July 30, 2024 • 36 mins
'I Saw The TV Glow' finally arrived in UK cinemas this weekend and another pair of 90s kids, Dallas and Lee review Jane Schoenbrun's beautiful allegory for the experience of being transgender.
A classmate introduces teenage Owen to a mysterious late-night TV show -- a vision of a supernatural world beneath their own. In the pale glow of the television, Owen's view of reality begins to crack.
A classmate introduces teenage Owen to a mysterious late-night TV show -- a vision of a supernatural world beneath their own. In the pale glow of the television, Owen's view of reality begins to crack.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:03):
Welcome to the Nerd Party.
Speaker 2 (00:12):
Hello, and welcome to the A twenty four project. Here
in the Nerd Party Network, my name is Lee Hudgson
and Dallas King and I make our way through the
A twenty four filmography and along the way bring you
interviews with the talent involved in front of and behind
the camera, and in this episode, a couple of nineties
kids finally get the opportunity to review. I saw the
TV Glow, which finally landed in some UK cinemas this
(00:33):
weekend as the counterprogramming release to Deadpool and Wolverine. So
I just saw it just before we started recording today.
The kind of box office was coming out for the
film and it had one of the best performing performances
at the UK and Ireland box office this weekend, where
it took one three hundred and fourteen pounds per cinema screen. So, Dallas,
(00:57):
you are someone that knows the nuts and bolts of
profit and such like its cinemas. That seems like a
really good number all things considered. Yep.
Speaker 1 (01:07):
And I mean I might argue with you maybe on
the on the nineties kid, I think probably technically more
of an eighties kid, But I did enjoy a lot
of TV during the nineties as well, so I'll take
it I look young, but yeah, no, I mean that's
that is a very good result given just the sheer
number of screens that went to Depot and Wolverine this weekend.
(01:29):
I mean, I saw this film at the Garden Cinema
in London. I think it was about three forty on
a Friday afternoon, and I would say that it was
probably had about I'd say probably around about forty people.
For a film like this, which is, you know, quite small,
the marketing budget would have been quite small as well,
(01:51):
so to get that sort of breakthrough, to get that
type of audience on an afternoon, and especially it was
skewed aitally, quite older of an audience for me, So
maybe it was people sort of reflecting back on their
time when they were obsessed with TV shows in the nineties.
But obviously, you know the way that it's it's trailer
(02:12):
and you know the storyline, it does potentially appeal to
a younger audience, so it's clearly broken through to all
sort of demographics here, so interested to see how this
one plays out. I mean, what about yourself, what was
your screening like?
Speaker 2 (02:26):
Yeah, I went to on a Sunnay afternoon, three point
fifteen in the afternoon, and I booked my ticket a
little bit earlier in the week and there wasn't much
seats had been really booked by that point, and then
I was like turning up not expecting too many people there,
and it had a really quite busy crowd. I think
probably about one hundred odd people for there was only
(02:48):
two screenings a day in Edinburgh at this one cinema alone,
thanks to the Cameo Cinema for actually putting this one on.
And yeah, there was a real big crowd, but I
would say most of the Mine skewed slightly younger. It
seemed like a very progressive queer crowd that turned up
for Mine, So probably the crowd that the story is
(03:11):
mostly aimed towards really turned up for Mine. So I
was really really pleased to see such a big crowd
relatively speaking for this type of film. And you had
a bit of a smile on my face that for
a film that I think a couple of weeks ago
there was talk of it going to be It's gonna
be out mid July and UK cinemas. Then it came
out that actually it's not actually showing in UK cinemas,
(03:32):
and you know, the director whipping up a bit of
a campaign of anyone, can you know, can someone reach
out put this on? And then obviously Sony stepped up
in what was no time at all to put this
in cinemas. When you think back to the long wait
we had for eighth Grade and Sony releasing it about
a year later, I was really surprised at the quick
turnaround from this and that It's cleary found an audience
(03:55):
from the buzz state side over the past few months. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (03:58):
No, I mean it was an interesting sort of distribution
roll out in the UK because obviously there was it's
it's listed as a twenty four I think in Park
Circus on the Film Distributors Association website, but you know
it's a division of Sony as well. But for me
it was yeah, I saw, I believed because it was
(04:20):
sometimes in London had a screening of it, and then
I think I thought it was going to be this.
I actually originally thought it was the untitled Altitude Horror
release towards the end of July, but then it was
like yeah, then you know, there was sort of no
chatter about it. It seemed to have disappeared, and like
you said, the director was sort of being, you know,
(04:41):
we really want audiences to see it, you know, do
what you need to do. And then obviously, like the
the usual suspects for a film like this kind of
stepped up and there was bookings made in for sort
of Prince Charles and the Glasgow Film Theater up in Scotland,
and I was wondering if they were basically said, I
was just going straight to like a twenty four in
America or something and going, you know what, we think
(05:03):
we can do well with this, and it was going
to get like a very small release. And then yeah,
literally probably about two weeks ago, Yeah, it seemed to
be actually getting booked in quite a few number of
cinemas that you wanted to count a program against the
juggernaut that was Depomoverine And so, yeah, it has skewed
more towards you sort of independence and sort of art
(05:25):
house cinemas and stuff like that. But it's great that
they're taking a shot on something like this and clearly
you know, their marketing in the marketing of Park Circus,
and that has has hit home to where it needed
to be and yeah, audiences are turning out for it.
Speaker 2 (05:38):
So for those not familiar with the film or havn't
had a chance to see it, Yeah, This is the
second entry in Jane Schoeneberg's Green trilogy, so following We're
All Going to the World's Fair, which came out in
twenty twenty one, and there's the going to be upcoming
public access Afterworlds. This one is set in the nineteen
nineties and Owen navigates a troubled adolescence in high school,
(06:02):
grappling with uncertainties about his identity and sexuality, admits the
quite a strained relationship with his mother and stepfather, and
his life takes a kind of transformative turn when he
meets Maddie, burning by her struggles and her own queerness,
a term really not that common at the time for
young people. So Maddy introduces Owen to a cult TV
(06:23):
show called The Pink Opaic, a supernatural drama featuring two girls,
Isabelle and Tara, whose intense, ambiguous relationship fascinates and captivates
them both and their shared obsession with the show and
each other in a platonic sense, Owen and Maddie finds
solace and escape in the series, viewing it as more
real and meaningful than their mundane existence in New Jersey.
(06:46):
So Maddie suddenly disappears and is presumed dead for a decade,
leaving Owen to grapple with the passage of time and
his deepening depression. And when Maddy resurfaces, Owen, now older
and more disillusioned, is haunted by questions about her whereabouts
and the harsh realities of adulthood that have caught up
with him unexpectedly. So, Dallas, this is a film that
(07:08):
I'm not sure how much you knew going into the film,
but for me, i'd managed to avoid the trailers, probably
based on the quick turnaround time. I don't think there
was any that ever made it into UK cinemas. But
this much I knew was the real good buzz that
came out of Sundance for it, that this was going
to be a film that would explore trans and queer feelings,
(07:29):
there would also be a little bit of Buffy the
Vampire Slayer involved, and that it was going to be
very very purple. What did you know about the film
going in?
Speaker 1 (07:39):
I knew the sort of the basic premise I'd seen
hadn't read any of the reviews because I like to,
you know, like you try to keep my powder dryes
as much as possible. But I knew the vague concept,
and I think I had eventually seen the trailer for it,
and yet to me, it looked like a film which
(07:59):
was right up my street. I love the visual aesthetic
of it. I like the sort of throwback to these
nineties sort of shows. There was this mysterious element about
what's real what's not is are you getting lost within
the TV show? Are they within a TV show? All
that sort of stuff kind of really sort of appealed
(08:21):
to me. So I was very very excited to see
this one.
Speaker 2 (08:25):
Yeah, I was also kind of looking forward to it
as well, and there was so much that I didn't
kind of expect, but we'll kind of talk about that
a little bit later on. But the one thing I
did know really was kind of this trans queer perspective.
You know, obviously there's a film that comes from a
trans director, a queer actress and actor as well, so
(08:46):
you know, real representation on the on and behind the
screen and so on. And it was interesting how it
spoke to kind of that trans experience and sort of
kind of through a slightly horror lens and so on,
And I won't even pretend to truly understand all of
the kind of deep meaning and layer to all of
the film and so on through that kind of lens,
(09:08):
but it was certainly something I could appreciate and tried
my best to understand. And you know, I suppose this
film worked for me on quite a level because the
world of work I work in is working with a
lot of neurodivergent individuals, and I think that is incredibly
well represented on the screen with what's clearly an autistic
character in the form of Owen. But it's one of
(09:30):
those ones where the statistics and information and it's unfortunately
been weaponized by some very toxic individuals that more autistic
people than not are more likely to be trans or queer,
non binary, etc. So it's something that really speaks to
kind of the co occurring conditions and kind of life
(09:53):
for autistic individuals, which I thought came across really really well.
But for you, Dallas, how did the kind of the
trans experience come across to you? Because I know for
kind of the director, that was something that she started
kind of writing this film during sort of her transition.
(10:14):
How did you sort of feel that kind of theme
and kind of allegory presented itself in the film.
Speaker 1 (10:21):
So yeah, so well, I'll say, you know, straight white male,
I'm not able to identify with the trans experience or
the quick experience. What I was I did be able
to identify with the film was that sort of feeling
of just not quite fitting in at school. You know,
I was quite a shy kid, a quiet kid. I
had a small group of friends, but I wasn't like
(10:43):
the loud, brash personality. I was quite a bit of
a wallflower, quite self contained. But one way that I
was able to express myself is that I was able
to find and identify with characters in TV shows. And
you know, the chart of won himself say, you know,
he's actually asked at one point, you know, she Maddie
sort of says, you know, I like girls. You know,
(11:05):
do you like girls? Do you like boys? And you
just reprise I like TV shows. And you know, for
a lot of people at school, when you're trying to
find your way, you find your place and wherever you
sometimes are able to see yourself represented in a TV
show and that can become your obsession your personality in
(11:25):
some ways. I think for the first time they meet
in the show is she's actually reading like a book,
which is just one of the episode of guides to
the show. And I know that, Yeah, there was a
big sort of trend during the late nineties for you know,
books exactly like that for Phil, for shows like Buffy,
(11:45):
X Files and stuff like that as well. So what
I was able to do is yet, well I couldn't
identify completely. I was able to sort of see myself
and reflected in that sort of aspect of it. And Yeah,
what I really appreciated about it film was, you know,
I think it's got a beautiful aesthetic to you know,
the sort of pink and purple glows to the they
(12:08):
are coming off either off the sort of TV screen
or just in the sort of sunsets and stuff like that.
But also the sort of authenticity of these TV shows
that the TV show within the film where You've got
you know, it looks like it's been you know, because
it revects actually what Maddy does for Ohen, which is
basically tape it off the TV. So it has that
(12:30):
really sort of grubby, authentic look to it. And I
really sort of like that and apparently uses the same
title font as the original series of Buffy the Vampire
Slayer as well. So there was a lot of stuff
like that which I really appreciated.
Speaker 2 (12:45):
Yeah, as someone that was a huge Buffy fan in
the nineties and into the early two thousands, the font
was not missed on on myself, and as someone that
also had like a Buffy episode guide and probably the
X Files one and a Star Trek one, I could
really kind of relate to that aspect of it, just
like even kind of the terminology that you know, it's
(13:08):
a bit more kind of mainstream these you know, past
few decades with things like kind of the Avengers, Like
there was that, like everyone was talking about the Big
Bad and the theme for the season and these you know,
villains and characters that were essentially kind of metaphors for
growing up or the issues that many people faced. And
you know, I look back and think of Buffy as
(13:29):
an incredibly progressive show. I haven't really rewatched it and
in those years, but I think it was one of
those ones where I think if you were a Buffy
fan and there was that moment where he, you know,
Owen goes to visit the mother of the kid that
he was pretending to go see, and like, Amber Benson
turns up and you're like, that's terrifrom Buffy. Like I remember, actually,
(13:53):
and this one will be appreciated by you. I remembered
queuing up for about three or four hours Amber Benson visited,
and it was very rare that you would get, you know,
TV stars and such like visiting kind of Aberdeen. And
I remember she was visiting the Forbidden Planet at this
comic book store and I queued up for about four
hours just to meet Amber Benson and so on, so
(14:14):
as I could very much relate to that aspect of it.
But you know, it was certainly something that wasn't kind
of lost on me that this was something, you know,
truly profound, and there's so many layers that I just
I'm sure that clicks with with a lot of people
that you know, I know that kind of the director
they've spoken about sort of like it being a kind
(14:34):
of egg crack, you know, that a moment where sort
of a trans person realizes that their identity doesn't match.
And I just thought it was it was so beautiful
and I'm glad this film is resonating with an audience
that is criminally underserved but overserved by a lot of
hatred in the media and politics. You only have to
look at kind of the you know, what's coming out
about puberty blockers here in the UK, and just it
(14:59):
felt like during the recent election and so many elections
where there was a great kind of public study carried
out that trans issues was like one percent of kind
of people's ish worry and concern and so on. Yet
some journalists and kind of the media and politicians made
out to be one of these huge existential crisises to
(15:19):
our country and so on, when at the end of
the day, there is a lot of people that just
need a lot of love and a lot of support,
And I'm glad that there's films out there that are
trying to serve that, because boy, are people not being
served by by so much other forms of media.
Speaker 1 (15:33):
Yeah, I mean it really sort of speaks to its audience,
sort of cuts through and does that. And yet I
got the I also managed to recognize Ambrabinson within it,
and I think, yeah, for a lot of people, that
sort of moment in Buffy was probably quite you know,
a game changer for you know, what would have been,
(15:54):
you know, a mainstream US show to have you know,
the character Willow who had you know, dated men and
stuff like that, to come out as bisexual lesbian in
the show and stuff like that. You know, for me,
I still remember, as you know, technically a child of
the eighties, you know, the first sort of big lesbian
on screen kiss in the UK actually came in Brookside
(16:16):
with when are we.
Speaker 2 (16:17):
Going to get a TV glow version of Brookside? There's
something that's used to the UK experience.
Speaker 1 (16:23):
Exactly so, but it was it was interesting to see that,
you know, she the director was using sort of people
from you know, the shows that you know, they've grown
up with and we've grown up with in order to
sort of read a bit about how they wanted to
use them in a way that feels familiar but not
familiar sort of and so almost unsettling in the way
(16:45):
that they use the characters. And for me it was
I actually didn't realize until the end credits came up
that the father of one was played by Fred Durst
from Biscuit. I was like wait what. I was like what,
because I was just like, I mean, you know, it's
it's just I mean, it's it's it's a great performance.
It's a small performance, but you know, it's got quite
(17:06):
a menacing presence. But I just I just didn't put
it together. It's probably because he wasn't wearing his traditional
backwards cape.
Speaker 2 (17:13):
He wasn't trying to break stuff or anything like that.
I couldn't believe that. Like I went home, and it
was like a few hours later, when I was just
sort of reading up on the film, I was like,
that was fred Durst. And I'm sure someone had said
something about fred Durst months ago, but I've tried to
push as much out of this, much of this discussion
about the film out until i'd seen it. But I
couldn't really believe that that was a huge surprise. It
(17:35):
maybe says something to me that I recognized Amber Benson,
but that I could recognize Fred Durst another. Yeah, So
it's one of those things. I mentioned it as well,
that it doesn't necessarily just speak to sort of this
this trance and queer experience, but kind of the for
many the co occurring sort of of of autism. And
(17:57):
I thought that was a really fantastic kind of portrayal
as as well, that you know, as I mentioned my
line of work is working, you know, and I have
done so for for over a decade. And you know,
still when you kind of hear people like a lot
of the imagery that they draw when they think about
autism representation is rain Man when you actually think something
(18:18):
like this is much more kind of pully truer to life.
You know, you have that kind of special interest that
the Pinko Pate kind of serves and so on. And
you know, I've seen it over the years that that
kind of strong interest, whether it's a local football team
or you know, a TV show, that special interest brings
a lot of joy and a true sense of identity.
(18:39):
And you know, there's the societal norms that we kind
of see that you know Owen struggles with as well.
And you know that intersectionality, as I mentioned, the crossover
is so huge between kind of autism, queerness trans I
thought that was an incredible bit of representation as well.
But for me, one of the more most powerful kind
(19:00):
of moments was that kind of ending scene where kind
of Owen experiences this real sensory overload and you know,
the extreme stress and just you know, having to really
mask for for so long who they truly are. And
I felt, you know, a real sadness for Owen and
those kind of final few moments and you know, being
(19:21):
able to kind of cut himself open and see you know,
his true passion that he's been kind of bearing underneath.
I thought it was it didn't have to be. It
wasn't as perhaps you know, and I don't mean this
in a negative ways, as subtle, perhaps as kind of
the transrepresentation was, but it was completely respectful. It was
(19:42):
spot on, and you know it's it's things like this
aren't Nestlily meant to be as subtle. It's you know,
this there on the screen. It's not like a gotcha moment.
And I thought that was great and just that climax,
I think we'll stick with me for a long time.
And just the sadness I felt for one of that moment,
you know, this old lonely you know, even though he
(20:02):
has a family and so on. Just you know, just
I've sometimes wondered, and you know, part of my job
is helping autistic individuals into two roles that match their
skills and experiences. And you know, there's so many people,
autistic people that are not in work or roles that
(20:23):
match their experiences and passions. And you know, I work
with someone that works in really high end kind of
not necessarily finance, but tech finance and so on. And
he once described himself for a long periods of time
before he came to work with us, as being someone
that was like the most you know, technically experienced pizza
delivery boy. And you know, I felt really sorry for
(20:45):
him at that moment, just to have lived a life
and a job that was probably so unfulfilling and quite
you know, difficult, and just that moment of just breakdown
was just I thought was really powerful.
Speaker 1 (20:57):
Yeah, and it's I mean, for I think of what
you're sort of saying there sort of makes me think that,
you know, he's you know, he's clearly sort of very smart,
intelligent person, but he's just in these dead end jobs.
You know, he works in the movie theater. Then he's
working in this sort of very like you say, the
sensory overload of this fun center, even though it doesn't
(21:18):
look fun at all, to be honest, but it's he's
it feels like he's sort of taking these jobs because
you know, he's clearly still not accepted his true self
in some ways, he's almost he's also hidden from the world,
and these jobs allow him to hide while he still
struggles to come to terms with his true self. He
(21:40):
can't you know, find a job or something that he
truly loves, because the only thing that he's really truly loved,
probably in this whole world, is a the pinkle Peke
and Be the character of madded there is that it's
a platonic relationship, but you know, there's clearly a fondness
and a bond between the two of them. One thing
that I found interesting, so just thinking about it now,
(22:02):
is the decision to make this film. You know, it's
set it in the nineties because you know, you've got
these two characters who are obsessed with this particular show,
but at a time when you know, the Internet was
not really a thing. You know, there was only these books,
(22:23):
and you would basically have to have, you know, actual
conversations with people about it, whereas you know there would
be you know, if it was set these days, there
would be people going on to Reddit threads and fore
rooms and stuff like that to discuss all the different
theories and sort of the hidden messages and stuff like
that about what the pink or pick was what it meant,
(22:44):
what was this character meaning? What was all that? So
it was interesting to go back to that sort of
almost analog time where if you wanted to enjoy a show,
it was, you know, rewatching it on video because you know,
it wasn't on streaming. You know, the only time to
watch it was basically taping it off the TV and
then rewatching it to your content or buying a very
(23:04):
very expensive VHS box set with about ten ten vhs,
isn't it?
Speaker 2 (23:09):
Yeah? Do you know how I use as someone that
bought the buffet box sets and DVDs back in the day,
you could buy like a box set of half a
season on VHS for about kind of I think it
was about thirty quid and so on. And then like
I remember, the DVDs came out in that initial stage
where like Fox DVDs came out where it's kind of
like I think they were like seventy odd five pounds
and so on. And I always think when you go
(23:31):
into these kind of secondhand DVD shops these days and
you see it for like five pounds, far from it
and so on, you know, you change days exactly. It's
just blows your mind you think, how much money did
I spend on on these kind of box sets.
Speaker 1 (23:46):
It's just it's crazy, and there's that sort of almost
other sort of sad moment. But it also sort of
sort of feeds into the aspect of this sort of
central mystery of you know, is the show real? Are
they within a show? And whatever? Of where he's older
and he's like lying on the tee on the sofa
(24:08):
late one night and discovers that the entire four season
five seasons of The Pinkle Pike is on a streaming
service and he starts to rewatch it and it's not
exactly how he remembers that it's much more cheesy and
stuff like that. And I mean, it is always a risk,
isn't it when you have a TV show or something
that you've loved so much and you've maybe had some
(24:28):
distance from it for a while, and that temptation to
go back, and then they worry that if you do,
it might not be as good as you remember. I know,
there's currently a TV show that I used to watch
as a kid, which was completely bizarre. Actually this film
actually kind of reminded me of it, and I started
to do some research and it turns out the entire
thing is on Amazon Prime and I could rewatch it
(24:50):
if I wanted, but I'm kind of slightly nervous. And
that was an Australian kids show called Render Twist. I
don't know if you ever encountered it.
Speaker 2 (24:59):
I remember the name, but never watched it.
Speaker 1 (25:01):
It was so weird. It was like it was all
these strange goings on about what happened to this family
who lived in an Australian lighthouse. And there was like
one episode where a and this was apparently on you know,
National TV in Australia and the UK, about how the
young child got a fish that swam up his penis
(25:25):
and it was a propeller fish and it allowed him
to win swimming races because it would basically shoot him
along like a jet underwater. And the dad even himself
saw the kid in the bath and went, oh, Johnny,
you've got a Wally Willy. And it's like reading that
description now, I'm like, how on earth did aid did
this show get made? And b did nobody complain about
(25:46):
it at the time. You could just imagine people losing
their minds. The woke crowd would not like this in
the future, just now I believe.
Speaker 2 (25:57):
Yeah, it's fascinating when you think. I like, recently, my
partners just started watching some random episodes of season one
of Buffy, and I always felt like the first season
of Buffy it was just it was never great, and
I think I recognized that at the time, and it
was interesting. I did think it was somewhat interesting that
they made the choice to go with with Buffy. And
you know, it does speak to a lot of these
things where it's like the art from the artists. You know,
(26:19):
Joss Whedon has had quite the fall from from Grace
and so on with the local kind of me too
movement and then just sort of revelations about his behavior
towards the cast as well. But you know, it's one
of those ones. There is always those things to say
that regardless of sometimes the maker these things, you can't
necessarily just completely throw something out. You know, the influence
(26:41):
these things can have on people, and it's not just
you know, creative inspiration, but you know, being true to themselves.
And you know, Buffy is certainly dated and has its issues,
but you know, you can't deny its influence it had
on a lot of young people as well, and helping
them find their way in the world.
Speaker 1 (26:58):
And I talking about that, I think that can probably
be used as well on another fantasy franchise that is
incredibly popular and change a lot of people's lives, only
to discover that the creator of it has some rather
extreme views, and that one obviously being Harry Potter and
the author JK. Rowling, who has some very strong opinions,
(27:19):
particularly in the on the trans community. Let's just say,
and how you it's that whole sort of art for artist,
isn't it. It's how do you justify? I mean, there's
a lot of people who have boycotted I guess Buffy
and Harry Potter and stuff following you know, the allegations
and views of the creators. But you know it's you know,
(27:40):
in doing so, they cut a huge part of their
life and you know what was a formative part of
their identity as well, and it's a shame that they
have to do that. But it's how do you, I guess,
how do you balance the two things, isn't it? And
that's I guess what happens with the characters in the
show about you know, Owen tries to distance himself from
(28:02):
Maddie and her more extreme views on the show and
how she believes that you know, they are actually characters
within the show and stuff like that. And it's something
that he, you know, finds appealing because you know, who
would want to get lost in the favorite TV show?
But at the same time he finds himself pulling back
from what it means. And it's again that sort of
internal struggle that he's going through about identifying the real
(28:26):
version of him and making that leap, I guess, isn't it.
Speaker 2 (28:30):
Yeah, And I've always hated jk Rowling and you know,
Harry Potter, and you know, it's quite interesting. I work,
as I mentioned, I work with some trans people, and
you know, the fear that people like jk Rowling put
in that, the influence that she exerts over kind of
policy on trans and just the hatred that she whips
(28:53):
up towards the thinnest slice of people. It's just it's
just really sad. And you know, you I was saying
it to someone the other day when I was I
was recommending this film of like, you know, it's not
necessarily just trans people that you hope or you know,
people that will naturally go along and see a film
like this. But there's people that would completely degrade trans
(29:13):
people that would really benefit from seeing this film, but
it's probably unlikely realistically that they're going to do that,
you know. I think someone like jak Relling. I think
there's been some great articles from trans people that have
been like had that relationship where they're like, oh, you know,
this was something that meant a lot to me, and
now the creator is this absolute piece of shit that
(29:35):
wants me, you know, dead and you know, have my
right strip away from me and you know, say what
you want about kind of of buffet. There's certainly lots
of problematic issues with the creator of that, but it's
something that he certainly never punched down on trans people,
and I think that hopefully keeps that a somewhat safe
space for them where there's just so much that is
(29:58):
again going against them. But it it's interesting to see
and you know that, you know, Buffy continuing to live
on after after all these years, and I was certainly
watching it going I want to see a special feature
when it comes out on Bulle ray or whatever of
like the pink O Peic episodes and so on. I'd
probably give it a watch. And I think when you
watch when Owen watched one of the episodes when he
(30:20):
was much older and so on, and it's mister Sprinkle
or whatever, and it was like, oh, you know, I'm
just really sad. I like to give people ice cream
and so on, and and just that line delivery of like,
well maybe perhaps in the summer, oh sorry, in the winter,
you could make serve people ice soup. And I just
thought that was like one of the best lines of
(30:41):
the year where you're like, this film was taking a
complete turn, and why that is one of the funniest lines.
Like I would see Deadpool about like two hours later,
and that was a bigger belly laugh for me for
that line than anything I saw on Deadpool.
Speaker 1 (30:54):
Yeah, the soup moment got a huge responsor in my
crowd as well. It's just interesting that, you know, apparently
in America that particular kid thought, what's the diametric opposite
of ice cream? Oh, I know, it must be soup.
And I'm like, okay, yeah, sure, yeah, yeah, ice cream
(31:15):
to soup. Yeah I get it. No I don't, but yeah,
it worked in the moment absolutely.
Speaker 2 (31:21):
So any final thoughts on I saw the TV glow.
Speaker 1 (31:26):
I mean, it's a film ultimately that I think I
liked and admired more than I loved. But part of
that was maybe due to I mean, I guess, you know,
it's not a film particularly for me, but in some
ways it was. Some ways it's not, but there was
a slight disconnect from me. I could appreciate it, but
(31:50):
I didn't. I wasn't completely in love with it. Part
of that was potentially because I think in my head
I had a slightly different movie in mind. I think
I a more I guess going down the rabbit hole
of what's real what's not, almost like a sort of
matrix style sort of thing of you know, is the
(32:11):
TV show. I thought there was going to be a
bit more explanit not maybe I maybe didn't need explicit
answers on it, but I thought there was going to
be a bit more of like an investigative search into
what where Maddie had gone, Whereas it just kind of
did that automatic leap forward ten years and then she
was back to sort of discuss it. So it wasn't
quite maybe where I thought it was going to go.
(32:32):
But I think it's a film which if I rewatched
I'd be able to appreciate it. And love it even more.
And like you say, I think there's a lot more
stuff which, you know, if there was a blu ray
of it that had the extended extras of all the
different clips and TV shows and audio commentries and stuff
like that, I think it's something that could really have
a really nice package together. But yeah, I think the director,
(32:57):
Jashon Malam's got a huge future ahead. I think it
was stylistically a beautiful film to look at. You know,
I hits using phrases like lynching, but very lynching at times.
The sort of the band performance in the weird bar
before she starts sort of taking them on this journey
(33:17):
where she's been, and stuff like that that felt very
sort of black logy lynching sort of stuff. So yeah,
not a film which I appreciated and liked but maybe
didn't quite love. But yeah, that's what I'm sort of
standing on it at the moment.
Speaker 2 (33:30):
Well, I'm looking forward to to when it comes out
because in America it's been on digital for for a
little while now and it comes with twelve deleted scenes,
so I'm very cuse to know what those twelve are.
That's quite a high number as well, so I'm very
curious to see what got caught. But for me was
slightly only the opposite, because I had no real expectations
(33:51):
of what the film was going to be outside of
this kind of allegory and sort of like Buffy connection.
I loved just watching it going, I don't really know
where this is going at all, and so on, and
even kind of Maddie's disappearance, so it was like a
surprise and where's this kind of going to go? But
for me, it was something that again, it kind of
(34:12):
it tickled that professional part of me that works in
this world as well, and there was so much that
I could see on it and draw from it and
recognize in my you know, professional life as well. And
I think it was you know, something like that did
a lot of a lot of tickling for me. But
I'm very again keen to see this one quite quite
(34:33):
soon again, and I'm very glad I got the chance
to see this in the cinema because it just it
looked beautiful. You go from watching a film like this
to then you know, something like a dead poone Wolverine
that just looked like it had some of the most
lazy cinematography that you know, there's a huge section of
this film set and a void and literally it was
just a void of creativit creativity in front of the camera.
(34:54):
You think of a film like this, which is I
think this in Red Rocket were a couple of them
where it was like, you know, this movie, this film
had the budget of zero point zero three three percent
of X film and so on, and you know, TV
Globe just just beautiful. I'm glad this was a counter
programming release this week, and yeah, made for a good,
(35:14):
good part to a double bill.
Speaker 1 (35:16):
Absolutely, yeah, I think it's it's one which is gonna
find I think it's beyond like that, you know, the
you know the good opening weekend in the UK and stuff.
This is one which is actually going to find its
audience much later on in life, Like you're going to
stumble across it on TV later one night and go,
oh what's this and there's gonna be then you're going
(35:38):
to find the Reddit threads and stuff like that of
the obsessive fans who sort of pour over it everything,
just like you know Owen and Maddie do for the
pink O Pick. This is going to hit hard with
the right audience, and I think it's gonna they're going
to take it as their own and and make it
something into into like a culture online and make it
really special.
Speaker 2 (35:57):
I think so well. I can assume that probably, you know,
we've got busy few weeks coming up ourselves, so I
can imagine maybe the next film we're going to be
reviewing is Sing Sing, perhaps towards the end of the
month beginning of September, but you will. Obviously, we have
a couple of interviews coming up. We have another Maxine
interview coming next week and hopefully all going well. We're
(36:19):
getting one recorded this week with one of the stars
of Yeah I Saw the TV Glow, so really looking
forward to hearing their their experiences on the film. All
going well, so lots to look forward to in the
coming week, So thanks to everyone for listening.
Welcome to the Nerd Party.
Speaker 2 (00:12):
Hello, and welcome to the A twenty four project. Here
in the Nerd Party Network, my name is Lee Hudgson
and Dallas King and I make our way through the
A twenty four filmography and along the way bring you
interviews with the talent involved in front of and behind
the camera, and in this episode, a couple of nineties
kids finally get the opportunity to review. I saw the
TV Glow, which finally landed in some UK cinemas this
(00:33):
weekend as the counterprogramming release to Deadpool and Wolverine. So
I just saw it just before we started recording today.
The kind of box office was coming out for the
film and it had one of the best performing performances
at the UK and Ireland box office this weekend, where
it took one three hundred and fourteen pounds per cinema screen. So, Dallas,
(00:57):
you are someone that knows the nuts and bolts of
profit and such like its cinemas. That seems like a
really good number all things considered. Yep.
Speaker 1 (01:07):
And I mean I might argue with you maybe on
the on the nineties kid, I think probably technically more
of an eighties kid, But I did enjoy a lot
of TV during the nineties as well, so I'll take
it I look young, but yeah, no, I mean that's
that is a very good result given just the sheer
number of screens that went to Depot and Wolverine this weekend.
(01:29):
I mean, I saw this film at the Garden Cinema
in London. I think it was about three forty on
a Friday afternoon, and I would say that it was
probably had about I'd say probably around about forty people.
For a film like this, which is, you know, quite small,
the marketing budget would have been quite small as well,
(01:51):
so to get that sort of breakthrough, to get that
type of audience on an afternoon, and especially it was
skewed aitally, quite older of an audience for me, So
maybe it was people sort of reflecting back on their
time when they were obsessed with TV shows in the nineties.
But obviously, you know the way that it's it's trailer
(02:12):
and you know the storyline, it does potentially appeal to
a younger audience, so it's clearly broken through to all
sort of demographics here, so interested to see how this
one plays out. I mean, what about yourself, what was
your screening like?
Speaker 2 (02:26):
Yeah, I went to on a Sunnay afternoon, three point
fifteen in the afternoon, and I booked my ticket a
little bit earlier in the week and there wasn't much
seats had been really booked by that point, and then
I was like turning up not expecting too many people there,
and it had a really quite busy crowd. I think
probably about one hundred odd people for there was only
(02:48):
two screenings a day in Edinburgh at this one cinema alone,
thanks to the Cameo Cinema for actually putting this one on.
And yeah, there was a real big crowd, but I
would say most of the Mine skewed slightly younger. It
seemed like a very progressive queer crowd that turned up
for Mine, So probably the crowd that the story is
(03:11):
mostly aimed towards really turned up for Mine. So I
was really really pleased to see such a big crowd
relatively speaking for this type of film. And you had
a bit of a smile on my face that for
a film that I think a couple of weeks ago
there was talk of it going to be It's gonna
be out mid July and UK cinemas. Then it came
out that actually it's not actually showing in UK cinemas,
(03:32):
and you know, the director whipping up a bit of
a campaign of anyone, can you know, can someone reach
out put this on? And then obviously Sony stepped up
in what was no time at all to put this
in cinemas. When you think back to the long wait
we had for eighth Grade and Sony releasing it about
a year later, I was really surprised at the quick
turnaround from this and that It's cleary found an audience
(03:55):
from the buzz state side over the past few months. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (03:58):
No, I mean it was an interesting sort of distribution
roll out in the UK because obviously there was it's
it's listed as a twenty four I think in Park
Circus on the Film Distributors Association website, but you know
it's a division of Sony as well. But for me
it was yeah, I saw, I believed because it was
(04:20):
sometimes in London had a screening of it, and then
I think I thought it was going to be this.
I actually originally thought it was the untitled Altitude Horror
release towards the end of July, but then it was
like yeah, then you know, there was sort of no
chatter about it. It seemed to have disappeared, and like
you said, the director was sort of being, you know,
(04:41):
we really want audiences to see it, you know, do
what you need to do. And then obviously, like the
the usual suspects for a film like this kind of
stepped up and there was bookings made in for sort
of Prince Charles and the Glasgow Film Theater up in Scotland,
and I was wondering if they were basically said, I
was just going straight to like a twenty four in
America or something and going, you know what, we think
(05:03):
we can do well with this, and it was going
to get like a very small release. And then yeah,
literally probably about two weeks ago, Yeah, it seemed to
be actually getting booked in quite a few number of
cinemas that you wanted to count a program against the
juggernaut that was Depomoverine And so, yeah, it has skewed
more towards you sort of independence and sort of art
(05:25):
house cinemas and stuff like that. But it's great that
they're taking a shot on something like this and clearly
you know, their marketing in the marketing of Park Circus,
and that has has hit home to where it needed
to be and yeah, audiences are turning out for it.
Speaker 2 (05:38):
So for those not familiar with the film or havn't
had a chance to see it, Yeah, This is the
second entry in Jane Schoeneberg's Green trilogy, so following We're
All Going to the World's Fair, which came out in
twenty twenty one, and there's the going to be upcoming
public access Afterworlds. This one is set in the nineteen
nineties and Owen navigates a troubled adolescence in high school,
(06:02):
grappling with uncertainties about his identity and sexuality, admits the
quite a strained relationship with his mother and stepfather, and
his life takes a kind of transformative turn when he
meets Maddie, burning by her struggles and her own queerness,
a term really not that common at the time for
young people. So Maddy introduces Owen to a cult TV
(06:23):
show called The Pink Opaic, a supernatural drama featuring two girls,
Isabelle and Tara, whose intense, ambiguous relationship fascinates and captivates
them both and their shared obsession with the show and
each other in a platonic sense, Owen and Maddie finds
solace and escape in the series, viewing it as more
real and meaningful than their mundane existence in New Jersey.
(06:46):
So Maddie suddenly disappears and is presumed dead for a decade,
leaving Owen to grapple with the passage of time and
his deepening depression. And when Maddy resurfaces, Owen, now older
and more disillusioned, is haunted by questions about her whereabouts
and the harsh realities of adulthood that have caught up
with him unexpectedly. So, Dallas, this is a film that
(07:08):
I'm not sure how much you knew going into the film,
but for me, i'd managed to avoid the trailers, probably
based on the quick turnaround time. I don't think there
was any that ever made it into UK cinemas. But
this much I knew was the real good buzz that
came out of Sundance for it, that this was going
to be a film that would explore trans and queer feelings,
(07:29):
there would also be a little bit of Buffy the
Vampire Slayer involved, and that it was going to be
very very purple. What did you know about the film
going in?
Speaker 1 (07:39):
I knew the sort of the basic premise I'd seen
hadn't read any of the reviews because I like to,
you know, like you try to keep my powder dryes
as much as possible. But I knew the vague concept,
and I think I had eventually seen the trailer for it,
and yet to me, it looked like a film which
(07:59):
was right up my street. I love the visual aesthetic
of it. I like the sort of throwback to these
nineties sort of shows. There was this mysterious element about
what's real what's not is are you getting lost within
the TV show? Are they within a TV show? All
that sort of stuff kind of really sort of appealed
(08:21):
to me. So I was very very excited to see
this one.
Speaker 2 (08:25):
Yeah, I was also kind of looking forward to it
as well, and there was so much that I didn't
kind of expect, but we'll kind of talk about that
a little bit later on. But the one thing I
did know really was kind of this trans queer perspective.
You know, obviously there's a film that comes from a
trans director, a queer actress and actor as well, so
(08:46):
you know, real representation on the on and behind the
screen and so on. And it was interesting how it
spoke to kind of that trans experience and sort of
kind of through a slightly horror lens and so on,
And I won't even pretend to truly understand all of
the kind of deep meaning and layer to all of
the film and so on through that kind of lens,
(09:08):
but it was certainly something I could appreciate and tried
my best to understand. And you know, I suppose this
film worked for me on quite a level because the
world of work I work in is working with a
lot of neurodivergent individuals, and I think that is incredibly
well represented on the screen with what's clearly an autistic
character in the form of Owen. But it's one of
(09:30):
those ones where the statistics and information and it's unfortunately
been weaponized by some very toxic individuals that more autistic
people than not are more likely to be trans or queer,
non binary, etc. So it's something that really speaks to
kind of the co occurring conditions and kind of life
(09:53):
for autistic individuals, which I thought came across really really well.
But for you, Dallas, how did the kind of the
trans experience come across to you? Because I know for
kind of the director, that was something that she started
kind of writing this film during sort of her transition.
(10:14):
How did you sort of feel that kind of theme
and kind of allegory presented itself in the film.
Speaker 1 (10:21):
So yeah, so well, I'll say, you know, straight white male,
I'm not able to identify with the trans experience or
the quick experience. What I was I did be able
to identify with the film was that sort of feeling
of just not quite fitting in at school. You know,
I was quite a shy kid, a quiet kid. I
had a small group of friends, but I wasn't like
(10:43):
the loud, brash personality. I was quite a bit of
a wallflower, quite self contained. But one way that I
was able to express myself is that I was able
to find and identify with characters in TV shows. And
you know, the chart of won himself say, you know,
he's actually asked at one point, you know, she Maddie
sort of says, you know, I like girls. You know,
(11:05):
do you like girls? Do you like boys? And you
just reprise I like TV shows. And you know, for
a lot of people at school, when you're trying to
find your way, you find your place and wherever you
sometimes are able to see yourself represented in a TV
show and that can become your obsession your personality in
(11:25):
some ways. I think for the first time they meet
in the show is she's actually reading like a book,
which is just one of the episode of guides to
the show. And I know that, Yeah, there was a
big sort of trend during the late nineties for you know,
books exactly like that for Phil, for shows like Buffy,
(11:45):
X Files and stuff like that as well. So what
I was able to do is yet, well I couldn't
identify completely. I was able to sort of see myself
and reflected in that sort of aspect of it. And Yeah,
what I really appreciated about it film was, you know,
I think it's got a beautiful aesthetic to you know,
the sort of pink and purple glows to the they
(12:08):
are coming off either off the sort of TV screen
or just in the sort of sunsets and stuff like that.
But also the sort of authenticity of these TV shows
that the TV show within the film where You've got
you know, it looks like it's been you know, because
it revects actually what Maddy does for Ohen, which is
basically tape it off the TV. So it has that
(12:30):
really sort of grubby, authentic look to it. And I
really sort of like that and apparently uses the same
title font as the original series of Buffy the Vampire
Slayer as well. So there was a lot of stuff
like that which I really appreciated.
Speaker 2 (12:45):
Yeah, as someone that was a huge Buffy fan in
the nineties and into the early two thousands, the font
was not missed on on myself, and as someone that
also had like a Buffy episode guide and probably the
X Files one and a Star Trek one, I could
really kind of relate to that aspect of it, just
like even kind of the terminology that you know, it's
(13:08):
a bit more kind of mainstream these you know, past
few decades with things like kind of the Avengers, Like
there was that, like everyone was talking about the Big
Bad and the theme for the season and these you know,
villains and characters that were essentially kind of metaphors for
growing up or the issues that many people faced. And
you know, I look back and think of Buffy as
(13:29):
an incredibly progressive show. I haven't really rewatched it and
in those years, but I think it was one of
those ones where I think if you were a Buffy
fan and there was that moment where he, you know,
Owen goes to visit the mother of the kid that
he was pretending to go see, and like, Amber Benson
turns up and you're like, that's terrifrom Buffy. Like I remember, actually,
(13:53):
and this one will be appreciated by you. I remembered
queuing up for about three or four hours Amber Benson visited,
and it was very rare that you would get, you know,
TV stars and such like visiting kind of Aberdeen. And
I remember she was visiting the Forbidden Planet at this
comic book store and I queued up for about four
hours just to meet Amber Benson and so on, so
(14:14):
as I could very much relate to that aspect of it.
But you know, it was certainly something that wasn't kind
of lost on me that this was something, you know,
truly profound, and there's so many layers that I just
I'm sure that clicks with with a lot of people
that you know, I know that kind of the director
they've spoken about sort of like it being a kind
(14:34):
of egg crack, you know, that a moment where sort
of a trans person realizes that their identity doesn't match.
And I just thought it was it was so beautiful
and I'm glad this film is resonating with an audience
that is criminally underserved but overserved by a lot of
hatred in the media and politics. You only have to
look at kind of the you know, what's coming out
about puberty blockers here in the UK, and just it
(14:59):
felt like during the recent election and so many elections
where there was a great kind of public study carried
out that trans issues was like one percent of kind
of people's ish worry and concern and so on. Yet
some journalists and kind of the media and politicians made
out to be one of these huge existential crisises to
(15:19):
our country and so on, when at the end of
the day, there is a lot of people that just
need a lot of love and a lot of support,
And I'm glad that there's films out there that are
trying to serve that, because boy, are people not being
served by by so much other forms of media.
Speaker 1 (15:33):
Yeah, I mean it really sort of speaks to its audience,
sort of cuts through and does that. And yet I
got the I also managed to recognize Ambrabinson within it,
and I think, yeah, for a lot of people, that
sort of moment in Buffy was probably quite you know,
a game changer for you know, what would have been,
(15:54):
you know, a mainstream US show to have you know,
the character Willow who had you know, dated men and
stuff like that, to come out as bisexual lesbian in
the show and stuff like that. You know, for me,
I still remember, as you know, technically a child of
the eighties, you know, the first sort of big lesbian
on screen kiss in the UK actually came in Brookside
(16:16):
with when are we.
Speaker 2 (16:17):
Going to get a TV glow version of Brookside? There's
something that's used to the UK experience.
Speaker 1 (16:23):
Exactly so, but it was it was interesting to see that,
you know, she the director was using sort of people
from you know, the shows that you know, they've grown
up with and we've grown up with in order to
sort of read a bit about how they wanted to
use them in a way that feels familiar but not
familiar sort of and so almost unsettling in the way
(16:45):
that they use the characters. And for me it was
I actually didn't realize until the end credits came up
that the father of one was played by Fred Durst
from Biscuit. I was like wait what. I was like what,
because I was just like, I mean, you know, it's
it's just I mean, it's it's it's a great performance.
It's a small performance, but you know, it's got quite
(17:06):
a menacing presence. But I just I just didn't put
it together. It's probably because he wasn't wearing his traditional
backwards cape.
Speaker 2 (17:13):
He wasn't trying to break stuff or anything like that.
I couldn't believe that. Like I went home, and it
was like a few hours later, when I was just
sort of reading up on the film, I was like,
that was fred Durst. And I'm sure someone had said
something about fred Durst months ago, but I've tried to
push as much out of this, much of this discussion
about the film out until i'd seen it. But I
couldn't really believe that that was a huge surprise. It
(17:35):
maybe says something to me that I recognized Amber Benson,
but that I could recognize Fred Durst another. Yeah, So
it's one of those things. I mentioned it as well,
that it doesn't necessarily just speak to sort of this
this trance and queer experience, but kind of the for
many the co occurring sort of of of autism. And
(17:57):
I thought that was a really fantastic kind of portrayal
as as well, that you know, as I mentioned my
line of work is working, you know, and I have
done so for for over a decade. And you know,
still when you kind of hear people like a lot
of the imagery that they draw when they think about
autism representation is rain Man when you actually think something
(18:18):
like this is much more kind of pully truer to life.
You know, you have that kind of special interest that
the Pinko Pate kind of serves and so on. And
you know, I've seen it over the years that that
kind of strong interest, whether it's a local football team
or you know, a TV show, that special interest brings
a lot of joy and a true sense of identity.
(18:39):
And you know, there's the societal norms that we kind
of see that you know Owen struggles with as well.
And you know that intersectionality, as I mentioned, the crossover
is so huge between kind of autism, queerness trans I
thought that was an incredible bit of representation as well.
But for me, one of the more most powerful kind
(19:00):
of moments was that kind of ending scene where kind
of Owen experiences this real sensory overload and you know,
the extreme stress and just you know, having to really
mask for for so long who they truly are. And
I felt, you know, a real sadness for Owen and
those kind of final few moments and you know, being
(19:21):
able to kind of cut himself open and see you know,
his true passion that he's been kind of bearing underneath.
I thought it was it didn't have to be. It
wasn't as perhaps you know, and I don't mean this
in a negative ways, as subtle, perhaps as kind of
the transrepresentation was, but it was completely respectful. It was
(19:42):
spot on, and you know it's it's things like this
aren't Nestlily meant to be as subtle. It's you know,
this there on the screen. It's not like a gotcha moment.
And I thought that was great and just that climax,
I think we'll stick with me for a long time.
And just the sadness I felt for one of that moment,
you know, this old lonely you know, even though he
(20:02):
has a family and so on. Just you know, just
I've sometimes wondered, and you know, part of my job
is helping autistic individuals into two roles that match their
skills and experiences. And you know, there's so many people,
autistic people that are not in work or roles that
(20:23):
match their experiences and passions. And you know, I work
with someone that works in really high end kind of
not necessarily finance, but tech finance and so on. And
he once described himself for a long periods of time
before he came to work with us, as being someone
that was like the most you know, technically experienced pizza
delivery boy. And you know, I felt really sorry for
(20:45):
him at that moment, just to have lived a life
and a job that was probably so unfulfilling and quite
you know, difficult, and just that moment of just breakdown
was just I thought was really powerful.
Speaker 1 (20:57):
Yeah, and it's I mean, for I think of what
you're sort of saying there sort of makes me think that,
you know, he's you know, he's clearly sort of very smart,
intelligent person, but he's just in these dead end jobs.
You know, he works in the movie theater. Then he's
working in this sort of very like you say, the
sensory overload of this fun center, even though it doesn't
(21:18):
look fun at all, to be honest, but it's he's
it feels like he's sort of taking these jobs because
you know, he's clearly still not accepted his true self
in some ways, he's almost he's also hidden from the world,
and these jobs allow him to hide while he still
struggles to come to terms with his true self. He
(21:40):
can't you know, find a job or something that he
truly loves, because the only thing that he's really truly loved,
probably in this whole world, is a the pinkle Peke
and Be the character of madded there is that it's
a platonic relationship, but you know, there's clearly a fondness
and a bond between the two of them. One thing
that I found interesting, so just thinking about it now,
(22:02):
is the decision to make this film. You know, it's
set it in the nineties because you know, you've got
these two characters who are obsessed with this particular show,
but at a time when you know, the Internet was
not really a thing. You know, there was only these books,
(22:23):
and you would basically have to have, you know, actual
conversations with people about it, whereas you know there would
be you know, if it was set these days, there
would be people going on to Reddit threads and fore
rooms and stuff like that to discuss all the different
theories and sort of the hidden messages and stuff like
that about what the pink or pick was what it meant,
(22:44):
what was this character meaning? What was all that? So
it was interesting to go back to that sort of
almost analog time where if you wanted to enjoy a show,
it was, you know, rewatching it on video because you know,
it wasn't on streaming. You know, the only time to
watch it was basically taping it off the TV and
then rewatching it to your content or buying a very
(23:04):
very expensive VHS box set with about ten ten vhs,
isn't it?
Speaker 2 (23:09):
Yeah? Do you know how I use as someone that
bought the buffet box sets and DVDs back in the day,
you could buy like a box set of half a
season on VHS for about kind of I think it
was about thirty quid and so on. And then like
I remember, the DVDs came out in that initial stage
where like Fox DVDs came out where it's kind of
like I think they were like seventy odd five pounds
and so on. And I always think when you go
(23:31):
into these kind of secondhand DVD shops these days and
you see it for like five pounds, far from it
and so on, you know, you change days exactly. It's
just blows your mind you think, how much money did
I spend on on these kind of box sets.
Speaker 1 (23:46):
It's just it's crazy, and there's that sort of almost
other sort of sad moment. But it also sort of
sort of feeds into the aspect of this sort of
central mystery of you know, is the show real? Are
they within a show? And whatever? Of where he's older
and he's like lying on the tee on the sofa
(24:08):
late one night and discovers that the entire four season
five seasons of The Pinkle Pike is on a streaming
service and he starts to rewatch it and it's not
exactly how he remembers that it's much more cheesy and
stuff like that. And I mean, it is always a risk,
isn't it when you have a TV show or something
that you've loved so much and you've maybe had some
(24:28):
distance from it for a while, and that temptation to
go back, and then they worry that if you do,
it might not be as good as you remember. I know,
there's currently a TV show that I used to watch
as a kid, which was completely bizarre. Actually this film
actually kind of reminded me of it, and I started
to do some research and it turns out the entire
thing is on Amazon Prime and I could rewatch it
(24:50):
if I wanted, but I'm kind of slightly nervous. And
that was an Australian kids show called Render Twist. I
don't know if you ever encountered it.
Speaker 2 (24:59):
I remember the name, but never watched it.
Speaker 1 (25:01):
It was so weird. It was like it was all
these strange goings on about what happened to this family
who lived in an Australian lighthouse. And there was like
one episode where a and this was apparently on you know,
National TV in Australia and the UK, about how the
young child got a fish that swam up his penis
(25:25):
and it was a propeller fish and it allowed him
to win swimming races because it would basically shoot him
along like a jet underwater. And the dad even himself
saw the kid in the bath and went, oh, Johnny,
you've got a Wally Willy. And it's like reading that
description now, I'm like, how on earth did aid did
this show get made? And b did nobody complain about
(25:46):
it at the time. You could just imagine people losing
their minds. The woke crowd would not like this in
the future, just now I believe.
Speaker 2 (25:57):
Yeah, it's fascinating when you think. I like, recently, my
partners just started watching some random episodes of season one
of Buffy, and I always felt like the first season
of Buffy it was just it was never great, and
I think I recognized that at the time, and it
was interesting. I did think it was somewhat interesting that
they made the choice to go with with Buffy. And
you know, it does speak to a lot of these
things where it's like the art from the artists. You know,
(26:19):
Joss Whedon has had quite the fall from from Grace
and so on with the local kind of me too
movement and then just sort of revelations about his behavior
towards the cast as well. But you know, it's one
of those ones. There is always those things to say
that regardless of sometimes the maker these things, you can't
necessarily just completely throw something out. You know, the influence
(26:41):
these things can have on people, and it's not just
you know, creative inspiration, but you know, being true to themselves.
And you know, Buffy is certainly dated and has its issues,
but you know, you can't deny its influence it had
on a lot of young people as well, and helping
them find their way in the world.
Speaker 1 (26:58):
And I talking about that, I think that can probably
be used as well on another fantasy franchise that is
incredibly popular and change a lot of people's lives, only
to discover that the creator of it has some rather
extreme views, and that one obviously being Harry Potter and
the author JK. Rowling, who has some very strong opinions,
(27:19):
particularly in the on the trans community. Let's just say,
and how you it's that whole sort of art for artist,
isn't it. It's how do you justify? I mean, there's
a lot of people who have boycotted I guess Buffy
and Harry Potter and stuff following you know, the allegations
and views of the creators. But you know it's you know,
(27:40):
in doing so, they cut a huge part of their
life and you know what was a formative part of
their identity as well, and it's a shame that they
have to do that. But it's how do you, I guess,
how do you balance the two things, isn't it? And
that's I guess what happens with the characters in the
show about you know, Owen tries to distance himself from
(28:02):
Maddie and her more extreme views on the show and
how she believes that you know, they are actually characters
within the show and stuff like that. And it's something
that he, you know, finds appealing because you know, who
would want to get lost in the favorite TV show?
But at the same time he finds himself pulling back
from what it means. And it's again that sort of
internal struggle that he's going through about identifying the real
(28:26):
version of him and making that leap, I guess, isn't it.
Speaker 2 (28:30):
Yeah, And I've always hated jk Rowling and you know,
Harry Potter, and you know, it's quite interesting. I work,
as I mentioned, I work with some trans people, and
you know, the fear that people like jk Rowling put
in that, the influence that she exerts over kind of
policy on trans and just the hatred that she whips
(28:53):
up towards the thinnest slice of people. It's just it's
just really sad. And you know, you I was saying
it to someone the other day when I was I
was recommending this film of like, you know, it's not
necessarily just trans people that you hope or you know,
people that will naturally go along and see a film
like this. But there's people that would completely degrade trans
(29:13):
people that would really benefit from seeing this film, but
it's probably unlikely realistically that they're going to do that,
you know. I think someone like jak Relling. I think
there's been some great articles from trans people that have
been like had that relationship where they're like, oh, you know,
this was something that meant a lot to me, and
now the creator is this absolute piece of shit that
(29:35):
wants me, you know, dead and you know, have my
right strip away from me and you know, say what
you want about kind of of buffet. There's certainly lots
of problematic issues with the creator of that, but it's
something that he certainly never punched down on trans people,
and I think that hopefully keeps that a somewhat safe
space for them where there's just so much that is
(29:58):
again going against them. But it it's interesting to see
and you know that, you know, Buffy continuing to live
on after after all these years, and I was certainly
watching it going I want to see a special feature
when it comes out on Bulle ray or whatever of
like the pink O Peic episodes and so on. I'd
probably give it a watch. And I think when you
watch when Owen watched one of the episodes when he
(30:20):
was much older and so on, and it's mister Sprinkle
or whatever, and it was like, oh, you know, I'm
just really sad. I like to give people ice cream
and so on, and and just that line delivery of like,
well maybe perhaps in the summer, oh sorry, in the winter,
you could make serve people ice soup. And I just
thought that was like one of the best lines of
(30:41):
the year where you're like, this film was taking a
complete turn, and why that is one of the funniest lines.
Like I would see Deadpool about like two hours later,
and that was a bigger belly laugh for me for
that line than anything I saw on Deadpool.
Speaker 1 (30:54):
Yeah, the soup moment got a huge responsor in my
crowd as well. It's just interesting that, you know, apparently
in America that particular kid thought, what's the diametric opposite
of ice cream? Oh, I know, it must be soup.
And I'm like, okay, yeah, sure, yeah, yeah, ice cream
(31:15):
to soup. Yeah I get it. No I don't, but yeah,
it worked in the moment absolutely.
Speaker 2 (31:21):
So any final thoughts on I saw the TV glow.
Speaker 1 (31:26):
I mean, it's a film ultimately that I think I
liked and admired more than I loved. But part of
that was maybe due to I mean, I guess, you know,
it's not a film particularly for me, but in some
ways it was. Some ways it's not, but there was
a slight disconnect from me. I could appreciate it, but
(31:50):
I didn't. I wasn't completely in love with it. Part
of that was potentially because I think in my head
I had a slightly different movie in mind. I think
I a more I guess going down the rabbit hole
of what's real what's not, almost like a sort of
matrix style sort of thing of you know, is the
(32:11):
TV show. I thought there was going to be a
bit more explanit not maybe I maybe didn't need explicit
answers on it, but I thought there was going to
be a bit more of like an investigative search into
what where Maddie had gone, Whereas it just kind of
did that automatic leap forward ten years and then she
was back to sort of discuss it. So it wasn't
quite maybe where I thought it was going to go.
(32:32):
But I think it's a film which if I rewatched
I'd be able to appreciate it. And love it even more.
And like you say, I think there's a lot more
stuff which, you know, if there was a blu ray
of it that had the extended extras of all the
different clips and TV shows and audio commentries and stuff
like that, I think it's something that could really have
a really nice package together. But yeah, I think the director,
(32:57):
Jashon Malam's got a huge future ahead. I think it
was stylistically a beautiful film to look at. You know,
I hits using phrases like lynching, but very lynching at times.
The sort of the band performance in the weird bar
before she starts sort of taking them on this journey
(33:17):
where she's been, and stuff like that that felt very
sort of black logy lynching sort of stuff. So yeah,
not a film which I appreciated and liked but maybe
didn't quite love. But yeah, that's what I'm sort of
standing on it at the moment.
Speaker 2 (33:30):
Well, I'm looking forward to to when it comes out
because in America it's been on digital for for a
little while now and it comes with twelve deleted scenes,
so I'm very cuse to know what those twelve are.
That's quite a high number as well, so I'm very
curious to see what got caught. But for me was
slightly only the opposite, because I had no real expectations
(33:51):
of what the film was going to be outside of
this kind of allegory and sort of like Buffy connection.
I loved just watching it going, I don't really know
where this is going at all, and so on, and
even kind of Maddie's disappearance, so it was like a
surprise and where's this kind of going to go? But
for me, it was something that again, it kind of
(34:12):
it tickled that professional part of me that works in
this world as well, and there was so much that
I could see on it and draw from it and
recognize in my you know, professional life as well. And
I think it was you know, something like that did
a lot of a lot of tickling for me. But
I'm very again keen to see this one quite quite
(34:33):
soon again, and I'm very glad I got the chance
to see this in the cinema because it just it
looked beautiful. You go from watching a film like this
to then you know, something like a dead poone Wolverine
that just looked like it had some of the most
lazy cinematography that you know, there's a huge section of
this film set and a void and literally it was
just a void of creativit creativity in front of the camera.
(34:54):
You think of a film like this, which is I
think this in Red Rocket were a couple of them
where it was like, you know, this movie, this film
had the budget of zero point zero three three percent
of X film and so on, and you know, TV
Globe just just beautiful. I'm glad this was a counter
programming release this week, and yeah, made for a good,
(35:14):
good part to a double bill.
Speaker 1 (35:16):
Absolutely, yeah, I think it's it's one which is gonna
find I think it's beyond like that, you know, the
you know the good opening weekend in the UK and stuff.
This is one which is actually going to find its
audience much later on in life, Like you're going to
stumble across it on TV later one night and go,
oh what's this and there's gonna be then you're going
(35:38):
to find the Reddit threads and stuff like that of
the obsessive fans who sort of pour over it everything,
just like you know Owen and Maddie do for the
pink O Pick. This is going to hit hard with
the right audience, and I think it's gonna they're going
to take it as their own and and make it
something into into like a culture online and make it
really special.
Speaker 2 (35:57):
I think so well. I can assume that probably, you know,
we've got busy few weeks coming up ourselves, so I
can imagine maybe the next film we're going to be
reviewing is Sing Sing, perhaps towards the end of the
month beginning of September, but you will. Obviously, we have
a couple of interviews coming up. We have another Maxine
interview coming next week and hopefully all going well. We're
(36:19):
getting one recorded this week with one of the stars
of Yeah I Saw the TV Glow, so really looking
forward to hearing their their experiences on the film. All
going well, so lots to look forward to in the
coming week, So thanks to everyone for listening.
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