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June 18, 2025 56 mins

In his new book, Why Religion Went Obsolete, sociologist Christian Smith argues that religion is not just declining; it is increasingly seen as unnecessary. People can be good without God. Religion does not play a positive role in the world. So, what is the future for the church? In this interview, Cole talks with Christian Smith about the data, the rise of the spiritual but not religious, and what the future might hold for the church. 

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