loved both of them dearly and um, but we just felt there was the The, uh, residential aspect of Neshoda House had different, uh, uh, taste and feel than Trinity.
(07:48):
.999And so we thought, well, boy, we'd be fine at either one, but let's, let's go to Neshoda.
And so, uh, That's where we headed off.
And, uh, it has, uh, those of you that haven't been, there are a variety of seminaries in the Episcopal church.
.999They tend to have a history that has to do with what we used to call churchmanship back in the day, where there were high church places like Nishoda house.
(08:13):
And Seabury Western, and then there, and General Seminary.
And then there were low church places like Virginia Seminary.
Or Trinity, which was very evangelical.
.999Evangelical, right? And so back in the day, when I went to seminary, there was still talk about, you know, are you going to a high church place or a low church place? Which I should say, sometimes people misunderstand what that term is about. 63 00:08:36,294.999 --> 00:08:41,895 The high church does not mean more serious, and low church does not mean less serious.
(08:42):
It talks about, it's about your emphasis that you place on various theological Positions.
So would you like to describe it? You want me to, like, I'd love for people to really kind of know that part of the history of the Episcopal Church, because I don't know that people think about that anymore.
.999Well, Neshoda's, uh, particular view of churchmanship is that, uh, they live under a Benedictine rule, so we really understood.
(09:08):
It's very monastic when you go to, when you go to a place like that, right? Yes.
And there's a cloister, the chapel is gorgeous.
Yes, the chapel, of course, the whole chapel is choir.
So you're facing each other and you have assigned seating and you're expected to be there for the two daily services, uh, and, um, uh, the, uh, also vested, right? You'll be vested, uh, most, most of the time just in a cassock.
(09:35):
A lot of my fellow students wore their cassocks all the time.
.9And, uh, then those for solemn, uh, services, whether it be even song or Or, um, uh, mass, uh, we would, we'd be fully, fully robed with, uh, cassock and surplus surplus.
(09:57):
Cause they're all seminarians.
You're lay people at the time.
So for those of you, this is a good opportunity for me to explain choir dress, which is, as you said, in a Benedictine place and in lots of our churches, you'll see.
Up by the altar, there's the altar, and the acolytes hang out up there, and the clergy are often up there.
And then there's usually in between the nave, where the majority of the congregation sits, and the altar, there's what's called the choir.
(10:26):
.999And, and it was built for a choir. 79 00:10:28,369.999 --> 00:10:30,180 They often look at each other this way.
Our Cathedral of St.
John is shaped that way.
Many of our churches are shaped that way.
And so, you would be, um, in the choir.
And in the Anglican tradition, this is different from Presbyterians, it's different from Methodists, it's different from Roman Catholics.
We have a choir dress that is a cassock, a surplus, and then if you're a clergy person, you would wear what's called a tippet, which is the black stole.
(10:54):
It's not of the seasons.
.9It's there for morning prayer and evening prayer.
And it comes out of the, the cathedral office tradition in, in Anglicanism, where the, whether you were clergy or not, you would sit in the choir.
.999And so the only distinguishing feature, everybody was wearing the same thing, the cassock and the surplus.
(11:16):
And then the only distinguishing feature is that the clergy would wear the tippet and the bishop would wear a ratchet and Shamir But the important part of that is we're all in the choir together Yes vested in our baptismal garments because the white of the surplus is the as it says in the book of Revelation It'll be their garments are washed white as snow and and so we are sort of vested In preparation for and, and in acknowledgement of the fact that we are a part of the risen body of Christ.
(11:49):
Right now, and we're all vested.
I've sort of had fantasies that like we would have, um, cassocks and surplus for everybody.
.999So you come through the nave, put on your cassock and surplus, and that's kind of what the monastic tradition that they still observe at Neshoda House, they do. 94 00:12:07,369.999 --> 00:12:18,549.999 So instead of having sort of You know a big nave little choir and then clergy sort of up around the altar and the shoda house There's a huge choir and everybody joins in there's nowhere else.
(12:18):
I've been there's a very small Two rows of seats.
That's right and um Uh, and so, yes, so, part, part of the, uh, the life of Neshoda House is the worship, and so we had, uh, the daily offices every day, um, but on Thursday you would have, um, matins, sung matins, uh, in the morning.
(12:40):
And frequently it was solemn, um, meaning incense and, and, um, uh, bells.
Of course we use bells all the time.
Um, I'll talk about the bells in a second.
And then on Thursday evening would be the community high mass of the week.
And you usually, whatever saint happened to be that day or the major saint, uh, you would celebrate that at the mass.
(13:03):
We were not required to be at mass on Sunday morning.
Because we were expected to be in our field at church or another church doing work in the in the community and And so we we enjoyed a great spiritual life and Angle Catholic it did have we use lots of incense and I need to dig up a photograph I have during the week that I was serving and The smoke was over my head.
(13:31):
It just filled up, you know, the Shekinah glory kind of idea But these are part of the beautiful thing is, uh, uh, and all Episcopal churches do this, but we worship with all five of our senses.
So you've talked about the vestments and what things look like and how the church is laid out in the traditional monastic style.
(13:52):
Well, we, we worship with every sense of our body.
We can smell the incense.
We can hear God's Word.
We can sing God's praises.
We can, uh, see the colors of the, the, the liturgical colors that tell us what part of Christ's life we're, we're celebrating at that season.
And, um, Uh, so it is a wonderful place.
(14:14):
.999And of course, uh, you could call us an extremist place, I guess, uh, because we, we overdid all of those things and, and, um, yet those were outward visible signs of an inward spiritual grace.
.999And of course, uh, we, uh, Uh, rang the Angelus three times a day, which is a gotta explain that that's a mystery to many many Episcopalians Um, we do have We have a Marian focus and it's not about worshiping Mary, but it's about honoring the fact that she was the Theotokos The God bearer, the one who, who birthed our Savior, Jesus Christ, and so there's a practice of, uh, uh, prayers and ringing of bells that, uh, on, honor, um, uh, Mary, and, uh, during most of the year, it's called the Angelus.
(15:02):
Where, uh, there are beautiful prayers, uh, that go along with the ringing of the bells.
.999And our method was three, uh, three rings during each of the three Hail Marys.
And then we'd have, uh, it's supposed to be nine rings, but bells that are, uh, Uh, like Michael, a tooth.
We had a 2000 pound, uh, bell named Michael, and we would ring her, ring him.
(15:25):
And you cannot ring, uh, you have to ring 18 because there's always a second strike.
.999And so, um, Bishop may have even heard me ringing that today. 120 00:15:36,899.999 --> 00:15:38,770 We'll have to get some audio of you.
In fact, maybe you'll take us back.
Let's do that.
We'll go over there and you can show us how that, how the ambulance is working. 124 00:15:45,195.1 --> 00:15:45,645 I can do that.
(15:45):
.999But, um, church bells are meant to make the community aware of God's presence in the community.
And so that's why I like to ring the bells here because, uh, I want people to know that Christ is, is alive and that, uh, there are people at Grace Church.
that enjoy being in the presence of God and receiving his real presence.
(16:08):
And so wonderful.
Um, that might be apocryphal, not quite exactly historically accurate, but there's a wonderful phrase in some of George Herbert's writings that talk about how it is the responsibility of the priest in a country parish.
to ring the bells for morning prayer and evening prayer.
And he talks about how the farmers in the fields would stop and remove their hats for a time, a moment, at least of silent prayer, when they heard the bells ring and then they'd go back to their, to their plowing. 132 00:16:37,939.999 --> 00:16:44,410 And then when I moved to back to, to New Mexico, we have some wonderful icons of San Ysidro.
(16:44):
Who is always, you know, the story of San Ysidro, who is the farmer plowing and he couldn't get his work done Because he kept trying to pray and so God sent an angel to do the work. 134 00:16:54,644.999 --> 00:17:17,590 So there's these wonderful San Ysidro icons of San Ysidro praying in the fields while the angel is plowing and every time I hear that Angelus I bring together that sense of George Herbert's The church calls the community to prayer, not just the people in the building, and, and that no matter where you are when you hear those church bells.
(17:18):
You can take time to make the sign of the cross and and at least pray if you can't do the whole morning prayer You can at least stop for a moment to recognize God's presence in your life and God's presence in our world Yes, thank you for bringing to light a lot of things, you know We can pray without ceasing as Paul said and sometimes it might be just the moment When someone comes to your mind that has a special need that you can pray for them, or in this sense, the ringing of bells that stops you, uh, one of the first experiences you have at an Ashota house is, um, the bells ring at noontime, at the end of class.
(17:53):
And you look around campus and there's not a soul moving you see all of these people just standing still because that's what they're doing They're actually uh praying The angels we we didn't pray the angelus out loud with words because some people uh, It's not as meaningful to them. 137 00:18:10,279.999 --> 00:18:16,370 But uh, we we allowed for that flexibility But I do like saying the prayers.
(18:16):
.999They remind me of the Blessed Virgin Mary and the incarnation of, you know, the Word became flesh and dwelt among us. 139 00:18:24,499.999 --> 00:18:32,110 And so, so it's a wonderful sign of God's presence and of His incarnation and we like to do that.
There is a Regina Chaley that we do during the Easter season that's different.
(18:38):
.999So we, See, we have a wonderful liturgical year of which we can express what's going on in Christ's life and in our own lives with every aspect of our life.
And thank you for reminding me of Saint Isidro.
There's a beautiful museum in Santa Fe that has a lot of tablas of Saint Isidro.
(19:01):
uh, uh, wonderful, um, memory.
And it's, it's really nice the way we have different expressions of that.
And what a great example of how Christ comes to us in our lives where we are. 147 00:19:13,724.999 --> 00:19:19,994.999 We don't have to be perfected or be just made right or anything first that we can come to Christ.
.999Just as we are, whether we're a farmer or an oilman, uh, is in our area, uh, and, uh, and so, uh, thank you.
(19:29):
So, so life at Neshoda prepares us for bringing God to the community and, uh, with that monastic life, we, we, uh, followed the Benedictine rule of, uh, um, prayer, study, and work.
And so even part of, uh, my week included at assigned time, where we had to do physical labor for the seminary with no renumeration.
(19:53):
You know, we did have opportunities to, to work in different things.
.9995I was a choral scholar, so I got a little extra tuition, uh, covered by, by singing, uh, in, in chapel. 153 00:20:03,754.9995 --> 00:20:07,205 And kind of work study, like people would understand in other places. 154 00:20:07,304.999 --> 00:20:08,444.999 Yes, exactly. 155 00:20:08,454.999 --> 00:20:13,404.999 But the, the, the work that I was talking about on Wednesdays was the day at my time.
(20:13):
We had to either be mowing the lawn or cleaning up sticks and stones or, or in my case, it was, uh, cleaning the library and, and we had to clean the library from all three floors. 157 00:20:26,494.999 --> 00:20:31,514.9995 It included dusting, uh, books that included one time they wanted to move a section. 158 00:20:31,514.9995 --> 00:20:37,035 So, uh, during the summer, I actually, for a few weeks, I'd moved books, uh, from one location to another.
(20:37):
But, uh, we also had to clean the, the restrooms.
And so, uh, I became a professional, uh, cleaner during that because no one else wanted to do that preparation for parish ministry and they, uh, yes, uh, plumbing and electricity all come into play in the ministry of the clergy. 161 00:20:56,464.999 --> 00:20:59,295 And, um, and so we took this very seriously.
(20:59):
Um, you know, we did do work.
Um, I spend an awful lot of time at the Corpus Christi's chapel.
Uh, in the Blessed Sacrament, um, just, uh, praying and inter, you know, interceding for myself.
.9Help me, Lord! Yes, Lord, please help! Come quickly to help us! That's my most eloquent prayer, and I, I cannot tell you how many times I just cried out to God, Help! I have a Hebrew test tomorrow! Right, right, right.
(21:27):
But um, so and I don't I'll mention a lighter thing.
.999Um, You you alluded to life is fun and seminary is challenging but uh I cannot tell you some of the pranks that we played with each other around that are But i'll mention one our first greek exam we get there and we're all really really worried about this exam And then this procession comes into the classroom and there are people dressed up with miters and with uh, One guy, fella had a set of rosary beads that was six feet long, you know when they glowed in the dark and there were like four or five thuribles just smoking away and They're, they're taking up all this time and joking around and we're, we're like, you know, when are we going to take this exam? And, uh, so that was one of the funny traditions.
(22:21):
The first Greek exam, uh, the, uh, upper classes would come and harass the, uh, people taking the test and.
Uh, the joy was the next year you got to do that for somebody else.
Right, right.
So you see there the joy of the lord is our strength and we we even Involved had some of that at seminary as well.
(22:45):
Absolutely and so when we talk about high church and you're doing a wonderful job of Like helping people see and feel and understand what it usually means is there's a high doctrine of the nature of church, which is to say, uh, a strong emphasis on that, that the church is the body of Christ active in the world.
(23:07):
as it is, through its structures, through its buildings, through its clergy.
A high doctrine of the priesthood usually goes along with this.
High doctrine of the Eucharist, that it is the body and blood of Jesus Christ, and that is revered both by keeping it in the ombre with a candle and a light on. 176 00:23:24,679.999 --> 00:23:34,470 If you go into your church and there's a red light up there by the altar, what that means That the presence, uh, that the body and blood of Jesus Christ are being kept in what's called an ombry.
(23:34):
.999It's a little box with a little lock and key on it. 178 00:23:37,809.999 --> 00:23:45,560 And the light is on to remind everyone that the presence of Jesus Christ is there in real form in the body and blood of Jesus.
There all the time so you can come in and pray in the presence of Jesus Christ.
That's correct There's consecrated bread and wine as well as some often the oil holy oils are also in the OMRI and and so we as lovers lovers of Jesus can can feel that we have the presence of Christ and of course the Eucharist isn't available to us every time we come into the church and so one of the The high church things that we we reverence the the real presence of christ and and that's why I like to go there I could go to the joseph altar or the merry altar, but I like the real presence and so I always would light a candle and and intercede for for my loved ones as well as uh, Pray for myself and um, and actually that's why if you see people come into a church and they bow They're not bowing to the altar They're bowing to the presence of Christ who is really present there.
(24:47):
And so I, you'll, if, when I come in, for example, to the cathedral, if I come in, you'll see, I bow, but, and it may look like I'm bowing to the altar, but I'm always looking at.
Where the ombre is so it's so that the emphasis there is about Jesus Christ God's self is actually present in the midst of the church, which is which is different from the way our Tradition in the Episcopal Church is so broad that there are others who would say no If we want to find the presence of Christ, we're gonna look in the Bible And they might call themselves more low church where all this stuff you're doing with the incense and these vestments you like to wear And all the bowing and scraping and all of that stuff. 183 00:25:30,984.999 --> 00:25:44,355 We don't want to do any of that What we want to do is focus on the emphasis of the word And that has a low what we would call a lower doctrine of priesthood Often the the person who is low church who is an ordained priest might call themselves.
(25:44):
Mr Or ms instead of father or mother they might never wear a collar Cause they're deemphasizing the distinctiveness of the priesthood.
So it's, it's, we would say it's a lower doctrine of priesthood, a lower doctrine of church, less emphasis on the, the sort of glorious or magnified, um, architecture.
(26:05):
Etc.
So we have all of that in the Episcopal Church and and it's fun getting to talk to you because you can explore with Us the high church piece and we can learn about that and I'll find some low church folks in the diocese too So we'll have another follow up.
Yes That's a great segue into I want to make sure that people understand you mentioned bowing and scraping and and I crossed myself incessantly at the, the Gloria Patri and, um, uh, and I, I do even bow at the Gloria Patri in the name of Jesus.
(26:37):
Um, um, and I, my Beretta hasn't come out, uh, yet, uh, at Grace Church, but, uh, I do have a a symbol of my priesthood, uh, that I like to wear, um, but, um, high church, it's not just the symbolism and the ritual.
That is important because they are outward signs of an inward spiritual grace.
(26:59):
But during the Oxford movement, When these, the, there was this little tension between the reformers and the, and the, and the Angle, the Angle Catholic expression of the faith, the Oxford movement and the Tractarians, their real main thing was to bring the, the worship to the people.
(27:19):
Yes.
.999And also.
the ministry to the people.
There were more churches formed to help the poor and the destitute and the orphans, um, during the Oxford movement than almost any other time. 196 00:27:32,369.999 --> 00:27:33,880 And there was a real sense of that.
We build churches to go, we built them in places where the poor are.
We go to the people with the glory of God.
(27:41):
.999And so some of the, some of the grandeur of the church, the music, the vestments, the incense was to remind people who do not experience that kind of luxury all the time that they are worth that.
And even though the world might say, well, you get to live on skid row and you don't get to live on fifth Avenue.
(28:02):
The church is going to bring the magnificent glory of God.
.9995To the people there, you may not be afford afford to go to the symphony, but your church choir is going to praise the glory of God with everything. 203 00:28:14,244.9995 --> 00:28:14,795 It's God.
.999And it was, it was, it's really helpful for people not to think like, Oh, so high church thing is a rich church thing.
.9995Not at all. 206 00:28:21,284.9995 --> 00:28:22,674.999 In fact, just the opposite.
(28:23):
The priest wears what is the habit, right? Which is the cassock or we, you and I are in our habits today.
The black suit is the.
Is the habit which is the same simple garment every day.
That's not my particular personal style choice It is a sign to the world that the church is here for you and that you can talk to me And that I want to bring the message of jesus christ to you so that That's, thank you for, for emphasizing that.
(28:52):
And you've, you've mentioned something that, that connected me with the Oxford movement.
I do wear my clericals in order to be an icon of Christ to the world.
.999And large portion of my ministry is in the grocery store and on the street and wherever I go.
People will come up and I'm, I'm hoping it's my smile too, but uh, It's usually the the clothing and they say hi father and I say how's how's your day today? What was your closest moment to christ today? That's a great question, you know from our curio experiences We we ask that question.
(29:27):
So I use that a lot and people will Will say I need you to pray for me and right in the aisle in the grocery store.
Um, I I uh, And so that's the oxford movement you go to the people and you bring christ to the people Um, and so it's it is a lifestyle Um, I grew up in a broad church a low church And yet I remember Um, in my upbringing, the, the, the church was a refuse from the storm of my challenging childhood.
(29:57):
We had family situations and stuff, and, and I, we were involved in the church.
I was super involved in the church, but there were times when I just went to be away from the turmoil of home, and I would cry out to God in that most eloquent prayer, like, Help dad, help mom, help me, you know, and um, and so it was great to have a beautiful place, a quiet place, a peaceful space, place where the Spirit of God dwelled and to go and to, to offer up to God myself and, and the challenges of my life.
(30:34):
And so that, that I think is the spirit that you're talking about, that uh, yeah.
Christ's love is available to all people and we just want to have opportunities and so I do like wearing my clericals Uh, I always joke.
.999It's real easy.
I can get dressed in the dark, you know, I don't have to figure out But but also it's I'm available to people to You know question me or ask for prayer and people do respond to to my clothing, you know Yeah, oh that, that just, people may not care about this, but um, that's why I still wear black.
(31:14):
Two reasons.
And, and it's not, some people are like, oh, you're being humble.
It's not about humble.
It's about the black shirt with the clergy collar is for the last few centuries what, what clergy have worn, regardless of whether they were high church or low church. 227 00:31:32,649.999 --> 00:31:33,610 This is kind of a uniform. 228 00:31:33,979.999 --> 00:31:37,959.999 So it's sort of like you expect to see a police officer in the uniform.
(31:38):
This is, this is that uniform.
And if you, and it's the traditional thing as well.
The thing that signifies a bishop is the pectoral cross.
Not the color of the shirt.
The purple shirt came in in the late 60s or early 70s when, um, there was a bishop in London, I believe, who Thought his shirt should match his cassock.
(31:58):
Cause he had, he was in the cathedral and he had a purple cassock.
Cause the cathedral is the color purple, not the bishop.
The cathedral is the color. 237 00:32:06,69.999 --> 00:32:09,99.999 And so, he was like, I want to get a shirt to match my cassock.
So, so he wore a purple shirt. 239 00:32:10,859.999 --> 00:32:12,119.999 And then there was a Lambeth conference.
All the bishops from all the world came and they saw this bishop in a purple shirt and they went.
Ooh, I like that.
And they all went to Whipple's, the famous clerical outfitter in London, and they all bought purple shirts.
(32:23):
And now everybody thinks the symbol of a bishop is the color purple, but that's, that's a very recent thing.
So that's part of the reason why I, is that I, I like that our traditions in the church and I try to understand those traditions and then embody them in contemporary ways.
Um, so I'm wearing my black suit, but I'm wearing my cowboy boots too.
So there's a little bit, a little modern mixed in there. 247 00:32:46,65.1 --> 00:32:48,625 And so I have some purple shirts.
(32:49):
The first week that I was bishop in the Rio Grande, I wore the purple shirt. 249 00:32:53,45.1 --> 00:33:12,635 I stopped wearing the purple shirt because, during that week, multiple people came up to me, on the street, and what they said was, Father, you're so stylish and fashionable, I like that purple shirt, that's really cool! Or, They said, they let you wear your own colors of purple.
(33:12):
Wow, that's really cool.
.999So when someone approached me like that and asked me if I was either fashionable or, you know, they let me wear, I had really two options.
One was to say, thank you, I'm a very stylish person, that's fabulous.
Or to say, actually, I'm a bishop.
Which, neither of which, both of which would have stopped the conversation cold.
(33:35):
When I switched back to wearing the black shirt, now people stop me on the street and they say, Father, will you pray for me? And that's the conversation I want to have with people. 256 00:33:44,514.999 --> 00:33:45,295 Not the other.
It's not about fashion. 258 00:33:46,544.999 --> 00:33:49,465 More, more, more of Jesus and less of me.
Exactly! Which is the whole point of all this get up, really, is more of Jesus, less of me.
And so I will occasionally wear a purple shirt, like, if I'm at a bishop's consecration in another diocese.
(34:01):
Just because on that day, everybody knows what the purple is.
And it's sometimes helpful for the altar guild, because they send the bishops in one direction to get us all corralled in one room.
.999But most of the time, I wear the black, because it's the more traditional choice. 264 00:34:17,174.999 --> 00:34:24,765 But it's also the choice, more importantly, that invites people to ask me to pray with them and do this for them, rather than otherwise.
(34:25):
.5695652And some who are Really knowledgeable church people recognize that I'm a bishop because I'm wearing a temple cross, but, but it's the black shirt that is the key. 266 00:34:34,27.5695652 --> 00:34:40,555 So that's why, that's why I have a preference for clergy wear black, not lots of different colors.
.999Now I know that there are clergy in the diocese, don't think I'm cracking on you all. 268 00:34:44,814.999 --> 00:34:47,990 Clergy do wear different, um, Uh, colored shirts.
(34:48):
That is a matter of personal choice, and it is about how each of us embodies the priesthood, and people do it in different ways.
So we all make our different choices, but I'm grateful to hear about your choices and the background of, of the theology behind it. 271 00:35:02,220.1 --> 00:35:02,819.9 Yes.
And, um, and so, yes, I, I grew up in a broad church and my Anglo Catholicism came a lot later.
(35:12):
.999Um, but even it did come in an, uh, in an evangelical diocese. 274 00:35:16,879.999 --> 00:35:36,120 So, you know, um, the expressions of our, our faith are everywhere and we should honor them and, and know that, uh, just because this might be a little different or Um, uh, or here and versus here that, um, we, we're, we have a lot of room for the expression of our faith.
(35:36):
.999And we should use the ones that are most comfortable to us, but also honor the fact that there are other reasons.
Expressions as well.
And that was one beautiful thing we had at Nho house.
Uh, the, uh, the, um, there was an, there's an annual meeting of, uh, seminarians at the various seminaries in the United States and they, they came, uh, the year they came to Nho was while I was there.
(36:04):
And, um, the expressions of these fellow seminarians from the 12 other seminaries.
It was amazing.
They, most of them said, we need to come here and learn a little bit more about churchmanship.
.3886667And they said, you're not as weird as everyone said you were. 283 00:36:21,363.3886667 --> 00:36:22,136.6773333 That's good. 284 00:36:22,136.6773333 --> 00:36:24,770 Not quite as weird as everyone said. 285 00:36:24,770.1 --> 00:36:28,170 And you know, so here we are at lunch in the seminary.
(36:28):
And I, I was laying hands on someone that expressed a need for prayer, and, uh, I couldn't anoint with oil because I was not an ordained clergy, uh, but, uh, uh, you know, and, and we had such a wonderful exchange, and, uh, with, uh, people from every one of the Episcopal seminaries, uh, during that time, and, and, um, we, we honored our, our, um, Jesus in each of us rather than thinking about the differences of our expression.
(36:57):
That's the important thing.
It was really a beautiful thing.
Hello, Diocese This is your weekly update for the third week of Epiphany 2025.
.999In this weekly update, I am grateful to share with you an introduction to the new rector of Grace Episcopal Church in Carlsbad, New Mexico, Father James Brzezinski.
That'll be coming up shortly.
But before that interview, I want to let you know that just this past weekend, the leadership of your diocese.
(00:38):
That means The Standing Committee of the Diocese, the Diocesan Council, and the Chancellors, along with the staff of the Diocese, had our annual Leadership Retreat, which we do every January.
It's the one time each year when we all get together in person.
The rest of our work since COVID has been done on Zoom, and that will continue to be the case.
(01:00):
We get together for one weekend every year in January to get to know each other and kind of plan the year and do some strategic thinking.
.999This year for the first time we gathered not at Bishop's Ridge or at the Cathedral, we gathered in the Big Bend at Fort Davis.
at a little ranch called Prude Ranch in Fort Davis, Texas.
(01:23):
And we were hosted by St.
Paul's Episcopal Church in Marfa, Texas.
As a part of the visit, we took an opportunity, as we talk about the future strategy of the diocese, we took the opportunity to do that in the context of the Big Bend, where we have five churches in a piece of land that is the size of the state of Connecticut.
(01:45):
And those five churches have now two priests who work to help look after those five congregations.
Mike Wallens and our curate, which is, who is funded largely through the diocesan budget, is in the Big Bend.
Katie Hudak is her name.
And we heard from them about how things are going, what life is like ministering in the rural parts of the diocese.
(02:11):
We also had an opportunity to tour the Blackwell School and to learn about this particular ways in which racism against people of brown skin who speak Spanish has unfolded in the state of Texas and in our diocese.
We also had an opportunity to meet with the Border Patrol in the Marfa sector and to talk with Border Patrol agents about the challenges they face and to learn some unpleasant truths or to dispel some notions that we might have had about the Border Patrol and their work.
(02:45):
As you know, our work with Rio Grande Borderland Ministries continues supporting those who are legally claiming asylum in the United States and also supporting the Border Patrol and pushing for comprehensive immigration reform.
Cause the one thing everybody can agree on is our current system is not working very well.
(03:05):
We also took the opportunity to go on Friday evening to look for the Marfa Lights at the Marfa Lights Viewing Center just outside of town of Marfa.
And we had planned to do a star party at the McDonnell Observatory there in Fort Davis, Texas.
But there was a pipe that burst and we weren't able to do that.
The feedback from everybody, many of the leaders of our diocese had never been to the Big Bend, but always wanted to go.
(03:30):
The feedback was that all of us want to go back and spend more time in Marfa, in Alpine, in Fort Davis, in Terlingua, in Fort Stockton, because it's such a beautiful part of the world and a beautiful part of our diocese.
I encourage you to go and check out the Big Ben, plan your next holiday to go there, drop in and hang out with one of our churches.
(03:53):
The Diocese of the Rio Grande is a vast and beautiful place, and I want you to get to know all of it.
I also want you to know that this coming week, January 20th to 26th, has been named by the Episcopal Church as Migration with Dignity Week.
(04:20):
Migration with Dignity is a concept that talks about making sure that everybody who is migrating be treated as a human being. 31 00:04:28,514.999 --> 00:04:33,635 Now that means if you're a criminal you're going to get arrested and you should do the time and be deported.
But it also means that if you are coming to the country legally for a variety of reasons.
And even if you're coming illegally, you should be treated humanely, no matter what.
(04:44):
And so if you're interested in learning some more about migration with dignity, check out the link below and it will help you learn some things like the fact that a refugee and an asylum seeker are not necessarily the same thing.
And the more we all learn about the border, the more we can help see the places in which it's broken and the places in which we can fix it.
(05:04):
I say this as someone who works regularly with both the Border Patrol and people who are migrating through as seeking asylum in the United States.
This is not a political effort.
This is a Christian effort to make sure that we are treating everybody with the dignity that God gave them when God created them. 39 00:05:22,639.999 --> 00:05:30,580 And now, I want you to meet Father James Brzezinski, the new rector of Grace Episcopal Church in Carlsbad, New Mexico.
(05:31):
.9Go visit him if you get a chance.
Hello there, Diocese of the Rio Grande.
I want to make sure you know the new rector of Grace Episcopal Church in Carlsbad, New Mexico, the Reverend James Brzezinski. 43 00:05:56,619.999 --> 00:05:57,290 Hello, Bishop.
(05:57):
Father James, it's so good to see you.
It's good to see you, and it's good to be back in the Diocese of the Rio Grande.
.02133333Yes, you're back! This is Yes, I am. 47 00:06:08,31.02133333 --> 00:06:25,425 I started my priestly ministry at Holy Faith, and um, in Santa Fe, uh, under, uh, Father, uh, Ken Seaman and enjoyed a two year cur curacy there and, uh, what an incredible parish and, uh, what an interesting place as well. 48 00:06:25,444.999 --> 00:06:41,160 Santa Fe, uh, had some, uh, different food that I hadn't experienced before that, uh, amongst other things and, uh, Um, really, really enjoyed that and learned a lot under Father Ken, um, and you went to Neshota House, is that right? I did.
(06:41):
I attended Neshota House. 50 00:06:42,909.999 --> 00:06:48,950 And how did you find Neshota from Florida? So yes, so I was in the Diocese of Central Florida. 51 00:06:48,965.1 --> 00:06:52,585 And he suggested four places.
He said Trinity School of Ministry, of which he was one of the founders, and then Neshoda House.
And he said, there's two others I'd recommend to you, and that was, uh, Wickliffe in Toronto, and he said, uh, there is an English school, and I, I suspect he was thinking of St.
(07:09):
Stephens, knowing my My background and um, uh, and I thought our daughter was going to uh, College the the same day that we were heading to nishoda house so we we dropped her off in birmingham and continued up to nishoda house and um after we got her settled and Uh, so we had visited trinity and we visited nishoda house and we loved both of them dearly and um, but we just felt there was the The, uh, residential aspect of Neshoda House had different, uh, uh, taste and feel than Trinity.
(07:48):
.999And so we thought, well, boy, we'd be fine at either one, but let's, let's go to Neshoda.
And so, uh, That's where we headed off.
And, uh, it has, uh, those of you that haven't been, there are a variety of seminaries in the Episcopal church.
.999They tend to have a history that has to do with what we used to call churchmanship back in the day, where there were high church places like Nishoda house.
(08:13):
And Seabury Western, and then there, and General Seminary.
And then there were low church places like Virginia Seminary.
Or Trinity, which was very evangelical.
.999Evangelical, right? And so back in the day, when I went to seminary, there was still talk about, you know, are you going to a high church place or a low church place? Which I should say, sometimes people misunderstand what that term is about. 63 00:08:36,294.999 --> 00:08:41,895 The high church does not mean more serious, and low church does not mean less serious.
(08:42):
It talks about, it's about your emphasis that you place on various theological Positions.
So would you like to describe it? You want me to, like, I'd love for people to really kind of know that part of the history of the Episcopal Church, because I don't know that people think about that anymore.
.999Well, Neshoda's, uh, particular view of churchmanship is that, uh, they live under a Benedictine rule, so we really understood.
(09:08):
It's very monastic when you go to, when you go to a place like that, right? Yes.
And there's a cloister, the chapel is gorgeous.
Yes, the chapel, of course, the whole chapel is choir.
So you're facing each other and you have assigned seating and you're expected to be there for the two daily services, uh, and, um, uh, the, uh, also vested, right? You'll be vested, uh, most, most of the time just in a cassock.
(09:35):
A lot of my fellow students wore their cassocks all the time.
.9And, uh, then those for solemn, uh, services, whether it be even song or Or, um, uh, mass, uh, we would, we'd be fully, fully robed with, uh, cassock and surplus surplus.
(09:57):
Cause they're all seminarians.
You're lay people at the time.
So for those of you, this is a good opportunity for me to explain choir dress, which is, as you said, in a Benedictine place and in lots of our churches, you'll see.
Up by the altar, there's the altar, and the acolytes hang out up there, and the clergy are often up there.
And then there's usually in between the nave, where the majority of the congregation sits, and the altar, there's what's called the choir.
(10:26):
.999And, and it was built for a choir. 79 00:10:28,369.999 --> 00:10:30,180 They often look at each other this way.
Our Cathedral of St.
John is shaped that way.
Many of our churches are shaped that way.
And so, you would be, um, in the choir.
And in the Anglican tradition, this is different from Presbyterians, it's different from Methodists, it's different from Roman Catholics.
We have a choir dress that is a cassock, a surplus, and then if you're a clergy person, you would wear what's called a tippet, which is the black stole.
(10:54):
It's not of the seasons.
.9It's there for morning prayer and evening prayer.
And it comes out of the, the cathedral office tradition in, in Anglicanism, where the, whether you were clergy or not, you would sit in the choir.
.999And so the only distinguishing feature, everybody was wearing the same thing, the cassock and the surplus.
(11:16):
And then the only distinguishing feature is that the clergy would wear the tippet and the bishop would wear a ratchet and Shamir But the important part of that is we're all in the choir together Yes vested in our baptismal garments because the white of the surplus is the as it says in the book of Revelation It'll be their garments are washed white as snow and and so we are sort of vested In preparation for and, and in acknowledgement of the fact that we are a part of the risen body of Christ.
(11:49):
Right now, and we're all vested.
I've sort of had fantasies that like we would have, um, cassocks and surplus for everybody.
.999So you come through the nave, put on your cassock and surplus, and that's kind of what the monastic tradition that they still observe at Neshoda House, they do. 94 00:12:07,369.999 --> 00:12:18,549.999 So instead of having sort of You know a big nave little choir and then clergy sort of up around the altar and the shoda house There's a huge choir and everybody joins in there's nowhere else.
(12:18):
I've been there's a very small Two rows of seats.
That's right and um Uh, and so, yes, so, part, part of the, uh, the life of Neshoda House is the worship, and so we had, uh, the daily offices every day, um, but on Thursday you would have, um, matins, sung matins, uh, in the morning.
(12:40):
And frequently it was solemn, um, meaning incense and, and, um, uh, bells.
Of course we use bells all the time.
Um, I'll talk about the bells in a second.
And then on Thursday evening would be the community high mass of the week.
And you usually, whatever saint happened to be that day or the major saint, uh, you would celebrate that at the mass.
(13:03):
We were not required to be at mass on Sunday morning.
Because we were expected to be in our field at church or another church doing work in the in the community and And so we we enjoyed a great spiritual life and Angle Catholic it did have we use lots of incense and I need to dig up a photograph I have during the week that I was serving and The smoke was over my head.
(13:31):
It just filled up, you know, the Shekinah glory kind of idea But these are part of the beautiful thing is, uh, uh, and all Episcopal churches do this, but we worship with all five of our senses.
So you've talked about the vestments and what things look like and how the church is laid out in the traditional monastic style.
(13:52):
Well, we, we worship with every sense of our body.
We can smell the incense.
We can hear God's Word.
We can sing God's praises.
We can, uh, see the colors of the, the, the liturgical colors that tell us what part of Christ's life we're, we're celebrating at that season.
And, um, Uh, so it is a wonderful place.
(14:14):
.999And of course, uh, you could call us an extremist place, I guess, uh, because we, we overdid all of those things and, and, um, yet those were outward visible signs of an inward spiritual grace.
.999And of course, uh, we, uh, Uh, rang the Angelus three times a day, which is a gotta explain that that's a mystery to many many Episcopalians Um, we do have We have a Marian focus and it's not about worshiping Mary, but it's about honoring the fact that she was the Theotokos The God bearer, the one who, who birthed our Savior, Jesus Christ, and so there's a practice of, uh, uh, prayers and ringing of bells that, uh, on, honor, um, uh, Mary, and, uh, during most of the year, it's called the Angelus.
(15:02):
Where, uh, there are beautiful prayers, uh, that go along with the ringing of the bells.
.999And our method was three, uh, three rings during each of the three Hail Marys.
And then we'd have, uh, it's supposed to be nine rings, but bells that are, uh, Uh, like Michael, a tooth.
We had a 2000 pound, uh, bell named Michael, and we would ring her, ring him.
(15:25):
And you cannot ring, uh, you have to ring 18 because there's always a second strike.
.999And so, um, Bishop may have even heard me ringing that today. 120 00:15:36,899.999 --> 00:15:38,770 We'll have to get some audio of you.
In fact, maybe you'll take us back.
Let's do that.
We'll go over there and you can show us how that, how the ambulance is working. 124 00:15:45,195.1 --> 00:15:45,645 I can do that.
(15:45):
.999But, um, church bells are meant to make the community aware of God's presence in the community.
And so that's why I like to ring the bells here because, uh, I want people to know that Christ is, is alive and that, uh, there are people at Grace Church.
that enjoy being in the presence of God and receiving his real presence.
(16:08):
And so wonderful.
Um, that might be apocryphal, not quite exactly historically accurate, but there's a wonderful phrase in some of George Herbert's writings that talk about how it is the responsibility of the priest in a country parish.
to ring the bells for morning prayer and evening prayer.
And he talks about how the farmers in the fields would stop and remove their hats for a time, a moment, at least of silent prayer, when they heard the bells ring and then they'd go back to their, to their plowing. 132 00:16:37,939.999 --> 00:16:44,410 And then when I moved to back to, to New Mexico, we have some wonderful icons of San Ysidro.
(16:44):
Who is always, you know, the story of San Ysidro, who is the farmer plowing and he couldn't get his work done Because he kept trying to pray and so God sent an angel to do the work. 134 00:16:54,644.999 --> 00:17:17,590 So there's these wonderful San Ysidro icons of San Ysidro praying in the fields while the angel is plowing and every time I hear that Angelus I bring together that sense of George Herbert's The church calls the community to prayer, not just the people in the building, and, and that no matter where you are when you hear those church bells.
(17:18):
You can take time to make the sign of the cross and and at least pray if you can't do the whole morning prayer You can at least stop for a moment to recognize God's presence in your life and God's presence in our world Yes, thank you for bringing to light a lot of things, you know We can pray without ceasing as Paul said and sometimes it might be just the moment When someone comes to your mind that has a special need that you can pray for them, or in this sense, the ringing of bells that stops you, uh, one of the first experiences you have at an Ashota house is, um, the bells ring at noontime, at the end of class.
(17:53):
And you look around campus and there's not a soul moving you see all of these people just standing still because that's what they're doing They're actually uh praying The angels we we didn't pray the angelus out loud with words because some people uh, It's not as meaningful to them. 137 00:18:10,279.999 --> 00:18:16,370 But uh, we we allowed for that flexibility But I do like saying the prayers.
(18:16):
.999They remind me of the Blessed Virgin Mary and the incarnation of, you know, the Word became flesh and dwelt among us. 139 00:18:24,499.999 --> 00:18:32,110 And so, so it's a wonderful sign of God's presence and of His incarnation and we like to do that.
There is a Regina Chaley that we do during the Easter season that's different.
(18:38):
.999So we, See, we have a wonderful liturgical year of which we can express what's going on in Christ's life and in our own lives with every aspect of our life.
And thank you for reminding me of Saint Isidro.
There's a beautiful museum in Santa Fe that has a lot of tablas of Saint Isidro.
(19:01):
uh, uh, wonderful, um, memory.
And it's, it's really nice the way we have different expressions of that.
And what a great example of how Christ comes to us in our lives where we are. 147 00:19:13,724.999 --> 00:19:19,994.999 We don't have to be perfected or be just made right or anything first that we can come to Christ.
.999Just as we are, whether we're a farmer or an oilman, uh, is in our area, uh, and, uh, and so, uh, thank you.
(19:29):
So, so life at Neshoda prepares us for bringing God to the community and, uh, with that monastic life, we, we, uh, followed the Benedictine rule of, uh, um, prayer, study, and work.
And so even part of, uh, my week included at assigned time, where we had to do physical labor for the seminary with no renumeration.
(19:53):
You know, we did have opportunities to, to work in different things.
.9995I was a choral scholar, so I got a little extra tuition, uh, covered by, by singing, uh, in, in chapel. 153 00:20:03,754.9995 --> 00:20:07,205 And kind of work study, like people would understand in other places. 154 00:20:07,304.999 --> 00:20:08,444.999 Yes, exactly. 155 00:20:08,454.999 --> 00:20:13,404.999 But the, the, the work that I was talking about on Wednesdays was the day at my time.
(20:13):
We had to either be mowing the lawn or cleaning up sticks and stones or, or in my case, it was, uh, cleaning the library and, and we had to clean the library from all three floors. 157 00:20:26,494.999 --> 00:20:31,514.9995 It included dusting, uh, books that included one time they wanted to move a section. 158 00:20:31,514.9995 --> 00:20:37,035 So, uh, during the summer, I actually, for a few weeks, I'd moved books, uh, from one location to another.
(20:37):
But, uh, we also had to clean the, the restrooms.
And so, uh, I became a professional, uh, cleaner during that because no one else wanted to do that preparation for parish ministry and they, uh, yes, uh, plumbing and electricity all come into play in the ministry of the clergy. 161 00:20:56,464.999 --> 00:20:59,295 And, um, and so we took this very seriously.
(20:59):
Um, you know, we did do work.
Um, I spend an awful lot of time at the Corpus Christi's chapel.
Uh, in the Blessed Sacrament, um, just, uh, praying and inter, you know, interceding for myself.
.9Help me, Lord! Yes, Lord, please help! Come quickly to help us! That's my most eloquent prayer, and I, I cannot tell you how many times I just cried out to God, Help! I have a Hebrew test tomorrow! Right, right, right.
(21:27):
But um, so and I don't I'll mention a lighter thing.
.999Um, You you alluded to life is fun and seminary is challenging but uh I cannot tell you some of the pranks that we played with each other around that are But i'll mention one our first greek exam we get there and we're all really really worried about this exam And then this procession comes into the classroom and there are people dressed up with miters and with uh, One guy, fella had a set of rosary beads that was six feet long, you know when they glowed in the dark and there were like four or five thuribles just smoking away and They're, they're taking up all this time and joking around and we're, we're like, you know, when are we going to take this exam? And, uh, so that was one of the funny traditions.
(22:21):
The first Greek exam, uh, the, uh, upper classes would come and harass the, uh, people taking the test and.
Uh, the joy was the next year you got to do that for somebody else.
Right, right.
So you see there the joy of the lord is our strength and we we even Involved had some of that at seminary as well.
(22:45):
Absolutely and so when we talk about high church and you're doing a wonderful job of Like helping people see and feel and understand what it usually means is there's a high doctrine of the nature of church, which is to say, uh, a strong emphasis on that, that the church is the body of Christ active in the world.
(23:07):
as it is, through its structures, through its buildings, through its clergy.
A high doctrine of the priesthood usually goes along with this.
High doctrine of the Eucharist, that it is the body and blood of Jesus Christ, and that is revered both by keeping it in the ombre with a candle and a light on. 176 00:23:24,679.999 --> 00:23:34,470 If you go into your church and there's a red light up there by the altar, what that means That the presence, uh, that the body and blood of Jesus Christ are being kept in what's called an ombry.
(23:34):
.999It's a little box with a little lock and key on it. 178 00:23:37,809.999 --> 00:23:45,560 And the light is on to remind everyone that the presence of Jesus Christ is there in real form in the body and blood of Jesus.
There all the time so you can come in and pray in the presence of Jesus Christ.
That's correct There's consecrated bread and wine as well as some often the oil holy oils are also in the OMRI and and so we as lovers lovers of Jesus can can feel that we have the presence of Christ and of course the Eucharist isn't available to us every time we come into the church and so one of the The high church things that we we reverence the the real presence of christ and and that's why I like to go there I could go to the joseph altar or the merry altar, but I like the real presence and so I always would light a candle and and intercede for for my loved ones as well as uh, Pray for myself and um, and actually that's why if you see people come into a church and they bow They're not bowing to the altar They're bowing to the presence of Christ who is really present there.
(24:47):
And so I, you'll, if, when I come in, for example, to the cathedral, if I come in, you'll see, I bow, but, and it may look like I'm bowing to the altar, but I'm always looking at.
Where the ombre is so it's so that the emphasis there is about Jesus Christ God's self is actually present in the midst of the church, which is which is different from the way our Tradition in the Episcopal Church is so broad that there are others who would say no If we want to find the presence of Christ, we're gonna look in the Bible And they might call themselves more low church where all this stuff you're doing with the incense and these vestments you like to wear And all the bowing and scraping and all of that stuff. 183 00:25:30,984.999 --> 00:25:44,355 We don't want to do any of that What we want to do is focus on the emphasis of the word And that has a low what we would call a lower doctrine of priesthood Often the the person who is low church who is an ordained priest might call themselves.
(25:44):
Mr Or ms instead of father or mother they might never wear a collar Cause they're deemphasizing the distinctiveness of the priesthood.
So it's, it's, we would say it's a lower doctrine of priesthood, a lower doctrine of church, less emphasis on the, the sort of glorious or magnified, um, architecture.
(26:05):
Etc.
So we have all of that in the Episcopal Church and and it's fun getting to talk to you because you can explore with Us the high church piece and we can learn about that and I'll find some low church folks in the diocese too So we'll have another follow up.
Yes That's a great segue into I want to make sure that people understand you mentioned bowing and scraping and and I crossed myself incessantly at the, the Gloria Patri and, um, uh, and I, I do even bow at the Gloria Patri in the name of Jesus.
(26:37):
Um, um, and I, my Beretta hasn't come out, uh, yet, uh, at Grace Church, but, uh, I do have a a symbol of my priesthood, uh, that I like to wear, um, but, um, high church, it's not just the symbolism and the ritual.
That is important because they are outward signs of an inward spiritual grace.
(26:59):
But during the Oxford movement, When these, the, there was this little tension between the reformers and the, and the, and the Angle, the Angle Catholic expression of the faith, the Oxford movement and the Tractarians, their real main thing was to bring the, the worship to the people.
(27:19):
Yes.
.999And also.
the ministry to the people.
There were more churches formed to help the poor and the destitute and the orphans, um, during the Oxford movement than almost any other time. 196 00:27:32,369.999 --> 00:27:33,880 And there was a real sense of that.
We build churches to go, we built them in places where the poor are.
We go to the people with the glory of God.
(27:41):
.999And so some of the, some of the grandeur of the church, the music, the vestments, the incense was to remind people who do not experience that kind of luxury all the time that they are worth that.
And even though the world might say, well, you get to live on skid row and you don't get to live on fifth Avenue.
(28:02):
The church is going to bring the magnificent glory of God.
.9995To the people there, you may not be afford afford to go to the symphony, but your church choir is going to praise the glory of God with everything. 203 00:28:14,244.9995 --> 00:28:14,795 It's God.
.999And it was, it was, it's really helpful for people not to think like, Oh, so high church thing is a rich church thing.
.9995Not at all. 206 00:28:21,284.9995 --> 00:28:22,674.999 In fact, just the opposite.
(28:23):
The priest wears what is the habit, right? Which is the cassock or we, you and I are in our habits today.
The black suit is the.
Is the habit which is the same simple garment every day.
That's not my particular personal style choice It is a sign to the world that the church is here for you and that you can talk to me And that I want to bring the message of jesus christ to you so that That's, thank you for, for emphasizing that.
(28:52):
And you've, you've mentioned something that, that connected me with the Oxford movement.
I do wear my clericals in order to be an icon of Christ to the world.
.999And large portion of my ministry is in the grocery store and on the street and wherever I go.
People will come up and I'm, I'm hoping it's my smile too, but uh, It's usually the the clothing and they say hi father and I say how's how's your day today? What was your closest moment to christ today? That's a great question, you know from our curio experiences We we ask that question.
(29:27):
So I use that a lot and people will Will say I need you to pray for me and right in the aisle in the grocery store.
Um, I I uh, And so that's the oxford movement you go to the people and you bring christ to the people Um, and so it's it is a lifestyle Um, I grew up in a broad church a low church And yet I remember Um, in my upbringing, the, the, the church was a refuse from the storm of my challenging childhood.
(29:57):
We had family situations and stuff, and, and I, we were involved in the church.
I was super involved in the church, but there were times when I just went to be away from the turmoil of home, and I would cry out to God in that most eloquent prayer, like, Help dad, help mom, help me, you know, and um, and so it was great to have a beautiful place, a quiet place, a peaceful space, place where the Spirit of God dwelled and to go and to, to offer up to God myself and, and the challenges of my life.
(30:34):
And so that, that I think is the spirit that you're talking about, that uh, yeah.
Christ's love is available to all people and we just want to have opportunities and so I do like wearing my clericals Uh, I always joke.
.999It's real easy.
I can get dressed in the dark, you know, I don't have to figure out But but also it's I'm available to people to You know question me or ask for prayer and people do respond to to my clothing, you know Yeah, oh that, that just, people may not care about this, but um, that's why I still wear black.
(31:14):
Two reasons.
And, and it's not, some people are like, oh, you're being humble.
It's not about humble.
It's about the black shirt with the clergy collar is for the last few centuries what, what clergy have worn, regardless of whether they were high church or low church. 227 00:31:32,649.999 --> 00:31:33,610 This is kind of a uniform. 228 00:31:33,979.999 --> 00:31:37,959.999 So it's sort of like you expect to see a police officer in the uniform.
(31:38):
This is, this is that uniform.
And if you, and it's the traditional thing as well.
The thing that signifies a bishop is the pectoral cross.
Not the color of the shirt.
The purple shirt came in in the late 60s or early 70s when, um, there was a bishop in London, I believe, who Thought his shirt should match his cassock.
(31:58):
Cause he had, he was in the cathedral and he had a purple cassock.
Cause the cathedral is the color purple, not the bishop.
The cathedral is the color. 237 00:32:06,69.999 --> 00:32:09,99.999 And so, he was like, I want to get a shirt to match my cassock.
So, so he wore a purple shirt. 239 00:32:10,859.999 --> 00:32:12,119.999 And then there was a Lambeth conference.
All the bishops from all the world came and they saw this bishop in a purple shirt and they went.
Ooh, I like that.
And they all went to Whipple's, the famous clerical outfitter in London, and they all bought purple shirts.
(32:23):
And now everybody thinks the symbol of a bishop is the color purple, but that's, that's a very recent thing.
So that's part of the reason why I, is that I, I like that our traditions in the church and I try to understand those traditions and then embody them in contemporary ways.
Um, so I'm wearing my black suit, but I'm wearing my cowboy boots too.
So there's a little bit, a little modern mixed in there. 247 00:32:46,65.1 --> 00:32:48,625 And so I have some purple shirts.
(32:49):
The first week that I was bishop in the Rio Grande, I wore the purple shirt. 249 00:32:53,45.1 --> 00:33:12,635 I stopped wearing the purple shirt because, during that week, multiple people came up to me, on the street, and what they said was, Father, you're so stylish and fashionable, I like that purple shirt, that's really cool! Or, They said, they let you wear your own colors of purple.
(33:12):
Wow, that's really cool.
.999So when someone approached me like that and asked me if I was either fashionable or, you know, they let me wear, I had really two options.
One was to say, thank you, I'm a very stylish person, that's fabulous.
Or to say, actually, I'm a bishop.
Which, neither of which, both of which would have stopped the conversation cold.
(33:35):
When I switched back to wearing the black shirt, now people stop me on the street and they say, Father, will you pray for me? And that's the conversation I want to have with people. 256 00:33:44,514.999 --> 00:33:45,295 Not the other.
It's not about fashion. 258 00:33:46,544.999 --> 00:33:49,465 More, more, more of Jesus and less of me.
Exactly! Which is the whole point of all this get up, really, is more of Jesus, less of me.
And so I will occasionally wear a purple shirt, like, if I'm at a bishop's consecration in another diocese.
(34:01):
Just because on that day, everybody knows what the purple is.
And it's sometimes helpful for the altar guild, because they send the bishops in one direction to get us all corralled in one room.
.999But most of the time, I wear the black, because it's the more traditional choice. 264 00:34:17,174.999 --> 00:34:24,765 But it's also the choice, more importantly, that invites people to ask me to pray with them and do this for them, rather than otherwise.
(34:25):
.5695652And some who are Really knowledgeable church people recognize that I'm a bishop because I'm wearing a temple cross, but, but it's the black shirt that is the key. 266 00:34:34,27.5695652 --> 00:34:40,555 So that's why, that's why I have a preference for clergy wear black, not lots of different colors.
.999Now I know that there are clergy in the diocese, don't think I'm cracking on you all. 268 00:34:44,814.999 --> 00:34:47,990 Clergy do wear different, um, Uh, colored shirts.
(34:48):
That is a matter of personal choice, and it is about how each of us embodies the priesthood, and people do it in different ways.
So we all make our different choices, but I'm grateful to hear about your choices and the background of, of the theology behind it. 271 00:35:02,220.1 --> 00:35:02,819.9 Yes.
And, um, and so, yes, I, I grew up in a broad church and my Anglo Catholicism came a lot later.
(35:12):
.999Um, but even it did come in an, uh, in an evangelical diocese. 274 00:35:16,879.999 --> 00:35:36,120 So, you know, um, the expressions of our, our faith are everywhere and we should honor them and, and know that, uh, just because this might be a little different or Um, uh, or here and versus here that, um, we, we're, we have a lot of room for the expression of our faith.
(35:36):
.999And we should use the ones that are most comfortable to us, but also honor the fact that there are other reasons.
Expressions as well.
And that was one beautiful thing we had at Nho house.
Uh, the, uh, the, um, there was an, there's an annual meeting of, uh, seminarians at the various seminaries in the United States and they, they came, uh, the year they came to Nho was while I was there.
(36:04):
And, um, the expressions of these fellow seminarians from the 12 other seminaries.
It was amazing.
They, most of them said, we need to come here and learn a little bit more about churchmanship.
.3886667And they said, you're not as weird as everyone said you were. 283 00:36:21,363.3886667 --> 00:36:22,136.6773333 That's good. 284 00:36:22,136.6773333 --> 00:36:24,770 Not quite as weird as everyone said. 285 00:36:24,770.1 --> 00:36:28,170 And you know, so here we are at lunch in the seminary.
(36:28):
And I, I was laying hands on someone that expressed a need for prayer, and, uh, I couldn't anoint with oil because I was not an ordained clergy, uh, but, uh, uh, you know, and, and we had such a wonderful exchange, and, uh, with, uh, people from every one of the Episcopal seminaries, uh, during that time, and, and, um, we, we honored our, our, um, Jesus in each of us rather than thinking about the differences of our expression.
(36:57):
That's the important thing.
It was really a beautiful thing.
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