April 6, 2022 • 29 mins
William Sherak and his partners at Project X Entertainment think there's room for success in movie theaters beyond Marvel franchises; they've already proven it this year with the revival of the 'Scream' brand, and they're out to do it again with a Michael Bay action movie. But that's just the beginning for this ambitious company intent on pursuing M&A in hopes of becoming Hollywood's next mini-major.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
M h. Welcome to Strictly Business, the podcast in which
we talk with some of the brightest minds working in
the media business today. I'm Andrew Wallenstein with Variety. When
the new movie Ambulance opens in theaters this month, Hollywood
(00:22):
will once again put to the test a kind of
film that would seem to be an endangered species these days,
the mid budget movie. But my next guest is betting
these movies will defy extinction. William Sharik is one of
the principles at Project X Entertainment, production outfit that already
scored a mid budget this year with the revival of
(00:42):
the Scream franchise. We'll talk to William in just a moment.
Welcome back to Strictly Business, where we're talking with William
Sharik of Project X Entertainment. William, thanks for coming on
the podcast. Thanks for having me. First thing, I gotta
ask Project X what what's with the title? There's got
(01:05):
to be a story behind that. Uh myself, Jamie and
uh my two partner Shamie Vanderbilt and Pulline. Scene when
we were coming up with sort of the white board
of what we wanted the company to be and and
all of the things that we believed in. As we
looked at, you know, hopefully this being the last company
we ever start and doing this till we retired. We
(01:29):
we felt like we didn't have a company name, so
we just put a code name at the top of
every white piece of paper and it was Project X.
And then by the time the weekend was over of
us all sitting down, putting down, you know, putting all
our buzzwords and things we you know, our mission statement
all that, we kind of fell in love with the
code word and it stopped. And you've been out there
(01:49):
for about a year now, and of course scream uh
is your first film? Is it out? For Project X?
It is and obviously or maybe not obviously a success.
I'm going to assume you weren't surprised. I'd like to
know why you had faith in this franchise. So, you know,
(02:11):
I think one we're lovers of the franchise. So anytime
you love something, you want to believe there's continued success
possible with it. UM. And when we when Gary Barbera
allowed us to to get involved in rebuilding it for him,
with him and for him, UM, we just believe that
audience after four movies it's been a decade since the
(02:32):
last one wanted wanted something fun again, you know, I
think post pandemic or middle of pandemic. The idea of
fun horror is is something that we as a company love.
We you know, Jamie and I produced before Project that
we start Project, we produced a movie called Ready or
Not Together, um, which was a matchup of you know,
(02:54):
horror comedy and scream is the is the pinnacle of that, right,
something that you have so much fun but still get
scared to death. Um. So we never never wavered on
the idea that bringing it back was something that would
be successful in at this moment in time. Well, speaking
of scared to death, I'm curious, were you at all
(03:17):
scared putting this movie out in theaters at a time
when nothing is a sure bet? The answer is a
qualified kind of you know. I think that I'm a
kid who grew up in the eighties and nineties, and
I grew up with a father and distribution, and I
believe in the theatrical experience. I always will till the
(03:40):
day I die, regardless of what's going on in our industry. UM,
So I'm always going to bet on it. Does that
mean every movie is right for it, no um. But
I believe that movies that you want to see with
other people will always work in the theatrical environment, and
a horror movies the movie you want to see with
other people, no question. But you know, I think the
(04:04):
prevailing wisdom these days is is if you're going to
go in the theaters and you're not a Marvel movie,
you've got your work cut out for you. And we've
seen plenty of failures and this whole notion of let's
call it as we've been been calling it, the mid
budget movie, which is, you know, somewhere between fifth, you know,
(04:25):
ten and fifty or sixty million dollars. It's not nearly
as expensive as the big Marvel blockbusters. It's not on
the other end sort of an art house oscar kind
of thing either. You're you're really staking project X on
these kind of movies. Ambulance is another one of these
kind of movies. Why because some I'm almost wondering if
(04:49):
people have come to you in this business and said,
are you nuts? No, I you know, I I think
I think I disagree with the premise that it can
only be the big Marvel movies And don't get me wrong.
I love them. I'm a fan. I've seen every single
one of them, but I do believe that. And if
you look at Ambulance and Screen, they're the two common
(05:09):
the common theme between the two of them, even though
they're different studios. Both studios planted a flag and said,
these will be theatrical movies, and I think, what what
we've forgotten? And look, it's hard coming out of a
pandemic because it's easy to forget the you know, a
day feels like a year, right, But don't forget. These
marketing and distribution people are very good at what they do.
(05:31):
I mean very good. And and the teams at both
Universal and Paramount that when they planted the flag and
said these will be theatrical movies, they turned on those machines.
And even though they are not the size of Marvel movies,
when you see the campaigns behind both of them, you
feel like they are big, big events that you're supposed
to go see in a movie theater. And I think
(05:54):
that when you plant a flag and don't waiver, these
people are very good at what they do, and they're
very good at telling an audience this is something you
should get out of your house. To come see. So
do you see a real future for mid budget movies.
Let's just let's not even talk about streaming yet. Theatrical
(06:15):
exclusive mid budget movies you think can work in the
indefinite future without question? That basically, and I the only
cabinet I get it give it is that I do
believe it is somewhat genre specific, right. I think there
are movies at mid budget that might not as we
look to the future, Um, depending on age, may age
(06:36):
breakdown and sort of what the audience may or may
not be for that movie. Um, I think you can
get stuck in no man's land for lack of a
better term. But in the right genre, regardless of budget,
I do believe there's a theatrical marketplace for movies. Okay,
I agree with you to an extent when when you
talk about Scream, for instance, I think fun horror movies
(06:58):
are going to have a place in theaters for a
long long time to come. Certainly, I p like Scream
that's already well known is going to have a big advantage.
But I have to be honest, I'm a little skeptical
about a movie like Ambulance, which, let's let's explain it
a Little is sort of like a police chase movie that, honestly,
(07:19):
you turn on Netflix these days you see a lot
of that. Some of it you even see with your
star Jake Jillen Hall, who was in a Netflix movie
of this type earlier this year. So how does the
genre of the police chase work for mid budget success?
I think it's opportunity. I think it's if you had
(07:40):
the opportunity to see the movies you're talking about streaming
in a in a massive platform, and they put the
campaign behind it to say you should go do this,
and it's a filmmaker that resonates in terms of the
look says I should see this on a massive screen.
Let's be like the seventy inch television or eighty five
inch television is amazing on your living room wall, it
(08:02):
is not forty five ft wide. And there is something
different when you take the guy who is arguably the
best at doing this thing right, Michael Bay, and you
let him do it in Los Angeles in a car chase, right,
with things blowing up in fires and all of that
stuff that and I mean that I don't think there's
(08:23):
anybody better at better at it in our generation. I
think that it is a different differentiator. I think if
any of those other movies you're talking about planted a
flag and said we're going to give you a window
and a time to come see it, and a campaign
behind it that made it an event, I think they
do have the opportunity to succeed. Do I think that
(08:44):
at certain budget levels, as you kind of get higher
and higher and higher, there probably is a danger zone.
Right when you think about a million one twenty, you
know where you go, what do I have to spend
and release it versus what can I do theatrically? But
when you're in the midget, mid budget range, your cash
(09:05):
break number is such a lower number where success I
think we also have to redefine success, right. Success no
longer has to be eight hundred million dollars with the
box office with a mid budget movie. You know, we're
so used to seeing these, and I say so used.
I don't want to take it for granted, but Marvel
and d C and some of these animated movies have
(09:27):
have changed our expectations in hundred and ninety million opening weekend,
and if you don't see that, you go it's not
a success. I would certainly agree with that we're talking though,
about a director like Michael Bay, we're talking about a
star like Jake Jillenhall. What do you think about the
drawing power of those names here and your ability to
(09:50):
generate success, Because certainly they're well known quantities, but I
you know, they're not. I wouldn't say they're sort of
a list A plus list. Um, will they be enough
to make the difference for you with this movie? I
think so. I think that one. I think they are.
I think from a talent standpoint, they're absolutely a plus.
I think that, um, I wouldn't know how to define
(10:15):
what you're what I think you're trying to get to
with the definition of that A plus actor, I would argue,
in today's world, Jake is without question. I think that,
you know, what we've moved away from is that, you know,
late eighties, early nineties, the poster is the movie star
on the you know, and that it doesn't matter what
(10:35):
the movie is, right. I remember right growing up, every
Tom Hanks movie it was like it didn't matter the
thing that made him so specially, you could put his
face on a poster and I like him. I'm going
to see that. I think we sell movies differently today,
So I think you don't have to look at it
the same way understood. You know, I think it was it.
(10:56):
I think I read that this movie costs fifty million dollars.
Is that I in the neighborhood. You're in the neighborhood, Okay. Um.
Michael Bay is a guy who you know, years back
probably didn't roll out of bed for a movie below
a hundred million? Was this something he was comfortable making
at that price tag? Was that in an adjustment to
(11:18):
the Michael Michael Bay way of doing things? The opposite
this is this is the movie he wanted to make.
He came out at the exact opposite way, which is,
we should make this as a down in dirty movie
in Los Angeles. And when we shot it during the pandemic,
he he saw that it could be done for a price.
He he was the one who tackled it. He was
(11:39):
the one who came up with how much we should
shoot it for? Um, And he came in saying, I
want to go back to that world where you know,
Mike little micro days with action units and and not
doing the giant thing. And and I think that's what
makes that's that's what makes this one special you know,
(12:00):
is we've when you get when you do years of
those massive, massive movies, of which they are spectacles and
amazing to watch. We forget the that version of Michael Bay,
you forget this version, which is arguably one of the
best shoot action shooters to ever live, and you just
(12:20):
you give him a camera and a car crash and
he will figure out how to do something cooler than
you have seen. And that's not special effects, that's not
that is purely a man in his camera and what
he's good at, and it's it's like nobody else. So
he's if you have a filmmaker who wants to do it,
it's amazing what you could accomplish. His track record certainly
(12:44):
speaks for itself. I'm also curious to get your sense
of in this very different theatrical marketplace, this post pandemic marketplace. UM,
I'm curious about your take with regard to shrinking window
for these movies in the theater. The days of the
(13:04):
ninety day are over now. It's depending on where you are,
forty five or thirty. Um. Does that figure into your
calculations of how to make movies work in theaters. No, Um,
it doesn't. I think I don't think you can. As
a producer, I don't think you can outsmart or overthink
(13:29):
the distribution platforms that exist. They're gonna they're going to
do what's good for their businesses, as they should. And
as a producer, if you want to be in the
theatrical business, you figure out the place that has the
most in line interests with how you see the world.
With Ambulance, Universal sees that the actual window is valuable
(13:49):
and we love we love that, and then whatever the
window is for them, you create the box that exists.
And we went in with my wanting to do this
size movie and it fit in that box where we
could be successful in a window. And you know, it's
not quite reverse engineering, but I think you have to.
(14:11):
You have to understand the what these businesses are going
through and then create, you know, sort of the right
environment to go be successful in that specific box. You know.
I'm also curious about the appetite for mid budget movies
(14:31):
at the streaming services, where you could have conceivably steered
Ambulance and perhaps we'll steer other things. What is your
sense of the marketplace there. Do you think you could
end up doing more for streaming services, and you necessarily
would for theaters in the future. I you know, it's funny.
I don't look at the world that way. I look
(14:53):
at the world at from from our perspective. At project text.
We develop our proper our material house. When we're ready
to take it to the town, we decide, we try
and decide what's right for that specific piece of content,
and then go try and get it done. In that
we don't look at the world and say everything has
to be x or y um and I think the
(15:16):
right way in today's marketplace is to have a good
mix across the board. There are certain projects that should
be streaming. For me, mid budget things or high bunche
of things are low budget things that will fit perfectly
in a streaming platform. Um And I think to be
successful as a producer, independent or otherwise, it's always been
(15:36):
a relationship business and it has to continue to be
that right because making movies is hard, so you might
as well make movies with people you like. So relationships
is a very important piece of our business. And I
think you need to have projects everywhere in all kinds
of mediums and plant and distribution platforms to be successful.
So we look at it and say what's the right
mix for us in any given year in terms of
(15:59):
project we have set up so that as things cycle
through getting made, you have a good mix of streaming
of theatrical release. You know, those are those are all
good ways to keep a business healthy. We're talking with
William Sharik and we'll be back with him in just
a moment. And we're back with William Sharick of Project
(16:22):
X Entertainment, producer of films like Scream, the Latest One
and the upcoming Ambulance. William, I want to talk more
about Project X and what you're doing there, because you
know you've got off to a nice start this year.
There's I think four movies or maybe three, and and
you also have a limited series is it The Night
(16:45):
Agent set up at Netflix as well. It's it's a
busy year. Um, what is the next phase of growth
for your company? Um? You know, we kind of look
at it in different phases. I think phase one. And
because you know, Jamie, Paul and I my two partners,
um have all been doing this for a pretty long time.
(17:06):
It was proving to ourselves in the industry that as
a partnership the three of us could be successful in
sort of what you would call the traditional producing you know,
the traditional producing ways, developing material, getting out in the marketplace,
getting the maide having to be successful, I think year
one and to prove that, you know, Scream came out,
(17:26):
was was successful. We're super excited we were getting a sequel,
will shoot this summer um Ambulance. I could not be
more proud of as well, you know, we put it together.
It's a it's a great piece of material with an
amazing filmmaker and stars, and Universal is really happy and
they've been an unbelievable partner. Our first TV show is
a series of Netflix that Shawn Ryan created with us
(17:48):
UM based on a book we option called The Night Agent.
And then we have a movie UM with Sts that
comes out in July called bed Rest with the first
time director right, a writer director that we love, Nick
Lori Evans Taylor, and we're super thrilled to prove that
she can be a big director in the world. And
so for us that that's phase one, right, proving to
(18:10):
the world that this group of few people together, even
though individually we've all had you know, a certain level
of success and getting things made in and things that
people enjoyed as a group, we can do it. Phase two,
because we want to stay independent UM will be some
version of building, buying or raising a platform so that
(18:31):
we don't need to go into a bigger infrastructure UM
and for us, that is either raising a fund UM
buying a business that is currently its own platform, and
then putting our talents on top of that as a
management team, but at the end of the day, creating
a cash flows creating a business that has a big
(18:51):
enough cash flow stream where we can stay independent and
continue to UM to developed material, co find material and
you know, and and sort of uh create our own destiny.
Sounds audacious. I want to understand better than what you
mean by acquiring a platform. And I know I'm not
asking you to sort of tip your hand what you're
gonna do, but give me a better sense of what
(19:13):
that means. Do you want to buy a Netflix or something?
I mean no, no, no, I for us think much smaller,
right Like for us, it's it's I want to you know,
there are there are independent companies out there that have
done a great job over the years of building a
small library of content UM and as those cycle through
the sales process, right people retire, they want to sell
(19:35):
their libraries. There's constantly small things out there that are available,
and if you acquire them, you're building you know, ongoing
cash flow, which can you know build sort of prop
up a business. I think, you know, one of the
things that differentiates us is that separate of producing or
with Jamie writing directing, we have some more traditional business backgrounds. Um.
(20:00):
You know, my partner pull Mine scene random business affairs
at Paramount for ten years, then was the CEO of
rat Pack and did all the slate financing deals, so
he has that background. UM. I took a little bit
of time off from producing about eleven years ago and
created what became the largest we D conversion company in
the world and sold that to Ron Perlman's Deluxe, and
then became president of Creative Group of Deluxe and did
(20:22):
half a dozen M and A transactions in that world,
and then during the pandemic, through Platinum Equity, bought back
Deluxe the post production entity. So we have a ton
of M and A background UM, So it's sort of
as opposed to just creative producing, So there's a there's
a direct sort of link for us to go use
(20:44):
those skill sets and turn project X into more of
a as opposed to producer for higher and fee based
more of a enterprise and growing enterprise value in business. Well,
it's certainly an interesting time to have that ambition because
the marketplace out there for content companies right now is
(21:08):
like nothing I've ever seen. I think, Frau frau that
you would be an understatement. UM. But I wonder if
that represents a challenge because some of the price tags
on some of these companies is they've been driven up
quite high because of all the interest private equities out
there hunting. Um. So what do you think of this marketplace?
Does it help you, hurt you? I think it helps.
(21:29):
There's so much money on the sidelines to put into
it that, you know, look for us, the checks we'd
be looking at aren't checks we could afford. You're going
to need to bring in a financial sponsor to help
you do it. So all of the places you're talking
about that have driven the pricing up, those would be
our partners. So I'm because we're also we believe we're
good at what we do UM, and we want to
(21:51):
keep doing it. We're not looking to retire. I think
if we can take our ability to um to scale
capacity in a in a library that generates cash flow.
Regardless of price you pay, you can continue to grow
the enterprise value. So I'm not worried. I'm not worried today.
Even if pricing is high, I don't think it drops
(22:13):
in the next decade, twenty years from now. Who knows, right, Like,
let's be clear that you know, there could be somebody
working on a piece of technology that none of us
have even thought of. But at least for the foreseeable future,
the value of content is not going down. Okay, pre
acquisition though, uh you it seems like you're still partnering
(22:33):
with studios though you still have the ability to finance
if you want to. And where where does that come from?
Do you have backers and and they're ready to help
fund a acquisition as well? Well, So that from a
development standpoint, self funded. From a production standpoint, you know,
(22:54):
we're we're not in a place at the moment to
fully co fide um, but we are in a place
where um, given the right financial given the right financial
you know, sort of box any one movie is put in.
If there is a way to be more financing, create
(23:14):
a financing opportunity that's what Paul does. So bed Rest
wasn't minimum guarantee from STX. We met, we banked, and
we own and so we did that movie. We did
the movie that movie that way. UM, so we have
the ability to go get financing um and because we
know how to structure those deals, we'd be able to
create that opportunity if it's the right project for us. Okay,
I mean it sounds like you've got ambitions to be
(23:37):
what what's known in the business as a mini major,
something that could stand side by side with some of
the bigger studios, but you would be no small fry.
That's the hope, right, I think you you want to
do that. You want to build a place where all
of our friends and colleagues that we've had so much
fun working with over the years can come and create. Um.
(23:58):
That's the goal, right, is to to give all of
our content creating friends, right, the true creatives, just another
place to develop that they're excited to work with and
and that we can scale a business that content creators
enjoy working with. And then the nimble. The thing we
don't want to do is get so big where you
can't be nimble. We want to stay in the world
(24:19):
where we are always independent, so our nimbleness allows us
then to sell to any distributor. We should make clear
you're not just in the movie business. We talked about
The Night Agent. I think you also have an animated
show set up at Fox based on the Bloom County
comic strip. Isn't TV really sort of the better market
(24:40):
right now than compared to film anyway? You know, I
don't know. I think that. I guess I don't look
at the world that way. I look at the world
that you want to have a great mix. You want
to you want to be creating content for all the
different mediums of distribution, um, whether that be you know,
(25:00):
limited series, animation, normal series, network series, film, whether it
be theatrical, extreaming. I think we want to create a world,
an environment at Project X where we have proven ourselves
in each of the mediums, so we have a project
that's right for any one of them, we can go
get it done. That's how we look at the world.
I don't think it's a one is better or the
(25:22):
other than the other. We look at it as we
we as a group of partners, love consuming all of it.
So what's the right story to tell in what medium
is sort of the way we look at it and
we go from there. You know bloom County I mentioned,
And there's other things on your development slide, be it
(25:43):
film or TV that are kind of like Scream. You know,
old franchises that you might be looking to revive or reboot.
I'm curious whether it's Scream or anything else. How do
you figure out what intellectual property out there could resonate again? Had?
I mean, I think you talk about a good story
(26:04):
and having fun with people you want to partner with,
But how do you know what I p has a
sort of a reservoir of goodwill out in the audience
worth tapping. Um. I think you pretend you're smart and
hope you're lucky, right. I think, Look, I think it's
all gut and you're either going to be right or wrong. Um.
(26:26):
But you know, we have a saying a project XT
not everybody has to like it, but somebody here has
to love it. And as long as somebody loves it,
we can all get behind because I think the passion
of liking, of loving it comes through in the creation
of it. We all love the screen franchise, we love it, right,
we love the original. We loved all of the three
(26:46):
others um that followed, and I think the fun of
this new one comes through in our love of everything
West Craven Kevin Williamson did Opus and Blue County another one.
What Berkeley created that comic strip is second to none. Right,
he want to feel a surprise for it. I think
getting to revive, although not revives unfair. He's been doing
(27:09):
the comic strips recently. UM, so it's not a revival
as much as it is let's turn it into a
visual medium. Yeah, a moving image medium, not just a
comic strip. Um. We think we're gonna be right right.
We look at what Berkeley's done, and he's gonna be
the north star of this show and create it. Um.
We think as an animated show it can live forever. Um.
(27:31):
And we're excited about it. But I don't think you
can ever pretend you truly know. We just we love
what we love and we're going to get behind that
and work as hard as we can to make it successful.
And then once it's out there, the audience is going
to tell you if you were right or not. And
I assume that's a project for beyond two. Uh. What
(27:53):
does the post two slate look like right now? What
could we see the year after? Do you have you
guys sort of map that far ahead yet in terms
of what's going to come out? Um, yeah, we have
a we have you know, a handful of TV things
and a handful of feature things that we're getting ready
to take to market. Obviously Screen the next screen, which
(28:13):
we're very excited about. We start shooting in June, so
you know, it's it's it's a combination of feature and
television and and as we got to market with stuff,
you know, we've we've had a pretty good conversion rate
of getting stuck made in the hope is we stick
in that same world, but we try and go to
market with stuff that's a little more ready to go
(28:34):
as opposed to being in development for a long time,
So we kind of hold stuff in house longer in
hopes that when we do go out with it, it's
sort of let's go make this. Well. I'm really looking
forward to seeing what the world holds for you and
Project x Uh, not just for Ambulance in the coming weeks,
but uh in the years ahead. You've got quite an
(28:55):
ambitious UH agenda ahead of the company and I wish
you the best with it. Thank you so much and
thanks for allowing me to be on this. It was
a ton of fun and UH look forward to hearing
what comes next for you. This has been another episode
(29:16):
of Strictly Business. Tune in next week for another helping
of scintillating conversation with media movers and shakers, and please
make sure you subscribe to the podcast to hear future episodes. Also,
leave a review in Apple Podcasts and let us know
how we're doing.
M h. Welcome to Strictly Business, the podcast in which
we talk with some of the brightest minds working in
the media business today. I'm Andrew Wallenstein with Variety. When
the new movie Ambulance opens in theaters this month, Hollywood
(00:22):
will once again put to the test a kind of
film that would seem to be an endangered species these days,
the mid budget movie. But my next guest is betting
these movies will defy extinction. William Sharik is one of
the principles at Project X Entertainment, production outfit that already
scored a mid budget this year with the revival of
(00:42):
the Scream franchise. We'll talk to William in just a moment.
Welcome back to Strictly Business, where we're talking with William
Sharik of Project X Entertainment. William, thanks for coming on
the podcast. Thanks for having me. First thing, I gotta
ask Project X what what's with the title? There's got
(01:05):
to be a story behind that. Uh myself, Jamie and
uh my two partner Shamie Vanderbilt and Pulline. Scene when
we were coming up with sort of the white board
of what we wanted the company to be and and
all of the things that we believed in. As we
looked at, you know, hopefully this being the last company
we ever start and doing this till we retired. We
(01:29):
we felt like we didn't have a company name, so
we just put a code name at the top of
every white piece of paper and it was Project X.
And then by the time the weekend was over of
us all sitting down, putting down, you know, putting all
our buzzwords and things we you know, our mission statement
all that, we kind of fell in love with the
code word and it stopped. And you've been out there
(01:49):
for about a year now, and of course scream uh
is your first film? Is it out? For Project X?
It is and obviously or maybe not obviously a success.
I'm going to assume you weren't surprised. I'd like to
know why you had faith in this franchise. So, you know,
(02:11):
I think one we're lovers of the franchise. So anytime
you love something, you want to believe there's continued success
possible with it. UM. And when we when Gary Barbera
allowed us to to get involved in rebuilding it for him,
with him and for him, UM, we just believe that
audience after four movies it's been a decade since the
(02:32):
last one wanted wanted something fun again, you know, I
think post pandemic or middle of pandemic. The idea of
fun horror is is something that we as a company love.
We you know, Jamie and I produced before Project that
we start Project, we produced a movie called Ready or
Not Together, um, which was a matchup of you know,
(02:54):
horror comedy and scream is the is the pinnacle of that, right,
something that you have so much fun but still get
scared to death. Um. So we never never wavered on
the idea that bringing it back was something that would
be successful in at this moment in time. Well, speaking
of scared to death, I'm curious, were you at all
(03:17):
scared putting this movie out in theaters at a time
when nothing is a sure bet? The answer is a
qualified kind of you know. I think that I'm a
kid who grew up in the eighties and nineties, and
I grew up with a father and distribution, and I
believe in the theatrical experience. I always will till the
(03:40):
day I die, regardless of what's going on in our industry. UM,
So I'm always going to bet on it. Does that
mean every movie is right for it, no um. But
I believe that movies that you want to see with
other people will always work in the theatrical environment, and
a horror movies the movie you want to see with
other people, no question. But you know, I think the
(04:04):
prevailing wisdom these days is is if you're going to
go in the theaters and you're not a Marvel movie,
you've got your work cut out for you. And we've
seen plenty of failures and this whole notion of let's
call it as we've been been calling it, the mid
budget movie, which is, you know, somewhere between fifth, you know,
(04:25):
ten and fifty or sixty million dollars. It's not nearly
as expensive as the big Marvel blockbusters. It's not on
the other end sort of an art house oscar kind
of thing either. You're you're really staking project X on
these kind of movies. Ambulance is another one of these
kind of movies. Why because some I'm almost wondering if
(04:49):
people have come to you in this business and said,
are you nuts? No, I you know, I I think
I think I disagree with the premise that it can
only be the big Marvel movies And don't get me wrong.
I love them. I'm a fan. I've seen every single
one of them, but I do believe that. And if
you look at Ambulance and Screen, they're the two common
(05:09):
the common theme between the two of them, even though
they're different studios. Both studios planted a flag and said,
these will be theatrical movies, and I think, what what
we've forgotten? And look, it's hard coming out of a
pandemic because it's easy to forget the you know, a
day feels like a year, right, But don't forget. These
marketing and distribution people are very good at what they do.
(05:31):
I mean very good. And and the teams at both
Universal and Paramount that when they planted the flag and
said these will be theatrical movies, they turned on those machines.
And even though they are not the size of Marvel movies,
when you see the campaigns behind both of them, you
feel like they are big, big events that you're supposed
to go see in a movie theater. And I think
(05:54):
that when you plant a flag and don't waiver, these
people are very good at what they do, and they're
very good at telling an audience this is something you
should get out of your house. To come see. So
do you see a real future for mid budget movies.
Let's just let's not even talk about streaming yet. Theatrical
(06:15):
exclusive mid budget movies you think can work in the
indefinite future without question? That basically, and I the only
cabinet I get it give it is that I do
believe it is somewhat genre specific, right. I think there
are movies at mid budget that might not as we
look to the future, Um, depending on age, may age
(06:36):
breakdown and sort of what the audience may or may
not be for that movie. Um, I think you can
get stuck in no man's land for lack of a
better term. But in the right genre, regardless of budget,
I do believe there's a theatrical marketplace for movies. Okay,
I agree with you to an extent when when you
talk about Scream, for instance, I think fun horror movies
(06:58):
are going to have a place in theaters for a
long long time to come. Certainly, I p like Scream
that's already well known is going to have a big advantage.
But I have to be honest, I'm a little skeptical
about a movie like Ambulance, which, let's let's explain it
a Little is sort of like a police chase movie that, honestly,
(07:19):
you turn on Netflix these days you see a lot
of that. Some of it you even see with your
star Jake Jillen Hall, who was in a Netflix movie
of this type earlier this year. So how does the
genre of the police chase work for mid budget success?
I think it's opportunity. I think it's if you had
(07:40):
the opportunity to see the movies you're talking about streaming
in a in a massive platform, and they put the
campaign behind it to say you should go do this,
and it's a filmmaker that resonates in terms of the
look says I should see this on a massive screen.
Let's be like the seventy inch television or eighty five
inch television is amazing on your living room wall, it
(08:02):
is not forty five ft wide. And there is something
different when you take the guy who is arguably the
best at doing this thing right, Michael Bay, and you
let him do it in Los Angeles in a car chase, right,
with things blowing up in fires and all of that
stuff that and I mean that I don't think there's
(08:23):
anybody better at better at it in our generation. I
think that it is a different differentiator. I think if
any of those other movies you're talking about planted a
flag and said we're going to give you a window
and a time to come see it, and a campaign
behind it that made it an event, I think they
do have the opportunity to succeed. Do I think that
(08:44):
at certain budget levels, as you kind of get higher
and higher and higher, there probably is a danger zone.
Right when you think about a million one twenty, you
know where you go, what do I have to spend
and release it versus what can I do theatrically? But
when you're in the midget, mid budget range, your cash
(09:05):
break number is such a lower number where success I
think we also have to redefine success, right. Success no
longer has to be eight hundred million dollars with the
box office with a mid budget movie. You know, we're
so used to seeing these, and I say so used.
I don't want to take it for granted, but Marvel
and d C and some of these animated movies have
(09:27):
have changed our expectations in hundred and ninety million opening weekend,
and if you don't see that, you go it's not
a success. I would certainly agree with that we're talking though,
about a director like Michael Bay, we're talking about a
star like Jake Jillenhall. What do you think about the
drawing power of those names here and your ability to
(09:50):
generate success, Because certainly they're well known quantities, but I
you know, they're not. I wouldn't say they're sort of
a list A plus list. Um, will they be enough
to make the difference for you with this movie? I
think so. I think that one. I think they are.
I think from a talent standpoint, they're absolutely a plus.
I think that, um, I wouldn't know how to define
(10:15):
what you're what I think you're trying to get to
with the definition of that A plus actor, I would argue,
in today's world, Jake is without question. I think that,
you know, what we've moved away from is that, you know,
late eighties, early nineties, the poster is the movie star
on the you know, and that it doesn't matter what
(10:35):
the movie is, right. I remember right growing up, every
Tom Hanks movie it was like it didn't matter the
thing that made him so specially, you could put his
face on a poster and I like him. I'm going
to see that. I think we sell movies differently today,
So I think you don't have to look at it
the same way understood. You know, I think it was it.
(10:56):
I think I read that this movie costs fifty million dollars.
Is that I in the neighborhood. You're in the neighborhood, Okay. Um.
Michael Bay is a guy who you know, years back
probably didn't roll out of bed for a movie below
a hundred million? Was this something he was comfortable making
at that price tag? Was that in an adjustment to
(11:18):
the Michael Michael Bay way of doing things? The opposite
this is this is the movie he wanted to make.
He came out at the exact opposite way, which is,
we should make this as a down in dirty movie
in Los Angeles. And when we shot it during the pandemic,
he he saw that it could be done for a price.
He he was the one who tackled it. He was
(11:39):
the one who came up with how much we should
shoot it for? Um, And he came in saying, I
want to go back to that world where you know,
Mike little micro days with action units and and not
doing the giant thing. And and I think that's what
makes that's that's what makes this one special you know,
(12:00):
is we've when you get when you do years of
those massive, massive movies, of which they are spectacles and
amazing to watch. We forget the that version of Michael Bay,
you forget this version, which is arguably one of the
best shoot action shooters to ever live, and you just
(12:20):
you give him a camera and a car crash and
he will figure out how to do something cooler than
you have seen. And that's not special effects, that's not
that is purely a man in his camera and what
he's good at, and it's it's like nobody else. So
he's if you have a filmmaker who wants to do it,
it's amazing what you could accomplish. His track record certainly
(12:44):
speaks for itself. I'm also curious to get your sense
of in this very different theatrical marketplace, this post pandemic marketplace. UM,
I'm curious about your take with regard to shrinking window
for these movies in the theater. The days of the
(13:04):
ninety day are over now. It's depending on where you are,
forty five or thirty. Um. Does that figure into your
calculations of how to make movies work in theaters. No, Um,
it doesn't. I think I don't think you can. As
a producer, I don't think you can outsmart or overthink
(13:29):
the distribution platforms that exist. They're gonna they're going to
do what's good for their businesses, as they should. And
as a producer, if you want to be in the
theatrical business, you figure out the place that has the
most in line interests with how you see the world.
With Ambulance, Universal sees that the actual window is valuable
(13:49):
and we love we love that, and then whatever the
window is for them, you create the box that exists.
And we went in with my wanting to do this
size movie and it fit in that box where we
could be successful in a window. And you know, it's
not quite reverse engineering, but I think you have to.
(14:11):
You have to understand the what these businesses are going
through and then create, you know, sort of the right
environment to go be successful in that specific box. You know.
I'm also curious about the appetite for mid budget movies
(14:31):
at the streaming services, where you could have conceivably steered
Ambulance and perhaps we'll steer other things. What is your
sense of the marketplace there. Do you think you could
end up doing more for streaming services, and you necessarily
would for theaters in the future. I you know, it's funny.
I don't look at the world that way. I look
(14:53):
at the world at from from our perspective. At project text.
We develop our proper our material house. When we're ready
to take it to the town, we decide, we try
and decide what's right for that specific piece of content,
and then go try and get it done. In that
we don't look at the world and say everything has
to be x or y um and I think the
(15:16):
right way in today's marketplace is to have a good
mix across the board. There are certain projects that should
be streaming. For me, mid budget things or high bunche
of things are low budget things that will fit perfectly
in a streaming platform. Um And I think to be
successful as a producer, independent or otherwise, it's always been
(15:36):
a relationship business and it has to continue to be
that right because making movies is hard, so you might
as well make movies with people you like. So relationships
is a very important piece of our business. And I
think you need to have projects everywhere in all kinds
of mediums and plant and distribution platforms to be successful.
So we look at it and say what's the right
mix for us in any given year in terms of
(15:59):
project we have set up so that as things cycle
through getting made, you have a good mix of streaming
of theatrical release. You know, those are those are all
good ways to keep a business healthy. We're talking with
William Sharik and we'll be back with him in just
a moment. And we're back with William Sharick of Project
(16:22):
X Entertainment, producer of films like Scream, the Latest One
and the upcoming Ambulance. William, I want to talk more
about Project X and what you're doing there, because you
know you've got off to a nice start this year.
There's I think four movies or maybe three, and and
you also have a limited series is it The Night
(16:45):
Agent set up at Netflix as well. It's it's a
busy year. Um, what is the next phase of growth
for your company? Um? You know, we kind of look
at it in different phases. I think phase one. And
because you know, Jamie, Paul and I my two partners,
um have all been doing this for a pretty long time.
(17:06):
It was proving to ourselves in the industry that as
a partnership the three of us could be successful in
sort of what you would call the traditional producing you know,
the traditional producing ways, developing material, getting out in the marketplace,
getting the maide having to be successful, I think year
one and to prove that, you know, Scream came out,
(17:26):
was was successful. We're super excited we were getting a sequel,
will shoot this summer um Ambulance. I could not be
more proud of as well, you know, we put it together.
It's a it's a great piece of material with an
amazing filmmaker and stars, and Universal is really happy and
they've been an unbelievable partner. Our first TV show is
a series of Netflix that Shawn Ryan created with us
(17:48):
UM based on a book we option called The Night Agent.
And then we have a movie UM with Sts that
comes out in July called bed Rest with the first
time director right, a writer director that we love, Nick
Lori Evans Taylor, and we're super thrilled to prove that
she can be a big director in the world. And
so for us that that's phase one, right, proving to
(18:10):
the world that this group of few people together, even
though individually we've all had you know, a certain level
of success and getting things made in and things that
people enjoyed as a group, we can do it. Phase two,
because we want to stay independent UM will be some
version of building, buying or raising a platform so that
(18:31):
we don't need to go into a bigger infrastructure UM
and for us, that is either raising a fund UM
buying a business that is currently its own platform, and
then putting our talents on top of that as a
management team, but at the end of the day, creating
a cash flows creating a business that has a big
(18:51):
enough cash flow stream where we can stay independent and
continue to UM to developed material, co find material and
you know, and and sort of uh create our own destiny.
Sounds audacious. I want to understand better than what you
mean by acquiring a platform. And I know I'm not
asking you to sort of tip your hand what you're
gonna do, but give me a better sense of what
(19:13):
that means. Do you want to buy a Netflix or something?
I mean no, no, no, I for us think much smaller,
right Like for us, it's it's I want to you know,
there are there are independent companies out there that have
done a great job over the years of building a
small library of content UM and as those cycle through
the sales process, right people retire, they want to sell
(19:35):
their libraries. There's constantly small things out there that are available,
and if you acquire them, you're building you know, ongoing
cash flow, which can you know build sort of prop
up a business. I think, you know, one of the
things that differentiates us is that separate of producing or
with Jamie writing directing, we have some more traditional business backgrounds. Um.
(20:00):
You know, my partner pull Mine scene random business affairs
at Paramount for ten years, then was the CEO of
rat Pack and did all the slate financing deals, so
he has that background. UM. I took a little bit
of time off from producing about eleven years ago and
created what became the largest we D conversion company in
the world and sold that to Ron Perlman's Deluxe, and
then became president of Creative Group of Deluxe and did
(20:22):
half a dozen M and A transactions in that world,
and then during the pandemic, through Platinum Equity, bought back
Deluxe the post production entity. So we have a ton
of M and A background UM, So it's sort of
as opposed to just creative producing, So there's a there's
a direct sort of link for us to go use
(20:44):
those skill sets and turn project X into more of
a as opposed to producer for higher and fee based
more of a enterprise and growing enterprise value in business. Well,
it's certainly an interesting time to have that ambition because
the marketplace out there for content companies right now is
(21:08):
like nothing I've ever seen. I think, Frau frau that
you would be an understatement. UM. But I wonder if
that represents a challenge because some of the price tags
on some of these companies is they've been driven up
quite high because of all the interest private equities out
there hunting. Um. So what do you think of this marketplace?
Does it help you, hurt you? I think it helps.
(21:29):
There's so much money on the sidelines to put into
it that, you know, look for us, the checks we'd
be looking at aren't checks we could afford. You're going
to need to bring in a financial sponsor to help
you do it. So all of the places you're talking
about that have driven the pricing up, those would be
our partners. So I'm because we're also we believe we're
good at what we do UM, and we want to
(21:51):
keep doing it. We're not looking to retire. I think
if we can take our ability to um to scale
capacity in a in a library that generates cash flow.
Regardless of price you pay, you can continue to grow
the enterprise value. So I'm not worried. I'm not worried today.
Even if pricing is high, I don't think it drops
(22:13):
in the next decade, twenty years from now. Who knows, right, Like,
let's be clear that you know, there could be somebody
working on a piece of technology that none of us
have even thought of. But at least for the foreseeable future,
the value of content is not going down. Okay, pre
acquisition though, uh you it seems like you're still partnering
(22:33):
with studios though you still have the ability to finance
if you want to. And where where does that come from?
Do you have backers and and they're ready to help
fund a acquisition as well? Well, So that from a
development standpoint, self funded. From a production standpoint, you know,
(22:54):
we're we're not in a place at the moment to
fully co fide um, but we are in a place
where um, given the right financial given the right financial
you know, sort of box any one movie is put in.
If there is a way to be more financing, create
(23:14):
a financing opportunity that's what Paul does. So bed Rest
wasn't minimum guarantee from STX. We met, we banked, and
we own and so we did that movie. We did
the movie that movie that way. UM, so we have
the ability to go get financing um and because we
know how to structure those deals, we'd be able to
create that opportunity if it's the right project for us. Okay,
I mean it sounds like you've got ambitions to be
(23:37):
what what's known in the business as a mini major,
something that could stand side by side with some of
the bigger studios, but you would be no small fry.
That's the hope, right, I think you you want to
do that. You want to build a place where all
of our friends and colleagues that we've had so much
fun working with over the years can come and create. Um.
(23:58):
That's the goal, right, is to to give all of
our content creating friends, right, the true creatives, just another
place to develop that they're excited to work with and
and that we can scale a business that content creators
enjoy working with. And then the nimble. The thing we
don't want to do is get so big where you
can't be nimble. We want to stay in the world
(24:19):
where we are always independent, so our nimbleness allows us
then to sell to any distributor. We should make clear
you're not just in the movie business. We talked about
The Night Agent. I think you also have an animated
show set up at Fox based on the Bloom County
comic strip. Isn't TV really sort of the better market
(24:40):
right now than compared to film anyway? You know, I
don't know. I think that. I guess I don't look
at the world that way. I look at the world
that you want to have a great mix. You want
to you want to be creating content for all the
different mediums of distribution, um, whether that be you know,
(25:00):
limited series, animation, normal series, network series, film, whether it
be theatrical, extreaming. I think we want to create a world,
an environment at Project X where we have proven ourselves
in each of the mediums, so we have a project
that's right for any one of them, we can go
get it done. That's how we look at the world.
I don't think it's a one is better or the
(25:22):
other than the other. We look at it as we
we as a group of partners, love consuming all of it.
So what's the right story to tell in what medium
is sort of the way we look at it and
we go from there. You know bloom County I mentioned,
And there's other things on your development slide, be it
(25:43):
film or TV that are kind of like Scream. You know,
old franchises that you might be looking to revive or reboot.
I'm curious whether it's Scream or anything else. How do
you figure out what intellectual property out there could resonate again? Had?
I mean, I think you talk about a good story
(26:04):
and having fun with people you want to partner with,
But how do you know what I p has a
sort of a reservoir of goodwill out in the audience
worth tapping. Um. I think you pretend you're smart and
hope you're lucky, right. I think, Look, I think it's
all gut and you're either going to be right or wrong. Um.
(26:26):
But you know, we have a saying a project XT
not everybody has to like it, but somebody here has
to love it. And as long as somebody loves it,
we can all get behind because I think the passion
of liking, of loving it comes through in the creation
of it. We all love the screen franchise, we love it, right,
we love the original. We loved all of the three
(26:46):
others um that followed, and I think the fun of
this new one comes through in our love of everything
West Craven Kevin Williamson did Opus and Blue County another one.
What Berkeley created that comic strip is second to none. Right,
he want to feel a surprise for it. I think
getting to revive, although not revives unfair. He's been doing
(27:09):
the comic strips recently. UM, so it's not a revival
as much as it is let's turn it into a
visual medium. Yeah, a moving image medium, not just a
comic strip. Um. We think we're gonna be right right.
We look at what Berkeley's done, and he's gonna be
the north star of this show and create it. Um.
We think as an animated show it can live forever. Um.
(27:31):
And we're excited about it. But I don't think you
can ever pretend you truly know. We just we love
what we love and we're going to get behind that
and work as hard as we can to make it successful.
And then once it's out there, the audience is going
to tell you if you were right or not. And
I assume that's a project for beyond two. Uh. What
(27:53):
does the post two slate look like right now? What
could we see the year after? Do you have you
guys sort of map that far ahead yet in terms
of what's going to come out? Um, yeah, we have
a we have you know, a handful of TV things
and a handful of feature things that we're getting ready
to take to market. Obviously Screen the next screen, which
(28:13):
we're very excited about. We start shooting in June, so
you know, it's it's it's a combination of feature and
television and and as we got to market with stuff,
you know, we've we've had a pretty good conversion rate
of getting stuck made in the hope is we stick
in that same world, but we try and go to
market with stuff that's a little more ready to go
(28:34):
as opposed to being in development for a long time,
So we kind of hold stuff in house longer in
hopes that when we do go out with it, it's
sort of let's go make this. Well. I'm really looking
forward to seeing what the world holds for you and
Project x Uh, not just for Ambulance in the coming weeks,
but uh in the years ahead. You've got quite an
(28:55):
ambitious UH agenda ahead of the company and I wish
you the best with it. Thank you so much and
thanks for allowing me to be on this. It was
a ton of fun and UH look forward to hearing
what comes next for you. This has been another episode
(29:16):
of Strictly Business. Tune in next week for another helping
of scintillating conversation with media movers and shakers, and please
make sure you subscribe to the podcast to hear future episodes. Also,
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