February 9, 2024 • 46 mins
For the 40th episode, Dan, Suzana, and Flavio return to Atlanta, Georgia, to celebrate seven years of Spiritist Conversations. After a trip down memory lane, they engage in a timely conversation about war- of all kinds- with guest Edward Christie from New York.
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Episode Transcript
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Dan Assisi (00:00):
Welcome to Spiritist Conversations number 40.
I think that's the number, right?
We believe so.
We believe so.
A show where we sit down withfriends, literally today, to talk
about the world through an informal,unscripted, and unplugged way.
(00:20):
And I am Dan, we have Flavio, wehave Susanna, and we have our friend
Edward here today, and we're goingto introduce him in a little bit.
But before we do that, we justwant to go back a little bit to
our origin story because today, asyou can see, if you're watching us.
We are winging this as we oftendo, but why are we doing that?
Flavio Zanetti (00:42):
I was going to say, what changed?
So we always do it.
So, but the reason why we're doing thisis here is because we are from, we are
in Atlanta, Georgia right now, whereeverything started exactly seven years
ago, the whole universe started sevenyears ago, our universe, our universe, or
the universe of spiritist conversationsstarted here in Atlanta, Georgia.
(01:07):
Seven years ago,
Suzana Simões (01:09):
what do we remember from that day?
Flavio Zanetti (01:12):
We were in a much better place than this.
. We had a table.
That is true.
We had chairs, Uhhuh, anduh, now we're just winging it
Dan Assisi (01:20):
Today.
We don't have chairs or tables.
We're couches.
Flavio Zanetti (01:22):
Just couches and the chair for friend Edward.
And, uh, here we are, walk into
Suzana Simões (01:26):
that room and start talking about something.
Flavio Zanetti (01:29):
Let's talk about Spiritism and then all of a sudden.
Why don't we make
Dan Assisi (01:32):
this a podcast?
Daniel Acosta,
Suzana Simões (01:36):
you guys.
There was no podcastat the time, I'm sorry.
Why don't we make it into a conversation?
A conversation, yeah.
Podcast
Flavio Zanetti (01:42):
was just starting back then, I think.
Dan Assisi (01:44):
No, I don't think so.
And the reason why was becauseWhenever we met at different
conferences, we would end up chattingafterwards and have so much fun.
So, I decided to buy a microphone,which I had never really used before.
We brought it, took it in the computer.
We recorded our first episodebecause you guys couldn't run
away from that room, I think.
(02:05):
I think I kind of likelocked us in or something.
You guys were so nice about it.
And I also remember this.
We recorded a whole hour of the thing.
Only to find out that itdid not record, so we had
Flavio Zanetti (02:16):
to do everything again.
Again.
That I remember.
That you remember?
That I remember, yes.
You
Dan Assisi (02:21):
remembered every word, I'm sure.
If you ever listen to episode number one,um, just let you know that the first pass
was way better than the second pass thatwe did, which you all need to listen.
Flavio Zanetti (02:32):
Amateurs.
I can't believe that.
But
Dan Assisi (02:34):
what I think is really exciting and I'm thankful for, Um,
obviously I'm very thankful to making newfriends along the way like Edward today.
We're going to introduce him in a littlebit, but I'm also very thankful to
Flavia and Susanna who have agreed toembark on this crazy journey when we do
this podcast that became later video.
Um, and it has had over 40, 000 plays.
(02:57):
At this point in time,which is pretty cool.
Almost 50, 000.
Yeah.
Yeah, I think so.
You know, I got to look at the numbers,but, um, clearly you can do that.
You can see that we don't do agreat job of promoting this thing
or keeping track of how far weget, but we do have tons of fun.
And so thank you, Flavia andSusanna for, for agreeing to, to
learn with me, to teach me, toshare your perspectives on things.
(03:21):
And it's been seven years.
It's kind of crazy.
Suzana Simões (03:24):
Unbelievable, right?
I would never, I think.
Pot that would go that far.
No.
That we would keep doing for so many yearsand thank you for buying the microphone.
You know it's funny
Dan Assisi (03:36):
enough.
It made it all possible.
Yeah, and you know had I known Iwould have borrowed one of Flavio's
microphones because I think he hadthe same microphone that I Bought.
Yeah, right.
Yeti,
Flavio Zanetti (03:44):
right?
It was a Yeti.
Yeah, I think it was one of those.
But,
Dan Assisi (03:47):
uh, but anyways the the premise has not changed and the idea
is we sit down with friends really Inan unplugged way with no pre conceived
like speech or talk or points.
And we just share with each other ourperspectives on a particular topic.
Flavio Zanetti (04:08):
It's almost like having a conversation at a, you know, at a
restaurant or running each other downthe middle of the street, grab a cup
of coffee and then end up talking,
Dan Assisi (04:15):
right?
Yeah, Spiritist Conversations becauseI don't know if you remember this.
No.
But people would sometimes afterour sessions come back and say, Hey.
Like, you know, from the audience, are youguys going to have the conversation again?
Right.
And so we're like, hold on a second.
If they're asking where we're going tobe, like, you know, maybe we record this.
Maybe there's more people whoactually want to listen to it.
(04:35):
Right.
And we were very original with our name.
As you can tell the marketingdepartment really was.
You know, I work.
M.
I.
A.
Flavio Zanetti (04:43):
Spiritist Conversation.
Marketing department do not exist.
Still doesn't exist, by the way.
You had a low budget.
Dan Assisi (04:49):
As you can see, if you're watching us, very low
budget, but we know that's notwhat matters at the end of the day.
It's really the opportunity to betogether and engage with topics that could
benefit from a spiritual perspective.
And
Flavio Zanetti (05:03):
along the way, make new friends.
Speaking of new friends, Edgar Christie.
Hello, welcome, welcometo, welcome to our family.
Dan Assisi (05:12):
And we are here in Atlanta again for another conference.
And today I had the pleasure of hearingSusana and Flavio and Edward speak.
And by the way, um, he's going toshare that with you, but Edward is also
fantastic piano player and musician.
Um, and we had a lovely time and reallyharkened back to the beginning, but
Edward, tell us a little bit aboutyourself and your background for folks
(05:34):
who are watching and, or listening to us.
Well,
Edward Christie (05:38):
how far do you want me to go back?
Flavio Zanetti (05:41):
Holy!
Since you were born.
Dan Assisi (05:43):
Since you were born.
Suzana Simões (05:44):
Um,
Edward Christie (05:47):
well I met Sonya, my wife.
She was the one whointroduced me to Spiritism.
And I really took to it.
And so we've been studying together from,well we've been married 26 years now.
It's more like, uh, 28 yearsthat I've been studying with her.
And, uh, yeah, and we were luckyto find an English language
(06:10):
spiritist center in New York.
And there are a number of them,actually, now, so that, that's,
that's been a great thing.
Uh, there, and, and in New York,there, there are actually a number
of them that are exclusivelyEnglish ling, English speaking.
which is really nice.
There's a lot of outreach there and,uh, people are really dedicated.
(06:34):
I, I, I, I really, all I can sayis I really took to the whole
idea of Spiritism and it's a topicof conversation in our house.
We, we open up the books, wefind things to talk about, uh,
over breakfast coffee and things.
So it, it, we keep it alivevery, very much in the house.
Suzana Simões (06:56):
Wonderful.
Which group do you, uh, are you part of
Dan Assisi (06:59):
in New York?
Um,
Edward Christie (07:01):
right now I'm a part of IESS, the Inner
Enlightenment Spiritist Society.
Mm hmm.
And, um, yeah, we, we run theJoana de Angelis study, which
is a weekly study that we do.
There, so right now we're studyingthe psychology of gratitude book.
Fantastic.
Yeah.
It's a wonderful book.
(07:21):
We've gone through the existentialconflicts Uh, and, and what was, I
was trying to remember the other one.
It's so long ago
Dan Assisi (07:30):
now.
Yeah, and the spirit Durana Jandilis, is an incredible spirit who
has a wonderful books and teachingsgenerally centered around psychology.
Right.
Eventually we have in our, in our planto do an episode on her so that folks can
have some context, but Um, it's really
Edward Christie (07:47):
deep work.
Yes, and especially thepsychology of gratitude.
There's, we, we had to learn a lotabout Carl Jung and all of his ideas
in order to, to really understand.
Of course, we're all amateurs at it,which is good because the pressure
isn't on, um, for us to learn.
So we all learn together.
(08:07):
And yeah, it's, it's been, it'sbeen fun for that reason, fun,
maybe that was the wrong word.
Rewarding.
Rewarding, I think.
Dan Assisi (08:19):
And thanks for joining us because we might need a little bit of
that psychological insight to make senseof these difficult times that we live in.
Um, we were chatting beforehand,what should we talk about today?
And I think episode 40.
is about war because we knowthat we have these challenges
(08:39):
going on around the globe.
Just a couple of days ago, we alsohave the situation with Hamas in the
Gaza Strip and Israel and everybodyis really concerned about that on
top of Ukraine and all the differentthings that are happening in Africa.
So, You know, we figured that we couldprobably name this, we'll figure it out.
But maybe we named this one, warwas what, why, what is it good for?
(09:04):
Absolutely nothing.
Do we even need it?
Do we even need it, right?
So we maybe want to talk a littlebit about, hey, What's this war
stuff, why are we singing now,and how do we navigate that stuff?
Anybody want to jump in?
Does that sound good to you?
Flavio Zanetti (09:22):
Sounds good.
Sounds alright.
I, no, please go ahead.
No, one
Edward Christie (09:28):
of the things that, uh, that surprised me as I was reading was the
idea that, um, well, in this case it wasIsrael wanting to totally destroy Hamas,
which, uh, and I thought, how do you?
Destroy an idea.
I mean, you're destroying peoplehoping that no one will be around
(09:51):
that has those ideas anymore.
And you see this, you sawthis after 9 11 was the same.
Um, you see these same ideasrepeating, and, you know, you
can't kill an idea, really.
It just gets passed from one generationto another, and, so there's a lot of
stuff we talk about Joan of Angelus.
(10:11):
There's a lot in the collectiveshadow that people are working out.
Um, certainly that, that areaof the world has been under
conflict for centuries, for ages.
Thousands of years.
And there's somethingbeing worked out there.
Uh, whatever, well, we could speculateon what that is, but there is
(10:32):
definitely something being workedout there and, and the idea of just
destroying and hoping that that'sgoing to solve the problem doesn't
seem, it seems to be misguided to me.
Suzana Simões (10:42):
Short sighted to say
Dan Assisi (10:44):
the least.
Right.
It's what we've been doing forever, right?
As a, as a humanity.
I mean, the trick now is that you havea state fighting a non state, right?
So, you know, Hamas is not even a country.
So it becomes really persnickety,this idea that you can win the
(11:04):
war against somebody who is noteven officially recognized as a
government state piece, right?
So but I think my point is, war evolvesand no matter what we throw at it,
it still comes back because there'ssomething else that's being worked
out that we haven't quite figured out.
(11:26):
And it seems like these are momentswhere things are bubbling up everywhere.
Flavio Zanetti (11:33):
Yeah, but I think if, if you look at, it's, it's, I, do you
guys think that we'll ever be ableto understand what goes on in, for
example, in that conflict, in thatlocation, that part of the world?
Or even between Russia and Ukraineand we're so far removed from that,
but all of a sudden if you look ateverybody, all of a sudden everybody
(11:53):
became war, you know, experts or Ukraineexperts or Russia experts or, you know,
why are we doing this as a society?
Why
Suzana Simões (12:04):
is that happening?
Yeah.
And I think, I think to your point, uh,Flavio, we, we, you know, as a spiritist.
Um, because, okay, we're talkingabout these more recent wars,
but war has been going on, right?
So I don't think our intent today isto narrow, zoom in into a war, but
I think it's to recognize that theworld has been in a state of war.
(12:30):
There are many wars going on,sometimes wars that don't get as much.
Uh, time on TV and I think recognize thatthe way we receive the news is always one
narrow bias, bias, um, approach to things.
(12:53):
And we have jumped into conclusions.
And as you said, become experts andgiving sentences and making judgments.
And in ways, as we do that with the warand with anything and everything, the
realization that we are not necessarilyhelping to change the state of things.
(13:18):
Because every time that you are biasedtowards one side or another, I think
you lose sight of empathy and seeing.
Everyone as human beings
Flavio Zanetti (13:33):
use a very strong and important words.
Susanna empathy, empathy only worksif it's present on both sides, you
cannot, you cannot be empatheticonly with one part of the world.
We have to be empatheticwith the entire world.
How do we do that as spiritists?
Dan Assisi (13:48):
How do we get there?
And I think there's alsoa distinction, right?
I think that we can still saythat specific actions, whatever
they are, because we're nottalking about specific actions.
They might be perhaps not asright or wrong and others, right?
I have two kids, for instance.
I love both the same and sometimes oneof them beats the other one up, right?
Or does something and that's wrong, butdoesn't mean that I am going to just focus
(14:11):
on that action and say that's a bad kid.
I think that what I really like aboutwhat you're saying, Susana, is sure that
regardless of who started it, or who's atfault for that particular reason, there
is an underlying tension and challengesthat we have not been able to resolve.
And whether you call that arroganceor, you know, whatever it is that
(14:32):
you want to do, you should say like,we're going to go physical on this
thing because I am not going to yield.
I'm right.
You're wrong.
And I'm just going to go over you becausethey're more powerful than you are.
That's a very human thing, right?
And we're going to let our fighting dothe talking because we cannot agree.
Or I think just, or maybe I just simplythink that I don't even want to talk
(14:52):
to you because I think I'm stronger.
I'm just going to pummel you and do it.
Right.
But that behavior is, I thinkis the challenging piece, right?
Because Earlier today, we were havinga conversation as well, and we were
equating, and I think maybe we can pickthat up, is that that kind of thinking
that we see out in the world, and wethink it's like Ukraine and Russia and
(15:15):
Palestine and Israel, yes, that too, butthat also happens in our homes, right?
That also happens in ourstreets and our neighbors.
. So we have this inability to figurethings out that escalates, right?
Either to a fist fight in yourneighborhood or, you know, slaps
in your house or, or, or hurtfulwords in your house to missiles
(15:38):
and airplanes in countries and, andthat is the difficult piece, right?
Sometimes that we don't seethat we are, we're feeding.
This kind of thought process on that.
We need to change that.
Flavio Zanetti (15:50):
How do we change that?
What's the mechanism that's going toallow us to change that common thought?
I have.
I have an idea.
Go on.
Imagine.
Imagine he has an
Dan Assisi (16:00):
idea for once.
He's going to start playingdevil's advocate all the time
Flavio Zanetti (16:05):
asking questions.
If you follow us, you're goingto see that I always play devil's
advocate in some of the comments.
But now let me just throw my first idea.
And if you
Dan Assisi (16:13):
don't follow
Flavio Zanetti (16:13):
us, why not?
Exactly.
You're missing out.
You're totally missing out.
Hit that subscribe button on
Dan Assisi (16:18):
YouTube.
Um, do the podcasting on whatever podcast.
Flavio Zanetti (16:21):
Subscribe to whatever podcast tool that you use.
SoundCloud, we're available inevery single, you know, form.
What I was going to say is,thanks to Spiritism, we have
knowledge about reincarnation.
So, everything that we doThere's a consequence, correct?
Who would be, without making anypredictions, if those actions
(16:46):
are causing harm on others, we'reresponsible for those actions.
How are we going to fix thoseactions, or repent and correct
those actions in the future?
So it's very likely that in this life,I'm born in one location of the world,
In the next life, I may be born in adifferent place or different part of the
world, but imagine if I am in conflict orI was in conflict with that part of the
(17:09):
world, then I'll be born in the next life.
Dan Assisi (17:13):
And regardless of whether you're born, right?
The whole thing of like, you started it.
It's not an argument, right?
It's a very juvenile thing.
Well, I beat Susanna up,but she started it, right?
Like, at what point doesthis also stop, right?
Who's going to be the adult in the roomand say, yeah, what you did wasn't great?
But I'm not going tocome back and pummel you.
(17:35):
And I think that this is very, youknow, I want folks to hear that I get
that is very hard for us to understandthat at a national level, right?
Because there's pride andthere is fear, safety, and all
those things coming to place.
But at some point in time,as a, as a race, right?
(17:55):
As humanity, we've got to figure it out.
For me, Flavio, I agree with you.
I think that reincarnation isthe thing that at least helps me.
Like figure things out a little bit,because if we don't solve this now, we're
going to have to come back and do exactly,and I think I got a hunch that we've been
doing this for a couple of centuries,
Flavio Zanetti (18:15):
right?
So one part, we're in this partof the, uh, the, the conflict.
Another part, we're in that partof the conflict or in this life
from here, that life from there.
So why do I make sense of it?
How do I make
Suzana Simões (18:27):
sense of it?
So we have to, um, and this is a, anincredible opportunity for us to, for
us who consider ourselves Christians,right, to ask what is it that we
have learned from the gospel, fromthe way Jesus, um, act while he was,
(18:51):
uh, with us that we can take homeand we can, uh, put into practice.
So, it's just very incredible andchallenging that he came to take
love to another level when heinvited us to love our enemies.
(19:12):
And the gospel is very clear becauseit says, it doesn't mean you're going
to bring the enemy into your house, butit means that you are not going, you're
going to refrain yourself from harmingthe enemy, from retaliation, and so
how can we point fingers and blame andaccuse governments and countries when,
(19:40):
going back to what Dan said, right?
In our own homes, in our daily lives.
We continue to embrace the law, theold law of an eye for an eye, right?
So it is exactly, we are being invitedto be so disgusted by the, the current
(20:02):
situation that it's almost like the,the life is telling us, Hey, can you
realize that this way of living wherewe are nurturing and feeding hate?
We'll just lead to thedestruction of everyone.
It's not bringing any good.
(20:24):
So we are actually invited to, to growup, to leave those teenager's years
and to understand that we need, at somepoint, one sign needs to rise above,
needs to introduce something different.
We are invited to be the, the, theend of this vicious cycle of hatred of
(20:47):
retaliation of an eye for an eye and thisinvitation has been over there for us
for over 2000 years and again I think weneed to take individual responsibility
for what is happening in the world.
See, the thing is that it's not aPalestinian or Israeli or Russian or
Ukrainian, it's everyone's problem,it's everyone's business and we need
(21:12):
to take personal responsibility forwhat is happening by trying You know,
making a difference in our day-to-Day
Dan Assisi (21:20):
lives.
Yes.
Because we seem to forget this.
He's enlightened right now.
Yes.
I'm getting the light.
You feeling?
Are you praying it over there?
I'm getting the light.
Got it.
Flavio Zanetti (21:27):
The uh, yes, I feel it.
Dan Assisi (21:29):
I can feel it.
Yeah.
I'm gonna set you up.
It's coming
Flavio Zanetti (21:31):
down.
Set you up for a second.
It's coming, but now, now I'm gonnaplay my role that I play all the
Dan Assisi (21:35):
time.
Yes.
But hold on before youdo that really quick.
Alright, go ahead.
He was gonna say something,say, I wanna say yes to all she
said, and I think the point is.
We fantasize this idea thatcountries fight countries, right?
But it's really people.
Yeah.
Yeah, right?
It's somebody with a certain mentalityand a mindset that came to power within
that country or a group of people and theyhave carried out their personal of Dealing
(22:02):
with the world into the national leveland because they have that platform they
took that action so I think that we feellike these are complex things, but it's
people deciding to have wars and On behalfof their countries with other people.
So if we can work on people and I, I'mgoing to be a little bit jaded here and
say, you know, the people who are in powerright now, we're not fixing those people.
(22:24):
It's not going to happen,but can we work on our kids?
Can we work on ourselves so thatwe know how to deal with conflict?
We are more accepting so that wecan figure our stuff out before
we get into levels of power.
Right?
Where we are justrepeating the cycle that we
Flavio Zanetti (22:41):
see now.
I think even before dealing withconflict, I think what we can do as
parents is teaching our kids to lookat the differences, embrace those
differences, and not look at thosedifferences from a many cases, you
know, a perspective that if it's notlike me, therefore it must be wrong.
Because there's so much, so manydifferences out there in the world.
(23:02):
That if we embrace inclusion since earlyages, there's so many pictures I've seen.
One that really touched me a lotwas a picture of two kids, two
boys, one Palestinian, one Israeli.
You can see from theirheads, hugging each other.
Their backs, you can only see their backs.
Because kids, they don't havean issue with each other.
(23:22):
That's learned behavior, right?
It's a learned behavior.
It's a thought.
It's a thought behavior, learnedbehavior that happens afterwards.
But if we teach our kids to bestrong, to embrace differences,
right, to go out there and helpeach other, hopefully the future.
Of our world, it wouldbe a different place.
Edward Christie (23:42):
Yeah, but that requires for the parents to have that awareness,
because, uh, there's a saying, how youdo anything is how you do everything.
So if in the house, just amongfamily members or neighbors or who
you work with, you're fighting, thatis, that's, that's an indication.
(24:06):
Yeah, it won't, it won't becontained within the house.
It will leak out to
Suzana Simões (24:11):
everything.
And that brings, um, the topicof the importance of healing.
Yes.
As a, as a primary cell of society where,you know, we need to, because we're
always seeking for short term solutions.
But when it comes to that, Ithink there's only a long term
(24:33):
solution, and the long term solutionis the education of the soul.
Right.
Is the introduction of the concepts of thegospel, of the concepts of immortality.
So we really have to alphabetizeour humanity here on this planet.
(24:55):
We have to.
Um, again, uh, ourselves as adults,our children, the more that we
can become true immortalists, inother words, bring immortality to
anything and everything that we do.
That's a long term solutionbecause when we are truly under the
immortalist paradigm, things change,things change, things change, right?
Dan Assisi (25:21):
Because war makes sense from a materialist perspective, right?
Because I go over there and Ikill you and I think it's over.
Yeah, from a materialistic perspective,I think I won and I solved the problem.
Little do we know.
Little do we know, or actually,lots do we know, right?
Nowadays, after 160 years, forinstance, of Spiritism, where we
(25:41):
have been learning about mediumshipand the interchange between worlds,
which has always taken place.
But with the mediums book we got morelike a treatise that's more Democratic
anybody can learn about mediumship theywant to from that we know that we go
on I think it's very important at thispoint and if you go on if I go on When
I kill you our troubles are not over
Flavio Zanetti (26:04):
So are you suggesting we have the intelligence to create,
you know, weapons and all those things?
We have the emotional intelligenceto control our actions, but are we
missing a spiritual intelligence?
Dan Assisi (26:18):
Well, I would say, I think that's a beautiful distinction
you make, but I'm, I'm, I mightlike, I don't know, the jury is
out on the emotional intelligence.
I don't think we
Flavio Zanetti (26:25):
can control our actions.
Maybe emotional intelligenceare not there yet.
Yeah.
But I mean, if we takethis to the next level.
In a way that, hey, you can killyour enemy now, but maybe next
you're going to go back as the enemy.
Dan Assisi (26:37):
Well, yeah, but I think that's my point is, would we
behave this way if I knew, like,I'm going to pick on poor Edward.
Like, if I go and kill Edward, right,but would I do that if I knew that
once he is, his physical body'sdead, he may come after me in the
spiritual world, or he may reincarnate.
Like, would I think twice?
Is that a strong enough reasonfor me to start to double
(27:00):
think and say, You know what?
This whole killing thing, it isnot the same It ain't gonna work.
to this problem because I might killyou now, but then you can come back
and, uh, you know, kind of try to killme next time or try to harm me from
the other side kind of thing, right?
We know this happens.
Topic for another conversation.
But I wonder if that is enough andthat's the beginning of You know what?
(27:21):
I think it's the beginning.
We can do this because it never ends.
It
Flavio Zanetti (27:24):
never ends.
I think it's the beginning.
That awareness of the spiritual,you know, beings that we are.
We're not physical beings with a spirit.
We're spiritual beings ina body, in a physical body.
That means I'm in this body right now,in the next life I'm in a different body,
or even in between lives that I have nophysical body per se, I'm still in contact
(27:45):
with you, with you and anybody else.
There's still the connections.
Emotional connections,affinity and whatnot.
So, killing is not the solution.
War is never the solution.
Edward Christie (27:56):
Well, as Daniel says, um, you know, that, that is the
lowest level, what you're suggesting.
You know, I'm going to, I'mgoing to suffer in the end.
So, what you're doing is, uh, operatingfrom fear, which is something.
It's the beginning of something, right?
It's the lowest level.
You know, the highest would be Love.
(28:18):
I wouldn't kill this personbecause I see their value.
I see them as a child of God,but we probably can't do that.
Dan Assisi (28:27):
At our level of selfishness, we're still very much
worried about what's in it for me.
And the thou shall not kill.
Right?
Is the beginning, because thou shaltget in trouble, is the beginning of, if
you're not here yet, all the way to thetop, if you don't have that empathy yet,
you've got to start at the lowest level.
Edward Christie (28:45):
Right.
And I think what Susanna saidwas reminding me, uh, because
we're both talking about family,and being a parent is a mission.
Our mission, for most of us, certainlyhere, is not to resolve the issue.
In the Ukraine, or in the GazaStrip, or anything like that, our
mission is, as parents, and to teachour children, um, A different way.
(29:11):
Yes.
So, you know, we can, we can make ourfocus, we can have an opinion about what
goes on in the world, and forget whatwe're, what we're really meant to do here.
To, to resolve, to, tofulfill our, our mission as a
Dan Assisi (29:29):
parent.
Well, now that we solvedthe world's problems.
Suzana Simões (29:32):
We just did.
I just want to, um, before comingto the final solution, uh, go
on on, uh, what you were saying.
And bring one more aspect, because I dothink that The understanding that, you
know, not only life does not end, butall the repercussions that come with, uh,
(29:53):
healing or suicide and, and, and thingslike that, um, You know, operating from a
place of, uh, fear and, and understanding.
I think there's more and, and, and I,like you're saying, um, love, right?
I think that we have to reallycommit ourselves to learn
(30:14):
to love and learn to love.
By that, I mean that we are still.
Loving the ones who are likeexactly like just like us.
Yeah.
So I like the idea of respect beinglove with worth associated with work.
In other words, you thinkdifferently than me.
(30:35):
We may not agree, but the fact that youthink differently, or perhaps you behave
differently, does not diminish you.
You remain someone who is worth it.
Worth it of belonging, worth it of love,of recognition, of being seen, right?
So, a lot of times we'll say to someone,Oh yeah, I respect you, but deep inside,
(31:02):
Deep inside, the feeling is, well, but,
Dan Assisi (31:05):
you
Suzana Simões (31:06):
know, you don't know any better, and I'm better than you, that
feeling, so, you know, that is, so thatis something very basic because the, the
consequences, the way that this unfoldsis, um, when people feel that they are
not valued as human beings, you know, alot of times what triggers and generates
(31:32):
is, Aggression and hostility is shame.
People feel deeply humiliated.
And that is a lot of times what'sgoing to bring that anger, destructive
anger, because they can't bear, theycannot bear the feeling of being
so diminished, oppressed, you know?
(31:53):
So I think that here lies the incrediblespiritual work challenge ahead of us as
humanity, you know, to really invest.
And again, going back.
This starts within our homesbecause a lot of times education
is done through humiliation.
(32:14):
Our kids are humiliated in the way wespeak to them, in the way we address them.
So it's, it's just, uh, itfeels a little bit overwhelming
right now as I'm speaking.
Dan Assisi (32:24):
It does.
Help me out.
It does, right?
And I would say even beforeshame, I think there's tons of
flavorings from insecurity, right?
Uh huh.
Because we are all insecure.
We're all, like, not completely sure ofour abilities and our worth in the world.
We all have our moments wherewe, we, we hesitate, we question,
we wonder if we're enough, we'redoing the right thing, right?
(32:46):
And then when the other, who may bedistant from us, comes and, for their
own reasons, tries to assert their, theirknowledge, because they want to feel
good about themselves and they don'tknow how to do it other than putting
somebody else down, right, becausethen they feel like they're actually
not, not bad, they're okay, right?
Uh, then it all starts and Shanekicks in and all that kind of stuff.
(33:08):
But, you know, I also want toacknowledge that we are going to have
those feelings sometimes and thosethoughts and I'm gonna judge you, right?
And say, I know, I knowbetter than you kind of thing.
But in that moment, have the decencyto swallow it up and be a good human
being and say, I'm thinking aboutthat, but I'm not going to act on that.
Right.
Until we get to a point.
Where I can work on no longer havingthose feelings, but, but it's like,
(33:31):
we're going to have those feelings,but at the very least, from a social
perspective, we got to make sure thatwe're not acting on those feelings.
Right.
Because I think that we're still faraway from, from being in a place where
we truly have the empathy that wetalked about that you were mentioning.
That is true.
Right.
But, but I think that the shame piece,like you say, is really important because.
(33:51):
We also have to ask ourselves, why, whyshould I be shameful about this, right?
Why does it matter whatother people think?
So there's all things that we canunpack from, from, from their piece.
But there's a lot of stuff, like, there'sa lot, there's a lot of outer work to be
done, but there's a lot of inner work,
Edward Christie (34:10):
right?
I, uh,
Flavio Zanetti (34:11):
I actually saw a quote from your wife, Nicole, if
you're watching us, hello, that,uh, she wrote on, uh, social media.
Uh, we cannot compete because Iwant you to succeed the moment we
won the moment we won everybodyto succeed, not only ourselves.
I think it's the start ofthe, of the, of the change.
Dan Assisi (34:30):
A rising tide lifts all boats, right?
It's a win win situation, which goesto the scarcity thing that, you know,
you're talking about earlier today,Susana, we have this idea that there's
only a limited amount of goodnessor some, whatever it is out there.
And then we've got to fight foreach other with each other for that.
But the truth is, you know, we canalways been creating more things.
So there is a, there is a point wheremaybe when we go back to the immortality
(34:53):
of the soul, when we realize thatwe're more connected than we imagined,
we stopped seeing each other ascompetitors and we really see, Hey.
Today, you lift me up.
Flavio Zanetti (35:03):
Tomorrow, I'll lift you up.
And vice versa.
Right?
Yeah.
It's tough because theworld is a little heavy.
So if you want to lift usup, maybe the two of you.
Dan Assisi (35:13):
But here's the interesting thing, right?
So now that we solved theworld's problems almost, um, like
what is, what is war good for?
Because I think in the divineplanning of the world, you can
kind of say, you know what?
This war is a failure, is a problem.
Yes, it all to all of that.
These are choices that weremade and they're helpful.
But is there somethingthat we can learn from
Edward Christie (35:33):
war?
Oh, sure.
Yeah, I mean, war, to me, is, it's a clearindication that there's something been
bubbling inside of us for a long time.
Because it, people wouldnever give in to something.
I, I really, truly believe that.
Maybe I'm too optimistic about humannature, but I can't imagine that people
would be willing to destroy withoutsome, something that's going on inside.
(35:54):
So people push down, push down, pushdown, push down, and eventually,
That, um, that surfaces in some way.
So, so if it comes to that point,if it's really a war, that's
the time to look inside and say,how, how did it come to this?
Dan Assisi (36:10):
That's a good point.
Like, nobody wakes up and says, youknow, I had a wonderful day yesterday.
I'm not going to go to war today.
Edward Christie (36:15):
Yeah.
Right?
I just wanted to kill a bunch of people.
Who, who are
Dan Assisi (36:18):
we going to beat up today, right?
So I think you got a really great
Flavio Zanetti (36:21):
point.
But there are some, there are somesocietal benefits sometimes with war.
For example, penicillin.
Penicillin was inventedafter the second world war.
Yes.
Right?
So there, there are a few things.
But the question that I have is,would they justify all the atrocities?
That happened
Dan Assisi (36:39):
from wars.
They may not but given that theythese atrocities have happened
and we cannot change them Can'tgo back What can we do right?
And I think that we read in the wonderfuland wise answer by the spirits to that
question of war in the spirits bookThat war helps us I think I'm going
to just, you know, paraphrase, but hehelps us be aware that things are not
(37:01):
okay and realize that we need to goforward faster than we were before.
Listen, we are moving forwardas a planet, as a society.
We can say that, right?
I truly believe this.
But we've got to move alittle bit faster, right?
Because we're not making the progressthat we give ourselves credit for.
There's a lot to
Flavio Zanetti (37:18):
change.
I think we've made andwe're still making a lot of
technological progress everywhere.
The area that we're not making alot of progress is when it comes to
ethics and morals and those things.
I think we're still on theapplication of the knowledge.
Yeah.
So, which is great that we have allthese inventions that are enabling
us to, for example, sit here andhave a conversation and that being
(37:40):
broadcasted, you know, tomorrow withthe entire world, which is awesome.
What are some of the things thatwe can leverage the technology?
To make not only us better,but humanity better overall.
Dan Assisi (37:52):
That's a great question.
I think that as we approachthe beginning of the end No!
I know, it goes fast.
It goes fast.
Um, I think it's great for usto start thinking about that.
So what kind of actions, whatkind of takeaways do we take
with us from these situations?
(38:13):
And how can each one ofus Um, make a difference,
Suzana Simões (38:18):
right?
Yeah, I go back, I go back to whatI said because I think that it's
so easy to, to think and to assumethat war is someone else's problem.
You know, I think that, and we werealso talking about this a little earlier
today, sometimes it's necessary for,Things to get this horrific to be
(38:43):
able to kind of catch our attentionand stimulate us to, to, to do more.
You know, so out of these horriblethings, agreements, uh, happen, people
are mobilized at the administration,governmental level, but we, we need to,
(39:05):
to also be shaken and take responsibilityand seek to do our part, whether it
is, um, you know, You know, working,I mean, one of the, the, the greatest
things, uh, that we can do in thislifetime is to become better at relating.
So, you know, how do we do that, right?
(39:28):
So, with inner work, with self knowledge,understanding of like, you know, I'm
angry, I want to kill this person.
So, you have to be curious about.
What is beneath the anger what isfueling that anger so Start to to
be curious to ask questions to beproactive to take responsibility And
(39:48):
as much as possible um, try not tobe someone who is Fomenting, uh, the
war, you know, uh, be the end of it.
Don't, don't fuel conversations that bringseparation, that brings more hostility.
So those are small, but not such smallthings that I think we can start doing.
(40:13):
Because people get very anxiousabout like, you know, what can I do?
You know, and they feel very powerless.
But it's not true.
We do have power.
There are things that we can do
Dan Assisi (40:27):
and I, you know, I'm not going to add much that i'm a hundred
percent in agreement with you And Ithink that's how you act locally, right?
I think that um You know, peace isnot the absence of conflict, it's
the resolution of conflict, right?
In a way, that's great.
And so it's not about also notaddressing the issues or not talking
(40:48):
with people about the challenges we have.
That's negligence.
That's not peace.
That's negligence.
That's a great point, right?
But it's, it's, it's coming together andrealizing that we do have individual work
on conflict resolution, communication, andall the stuff that we need to do because
clearly it's not working out great.
Right.
Um, and before I pass it on to Flavio,I should have said this a long time ago.
(41:10):
I want to do a shout outto Renan out in the UK.
I was in the UK doing a talk in Burnmouth.
Renan, thanks for visiting us,like South, um, Southwestern UK.
Uh, get a listener from Spiritsof Conversation that wants to come
and say hello and say, Whoa, great.
Um, you know, he came out,he came by and he said hello.
(41:31):
And then, you know what the firstquestion he asked me was after that?
Is Flavio really always that loud?
And I said, yes, you should see howwe have to edit his audio levels.
Today, you're very not loud at all.
So.
Um, so thank you right nowfor calling that, bringing
Flavio Zanetti (41:47):
that to it.
Maybe we're going to call meto ask me not to be loud today.
So we're not a big shout out to you.
Thanks for listening and watching us.
We have one follower.
Yay.
We're getting there.
Other than your mom.
Other than my mom, well, she's fallingfrom the spiritual, spiritual world.
But, uh, I'd like to say that for usparents, we have to make sure that we
(42:11):
are properly educating our kids, asI said before, to embrace diversity.
Because if we don't do that, There'sa small conflict at home, maybe in
our neighborhoods, maybe a bullying inschool because somebody else is different
in school than they are, than we are.
If we don't do that, if we don'tstart in our bases, in our homes,
the world's not gonna change.
(42:32):
Yeah, we cannot change what'shappening in the Middle East
right now, or what's happening,you know, in Ukraine and Russia.
That's way too, or fartoo removed from that.
But we have to start changing ourselves.
When we look, for example, atsituations that sometimes are tainting
towards one side versus another.
Let's take a step.
Hang on, hang on.
Let's look at this from a, froma both, both sides perspective.
(42:55):
Try to find, you know, information thatreally can compare notes on both sides.
Because war, nobody wins.
You may believe youwin, but you also lose.
So nobody's right.
That's another point, right?
Nobody's ever right.
Because doing something wrong, Right.
Something, something's done,something wrong is done to you.
(43:16):
Does not give you the right to dosomething wrong to somebody else, right?
Two wrongs.
I guess what I'm trying to say istwo wrongs doesn't make a right.
So that's what I, you know, like to
Edward Christie (43:24):
call out.
And, and to follow on what you're saying,and also what Susanna was saying, you
know, being curious and being open.
We have a lot of opinions.
I mean, we, we have an, anopinion about everything, really.
We have opinions about having opinions.
Yeah, right.
And those opinions are really away of shutting down curiosity.
(43:47):
Because I think this is the waythis, this, this side should win
in the war, or these people areright and those people are wrong.
And really not knowing about that,that really shuts us down, uh, from
learning about ourselves and, uh,and also from remaining curious.
Dan Assisi (44:06):
And that's maybe a great place to end our conversation there, but before
we do that, Edward, thanks for joining us.
Thank you for having me.
It's your first time with us.
Yes.
We love having you.
We appreciate your Your thoughtfulness,your great energy you bring to
all conversations, even thoughwe don't always record them.
Um, and for the beautiful musicand art that you come and, uh, the
(44:28):
thoughtful, you know, um, intentional,uh, thinking that you often do when it
comes to religion, things in general.
Uh, so with that in mind, tell usa little bit about where, uh, where
folks can find you if they want toknow more about you, because I'm sure
you're going to love their attention.
Edward Christie (44:44):
Find
Flavio Zanetti (44:44):
me.
All of our thousands of followersare going to go after you now.
Edward Christie (44:49):
I don't know.
I'm not, I'm not on any social media,so I, I wouldn't know how, um, okay.
Contact
Dan Assisi (44:57):
you.
Contact Dan.
Okay.
Flavio Zanetti (45:00):
Let us know.
We can, we can, we can, wecan, we can get through Edward.
Edward Christie (45:03):
Yes.
They'll, they'll figure out where I am.
You'll figure out where I am.
Um,
Dan Assisi (45:07):
thanks for being with us.
Thank you for inviting me.
And thank you, uh, Flavio and Susannafor a wonderful seven years of impromptu.
Infrequent, but
Flavio Zanetti (45:19):
unscripted, unscripted,
Dan Assisi (45:20):
off the cuff,
Suzana Simões (45:22):
right?
It's
Dan Assisi (45:22):
working out.
Listen, we have no plansfor world domination.
We are not trying to crank outstuff on a schedule because it
doesn't always happen that way.
These are meant to be realconversations for important topics.
And if you did like any of you wantto be part of our conversation,
you can follow us on YouTube.
You can follow, uh, you know,listen to as a podcast and whatever.
(45:46):
Podcast platform you would like best whenyou're driving, when you are walking the
dog or what have you, and of course youcan follow us on social media as well.
We just want to thankyou for, for being there.
And if you want to know more aboutdifferent things that we do connect
with us again, thanks for being here.
We also want to give ashout out to our friend.
(46:08):
Marcello today.
Flavio Zanetti (46:10):
Yeah,
Dan Assisi (46:11):
Marcello, we basically co opted to last minute to
help us figure this thing out.
So thank you so very much, sir, um,for, for being with us and helping, uh,
behind the scenes, figure things out.
Thanks everybody.
This has been a SpiritistInstitute production.
We hope that you've enjoyed it.
Check us out and, and wehope to see you in the next
Flavio Zanetti (46:30):
conversation.
And thank you to oursponsors whenever they come.
Welcome to Spiritist Conversations number 40.
I think that's the number, right?
We believe so.
We believe so.
A show where we sit down withfriends, literally today, to talk
about the world through an informal,unscripted, and unplugged way.
(00:20):
And I am Dan, we have Flavio, wehave Susanna, and we have our friend
Edward here today, and we're goingto introduce him in a little bit.
But before we do that, we justwant to go back a little bit to
our origin story because today, asyou can see, if you're watching us.
We are winging this as we oftendo, but why are we doing that?
Flavio Zanetti (00:42):
I was going to say, what changed?
So we always do it.
So, but the reason why we're doing thisis here is because we are from, we are
in Atlanta, Georgia right now, whereeverything started exactly seven years
ago, the whole universe started sevenyears ago, our universe, our universe, or
the universe of spiritist conversationsstarted here in Atlanta, Georgia.
(01:07):
Seven years ago,
Suzana Simões (01:09):
what do we remember from that day?
Flavio Zanetti (01:12):
We were in a much better place than this.
. We had a table.
That is true.
We had chairs, Uhhuh, anduh, now we're just winging it
Dan Assisi (01:20):
Today.
We don't have chairs or tables.
We're couches.
Flavio Zanetti (01:22):
Just couches and the chair for friend Edward.
And, uh, here we are, walk into
Suzana Simões (01:26):
that room and start talking about something.
Flavio Zanetti (01:29):
Let's talk about Spiritism and then all of a sudden.
Why don't we make
Dan Assisi (01:32):
this a podcast?
Daniel Acosta,
Suzana Simões (01:36):
you guys.
There was no podcastat the time, I'm sorry.
Why don't we make it into a conversation?
A conversation, yeah.
Podcast
Flavio Zanetti (01:42):
was just starting back then, I think.
Dan Assisi (01:44):
No, I don't think so.
And the reason why was becauseWhenever we met at different
conferences, we would end up chattingafterwards and have so much fun.
So, I decided to buy a microphone,which I had never really used before.
We brought it, took it in the computer.
We recorded our first episodebecause you guys couldn't run
away from that room, I think.
(02:05):
I think I kind of likelocked us in or something.
You guys were so nice about it.
And I also remember this.
We recorded a whole hour of the thing.
Only to find out that itdid not record, so we had
Flavio Zanetti (02:16):
to do everything again.
Again.
That I remember.
That you remember?
That I remember, yes.
You
Dan Assisi (02:21):
remembered every word, I'm sure.
If you ever listen to episode number one,um, just let you know that the first pass
was way better than the second pass thatwe did, which you all need to listen.
Flavio Zanetti (02:32):
Amateurs.
I can't believe that.
But
Dan Assisi (02:34):
what I think is really exciting and I'm thankful for, Um,
obviously I'm very thankful to making newfriends along the way like Edward today.
We're going to introduce him in a littlebit, but I'm also very thankful to
Flavia and Susanna who have agreed toembark on this crazy journey when we do
this podcast that became later video.
Um, and it has had over 40, 000 plays.
(02:57):
At this point in time,which is pretty cool.
Almost 50, 000.
Yeah.
Yeah, I think so.
You know, I got to look at the numbers,but, um, clearly you can do that.
You can see that we don't do agreat job of promoting this thing
or keeping track of how far weget, but we do have tons of fun.
And so thank you, Flavia andSusanna for, for agreeing to, to
learn with me, to teach me, toshare your perspectives on things.
(03:21):
And it's been seven years.
It's kind of crazy.
Suzana Simões (03:24):
Unbelievable, right?
I would never, I think.
Pot that would go that far.
No.
That we would keep doing for so many yearsand thank you for buying the microphone.
You know it's funny
Dan Assisi (03:36):
enough.
It made it all possible.
Yeah, and you know had I known Iwould have borrowed one of Flavio's
microphones because I think he hadthe same microphone that I Bought.
Yeah, right.
Yeti,
Flavio Zanetti (03:44):
right?
It was a Yeti.
Yeah, I think it was one of those.
But,
Dan Assisi (03:47):
uh, but anyways the the premise has not changed and the idea
is we sit down with friends really Inan unplugged way with no pre conceived
like speech or talk or points.
And we just share with each other ourperspectives on a particular topic.
Flavio Zanetti (04:08):
It's almost like having a conversation at a, you know, at a
restaurant or running each other downthe middle of the street, grab a cup
of coffee and then end up talking,
Dan Assisi (04:15):
right?
Yeah, Spiritist Conversations becauseI don't know if you remember this.
No.
But people would sometimes afterour sessions come back and say, Hey.
Like, you know, from the audience, are youguys going to have the conversation again?
Right.
And so we're like, hold on a second.
If they're asking where we're going tobe, like, you know, maybe we record this.
Maybe there's more people whoactually want to listen to it.
(04:35):
Right.
And we were very original with our name.
As you can tell the marketingdepartment really was.
You know, I work.
M.
I.
A.
Flavio Zanetti (04:43):
Spiritist Conversation.
Marketing department do not exist.
Still doesn't exist, by the way.
You had a low budget.
Dan Assisi (04:49):
As you can see, if you're watching us, very low
budget, but we know that's notwhat matters at the end of the day.
It's really the opportunity to betogether and engage with topics that could
benefit from a spiritual perspective.
And
Flavio Zanetti (05:03):
along the way, make new friends.
Speaking of new friends, Edgar Christie.
Hello, welcome, welcometo, welcome to our family.
Dan Assisi (05:12):
And we are here in Atlanta again for another conference.
And today I had the pleasure of hearingSusana and Flavio and Edward speak.
And by the way, um, he's going toshare that with you, but Edward is also
fantastic piano player and musician.
Um, and we had a lovely time and reallyharkened back to the beginning, but
Edward, tell us a little bit aboutyourself and your background for folks
(05:34):
who are watching and, or listening to us.
Well,
Edward Christie (05:38):
how far do you want me to go back?
Flavio Zanetti (05:41):
Holy!
Since you were born.
Dan Assisi (05:43):
Since you were born.
Suzana Simões (05:44):
Um,
Edward Christie (05:47):
well I met Sonya, my wife.
She was the one whointroduced me to Spiritism.
And I really took to it.
And so we've been studying together from,well we've been married 26 years now.
It's more like, uh, 28 yearsthat I've been studying with her.
And, uh, yeah, and we were luckyto find an English language
(06:10):
spiritist center in New York.
And there are a number of them,actually, now, so that, that's,
that's been a great thing.
Uh, there, and, and in New York,there, there are actually a number
of them that are exclusivelyEnglish ling, English speaking.
which is really nice.
There's a lot of outreach there and,uh, people are really dedicated.
(06:34):
I, I, I, I really, all I can sayis I really took to the whole
idea of Spiritism and it's a topicof conversation in our house.
We, we open up the books, wefind things to talk about, uh,
over breakfast coffee and things.
So it, it, we keep it alivevery, very much in the house.
Suzana Simões (06:56):
Wonderful.
Which group do you, uh, are you part of
Dan Assisi (06:59):
in New York?
Um,
Edward Christie (07:01):
right now I'm a part of IESS, the Inner
Enlightenment Spiritist Society.
Mm hmm.
And, um, yeah, we, we run theJoana de Angelis study, which
is a weekly study that we do.
There, so right now we're studyingthe psychology of gratitude book.
Fantastic.
Yeah.
It's a wonderful book.
(07:21):
We've gone through the existentialconflicts Uh, and, and what was, I
was trying to remember the other one.
It's so long ago
Dan Assisi (07:30):
now.
Yeah, and the spirit Durana Jandilis, is an incredible spirit who
has a wonderful books and teachingsgenerally centered around psychology.
Right.
Eventually we have in our, in our planto do an episode on her so that folks can
have some context, but Um, it's really
Edward Christie (07:47):
deep work.
Yes, and especially thepsychology of gratitude.
There's, we, we had to learn a lotabout Carl Jung and all of his ideas
in order to, to really understand.
Of course, we're all amateurs at it,which is good because the pressure
isn't on, um, for us to learn.
So we all learn together.
(08:07):
And yeah, it's, it's been, it'sbeen fun for that reason, fun,
maybe that was the wrong word.
Rewarding.
Rewarding, I think.
Dan Assisi (08:19):
And thanks for joining us because we might need a little bit of
that psychological insight to make senseof these difficult times that we live in.
Um, we were chatting beforehand,what should we talk about today?
And I think episode 40.
is about war because we knowthat we have these challenges
(08:39):
going on around the globe.
Just a couple of days ago, we alsohave the situation with Hamas in the
Gaza Strip and Israel and everybodyis really concerned about that on
top of Ukraine and all the differentthings that are happening in Africa.
So, You know, we figured that we couldprobably name this, we'll figure it out.
But maybe we named this one, warwas what, why, what is it good for?
(09:04):
Absolutely nothing.
Do we even need it?
Do we even need it, right?
So we maybe want to talk a littlebit about, hey, What's this war
stuff, why are we singing now,and how do we navigate that stuff?
Anybody want to jump in?
Does that sound good to you?
Flavio Zanetti (09:22):
Sounds good.
Sounds alright.
I, no, please go ahead.
No, one
Edward Christie (09:28):
of the things that, uh, that surprised me as I was reading was the
idea that, um, well, in this case it wasIsrael wanting to totally destroy Hamas,
which, uh, and I thought, how do you?
Destroy an idea.
I mean, you're destroying peoplehoping that no one will be around
(09:51):
that has those ideas anymore.
And you see this, you sawthis after 9 11 was the same.
Um, you see these same ideasrepeating, and, you know, you
can't kill an idea, really.
It just gets passed from one generationto another, and, so there's a lot of
stuff we talk about Joan of Angelus.
(10:11):
There's a lot in the collectiveshadow that people are working out.
Um, certainly that, that areaof the world has been under
conflict for centuries, for ages.
Thousands of years.
And there's somethingbeing worked out there.
Uh, whatever, well, we could speculateon what that is, but there is
(10:32):
definitely something being workedout there and, and the idea of just
destroying and hoping that that'sgoing to solve the problem doesn't
seem, it seems to be misguided to me.
Suzana Simões (10:42):
Short sighted to say
Dan Assisi (10:44):
the least.
Right.
It's what we've been doing forever, right?
As a, as a humanity.
I mean, the trick now is that you havea state fighting a non state, right?
So, you know, Hamas is not even a country.
So it becomes really persnickety,this idea that you can win the
(11:04):
war against somebody who is noteven officially recognized as a
government state piece, right?
So but I think my point is, war evolvesand no matter what we throw at it,
it still comes back because there'ssomething else that's being worked
out that we haven't quite figured out.
(11:26):
And it seems like these are momentswhere things are bubbling up everywhere.
Flavio Zanetti (11:33):
Yeah, but I think if, if you look at, it's, it's, I, do you
guys think that we'll ever be ableto understand what goes on in, for
example, in that conflict, in thatlocation, that part of the world?
Or even between Russia and Ukraineand we're so far removed from that,
but all of a sudden if you look ateverybody, all of a sudden everybody
(11:53):
became war, you know, experts or Ukraineexperts or Russia experts or, you know,
why are we doing this as a society?
Why
Suzana Simões (12:04):
is that happening?
Yeah.
And I think, I think to your point, uh,Flavio, we, we, you know, as a spiritist.
Um, because, okay, we're talkingabout these more recent wars,
but war has been going on, right?
So I don't think our intent today isto narrow, zoom in into a war, but
I think it's to recognize that theworld has been in a state of war.
(12:30):
There are many wars going on,sometimes wars that don't get as much.
Uh, time on TV and I think recognize thatthe way we receive the news is always one
narrow bias, bias, um, approach to things.
(12:53):
And we have jumped into conclusions.
And as you said, become experts andgiving sentences and making judgments.
And in ways, as we do that with the warand with anything and everything, the
realization that we are not necessarilyhelping to change the state of things.
(13:18):
Because every time that you are biasedtowards one side or another, I think
you lose sight of empathy and seeing.
Everyone as human beings
Flavio Zanetti (13:33):
use a very strong and important words.
Susanna empathy, empathy only worksif it's present on both sides, you
cannot, you cannot be empatheticonly with one part of the world.
We have to be empatheticwith the entire world.
How do we do that as spiritists?
Dan Assisi (13:48):
How do we get there?
And I think there's alsoa distinction, right?
I think that we can still saythat specific actions, whatever
they are, because we're nottalking about specific actions.
They might be perhaps not asright or wrong and others, right?
I have two kids, for instance.
I love both the same and sometimes oneof them beats the other one up, right?
Or does something and that's wrong, butdoesn't mean that I am going to just focus
(14:11):
on that action and say that's a bad kid.
I think that what I really like aboutwhat you're saying, Susana, is sure that
regardless of who started it, or who's atfault for that particular reason, there
is an underlying tension and challengesthat we have not been able to resolve.
And whether you call that arroganceor, you know, whatever it is that
(14:32):
you want to do, you should say like,we're going to go physical on this
thing because I am not going to yield.
I'm right.
You're wrong.
And I'm just going to go over you becausethey're more powerful than you are.
That's a very human thing, right?
And we're going to let our fighting dothe talking because we cannot agree.
Or I think just, or maybe I just simplythink that I don't even want to talk
(14:52):
to you because I think I'm stronger.
I'm just going to pummel you and do it.
Right.
But that behavior is, I thinkis the challenging piece, right?
Because Earlier today, we were havinga conversation as well, and we were
equating, and I think maybe we can pickthat up, is that that kind of thinking
that we see out in the world, and wethink it's like Ukraine and Russia and
(15:15):
Palestine and Israel, yes, that too, butthat also happens in our homes, right?
That also happens in ourstreets and our neighbors.
. So we have this inability to figurethings out that escalates, right?
Either to a fist fight in yourneighborhood or, you know, slaps
in your house or, or, or hurtfulwords in your house to missiles
(15:38):
and airplanes in countries and, andthat is the difficult piece, right?
Sometimes that we don't seethat we are, we're feeding.
This kind of thought process on that.
We need to change that.
Flavio Zanetti (15:50):
How do we change that?
What's the mechanism that's going toallow us to change that common thought?
I have.
I have an idea.
Go on.
Imagine.
Imagine he has an
Dan Assisi (16:00):
idea for once.
He's going to start playingdevil's advocate all the time
Flavio Zanetti (16:05):
asking questions.
If you follow us, you're goingto see that I always play devil's
advocate in some of the comments.
But now let me just throw my first idea.
And if you
Dan Assisi (16:13):
don't follow
Flavio Zanetti (16:13):
us, why not?
Exactly.
You're missing out.
You're totally missing out.
Hit that subscribe button on
Dan Assisi (16:18):
YouTube.
Um, do the podcasting on whatever podcast.
Flavio Zanetti (16:21):
Subscribe to whatever podcast tool that you use.
SoundCloud, we're available inevery single, you know, form.
What I was going to say is,thanks to Spiritism, we have
knowledge about reincarnation.
So, everything that we doThere's a consequence, correct?
Who would be, without making anypredictions, if those actions
(16:46):
are causing harm on others, we'reresponsible for those actions.
How are we going to fix thoseactions, or repent and correct
those actions in the future?
So it's very likely that in this life,I'm born in one location of the world,
In the next life, I may be born in adifferent place or different part of the
world, but imagine if I am in conflict orI was in conflict with that part of the
(17:09):
world, then I'll be born in the next life.
Dan Assisi (17:13):
And regardless of whether you're born, right?
The whole thing of like, you started it.
It's not an argument, right?
It's a very juvenile thing.
Well, I beat Susanna up,but she started it, right?
Like, at what point doesthis also stop, right?
Who's going to be the adult in the roomand say, yeah, what you did wasn't great?
But I'm not going tocome back and pummel you.
(17:35):
And I think that this is very, youknow, I want folks to hear that I get
that is very hard for us to understandthat at a national level, right?
Because there's pride andthere is fear, safety, and all
those things coming to place.
But at some point in time,as a, as a race, right?
(17:55):
As humanity, we've got to figure it out.
For me, Flavio, I agree with you.
I think that reincarnation isthe thing that at least helps me.
Like figure things out a little bit,because if we don't solve this now, we're
going to have to come back and do exactly,and I think I got a hunch that we've been
doing this for a couple of centuries,
Flavio Zanetti (18:15):
right?
So one part, we're in this partof the, uh, the, the conflict.
Another part, we're in that partof the conflict or in this life
from here, that life from there.
So why do I make sense of it?
How do I make
Suzana Simões (18:27):
sense of it?
So we have to, um, and this is a, anincredible opportunity for us to, for
us who consider ourselves Christians,right, to ask what is it that we
have learned from the gospel, fromthe way Jesus, um, act while he was,
(18:51):
uh, with us that we can take homeand we can, uh, put into practice.
So, it's just very incredible andchallenging that he came to take
love to another level when heinvited us to love our enemies.
(19:12):
And the gospel is very clear becauseit says, it doesn't mean you're going
to bring the enemy into your house, butit means that you are not going, you're
going to refrain yourself from harmingthe enemy, from retaliation, and so
how can we point fingers and blame andaccuse governments and countries when,
(19:40):
going back to what Dan said, right?
In our own homes, in our daily lives.
We continue to embrace the law, theold law of an eye for an eye, right?
So it is exactly, we are being invitedto be so disgusted by the, the current
(20:02):
situation that it's almost like the,the life is telling us, Hey, can you
realize that this way of living wherewe are nurturing and feeding hate?
We'll just lead to thedestruction of everyone.
It's not bringing any good.
(20:24):
So we are actually invited to, to growup, to leave those teenager's years
and to understand that we need, at somepoint, one sign needs to rise above,
needs to introduce something different.
We are invited to be the, the, theend of this vicious cycle of hatred of
(20:47):
retaliation of an eye for an eye and thisinvitation has been over there for us
for over 2000 years and again I think weneed to take individual responsibility
for what is happening in the world.
See, the thing is that it's not aPalestinian or Israeli or Russian or
Ukrainian, it's everyone's problem,it's everyone's business and we need
(21:12):
to take personal responsibility forwhat is happening by trying You know,
making a difference in our day-to-Day
Dan Assisi (21:20):
lives.
Yes.
Because we seem to forget this.
He's enlightened right now.
Yes.
I'm getting the light.
You feeling?
Are you praying it over there?
I'm getting the light.
Got it.
Flavio Zanetti (21:27):
The uh, yes, I feel it.
Dan Assisi (21:29):
I can feel it.
Yeah.
I'm gonna set you up.
It's coming
Flavio Zanetti (21:31):
down.
Set you up for a second.
It's coming, but now, now I'm gonnaplay my role that I play all the
Dan Assisi (21:35):
time.
Yes.
But hold on before youdo that really quick.
Alright, go ahead.
He was gonna say something,say, I wanna say yes to all she
said, and I think the point is.
We fantasize this idea thatcountries fight countries, right?
But it's really people.
Yeah.
Yeah, right?
It's somebody with a certain mentalityand a mindset that came to power within
that country or a group of people and theyhave carried out their personal of Dealing
(22:02):
with the world into the national leveland because they have that platform they
took that action so I think that we feellike these are complex things, but it's
people deciding to have wars and On behalfof their countries with other people.
So if we can work on people and I, I'mgoing to be a little bit jaded here and
say, you know, the people who are in powerright now, we're not fixing those people.
(22:24):
It's not going to happen,but can we work on our kids?
Can we work on ourselves so thatwe know how to deal with conflict?
We are more accepting so that wecan figure our stuff out before
we get into levels of power.
Right?
Where we are justrepeating the cycle that we
Flavio Zanetti (22:41):
see now.
I think even before dealing withconflict, I think what we can do as
parents is teaching our kids to lookat the differences, embrace those
differences, and not look at thosedifferences from a many cases, you
know, a perspective that if it's notlike me, therefore it must be wrong.
Because there's so much, so manydifferences out there in the world.
(23:02):
That if we embrace inclusion since earlyages, there's so many pictures I've seen.
One that really touched me a lotwas a picture of two kids, two
boys, one Palestinian, one Israeli.
You can see from theirheads, hugging each other.
Their backs, you can only see their backs.
Because kids, they don't havean issue with each other.
(23:22):
That's learned behavior, right?
It's a learned behavior.
It's a thought.
It's a thought behavior, learnedbehavior that happens afterwards.
But if we teach our kids to bestrong, to embrace differences,
right, to go out there and helpeach other, hopefully the future.
Of our world, it wouldbe a different place.
Edward Christie (23:42):
Yeah, but that requires for the parents to have that awareness,
because, uh, there's a saying, how youdo anything is how you do everything.
So if in the house, just amongfamily members or neighbors or who
you work with, you're fighting, thatis, that's, that's an indication.
(24:06):
Yeah, it won't, it won't becontained within the house.
It will leak out to
Suzana Simões (24:11):
everything.
And that brings, um, the topicof the importance of healing.
Yes.
As a, as a primary cell of society where,you know, we need to, because we're
always seeking for short term solutions.
But when it comes to that, Ithink there's only a long term
(24:33):
solution, and the long term solutionis the education of the soul.
Right.
Is the introduction of the concepts of thegospel, of the concepts of immortality.
So we really have to alphabetizeour humanity here on this planet.
(24:55):
We have to.
Um, again, uh, ourselves as adults,our children, the more that we
can become true immortalists, inother words, bring immortality to
anything and everything that we do.
That's a long term solutionbecause when we are truly under the
immortalist paradigm, things change,things change, things change, right?
Dan Assisi (25:21):
Because war makes sense from a materialist perspective, right?
Because I go over there and Ikill you and I think it's over.
Yeah, from a materialistic perspective,I think I won and I solved the problem.
Little do we know.
Little do we know, or actually,lots do we know, right?
Nowadays, after 160 years, forinstance, of Spiritism, where we
(25:41):
have been learning about mediumshipand the interchange between worlds,
which has always taken place.
But with the mediums book we got morelike a treatise that's more Democratic
anybody can learn about mediumship theywant to from that we know that we go
on I think it's very important at thispoint and if you go on if I go on When
I kill you our troubles are not over
Flavio Zanetti (26:04):
So are you suggesting we have the intelligence to create,
you know, weapons and all those things?
We have the emotional intelligenceto control our actions, but are we
missing a spiritual intelligence?
Dan Assisi (26:18):
Well, I would say, I think that's a beautiful distinction
you make, but I'm, I'm, I mightlike, I don't know, the jury is
out on the emotional intelligence.
I don't think we
Flavio Zanetti (26:25):
can control our actions.
Maybe emotional intelligenceare not there yet.
Yeah.
But I mean, if we takethis to the next level.
In a way that, hey, you can killyour enemy now, but maybe next
you're going to go back as the enemy.
Dan Assisi (26:37):
Well, yeah, but I think that's my point is, would we
behave this way if I knew, like,I'm going to pick on poor Edward.
Like, if I go and kill Edward, right,but would I do that if I knew that
once he is, his physical body'sdead, he may come after me in the
spiritual world, or he may reincarnate.
Like, would I think twice?
Is that a strong enough reasonfor me to start to double
(27:00):
think and say, You know what?
This whole killing thing, it isnot the same It ain't gonna work.
to this problem because I might killyou now, but then you can come back
and, uh, you know, kind of try to killme next time or try to harm me from
the other side kind of thing, right?
We know this happens.
Topic for another conversation.
But I wonder if that is enough andthat's the beginning of You know what?
(27:21):
I think it's the beginning.
We can do this because it never ends.
It
Flavio Zanetti (27:24):
never ends.
I think it's the beginning.
That awareness of the spiritual,you know, beings that we are.
We're not physical beings with a spirit.
We're spiritual beings ina body, in a physical body.
That means I'm in this body right now,in the next life I'm in a different body,
or even in between lives that I have nophysical body per se, I'm still in contact
(27:45):
with you, with you and anybody else.
There's still the connections.
Emotional connections,affinity and whatnot.
So, killing is not the solution.
War is never the solution.
Edward Christie (27:56):
Well, as Daniel says, um, you know, that, that is the
lowest level, what you're suggesting.
You know, I'm going to, I'mgoing to suffer in the end.
So, what you're doing is, uh, operatingfrom fear, which is something.
It's the beginning of something, right?
It's the lowest level.
You know, the highest would be Love.
(28:18):
I wouldn't kill this personbecause I see their value.
I see them as a child of God,but we probably can't do that.
Dan Assisi (28:27):
At our level of selfishness, we're still very much
worried about what's in it for me.
And the thou shall not kill.
Right?
Is the beginning, because thou shaltget in trouble, is the beginning of, if
you're not here yet, all the way to thetop, if you don't have that empathy yet,
you've got to start at the lowest level.
Edward Christie (28:45):
Right.
And I think what Susanna saidwas reminding me, uh, because
we're both talking about family,and being a parent is a mission.
Our mission, for most of us, certainlyhere, is not to resolve the issue.
In the Ukraine, or in the GazaStrip, or anything like that, our
mission is, as parents, and to teachour children, um, A different way.
(29:11):
Yes.
So, you know, we can, we can make ourfocus, we can have an opinion about what
goes on in the world, and forget whatwe're, what we're really meant to do here.
To, to resolve, to, tofulfill our, our mission as a
Dan Assisi (29:29):
parent.
Well, now that we solvedthe world's problems.
Suzana Simões (29:32):
We just did.
I just want to, um, before comingto the final solution, uh, go
on on, uh, what you were saying.
And bring one more aspect, because I dothink that The understanding that, you
know, not only life does not end, butall the repercussions that come with, uh,
(29:53):
healing or suicide and, and, and thingslike that, um, You know, operating from a
place of, uh, fear and, and understanding.
I think there's more and, and, and I,like you're saying, um, love, right?
I think that we have to reallycommit ourselves to learn
(30:14):
to love and learn to love.
By that, I mean that we are still.
Loving the ones who are likeexactly like just like us.
Yeah.
So I like the idea of respect beinglove with worth associated with work.
In other words, you thinkdifferently than me.
(30:35):
We may not agree, but the fact that youthink differently, or perhaps you behave
differently, does not diminish you.
You remain someone who is worth it.
Worth it of belonging, worth it of love,of recognition, of being seen, right?
So, a lot of times we'll say to someone,Oh yeah, I respect you, but deep inside,
(31:02):
Deep inside, the feeling is, well, but,
Dan Assisi (31:05):
you
Suzana Simões (31:06):
know, you don't know any better, and I'm better than you, that
feeling, so, you know, that is, so thatis something very basic because the, the
consequences, the way that this unfoldsis, um, when people feel that they are
not valued as human beings, you know, alot of times what triggers and generates
(31:32):
is, Aggression and hostility is shame.
People feel deeply humiliated.
And that is a lot of times what'sgoing to bring that anger, destructive
anger, because they can't bear, theycannot bear the feeling of being
so diminished, oppressed, you know?
(31:53):
So I think that here lies the incrediblespiritual work challenge ahead of us as
humanity, you know, to really invest.
And again, going back.
This starts within our homesbecause a lot of times education
is done through humiliation.
(32:14):
Our kids are humiliated in the way wespeak to them, in the way we address them.
So it's, it's just, uh, itfeels a little bit overwhelming
right now as I'm speaking.
Dan Assisi (32:24):
It does.
Help me out.
It does, right?
And I would say even beforeshame, I think there's tons of
flavorings from insecurity, right?
Uh huh.
Because we are all insecure.
We're all, like, not completely sure ofour abilities and our worth in the world.
We all have our moments wherewe, we, we hesitate, we question,
we wonder if we're enough, we'redoing the right thing, right?
(32:46):
And then when the other, who may bedistant from us, comes and, for their
own reasons, tries to assert their, theirknowledge, because they want to feel
good about themselves and they don'tknow how to do it other than putting
somebody else down, right, becausethen they feel like they're actually
not, not bad, they're okay, right?
Uh, then it all starts and Shanekicks in and all that kind of stuff.
(33:08):
But, you know, I also want toacknowledge that we are going to have
those feelings sometimes and thosethoughts and I'm gonna judge you, right?
And say, I know, I knowbetter than you kind of thing.
But in that moment, have the decencyto swallow it up and be a good human
being and say, I'm thinking aboutthat, but I'm not going to act on that.
Right.
Until we get to a point.
Where I can work on no longer havingthose feelings, but, but it's like,
(33:31):
we're going to have those feelings,but at the very least, from a social
perspective, we got to make sure thatwe're not acting on those feelings.
Right.
Because I think that we're still faraway from, from being in a place where
we truly have the empathy that wetalked about that you were mentioning.
That is true.
Right.
But, but I think that the shame piece,like you say, is really important because.
(33:51):
We also have to ask ourselves, why, whyshould I be shameful about this, right?
Why does it matter whatother people think?
So there's all things that we canunpack from, from, from their piece.
But there's a lot of stuff, like, there'sa lot, there's a lot of outer work to be
done, but there's a lot of inner work,
Edward Christie (34:10):
right?
I, uh,
Flavio Zanetti (34:11):
I actually saw a quote from your wife, Nicole, if
you're watching us, hello, that,uh, she wrote on, uh, social media.
Uh, we cannot compete because Iwant you to succeed the moment we
won the moment we won everybodyto succeed, not only ourselves.
I think it's the start ofthe, of the, of the change.
Dan Assisi (34:30):
A rising tide lifts all boats, right?
It's a win win situation, which goesto the scarcity thing that, you know,
you're talking about earlier today,Susana, we have this idea that there's
only a limited amount of goodnessor some, whatever it is out there.
And then we've got to fight foreach other with each other for that.
But the truth is, you know, we canalways been creating more things.
So there is a, there is a point wheremaybe when we go back to the immortality
(34:53):
of the soul, when we realize thatwe're more connected than we imagined,
we stopped seeing each other ascompetitors and we really see, Hey.
Today, you lift me up.
Flavio Zanetti (35:03):
Tomorrow, I'll lift you up.
And vice versa.
Right?
Yeah.
It's tough because theworld is a little heavy.
So if you want to lift usup, maybe the two of you.
Dan Assisi (35:13):
But here's the interesting thing, right?
So now that we solved theworld's problems almost, um, like
what is, what is war good for?
Because I think in the divineplanning of the world, you can
kind of say, you know what?
This war is a failure, is a problem.
Yes, it all to all of that.
These are choices that weremade and they're helpful.
But is there somethingthat we can learn from
Edward Christie (35:33):
war?
Oh, sure.
Yeah, I mean, war, to me, is, it's a clearindication that there's something been
bubbling inside of us for a long time.
Because it, people wouldnever give in to something.
I, I really, truly believe that.
Maybe I'm too optimistic about humannature, but I can't imagine that people
would be willing to destroy withoutsome, something that's going on inside.
(35:54):
So people push down, push down, pushdown, push down, and eventually,
That, um, that surfaces in some way.
So, so if it comes to that point,if it's really a war, that's
the time to look inside and say,how, how did it come to this?
Dan Assisi (36:10):
That's a good point.
Like, nobody wakes up and says, youknow, I had a wonderful day yesterday.
I'm not going to go to war today.
Edward Christie (36:15):
Yeah.
Right?
I just wanted to kill a bunch of people.
Who, who are
Dan Assisi (36:18):
we going to beat up today, right?
So I think you got a really great
Flavio Zanetti (36:21):
point.
But there are some, there are somesocietal benefits sometimes with war.
For example, penicillin.
Penicillin was inventedafter the second world war.
Yes.
Right?
So there, there are a few things.
But the question that I have is,would they justify all the atrocities?
That happened
Dan Assisi (36:39):
from wars.
They may not but given that theythese atrocities have happened
and we cannot change them Can'tgo back What can we do right?
And I think that we read in the wonderfuland wise answer by the spirits to that
question of war in the spirits bookThat war helps us I think I'm going
to just, you know, paraphrase, but hehelps us be aware that things are not
(37:01):
okay and realize that we need to goforward faster than we were before.
Listen, we are moving forwardas a planet, as a society.
We can say that, right?
I truly believe this.
But we've got to move alittle bit faster, right?
Because we're not making the progressthat we give ourselves credit for.
There's a lot to
Flavio Zanetti (37:18):
change.
I think we've made andwe're still making a lot of
technological progress everywhere.
The area that we're not making alot of progress is when it comes to
ethics and morals and those things.
I think we're still on theapplication of the knowledge.
Yeah.
So, which is great that we have allthese inventions that are enabling
us to, for example, sit here andhave a conversation and that being
(37:40):
broadcasted, you know, tomorrow withthe entire world, which is awesome.
What are some of the things thatwe can leverage the technology?
To make not only us better,but humanity better overall.
Dan Assisi (37:52):
That's a great question.
I think that as we approachthe beginning of the end No!
I know, it goes fast.
It goes fast.
Um, I think it's great for usto start thinking about that.
So what kind of actions, whatkind of takeaways do we take
with us from these situations?
(38:13):
And how can each one ofus Um, make a difference,
Suzana Simões (38:18):
right?
Yeah, I go back, I go back to whatI said because I think that it's
so easy to, to think and to assumethat war is someone else's problem.
You know, I think that, and we werealso talking about this a little earlier
today, sometimes it's necessary for,Things to get this horrific to be
(38:43):
able to kind of catch our attentionand stimulate us to, to, to do more.
You know, so out of these horriblethings, agreements, uh, happen, people
are mobilized at the administration,governmental level, but we, we need to,
(39:05):
to also be shaken and take responsibilityand seek to do our part, whether it
is, um, you know, You know, working,I mean, one of the, the, the greatest
things, uh, that we can do in thislifetime is to become better at relating.
So, you know, how do we do that, right?
(39:28):
So, with inner work, with self knowledge,understanding of like, you know, I'm
angry, I want to kill this person.
So, you have to be curious about.
What is beneath the anger what isfueling that anger so Start to to
be curious to ask questions to beproactive to take responsibility And
(39:48):
as much as possible um, try not tobe someone who is Fomenting, uh, the
war, you know, uh, be the end of it.
Don't, don't fuel conversations that bringseparation, that brings more hostility.
So those are small, but not such smallthings that I think we can start doing.
(40:13):
Because people get very anxiousabout like, you know, what can I do?
You know, and they feel very powerless.
But it's not true.
We do have power.
There are things that we can do
Dan Assisi (40:27):
and I, you know, I'm not going to add much that i'm a hundred
percent in agreement with you And Ithink that's how you act locally, right?
I think that um You know, peace isnot the absence of conflict, it's
the resolution of conflict, right?
In a way, that's great.
And so it's not about also notaddressing the issues or not talking
(40:48):
with people about the challenges we have.
That's negligence.
That's not peace.
That's negligence.
That's a great point, right?
But it's, it's, it's coming together andrealizing that we do have individual work
on conflict resolution, communication, andall the stuff that we need to do because
clearly it's not working out great.
Right.
Um, and before I pass it on to Flavio,I should have said this a long time ago.
(41:10):
I want to do a shout outto Renan out in the UK.
I was in the UK doing a talk in Burnmouth.
Renan, thanks for visiting us,like South, um, Southwestern UK.
Uh, get a listener from Spiritsof Conversation that wants to come
and say hello and say, Whoa, great.
Um, you know, he came out,he came by and he said hello.
(41:31):
And then, you know what the firstquestion he asked me was after that?
Is Flavio really always that loud?
And I said, yes, you should see howwe have to edit his audio levels.
Today, you're very not loud at all.
So.
Um, so thank you right nowfor calling that, bringing
Flavio Zanetti (41:47):
that to it.
Maybe we're going to call meto ask me not to be loud today.
So we're not a big shout out to you.
Thanks for listening and watching us.
We have one follower.
Yay.
We're getting there.
Other than your mom.
Other than my mom, well, she's fallingfrom the spiritual, spiritual world.
But, uh, I'd like to say that for usparents, we have to make sure that we
(42:11):
are properly educating our kids, asI said before, to embrace diversity.
Because if we don't do that, There'sa small conflict at home, maybe in
our neighborhoods, maybe a bullying inschool because somebody else is different
in school than they are, than we are.
If we don't do that, if we don'tstart in our bases, in our homes,
the world's not gonna change.
(42:32):
Yeah, we cannot change what'shappening in the Middle East
right now, or what's happening,you know, in Ukraine and Russia.
That's way too, or fartoo removed from that.
But we have to start changing ourselves.
When we look, for example, atsituations that sometimes are tainting
towards one side versus another.
Let's take a step.
Hang on, hang on.
Let's look at this from a, froma both, both sides perspective.
(42:55):
Try to find, you know, information thatreally can compare notes on both sides.
Because war, nobody wins.
You may believe youwin, but you also lose.
So nobody's right.
That's another point, right?
Nobody's ever right.
Because doing something wrong, Right.
Something, something's done,something wrong is done to you.
(43:16):
Does not give you the right to dosomething wrong to somebody else, right?
Two wrongs.
I guess what I'm trying to say istwo wrongs doesn't make a right.
So that's what I, you know, like to
Edward Christie (43:24):
call out.
And, and to follow on what you're saying,and also what Susanna was saying, you
know, being curious and being open.
We have a lot of opinions.
I mean, we, we have an, anopinion about everything, really.
We have opinions about having opinions.
Yeah, right.
And those opinions are really away of shutting down curiosity.
(43:47):
Because I think this is the waythis, this, this side should win
in the war, or these people areright and those people are wrong.
And really not knowing about that,that really shuts us down, uh, from
learning about ourselves and, uh,and also from remaining curious.
Dan Assisi (44:06):
And that's maybe a great place to end our conversation there, but before
we do that, Edward, thanks for joining us.
Thank you for having me.
It's your first time with us.
Yes.
We love having you.
We appreciate your Your thoughtfulness,your great energy you bring to
all conversations, even thoughwe don't always record them.
Um, and for the beautiful musicand art that you come and, uh, the
(44:28):
thoughtful, you know, um, intentional,uh, thinking that you often do when it
comes to religion, things in general.
Uh, so with that in mind, tell usa little bit about where, uh, where
folks can find you if they want toknow more about you, because I'm sure
you're going to love their attention.
Edward Christie (44:44):
Find
Flavio Zanetti (44:44):
me.
All of our thousands of followersare going to go after you now.
Edward Christie (44:49):
I don't know.
I'm not, I'm not on any social media,so I, I wouldn't know how, um, okay.
Contact
Dan Assisi (44:57):
you.
Contact Dan.
Okay.
Flavio Zanetti (45:00):
Let us know.
We can, we can, we can, wecan, we can get through Edward.
Edward Christie (45:03):
Yes.
They'll, they'll figure out where I am.
You'll figure out where I am.
Um,
Dan Assisi (45:07):
thanks for being with us.
Thank you for inviting me.
And thank you, uh, Flavio and Susannafor a wonderful seven years of impromptu.
Infrequent, but
Flavio Zanetti (45:19):
unscripted, unscripted,
Dan Assisi (45:20):
off the cuff,
Suzana Simões (45:22):
right?
It's
Dan Assisi (45:22):
working out.
Listen, we have no plansfor world domination.
We are not trying to crank outstuff on a schedule because it
doesn't always happen that way.
These are meant to be realconversations for important topics.
And if you did like any of you wantto be part of our conversation,
you can follow us on YouTube.
You can follow, uh, you know,listen to as a podcast and whatever.
(45:46):
Podcast platform you would like best whenyou're driving, when you are walking the
dog or what have you, and of course youcan follow us on social media as well.
We just want to thankyou for, for being there.
And if you want to know more aboutdifferent things that we do connect
with us again, thanks for being here.
We also want to give ashout out to our friend.
(46:08):
Marcello today.
Flavio Zanetti (46:10):
Yeah,
Dan Assisi (46:11):
Marcello, we basically co opted to last minute to
help us figure this thing out.
So thank you so very much, sir, um,for, for being with us and helping, uh,
behind the scenes, figure things out.
Thanks everybody.
This has been a SpiritistInstitute production.
We hope that you've enjoyed it.
Check us out and, and wehope to see you in the next
Flavio Zanetti (46:30):
conversation.
And thank you to oursponsors whenever they come.
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