May 15, 2025 • 24 mins
In this episode, my guest is Jacqui Barker, Global OEM Strategy Director at Keyloop, joining me from the floor of the Toronto International Auto Show.
We get into the real stuff—the behind-the-scenes friction points in today’s car buying journey and what needs to change now if dealerships want to stay relevant in a world of evolving tech and rising customer expectations, and let me tell you—this conversation will challenge how you see digital retailing, data integration, and the customer experience in automotive.
This one’s a must-listen if you’re serious about evolving your dealership experience with purpose (not panic).
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
MC (00:00):
This episode is brought to you by FlexDealer.
Hey auto industry, welcome tothis episode of the Dealer
Playbook Podcast.
We're at the TorontoInternational Auto Show.
(00:22):
I'm with my new pal, jackieBarker.
You are the Global OEM StrategyDirector at Keyloop.
Thanks so much for joining meon the podcast.
Jacqui (00:30):
Thank you for having me.
MC (00:31):
That sounds like a lot of responsibility.
Jacqui (00:36):
There's a big team.
It's okay, it's good.
My role really with Keyloop isoriginally I joined to work with
the Global Oem team and wewould build lots of interfaces
to make sure that manufacturersystems work in the dms's that
we provide.
So the technology relies ondata and that data has to come
from somewhere.
So we provide the software atthe retailer level and then
(00:59):
integrations up to the oem.
And now we're moving more intothe automotive retail space in
terms of tech and that doesn'tnecessarily have to just sit
with the dealer.
Lots of other platforms sellcars and all of those systems
require connecting in some way.
So it's about making sure weknow what the OEMs are trying to
achieve and then our technologydovetails into the right OEM in
(01:19):
the right market in a way yousound like a glutton for
punishment.
MC (01:23):
You said DMS technology and connecting systems.
And data and data, which weknow is a difficult task in our
industry.
With you know, everything isbehind an iron gate, as it were,
but you've keyed into somethingthat plays into the dealership
ecosystem.
Tell me about what discoveriesyou've made along the way of
(01:44):
pain points or friction pointsthat you can solve for the
dealer.
Jacqui (01:49):
So I joined Keyloop three years ago.
I was new to DMSs and I waslike why have they hired me?
I don't really understand whatthe DMS.
I didn't know the detail thatthe DMS sort of provided or how
it works as a tech platform.
My biggest driver was how canyou make it easy for a customer
to buy from you for in the carspace?
So I'd kind of come through amedia background selling
(02:09):
advertising.
So my background was very muchmarketing.
And then I moved into techthrough auto trader.
So I spent three or four yearslearning how consumers behave
online and we spent that timeeducating manufacturers into how
can you target your messagingat the right time when consumers
are coming into market.
And I think we spend a hugeamount.
We see lots of money spent onmarketing in the hope that
(02:32):
somebody will see it at theright time.
And actually when consumers arecoming into a marketplace like
an auto trader or an Amazon orsimilar bookingcom, you're in
the market to buy something.
So actually catch me then whenI'm browsing or thinking about
it.
Right, and then the mood tokeely was a bit more of a.
It felt like the right place tobe to learn about tech and how
(02:53):
that can solve for it.
So I think it's a very humanbusiness and people buy from
people, but technology can do somuch of the heavy lifting to
give you, as a business, theright data at the right time.
So so it was a massive learningcurve.
I'm not going to lie.
It was like every day is stilla school day for me.
It's like we do what and theycall this what, and every OEM
has a different set of names andcodes and project things that
(03:15):
are all different.
MC (03:17):
They said here's the textbook of automotive acronyms
that you need to learn.
Learn them.
Jacqui (03:21):
And then they're going to change tomorrow.
Yeah, great, thanks See, ya,it's fun.
MC (03:25):
And then we're going to come up with a new buzz acronym just
ahead of the next NADA.
You've said somethinginteresting, I think, which is
the experience, the examining ofthe industry and then leaning
into the technology, yeah, whenI think a fundamental mistake
and I'd love your thoughts onthis my opinion is a fundamental
mistake is technologists tryand create technology to solve a
(03:49):
problem, whether they know ornot it existed.
Jacqui (03:53):
In some cases, yeah, they do that, and I think where
you see, disruption usuallycomes out of something doesn't
feel right, it doesn't work,it's clunky, it's difficult.
So, like the iPhone is a greatexample of tech has provided
something we didn't even know weneeded.
So that was an incredibleexample of you put a little
(04:13):
computer in the back pocket ofevery single human and we now
have AI that does a lot ofthinking for us and I look I'm a
fan of AI, I'm not gonna lie.
So my brain works in a verymind mappy kind of way.
Long form content isn't, youknow, something I really relish.
But actually using ai can helpto form my thoughts into a, into
a long form proposal, if I needit to do that.
(04:34):
Yeah, so I think tech what Ifind frustrating is where we
know we've got problems and wejust don't seem to want to solve
them.
We just kind of blindly go ongoing oh, it's okay, you just
sweep it under the rug.
Yeah, and there was a pointmade.
Actually, I've been at quite afew conferences this week,
mainly to learn what's going onin Canada, because the market
(04:55):
here is different to SouthAfrica or New Zealand or the UK
or Europe.
Everyone is like a slightlydifferent life stage in their
tech evolution and one of thethings that was quite apparent
was somebody mentioned you couldput my grandfather in a car and
he wouldn't know how to startit.
But you could put him in adealership and he wouldn't know
how to buy a car because theprocess hasn't really changed.
(05:16):
And you think, yeah, we need todo something about that.
Actually, we need to make thatbetter.
MC (05:23):
You almost you just drug a cough out of me.
I laugh cough.
We're talking aboutgrandfathers and my grandpa,
cough laugh came out.
Isn't that fascinating.
Jacqui (05:33):
Yeah.
MC (05:34):
And my knee jerk question was Do we need to change it?
And then my immediate responsewas yes, we do.
We do need to change it.
Yeah, Because at first I yes,we do, we do need to change it.
Yeah, Because at first I waslike, oh, the marketer in me I
went oh, the process is terrible, so familiar, my grandpa can
(05:55):
still buy a car.
And then I realized all of mygrandparents are dead.
Jacqui (05:58):
Yeah.
MC (05:59):
They don't exist on this planet anymore, sadly.
And but my children?
I have a 15, almost 16.
They're in that you know thatalmost phase, like almost 16,
almost 15.
I have three kids.
We decided at Christmas to buythem phones.
We had staved off the wholephone thing for that long and I
(06:21):
was driving one day and thethought occurred to me but
they're the first generation whowill never not have this.
Yeah, and to your point aboutAI.
So to your point about do weneed to change the process?
We absolutely do, because thenext people buying cars are our
children.
Jacqui (06:39):
Yeah, it feels so.
We talked about reverseengineering.
So actually the whole topic ofthis was how can you reverse
engineer it?
And when I think about reverseengineering, it's like think
about it from the customer'spoint of view.
It still feels the processfeels very analog, but we have
all the tools to make it verydigital and connected.
The process feels very analog,but we have all the tools to
(07:00):
make it very digital andconnected.
And the frustration when Iworked for an e-commerce agency
for a while, one of the thingsthat I would do is try and buy
from that company.
If I was working for amanufacturer, I'd be like, right
, how easy is it?
And what's my lived experienceof trying to buy something from
this company?
And then, where do I get stuck?
And that's the bit where youthink well, why are you getting
stuck here?
So one example was amanufacturer had a really lovely
(07:20):
Facebook campaign with all ofthe accessories on the vehicle
and I just thought I want thatone as a consumer.
You see, someone's designed itLike you wouldn't go to a.
Maybe you have a tailored suit.
You wouldn't pick your liningor your buttons.
I don't want to configure a carfrom the ground up.
(07:43):
I just don't have the timeright or the, and I'm a car,
that I'm a petrol head and Iknow what I want and I wanted
that one and I tried to buy thatone and it took me into an
accessories journey where Icould add the wheels or the
spoiler or the thing, and I waslike I just wanted it with those
.
MC (07:52):
I wanted it, how I saw it yeah, I expect a car.
Jacqui (07:55):
Once I was like can I have the blacked out windows and
the drug dealer wheels?
That's the one I want?
They were like oh, we knowexactly which one you want, and
that was an S-Max back in theday, when I also have three kids
.
So my test driving experiencewas I would turn up at the
dealership with my life and if Icouldn't fit it in the car, I
didn't drive the car of doublebuggy three seats.
You know my life stage at thatpoint required huge amounts of
(08:18):
moving of humans and people andstuff and now very different.
My life is different.
The kids are all driving, yeah,so my youngest one they've just
not almost so.
One just got his big job, onejust bought his first actual
decent car, not a shed, and theyoungest one just passed his
test.
So I'm at the free stage oflife where?
But all of that?
take yourself I know, driveyourself to the thing.
(08:39):
I'm not doing it.
So, yeah, it's quite good.
So so I think the how do youreverse engineer something is
try and buy it from yourselves,and most of this industry
doesn't do that.
They get given a car and theydon't have to think about what
it's like to try and buy it, andthey still have very antiquated
practices of trying to notreally be clear about the
finance deal you're giving me.
(09:01):
I'll tell you the interest rate, maybe later, but I'll just
give you the monthly amount, andconsumers aren't stupid, and I
think that's the point where youhave a laptop in your pocket.
We're going to search and findthings.
Don't patronize me and think Idon't know what an interest rate
should be.
Yeah, you know, make it easyfor me.
Be transparent with me a bit oflike.
I'm a human to human, you know.
(09:21):
Yeah why?
MC (09:22):
what do you think is prevent ?
Because I agree with thiswholeheartedly.
I remember having aconversation with a dealer owner
and I encouraged him to do whatyou're saying like actually go
through the process.
He says, well, I've neverbought a car in my life, right,
he's, I think, second or thirdgeneration owner now.
Yeah, he's always had a demovehicle or you know whatever.
(09:43):
He's never had to go fromresearch to walk in dealership
to, you know, do the wholeprocess.
He just hasn't had to do that.
Yeah, what's preventing us fromdoing that?
I?
Jacqui (10:00):
mean it seems like it's so readily accessible to anybody
.
Yeah, it does, and it's so.
This is thing when you look atthe skill set within the
industry, and obviously we seethis a lot because we work with
manufacturers and retailers andwe also.
What we see is so another kindof reverse engineering is look
under the hood of what techyou've got in your business.
So if you're a retailer,reverse engineer it from the
people that work in yourshowroom and the system they
(10:20):
have to navigate into and out ofjust to sell that vehicle.
So I dare say most of thepeople that own the businesses
have come, they've come throughthe ranks of selling a vehicle,
booking it in for service, sothey know how it works.
But those things haven't changedand often the tech and we're
guilty of this, actually thetech that we would provide
doesn't do everything.
(10:41):
But we need to then have afairly robust and integrated
partner ecosystem to connect insome of those things that maybe
the core system doesn't actuallydo.
But if you don't integrate it,it means you've then got to log
into and out of another systemright to move my details from
your service experience with meinto the.
I'm going to sell you a new car.
Therefore, I'm going to have tore-enter all of your
(11:02):
information rather than havingan account area or having a way
that you hold my data and youknow then how to enhance my
experience.
So the biggest frustration Ifound as a consumer buying in
this because I do a lot ofmystery shopping with our
customers, just remember,actually I'm a car buyer is you
do this whole process and you'llmaybe find the thing that you
(11:24):
want and then you they'recomparing this thing with that
thing really unnecessarily hard.
Just to be able to compare,like total cost of ownership
with an ev is going to is goingto become more important.
How are you as a retailer,how's it how you help a customer
make the right decision?
And total cost of ownership?
I did it.
We had a, an event and we Iposed a question to the floor
(11:46):
and it was senior retailers inthe room like how many of you
could confidently explain thedifference between pence per
kilowatt hour versus dollar permile pound you know pence,
whatever and they all kind oflooked like horrified, like I
was going to ask them.
I was like, don't worry, I knowhow to explain, I know the
difference and I would find ithard.
But actually, if you cansimplify some of those data
(12:07):
points to make it easier forcustomers to buy and compare or
save their journey, so when theywalk in, still you've got all
of that history, history, youcan see what car I'm currently
driving.
You've probably got thevaluation integrated already
into your system becausevaluation data is readily
available through either that,you know, the local book
solution, auto trader, so youcan see all of that rich data.
(12:27):
And then when I walk in, you'rejust helping me do the final
bits of the journey.
And we've got so many digitaltools now with online document
signing, you don't have to havea signature.
So all of these things arethere.
It just.
I think our job actually isjust the plumbing.
In some cases, we just connectit all up so you make it easier
for the dealership to not haveto spend unnecessary hours
(12:50):
moving data around, and that'salso where mistakes happen.
MC (12:56):
Hey, does your marketing agency suck?
Listen, before we hop back intothis episode.
I know you know me as the hostof the dealer playbook, but did
you also know that I'm the CEOof FlexDealer, an agency that's
helping dealers capture betterquality leads from local SEO and
hyper-targeted ads that convert?
So if you want to sell morecars and finally have a partner
that's in it with you, thatdoesn't suck visit flexdealercom
(13:19):
.
Let's hop back into thisepisode.
I love that word.
This conversation to me isalmost like a forced moment of
pause to just reflect on.
Yeah, you're right, what are wedoing?
Because when you look at theand by the way, I mean my
audience knows this I am a laydown when it comes to buying a
(13:40):
vehicle.
I walk into a dealership and Igo that one, that same.
Yeah.
And somebody just said to meit's because you're a
salesperson Like mostsalespeople are just like.
Yeah, you know, they don't wantto make it difficult, but what
I think is interesting to yourpoint is, despite being a lay
down and saying that one, theytreat me like I just started the
(14:02):
process.
Jacqui (14:04):
They say, oh, he's a walk-in.
No, he isn't.
Nobody is a walk-in.
There is no such thing as awalk-in.
They've all done research and Ithink you may not have known
about me before, but I will justwalk in, having done a lot of
research, and there was a lot oftalk about that over the events
in the last three days.
So it's how much researchconsumers can do online.
(14:25):
We may not want to buy onlineand if it's a used vehicle, you
are going to want to go and seeit and test drive it and, as I
mentioned, try my life on.
It's like retail I'll go andtry on an outfit or your life,
or you know.
So there's some really coolthings you can do to make it
easier for customers just to dothat bit of the journey and save
(14:47):
it and come back.
So you know, let me put it in abasket, Let me think about it.
MC (14:52):
Right, yeah, isn't that interesting.
Do you think, under thispremise, under the concept of,
like you said, reverseengineering, getting a good
grasp of what we currently haveand where the the friction
points are, do you think maybewe rushed the whole digital
retail thing like?
Do you think we, instead of,because what you're saying
(15:14):
sounds very phased lined, verystrategic, oh yeah, very much
and we went yeah, let's justdisregard that.
And everyone wants to buyonline what I've.
Jacqui (15:22):
I mean what's interesting from a, an oem
global observation vector, isand I respect the big consulting
firms that like to you know,charge a lot of money to give
advice and they do a really goodjob when it comes to having
filling a skill gap for oems.
When you don't have digital,maybe skill in your business,
they'll kind of have you knowboots on the ground.
(15:43):
They can then stand up and helpyou build or configure a system
.
I think what what I foundstrange is we've seen like the
big four topics were automotive,like autonomous, connected,
electric, shared.
You would have gone to anyconference in the last 10 years
and you'd have heard peopletalking about oh, autonomous
(16:05):
vehicles are going to be thebest thing of the world, are
they really?
And connected vehicles.
I actually think there's areally exciting space in
connected vehicle technology andhow you can start to unlock the
data from the vehicle to keephumans safer and actually
autonomous vehicles have meant.
I drive a volvo.
That car has saved my life anumber of times, you know,
(16:26):
because it will almostanticipate something before I've
even seen it, because thecamera has recognized the motion
.
It will automatically slow medown.
So I think there's some greattechnology coming in that space.
But the electric and sharedcompletely went after COVID,
like, we saw a massive rise inthe sale of used vehicles
because people didn't want toshare a vehicle with anybody.
But the other thing as well thatI found quite frankly strange
(16:50):
is the oh, let's go agency.
Let's, yeah, we're all going tosell direct to consumer, and
there's what agencies sought tosolve was consumer experience
and brand experience on.
What the industry failed to dowas connect the dots with the
retailer and actually have thatonline in-store approach.
So you're absolutely right, wetried to literally go all in
(17:11):
without having a step-by-step,just do one thing really well.
So when I first started workingin e-commerce, it was a retail
agency that started buildingwebsites for manufacturers and
we launched the Europeananplatform for stalantis,
initially as a as an internalsales tool.
So they learned, they did lotsof learn and then do next.
Do the next thing.
You do one thing you make iteasier for your internal people
(17:35):
to buy vehicles, either leasethem and of course, you haven't
got to worry about lots ofdifferent finance options,
because it's you know, you'regetting it through your company
game, whatever.
So why fleet isn't online againis flummoxing to me, because
actually you've already got yourleasing terms set in place and
your company car drivers couldliterally buy those things
online.
That could be an onlinetransaction.
You don't need to have moneymoving around, but it's.
(17:58):
But the whole agency piece wasjust a bit of a sledgehammer to
crack a nut.
I think it was like let's goall in.
Yeah, well, really, consumersjust wanted to have oems, wanted
to give consumers a transparentexperience, and they were right
to try and do that.
And I just think if we'd havegone about it a bit differently,
which is just connect all ofyour data points so that
(18:18):
consumers have more transparentchoice, and you don't.
You know, in the uk now we havecomparison sites for everything
.
I can choose financial productstransparently.
I look at my mortgage rates.
I can see who's offering thebest deal and I'll choose the
best deal.
Insurance I look at who's gotthe best rates.
I choose the best ratesinterest.
(18:39):
Why we're not doing that in thecar space trip advisor?
As humans, we're hardwired tofollow the crowd.
That's why reviews reallymatter, because we want to feel
like safe in that, in thosenumbers, you know, as part of
the crowd.
If we do something differentthen we're at risk.
So I think if we were to justdo a phased approach, do one
thing really well make it easyfor me to value my car so I know
(19:01):
what I've got to spend.
You wouldn't buy a house untilyou knew what you were selling
your old house for Same as a carRight.
You won't make a decision untilyou know how much money you've
got to spend.
So the first thing you could dois just give the consumer a
valuation, and we did that whenwe first started building
websites.
It was just OEM.
Put a valuation tool on yourwebsite, make your website
(19:22):
stickier.
A valuation tool on yourwebsite, make your website
stickier.
I don't want to configuresomething, I just need to start
to make the process easier, andthe first step could be what's
my budget?
And then you can start to buildgreat.
Well.
So what are my choices?
So what stalantis did in europewas they simplified, not giving
you millions of configurations.
They gave you three choiceslike small, medium, large.
(19:43):
So what's your budget like?
Here's the mid-range, is theluxury, here's the base level.
Yeah, so as a consumer, you'remaking it really easy for me to
go.
Oh, I think I'm probablymid-level, or my sons are,
they're just learning to drive.
Yeah, base level shared,they'll spend not very much
money on a car.
I'm now.
I've earned, you know, longenough and I deserve to have a
(20:04):
bit of luxury.
So I've probably gone more atthe luxury end.
So, but consumers don't want tohave a million choices, and if
you look at how OEMs have almostnow made it easy for customers
to build to order, which alsomakes it difficult to value
residual values, blah blah.
So so I think, actually, if yousimplify, start to simplify and
make it easier for me to doanother thing.
You're collecting data about mein that process, so you know if
(20:28):
I'm valuing something, what I'mcurrently driving.
You can then help me choose thenext thing.
MC (20:32):
Sure, I love this.
I'm a nerd.
Okay, confession everybody I'ma nerd or geek.
Is that what we say?
Now, I don't know what we say,it doesn't matter, but as I
listen to you, I think about howand I don't know if this was
the case or not, but it's how Iperceive it when steve jobs
(20:54):
stood up and said you can put 4500, you know the ipod thing,
yeah that's.
that was the marketing pitch tothe general population.
What he he was really saying isI'm going to put a data
collection device in everyperson's pocket on the plane.
And then, just a few yearslater, it was like oh, guess
what?
Apple Play is now in yourvehicle, which learns about how
(21:15):
you drive and where you drive,and how often you drive, and
what music you listen to whileyou drive, and on and on.
And then, to your point, aboutinsurance companies and things
of that nature.
So now I have this always withme.
It knows we're in Toronto, itknows that we are next to each
other you know maybe notconnecting that, but the data is
(21:36):
definitely going somewhere thatit knows you're there and I'm
here.
It knows the flights you'regoing to be on, it knows
duration.
It knows so many things aboutus.
And yet, to your point, we talkabout the automotive purchase
as the second largest purchasemost people make and it is the
(22:00):
least served.
It is the least connected.
Yeah, it is the least connected, yeah, yeah, it's crazy.
I can go to Expedia right nowand get an all-inclusive
everything and it'll know whatmy preferences are, because it
saved all of that data from thelast time.
I, but not the vehicle purchase.
Jacqui (22:16):
My car is parked on my driver.
I could set its charge from myphone If I wanted to.
It's a hybrid, it's plugged in.
I could look at my phone nowand know exactly what my mileage
and how much charge I've got onmy car and what my range is.
It's nuts, isn't it?
MC (22:33):
Well, we've got a big job ahead of us.
Jacqui (22:35):
Just a bit, but yeah.
MC (22:39):
You've made me think.
You've given me some ahamoments and some points of pause
, and I know that's certainlythe case for the audience.
Jackie, how can those listeningand watching get in touch with
you and connect?
Jacqui (22:53):
I'm on LinkedIn, so by all means, follow me.
We're launching a podcast thisyear as well.
So trying to demystify, I think, some of the things that you
maybe don't want to ask abouttech, but you'd like to know,
but you're too afraid to ask andalso just trying to make it
easier for you to access all ofthe different micro moments in a
car life, ownership, life.
So we'd love to make it a bitmore accessible so that you can
make improvements in yourbusiness and drive efficiency by
(23:15):
using tech and then knowingwhere to start.
I think that's the bit where Istill have conversations with
oems, where they just they don'tknow where to start and they
throw the kitchen sink at it,and so I think you don't need to
throw the kitchen sink atanything, just like start small,
do it really well, then do thenext thing.
So you know you can find me onLinkedIn.
Thank you very much, andhopefully you'll tag we'll tag
(23:36):
something in this.
But, I'm based in the UK, sowhen I travel all over the world
with Keyloop so it's a reallyI'm very fortunate.
I get to work with a number ofour customers and sales teams
and then the fun stuff that weget to do is actually try and
co-create some of these techexperiences with oems and users
of our tech.
So if you're a technician or aservice advisor who's using
(23:58):
technology, we design with theuser in mind, so we do a lot of
shared discovery.
So if people want to getinvolved with that shared
discovery and then you learn howtech is built and developed, I
think that's a really greatopportunity for people that have
worked in automotive for a longtime to start to make that sort
of step into a tech space,because that's exciting.
You know.
(24:18):
It's a really great place to be.
MC (24:19):
Well, that's fascinating.
Well, thank you so much forjoining me on the Dealer
Playbook.
Jacqui (24:23):
Thanks for having me.
It's been a real pleasure, so Ihope we can do this again we
will hey.
MC (24:28):
Thanks for listening to the Dealer Playbook podcast.
If you enjoyed tuning in,please subscribe, share and hit
that like button.
You can also join us and theDPB community on social media.
Check back next week for a newDealer Playbook episode.
Thanks so much for.
This episode is brought to you by FlexDealer.
Hey auto industry, welcome tothis episode of the Dealer
Playbook Podcast.
We're at the TorontoInternational Auto Show.
(00:22):
I'm with my new pal, jackieBarker.
You are the Global OEM StrategyDirector at Keyloop.
Thanks so much for joining meon the podcast.
Jacqui (00:30):
Thank you for having me.
MC (00:31):
That sounds like a lot of responsibility.
Jacqui (00:36):
There's a big team.
It's okay, it's good.
My role really with Keyloop isoriginally I joined to work with
the Global Oem team and wewould build lots of interfaces
to make sure that manufacturersystems work in the dms's that
we provide.
So the technology relies ondata and that data has to come
from somewhere.
So we provide the software atthe retailer level and then
(00:59):
integrations up to the oem.
And now we're moving more intothe automotive retail space in
terms of tech and that doesn'tnecessarily have to just sit
with the dealer.
Lots of other platforms sellcars and all of those systems
require connecting in some way.
So it's about making sure weknow what the OEMs are trying to
achieve and then our technologydovetails into the right OEM in
(01:19):
the right market in a way yousound like a glutton for
punishment.
MC (01:23):
You said DMS technology and connecting systems.
And data and data, which weknow is a difficult task in our
industry.
With you know, everything isbehind an iron gate, as it were,
but you've keyed into somethingthat plays into the dealership
ecosystem.
Tell me about what discoveriesyou've made along the way of
(01:44):
pain points or friction pointsthat you can solve for the
dealer.
Jacqui (01:49):
So I joined Keyloop three years ago.
I was new to DMSs and I waslike why have they hired me?
I don't really understand whatthe DMS.
I didn't know the detail thatthe DMS sort of provided or how
it works as a tech platform.
My biggest driver was how canyou make it easy for a customer
to buy from you for in the carspace?
So I'd kind of come through amedia background selling
(02:09):
advertising.
So my background was very muchmarketing.
And then I moved into techthrough auto trader.
So I spent three or four yearslearning how consumers behave
online and we spent that timeeducating manufacturers into how
can you target your messagingat the right time when consumers
are coming into market.
And I think we spend a hugeamount.
We see lots of money spent onmarketing in the hope that
(02:32):
somebody will see it at theright time.
And actually when consumers arecoming into a marketplace like
an auto trader or an Amazon orsimilar bookingcom, you're in
the market to buy something.
So actually catch me then whenI'm browsing or thinking about
it.
Right, and then the mood tokeely was a bit more of a.
It felt like the right place tobe to learn about tech and how
(02:53):
that can solve for it.
So I think it's a very humanbusiness and people buy from
people, but technology can do somuch of the heavy lifting to
give you, as a business, theright data at the right time.
So so it was a massive learningcurve.
I'm not going to lie.
It was like every day is stilla school day for me.
It's like we do what and theycall this what, and every OEM
has a different set of names andcodes and project things that
(03:15):
are all different.
MC (03:17):
They said here's the textbook of automotive acronyms
that you need to learn.
Learn them.
Jacqui (03:21):
And then they're going to change tomorrow.
Yeah, great, thanks See, ya,it's fun.
MC (03:25):
And then we're going to come up with a new buzz acronym just
ahead of the next NADA.
You've said somethinginteresting, I think, which is
the experience, the examining ofthe industry and then leaning
into the technology, yeah, whenI think a fundamental mistake
and I'd love your thoughts onthis my opinion is a fundamental
mistake is technologists tryand create technology to solve a
(03:49):
problem, whether they know ornot it existed.
Jacqui (03:53):
In some cases, yeah, they do that, and I think where
you see, disruption usuallycomes out of something doesn't
feel right, it doesn't work,it's clunky, it's difficult.
So, like the iPhone is a greatexample of tech has provided
something we didn't even know weneeded.
So that was an incredibleexample of you put a little
(04:13):
computer in the back pocket ofevery single human and we now
have AI that does a lot ofthinking for us and I look I'm a
fan of AI, I'm not gonna lie.
So my brain works in a verymind mappy kind of way.
Long form content isn't, youknow, something I really relish.
But actually using ai can helpto form my thoughts into a, into
a long form proposal, if I needit to do that.
(04:34):
Yeah, so I think tech what Ifind frustrating is where we
know we've got problems and wejust don't seem to want to solve
them.
We just kind of blindly go ongoing oh, it's okay, you just
sweep it under the rug.
Yeah, and there was a pointmade.
Actually, I've been at quite afew conferences this week,
mainly to learn what's going onin Canada, because the market
(04:55):
here is different to SouthAfrica or New Zealand or the UK
or Europe.
Everyone is like a slightlydifferent life stage in their
tech evolution and one of thethings that was quite apparent
was somebody mentioned you couldput my grandfather in a car and
he wouldn't know how to startit.
But you could put him in adealership and he wouldn't know
how to buy a car because theprocess hasn't really changed.
(05:16):
And you think, yeah, we need todo something about that.
Actually, we need to make thatbetter.
MC (05:23):
You almost you just drug a cough out of me.
I laugh cough.
We're talking aboutgrandfathers and my grandpa,
cough laugh came out.
Isn't that fascinating.
Jacqui (05:33):
Yeah.
MC (05:34):
And my knee jerk question was Do we need to change it?
And then my immediate responsewas yes, we do.
We do need to change it.
Yeah, Because at first I yes,we do, we do need to change it.
Yeah, Because at first I waslike, oh, the marketer in me I
went oh, the process is terrible, so familiar, my grandpa can
(05:55):
still buy a car.
And then I realized all of mygrandparents are dead.
Jacqui (05:58):
Yeah.
MC (05:59):
They don't exist on this planet anymore, sadly.
And but my children?
I have a 15, almost 16.
They're in that you know thatalmost phase, like almost 16,
almost 15.
I have three kids.
We decided at Christmas to buythem phones.
We had staved off the wholephone thing for that long and I
(06:21):
was driving one day and thethought occurred to me but
they're the first generation whowill never not have this.
Yeah, and to your point aboutAI.
So to your point about do weneed to change the process?
We absolutely do, because thenext people buying cars are our
children.
Jacqui (06:39):
Yeah, it feels so.
We talked about reverseengineering.
So actually the whole topic ofthis was how can you reverse
engineer it?
And when I think about reverseengineering, it's like think
about it from the customer'spoint of view.
It still feels the processfeels very analog, but we have
all the tools to make it verydigital and connected.
The process feels very analog,but we have all the tools to
(07:00):
make it very digital andconnected.
And the frustration when Iworked for an e-commerce agency
for a while, one of the thingsthat I would do is try and buy
from that company.
If I was working for amanufacturer, I'd be like, right
, how easy is it?
And what's my lived experienceof trying to buy something from
this company?
And then, where do I get stuck?
And that's the bit where youthink well, why are you getting
stuck here?
So one example was amanufacturer had a really lovely
(07:20):
Facebook campaign with all ofthe accessories on the vehicle
and I just thought I want thatone as a consumer.
You see, someone's designed itLike you wouldn't go to a.
Maybe you have a tailored suit.
You wouldn't pick your liningor your buttons.
I don't want to configure a carfrom the ground up.
(07:43):
I just don't have the timeright or the, and I'm a car,
that I'm a petrol head and Iknow what I want and I wanted
that one and I tried to buy thatone and it took me into an
accessories journey where Icould add the wheels or the
spoiler or the thing, and I waslike I just wanted it with those
.
MC (07:52):
I wanted it, how I saw it yeah, I expect a car.
Jacqui (07:55):
Once I was like can I have the blacked out windows and
the drug dealer wheels?
That's the one I want?
They were like oh, we knowexactly which one you want, and
that was an S-Max back in theday, when I also have three kids
.
So my test driving experiencewas I would turn up at the
dealership with my life and if Icouldn't fit it in the car, I
didn't drive the car of doublebuggy three seats.
You know my life stage at thatpoint required huge amounts of
(08:18):
moving of humans and people andstuff and now very different.
My life is different.
The kids are all driving, yeah,so my youngest one they've just
not almost so.
One just got his big job, onejust bought his first actual
decent car, not a shed, and theyoungest one just passed his
test.
So I'm at the free stage oflife where?
But all of that?
take yourself I know, driveyourself to the thing.
(08:39):
I'm not doing it.
So, yeah, it's quite good.
So so I think the how do youreverse engineer something is
try and buy it from yourselves,and most of this industry
doesn't do that.
They get given a car and theydon't have to think about what
it's like to try and buy it, andthey still have very antiquated
practices of trying to notreally be clear about the
finance deal you're giving me.
(09:01):
I'll tell you the interest rate, maybe later, but I'll just
give you the monthly amount, andconsumers aren't stupid, and I
think that's the point where youhave a laptop in your pocket.
We're going to search and findthings.
Don't patronize me and think Idon't know what an interest rate
should be.
Yeah, you know, make it easyfor me.
Be transparent with me a bit oflike.
I'm a human to human, you know.
(09:21):
Yeah why?
MC (09:22):
what do you think is prevent ?
Because I agree with thiswholeheartedly.
I remember having aconversation with a dealer owner
and I encouraged him to do whatyou're saying like actually go
through the process.
He says, well, I've neverbought a car in my life, right,
he's, I think, second or thirdgeneration owner now.
Yeah, he's always had a demovehicle or you know whatever.
(09:43):
He's never had to go fromresearch to walk in dealership
to, you know, do the wholeprocess.
He just hasn't had to do that.
Yeah, what's preventing us fromdoing that?
I?
Jacqui (10:00):
mean it seems like it's so readily accessible to anybody
.
Yeah, it does, and it's so.
This is thing when you look atthe skill set within the
industry, and obviously we seethis a lot because we work with
manufacturers and retailers andwe also.
What we see is so another kindof reverse engineering is look
under the hood of what techyou've got in your business.
So if you're a retailer,reverse engineer it from the
people that work in yourshowroom and the system they
(10:20):
have to navigate into and out ofjust to sell that vehicle.
So I dare say most of thepeople that own the businesses
have come, they've come throughthe ranks of selling a vehicle,
booking it in for service, sothey know how it works.
But those things haven't changedand often the tech and we're
guilty of this, actually thetech that we would provide
doesn't do everything.
(10:41):
But we need to then have afairly robust and integrated
partner ecosystem to connect insome of those things that maybe
the core system doesn't actuallydo.
But if you don't integrate it,it means you've then got to log
into and out of another systemright to move my details from
your service experience with meinto the.
I'm going to sell you a new car.
Therefore, I'm going to have tore-enter all of your
(11:02):
information rather than havingan account area or having a way
that you hold my data and youknow then how to enhance my
experience.
So the biggest frustration Ifound as a consumer buying in
this because I do a lot ofmystery shopping with our
customers, just remember,actually I'm a car buyer is you
do this whole process and you'llmaybe find the thing that you
(11:24):
want and then you they'recomparing this thing with that
thing really unnecessarily hard.
Just to be able to compare,like total cost of ownership
with an ev is going to is goingto become more important.
How are you as a retailer,how's it how you help a customer
make the right decision?
And total cost of ownership?
I did it.
We had a, an event and we Iposed a question to the floor
(11:46):
and it was senior retailers inthe room like how many of you
could confidently explain thedifference between pence per
kilowatt hour versus dollar permile pound you know pence,
whatever and they all kind oflooked like horrified, like I
was going to ask them.
I was like, don't worry, I knowhow to explain, I know the
difference and I would find ithard.
But actually, if you cansimplify some of those data
(12:07):
points to make it easier forcustomers to buy and compare or
save their journey, so when theywalk in, still you've got all
of that history, history, youcan see what car I'm currently
driving.
You've probably got thevaluation integrated already
into your system becausevaluation data is readily
available through either that,you know, the local book
solution, auto trader, so youcan see all of that rich data.
(12:27):
And then when I walk in, you'rejust helping me do the final
bits of the journey.
And we've got so many digitaltools now with online document
signing, you don't have to havea signature.
So all of these things arethere.
It just.
I think our job actually isjust the plumbing.
In some cases, we just connectit all up so you make it easier
for the dealership to not haveto spend unnecessary hours
(12:50):
moving data around, and that'salso where mistakes happen.
MC (12:56):
Hey, does your marketing agency suck?
Listen, before we hop back intothis episode.
I know you know me as the hostof the dealer playbook, but did
you also know that I'm the CEOof FlexDealer, an agency that's
helping dealers capture betterquality leads from local SEO and
hyper-targeted ads that convert?
So if you want to sell morecars and finally have a partner
that's in it with you, thatdoesn't suck visit flexdealercom
(13:19):
.
Let's hop back into thisepisode.
I love that word.
This conversation to me isalmost like a forced moment of
pause to just reflect on.
Yeah, you're right, what are wedoing?
Because when you look at theand by the way, I mean my
audience knows this I am a laydown when it comes to buying a
(13:40):
vehicle.
I walk into a dealership and Igo that one, that same.
Yeah.
And somebody just said to meit's because you're a
salesperson Like mostsalespeople are just like.
Yeah, you know, they don't wantto make it difficult, but what
I think is interesting to yourpoint is, despite being a lay
down and saying that one, theytreat me like I just started the
(14:02):
process.
Jacqui (14:04):
They say, oh, he's a walk-in.
No, he isn't.
Nobody is a walk-in.
There is no such thing as awalk-in.
They've all done research and Ithink you may not have known
about me before, but I will justwalk in, having done a lot of
research, and there was a lot oftalk about that over the events
in the last three days.
So it's how much researchconsumers can do online.
(14:25):
We may not want to buy onlineand if it's a used vehicle, you
are going to want to go and seeit and test drive it and, as I
mentioned, try my life on.
It's like retail I'll go andtry on an outfit or your life,
or you know.
So there's some really coolthings you can do to make it
easier for customers just to dothat bit of the journey and save
(14:47):
it and come back.
So you know, let me put it in abasket, Let me think about it.
MC (14:52):
Right, yeah, isn't that interesting.
Do you think, under thispremise, under the concept of,
like you said, reverseengineering, getting a good
grasp of what we currently haveand where the the friction
points are, do you think maybewe rushed the whole digital
retail thing like?
Do you think we, instead of,because what you're saying
(15:14):
sounds very phased lined, verystrategic, oh yeah, very much
and we went yeah, let's justdisregard that.
And everyone wants to buyonline what I've.
Jacqui (15:22):
I mean what's interesting from a, an oem
global observation vector, isand I respect the big consulting
firms that like to you know,charge a lot of money to give
advice and they do a really goodjob when it comes to having
filling a skill gap for oems.
When you don't have digital,maybe skill in your business,
they'll kind of have you knowboots on the ground.
(15:43):
They can then stand up and helpyou build or configure a system
.
I think what what I foundstrange is we've seen like the
big four topics were automotive,like autonomous, connected,
electric, shared.
You would have gone to anyconference in the last 10 years
and you'd have heard peopletalking about oh, autonomous
(16:05):
vehicles are going to be thebest thing of the world, are
they really?
And connected vehicles.
I actually think there's areally exciting space in
connected vehicle technology andhow you can start to unlock the
data from the vehicle to keephumans safer and actually
autonomous vehicles have meant.
I drive a volvo.
That car has saved my life anumber of times, you know,
(16:26):
because it will almostanticipate something before I've
even seen it, because thecamera has recognized the motion
.
It will automatically slow medown.
So I think there's some greattechnology coming in that space.
But the electric and sharedcompletely went after COVID,
like, we saw a massive rise inthe sale of used vehicles
because people didn't want toshare a vehicle with anybody.
But the other thing as well thatI found quite frankly strange
(16:50):
is the oh, let's go agency.
Let's, yeah, we're all going tosell direct to consumer, and
there's what agencies sought tosolve was consumer experience
and brand experience on.
What the industry failed to dowas connect the dots with the
retailer and actually have thatonline in-store approach.
So you're absolutely right, wetried to literally go all in
(17:11):
without having a step-by-step,just do one thing really well.
So when I first started workingin e-commerce, it was a retail
agency that started buildingwebsites for manufacturers and
we launched the Europeananplatform for stalantis,
initially as a as an internalsales tool.
So they learned, they did lotsof learn and then do next.
Do the next thing.
You do one thing you make iteasier for your internal people
(17:35):
to buy vehicles, either leasethem and of course, you haven't
got to worry about lots ofdifferent finance options,
because it's you know, you'regetting it through your company
game, whatever.
So why fleet isn't online againis flummoxing to me, because
actually you've already got yourleasing terms set in place and
your company car drivers couldliterally buy those things
online.
That could be an onlinetransaction.
You don't need to have moneymoving around, but it's.
(17:58):
But the whole agency piece wasjust a bit of a sledgehammer to
crack a nut.
I think it was like let's goall in.
Yeah, well, really, consumersjust wanted to have oems, wanted
to give consumers a transparentexperience, and they were right
to try and do that.
And I just think if we'd havegone about it a bit differently,
which is just connect all ofyour data points so that
(18:18):
consumers have more transparentchoice, and you don't.
You know, in the uk now we havecomparison sites for everything
.
I can choose financial productstransparently.
I look at my mortgage rates.
I can see who's offering thebest deal and I'll choose the
best deal.
Insurance I look at who's gotthe best rates.
I choose the best ratesinterest.
(18:39):
Why we're not doing that in thecar space trip advisor?
As humans, we're hardwired tofollow the crowd.
That's why reviews reallymatter, because we want to feel
like safe in that, in thosenumbers, you know, as part of
the crowd.
If we do something differentthen we're at risk.
So I think if we were to justdo a phased approach, do one
thing really well make it easyfor me to value my car so I know
(19:01):
what I've got to spend.
You wouldn't buy a house untilyou knew what you were selling
your old house for Same as a carRight.
You won't make a decision untilyou know how much money you've
got to spend.
So the first thing you could dois just give the consumer a
valuation, and we did that whenwe first started building
websites.
It was just OEM.
Put a valuation tool on yourwebsite, make your website
(19:22):
stickier.
A valuation tool on yourwebsite, make your website
stickier.
I don't want to configuresomething, I just need to start
to make the process easier, andthe first step could be what's
my budget?
And then you can start to buildgreat.
Well.
So what are my choices?
So what stalantis did in europewas they simplified, not giving
you millions of configurations.
They gave you three choiceslike small, medium, large.
(19:43):
So what's your budget like?
Here's the mid-range, is theluxury, here's the base level.
Yeah, so as a consumer, you'remaking it really easy for me to
go.
Oh, I think I'm probablymid-level, or my sons are,
they're just learning to drive.
Yeah, base level shared,they'll spend not very much
money on a car.
I'm now.
I've earned, you know, longenough and I deserve to have a
(20:04):
bit of luxury.
So I've probably gone more atthe luxury end.
So, but consumers don't want tohave a million choices, and if
you look at how OEMs have almostnow made it easy for customers
to build to order, which alsomakes it difficult to value
residual values, blah blah.
So so I think, actually, if yousimplify, start to simplify and
make it easier for me to doanother thing.
You're collecting data about mein that process, so you know if
(20:28):
I'm valuing something, what I'mcurrently driving.
You can then help me choose thenext thing.
MC (20:32):
Sure, I love this.
I'm a nerd.
Okay, confession everybody I'ma nerd or geek.
Is that what we say?
Now, I don't know what we say,it doesn't matter, but as I
listen to you, I think about howand I don't know if this was
the case or not, but it's how Iperceive it when steve jobs
(20:54):
stood up and said you can put 4500, you know the ipod thing,
yeah that's.
that was the marketing pitch tothe general population.
What he he was really saying isI'm going to put a data
collection device in everyperson's pocket on the plane.
And then, just a few yearslater, it was like oh, guess
what?
Apple Play is now in yourvehicle, which learns about how
(21:15):
you drive and where you drive,and how often you drive, and
what music you listen to whileyou drive, and on and on.
And then, to your point, aboutinsurance companies and things
of that nature.
So now I have this always withme.
It knows we're in Toronto, itknows that we are next to each
other you know maybe notconnecting that, but the data is
(21:36):
definitely going somewhere thatit knows you're there and I'm
here.
It knows the flights you'regoing to be on, it knows
duration.
It knows so many things aboutus.
And yet, to your point, we talkabout the automotive purchase
as the second largest purchasemost people make and it is the
(22:00):
least served.
It is the least connected.
Yeah, it is the least connected, yeah, yeah, it's crazy.
I can go to Expedia right nowand get an all-inclusive
everything and it'll know whatmy preferences are, because it
saved all of that data from thelast time.
I, but not the vehicle purchase.
Jacqui (22:16):
My car is parked on my driver.
I could set its charge from myphone If I wanted to.
It's a hybrid, it's plugged in.
I could look at my phone nowand know exactly what my mileage
and how much charge I've got onmy car and what my range is.
It's nuts, isn't it?
MC (22:33):
Well, we've got a big job ahead of us.
Jacqui (22:35):
Just a bit, but yeah.
MC (22:39):
You've made me think.
You've given me some ahamoments and some points of pause
, and I know that's certainlythe case for the audience.
Jackie, how can those listeningand watching get in touch with
you and connect?
Jacqui (22:53):
I'm on LinkedIn, so by all means, follow me.
We're launching a podcast thisyear as well.
So trying to demystify, I think, some of the things that you
maybe don't want to ask abouttech, but you'd like to know,
but you're too afraid to ask andalso just trying to make it
easier for you to access all ofthe different micro moments in a
car life, ownership, life.
So we'd love to make it a bitmore accessible so that you can
make improvements in yourbusiness and drive efficiency by
(23:15):
using tech and then knowingwhere to start.
I think that's the bit where Istill have conversations with
oems, where they just they don'tknow where to start and they
throw the kitchen sink at it,and so I think you don't need to
throw the kitchen sink atanything, just like start small,
do it really well, then do thenext thing.
So you know you can find me onLinkedIn.
Thank you very much, andhopefully you'll tag we'll tag
(23:36):
something in this.
But, I'm based in the UK, sowhen I travel all over the world
with Keyloop so it's a reallyI'm very fortunate.
I get to work with a number ofour customers and sales teams
and then the fun stuff that weget to do is actually try and
co-create some of these techexperiences with oems and users
of our tech.
So if you're a technician or aservice advisor who's using
(23:58):
technology, we design with theuser in mind, so we do a lot of
shared discovery.
So if people want to getinvolved with that shared
discovery and then you learn howtech is built and developed, I
think that's a really greatopportunity for people that have
worked in automotive for a longtime to start to make that sort
of step into a tech space,because that's exciting.
You know.
(24:18):
It's a really great place to be.
MC (24:19):
Well, that's fascinating.
Well, thank you so much forjoining me on the Dealer
Playbook.
Jacqui (24:23):
Thanks for having me.
It's been a real pleasure, so Ihope we can do this again we
will hey.
MC (24:28):
Thanks for listening to the Dealer Playbook podcast.
If you enjoyed tuning in,please subscribe, share and hit
that like button.
You can also join us and theDPB community on social media.
Check back next week for a newDealer Playbook episode.
Thanks so much for.
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