Draft Show: Fool's Gold?

What players in the 2025 NFL Draft are teams "overlooking" and why should they keep things simple on certain prospects? Also, what does Brian Schottenheimer's words at the NFL Owner's Meetings mean towards the Cowboys draft strategy?

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:03):
Is the Dallascowboys dot Com Draft Show, your war room
for insider news and draft analysis from deep within the
confines of Cowboys headquarters at the Star Infrasco.

Speaker 2 (00:16):
And now your host, Kyle Yeomans.

Speaker 3 (00:22):
Today is Tuesday, April first, twenty twenty five. We are
officially in Draft month, just twenty three days away from
the NFL Draft. Welcome into the Draft Show, presented by
Miller Light, the only beer of the Dallas Cowboys. It
is Miller time. Starting to get exciting around these parts.
Thirty visits starting this week. We've got a lot of

(00:43):
information flying around at the owner's beatings, a whole lot
of information still compiling into the board as we speak.
But this is the final stretch as we work into April.

Speaker 4 (00:54):
And no, that is not an April fool's joke.

Speaker 3 (00:56):
We've got Zach Olchuck, Brian brought us Vox Lombardi, Bobby
Belt with Chris Beam and the backladder with us.

Speaker 4 (01:02):
Everybody. This is an exciting time, gentlemen. Brian, I know.

Speaker 3 (01:06):
There's a lot of talk about rules and explanation of
the rules and all that stuff, but it's still a
lot of draft talk.

Speaker 5 (01:12):
At the same time, The biggest thing I heard was
that the head coach today told us that he wasn't
interested in getting his coaches involved in scouting, which I
thought was cool.

Speaker 4 (01:20):
I liked it.

Speaker 5 (01:20):
I guess I kind of made that up in a way.
You know, he said no. He was even talking about
how his guys, you know, he listen to these guys,
the scouts. It's their job, it's their responsibilities and stuff.
That was something I know that we had talked about
on a couple of different platforms about this that would
the first year, would Brian Schottenheimer say, Hey, I'm going

(01:43):
to let the scouts do their job. I'll be there
to kind of be to moderate what's going on, much
like with Bill Parcells and what he did when he
first came here. Let the Scouts do their job, you
learn the scouts and then that just that way Schottenheimer's
been here before. But what the situation is in that chair,
He's gonna almost be like the vice president of the

(02:04):
United States. He's going to break ties and so that's
where he has to be very mindful. And the fact
that he was talking about the scouts do their job.
I think that's some of the best news I heard
coming out of the owners meetings today and.

Speaker 4 (02:17):
Then Shody talking about buildings from the outside end. Right.

Speaker 6 (02:20):
Uh so he did mention edge rushers, but wide receiver
corner seems like that's gonna be very much in play
there at pick number twelve.

Speaker 7 (02:28):
Yeah, just to be missy, right, because I like, you know, good, good.

Speaker 4 (02:31):
Miss it is a toxic Tuesday.

Speaker 7 (02:34):
Do you think that's like a Schoenheimer thing that I'm
just gonna let the scouts do this right or he's
been to build it so long he's going, Man, that
coach at this pick up, this coach, Damn boy, the
scouts would be fine, but this coach says non sense
right here, I'm gonna let them fly because I've been around.

Speaker 8 (02:49):
It's a it's a largely new coaching staff and a
lot of these guys he talked about that like when
he got during the hiring process, he didn't know a
lot of them very well. He had like taken recommendations
and things like that. So I don't know that he's
got a great handle on what kind of evaluators they
all are at this point. I mean some of them
he would know old guys.

Speaker 7 (03:07):
I'm talking about the oh oh yeah, like he's seen
coaches mess the draft up, so he's gonna go, man,
you know what, I'm just gonna keep my hands off
this and let Will in the guys.

Speaker 3 (03:15):
That's I think it may be a little bit more
of respect element for the scouting department, for the guys
that they have found before. I mean, Tyler Smith was
a pick that no one had their eyes on, at
least going into the final weeks of the draft.

Speaker 4 (03:28):
He ended up being an All Pro.

Speaker 3 (03:30):
I mean, there's there's a lot of different elements, and
that's just one example. But I think it's more so
Schottenheimer's been around the building. He's seen the job that
Will McLay and his staff put on the table year
after year after year, and so he says, it's not
on me to mess that up and try and shake
things up along them.

Speaker 5 (03:45):
I like it. Whatever whatever we however we painted, whatever
we painted. As a scout sitting there, you have to
feel like, Okay, this is on us, guys. I mean,
you know, he's gonna tell us the coaches are going
to say, to Bobby's point, there's a lot of coaches
that haven't been in the national football You got some
college guys, you know, they could tell you, like, hey,
you know, when I was at Kansas State, you guys

(04:06):
kind of saw the players we played with the offensive line,
you kind of have an idea of that. But overall, though,
I mean, I think it's a very, very at least
for the first draft, kind of get a feel, get
an idea of what coaches can evaluate and which coaches can't,
and as you move along, Will will know that, and
then he'll be able to say, Okay, if this guy
gives his opinion about a player, I need to take it,

(04:28):
or Okay, thank you very much, coach. Is there anything
else we need to talk about here?

Speaker 3 (04:31):
It's really a coach's coach scout scout mentality.

Speaker 5 (04:34):
Never called a third down defense in my life, never
called a third down defense. So I don't think you know,
and when they and I think there's a place for coaches,
I think there are some really good coach evaluators. I
want to say this, I would have liked to have
worked with Jason Garrett. As much problems as I had
with Jason Garrett, as some of the coaching things he did,
I would have liked to work with him in the
scouting department. I worked with his dad for a long time.

(04:57):
I think there were some probably some conversations he had
at the enter table with his dad about scouting, and
I think he had a pretty good understanding about that.
You can get some coaches that have some good evaluation
takes well.

Speaker 3 (05:07):
And you've got twenty three days to kind of put
your board together and finish out the way you think
on this draft class. And when you've got a new
coaching staff, you've got a coach that's been around for
at least a little bit here in Schottenheimer, and then
you've got a scouting department that's done this the same way.

Speaker 4 (05:22):
For a number of years too.

Speaker 3 (05:23):
It's easier to have overthink and it's easier to have
some miscommunication back and forth between those two sides. If
there is a full on involvement. Now everyone's going to
have an involvement. It's just a different level of that
across the board between the coaches and the scouts. But
I thought the overthink side of things was interesting, And Bobby,

(05:44):
you brought up the NFL dot com article from Bucky
Brooks this past week. You can go check it out.
Of course, a friend of the show, former Draft Show
analyst in his own right, but Bucky said in the
twenty twenty five NFL Draft, here's a list of names
that you shouldn't overthink, and it kind of brought to
the attention we don't have to go buy the same names.
You can go by your own names. What does it

(06:06):
mean to overthink a player? How easy is it to
do that? And what are some of the names that
fit that mold here in twenty twenty five.

Speaker 8 (06:13):
So I think when I think of overthink as just
a obviously could meet different things to different people. But
whenever I hear anybody talk about that during the draft process,
what they're talking about there is you know, something we've
touched on recently, fatigue, like name fatigue. Somebody who's been
around a long time, and you maybe get a little
jaded towards hearing them. But a lot of times what
I think about when I hear overthink is basically looking

(06:35):
at anything that's outside of what they put on tape,
like and hyper focusing on anything they put up. So
will Campbell's arm lengths? All right? Are you are you
gonna be hyperfixiated on that or are you gonna worry about? Okay,
but what did you look like on tape? Are you
gonna be worried about somebody's long speed or their time speed,
or are you gonna just say that guy looked great
on tape, so I'm gonna trust that. So that's generally

(06:55):
how I look at it as just the I know
there are questions there that exist or that have popped
up during the process relative to aspects that are important
to the evaluation. But should they be trumping what we
see on tape, which is a good football player.

Speaker 6 (07:11):
Yeah, to your point of me, like Ted McMillan, right
with the forty time with him, it looks plenty fast
when you watch him play, Like, to me, that's not
a prospect that you should overthink. I think Ted McMillan's
the best wide receiver in this draft class, and I
wouldn't move him there based on, oh, he didn't run
an X amount of forty times. So I do think
there's a couple of these prospects. To your point, Will
Campbell's another one good player, right, but there's been the

(07:32):
conversations he tackle?

Speaker 4 (07:34):
Is he a guard? Bobby?

Speaker 6 (07:35):
I heard you make the comment about Rashaun Slater. They
had that same conversation about with the arm length, the
gold Campbell's tape is pretty darn good. Now when he
plays against one guy from South Carolina that I throw
out is a not overthinking player, Kyle Canard.

Speaker 4 (07:47):
Kyle Canard's a dude that is just absolutely productive.

Speaker 6 (07:51):
And I think Kyle Canard is one of these guys
that's being slept on as an edge rusher and he's
gonna end up being like a Byron Young, a Kobe Turner,
one of these guys that a key on White that
ends up sliding maybe to the day two, second third round,
ends up being one of the better pass rushers in
this draft class.

Speaker 3 (08:05):
You say, what Ted McMillan and not overthinking tet Before
we get away from that well too much, there was
a video that did pop up this past weekend on
social media where he was talking about how he did
not like watching football and he did not like watching film.
Does something like that play a factor in to overthink
because again, it's a factor, like Bobby said, that's outside
of film, but it does have to do with the film, right.

Speaker 4 (08:28):
Does that play a factor at all in the way
that you look at McMillan and the way that he
moves forward.

Speaker 6 (08:32):
Well, you gotta find out does he is it? I
just don't like watching football, or do you not love football?
And I do think that that's an old video apparently
that has surfaced that a couple of years, several years ago,
so his mindset might have changed completely. And he didn't
say I don't necessarily hate watching film. He just does
it with the wide receiver group. He's not going to
go seek it out necessarily by himself. So you talk

(08:53):
about a guy that everything that I've been able to hear,
high character, comes to work every day. That's a dude
that hasn't given you any other problems off the field.
I don't think it's an I don't love football. He
just doesn't like watching football. And if you look at
professionals across all sports, there's plenty that feel the same way.

Speaker 5 (09:08):
See Michael Parsons, Yeah, See Michael Mary Cooper, Yeah, see
guys that you know. And this is a situation where
if Ted McMillan didn't like football and you're watching his tape,
you could tell that, yeah, you could tell. But but
when you watch him, and right now we've got the
highlights up of him just doing everything he can to
get an extra yard or two, or to make a catch,

(09:30):
or to sacrifice this body. You know, if you don't
like football, you don't play well. And I and I
and I was watching you know, Jesse Holly was making
some comments about about that, you know, and he was saying, well,
you lose that edge.

Speaker 4 (09:44):
You lose that edge when you don't.

Speaker 5 (09:45):
But you know, if if I had to ask you,
guys right now, power rank how these linebackers have played
here with the Dallas Cowboys, Michael Parsons, Sean Lee, and
Leyton vander USh, what order would you put those guys in?

Speaker 4 (09:58):
Yeah, Michael would be at the top.

Speaker 5 (10:00):
The other two guys watch film extensively, Yeah, all the time.

Speaker 4 (10:03):
Yep.

Speaker 5 (10:04):
But you just guys just told me that Michael Parsons
was the best player. You know, so there are guys
that play this game. I mean, if he didn't love
the game and he came out and said, man, I'm
just playing this so I can open my ice cream
shop or become a doctor, you know, pay met for
medical school, that's a concern. But you watch his tape.
Don't overthink this, don't overthink this.

Speaker 8 (10:26):
With this he doesn't look like like and I mean,
obviously you don't want to totally interpret effort or other
things based off the tape all the time, Like you
don't want to say, oh, that person's lazy and a
Baylor receivers used to run into that all the time,
that's lazy when it.

Speaker 4 (10:38):
Was scheme part of what the game was.

Speaker 8 (10:41):
But I don't think when you watch tech Ncmillan play,
like when you see him freelance and work back to
the volunarer, different thing, that doesn't strike me as somebody
who doesn't enjoy the game and enjoy what goes into it.
And so to me, I think that he does. Does
he show up like he looks like he studies all
the time. That doesn't necessarily pop, But I mean he
looks like a guy who is has a few for
the game, enjoys it, enjoys playing it. Plenty of people

(11:02):
enjoy playing sports and not watching them. People enjoy watching
sports in person and not on TV. Yeah, Like, I mean,
there's there's lots of different ways to explain that. I
think LOFs loafs matter. And we don't see loas with him.
You know, we don't see oh, I know the ball
is not going to me. I'm just gonna kick it,
Like we don't see that from him, And you know,
as far as the whole film stuff goes. It took
me a couple of days to think about this because
I was befuddled when I first saw it because I

(11:24):
thought about the the Headache guys or the they may
not love ball guys. But but I think Dak will
have something to say about that.

Speaker 7 (11:32):
Yeah, like he do, Hey, come.

Speaker 4 (11:33):
Go ask movie and twelve overall Pick City.

Speaker 7 (11:36):
Lamba has something to do with that. Right. If you're
a role player with no leadership in this locker room,
then we may have something to talk about then. But
there's gonna be like if it is McMillan and he's here,
there's gonna be a clear peck in order that he's
gonna have to answer to as a young dude, and
we're gonna have to go from there. Michael Parsons, who
kind of just rolls off the couch as a guy,
tank what you're gonna tell me? And you ain't got

(11:57):
a sack in three years, you know what I'm saying.
So leadership mayn't matter there. I don't think this is
going to be a big deal for this kid.

Speaker 5 (12:03):
I think, and this is this is this young man,
this is unfortunate. I'm gonna bring this up. I don't
think Diggs is that type of guy. I don't think
Diggs is a guy that's what we consider a guy
that's just gonna grind out on film and all that.
And he's a natural player. You watch him play, you
can watch him be in position, you know, you can
watch it. There's a lot of natural ability. But they're

(12:23):
guys in this team that aren't big film watchers. When
tech nc Millan said that, and those guys saw that
on social media, they're like, huh, that seems pretty interesting.

Speaker 4 (12:32):
You know.

Speaker 5 (12:32):
There's some guys like huh, I can't believe you don't
like film, And there's others like man that dude's got
a lot of natural ability, you know, And so yeah,
they're there are players in this league. And I brought
up Diggs because I think Diggs is one of those
guys that plays on a lot of feel you know.

Speaker 4 (12:47):
I mean, but you could study.

Speaker 5 (12:48):
But I'm I don't think he's one of those guys
that's just kind of knocking it out every single day
like that.

Speaker 8 (12:54):
Like what, I prefer somebody who does it that way. Yeah,
I would prefer something like John Lee everywhere. Un Sure
some people can can probably get away with less work
than others. And you know what I mean, there were probably.

Speaker 5 (13:09):
I think Hunters that way in this draft. I think
Hunter's I think Hunter is a player that plays with
tremendous feet.

Speaker 4 (13:15):
He's a field player.

Speaker 6 (13:16):
I don't know that he's not putting the work though,
to watch tape, I think he's probably he's a super
high IQ.

Speaker 4 (13:21):
Yeah, I think he's super smart.

Speaker 5 (13:23):
But when you watch him run routes and you watch
him cover that, that is not a great route right there. No,
I mean that is not a guy that's that is
that is a guy who is has been touched by God. Yes,
and you know mom and dad and and he is
that type of a player. I think if I think this,
and we had this discussion on one O five three
the Fan yesterday on the g Bag Nation, I think

(13:45):
if Hunter played one position, he would be great. Playing
two positions, you might not get his absolute greatness out
of this. Well.

Speaker 8 (13:53):
Is that is that where the lack of polish comes from?
Because he's not a super polished corner either.

Speaker 4 (13:57):
That's what I'm saying.

Speaker 5 (13:58):
But how much I mean, you won you wonder how
much does he really study? You know, you wonder and
I'm not saying he's he's just completely doesn't do it.
But I see a player when you watch him, when
you watch him play the routes and stuff like that,
they're not real. I mean a lot of it is
kind of feel drive. I'm gonna turn it here, I'm

(14:20):
gonna burst here, I'm gonna use my hands here. I
mean there's things that he could do film wise to
probably set guys up. I think he does it just
by how.

Speaker 8 (14:30):
He plays, and I think he like because again, he
is a I love the kid. He's a full time
player on both sides. With him being a full time
player on both sides, maybe he's not. God is like,
I don't know that I have much time to like
sit here and like start studying down on my technique
and mechanics as a corner, because I gotta go do
some practice exactly see, so that can can split you up.
I would say this that I will as soon as

(14:52):
he commits to one position and then as part time another,
because I don't think he's gonna be full time at
both anywhere. As soon as he commits to one, I
think he's going to become a really good technician, really fast.

Speaker 4 (15:01):
Agreed, but like I said, that's that's what I'm saying.
He doesn't have the time to.

Speaker 8 (15:05):
Because I don't know that there's a more naturally instinctive
player at either people. And he's playing than an.

Speaker 4 (15:12):
All field, all freelances well. And he's a damn good
athlete too. He's one of the best we've ever seen. Yeah,
the athletic ability helps him hide a.

Speaker 8 (15:21):
Lot of THEA you can be a really hard worker
and have no instincts, and and that can I mean
that was I think that's for a long time what
people felt like happened to Charles Tapper here. Outside of
just the injuries, I think a lot of people felt
like that guy worked, he was a good person, he
had all the trades. He just had no instincts, And
I think that was a big.

Speaker 4 (15:38):
For that position.

Speaker 5 (15:38):
It's hard to be that you can't play his position
and not have instincts.

Speaker 3 (15:42):
So would you rather have the instincts as opposed to
a film junkie as we were talking about a moment ago,
I mean, you would.

Speaker 4 (15:49):
Like to have this, Yeah, he would love to have.

Speaker 6 (15:53):
I can't teach instincts. Yeah, you have the feel or
you have instincts. You don't I can teach you how
to watch tape.

Speaker 7 (15:58):
Yeah, film do it is awesome though, Man, I was
just thinking about Leaf would have passed him because the
boy I missed Lee, He's you know what I'm saying. Yeah,
if he was healthy, Yeah for sure.

Speaker 8 (16:07):
If Travis Hunter covered Travis Hunter for a full game,
gets the better of him.

Speaker 5 (16:12):
I Travis Hunder the receiver. Wow, Travis Hunter the receiver.
I think Travis Hunter could be an All Pro receiver
in this league. So you think he could be a
better receiver than a corner.

Speaker 4 (16:21):
I put him on my board as a receiver.

Speaker 5 (16:22):
I mean the more I watched him play, and it
all goes back to studying Shador Sanders. It all goes
back to that and watching him play, and I there
are times when shardor Sanders is in complete trouble and
that guy bails him out. And so to me, if
and I I know, watch and I haven't talked about

(16:43):
this on our show, but I the more and we
did these quarterbacks late and I started the more I watched.
The more I watch, the more I watch him like
that guy right there could be an All Pro wide receiver.

Speaker 7 (16:53):
Would you say that the cornerback Travis is better now,
but the wide receiver Travis has more room to gro.

Speaker 4 (16:58):
I think I think I think it's the opposite. I
think that wide receiver's better now.

Speaker 8 (17:01):
The corner's got I think I think the the traits
for him as a receiver are I think ridiculous for
him to be an elite run.

Speaker 5 (17:11):
I think he could do more damage to you as
an opponent, sure playing wide receiver than he can't corner.

Speaker 4 (17:17):
That's the nature of the position, though right there a
certain ex Yeah you could not. He could.

Speaker 5 (17:21):
He could do damage by not throwing his direction.

Speaker 4 (17:23):
Yeah that could be. That could be.

Speaker 5 (17:25):
But you watch him play down after down after down,
Like I say, watch, and I got on these quarterbacks late.
I feel like I got on him late. I'm sorry.

Speaker 4 (17:33):
Watch.

Speaker 7 (17:33):
I know I wouldn't watch.

Speaker 5 (17:34):
You weren't gonna watch. And I respected that because I've
been in your shoes. I've been in that guysh I
do not want to watch these guys can. But the
more you watch Door Sanders throw the football, you realize
how special that number twelve is.

Speaker 3 (17:46):
So Bobby, just to feel around the league, does anybody
kind of agree with that sentiment about the wide receiver?
Because I had him on my board.

Speaker 5 (17:53):
I think a lot of people, I think a lot
of teams.

Speaker 8 (17:55):
I think I think there are more people that have
him as a receiver than like to think he would
be a better receiver. So it's split. I think there
are some people who believe he's a better receiver. He's
more valuable at corner, so we wouldn't playhim at corner.
He's a better corner than he is a receiver. He's
pretty split. We're gonna play him, But I think it's
it's kind of all over the place. I do think
that there's a growing contingent because it's very fractured in

(18:18):
general how people feel about But I think there's a
growing group that views it the way Brian does, that
he'd be a better receiver. But ultimately I think most
teams would play him at corner, yeah, because they would
just say.

Speaker 5 (18:28):
I know the Patriots are good play at wide receiver.
They're not gonna playm.

Speaker 8 (18:30):
At Cleveland's talked about playing them at receiver.

Speaker 5 (18:33):
But I fear as the Giants pick him at three,
if you're a Cowboy fan, you.

Speaker 6 (18:37):
Should fear that now you've got a hunter and neighbors
that could be very scary yeah, then you'll see.

Speaker 5 (18:44):
Yeah, then they picked mill Road and drop the second
and away we go right, stop the run and the receiver.

Speaker 8 (18:51):
That's be great. They couldn't complete a pass that would
be helpful old school football.

Speaker 3 (18:54):
Yeah.

Speaker 7 (18:56):
Does this whole work hard thing matter more for the
later round guys than the super talented dudes, Like if
I got a second round guy he doesn't work hard,
he's more likely to be a buzzed like a super
talented you know, Travis hunt to type.

Speaker 4 (19:07):
I think that goes back to what Zach was talking about.

Speaker 3 (19:09):
You can't teach instincts, and a lot of times, if
you have instincts, you're gonna go early in the draft, right, Yeah,
because if you're not, you're getting knocked for certain elements,
pros and cons of your game. And that's when you
slide to the second, the third, the fourth round, and
then get into Day three. I think if you have
those instincts, and you have that and you can pair
it with the tape and the relentless studying, then all

(19:31):
of a sudden you have the perfect prospects. And those
are the guys that are very rare up at the
top of the draft that don't have those red flag.

Speaker 5 (19:37):
I think guys like Perish from Kansas State. I think
Huzzy from North Carolinaup. I think who else had got
that Mohammed.

Speaker 4 (19:45):
If you're undersized, you're already kind of working with something
a limiting go. Yeah, you better be studying.

Speaker 5 (19:51):
You better be kind of figuring out how to do
things because you you're talented for your position, you're kind
of a specialist in some ways. But you better know
who you're playing against now.

Speaker 6 (20:02):
Because you're gonna have to, you know, make the team
on special teams. Right, You're gonna have to put in
the extra effort. You're gonna have to be able to make sure, hey,
I can tackle, I'm coming in here. When you're one
of these premier athletes, there's a reason you're probably being
picked in the first round. Now, when it comes to
being good versus great, the guys that might want to
put in the extra time, they're gonna put in the
film work, They're gonna stay after and work the jugs
machine after practice. Maybe that sets you apart. Maybe that's

(20:22):
from a pro bowler. Now, I'm an all pro type
of guy. I'm a ten year old, decade team type
of player versus just being one of the best top
ten in my position. That that's where you can start
fight with the elite talent.

Speaker 8 (20:32):
That's where Nate Newton has talked about before. Where he
found Margins was he he saw Troy Aikman work and
he went, I don't want to let him down. And
he's like, that was the biggest motivating factor he ever
had to work was Aikman and the way that he worked. Yeah,
and the way that then he was like, I can't
let this guy down. I can't let this guy's work
go for nothing. So I need to work. And he said,
Troy getting here and Troy showing his work ethic is

(20:53):
what made Nate from just you know, decent player for
seven eight years whatever was to one of the best
offensive linemen and football for six year run.

Speaker 7 (21:01):
I was just thinking about Terror Steele, right, Like he
came from this offense where they throw the ball fifty times.

Speaker 4 (21:06):
Yep.

Speaker 7 (21:06):
But the coach said, oh, he work hard, you work hard,
and now he can run black his as he's a
run blocking offensive lineman. Now you know, I'm saying, brock
Hoff and we as much as I rolled my eyes
about up whole brock works hard. Oh, brock works.

Speaker 6 (21:17):
But I think you just answered your own question because
those are undrafted free agent guys, right, That's what I'm saying,
that they got to work.

Speaker 4 (21:22):
To get to where they're going.

Speaker 7 (21:23):
Yeah, but we don't hear him saying about Tyler Smith.
And this ain't me saying Tyler Smith don't work hard.
Tyler Smith guy like God gifts. He just rolled out
the big whoopen focus is probably a little different and.

Speaker 4 (21:32):
He may work just as hard. He probably worked just right.

Speaker 3 (21:35):
Type of stuff is gonna not that's gonna come second
to you destroying guys at the line of scrimmage and
absolutely blocking half of the defense half the time.

Speaker 8 (21:43):
But that is also the difference between Tyler Smith being
a second team All Pro and still waiting for Tyler
Smith to click. It is because Tyler Smith works. And
that's one of the things that the Cowboys worked on
in the process was they went, all right, we know
he's a good student, we know that he takes to coach,
and he's young. This will come into place. Whereas if
they didn't have that or he was into worker, you'd
probably be dealing with a lot more frustrating places from
Tyler Smith. Over the last three years.

Speaker 5 (22:04):
Can I throw one more guy and that that. Don't
overthink my over just go and drafted one technique at twelve.
Is that what you exactly?

Speaker 4 (22:16):
Yeah, go ahead, Brian, get Dereck Harmon.

Speaker 5 (22:18):
Don't overthink Baron, Baron, don't over don't overthink Texas Corner.

Speaker 4 (22:22):
I like that.

Speaker 7 (22:23):
Jean Lewison take it. He's been he's been a little
guy here for eight years old.

Speaker 5 (22:27):
Don't overthink that play. Please, don't over think that.

Speaker 3 (22:31):
Any other names that you guys have out there that
you don't want to overthink.

Speaker 8 (22:36):
Jalen Walker, like in terms of just I know you
can't figure out what to do with him necessarily. A
lot of I know exactly what, Yeah, you know, but
there's people who feel like he's tweener or whatever, like
you know, position list. Figure you'll figure something out. He's
a good player, You'll figure something out. So don't let
that paralyze that worry you.

Speaker 5 (22:53):
Though, when when guys remember the guy Simmons that was
that clem has bounced around a little bit.

Speaker 4 (22:58):
Does it were you that a guy like that? Though?

Speaker 5 (23:00):
I mean, I'm just talking about we don't know what position.

Speaker 8 (23:03):
Shack of all trades means.

Speaker 5 (23:04):
We're not a linebacker in safety and then they don't
play him either.

Speaker 8 (23:08):
One in these Yeah, Jabrill Peppers ran into that for
for a long time. But I mean that you for
all those that you have, you also then have like
Shaq Thompson who turns into a good football player. And
so to me, I think Walker is just one of
those where he's going to be a good football player.
And I think that you shouldn't overthink him too much,
don't prioritize him over a Travis Hunter or somebody else.
Just genty for me, But you know, I think that

(23:29):
Walker is one that I wouldn't want to overthink too much.
And then I think one of the other ones that
stands out for me. And I don't know how much
other people are. We already mentioned McMillan. One of their
names are wrote down. Is because I have seen some
people talk about like they just don't trusted Buka's speed
and he's won that right now. That is I told
you this, Zach, that the guy.

Speaker 4 (23:51):
He reminds me of the rest of us.

Speaker 8 (23:53):
Well, I mean we're on the phone, we're talking about
player comps. The guy he reminds me of. Honestly, when
I went back and looked at my notes and everything else.
It's Cooper Cup. That's who he reminds me of. And
I think he's got better speed than Cooper Cup. But
the type of player he is, the way he tracks
the ball down the field, the way that he works
in zone, the way that he is, you know, slot specific,
the type of build that he has, that is who
he reminds me of to a great extent. Is Cup

(24:15):
coming out of Eastern Wall?

Speaker 5 (24:16):
Is he a first round player in any other draft?

Speaker 9 (24:20):
No?

Speaker 8 (24:20):
I mean I have him top of the second.

Speaker 5 (24:22):
I don't even have okay, because I know you you
had you have first, right first for them the first,
but you have Golden above him, right, Okay, But in
any other draft, I take Bobby out of this because
he's actually going We'll see if he's right last year's class, now,
last year's class, any class, any last three classes.

Speaker 4 (24:39):
Probably not no, probably not right? No?

Speaker 5 (24:42):
No, okay, would you No? I'm just saying, I think
to me, because he is the last guy. I mean,
if I've got fifteen players, and he's likely either fourteen
or fifteen when I stacked.

Speaker 6 (24:53):
But heck, we had Alad McConaughey going around two last year,
and that dude, Oh no, I mean so he I think,
no matter.

Speaker 4 (24:57):
What people would have been a really good player. But yeah,
a couple of years ago, no doubt fifth that.

Speaker 6 (25:03):
The other one that I threw out there is Donovan
Jackson out of Ohio State, and we've talked about a
lot of guards. Donovan Jackson to me, I ended up
putting him as my last fifteenth first round grade. I
just think he's a stuff. I think he's gonna end
up being a really take Booker over Booker. Yeah, I
just I just think he's a ten year player that's
going to be really, really good. He's got better feet
than Booker does. He can also move people off the

(25:23):
line of scrimmage. He's not quite the maller. He's doesn't
have quite the power that Booker does. But I was
so impressed with his ability to kick outside play left
tackle during that championship run for Ohio State. Kind of
gave me Joe Tooney vibes, right, who's been an excellent
guard his entire career. Then in a pinch, he's got
a kick out the left tackle and until the Super
Bowl he's not getting his ass totally kicked. So to me,

(25:43):
I love Donovan Jackson. I think he's he's the guy
that is going to be a good.

Speaker 4 (25:47):
Pro no matter what's standing up on the table right there. No,
I like it.

Speaker 7 (25:50):
He can stand out to light. But he said the
right thing. He's not as powerful as but not powerful. Okay, cool,
I'll con see that anything.

Speaker 4 (25:55):
I think his game overall, I like a little more.
You like who you like.

Speaker 7 (25:57):
That's cool, look a better, but you like who you like.
I love Donovan too, though Donovan is a dude, and
I love that football thing where you go, I'll play
left tackle the car he.

Speaker 4 (26:08):
Just stood left tackle.

Speaker 7 (26:10):
Booker can't play left tackle. But if I'm drafting the guard,
that don't matter to me, because you do that same
thing with with the Banks. You'll go, oh, Banks is
a guard, and then you'll go, but I got tackle tackle.
But you will say, let men, may I finishing something
something I didn't know because you were on the internet.
You say, well, I'll put Banks at guard, and then

(26:33):
I'll ask you, well, is Banks are better guard than Booker?
And you will bring up Banks playing tackle, just like
you will do with with Donovan. If I'm just looking
for a guard, I think personally, Booker is a better
guard than both of them.

Speaker 5 (26:44):
I hate position flexibility.

Speaker 4 (26:46):
You know that.

Speaker 7 (26:46):
Oh well you well, we shouldn't be talking about uh
uh Banks playing guard or.

Speaker 4 (26:53):
And you're sticking.

Speaker 7 (26:54):
You must just change your mind on that because you've
be saying Banks at guard for a while.

Speaker 5 (26:57):
No, I absolutely changed my mind on that.

Speaker 7 (27:00):
Why you act like you? Why you act like you
have no clue what I'm talking about? You had him
at goal?

Speaker 4 (27:06):
I absolutely no, No, I just flip flopped down.

Speaker 5 (27:09):
So the consideration of him, I sure, I personally I don't.
I'm worried about and play in either spot.

Speaker 7 (27:15):
To be honest with you, I take that too. Lay
film when is good exactly? Yeah, yeah, yeah, I agree.

Speaker 3 (27:21):
All right, we got to take our first break when
we come back. We got some Twitter on the twenty.
Maybe one of these guys has Banks.

Speaker 4 (27:28):
At a tackle or at a guard.

Speaker 3 (27:29):
We'll see what they think overall, but send it your
questions Twitter on the twenty.

Speaker 4 (27:33):
More of the draft shows.

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Speaker 4 (28:33):
Hoo hoo.

Speaker 11 (28:34):
I'm Dak Prescott, quarterback of the Dallas Cowboys.

Speaker 5 (28:37):
As they snapper, the press scout, who looks right, it's
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He'll look for a pre style.

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Speaker 2 (29:36):
This is the Dallascowboys dot Com Draft.

Speaker 3 (29:39):
Show Cowboys fans get ready for Draft Weekend, presented by
Miller Lyte at The Star in Frisco. The action kicks
off on Thursday, April twenty fourth with the Ultimate Draft
Party continues on Friday with the Draft Hangout and wraps
up on Saturday with the Draft Day five K presented

(30:01):
by Baylor Scott in White Health, three days of football
fun and fan experiences you won't want to miss. Visit
Dallas Cowboys dot com slash Draft for details. Full weekend
full of fun here at the Star and Frisk Go.
Of course, we'll be on the air an hour before
each of the first picks along the way, and we're
going all the way through each selection of the NFL

(30:21):
Draft here in twenty twenty five, as we always do.

Speaker 4 (30:24):
It is a great weekend you got to think about.
So Saturday is when we got to get the breakfast tacos.

Speaker 5 (30:30):
Yeah, at the breakfast tacos. Well, I'll take care of that.

Speaker 4 (30:33):
I feel like it needs to be a rookie thing.

Speaker 5 (30:34):
Now we're a rookie veteran.

Speaker 7 (30:37):
Tom the Tommy and Hazen. Don't bother me, y'all.

Speaker 8 (30:42):
Tommy's driving fifty miles away. I'm not drinking. I'm not
eating cold breakfast burritos from Tommy.

Speaker 4 (30:47):
So we could get him over here.

Speaker 7 (30:49):
That's so far.

Speaker 4 (30:50):
Oh, you're right, Yeah, him and Nick a far.

Speaker 5 (30:52):
We'll they live in like Princeton. I'll tell you what
this jersey about the third day. What I really like
about the third day because I think that it's really
kind of where you can dig in on some guys.
It's something that's we're tuning in that hour before the
actual draft. Yes, we have that opportunity, and thanks to
Roxanne and Chris, those guys in the back of them

(31:13):
grabbing coaches and scouts and stuff, and man, you get
some super insight of some of the picks that were
made you know, earlier, and then maybe kind of sets
you up for what's going to happen in day three.
So courage you all three days to watch. But man,
day three, that hour before it's one of my favorite
times to kind of get an insight of what they

(31:35):
were thinking when they were picking these players.

Speaker 4 (31:36):
That might be the most informational hour of radio.

Speaker 14 (31:40):
You could ask, Oh no, I mean, it really is
a lot of fun, like getting to talk with Chris
Vaughan Ross Whinch, like all the scouts are they're awesome,
and then the position coaches like Londa Wells comes.

Speaker 4 (31:50):
In just ripping with swag. We're the cowboy hat.

Speaker 6 (31:53):
And then it's awesome when you get the position coach
and they've drafted somebody in that position group and you
kind of get a feel for like what is the vision,
what's playing?

Speaker 3 (32:00):
Well a lot of times you get the story too,
why they were the track, why you end up doing that.

Speaker 4 (32:05):
But it's a pleasure.

Speaker 3 (32:06):
It really really super informative and and I mean I
think we're like three years in a row running where
we've made like a documentary from those clips, Like not
us making the documentary, but like those clips have been
used in some documents.

Speaker 4 (32:18):
That's awesome across the board because it's it is.

Speaker 3 (32:20):
It's an informational uh vast majority of that hour and
it's a lot of fun.

Speaker 4 (32:26):
All right, sign out for some Twitter on the Twitter now,
I got a.

Speaker 7 (32:31):
Question, Oh my gosh, you can't take over water. On
the twenty me and Woodchuck was talking as I'm taking
over Twitter.

Speaker 5 (32:38):
On becoming and was just talking Derek Eagleton watching this
right now, I hope back.

Speaker 7 (32:46):
Listen, Well, we're all watching film and evaluating players, right
and me and Brod has mentioned this for one week
and we just didn't bring it back up.

Speaker 15 (32:52):
Uh huh.

Speaker 7 (32:53):
When a players played football for like five or six
years and they only got one good year or like, damn,
you been playing football and you still can't contain, You
still can't do X y Z. They still get you on.

Speaker 4 (33:04):
That, all these COVID guys.

Speaker 7 (33:06):
How do you account for that when you're breaking down
these guys, perfect example, Kara prinslely oh mam and yelling
he almost got it, boy, he been he been playing
football for a minute. Yeah, played in Florida and came
on the old miss and they still take him off
the field on rundowns and he's a great pass rusher,
but they still don't trust him to do the fundamental
football stuff. Right, But you've been playing for so long.

(33:28):
What have you been doing some of those years?

Speaker 4 (33:29):
Right?

Speaker 7 (33:29):
So maybe just in the back of my mind we
just talked about overthinking, maybe that accounts for something when
I'm moving up and down on board.

Speaker 3 (33:35):
No, it does, and I think the COVID years added
an extra element into that, right, A lot of these
guys and this is probably the end of thank god,
but it adds an extra thing to where you've been
in the in the college ranks for how long. I
mean there are some guys. I mean you mentioned de Royo.
I mean that's a player for me. It's like Darri Porter,
the corner from Iowa State, Like, that's you guy. Now

(33:57):
he converted from wide receiver to corner and he's the
guy that I'm seeing is like a day two pick.
His measurables are there for him, but he's essentially like
a glorified special teams player.

Speaker 4 (34:06):
Yeah, yeah, but a lot of that's really what he was.

Speaker 3 (34:08):
A lot of times we're quick to dismiss and Brian
brings it up every once in a while, but we're
quick to dismiss the transfer portal and how these guys
bounce from one school next because it's just the norm now, right.

Speaker 4 (34:19):
I think the same thing.

Speaker 3 (34:20):
Can be said for these extra years of eligibility and
along the way.

Speaker 4 (34:24):
You just got to have to keep it in the
back of your head when you're evaluating these.

Speaker 5 (34:27):
Would you consider that? And I know you and I've
had this discussion about Shuck. So the quarterback, why is
he still doing that?

Speaker 2 (34:35):
Now?

Speaker 7 (34:36):
Says he's doing you know.

Speaker 5 (34:37):
Yeah, seven years, a couple of broken collar bones, broken
femur along the way, you know. I mean, is it
is that seven years good for him? Are bad for him?

Speaker 7 (34:48):
I think ultimately is gonna be bad form I think
it's going to impact him negatively. But I think some
team is gonna look at traits and they're gonna look
at the idea that we don't know what the hell
we're doing with quarterback in the first place. And he
does at gamble on him. But but you know, but
with his traits though, some team would be like, oh,
that's a second those a second round.

Speaker 4 (35:06):
He's the prototype.

Speaker 7 (35:08):
Yeah yeah, yeah, but he thought the box to the
other team for no reason. Yeah, and that'll be the
reason why he'll probably be the Day three guy. So
is its me something?

Speaker 1 (35:15):
All right?

Speaker 8 (35:16):
Day three?

Speaker 3 (35:16):
It's eleven thirty six. We're gonna get to twitter on
the sorry fotch on the twenty all right, everybody twenty
Cowboys buzz on Twitter?

Speaker 4 (35:26):
Once?

Speaker 5 (35:26):
Another name one player we could see at twelve that's
not considered a top position of need, keeping that.

Speaker 4 (35:32):
Player or best player?

Speaker 5 (35:33):
What everybody wants to draft a tight end.

Speaker 6 (35:35):
As a conversation, whys quarterback out of Colorado?

Speaker 4 (35:40):
Quarterback's not a position in need? R it is? You
got Dak Prescott. I think you did today.

Speaker 6 (35:44):
I think every other position you could say is of need.
But if Shador Sanders is there at twelve. I think
you've got to have that conversation, and I would take it.

Speaker 8 (35:51):
What's player?

Speaker 4 (35:52):
Whoa whoa?

Speaker 12 (35:52):
Whoa?

Speaker 15 (35:52):
Whoa?

Speaker 4 (35:53):
What what was that last part?

Speaker 6 (35:54):
I would I would take him, Sorry, Bobby, I would
take him.

Speaker 4 (35:56):
I think, yeah, what's the quarterback Cowboys?

Speaker 8 (36:01):
This is this, uh, this specific question. We're talking about
a player that could be there one one we think
they realistically could take because they're not taking.

Speaker 4 (36:07):
It or I don't think it's well but either jerial stance.

Speaker 8 (36:11):
So we're so we're talking about players we think they
could realistically take who are not considered a position. Correct, Yes,
Tyler Warren, That's.

Speaker 4 (36:17):
What I just said.

Speaker 8 (36:18):
Yeah, that's that's tight end.

Speaker 5 (36:19):
I mean I get more, I get more likely Fergie's
not any good and you know, Bergie struggled with some
He's a good player, he's a good player.

Speaker 4 (36:27):
But that's what I'm saying, struggled last year, my guy.

Speaker 5 (36:30):
I kind of feel like back to quick, I feel
like Mason Taylor. If you need to take a tight end,
look take him Mason Taylor.

Speaker 8 (36:36):
But definitely take Mason.

Speaker 4 (36:37):
Yeah, but I think I.

Speaker 5 (36:39):
Think to be the you know what, Bobby, huh, forty
four of them's got a great family.

Speaker 3 (36:45):
Jason Taylor does a lot of stuff in the community,
Thomas see you, and this doesn't work from five thirty
to two.

Speaker 5 (36:52):
But no, I I think I can say I everybody's
about drafting Warren at twelve, and I you know, I
like Warnt, but man, there's just and it answers the
question because yeah, you would, that's a position that he
would probably take, But you don't need I don't.

Speaker 8 (37:09):
Think here's the problem. What don't they need right now?

Speaker 4 (37:11):
Yeah?

Speaker 6 (37:11):
I think you could argue like every spot, except they
do have a quarterback on their contract.

Speaker 4 (37:15):
That's why I just went through out your door.

Speaker 8 (37:17):
So I have a quarterback and they have.

Speaker 5 (37:18):
They might tell you that, they might tell you they
don't need a safety, but even though they're bringing even
they're bringing one in.

Speaker 3 (37:24):
But is there a safety available at twelve that you
would take? I mean, would you go up the twelve? No,
I'm just saying just saying a position. Sure it is
this saying a position.

Speaker 7 (37:32):
But the Cowboys needing everything is the reason why I
wouldn't draft Warn. I think tight end is just so luxury.
You know what I'm saying. I can't pass on a
great edge or a wide receiver or a corner for
a tight end, is it. I mostly feel like quarterbacks
elevate tight ends anyway, you know, like your tight end
is kind of sort of what your quarterback is. Sometimes,
you know, Bottles can elevate the raiders or whatever. He's special.

(37:53):
For the most part, a nonsense tight end can be
elevated by a great quarterback. I think Jake Ferguson. I
ain't saying he's nonsense guy, but he's been elevated by force.
I think as long as you got four, you have
a tight end. But just because you got four don't
mean you got right guard or age or wire receiver
two or Quanta two.

Speaker 3 (38:09):
And remember the connection that Ferguson and Dak had had
when they were both healthy for an entire season.

Speaker 4 (38:15):
I agree.

Speaker 3 (38:16):
I think Tyler Warren's the first round player. I think
he's a great prospect at twelve. I think there are
other needs, I really do, And that's kind of where
I'm at now.

Speaker 5 (38:23):
I want to circle about three technique that's all day,
every day.

Speaker 3 (38:27):
Yeah, I think that's a need though, wouldn't it be well,
I guess you have and Thomas right, Yeah, that would fit,
that would fit.

Speaker 8 (38:35):
That yeah, I just I wouldn't take one. What I'm saying, yeah, I.

Speaker 6 (38:39):
Would Nolan then at twelve probably, and now I could
see them maybe taking Walterland, but I'd rather go like
Derek Harrimon or Kenneth Grant, like one of the one texts.

Speaker 4 (38:48):
I agree. I'm just saying that three.

Speaker 7 (38:50):
But you're right, Yeah, I would just take Mason Graham
playing at one text sometimes and Solomon Thomas would just
cease to exist from you, or just put him at
five or something you like, if you have an opportunity
to check Mason, if you just get.

Speaker 6 (39:01):
Them, hey, maybe you move up and go get Mason Graham.
You do a lot straight up.

Speaker 3 (39:06):
You're trying to drafts all of our draft capital the
Draft Show.

Speaker 4 (39:10):
I'm trying to throw out some hubbing the water.

Speaker 3 (39:12):
Yeah, what it is. I said this on the fan
actually this past weekend. But the the thought process around
Jerry having a conversation when Shador is there at twelve,
if he had a.

Speaker 4 (39:25):
Conversation for Johnny Manziel the.

Speaker 3 (39:26):
Way, if Sanders is there, absolutely will No.

Speaker 8 (39:33):
I'm just saying sure, yeah, they'll talk like I mean,
just like they talk. Don't think it'll happen Yeah, I'm calling.

Speaker 4 (39:40):
Bobby.

Speaker 5 (39:40):
You think they would have Sanders over Ward.

Speaker 8 (39:44):
M oh Man, I know most of the league does.

Speaker 4 (39:47):
I don't know.

Speaker 8 (39:47):
In fact, I know that there's a lot of people
in the league who have Dart above Sanders and have
Shuck over Sanders, and so I mean there's a lot
more split opinions on Shudor. I feel like I just
I think that they will probably end up having Ward higher,
is what I would guess. But obviously Ward's not gonna
be there. He's gonna be the first quarterback off the board.

Speaker 7 (40:08):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (40:09):
John wants to know if the Cowboys were guaranteed to
take a wide receiver in the second round. Sitting there
at forty four, who would be the best fit for
this team at wide.

Speaker 4 (40:19):
Receiver at forty four?

Speaker 6 (40:21):
Trey Harris best fit, Trey Harris's best you should make
a case for I'd go Trey Harris at ole Miss.
I've got him a little higher than Besh and I
think he compliments Cede Lamb well. He does a little
bit of different things than what CD, but we're.

Speaker 4 (40:34):
Thinking the same type.

Speaker 6 (40:35):
Right, Edgig, bigger body and bes Besch would be my
second option to Trey Harris. There because I've got Jalen
Royal Sandwich right in between them and my stack.

Speaker 4 (40:44):
But Royle is a little bit of a smaller player, see,
but you can put that rot and be okay.

Speaker 6 (40:48):
No roy and Royal's He reminds me a lot of
Steve Smith. I mean he's a thick build, explosive and
in the open field. Uh, you can do a lot
with him. He can play on the outside more than
some of these other smaller slot guys. But Trey harry Man,
I think he'd be a great compliment to see thee Lamb.

Speaker 7 (41:03):
Physically, Hairs may be more impressive, but I think Besh
and his route running in his feel, I think that's
going to translate to deck a little bit better. That's
just you know, that's just you know how from the
Dallas connection and and oh we love a good story, Bobby.

Speaker 8 (41:17):
Come on, man, you got the family ties.

Speaker 7 (41:19):
Even though I got Besch higher, I got a two
on Besh and a three on on Hairs. I just
think Besh fits a.

Speaker 6 (41:24):
Little better well on Heck, Besha does have l s
U wide receiver history, and we as a freshman, we
know how the LSU wide receivers.

Speaker 4 (41:33):
So I'm not gonna fight it. You think I think
I should.

Speaker 5 (41:35):
They're not looking at the big receiver opposite because of Mingo.

Speaker 7 (41:39):
I hope that ain't.

Speaker 4 (41:40):
Do you think they're they're looking away from it?

Speaker 5 (41:42):
You mean they're they're thinking that Mingo is their ex
and they're gonna find somebody similar to.

Speaker 4 (41:47):
How Lamb plays. If I had the slot player.

Speaker 7 (41:50):
If I had to guess, the only guys that they're
really accounting for is Lamb and Turping. If I had
to guess, because tur just got money. But I would
be gravely upset that they see, all right, we just
going to lean into Mingo as big and maybe we'll
get a depth piece of.

Speaker 4 (42:04):
Goal backup plan.

Speaker 5 (42:06):
Anybody want to bet lunch that that's when they get
up there and talk, that's going to be the case
that they're going to talk about Mingo When somebody asked
a question about receiver, Mingo is going to be the
first name out of their mouth.

Speaker 4 (42:18):
I think I would.

Speaker 3 (42:18):
I would agree with you, because especially this front office,
they believe Mingo can be a guy.

Speaker 5 (42:24):
Uh.

Speaker 4 (42:24):
They traded a fourth round pick for him. I don't
think they've given up on him yet.

Speaker 8 (42:28):
I'm I'm playing CD in the slot so often that
I don't think you have like a you know, permanent
X or Z, and so I'm not necessarily like gung
ho about like I need to go get the bigger body,
the guy. I would get his Jalen Dole. That's why
I'd go get in the second Jalen Dole.

Speaker 4 (42:41):
We argued about him last week. I'm a fan. I
think he's the better of.

Speaker 8 (42:44):
The time if you want to talk about again checking
every box that Brian Schottenheim was talking about in terms
of establishing culture here, that's the guy. But like like
I think when you look at the tape now, there's
obviously he's available in the second round for a reason.
There's there's stuff I think with his routefficient see and
some of the Polish it's not great. But I think
the the traits are off the charts. I think the

(43:06):
work ethic is really really high. You know. I was
talking to Brent Callaway in Indianapolis who runs EXOS, and
he was talking about Jalen and he said, he's the
valedictorian of our performance program this year. That dude is
always the first up, that he's an hour there's they're
an hour before the workouts start. He is the one
holding everybody accountable. He's the one saying, you know, lifting

(43:28):
up the workouts. He is as hard a worker as
I've ever had. I mean, he's somebody who I think
everything you hear, he checks a ton of boxes for them.

Speaker 7 (43:37):
So Brian Mingo may keep them from going wide receiver
in day two, there's no way that keeps them from
looking at a wide receiver at twelve overall.

Speaker 5 (43:45):
Is no See, that's the question I'm asking, That's the quest.
I mean, I I think they would take McMillan.

Speaker 4 (43:52):
I think, yeah, I would hope.

Speaker 5 (43:53):
I would think we Why.

Speaker 7 (43:55):
Do we have that? That's what I'm saying, Why do
we have? Why is this a coin?

Speaker 4 (43:58):
Flip?

Speaker 7 (43:58):
Wise?

Speaker 3 (43:59):
Because they're multiple needs. It goes back to the conversation
we just had. What don't they need at twelve?

Speaker 4 (44:05):
There's never gonna try to sell.

Speaker 7 (44:07):
There's never a world they should sell. Me mean, oh yeah,
we look, we passed the home and look, Mengo is
the best player on our board. If we put, if
we put.

Speaker 4 (44:14):
They told they told me to say a top of
the second round.

Speaker 7 (44:17):
Guy, they will say that to us. I'm just hoping
that they don't look at McMillan and go, oh, well,
we're gonna go with the corner that Brian doesn't like because.

Speaker 4 (44:24):
We got me Johnson.

Speaker 3 (44:26):
Yeah, yea, yeah, yeah, that's a realistic scenario.

Speaker 7 (44:31):
I'm just saying I'd be sick.

Speaker 3 (44:34):
Okay, all right, we got to take our second break.
When we come back. I've got some tell me more names.
I want to hear some scouting reports on some lesser
known guys, lesser names.

Speaker 7 (44:43):
But I got two answers in my bad one of them.

Speaker 3 (44:45):
Yeah, thanks fot you man three two of them from
the fans, one from vat you got right after this.

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Is The Dallascowboys dot Com Draft Show.

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Speaker 4 (47:19):
Online and in stores.

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As you do your shopping this weekend, look for it.

Speaker 4 (47:26):
It's good.

Speaker 3 (47:27):
Look at magazine, absolutely wonderful, gorgeous. Got one hundred and
ten bios and scouting reports in there. I want to
add a couple of scouting reports here.

Speaker 4 (47:35):
If you've got some time little tell me more.

Speaker 3 (47:38):
As we wrap up this episode of the Draft Show, Brian,
I'll start with you on this one. I want to
hear about Jamari Harris corner from Iowa.

Speaker 5 (47:47):
Yeah, Jamari Harris. Let me get to Jamori Harrison. He
is the starting left corner for the Hawkeyes and he
plays a ton of zone coverage. He's got length, He's
a smooth player. There's a Twitter cheat element to his game.
The reactions to his ability to read the routes and
stuff like that. He could run the route at times

(48:07):
better than the receiver and coverage. You think he's guessing,
but he really really isn't.

Speaker 4 (48:12):
He sees the.

Speaker 5 (48:13):
Development of the play, he's on top of it, and
the ball skills are outstanding. He's in position for overthrows.
There's just when quarterbacks tend to be reckless with the ball.
This guy is kind of in that spot. I will
say this though. You know you have to be able
to understand this guy plays sideways a lot and then

(48:34):
he adjust his route ass or he adjust his coverage
as the route comes off. He he only has adequate
top end speed. He really really does. Smith by Ohio
State just ran right by him, and Smith runs by
a lot of people.

Speaker 4 (48:48):
But you know, you've you've.

Speaker 5 (48:50):
Got to understand that this guy is really a zone player.
He'll need some work as a man cover guy. If
your scheme is really really zone heavy, this is your
guy because he thrives playing this way six one, one
ninety one and uh. But man, he will compete in
the tackling aspect of it. And but like you say,

(49:11):
it's it's really about being able to read and react,
and that's what he does pretty well in his own coverage.

Speaker 6 (49:16):
And he's also one of these older guys. He's gonna
be twenty five in September. N he's a six year guy. Yeah,
he started twenty seven games. But you're right, Like the
double moves that can get him and you can pick
on him underneath. Now he'll come up and tackle. But
when he's playing off, that's what you'll see a lot
of teams. They're just gonna get the ball out quick
to him. Now he's got to come up and make
the play.

Speaker 4 (49:35):
It's always a little late too, Yeah, a little bit late.

Speaker 6 (49:38):
But he'll try and bait quarterbacks like you're right, Like
he is very instinctive looking and king on the quarterback,
reading the eyes and then he'll come up there. I mean,
tremendous ball skills and the arm length is there to
be able to come in and strike as soon as
the ball lands. So he is an intriguing day three
option if you don't land a cornerback in day one
or two.

Speaker 8 (49:55):
He's instinctive. The awareness is really good. One hundred percent
agree with everything Bright said about zone specific A guy
who the top ends isn't there. The guy here reminded
me of somebody here in Dallas who didn't play a time,
but similar player coming out and some of the stuff
we started in training camp. He reminds me a lot
of Donovan Alumba when he was here. The same sort
of like bigger guy, bigger build, without top end speed.

Speaker 4 (50:16):
You probably just kill him.

Speaker 8 (50:17):
In your eyes, he is Donovan Alumba. It's like I
would have given donnov An Alumba more of a shot.
I thought he was a good player, but zone specific,
you're not do not. I would not throw him out
there to play man coverage.

Speaker 3 (50:28):
And it was the Comeback Player of the Year honoree
for IOWA in twenty twenty three.

Speaker 4 (50:34):
Suffered some injury in twenty twenty He.

Speaker 6 (50:36):
Also got suspended two games for gambling. Did he at Iowa? Yeah,
he was cutting a little.

Speaker 4 (50:40):
I mean who hasn't. But hey, that's fine with me.
Playing a little over under with you.

Speaker 7 (50:43):
That might have been more or less like gambling gamble.
He was like shooting dice zone.

Speaker 4 (50:47):
No, I think it was like gambling. O.

Speaker 8 (50:49):
Yeah, I guess taking the unders on IOWA offense like
everybody else.

Speaker 3 (50:51):
Daily Fantasy man get in all that? Why not yet, players,
There's a lot of reason do not get in on it.
Don't do that bad idea? All right, next one up,
don't do bad idea. I forget me on the name pronunciation.
I'm gonna look it up as you as you guys
give it. But Jay Tuya or Toya Toya.

Speaker 4 (51:11):
From is it Toya?

Speaker 8 (51:12):
I thought it was Toya?

Speaker 3 (51:13):
Is it Toya Toy? We'll go with Toya from UCLA
interior defensive lineman. Who's got him?

Speaker 4 (51:17):
I'll take it.

Speaker 5 (51:18):
Yeah, massive noseman for the Bruins. He comes from a
family of athletes, sure brothers, and he had a brother
NFL player college players. This is a rugby family too,
so if this he maybe has some little Jordan mile
Lotta in his.

Speaker 4 (51:31):
In his blood.

Speaker 5 (51:32):
But he is from Tonga and and uh he has
been a three year starter.

Speaker 4 (51:37):
There's some initial quickness.

Speaker 5 (51:38):
This guy six two three and forty two pounds, he
could be a load to deal with inside. His first
initial contact is pretty powerful and you kind of see
blockers getting knocked back a little bit. And I thought
the power and strenk was good. He's not a long
arm guy, so he's just kind of there trying to
eat up space in the way that he plays. His
movement's not poor for his size, but you see him

(51:59):
play down the line and up the field with chasing.

Speaker 7 (52:01):
Uh.

Speaker 5 (52:02):
He's got that nose tackle thickness to him. Will battle
all kinds of blocks and he can cause problems as
a pass rus or just on the penetration.

Speaker 4 (52:10):
Part of it.

Speaker 5 (52:11):
But if he has to start, stop then restart, he's
likely going to get stuck along the line of scrimmage,
and uh, I think that, you know, he has to
keep moving in order to have a chance to make
the play. Teams that run wide on him tend to
give him more problems because he just can't get all
the way to the outside there. So he's only had

(52:31):
two sacks and three seasons, and so he needs to
play in a technique where he could be a head
up nose or just that one technique, but he will
surprise you with his athletic ability.

Speaker 3 (52:40):
Is that the way an NFL team would look at
him is if they're looking at him as a one
tech and a guy that maybe could be a late day.

Speaker 5 (52:46):
Three rotation mids, I'd absolutely look at Yeah, there's several
times you watch him play. I mean in the USC game,
the Washing game, I mean, he's like head up nose
and you know he's he's controlled. Those guys have a
hard time moving him in ways. But I could say
he's kind of he's his when he could go forward,
he's really good. When he gets that momentum, he's hard

(53:08):
to stop. But as I mentioned, start, stop, then restart,
he's balls out. He's just gonna He kind of gets
he kind of gets caught up along the line of scrimmage.

Speaker 4 (53:18):
He moves pretty well for his size in the hustle
and FX there.

Speaker 6 (53:21):
I mean, he ends up getting rewarded on some hustle
plays by circling back and making a sack or or
or a tackle against the run. And he shows some
good awareness against the screens, able to sniff out a
screen in the Iowa game. That was pretty darn impressive.

Speaker 4 (53:33):
I liked him. I liked him quite a bit as
a Day three option.

Speaker 3 (53:36):
So I have found his pronunciation on the UCLA's athletic website.

Speaker 4 (53:39):
Heard Toya Toya Toya. There's three remember Saki, Siaka, Ika,
brother Lash. Yeah they're related. Yeah, are they really? Yeah?

Speaker 3 (53:48):
Okay, that's interesting. Yeah, Toya is how you say his
last name? But uh, but Votch, did you have anything
on Toya?

Speaker 13 (53:56):
No?

Speaker 7 (53:56):
I mean I haven't seen him. He was way at
the bottom my list, man, my bed, I know.

Speaker 3 (53:59):
You've seen Kevin what Winston, junior safety from sten State.

Speaker 4 (54:03):
Tell me about him.

Speaker 7 (54:03):
First thing. I want to, you know, look at when
I see when I see these safeties, free safeties, I
want to know ken they tackle and keviv Kevin went
Kelvin Kevin Kevin Kevin Winston is a tackling fool, and
I just stand up and clap every time I see
him do it. But he's also a really good cover guy.
You know, where there's one high too high, it's probably
gonna be more of a too high kind of dude.

(54:23):
I don't think he has the range to go from
from one side of the field to the other numbers
or whatnot. But I think just as a rangey dude,
you know, high safety on the roof gy tackle. I
think he's pretty good. I seen him walk him down
sometimes they're walking down a strong I like him more
back as a support tackle dude, you know what I'm saying.
But as a as a covering free sometimes tackling dude,

(54:45):
I love him.

Speaker 6 (54:45):
He's an energy type of player, dude. He kind of
kind of gives me like a little Earl Thomas vibes
when you watch him. He's just a much bigger player
than where Earl was and only one year of starting experience.
But he can play all over the secondary. He he's
got range, he can cover the slot, deep freeze you
mentioned their vatch, can also play in the box. Consistent tackler,

(55:06):
short area of quickness, explosiveness to make plays in space.

Speaker 4 (55:09):
Uh.

Speaker 6 (55:09):
The only negative really is he can be a little
over aggressive, like he might He might just over pursue
because he comes in like a Tasmanian devil overruns a play.
But Kevin Winston Junior I was a huge fan, just
was injured Week two of last season in practice, missed
the whole season. So there's some injury background that you've
got to kind of figure out with him. But a
team captain, he's one of these, say another one of

(55:31):
these safeties that can be a big time improvement for
you have second round.

Speaker 4 (55:36):
Yeah, got the second that's yeah.

Speaker 3 (55:38):
And coming off of an injury like that, Like you said,
it was a partially torn ACL. It's the season suffered
again against Bowling Green. We were watching Fan and Junior
the tight end, and he was going up against them
for a little bit.

Speaker 4 (55:49):
Yeah, we ended up getting hurt. Uh, that's a high
that's a high IQ player.

Speaker 8 (55:54):
By the way, I gotta watch him back, I guess
because I watched him Luwaga and I did not see
I did not see free at all. I think it's
the best we're gonna talk about here. But that's a
strong exclusive to me, that is a strong safety. Play
him downhill, do not have him in coverage, is what
I saw.

Speaker 3 (56:06):
Yeah, great athletic build, sure tackler closing speed showed on
tape as some of the notes that I've got. I
didn't see a ton of vision. I didn't see that
footwork and that that instinct that going downhill, kind of
like what Bobby's saying.

Speaker 4 (56:21):
I didn't see a ton of coverage there.

Speaker 3 (56:22):
I watched him against West Virginia, and then I took
the twenty twenty three tape against Rutgers in Ohio State
looked at him a little bit there. I think he
can play downhill better than anybody. Maybe not better than
anybody that's probably too much so, but probably up with
the better safeties in this draft.

Speaker 5 (56:36):
I think cover tight ends. I mean his length, in
his size, he could got. I saw a guy that
can flip his hips and be able to run with receivers.
But like I said, we'll have to see how the
knee injury hurts his mobility on that especially change of direction.

Speaker 4 (56:52):
A little bit questionable there.

Speaker 3 (56:54):
Jake Brenning Stool we talked to him and tight end
out of Clemson during our time at the senior ball.

Speaker 4 (57:00):
Why did you make that?

Speaker 7 (57:01):
I tell you what, man. When I was watching film
on the first thing I thought was, boy, maya mccarthur
lud his kid. They run some hitches and slants over there.

Speaker 4 (57:07):
Boy, Yeah, they do a lot of misdirection with him.

Speaker 7 (57:09):
A lot of run around the circle, run through the
line of scrimmage, and get magically open some of those places.
I hate those those plays you kin him open. I
hate that, But most of his plays are we gonna
run some hitches, We're gonna run some slams, were gonna
run some hous. That's really what it is. Doesn't really
have a have a deep game to him, you know.
He he could be a somewhat yeat guy, like if
he get a couple of steps, but they tackle him.
For the most part, I didn't think he was. He

(57:31):
was that big of a dude. And I think that
they that they move him around because they just can't
keep him in line. I don't think he's gonna block anybody.

Speaker 4 (57:36):
Him Ergatston.

Speaker 7 (57:39):
Uh, Syracuse. Yeah, I put gasing over him.

Speaker 4 (57:42):
It's a run day. Yeah, I play touching tags for me,
but I have brending stool a little bit better.

Speaker 6 (57:46):
I liked it more than you did. At six six
two forty one. Like he's a guy that I think
can run the same. I think he can give you
something down the field. Uh and first six six guy,
He'll go down and catch some balls that are low
on him too. He'll dig something out of the dirt
for you. But you're right, he's used a ton in
misdirection and you do see him engage in climb to
the second level. He just doesn't have a ton of power,

(58:06):
and there's not a lot of bend there either, because.

Speaker 4 (58:08):
He's such a tall guy. He's only two forty.

Speaker 6 (58:11):
But I mean to be yeah, he needs to put
on some power, put on some weight. But as a
number two tight end, that will develop over the course
of his career. He could end up developing into an
impactful player.

Speaker 3 (58:19):
He's a good route runner too, for a tight end.
I thought he ran routes pretty well. He's a big
play threat. They used him over the top quite a bit.
Did anybody watched the SMU game.

Speaker 4 (58:29):
Miami, Wake, Forest and Georgia.

Speaker 7 (58:31):
That's a bad thing about tight ends two.

Speaker 5 (58:32):
He got tossed around pretty good in Get Yeah, our
end roberts yet couple of times he's.

Speaker 8 (58:39):
Tough because he he looks like a receiver. He looks
like a big receiver out there. He's not athletic enough
to be a big receiver at the NFL level. Correct,
that's the biggest thing. You play Gats in a big
receiver then, I mean he's a Tweeners, so I mean
probably I could see him playing big receiver. I could see.
I think there's flexibility with Gats. The thing here with him,
I don't think in line. I just watched him for

(58:59):
the first time yesterday the Clemson No, the Clemson tight
end Okay, I just watched him for the first time
yesterday when we were talking about who we're going to discuss,
and I see a guy who can be a contributor
in a tight end room. I don't think that's ever
going to develop into a starter.

Speaker 7 (59:14):
I wrote in here that he.

Speaker 8 (59:15):
Looks like a big receiver, doesn't have the athleticism or
polished to transition. I think the lack of athleticism keeps
defenders in his pocket pretty consistently, causes some some suffocation
in man coverage. He sits down in his own he's
pretty aware. He's good there are But I don't think
you can just say, like, all right, that's our starting
to I don't think that's going to be a guy
he develops into at any point.

Speaker 4 (59:34):
No, it's a good point.

Speaker 3 (59:35):
And the guy that I compared him to when I
was looking at the film and looking back at notes
was Harrison Bryant from a couple.

Speaker 5 (59:41):
Of years ago.

Speaker 3 (59:42):
You remember sure six foot five, kind of undersized, slender
build to him, and and Bryant to your point, Bobby
never really stuck around to tight end, hadn't played very
well with Cleveland still in the league. Currently, he's with
the Eagles now he's this backup currently in Philadelphia, but was.

Speaker 4 (59:57):
With the Raiders last year.

Speaker 3 (59:59):
He's been on that to roster, but he's been a
backup tight end and hasn't necessarily developed into a big
play threat like they thought maybe out of the fourth
round that they drafted him out of fau back in
twenty twenty.

Speaker 8 (01:00:10):
I compared him to Doreel green Beckham with tease taber speed.

Speaker 4 (01:00:14):
That's what I okay, okay, well.

Speaker 8 (01:00:21):
Missuri Missouri, you love you loved Doreel greenback if we
all did.

Speaker 4 (01:00:26):
I was looking at you, Bobby, and I was like, everybody's.

Speaker 8 (01:00:28):
Entitled that's twelve years ago that day.

Speaker 3 (01:00:31):
All right, that's gonna do it for us here on
the Draft show. Hope you had some fun with us
here with this next or this last hour.

Speaker 4 (01:00:37):
When we come back on Thursday, will officially be three
weeks out from the NFL Draft. It is coming up
very very.

Speaker 3 (01:00:43):
Quickly for Zach Wolchuck Bryan brought us watch from Barty
Bobby Belt with Chris Beam and the back of Kyle
Yeomans saying so long.

Speaker 4 (01:00:50):
We'll see on Thursday with more of the Draft show.

Speaker 1 (01:00:52):
This has been a production of Dallascowboys dot Com and
the Dallas Cowboys Football Club.