August 30, 2024 • 18 mins
To mark our landmark 200th episode, we dive into the making of 'Sing Sing' as we hear from the film's co-writer and director, Greg Kwedar.
'Sing Sing' arrives in the UK cinemas today starring Colmon Damingo as Divine G, who is imprisoned at Sing Sing and finds purpose by acting in a theatre group alongside other incarcerated men.
'Sing Sing' arrives in the UK cinemas today starring Colmon Damingo as Divine G, who is imprisoned at Sing Sing and finds purpose by acting in a theatre group alongside other incarcerated men.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:03):
Welcome to the NED Party.
Speaker 2 (00:12):
For the two hundredth time. Welcome to the A twenty
four project here in the Nerd Party Network. My name
is Lee Hutchison and Dallas King and I make our
way through the A twenty four filmography and along the
way bring you interviews with the talent involved in front
of and behind the camera. Today we dive into the
making of the critically acclaimed Sing Sing and hear from
the film's co writer and director Greg Quaidar Sing Sing
(00:34):
arrives in UK cinemas today and starts Coleman Domingo as
Divine g who's imprisoned at Sing Sing Correctional Facility and
finds purpose by acting in a theater group alongside other
incarcerated men. Thanks so much to Greg for joining us
for this landmark episode, and thank you too for joining
us for two hundred odd episodes. I hope you enjoy
the show and I look forward to talking about more
(00:55):
E twenty four films with you in the years to come.
Speaker 1 (00:59):
Here to become a human again and enjoyed the things
that is not in our reality.
Speaker 3 (01:07):
Think you guys are becoming real with each other Vard, So.
Speaker 4 (01:12):
It's kind of been learn and this has been like
a nearly a decade blow for you, Greg True, Can
you told me through the journey for the film for.
Speaker 1 (01:20):
This Yeah, I've been working on this movie for over
eight years, and.
Speaker 3 (01:26):
You know, came across the story quite unexpectedly.
Speaker 1 (01:29):
I was producing a short documentary inside of a maxim
security prison in Kansas, and of my first time ever
behind the walls, and on the tour of the facility,
we were doing a short about something else, but I
passed by a cell and there's a young man raising
a rescue dog inside of a cell, and immediately I'll
just stopped in my tracks because it completely upended all
my expectations of you know, what I've been trained to
(01:52):
believe about.
Speaker 3 (01:53):
Prison from the movies I grew up watching.
Speaker 1 (01:55):
And here in the in that cell was a picture
of humanity, of healing between this man and his animal,
and I was just desperate to know that there was
anyone else.
Speaker 3 (02:04):
Out there doing things differently. And that night in the.
Speaker 1 (02:07):
Hotel room, I discovered this theater program in New York
rehabilitation through the arts on Google and quickly just fell
in love with what they were doing, and particularly this
Esquire article from a two thousand and five production of
a time traveling musical comedy called Breaking the Bummy's Code,
(02:29):
and I just was so struck by the warmth of it,
the joy of the process, despite the environment that they
were in, this you know, two hundred year old prison, and.
Speaker 3 (02:43):
It felt like an invitation, you know. And that was
really the beginning.
Speaker 1 (02:47):
It took six years of development to finally get to
the point of production, and part of that trial of
taking that long was we had a lot of learning
to do.
Speaker 3 (03:00):
We had to The main thing we had to learn.
Speaker 1 (03:01):
Was in order to fully tell the story, it had
to mirror the community.
Speaker 3 (03:09):
That we were trying to tell a story about.
Speaker 1 (03:11):
And that was a process of opening that circle up
beyond just my creative partner Clinton and I as writers
who needed to involve the men who had really lived
it into the process.
Speaker 4 (03:21):
Because I know that you're a bit of a documentary
filmmaker as well, and I can imagine over that ORCA
documentary or you know, even their puach or even just
a traditional kind of storytelling, you've kind of almost gone
for so blended approach, you know, with the choice of
actors that you've gone with as well.
Speaker 1 (03:37):
Yeah, you know, I always saw this as a work
of fiction actually, so over time it becoming more hybrid
came later. It was intended to be more purely a
work of fiction in the beginning, and as we got
to know these men and work with a lot of
(03:57):
real life people, including Brent Buell, who was the theater
teacher that wrote and directed Breaking the Mummy's Gude, and
then meeting like the real Divine Eye Divine E, who
are very central to this story, you started to I mean,
I think from the very beginning I was like, oh,
these men need to be in the movie somewhere. Yeah,
(04:20):
But with time it was like, no, these men need
to be at the very center of what we're doing.
And I'm really excited about the exchange that can happen
between established actors like Colman Domingo and Paul Racy dancing
alongside men with real lived experience. There is an alchemy
there that I think becomes transcendent and more than its
(04:44):
individual parts.
Speaker 4 (04:45):
What's your pitch to people that say that have gone
through the system for whatever potential crime, And there's I
suppose there's an element of care for people. There's probably
an element of being triggered, probably, but you can going
back into that environment and the spoil like you think, oh,
we'll make a film, but you never know what, Like
you might buzz this film is getting there's so many
eyes on it, and yeah, you know what the media
(05:05):
is like people died into people's past. Is what was
your kind of pitch to these people to kind of
get in fullthold.
Speaker 3 (05:13):
Well, it was hard to pitch what we were actually.
Speaker 1 (05:16):
Going to make because there's so many meta elements to
it of like, hey, we're making a movie about a
production that you did in two thousand and five. Then
you're playing a version of yourself, but not quite yourself.
You're playing a part in this play that's also in
the movie. And there's scripted moments and unscripted moments and
all that.
Speaker 3 (05:36):
But I think the men were all just so proud
of what the work they did was in this program,
what the program stands.
Speaker 1 (05:45):
For, that they really were caretakers of it. And I
think there's the trust that was extended to us, and
and I think the pride and the belief that that
if anyone was going to tell a story, they wanted
(06:07):
to be at the helm of telling their own story.
And I think when someone has real ownership over the
work they're doing. Yeah, and has the space in the
autonomy to bring forth in their own words, the things
that matter most of them. Then you know, within that
(06:31):
there's a belief that it's going to work out.
Speaker 4 (06:37):
You know, it was a quite a collaborative process to
suppose to develop in that script. You know, people's input
from their their lived experience, which is the heart of
the film, and you know, was there elements were like
I saw it going this way, but to kind of
pull it back, and.
Speaker 1 (06:51):
I would just say it was just constantly expanding my
vision of what was possible.
Speaker 3 (06:58):
Yeah. You know, Divine Eye, Divine G very integral.
Speaker 1 (07:02):
In the development of the script we ended up shooting
that is really centered on their friendship and their life story,
and so we have very intimate access to memories and
things that would translate into the movie. Namely, one example
I think of what he might be asking, is there's
a scene in a movie that's a clemency hearing for
(07:23):
Divine G. And I had come across in the New
York Times these parole word transcripts that were just published,
and as you read them, it's so riveting because on
one side of the table we have these parole commissioners
who are seeing maybe twelve cases in a day. It's
very casual, just another another hearing of many. And on
(07:44):
the other side table we have someone who's literally fighting
for their life. And I remember calling Divine g about it.
I've got this idea for the clemency hearing. What if
we you know, you can find these parole transcripts online.
What if we just patch together using real transcripts a
scene and he's like, wow.
Speaker 3 (08:02):
That's very interesting or you could you see his answer?
Speaker 1 (08:06):
And so the clemency hearing is based on his actual
parole hearing transcripts, the questions he's asked, including like are
you acting in this interview? He was asked in real life. Yeah,
And that really knocked me out when I first read it.
It's just I'm kind of haunted by the fact that
one human would ask you another human question like that
(08:27):
in a moment like that.
Speaker 4 (08:28):
And there's has been so much talk and it's something
you've seen a lot of mediate in a moment of
like prison system just not being fit for a purpose
that you know, it's it's more isolating people as opposed
to kind of rehabilitation and right, you know, you think
even a few years ago watching the critchusul, but just
giving people a chance to cook and sole on. Yeah,
Like for you, what did you see like meeting these people?
(08:49):
Like what did you feel like the arts made a
difference to them, Whether it was confidence or that when
you're you know, spending years or a lifetime or something.
Speaker 1 (08:59):
Yeah, I mean I think there is a lot of
intangible power to it that maybe we don't have words for,
you know, just the way of when you look at
a painting it might open up up something up in
you that you can't quite describe. I think that's no
different than what was happening in this program. But I
think the most, the finest, finest point.
Speaker 3 (09:21):
I can put on it is that I think wherever.
Speaker 1 (09:23):
Anyone has access to art, they thrive, and that happens
to be the case inside prison.
Speaker 4 (09:29):
No surprise. With Shakespeare there there was as well, it's
nothing again to a different kind of prison story, like.
Speaker 3 (09:35):
I didn't like to hear the bar is well.
Speaker 1 (09:37):
I think if you go back to the way Shakespeare
was originally staged, it was accessible to the more common man,
you know, and and that's was its intention, and where
it was readily available, and I think Shakespeare can come
(09:58):
alive beyond the kind of like more crusty English, the
way that that we've heard it BEFOREM Like you you
can hear it with new years, when you hear it
through the voice of someone like divine Eye. I think
his performance of that soliloquy from Hamlet, I would I
(10:21):
would put him up against anyone in history who has
ever performed that. The way that he resonates with those
words is quite profound.
Speaker 4 (10:29):
And what was it like to kind of take I
suppose theater actors and kind of put them into like
a film setting and so on, Like how did they
kind of bridge that out? Because that's something that was
very hard to replicate him.
Speaker 1 (10:40):
Yeah, you know the the I think one thing about
particularly here in the you know in the UK's uh,
so many of so many fine film actors came from
stage training. There the diss plan of it all that
(11:01):
really translates well to a film set. And and I
think when a stage actor comes to film, I think
the hardest thing to step uh that's the hardest threshold
to step through is is the intimacy of it, of
how it all like has to exist, you know, the
(11:23):
subtlety that can convey like something very loudly that on
stage you need to project much more intensely. And once
that click happened, for most of our cast like they
were just in the pocket. And they were, but they
were also very adamant and really proud of trying to
nail things in one take, and anytime someone would they
(11:47):
would take about, you know, in front of the rest
of the.
Speaker 4 (11:49):
Cast's what's colmon like is a kind of I suppose
that the leader of this kind of truth has been cast.
Speaker 3 (11:58):
What is so beautiful about Coleman as a person.
Speaker 1 (12:01):
And an artist and you know, really a leader of
the cast was how he could come into a space
and really.
Speaker 3 (12:10):
Lead from the front, really.
Speaker 1 (12:11):
Command a moment, it seem, but yet at the same
time be very generous and ensure that people around him
can shine.
Speaker 3 (12:19):
I think the other thing that this performance you really
unlocked for him.
Speaker 1 (12:23):
As a chance to really bear more of his own
vulnerability and bring more of himself into it, just in
the way that the rest of the cast was doing
through their roles.
Speaker 3 (12:36):
And so there's this beautiful.
Speaker 1 (12:40):
Blend of all of his craft and training of thirty
years of doing this with maybe his most raw performance
today at the same time.
Speaker 4 (12:49):
Absolutely, and for yourself, what was it like shooting these locations.
You know they're not the most forgiving things.
Speaker 2 (12:55):
You know, it's clearly real. It's not like you can go,
we can have some bigger rooms here, overspill rooms here.
Like it was half challenging.
Speaker 4 (13:01):
It wasn't this real environment, you know, the.
Speaker 1 (13:04):
More prison centric settings within our film where.
Speaker 3 (13:10):
Even though it was a decommissioned prison, have been closed.
Speaker 1 (13:12):
This place helled Downstade have been closed about a month
before we went in there. Even though it was not active,
you still feel the oppressive quality of it. Just the
miles of razor wire out every window. It feels like
any room you're in with all that razorm it feels
like the razor worm is choking and.
Speaker 3 (13:31):
You know, strangling. The heat.
Speaker 1 (13:34):
You know, there's no heating in air in most prisons
in America, very little ventilation.
Speaker 3 (13:39):
If any, and it's just stifling. It kind of weighs
on you. And then also you just kind of feel
the ghosts in the walls.
Speaker 1 (13:50):
You know, it took a toll on all of us,
but especially our men who were formally incarcerated, who had
walked men in these corridors that many had been incarcerated
in the place that we were actually shooting, you know,
Divine Eye.
Speaker 3 (14:07):
The cell that he that was a set in our
movie was directly beneath the cell he occupied at one
point in his life.
Speaker 4 (14:16):
And for you, it's like, you know, it's been clear
that already at this early stage that the film's having
an impact and people have a discussion in a prison reform,
which is what what would you suppose that with your
bet a documentary film maker, too, is how that conversation
that's coming out of this as well? Does that appeal
to both sides of you that you're shining a light
on something you not people aren't dismissing it.
Speaker 2 (14:36):
It's just fantasy.
Speaker 1 (14:37):
And so what's rare kind of about this particular project
is documentaries often can have very direct impact of it.
Speaker 3 (14:47):
Let's create more access to programs.
Speaker 1 (14:50):
Like this, let's enable legislation that can overturn something unjust,
or let's raise money for this cause or whatever. And
narrative film oftentimes those strong intent power of ideas to
take a route, to change our way of thinking and
to create empathy. And so it's rare to have a
film that can work across that whole spectrum. And so
(15:14):
I think a movie like this can very directly empower
people to create more access to programs like this which work,
and also to start to shift our mindset to really
look in the eyes of people who are behind these
walls and to recognize our common humanity and the possibility,
(15:38):
you know, of our human potential.
Speaker 4 (15:41):
Infinitely fine question, where do you kind of you know,
see the conversation going in in kind of a few
months with with this film or a year. I think
it's going to have that kind of last impact. It's
probably where people continue to find these types of films
that you see a SOULFTI with like these eight twenty
four films, and people see them. The crowd that are
already predisposed to those investment see it, and then it's
the people will find out HBO, Max Stream and and
(16:04):
so on. Where do you kind of see that DC
the film kind of having that rule and kind of journey.
Speaker 3 (16:09):
A man who knows where the road will lead us.
Speaker 1 (16:14):
I just.
Speaker 3 (16:16):
I don't think too far ahead, you know.
Speaker 1 (16:19):
I try to really just like I think any great
performance or actors being present, being in the moment, and.
Speaker 3 (16:28):
So I'm just trying to appreciate each step of this
journey and for the gift that it is and.
Speaker 1 (16:37):
Just is how we made that's how we made the movement,
you know, and we were really cared about the process
and weren't so fixated on results.
Speaker 4 (16:49):
Did it feel like we're being in a bubble, like
in a real life prison of like we're doing this
and then you know, the surprise that it's the conversations
that wound the film.
Speaker 2 (16:56):
Here we are.
Speaker 1 (16:57):
When we had our New York premiere, which was really
special news because it's a setne or Sean Dino Johnson,
one of our cast members who's an alumni of the program.
It's actually when founding members of RTA. He got in
front of the crowd with the mic and he says,
this was special to us, and I hope it's now
(17:21):
special to you.
Speaker 3 (17:22):
It belongs to you and the world.
Speaker 2 (17:24):
Thank you.
Speaker 1 (17:25):
You know. That's kind of where we are now. It's
a transition. We're giving this movie now to the world
that it belongs.
Speaker 3 (17:31):
To the world now.
Speaker 4 (17:32):
And they had been surprised by any of the kind
of the reactions and so on. Has there been something
people meeting in different ways.
Speaker 3 (17:38):
And what's amazing. I've screened this.
Speaker 1 (17:43):
All over the US and now starting to get to
screen it internationally.
Speaker 3 (17:47):
I'll let you know after tonight when it plays in Edinburgh.
Speaker 1 (17:50):
But there are things in the movie that no matter
where we are, connect in any theater. And then there
are special finger friends of how it resonates with people uniquely,
and that's what's I think special about, you know.
Speaker 3 (18:07):
The human experiences.
Speaker 1 (18:08):
There are things that we can truly share that are universal,
and then there are things that are.
Speaker 3 (18:15):
Very distinctly personal to us as well.
Speaker 1 (18:18):
And I love seeing the responses that are both shared
and unique.
Welcome to the NED Party.
Speaker 2 (00:12):
For the two hundredth time. Welcome to the A twenty
four project here in the Nerd Party Network. My name
is Lee Hutchison and Dallas King and I make our
way through the A twenty four filmography and along the
way bring you interviews with the talent involved in front
of and behind the camera. Today we dive into the
making of the critically acclaimed Sing Sing and hear from
the film's co writer and director Greg Quaidar Sing Sing
(00:34):
arrives in UK cinemas today and starts Coleman Domingo as
Divine g who's imprisoned at Sing Sing Correctional Facility and
finds purpose by acting in a theater group alongside other
incarcerated men. Thanks so much to Greg for joining us
for this landmark episode, and thank you too for joining
us for two hundred odd episodes. I hope you enjoy
the show and I look forward to talking about more
(00:55):
E twenty four films with you in the years to come.
Speaker 1 (00:59):
Here to become a human again and enjoyed the things
that is not in our reality.
Speaker 3 (01:07):
Think you guys are becoming real with each other Vard, So.
Speaker 4 (01:12):
It's kind of been learn and this has been like
a nearly a decade blow for you, Greg True, Can
you told me through the journey for the film for.
Speaker 1 (01:20):
This Yeah, I've been working on this movie for over
eight years, and.
Speaker 3 (01:26):
You know, came across the story quite unexpectedly.
Speaker 1 (01:29):
I was producing a short documentary inside of a maxim
security prison in Kansas, and of my first time ever
behind the walls, and on the tour of the facility,
we were doing a short about something else, but I
passed by a cell and there's a young man raising
a rescue dog inside of a cell, and immediately I'll
just stopped in my tracks because it completely upended all
my expectations of you know, what I've been trained to
(01:52):
believe about.
Speaker 3 (01:53):
Prison from the movies I grew up watching.
Speaker 1 (01:55):
And here in the in that cell was a picture
of humanity, of healing between this man and his animal,
and I was just desperate to know that there was
anyone else.
Speaker 3 (02:04):
Out there doing things differently. And that night in the.
Speaker 1 (02:07):
Hotel room, I discovered this theater program in New York
rehabilitation through the arts on Google and quickly just fell
in love with what they were doing, and particularly this
Esquire article from a two thousand and five production of
a time traveling musical comedy called Breaking the Bummy's Code,
(02:29):
and I just was so struck by the warmth of it,
the joy of the process, despite the environment that they
were in, this you know, two hundred year old prison, and.
Speaker 3 (02:43):
It felt like an invitation, you know. And that was
really the beginning.
Speaker 1 (02:47):
It took six years of development to finally get to
the point of production, and part of that trial of
taking that long was we had a lot of learning
to do.
Speaker 3 (03:00):
We had to The main thing we had to learn.
Speaker 1 (03:01):
Was in order to fully tell the story, it had
to mirror the community.
Speaker 3 (03:09):
That we were trying to tell a story about.
Speaker 1 (03:11):
And that was a process of opening that circle up
beyond just my creative partner Clinton and I as writers
who needed to involve the men who had really lived
it into the process.
Speaker 4 (03:21):
Because I know that you're a bit of a documentary
filmmaker as well, and I can imagine over that ORCA
documentary or you know, even their puach or even just
a traditional kind of storytelling, you've kind of almost gone
for so blended approach, you know, with the choice of
actors that you've gone with as well.
Speaker 1 (03:37):
Yeah, you know, I always saw this as a work
of fiction actually, so over time it becoming more hybrid
came later. It was intended to be more purely a
work of fiction in the beginning, and as we got
to know these men and work with a lot of
(03:57):
real life people, including Brent Buell, who was the theater
teacher that wrote and directed Breaking the Mummy's Gude, and
then meeting like the real Divine Eye Divine E, who
are very central to this story, you started to I mean,
I think from the very beginning I was like, oh,
these men need to be in the movie somewhere. Yeah,
(04:20):
But with time it was like, no, these men need
to be at the very center of what we're doing.
And I'm really excited about the exchange that can happen
between established actors like Colman Domingo and Paul Racy dancing
alongside men with real lived experience. There is an alchemy
there that I think becomes transcendent and more than its
(04:44):
individual parts.
Speaker 4 (04:45):
What's your pitch to people that say that have gone
through the system for whatever potential crime, And there's I
suppose there's an element of care for people. There's probably
an element of being triggered, probably, but you can going
back into that environment and the spoil like you think, oh,
we'll make a film, but you never know what, Like
you might buzz this film is getting there's so many
eyes on it, and yeah, you know what the media
(05:05):
is like people died into people's past. Is what was
your kind of pitch to these people to kind of
get in fullthold.
Speaker 3 (05:13):
Well, it was hard to pitch what we were actually.
Speaker 1 (05:16):
Going to make because there's so many meta elements to
it of like, hey, we're making a movie about a
production that you did in two thousand and five. Then
you're playing a version of yourself, but not quite yourself.
You're playing a part in this play that's also in
the movie. And there's scripted moments and unscripted moments and
all that.
Speaker 3 (05:36):
But I think the men were all just so proud
of what the work they did was in this program,
what the program stands.
Speaker 1 (05:45):
For, that they really were caretakers of it. And I
think there's the trust that was extended to us, and
and I think the pride and the belief that that
if anyone was going to tell a story, they wanted
(06:07):
to be at the helm of telling their own story.
And I think when someone has real ownership over the
work they're doing. Yeah, and has the space in the
autonomy to bring forth in their own words, the things
that matter most of them. Then you know, within that
(06:31):
there's a belief that it's going to work out.
Speaker 4 (06:37):
You know, it was a quite a collaborative process to
suppose to develop in that script. You know, people's input
from their their lived experience, which is the heart of
the film, and you know, was there elements were like
I saw it going this way, but to kind of
pull it back, and.
Speaker 1 (06:51):
I would just say it was just constantly expanding my
vision of what was possible.
Speaker 3 (06:58):
Yeah. You know, Divine Eye, Divine G very integral.
Speaker 1 (07:02):
In the development of the script we ended up shooting
that is really centered on their friendship and their life story,
and so we have very intimate access to memories and
things that would translate into the movie. Namely, one example
I think of what he might be asking, is there's
a scene in a movie that's a clemency hearing for
(07:23):
Divine G. And I had come across in the New
York Times these parole word transcripts that were just published,
and as you read them, it's so riveting because on
one side of the table we have these parole commissioners
who are seeing maybe twelve cases in a day. It's
very casual, just another another hearing of many. And on
(07:44):
the other side table we have someone who's literally fighting
for their life. And I remember calling Divine g about it.
I've got this idea for the clemency hearing. What if
we you know, you can find these parole transcripts online.
What if we just patch together using real transcripts a
scene and he's like, wow.
Speaker 3 (08:02):
That's very interesting or you could you see his answer?
Speaker 1 (08:06):
And so the clemency hearing is based on his actual
parole hearing transcripts, the questions he's asked, including like are
you acting in this interview? He was asked in real life. Yeah,
And that really knocked me out when I first read it.
It's just I'm kind of haunted by the fact that
one human would ask you another human question like that
(08:27):
in a moment like that.
Speaker 4 (08:28):
And there's has been so much talk and it's something
you've seen a lot of mediate in a moment of
like prison system just not being fit for a purpose
that you know, it's it's more isolating people as opposed
to kind of rehabilitation and right, you know, you think
even a few years ago watching the critchusul, but just
giving people a chance to cook and sole on. Yeah,
Like for you, what did you see like meeting these people?
(08:49):
Like what did you feel like the arts made a
difference to them, Whether it was confidence or that when
you're you know, spending years or a lifetime or something.
Speaker 1 (08:59):
Yeah, I mean I think there is a lot of
intangible power to it that maybe we don't have words for,
you know, just the way of when you look at
a painting it might open up up something up in
you that you can't quite describe. I think that's no
different than what was happening in this program. But I
think the most, the finest, finest point.
Speaker 3 (09:21):
I can put on it is that I think wherever.
Speaker 1 (09:23):
Anyone has access to art, they thrive, and that happens
to be the case inside prison.
Speaker 4 (09:29):
No surprise. With Shakespeare there there was as well, it's
nothing again to a different kind of prison story, like.
Speaker 3 (09:35):
I didn't like to hear the bar is well.
Speaker 1 (09:37):
I think if you go back to the way Shakespeare
was originally staged, it was accessible to the more common man,
you know, and and that's was its intention, and where
it was readily available, and I think Shakespeare can come
(09:58):
alive beyond the kind of like more crusty English, the
way that that we've heard it BEFOREM Like you you
can hear it with new years, when you hear it
through the voice of someone like divine Eye. I think
his performance of that soliloquy from Hamlet, I would I
(10:21):
would put him up against anyone in history who has
ever performed that. The way that he resonates with those
words is quite profound.
Speaker 4 (10:29):
And what was it like to kind of take I
suppose theater actors and kind of put them into like
a film setting and so on, Like how did they
kind of bridge that out? Because that's something that was
very hard to replicate him.
Speaker 1 (10:40):
Yeah, you know the the I think one thing about
particularly here in the you know in the UK's uh,
so many of so many fine film actors came from
stage training. There the diss plan of it all that
(11:01):
really translates well to a film set. And and I
think when a stage actor comes to film, I think
the hardest thing to step uh that's the hardest threshold
to step through is is the intimacy of it, of
how it all like has to exist, you know, the
(11:23):
subtlety that can convey like something very loudly that on
stage you need to project much more intensely. And once
that click happened, for most of our cast like they
were just in the pocket. And they were, but they
were also very adamant and really proud of trying to
nail things in one take, and anytime someone would they
(11:47):
would take about, you know, in front of the rest
of the.
Speaker 4 (11:49):
Cast's what's colmon like is a kind of I suppose
that the leader of this kind of truth has been cast.
Speaker 3 (11:58):
What is so beautiful about Coleman as a person.
Speaker 1 (12:01):
And an artist and you know, really a leader of
the cast was how he could come into a space
and really.
Speaker 3 (12:10):
Lead from the front, really.
Speaker 1 (12:11):
Command a moment, it seem, but yet at the same
time be very generous and ensure that people around him
can shine.
Speaker 3 (12:19):
I think the other thing that this performance you really
unlocked for him.
Speaker 1 (12:23):
As a chance to really bear more of his own
vulnerability and bring more of himself into it, just in
the way that the rest of the cast was doing
through their roles.
Speaker 3 (12:36):
And so there's this beautiful.
Speaker 1 (12:40):
Blend of all of his craft and training of thirty
years of doing this with maybe his most raw performance
today at the same time.
Speaker 4 (12:49):
Absolutely, and for yourself, what was it like shooting these locations.
You know they're not the most forgiving things.
Speaker 2 (12:55):
You know, it's clearly real. It's not like you can go,
we can have some bigger rooms here, overspill rooms here.
Like it was half challenging.
Speaker 4 (13:01):
It wasn't this real environment, you know, the.
Speaker 1 (13:04):
More prison centric settings within our film where.
Speaker 3 (13:10):
Even though it was a decommissioned prison, have been closed.
Speaker 1 (13:12):
This place helled Downstade have been closed about a month
before we went in there. Even though it was not active,
you still feel the oppressive quality of it. Just the
miles of razor wire out every window. It feels like
any room you're in with all that razorm it feels
like the razor worm is choking and.
Speaker 3 (13:31):
You know, strangling. The heat.
Speaker 1 (13:34):
You know, there's no heating in air in most prisons
in America, very little ventilation.
Speaker 3 (13:39):
If any, and it's just stifling. It kind of weighs
on you. And then also you just kind of feel
the ghosts in the walls.
Speaker 1 (13:50):
You know, it took a toll on all of us,
but especially our men who were formally incarcerated, who had
walked men in these corridors that many had been incarcerated
in the place that we were actually shooting, you know,
Divine Eye.
Speaker 3 (14:07):
The cell that he that was a set in our
movie was directly beneath the cell he occupied at one
point in his life.
Speaker 4 (14:16):
And for you, it's like, you know, it's been clear
that already at this early stage that the film's having
an impact and people have a discussion in a prison reform,
which is what what would you suppose that with your
bet a documentary film maker, too, is how that conversation
that's coming out of this as well? Does that appeal
to both sides of you that you're shining a light
on something you not people aren't dismissing it.
Speaker 2 (14:36):
It's just fantasy.
Speaker 1 (14:37):
And so what's rare kind of about this particular project
is documentaries often can have very direct impact of it.
Speaker 3 (14:47):
Let's create more access to programs.
Speaker 1 (14:50):
Like this, let's enable legislation that can overturn something unjust,
or let's raise money for this cause or whatever. And
narrative film oftentimes those strong intent power of ideas to
take a route, to change our way of thinking and
to create empathy. And so it's rare to have a
film that can work across that whole spectrum. And so
(15:14):
I think a movie like this can very directly empower
people to create more access to programs like this which work,
and also to start to shift our mindset to really
look in the eyes of people who are behind these
walls and to recognize our common humanity and the possibility,
(15:38):
you know, of our human potential.
Speaker 4 (15:41):
Infinitely fine question, where do you kind of you know,
see the conversation going in in kind of a few
months with with this film or a year. I think
it's going to have that kind of last impact. It's
probably where people continue to find these types of films
that you see a SOULFTI with like these eight twenty
four films, and people see them. The crowd that are
already predisposed to those investment see it, and then it's
the people will find out HBO, Max Stream and and
(16:04):
so on. Where do you kind of see that DC
the film kind of having that rule and kind of journey.
Speaker 3 (16:09):
A man who knows where the road will lead us.
Speaker 1 (16:14):
I just.
Speaker 3 (16:16):
I don't think too far ahead, you know.
Speaker 1 (16:19):
I try to really just like I think any great
performance or actors being present, being in the moment, and.
Speaker 3 (16:28):
So I'm just trying to appreciate each step of this
journey and for the gift that it is and.
Speaker 1 (16:37):
Just is how we made that's how we made the movement,
you know, and we were really cared about the process
and weren't so fixated on results.
Speaker 4 (16:49):
Did it feel like we're being in a bubble, like
in a real life prison of like we're doing this
and then you know, the surprise that it's the conversations
that wound the film.
Speaker 2 (16:56):
Here we are.
Speaker 1 (16:57):
When we had our New York premiere, which was really
special news because it's a setne or Sean Dino Johnson,
one of our cast members who's an alumni of the program.
It's actually when founding members of RTA. He got in
front of the crowd with the mic and he says,
this was special to us, and I hope it's now
(17:21):
special to you.
Speaker 3 (17:22):
It belongs to you and the world.
Speaker 2 (17:24):
Thank you.
Speaker 1 (17:25):
You know. That's kind of where we are now. It's
a transition. We're giving this movie now to the world
that it belongs.
Speaker 3 (17:31):
To the world now.
Speaker 4 (17:32):
And they had been surprised by any of the kind
of the reactions and so on. Has there been something
people meeting in different ways.
Speaker 3 (17:38):
And what's amazing. I've screened this.
Speaker 1 (17:43):
All over the US and now starting to get to
screen it internationally.
Speaker 3 (17:47):
I'll let you know after tonight when it plays in Edinburgh.
Speaker 1 (17:50):
But there are things in the movie that no matter
where we are, connect in any theater. And then there
are special finger friends of how it resonates with people uniquely,
and that's what's I think special about, you know.
Speaker 3 (18:07):
The human experiences.
Speaker 1 (18:08):
There are things that we can truly share that are universal,
and then there are things that are.
Speaker 3 (18:15):
Very distinctly personal to us as well.
Speaker 1 (18:18):
And I love seeing the responses that are both shared
and unique.
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