This week, I'm joined by the amazing Tayrell from StaysKrunchyinMilk, discussing fatherhood and the importance of being present in a child's life.
Podcast: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/stays-krunchy-in-milk/id656626723
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Episode Transcript
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(00:20):
Thank you. Welcome to the Delvin Cox
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experience, the podcast which each week I'm on a one man
mission to you. Now I coast to diversity.
I'm your host, Delvin Cox, and first and foremost, happy
Father's Day to all the great dads out there.
And to celebrate this monumentous occasion, I brought
in another great dad, someone I've known for several years and
(01:06):
I've known him. Not only is he a great man, he's
a great father. I think that I think when you're
a great father, that speaks volumes about a person.
So the host of Stage Crunchy Milk, Coast of Cadillac on Mars,
coast of the other podcast, I can't say the name of Creme
Brulee. Creme Patissier.
(01:28):
I know what any of that it meansit's some podcast is really
popular apparently from the showI don't watch my homie tea.
How you doing bro? I'm good, I'm good.
Thank you so much. Thank you for having so much
patience for me tonight. We were having some technical
difficulties on this end of the business y'all, but we get, we
air, we all here. It sounds like he was using one
of those mics that you would buylike as a toy store.
(01:53):
It's my dope setup too. It's my good mic, it's my good
like recorder because. There's one of those.
This Elgato has not been workingat all.
The fact it's working right now,Miracle.
So the Elgato had died of me, soI was like, what do I have that
I could use? And I was like, oh, I got my pie
track and I know I can run the feed through it and it normally
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works like a champ. I've been using it at work.
I've been using to record. Tonight it was like fuck you.
Nope, happens like that sometimes.
That's how I'd be nice. But like all great dad,
sometimes you got to figure shitout.
Facts. As always, like to start the
podcast off with the five for five, Five questions 5 asks to
get the ball rolling. T Are you ready for this
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Father's Day edition? Up to 5 for five.
Not even in the slightest, but we going to make it happen.
Question number one, give me your favorite dad joke.
Oh, do I have a favorite dad joke?
I don't know if I have a favorite dad joke.
Now, did you say that? That's going to bother me.
(02:59):
Mess it up man, got to have one.Now here's here's what I tell
you. Something I always say, though,
they have the what, what, what, what somebody else tell you like
you ain't got to do it and or something to that effect.
And my answer is always all I got to do is stay black and pay
taxes and then I just leave it at.
That's a good one. That's a good dad saying.
(03:22):
I appreciate that. That's a dad ass saying Yeah,
yeah, I like that. One question #2 give me your top
five TV dads. OK, hold on.
(03:47):
I'm going to write it so I can just let's let's let's take a
look at at, at TV fathers who are, who are, who are basically.
I'm not. I'm let you know right now.
I didn't grow up with my father.TV dads raised TV dads raised
me. OK, so you should be good at
this. Look man, I'm not trying to say
nothing about nothing, but I'm be real with you, Bill Connolly
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was a good TV dad, TV dad, TV dad.
TV dad? Yes, real life person.
Real piece of shit. You know, it was a good dad and
I, and I feel like we'd be like,come on, man, your man's Mr.
Drummond. Oh yeah, yeah, he was a great
(04:28):
dad taking any. Children, it wasn't his own, but
also looking out for his daughter that was his.
So respect due to Mr. Phillip Drummond.
He took in three kids that wasn't his own because Roman
there see, remember, see, I was a big Different Strokes fan was
Arnold Willis in the later seasons.
They always bring in a a a childthat don't don't look the part.
(04:50):
Yeah, it was sad because he he he remarried that girl, that
Lady, and he took in Sam as his son.
That Lady was oh come on, T not Delta Burke, the other lady from
Designer Women. Yes.
Yeah, yeah. Word up.
OK, OK. Respect you man. 3 kids that
wouldn't. He is.
Can't be a better dad than that,you know what I'm saying?
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Let me see TV dash that I. So you got Bill Cosby, You got
Phillip Drumming. Who else you got?
Yeah, as I try, as I run throughmy my TV Fathers of the Dad from
Boys Meet Boy Meets World, Mr. Mr. Mr. Well, man, what was that
last name on that show? I don't remember his name.
It was. Matthews.
(05:34):
Matthews Yeah, yeah, Mr. Matthews But Speaking of which,
if you, if we want to take the route, you're saying the dad
from the Wonder Years was a hardass dude, but a good dad.
That is true. Oh, you just put them on your
list. Yeah, yeah, we put Mr. Woodman
wonder years. And A Boy Meets World.
Boy Meets World. OK, that's 4.
(05:54):
And Uncle Phil. OK, glad you got the Uncle Phil
like I was getting worried for asecond.
One of the greatest TV fathers that ever was once again another
another brother who's like, I got to take care of my my my, my
people's family, brought in his nephew and looked out for him
and tried to raise him along with his own kids right that he
looked out for respect, dude. Uncle, Uncle, Uncle Phil, man.
(06:14):
Yeah, also apparently a really good person like.
Everybody said in life was apparently a very good dude, so
we're. Stand up dude.
Apparently. Rest easy.
He was also the voice of Shredder on the Ninja Turtles.
I like it let. Me tell you something when he
passed away, right? I was hurt.
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My man Dan was more taken aback that we lost Shredder than by
Uncle Phil. He was really, he was really
wrecked by the fact we lost Uncle Phil because he was a dude
who came on fresh prison, like, you know, a lot of kids did.
But when he was, when we actually said, Oh yeah, he was
also the voice of Shredder, you could almost see him start
crying. It was bad.
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I didn't know that. Because not everybody dork's
like we are nobody. Nobody in certain depths of
dork, you know what I'm saying? So.
I like it. That's a good point.
All right, question #3. No, that can't be 3.
Yeah, that's three. Is that 3?
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OK, go on. Three.
All right. Because it was the first
question was dad jokes. Dad jokes OK this.
Is 3 we all three now? Very good.
All right. On the flip side, the three
worst TV Dads cartoons count. I, I, I, I truly did not get
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down with Tim Allen on home improvements, even though a lot
of people would. I don't think he was a good dad.
He kind of sucked. Yeah, oddly enough, same thing
can go for your boy Raymond or Everybody Loves Raymond.
Love that show. Funny shows over the song.
Good dude. But his wife held that house
now. Yeah, OK.
You know what I'm saying? He really wouldn't.
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He really wouldn't. Contributing.
Let's see if you get one more. One more you got I have one in
mind. Let's see if you name the person
I got in mind. See if you got a cartoon dad in
in mind. Yes, I do.
Or cartoon involvers that I justjust can't, that I cannot get
down with. And I'm like.
Let me see, I got one in mind when I say like, oh, that makes
a lot of sense. I'm gonna go Papa Smurf who
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irresponsible when he had too many children.
That that aspect he is. He is the future of cartoon
characters, AKA future. The answer is Goku.
Oh, watch Dragon Ball. Goku is a fucking terrible day.
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Fair, fair. He sends his son out to fight
these giant ass bad ass fucking creatures trying to destroy the
world and then he just leaves for like several months to a
year. It just leaves his son.
Some random ass got a raise. Everybody else was a better
father to Goku's son than Goku. Ain't that a blip?
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So it's so I'll hear turns the phrase Goku and Son Goku.
Is that Goku's kid or Son Goku Goku's real name?
I don't I don't watch dragon his.
Son Goku, because he's his name's Goku.
OK. That's that, but that's they
call him Son Goku. I forgot why they call him Son.
Goku is his son like like Asian.Your son like son like son, son.
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Can't call it. Yeah, your man.
Your man's was not his. Son's name is Gohan.
Gohan OK, Yeah, I feel bad if you go, huh?
Sorry. Awful Dad.
I can like I I just buy, you know, osmosis be like I can name
you a bunch of Dragon Ball characters.
I can, I can tell you, I can sayMajin Boo, that little pink
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dude. Correct.
Dad looks like a dude who look like a who look like an Egyptian
Anubis. I don't know his name, but I
know him. It's this dude with the turban
on. Because it's like I say, if you
were in my house right now, there are two Dragon Ball
statues right here. My kit.
Put it I'm talking about what ishis name?
Piccolo. OK, Piccolo plays a motherfucker
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with his Cape. His Cape is dope.
Yeah, give it up to him. I don't know which which.
Character So you have a you havea statue of Piccolo in your
house but don't know who the fuck he is.
I'm grabbing both. How did that happen?
Because my son, my son will fuckwith him.
OK. So I don't know who these people
are. The one with the gold hair is
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Goku, okay. The other one is Piccolo All.
Right, All right. Piccolo plays a motherfucker.
Do you remember Robin Harris? I like it.
I respect. That's just me loving my kid,
you know what I'm saying? He put them up, he put them
right down. I'm like, I don't care.
And so he has them. If you, if you were here, you
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can see it's like the way to my house set up is a little opening
right here and like there's likeshelves.
So he has one-on-one side 1 and facing the other across from
each other. OK, I love it.
Question #4 All right, what is the last time, last thing you
watched on television that made you cry?
OK, we just want something recently that that almost got me
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in my got my goat. And what was it?
Because we've been watching a ton like this has been the Last
of Us and or it was the other night too.
That's crazy because when my my lady was just like, Oh my God,
turn to make sure I was OK, She's like, are you all right?
I'm like, oh, so whatever it is,it really got me and I'm trying
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to think what it was. I can't call it.
It happens. Trust me, your boy be in tears a
lot that came with fatherhood. Promise you.
I used to get a little worked up, but never actually broke the
tears never broke free. I'd be like I'd feel it in you'd
feel the clip, as they'd say, right and then well past being a
father, being a parent, it was like shit would just hit me like
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a ton of bricks and I'd be like the waterworks boy.
Tell me right now. Something I can say that got me
recently enough, though, was we saw wicked in the theater.
I'm telling you right now, that last song of.
Oh, that's crazy. Fantastic movie.
Great movie for sure, for sure, but her singing.
So if you care to find me, look to the West grand sky.
(12:18):
Anyway, that whole scene as as as you go through that movie
right there, as as you see her working up to her powers and
start saying so I just I was just tears flowing down my face.
So I'll be watching that shit right.
It was bad. I knew nothing about Wicked.
All that I knew about Wicked, itwas a sequel to The Wizard of
Oz, right? Yeah, pretty much, I guess.
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Yeah. Yeah, yeah, Sequel, prequel, I
guess you could call it. So I said when I saw like the
previous stuff I like this looksinteresting.
I kind of want to see it and getget their take on and kind of
like figure out what it is. I'm like I knew nothing about
it. Yeah.
I when I say I was blown away for how good it was and I was
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enthralled in the story and thenwhen the ending happened, I like
jumped out out my seat. I'm watching this at home.
Like I'm watching end game and shit like oh, this is fucking
awesome. Like the whole sequence that
happened at the final acting like, oh, this the end.
They're like oh there's a Part 2like this is dope as shit.
Yeah, and and now I think about it, it definitely was that last
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episode, The Last of Us, when they did the job flashback.
And it was the last scene with him and Ellie where he was
explaining of, well, she was asking basically, like, did you
merk out that hospital? He's like, I did.
And I love you and I hope, you know, I hope you do a little
better than I do. Joe was crying and I was crying.
I will. I will keep my Last of Us
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comments to myself about that season.
I had no, no, no, no, let's be real.
Because this is what we do, man.It was fine.
A lot of highs, but the lows were so incredibly low that it's
almost like to the point was like, this is disrespectful.
I agree, that's the problem I had with it.
Yeah, yeah, like last night's episode was really, well, a lot
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last night, two nights ago episode really bother me because
they really took took away from the LE that we know.
And I, my man Anthony been telling me this forever.
He hate, he hates the show, not really hate.
He really doesn't like Joe because he loves the games so
much and to to see to see what essentially is like what seemed
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to be a real clueless Ellie really bothered him.
I kind of and if I and I finallysaw a biggest day, I was like,
oh, they played my girl on this.The show is really watered down,
Yeah. And and because I don't want to
make this about Lazarus, but my biggest thing was what the thing
that I liked about the the game is, well, especially part one.
(14:50):
Yeah, that the choice, the big choice of Part 1 was ambiguous.
Yeah. So there were sort of people
having a conversation about whatwas right, what was wrong, how
they felt about it. The show tells you the answer to
that choice, and that takes the fun away from it.
Yeah. Oddly enough, fatherhood right
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there and then and there. Yeah, you know what I'm saying?
As people were like, oh, as a parent, go would you go save
your kid or you gonna let him save the world?
I'm like, the answer is always going to be, I'm going to say my
kid because my kid in in this situation of of the Last of Us
didn't actually have a choice. Yes, exactly, that was my whole
argument about it. You took away the choice from
the kid. Yeah, you just knocked my kid
out and took him to cut him, cuthim open without having a
(15:33):
discussion with them at first. So no, I'm gonna shoot you all
the fucking. Ribbons and I feel like getting
a little bit less for still choice for us, but I feel like
the ideal of them taking away that option and that choice,
just making it seem like, oh, that choice.
But then then when that's a, that's a huge part of that, that
(15:53):
that decision. It's just creators sometimes be
just talking. I don't bang with JK Rowling at
all. You know, she's a she's a
transphobia and I cannot abide by that.
But she constantly for a while there was just like, you know,
her mommy was black. You know, doodle Doo was gay.
Just shit. That was never in the in the the
material. It's just given enough time.
(16:14):
Creators just got to have it, just sprinkling other shit that
they thought they might or should have, could have, did.
Yeah. And I think that's what Neil
Druckman is doing right now. And I think that I think that
because I had in the PSVG chat, I was saying that sometimes
creators don't do kind of do toomuch and don't always do what's
(16:38):
best for their property. And, and, and it's not because I
know people's like, Oh yeah, butit's the creator.
It's the creator said, yes, it'sthe greatest decision.
But at the same time, they're creating something for people to
enjoy. Yeah.
And you have to appease the masses to that aspect unless
you're making something for yourself and making something
(16:59):
for yourself, it's whatever. But if you're making a story to
be enjoyed, you got to sometimesbend a little bit.
You, you, you put it on the world and you let the world do
it what it will. No, it's your baby and you want
to do some stuff with it. But.
If if the world is telling you they want something one way and
you do it the other way, the people, people have a problem
(17:20):
with that. That's because, well, that's
what it is. Perfect example is Game of
Thrones, the Game of Thrones finale.
Everybody wanted something one way and they and they kind of
just try to go against the grainand people like this.
This sucks. They swear that's the outline
that Georgia R Martin gave them.And in fact, Georgia R Martin
has said that is the outline I gave them.
So it's not like they went against the grain.
(17:41):
They went with the grain, a little bit of grain they had
left. Yeah, and, and they'll let
people and people rejected it. Sometimes you got to listen to
the people. Facts.
Sometimes you get what they want.
Get out of here. We know, we know.
Drove all off the Cliff. That's that's what this show
does. We do the 55, sometimes the last
five minutes, sometimes the last30 minutes.
Depends on the questions. Question #5 that's the easy one
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for you. Or maybe not.
Sometimes, sometimes not. What is the most dad ass thing
that you have in your house? You look around, you're like
man, this is some shit a dad would have.
What is something that you have that's like that besides that
hat? Brand new my my baby just got it
from my lady got it for me. We saw it a hot time ago and I
(18:24):
was like a Totoro safari style hat got to have it and then she
came home with the other day outof nowhere and I was like that's
so dope for a while there until I was the God the world decided
Oh T been doing it right this whole time.
Turntable T was not rocking turntables like I was rocking
turntables for as long as I was rocking the turntable.
With no disrespect, I'm not trying to say I was a a
(18:45):
turntable hipster. I'm not.
Some people have been holding onwith the turntable since the
jump, but for a while there it was really it was very much a
your dad listens to records is what my kids friends say, and it
just seems so out of pocket. But in in indeed I do.
You see these boom boxes back behind me.
You know what I'm saying? I got Lego all over the place.
(19:07):
You were saying I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I don't know, man.
I'm my own type of dad, I guess you know what I'm saying.
See, that's the cool thing abouttoday and dads of today.
I feel like because generations have changed and one thing about
our generation, whether people want to admit to it or not,
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we're not the absentee father that the previous generation was
for the most part, whether whether they're together or not,
the dads are being more on thesekids life, black dads and kids
in these kids life. And you know, and it's very
different. And not only that, the dads are
younger, like our 40 feels a lotdifferent than our parents 40 in
(19:54):
terms of like we still have likeart, like we still play video
games. We still have collectibles.
I'm not just talking about me. And you like a general
consistence when I look like these are like these people.
I know my friends who are my age, who have kids, they're
like, yeah, we still play video games.
We still collect things these this is what we spend our time
with. We we may watch sports and stuff
(20:15):
like that, but we still are veryyoung at heart in many ways and
I think because of that our kidscan relate to us.
To a certain degree and and levels very.
Different than our, our, our generation, our dads kind of
felt when when they were when the ones we had were around, you
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know, it was very, very different vibe.
Yeah. Then what we have today, you
know, where we kind of feel likeat least I can, I don't speak
from my experience. The dance I see don't have that
same vibe. The dance I grew up watching,
watching scene had like, you know, it's just very different.
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And I guess because we grew up in a different era, we're we're,
I want to say we're really the first wave of hip hop kids true
that grew up in that, that era of hip hop and that, that kind
of cool era where we had like hip hop and we had video games.
We had like, you know, the firstwave of computer kids.
(21:17):
Really. Yeah.
So a lot of the things that our parents had is different.
Like, you know, our parents had other things, but it's not like
our our wave was our wave is just different.
Yeah, I, I, you know, I'll see stuff show up and I'm not, I'm,
I'm, I'm firmly in Gen. X show.
And some people like he's like millennial millennials be like,
I'm like millennials. I was the first one on the
computer like you were not because I was on the computer.
(21:38):
Trust your boy. We had AOL chat rooms and stuff
like that in Myspace. Yeah, man.
So there's levels to it. I'm saying, did you have an
Apple 2 E in your classroom? I did so.
Were you playing Doom or Wolfenstein or I come to San
(21:58):
Diego? I did play indeed Return to
Castle Wolfenstein and and and because I because that's that's
the one I that one of the first first person joints ever I've
ever messed around with. And I think we checked it out
from the library oddly enough and it was multiple disk.
Yes. And so you had to just gotta and
one, if you once you got them all loaded, hope your computer
(22:20):
can handle it, because a lot of computers could not.
And So what it ended up being isthat you you'd be having like
just a a little box and kind of like the center of the screen
that you're playing the game on as opposed to being full screen.
And obviously we got the computers that can handle, you
know, the fuller screen graphics.
Yeah, man, I, I, yeah. Return to cover Wolf.
Wolfenstein was the first joint I ever played, man.
So first person joint I ever played.
(22:42):
So very. Specific.
Yeah. Yeah, well.
Well, let's get right to it man,since we're talking about
fathers. Stuff like that.
What what's your journey of becoming a dad and what it's
been like for you? So I.
Have two kids I Once Upon a timeI would have told you I had a
boy and a girl and I caught all the Pokémon but life does not
(23:04):
stay that way now does it? So now I have two boys and well,
at this point practically 2 men and my, my, my oldest son was a
not perfectly because it was definitely a challenge to get
him into this world, but he was he was applauded and schemed and
planned child who was created via it's not in vitro
(23:29):
fertilization. What is the fertilization
technique based? I had to put some so I had to, I
had to make a deposit into a jar.
They take the jars contents and then go and drop them off at the
door. This is how this worked out for
me after after of course, my wife at the time had taken up a
bunch of a bunch of medicine to help her produce a good supply
of eggs. Everything we've been told was
(23:52):
not supposed to work out the first time, but that's not how
life was for us. So took like that.
I can tell you the exact name myson was made.
I can tell you the exact name hewas born because that's how
science works. So on let.
Me ask you this, what was that whole experience like?
Because that is like a very it. Was it was, you would think it'd
(24:15):
be nerve wracking racking, but it really wasn't.
We had a a, we had a highly recommended old dudes, old
Jewish Doctor Who was just like,just like just the silliest dude
man. And my, my company, I said,
well, people tell you all the time, the company I work for is
just super indepo appropriation,you know what I'm saying?
(24:37):
They, they pay for it, they cover it, they cover it up to a,
up to a real high amount. Luckily we got it done the first
go round, you know what I'm saying?
So what covered it? Yeah, yeah.
I didn't have to pay anything out of pocket besides co-pays.
And that's great. So it turns out my, my, my, my,
my kids mom, she had a what's called PCOS polycystic ovary
(25:00):
syndrome, I believe is what it is.
I think sometimes, yeah. And basically her eggs would not
mature, I believe is how that works out.
And so they'd be a bunch of they, they, they wouldn't mature
all the way and then they'd formcyst so you wouldn't get a, a
fully, you know, fur forged egg that could then thusly be
(25:21):
fertilized and then, you know, you know, hopefully grow into a
kid. And and so once we that part was
discovered, he's like, well, here's the work around for that.
We can give her medicine that will make her pop more eggs that
are hopefully that will work out.
And indeed, she I can remember that clear as day.
(25:42):
She had 333 eggs that look like they could work.
So really, I could have had a whole lot more kids.
This could have took a whole different direction for your
man. It did not and.
You could have had like little kids the future had.
Yeah, it could have been a litter.
But your panel puppies? And so it like I said, it it it
(26:07):
worked. It it, it took, it worked.
March 25th, 2003 was when we made my child and December 8th,
2003 is when he came into this world.
And so and then of course he wasa, he was a challenging child to
come into this world. We we had went to because he was
a, he was a, they planned to induce.
(26:29):
So he went in on a Friday and myson didn't arrive till Monday
and, and, and by the time we gotthere, it was like, oh, hey,
he's suffering from tachycardia.I think I was saying his heart
was slowing down. Yeah, I think that's what that
was slowing down. And they're like, we got to go
get him. So it goes from what is already
(26:52):
a, a nerve wracking experience and multiple days of of Labor,
but not labor. She was not labouring a little
bit labor, but she was sufferingcontractions and the like to an
emergency C-section. And so all of a sudden it's
like, OK, they take her, they suit me up.
(27:14):
There's like there's a picture of some around here of me and my
full little hospital situation. I'm a big dude, so of course
they have me in this suit that Ican just brace you.
Oh God, you got to, you got to, you got to send me that picture
because that's going to be on. That's going to be the picture
this episode. If I can find that picture, I
certainly will. Yes, Sir, and I'm in a, in a, in
a, in a surgery and, and, and you know, and I in an OR as they
(27:38):
bring my kid into the world. And of course my kid comes to
the world just quiet as a churchmouse, which is scary as shit,
'cause, you know, TV has taught us baseballs be screaming and
coming to the world gapping. Not my son who came in this
world quiet as a church mouse. And I was sitting there just
freaking out, but they let me goover there and they let me snip
the cord and they weighed them in 8 lbs eight oz on the 8th.
(28:00):
So I can always remember Zander's size.
And I got to hold him for his mom while they were sewing her
back up. And there we were.
We were parents. And it was dope.
And it really was my, my, my oldest son is, is and remains
just a delight. It was super easy to, to, to, to
(28:20):
raise and bring into this world.Very chill kid.
Like you. Slept easy.
What's up? I say.
You and him probably have the similar qualities when it come
to that. Maybe, Maybe.
But then let's say six weeks into his life, all of a sudden
his mom is having pain and discomfort.
(28:41):
And so from so on, it turns out she had to have her gallbladder
out. So she had to go in the hospital
for a stretch, meaning she and was, you know, sick and surgery.
And so over the term, she couldn't breastfeed my kid
anymore who was already having trouble breastfeeding because as
it turns out, he has a short, had a short tongue.
They had to clip his underneath his tongue.
So his tongue would be his tongue tied is what they call
it. And yeah, so we had to switch my
(29:03):
man from boobs to bottle in realshort order.
But what she was like there all day, give me this formula.
Cool son, you don't want so real, real, real good stuff.
So like 2 1/2, three years later, there's the excess about
the, the, the, the amount of time between my kids.
(29:26):
Boom, my wife just ends up pregnant.
Mind you, we've been told you can't get pregnant like this.
It's going to take steps, you got to go to the weather.
But Nope, old school, natural, no, nothing, no whatever.
And it's just. Like you old doggies?
That's crazy. Got her.
(29:47):
Did you say that She's like Bobby?
Second kid schedule C-section. OK, so a little more ready for
what I'm used to, but that Doctor Who was not the same
Doctor Who did who was, was a real piece of shit.
(30:08):
And I hate him to this day. I hate him.
He my, my wife with my with my with our second kid had
gestational diabetes and did everything she was supposed to
do to to control it. So the kid would be well and she
would be well was never playing around with it.
But my kid still came into this world. 10 lbs for like 14 oz.
(30:32):
Giants. A giant.
Baby, he's a big kid. And the doctor just says out
loud because he I just don't like, he thinks he's cracking
jokes with the staff. He's like, so much for diabetic
control. I'm like, you lucky.
I'm over here having to hold it down over here and knock over
there and smack fire out your mouth, son, because that's not
(30:53):
what's happening here. It's amazing the things that
doctors and nurses say because you know that the job requires
them to be around a lot of people all day as part of their
job. But the the bedside manner was
just fascinating. Yeah, yeah, dude was waxed.
You don't fuck with him. If he is alive, fuck him.
(31:16):
And if he's dead, I'll be in hell.
And I don't even believe in hell, but for him I'll make the
exception. There you go.
So there we are a parent, two kids of it.
It's it's it was wild. And maybe a year, not even a
year, six months after we had toget, we moved to the house I'm
in now and I've been since what's that?
(31:41):
Five years after that we get a divorce.
Just shit happens. Yeah, people just we took the
part. It's the thing.
Yeah, we were very good Co parents and I looked to a point
it was like it was like I I thought pretty impressive how
how how good a Co parents we were.
But shit, three years after that, almost 10 years, almost in
(32:05):
fact 10 years next week of she passed away, my ex-wife, my my
kids mom's passed away. And like I said, she would, she
would have been gone 10 years next week.
How old were your kids at the time?
Good question. Well, let's just do the maths.
Let's just take a quick look. Because I imagined that had to
(32:26):
be traumatizing for kids. Yes.
And for you, for that matter. Yeah.
So my youngest, my oldest was 11and my youngest was 7 going on
8. Yeah, I imagine a lot to take in
because, you know, you have these kids that are super young.
(32:49):
Yeah. Then their mom passes away.
Yeah, now it's like. We had 5050 custody, literally
half time with me, half time with their mom.
Yes, very, very easy. They went to school where I
live. We kept that going for, for for
continuity sake. We had a real good sitter set up
already, so you know what I'm saying?
A support system was in place. But now it's no longer 5050
(33:13):
because she's gone. So now it's 100 hundred you.
Yeah, 100% me. So what's that like?
It was never 100% just me and I'll tell you why the year we
got divorced, but we so we splitup in 2012, got divorced in
2013. The year we got divorced, we
split up and we knew what the deal was.
(33:35):
And, and and she had, it was like she moved out like probably
like a month after. So we were out in the world.
Like, yeah, if we ain't going tobe together, that's cool.
Let's just, we, we're good. We can go date and go see the
world. It's OK.
No beef, no, no disrespect. You know what I'm saying?
I started, I went on a date withthe, the, the, the lady who I'm
still with to this day. And so we went on a date, August
(33:58):
of 2012. We'd go see Batman, The Dark
Knight Rises, still one of my favorite movies of all time.
Fuck with Bang no matter what nobody says and we.
All can't be perfect. Hey, man.
And so that's when I'm not goingto say we started dating, but we
were, we were, you know, we, we had gone on on a couple of dates
(34:18):
that year and then the next yearwe kind of really like, OK,
let's sell into a groove here. We're going to we're going to, I
think it's going to be me and you.
And so she had been with me for a couple of years at that point
and she had met the kids, but I was so I was very, very weird
about my kids meeting people I was dating didn't know what it
was going to be. And I didn't want them having to
(34:38):
draw, making any attachments to people that may not be in my
life or any kind of stretch. And in fact, they met my lady on
accident. It just got late today one day
and I was like, shit, I got to get my kids from school and
we've been messing around away on over here.
You got to come with me, go get my kids right quick.
Sorry. And she's like, all right, this
(35:00):
is what it is. So this we meet them.
And so that's when we go go meet, go.
They meet my lady Vanessa for the first time.
And then so like Vanessa had been coming through staying, so
staying over some nights, not no, no, no real stress of time.
But when my kids mom passed away, she just was like, all
right, I'm here. I, I just, I live here now.
(35:22):
I, I'm going and brought her stuff, got the rest of her
stuff. And I'm saying that wasn't over
here. And just immediately was just
like, all right, I, I, I volunteer as tribute.
I know it's about to be rough and I'm not going to leave you
out here on on on your own. And so again, I was never by
myself, never without. Now, she was nobody's mom.
She takes this day, didn't have kids, did not really know my
(35:45):
children that that strongly yet.She knew them well, you know,
I'm saying they knew each other.Everybody knew Vanessa.
We'd hung out, we'd gone to sporting events and, you know,
you know, the zoo and movies andstuff like that there.
So, yes. But she was not, you know,
motherly or whatever. And so it really was on me to,
you know, just be what I was. And it was awful.
It was a terrible, terrible. Sometimes.
(36:07):
Some days, I tell you right now,10 years old, it still feels
terrible. Yeah, but.
I can imagine. I I did what what I hope was
what I was supposed to do and I took care of the other kids and
then hopefully, you know, did right by them and got them
through rough times. I'm telling you right now,
there's a lot of crazy stuff that went down.
(36:29):
Tell you my my, my oldest hair grew out real long fro, but it
was a fro that he never took care of.
So it's just a peasy mess. And one dad just had to chop it
up with him like, hey, man, you ain't let me come with you ain't
doing that until what is going on?
And he was like, mom says she's like my hair long.
(36:53):
And so I just want to keep it that way for her.
I go between taking care of it. You think your Mama would have
wanted you and I and I never wasthe guy who threw around your
Mama wouldn't have wanted you todo this or that because I never
want to put make their mom some kind of pariah or or just be the
mean focal point or whatever like that.
But I'm just like, your mom wouldn't want you just doing
this if you don't want to be doing this, man, you don't have
to do this if you don't want to do this.
(37:16):
And he was so hurt. He was so not hurt that it had
to happen, but he was so hurt. He was just, he was just taken
aback. And so, and so we went and got
his hair cut and got him, got him right, you know what I'm
saying? And ever since he's been very
good about taking care of his hair.
But he, it was just one of it's one of those many things that
people are like, my mom's did this, but my, my kids are like,
(37:36):
mom's like this mom like that. Now here's the thing I have I, I
consistently tried to make sure to some people will try to,
let's just tuck that memory away.
So we will be and we'll leave itbehind.
And I was like, fuck that. We will talk about your mother
and the best in terms and the worst in terms at all times.
So we can, we can, we can celebrate her memory and her
(37:57):
existence and her presence in your lives and why that means
something. My youngest looks and behaves
just like her. It is so funny.
Laugh like her got her got her smile got her everything.
It makes me chuckle every time. My oldest loves the things she
loved, roller coaster, scary movies, things like that.
There's so much of her that's like that is that is a part of
(38:19):
her. And like I said, I made the
point to try to be not just try to be, but to be very cool with
her, her people, her side of thefamily and so forth.
And up until recently. And again, that's another thing
of fatherhood. It finally got to a point and
I'll get you there. Well, you know what?
I'll get you there when I get toanother part of story.
So yeah, it was, it was terrible.
(38:40):
It was let me tell you somethingright now, losing a parent is
awful and losing your Co parent,you know what I'm saying?
Your your partner is even is is is is is its own version of
awful and so forth. And so it's just was, it was a
bad time for the Empire, you know what I'm saying?
And I just cried. I cried, I cried, I cried, I
(39:01):
cried, I cried. They cried.
I had to tell them that this happened.
You know what I'm saying? Yeah.
And and so I tell my son like the night I'm told about it, my
kid, my, my, my, my, my up boy told me my oldest son and my
youngest son was asleep. So I had to wake them when they
woke up the next day. I had to go to I had to tell
them that they mom was gone and not coming back.
You know what I'm saying this night.
(39:21):
And and so I was just like. I I can speak on this aspect of
it. One of the hardest things you
can do as a parent, as a dad, because it seems like it always
falls on us, is to tell your child that someone they love is
no longer around. Yeah.
(39:43):
And for those for those who don't know, my grandmother and
my father-in-law passed away last year within days of each
other. One was expected, one was
completely out of left field. So my father-in-law died.
(40:03):
I want to say like it was like aSaturday or something like that.
And what happened was they was trying to reach my ex-wife and
for some reason I think she was sick and she wasn't feeling
good. She wasn't answering the phone,
so they called me. My brother-in-law and he was all
(40:26):
destroyed. Like, hey, I'm allowed to tell
you this, but their, their dad just died.
Like what? And you know, he, you know, all
intensive purposes. Me, whether me and my ex
together or not, that was still a good man.
That was somebody I knew for 20 years.
(40:49):
Yeah. So that it hit me hard and then
you come up with reality, like, oh shit, I have to tell her that
her dad's gone. Yeah.
And I only have to tell her thatI have to tell my kids that.
So now I have to make the journey over there and wake her
(41:11):
up and tell her that her dad's gone and that's not something
anybody wants to do. But it is A to be grieving
yourself and then have to shoulder and witness somebody
else's grief. And.
Not just grief, because that part that person is like is a
hit you don't want to ever experience.
Not just grief, it is. It is to to have to break
(41:35):
someone's heart. Yes.
To literally and without when and and no joke, I'm saying to
go and have to just have to no, no walking around and no getting
around and no I can tell some stories or whatever.
You know what I'm saying? No, I have to.
I have to break your heart in a way that will never be repaired.
Yes, fucking bullshit. And then to top that off I had
(41:56):
to do it again like 3 days later.
Yeah, yeah. It's something I wouldn't wish
on anyone. I always I Chuck when I tell
this story. I used to work at work at Little
Caesars, manage the Little Caesars for a while, had a boss,
Stan and Stan had two kids and stand one day explained to us
(42:17):
the idea of becoming a father, said it's not something I wish
on my worst enemy, He said. You in the hospital, you are
scared for your wife, you are scared for your kids, you're
scaring about becoming a dad andso forth and so on and all the
means for and so on and so on. And I didn't, I, it's like I
(42:39):
heard him in my head when my kidcame into this world the first
time. It's like, you're right.
This is awful. Everything about this is awful.
I was because again, this is major surgery.
They cutting a kid out of this woman.
My kid is hope is is they they're telling me it's such a
mercy that they have to cut him out of her.
You know what I'm saying? So things that you wouldn't
worship on your worst enemy, becoming a dad via caesarean
(43:00):
section or, you know, just becoming a dad any anyway, and
also having to tell somebody that you tell somebody you love
to somebody they love is no longer going to be a part of
their life. No, thank you.
I wouldn't tell. I wouldn't do it to anybody.
I don't wish it upon you or anyone you love because it's
awful. I do.
Straight up. So getting back to get your
story. Yeah, I am.
(43:22):
A You had to kind of deal with becoming this, I want to say,
new single father. Yeah, but you had someone by
your side, but they were more unexperienced with parenthood
than you were. Straight up just a rookie.
So I so I so I even till up until last week when my kid
(43:44):
finished school, I wake up, I make lunches, I make dinner.
I I do all those things that parents do.
I'm not saying my lady don't do that, but she because she what
she does is she contributes. She does, she does, she can do
out of pocket. Basically, she becomes the
muscle of the organization. You know what I'm saying?
She takes care of a business like that.
(44:04):
And you know, we, we tried to, we tried to attend all the shows
and events and football games. We tried to take care of their
friends. So from song, we did what we
thought parents supposed to do. I'm gonna tell you right now,
everything I do is basically, basically everything I was doing
was basically things I saw on sitcoms growing up.
It's like, OK, make sure your kids go to prom.
Make sure your kids go to movies, make sure they have the
good snacks and not the shitty ones.
(44:25):
Make sure they got dope shoes and not no nonsense.
And I just tried to make sure I did those things and abided by
those things kept in the same school system the entire time.
So I tried to be stable. I decided never to move.
I like I said, we were getting, you know what I'm saying?
I was talking about moving. I was just like, no, I'm not
going to, I'm going to hold it down that way.
They have a place to call home. You know what I'm saying?
It's like, these are the steps. I was, I was thinking about
(44:48):
taking a life tried, like I said, try to make sure they stay
tight with their mom's side of the, of the family, because
you're saying I, I didn't, I don't like, I, I, I didn't grow
with my father and I don't know my, my father's side of the
family and I, and I, I don't, it's not that I, I have a
distaste for that or anything together.
I just didn't want my kids repeating that, you know what
I'm saying? So I tried to make sure I, I, I
(45:10):
took better care of that than myfather took care of, you know
what I'm saying? Because he could have probably
been a more, a more present father.
He just chose to not be. So that's on him and I, like I
said, I'll try to be better thanhim.
It was. And that's really why that Joel
shit made me cry on The Last of Us.
I'm saying just do a little bit better than me.
And it was like, yeah, that's, that's that is the goal and
(45:32):
intent of, of, of, of, of, of this whole operation.
I hope I've done better than my Mama and I hope when they have
kids, they'll do better than I meet.
You know what I'm saying? I was never, I was never a
hitter. I wouldn't really spanking my
kids. My kid spoke recently, told me
how Once Upon a time I snatched them up and it fucked with him
(45:53):
so much that they still kind of bothered by because they got
snatched up. You know what I'm saying?
I didn't beat my children. I don't spank them that they got
there, but I did yoke their ass up one time and it still is is
in their soul and I feel bad about that, you know what I'm
saying? Yeah.
And and, you know, it's, it's kind of interesting because I
know our generation grew up around the violence.
(46:18):
And what I mean is, you know, like spread a rod, spread a
child, you know, weapons was a commonplace.
And our generation, I guess because of the trauma some of us
carry that, that with us, most of us, for the most part, the
ones I know, they don't really like to expect their kids with
the kids because they know that it doesn't work.
(46:38):
And it's been kind of really interesting watching for what I
know people grow and develop andlearn from the mistakes of their
their fathers and mothers and, and kind of use that to build on
the way they want to raise and teach their kids.
So what had that been like from you learning the lessons from
your parents with your mother? Again, I, I, I, I was not a
(47:03):
strike my children kind of guy, you know, old school, get your
hand away from that Dang light socket, whatever, you know what
I'm saying? Why you got that butter knife in
your hand going near the plug inthe wall.
Children is wild that way, but they do that shit, you know what
I'm saying? So a little bit of that, the
little hand smack like no, don'tdo that and so on and so on.
Like I said never a full on ass whatever have I ever given my
kids. I tried to be a little more
(47:25):
loose with how so and Vanessa tell you my lady hates it and I
hate it now because right now I'm having to clean my sons my
oldest sons room who don't basically say anymore.
He pretty stay with his lady at this point.
He old enough to be whatever buthis room is a fucking mess.
But my Mama coming this weekend because my youngest is about to
graduate and so she going to stay in that room and it's
definitely such a goddamn mess. I'll know to do it.
(47:47):
But what it is is I used to hatemy Mama being on my ass by
cleaning my room. Hated it.
So I was always just like, look,try to take care of it, pick it
up, try to keep it decent, You know what I'm saying?
And that's all that's about as worse as I was about when it
came to, you know, telling my kids to clean their room, You
know what I'm saying? It's like, look, make sure I can
walk in here and not die. Don't have too much.
No, don't have food to put too much food up in here, so and so
(48:07):
on. I try to be just kind of chill
about it in that regard. And, and my mom, as funny as my
mom would, would tell you that she as she got older and
actually was kind of like takingcare of my my brother's kid.
She was like, no, just kind of let that's their space.
Let them treat their space like they like, like they would want
(48:28):
to, you know what I'm saying? If they wanted to be a shit hole
and that's on them, I guess, youknow what I'm saying?
And that's how funny that's, that's her as a grandma.
She realized that, not as a mom.She didn't realize that.
So I try to you try to let him go play out on the streets
without too much, you know, saying nonsense, you know what
I'm saying? But but also I got out there and
(48:49):
taught him how to ride bikes andand so forth.
You know what I'm saying, pushing around and took him in
a, a stroller or, or, or a wagonaround the way.
You know what I'm saying, Walkedaround.
I was out there. I tried to be involved as much
as as much as possible throughout my kids lives, you
know, and so my oldest played football for some years and I
(49:10):
was, you know, at every game andat every practice too.
I was like everyone not didn't miss, never missed.
And so when they got to high school and he was, he was in
marching band, but when he was in junior high, they did
orchestra and choir. So again, I was at all those
performances too, because then Ijust tried to make sure that I
was everywhere next. That's another good thing is
(49:30):
that I'm not saying I work, I work for the best company in the
world, but I I've worked for people who are like, I'm a
parent. I get it.
If you need to dip out a little early to get to the concert or
you need to dip out a little early, take him somewhere.
Don't worry about it. We'll get the time made-up
somewhere along the lines. And I've always appreciated
that. You know what I'm saying?
It's like people be like, wait, why you so loyal to this gig
(49:51):
that you benefit so long? Because they have been pretty
decent to me over the years. And that's, and that's why I
try, I try to, I try to pay thatback with a decent amount of
loyalty, you know what I'm saying?
I got to respect it. Yeah, yeah.
Let me ask this because it's something you mentioned earlier
and I want to touch on a little bit.
You said earlier when we first started that you know one of
(50:14):
your children went through a transition.
Yeah. And one, I commend you for being
the man that you are, to let your child choose to be who they
want to be. Yeah.
And what they put in their heart.
So what was that like for you tokind of like?
(50:36):
That little jive so and so one day just out of nowhere, it said
on Instagram of all places, justfor my parents, my name is Lee
now and blah, blah, yeah, he's smaggy.
So and and and I, and at that point they were they they I
think they were like, decide they're going to be non binding.
And I was like straight up and down.
(50:57):
Don't be put me on blast in the streets, erase that.
And I had to make them take thatpose down like you're going to
be put me on blast because I didn't know you had decided to
become Lee. I didn't know that you you think
hinting at it was going to get you somewhere.
But what it is is that bravery finally struck me, finally got
brave enough to come out and be like, this is who I am.
And and but they did. I feel like the wrong way.
(51:19):
I'm like, God, because you you got folks looking at me like,
I'm sorry, like I'm the I'm a I'm a asshole and I'm like, I'm
not. I would never be that way.
All I'm ever going to do is be like, OK, let's talk about it.
Let's let's see. And so the former Lily said, I
am Lee now and I'm like, OK, andwhat does that mean?
Well, right now, I think I identified as non binary and
(51:41):
years some sometime later, he would be like, I knew I was a
boy, but I just kind of I wouldn't I wouldn't fully ready
to say that I was a boy yet. You know what I'm saying?
Because I know with that, I knowthat is a, that that is a step,
you know? Yes.
And I was just like, OK, I know,I know, I know.
People are like you. It wasn't a big deal to you.
I it was about so here's take you back today.
(52:05):
So when I first had was told I was going to have a daughter, I
was like, I'm going to make it apoint to never try to treat them
girly or be make them have to dopink and all that other stuff.
If they if that's the right theywant to walk, then sure thing,
but I'm never going to force theissue and people will fucking be
like I'm going to buy her all kinds of pink shit and blah,
blah, blah. I'm like like funny, I know you
(52:26):
think you joking or whatever, whatever.
I had a lady once tell me, Sir at work again, maybe your son
will become a dancer. And how's this like?
Oh, that'd be so dope because she wanted she wanted a
different response from me. She thought she's about to go me
into some some nonsense. I go, Ah, bro, that'd be so
dope, especially if you got liketo ballet or something like that
and I can go see all the shows and it fucked her up and it
ruined her shit. And I'm saying because that's
(52:46):
the type that and that that one was with with intent and malice.
I had to say that to her face and I really wouldn't like if my
if my kid was a dancer, it wouldhave been dope, but that broad
didn't want that. She thought it's about to be
something whenever and I'm like,Nah, bro, I'm just not built
that way. I'm simply so by the time you
get around to my son telling me I'm your son, it's like, OK,
(53:07):
let's let's see what that means.School since my I got my kids.
It's super supportive. Was like, all right, you want to
be identified as Lee Lee You are.
And of it's it's just it's and it was funny.
It's like if you if you if you see my kid, it's like sure
thing, dude, he's a guy by his name legally name changed and
(53:29):
all that good stuff. Working on the gender situation
now because Ohio be weird. And also it something got hung
up and then it makes that we just found out the other day
because we did it at the same time.
So all this should have been done already, but it turns out
it's not done because something got hemmed up and I was just
like, come on, bro, y'all playing your boy.
But that just it's effort. And so because of just life
(53:54):
happening, because life be life is sometimes my, my, my son had
a bit of an eating disorder. Disordered eating is what they
call that now they don't call iteating disorder.
It's called disordered eating engaged in self harm.
So my son is full of scars because he was cutting himself
(54:15):
and also was Once Upon a time trying to take his life.
And so he had to, so he was, he had to go do like, you know,
mandatory hole type shit, you know what I'm saying?
Because it happens and it just, and it goes down like that.
And so we were stacking all those crates, right.
(54:35):
And then so with, with all that means.
And of course, then, you know, my mom passed away.
My kid has been in the hands of,of, of, of mental health
professionals for a stretch. That's good because that helps
them kind of walk the walk and figure out, OK, you can't just
say I, I, I know the world wantsto believe that you can just put
(54:56):
on a dress and call yourself a lady and that makes you a trans
person. Not how it works to to to be
considered A to transition. Legally you.
Know what I'm saying, and I knowsome people be like fuck
legality or they might be mad about that persuasion, but it it
does involve a mental health professional saying this person
(55:18):
meets the criteria that they have set place set forth that
says, yes, indeed, this person suffers from gender dysphoria
and, and, and, and should be it does identify as the the gender
opposite of what they were assigned at birth.
And through the process of all these other things and seeing,
(55:39):
you know, shrinks and so forth and trying to get better and
getting better, we, we, it was, it was, it's much easier, you
know what I'm saying? We got a mental health
professional kind of help holding our hands and walking us
through it and walking us through the process and and so
forth and getting us right. And so I know it just keeps like
a little teen your sister or whatever.
(55:59):
It just was, it was nothing. It was nothing but except my kid
for who my kid is and continuingto love my kid for just being my
kid. And it it it cost me nothing.
I promise you it cost me co-paysfor for shrinks.
That's what it cost me. And I and I didn't care because
I got a card I get from from work that I pay on every
paycheck and it has bread on it for that.
(56:20):
So. And see, that's what being a
father's about, you know, and, and and I commend you on that
because, you know, you make you made that decision sound like
such an easy thing. I don't know how it's not to
some people. And that's the thing, to a lot
of people, it's not. I it's, it's, it's so weird to
(56:44):
me when somebody just decides I can't love you the same because
you are, you've transitioned. It turns out you like the same
sex. You know what I'm saying?
You, whatever that is, you know what I'm saying?
I like, like, how can I not lovethese people who I love so
deeply? Mandy, you know it.
(57:04):
And I think I think most parentsknow it.
It is a love that is. It's unexplainable.
Correct. Where where you could feel their
joy, you could feel their hurt and, and, and too and you know
it and you feel it and and and so forth and so on.
It's so different than than thanany romantic love or anything
like that there that I've ever had ever experienced.
(57:27):
And so it's like I have an on off switch for that.
And it's weird to me that some people do where they where
they've just decided I can't love you if you're not what
society says you must be. I'm just I'm not built that way.
It's not in me in at all. And I'm not trying to say it to
make me so cool or make me such a good dude.
It just is who I am. And that's what makes you a good
(57:50):
dude. I hope so, and if that's the
case then I'll take it. I'll take it bro.
Because you care for your kids no matter what, your Love's
unconditional. I think that's in the essence of
what being a father is about. To good times, to bad times.
(58:10):
The things that you've kind of discussed during this episode,
whether it's through the loss oftheir mother, whether it's
through self harm, was through all these different areas of
their life they went through. There's been one constant that
kept them afloat, that kept themaround, that made them a better
person to get them where they they.
(58:31):
And that is you. And that's what makes you
special. That's what fatherhood is about.
That is what fatherhood is about, sacrificing and doing
what's necessary so your kids can be OK.
It seems like it's it seems easy, but a lot of people can't
(58:52):
do that. Again, I'll never understand it
as I said it, it it just it it it it I said the one thing I was
like, hey, man, you can't just put me on the Internet talking
about I didn't I didn't accept you for who you was because
that's not the case. I didn't know who you was,
little dude, watch yourself well, and the conversation was a
(59:13):
simple it was not simple. It was it was involved.
I go. Let me tell you something.
I've I've called you she her foryour entire life.
I've called you by the your old name your entire life.
I'm going to fuck up but it's never going to be intentional
and I'll always try to and I'll always try to correct myself.
To this day, and it's been so many years at this point, I
(59:36):
still will stumble every now andagain and say she and I always
apologize incorrect and just keep my fucking moving.
When when Let me tell you something and that's how this
how I know that people can change and people who are not
changing is just on some bullshit.
My mom is 77 about to be 78 years old but I laid it out to
(59:56):
her what the deal was. She's like okay now to this day
I'm saying she'll stumble every night against it'll say she
always corrects herself. It says he and and just accepts
it as taking it and knows it andgets kept moving it and and and
and. And pretty much didn't think
nothing of it like Jim was just like, all right, I guess that's
(01:00:16):
pretty much what my mom was up and went first and I'm like,
there you go. That's what that's what's up.
My general general, I guess because she loved her grandbaby
and that like they had a real tight bomb.
My mom would come and kick it uphere.
They would always kick it together.
Like my mom be up here, we'll behere Friday.
Guess what, they probably going to ride dirty together.
They're going to be kicking it together anyway because that's
just how it gets down. That's their relationship.
(01:00:38):
And so I know people say old people don't change or whatever.
It's open to them. It's like it's a lie.
It's a lie. It's a lie because I got a old
person in my life who was just like, OK, that's how we're doing
it now. I say that to go to the opposite
of that. His mama's Mama can't get right
(01:00:58):
or simply refuses to because I'mtrust me, I just told you, you
can get right. It ain't nothing to it.
In fact, and last year, probablyyear before last night, if I
think about it, we had something, we had an incident
where it just was like, I'll never see that motherfucker
again, dad. And I'm like, you OK with that?
I'm fully OK with you saying youdon't want to go contact with
(01:01:19):
your no contact with your grandma because if she can't get
right, can I respect yo-yo yo designation how I'm saying and
keep trying to be on some bullshit.
There ain't no point in trying to keep her in your keep her in
your life. And so I had to be supportive of
that. And I, I and I had to actually
(01:01:41):
get real. I was like, let me tell you
something right now. Yeah, yeah.
But I'm like, you'd never see you'd never see her until she in
her damn coffin. And that's if you want to go to
our funeral. Fuck her.
And that's not to me trying to be hateful.
I don't like, I do not like my fuck more than I never did fuck
with her. She didn't like me and my me and
my kids mom being together. We got together far too young.
I get it. But also I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm,
(01:02:04):
I'm, I'm, I'm a brown man. And then my my baby Mama was
not. So her mom was on that bullshit.
And to this day she remains on that bullshit.
And so my kids don't see their grandma no more.
Remember I told you, I try to keep him tight with that side of
fatty. So what they do see is they show
love. They hurt their mom's brother,
(01:02:24):
their uncle got love for him. He comes through, they kick it,
they'll go to his house over thesong Cool Bees.
They grandpa, they great grandpa, before he left this
world, they was cool with him show love.
I'm saying they great aunt who was always more of a mother to
their mom than her mother was. They always got to got love,
show love and so forth. So they still do get down with
(01:02:45):
that side of the family that wants to be getting down with
them. You know what I'm saying?
Yeah, I'm fucking with Mark, because Mark talking with us,
you know what I'm saying? Let's let's end this on a happy
note. Go ahead.
Because we done told your story from start, now let's get to the
ending. Very good.
(01:03:06):
And the ending is what I'm proudof.
As of this past couple weeks, one of your babies graduated.
They graduate Sunday. Oh, yeah, yeah.
As we record this, they will graduate Sunday of this week.
And then so by the time you hearthis, they will have graduated,
Yes. So you have gotten to the finish
line. I did it.
(01:03:27):
I raised two. I successfully raised two
adults, two people from baby to adulthood.
Now I won. I know, I know.
As a parent, the struggle doesn't end there.
For sure. But you got them there, and I
think that is to be committed. That's where you know your
(01:03:49):
story, that your part of the story as mentor kind of ends a
little bit. Yeah.
And their story of learning and finding themselves in the real
world begins. So what is that like for you now
that you're at that point? So my oldest has been pretty
much on his on his grizzly sincemaybe, maybe six months after he
(01:04:11):
graduated. He got a gig.
He he had a buddy whose granddaddy owns a a shop.
He's like, I can probably put you on my granddaddy and put him
on his granddaddy. He did.
And so he's had this job for some years now and likes it.
They, they pay him OK. They, you know, think it's a
fine job. But he actually is working on
(01:04:32):
trying to get into a program to start working on cars.
Because my kid loves my oldest loves cars, not just loves cars.
I'll talk your ear off about cars.
You know someone who knows aboutcars.
Put them two together. They'll just cipher the whole
time about cars. So he's been working on that.
He just he had had an interview with a with a a for a mentor
program or of some sort recently.
So we hope that all plays out well.
(01:04:54):
My youngest off RIP was like, I want to go to this school and I
want to major in music therapy. And I was like, I kind of don't
want you staying in Ohio becausewhile I was on some bullshit
when it comes to trans people, what the reality of it is is
Ohio on some bullshit when it comes to basically they don't
like trans women. Basically no one.
You never really hear people talking shit about trans men.
Yes, it's trans women. They hate women is what it comes
(01:05:15):
down to. They hate women, the six women,
they hate trans women, they justhate women.
They want to control them. So that's just what it is when
it comes down to it. And so, but the school he wants
to go to is, is local. But I was like, OK, but you know
what? We'll let you stay in the door.
That way you get that experienceand you're under your belt.
You know what I'm saying? You know what it is to go be
(01:05:35):
away from your folk and so forth.
And I'm just excited for them. They're excited.
I'm excited. I'm I'm I'm pumped to have to
have successfully have done it. I attended every, I attended all
the shows this this last year. My kid played lacrosse one year
also. I went to every game.
My youngest really was, it was areal man about town.
(01:05:58):
He played lacrosse. He was in margin band his first
year, but that was his brother'slast year margin man.
So that's kind of why he did it.He's been in choir this all all
four years. So he does, you know what I'm
saying? He does choir and that's and,
and because he's on testosterone, his voice has been
changing so, so surely. But he's got a couple of solos
under his belt and I think that's wonderful.
And I always cry when I see my son upstate on stage singing.
(01:06:20):
That always happens. So it's always fun of it's just
for a night, night. And so, and here's the thing,
you know, I told him what my sonhas gone through.
It's over dawn. But when he truly knew who he
was and I was like, I am me. I am Lee and this is who I am.
And I'm a boy named Lee and we all got on board and all signed
up for it and got them got them the help.
You need it straight A student crushing it in these streets.
(01:06:44):
Now, like I said, it didn't first couple of years weren't
that great. So, so that GPA looks kind of
kind of whatever now, because you were saying the first few
years weren't great. But right now, man, my kid is,
is, is is on the moves taking, you know, taking AP African
American studies and and and andso forth and so on and doing the
damn thing. Man, I'm super duper just proud
(01:07:04):
to have with with Vanessa holding my hand and I can say I
tell people all the time, boy, take a village.
Everybody in my life that has been a part of my children's
life have helped us get to this point.
I've done my part sure thing, but that's not it was never
alone. It was never just me and I, I
can never just give all that credit to myself because it has
been other people who have been in our lives and, and, and, and
(01:07:26):
have helped us get to where we are.
And so success into US, man, we've done it.
And I'm very, very, very proud of that man.
No doubt I. Love it.
So before we go, any final wordsyou want to say to potential
(01:07:48):
dads out there? I'm going to let you like, say
I'm gonna repeat myself, my man,Stan said.
Bro I wouldn't wish upon my worst enemy because the
experience is so it's so intensebut then it's the most amazing
thing you'll ever have in your entire life after the fact so
(01:08:09):
that that bringing them into this world is hard keeping them
alive. Way more challenging than people
giving credit for kids. Be on some bullshit, be in
cabinets trying to get a stuff they shouldn't be touching
things they shouldn't. It is a challenge, but you will
never love the way you love yourkids, man.
(01:08:30):
And it's just super duper dope, man.
It's so dope. And I'm telling you right now
around your, your whole life will be changed, but for the
better. You'll love it.
And I, I just need you to, to, to, to, to get ribby ready for
it. Know what it's going to be and
what it and what that what it all means.
Be ready to fight the good fight.
(01:08:51):
Sometimes, I mean literally haveto go into the office and have
to check foods at the gate. Like hold on.
You ain't going to be talking tomy kid this way.
And if I got a problem with thisteacher or I got a problem with
this student, I guess sometimes you got to get in there and let
him know. But if you got that in you man,
you are really going to make something great.
And I think that is just amazingand just being a kids life.
(01:09:11):
Play video games bad. I was playing, playing video
games with my son laying on my chest when he was literally I
was saying, I've taught my children to play games.
This game's all over my house. I know that seems weird, but
it's like, but that's what they do.
They love to be they, they, theywere gamers because I was a
gamer, but also when they went to go play sport, like I said, I
was, I tried to be present, like, OK, you want to take up
(01:09:32):
lacrosse, then I'll be out here at the lacrosse pitch trying my
best to learn that sport. Trust me.
That was some stuff that like what?
How's this hit man? There's a bunch of rules of that
game. It's like soccer and hockey all
in one. It's crazy.
And so you just, you're going tolearn, you're going to figure it
out and it's going to be wonderful.
(01:09:54):
And I hope it's breezy. I hope you have a good woman
with you, a good person with you, because you know what I'm
saying? At this point, we, we don't even
got thought around about you just got, I hope you got good
people surrounding you to help you raise your kid or, or, or
that you are a good person in helping people raise their kids
by being a good presence in their lives and, and, and, and
taking care of business and taking care of them.
(01:10:15):
And so you could be the dopest uncle, the dopest grandpa, the
the dopest whatever. You know, I'm saying brother
that has to take care of you know, I'm saying his siblings or
whatever you do and will figure it out and you're going to do
better than you have any any idea.
And you're going to be so good at it.
You're going to be like, look atthat.
I successfully graduated two children.
I got them from from from from birth to the hood.
(01:10:38):
Crazy. Hey, Benny, that for real, T?
Let them know to find you brother.
I am across the, the, the, the far and wide.
I am the internet's Tayrel 713 TAYREL, the number 7, the number
13 all in one. No, I'm not from Houston. 7 to
13 is a whole bunch of other stuff that I care not to explain
to you right now. Just know it's about luck and
(01:11:01):
unluck and so forth. And so I have a show that I've
been doing for a dozen years. It's called stage crunchy milk
Crunchy, of course, being spelled with AK regular podcast.
It's me and my homeboys. We sit, we chop it up, just talk
about whatever and it's a good time to be had there.
I have a second podcast. It's called Crimpa to say that
crim is spelled with AK because you know, I'm branding.
(01:11:21):
If I got a crunchy, I got to have a crim.
Crimpa to say is a Great BritishBake Off podcast.
We review and recap the Great British Bake Off and the Great
American Baking Show. And what I've been so lucky to
have of these last couple of seasons is the bakers from the
Great American Baking Show have jumped on and hung out with us
and that has been super fun. If you get down with a Bake Off
(01:11:43):
type of universe, you might wantto listen to our show because I
think it's pretty great. Got a music show that we don't
do as much anymore, but it's still out there.
You can go get it. It's on Spotify right now
though. They've been hollering at your
boy about, hey man, it's music on this thing.
Should we be letting you keep this up?
It's caught a pod called Cast and it's pretty dope.
There's been a couple episodes of that.
So if you go listen to it, you can you can hear him on there
(01:12:04):
giving his as we opine about music.
It's a good thing to have when it's all said and done, man, We
we, we, I'm just I'm out here, bro.
I'm saying you want to follow meon PlayStation or or or Xbox or
Nintendo so forth and so on, Man, like I said, I'm Tabriel
713 the Internet over. I try to be a good person.
I don't play a lot of online with other people, but every now
(01:12:25):
and again I thought the headphones on and we'll just go
shoot some Fortnite or something.
It's cool. But that is who I am and that is
what I do. Also, man, saying I brought a
shotgun in the Cadillac. If you listen to Cadillac on
Mars, we have not done the last couple of months because
Trophy's kid had a scheduling conflict by the way we record.
But we should be coming back here in the month of June, so
(01:12:46):
worry not all. Right.
Think I've done it all. Perfect.
Thank you guys for listening. As always, Delvin Cox
experiencing we are out. Peace, Peace.
This podcast is sponsored by patreon.com/devil Cock
Experience. If you want more content,
including exclusive shows, make sure you go to patreon.com/devil
Cock Experience. Also, special shout out to
Patreon producer Douglas Mcgirt Johnson.
(00:20):
Thank you. Welcome to the Delvin Cox
(00:42):
experience, the podcast which each week I'm on a one man
mission to you. Now I coast to diversity.
I'm your host, Delvin Cox, and first and foremost, happy
Father's Day to all the great dads out there.
And to celebrate this monumentous occasion, I brought
in another great dad, someone I've known for several years and
(01:06):
I've known him. Not only is he a great man, he's
a great father. I think that I think when you're
a great father, that speaks volumes about a person.
So the host of Stage Crunchy Milk, Coast of Cadillac on Mars,
coast of the other podcast, I can't say the name of Creme
Brulee. Creme Patissier.
(01:28):
I know what any of that it meansit's some podcast is really
popular apparently from the showI don't watch my homie tea.
How you doing bro? I'm good, I'm good.
Thank you so much. Thank you for having so much
patience for me tonight. We were having some technical
difficulties on this end of the business y'all, but we get, we
air, we all here. It sounds like he was using one
of those mics that you would buylike as a toy store.
(01:53):
It's my dope setup too. It's my good mic, it's my good
like recorder because. There's one of those.
This Elgato has not been workingat all.
The fact it's working right now,Miracle.
So the Elgato had died of me, soI was like, what do I have that
I could use? And I was like, oh, I got my pie
track and I know I can run the feed through it and it normally
(02:15):
works like a champ. I've been using it at work.
I've been using to record. Tonight it was like fuck you.
Nope, happens like that sometimes.
That's how I'd be nice. But like all great dad,
sometimes you got to figure shitout.
Facts. As always, like to start the
podcast off with the five for five, Five questions 5 asks to
get the ball rolling. T Are you ready for this
(02:37):
Father's Day edition? Up to 5 for five.
Not even in the slightest, but we going to make it happen.
Question number one, give me your favorite dad joke.
Oh, do I have a favorite dad joke?
I don't know if I have a favorite dad joke.
Now, did you say that? That's going to bother me.
(02:59):
Mess it up man, got to have one.Now here's here's what I tell
you. Something I always say, though,
they have the what, what, what, what somebody else tell you like
you ain't got to do it and or something to that effect.
And my answer is always all I got to do is stay black and pay
taxes and then I just leave it at.
That's a good one. That's a good dad saying.
(03:22):
I appreciate that. That's a dad ass saying Yeah,
yeah, I like that. One question #2 give me your top
five TV dads. OK, hold on.
(03:47):
I'm going to write it so I can just let's let's let's take a
look at at, at TV fathers who are, who are, who are basically.
I'm not. I'm let you know right now.
I didn't grow up with my father.TV dads raised TV dads raised
me. OK, so you should be good at
this. Look man, I'm not trying to say
nothing about nothing, but I'm be real with you, Bill Connolly
(04:08):
was a good TV dad, TV dad, TV dad.
TV dad? Yes, real life person.
Real piece of shit. You know, it was a good dad and
I, and I feel like we'd be like,come on, man, your man's Mr.
Drummond. Oh yeah, yeah, he was a great
(04:28):
dad taking any. Children, it wasn't his own, but
also looking out for his daughter that was his.
So respect due to Mr. Phillip Drummond.
He took in three kids that wasn't his own because Roman
there see, remember, see, I was a big Different Strokes fan was
Arnold Willis in the later seasons.
They always bring in a a a childthat don't don't look the part.
(04:50):
Yeah, it was sad because he he he remarried that girl, that
Lady, and he took in Sam as his son.
That Lady was oh come on, T not Delta Burke, the other lady from
Designer Women. Yes.
Yeah, yeah. Word up.
OK, OK. Respect you man. 3 kids that
wouldn't. He is.
Can't be a better dad than that,you know what I'm saying?
(05:13):
Let me see TV dash that I. So you got Bill Cosby, You got
Phillip Drumming. Who else you got?
Yeah, as I try, as I run throughmy my TV Fathers of the Dad from
Boys Meet Boy Meets World, Mr. Mr. Mr. Well, man, what was that
last name on that show? I don't remember his name.
It was. Matthews.
(05:34):
Matthews Yeah, yeah, Mr. Matthews But Speaking of which,
if you, if we want to take the route, you're saying the dad
from the Wonder Years was a hardass dude, but a good dad.
That is true. Oh, you just put them on your
list. Yeah, yeah, we put Mr. Woodman
wonder years. And A Boy Meets World.
Boy Meets World. OK, that's 4.
(05:54):
And Uncle Phil. OK, glad you got the Uncle Phil
like I was getting worried for asecond.
One of the greatest TV fathers that ever was once again another
another brother who's like, I got to take care of my my my, my
people's family, brought in his nephew and looked out for him
and tried to raise him along with his own kids right that he
looked out for respect, dude. Uncle, Uncle, Uncle Phil, man.
(06:14):
Yeah, also apparently a really good person like.
Everybody said in life was apparently a very good dude, so
we're. Stand up dude.
Apparently. Rest easy.
He was also the voice of Shredder on the Ninja Turtles.
I like it let. Me tell you something when he
passed away, right? I was hurt.
(06:34):
My man Dan was more taken aback that we lost Shredder than by
Uncle Phil. He was really, he was really
wrecked by the fact we lost Uncle Phil because he was a dude
who came on fresh prison, like, you know, a lot of kids did.
But when he was, when we actually said, Oh yeah, he was
also the voice of Shredder, you could almost see him start
crying. It was bad.
(06:54):
I didn't know that. Because not everybody dork's
like we are nobody. Nobody in certain depths of
dork, you know what I'm saying? So.
I like it. That's a good point.
All right, question #3. No, that can't be 3.
Yeah, that's three. Is that 3?
(07:15):
OK, go on. Three.
All right. Because it was the first
question was dad jokes. Dad jokes OK this.
Is 3 we all three now? Very good.
All right. On the flip side, the three
worst TV Dads cartoons count. I, I, I, I truly did not get
(07:41):
down with Tim Allen on home improvements, even though a lot
of people would. I don't think he was a good dad.
He kind of sucked. Yeah, oddly enough, same thing
can go for your boy Raymond or Everybody Loves Raymond.
Love that show. Funny shows over the song.
Good dude. But his wife held that house
now. Yeah, OK.
You know what I'm saying? He really wouldn't.
(08:02):
He really wouldn't. Contributing.
Let's see if you get one more. One more you got I have one in
mind. Let's see if you name the person
I got in mind. See if you got a cartoon dad in
in mind. Yes, I do.
Or cartoon involvers that I justjust can't, that I cannot get
down with. And I'm like.
Let me see, I got one in mind when I say like, oh, that makes
a lot of sense. I'm gonna go Papa Smurf who
(08:22):
irresponsible when he had too many children.
That that aspect he is. He is the future of cartoon
characters, AKA future. The answer is Goku.
Oh, watch Dragon Ball. Goku is a fucking terrible day.
(08:45):
Fair, fair. He sends his son out to fight
these giant ass bad ass fucking creatures trying to destroy the
world and then he just leaves for like several months to a
year. It just leaves his son.
Some random ass got a raise. Everybody else was a better
father to Goku's son than Goku. Ain't that a blip?
(09:06):
So it's so I'll hear turns the phrase Goku and Son Goku.
Is that Goku's kid or Son Goku Goku's real name?
I don't I don't watch dragon his.
Son Goku, because he's his name's Goku.
OK. That's that, but that's they
call him Son Goku. I forgot why they call him Son.
Goku is his son like like Asian.Your son like son like son, son.
(09:27):
Can't call it. Yeah, your man.
Your man's was not his. Son's name is Gohan.
Gohan OK, Yeah, I feel bad if you go, huh?
Sorry. Awful Dad.
I can like I I just buy, you know, osmosis be like I can name
you a bunch of Dragon Ball characters.
I can, I can tell you, I can sayMajin Boo, that little pink
(09:48):
dude. Correct.
Dad looks like a dude who look like a who look like an Egyptian
Anubis. I don't know his name, but I
know him. It's this dude with the turban
on. Because it's like I say, if you
were in my house right now, there are two Dragon Ball
statues right here. My kit.
Put it I'm talking about what ishis name?
Piccolo. OK, Piccolo plays a motherfucker
(10:10):
with his Cape. His Cape is dope.
Yeah, give it up to him. I don't know which which.
Character So you have a you havea statue of Piccolo in your
house but don't know who the fuck he is.
I'm grabbing both. How did that happen?
Because my son, my son will fuckwith him.
OK. So I don't know who these people
are. The one with the gold hair is
(10:30):
Goku, okay. The other one is Piccolo All.
Right, All right. Piccolo plays a motherfucker.
Do you remember Robin Harris? I like it.
I respect. That's just me loving my kid,
you know what I'm saying? He put them up, he put them
right down. I'm like, I don't care.
And so he has them. If you, if you were here, you
(10:50):
can see it's like the way to my house set up is a little opening
right here and like there's likeshelves.
So he has one-on-one side 1 and facing the other across from
each other. OK, I love it.
Question #4 All right, what is the last time, last thing you
watched on television that made you cry?
OK, we just want something recently that that almost got me
(11:14):
in my got my goat. And what was it?
Because we've been watching a ton like this has been the Last
of Us and or it was the other night too.
That's crazy because when my my lady was just like, Oh my God,
turn to make sure I was OK, She's like, are you all right?
I'm like, oh, so whatever it is,it really got me and I'm trying
(11:35):
to think what it was. I can't call it.
It happens. Trust me, your boy be in tears a
lot that came with fatherhood. Promise you.
I used to get a little worked up, but never actually broke the
tears never broke free. I'd be like I'd feel it in you'd
feel the clip, as they'd say, right and then well past being a
father, being a parent, it was like shit would just hit me like
(11:56):
a ton of bricks and I'd be like the waterworks boy.
Tell me right now. Something I can say that got me
recently enough, though, was we saw wicked in the theater.
I'm telling you right now, that last song of.
Oh, that's crazy. Fantastic movie.
Great movie for sure, for sure, but her singing.
So if you care to find me, look to the West grand sky.
(12:18):
Anyway, that whole scene as as as you go through that movie
right there, as as you see her working up to her powers and
start saying so I just I was just tears flowing down my face.
So I'll be watching that shit right.
It was bad. I knew nothing about Wicked.
All that I knew about Wicked, itwas a sequel to The Wizard of
Oz, right? Yeah, pretty much, I guess.
(12:39):
Yeah. Yeah, yeah, Sequel, prequel, I
guess you could call it. So I said when I saw like the
previous stuff I like this looksinteresting.
I kind of want to see it and getget their take on and kind of
like figure out what it is. I'm like I knew nothing about
it. Yeah.
I when I say I was blown away for how good it was and I was
(13:02):
enthralled in the story and thenwhen the ending happened, I like
jumped out out my seat. I'm watching this at home.
Like I'm watching end game and shit like oh, this is fucking
awesome. Like the whole sequence that
happened at the final acting like, oh, this the end.
They're like oh there's a Part 2like this is dope as shit.
Yeah, and and now I think about it, it definitely was that last
(13:22):
episode, The Last of Us, when they did the job flashback.
And it was the last scene with him and Ellie where he was
explaining of, well, she was asking basically, like, did you
merk out that hospital? He's like, I did.
And I love you and I hope, you know, I hope you do a little
better than I do. Joe was crying and I was crying.
I will. I will keep my Last of Us
(13:44):
comments to myself about that season.
I had no, no, no, no, let's be real.
Because this is what we do, man.It was fine.
A lot of highs, but the lows were so incredibly low that it's
almost like to the point was like, this is disrespectful.
I agree, that's the problem I had with it.
Yeah, yeah, like last night's episode was really, well, a lot
(14:06):
last night, two nights ago episode really bother me because
they really took took away from the LE that we know.
And I, my man Anthony been telling me this forever.
He hate, he hates the show, not really hate.
He really doesn't like Joe because he loves the games so
much and to to see to see what essentially is like what seemed
(14:28):
to be a real clueless Ellie really bothered him.
I kind of and if I and I finallysaw a biggest day, I was like,
oh, they played my girl on this.The show is really watered down,
Yeah. And and because I don't want to
make this about Lazarus, but my biggest thing was what the thing
that I liked about the the game is, well, especially part one.
(14:50):
Yeah, that the choice, the big choice of Part 1 was ambiguous.
Yeah. So there were sort of people
having a conversation about whatwas right, what was wrong, how
they felt about it. The show tells you the answer to
that choice, and that takes the fun away from it.
Yeah. Oddly enough, fatherhood right
(15:13):
there and then and there. Yeah, you know what I'm saying?
As people were like, oh, as a parent, go would you go save
your kid or you gonna let him save the world?
I'm like, the answer is always going to be, I'm going to say my
kid because my kid in in this situation of of the Last of Us
didn't actually have a choice. Yes, exactly, that was my whole
argument about it. You took away the choice from
the kid. Yeah, you just knocked my kid
out and took him to cut him, cuthim open without having a
(15:33):
discussion with them at first. So no, I'm gonna shoot you all
the fucking. Ribbons and I feel like getting
a little bit less for still choice for us, but I feel like
the ideal of them taking away that option and that choice,
just making it seem like, oh, that choice.
But then then when that's a, that's a huge part of that, that
(15:53):
that decision. It's just creators sometimes be
just talking. I don't bang with JK Rowling at
all. You know, she's a she's a
transphobia and I cannot abide by that.
But she constantly for a while there was just like, you know,
her mommy was black. You know, doodle Doo was gay.
Just shit. That was never in the in the the
material. It's just given enough time.
(16:14):
Creators just got to have it, just sprinkling other shit that
they thought they might or should have, could have, did.
Yeah. And I think that's what Neil
Druckman is doing right now. And I think that I think that
because I had in the PSVG chat, I was saying that sometimes
creators don't do kind of do toomuch and don't always do what's
(16:38):
best for their property. And, and, and it's not because I
know people's like, Oh yeah, butit's the creator.
It's the creator said, yes, it'sthe greatest decision.
But at the same time, they're creating something for people to
enjoy. Yeah.
And you have to appease the masses to that aspect unless
you're making something for yourself and making something
(16:59):
for yourself, it's whatever. But if you're making a story to
be enjoyed, you got to sometimesbend a little bit.
You, you, you put it on the world and you let the world do
it what it will. No, it's your baby and you want
to do some stuff with it. But.
If if the world is telling you they want something one way and
you do it the other way, the people, people have a problem
(17:20):
with that. That's because, well, that's
what it is. Perfect example is Game of
Thrones, the Game of Thrones finale.
Everybody wanted something one way and they and they kind of
just try to go against the grainand people like this.
This sucks. They swear that's the outline
that Georgia R Martin gave them.And in fact, Georgia R Martin
has said that is the outline I gave them.
So it's not like they went against the grain.
(17:41):
They went with the grain, a little bit of grain they had
left. Yeah, and, and they'll let
people and people rejected it. Sometimes you got to listen to
the people. Facts.
Sometimes you get what they want.
Get out of here. We know, we know.
Drove all off the Cliff. That's that's what this show
does. We do the 55, sometimes the last
five minutes, sometimes the last30 minutes.
Depends on the questions. Question #5 that's the easy one
(18:03):
for you. Or maybe not.
Sometimes, sometimes not. What is the most dad ass thing
that you have in your house? You look around, you're like
man, this is some shit a dad would have.
What is something that you have that's like that besides that
hat? Brand new my my baby just got it
from my lady got it for me. We saw it a hot time ago and I
(18:24):
was like a Totoro safari style hat got to have it and then she
came home with the other day outof nowhere and I was like that's
so dope for a while there until I was the God the world decided
Oh T been doing it right this whole time.
Turntable T was not rocking turntables like I was rocking
turntables for as long as I was rocking the turntable.
With no disrespect, I'm not trying to say I was a a
(18:45):
turntable hipster. I'm not.
Some people have been holding onwith the turntable since the
jump, but for a while there it was really it was very much a
your dad listens to records is what my kids friends say, and it
just seems so out of pocket. But in in indeed I do.
You see these boom boxes back behind me.
You know what I'm saying? I got Lego all over the place.
(19:07):
You were saying I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I don't know, man.
I'm my own type of dad, I guess you know what I'm saying.
See, that's the cool thing abouttoday and dads of today.
I feel like because generations have changed and one thing about
our generation, whether people want to admit to it or not,
(19:29):
we're not the absentee father that the previous generation was
for the most part, whether whether they're together or not,
the dads are being more on thesekids life, black dads and kids
in these kids life. And you know, and it's very
different. And not only that, the dads are
younger, like our 40 feels a lotdifferent than our parents 40 in
(19:54):
terms of like we still have likeart, like we still play video
games. We still have collectibles.
I'm not just talking about me. And you like a general
consistence when I look like these are like these people.
I know my friends who are my age, who have kids, they're
like, yeah, we still play video games.
We still collect things these this is what we spend our time
with. We we may watch sports and stuff
(20:15):
like that, but we still are veryyoung at heart in many ways and
I think because of that our kidscan relate to us.
To a certain degree and and levels very.
Different than our, our, our generation, our dads kind of
felt when when they were when the ones we had were around, you
(20:35):
know, it was very, very different vibe.
Yeah. Then what we have today, you
know, where we kind of feel likeat least I can, I don't speak
from my experience. The dance I see don't have that
same vibe. The dance I grew up watching,
watching scene had like, you know, it's just very different.
(20:57):
And I guess because we grew up in a different era, we're we're,
I want to say we're really the first wave of hip hop kids true
that grew up in that, that era of hip hop and that, that kind
of cool era where we had like hip hop and we had video games.
We had like, you know, the firstwave of computer kids.
(21:17):
Really. Yeah.
So a lot of the things that our parents had is different.
Like, you know, our parents had other things, but it's not like
our our wave was our wave is just different.
Yeah, I, I, you know, I'll see stuff show up and I'm not, I'm,
I'm, I'm firmly in Gen. X show.
And some people like he's like millennial millennials be like,
I'm like millennials. I was the first one on the
computer like you were not because I was on the computer.
(21:38):
Trust your boy. We had AOL chat rooms and stuff
like that in Myspace. Yeah, man.
So there's levels to it. I'm saying, did you have an
Apple 2 E in your classroom? I did so.
Were you playing Doom or Wolfenstein or I come to San
(21:58):
Diego? I did play indeed Return to
Castle Wolfenstein and and and because I because that's that's
the one I that one of the first first person joints ever I've
ever messed around with. And I think we checked it out
from the library oddly enough and it was multiple disk.
Yes. And so you had to just gotta and
one, if you once you got them all loaded, hope your computer
(22:20):
can handle it, because a lot of computers could not.
And So what it ended up being isthat you you'd be having like
just a a little box and kind of like the center of the screen
that you're playing the game on as opposed to being full screen.
And obviously we got the computers that can handle, you
know, the fuller screen graphics.
Yeah, man, I, I, yeah. Return to cover Wolf.
Wolfenstein was the first joint I ever played, man.
So first person joint I ever played.
(22:42):
So very. Specific.
Yeah. Yeah, well.
Well, let's get right to it man,since we're talking about
fathers. Stuff like that.
What what's your journey of becoming a dad and what it's
been like for you? So I.
Have two kids I Once Upon a timeI would have told you I had a
boy and a girl and I caught all the Pokémon but life does not
(23:04):
stay that way now does it? So now I have two boys and well,
at this point practically 2 men and my, my, my oldest son was a
not perfectly because it was definitely a challenge to get
him into this world, but he was he was applauded and schemed and
planned child who was created via it's not in vitro
(23:29):
fertilization. What is the fertilization
technique based? I had to put some so I had to, I
had to make a deposit into a jar.
They take the jars contents and then go and drop them off at the
door. This is how this worked out for
me after after of course, my wife at the time had taken up a
bunch of a bunch of medicine to help her produce a good supply
of eggs. Everything we've been told was
(23:52):
not supposed to work out the first time, but that's not how
life was for us. So took like that.
I can tell you the exact name myson was made.
I can tell you the exact name hewas born because that's how
science works. So on let.
Me ask you this, what was that whole experience like?
Because that is like a very it. Was it was, you would think it'd
(24:15):
be nerve wracking racking, but it really wasn't.
We had a a, we had a highly recommended old dudes, old
Jewish Doctor Who was just like,just like just the silliest dude
man. And my, my company, I said,
well, people tell you all the time, the company I work for is
just super indepo appropriation,you know what I'm saying?
(24:37):
They, they pay for it, they cover it, they cover it up to a,
up to a real high amount. Luckily we got it done the first
go round, you know what I'm saying?
So what covered it? Yeah, yeah.
I didn't have to pay anything out of pocket besides co-pays.
And that's great. So it turns out my, my, my, my,
my kids mom, she had a what's called PCOS polycystic ovary
(25:00):
syndrome, I believe is what it is.
I think sometimes, yeah. And basically her eggs would not
mature, I believe is how that works out.
And so they'd be a bunch of they, they, they wouldn't mature
all the way and then they'd formcyst so you wouldn't get a, a
fully, you know, fur forged egg that could then thusly be
(25:21):
fertilized and then, you know, you know, hopefully grow into a
kid. And and so once we that part was
discovered, he's like, well, here's the work around for that.
We can give her medicine that will make her pop more eggs that
are hopefully that will work out.
And indeed, she I can remember that clear as day.
(25:42):
She had 333 eggs that look like they could work.
So really, I could have had a whole lot more kids.
This could have took a whole different direction for your
man. It did not and.
You could have had like little kids the future had.
Yeah, it could have been a litter.
But your panel puppies? And so it like I said, it it it
(26:07):
worked. It it, it took, it worked.
March 25th, 2003 was when we made my child and December 8th,
2003 is when he came into this world.
And so and then of course he wasa, he was a challenging child to
come into this world. We we had went to because he was
a, he was a, they planned to induce.
(26:29):
So he went in on a Friday and myson didn't arrive till Monday
and, and, and by the time we gotthere, it was like, oh, hey,
he's suffering from tachycardia.I think I was saying his heart
was slowing down. Yeah, I think that's what that
was slowing down. And they're like, we got to go
get him. So it goes from what is already
(26:52):
a, a nerve wracking experience and multiple days of of Labor,
but not labor. She was not labouring a little
bit labor, but she was sufferingcontractions and the like to an
emergency C-section. And so all of a sudden it's
like, OK, they take her, they suit me up.
(27:14):
There's like there's a picture of some around here of me and my
full little hospital situation. I'm a big dude, so of course
they have me in this suit that Ican just brace you.
Oh God, you got to, you got to, you got to send me that picture
because that's going to be on. That's going to be the picture
this episode. If I can find that picture, I
certainly will. Yes, Sir, and I'm in a, in a, in
a, in a surgery and, and, and you know, and I in an OR as they
(27:38):
bring my kid into the world. And of course my kid comes to
the world just quiet as a churchmouse, which is scary as shit,
'cause, you know, TV has taught us baseballs be screaming and
coming to the world gapping. Not my son who came in this
world quiet as a church mouse. And I was sitting there just
freaking out, but they let me goover there and they let me snip
the cord and they weighed them in 8 lbs eight oz on the 8th.
(28:00):
So I can always remember Zander's size.
And I got to hold him for his mom while they were sewing her
back up. And there we were.
We were parents. And it was dope.
And it really was my, my, my oldest son is, is and remains
just a delight. It was super easy to, to, to, to
(28:20):
raise and bring into this world.Very chill kid.
Like you. Slept easy.
What's up? I say.
You and him probably have the similar qualities when it come
to that. Maybe, Maybe.
But then let's say six weeks into his life, all of a sudden
his mom is having pain and discomfort.
(28:41):
And so from so on, it turns out she had to have her gallbladder
out. So she had to go in the hospital
for a stretch, meaning she and was, you know, sick and surgery.
And so over the term, she couldn't breastfeed my kid
anymore who was already having trouble breastfeeding because as
it turns out, he has a short, had a short tongue.
They had to clip his underneath his tongue.
So his tongue would be his tongue tied is what they call
it. And yeah, so we had to switch my
(29:03):
man from boobs to bottle in realshort order.
But what she was like there all day, give me this formula.
Cool son, you don't want so real, real, real good stuff.
So like 2 1/2, three years later, there's the excess about
the, the, the, the amount of time between my kids.
(29:26):
Boom, my wife just ends up pregnant.
Mind you, we've been told you can't get pregnant like this.
It's going to take steps, you got to go to the weather.
But Nope, old school, natural, no, nothing, no whatever.
And it's just. Like you old doggies?
That's crazy. Got her.
(29:47):
Did you say that She's like Bobby?
Second kid schedule C-section. OK, so a little more ready for
what I'm used to, but that Doctor Who was not the same
Doctor Who did who was, was a real piece of shit.
(30:08):
And I hate him to this day. I hate him.
He my, my wife with my with my with our second kid had
gestational diabetes and did everything she was supposed to
do to to control it. So the kid would be well and she
would be well was never playing around with it.
But my kid still came into this world. 10 lbs for like 14 oz.
(30:32):
Giants. A giant.
Baby, he's a big kid. And the doctor just says out
loud because he I just don't like, he thinks he's cracking
jokes with the staff. He's like, so much for diabetic
control. I'm like, you lucky.
I'm over here having to hold it down over here and knock over
there and smack fire out your mouth, son, because that's not
(30:53):
what's happening here. It's amazing the things that
doctors and nurses say because you know that the job requires
them to be around a lot of people all day as part of their
job. But the the bedside manner was
just fascinating. Yeah, yeah, dude was waxed.
You don't fuck with him. If he is alive, fuck him.
(31:16):
And if he's dead, I'll be in hell.
And I don't even believe in hell, but for him I'll make the
exception. There you go.
So there we are a parent, two kids of it.
It's it's it was wild. And maybe a year, not even a
year, six months after we had toget, we moved to the house I'm
in now and I've been since what's that?
(31:41):
Five years after that we get a divorce.
Just shit happens. Yeah, people just we took the
part. It's the thing.
Yeah, we were very good Co parents and I looked to a point
it was like it was like I I thought pretty impressive how
how how good a Co parents we were.
But shit, three years after that, almost 10 years, almost in
(32:05):
fact 10 years next week of she passed away, my ex-wife, my my
kids mom's passed away. And like I said, she would, she
would have been gone 10 years next week.
How old were your kids at the time?
Good question. Well, let's just do the maths.
Let's just take a quick look. Because I imagined that had to
(32:26):
be traumatizing for kids. Yes.
And for you, for that matter. Yeah.
So my youngest, my oldest was 11and my youngest was 7 going on
8. Yeah, I imagine a lot to take in
because, you know, you have these kids that are super young.
(32:49):
Yeah. Then their mom passes away.
Yeah, now it's like. We had 5050 custody, literally
half time with me, half time with their mom.
Yes, very, very easy. They went to school where I
live. We kept that going for, for for
continuity sake. We had a real good sitter set up
already, so you know what I'm saying?
A support system was in place. But now it's no longer 5050
(33:13):
because she's gone. So now it's 100 hundred you.
Yeah, 100% me. So what's that like?
It was never 100% just me and I'll tell you why the year we
got divorced, but we so we splitup in 2012, got divorced in
2013. The year we got divorced, we
split up and we knew what the deal was.
(33:35):
And, and and she had, it was like she moved out like probably
like a month after. So we were out in the world.
Like, yeah, if we ain't going tobe together, that's cool.
Let's just, we, we're good. We can go date and go see the
world. It's OK.
No beef, no, no disrespect. You know what I'm saying?
I started, I went on a date withthe, the, the, the lady who I'm
still with to this day. And so we went on a date, August
(33:58):
of 2012. We'd go see Batman, The Dark
Knight Rises, still one of my favorite movies of all time.
Fuck with Bang no matter what nobody says and we.
All can't be perfect. Hey, man.
And so that's when I'm not goingto say we started dating, but we
were, we were, you know, we, we had gone on on a couple of dates
(34:18):
that year and then the next yearwe kind of really like, OK,
let's sell into a groove here. We're going to we're going to, I
think it's going to be me and you.
And so she had been with me for a couple of years at that point
and she had met the kids, but I was so I was very, very weird
about my kids meeting people I was dating didn't know what it
was going to be. And I didn't want them having to
(34:38):
draw, making any attachments to people that may not be in my
life or any kind of stretch. And in fact, they met my lady on
accident. It just got late today one day
and I was like, shit, I got to get my kids from school and
we've been messing around away on over here.
You got to come with me, go get my kids right quick.
Sorry. And she's like, all right, this
(35:00):
is what it is. So this we meet them.
And so that's when we go go meet, go.
They meet my lady Vanessa for the first time.
And then so like Vanessa had been coming through staying, so
staying over some nights, not no, no, no real stress of time.
But when my kids mom passed away, she just was like, all
right, I'm here. I, I just, I live here now.
(35:22):
I, I'm going and brought her stuff, got the rest of her
stuff. And I'm saying that wasn't over
here. And just immediately was just
like, all right, I, I, I volunteer as tribute.
I know it's about to be rough and I'm not going to leave you
out here on on on your own. And so again, I was never by
myself, never without. Now, she was nobody's mom.
She takes this day, didn't have kids, did not really know my
(35:45):
children that that strongly yet.She knew them well, you know,
I'm saying they knew each other.Everybody knew Vanessa.
We'd hung out, we'd gone to sporting events and, you know,
you know, the zoo and movies andstuff like that there.
So, yes. But she was not, you know,
motherly or whatever. And so it really was on me to,
you know, just be what I was. And it was awful.
It was a terrible, terrible. Sometimes.
(36:07):
Some days, I tell you right now,10 years old, it still feels
terrible. Yeah, but.
I can imagine. I I did what what I hope was
what I was supposed to do and I took care of the other kids and
then hopefully, you know, did right by them and got them
through rough times. I'm telling you right now,
there's a lot of crazy stuff that went down.
(36:29):
Tell you my my, my oldest hair grew out real long fro, but it
was a fro that he never took care of.
So it's just a peasy mess. And one dad just had to chop it
up with him like, hey, man, you ain't let me come with you ain't
doing that until what is going on?
And he was like, mom says she's like my hair long.
(36:53):
And so I just want to keep it that way for her.
I go between taking care of it. You think your Mama would have
wanted you and I and I never wasthe guy who threw around your
Mama wouldn't have wanted you todo this or that because I never
want to put make their mom some kind of pariah or or just be the
mean focal point or whatever like that.
But I'm just like, your mom wouldn't want you just doing
this if you don't want to be doing this, man, you don't have
to do this if you don't want to do this.
(37:16):
And he was so hurt. He was so not hurt that it had
to happen, but he was so hurt. He was just, he was just taken
aback. And so, and so we went and got
his hair cut and got him, got him right, you know what I'm
saying? And ever since he's been very
good about taking care of his hair.
But he, it was just one of it's one of those many things that
people are like, my mom's did this, but my, my kids are like,
(37:36):
mom's like this mom like that. Now here's the thing I have I, I
consistently tried to make sure to some people will try to,
let's just tuck that memory away.
So we will be and we'll leave itbehind.
And I was like, fuck that. We will talk about your mother
and the best in terms and the worst in terms at all times.
So we can, we can, we can celebrate her memory and her
(37:57):
existence and her presence in your lives and why that means
something. My youngest looks and behaves
just like her. It is so funny.
Laugh like her got her got her smile got her everything.
It makes me chuckle every time. My oldest loves the things she
loved, roller coaster, scary movies, things like that.
There's so much of her that's like that is that is a part of
(38:19):
her. And like I said, I made the
point to try to be not just try to be, but to be very cool with
her, her people, her side of thefamily and so forth.
And up until recently. And again, that's another thing
of fatherhood. It finally got to a point and
I'll get you there. Well, you know what?
I'll get you there when I get toanother part of story.
So yeah, it was, it was terrible.
(38:40):
It was let me tell you somethingright now, losing a parent is
awful and losing your Co parent,you know what I'm saying?
Your your partner is even is is is is is its own version of
awful and so forth. And so it's just was, it was a
bad time for the Empire, you know what I'm saying?
And I just cried. I cried, I cried, I cried, I
(39:01):
cried, I cried. They cried.
I had to tell them that this happened.
You know what I'm saying? Yeah.
And and so I tell my son like the night I'm told about it, my
kid, my, my, my, my, my up boy told me my oldest son and my
youngest son was asleep. So I had to wake them when they
woke up the next day. I had to go to I had to tell
them that they mom was gone and not coming back.
You know what I'm saying this night.
(39:21):
And and so I was just like. I I can speak on this aspect of
it. One of the hardest things you
can do as a parent, as a dad, because it seems like it always
falls on us, is to tell your child that someone they love is
no longer around. Yeah.
(39:43):
And for those for those who don't know, my grandmother and
my father-in-law passed away last year within days of each
other. One was expected, one was
completely out of left field. So my father-in-law died.
(40:03):
I want to say like it was like aSaturday or something like that.
And what happened was they was trying to reach my ex-wife and
for some reason I think she was sick and she wasn't feeling
good. She wasn't answering the phone,
so they called me. My brother-in-law and he was all
(40:26):
destroyed. Like, hey, I'm allowed to tell
you this, but their, their dad just died.
Like what? And you know, he, you know, all
intensive purposes. Me, whether me and my ex
together or not, that was still a good man.
That was somebody I knew for 20 years.
(40:49):
Yeah. So that it hit me hard and then
you come up with reality, like, oh shit, I have to tell her that
her dad's gone. Yeah.
And I only have to tell her thatI have to tell my kids that.
So now I have to make the journey over there and wake her
(41:11):
up and tell her that her dad's gone and that's not something
anybody wants to do. But it is A to be grieving
yourself and then have to shoulder and witness somebody
else's grief. And.
Not just grief, because that part that person is like is a
hit you don't want to ever experience.
Not just grief, it is. It is to to have to break
(41:35):
someone's heart. Yes.
To literally and without when and and no joke, I'm saying to
go and have to just have to no, no walking around and no getting
around and no I can tell some stories or whatever.
You know what I'm saying? No, I have to.
I have to break your heart in a way that will never be repaired.
Yes, fucking bullshit. And then to top that off I had
(41:56):
to do it again like 3 days later.
Yeah, yeah. It's something I wouldn't wish
on anyone. I always I Chuck when I tell
this story. I used to work at work at Little
Caesars, manage the Little Caesars for a while, had a boss,
Stan and Stan had two kids and stand one day explained to us
(42:17):
the idea of becoming a father, said it's not something I wish
on my worst enemy, He said. You in the hospital, you are
scared for your wife, you are scared for your kids, you're
scaring about becoming a dad andso forth and so on and all the
means for and so on and so on. And I didn't, I, it's like I
(42:39):
heard him in my head when my kidcame into this world the first
time. It's like, you're right.
This is awful. Everything about this is awful.
I was because again, this is major surgery.
They cutting a kid out of this woman.
My kid is hope is is they they're telling me it's such a
mercy that they have to cut him out of her.
You know what I'm saying? So things that you wouldn't
worship on your worst enemy, becoming a dad via caesarean
(43:00):
section or, you know, just becoming a dad any anyway, and
also having to tell somebody that you tell somebody you love
to somebody they love is no longer going to be a part of
their life. No, thank you.
I wouldn't tell. I wouldn't do it to anybody.
I don't wish it upon you or anyone you love because it's
awful. I do.
Straight up. So getting back to get your
story. Yeah, I am.
(43:22):
A You had to kind of deal with becoming this, I want to say,
new single father. Yeah, but you had someone by
your side, but they were more unexperienced with parenthood
than you were. Straight up just a rookie.
So I so I so I even till up until last week when my kid
(43:44):
finished school, I wake up, I make lunches, I make dinner.
I I do all those things that parents do.
I'm not saying my lady don't do that, but she because she what
she does is she contributes. She does, she does, she can do
out of pocket. Basically, she becomes the
muscle of the organization. You know what I'm saying?
She takes care of a business like that.
(44:04):
And you know, we, we tried to, we tried to attend all the shows
and events and football games. We tried to take care of their
friends. So from song, we did what we
thought parents supposed to do. I'm gonna tell you right now,
everything I do is basically, basically everything I was doing
was basically things I saw on sitcoms growing up.
It's like, OK, make sure your kids go to prom.
Make sure your kids go to movies, make sure they have the
good snacks and not the shitty ones.
(44:25):
Make sure they got dope shoes and not no nonsense.
And I just tried to make sure I did those things and abided by
those things kept in the same school system the entire time.
So I tried to be stable. I decided never to move.
I like I said, we were getting, you know what I'm saying?
I was talking about moving. I was just like, no, I'm not
going to, I'm going to hold it down that way.
They have a place to call home. You know what I'm saying?
It's like, these are the steps. I was, I was thinking about
(44:48):
taking a life tried, like I said, try to make sure they stay
tight with their mom's side of the, of the family, because
you're saying I, I didn't, I don't like, I, I, I didn't grow
with my father and I don't know my, my father's side of the
family and I, and I, I don't, it's not that I, I have a
distaste for that or anything together.
I just didn't want my kids repeating that, you know what
I'm saying? So I tried to make sure I, I, I
(45:10):
took better care of that than myfather took care of, you know
what I'm saying? Because he could have probably
been a more, a more present father.
He just chose to not be. So that's on him and I, like I
said, I'll try to be better thanhim.
It was. And that's really why that Joel
shit made me cry on The Last of Us.
I'm saying just do a little bit better than me.
And it was like, yeah, that's, that's that is the goal and
(45:32):
intent of, of, of, of, of, of this whole operation.
I hope I've done better than my Mama and I hope when they have
kids, they'll do better than I meet.
You know what I'm saying? I was never, I was never a
hitter. I wouldn't really spanking my
kids. My kid spoke recently, told me
how Once Upon a time I snatched them up and it fucked with him
(45:53):
so much that they still kind of bothered by because they got
snatched up. You know what I'm saying?
I didn't beat my children. I don't spank them that they got
there, but I did yoke their ass up one time and it still is is
in their soul and I feel bad about that, you know what I'm
saying? Yeah.
And and, you know, it's, it's kind of interesting because I
know our generation grew up around the violence.
(46:18):
And what I mean is, you know, like spread a rod, spread a
child, you know, weapons was a commonplace.
And our generation, I guess because of the trauma some of us
carry that, that with us, most of us, for the most part, the
ones I know, they don't really like to expect their kids with
the kids because they know that it doesn't work.
(46:38):
And it's been kind of really interesting watching for what I
know people grow and develop andlearn from the mistakes of their
their fathers and mothers and, and kind of use that to build on
the way they want to raise and teach their kids.
So what had that been like from you learning the lessons from
your parents with your mother? Again, I, I, I, I was not a
(47:03):
strike my children kind of guy, you know, old school, get your
hand away from that Dang light socket, whatever, you know what
I'm saying? Why you got that butter knife in
your hand going near the plug inthe wall.
Children is wild that way, but they do that shit, you know what
I'm saying? So a little bit of that, the
little hand smack like no, don'tdo that and so on and so on.
Like I said never a full on ass whatever have I ever given my
kids. I tried to be a little more
(47:25):
loose with how so and Vanessa tell you my lady hates it and I
hate it now because right now I'm having to clean my sons my
oldest sons room who don't basically say anymore.
He pretty stay with his lady at this point.
He old enough to be whatever buthis room is a fucking mess.
But my Mama coming this weekend because my youngest is about to
graduate and so she going to stay in that room and it's
definitely such a goddamn mess. I'll know to do it.
(47:47):
But what it is is I used to hatemy Mama being on my ass by
cleaning my room. Hated it.
So I was always just like, look,try to take care of it, pick it
up, try to keep it decent, You know what I'm saying?
And that's all that's about as worse as I was about when it
came to, you know, telling my kids to clean their room, You
know what I'm saying? It's like, look, make sure I can
walk in here and not die. Don't have too much.
No, don't have food to put too much food up in here, so and so
(48:07):
on. I try to be just kind of chill
about it in that regard. And, and my mom, as funny as my
mom would, would tell you that she as she got older and
actually was kind of like takingcare of my my brother's kid.
She was like, no, just kind of let that's their space.
Let them treat their space like they like, like they would want
(48:28):
to, you know what I'm saying? If they wanted to be a shit hole
and that's on them, I guess, youknow what I'm saying?
And that's how funny that's, that's her as a grandma.
She realized that, not as a mom.She didn't realize that.
So I try to you try to let him go play out on the streets
without too much, you know, saying nonsense, you know what
I'm saying? But but also I got out there and
(48:49):
taught him how to ride bikes andand so forth.
You know what I'm saying, pushing around and took him in
a, a stroller or, or, or a wagonaround the way.
You know what I'm saying, Walkedaround.
I was out there. I tried to be involved as much
as as much as possible throughout my kids lives, you
know, and so my oldest played football for some years and I
(49:10):
was, you know, at every game andat every practice too.
I was like everyone not didn't miss, never missed.
And so when they got to high school and he was, he was in
marching band, but when he was in junior high, they did
orchestra and choir. So again, I was at all those
performances too, because then Ijust tried to make sure that I
was everywhere next. That's another good thing is
(49:30):
that I'm not saying I work, I work for the best company in the
world, but I I've worked for people who are like, I'm a
parent. I get it.
If you need to dip out a little early to get to the concert or
you need to dip out a little early, take him somewhere.
Don't worry about it. We'll get the time made-up
somewhere along the lines. And I've always appreciated
that. You know what I'm saying?
It's like people be like, wait, why you so loyal to this gig
(49:51):
that you benefit so long? Because they have been pretty
decent to me over the years. And that's, and that's why I
try, I try to, I try to pay thatback with a decent amount of
loyalty, you know what I'm saying?
I got to respect it. Yeah, yeah.
Let me ask this because it's something you mentioned earlier
and I want to touch on a little bit.
You said earlier when we first started that you know one of
(50:14):
your children went through a transition.
Yeah. And one, I commend you for being
the man that you are, to let your child choose to be who they
want to be. Yeah.
And what they put in their heart.
So what was that like for you tokind of like?
(50:36):
That little jive so and so one day just out of nowhere, it said
on Instagram of all places, justfor my parents, my name is Lee
now and blah, blah, yeah, he's smaggy.
So and and and I, and at that point they were they they I
think they were like, decide they're going to be non binding.
And I was like straight up and down.
(50:57):
Don't be put me on blast in the streets, erase that.
And I had to make them take thatpose down like you're going to
be put me on blast because I didn't know you had decided to
become Lee. I didn't know that you you think
hinting at it was going to get you somewhere.
But what it is is that bravery finally struck me, finally got
brave enough to come out and be like, this is who I am.
And and but they did. I feel like the wrong way.
(51:19):
I'm like, God, because you you got folks looking at me like,
I'm sorry, like I'm the I'm a I'm a asshole and I'm like, I'm
not. I would never be that way.
All I'm ever going to do is be like, OK, let's talk about it.
Let's let's see. And so the former Lily said, I
am Lee now and I'm like, OK, andwhat does that mean?
Well, right now, I think I identified as non binary and
(51:41):
years some sometime later, he would be like, I knew I was a
boy, but I just kind of I wouldn't I wouldn't fully ready
to say that I was a boy yet. You know what I'm saying?
Because I know with that, I knowthat is a, that that is a step,
you know? Yes.
And I was just like, OK, I know,I know, I know.
People are like you. It wasn't a big deal to you.
I it was about so here's take you back today.
(52:05):
So when I first had was told I was going to have a daughter, I
was like, I'm going to make it apoint to never try to treat them
girly or be make them have to dopink and all that other stuff.
If they if that's the right theywant to walk, then sure thing,
but I'm never going to force theissue and people will fucking be
like I'm going to buy her all kinds of pink shit and blah,
blah, blah. I'm like like funny, I know you
(52:26):
think you joking or whatever, whatever.
I had a lady once tell me, Sir at work again, maybe your son
will become a dancer. And how's this like?
Oh, that'd be so dope because she wanted she wanted a
different response from me. She thought she's about to go me
into some some nonsense. I go, Ah, bro, that'd be so
dope, especially if you got liketo ballet or something like that
and I can go see all the shows and it fucked her up and it
ruined her shit. And I'm saying because that's
(52:46):
the type that and that that one was with with intent and malice.
I had to say that to her face and I really wouldn't like if my
if my kid was a dancer, it wouldhave been dope, but that broad
didn't want that. She thought it's about to be
something whenever and I'm like,Nah, bro, I'm just not built
that way. I'm simply so by the time you
get around to my son telling me I'm your son, it's like, OK,
(53:07):
let's let's see what that means.School since my I got my kids.
It's super supportive. Was like, all right, you want to
be identified as Lee Lee You are.
And of it's it's just it's and it was funny.
It's like if you if you if you see my kid, it's like sure
thing, dude, he's a guy by his name legally name changed and
(53:29):
all that good stuff. Working on the gender situation
now because Ohio be weird. And also it something got hung
up and then it makes that we just found out the other day
because we did it at the same time.
So all this should have been done already, but it turns out
it's not done because something got hemmed up and I was just
like, come on, bro, y'all playing your boy.
But that just it's effort. And so because of just life
(53:54):
happening, because life be life is sometimes my, my, my son had
a bit of an eating disorder. Disordered eating is what they
call that now they don't call iteating disorder.
It's called disordered eating engaged in self harm.
So my son is full of scars because he was cutting himself
(54:15):
and also was Once Upon a time trying to take his life.
And so he had to, so he was, he had to go do like, you know,
mandatory hole type shit, you know what I'm saying?
Because it happens and it just, and it goes down like that.
And so we were stacking all those crates, right.
(54:35):
And then so with, with all that means.
And of course, then, you know, my mom passed away.
My kid has been in the hands of,of, of, of mental health
professionals for a stretch. That's good because that helps
them kind of walk the walk and figure out, OK, you can't just
say I, I, I know the world wantsto believe that you can just put
(54:56):
on a dress and call yourself a lady and that makes you a trans
person. Not how it works to to to be
considered A to transition. Legally you.
Know what I'm saying, and I knowsome people be like fuck
legality or they might be mad about that persuasion, but it it
does involve a mental health professional saying this person
(55:18):
meets the criteria that they have set place set forth that
says, yes, indeed, this person suffers from gender dysphoria
and, and, and, and should be it does identify as the the gender
opposite of what they were assigned at birth.
And through the process of all these other things and seeing,
(55:39):
you know, shrinks and so forth and trying to get better and
getting better, we, we, it was, it was, it's much easier, you
know what I'm saying? We got a mental health
professional kind of help holding our hands and walking us
through it and walking us through the process and and so
forth and getting us right. And so I know it just keeps like
a little teen your sister or whatever.
(55:59):
It just was, it was nothing. It was nothing but except my kid
for who my kid is and continuingto love my kid for just being my
kid. And it it it cost me nothing.
I promise you it cost me co-paysfor for shrinks.
That's what it cost me. And I and I didn't care because
I got a card I get from from work that I pay on every
paycheck and it has bread on it for that.
(56:20):
So. And see, that's what being a
father's about, you know, and, and and I commend you on that
because, you know, you make you made that decision sound like
such an easy thing. I don't know how it's not to
some people. And that's the thing, to a lot
of people, it's not. I it's, it's, it's so weird to
(56:44):
me when somebody just decides I can't love you the same because
you are, you've transitioned. It turns out you like the same
sex. You know what I'm saying?
You, whatever that is, you know what I'm saying?
I like, like, how can I not lovethese people who I love so
deeply? Mandy, you know it.
(57:04):
And I think I think most parentsknow it.
It is a love that is. It's unexplainable.
Correct. Where where you could feel their
joy, you could feel their hurt and, and, and too and you know
it and you feel it and and and so forth and so on.
It's so different than than thanany romantic love or anything
like that there that I've ever had ever experienced.
(57:27):
And so it's like I have an on off switch for that.
And it's weird to me that some people do where they where
they've just decided I can't love you if you're not what
society says you must be. I'm just I'm not built that way.
It's not in me in at all. And I'm not trying to say it to
make me so cool or make me such a good dude.
It just is who I am. And that's what makes you a good
(57:50):
dude. I hope so, and if that's the
case then I'll take it. I'll take it bro.
Because you care for your kids no matter what, your Love's
unconditional. I think that's in the essence of
what being a father is about. To good times, to bad times.
(58:10):
The things that you've kind of discussed during this episode,
whether it's through the loss oftheir mother, whether it's
through self harm, was through all these different areas of
their life they went through. There's been one constant that
kept them afloat, that kept themaround, that made them a better
person to get them where they they.
(58:31):
And that is you. And that's what makes you
special. That's what fatherhood is about.
That is what fatherhood is about, sacrificing and doing
what's necessary so your kids can be OK.
It seems like it's it seems easy, but a lot of people can't
(58:52):
do that. Again, I'll never understand it
as I said it, it it just it it it it I said the one thing I was
like, hey, man, you can't just put me on the Internet talking
about I didn't I didn't accept you for who you was because
that's not the case. I didn't know who you was,
little dude, watch yourself well, and the conversation was a
(59:13):
simple it was not simple. It was it was involved.
I go. Let me tell you something.
I've I've called you she her foryour entire life.
I've called you by the your old name your entire life.
I'm going to fuck up but it's never going to be intentional
and I'll always try to and I'll always try to correct myself.
To this day, and it's been so many years at this point, I
(59:36):
still will stumble every now andagain and say she and I always
apologize incorrect and just keep my fucking moving.
When when Let me tell you something and that's how this
how I know that people can change and people who are not
changing is just on some bullshit.
My mom is 77 about to be 78 years old but I laid it out to
(59:56):
her what the deal was. She's like okay now to this day
I'm saying she'll stumble every night against it'll say she
always corrects herself. It says he and and just accepts
it as taking it and knows it andgets kept moving it and and and
and. And pretty much didn't think
nothing of it like Jim was just like, all right, I guess that's
(01:00:16):
pretty much what my mom was up and went first and I'm like,
there you go. That's what that's what's up.
My general general, I guess because she loved her grandbaby
and that like they had a real tight bomb.
My mom would come and kick it uphere.
They would always kick it together.
Like my mom be up here, we'll behere Friday.
Guess what, they probably going to ride dirty together.
They're going to be kicking it together anyway because that's
just how it gets down. That's their relationship.
(01:00:38):
And so I know people say old people don't change or whatever.
It's open to them. It's like it's a lie.
It's a lie. It's a lie because I got a old
person in my life who was just like, OK, that's how we're doing
it now. I say that to go to the opposite
of that. His mama's Mama can't get right
(01:00:58):
or simply refuses to because I'mtrust me, I just told you, you
can get right. It ain't nothing to it.
In fact, and last year, probablyyear before last night, if I
think about it, we had something, we had an incident
where it just was like, I'll never see that motherfucker
again, dad. And I'm like, you OK with that?
I'm fully OK with you saying youdon't want to go contact with
(01:01:19):
your no contact with your grandma because if she can't get
right, can I respect yo-yo yo designation how I'm saying and
keep trying to be on some bullshit.
There ain't no point in trying to keep her in your keep her in
your life. And so I had to be supportive of
that. And I, I and I had to actually
(01:01:41):
get real. I was like, let me tell you
something right now. Yeah, yeah.
But I'm like, you'd never see you'd never see her until she in
her damn coffin. And that's if you want to go to
our funeral. Fuck her.
And that's not to me trying to be hateful.
I don't like, I do not like my fuck more than I never did fuck
with her. She didn't like me and my me and
my kids mom being together. We got together far too young.
I get it. But also I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm,
(01:02:04):
I'm, I'm, I'm a brown man. And then my my baby Mama was
not. So her mom was on that bullshit.
And to this day she remains on that bullshit.
And so my kids don't see their grandma no more.
Remember I told you, I try to keep him tight with that side of
fatty. So what they do see is they show
love. They hurt their mom's brother,
(01:02:24):
their uncle got love for him. He comes through, they kick it,
they'll go to his house over thesong Cool Bees.
They grandpa, they great grandpa, before he left this
world, they was cool with him show love.
I'm saying they great aunt who was always more of a mother to
their mom than her mother was. They always got to got love,
show love and so forth. So they still do get down with
(01:02:45):
that side of the family that wants to be getting down with
them. You know what I'm saying?
Yeah, I'm fucking with Mark, because Mark talking with us,
you know what I'm saying? Let's let's end this on a happy
note. Go ahead.
Because we done told your story from start, now let's get to the
ending. Very good.
(01:03:06):
And the ending is what I'm proudof.
As of this past couple weeks, one of your babies graduated.
They graduate Sunday. Oh, yeah, yeah.
As we record this, they will graduate Sunday of this week.
And then so by the time you hearthis, they will have graduated,
Yes. So you have gotten to the finish
line. I did it.
(01:03:27):
I raised two. I successfully raised two
adults, two people from baby to adulthood.
Now I won. I know, I know.
As a parent, the struggle doesn't end there.
For sure. But you got them there, and I
think that is to be committed. That's where you know your
(01:03:49):
story, that your part of the story as mentor kind of ends a
little bit. Yeah.
And their story of learning and finding themselves in the real
world begins. So what is that like for you now
that you're at that point? So my oldest has been pretty
much on his on his grizzly sincemaybe, maybe six months after he
(01:04:11):
graduated. He got a gig.
He he had a buddy whose granddaddy owns a a shop.
He's like, I can probably put you on my granddaddy and put him
on his granddaddy. He did.
And so he's had this job for some years now and likes it.
They, they pay him OK. They, you know, think it's a
fine job. But he actually is working on
(01:04:32):
trying to get into a program to start working on cars.
Because my kid loves my oldest loves cars, not just loves cars.
I'll talk your ear off about cars.
You know someone who knows aboutcars.
Put them two together. They'll just cipher the whole
time about cars. So he's been working on that.
He just he had had an interview with a with a a for a mentor
program or of some sort recently.
So we hope that all plays out well.
(01:04:54):
My youngest off RIP was like, I want to go to this school and I
want to major in music therapy. And I was like, I kind of don't
want you staying in Ohio becausewhile I was on some bullshit
when it comes to trans people, what the reality of it is is
Ohio on some bullshit when it comes to basically they don't
like trans women. Basically no one.
You never really hear people talking shit about trans men.
Yes, it's trans women. They hate women is what it comes
(01:05:15):
down to. They hate women, the six women,
they hate trans women, they justhate women.
They want to control them. So that's just what it is when
it comes down to it. And so, but the school he wants
to go to is, is local. But I was like, OK, but you know
what? We'll let you stay in the door.
That way you get that experienceand you're under your belt.
You know what I'm saying? You know what it is to go be
(01:05:35):
away from your folk and so forth.
And I'm just excited for them. They're excited.
I'm excited. I'm I'm I'm pumped to have to
have successfully have done it. I attended every, I attended all
the shows this this last year. My kid played lacrosse one year
also. I went to every game.
My youngest really was, it was areal man about town.
(01:05:58):
He played lacrosse. He was in margin band his first
year, but that was his brother'slast year margin man.
So that's kind of why he did it.He's been in choir this all all
four years. So he does, you know what I'm
saying? He does choir and that's and,
and because he's on testosterone, his voice has been
changing so, so surely. But he's got a couple of solos
under his belt and I think that's wonderful.
And I always cry when I see my son upstate on stage singing.
(01:06:20):
That always happens. So it's always fun of it's just
for a night, night. And so, and here's the thing,
you know, I told him what my sonhas gone through.
It's over dawn. But when he truly knew who he
was and I was like, I am me. I am Lee and this is who I am.
And I'm a boy named Lee and we all got on board and all signed
up for it and got them got them the help.
You need it straight A student crushing it in these streets.
(01:06:44):
Now, like I said, it didn't first couple of years weren't
that great. So, so that GPA looks kind of
kind of whatever now, because you were saying the first few
years weren't great. But right now, man, my kid is,
is, is is on the moves taking, you know, taking AP African
American studies and and and andso forth and so on and doing the
damn thing. Man, I'm super duper just proud
(01:07:04):
to have with with Vanessa holding my hand and I can say I
tell people all the time, boy, take a village.
Everybody in my life that has been a part of my children's
life have helped us get to this point.
I've done my part sure thing, but that's not it was never
alone. It was never just me and I, I
can never just give all that credit to myself because it has
been other people who have been in our lives and, and, and, and
(01:07:26):
have helped us get to where we are.
And so success into US, man, we've done it.
And I'm very, very, very proud of that man.
No doubt I. Love it.
So before we go, any final wordsyou want to say to potential
(01:07:48):
dads out there? I'm going to let you like, say
I'm gonna repeat myself, my man,Stan said.
Bro I wouldn't wish upon my worst enemy because the
experience is so it's so intensebut then it's the most amazing
thing you'll ever have in your entire life after the fact so
(01:08:09):
that that bringing them into this world is hard keeping them
alive. Way more challenging than people
giving credit for kids. Be on some bullshit, be in
cabinets trying to get a stuff they shouldn't be touching
things they shouldn't. It is a challenge, but you will
never love the way you love yourkids, man.
(01:08:30):
And it's just super duper dope, man.
It's so dope. And I'm telling you right now
around your, your whole life will be changed, but for the
better. You'll love it.
And I, I just need you to, to, to, to, to get ribby ready for
it. Know what it's going to be and
what it and what that what it all means.
Be ready to fight the good fight.
(01:08:51):
Sometimes, I mean literally haveto go into the office and have
to check foods at the gate. Like hold on.
You ain't going to be talking tomy kid this way.
And if I got a problem with thisteacher or I got a problem with
this student, I guess sometimes you got to get in there and let
him know. But if you got that in you man,
you are really going to make something great.
And I think that is just amazingand just being a kids life.
(01:09:11):
Play video games bad. I was playing, playing video
games with my son laying on my chest when he was literally I
was saying, I've taught my children to play games.
This game's all over my house. I know that seems weird, but
it's like, but that's what they do.
They love to be they, they, theywere gamers because I was a
gamer, but also when they went to go play sport, like I said, I
was, I tried to be present, like, OK, you want to take up
(01:09:32):
lacrosse, then I'll be out here at the lacrosse pitch trying my
best to learn that sport. Trust me.
That was some stuff that like what?
How's this hit man? There's a bunch of rules of that
game. It's like soccer and hockey all
in one. It's crazy.
And so you just, you're going tolearn, you're going to figure it
out and it's going to be wonderful.
(01:09:54):
And I hope it's breezy. I hope you have a good woman
with you, a good person with you, because you know what I'm
saying? At this point, we, we don't even
got thought around about you just got, I hope you got good
people surrounding you to help you raise your kid or, or, or
that you are a good person in helping people raise their kids
by being a good presence in their lives and, and, and, and
taking care of business and taking care of them.
(01:10:15):
And so you could be the dopest uncle, the dopest grandpa, the
the dopest whatever. You know, I'm saying brother
that has to take care of you know, I'm saying his siblings or
whatever you do and will figure it out and you're going to do
better than you have any any idea.
And you're going to be so good at it.
You're going to be like, look atthat.
I successfully graduated two children.
I got them from from from from birth to the hood.
(01:10:38):
Crazy. Hey, Benny, that for real, T?
Let them know to find you brother.
I am across the, the, the, the far and wide.
I am the internet's Tayrel 713 TAYREL, the number 7, the number
13 all in one. No, I'm not from Houston. 7 to
13 is a whole bunch of other stuff that I care not to explain
to you right now. Just know it's about luck and
(01:11:01):
unluck and so forth. And so I have a show that I've
been doing for a dozen years. It's called stage crunchy milk
Crunchy, of course, being spelled with AK regular podcast.
It's me and my homeboys. We sit, we chop it up, just talk
about whatever and it's a good time to be had there.
I have a second podcast. It's called Crimpa to say that
crim is spelled with AK because you know, I'm branding.
(01:11:21):
If I got a crunchy, I got to have a crim.
Crimpa to say is a Great BritishBake Off podcast.
We review and recap the Great British Bake Off and the Great
American Baking Show. And what I've been so lucky to
have of these last couple of seasons is the bakers from the
Great American Baking Show have jumped on and hung out with us
and that has been super fun. If you get down with a Bake Off
(01:11:43):
type of universe, you might wantto listen to our show because I
think it's pretty great. Got a music show that we don't
do as much anymore, but it's still out there.
You can go get it. It's on Spotify right now
though. They've been hollering at your
boy about, hey man, it's music on this thing.
Should we be letting you keep this up?
It's caught a pod called Cast and it's pretty dope.
There's been a couple episodes of that.
So if you go listen to it, you can you can hear him on there
(01:12:04):
giving his as we opine about music.
It's a good thing to have when it's all said and done, man, We
we, we, I'm just I'm out here, bro.
I'm saying you want to follow meon PlayStation or or or Xbox or
Nintendo so forth and so on, Man, like I said, I'm Tabriel
713 the Internet over. I try to be a good person.
I don't play a lot of online with other people, but every now
(01:12:25):
and again I thought the headphones on and we'll just go
shoot some Fortnite or something.
It's cool. But that is who I am and that is
what I do. Also, man, saying I brought a
shotgun in the Cadillac. If you listen to Cadillac on
Mars, we have not done the last couple of months because
Trophy's kid had a scheduling conflict by the way we record.
But we should be coming back here in the month of June, so
(01:12:46):
worry not all. Right.
Think I've done it all. Perfect.
Thank you guys for listening. As always, Delvin Cox
experiencing we are out. Peace, Peace.
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