July 28, 2021 • 50 mins
In this fun episode we dive into what it's like as a newbie to Podio and we're joined by Bavo De Cooman (from Quivvy) and Tim Castillo-Gill (from Future Solutions). Both have recently joined the companies and both share insights into what it's like to get into the Podio ecosystem.
This is a fun episode and a must listen for anyone who has to onboard new employees into Podio. We get to dive into some of the challenges that learning Podio has for new people, and how both of the guys started to see the limitless possibilities that Podio has the more they learned.
Show Links:
Check out Bavo and Quivvy Solutions - https://quivvy.com/en
Check out Tim and Future Solutions - https://futuresolutionsonline.co.uk/
Try out smrtPhone for free for 30 Days- http://bit.ly/smrtPhone-supercharged
Want to be on the show? Register Now - https://www.wearegamechangers.com/en/podcast/
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Narrator (00:00):
Welcome to powered by podio automation is everything.
supercharge your business withpodio. Get ready for another
episode of supercharged withJordan Samuel Fleming, your
weekly dive into the awesomeimpact workflow and automation
you can have on your businesswhen it's powered by podio. Join
(00:22):
us each week as we learn fromthe top podio partners in the
world as we investigate systemintegrations and add ons and
hear from real business ownerswho have implemented podio into
their business. Now, join yourhost Jordan Samuel Fleming, CEO
of game changers for this week'sepisode.
Jordan Fleming (00:45):
Hey, everybody, its Jordan, Samuel Fleming here
host of supercharge. I'm here totalk all about the power of
workflow and automation whenyour business is powered by
podio. And this week, to the funepisode, because I am joined by
two people in a group episode totalk a little about how new
people come into podio. And thisis particularly relevant if
(01:06):
you've got a company and you'reonboarding new staff. What are
the some of the challengesinvolved with that? What are the
things that that resonates withthem or doesn't resonate with
them. And so I reached out somemy pull your partner friends and
Mike from quibi tools and Petefrom future solutions happened
(01:27):
to both have two relatively newemployees babble and Tim, and
they joining me today, and we'rejust giving a bit of a newbie
experience to podio it's reallyfun discussion, we learned a bit
about their backgrounds, abouthow they transitioned into
building into podio of wheretheir confidence, you know,
where they're getting confidenceright now, and where they're
still learning and how they'resort of seeing podio as people
(01:51):
who are coming into the system,really for the first time and
starting to work on it. It'sreally great kind of view from
the other angle, you know, I Italked to so many people
sometimes who are, you know,super users of podio. And, and
people who, you know, they buildlots of things and they've been
building for years. They know itback and forwards. And and that
is awesome. And there's a lot tobe learned from that. But
(02:13):
sometimes it's great to flip thescript and talk to people who
are relatively new and say like,how's it going? What's what have
you found good, what have younot, you know, found difficult
in this episode really doesfocus in on that. And I'm really
grateful to the two of them forcoming in and having a little
discussion. It's fun chat. And,you know, of course, I was
(02:33):
always you can reach out totheir respective companies. I'll
put all the information into thepodcast notes. Finally, please,
please, please, please stop whatyou're doing. And give a like,
give a share, give a littlereview, it really does help
boost our presence and make surethat more people can find the
podcast and more people canlearn about the power of podio.
(02:54):
Now let's get to the podcastwhere I'm joined by Tim and
Bubba. Let's listen in. what itwas like, quite, quite honestly,
so. So yeah, it's I don't knowif you've heard the podcast
before. But we're gonna justlaunch into it now. So I'm
(03:15):
excited to hear about you guysstories. Why don't we just take
a quick second, and you guysintroduce yourselves? who you
are. Tim wants to go first.
Tim Castillo-Gill (03:26):
So my name is Tim. I started my career as a
music, music production andmusic performance. And then I
move. Exactly, but it's amistake.
Jordan Fleming (03:41):
Well, that's what I need to I did use it get
Edinburgh. Yeah. So there yougo. Okay, so I'm allowed to say
that.
Tim Castillo-Gill (03:50):
But in money terms, it can be a mistake, you
either make it or you may or youdon't. And you have to be
pretty, pretty impassioned tomake it. So I don't think I was
quite quite there. So I movedmyself on to teaching at one
point and was teaching for threeor four years when taught in
Brussels, taught in the UK anddeaf, different places. And then
(04:14):
I got more and more interestedas COVID here with how
technology is used in education,how technology is used more
broadly. how technology can be,you know, can simplify things
that are thought of ascomplicated. And then went into
sort of teaching myself to codeand then did a boot camp. So in
(04:35):
the UK, there's various type ofboot camps. I did one of those
and came out the other end andgot a job with future solutions
with Pete and Izzy. Andcurrently I'm learning the
platform of podio and all theother sort of side things that
go along like pw a and proc founaddresses babies.
Jordan Fleming (04:57):
Both of those friends of the show, so
Fantastic Bob Oh, go ahead.
Bavo De Cooman (05:03):
Okay, I'm Babu I, I actually I was also a
teacher. I quit teaching threemonths ago. So I was a teacher,
but I was always I was alanguage teacher, English and
German. And so if I make Englishmistakes, that there goes the
reputation of all BelgianEnglish teachers now, but I
(05:26):
always had an interest in itwhen it came to education. And
I'm also a writer and astoryteller on the site for
children's stories. And I wasdeveloping my own websites. And
I got more and more into that.
And I thought, I'm going to dothat as a site profession,
because I was looking like fornew horizons. And then I had a
good friend, Mike. And he said,Well, maybe you could do a few
(05:49):
things. For me, maybe you canwrite a few texts for me,
because I was doing websites andcopywriting and stuff. So I
started writing, writing textfor for him. And he says, By the
way, with your new siteprofessional, maybe you'd like
to work with this tool calledpodio. And I'll explain to you
how it works. And it looks, itlooks pretty interesting to me,
(06:10):
because I'm still planning inthe planning for several years
of building my own, publishingmy own books. So building that
into podio, looked like a goodopportunity. And then he started
query tools, and I had to learnhow that worked at cetera, et
cetera. But it was still on theon the baseline. So globey, flow
(06:31):
still looked a bit like Chineseto me. But now I've made the
switch, Mike has has had towasn't one man's business
quickly was one man's business,we had to expand this team. So I
jumped in. And now I'm alsolearning decoding stuff, it's
good to have both the thedigital creative stuff like
(06:53):
writing a bit and designing afew things. And then on the
other hand, learning the coding.
So I've been doing supporttickets and stuff like that. And
now I'm starting to build thefirst project in podio. It's
really interesting.
Jordan Fleming (07:10):
Nice. Well, I think, you know, this is, this
is an interesting one, because Idon't think we've ever had. And
this I think it was actuallyPete, who suggested this topic,
which was, you know, we, I don'tthink we've ever had anybody on
the podcast, to explore whatit's like when you're first
starting to learn podio, becausemost of the people that I have
(07:32):
the podcast are either, youknow, partners, like myself,
Pete and Mike who have beenaround for ages and, and have,
you know, built hundreds ofsystems and done all this stuff.
And so don't really rememberwhat it was like to learn podio
almost, or what it was like tocome to try and understand the
basics, or people who have theirown businesses using podio. And
(07:54):
they've been using it for awhile, I don't think I've ever
had anyone who's quite so new.
And so I'm quite fascinated tokind of look at the look at the
new to podio journey, andidentify a little bits of you
know, what, what was some of thethings that were confusing or
difficult to really wrap yourhead around? I mean, that
(08:16):
there's got to be a few of them.
Can you guys think do you have?
Do you have any kind of onesthat stand out for you, as we
sit here right now?
Tim Castillo-Gill (08:30):
And for me, I think the main one that I
struggled with to begin with wasmaybe not like, specifically
podio. So maybe this isn'tanswering your question exactly.
But it was, it was the structureof a database, and how the
relationships, how you shouldstructure your relationships in
order to make the most efficientuse of a database and the tables
(08:54):
within it. And that was my tothe sort of architecture, I
guess, if the database is a reallearning curve, and I suppose
that's that in some ways, podiomakes that easier, because it
gives you a gooey interface toactually see what's going on and
see a relationship, and thenfollow the trace of that
relationship you feel towherever it goes. So in that
(09:15):
case, for me, the hardest partyet is figuring out the
architecture of an entiredatabase. And some of them, you
know, mind bogglinglycomplicated.
Jordan Fleming (09:25):
Did you do you then, in the work you're doing
right now? Are you starting tobuild systems from scratch? Have
you been building systems fromscratch? yet?
Tim Castillo-Gill (09:36):
For me, I have not built anything from
scratch other than my own tests,playing around and test things
I've been really poking aroundin lots of I mean, obviously,
it's mostly in Pete's work andseeing how those things, this
trail of how things work, andwe've been trying to make PRM
(09:58):
diagrams Using lucid chart andhis he's quite big on those as
well. So you can sort of see therelationships quite clearly from
a sort of big perspective,zooming out on it. So that's
where we are. And that's how I'mtrying to figure out the general
sort of architecture of how thedatabases so bother you.
Bavo De Cooman (10:19):
Yeah, yeah, that's it relationships is a
wreck is a recognisable thing.
So in the beginning, I had thisI have no, I had no clue of
databases even so. So, in thebeginning, when I learned what a
relationship was, in my ownapps, I started laying double
relationships.
Jordan Fleming (10:42):
across the face,
Bavo De Cooman (10:44):
the forwards and backwards relationship that if
you make one that the other onesautomatically didn't realise. So
in the beginning, it was reallylike building ugly things with
podio bricks. So it's, like withLego you can, you can build the
Taj Mahal and you can build theugliest building ever. And, and
(11:06):
in the beginning, the blankcanvas was a bit was a bit
confusing. So it took a whilefor me to actually adopt it. So
in the beginning, I was justwriting text and not really
using podio. Because what youhave this blank canvas, I tried
a few things, but there's likenothing on it. But then Mike
asked me, so maybe we'd like todo a podio trainings because he
(11:30):
there was a company working withpodio. And he was doing podio
training for that had no time.
Could you take that over? said,Well, yeah, okay, so then I
really dived into the interface.
And then it started, then thenrelease, I started realising how
it actually works. That was agood starting point for me.
Jordan Fleming (11:49):
And interesting, actually, because the data I
mean, you've you've, you've hiton a really fundamental thing
that you learn as you go withpodio about, you know, data
structuring is a critical partof a good if you're going to
build a good podio system, howthe data is structured, and the
hierarchies that you create andthe and where you're going to
(12:11):
keep, you know, the end businessobjects and how you're going to
relate to them. That's animportant thing. And you both
have, you know, with Mike, withMike and Pete, and, Izzy, you do
have, you know, some veryexperienced developers who
understand the concepts of data.
Okay, it was there any, as youstarted to learn best practice,
from looking at some of thesystems they built or talking to
(12:32):
them? Was there anything thatthat that went, you know, that
was either surprising or kind ofwent against what you would have
thought was intuitive? Or didit? Was it like once you heard
it, you went? Oh, yeah, thatmakes sense.
Bavo De Cooman (12:49):
Yeah, I think the last one or like, yeah, like
insights coming? Like, divineinsights, like, Okay, this is
how it works. So when we aresolving things, so Mike shows me
your problem, I have no, no cluewhat I have to do. And then he
(13:12):
step by step with goodpractices, shows me how to do
it. And I say, Well, is it thatsimple, like, especially the
CWA, it looked like very, verydifficult to me, but when I,
when, when, when I hadn't workedwith it yet, but now it really
makes sense. And I can, and Ican read it brick by brick. And
(13:33):
before that, I had to I had tomake demos of query tools,
showing globey flow breaks andwas like, I don't know what the
hell is in there. But now I canactually actually read it. So
it's a good thing. So he'sactually Mike is actually
training me I'm doing a fewthings on my own, which I can
which I can already build. Andthen he helps me few hours a day
(14:00):
to do a few support tickets andfrom support tickets, I get to
know the client setups and Iimmediately get to know the good
practice so I'm actuallylearning with the good practice
in mind immediately that's avery good thing.
Tim Castillo-Gill (14:15):
Yeah, I can I can second that's there's
there's a moment I had actuallyhad an A moment the other day
where it was with Izzy that Iwas chatting to him and he was
he was talking about how thecore of a lot of his of the a
lot of the workspaces he does orthe organization's he does is,
is this contact app. Soeverything you know, so you've
got people and always that namesthat have phone numbers or
(14:36):
whatever, always coming out ofthese contacts apps, but then
you might want another area ofthis person that isn't so free
and open. There's not sharedwith everyone so you have
another app. That is likeanother DBS check or whatever it
is or their, their I think theyuse the example of maybe they
have what's called when you dosomething bad or work whenever
(14:57):
you have like a you get adisciplinary or something you
don't want that to be open toeveryone. So you have a
different app that's not sharedwith everyone, but it's related
to that person. So all thesepeople, so all this information
is always been fed by thiscontext app. So you have these
sort of core apps that you'llfind related in, you know, maybe
all, if not quite a lot of theseapps, or these tables in, I
(15:20):
always get the whole app tablething, if you want to get back
to the podio kind of linguisticthing, the app on a table is
taken me quite a while, like,obviously, it's just an app is a
table a table is now but whythey call them an app, not just
to take
Jordan Fleming (15:41):
notes, a table denotes almost a static bit of
data on AP to denote somethingthat you can actually work with,
I think, but but interesting,you know, I think, you know,
when you're those dataprinciples are important, but
also just the experience of, youknow, of how much I think it
(16:05):
helps to have people showing youbest practice on a routine
basis. Because I, I think that'sgot to be probably if you if you
get when I first started usingpodio, I built our first systems
when I first started usingpodio. So I was figuring it out.
And there was nothing thatanybody could do, like I was the
one figuring it out. So I didn'tneed to be taught as I was
(16:27):
building the apps. Now they werehorrible. But whereas if you get
parachuted into what I wouldconsider a mature environment,
like it's already built, it'salready doing this, and you got
to work in it. The learningcurve, there's a little
different, it's a, it's adifferent thing, because you're
not just walking in and figuringlots of stuff out, you're
(16:47):
actually having to look atrelatively already developed
workflow and app structures anddata structures, and decide and
figure out what you can andcannot do with it. Right. And
that must like he just he justif we take a step back and think
of cuz people bitch all the timeabout the podio interface and
(17:10):
how it's not changed in a longtime, and it hasn't, but I like
it because of its consistency.
But I don't think it'snecessarily easy to learn. What
was your experience? getting tothe point where you felt like
you could whiz around podio,right, because there's
difference between kind of goingin and knowing where to go and
being able to, you know, justfucking fly? Well, how did you
(17:32):
find that experience?
Bavo De Cooman (17:37):
Yeah, knowing that notifications is actually
your inbox, that is one thing.
And that, that it's like areverse email system. So instead
of emails being pushed to you,you're pulling up the you're
pulling in the index, you wantthe updates you want to follow.
So that was a good thing. So Solearning that following smartly,
(18:01):
and then you get thesenotifications, and this is like
your inbox, then having thetasks, the tasks as as
reminders, that was a good one.
So to immediately go to theright context, and just getting
to know the zones. So theinterface is when you first look
(18:24):
at it, it's it's weird, butthere's so little on it that
once you know what every zonemeans, then you can you can get
started. So have. So this is myimportant stuff. Here's a tile,
on my on my right side panel, inmy activity, I see the things
that happened. And if I unfollowa few things, it's going to
(18:46):
become relevant. And same thingfor the notifications. And then
you're good to go. Yeah,
Tim Castillo-Gill (18:53):
that's I agree with you Baba that I think
that a lot of like, the actualdifferent elements of podio is
fairly, as long as you get toknow where they are, what they
kind of do, they're kind ofuseful at the task thing is
quite interesting. Because ifyou're in an app, and then you
set a task, it's sort ofattached to that item or that
Yeah, so that's, that's this,there's certain things which you
(19:13):
can do, which aren't necessarilylike, you'd could take advantage
of more, or I could takeadvantage of more. But I just
don't think of doing it. Soit's, it's, there's that part of
it, which is I just think of atask being the big task, right?
Like it's just a big list. Idon't think of it attaching it
to a particular item, which I'msure would be extremely useful.
(19:34):
You know, if something's got abug or something, it's
particular to that item. Andthen then that's perfect use
case for it, I guess.
Jordan Fleming (19:42):
Stop. Okay, I'm sorry. I'm just going to
interrupt this amazing podcastfor a couple of seconds. I know
if you're a regular listener.
You've heard me talk about thegame changers supercharged
masterclass series, and I'vealready had a number of people
give their details in with theform and comment attack me
saying when can we get involved?
(20:02):
Well, life has happened. movinghouse lots of things going on.
And although I promised to getup the first modules in June, it
is going to be the end of Julynow July 2021. But I am super
excited about it. Thisabsolutely free masterclass
series is going to go through abunch of great modules, the
(20:22):
fundamentals of podio, thefundamentals of great podio
design, great ways of usingglobey flow and extending podio.
It is distillation of using useof my team, myself included, of
designing podio. It's ourattempt at bringing together
some best in class principles ofpodio design, it's really an
(20:45):
exciting proposition, I can'twait to launch it, it is coming
soon. Go over to www.we are gamechangers.com go to the master
class sending your details willlet you know as soon as the
first module is up, I guaranteethe first modules are going up
and to July 2021. Now, back tothis awesome podcast, when
(21:06):
contextually understanding whatyou need to do is an important
part of, of relationshiprelationships. In podio, whether
you're using the podio nativetasks up the top, or whether
using a separate task app, youalmost always have the the task
you create, whether it's an appitem or a task in the podio
(21:26):
system, it's always going to berelated to the things that
matter. Now we choose to use atask app. And I'm surprised to
hear you say tasks, because Iwould have thought both Peter
and Mike wouldn't be using thepodio task, they'd be using a
task app.
Bavo De Cooman (21:40):
And the reason we do that, but we use that to
it we use them both. So
Jordan Fleming (21:46):
yeah, logic is to why do you have curiosity? Do
you have logic as to which oneyou use when?
Bavo De Cooman (21:54):
Well, that by renaming the word task reminder.
And so when I did my first whenI was investigating podio for
for my first of all, yourtraining, that's what we came up
with that actually it's not thetask is not a to do item because
it to do the item has detailedinformation and maybe link
(22:16):
documents and stuff. But thetask is a reminder, I have
tomorrow I have to look at thatI have to read the document. And
in two days, I have to writepart of it. And then I have to
mention my colleague. And sothese tasks are just reminders
that bring you to the rightcontext. So in that respect, the
(22:36):
word task is maybe even a badword. But now the to do apps are
actually like, I don't thinkthere's like a mike should
correct me if I'm wrong. Butthere's not really a native to
do app where everything is wehave several. So we have we have
(23:00):
a help desk app for for clienttickets. And we have a few
backlog absolute, let's say wehave five, six to do apps. And
then we use reminders ifnecessary to do that. And views.
So also, to follow up a fewviews to check on the new ones.
(23:21):
For the two dues and setreminders when necessary.
Personally, I
Tim Castillo-Gill (23:27):
think it's the it's the same, this is the
same besides. So I think I thinkthe tasks mainly, mainly are
used just for small things, youknow, like yeah, I don't think
I'm probably like, using themmore than anyone else to be
honest. So just this little,like, I've got to remember to,
you know, to do my put my notesinto daily stand up or
(23:48):
something, it would be somethinglike really random, whereas
actually we have we do as yousay, Jordan, we have, like an
app for
Jordan Fleming (23:55):
I will be very surprised. Yeah. I would have
been shocked back to actually
Unknown (24:01):
without a
Bavo De Cooman (24:02):
question. It's true. It's it's, it's really
powerful. it to me that was oneof the things that actually got
me into podio because beforethat I had been experimenting
with task planners, I I've beendoing a subject with a free and
open subject with students withinvestigating productivity apps.
And then you have this taskplanner and that task planner
(24:22):
and this one was task planningfunctionality, etc. And I had
never found a good task planner.
And then there was podio andit's it's you have this platform
and then they have somewherethey have a full blown task
planner that actually isperfectly well thought out. So
like for the recurring tasks isis really well done. So yeah, I
(24:44):
find it I find it striking howpodio can sometimes surprise you
like oh, it can do that too.
Like so like that like having afull blown task planner or like
having a cat board where you canrearrange the order of cards,
(25:06):
things like that. So things thatI was was thinking of using an
external app and then realisingactually podio can do it as
well.
Jordan Fleming (25:15):
What did you guys think podio was? Because,
like, out of curiosity is Imean, people always come and
say, come to me and say, Hey, sois podio CRM. And you're like,
Well, yeah, I can. Yeah, I canbe you can build a great CRM.
Oh, it's a project managementtool. Yeah, you can build a
great project management tool.
But is it one? No. Use but youcan build one, my stock answer
(25:36):
is nobody, you can build one.
But almost everybody who doesn'tunderstand the power of a
system, a platform that you canbuild multiple business kind of
process in, thinks in terms oftunnel vision, software apps, I
buy Microsoft Office, to getWord, Excel, and whatever else
(25:57):
shift a to pile into it now, andI just care about what I buy. I
buy Asana, because it tells meit's a project management
system, I buy it, Salesforce,tells me it's a CRM system, what
was your way with podio? As weall know, those rules are
completely broken, because itcan be any of those things, all
(26:20):
of those things together,combined with everything else.
So what did you think when youfirst were coming into podio?
That it was supposed to be? Andhow surprised Were you with jet
like as the Bible as you weresort of saying like, Oh, shit,
it can do this? did have youboth felt a and I'll go to Tim
first. Have you both felt thiskind of like, what the fuck
(26:41):
holy? Wow, it can do everythingmoment or what? What's been your
experience?
Tim Castillo-Gill (26:45):
Yeah, I mean, that when I first arrived at
podio, that was part of myinterview process was to
basically come accustomed to it.
And then Pete sent me some whatlooks what seemed like a
complicated task at the time,but it was fairly simple in
hindsight, is, is that podio islike, yeah, like you say, when I
first arrived at it, I thought,well, this is a way of
structuring data. I mean, Ithink, and that's basically, I
(27:08):
guess, it kind of is what it is,in some ways. So I don't think I
described a delegate was Ithink, perhaps it was
purposefully not described asanything by P or Izzy,
specifically, they just said,it's this thing and go and find
out what it is basically, andwhat I came to it and I could
move these different fields,date fields, title fields, text
(27:29):
fields, whatever it was, andcalculated fields, I had no idea
what that was when I firstarrived to it. So I was like,
two plus two plus two. Is thatis that gonna give me for a bit?
So that was my first what was myfirst arrived to podio? I was
like, Okay, well, what, what isthis? And that was my
expectation. That was my sort ofexpectation as I came to the
(27:52):
interviews, okay. So they'regoing to ask me to take some
information and structure itsomehow, because that seems to
be what podio does. So it wasn'tdescribed as a CRM, or a project
management tool, or any of thosethings. In hindsight, in answer
to your question, have I hadlike a heart like, Whoa, kind of
moment? Yeah, sure. When I see,it mostly comes from the when I
(28:14):
see is he or piece because I amsure Mike does the same thing.
But he's there. These are thepeople I've seen their work of.
And I've seen the differentcontexts that they've used
podio. And they go, like, allthe different ways that it can
be used. It's sort of likegoing, Okay, well, this is a
database. And if I forget pw A,which is a huge part of what
(28:35):
makes podio useful, in someways, it just structuring data,
is it really useful, and thenbeing able to see it quite
nicely in a nice UI is quitenice, because when I was when I
was learning how to develop, wedid, we touched on databases,
(28:56):
and we used mostly code baseddatabases where it was a bit
sort of behind behind thecurtain, you couldn't really
see, unless you tapped in theright keys, you couldn't really
see what you were looking at,certainly couldn't use the
mouse, you know, becauseobviously, it wasn't the user
interface. So podio for me waslike, I can see what I'm doing,
(29:16):
I can see the data that I'mputting in, I can see the
labels, you can see the theitems and the values. So that
for me was like, Oh, this isgreat. Because I actually never
really liked that part of thecoding part of not being to see
what I was doing. So for me,that was what podio was. And
then pw a I'm sure is that it'sjust another conversation, I
(29:37):
think,
Jordan Fleming (29:39):
well, I'll go to Babel first and then we'll touch
on bw actually, so go ahead,Baba. Yeah,
Bavo De Cooman (29:45):
well, it looked a bit like like, like in the
like, data set like an like abig, big collection of
interconnected Excel files,something like that. So and the
interface not far off from whatit is I mean, yeah, yeah, but so
and the interface was empty. Andso it was like a boring set of
(30:09):
data. And then but you could doevery and everything with it.
And once you start actuallyseeing how things are built,
then you start realising, okay,you can actually build something
with it. And especially whenwith with pw a, like that, you
can build an app that can fillin all kinds of information
(30:33):
automatically, and you justclick a button. And it's like,
it's like making making anapplications with just globey
flow and podium. That was reallysurprising. That is, so that's
for something that normally Iwould think, Okay, this needs
this and this and this, andthis, and this, and this in this
field, it's just like, okay,that's, here's the button, and
(30:57):
all the fields are filled infrom referenced apps
Jordan Fleming (31:01):
have been surprised. I'm so sorry for
interrupting you been surprisedby just how much automation you
can squeeze into businessprocesses? Yes. Wow. It's
amazing. I mean, I, I'm used toit now. But I still sometimes
(31:22):
when we turn over a system, toone of the clients, and they're
just like, like, you know, like,holy shit, because all of this,
all of the automation and theworkflow, and, you know, just to
every five minutes you save byhaving something presented to
you, with everything filled inproperly, and double blah, blah,
(31:42):
and all these manual things.
And, you know, a process which amonkey could do by filling in
paperwork and creating a PDF andemailing it, someone takes a
human being 15 minutes. And, youknow, yeah, that must as part of
your understanding of podio, pwA's is necessarily going to play
a big part of it. How has your Imean, you kind of mentioned the
(32:07):
Bible, I think he said, You cannow read the, you know, you can
read brick by brick, etc. Kindof like when you're a musician,
if you're a musician, I'vealways wondered why you could
read a store. Yeah, show scoreon a plane and just be like,
Yeah, I got it, like, it's fine.
Other people would be like,like, but so with, with pw a,
(32:32):
you know, how has the How isthat? How's the experience been
kind of getting to know PDO?
with web?
Tim Castillo-Gill (32:43):
It's a it's a, it's a roller coaster PWB. In
some ways, it's like a dreamcome true in other ways. It's a
it's a sort of head against thebrick wall moment. Some of it
like some of it worksbeautifully. And some of it you
go like, Well, why does it dothat? Why do I have to do that?
First? I think more and moreover the last, maybe the last
four weeks? Specifically, I've,I've been in this job for? This
(33:06):
is my eighth week, I think so.
Over the last four weeks, Ithink that the first four weeks
was me just getting to knoweverything. And the last four
weeks has been quite TWAfocused, and more and more is
kind of gone. Okay, now I getwhy you have to do that it sort
of makes sense. To begin with. Iwas I learned in my in this boot
camp that I did, we dideverything in a text editor. So
(33:28):
it was you had to writeeverything. So this the block
system, in some ways, feels veryrigid. And it's rigid for a
reason. I can't understand whyit is. But it's always
frustrating. If you've got like,Yeah, I'd really like to do
that, then. Or I'd like to usethis, you know, in this case,
PHP function, and it's notavailable. Well, those there's
(33:50):
some frustrations, but at thesame way, you've got to go.
Yeah, but I'd have to do withauthentification I don't have to
deal with, you know, like allthis other stuff that obviously
PwC deals with. And so it's abit of a push Nepal swings
around about situation for me.
Bavo De Cooman (34:08):
Yeah, that's always thinking of how I'm going
to construct it. So because thedanger of the pitfall of podio.
And probably also, the greatthing about podio is like it's
so flexible, that you can buildanything and so you can also
build really shitty systems. So,when working with globey flow on
(34:35):
tickets, I get this goodpractice of making the flows as
simple as possible and alsosplitting up. So like having
short create, create and updateflows. And then having manual
flows that do just this task isfor this manual flow and this
task is for that manual flow.
And that way it's a it's It'seasier to understand the
(35:00):
structure of it, instead ofhaving this super long flow that
if this happens, then do this.
And if that happens, and thatand if this happens and that and
so they can, they can sometimesbecome extremely long. And the
process has become for Mike.
Also a learning curve has becomea shortening them where
(35:21):
possible. And I think that's avery good practice to start
with.
Jordan Fleming (35:26):
Have you. Sorry, just to follow up on what you're
just saying? I'm an interruptingbastard, by the way. So like, no
worries, because and it's mypodcast, so I'll fucking do it
if I want it right? No, have youfound that as you've grown in
your, in your pw a, you'resupposed to call it bw a now
Bob? Oh, trust me, I'm with youon the global COVID. But I'm
(35:48):
getting used to calling a PwC.
Now Actually, I'm there now. Sohave you found that as you
develop your pw a andpotentially your proc foo Oh,
that's, that isn't one we'll getinto today. But your view a
knowledge, your understanding ofwhy podio data hierarchy needs
to be certain ways. It's sort oflike, you learn, you level up
your learning here, which makesyou go Oh, and then then you
(36:10):
kind of you know, it's aconstant of evolution. Because
more you start to build. What Iwould say is more advanced
workflow, you know, more complexworkflows that maybe need to
work together or or need to workacross a larger environment, the
more your understanding of podiostructure and what is going to
(36:32):
work and what isn't, evolves. Sodo you feel like every time you
level up in your pw aunderstanding, you're levelling
up in your podio understandingas well.
Bavo De Cooman (36:48):
Somewhat here, like, the way apps are
referenced, and to think ofmaybe also learn to think of, I
should make a view for thatfirst, and then bake that. Take
that view? Few things like that.
But like, I don't think I have Ihave gotten to the point you're,
(37:12):
you're explaining that. Youreally see I had I had already I
had already a good basicunderstanding. So no big changes
yet. But I also haven't done toocomplex projects yet.
Unknown (37:34):
Yeah, start getting there.
Tim Castillo-Gill (37:37):
Yeah, I think I think I'm, I think I'm so
certain Well, a similar chain,similar train as Baba, where I'm
going have I like, if I write aflow in pw a, and I want to get
hold of a piece of informationfrom podio. I guess I'm
impatient, I suppose, in thesense of just, I need that piece
(38:00):
of information, go and get itfor me, in some ways, so just
like, if I'm going to use you goand do this thing for me, and I
want to do what I want to do onit. So in some ways, I'm
spoiled, I guess in like, if Iwanted to do everything for me,
and then I'll just sell, I say,you know, I'll take this, this
and this, and I want to add thatto that and that whatever I'm
(38:21):
doing, and then I want to updatethat item. And I want you to do
everything else will be pleased.
And it's not quite it's that Idon't know if so in that sense,
I'm not quite there in the waythat you're saying. Yeah, you
need to balance up the sort oftheir their the architecture of
polio and how you've designedyour database or your apps or
whatever, to how you write aflow. I don't know I don't think
(38:44):
I'm not quite not quite therewith with with that balance, or
with that sort of realisation Iguess maybe
Jordan Fleming (38:53):
after eight weeks, you're not there yet.
have a word with fucking Pete,man. I don't know. But I think
you'll find as you're just asyou guys continue to grow your
skills, you're you you're youwill probably come up with your
own style. And it may be one youslightly inherit from Mike and
(39:15):
Pete and Izzy because you willinherit is it's you know, their
companies. So they're going toshow enforce a certain element
of style. But you'll also comeup with your own on your own
feel for what is good for whatis good. You know, we'd sort of
like we know it when we see it.
And we know when we feel it andI'm sure you'll find you know
that you've got that just out ofcuriosity as as some as people
(39:36):
who are, you know, only a fewmonths into your polio journey.
Do you have anything that youjust really, that really you
don't like? Or things that youfound really frustrating that
you had to kind of work to getover just out of curiosity, you
may not and that's fine, butsometimes people do and I'm
(39:57):
curious,
Bavo De Cooman (39:59):
too. text and writing and the description
fields. So the text, the multiline text field. And if I'm a
writer, you know, and I know. Somy cousin Mike has an idea. He
thinks in like very short piecesof text, I write out all kinds
(40:21):
of ideas and stuff. And then Iwant to rearrange and and, and
cut and paste and put this hereand put that there and drag and
drop and, and also, yeah, I'm abit of a chaotic person
collecting ideas fromeverywhere. So if you do that
type of planning, in a podioapp, it's terrible. So, so you,
(40:46):
you write something, you styleit a bit, because I'm, like, for
example, I take a title, Iwanted to have this colour,
because it's visual recognition,especially if it's long. And
then I copy and paste somethingstyle is gone. have to rearrange
that. So that that one doesn'twork too. Well. The Superman
menu helps a bit. The Supermanyou extension. A bit. So I've
(41:12):
learned to for that for actuallyfor more complex planning and
ideas to just move move out ofpodio for a short while. And and
then, yeah, so keep that out andjust have a summary in podio, or
something. And I'll link readthis blog post about connecting
(41:38):
notion to polio.
Unknown (41:42):
virus.
Bavo De Cooman (41:44):
But the thing was that I was I started
experimenting with notion then.
And I was doing too much innotion and then I returned to
polio again. So yeah, in theend, it's just going to be for
just a few things. Like, forexample, if you content
planning, like for newsletter,or for website articles and
things, which is also what I'mdoing there, content planning
(42:04):
does not work well in podio. SoI just link, I just add the
links. But I make sure I, I keepthe overview in podio.
Tim Castillo-Gill (42:16):
Yeah, Tim, yeah, for my end, the I guess my
main, my main thing is, as youalready kind of touched on was
the calculation fields theytake, sometimes take quite a
long time to do something, andthen you have to sort of, I
guess, it's one of the quirks ofpodio. But maybe that should be
really should just get hold off,which is you kind of have to put
(42:38):
a timeout or whatever, you haveto just give it some time to
sort of sort things out, whichjust makes everything really
slow. If you're a client, youwant something to happen quite
quickly, if it's slow, it feelsinefficient and kind of old, in
some ways. If you're, you know,the old the slower something is
the older it feels in my head atleast. So the quicker something
is the more modern, it feels themore contemporary or whatever,
(42:59):
so I think they need to sortthat out. And pw a wise I'm so
used to seeing differentcolours. pw a just is quite a
bland set of colours and a wish,for example, and if an endif had
the same colour, so there weredifferent colours to the rest of
the blocks, if it was blue, andf is blue, E for each has red
(43:21):
ended, or whatever it's calledcontinues A B is also red, so
that there's some kind ofmatching up with the colours.
Just give it give me somethingNo,
Jordan Fleming (43:30):
I'm only laughing I'm only laughing. I'm
not laughing at your concept.
I'm only laughing because rightnow, in in smartphone, I'm
working on a project internally,where we are redesigning the
call flow system, and one of thethings we're doing is bringing
each type of block will is gonnahave have its own colour, so
that you have a visual referenceto the type of block you're
(43:53):
using. And so I'm not laughingcuz I think it's a dumb idea.
I'm laughing because I'm doingthis. We're doing this right now
in smart.
Tim Castillo-Gill (44:04):
Yeah, and it probably wouldn't be that hard
to do through some kind ofChrome extension or something.
Right, like, you know, the supermenu and things is I don't I've
not written a Chrome extension.
So I had no idea how difficultit is. But it seems like
something that would be quiteeasy to do. But who knows if it
is,
Jordan Fleming (44:19):
I think Chrome extension maybe but I mean, I
can tell you right now that Imean, you can you can put you
can usually put a skin on adeveloped system, you know,
change the visuals, as long asyou're changing the overall
functionality, or anything. Theskin can usually be done
relatively easily. It's when youstart screwing around with
(44:42):
everything else that it becomes,you know, people sometimes
they're like, well, can't youjust put this inside of that and
put this over there and you'relike, yeah, okay, just that. I
see an ad hours. Like, you know,come on you telling me? Hey,
sure, sure. Is there anythingwe've said? surprised you? Is it
(45:04):
kind of interest? No, I I thinkit's just interesting. I think
it's, you know, I think it'syou, you know, you both what's
the product tell you what didsurprise me. And I wonder if if
this is because you're bothworking within the environment
you're working, or maybe it'syour backgrounds. But you both
came with a sort of with adatabase heavy feel to you, in a
(45:29):
sense of like, you both describepodio. And most people will come
to me and describe podio as abusiness thing, like a CRM, or a
project management or whatever,you both came right in with this
notion of like, you know, ofdata and tables and data, you
know, that that's what podio wasto you. And that surprised me a
little because most people whenthey first come into podio, or
(45:52):
unless they are, unless you'redata scientists or or AI people
who build databases and SQL, orother fucking systems, most
people don't think of their datain that way. And you both kind
of came came to the, to thefield with that in your in your,
in your brains, but maybe that'salso slightly biassed by the
(46:15):
word, you know, the companiesyou're both gone into, are
people who are going to talkabout it like that all the
fucking time. I mean, he's, hewon't shut up about it, right? I
mean, you try you try. So thatsurprised me. But But, you know,
it's fun to I just, I don'tremember how podio was, I saw a
(46:38):
screenshot the other day ofpodio when I first got involved
with it, what it looked like,and it's not that dissimilar, by
the way, it's it's the but therewere some big differences. And,
and it really took me back. And,and it's nice to think of, of
when I first got involved withpodio. And I think what's
(46:59):
interesting about thisconversation is, you know, is
getting a perspective of peoplewho are new to podio. And
understanding maybe some of the,to me, my biggest takeaway is,
if you're going to bring peopleinto podio, particularly into an
environment where it's alreadybuilt pretty well, you need to
(47:20):
give them some method of playingto understand the fundamentals
of podio. If you're going totrain your staff to really be
able to use your system, well,they kind of have to play and
get to know podio. That's what Itake about. It that makes sense?
Tim Castillo-Gill (47:36):
Yeah, it does. It does. I think it also,
like you say with the bias, Ithink actually, obviously, there
is a bias to maybe myself andher brother member, welcome to
it. But also, we haven't foundpodio we've been sort of led to,
I guess, speak for myself. I wassomeone said, right, I've got
(47:57):
this job, you need to use thisplatform, and I have gone.
Whereas I've listened to otherpodcasts. He was Jordan, where
people have gone like, Oh, Ifound podio dabbled with it
left, it came back again, youknow that there was a bit more
sort of organic pneus about itor something. Whereas we've sort
of just gone, somebody has goneto us, sorry, this is what we're
using. You got to learn how touse it, and just crack on and
(48:20):
work out what's what. Yeah.
Jordan Fleming (48:22):
Interesting.
Interesting. Well, listen, guys,I really appreciate you coming
on. I will of course, for thoselistening, right now, I will of
course, pop both companywebsites into the podcast page
and into the description of thepodcast so that you can find
both both, I mean, quickfee andquibi. Tools. quibi is a
consultancy, query tools is anamazing system for that you can
(48:44):
really understand your podiosystem in a way that no other
system will let you do. And Ihighly recommend you check.
Check it out. And of course,future solutions, like quibi are
a great consultancy. And, youknow, they have a tremendous
(49:06):
they're based in the UK, Ababa,you're based in Belgium. Yeah.
And, you know, they are our twophenomenal partners who have a
long history of building greatthings in podio. And I highly
recommend you check them out aswell. So guys, thank you so much
for giving us your insight asnewbies to podio really
(49:27):
interesting journey and it wasalso a pleasure to meet both of
you. It's a pleasure. Thanks forhaving us.
Narrator (49:37):
You've been listening to supercharged with Jordan
Samuel Fleming. Subscribe todayon iTunes, Google Play or
Spotify for your weekly diveinto how you can supercharge
your business by making itpowered by podio. Be sure to
check out our website we aregame changers.com where you can
learn more and arrange a 30minute call with Jordan Dale
(49:58):
view understand how podiosupercharges you
Welcome to powered by podio automation is everything.
supercharge your business withpodio. Get ready for another
episode of supercharged withJordan Samuel Fleming, your
weekly dive into the awesomeimpact workflow and automation
you can have on your businesswhen it's powered by podio. Join
(00:22):
us each week as we learn fromthe top podio partners in the
world as we investigate systemintegrations and add ons and
hear from real business ownerswho have implemented podio into
their business. Now, join yourhost Jordan Samuel Fleming, CEO
of game changers for this week'sepisode.
Jordan Fleming (00:45):
Hey, everybody, its Jordan, Samuel Fleming here
host of supercharge. I'm here totalk all about the power of
workflow and automation whenyour business is powered by
podio. And this week, to the funepisode, because I am joined by
two people in a group episode totalk a little about how new
people come into podio. And thisis particularly relevant if
(01:06):
you've got a company and you'reonboarding new staff. What are
the some of the challengesinvolved with that? What are the
things that that resonates withthem or doesn't resonate with
them. And so I reached out somemy pull your partner friends and
Mike from quibi tools and Petefrom future solutions happened
(01:27):
to both have two relatively newemployees babble and Tim, and
they joining me today, and we'rejust giving a bit of a newbie
experience to podio it's reallyfun discussion, we learned a bit
about their backgrounds, abouthow they transitioned into
building into podio of wheretheir confidence, you know,
where they're getting confidenceright now, and where they're
still learning and how they'resort of seeing podio as people
(01:51):
who are coming into the system,really for the first time and
starting to work on it. It'sreally great kind of view from
the other angle, you know, I Italked to so many people
sometimes who are, you know,super users of podio. And, and
people who, you know, they buildlots of things and they've been
building for years. They know itback and forwards. And and that
is awesome. And there's a lot tobe learned from that. But
(02:13):
sometimes it's great to flip thescript and talk to people who
are relatively new and say like,how's it going? What's what have
you found good, what have younot, you know, found difficult
in this episode really doesfocus in on that. And I'm really
grateful to the two of them forcoming in and having a little
discussion. It's fun chat. And,you know, of course, I was
(02:33):
always you can reach out totheir respective companies. I'll
put all the information into thepodcast notes. Finally, please,
please, please, please stop whatyou're doing. And give a like,
give a share, give a littlereview, it really does help
boost our presence and make surethat more people can find the
podcast and more people canlearn about the power of podio.
(02:54):
Now let's get to the podcastwhere I'm joined by Tim and
Bubba. Let's listen in. what itwas like, quite, quite honestly,
so. So yeah, it's I don't knowif you've heard the podcast
before. But we're gonna justlaunch into it now. So I'm
(03:15):
excited to hear about you guysstories. Why don't we just take
a quick second, and you guysintroduce yourselves? who you
are. Tim wants to go first.
Tim Castillo-Gill (03:26):
So my name is Tim. I started my career as a
music, music production andmusic performance. And then I
move. Exactly, but it's amistake.
Jordan Fleming (03:41):
Well, that's what I need to I did use it get
Edinburgh. Yeah. So there yougo. Okay, so I'm allowed to say
that.
Tim Castillo-Gill (03:50):
But in money terms, it can be a mistake, you
either make it or you may or youdon't. And you have to be
pretty, pretty impassioned tomake it. So I don't think I was
quite quite there. So I movedmyself on to teaching at one
point and was teaching for threeor four years when taught in
Brussels, taught in the UK anddeaf, different places. And then
(04:14):
I got more and more interestedas COVID here with how
technology is used in education,how technology is used more
broadly. how technology can be,you know, can simplify things
that are thought of ascomplicated. And then went into
sort of teaching myself to codeand then did a boot camp. So in
(04:35):
the UK, there's various type ofboot camps. I did one of those
and came out the other end andgot a job with future solutions
with Pete and Izzy. Andcurrently I'm learning the
platform of podio and all theother sort of side things that
go along like pw a and proc founaddresses babies.
Jordan Fleming (04:57):
Both of those friends of the show, so
Fantastic Bob Oh, go ahead.
Bavo De Cooman (05:03):
Okay, I'm Babu I, I actually I was also a
teacher. I quit teaching threemonths ago. So I was a teacher,
but I was always I was alanguage teacher, English and
German. And so if I make Englishmistakes, that there goes the
reputation of all BelgianEnglish teachers now, but I
(05:26):
always had an interest in itwhen it came to education. And
I'm also a writer and astoryteller on the site for
children's stories. And I wasdeveloping my own websites. And
I got more and more into that.
And I thought, I'm going to dothat as a site profession,
because I was looking like fornew horizons. And then I had a
good friend, Mike. And he said,Well, maybe you could do a few
(05:49):
things. For me, maybe you canwrite a few texts for me,
because I was doing websites andcopywriting and stuff. So I
started writing, writing textfor for him. And he says, By the
way, with your new siteprofessional, maybe you'd like
to work with this tool calledpodio. And I'll explain to you
how it works. And it looks, itlooks pretty interesting to me,
(06:10):
because I'm still planning inthe planning for several years
of building my own, publishingmy own books. So building that
into podio, looked like a goodopportunity. And then he started
query tools, and I had to learnhow that worked at cetera, et
cetera. But it was still on theon the baseline. So globey, flow
(06:31):
still looked a bit like Chineseto me. But now I've made the
switch, Mike has has had towasn't one man's business
quickly was one man's business,we had to expand this team. So I
jumped in. And now I'm alsolearning decoding stuff, it's
good to have both the thedigital creative stuff like
(06:53):
writing a bit and designing afew things. And then on the
other hand, learning the coding.
So I've been doing supporttickets and stuff like that. And
now I'm starting to build thefirst project in podio. It's
really interesting.
Jordan Fleming (07:10):
Nice. Well, I think, you know, this is, this
is an interesting one, because Idon't think we've ever had. And
this I think it was actuallyPete, who suggested this topic,
which was, you know, we, I don'tthink we've ever had anybody on
the podcast, to explore whatit's like when you're first
starting to learn podio, becausemost of the people that I have
(07:32):
the podcast are either, youknow, partners, like myself,
Pete and Mike who have beenaround for ages and, and have,
you know, built hundreds ofsystems and done all this stuff.
And so don't really rememberwhat it was like to learn podio
almost, or what it was like tocome to try and understand the
basics, or people who have theirown businesses using podio. And
(07:54):
they've been using it for awhile, I don't think I've ever
had anyone who's quite so new.
And so I'm quite fascinated tokind of look at the look at the
new to podio journey, andidentify a little bits of you
know, what, what was some of thethings that were confusing or
difficult to really wrap yourhead around? I mean, that
(08:16):
there's got to be a few of them.
Can you guys think do you have?
Do you have any kind of onesthat stand out for you, as we
sit here right now?
Tim Castillo-Gill (08:30):
And for me, I think the main one that I
struggled with to begin with wasmaybe not like, specifically
podio. So maybe this isn'tanswering your question exactly.
But it was, it was the structureof a database, and how the
relationships, how you shouldstructure your relationships in
order to make the most efficientuse of a database and the tables
(08:54):
within it. And that was my tothe sort of architecture, I
guess, if the database is a reallearning curve, and I suppose
that's that in some ways, podiomakes that easier, because it
gives you a gooey interface toactually see what's going on and
see a relationship, and thenfollow the trace of that
relationship you feel towherever it goes. So in that
(09:15):
case, for me, the hardest partyet is figuring out the
architecture of an entiredatabase. And some of them, you
know, mind bogglinglycomplicated.
Jordan Fleming (09:25):
Did you do you then, in the work you're doing
right now? Are you starting tobuild systems from scratch? Have
you been building systems fromscratch? yet?
Tim Castillo-Gill (09:36):
For me, I have not built anything from
scratch other than my own tests,playing around and test things
I've been really poking aroundin lots of I mean, obviously,
it's mostly in Pete's work andseeing how those things, this
trail of how things work, andwe've been trying to make PRM
(09:58):
diagrams Using lucid chart andhis he's quite big on those as
well. So you can sort of see therelationships quite clearly from
a sort of big perspective,zooming out on it. So that's
where we are. And that's how I'mtrying to figure out the general
sort of architecture of how thedatabases so bother you.
Bavo De Cooman (10:19):
Yeah, yeah, that's it relationships is a
wreck is a recognisable thing.
So in the beginning, I had thisI have no, I had no clue of
databases even so. So, in thebeginning, when I learned what a
relationship was, in my ownapps, I started laying double
relationships.
Jordan Fleming (10:42):
across the face,
Bavo De Cooman (10:44):
the forwards and backwards relationship that if
you make one that the other onesautomatically didn't realise. So
in the beginning, it was reallylike building ugly things with
podio bricks. So it's, like withLego you can, you can build the
Taj Mahal and you can build theugliest building ever. And, and
(11:06):
in the beginning, the blankcanvas was a bit was a bit
confusing. So it took a whilefor me to actually adopt it. So
in the beginning, I was justwriting text and not really
using podio. Because what youhave this blank canvas, I tried
a few things, but there's likenothing on it. But then Mike
asked me, so maybe we'd like todo a podio trainings because he
(11:30):
there was a company working withpodio. And he was doing podio
training for that had no time.
Could you take that over? said,Well, yeah, okay, so then I
really dived into the interface.
And then it started, then thenrelease, I started realising how
it actually works. That was agood starting point for me.
Jordan Fleming (11:49):
And interesting, actually, because the data I
mean, you've you've, you've hiton a really fundamental thing
that you learn as you go withpodio about, you know, data
structuring is a critical partof a good if you're going to
build a good podio system, howthe data is structured, and the
hierarchies that you create andthe and where you're going to
(12:11):
keep, you know, the end businessobjects and how you're going to
relate to them. That's animportant thing. And you both
have, you know, with Mike, withMike and Pete, and, Izzy, you do
have, you know, some veryexperienced developers who
understand the concepts of data.
Okay, it was there any, as youstarted to learn best practice,
from looking at some of thesystems they built or talking to
(12:32):
them? Was there anything thatthat that went, you know, that
was either surprising or kind ofwent against what you would have
thought was intuitive? Or didit? Was it like once you heard
it, you went? Oh, yeah, thatmakes sense.
Bavo De Cooman (12:49):
Yeah, I think the last one or like, yeah, like
insights coming? Like, divineinsights, like, Okay, this is
how it works. So when we aresolving things, so Mike shows me
your problem, I have no, no cluewhat I have to do. And then he
(13:12):
step by step with goodpractices, shows me how to do
it. And I say, Well, is it thatsimple, like, especially the
CWA, it looked like very, verydifficult to me, but when I,
when, when, when I hadn't workedwith it yet, but now it really
makes sense. And I can, and Ican read it brick by brick. And
(13:33):
before that, I had to I had tomake demos of query tools,
showing globey flow breaks andwas like, I don't know what the
hell is in there. But now I canactually actually read it. So
it's a good thing. So he'sactually Mike is actually
training me I'm doing a fewthings on my own, which I can
which I can already build. Andthen he helps me few hours a day
(14:00):
to do a few support tickets andfrom support tickets, I get to
know the client setups and Iimmediately get to know the good
practice so I'm actuallylearning with the good practice
in mind immediately that's avery good thing.
Tim Castillo-Gill (14:15):
Yeah, I can I can second that's there's
there's a moment I had actuallyhad an A moment the other day
where it was with Izzy that Iwas chatting to him and he was
he was talking about how thecore of a lot of his of the a
lot of the workspaces he does orthe organization's he does is,
is this contact app. Soeverything you know, so you've
got people and always that namesthat have phone numbers or
(14:36):
whatever, always coming out ofthese contacts apps, but then
you might want another area ofthis person that isn't so free
and open. There's not sharedwith everyone so you have
another app. That is likeanother DBS check or whatever it
is or their, their I think theyuse the example of maybe they
have what's called when you dosomething bad or work whenever
(14:57):
you have like a you get adisciplinary or something you
don't want that to be open toeveryone. So you have a
different app that's not sharedwith everyone, but it's related
to that person. So all thesepeople, so all this information
is always been fed by thiscontext app. So you have these
sort of core apps that you'llfind related in, you know, maybe
all, if not quite a lot of theseapps, or these tables in, I
(15:20):
always get the whole app tablething, if you want to get back
to the podio kind of linguisticthing, the app on a table is
taken me quite a while, like,obviously, it's just an app is a
table a table is now but whythey call them an app, not just
to take
Jordan Fleming (15:41):
notes, a table denotes almost a static bit of
data on AP to denote somethingthat you can actually work with,
I think, but but interesting,you know, I think, you know,
when you're those dataprinciples are important, but
also just the experience of, youknow, of how much I think it
(16:05):
helps to have people showing youbest practice on a routine
basis. Because I, I think that'sgot to be probably if you if you
get when I first started usingpodio, I built our first systems
when I first started usingpodio. So I was figuring it out.
And there was nothing thatanybody could do, like I was the
one figuring it out. So I didn'tneed to be taught as I was
(16:27):
building the apps. Now they werehorrible. But whereas if you get
parachuted into what I wouldconsider a mature environment,
like it's already built, it'salready doing this, and you got
to work in it. The learningcurve, there's a little
different, it's a, it's adifferent thing, because you're
not just walking in and figuringlots of stuff out, you're
(16:47):
actually having to look atrelatively already developed
workflow and app structures anddata structures, and decide and
figure out what you can andcannot do with it. Right. And
that must like he just he justif we take a step back and think
of cuz people bitch all the timeabout the podio interface and
(17:10):
how it's not changed in a longtime, and it hasn't, but I like
it because of its consistency.
But I don't think it'snecessarily easy to learn. What
was your experience? getting tothe point where you felt like
you could whiz around podio,right, because there's
difference between kind of goingin and knowing where to go and
being able to, you know, justfucking fly? Well, how did you
(17:32):
find that experience?
Bavo De Cooman (17:37):
Yeah, knowing that notifications is actually
your inbox, that is one thing.
And that, that it's like areverse email system. So instead
of emails being pushed to you,you're pulling up the you're
pulling in the index, you wantthe updates you want to follow.
So that was a good thing. So Solearning that following smartly,
(18:01):
and then you get thesenotifications, and this is like
your inbox, then having thetasks, the tasks as as
reminders, that was a good one.
So to immediately go to theright context, and just getting
to know the zones. So theinterface is when you first look
(18:24):
at it, it's it's weird, butthere's so little on it that
once you know what every zonemeans, then you can you can get
started. So have. So this is myimportant stuff. Here's a tile,
on my on my right side panel, inmy activity, I see the things
that happened. And if I unfollowa few things, it's going to
(18:46):
become relevant. And same thingfor the notifications. And then
you're good to go. Yeah,
Tim Castillo-Gill (18:53):
that's I agree with you Baba that I think
that a lot of like, the actualdifferent elements of podio is
fairly, as long as you get toknow where they are, what they
kind of do, they're kind ofuseful at the task thing is
quite interesting. Because ifyou're in an app, and then you
set a task, it's sort ofattached to that item or that
Yeah, so that's, that's this,there's certain things which you
(19:13):
can do, which aren't necessarilylike, you'd could take advantage
of more, or I could takeadvantage of more. But I just
don't think of doing it. Soit's, it's, there's that part of
it, which is I just think of atask being the big task, right?
Like it's just a big list. Idon't think of it attaching it
to a particular item, which I'msure would be extremely useful.
(19:34):
You know, if something's got abug or something, it's
particular to that item. Andthen then that's perfect use
case for it, I guess.
Jordan Fleming (19:42):
Stop. Okay, I'm sorry. I'm just going to
interrupt this amazing podcastfor a couple of seconds. I know
if you're a regular listener.
You've heard me talk about thegame changers supercharged
masterclass series, and I'vealready had a number of people
give their details in with theform and comment attack me
saying when can we get involved?
(20:02):
Well, life has happened. movinghouse lots of things going on.
And although I promised to getup the first modules in June, it
is going to be the end of Julynow July 2021. But I am super
excited about it. Thisabsolutely free masterclass
series is going to go through abunch of great modules, the
(20:22):
fundamentals of podio, thefundamentals of great podio
design, great ways of usingglobey flow and extending podio.
It is distillation of using useof my team, myself included, of
designing podio. It's ourattempt at bringing together
some best in class principles ofpodio design, it's really an
(20:45):
exciting proposition, I can'twait to launch it, it is coming
soon. Go over to www.we are gamechangers.com go to the master
class sending your details willlet you know as soon as the
first module is up, I guaranteethe first modules are going up
and to July 2021. Now, back tothis awesome podcast, when
(21:06):
contextually understanding whatyou need to do is an important
part of, of relationshiprelationships. In podio, whether
you're using the podio nativetasks up the top, or whether
using a separate task app, youalmost always have the the task
you create, whether it's an appitem or a task in the podio
(21:26):
system, it's always going to berelated to the things that
matter. Now we choose to use atask app. And I'm surprised to
hear you say tasks, because Iwould have thought both Peter
and Mike wouldn't be using thepodio task, they'd be using a
task app.
Bavo De Cooman (21:40):
And the reason we do that, but we use that to
it we use them both. So
Jordan Fleming (21:46):
yeah, logic is to why do you have curiosity? Do
you have logic as to which oneyou use when?
Bavo De Cooman (21:54):
Well, that by renaming the word task reminder.
And so when I did my first whenI was investigating podio for
for my first of all, yourtraining, that's what we came up
with that actually it's not thetask is not a to do item because
it to do the item has detailedinformation and maybe link
(22:16):
documents and stuff. But thetask is a reminder, I have
tomorrow I have to look at thatI have to read the document. And
in two days, I have to writepart of it. And then I have to
mention my colleague. And sothese tasks are just reminders
that bring you to the rightcontext. So in that respect, the
(22:36):
word task is maybe even a badword. But now the to do apps are
actually like, I don't thinkthere's like a mike should
correct me if I'm wrong. Butthere's not really a native to
do app where everything is wehave several. So we have we have
(23:00):
a help desk app for for clienttickets. And we have a few
backlog absolute, let's say wehave five, six to do apps. And
then we use reminders ifnecessary to do that. And views.
So also, to follow up a fewviews to check on the new ones.
(23:21):
For the two dues and setreminders when necessary.
Personally, I
Tim Castillo-Gill (23:27):
think it's the it's the same, this is the
same besides. So I think I thinkthe tasks mainly, mainly are
used just for small things, youknow, like yeah, I don't think
I'm probably like, using themmore than anyone else to be
honest. So just this little,like, I've got to remember to,
you know, to do my put my notesinto daily stand up or
(23:48):
something, it would be somethinglike really random, whereas
actually we have we do as yousay, Jordan, we have, like an
app for
Jordan Fleming (23:55):
I will be very surprised. Yeah. I would have
been shocked back to actually
Unknown (24:01):
without a
Bavo De Cooman (24:02):
question. It's true. It's it's, it's really
powerful. it to me that was oneof the things that actually got
me into podio because beforethat I had been experimenting
with task planners, I I've beendoing a subject with a free and
open subject with students withinvestigating productivity apps.
And then you have this taskplanner and that task planner
(24:22):
and this one was task planningfunctionality, etc. And I had
never found a good task planner.
And then there was podio andit's it's you have this platform
and then they have somewherethey have a full blown task
planner that actually isperfectly well thought out. So
like for the recurring tasks isis really well done. So yeah, I
(24:44):
find it I find it striking howpodio can sometimes surprise you
like oh, it can do that too.
Like so like that like having afull blown task planner or like
having a cat board where you canrearrange the order of cards,
(25:06):
things like that. So things thatI was was thinking of using an
external app and then realisingactually podio can do it as
well.
Jordan Fleming (25:15):
What did you guys think podio was? Because,
like, out of curiosity is Imean, people always come and
say, come to me and say, Hey, sois podio CRM. And you're like,
Well, yeah, I can. Yeah, I canbe you can build a great CRM.
Oh, it's a project managementtool. Yeah, you can build a
great project management tool.
But is it one? No. Use but youcan build one, my stock answer
(25:36):
is nobody, you can build one.
But almost everybody who doesn'tunderstand the power of a
system, a platform that you canbuild multiple business kind of
process in, thinks in terms oftunnel vision, software apps, I
buy Microsoft Office, to getWord, Excel, and whatever else
(25:57):
shift a to pile into it now, andI just care about what I buy. I
buy Asana, because it tells meit's a project management
system, I buy it, Salesforce,tells me it's a CRM system, what
was your way with podio? As weall know, those rules are
completely broken, because itcan be any of those things, all
(26:20):
of those things together,combined with everything else.
So what did you think when youfirst were coming into podio?
That it was supposed to be? Andhow surprised Were you with jet
like as the Bible as you weresort of saying like, Oh, shit,
it can do this? did have youboth felt a and I'll go to Tim
first. Have you both felt thiskind of like, what the fuck
(26:41):
holy? Wow, it can do everythingmoment or what? What's been your
experience?
Tim Castillo-Gill (26:45):
Yeah, I mean, that when I first arrived at
podio, that was part of myinterview process was to
basically come accustomed to it.
And then Pete sent me some whatlooks what seemed like a
complicated task at the time,but it was fairly simple in
hindsight, is, is that podio islike, yeah, like you say, when I
first arrived at it, I thought,well, this is a way of
structuring data. I mean, Ithink, and that's basically, I
(27:08):
guess, it kind of is what it is,in some ways. So I don't think I
described a delegate was Ithink, perhaps it was
purposefully not described asanything by P or Izzy,
specifically, they just said,it's this thing and go and find
out what it is basically, andwhat I came to it and I could
move these different fields,date fields, title fields, text
(27:29):
fields, whatever it was, andcalculated fields, I had no idea
what that was when I firstarrived to it. So I was like,
two plus two plus two. Is thatis that gonna give me for a bit?
So that was my first what was myfirst arrived to podio? I was
like, Okay, well, what, what isthis? And that was my
expectation. That was my sort ofexpectation as I came to the
(27:52):
interviews, okay. So they'regoing to ask me to take some
information and structure itsomehow, because that seems to
be what podio does. So it wasn'tdescribed as a CRM, or a project
management tool, or any of thosethings. In hindsight, in answer
to your question, have I hadlike a heart like, Whoa, kind of
moment? Yeah, sure. When I see,it mostly comes from the when I
(28:14):
see is he or piece because I amsure Mike does the same thing.
But he's there. These are thepeople I've seen their work of.
And I've seen the differentcontexts that they've used
podio. And they go, like, allthe different ways that it can
be used. It's sort of likegoing, Okay, well, this is a
database. And if I forget pw A,which is a huge part of what
(28:35):
makes podio useful, in someways, it just structuring data,
is it really useful, and thenbeing able to see it quite
nicely in a nice UI is quitenice, because when I was when I
was learning how to develop, wedid, we touched on databases,
(28:56):
and we used mostly code baseddatabases where it was a bit
sort of behind behind thecurtain, you couldn't really
see, unless you tapped in theright keys, you couldn't really
see what you were looking at,certainly couldn't use the
mouse, you know, becauseobviously, it wasn't the user
interface. So podio for me waslike, I can see what I'm doing,
(29:16):
I can see the data that I'mputting in, I can see the
labels, you can see the theitems and the values. So that
for me was like, Oh, this isgreat. Because I actually never
really liked that part of thecoding part of not being to see
what I was doing. So for me,that was what podio was. And
then pw a I'm sure is that it'sjust another conversation, I
(29:37):
think,
Jordan Fleming (29:39):
well, I'll go to Babel first and then we'll touch
on bw actually, so go ahead,Baba. Yeah,
Bavo De Cooman (29:45):
well, it looked a bit like like, like in the
like, data set like an like abig, big collection of
interconnected Excel files,something like that. So and the
interface not far off from whatit is I mean, yeah, yeah, but so
and the interface was empty. Andso it was like a boring set of
(30:09):
data. And then but you could doevery and everything with it.
And once you start actuallyseeing how things are built,
then you start realising, okay,you can actually build something
with it. And especially whenwith with pw a, like that, you
can build an app that can fillin all kinds of information
(30:33):
automatically, and you justclick a button. And it's like,
it's like making making anapplications with just globey
flow and podium. That was reallysurprising. That is, so that's
for something that normally Iwould think, Okay, this needs
this and this and this, andthis, and this, and this in this
field, it's just like, okay,that's, here's the button, and
(30:57):
all the fields are filled infrom referenced apps
Jordan Fleming (31:01):
have been surprised. I'm so sorry for
interrupting you been surprisedby just how much automation you
can squeeze into businessprocesses? Yes. Wow. It's
amazing. I mean, I, I'm used toit now. But I still sometimes
(31:22):
when we turn over a system, toone of the clients, and they're
just like, like, you know, like,holy shit, because all of this,
all of the automation and theworkflow, and, you know, just to
every five minutes you save byhaving something presented to
you, with everything filled inproperly, and double blah, blah,
(31:42):
and all these manual things.
And, you know, a process which amonkey could do by filling in
paperwork and creating a PDF andemailing it, someone takes a
human being 15 minutes. And, youknow, yeah, that must as part of
your understanding of podio, pwA's is necessarily going to play
a big part of it. How has your Imean, you kind of mentioned the
(32:07):
Bible, I think he said, You cannow read the, you know, you can
read brick by brick, etc. Kindof like when you're a musician,
if you're a musician, I'vealways wondered why you could
read a store. Yeah, show scoreon a plane and just be like,
Yeah, I got it, like, it's fine.
Other people would be like,like, but so with, with pw a,
(32:32):
you know, how has the How isthat? How's the experience been
kind of getting to know PDO?
with web?
Tim Castillo-Gill (32:43):
It's a it's a, it's a roller coaster PWB. In
some ways, it's like a dreamcome true in other ways. It's a
it's a sort of head against thebrick wall moment. Some of it
like some of it worksbeautifully. And some of it you
go like, Well, why does it dothat? Why do I have to do that?
First? I think more and moreover the last, maybe the last
four weeks? Specifically, I've,I've been in this job for? This
(33:06):
is my eighth week, I think so.
Over the last four weeks, Ithink that the first four weeks
was me just getting to knoweverything. And the last four
weeks has been quite TWAfocused, and more and more is
kind of gone. Okay, now I getwhy you have to do that it sort
of makes sense. To begin with. Iwas I learned in my in this boot
camp that I did, we dideverything in a text editor. So
(33:28):
it was you had to writeeverything. So this the block
system, in some ways, feels veryrigid. And it's rigid for a
reason. I can't understand whyit is. But it's always
frustrating. If you've got like,Yeah, I'd really like to do
that, then. Or I'd like to usethis, you know, in this case,
PHP function, and it's notavailable. Well, those there's
(33:50):
some frustrations, but at thesame way, you've got to go.
Yeah, but I'd have to do withauthentification I don't have to
deal with, you know, like allthis other stuff that obviously
PwC deals with. And so it's abit of a push Nepal swings
around about situation for me.
Bavo De Cooman (34:08):
Yeah, that's always thinking of how I'm going
to construct it. So because thedanger of the pitfall of podio.
And probably also, the greatthing about podio is like it's
so flexible, that you can buildanything and so you can also
build really shitty systems. So,when working with globey flow on
(34:35):
tickets, I get this goodpractice of making the flows as
simple as possible and alsosplitting up. So like having
short create, create and updateflows. And then having manual
flows that do just this task isfor this manual flow and this
task is for that manual flow.
And that way it's a it's It'seasier to understand the
(35:00):
structure of it, instead ofhaving this super long flow that
if this happens, then do this.
And if that happens, and thatand if this happens and that and
so they can, they can sometimesbecome extremely long. And the
process has become for Mike.
Also a learning curve has becomea shortening them where
(35:21):
possible. And I think that's avery good practice to start
with.
Jordan Fleming (35:26):
Have you. Sorry, just to follow up on what you're
just saying? I'm an interruptingbastard, by the way. So like, no
worries, because and it's mypodcast, so I'll fucking do it
if I want it right? No, have youfound that as you've grown in
your, in your pw a, you'resupposed to call it bw a now
Bob? Oh, trust me, I'm with youon the global COVID. But I'm
(35:48):
getting used to calling a PwC.
Now Actually, I'm there now. Sohave you found that as you
develop your pw a andpotentially your proc foo Oh,
that's, that isn't one we'll getinto today. But your view a
knowledge, your understanding ofwhy podio data hierarchy needs
to be certain ways. It's sort oflike, you learn, you level up
your learning here, which makesyou go Oh, and then then you
(36:10):
kind of you know, it's aconstant of evolution. Because
more you start to build. What Iwould say is more advanced
workflow, you know, more complexworkflows that maybe need to
work together or or need to workacross a larger environment, the
more your understanding of podiostructure and what is going to
(36:32):
work and what isn't, evolves. Sodo you feel like every time you
level up in your pw aunderstanding, you're levelling
up in your podio understandingas well.
Bavo De Cooman (36:48):
Somewhat here, like, the way apps are
referenced, and to think ofmaybe also learn to think of, I
should make a view for thatfirst, and then bake that. Take
that view? Few things like that.
But like, I don't think I have Ihave gotten to the point you're,
(37:12):
you're explaining that. Youreally see I had I had already I
had already a good basicunderstanding. So no big changes
yet. But I also haven't done toocomplex projects yet.
Unknown (37:34):
Yeah, start getting there.
Tim Castillo-Gill (37:37):
Yeah, I think I think I'm, I think I'm so
certain Well, a similar chain,similar train as Baba, where I'm
going have I like, if I write aflow in pw a, and I want to get
hold of a piece of informationfrom podio. I guess I'm
impatient, I suppose, in thesense of just, I need that piece
(38:00):
of information, go and get itfor me, in some ways, so just
like, if I'm going to use you goand do this thing for me, and I
want to do what I want to do onit. So in some ways, I'm
spoiled, I guess in like, if Iwanted to do everything for me,
and then I'll just sell, I say,you know, I'll take this, this
and this, and I want to add thatto that and that whatever I'm
(38:21):
doing, and then I want to updatethat item. And I want you to do
everything else will be pleased.
And it's not quite it's that Idon't know if so in that sense,
I'm not quite there in the waythat you're saying. Yeah, you
need to balance up the sort oftheir their the architecture of
polio and how you've designedyour database or your apps or
whatever, to how you write aflow. I don't know I don't think
(38:44):
I'm not quite not quite therewith with with that balance, or
with that sort of realisation Iguess maybe
Jordan Fleming (38:53):
after eight weeks, you're not there yet.
have a word with fucking Pete,man. I don't know. But I think
you'll find as you're just asyou guys continue to grow your
skills, you're you you're youwill probably come up with your
own style. And it may be one youslightly inherit from Mike and
(39:15):
Pete and Izzy because you willinherit is it's you know, their
companies. So they're going toshow enforce a certain element
of style. But you'll also comeup with your own on your own
feel for what is good for whatis good. You know, we'd sort of
like we know it when we see it.
And we know when we feel it andI'm sure you'll find you know
that you've got that just out ofcuriosity as as some as people
(39:36):
who are, you know, only a fewmonths into your polio journey.
Do you have anything that youjust really, that really you
don't like? Or things that youfound really frustrating that
you had to kind of work to getover just out of curiosity, you
may not and that's fine, butsometimes people do and I'm
(39:57):
curious,
Bavo De Cooman (39:59):
too. text and writing and the description
fields. So the text, the multiline text field. And if I'm a
writer, you know, and I know. Somy cousin Mike has an idea. He
thinks in like very short piecesof text, I write out all kinds
(40:21):
of ideas and stuff. And then Iwant to rearrange and and, and
cut and paste and put this hereand put that there and drag and
drop and, and also, yeah, I'm abit of a chaotic person
collecting ideas fromeverywhere. So if you do that
type of planning, in a podioapp, it's terrible. So, so you,
(40:46):
you write something, you styleit a bit, because I'm, like, for
example, I take a title, Iwanted to have this colour,
because it's visual recognition,especially if it's long. And
then I copy and paste somethingstyle is gone. have to rearrange
that. So that that one doesn'twork too. Well. The Superman
menu helps a bit. The Supermanyou extension. A bit. So I've
(41:12):
learned to for that for actuallyfor more complex planning and
ideas to just move move out ofpodio for a short while. And and
then, yeah, so keep that out andjust have a summary in podio, or
something. And I'll link readthis blog post about connecting
(41:38):
notion to polio.
Unknown (41:42):
virus.
Bavo De Cooman (41:44):
But the thing was that I was I started
experimenting with notion then.
And I was doing too much innotion and then I returned to
polio again. So yeah, in theend, it's just going to be for
just a few things. Like, forexample, if you content
planning, like for newsletter,or for website articles and
things, which is also what I'mdoing there, content planning
(42:04):
does not work well in podio. SoI just link, I just add the
links. But I make sure I, I keepthe overview in podio.
Tim Castillo-Gill (42:16):
Yeah, Tim, yeah, for my end, the I guess my
main, my main thing is, as youalready kind of touched on was
the calculation fields theytake, sometimes take quite a
long time to do something, andthen you have to sort of, I
guess, it's one of the quirks ofpodio. But maybe that should be
really should just get hold off,which is you kind of have to put
(42:38):
a timeout or whatever, you haveto just give it some time to
sort of sort things out, whichjust makes everything really
slow. If you're a client, youwant something to happen quite
quickly, if it's slow, it feelsinefficient and kind of old, in
some ways. If you're, you know,the old the slower something is
the older it feels in my head atleast. So the quicker something
is the more modern, it feels themore contemporary or whatever,
(42:59):
so I think they need to sortthat out. And pw a wise I'm so
used to seeing differentcolours. pw a just is quite a
bland set of colours and a wish,for example, and if an endif had
the same colour, so there weredifferent colours to the rest of
the blocks, if it was blue, andf is blue, E for each has red
(43:21):
ended, or whatever it's calledcontinues A B is also red, so
that there's some kind ofmatching up with the colours.
Just give it give me somethingNo,
Jordan Fleming (43:30):
I'm only laughing I'm only laughing. I'm
not laughing at your concept.
I'm only laughing because rightnow, in in smartphone, I'm
working on a project internally,where we are redesigning the
call flow system, and one of thethings we're doing is bringing
each type of block will is gonnahave have its own colour, so
that you have a visual referenceto the type of block you're
(43:53):
using. And so I'm not laughingcuz I think it's a dumb idea.
I'm laughing because I'm doingthis. We're doing this right now
in smart.
Tim Castillo-Gill (44:04):
Yeah, and it probably wouldn't be that hard
to do through some kind ofChrome extension or something.
Right, like, you know, the supermenu and things is I don't I've
not written a Chrome extension.
So I had no idea how difficultit is. But it seems like
something that would be quiteeasy to do. But who knows if it
is,
Jordan Fleming (44:19):
I think Chrome extension maybe but I mean, I
can tell you right now that Imean, you can you can put you
can usually put a skin on adeveloped system, you know,
change the visuals, as long asyou're changing the overall
functionality, or anything. Theskin can usually be done
relatively easily. It's when youstart screwing around with
(44:42):
everything else that it becomes,you know, people sometimes
they're like, well, can't youjust put this inside of that and
put this over there and you'relike, yeah, okay, just that. I
see an ad hours. Like, you know,come on you telling me? Hey,
sure, sure. Is there anythingwe've said? surprised you? Is it
(45:04):
kind of interest? No, I I thinkit's just interesting. I think
it's, you know, I think it'syou, you know, you both what's
the product tell you what didsurprise me. And I wonder if if
this is because you're bothworking within the environment
you're working, or maybe it'syour backgrounds. But you both
came with a sort of with adatabase heavy feel to you, in a
(45:29):
sense of like, you both describepodio. And most people will come
to me and describe podio as abusiness thing, like a CRM, or a
project management or whatever,you both came right in with this
notion of like, you know, ofdata and tables and data, you
know, that that's what podio wasto you. And that surprised me a
little because most people whenthey first come into podio, or
(45:52):
unless they are, unless you'redata scientists or or AI people
who build databases and SQL, orother fucking systems, most
people don't think of their datain that way. And you both kind
of came came to the, to thefield with that in your in your,
in your brains, but maybe that'salso slightly biassed by the
(46:15):
word, you know, the companiesyou're both gone into, are
people who are going to talkabout it like that all the
fucking time. I mean, he's, hewon't shut up about it, right? I
mean, you try you try. So thatsurprised me. But But, you know,
it's fun to I just, I don'tremember how podio was, I saw a
(46:38):
screenshot the other day ofpodio when I first got involved
with it, what it looked like,and it's not that dissimilar, by
the way, it's it's the but therewere some big differences. And,
and it really took me back. And,and it's nice to think of, of
when I first got involved withpodio. And I think what's
(46:59):
interesting about thisconversation is, you know, is
getting a perspective of peoplewho are new to podio. And
understanding maybe some of the,to me, my biggest takeaway is,
if you're going to bring peopleinto podio, particularly into an
environment where it's alreadybuilt pretty well, you need to
(47:20):
give them some method of playingto understand the fundamentals
of podio. If you're going totrain your staff to really be
able to use your system, well,they kind of have to play and
get to know podio. That's what Itake about. It that makes sense?
Tim Castillo-Gill (47:36):
Yeah, it does. It does. I think it also,
like you say with the bias, Ithink actually, obviously, there
is a bias to maybe myself andher brother member, welcome to
it. But also, we haven't foundpodio we've been sort of led to,
I guess, speak for myself. I wassomeone said, right, I've got
(47:57):
this job, you need to use thisplatform, and I have gone.
Whereas I've listened to otherpodcasts. He was Jordan, where
people have gone like, Oh, Ifound podio dabbled with it
left, it came back again, youknow that there was a bit more
sort of organic pneus about itor something. Whereas we've sort
of just gone, somebody has goneto us, sorry, this is what we're
using. You got to learn how touse it, and just crack on and
(48:20):
work out what's what. Yeah.
Jordan Fleming (48:22):
Interesting.
Interesting. Well, listen, guys,I really appreciate you coming
on. I will of course, for thoselistening, right now, I will of
course, pop both companywebsites into the podcast page
and into the description of thepodcast so that you can find
both both, I mean, quickfee andquibi. Tools. quibi is a
consultancy, query tools is anamazing system for that you can
(48:44):
really understand your podiosystem in a way that no other
system will let you do. And Ihighly recommend you check.
Check it out. And of course,future solutions, like quibi are
a great consultancy. And, youknow, they have a tremendous
(49:06):
they're based in the UK, Ababa,you're based in Belgium. Yeah.
And, you know, they are our twophenomenal partners who have a
long history of building greatthings in podio. And I highly
recommend you check them out aswell. So guys, thank you so much
for giving us your insight asnewbies to podio really
(49:27):
interesting journey and it wasalso a pleasure to meet both of
you. It's a pleasure. Thanks forhaving us.
Narrator (49:37):
You've been listening to supercharged with Jordan
Samuel Fleming. Subscribe todayon iTunes, Google Play or
Spotify for your weekly diveinto how you can supercharge
your business by making itpowered by podio. Be sure to
check out our website we aregame changers.com where you can
learn more and arrange a 30minute call with Jordan Dale
(49:58):
view understand how podiosupercharges you
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