March 12, 2025 • 21 mins
International Women´s Day theme "Accelerate Action, calls on all of us to step forward raise our voices and push for change. Jenny Toh, Award-winning Founder of River Life Coaching shares her experince offering free Open Circle Meetings to reflect, connect and take action. Discussing challenges women face and barriers women can break. https://riverlifecoaching.com https://www.linkedin.com/in/jenny-toh-pcc
Find more Talk 2 Brazil business expert interviews at https://talk2brazil.blogspot.com
Find more Talk 2 Brazil business expert interviews at https://talk2brazil.blogspot.com
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Welcome to Talk to Brazil with Tom Rioch, the business
connector to business in Brazil. Talk to Brazil podcast talks
with business experts throughout the world. I'm Tom Reac, connecting
people from my studio in Brazil. Joining us today from Singapore.
Jenny Toe, certified Professional coach, award winning founder of Riverlife Coaching,
(00:25):
offering tailored coaching programs to thrive both personally and professionally. So, Jenny,
on a recent LinkedIn post of yours regarding International Women's
Day and that this year's theme, Accelerate Action, calls on
all of us to step forward, raise our voices, push
for change. You also mentioned your free open circle meetings
(00:50):
to reflect, connect and take action. Tell us about those meetings.
Speaker 2 (00:57):
Well, Hi, Tom, Fast of all, it's good to see
you again. And you know when we were talking earlier,
we've met each other three years ago. I can't believe
how fast time lives. Thanks for having me back on
the podcast. So yes, International Women's Day has come and gone,
eight of March, but the conversations, I hope, like what
we talked about earlier, will continue. So it's something that
(01:18):
I do every year for free, in conjunction with International
Women's Day. I think I've been doing this for the
past three years at least to whold open meetings, So
I hold them over Zoom. It's Singapore time five pm,
so I know it's a bit challenging for the folks
at your side of the world to join, but I
appreciate this airtime anyway, Singapore time five pm every Friday,
(01:40):
and I offer my zoom link to everyone through the
LinkedIn post and people can come in. Normally it's women
that I'm opening it up to everyone who's interested. Right,
So like today's this year's TEME is accelerate action. So
when I hold this meeting, I will talk about a
bit about the team based on the International Women's Day website.
So what does it mean to accelerate nation? Yeah, it's
(02:03):
not so much about thinking, oh, there's so many things
I need to change or the world needs to change,
and you just feel so overwhelmed and you end up
not doing anything. Accelerate action here, to me, how I
interpret it is, what's one step, small step you can
do for yourself? And if you're in a position, maybe
you're more senior in your organization, what's more small, one
(02:23):
small step I can do for women in my company, right,
maybe is to advocate for someone who wants to have
a promotion and has been struggling, so maybe even offer responsive.
So there's many small things you can do. So back
to the meeting, there's no fixed structured agenda. But what
I normally do is get everyone in. Then you know,
(02:44):
there's a period of introduction, getting to know each other,
and I would ask one question. So for this year's
accelerate Action, I would ask one question, what is one
challenge you're facing? And all one question is what do
you think you can do with your control, within your
influence to create a small change in that challenge?
Speaker 1 (03:05):
And that roly is that step by step, and if
everybody takes one small step, then it becomes a whole
different force.
Speaker 2 (03:14):
Yeah, that's true. And also from my experience of the
past circles, women who don't know each other come together,
but when they hear someone say something that they think
they've experienced as well, So that's some connection, that's some
common ground. Everyone feels very energized. It's this power of
being seen, heard, and maybe to a certain extent understood.
(03:37):
It's very powerful there, right, because a lot of times
we're so busy I may see you, but I don't
really hear you because I've got my own agenda going on.
And more so, I don't even understand you because I
don't take time to stand out. So in purpose of
having this circle, people come in, people get to know
each other, People talk about these two topics, what's by challenge?
What can I do to shift it? And hopefully within
(03:58):
that conversation someone will say, I've experienced this before and
this is what I've done, so not saying, you follow
what that person's said. So you feel encouraged and you
get some ideas, and you know, they say the collective wisdom, right,
there's always power in the collective wisdom.
Speaker 1 (04:12):
Well too that you you offer the invitation to anyone
who wants to join, So you're you're actually joining persons
who haven't met each other, like you mentioned, and you
might not know these persons either.
Speaker 2 (04:25):
No, no, I wouldn't. I mean, in the past, people
just joined and and you know I welcome them in
and I show up authentically. So I think one of
my secret superpowers is the ability to build trusted rapport
within people. People have given me feedback on debt that
I build trust very quickly and I know in my
(04:46):
profession as a coach, that's one key competency that so
I really, you know, take encouragement from that. You know,
even in a recent conversation where a new client she
was telling me, I feel so comfortable with you, I
can tell you everything, and that I was just in
the first session. So I don't know exactly what I do.
Perhaps is just showing up authentically.
Speaker 1 (05:06):
No, I think I see what you I'm looking at
your site right now and I said, you're award winning
and you actually are. And some of those awards are
the most Inclusive Coaching Company in Singapore, Right Life Coaching
Company of the Year twenty twenty four, Top Life Coaching
Company in Singapore, Best Life Coaches listing on Semi Best Singapore.
(05:30):
But one of the things that really caught me is
Asia's Most Passionate Women of the Year twenty twenty four.
So you do what you do, but you've you've already
externed a passion for what you do, so you are
Asia's most Passionate Women of twenty twenty four.
Speaker 2 (05:52):
I know it's quite strange. Some people say, oh, but
you say you're an introvert. You don't sound like an
introvert when you're talking, that's just it for introverts who
are passionate. And what I'm passionate about is supporting introverted people,
you know, to be more visible. Yes, it was on that. Yeah,
so you can say the passion drives me to put
(06:14):
myself out there. And the purpose of this open circle
is also for women to find a voice, right to
say that, oh, you know, I'm able to come here,
I'm able to share my thoughts without being judged. I
think a lot of times we feel that we are
being judged. Right. So even for me when I put
something out on social media and I'm normally on LinkedIn,
there is sometimes at the back of my mind, oh
(06:34):
if I put this out, how will people see me? Right?
And then you hesitate and then draw yourself in. Yeah.
But the main thing to overcome that is to say that,
you know, if only one person could read this or
hear this and feel encouraged, it's worth it, right, just
like what we were talking about earlier, Just put that
message out there in the hope that someone gets encouraged
(06:57):
and doesn't feel so alone. Right. A lot of times
you and I both struggle through things and we feel
so alone like.
Speaker 1 (07:03):
Me that you ever encourage that just having persons, inviting person,
having them come is really a major step. And also
from those meetings, do you see we're talking about challenges
for women? It is global, right, yes it is. We're
not talking about Singapore where you're talking about the world.
Speaker 2 (07:24):
Yeah, yeah, I mean, you know, Singapore is quite a
developed nation, so the challenges are maybe a bit more
different than you know, in a third world country, but
there are challenges and women feel that, you know, they
are not given equal rights. I mean there's this big debate,
ongoing debate about gender paid parity, right, it's ongoing, it's it.
(07:44):
And then they're saying it's going to take what five
generations from now, So even my daughters and my granddaughters
won't see the difference. I mean once see the gap
closing as much. It's going to go on for generations.
Speaker 1 (07:56):
I saw that in that person you mentioned that. So
and actually to the point of having a daughter, is
that another driver for you for other women who have daughters,
they can see that they want the future to come faster.
Speaker 2 (08:10):
Well, it's not so much about you know, men women
against men, right, So I like this quote by Mary
Shelley So. She's an author, you know, a long time
ago of Frankensteis. So is a renowned author. Her quote is,
it's not about women having power over men. It's about
women realizing that they have the power for themselves. I
(08:30):
think a lot of times society tells us we are
like the second class. I mean, maybe not so much now,
but back in the days, you are like the weaker
sex and you don't have so much power. You couldn't
even vote, you know how many years ago. So that's changing.
I recognize that. But it's not so much like, oh,
we're going to bash men, right, No, it's more like recognizing,
this is who I am. I'm unique. I should be
(08:51):
given visibility and seeing for my uniqueness as a person.
That's what I like people to see. Right, don't say
you're men are and now you've got a whole area
of you know, the genders.
Speaker 1 (09:05):
Well, hopefully someday we can get to the point where
we don't have to talk about that exactly.
Speaker 2 (09:09):
Someday we get to the point where we don't have
to talk about Tom. You're a guy, you know, Jenny's
a woman. You don't have to talk about that. Tom
is Tom and Tom is great at doing this and
Jenny's great at doing this, and we get recognition.
Speaker 1 (09:20):
Right.
Speaker 2 (09:21):
Yeah, that's that's where we're both hoping and hopefully a
lot of people hoping to get there as well.
Speaker 1 (09:26):
So to the acceleration, you know, to the point of
accelerate action and taking for what your takeaways. I know
you're still going to have more meetings, but what are
some of the takeaways you've had from these meetings? What
actions could be accelerated.
Speaker 2 (09:41):
It's asking yourself what could you do for yourself within
your circle of control and influence. A lot of times
we see the external problems and we say I have
no choice, I am stuck. But through the conversations you
suddenly see that, oh, actually I can still do this, right.
I can still have a conversation with someone. I may
(10:01):
not control the outcome from that conversation, but I can
voice what I want, put it out there. Just be
a bit more assertive. So when they start doing these
small things, it shifts and there's a ripple effect to
how they're feeling internally, and that's a ripple effect to
the people around them. So, for example, if you speak
up in a meeting and someone says, oh, she's poke
(10:23):
up in a meeting. Maybe I can do that and
they start speaking up as well, So you can see
the positive ripple effects slowly, but it's I believe it
will happen.
Speaker 1 (10:33):
And for a female leadership. Do you see more and
more of that happening corporate wise?
Speaker 2 (10:40):
Yes, definitely. I think that was a report by the
Singapore Stock Exchange as she has to say that now
the percentage in women leaders have been increased, I think
up to thirty percent. So there is definitely growth for
the women's CEOs in our country and I think in
everywhere else as well. But again it's a slow process,
(11:00):
but it's good that the representation has gone up.
Speaker 1 (11:03):
No, but the good thing there are models to be followed.
Speaker 2 (11:06):
Yes, yes there are. So it's actually very important for
women in senior leadership position to kind of reflect on
their own career journey, right who supported them? And it
doesn't have to be they can reflect that, Oh I
had male mentors. Maybe is to encourage the younger women
to reach out to mentors both male and female, to
give a balanced perspective on things. Why I'm so passionate
(11:27):
as I reflect on my own journey, I never really
had a strong female mentor in the past, so that's
why I really want to give it back. So yes,
I'm a coach, but in opportunities when it arise, I
also mentor people, right if they come to me for that, Yeah,
because I want to pay it back, pay forward as
well for what I did not have. So sometimes we
come from a place of life and we.
Speaker 1 (11:49):
Wonder them well and that I don't want to say
that was the majority, but that's the way it was
in many places, and so the more that they can
and I think that's one of the advantages of communication
today different from the past. So what you're doing in
your meetings, you're able to reach persons that several years
ago were unreasonable in a technical way you couldn't you know,
(12:11):
you don't have to make a phone call maybe, so
today that's completely different. So you can send out a
zoom link and people can access that. They have internet,
they have a handheld device that they can take part in.
So the technology has been a helper.
Speaker 2 (12:26):
Yes, yes, it's a double edged sword, right, So like
what you say, people can access the meetings, not just
mind anything right in a zoom call. Unfortunately, it also
grows a bit of distance in genuine human connection. So
sometimes Tom, I'm sure you've done it. Well, you enter
into a webinar, your video is off, your audio is off,
and you're just listening. So how engaged are you? You
(12:47):
know in that sometimes you're doing other things. I'm guilty
of that as well, if I a ten of webinar.
So when I run my webinars, I ensure that there's
space for interaction. Even though it's a zoom call. I
will pause, get feedback and for the well quite once
they might be busy typing in the chat, but that's fine,
right any folk to get that interaction between you know,
the speaker and the audience.
Speaker 1 (13:09):
Well, I'm obviously a firm believer in that. Like since
two thousand and nine, what I've been doing. The majority
of people that yourself we've spoken before. We interact on LinkedIn,
but we have never met personally.
Speaker 2 (13:26):
No, we haven't.
Speaker 1 (13:28):
I don't want to say that we may ever, but
it isn't. One of the years ago we sort of
had a feeling that we had to meet the person.
There had to be that physical connection of sitting down
and having coffee or tea, and we felt that was
necessary to develop relationships. But technology has shown us that
(13:50):
we can have virtual relationships. I don't want to call
our relationship virtual, it's virtual because it's technically we're in
the distance here, I'm on a a night before you.
You're you're already in tomorrow morning. Yeah, you know, if
you can believe that you're talking of your morning in
(14:10):
seeing whorre and I'm talking about yesterday in Brazil, and
so you know, how does that work?
Speaker 2 (14:16):
Well?
Speaker 1 (14:17):
It works, But years ago we couldn't do that. We
would be writing each other letters maybe and they wouldn't
get there. So so that has helped. I think that's
created a multifaceted world. And also for what you do
(14:37):
in your meetings, it gives you, i think, a challenge,
an opportunity to see a lot of women in different
places and in one meeting, and if you bring them
into the meeting, it's better, like you said.
Speaker 2 (14:48):
Yes, yes. And it's also that common understanding that although
you come from different cultures, background, aage, you know, profession,
whatever it is, there are common traits that that we
you all share, right Like you want to be recognized
for your worth, You want to have a place where
you can be authentic, and I think a lot of
(15:08):
people struggle to be their true authentic self in the
corporate world because you have to fit organization culture, maybe
your bosses of a certain personality. You're very different. So
that's all the struggles that I believe is universal. And
of course there's another thing, not saying mostly for women
because I speak to more women clients. It's that self doubt,
(15:31):
that inner critic in your mind, because I'm not saying
men don't have that. Male clients has overcome to me
and say that, you know, I don't think I'm good enough,
but maybe women tend to vocalize that more so you're
as a guy, maybe you don't go and tell everyone
to say that I think I'm not good enough, but
women sometimes where women get together, they'll say, I don't
think I'm good enough for this role. I don't think
(15:51):
I'm ready for that promotion, although deep down inside you
want it. So what's actually holding you back is not
so much external factors. But sometimes I believe that I
am not good enough, right, So it's also hearing other
women say that to say that, oh, I'm not going
crazy in the hit looks like yeah, people think in
this way as well. And then together, you work through
like how do I quieten down that inner critic and
(16:15):
raise the volume of my cheerleader? Right, A lot of
times we don't even hear our cheerleader. We hear the
critics so much we forget we also have the cheerleader.
Speaker 1 (16:24):
Well, give me a tip, all right, And we're talking
obviously women, you're talking to women. You're having the groups.
And we mentioned this before we started at the International
Women's Days in March, and they tend to bring it
to a day and what can we do? What can
I do as a as a male figure to keep
(16:44):
this alive till next year because it's just not a
one day thing. It's just not a one month event
because there's so much that needs to be done. What
are your suggestions to me and other guys? What can
we do during the year.
Speaker 2 (16:58):
Yeah, it's about awareness for you. You know, you've got
this beautiful tree podcast, So it's to create awareness tree
your podcasts, so you don't always have to talk about
International Women's State. But if one of your guests comes
in and then maybe talks about how to navigate those
difficult conversations at work, right, So then your guests can
(17:18):
talk about examples if it's a male guest, the male guest,
can they say that you know, how he as a
manager can support maybe his direct reports who are female
to navigate difficult conversations. And if you've got a female leader,
how does she handle those difficult conversations with very aggressive
male counterparts? How do you balance that? So it could
(17:40):
be very topic specific, but one I think it starts
from being aware and to create that awareness for everyone.
And the second thing is maybe to practice empathy. Right,
So so sometimes we're only human, we think more about ourselves, like, oh,
how do I see myself in this situation? But with
some space, you can think that, oh, if I would
(18:00):
put myself in his shoes or horror shoes, what does
set look like? So when you're interviewing guests, maybe even
for yourself to just I know you do this very well,
but just to get it's a bit more curious, like wow,
you know you see that from your lens? You know
I see it this way, and to have that conversation
that the event may be the same, but we're seeing
it with both our lines.
Speaker 1 (18:20):
And I think that's more often the case where we're
just looking at the same thing and seeing it in
different ways.
Speaker 2 (18:26):
It's so different and sometimes offering that shift. So for you,
you offer that shift maybe to someone younger, so it's
almost like you're mentoring, you offer that shift. You know,
I see it actually from this angle. What do you
think for all?
Speaker 1 (18:40):
Do you see a difference? Do you see something different?
You talk about your daughter as the perception among Garnber
women different than it was for you at their age change.
Speaker 2 (18:55):
Well, my daughters, they have access to so much information
right at this young age, both of them are, but
they know so much more. If I reflect when I
was thirteen, I didn't know anything. I didn't know. I
don't I don't think I know nearly as much as
all of them. So now again, technology is that their fingertips. Right,
they go turn on their phone. They asked a question.
(19:16):
My doctor will ask Google a question and Google will
give an answer. Right. So it's just so much information
and there comes the risk of comparison. So for the
younger men and women right now, social media is so powerful.
If you're not that mature and thinking, you're comparing, and
when you compare, everyone's life seems so much better than us. Right.
Speaker 1 (19:36):
Well, I think that's already an answer. If they're already
doing that at thirteen. Most thirteen year olds thirteen years
ago didn't do that, So I think that that's a
giant step.
Speaker 2 (19:48):
Yes, so they need positive role models. So like tok,
what you said, what you can do? Role model? Right,
create role model, whether for yourself or through your guests,
create positive role modeling. Because we can't shut down social media.
I mean you and I use it and it's useful
there right, Uh. It and have a very negative effect
on those who are younger.
Speaker 1 (20:10):
So, but there still is a I don't say it's
a rosy future. There could be a very positive future coming.
We just need to help help it happen.
Speaker 2 (20:19):
Yes, yes, yeah, use it for good, right, it's a tool.
It's a tool, so if the users wish how to
use it, use it for good or use it for
selfish reasons.
Speaker 1 (20:30):
And I think most people really do use it for good.
I think the the persons who don't, they sort of
overpower things. I think it's back to you instead of
having a voice or giving a voice. Yes, that may
be the challenge. So Jenny, how can our listeners find you?
Speaker 2 (20:47):
Okay? Great, so they can find me on my website,
Triple W Riverlifecoaching dot com and that's what we've alluded to.
I'm very active on LinkedIn, so Jenny to once you
search me Basi Singapore coach, you will very good.
Speaker 1 (21:01):
Well, I'm going to thank you for being here and
I'm sure we're not going to wait for another year
to talk again.
Speaker 2 (21:06):
I hope not.
Speaker 1 (21:07):
So thank you very much, thank you and bye bye.
Thank you, and again for our listeners. You can find
out more about Jenny totis j E n n Y.
The last name t o H. That's t o H.
Find your on LinkedIn and www. Riverlifecoaching dot com. Talk
to Brazil is brought to us by Focus M Market Intelligence,
(21:29):
specializing in market research for the Brazilian agricultural market. More
about them at f O c U, s m I
dot com. Remember when you talk to Tom, you talk
to the world. Goodbye and thanks for listening. Thanks for
listening to Tom Riok on Talk to Brazil, the business
connector to Brazil
Welcome to Talk to Brazil with Tom Rioch, the business
connector to business in Brazil. Talk to Brazil podcast talks
with business experts throughout the world. I'm Tom Reac, connecting
people from my studio in Brazil. Joining us today from Singapore.
Jenny Toe, certified Professional coach, award winning founder of Riverlife Coaching,
(00:25):
offering tailored coaching programs to thrive both personally and professionally. So, Jenny,
on a recent LinkedIn post of yours regarding International Women's
Day and that this year's theme, Accelerate Action, calls on
all of us to step forward, raise our voices, push
for change. You also mentioned your free open circle meetings
(00:50):
to reflect, connect and take action. Tell us about those meetings.
Speaker 2 (00:57):
Well, Hi, Tom, Fast of all, it's good to see
you again. And you know when we were talking earlier,
we've met each other three years ago. I can't believe
how fast time lives. Thanks for having me back on
the podcast. So yes, International Women's Day has come and gone,
eight of March, but the conversations, I hope, like what
we talked about earlier, will continue. So it's something that
(01:18):
I do every year for free, in conjunction with International
Women's Day. I think I've been doing this for the
past three years at least to whold open meetings, So
I hold them over Zoom. It's Singapore time five pm,
so I know it's a bit challenging for the folks
at your side of the world to join, but I
appreciate this airtime anyway, Singapore time five pm every Friday,
(01:40):
and I offer my zoom link to everyone through the
LinkedIn post and people can come in. Normally it's women
that I'm opening it up to everyone who's interested. Right,
So like today's this year's TEME is accelerate action. So
when I hold this meeting, I will talk about a
bit about the team based on the International Women's Day website.
So what does it mean to accelerate nation? Yeah, it's
(02:03):
not so much about thinking, oh, there's so many things
I need to change or the world needs to change,
and you just feel so overwhelmed and you end up
not doing anything. Accelerate action here, to me, how I
interpret it is, what's one step, small step you can
do for yourself? And if you're in a position, maybe
you're more senior in your organization, what's more small, one
(02:23):
small step I can do for women in my company, right,
maybe is to advocate for someone who wants to have
a promotion and has been struggling, so maybe even offer responsive.
So there's many small things you can do. So back
to the meeting, there's no fixed structured agenda. But what
I normally do is get everyone in. Then you know,
(02:44):
there's a period of introduction, getting to know each other,
and I would ask one question. So for this year's
accelerate Action, I would ask one question, what is one
challenge you're facing? And all one question is what do
you think you can do with your control, within your
influence to create a small change in that challenge?
Speaker 1 (03:05):
And that roly is that step by step, and if
everybody takes one small step, then it becomes a whole
different force.
Speaker 2 (03:14):
Yeah, that's true. And also from my experience of the
past circles, women who don't know each other come together,
but when they hear someone say something that they think
they've experienced as well, So that's some connection, that's some
common ground. Everyone feels very energized. It's this power of
being seen, heard, and maybe to a certain extent understood.
(03:37):
It's very powerful there, right, because a lot of times
we're so busy I may see you, but I don't
really hear you because I've got my own agenda going on.
And more so, I don't even understand you because I
don't take time to stand out. So in purpose of
having this circle, people come in, people get to know
each other, People talk about these two topics, what's by challenge?
What can I do to shift it? And hopefully within
(03:58):
that conversation someone will say, I've experienced this before and
this is what I've done, so not saying, you follow
what that person's said. So you feel encouraged and you
get some ideas, and you know, they say the collective wisdom, right,
there's always power in the collective wisdom.
Speaker 1 (04:12):
Well too that you you offer the invitation to anyone
who wants to join, So you're you're actually joining persons
who haven't met each other, like you mentioned, and you
might not know these persons either.
Speaker 2 (04:25):
No, no, I wouldn't. I mean, in the past, people
just joined and and you know I welcome them in
and I show up authentically. So I think one of
my secret superpowers is the ability to build trusted rapport
within people. People have given me feedback on debt that
I build trust very quickly and I know in my
(04:46):
profession as a coach, that's one key competency that so
I really, you know, take encouragement from that. You know,
even in a recent conversation where a new client she
was telling me, I feel so comfortable with you, I
can tell you everything, and that I was just in
the first session. So I don't know exactly what I do.
Perhaps is just showing up authentically.
Speaker 1 (05:06):
No, I think I see what you I'm looking at
your site right now and I said, you're award winning
and you actually are. And some of those awards are
the most Inclusive Coaching Company in Singapore, Right Life Coaching
Company of the Year twenty twenty four, Top Life Coaching
Company in Singapore, Best Life Coaches listing on Semi Best Singapore.
(05:30):
But one of the things that really caught me is
Asia's Most Passionate Women of the Year twenty twenty four.
So you do what you do, but you've you've already
externed a passion for what you do, so you are
Asia's most Passionate Women of twenty twenty four.
Speaker 2 (05:52):
I know it's quite strange. Some people say, oh, but
you say you're an introvert. You don't sound like an
introvert when you're talking, that's just it for introverts who
are passionate. And what I'm passionate about is supporting introverted people,
you know, to be more visible. Yes, it was on that. Yeah,
so you can say the passion drives me to put
(06:14):
myself out there. And the purpose of this open circle
is also for women to find a voice, right to
say that, oh, you know, I'm able to come here,
I'm able to share my thoughts without being judged. I
think a lot of times we feel that we are
being judged. Right. So even for me when I put
something out on social media and I'm normally on LinkedIn,
there is sometimes at the back of my mind, oh
(06:34):
if I put this out, how will people see me? Right?
And then you hesitate and then draw yourself in. Yeah.
But the main thing to overcome that is to say that,
you know, if only one person could read this or
hear this and feel encouraged, it's worth it, right, just
like what we were talking about earlier, Just put that
message out there in the hope that someone gets encouraged
(06:57):
and doesn't feel so alone. Right. A lot of times
you and I both struggle through things and we feel
so alone like.
Speaker 1 (07:03):
Me that you ever encourage that just having persons, inviting person,
having them come is really a major step. And also
from those meetings, do you see we're talking about challenges
for women? It is global, right, yes it is. We're
not talking about Singapore where you're talking about the world.
Speaker 2 (07:24):
Yeah, yeah, I mean, you know, Singapore is quite a
developed nation, so the challenges are maybe a bit more
different than you know, in a third world country, but
there are challenges and women feel that, you know, they
are not given equal rights. I mean there's this big debate,
ongoing debate about gender paid parity, right, it's ongoing, it's it.
(07:44):
And then they're saying it's going to take what five
generations from now, So even my daughters and my granddaughters
won't see the difference. I mean once see the gap
closing as much. It's going to go on for generations.
Speaker 1 (07:56):
I saw that in that person you mentioned that. So
and actually to the point of having a daughter, is
that another driver for you for other women who have daughters,
they can see that they want the future to come faster.
Speaker 2 (08:10):
Well, it's not so much about you know, men women
against men, right, So I like this quote by Mary
Shelley So. She's an author, you know, a long time
ago of Frankensteis. So is a renowned author. Her quote is,
it's not about women having power over men. It's about
women realizing that they have the power for themselves. I
(08:30):
think a lot of times society tells us we are
like the second class. I mean, maybe not so much now,
but back in the days, you are like the weaker
sex and you don't have so much power. You couldn't
even vote, you know how many years ago. So that's changing.
I recognize that. But it's not so much like, oh,
we're going to bash men, right, No, it's more like recognizing,
this is who I am. I'm unique. I should be
(08:51):
given visibility and seeing for my uniqueness as a person.
That's what I like people to see. Right, don't say
you're men are and now you've got a whole area
of you know, the genders.
Speaker 1 (09:05):
Well, hopefully someday we can get to the point where
we don't have to talk about that exactly.
Speaker 2 (09:09):
Someday we get to the point where we don't have
to talk about Tom. You're a guy, you know, Jenny's
a woman. You don't have to talk about that. Tom
is Tom and Tom is great at doing this and
Jenny's great at doing this, and we get recognition.
Speaker 1 (09:20):
Right.
Speaker 2 (09:21):
Yeah, that's that's where we're both hoping and hopefully a
lot of people hoping to get there as well.
Speaker 1 (09:26):
So to the acceleration, you know, to the point of
accelerate action and taking for what your takeaways. I know
you're still going to have more meetings, but what are
some of the takeaways you've had from these meetings? What
actions could be accelerated.
Speaker 2 (09:41):
It's asking yourself what could you do for yourself within
your circle of control and influence. A lot of times
we see the external problems and we say I have
no choice, I am stuck. But through the conversations you
suddenly see that, oh, actually I can still do this, right.
I can still have a conversation with someone. I may
(10:01):
not control the outcome from that conversation, but I can
voice what I want, put it out there. Just be
a bit more assertive. So when they start doing these
small things, it shifts and there's a ripple effect to
how they're feeling internally, and that's a ripple effect to
the people around them. So, for example, if you speak
up in a meeting and someone says, oh, she's poke
(10:23):
up in a meeting. Maybe I can do that and
they start speaking up as well, So you can see
the positive ripple effects slowly, but it's I believe it
will happen.
Speaker 1 (10:33):
And for a female leadership. Do you see more and
more of that happening corporate wise?
Speaker 2 (10:40):
Yes, definitely. I think that was a report by the
Singapore Stock Exchange as she has to say that now
the percentage in women leaders have been increased, I think
up to thirty percent. So there is definitely growth for
the women's CEOs in our country and I think in
everywhere else as well. But again it's a slow process,
(11:00):
but it's good that the representation has gone up.
Speaker 1 (11:03):
No, but the good thing there are models to be followed.
Speaker 2 (11:06):
Yes, yes there are. So it's actually very important for
women in senior leadership position to kind of reflect on
their own career journey, right who supported them? And it
doesn't have to be they can reflect that, Oh I
had male mentors. Maybe is to encourage the younger women
to reach out to mentors both male and female, to
give a balanced perspective on things. Why I'm so passionate
(11:27):
as I reflect on my own journey, I never really
had a strong female mentor in the past, so that's
why I really want to give it back. So yes,
I'm a coach, but in opportunities when it arise, I
also mentor people, right if they come to me for that, Yeah,
because I want to pay it back, pay forward as
well for what I did not have. So sometimes we
come from a place of life and we.
Speaker 1 (11:49):
Wonder them well and that I don't want to say
that was the majority, but that's the way it was
in many places, and so the more that they can
and I think that's one of the advantages of communication
today different from the past. So what you're doing in
your meetings, you're able to reach persons that several years
ago were unreasonable in a technical way you couldn't you know,
(12:11):
you don't have to make a phone call maybe, so
today that's completely different. So you can send out a
zoom link and people can access that. They have internet,
they have a handheld device that they can take part in.
So the technology has been a helper.
Speaker 2 (12:26):
Yes, yes, it's a double edged sword, right, So like
what you say, people can access the meetings, not just
mind anything right in a zoom call. Unfortunately, it also
grows a bit of distance in genuine human connection. So
sometimes Tom, I'm sure you've done it. Well, you enter
into a webinar, your video is off, your audio is off,
and you're just listening. So how engaged are you? You
(12:47):
know in that sometimes you're doing other things. I'm guilty
of that as well, if I a ten of webinar.
So when I run my webinars, I ensure that there's
space for interaction. Even though it's a zoom call. I
will pause, get feedback and for the well quite once
they might be busy typing in the chat, but that's fine,
right any folk to get that interaction between you know,
the speaker and the audience.
Speaker 1 (13:09):
Well, I'm obviously a firm believer in that. Like since
two thousand and nine, what I've been doing. The majority
of people that yourself we've spoken before. We interact on LinkedIn,
but we have never met personally.
Speaker 2 (13:26):
No, we haven't.
Speaker 1 (13:28):
I don't want to say that we may ever, but
it isn't. One of the years ago we sort of
had a feeling that we had to meet the person.
There had to be that physical connection of sitting down
and having coffee or tea, and we felt that was
necessary to develop relationships. But technology has shown us that
(13:50):
we can have virtual relationships. I don't want to call
our relationship virtual, it's virtual because it's technically we're in
the distance here, I'm on a a night before you.
You're you're already in tomorrow morning. Yeah, you know, if
you can believe that you're talking of your morning in
(14:10):
seeing whorre and I'm talking about yesterday in Brazil, and
so you know, how does that work?
Speaker 2 (14:16):
Well?
Speaker 1 (14:17):
It works, But years ago we couldn't do that. We
would be writing each other letters maybe and they wouldn't
get there. So so that has helped. I think that's
created a multifaceted world. And also for what you do
(14:37):
in your meetings, it gives you, i think, a challenge,
an opportunity to see a lot of women in different
places and in one meeting, and if you bring them
into the meeting, it's better, like you said.
Speaker 2 (14:48):
Yes, yes. And it's also that common understanding that although
you come from different cultures, background, aage, you know, profession,
whatever it is, there are common traits that that we
you all share, right Like you want to be recognized
for your worth, You want to have a place where
you can be authentic, and I think a lot of
(15:08):
people struggle to be their true authentic self in the
corporate world because you have to fit organization culture, maybe
your bosses of a certain personality. You're very different. So
that's all the struggles that I believe is universal. And
of course there's another thing, not saying mostly for women
because I speak to more women clients. It's that self doubt,
(15:31):
that inner critic in your mind, because I'm not saying
men don't have that. Male clients has overcome to me
and say that, you know, I don't think I'm good enough,
but maybe women tend to vocalize that more so you're
as a guy, maybe you don't go and tell everyone
to say that I think I'm not good enough, but
women sometimes where women get together, they'll say, I don't
think I'm good enough for this role. I don't think
(15:51):
I'm ready for that promotion, although deep down inside you
want it. So what's actually holding you back is not
so much external factors. But sometimes I believe that I
am not good enough, right, So it's also hearing other
women say that to say that, oh, I'm not going
crazy in the hit looks like yeah, people think in
this way as well. And then together, you work through
like how do I quieten down that inner critic and
(16:15):
raise the volume of my cheerleader? Right, A lot of
times we don't even hear our cheerleader. We hear the
critics so much we forget we also have the cheerleader.
Speaker 1 (16:24):
Well, give me a tip, all right, And we're talking
obviously women, you're talking to women. You're having the groups.
And we mentioned this before we started at the International
Women's Days in March, and they tend to bring it
to a day and what can we do? What can
I do as a as a male figure to keep
(16:44):
this alive till next year because it's just not a
one day thing. It's just not a one month event
because there's so much that needs to be done. What
are your suggestions to me and other guys? What can
we do during the year.
Speaker 2 (16:58):
Yeah, it's about awareness for you. You know, you've got
this beautiful tree podcast, So it's to create awareness tree
your podcasts, so you don't always have to talk about
International Women's State. But if one of your guests comes
in and then maybe talks about how to navigate those
difficult conversations at work, right, So then your guests can
(17:18):
talk about examples if it's a male guest, the male guest,
can they say that you know, how he as a
manager can support maybe his direct reports who are female
to navigate difficult conversations. And if you've got a female leader,
how does she handle those difficult conversations with very aggressive
male counterparts? How do you balance that? So it could
(17:40):
be very topic specific, but one I think it starts
from being aware and to create that awareness for everyone.
And the second thing is maybe to practice empathy. Right,
So so sometimes we're only human, we think more about ourselves, like, oh,
how do I see myself in this situation? But with
some space, you can think that, oh, if I would
(18:00):
put myself in his shoes or horror shoes, what does
set look like? So when you're interviewing guests, maybe even
for yourself to just I know you do this very well,
but just to get it's a bit more curious, like wow,
you know you see that from your lens? You know
I see it this way, and to have that conversation
that the event may be the same, but we're seeing
it with both our lines.
Speaker 1 (18:20):
And I think that's more often the case where we're
just looking at the same thing and seeing it in
different ways.
Speaker 2 (18:26):
It's so different and sometimes offering that shift. So for you,
you offer that shift maybe to someone younger, so it's
almost like you're mentoring, you offer that shift. You know,
I see it actually from this angle. What do you
think for all?
Speaker 1 (18:40):
Do you see a difference? Do you see something different?
You talk about your daughter as the perception among Garnber
women different than it was for you at their age change.
Speaker 2 (18:55):
Well, my daughters, they have access to so much information
right at this young age, both of them are, but
they know so much more. If I reflect when I
was thirteen, I didn't know anything. I didn't know. I
don't I don't think I know nearly as much as
all of them. So now again, technology is that their fingertips. Right,
they go turn on their phone. They asked a question.
(19:16):
My doctor will ask Google a question and Google will
give an answer. Right. So it's just so much information
and there comes the risk of comparison. So for the
younger men and women right now, social media is so powerful.
If you're not that mature and thinking, you're comparing, and
when you compare, everyone's life seems so much better than us. Right.
Speaker 1 (19:36):
Well, I think that's already an answer. If they're already
doing that at thirteen. Most thirteen year olds thirteen years
ago didn't do that, So I think that that's a
giant step.
Speaker 2 (19:48):
Yes, so they need positive role models. So like tok,
what you said, what you can do? Role model? Right,
create role model, whether for yourself or through your guests,
create positive role modeling. Because we can't shut down social media.
I mean you and I use it and it's useful
there right, Uh. It and have a very negative effect
on those who are younger.
Speaker 1 (20:10):
So, but there still is a I don't say it's
a rosy future. There could be a very positive future coming.
We just need to help help it happen.
Speaker 2 (20:19):
Yes, yes, yeah, use it for good, right, it's a tool.
It's a tool, so if the users wish how to
use it, use it for good or use it for
selfish reasons.
Speaker 1 (20:30):
And I think most people really do use it for good.
I think the the persons who don't, they sort of
overpower things. I think it's back to you instead of
having a voice or giving a voice. Yes, that may
be the challenge. So Jenny, how can our listeners find you?
Speaker 2 (20:47):
Okay? Great, so they can find me on my website,
Triple W Riverlifecoaching dot com and that's what we've alluded to.
I'm very active on LinkedIn, so Jenny to once you
search me Basi Singapore coach, you will very good.
Speaker 1 (21:01):
Well, I'm going to thank you for being here and
I'm sure we're not going to wait for another year
to talk again.
Speaker 2 (21:06):
I hope not.
Speaker 1 (21:07):
So thank you very much, thank you and bye bye.
Thank you, and again for our listeners. You can find
out more about Jenny totis j E n n Y.
The last name t o H. That's t o H.
Find your on LinkedIn and www. Riverlifecoaching dot com. Talk
to Brazil is brought to us by Focus M Market Intelligence,
(21:29):
specializing in market research for the Brazilian agricultural market. More
about them at f O c U, s m I
dot com. Remember when you talk to Tom, you talk
to the world. Goodbye and thanks for listening. Thanks for
listening to Tom Riok on Talk to Brazil, the business
connector to Brazil
Popular Podcasts
CrimeLess: Hillbilly Heist
It’s 1996 in rural North Carolina, and an oddball crew makes history when they pull off America’s third largest cash heist. But it’s all downhill from there. Join host Johnny Knoxville as he unspools a wild and woolly tale about a group of regular ‘ol folks who risked it all for a chance at a better life. CrimeLess: Hillbilly Heist answers the question: what would you do with 17.3 million dollars? The answer includes diamond rings, mansions, velvet Elvis paintings, plus a run for the border, murder-for-hire-plots, and FBI busts.
Crime Junkie
Does hearing about a true crime case always leave you scouring the internet for the truth behind the story? Dive into your next mystery with Crime Junkie. Every Monday, join your host Ashley Flowers as she unravels all the details of infamous and underreported true crime cases with her best friend Brit Prawat. From cold cases to missing persons and heroes in our community who seek justice, Crime Junkie is your destination for theories and stories you won’t hear anywhere else. Whether you're a seasoned true crime enthusiast or new to the genre, you'll find yourself on the edge of your seat awaiting a new episode every Monday. If you can never get enough true crime... Congratulations, you’ve found your people. Follow to join a community of Crime Junkies! Crime Junkie is presented by audiochuck Media Company.
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.