Tools and Techniques for Stunning Light Painting Photos with Russell Klimas

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Russell Klimas (00:00):
If you get one good photo, it was a good shoot.
Just get one.
If you're happy with one, great.
Just because there's so muchtrial and error and things that
can go wrong or the weather'sbad or whatever, or you play
with it and maybe it works.
if you just try to get one outof it and you're happy with one,
it's a good session.

Raymond Hatfield (00:17):
Cool.
Hey, welcome to the beginnerphotography podcast.
I am your host, RaymondHatfield.
And today we're chatting withlight painter, Russell Climus
about how to get started withthis creative long exposure
technique.
But first the beginnerphotography podcast is brought
to you by Cloudspot.
Cloudspot has everything youneed to build a thriving

(00:39):
photography business.
They help you impress yourclients, deliver a professional
experience, and streamline yourworkflow all in one platform.
You can grab your free foreveraccount over at deliverphotos.
com and only upgrade when youand your business are ready.
One of my favorite memories inphotography was very early on, I
might have still been in filmschool, actually, going out with

(01:01):
a friend and shooting some longexposure night photos, just
using like a flashlight to makeit look like we were shooting
things like fireballs and stufflike that out of our hands.
None of these photos were reallygood because long exposures,
they take a lot of practice todo well, but I'll tell you what,
it was fun.
And looking at today's guestRussell's images, they're not

(01:22):
only fun, but when you realizethat they're all done in camera.
Technically, it's very, veryincredible.
His use of light to createincredible night scenes is a
true skill that he has worked onfor years.
I highly encourage you to checkout his work on Instagram before
listening to this interview.
There's a link in the shownotes.

(01:42):
But today Russell is going tohelp teach you how you can get
started in light painting tocreate jaw dropping photos for
yourself.
Have you ever done any lightpainting or long exposure?
I personally would love to seeit.
And you can post your images inthe free and amazing beginner
photography podcast communityright now, which you can join
over at beginner photopod.

(02:04):
com forward slash group.
Again, I'd love to see it.
To see him with that, let's goahead and get on into today's
interview with Russell ClimusRussell, my first first question
for you is when did you knowthat photography was going to
play an important role in yourlife?
in your life?

I think that's an interesting question only
because I didn't really know itwas kind of those like, Oh, Hey,
I'm just going to do what myheart wants me to do.
And I just kind of followedthat.
Hmm, I don't really know.
I feel like it kind of waxes andwanes a lot of the time still.
I'm getting more into it nowthan I was the past year.
but yeah, I have no idea.

(02:39):
I just kind of let the universehappen.
What happens?
And I'll be like, Hey, thiscould be fun.
Let me go apply for this thing.
And I just apply for stuff andsee what happens.
And then you just kind ofbecomes more and more a part of
your life.

What do you mean by that?
Apply for stuff.

For example, I did like a TEDx talk, a few
years ago and it was one ofthose.
I didn't my goals that year thatI wanted to do a TEDx talk.
I was like, Hey, look, thislooks fun.
Let me apply for it or doing thesame for like, WPPI, which is a
photography conference thathappens every year in Vegas.
I said, you know what?
Let me apply to be an instructorfor that.

(03:14):
Let me just give it a shot.
And then it happened.
So I'm just like trying stuffthen it becomes more a part of
my life.
And just like applying forcompetitions.
What?
Like I just won a competitionrecently, with Lindsay Adler
and, That was last minute.
I was just like, you know what?
Let's just try it.
You never know.
Just apply yourself.
Just try things.

That's hilarious.
Okay, but clearly photography islarge part of your life, today.
but it sounds like it wasn'talways.
So, this show is called thebeginner photography podcast.
I want to focus for a minute onon those early days for you in
photography.
Do do you you remember, wasthere one photo, that made you
say like, holy cow, like this isbetter than just a snapshot.

(03:55):
Like I actually did something.
Um,

Yeah, I guess.
I mean, the first time that Ireally thought about like, maybe
I want to get into photographyis I was working.
I just moved back to Colorado.
and I got on a Netflix moviethat was filming in my city and
we went up to some pass in themountains very early in the
morning.
And I was like, I took out my, Ithink it was an LGV 10 at the
time.
and I took some landscape photosand I was like, Oh, these are

(04:20):
really nice.
Like maybe I should get intothis.
And of course, when you get intophotography, you oversaturate
everything.
Cause you're like, man, this isawesome.
but that, I feel like reallykind of, sparked my interest.
And then when I got into lightpainting, Maybe it wasn't like
six months later, but it was alittle down the line.
And I found that then I waslike, yeah, this is it for me.
This is what I want to do

V10, that cell cell phone, right?

Yeah

Okay, Yeah, so I think it's similar to a lot of
listeners.
It's like, you either go throughthis phase of like, oh, I had a
baby.
Maybe I should buy a camera Orgrew up with a camera in your
hand, you know quote unquote Orwith today's technology,
realize, Oh, I've taken a fewgood photos on my phone.
Maybe I I should make this athing.
What was it that you weremissing from your cell phone

(05:05):
that you thought, Oh, maybe Ishould actually upgrade and buy
a dedicated camera?

I don't know if there was necessarily anything.
I just, wanted the ability toeither like change lenses or
just have higher megapixel countbecause this whole, The iPhone
has 48 megapixels.
It's not true.
They do pixel binning.
Okay.
It's not the same.
and so I think it was just oneof those things where I just
wanted to have it and honestlyholding a camera feels way more

(05:30):
satisfying than holding a phone.
Can't really explain it.
It just does.

I totally get it.
I mean, of the reasons why Ishoot and love Fuji cameras is
is like literally just the waythat it feels in my hand.
just, it feels intuitive to me.
So I think that like the toolthat you use is super important
and you don't always have a wayto explain it.
So I totally get it.
let's talk about your entryinto, into light painting
because today you're very wellknown for your light painting,

(05:56):
what it is that you're able tocreate.
Where did that start?

I believe this is a story I tell myself cause
they don't actually remember,but I was, uh, Yeah.
So I have a bunch of friends whoare either circus performers who
play with fire or whatever.
And I was looking up how to dolike fire photography when it
comes to that aspect.
And then I stumbled Eric Paré'swork on Google.

(06:20):
And I was looking up stuffrelated to that.
And I was like, What in theworld is this?
This is so magical.
I have to figure out how to doit.
And he's been a huge inspirationfor me.
And so like, once I found that Iwas, is this game over?
And that's just like, that's thething I want to pursue.
Photography is mostly alwaysbeen fun for me and just for

(06:41):
fun.
But to be able to push thetechnical aspects of a camera to
see what's possible, that's whatis exciting to me.

I guess I, might have missed a question.
for for those who might be likereally green in photography, can
you, I guess, briefly explain,like, what is light painting?

Good point.
we should clarify.
so light painting is a form oflong exposure photography.
So how I like to explain it isyou've probably seen airplane
trails or car trails before, andthat's long exposure.
And in any kind of longexposure, how I explain it is
when you normally take a photo,you click the button.
Once you take the photo andyou're done now in a long

(07:21):
exposure, you click the buttonand then you wait.
And the camera takes in lightfor a longer period of time and
then it ends the exposure.
And that's the differencebetween the two.
And so with light paintingspecifically, while you can have
your basic long exposure withstar trails or car trails, we
can use a lot of differenttools, whether it's tubes,
blades, fiber optics, oranything else that you can

(07:43):
pretty much play with aflashlight or other, there are
very specific light paintingtools out there now.
And you can create portraits,abstract stuff.
You can, Light paint cars, youcan do so many different things
and a lot of the times you canuse it in real estate.
It really just allows you toreally shape the light in your
photo in a way that eithernatural light or studio light
might not be able to do.

One of the questions that I think, I'm I'm
just going to assume here thatpeople are trying to like put
this together in their head,right?
That maybe, we'd let just assumethat nobody's ever like seen
photo that is like paintedbefore.
these are typically done like inthe very low light situations,
right?
Like for you to be able to, addlight.
Is that right?
right?

Yeah.
Nine times out of 10 or I reallylike 99 times out of a hundred.
You're going to either be in lowlight or in the dark.
there are exceptions to that,but we're not going to get into
it.
It's too, too, niche.

the intermediate advanced
photographer.
podcast right there.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Okay.
So let's go back to when yousaid that you were looking up
this photographer who was doingfire, photography and something
about it.
Yeah.
spoke to you.
Yeah, so.
words, what was it?

So basically with Eric Paré's work, I don't
know how it got bundled in orhow I was searching for fire
photography, but all of his workor majority of it with light
painting is using safety tube.
You can pick these safety tubesup from like your local home
improvement store, like HomeDepot or Lowe's and the cost
about 4.
They are called T8.
There's T8 and T12, twodifferent sizes.

(09:09):
The majority of the communityhas shifted to T8 tubes, and
basically it's a tube.
It's plastic.
They normally go overfluorescent lights in case those
fluorescent lights were toshatter.
And what you will do is you willtake the tube.
Oftentimes we will put somebaking paper.
In the tube, or whatever theother term for baking paper is,
that I can't think

Parchment paper.

Thank you, parchment paper.
And, put that in the tube,that'll diffuse the light that
comes from the flashlight.
And then if you want to put in agel, you can generally find
those like on eBay, you justhave to look for like really
long, like four foot gels.
And then you can put that in thetube as well.
And then you just, yeah, you,basically it's a budget
lightsaber.
You put your flashlight in thereand you swing it around.

(09:51):
I

I love this because it's like, I think one
of the first things that I didwhen I first got into
photography and like reallyunderstood.
I came from the world of,cinematography and and then I
got into photography and it'slike in cinematography, your
shutter speed is pretty muchlocked, like nine times out of
10, unless you're doingsomething crazy, like saving
private ryan or something, but,your shutter speed is going to
be locked.
So you never really get to playwith that element.

(10:15):
And I think that moving intophotography for me was really
exciting to have thatopportunity to be able to do so.
And the first place where mymind went was.
Oh, well, oh, well, if we'regoing to do long exposures, what
can we do here in terms of,like, or, something?
and we just had like little,flashlights, little, like,
keychain flashlights orwhatever.
And it kind of and it kind ofworked, right?

(10:35):
Like, you could, like, drawstuff or make it look like you
were shooting something out ofyour hand.
Did you start did you startthere?
Because that's not where youtoday.
Like, when I look at your worktoday, there is, like, a
production involved, a moregear.
But when you, first started out,like, was that where it started?

No, for me it was emulating Eric Paré's work
because the way that he was ableto incorporate it with a person
and make it look elegant andbeautiful.
I was like, this is it.
Like it just, it createdsomething that I thought was
beautiful because most peoplethat have seen steel wool
photography and like, that'sfine.
and a lot of just like stuffthat you do with your flashlight
or whatever, but it looks justlow quality to me.

(11:12):
Um, And I was like, that's fine,but it's not inspiring.
I wanted to see how I couldcreate something beautiful.
At least what I thought wasbeautiful.

did you figure figure that out, what is
something that's beautiful morethan just still wool?
wool?

I mean, when I saw again, it always goes back
to Eric Farray for me at the endof the day.
But just when I see the tubework, it's simple.
It looks clean.
Those are the two biggest thingsthat I really look for is I want
something that looks intentionalAnd looks clean and beautiful
and a lot of the stuff that I doI have very specific shapes that
i'm going to make Or I have avery specific idea of how i'm

(11:49):
going to light it and then usethe light painting as an accent
to create like like I love doinglike crowns for example and
being very specific On theplacement of where those blades
are when you're creating thesecrowns.
The blades being, they'reacrylic blades.
You can get them fromlightpaintingbrushes.
com or insonomelon.
com.
And they're just acrylic bladesthat you pop a flashlight into

(12:10):
and you can either do stuff witha flashlight on strobe or you
can turn it on and off and youget two different effects, but
you can use that to do a varietyof different things.
And, at least for crowns or ofthe like when using portraits.
So it's just all about justHaving good lighting, good
wardrobe, and then having thelight panning kind of be a part
of it.
And each part of a photograph,Is going to need all of those

(12:32):
elements.
So I always refer back toLindsay Adler all the time
because she's like my favoritephotographer.
I love her so much.
And when you look at how herlighting is, a lot of people
will ask her, how can I do thiswith, cheap lights or whatever.
And it's, not about the qualitylight you have.
It's how you control it.
And on top of that, she hasreally good wardrobe.
So if you have good wardrobe andgood lighting, that's all you

(12:56):
need.
Everything else doesn't reallymatter.

did you start with portraits?
Like you started doing bothlight painting and portraits at
the same time?
Like combining them?

I had tried playing with portraits once I'd
got my camera cause after theNetflix movie, or I think maybe
during it, I got a Sony, a 6,400.
And which is a crop sensor it'sa pretty good starter camera, I
think, for people who don't haveone battery life, not great, but
other than that, and I startedplaying with portraits again,
everything was oversaturatedand, just trying to figure it

(13:25):
out.
And then I just wanted somethingdifferent.
because portraits, I get boredeasily.
Once I discover a technique, I'mlike, cool, I did it.
I want the next thing.
Now I'm always searching for thenext thing and how to push it
because photography has alwaysbeen about what I want, not
about what other people want.
And that's the differencebetween like doing it for work

(13:46):
and doing it for fun.

Yeah, no, of course.
But like, when it comes to theportraits, Right.
at at least for myself, it'slike Again, I'm no master at
light light painting, but I'vetried, tried the the light
painting itself.
Like that was the technique.
But talking about, it Eric?
Looking at his work, seeing thathe was doing fire and portraits,
did tackle them both at the sametime?

at same time?
is it's just kind of a part ofit.
And you learn when, especiallywhen you're doing portraits, and
with tubes is person who youwere like painting behind,
you're doing a collaboration, orat least how I like to work,
where I say, cool, hit me with apose, generally something that's

(14:31):
not super far away from thebody.
Cause anything super far away,your hand's going to move.
That's going to cause shiftingin the long exposure.
But I let them like, If they puttheir hands one direction, or
one hand up and the other handslike into their body, I use
their body to guide where thelight pinning tube is going to
go.
Because now we have a person andthe light in harmony with each
other, and that makes thepicture itself just more

(14:54):
pleasing to look at.
And so I really didn't have achoice but to tackle both at the
same time.

That wow.
That sounds extremelycomplicated.
that sounds you're doingmultiple things at once, like
trying to learn all of it.
that is a lot because, as youmentioned, like you're doing
long exposures as well, so notonly do you have to learn how to
communicate with your modelshere, but but also, you you have
to have them frozen, and nowyou're gonna go in front of the

(15:21):
camera and start, uh, using aflashlight or, a tube to to
paint them, to accentuate them,to, create this image.
Talk to me about some of theseearliest photos, cause it had to
have been, I don't want to say adumpster fire, but like to have
been like a lot of mistakes thatwent through at first.

it's easy when you look back at your old work,
you're like, yeah, that wasgarbage.
But at the time you're like,this is great.
Right.
And really just like witheverything.
Or at least how I work is it'sone step at a time.
I'm all about baby steps andbeing like, cool, this is what I
want to play with.
Did I get the effect I wanted?
Yes.
Cool.
I got that.
And it's just building upon it.
Cause I remember the first timeI did a good tube light painting

(15:56):
with my friend Hannah, and shewas always down for escapades
with light painting, which wasvery, I very much appreciated.
And, I was like, yeah, this isexactly what I wanted, for what
I was trying to go for, but nowI look at it and, I wasn't level
or like, the horizon was weirdor, the composition couldn't be
better.
Like, yeah, we have a reflectionin the water, but it's only part
of her.
So that doesn't really feel likeit, you know, exactly what I

(16:18):
want, but a lot of the time, Andthis is how Eric Paré works too.
At least if I remembercorrectly, it could just be
putting words in his mouth atthis point.
Uh, don't do that.
But, if you get one good photo,it was a good shoot.
Just get one.
If you're happy with one, great.
Just because there's so muchtrial and error and things that
can go wrong or the weather'sbad or whatever, or you play

(16:39):
with it and maybe it works.
And so if you just try to getone out of it and you're happy
with one, it's a good session.

Wow, yeah, okay.
So then let's talk about thatbecause, as a wedding as a
wedding photographer, it's likea lot of my shooting was
reactionary.
I would see something I wouldsee something in front of me,
capture I would capture it.
The type that you do is not likethat.
and correct me if I'm wrong, butit feels more like you have to
construct an image there beforeyou even like put up the camera.
So, talk to me about this previsualization that you to to do

(17:09):
before you start taking photos.

So, What I always recommend when it comes
to learning anything, especiallyin photography is find someone's
style, who you like and emulatethe crap out of it.
Just literally try to copy it asmuch as you can.
So you understand what'shappening.
it's just like most things, onceyou learn the rules and
understand the rules, then youcan break the rules.
And so once you kind of get usedto knowing, okay, I understand

(17:33):
how this works.
Then you think what I do and howit works for me is, How can I
take that one step further?
So a good example of that is ifI make a crown, for example, and
I'm doing it, either on strobe,we'll just argue with strobe for
now.
And you just make a basic circleand you start basically from the
blade pointing down from behindthe person's head.

(17:55):
And you make a circle aroundtheir head.
It's just like a nice, easycircle.
Then I was like, okay, cool.
So the blade is parallel to theperson.
Okay.
Now, what if, while I'm making acircle, what if I rotated the
blade as that circle is beingmade?
So now I'm introducing a 3Delement to it that's going to
change the shape of the crown.

(18:16):
Okay, cool.
let me try that same thing, noton strobe, but just turning the
flashlight on and off.
See what effect that makes.
Or, you know, what if it happensas I'm going around, I make it,
like, jut out at certain points.
So it's literally just, know,Oh, let me try this thing.
Let me try this thing.
And just one step at a time.
and I can't tell you, I used todo, light painting Airbnb
experiences for a little while.

(18:38):
And which was really fun.
for one, the people here arethere, but two, because I would
say, Hey, do you want to lightpaint?
And I can guarantee you almostevery single time I did that,
they did something I had neverthought of.
And I was like, Oh, I didn'tthink about it that way.
And I thought that was so coolbecause they're coming at it
from a completely differentlens, all puns intended.

(18:59):
And Yeah.
they're looking at it in adifferent way that I didn't even
think about it because theydon't have the experience.
that's so valuable.
And so it's literally just trystuff.
And then once you get used to itand you know what you like, then
you already know what works andit becomes.
just like a second nature thing,because you don't really think
about it.
A lot of the time I'll just bein the moment and be like, Oh,

(19:20):
what if I try this thing andjust see what happens.
Right.
And when you're working withsomeone like it's just as
exciting.
Cause honestly, the best feelingis when you do a shot and then
the model or whomever you'reworking with comes and looks at
the photo and they're blownaway.
And I'm like, you can't beatthat.
You just can't beat that becausethere's like, it's like magic

(19:41):
when

Yeah, that's a lot of photography.
It feels like magic sometimes sowhen you go out.
Again, I'm I'm trying to relatethis to like what I do kind of,
or what I did just take, forexample, like engagement
photography, right?
this this could be an hour.
I might be out for an hour,maybe an hour and a half.
Is is that about how long you'reout is it longer?
Is it shorter amounts of time?

I would say on average, it's two hours.
That seems pretty standard forme, just because we were like,
all right, cool.
We had like, had a good time.
And then after about two hours,Given how it always works is
when you're at the two hourmark, that's when you're getting
your best stuff.
And you're like, man, this isawesome.
so sometimes you might push foranother, but normally I've never
gone past three, uh, justbecause I know I get hungry or

(20:24):
tired or we need a break orwhatever.

Yeah.
I guess, walk me through likewhat, are those, let's like you
arrive.
Let's start before that.
Do you.
talk to me about the the comingup with an idea or coming up
with a concept that you want to,create?
let's start there.

idea coming up with a concept that you want to,
let's start I was like, okay,cool.
I love the way that the lightfall off in this vibe here.

(21:00):
And I was like, okay, cool.
How can I take that, put my ownspin on it and add light
painting into it.
So, I'm going to look at thatand be like, okay, cool.
I could, do this kind of crownor do this thing.
Or I have some new blades.
I have a mannequin in my roomthat I'll test stuff on to be
like, do I like the way thislooks or not?
And, um, to get a better idea ofwhat I'm going to want to do.
But a lot of the time, or atleast when I was in like, And do

(21:22):
it super hard.
It was like, hey, you wanna golight painting?
And we just kinda yellow it.
Because it's just in the momentwhen you're creating with
someone, you just kinda letinspiration strike you and just
have a good time.
That's what's most important tome is, we're just having a good
time.
Like, whatever happens, cool.

I love that.
that's how I feel like a lot oflisteners want to feel about
photography, just to go out.
and just to have fun.
I guess what I'm trying to getout here is that Like, it's
easier to just go out, like, toyour local park and walk around
for an hour and see It's easierto, know, if have kid, spend
some time with them and takesome photos of, like, just see

(21:57):
what happens.
It's, but with this happening atnight, with you needing another
person, with you having theadditional gear, there there has
to be a little bit moreinvolved, right?
how can listeners approach itwith that same mindset of like,
let's let's have fun.
how do we get into lightpainting way, right?
Like what, what's the 101, like,what should we do when we first

(22:19):
get to a location?
how should we set this

Okay, cool.
So first, when you first get toa location, pretty much, you
look for composition and youlook for ambient light because
your ambient light is going toaffect your photo in ways you
might not like.
So a lot of times street lamps,they're going to be, a lot of
the time they're going to bewarm.
And if you're not using a warmcolored tube, Then you might get
a clashing of warm and coolcolors and you don't like that.
Or, if there's too much ambientlight, you might get

(22:42):
overexposed.
So you have to really kind ofdetermine where you want to go
and how you want to shoot it.
Not saying that you can't shootwith ambient light, but you have
to be fast.
You have to be 2 3 seconds maxfor something like that.
And you need a really strongflashlight to overpower the
ambient.
a lot of Eric Paré stuff, Helights Kim who's his model
majority of the time with justthe ambient light of the tube

(23:03):
and it looks incredible I stilldon't know how he does it.
It's just like it blows me away

Amen.

it felt a little unsafe.
And so, just being aware ofthose things.
Obviously, like do this soberbecause it's at night.
You got to be extra safe atnight.
look for any potential ways thatyou can trip or, animals,
plants, bushes, all that sort ofstuff.
Just try to be super safetyconscious.
because without the person whoyou're taking photos of to do

(23:56):
the light painting behind, youdon't have a photo.
So they're number one all thetime.
So you do what you can toaccommodate them and just make
sure that everything's good ontheir end.
but I mean, other than that,it's just like, cool.
I have my composition.
Let's Hey, give me a pose.
And you can give them examples.
Eric Paré is a great person toreference to see just different
poses and what works and whatdoesn't, because he's done it so
much.

(24:16):
And he's like the master.
And then you can kind of just gofrom there and see what you get
and adjust your settingsaccordingly.
There is no perfect setting forlight panning because it just
doesn't exist because of yourambient light, the strength of
your flashlight, as well as howlong the exposure is.
And so those variables arealways going to be changing, are

(24:36):
always going to be different.
And depending on the tool thatyou use with a flashlight also
might affect it.
So it really like you literallyjust have to play with it.
My standard go to is ISO Andthen I have a wireless trigger.
So I always shoot on bulb and awireless trigger will let me
click the exposure and then Ican expose for however long I

(24:57):
want.
And then I can end it again.
My longest ever exposure was 45minutes.
No way.
yeah, that was with doing dronestuff.
ha ha ha.

Okay, gotcha.

and that was like, you know, then you have to
shoot it like F 13 for all ofthat because it's such a long
exposure.
so those are like the mainthings I would say is
composition.
Make sure the environment iscool.
Check your settings and thenjust light paint and see what
happens.
There is so much to see whathappens in light painting.

Of course, of course.
So, when you're not doing dronestuff, like if you're doing a
portrait, what would you say,just kind of ballpark your
shutter speed might be?
is it around I would, yeah.

It depends on the light painting shape that
I'm making.
If you're doing tubes, generallyit won't go over like 10
seconds.
With the exception of if you areexposing for the environment.
if you're like outside.
So, other than that, Generally Iget most things done under 30.
the longest sort of things I doare like wings with, acrylic

(25:54):
blades and those take between 15to 20 seconds.
Oh, Or some other stuff thatI've done with like making
portals and like, they're just,I never go over 30.
It's just the ease of being ableto start and stop whenever I
want.
And, that can be really nice.

Sure.
Of course.
let's, let's, let's get we getto a location, we find cool a
cool composition, play with oursettings.
we get something that we like atfirst.
How many setups do you think youdo in the two hours?
How many different variations ofphotos are you doing in those
two hours?

the two How photos are you doing in those
two hours?
but I generally will just try tofind the best composition for
that area if I'm outside.

(26:47):
In the studio, it varies justbecause amount of time.
What I generally will end updoing in the studio is we keep
the same lighting setup, andoften I'll use gels.
So then I'll switch out the gelcolors, but then I'll try
different crowns or differentthings Within the same setup or
similar setup anyway, justbecause I've done Setups in
studio that were five differentlights and it took like an hour

(27:09):
to get it, right And that's justnot worth the amount of studio
time that I have to pay for AndI've done studio shoots where
it's, I just do one lightingsetup and then I'm like, okay,
cool.
I have this tool.
How many different ways can Iuse just this one tool?
With this lighting setup tocreate something new, or
different.
And I've gotten a lot of goodstuff from just the same thing.

(27:30):
Are you add in like, um, you cando some standing stuff, do stuff
with a stool, do stuff with oneof those white cubes and just
kind of, add in differentelements to see how it's going
to push your brain to thinkdifferently.
I mean, you can go from outside,you can have up to three,
sometimes up just a onedepending on the environment.
And then in the studio, yeah,you just wanted to generally, or
you just add in props.

(27:50):
Props can help change a lot.

Okay, so in the two hours, you might pick
three different, you know,locations, or different setups.
But but the majority of thattime you're trying to, out what
can I can I do different?
with my tools here?
What can I do different withthese lights?
Is that, different colors?
Is it, is it, let's just see ifI go a little bit slower with
this, like, through that alittle bit.
Cause I'm guessing it's a lot ofjust guess and check, is that

(28:14):
right?
is that right?

a lot of it is guess and check, especially when
you're starting out.
but even when I'm like, I wantto try a new thing and I just
let her know, I don't know ifthis is going to work or not.
And even then when I practice,when I'm hanging out with people
who want to do it or whatever,I'd say, Hey, I'm going to do
what I want to do because thisis what I, want to do or
whatever.
If there's specific shots youwant, we can do those.

(28:35):
Cause I've done them so manytimes, but.
just be happy with whateverbecause I'm doing this for me
and you just want to be a partof it.
So, as long as that'scommunicated, we're good.
But for the most part, colorsdon't really matter in the long
scheme of things when it comesto making shapes.
colors are, an after effect tome.

(28:55):
So I'll be like, cool, whatshape can I make with this or
whatever?
The only exception being is thatif you're using a flashlight and
you're using like a rainbowspandex or a holographic paper
or something, the white lightcan overpower the color and blow
it out.
and you won't be able to recoverthat in post.
So just kind of be aware ofthat, that you should be aware
of how bright your flashlightis.
Cause especially when usingtubes or any kind of blades or

(29:16):
whatever, there's always a hotpoint closest to the, End of the
flashlight.
So that's something just to beaware of.
but yeah, for the most part,it's just, what shifts can I
make?
What if I move it this way?
What if I trace their body withthe tube or the tool?
What does that look like?
what if I throw them?
What if I throw the tubes?
What does that look like?
I've done that before.
I'm like, all right, we're justgoing to throw and see what

(29:38):
happens.
Like you just try stuff.
Let your creativity shine.

That's great.
I love that.
when it comes to like, newphotographers, right.
they're trying to picture, whatare what are the different
possibilities, right?
And obviously saying like, justtry something, just go out there
and just do something, isimportant because I've often
said this, you you can canwatch, like, literally every
photography video on YouTube,but until you you do something,

(30:03):
you don't actually know how it'sdone.
I And I feel feel like this isone one of those areas that
probably it applies to more,right?
So, what advice do you have forpeople who are, they do want to
get out, but maybe they'rethey're nervous, they feel like
they don't have enough gear.
they're overwhelmed byeverything that we've learned
today.
Like, what would you tell thosepeople?

Yeah.
So one, I always think it'sfunny.
We're like, let's talk about avisual medium on an audio
podcast because that makessense.
Right?
Like works so well, especiallywhen light painting, you're
like, how do I visualize thisthing in my head?
And I don't understand.
So we're already doing great.
but I mean, as like you all, asyou know, the best camera is the

(30:44):
one that you have on you, whichis agreed.
but then Also the same light.
You have, a light on your phoneand I've often done.
So if you don't have a cameraand you're wanting it to light
painting, so on iPhone they havetwo different apps.
You have photo gear, F O T O Rgear, which is a free app that
can also do video lightpainting, which is pretty cool.

(31:05):
And then there's also the slowshutter app.
And so those are two optionsthat can do long exposure.
And then on Android, it kind ofvaries on the manual camera
setup, but is you can use thatas your camera and then use
somebody else's flashlight ontheir phone to light paint with.
And that works really well.
If you just want to do like,I've done stuff where if I have

(31:26):
a portrait, right.
so then I'll start theflashlight behind their head.
And I'll just do like a slowspiral out with the cell phone
camera.
And then if you want to lightyour subject, we'll then just
turn the light and then light.
Your subject with the light fromthe cell phone.
or if you want to, say, let's,for example, when we were
growing up, we all made the fivepointed star in the notebooks

(31:47):
where they would, all the lineswould connect, right.
Is so what you can do is you canuse your other hand and block
the light with the cell phone,right.
And then remove it as you startmaking that star and where it
ends, block the light again, sothat way you don't have those
trails in there.
So you can create.
like little environments thatway and create different ways,

(32:09):
to kind of create your scene,whatever you want it to be.
really it all comes down to yourimagination.
a guy who's really, really goodat, drawing stuff.
if you looked into lightpainting at all, you've probably
come across Darius twin.
He's incredible at drawing.
I don't know how he does it withhis.
Spatial awareness.
I do not have that spatialawareness.
there's another guy who I can'tremember off the top of my head

(32:29):
who's really, really good withjust creating that spatial
stuff.
mass street art is probably thebest light calligrapher I've
ever seen in my entire life.
he has specific tools.
He does a lot of like Arabiclooking symbols and like, he's
written the entire alphabet andit looks gorgeous.
you can use your flash, you canjust grab any flashlight.
And if you want to, you can usethe wall, put it on the wall and

(32:50):
it's going to create this kindof this cone effect.
And he has used that toliterally create light graffiti
on the wall.
And it looks incredible.
So there's like so many optionsyou can do with just a
flashlight,

Yeah guess maybe that's another thing that
we probably should have dove alittle bit deeper into is the
gear.
So, you're telling me that Icould probably get into this
with just a cell phone, which isgreat, but Let's, stick to the
dedicated camera.
here So we got a camera is thereany specifics that we need as
far as lenses go or talk to meto me about the flashlights and
the gear and I guess tripods aswell, like what do we need just

(33:25):
to just to get started.
And then how do we grow?
once we're out of that beginnerphase?

Cool.
So to get started, generallylike, any camera will do a lens
wise.
I, for years, I only recentlyswitched to just like other
lenses.
I just use a 24 to 70.
That's all I used forever wasjust that, for like 99 percent
of everything that I shot.
So.
That's a great lens at 16 to 35is also good the reason I got

(33:52):
the 24 to 70 was I can do widebut I can also do portraits and
that was like the Happy mediumbetween the two for me Tripod
wise honestly anything works.
I still have the first tripod.
I bought from Goodwill for like10 Okay, I still use it, right?
It's not great, but it works AndThen when it comes to
flashlights the best one thatyou probably start out with, if

(34:15):
you want to just, you're on abudget, you want to start it.
I believe it's onlightpainting.store that Eric
Paré runs.
And it's the Folomov F O L O M OV, 18650.
It runs for about 35.
It has a constant strobe, whichis really important.
It has an adjustable brightness,which is also really important.
These are things that as lightpainters, we look for, we want

(34:35):
these things.
And it, can go up to about 960lumens.
So that's a great starterflashlight.
The one caveat is that it doesget toasty.
That flashlight will get hotwith a fresh battery.
So be aware of that.
But other than that, greatstarter flashlight that I would
highly recommend if they'restill around.
Eric Paré generally will updatehis blog or will update the
store for other flashlights thathe finds.

(34:57):
Another good resource forflashlights Is steven light art
I want to say and he does justlike flashlight reviews in
general and he's a light painterSo like if you want to look at
the pros and cons and everythingyou want to get into it Check
out his reviews.
no, there's nobody who does morein depth reviews than he does.
other than that, tools, withlight painting.

(35:18):
Obviously you can make your ownlight painting tubes.
You can also get light paintingtubes from Eric Paré at the
lightpainting.storelightpaintingbrushes.com and
then ansonamelon.com Those aregoing to be your three main
areas that I would peruse.
light painting blades is goingto be cheaper than Ansonamelon.
But the thinness, especially ifyou're using blades, and they
have some different tools thereas well, there's more than just,

(35:38):
there's fiber optics, there's,different, like, collapsible
lightsabers, they have theportrait light, which I really
like to, like, light my subject,and, the blades are really thin.
And so I can't tell you how manytimes I dropped those blades and
they broke.
And I was like, dang, that's 40that are no good no more, which
you can hot glue, but it's notthe same.
but the Anson and Mellon blades,which are more expensive, their

(35:59):
flashlight, their new one, whichis amazing.
it costs 159, which seems insanefor a flashlight, but to be able
to change strobe, whatever youwant, intensity, as well as
color, make your own patterns,all from a Bluetooth app.
So it makes it super, supereasy.
it's honestly invaluable andit's like the only flashlight I
ever want to use anymore, unlessI'm doing tubes.

(36:21):
Like it's amazing.
if I didn't believe in it, likegiven I'm also like an affiliate
sponsored with them, but like, Iwouldn't be unless I believed in
it because it's so good.
And it's so useful.
And I'm like, Oh, continuingwhere we've been with like the
color shine flashlight, which islike a 35 flash on Amazon.
If you drop it, it becomes redforever.

(36:41):
And, uh, it runs off AAAbatteries and it's not very
bright.
So like, it was something thatwas sorely needed in the light
painting community to have anamazing color flashlight.

Yeah, I kind of want to go back to something
that you said earlier, now thatyou brought that up.
You said that, don't really playaround a lot with color.
Did I get that right when youwere talking about portraits?

When it comes to shapes when you're asking what
am I looking for?
I always care about the shapefirst Because color can always
be changed In post.
Well, yeah.
I mean, as a light painter, wedon't try to because it's all
about getting it in camera.
But I mean, like I can make thesame shape and it's just one
less thing I have to thinkabout.
Right.
It's just like when we'rebuilding a studio session, you

(37:21):
do one light at a time to seelike, do I like the way the
light falls?
Right.
And then you add, like, you wantto fill in the shadows.
Okay.
I'm gonna use a gel to do that.
But with light painting, it'slet me get the shape first.
Cool.
I like that shape.
Now let's add color to it.
See if I like that color andyou're going to adjust that way.
you're already going at ahundred miles an hour trying to
think about things cause you'rethinking more than you would an

(37:43):
average photo, which is ISO Fstop and shutter speed.
And so building one at a timeand just taking it piece by
piece is going to help you juststay sane.
And so that's why I don't worryabout color to start.

Maybe If that was maybe one of those tricks,
like you just shoot everything,whatever the color, daylight
balanced, I guess, as yourflashlight, and then just change
it in post.
But, you kind of brought up aninteresting point of, always
trying to get it right incamera.
would imagine, this is probably,I mean, correct me if I'm wrong,
one of the easiest things thatyou could fake in Photoshop,
right?

(38:18):
Because you're, trying to likemask yourself.
just these floating shapes andcolors, in the atmosphere.
You could technically fake allof this, but is the, thrill of
the of the hunt, I guess, thegetting it right in camera?

A thousand percent.
The thrill of the hunt isgetting it right in camera.
that is what makes it funbecause yeah, I could just make
it in Photoshop.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And that's, that's boring to me.
Like again.
I'm always wanting tochallenging myself because
that's what makes it fun.
Doing a Photoshop is boring,right?
Doing stuff with, just making animage with AI.
Like, cool.
I can do that.
But it's boring because I'mlike, all right, while I did the

(38:55):
thing, it wasn't fun for me.
Unless there's a very specificchallenge I'm trying to hit
that's difficult to do.
I don't want to do it.
So with like light painting,there's been instances where I'm
like, okay, cool.
I'm going to take this crownconcept and now we're going to
expand it.
So we'll start with the crownbehind their head and then
let's, Add two layers to thatthat are coming emanating from
their body.
Can I make those evenly spacedand make that look really clean?

(39:17):
That's really hard because youhave to think about where your
arm is, how the blade ischanging and shifting with the
camera and where the light isbeing angled at.
there's so many different.
Where you have to think aboutit, and that's what makes it
fun.
And with most light painters, welike to go out and do the thing.
We don't want to be behind acomputer.
photoshopping and stuff, becauseit's more fun to just do it in
real life.

I feel the same way about photography.
Yeah, a hundred percent.
so this will be my last Thiswill be my last question for you
is, how do you know?
That you've done a good job.
Like, how do you know at the endof the night that you didn't
waste your entire evening, andthat you're coming home with
something.
that you're proud of?

ha.
side, because we care aboutdoing it in camera, you'll know,
pretty much because you look atthe back of the camera like, I
got it or I didn't.
But like I alluded to earlier,did I have a good time?
Did I enjoy myself with thepeople or person I was hanging
out with?
If I did, it was a good night.
It doesn't really matter.
what I came away with, becauseat the end of the day, just like

(40:13):
with most things, if I failed, Ilearned things and now it's
going to make me better for nexttime.
So if I failed a bunch and I'mlike, man, none of this worked.
Or if I just had an off night,that's cool.
Check in with yourself to belike, all right, cool.
What could I do better?
I can't tell you how many timesI have had a migraine coming on.
And I was like, I'm going to dodrone light painting tonight.
Cause I need to go out and doit.

(40:34):
And every time I've done that,something went horribly wrong.
And so I just like.
Oh, cool.
I've learned this multipletimes.
I should just, if I have amigraine coming on, don't go out
because I'm going to misssomething very important and
it's going to crash my drone.
So like, got to check in onyourself.
And again, I feel all the timeyou're going to fail more in
light painting than you're goingto succeed.
But when you succeed or whenserendipitous serendipity stuff

(40:58):
happens, then it's justincredible.
there was one time it was duringI'm friends with a sound and
lighting production studio.
And I was going to have a friendcome in and, I guess there was a
miscommunication.
She was going to model and I waslike, all right, cool, whatever.
And then I ended up calling myfriend Rachel and I was like,
Hey, Rachel, what are you up toright now?
She's like, well, I was justtesting out makeup.
I'm like, perfect.

(41:18):
So you're already done.
available?
Can you come down to the studio?
And we had this big parachutedress and everything and
everything just came together.
And it's still my favorite photothat I've ever taken.
And it was just amazing.
And it was just because ithappened, right?
I didn't know I was going to getthat shot, but it happened and
it was great.
So, either things will happen,things they don't, but as long

(41:39):
as we had fun, all that reallymattered for me.

Russell, that's perfect.
I know a lot of people are goingto listen to that and they're
going to have a big smile ontheir face, Whether they're in
the car or at the gym andthey're going to look like a
weirdo, especially if they're atthe gym, hopefully not smiling
in front of somebody all creepy,but, appreciate the sentiment
for sure because I, feel thefeel the same way when those
little happen, There's, thanthat.
So, Russell, I russell, I thinkthat I asked you everything that

(42:03):
I I could think of, you're butyou're into this world more than
I am.
Is there anything that I didn'task you that you want to make
sure that people know aboutlight painting or something that
I missed?
missed?

so the first thing that comes to my mind is
one, when it comes to theclothing that your model wears,
we're not going to talk aboutfire or anything cause that's
way dangerous.
And there's a lot of things thatwe're not going to get into.
but when it comes to, if you'rejust using, like either lighting
them, or if you're dealing withambient light or anything like
that, black or white clothing isthe best.

(42:33):
The reason it's the best is tosay I have an orange colored
tube, and you're wearing a greencolored outfit.
Well, the ambient lighting fromthat orange color tube is going
to change the color of thatgreen outfit if I am not
lighting them with a strobe orsomething.
And so that's something you needto be aware of, is how your
ambient light is going to affectthe clothing that your subject
is wearing.
that's something that can, beeasily missed.

(42:55):
in that, and then also, otherthings is just, like,
communicate with your model.
Like, I always do a 3 2 1countdown.
And like, what's gonna happen?
We're gonna do this thing, andthen I'll let you know when you
can, you know, Stop being stilllike a statue! Otherwise they'll
be like, I need to breathe! Orlike, whatever, like, so
communicate, Anything with yoursubjects, Like if your arms are

(43:16):
really far out, or if they're onone foot, or whatever, like
literally try it right now.
If you put your arms out all theway, And you try to not make
them move, They're moving! Youcan't help it.
You can't stop.
You want to.
You can't stop.
for the average person, it'snext to impossible.
I've worked with likecontortionists and stuff where
they've been able to hold crazyposes and be perfectly still,

(43:36):
but you know, they've trainingfor that.
so just be aware of the bodypositions and what's going to
work or not.
You will definitely, if you domove, you're going to see like
this, like shadow almost, whichif you use effectively can look
really, really cool.
and then I think the only otherthing I can think of right now,
We didn't talk a lot about fiberoptics, but a lot of the time
people will use them like ontheir face or something like
that.
just be careful of how the fiberoptics go.

(43:59):
because if their eyes are openand those fiber optics can
potentially poke them in theeye.
So just be careful about that.
I've never had it happen.
I've done this a crap ton, I'veheard people say it's happened.
and then lastly, if you have,any questions or anything like
that.
So on my website, I have what Icreated the ultimate light
painting guide.
Okay, it is just a giantdocument.

(44:20):
That's on my website There's atable of contents that you can
just click on it will bring youto it And it's basically
everything I know how to do.
There's a bunch of videotutorials on there.
There's just like Resources forother people you can learn from
or tools or whatever So if youhave any questions don't know
where to look start there kindof find what you want see what
you like and then experimentyourself because that's going to

(44:42):
be how you learn and kind ofdetermine what you like.

where can we find this document?
Where can we find out more ofyour work as well online?

so the main two places, you can go to my
website, lightandlens.
com that's light and, and then le n s e.
com.
and that's where you can eitherfind, a variety of different
stuff.
And then I just like post onInstagram for the most part.
With the tag of light and lenswith the E at the end and
there's a whole bunch of stuffI'm working on now that I have a
camera that can do multipleexposure because Sony's can't it

(45:10):
makes me sad and So yeah,they're gonna be a lot more
multiple exposure related thingsthat are all gonna be about in
camera and pushing thatpossibility That hopefully will
blow your minds because I thinkit's really cool.
And there's literally onecompetition In America that I
know of, there might be two thatdoes in camera artistry.
So it's all about being incamera and slow, like find that

(45:32):
stuff, apply for that stuff andlike, See how you can really
push your brain to create stuffthat like, look at a photo and
look like, all right, this wasdone in Photoshop.
How could I do it in camera?
And that's what makes meexcited.
so if you think that way, that'sgoing to be the best way that I
think to go about any kind ofphotography, honestly.
but yeah, so those are the twoplaces you could find me as I

(45:52):
totally went on a totallydifferent side rant.

Perfect.
Well, Russell again, man, thankyou coming on today.
I'm going to include links toall those places in the show
notes.
Appreciate I appreciate you youcoming on and sharing everything
that you did to seeing this newmultiple exposure thing that you
got going on.
This is gonna be real cool.

Heck yeah, dude.
Thanks for having me on.

Woo.
All right, let's go ahead andrecap what we have learned today
from Russell.
First of all, big thanks toRussell for coming on and really
breaking all this down firsttakeaway is aim for just one
great shot, try to focus ongetting one truly exceptional
photo during shoot, whenever itis, you go out to plan to get

(46:32):
these photos.
And just assume that it's goingto involve a lot of trial and
error because trust me, it will.
But I think if you approach itwith that mindset, it's going to
be much less pressure and you'llfind that the creativity just
flows a whole lot better.
So try to spend more time previsualizing your shot, and try

(46:52):
to understand, what is thelighting that's going to go into
this?
What is the angle that you'regoing for?
What's a focal length?
What's a composition that you'regoing for?
So that when you go out there.
It'll just be more of a step bystep process to capturing that
photo.
Takeaway number two is toexperiment with different light
techniques.
Like I shared in the beginning,light painting can be a super
fun way to create unique images.

(47:14):
You can start with just a simpleflashlight and gradually
incorporate more complex methodsas you grow comfortable.
So again, start with that cheapflashlight and then focus on
shapes at first and thenexperiment with colors and then
other elements to add more depthto your photos as well.
Lastly, embrace failure as alearning opportunity, not as a

(47:35):
failure.
Not every photo is going to beperfect.
Trust me.
But remember, every failure is achance to learn and improve
because it failed for a reason.
And if you can figure out whatthat reason is and why you don't
like it, well, now you know whatnot to do next time.
So do that and then embrace theprocess and honestly, just enjoy
the journey.

(47:55):
It's a fun journey.
Enjoy.
I really want to hear yourbiggest takeaway again, in the
free and amazing beginnerphotography podcast community,
which you can join by headingover to beginner photopod.
com forward slash group rightnow, that was it for today.
Until next time.
Remember the more that you shoottoday, the better of a
photographer you will betomorrow.
Talk soon.

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Tools and Techniques for Stunning Light Painting Photos with Russell Klimas

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