February 5, 2025 • 40 mins
Today, we’re diving into one of my favorite topics—social media. It’s where brands come alive, communities thrive, and, let’s be real, trends either take off or flop spectacularly. Joining me today is someone who knows this world inside and out: Lauren Freund, Social Media Manager at Canva. Lauren has a lot of experience in marketing and digital media, and she’s absolutely mastered the art of turning likes and shares into meaningful growth.
Whether it’s building community, crafting strategic engagement, or jumping on trends at just the right moment, Lauren has seen it all. We’re here to talk about how to truly master social media for growth—how to build a community that actually cares, engage in ways that make a difference, and stay ahead of the curve when it comes to trends.
If you’re a marketer, brand strategist, or even just someone curious about the magic behind the posts you double-tap, this one’s for you.
Whether it’s building community, crafting strategic engagement, or jumping on trends at just the right moment, Lauren has seen it all. We’re here to talk about how to truly master social media for growth—how to build a community that actually cares, engage in ways that make a difference, and stay ahead of the curve when it comes to trends.
If you’re a marketer, brand strategist, or even just someone curious about the magic behind the posts you double-tap, this one’s for you.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
Social media It's where brands come alive, communities thrive, and
trends either take off or flop spectacularly. But what does
it really take to build a social presence that goes
beyond vanity metrics? How do you craft engagement that actually
means something? Today we're breaking it all down with someone
who knows this world inside and out. Lauren is a
(00:23):
social media manager at Canva. Lauren has mastered the art
of turning likes and shares into meaningful growth, building engaged communities,
and staying ahead of the trends. If you're a marketer,
brand strategist, or just someone curious about what makes a
post actually work, this episode's for you. I'm your host,
Niki Ramirez, and this is Talk Digital to Me, where
(00:46):
we uncover the latest in digital marketing, tech, AI innovation,
and strategies for personal and professional growth. This is episode
twenty one, from Likes to Loyalty, How to build a
social media strategy that actually works. Hey, everyone, welcome back
(01:14):
to Talk Digital to Me. I'm your host, Nikki Ramirez,
and today we're diving into one of my favorite topics,
social media. It's where brands come alive, communities thrive, and
let's be real, trends either take off or flop spectacularly.
Joining me today is someone who knows this world inside
and out. Lauren is a social media manager at Canva.
(01:36):
Lauren has a ton of experience in marketing and digital media,
and she has absolutely mastered the art of turning likes
and shares into meaningful growth. Whether it's building community, crafting
strategic engagement, or jumping on trends at the right moment,
Lauren has seen it all. We're here to talk about
how to truly master social media for growth, how to
(01:56):
build a community that actually cares, engage in ways that
make a different friends, and stay ahead of the curve
when it comes to trends. If you're a marketer, brand strategist,
or even someone just curious about the magic behind posts,
you double tap. This one's for you, Lauren. I'm so
excited to have you here.
Speaker 2 (02:13):
I'm so excited to be here. Thanks so much for
having me, and thank you for all the kind things
you just said. And I'm really excited to dive into
all the things we have to chat about today.
Speaker 1 (02:24):
Me too, I'm so excited to talk to you. So
diving right in social media is all about community. What
do you think makes an online community really click? And
how do you make that happen at Canada?
Speaker 2 (02:37):
Yeah, so I really think like your online community importance
is huge. It's ultimately the heartbeat of your social presence.
If not, you know your brand and your sales so
high level? What makes it click? I love to use
the phrase why share?
Speaker 3 (02:53):
Why care?
Speaker 2 (02:54):
That's kind of the sweet spot or the click for
me of why is a brand? Are you sharing something?
Why as the audience are they going to care? And
I really think once you hit that sweet spot, that's
really going to make people care and have ultimately a
very strong community because of that. So this can take
form in a few different ways. I think the biggest
(03:16):
one that people normally talk about is a shared mission,
right so for can for example, it's empowering people to
design and communicate their ideas effortlessly. This shared purpose that
we focus on as a brand just brings creators, educators, marketers, entrepreneurs,
all the different types of people who use Canva together
and that's what's important to us. With making an online communities,
(03:38):
we're really catering to that and we do it in
a few different ways. We love highlighting user stories we
engage through challenges. We do a lot of design challenges
and like interactive polls. This encourages dialogue and just strengthens
that community that we have. And then, last but not least,
we listen. And whether it be through social listening or
(03:58):
just going through the comments, we always like to keep
tabs on what our users love, what they're struggling with,
what they want, and we really believe that all of
that just makes a really strong online community. And that's
what really makes things click is when I think your
audience can tell that you guys have a special relationship
and you're not just speaking at them.
Speaker 3 (04:19):
I love that.
Speaker 1 (04:20):
And yeah, so many brands tend to speak at people
then speaking.
Speaker 3 (04:24):
To what they actually care about.
Speaker 1 (04:25):
So the why share, why care is so perfect?
Speaker 3 (04:28):
I love that.
Speaker 1 (04:28):
Yeah, So be honest, what is the biggest mistake you
see brands making when they're trying to build a community
on social?
Speaker 2 (04:36):
Yeah, listen, No brand is perfect, but I think there
are some mistakes that I see your themes that I
see amongst some brands on social nowadays, and kind of
to what we were just talking about, I think one
of the biggest mistakes I see is brands treating social
media like a megaphone instead of treating it like a
conversation or a community. I think because it is so
(05:01):
I mean it like social media is just so saturated nowadays,
I think people forget what the purpose of it was
in the first place, which is that interaction, that engagement.
It's not just like a one way street. And I
see this in a few ways. I see brands ignoring
comments or failing to respond to messages. I see them
overlooking authenticity and just kind of posting what they think
(05:22):
they should post or what they've seen other brands posts.
I see brands jumping on trends for the sake of it,
regardless if it fits them or not. I see them
ignoring the why behind community of or even just ignoring
their community in general, of why they're there. And I
see them focusing solely on metrics, which metrics are super important,
(05:42):
but they don't always reflect a strong community, and true
success always comes from engagement and meaningful reactions versus, you know,
just some big numbers or some arbitrary numbers. So all
of that I think really ladders up to the mistake
brands have of treating social media like a megaphone instead
of really a place to connect and build something important.
Speaker 1 (06:03):
That's such a good vision for what people are seeing
on social it is megaphone. I love that imagery because
that's exactly what a lot of brands are getting wrong.
They need to be focused on engaging with their actual followers,
like we're following a brand for a reason.
Speaker 2 (06:19):
Exactly exactly. If I wanted to be megaphoned at I
would scroll through some ads or and scroll through their website.
But I really think people should remember what social media
is for and that even though everyone has a social
media account and brands have multiple ones, I don't think
because we've gotten so far, I don't think there's anything
(06:39):
wrong with going back to the basics and making sure
that it is a place for your community and it's
a place for that interaction.
Speaker 3 (06:46):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (06:46):
I mean people are already following your brand for a reason,
so lean into that and engage. And that brings it
to it's all about authenticity, and so brands have a
message to push as well. So how do you strike
that balance between the authenticity and not being a megaphone
so that it feels real and not forced.
Speaker 2 (07:05):
Yeah? Absolutely, I think this ties back to what I
said about why share why care. I think that balance
between feeling real and not force is finding a common
ground of feeling real of why you're sharing something and
why your audience is going to care, And I think
that's really a sweet spot. I think prioritizing value over
promotion is a really good road to go down. And
(07:27):
what I mean by that is authenticity comes from understanding
your audience's needs and creating content that serves them first. So,
for example, at Canva, we focus on empowering our users,
which takes form in providing design tips, creative inspiration, relatable
stories like hacks, tricks, all those types of things, and
(07:48):
we focus on that and showing that through storytelling that
is relatable and relevant and helpful rather than just pushing
our products. So we could say, you know, hey, we
came out with magic right, it's really cool. You should
try it. Or we could show a marketer like myself
who is facing a deadline and needs to write up
(08:10):
a proposal in the next one hour and needs to
use magic right to do it. So I think it
really comes with valuing the use cases and connection over
just the promotion and just stating something, and I think
that really brings in the authenticity because you're showing that
you understand and you know. To the back of authenticity,
it's also being a human and social is really important.
(08:32):
People connect better with people, not just faceless brands. So
on Campbo, we have friendly, approachable people and tones in
our messaging and ensuring that it feels very conversational and relatable,
and I think that really helps not just for us,
but for other brands feel more authentic. And then, lastly,
on the thought of authenticity, I think, you know, engaging
(08:52):
in trends that fit your brand is so important. I
might have mentioned this in the Mistakes already, but I
see a lot of brands just engaging in every single
trend there is, and that really decreases your authenticity. That's
not to say you shouldn't hop on trends, but I
really think that there needs to be more strategy and
more connection before you decide to do that. So at Canvo,
(09:14):
we engage with trends that support creativity, inclusivity and fun
because that's what our brand is and it makes sense
when we do it. And I just think overall, it's
really important to remain consistent with what your brand values
are in order to communicate to your audience that you
are being authentic.
Speaker 3 (09:30):
That makes perfect sense.
Speaker 1 (09:31):
I mean as someone who's used magic in a marketing
sense as to do a last minute project.
Speaker 2 (09:38):
I love you guys, oh my god, love to hear it.
Speaker 1 (09:41):
And so engagement is really really the holy grail of
social But it's more than just replying to the comments just.
Speaker 3 (09:48):
With thanks so much. Like, how do you think about.
Speaker 1 (09:52):
Creating engagement that actually means something?
Speaker 2 (09:55):
Yeah? Yeah, I love how we're focusing on value because
I think that is so important with all the noise
that's on social media currently, Like, it is so important
to keep going back to the value of it. So
in terms of your question on like engagement or applying
to comments, yeah, your engagement strategy can no longer be
replying to people with like, OMG, thanks, we love you too,
(10:15):
things like that. Do you know what I mean? It
really needs to be more than that, needs to be
more valuable. So I think now a strong strategy of
creating engagements can be a few different things. So I
think starting conversations rather than just commenting. Sometimes the best
things about like a TikTok or an Instagram reel is
the comments, not even the video. Like you you see
(10:37):
a video, You're like, oh, I got I have to
check the comments now.
Speaker 1 (10:40):
I run to the comments, right, run, yeah, TikTok, holy grail.
Speaker 2 (10:45):
Yes, literally, And I think that's really kind of taking
comments a step further. Because you go into the comments,
people are starting in a who whole conversation, And I
think that you can do that as a brand too.
You can start a conversation or something, whether it be
you are replying to one of your audience members or
you're jumping in another conversation. I think starting something rather
(11:07):
than just responding and ending it there is good. I
kind of think of, you know, in like theater or improv,
they always say you should say yes and and like
continue it. That's what I kind of think of for
social media as well, like just try to continue it
and have it be a conversation. I also think that
like commenting is still important. I don't want to devalue it,
(11:28):
but it's about bringing value to it. So for example,
at least like with us, it's great to continue that
education or inspiration, like sharing tips or templates. If someone
shows us something, of course we want to tell them
we love it, but it may go a little further
in value if we're like, oh, have you tried doing this?
Or like, oh my gosh, we love that. Have you
checked out these templates and just continuing that, or if
(11:50):
you're a fashion brand, like what if fashion brands started
commenting like accessories to go with stuff, Like if an
influencer is like here's my outbume, Involve like how cool
would it be? Revolve was like, oh my gosh, like
our necklace would go so well with that, or just
starting more conversation and being more human.
Speaker 1 (12:06):
And then genius, you should be calling up Revolved tomorrow.
Speaker 2 (12:09):
Sorry would you say it?
Speaker 1 (12:10):
I said that you should be calling them up.
Speaker 3 (12:13):
That's genius.
Speaker 2 (12:14):
Yes, maybe I will settle for a discount.
Speaker 1 (12:17):
They can have my idea, seel I think we can
get that worked out for you.
Speaker 2 (12:22):
And then the last thing I was just gonna say
is like engaging with brands too. I love it when
I see someone's video, whether they're an influencer or just
someone with not that big of a falling and you
see all these brands commenting, and I think people really
love that too. They're like, Wendy's what are you doing here?
You know, like it's just fun and it's funny, and
so I think there are so many different ways in
(12:43):
besides just replying with something bland or overused, to stay
in that conversation and create that really meaningful and valuable engagement.
Speaker 1 (12:52):
Yeah, a lot of the times you can find your
next content from what people are asking in the actual
comments themselves. There's so much to see what people are
actually talking about. And you know that goes along with
social listening. You know how much of a role does
it play in shaping what you post or how you engage?
Speaker 2 (13:09):
Yeah, I would say it plays a really big role
for us, and even even before I was at Canvas
and every role that I've been in, it's always played
a huge role just as a social media marketer and
kind of like what you were saying of you get
content ideas from the engagement and from social listening. Like,
we create so much content from comments or from things
(13:30):
that we see, and we love that because that again
just shows another level of engagement. If we go out
with a video and someone says something as simple as
like oh how did you create this? Or we love
creating more videos off the back of that because we
feel like we're really bringing a lot of value. So
that can be done through just manual comments, but there
are also so many social listening tools that I've used
(13:51):
over the years that are so so helpful, and it
plays a big role for us. Like I mentioned shaping content,
it's so important to understand what your audience cares about,
whether it be within your own brand of like oh
they care about this side of the brand, or it
could just be in general, like oh, they're really caring
about this topic in society right now. So I think
that's important to see through social listening. I also think
(14:14):
it can improve engagement and like trend opportunities for you
to stay on top of that and keep your finger
on the pulse, and then also building relationships. It's really
hard sometimes, especially when you work for big brands, to
stay on top of all of those communications and all
of that social listening data that's coming in, and I
think a lot of the tools nowadays make that easy
(14:34):
for us to kind of get a big snapshot of it.
Whether we can see like, okay, most of the comments
are about this, or you know, like those word clouds
to see like what phrases and words people are mentioning
the most, or if we can like really bucket in
our comments and get like a good read from it.
It's just social listening is so helpful for so many
different roles within marketing to make sure that you're making
(14:56):
informed decisions moving forward, whether it's about your messaging or
your content are both that's awesome.
Speaker 1 (15:01):
And with all that the analytics out there, you know
you talked about all the platforms that you do use.
When you're looking at those metrics, how do you know
what good engagement even looks like? Or what are your
go to metrics when you're really measuring against what you
want to do next?
Speaker 2 (15:18):
Yeah? I think you didn't ask this, but my least
favorite metric is virality. Let's make this go viral. I'm
sure so many social media marketers have heard that if.
Speaker 3 (15:28):
The marketers are just like having PTSD.
Speaker 2 (15:31):
Right, yeah, they should have a trigger moarning. I'm sorry
that is definitely my least favorite metric. Not to start
off on a negative foot, but I do think it's
important to talk about how I think sometimes metrics need
to be more thought out versus just picking something, whether
it be impressions, engagements, click through whatever. I think it
really starts with what is your objective and what is
(15:53):
the campaign? You know, sometimes we just go out with
social content because we think it's fun and we have
like evergreen content in the works. But a lot of
our content as well is supporting other campaigns, right Like
it comes from the brand team and we as social
or supporting this big campaign. So in that sense, we
really look to like what that campaign subjective is, and
(16:14):
sometimes it's signing up for something, And so our objective
even with social is going to be click through rate,
Like that's just how it's going to be, because we
want to support the overall goals of the brand or
of the campaign. But if it's evergreen content, I always
lean into engagements or specifically engagement rate. I don't really
like looking at, you know, how many followers do we have,
(16:35):
or how many impressions do they get. I think impressions
are important if you're trying to like strictly grow. I
know in the early stages of our TikTok we were
really focused on impressions because we just wanted to grow
the channel. But in terms of you know, as we've
talked about throughout this discussion, how important community is and
building that authenticity and that dialogue, I really think engagements
(16:56):
are where it's at. An engagement rate I think really
shows out of all the people who are seeing it, like,
what's the percentage that people are engaging? You know. I
always like to kind of use like a dinner party metaphor.
So if you invited like a hundred people to your
dinner party, but only one of them talked, like, that's
a pretty bad dinner party, right, But if you invited
like ten people to your dinner party, it's not that much.
But if nine out of those ten people talked, it
(17:18):
was a pretty fun party. So that's why I like
to think about engagement right as the most important, because
we want to make sure that the people we do
have engaged and the people who are seeing our content
are genuinely engaged and are genuinely liking it and paying
attention to it, because those are the valuable people who
are then going to like spread our message onto others.
(17:40):
We're not going to really have like those super silent
people spreading it. And of course all algorithms are different,
but that's really what I like to focus on outside
of a campaign that the whole company is working on,
if it's just evergreen content, I like to focus on engagement, right.
I think that's important, and I think I answered your question,
let me know if I forgot wanting on at that's perfect, Okay.
Speaker 3 (18:01):
I love that.
Speaker 1 (18:01):
And you know, for your business in Canva, your audience
has to be so broad because I know just from
personal experience that I'm a marketer, so we all use
it as marketers. But I have friends that own small
businesses who have never touched design in their life. Or
my husband who's an engineer who started a three D
Etsy printing business. They're now using Canva and they have
(18:24):
never been in the marketing business, never been in design.
So when you're looking at an audience that broad, how
do you tweak your engagement strategies for different platforms and
groups without losing your main focus.
Speaker 2 (18:36):
Yeah, it is really interesting. I think Canvas the first
company I've worked for that has this broad of an audience.
I think my past companies have been I don't want
to call it a niche at all, but you know
it was. It was more focused. So it's been an
interesting challenge, but I love it, and I don't want
to say it makes my job easy, but it is
really really nice as a marketer to have so much
(19:00):
many people interested in it, like such a broad audience.
And it's really great for me to learn, right because
there's all these audiences that I've never really worked with before.
Now I'm seeing how they love Canva and how they
use Canva. So it is honestly like a really big
positive for me. But in terms of like how you
would tweak, like engagement strategies and things like that, I
think really having a strategy from like the get go
(19:22):
is really important. And even if you're just starting out
your small business, like you mentioned, it can be a
bare bone strategy. But I always think starting somewhere and
like having a foundation is important because then you always
have something to go back to once you get more
insights and get more data and start to change things.
And I think doing research about the audiences and how
the content performs on each platform is so important. I've
(19:43):
only been at Canva for about three years now, and
so many things have changed because audiences are growing and
they're adapting, and you got to stay up with that,
and so I think adapting the tone for each platform
is also really important. Once you learn like the content
that does well, you know, like I can we know
that certain announcements do well on platforms, and then certain
(20:04):
inspiration content does better on other platforms, Like people are
just different on each platform, and I think adapting the
tone is really important as well. But overall, I would
say like maintaining consistent brand identity is important regardless of
platform or audience. I think the core message of at
least for Canda, like the core message of creativity, empowerment
(20:24):
and inclusivity like always stays the same. And that goes
back to like the strategy I was talking about before
of having a foundation, I think even a bare bone
strategy of like this is our company and this is
what we stand for, and that's that, and we're going
to go test everything else and come back with it.
I think that's important because it really has a common
thread now throughout all your channels, and the execution may
(20:45):
look different, right, It may sound a little different in
the tone, or the content may be a little different
or inspirational here, more straightforward there. But making sure that
you're keeping that consistent brand identity, then you'll never lose
yourself and it'll make sense cohesively in the end.
Speaker 1 (21:00):
I love that you also said something that I thought
was really interesting that people are there's different people on
different platforms, but also people are different on different platforms
like oh true, Yeah, it's like the same message that
I want on TikTok is not the same I'm going
to want on LinkedIn. So you know, it's going with
the platforms as well as the people.
Speaker 3 (21:20):
You know, the more.
Speaker 1 (21:21):
Unhinged things are more like for TikTok and different platforms
from that. But like if you saw one of those
on LinkedIn, that would throw you off a bit.
Speaker 2 (21:30):
No, it totally would. And that's what's interesting is I
feel like, as you know, social media has been around
for a while now, but in the grand scheme of things,
it still hasn't been that long. And I've been seeing more,
at least on LinkedIn. It always used to be like
LinkedIn as where you're more professional and this and that.
But I've been seeing like so many memes on LinkedIn.
Speaker 1 (21:51):
Yes, and some of my humor content, yeah, really well
on there.
Speaker 2 (21:55):
Humor content, And I don't think there's anything wrong with that.
I think that's just like a really great example of
of course, like LinkedIn has not gone to like the
unhinged level of TikTok, and I don't think they ever will.
Speaker 1 (22:07):
Yeah, I think I'm a little grateful for that. Like
Ale unhinged content for other platforms.
Speaker 3 (22:12):
But I enjoy it. I just want it on my
other ones exactly.
Speaker 2 (22:17):
But they're yeah, so it's it's never going to do
like a full three sixty. But I do think it's
interesting that there are these like little movements of like
being more casual and more relatable because I think ultimately
that's what people want. And you have to also think
about like the generations who are coming up like Gen
Z and then after that it's going to be Gen Alpha,
and I think they really value that type of communication more,
(22:38):
the more casual relatable stuff. So it's just interesting. It's
always going to be changing, Oh absolutely.
Speaker 1 (22:43):
I mean I talk all the time about how digital
platforms will always evolve, Like TikTok used to be in
competitive nature with Facebook and Instagram, but I think it's
more competitive with streaming and search now where people.
Speaker 3 (22:55):
Are finding their information.
Speaker 1 (22:57):
So I mean, you know, speaking of how platforms evolve,
social media trends evolve like crazy. They're like lightning here
one second.
Speaker 3 (23:04):
Gone the next.
Speaker 1 (23:05):
How do you decide which ones are worth jumping on
and which ones you know, let's let that one pass.
Speaker 2 (23:11):
Yes, I feel like like we already talked about Like,
this is an issue a lot of brands deal with,
so I'm glad we're chatting about it. I think, like
how you decide is rooted in authenticity and relevance to
your brand. I think trends should feel genuine to a
brand's voice, and for Canva, we hold that true, like
(23:32):
it has to feel genuine to our voice. We don't
jump on every trend, only those that resonate with our
community in a way that feels natural, and we evaluate
that whether the trend lines up to canvas mission in
Canvas tone of empowerment and creativity and if it's fun
and creative, like it's it really just matters if it matches.
(23:52):
And you know, there are brands out there like Due
Lingo and Wendy's and Ryanair who have like very snarky
brand and they create all that content that kind of
fits that tone, and most trends kind of work for
that because I feel like a lot of trends, at
least on TikTok are often like self deprecating and it's humorous,
(24:14):
but it works for those brands. And I think that's
where people run into issues of like they'll just jump
on trends that don't fit who they are, and audiences
will see that and it'll feel off and it'll feel inauthentic,
and then they won't engauge and it's just like not
a good path to go down. So that's how we
decide which ones are worth jumping on and which are
(24:35):
to let pass. If we can see like a very
clear vision of how we can integrate into it, and
we don't want to use it as like a promo,
Like we don't want to be like, oh my god,
like magic, right is the solution to this, you know,
but we do want some sort of connection to it.
And a deal breaker is if it's like not in
our tone, like if it is snarky or negative or
(24:56):
anything like that, it's just like an immediate no for us.
Speaker 3 (24:59):
Yeah that's fair.
Speaker 1 (25:00):
I mean, can you share a trend that Canva hopped
on that really worked for you guys?
Speaker 2 (25:04):
Yeah? There was actually I have two that come to mind. Okay,
so the first one is like definitely a trend. This
is gonna be so embarrassing. Have you ever had to
like explain a trend to someone and like they don't
know what you're talking about? You just sound like.
Speaker 1 (25:18):
My father in law has no idea what's going on
on the internet, and me trying to explain to him
what I'm doing is just out of this world.
Speaker 2 (25:26):
Yeah, so I'm gonna do my best. But you know
that trend that it was like in December, and it
was like when you're running from the cops and they say, like,
suspect is beautiful and it turns out, okay, good, you
know what I'm talking about.
Speaker 3 (25:37):
I know what you're talking about.
Speaker 2 (25:38):
Wonderful. So we hopped on that little trend and we
did something like Suspect makes beautiful Canva designs and the
person turned around and that was like such a simple
one for us to be a part of, and it
was like so easy and so authentic for us, and
it performed really well. It was just one of those
like really easy way in ones. So that was like
(25:59):
an exam of one that did really well for us.
And then another one I thought of, which less of
a typical TikTok trend and more of like a trend
or like a culture thing. Pantone obviously comes out with
like colors of the Year, and this year it was
I think it was Mocha something about something chocolatey, and
that was like a topic of conversation. I wouldn't say
it was like a trend, right, but like people were
(26:20):
talking about it on social it was a topic, and
so we created a video that used some like AI
magic that showed like a Mocha template and then we
showed like Mocha coffee coming out of the phone. It
was really really cool. Yeah, but from there we showed
people like how to recreate that effect because everyone loved
that video. So that's just an example of something that
(26:40):
I feel like people get really caught up in, like
the funny like TikTok trends, but you can also like
tap into just things happening in the world, like the awards, right,
like the Oscars happen every year, like the Super Bowl,
things like that. I think those are still considered trends
in a way, and they're easier to have your own
way into because there's not a oneliner or a specific
(27:01):
sound that's tied to it like TikTok trends are. But anyways,
that was one that we participated in that performed really
well because it was a no brainer for us, right,
It's like design, it's colors, it's things like that, and
for us to kind of showcase it in a way
that uses more of our products. For like, a very
esthetically pleasing and creative video was a great way in
for us. So those are a few examples of what
(27:22):
we pop on.
Speaker 3 (27:23):
Those are great examples.
Speaker 1 (27:25):
I mean, do you find yourself as a marketer just
like with your brain broken all the time, where everything
is just an idea or you're looking at it from
a marketing perspective.
Speaker 2 (27:34):
Yeah, yeah, it's always And I think it's so hard
to also like fight that voice of your head of
like when you see something on your personal time like
scrolling through and you're like, oh my god, this is
so funny, and then trying to make it work for
your brand of like yeh, wait a minute, now, this
is like a tetris that I have to play in
my head of like can this work for the brand?
Maybe I should just do it on my own, you know.
Speaker 1 (27:55):
Yeah, I feel like I can half enjoy things anymore
because I'm either going, oh, that would be a really
good idea for content, or I go oh, they shouldn't
have jumped on that trend that wasn't for them.
Speaker 2 (28:04):
Yes, I hear it's so interesting, Like I hear that
all the time. With so many different jobs out there, right,
Like I have friends who work in music and like
they cannot listen to a song like a normal person can.
Or people who like work in like movies and TV,
like they can't watch it because they're thinking about the
production and things like that. So it is interesting. I
find that as a social media marketer the same way.
(28:26):
Like I feel like I digest content a bit differently
because my brain is always like working in the background
instead of just enjoying it.
Speaker 1 (28:32):
Yeah, it's like I'm analyzing everything.
Speaker 2 (28:35):
Yep.
Speaker 1 (28:36):
Yeah, So everyone is chasing the trends, but evergreen content
is really where the value is and we've been concentrated a.
Speaker 3 (28:42):
Lot on value and I love that.
Speaker 1 (28:44):
So how do you balance being timely and then staying timeless?
Speaker 2 (28:49):
Ooh, I love that. That should be a goal for myself. Ooh,
I like even staying timeless. Yeah. I mean, maybe I'm biased.
It's like, but I really think think it's so important
to stay consistent with evergreen content because chasing those trends,
like that's all it's ever going to be is chasing it,
(29:10):
and it's not sustainable. Pepergreen content is like what's going
to keep your social sustainable, and it's what's going to
build a community and that authenticity. So I really think
it's important to lean heavily on that side because it's
your foundation, it's your backup. And there's so many times
where I've created like evergreen content and sometimes a trend
comes up and then we just push that evergreen content,
(29:31):
but at least we had it there, So I think
it's really important. And if we're talking about a balance,
I mean, I don't know if I should like assign
numbers to it, but definitely majority I would do evergreen content.
And trends are still really important. But like we talked about,
like jump on what makes sense for you and your
brand and your audience. I feel like that's a third
one that people often forget, like is this going to
(29:52):
make sense to your audience? That's it was so funny.
I think in the past, it was like last year
or two years ago or something when all like the
Taylor Swift eras tour stuff was trending quite a bit
because she was in the middle of the tour, and
we thought of a lot of creative ways into that
because you know, she has different eras and there's different
aesthetics to it and that really fits like the Canva brand.
(30:13):
And because myself and so many other of our social
media managers were seeing it all over their feed we
were like, oh my god, people are going to want this,
and we tested out a few different ones and they
just did not perform well. And it's it's just a
learning that we're like, Oh, the Canva audience I don't
think resonates with this like Era's context.
Speaker 1 (30:32):
It's really interesting, I know, even though it was like
our entire feeds, it wasn't like the Canva audience's feed.
Speaker 2 (30:40):
So it's just one of those things that you have
to use your best judgment. You have to use like
the data that you have at hand, and we did
and we tested it and it didn't work and that's
totally fine, and you're not always going to get winners.
And I think the things that don't do well or
like flop, I think that's just as valuable as the
things that do well because it steers you in the
(31:02):
right direction. Even if it's it was like the quote
unquote wrong move, I think it was the right move
in order to get you to the better place, you
know what I mean?
Speaker 1 (31:10):
Oh absolutely, I mean you have to test everything as
a marketer. I mean I do it myself as a
content creator on LinkedIn. Sometimes I put together a thought out,
insightful post that just completely goes quiet and flops, and
I'll put out a three sentence thing and it goes
through the roof and goes viral, and sometimes you're just
like why yeah, and it's such an thing.
Speaker 2 (31:32):
Yeah, Like sometimes there's no rhyme or reason. That's just
how the algorithms go, because I can't tell you, like
how many times I've just been scratching my brain and
trying to find the theme, trying to like piece together
the data of why X did well, but why didn't?
And sometimes it's just the algorithm. And you can't be
too hard on yourself.
Speaker 1 (31:50):
Yeah, I mean sometimes that you always test everything, look
at the data, but sometimes it's just the algorithm.
Speaker 3 (31:55):
Algorithm.
Speaker 2 (31:56):
Yes, that's a call back answer.
Speaker 3 (31:58):
Absolutely with it.
Speaker 1 (32:00):
They're like, well, what do you mean, I'm like, no.
Speaker 3 (32:02):
And this is just how it goes.
Speaker 1 (32:03):
So, you know, speaking of looking at metrics, let's talk numbers.
How much does data actually guide your social strategy? Is
it a gut feeling, analytics, or somewhere in between.
Speaker 2 (32:14):
It really guides our strategy like a lot we lean
heavily into it. I think it's extremely important to work
off of that, not just for ourselves and because it's
like factual, you know, like it's it's the way that
our audience is speaking to us. It's the way that
we are getting you know. We do get direct feedback
sometimes in the comments of people being like I don't
(32:34):
like this or I want this, but having that data
is also a way to get that feedback because you're like, oh,
people like this and not this. So I think it's
incredibly important to put into your strategy. It's also important
when you work with other stakeholders and other people in
the company, and when you're trying to collaborate on something,
you need to fall back on things to explain this
is why this is going to do well, this is
(32:55):
why this doesn't do well. We've tested this before. I
think the most important part of collaboration is having that understanding,
and that understanding comes from data. So I think it's
extremely important. But I will caveat by saying, like, I
think it's really important to still have ideas for testing.
I think having that foundation of like we work off
of data, like we do this, we don't do this
(33:17):
because of what we've found in our past performance. But
that doesn't mean you can't have ideas of testing. It
doesn't mean you can't throw something out there of like
let's test xyz and see if it does well or not.
I don't think you need data to test something. I
think you do need data to make content decisions of
like are we going to move forward with this or not.
I just think like we're at least at Canva, like
(33:40):
we're so encouraged to share our wins and our losses.
We always like to be say, oh, this piece of
content did really well on TikTok it hit like our goals,
et cetera. But we're also really encouraged to be like, hey,
we tried this video. It totally flopped. Why do we
think it happened? Like should we not do this in
the future? Should we tw we get to test something else,
(34:00):
Like we're really encouraged to have that open dialogue over
like our flow pieces, because that's how we're going to learn.
And it's really interesting to I like dissect why something
didn't do well the same as like why something did
do well. Honestly, I think it's more interesting and more
fun to dissect why something didn't do well because you
don't know exactly, but it's I just think it's really important.
(34:23):
So yes, to answer your question, so much data is
really really important. But that doesn't mean that you can't
throw ideas out there and like balance it with some
sort of gut feeling of this could do well, let's
try it.
Speaker 3 (34:34):
Yeah, I totally agree.
Speaker 1 (34:35):
I learn more from some of my content that doesn't
do well more than I ever learned from the ones
that do really well. You know, you're able to tweak
and revise, and you can also experiment with those things like, Okay,
it didn't do well in this format or on this platform, let's.
Speaker 3 (34:50):
Test it over here.
Speaker 2 (34:51):
Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 1 (34:52):
So imagine someone's just starting out with their brand, What
is like this one piece of advice that you would
tell them to start to grow their social presence?
Speaker 2 (35:02):
Ooh, one piece of advice, I would say, focus on
consistency and focus on value kind of like this has
been a theme throughout our conversation. But to build social channels,
especially with the algorithms nowadays, like you do really need
to be consistent. Consistency is key. You're going to get
the necessary data if you keep consistent, you're going to
(35:22):
get put on people's feeds. And I would say, build
a strategy. Have a foundation you can go off of,
even if it's bare bones when you post regularly, whether
it's helpful tips or inspiration or behind the scenes insights, like,
have content that is valuable, that can bring value to people.
Sprinkle in the trends there of course, but you know,
you want to make sure that you have a foundation
(35:42):
of evergreen content and you have a voice on social
and like, this is what my brand brings to the table.
This is how my brand is trying to connect with
our intended audience on social. And then through that, you know,
testing everything, measuring everything, I think is super important even
with small following. Just showing up consistently and providing something
(36:03):
useful we'll create like loyal engaged community members that want
more and we'll follow you and we'll engage. So I
think those points, even when it's a very tiny brand
are important for just starting out. I love that.
Speaker 1 (36:15):
So looking into your social media crystal ball, what is
the next big thing for social What should marketers be
ready for in the next year or two? I might
be asking personally, Well.
Speaker 2 (36:27):
I wish I had a crystal Ball. I would be
a lot further on in my career if I had
a crystal But listen, addressing the elephant in the room. Obviously,
the next big thing will be whatever replaces TikTok. True,
it's started like a need for users that maybe we're
gonna have to find somewhere else. Maybe an existing brand
(36:47):
will step up, or maybe a new one will who knows.
That's like, it's such a mess that's up in the
air right now. But I will say like that is
going to be part of the future. I think the
communities that were started on that platform and the people
message and connect is something that is not going to
go away and that people are gonna want to find
somewhere else. So talking about future like that's a big one.
(37:09):
I would also say, like, AI's not slowing down anytime soon.
So whether that be like AI created content or something
of the sort, there's whatever way you slice it. Like,
it's going to be on our socials and it could
take form and content, it could take form in the
different features on social maybe they integrate more AI into it.
But I see that in my crystal ball. And then oh,
(37:32):
another one that I think is social commerce I feel
like there've been like a huge social commerce evolution. It
started a little bit with Instagram, but I think it
really got I don't know, maybe I'm biased because I
always thought TikTok was better than Instagram, but I think
the TikTok shop was like a lot stronger version of
the Instagram shop, And for sure, I think that's just
going to like continue through other platforms. I think people
(37:56):
love being able to buy things from their phone. I
think they love being able to to hear real reviews
and like see things, and so I think that's going
to be really important. And then the last one I'll
say is I think micro influencers and like niche communities,
I think those will continue to grow in importance. I
think there was a huge renaissance of like these creators
(38:18):
who had like tens of millions of followers, But I
really think that people are connecting more with these niche influencers,
micro influencers, smaller ones. I think their engagement rate in
their communities a lot stronger than the larger ones. And
then that goes into niche communities, whether that be like
Facebook pages or a new platform like or maybe it's
(38:39):
just a sub section of TikTok or Instagram, like you know,
you get on book talk and those types of things. Like,
I really think those niche communities are going to continue
on social and I think if brands can really identify
those communities and like those micro influencers in those communities,
they're going to have a much more authentic and valuable
connection to their intended audiences. So that concludes my Crystal
(39:01):
blow No.
Speaker 1 (39:02):
I think that's great insights.
Speaker 3 (39:04):
I really love that.
Speaker 1 (39:06):
I think that is that I completely agree with what
you're thinking. And I think this has been such a
really insightful conversation.
Speaker 3 (39:13):
I love your focus on value.
Speaker 1 (39:15):
It's clear why Canva has been so incredible on their
social presence with you leading the charge.
Speaker 2 (39:22):
There's a lot of people leading the charge, and I'm
just so lucky to be a part of the brand.
It's been really great.
Speaker 3 (39:28):
That's awesome.
Speaker 1 (39:29):
So before we wrap up, where can people find you
if they want to connect or follow your work? Yeah?
Speaker 2 (39:33):
Absolutely, And they can find me on LinkedIn, Lauren Freund,
and that's probably where I'm most active. You can find
me on other social platforms, but I'm much more of
like a comment ern than i am a poster, So
LinkedIn will probably be the best place to find me.
I love connecting with new people on LinkedIn and sharing
insights like the ones we shared in this discussion today,
(39:54):
So yeah, that's where you can find me.
Speaker 3 (39:56):
Awesome.
Speaker 1 (39:56):
Well, thanks so much again for joining us today, Lauren,
Thank you, thank you. That wraps up another episode of
Talk Digital to Me, where we explore the strategies, trends,
and innovations shaping the digital world. I hope Lauren's insights
on building engaged communities, striking the balance between authenticity and
brand messaging, and making data driven social media decisions gave
(40:18):
you new perspectives on how to approach your own digital presence.
If you enjoyed this conversation, leave a review on Apple Podcasts,
Share this episode with a friend or colleague, and don't
forget to subscribe on whatever platform you're listening to me
Now until next time, keep creating, keep engaging, and remember
social media is a conversation, not a megaphone.
Speaker 3 (40:41):
See you soon.
Social media It's where brands come alive, communities thrive, and
trends either take off or flop spectacularly. But what does
it really take to build a social presence that goes
beyond vanity metrics? How do you craft engagement that actually
means something? Today we're breaking it all down with someone
who knows this world inside and out. Lauren is a
(00:23):
social media manager at Canva. Lauren has mastered the art
of turning likes and shares into meaningful growth, building engaged communities,
and staying ahead of the trends. If you're a marketer,
brand strategist, or just someone curious about what makes a
post actually work, this episode's for you. I'm your host,
Niki Ramirez, and this is Talk Digital to Me, where
(00:46):
we uncover the latest in digital marketing, tech, AI innovation,
and strategies for personal and professional growth. This is episode
twenty one, from Likes to Loyalty, How to build a
social media strategy that actually works. Hey, everyone, welcome back
(01:14):
to Talk Digital to Me. I'm your host, Nikki Ramirez,
and today we're diving into one of my favorite topics,
social media. It's where brands come alive, communities thrive, and
let's be real, trends either take off or flop spectacularly.
Joining me today is someone who knows this world inside
and out. Lauren is a social media manager at Canva.
(01:36):
Lauren has a ton of experience in marketing and digital media,
and she has absolutely mastered the art of turning likes
and shares into meaningful growth. Whether it's building community, crafting
strategic engagement, or jumping on trends at the right moment,
Lauren has seen it all. We're here to talk about
how to truly master social media for growth, how to
(01:56):
build a community that actually cares, engage in ways that
make a different friends, and stay ahead of the curve
when it comes to trends. If you're a marketer, brand strategist,
or even someone just curious about the magic behind posts,
you double tap. This one's for you, Lauren. I'm so
excited to have you here.
Speaker 2 (02:13):
I'm so excited to be here. Thanks so much for
having me, and thank you for all the kind things
you just said. And I'm really excited to dive into
all the things we have to chat about today.
Speaker 1 (02:24):
Me too, I'm so excited to talk to you. So
diving right in social media is all about community. What
do you think makes an online community really click? And
how do you make that happen at Canada?
Speaker 2 (02:37):
Yeah, so I really think like your online community importance
is huge. It's ultimately the heartbeat of your social presence.
If not, you know your brand and your sales so
high level? What makes it click? I love to use
the phrase why share?
Speaker 3 (02:53):
Why care?
Speaker 2 (02:54):
That's kind of the sweet spot or the click for
me of why is a brand? Are you sharing something?
Why as the audience are they going to care? And
I really think once you hit that sweet spot, that's
really going to make people care and have ultimately a
very strong community because of that. So this can take
form in a few different ways. I think the biggest
(03:16):
one that people normally talk about is a shared mission,
right so for can for example, it's empowering people to
design and communicate their ideas effortlessly. This shared purpose that
we focus on as a brand just brings creators, educators, marketers, entrepreneurs,
all the different types of people who use Canva together
and that's what's important to us. With making an online communities,
(03:38):
we're really catering to that and we do it in
a few different ways. We love highlighting user stories we
engage through challenges. We do a lot of design challenges
and like interactive polls. This encourages dialogue and just strengthens
that community that we have. And then, last but not least,
we listen. And whether it be through social listening or
(03:58):
just going through the comments, we always like to keep
tabs on what our users love, what they're struggling with,
what they want, and we really believe that all of
that just makes a really strong online community. And that's
what really makes things click is when I think your
audience can tell that you guys have a special relationship
and you're not just speaking at them.
Speaker 3 (04:19):
I love that.
Speaker 1 (04:20):
And yeah, so many brands tend to speak at people
then speaking.
Speaker 3 (04:24):
To what they actually care about.
Speaker 1 (04:25):
So the why share, why care is so perfect?
Speaker 3 (04:28):
I love that.
Speaker 1 (04:28):
Yeah, So be honest, what is the biggest mistake you
see brands making when they're trying to build a community
on social?
Speaker 2 (04:36):
Yeah, listen, No brand is perfect, but I think there
are some mistakes that I see your themes that I
see amongst some brands on social nowadays, and kind of
to what we were just talking about, I think one
of the biggest mistakes I see is brands treating social
media like a megaphone instead of treating it like a
conversation or a community. I think because it is so
(05:01):
I mean it like social media is just so saturated nowadays,
I think people forget what the purpose of it was
in the first place, which is that interaction, that engagement.
It's not just like a one way street. And I
see this in a few ways. I see brands ignoring
comments or failing to respond to messages. I see them
overlooking authenticity and just kind of posting what they think
(05:22):
they should post or what they've seen other brands posts.
I see brands jumping on trends for the sake of it,
regardless if it fits them or not. I see them
ignoring the why behind community of or even just ignoring
their community in general, of why they're there. And I
see them focusing solely on metrics, which metrics are super important,
(05:42):
but they don't always reflect a strong community, and true
success always comes from engagement and meaningful reactions versus, you know,
just some big numbers or some arbitrary numbers. So all
of that I think really ladders up to the mistake
brands have of treating social media like a megaphone instead
of really a place to connect and build something important.
Speaker 1 (06:03):
That's such a good vision for what people are seeing
on social it is megaphone. I love that imagery because
that's exactly what a lot of brands are getting wrong.
They need to be focused on engaging with their actual followers,
like we're following a brand for a reason.
Speaker 2 (06:19):
Exactly exactly. If I wanted to be megaphoned at I
would scroll through some ads or and scroll through their website.
But I really think people should remember what social media
is for and that even though everyone has a social
media account and brands have multiple ones, I don't think
because we've gotten so far, I don't think there's anything
(06:39):
wrong with going back to the basics and making sure
that it is a place for your community and it's
a place for that interaction.
Speaker 3 (06:46):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (06:46):
I mean people are already following your brand for a reason,
so lean into that and engage. And that brings it
to it's all about authenticity, and so brands have a
message to push as well. So how do you strike
that balance between the authenticity and not being a megaphone
so that it feels real and not forced.
Speaker 2 (07:05):
Yeah? Absolutely, I think this ties back to what I
said about why share why care. I think that balance
between feeling real and not force is finding a common
ground of feeling real of why you're sharing something and
why your audience is going to care, And I think
that's really a sweet spot. I think prioritizing value over
promotion is a really good road to go down. And
(07:27):
what I mean by that is authenticity comes from understanding
your audience's needs and creating content that serves them first. So,
for example, at Canva, we focus on empowering our users,
which takes form in providing design tips, creative inspiration, relatable
stories like hacks, tricks, all those types of things, and
(07:48):
we focus on that and showing that through storytelling that
is relatable and relevant and helpful rather than just pushing
our products. So we could say, you know, hey, we
came out with magic right, it's really cool. You should
try it. Or we could show a marketer like myself
who is facing a deadline and needs to write up
(08:10):
a proposal in the next one hour and needs to
use magic right to do it. So I think it
really comes with valuing the use cases and connection over
just the promotion and just stating something, and I think
that really brings in the authenticity because you're showing that
you understand and you know. To the back of authenticity,
it's also being a human and social is really important.
(08:32):
People connect better with people, not just faceless brands. So
on Campbo, we have friendly, approachable people and tones in
our messaging and ensuring that it feels very conversational and relatable,
and I think that really helps not just for us,
but for other brands feel more authentic. And then, lastly,
on the thought of authenticity, I think, you know, engaging
(08:52):
in trends that fit your brand is so important. I
might have mentioned this in the Mistakes already, but I
see a lot of brands just engaging in every single
trend there is, and that really decreases your authenticity. That's
not to say you shouldn't hop on trends, but I
really think that there needs to be more strategy and
more connection before you decide to do that. So at Canvo,
(09:14):
we engage with trends that support creativity, inclusivity and fun
because that's what our brand is and it makes sense
when we do it. And I just think overall, it's
really important to remain consistent with what your brand values
are in order to communicate to your audience that you
are being authentic.
Speaker 3 (09:30):
That makes perfect sense.
Speaker 1 (09:31):
I mean as someone who's used magic in a marketing
sense as to do a last minute project.
Speaker 2 (09:38):
I love you guys, oh my god, love to hear it.
Speaker 1 (09:41):
And so engagement is really really the holy grail of
social But it's more than just replying to the comments just.
Speaker 3 (09:48):
With thanks so much. Like, how do you think about.
Speaker 1 (09:52):
Creating engagement that actually means something?
Speaker 2 (09:55):
Yeah? Yeah, I love how we're focusing on value because
I think that is so important with all the noise
that's on social media currently, Like, it is so important
to keep going back to the value of it. So
in terms of your question on like engagement or applying
to comments, yeah, your engagement strategy can no longer be
replying to people with like, OMG, thanks, we love you too,
(10:15):
things like that. Do you know what I mean? It
really needs to be more than that, needs to be
more valuable. So I think now a strong strategy of
creating engagements can be a few different things. So I
think starting conversations rather than just commenting. Sometimes the best
things about like a TikTok or an Instagram reel is
the comments, not even the video. Like you you see
(10:37):
a video, You're like, oh, I got I have to
check the comments now.
Speaker 1 (10:40):
I run to the comments, right, run, yeah, TikTok, holy grail.
Speaker 2 (10:45):
Yes, literally, And I think that's really kind of taking
comments a step further. Because you go into the comments,
people are starting in a who whole conversation, And I
think that you can do that as a brand too.
You can start a conversation or something, whether it be
you are replying to one of your audience members or
you're jumping in another conversation. I think starting something rather
(11:07):
than just responding and ending it there is good. I
kind of think of, you know, in like theater or improv,
they always say you should say yes and and like
continue it. That's what I kind of think of for
social media as well, like just try to continue it
and have it be a conversation. I also think that
like commenting is still important. I don't want to devalue it,
(11:28):
but it's about bringing value to it. So for example,
at least like with us, it's great to continue that
education or inspiration, like sharing tips or templates. If someone
shows us something, of course we want to tell them
we love it, but it may go a little further
in value if we're like, oh, have you tried doing this?
Or like, oh my gosh, we love that. Have you
checked out these templates and just continuing that, or if
(11:50):
you're a fashion brand, like what if fashion brands started
commenting like accessories to go with stuff, Like if an
influencer is like here's my outbume, Involve like how cool
would it be? Revolve was like, oh my gosh, like
our necklace would go so well with that, or just
starting more conversation and being more human.
Speaker 1 (12:06):
And then genius, you should be calling up Revolved tomorrow.
Speaker 2 (12:09):
Sorry would you say it?
Speaker 1 (12:10):
I said that you should be calling them up.
Speaker 3 (12:13):
That's genius.
Speaker 2 (12:14):
Yes, maybe I will settle for a discount.
Speaker 1 (12:17):
They can have my idea, seel I think we can
get that worked out for you.
Speaker 2 (12:22):
And then the last thing I was just gonna say
is like engaging with brands too. I love it when
I see someone's video, whether they're an influencer or just
someone with not that big of a falling and you
see all these brands commenting, and I think people really
love that too. They're like, Wendy's what are you doing here?
You know, like it's just fun and it's funny, and
so I think there are so many different ways in
(12:43):
besides just replying with something bland or overused, to stay
in that conversation and create that really meaningful and valuable engagement.
Speaker 1 (12:52):
Yeah, a lot of the times you can find your
next content from what people are asking in the actual
comments themselves. There's so much to see what people are
actually talking about. And you know that goes along with
social listening. You know how much of a role does
it play in shaping what you post or how you engage?
Speaker 2 (13:09):
Yeah, I would say it plays a really big role
for us, and even even before I was at Canvas
and every role that I've been in, it's always played
a huge role just as a social media marketer and
kind of like what you were saying of you get
content ideas from the engagement and from social listening. Like,
we create so much content from comments or from things
(13:30):
that we see, and we love that because that again
just shows another level of engagement. If we go out
with a video and someone says something as simple as
like oh how did you create this? Or we love
creating more videos off the back of that because we
feel like we're really bringing a lot of value. So
that can be done through just manual comments, but there
are also so many social listening tools that I've used
(13:51):
over the years that are so so helpful, and it
plays a big role for us. Like I mentioned shaping content,
it's so important to understand what your audience cares about,
whether it be within your own brand of like oh
they care about this side of the brand, or it
could just be in general, like oh, they're really caring
about this topic in society right now. So I think
that's important to see through social listening. I also think
(14:14):
it can improve engagement and like trend opportunities for you
to stay on top of that and keep your finger
on the pulse, and then also building relationships. It's really
hard sometimes, especially when you work for big brands, to
stay on top of all of those communications and all
of that social listening data that's coming in, and I
think a lot of the tools nowadays make that easy
(14:34):
for us to kind of get a big snapshot of it.
Whether we can see like, okay, most of the comments
are about this, or you know, like those word clouds
to see like what phrases and words people are mentioning
the most, or if we can like really bucket in
our comments and get like a good read from it.
It's just social listening is so helpful for so many
different roles within marketing to make sure that you're making
(14:56):
informed decisions moving forward, whether it's about your messaging or
your content are both that's awesome.
Speaker 1 (15:01):
And with all that the analytics out there, you know
you talked about all the platforms that you do use.
When you're looking at those metrics, how do you know
what good engagement even looks like? Or what are your
go to metrics when you're really measuring against what you
want to do next?
Speaker 2 (15:18):
Yeah? I think you didn't ask this, but my least
favorite metric is virality. Let's make this go viral. I'm
sure so many social media marketers have heard that if.
Speaker 3 (15:28):
The marketers are just like having PTSD.
Speaker 2 (15:31):
Right, yeah, they should have a trigger moarning. I'm sorry
that is definitely my least favorite metric. Not to start
off on a negative foot, but I do think it's
important to talk about how I think sometimes metrics need
to be more thought out versus just picking something, whether
it be impressions, engagements, click through whatever. I think it
really starts with what is your objective and what is
(15:53):
the campaign? You know, sometimes we just go out with
social content because we think it's fun and we have
like evergreen content in the works. But a lot of
our content as well is supporting other campaigns, right Like
it comes from the brand team and we as social
or supporting this big campaign. So in that sense, we
really look to like what that campaign subjective is, and
(16:14):
sometimes it's signing up for something, And so our objective
even with social is going to be click through rate,
Like that's just how it's going to be, because we
want to support the overall goals of the brand or
of the campaign. But if it's evergreen content, I always
lean into engagements or specifically engagement rate. I don't really
like looking at, you know, how many followers do we have,
(16:35):
or how many impressions do they get. I think impressions
are important if you're trying to like strictly grow. I
know in the early stages of our TikTok we were
really focused on impressions because we just wanted to grow
the channel. But in terms of you know, as we've
talked about throughout this discussion, how important community is and
building that authenticity and that dialogue, I really think engagements
(16:56):
are where it's at. An engagement rate I think really
shows out of all the people who are seeing it, like,
what's the percentage that people are engaging? You know. I
always like to kind of use like a dinner party metaphor.
So if you invited like a hundred people to your
dinner party, but only one of them talked, like, that's
a pretty bad dinner party, right, But if you invited
like ten people to your dinner party, it's not that much.
But if nine out of those ten people talked, it
(17:18):
was a pretty fun party. So that's why I like
to think about engagement right as the most important, because
we want to make sure that the people we do
have engaged and the people who are seeing our content
are genuinely engaged and are genuinely liking it and paying
attention to it, because those are the valuable people who
are then going to like spread our message onto others.
(17:40):
We're not going to really have like those super silent
people spreading it. And of course all algorithms are different,
but that's really what I like to focus on outside
of a campaign that the whole company is working on,
if it's just evergreen content, I like to focus on engagement, right.
I think that's important, and I think I answered your question,
let me know if I forgot wanting on at that's perfect, Okay.
Speaker 3 (18:01):
I love that.
Speaker 1 (18:01):
And you know, for your business in Canva, your audience
has to be so broad because I know just from
personal experience that I'm a marketer, so we all use
it as marketers. But I have friends that own small
businesses who have never touched design in their life. Or
my husband who's an engineer who started a three D
Etsy printing business. They're now using Canva and they have
(18:24):
never been in the marketing business, never been in design.
So when you're looking at an audience that broad, how
do you tweak your engagement strategies for different platforms and
groups without losing your main focus.
Speaker 2 (18:36):
Yeah, it is really interesting. I think Canvas the first
company I've worked for that has this broad of an audience.
I think my past companies have been I don't want
to call it a niche at all, but you know
it was. It was more focused. So it's been an
interesting challenge, but I love it, and I don't want
to say it makes my job easy, but it is
really really nice as a marketer to have so much
(19:00):
many people interested in it, like such a broad audience.
And it's really great for me to learn, right because
there's all these audiences that I've never really worked with before.
Now I'm seeing how they love Canva and how they
use Canva. So it is honestly like a really big
positive for me. But in terms of like how you
would tweak, like engagement strategies and things like that, I
think really having a strategy from like the get go
(19:22):
is really important. And even if you're just starting out
your small business, like you mentioned, it can be a
bare bone strategy. But I always think starting somewhere and
like having a foundation is important because then you always
have something to go back to once you get more
insights and get more data and start to change things.
And I think doing research about the audiences and how
the content performs on each platform is so important. I've
(19:43):
only been at Canva for about three years now, and
so many things have changed because audiences are growing and
they're adapting, and you got to stay up with that,
and so I think adapting the tone for each platform
is also really important. Once you learn like the content
that does well, you know, like I can we know
that certain announcements do well on platforms, and then certain
(20:04):
inspiration content does better on other platforms, Like people are
just different on each platform, and I think adapting the
tone is really important as well. But overall, I would
say like maintaining consistent brand identity is important regardless of
platform or audience. I think the core message of at
least for Canda, like the core message of creativity, empowerment
(20:24):
and inclusivity like always stays the same. And that goes
back to like the strategy I was talking about before
of having a foundation, I think even a bare bone
strategy of like this is our company and this is
what we stand for, and that's that, and we're going
to go test everything else and come back with it.
I think that's important because it really has a common
thread now throughout all your channels, and the execution may
(20:45):
look different, right, It may sound a little different in
the tone, or the content may be a little different
or inspirational here, more straightforward there. But making sure that
you're keeping that consistent brand identity, then you'll never lose
yourself and it'll make sense cohesively in the end.
Speaker 1 (21:00):
I love that you also said something that I thought
was really interesting that people are there's different people on
different platforms, but also people are different on different platforms
like oh true, Yeah, it's like the same message that
I want on TikTok is not the same I'm going
to want on LinkedIn. So you know, it's going with
the platforms as well as the people.
Speaker 3 (21:20):
You know, the more.
Speaker 1 (21:21):
Unhinged things are more like for TikTok and different platforms
from that. But like if you saw one of those
on LinkedIn, that would throw you off a bit.
Speaker 2 (21:30):
No, it totally would. And that's what's interesting is I
feel like, as you know, social media has been around
for a while now, but in the grand scheme of things,
it still hasn't been that long. And I've been seeing more,
at least on LinkedIn. It always used to be like
LinkedIn as where you're more professional and this and that.
But I've been seeing like so many memes on LinkedIn.
Speaker 1 (21:51):
Yes, and some of my humor content, yeah, really well
on there.
Speaker 2 (21:55):
Humor content, And I don't think there's anything wrong with that.
I think that's just like a really great example of
of course, like LinkedIn has not gone to like the
unhinged level of TikTok, and I don't think they ever will.
Speaker 1 (22:07):
Yeah, I think I'm a little grateful for that. Like
Ale unhinged content for other platforms.
Speaker 3 (22:12):
But I enjoy it. I just want it on my
other ones exactly.
Speaker 2 (22:17):
But they're yeah, so it's it's never going to do
like a full three sixty. But I do think it's
interesting that there are these like little movements of like
being more casual and more relatable because I think ultimately
that's what people want. And you have to also think
about like the generations who are coming up like Gen
Z and then after that it's going to be Gen Alpha,
and I think they really value that type of communication more,
(22:38):
the more casual relatable stuff. So it's just interesting. It's
always going to be changing, Oh absolutely.
Speaker 1 (22:43):
I mean I talk all the time about how digital
platforms will always evolve, Like TikTok used to be in
competitive nature with Facebook and Instagram, but I think it's
more competitive with streaming and search now where people.
Speaker 3 (22:55):
Are finding their information.
Speaker 1 (22:57):
So I mean, you know, speaking of how platforms evolve,
social media trends evolve like crazy. They're like lightning here
one second.
Speaker 3 (23:04):
Gone the next.
Speaker 1 (23:05):
How do you decide which ones are worth jumping on
and which ones you know, let's let that one pass.
Speaker 2 (23:11):
Yes, I feel like like we already talked about Like,
this is an issue a lot of brands deal with,
so I'm glad we're chatting about it. I think, like
how you decide is rooted in authenticity and relevance to
your brand. I think trends should feel genuine to a
brand's voice, and for Canva, we hold that true, like
(23:32):
it has to feel genuine to our voice. We don't
jump on every trend, only those that resonate with our
community in a way that feels natural, and we evaluate
that whether the trend lines up to canvas mission in
Canvas tone of empowerment and creativity and if it's fun
and creative, like it's it really just matters if it matches.
(23:52):
And you know, there are brands out there like Due
Lingo and Wendy's and Ryanair who have like very snarky
brand and they create all that content that kind of
fits that tone, and most trends kind of work for
that because I feel like a lot of trends, at
least on TikTok are often like self deprecating and it's humorous,
(24:14):
but it works for those brands. And I think that's
where people run into issues of like they'll just jump
on trends that don't fit who they are, and audiences
will see that and it'll feel off and it'll feel inauthentic,
and then they won't engauge and it's just like not
a good path to go down. So that's how we
decide which ones are worth jumping on and which are
(24:35):
to let pass. If we can see like a very
clear vision of how we can integrate into it, and
we don't want to use it as like a promo,
Like we don't want to be like, oh my god,
like magic, right is the solution to this, you know,
but we do want some sort of connection to it.
And a deal breaker is if it's like not in
our tone, like if it is snarky or negative or
(24:56):
anything like that, it's just like an immediate no for us.
Speaker 3 (24:59):
Yeah that's fair.
Speaker 1 (25:00):
I mean, can you share a trend that Canva hopped
on that really worked for you guys?
Speaker 2 (25:04):
Yeah? There was actually I have two that come to mind. Okay,
so the first one is like definitely a trend. This
is gonna be so embarrassing. Have you ever had to
like explain a trend to someone and like they don't
know what you're talking about? You just sound like.
Speaker 1 (25:18):
My father in law has no idea what's going on
on the internet, and me trying to explain to him
what I'm doing is just out of this world.
Speaker 2 (25:26):
Yeah, so I'm gonna do my best. But you know
that trend that it was like in December, and it
was like when you're running from the cops and they say, like,
suspect is beautiful and it turns out, okay, good, you
know what I'm talking about.
Speaker 3 (25:37):
I know what you're talking about.
Speaker 2 (25:38):
Wonderful. So we hopped on that little trend and we
did something like Suspect makes beautiful Canva designs and the
person turned around and that was like such a simple
one for us to be a part of, and it
was like so easy and so authentic for us, and
it performed really well. It was just one of those
like really easy way in ones. So that was like
(25:59):
an exam of one that did really well for us.
And then another one I thought of, which less of
a typical TikTok trend and more of like a trend
or like a culture thing. Pantone obviously comes out with
like colors of the Year, and this year it was
I think it was Mocha something about something chocolatey, and
that was like a topic of conversation. I wouldn't say
it was like a trend, right, but like people were
(26:20):
talking about it on social it was a topic, and
so we created a video that used some like AI
magic that showed like a Mocha template and then we
showed like Mocha coffee coming out of the phone. It
was really really cool. Yeah, but from there we showed
people like how to recreate that effect because everyone loved
that video. So that's just an example of something that
(26:40):
I feel like people get really caught up in, like
the funny like TikTok trends, but you can also like
tap into just things happening in the world, like the awards, right,
like the Oscars happen every year, like the Super Bowl,
things like that. I think those are still considered trends
in a way, and they're easier to have your own
way into because there's not a oneliner or a specific
(27:01):
sound that's tied to it like TikTok trends are. But anyways,
that was one that we participated in that performed really
well because it was a no brainer for us, right,
It's like design, it's colors, it's things like that, and
for us to kind of showcase it in a way
that uses more of our products. For like, a very
esthetically pleasing and creative video was a great way in
for us. So those are a few examples of what
(27:22):
we pop on.
Speaker 3 (27:23):
Those are great examples.
Speaker 1 (27:25):
I mean, do you find yourself as a marketer just
like with your brain broken all the time, where everything
is just an idea or you're looking at it from
a marketing perspective.
Speaker 2 (27:34):
Yeah, yeah, it's always And I think it's so hard
to also like fight that voice of your head of
like when you see something on your personal time like
scrolling through and you're like, oh my god, this is
so funny, and then trying to make it work for
your brand of like yeh, wait a minute, now, this
is like a tetris that I have to play in
my head of like can this work for the brand?
Maybe I should just do it on my own, you know.
Speaker 1 (27:55):
Yeah, I feel like I can half enjoy things anymore
because I'm either going, oh, that would be a really
good idea for content, or I go oh, they shouldn't
have jumped on that trend that wasn't for them.
Speaker 2 (28:04):
Yes, I hear it's so interesting, Like I hear that
all the time. With so many different jobs out there, right,
Like I have friends who work in music and like
they cannot listen to a song like a normal person can.
Or people who like work in like movies and TV,
like they can't watch it because they're thinking about the
production and things like that. So it is interesting. I
find that as a social media marketer the same way.
(28:26):
Like I feel like I digest content a bit differently
because my brain is always like working in the background
instead of just enjoying it.
Speaker 1 (28:32):
Yeah, it's like I'm analyzing everything.
Speaker 2 (28:35):
Yep.
Speaker 1 (28:36):
Yeah, So everyone is chasing the trends, but evergreen content
is really where the value is and we've been concentrated a.
Speaker 3 (28:42):
Lot on value and I love that.
Speaker 1 (28:44):
So how do you balance being timely and then staying timeless?
Speaker 2 (28:49):
Ooh, I love that. That should be a goal for myself. Ooh,
I like even staying timeless. Yeah. I mean, maybe I'm biased.
It's like, but I really think think it's so important
to stay consistent with evergreen content because chasing those trends,
like that's all it's ever going to be is chasing it,
(29:10):
and it's not sustainable. Pepergreen content is like what's going
to keep your social sustainable, and it's what's going to
build a community and that authenticity. So I really think
it's important to lean heavily on that side because it's
your foundation, it's your backup. And there's so many times
where I've created like evergreen content and sometimes a trend
comes up and then we just push that evergreen content,
(29:31):
but at least we had it there, So I think
it's really important. And if we're talking about a balance,
I mean, I don't know if I should like assign
numbers to it, but definitely majority I would do evergreen content.
And trends are still really important. But like we talked about,
like jump on what makes sense for you and your
brand and your audience. I feel like that's a third
one that people often forget, like is this going to
(29:52):
make sense to your audience? That's it was so funny.
I think in the past, it was like last year
or two years ago or something when all like the
Taylor Swift eras tour stuff was trending quite a bit
because she was in the middle of the tour, and
we thought of a lot of creative ways into that
because you know, she has different eras and there's different
aesthetics to it and that really fits like the Canva brand.
(30:13):
And because myself and so many other of our social
media managers were seeing it all over their feed we
were like, oh my god, people are going to want this,
and we tested out a few different ones and they
just did not perform well. And it's it's just a
learning that we're like, Oh, the Canva audience I don't
think resonates with this like Era's context.
Speaker 1 (30:32):
It's really interesting, I know, even though it was like
our entire feeds, it wasn't like the Canva audience's feed.
Speaker 2 (30:40):
So it's just one of those things that you have
to use your best judgment. You have to use like
the data that you have at hand, and we did
and we tested it and it didn't work and that's
totally fine, and you're not always going to get winners.
And I think the things that don't do well or
like flop, I think that's just as valuable as the
things that do well because it steers you in the
(31:02):
right direction. Even if it's it was like the quote
unquote wrong move, I think it was the right move
in order to get you to the better place, you
know what I mean?
Speaker 1 (31:10):
Oh absolutely, I mean you have to test everything as
a marketer. I mean I do it myself as a
content creator on LinkedIn. Sometimes I put together a thought out,
insightful post that just completely goes quiet and flops, and
I'll put out a three sentence thing and it goes
through the roof and goes viral, and sometimes you're just
like why yeah, and it's such an thing.
Speaker 2 (31:32):
Yeah, Like sometimes there's no rhyme or reason. That's just
how the algorithms go, because I can't tell you, like
how many times I've just been scratching my brain and
trying to find the theme, trying to like piece together
the data of why X did well, but why didn't?
And sometimes it's just the algorithm. And you can't be
too hard on yourself.
Speaker 1 (31:50):
Yeah, I mean sometimes that you always test everything, look
at the data, but sometimes it's just the algorithm.
Speaker 3 (31:55):
Algorithm.
Speaker 2 (31:56):
Yes, that's a call back answer.
Speaker 3 (31:58):
Absolutely with it.
Speaker 1 (32:00):
They're like, well, what do you mean, I'm like, no.
Speaker 3 (32:02):
And this is just how it goes.
Speaker 1 (32:03):
So, you know, speaking of looking at metrics, let's talk numbers.
How much does data actually guide your social strategy? Is
it a gut feeling, analytics, or somewhere in between.
Speaker 2 (32:14):
It really guides our strategy like a lot we lean
heavily into it. I think it's extremely important to work
off of that, not just for ourselves and because it's
like factual, you know, like it's it's the way that
our audience is speaking to us. It's the way that
we are getting you know. We do get direct feedback
sometimes in the comments of people being like I don't
(32:34):
like this or I want this, but having that data
is also a way to get that feedback because you're like, oh,
people like this and not this. So I think it's
incredibly important to put into your strategy. It's also important
when you work with other stakeholders and other people in
the company, and when you're trying to collaborate on something,
you need to fall back on things to explain this
is why this is going to do well, this is
(32:55):
why this doesn't do well. We've tested this before. I
think the most important part of collaboration is having that understanding,
and that understanding comes from data. So I think it's
extremely important. But I will caveat by saying, like, I
think it's really important to still have ideas for testing.
I think having that foundation of like we work off
of data, like we do this, we don't do this
(33:17):
because of what we've found in our past performance. But
that doesn't mean you can't have ideas of testing. It
doesn't mean you can't throw something out there of like
let's test xyz and see if it does well or not.
I don't think you need data to test something. I
think you do need data to make content decisions of
like are we going to move forward with this or not.
I just think like we're at least at Canva, like
(33:40):
we're so encouraged to share our wins and our losses.
We always like to be say, oh, this piece of
content did really well on TikTok it hit like our goals,
et cetera. But we're also really encouraged to be like, hey,
we tried this video. It totally flopped. Why do we
think it happened? Like should we not do this in
the future? Should we tw we get to test something else,
(34:00):
Like we're really encouraged to have that open dialogue over
like our flow pieces, because that's how we're going to learn.
And it's really interesting to I like dissect why something
didn't do well the same as like why something did
do well. Honestly, I think it's more interesting and more
fun to dissect why something didn't do well because you
don't know exactly, but it's I just think it's really important.
(34:23):
So yes, to answer your question, so much data is
really really important. But that doesn't mean that you can't
throw ideas out there and like balance it with some
sort of gut feeling of this could do well, let's
try it.
Speaker 3 (34:34):
Yeah, I totally agree.
Speaker 1 (34:35):
I learn more from some of my content that doesn't
do well more than I ever learned from the ones
that do really well. You know, you're able to tweak
and revise, and you can also experiment with those things like, Okay,
it didn't do well in this format or on this platform, let's.
Speaker 3 (34:50):
Test it over here.
Speaker 2 (34:51):
Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 1 (34:52):
So imagine someone's just starting out with their brand, What
is like this one piece of advice that you would
tell them to start to grow their social presence?
Speaker 2 (35:02):
Ooh, one piece of advice, I would say, focus on
consistency and focus on value kind of like this has
been a theme throughout our conversation. But to build social channels,
especially with the algorithms nowadays, like you do really need
to be consistent. Consistency is key. You're going to get
the necessary data if you keep consistent, you're going to
(35:22):
get put on people's feeds. And I would say, build
a strategy. Have a foundation you can go off of,
even if it's bare bones when you post regularly, whether
it's helpful tips or inspiration or behind the scenes insights, like,
have content that is valuable, that can bring value to people.
Sprinkle in the trends there of course, but you know,
you want to make sure that you have a foundation
(35:42):
of evergreen content and you have a voice on social
and like, this is what my brand brings to the table.
This is how my brand is trying to connect with
our intended audience on social. And then through that, you know,
testing everything, measuring everything, I think is super important even
with small following. Just showing up consistently and providing something
(36:03):
useful we'll create like loyal engaged community members that want
more and we'll follow you and we'll engage. So I
think those points, even when it's a very tiny brand
are important for just starting out. I love that.
Speaker 1 (36:15):
So looking into your social media crystal ball, what is
the next big thing for social What should marketers be
ready for in the next year or two? I might
be asking personally, Well.
Speaker 2 (36:27):
I wish I had a crystal Ball. I would be
a lot further on in my career if I had
a crystal But listen, addressing the elephant in the room. Obviously,
the next big thing will be whatever replaces TikTok. True,
it's started like a need for users that maybe we're
gonna have to find somewhere else. Maybe an existing brand
(36:47):
will step up, or maybe a new one will who knows.
That's like, it's such a mess that's up in the
air right now. But I will say like that is
going to be part of the future. I think the
communities that were started on that platform and the people
message and connect is something that is not going to
go away and that people are gonna want to find
somewhere else. So talking about future like that's a big one.
(37:09):
I would also say, like, AI's not slowing down anytime soon.
So whether that be like AI created content or something
of the sort, there's whatever way you slice it. Like,
it's going to be on our socials and it could
take form and content, it could take form in the
different features on social maybe they integrate more AI into it.
But I see that in my crystal ball. And then oh,
(37:32):
another one that I think is social commerce I feel
like there've been like a huge social commerce evolution. It
started a little bit with Instagram, but I think it
really got I don't know, maybe I'm biased because I
always thought TikTok was better than Instagram, but I think
the TikTok shop was like a lot stronger version of
the Instagram shop, And for sure, I think that's just
going to like continue through other platforms. I think people
(37:56):
love being able to buy things from their phone. I
think they love being able to to hear real reviews
and like see things, and so I think that's going
to be really important. And then the last one I'll
say is I think micro influencers and like niche communities,
I think those will continue to grow in importance. I
think there was a huge renaissance of like these creators
(38:18):
who had like tens of millions of followers, But I
really think that people are connecting more with these niche influencers,
micro influencers, smaller ones. I think their engagement rate in
their communities a lot stronger than the larger ones. And
then that goes into niche communities, whether that be like
Facebook pages or a new platform like or maybe it's
(38:39):
just a sub section of TikTok or Instagram, like you know,
you get on book talk and those types of things. Like,
I really think those niche communities are going to continue
on social and I think if brands can really identify
those communities and like those micro influencers in those communities,
they're going to have a much more authentic and valuable
connection to their intended audiences. So that concludes my Crystal
(39:01):
blow No.
Speaker 1 (39:02):
I think that's great insights.
Speaker 3 (39:04):
I really love that.
Speaker 1 (39:06):
I think that is that I completely agree with what
you're thinking. And I think this has been such a
really insightful conversation.
Speaker 3 (39:13):
I love your focus on value.
Speaker 1 (39:15):
It's clear why Canva has been so incredible on their
social presence with you leading the charge.
Speaker 2 (39:22):
There's a lot of people leading the charge, and I'm
just so lucky to be a part of the brand.
It's been really great.
Speaker 3 (39:28):
That's awesome.
Speaker 1 (39:29):
So before we wrap up, where can people find you
if they want to connect or follow your work? Yeah?
Speaker 2 (39:33):
Absolutely, And they can find me on LinkedIn, Lauren Freund,
and that's probably where I'm most active. You can find
me on other social platforms, but I'm much more of
like a comment ern than i am a poster, So
LinkedIn will probably be the best place to find me.
I love connecting with new people on LinkedIn and sharing
insights like the ones we shared in this discussion today,
(39:54):
So yeah, that's where you can find me.
Speaker 3 (39:56):
Awesome.
Speaker 1 (39:56):
Well, thanks so much again for joining us today, Lauren,
Thank you, thank you. That wraps up another episode of
Talk Digital to Me, where we explore the strategies, trends,
and innovations shaping the digital world. I hope Lauren's insights
on building engaged communities, striking the balance between authenticity and
brand messaging, and making data driven social media decisions gave
(40:18):
you new perspectives on how to approach your own digital presence.
If you enjoyed this conversation, leave a review on Apple Podcasts,
Share this episode with a friend or colleague, and don't
forget to subscribe on whatever platform you're listening to me
Now until next time, keep creating, keep engaging, and remember
social media is a conversation, not a megaphone.
Speaker 3 (40:41):
See you soon.
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