The Gift of Time & Distance

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What if you could spot danger before it materializes? What if your decision-making advantage wasn't about reacting faster, but about seeing what others miss entirely? 

The gift of time and distance isn't just tactical jargon—it's a profound cognitive framework that separates reactive individuals from those who shape outcomes. This episode dives deep into how early detection of critical cues combined with expanded decisional space creates a powerful cognitive edge in both high-stakes and everyday situations.

We explore the fascinating paradox of human perception: we're wired with incredible pattern recognition abilities, yet our emotional responses often hijack these systems exactly when we need them most. The true masters of situation awareness aren't necessarily the tactical experts—they're those who can process information differently, identifying the symptoms of developing situations long before they manifest.

Through compelling real-world examples—from hostage negotiations to everyday safety practices—we demonstrate how this approach transcends professional domains. The concept isn't about paranoia or hypervigilance; it's about calibrating your attention to notice what matters. Simple habits like checking store interiors before entering, understanding normal environmental patterns, or pausing briefly before making decisions can dramatically improve your cognitive positioning.

Perhaps most importantly, we address why these seemingly obvious practices are so rarely implemented consistently. The emotional impulse to act immediately, the false comfort of routine, and our natural tendency toward immediate gratification all compete against our better judgment. Yet with consistent practice and a framework like our HBPRA methodology, these skills become second nature.

Ready to develop your cognitive edge? Join us as we unpack the strategies that transform reactive individuals into proactive decision makers. Whether you're in law enforcement, business, education, or simply want to navigate life more effectively, this episode provides actionable insights to anticipate problems before they escalate and identify opportunities others miss entirely.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hello everyone and welcome to the Human Behavior
Podcast.
Today we are exploring what wemean by the gift of time and
distance.
We dive deep into why earlydetection of critical cues and
the decisional space thatfollows are both literal and
metaphorical tools for expandingyour cognitive edge.
We'll explain how this conceptgoes beyond tactical know-how,
showing that time and distancecan radically improve safety

(00:20):
awareness and everyday decisionmaking.
Whether you're in lawenforcement, business, education
or simply want to become moreproactive in life, this episode
provides insights and practicaltips to help you anticipate
problems before they escalateand find hidden opportunities
along the way.
Grab a notebook and get readyto see how a small shift in
perspective can lead to bigchanges in your personal and
professional life.
Thank you so much for tuning in.

(00:41):
We hope you enjoy the episode.
Don't forget to check out ourPatreon channel for additional
content and subscriber-onlyepisodes.
If you enjoy the podcast,please consider leaving us a
review and, more importantly,sharing it with a friend.
A big picture concept,theoretically, philosophically,
everything, and we're going togive sort of our definitions of

(01:09):
what you know.
We use the term you know, thegift of time and distance for
for arcadia come, for arcadia,kognerati, and I want to define
what that means, because it'skind of, you know, everyone says
that, oh yeah, you got to gettime and distance as your friend
, or time and distance, and it'ssort sort of like in a tactical
way.
But this is a really, really bigconcept, and so I want to give

(01:31):
our definitions of what we meanby it and how we'll get into how
what we do can kind of givethat cognitive edge really fully
, just taking the time to jumpinto these and define them
specifically on what we mean bythem, because they are, these
are big concepts, right.
This isn't something you'rejust going to cover in a one

(01:52):
hour podcast or fully understand.
I mean, it's very complex whatwe mean by it, but there is a
way through that in a sense,right, there's a way to
understand it.
There's a way to utilize andmanipulate time and distance to
your advantage, and so there's alot to get into.
But I figure we'd maybe startI'll throw to you, greg to kind

(02:12):
of maybe, maybe give some streetdefinitions and then we can
kind of go from there.

Speaker 2 (02:17):
Yeah, yeah, let's start.
Let's start small and then wecan always get smaller, because
this is one of those topics,right?
So Brian wrote me a couple ofnotes to just say, hey, this is
what I wanted to talk abouttoday, and one of the notes that
Brian wrote is explain theconcept of early detection and
decisional space, which Ihighlighted on my notes because
I thought it was a greatquestion.

(02:37):
So, look, concept of earlydetection no matter what you do
for a living, early diagnosismatters.
So we identify symptoms,artifacts and evidence in
support of reasonableconclusions, the further left of
a potential incident, that wecan identify those symptoms.
And what's a symptom?
A symptom is when earlydetection is the identification

(03:00):
of diseases as soon as possiblefrom symptoms, well before it
manifests itself in some otherway, and that increases and
improves your chance oftreatment and other outcomes
that would reduce mortality.
So why wouldn't what we do bethe exact same thing?
What we try to do is we try toput together these artifacts and

(03:21):
evidence that tend to show that, for example, crime is afoot or
that an argument is beginningor that this is something this
person really doesn't want totalk about.
How can we ease the transitioninto it Because it's an
important topic.
So it doesn't matter what inthe human realm that you're
talking about.
Communication between humans isinherently simple, genetically

(03:44):
and hardwired, and historicallyand primitively.
But it's also hard as shitbecause we've evolved past the
type of communications we usedto have.
Then.
The second part of that isdecisional space.
So there's a whole realm ofpossibilities with decisional
space.
But what I like is what Brianmeant by it, what I'm reading
into it, and that's the range ofoptions, that's the range of

(04:07):
choices that are available to atrained decision maker compared
to an untrained decision maker,because there's a zone of
possibility of not only making adecision but then implementing
the decision.
And the time distance gap thatwe're talking about is not a
legal or a fiscal or atechnological or a political.

(04:30):
We're talking about liveshanging in the balance for
saying something or not sayingsomething, for taking cover,
because you see thisconstellation of clues coming
together and those cues wouldtend to show somebody that
something was about to happen.
So, and look, that's streetingit up.
That's the simplest definitionI can give of early detection,

(04:50):
and decisional space, so you canimagine how vast the topic is.

Speaker 1 (04:55):
Right.
So kind of what you're sayingis that you know, time and
distance in general is aboutearly recognition.
Time and distance in general isabout early recognition, and
then not just early recognition,but then early with the point
of having earlier action, right,it's not just, oh, I saw these
things starting to coalesce,it's no, I saw the pre-event

(05:16):
indicators, I saw the symptoms,like you said, and so we're
going to create an interventionstrategy now, right, so that we
don't have to wait until thatchaotic thing is happening, and
so that's really the you knowwhat you mean by time and
distance is sort of the earlyrecognition, and then time and
distance is its own thing withinit, and then understanding this

(05:38):
is what you get is what thecognitive edge is, right, it's
okay, now.
I'm doing this stuff I'm doingin recognizing these early
symptoms of something, and nowI'm interviewing, intervening or
making my decisions based onthose and the likelihood of what
I think is going to happen.
I'm doing that now rather thanwaiting for the situation to

(05:59):
occur and then getting better atresponding to the situation,
which is where most things areand which is not really what we
do.

Speaker 2 (06:07):
Okay, no, no, let's talk about that briefly, brian.
Let's talk about that brieflybecause 40 years ago I was
hosting courses called the Edgethe Edge like the singer that
plays with Bono right, but theidea was that the reason we
called it the Edge and then itwas institutional, so whether it
was in Grosse Pointe or it wasin Detroit or it was at

(06:27):
Powderhorn, for example, thecourses at Colorado were called
the Powderhorn Edge and the ideawas that I didn't know then
that what we were trying tobuild was the cognitive edge,
because I was still stuck withone foot squarely planted in the
tactical edge, was still stuckwith one foot squarely planted
in the tactical edge.
I was a police rifle master,instructor and edge weapons and

(06:48):
impact weapons and all theseother things, and then a martial
artist, and so from shoot, moveand communicate, I was always
on the ground, the best at thetactics, Brian.
The driving, you know, teachingat Selfridge, the emergency
vehicle operation and thepursuit driving and all that
other stuff.
So I became this guy that wasthe best at all those things.
But I didn't understand.
I wasn't teaching anybody howto fish.

(07:09):
So the idea was that I wasn'tgiving myself that next level.
I knew it was there, hence thename, the edge.
But I didn't understand thatthe step up was the next level,
which is the cognitive edge.

Speaker 1 (07:23):
Okay, yeah, because that, that that's, and that's
where you know you kind of.
What I say is people talk abouttime and distance, but you sort
of created the way to actuallylearn it and use it.
Meaning I absolutely, it's agreat way of you know, oh yeah,
you got to get some time anddistance but like, okay, how do
you do that?
So, so maybe let's, let's kindof give a straight definition of

(07:46):
?
well, yeah, so let's start witha sort of street definition of
time and distance and and whatwe mean.
And so you know you kind oftalked about it, right.
So time being, the earlydetection and decisional space,
right, you know something.
You know there's, you know wetalk about.
We did a whole podcast episodeon time and our perception of
time and what we mean by it.
And you know we can slow thingsdown and we often, you know,

(08:09):
just because of the respondingto different events and how it
affects us, we jam on thatskinny pedal on the right
instead of pressing the brake alittle bit, sometimes Right.
And then distance obviously itcan be like a physical or mental
distance.
So you're talking about thecognitive distance, but it can,
you know, whereas before it wasmost people considered it as a
very tactical way, like, hey,the closer you are to someone,

(08:30):
the easier it is for them tokill you, right, whether they
have training or not, right, sothere's a very literal sense.
But then there's sort of thatmental distance where you don't
want to.
You know that can help preventimpulsive decisions, right, and
don't want to.
You know that can help preventimpulsive decisions, right, and
that's what you get in with,like the negotiation or conflict
scenario or you know what.
Why don't I stay back here?

(08:51):
Because I have a few moreoptions cognitively, not just
tactically but that I can use.
So there's this very, veryliteral understanding of time
and distance, and then there'sthe sort of the metaphorical one
.
And so how?
Why are these two?

Speaker 2 (09:08):
things together.
Why like, how do?

Speaker 1 (09:10):
you, why do you what yeah?

Speaker 2 (09:11):
So you just said something that, if anybody's
listening to me right now, grabyour pen, grab your yellow pad
and write it down.
The closer you are to someone,the easier it is to kill.
Look, you're touching on on abunch of topics that we teach in
the course.
Even an untrained opponentthat's inside your physical and
personal zone is going to have amuch easier time killing you or
injuring you because ofdistance, right?

(09:34):
Okay, so that's both literaland metaphorical.
Why?
Because look, who is the mostlikely suspect that's going to
kill somebody in a house?
It's going to be your spouse.
Now, if it's not your spouse orsignificant other, it's going
to be somebody that's living inthat house, somebody familiar to
you.
So it crosses both lines, brian.
It's literal the physical space, a vantage point, position of

(09:56):
cover or concealment but it'salso metaphorical, and that
means emotion-based ormental-based or cognition-based.
And so once people understandthat that's what we mean, I'll
give you a perfect streetexample, and I know you've read
it.
I don't know how many of ourlisteners read Greg Mortensen's
book back in the day.
Three Cups of Tea.
So everybody that was flyingout was reading it on a plane,

(10:18):
because everybody's trying tofigure out.
Okay, what do I do?
Do I learn Pashto?
Do I learn Farsi?
And the idea was that Mortensenjust epitomized networking,
building the relationshipsgradually through interactions,
and his Three Cups of Tea werethose three interactions moving
first from being a stranger,then to a friend, then to part
of the family, before you evermake a request and conduct in

(10:40):
business.
Okay, brian, isn't that whatwe've done all along?
So so I would say, as importantas the book left a bang is,
three cups of tea is animportant book too, because my
hostage negotiation that wasquality Number one.
I need to get you talking.
If you're talking, you're notkilling, okay, on a traffic stop
.
I need to get you talking.
If you're talking, you're notfleeing or trying to run me down

(11:00):
or pulling a gun on me In adomestic.
I can deescalate the situationif I can get you talking.
And the idea is talking does anumber of things.
Again, the literal it creates atime and distance gap in your
brain from action or reaction.
And metaphorical, it creates afriendship, which means that now
I'm injecting emotions whichslow you down.

(11:22):
Emotions will slow you down.
That's why there's no crying inbaseball.
So so the idea is that it's astrategy.
Okay when you get a symptom.
If you leave a symptomunchecked, it's going to
manifest into something else.
So we're talking about thefurther left of this potential
situation that you're addressingthose symptoms and and making

(11:44):
sense of them, the better chanceyou're going to have,
especially in extremis of ofmaking the right decision at the
right time for the right reason.

Speaker 1 (11:54):
Yeah, and, and it's kind of that.
And that gives you right wherewe're talking about this, this
idea of the cognitive edge, ofwhat what we mean by that, and
you know.
That's why you know we do it,know, we do it.
We mean some of the exerciseswe even do in class.
Right, we call let's go to the,let's go to the cognitive gym,
because the the idea is you knowall the the, you know the

(12:15):
workouts and range time and mattime, that you do it, you know
it, it, like you said, itdoesn't matter if, if that
person is a step ahead of me, ifI'm in your space and I can do
the street magician and fool you, then it doesn't matter how
strong you are or how good of afighter or how your survival
skills are, it literally doesn'tmatter.

(12:36):
That all gets negated, so it'salmost like it has to start here
.

Speaker 2 (12:43):
A fraud is a cognitive attack.
Okay, because I fool you on thephone or with a credit card, or
with that empty gas can, brian?
And?
And the idea is, it doesn'tmatter how physically strong you
are or how resilient you are,because I can still steal from
you.
And that's the great equalizer,isn't it?
It?
Because cognition won't letthat happen.

(13:04):
Okay, cognition will say wait aminute, something's wrong here.
This doesn't feel or smell ortaste.
Right, you get what I mean.
So we're using the Holberman,we're using that big 360 now,
whereas before you're going,okay, I can out shoot you, I can
out fight you and I've got allthese defensive tactics.
Well, it's wonderful, but whathappens when the person can

(13:24):
outthink me?
What happens when the person'sfaster mentally than I am?

Speaker 1 (13:30):
Yeah, and the other reason I like these terms about
when we say time and distanceand the cognitive edge is, you
know, if that's my goal, likeyou gave the example of, you
know, the hostage negotiator orthe domestic whatever, like, hey
, if you're talking you're notshooting.
If you're talking you're notdoing, ok, so you're building

(13:53):
time and distance that you'renow actually taking control of
the narrative and taking control, or I should say you're
influencing it for the purposeof, hey, first thing I need to
do is get some time and distance.
How can I do that right now?
And what I mean by that is thateveryone's, you know, looking

(14:13):
for a solution to a problem or away to do things or a way to
respond to this or this is.
But it's like, hang on.
But before you even get to thatpoint, what have you done?
Going into a situation saying,how do I get some time and
distance?
Because and here's why thismatters right, we're having sort
of a discussion about this andI heard some other folks having
it about about orientation,perception and how you see

(14:37):
things, and you know people talkabout reading the environment
and seeing these cues andperceptions.
It's like, but your, your sortof mindset, your goal of what
you're doing shapes all of yourperceptions.
So if I go in saying, all right, I think this is going to

(14:58):
happen, or I want this to happen, or this is going to be a chase
, or this person's going to run,or this person's going to like
your, that, that's now going toshape everything that you do.
But if I walk in and go, allright, I want to go into this
situation and get some time anddistance, I get to create some
time and distance.
Now I've oriented myself, I'veshaped my perception to come up

(15:23):
with that solution.
Now, that's my goal in mind.
Meaning, if I'm going into asituation with that goal in mind
to create some time anddistance, okay, that will then
allow me that sort of cognitiveflexibility to come up with
different solutions in thissituation.
But but if I'm going in sayingI have to go do this, well then
I'm going to go do that and I'monly going to look for things

(15:44):
that confirm what I need to getthat done.
Does that make sense?
So, so, to create the time anddistance and gain the cognitive
edge, it it really is.
Before everyone talks about,like you know, the, the, the
perception of the elements inyour environment.
Well before that, there's athere's a world on unconscious
world happening in your brainthat governs everything that you

(16:06):
do.
That we need to start with, andthat's what starts with the
gift of time and distance, thecognitive edge.

Speaker 2 (16:14):
That's why it's called the gift and the idea is,
let's white belt that for justa minute, because you just laid
out a great fundamental argument.
Okay, so let's ask this verybasic question which is most
calorie conscious?
Okay, so let's ask this verybasic question which is most
calorie conscious?
Okay, is it more calorieconscious to avoid going into

(16:36):
that room or getting out of thatroom once I'm in a situation?
Is it better to avoid enteringinto that contract or that
situation or being in it andhaving to fight your way back
out of it?
And so people are saying, well,you're mincing words.
No, I'm not.
We had a great guy, adamParsativity podcast, if
anybody's looking it up fromacross the pond and he sent us
some photos, brian, of the mostrecent place that he was doing a

(16:57):
job that he does, and it was adangerous environment.
And the idea was look, you sawfrom a distance that these
things started to coalesce andthat meant that the danger
quotient increased.
So are you going to go aheadand grab that flashlight and
climb down into that?
Well, and get deeper to thesource of that, telling you

(17:24):
danger warning Will Robinson.
So what happens is, again, it'sthe same argument, with the
lights and sirens, we decidethat we're going to get to the
situation, because when we're atground zero we're going to be
making better decisions andinfluence a narrative.
But is that the right place tostand?
Should I penetrate before I'vemade certain decisions?
So the utmost level ofsituation awareness is being
well outside and understandinghey, something is going on here

(17:48):
and I just being vicariouslynear it and involved in it in
some way, and the interaction ofthe things in that situation
may prove to be good andbeneficial and wonderful if I
decide to go that direction, orthey could be the end of me so
so.
So that's the when.
When I say imagine engineeringtape, you know that police tape

(18:09):
and the truck outline on theground before you walk into a
place.
I mean that.
I mean that you shouldconstantly be thinking that is
this one of those situationsthat has the propensity, has the
tendency to spin out of mycontrol, and I can give you an
example of that in thegeographics realm.
And so anybody that's been toclass and if you haven't get to
do a training, so a long timeago, before anybody else was

(18:31):
doing this kind of stuff that Iknew of because I was the only
player that was running it forregions.
I would say, okay, do me afavor, we're going to conduct
training, training only.
Make sure that you do that,because people will do stuff
like shooting in a school andthen all of a sudden say, oh, it
was just training, and thenwonder how that spun wildly out
of control.
So the idea was okay, it doesn'tmatter what shift it is, we're
going to have a robbery at thislocation, whether it's a

(18:56):
7-Eleven or a bank, dependent onthe shift, all that other stuff
.
And what we want you to do isrealistically figure out, from
the time the person leaves, abunch of things are going to be
happening.
So I got a team at the scene, Igot a team in the parking lot,
I got a team at dispatch and Igot a team on the road and you
got to do all these things.
Brian, it's got to be a study.
And so the idea was okay, oncethat person's left and you're
going to dial 911, the clockstarts.

(19:16):
So how long does it take foryou to call 911?
And, with an average dispatchertaking the average amount of
information, get thatinformation out to the road and
remember this was before Enhance911 and all these other things.
Okay, now, in that amount oftime.
How far did the person get onfoot?
That means where would theircar likely be parked, or is
somebody waiting for them, or isthe car idling, or did they

(19:37):
have to hop a fence, or did theyhave to recon?
So that means there's a witnesssomewhere that knew that that
person was tying up a dog.
All these things are possible.
Now, that's close to the scene.
Then the idea is okay, if thisperson doesn't want to get
caught, they're not going tofloor it and spin the tires and
drive past the speed limit.
So going the speed limitthrough that subdivision or on
that side street, about how farcould they get?

(19:59):
No-transcript the person thatdid the robbery, because the
person is already gone andthey're already outside of that
ring.
So I was making hundreds offelony arrests on these type of

(20:20):
capers and people were going.
How are you doing that?
Because what I was able to dois profile it geographically and
figure about where that personwould have got.
And guess what?
If they were on a bike it wouldbe different.
If they were on foot, it wouldbe different.
And guess what, brian, thosetype of geographical profiles,

(20:59):
built with all the otherheuristics that we do in the
other domains help you plan inyour mind and guess what?
The more you do it, the betteryou get.
So you know the first felon, itwas a little rough, you know.
By the fifth felon it got a loteasier and after a while I'm
teaching the courses.
So that one example of how tobuild that out and that's a rock
in the pond, brian that's oneperfect example where you can
build an entire course aroundthat and understand that all
humans are likely to respond toexternal stressors the same way.
The second part of that timeand distance means that it's
logical.
And so now we're finding badguys, if that's what we're going
for.

Speaker 1 (21:18):
Okay.
So with that, with what you,the process, with that you just
described is sort of like inreal time, like this is what you
mean by the cognitive edge andgoing okay, if this is occurring
and I know these things, thenlikely this and then I can make
my decisions.
And you know, that is it's oddto me.
So maybe, maybe help meunderstand that one.

(21:42):
You, technically anyone, can dothat, right, you're meaning,
meaning it's, it's cognitivelypossible, we're, in a sense,
we're able to do that as humanbeings.
However, it's, it's almostseemingly counterintuitive,
because we're also very, veryreactive emotional creatures,
just inherently right.
So we're constantly respondingto things, or behind the curve.

(22:07):
And why is it difficult forhumans in general, at scale,
it's kind of general question,you know, why is it so difficult
for us to then do that?
Why do we get roped in everytime and keep just following in
along, whatever the trend is,whatever things are going or
like?

Speaker 2 (22:24):
you know what I'm saying.
Like, why can't we sit here anddo that?
Because there's no crying inbaseball, because our emotions
get the best of us, because ourelectrochemical
neurotransmitters are pumpinginto our brain that we're the
best we need, need to get to thescene.
We'll be making those decisionswhen, in reality, the gift of
time and distance isunderstanding all of time and
distance.
So we all know theory ofrelativity, speed and space and

(22:47):
time, so we can figure out whereobjects are.
But we also understandHeisenberg and we can either
pick one exactly or pick theother exactly.
So folks, look those up.
I'm not going to take time on acall explaining those here, but
the idea is, brian, if we thinkin those terms, I'll give you a
perfect example.
So you show up at a scene andthe scene is absolutely chaotic

(23:11):
and I'm on the ground andthere's fires burning and
gunshots were just fired andpeople are screaming and there's
people down with injuries andthere's one lone guy sitting on
the ground and there's firesburning and gunshots were just
fired and people are screamingand there's people down with
injuries and there's one loneguy sitting on the cement steps
of the house with his hands onhis knees and his head down
between his lap.
Okay, well, everybody else isrunning and screaming.
Guess who your suspect is?
That guy's not a witness, thatguy's just done all of these

(23:32):
horrible things.
So I would look at that and gohow is this guy holding it
together?
Well, this guy's in charge ofwhat's going on, this guy's at
the center of what's going onand everybody else is spinning
wildly out of control.
So if you understand entropyand the entropic principle and
you understand Newton's laws ofmotion, it's more likely that
that person is physicallyresponsible for what's happening

(23:54):
around here.
So guess what I got?
To give that person time anddistance.
And that's the person that'sgot my full attention now and
I'm starting to say let me seesome hands down on the ground,
all those other things.
Why?
Because I'm processing theartifacts and the evidence
faster than the other peoplerespond to the scene.
So that's the gift of time.
And I understand the moredistance I have from this

(24:16):
situation, the more likely it isthat I'll make a better
decision, because when we rushto a decision, we're taking on a
whole bunch of things that wedon't want to take on.
For example, when we're in areal world case, I make a fast
decision.
Then all of a sudden, I'm notunderstanding that that fast

(24:36):
decision isn't the best decisionand what I'm doing is I'm
actually reacting, sort of likea knee-jerk reaction, to the
evidence that I'm seeing.
And now we're playing what wecall you and I call Brian in the
cognitive gym pinball.
Boom, boom, boom.
I'm getting bounced around thescene.
Well, that's not the way ithappens.
And if you illustrate that inpractical terms, I am much more

(24:58):
related to police work and tomilitary work than I am, for
example, being a teacher in aschool.
Ok, although we've taught atacademic places.
That's a different thing for me.
So we're on the way to ashooting at the pastime bar at 9
at Van Dyke and all of a suddenthe people that are on the
street outside are much moreinteresting to me than the
people are fleeing from the bar.

(25:19):
And I catch the guy with thegun outside and all the other
cops are going.
Man, you're a shit magnet.
No, I'm not.
Time and distance.
Okay, where would that personbe?
What would I be doing?
Am I going to ditch the gun?
Am I going to hold on to thatgun for long enough that I get
clear of the incident locationto make sure there's not other
perpetrators before I throw itonto a business route.

(25:39):
Brian, it's out thinking acunning enemy, and that's what
takes it from the tactical tothe cognitive.
Because now what I'm doing isI'm saying these things matter
more than those things, andthat's a hard thing to do
without structure, without anarchitecture.

Speaker 1 (25:53):
Well, that, that absolutely right.
Without an architecture,without a structure, it can be
difficult, because then I don't.
It goes back to you know.
You know, what I was saying isabout how those perceptions
shape our outcomes and how weorient and what, what we find
significant.
And it's in the moment peopleare going to say, well, that's,

(26:15):
that's kind of hard to do, oryou can't really do that because
you're just you're, you're, youare responding to things as
they unfold, but but you're,you're, you're not.
There's knowns and there'sunknowns and there's things you
can project.
You, you can project into thefuture.
We do this all the time ashumans, during the winter we do,
I mean, like you, you, you're,you're hardwired for some of

(26:35):
this stuff but like you said I,I, this is where that our, our
training and response toeverything is just that it's
it's, it's so focused on.
This thing is occurring.
Here's how we respond to that.
But you're, it's almost likeyou're saying, okay, this thing
is occurring, but I'm getting inthe information, even if it's
in front of me, even if I'mseeing something I'm I is

(26:56):
occurring, but I'm getting inthe information, even if it's in
front of me, even if I'm seeingsomething, I'm sort of I'm in
the, I'm like in the I'm pickingup in the past or in a sense,
like that thing has alreadyoccurred, that that ball is
already in motion.
So if I'm chasing the last spotit was at, I'm never going to
catch it because I'm just goingafter the last spot.

Speaker 2 (27:13):
It's a hockey puck example exactly so.

Speaker 1 (27:17):
But then how, like in those times, like, how do you
then orient yourself in that way, like you just give the example
, like you show up, I got theguy you know this is what it was
.
He was the one with the gun andwasn't focused on the thing
that was happening right here.
So it's like how can I takethat and then use what I have as
a human being already born with, just biologically wired for,

(27:38):
like which we are, for successand pattern recognition and all
these things Right?
So how can I do that in, inunderstanding that that time and
distance right, like becausethat that seems difficult to
then say, all right, what'slikely to occur next?
But but if I don't do that,then I'm always going.
Here's how I respond, but I'mresponding in the past.
I'm responding to a pastincident.

Speaker 2 (28:00):
To an echo, to a ghost of what was.
You're exactly right, and solet's talk about that.
And let me give you an example.
110 years apart, so in 1914,franz Ferdinand and his wife
were assassinated, and GavriloPrincip was the one that did it,
with a bunch of other people,but he didn't do it at the
initial time when they wereflinging lead and throwing

(28:22):
grenades.
As a matter of fact, theykilled part of the personal
security detachment and injuredother parts.
So what does Franz Ferdinandwant to do?
He wants to take his wife andhe wants to go check on them at
the local hospital.
So who's fleeing through thebackyards?
Gavrilo Princip is fleeingthrough the backyards and ends
up crossing the street on theway to the hospital, completely

(28:42):
by happenstance, and sees FranzFerdinand and his old lady in
their limo, now sans securitybecause the security's all been
injured at this other ambushlocation.
So Gavrilo says you know what,here's a chance in a lifetime,
and goes and kills franceferdinand and his old lady.
You're saying that was completehappenstance.

(29:02):
I'm saying it was inevitable.
Why?
Because france ferdinand andhis driver and his old lady just
escaped an ambush and they werestill in that danger zone.
And so what did they do?
They said, well, we're going togo to the hospital and check on
these people, not saying weneed to go to a covered and
concealed position.
We need to get a new securityattachment.
We need to do these.
So you have policy andprocedure, you have TTPs.

(29:25):
Those are all great things, butin the moment, that short fuse
decision I made killed me.
So let's go to 2024 and let's goto Luigi Mangione.
He's hanging around in a hoteland he's obviously not a member
of that hotel or belonging inthat hotel.
And you got Brian Thompson, theCEO of US Health, that's

(29:46):
walking through the lobby.
Now think aboutUnitedHealthcare and think about
all the threats that they'vehad and everything else.
One, he doesn't have security.
Two, he's not situationallyaware.
Three, he's not six-checking.
And this guy walks up andblasts away at him and again
you're going wow, those thingsare.
Look again.
I will tell you it's inevitable.
You give enough time andevidence to support that.

(30:06):
It was an ongoing thing to tryto take his life.
Brian Thompson contributed tohis own death by being in a low
level of situation awareness ina hotel lobby and never

(30:28):
anticipating that one of thesedays, coming out of my car or
the parking garage, somebodymight accost me, and so that's
hard to take, brian, becausewhat we do is we go well, wait a
minute.
You're saying that's apersonality thing or that's a
this and that Now it's anemotional thing.
We all think that it's notgoing to happen to us and part
of the reason that the gift oftime and distance is out there

(30:48):
is, it can.
There was a cop that died lastnight or the night before,
rather, shot by a 14-year-oldkid.
There's another copper that'sintensive care.
Why?
Because we underestimate a14-year-old, we didn't give
ourselves the gift of the time.
It isn't.
And I'm not going to call thatcaper, because I wasn't there,
brian, but what I'm saying isit's emblematic of the symptoms,
of how one of those cases goesRight.
We reach in and grab theperndal because we don't expect

(31:10):
the driver to drive away, expectthe driver to drive away.
We're patting somebody down andwe say, hey, gun, partner, you
know.
And we're expecting our partnerto be able to figure that out
in nanoseconds and and takecover and come to my aid.
And and, brian, that's wheretraining has to come in, because
the gift of time and distanceisn't as easy as we're making it
sound.

(31:31):
It's a fucking hard thing to doand takes rehearsal, it takes
practice yes, and, and so you.

Speaker 1 (31:39):
You meant that this is where I I come in with what
I've said before.
You know where you know, humanbehavior is just way in some way
more simple than people realizeand then also way more complex
than we're kind of willing tograsp, sometimes like at the
same time and, and so this goesinto that that we talked about a

(32:01):
number of times when, whenpeople do that, you know well,
anything could happen, or this.
It's like no, no, no, it cannot.
There's, there's a finitenumber of things that can occur
throughout your day and only somany of them are likely right
and some are unlikely.
And so when you get intounderstanding the time and

(32:21):
distance and what you're talkingabout with this cognitive edge
like that's why we have HBPRA,that's our methodology of doing
it and that's why we have, youknow, the SPAR Sense, make
Problem Solve, adaptability,resilience and how to use that,
because that provides aframework.
But you know my but I'm alwaysjust curious by it it's like we
still fall into that, even whenpeople go oh yeah, I, I get it.

(32:45):
Yeah, of course we want to havetime and distance, yeah, we
want.
But but the, the application ofit, the actual process of doing
it, is rarely done.
So what?
Why?
When even you know anyone couldlook at just topically some of
the things that we discuss andand and that we show and go, oh

(33:05):
yeah, no, I, that totally getthat.
Yeah, that makes sense that,but then we, we don't go out and
apply those concepts.
We don't do that.
I'm not talking about likesomeone going through a training
course.
I'm just saying like, oh, yeah,well, well, that and and that
goes into it is is how do I dothat then?
So, like, how how can I developthis cognitive edge through

(33:26):
some, like you know, mentalrehearsal or practice throughout
my day?
Like how did you become good?
Like good at it in a sense ofnoticing things and then
attributing value to it, butthen taking that and applying
that to situations in acompletely different context or
a completely different domain,because that's where it seems to

(33:47):
get difficult for people, whichis why we use these
generalizations and that's whywe say time and distance.
It's like, okay, well, look,time and distance you can use in
any situation.
That's the point of doing it,and it's the same with
everything but but.
But then how?
How do I?
How do we do that on a dailybasis?
how can I sit here and say youknow what I'm saying?
Like, how do I, how do I comeup with a strategy to get better

(34:08):
at this?
On my own cognitively.

Speaker 2 (34:11):
I can only prompt people to training by giving
them examples of what trainingcan give them, because doing the
process would take a series ofthese podcasts, and we've been
doing it for three years now andwe're no closer to solving it
for everybody, because it is acomplex problem.
It's a lifestyle change.
It's how you must think aboutthings in the future.
So everybody out there knowsCabela's catalogs and the other

(34:36):
one, the fish guys, the whatever, the place where you buy all
your fishing gear and stuff.
They've got those huge factorystores and outlets all over the
place that sell all kinds ofcool stuff.
So we would have people thatcame to the ranch for 13 years
and I would tell them, when Italked to them on the phone and
when I sent them emails back andforth their texts don't go to
Cabela's and buy your gearbefore you come to the ranch,

(34:57):
because you're going to be up inthe high country in Colorado.
So make sure that everythingyou buy is high res orange or
high vis pink and you'll find itagain.
And you know what they did,brian.
They went to Cabela's and thatfish place and they bought a
range cam or a trail cam orwhatever else that they wanted
to.
And while they were goingaround, and they got on and off

(35:19):
their horse and had lunch andtook a picture of a fucking
porcupine, they left that cameraon the side of the trail
somewhere and me, with eightdifferent ranch hands, were up
there arm and arm searchingaround and guess what?
Nine out of 10 times wecouldn't find shit.
Why?
Because it was camouflage.
So is that human behaviorpattern recognition analysis?
Of course, because, even thoughyour instincts are going to

(35:40):
tell you, this guy told me thatthe best way is to buy something
bright.
You thought it would look a lotcooler to have that
hand-me-down lighter, thatflipped Zippo and flat black,
okay, and you can't find the sonof a bitch anymore.
So a simple idea like that.
So let's turn that on our edge.
Before you buy a fishing lure,take a look at the water and

(36:02):
figure out what the fish sees.
So, so simple.
Things like that came from myskin knees growing up and
smacking me and teaching me mymom and my aunt the Twin Towers
that lived right across thestreet from each other, that not
only survived the Nazi partybut they survived the Russian
purge after that and had to liveon their own.

(36:23):
So all of that street knowledgewas that people always
telegraph things before theyhappen.
People are always on transmit.
So if I pay attention to thosesound waves, if I pay attention
to those particles that arealways present, that are around
me, they hurry up and heat upand move faster, or they slow

(36:44):
way down and get thick and boggy.
When something's about tohappen, and and you know that
anybody out there knows thatbefore an ambush, all of a
sudden comms either spike andthey're you know, all over the
place, or comms go down tonothing.
You know that just beforesomebody smacks somebody,
everything goes real good andreal quiet, or things go noisy
right before they happen.
So all I did was turn it into agosh damn art form by writing

(37:08):
down all these things andtelling people, and then you
know what I had to deconstructit.
So, so the the greatest partabout reintegration and those
type of things science folks golook it up and understanding is
that you have to take a look ata situation backwards.
You have to take a look andreverse engineer it.
How did we get here?
And, if you can do the, how didwe get here?

(37:29):
Before you knock on the door,before you step out of the scout
car before you go to apply thatfirst handcuff, before you fire
that person at a businessmeeting or approach that kid at
his locker.
If you can do those thingsbefore hence the term left a
bang then you're likely to beable to conduct predictive
analysis in real time and avoiddangerous situations and

(37:51):
capitalize on those that aregoing to benefit you.
It's really that simple andthat's so hard.

Speaker 1 (38:04):
It's taken me my entire life to tell people, and
one of the one of the things Ilike to tell people is know your
role and your goal.
Meaning what?
What is your job in thissituation?
What is your role right,whether you're, you know, at the
store with your kids or you'reat work, whatever, what's your
role?
And then, what are you tryingto get?
What's the end state you'reworking towards?
You know, when you walk intosomething like what is the goal

(38:26):
I want out of this, because tome, like that helps sort of with
that orientation of what I'mgoing to perceive right, if it's
my goal is to you know what I'mgoing to get the kids and I'm
leaving right now because Idon't like where the situation
is, or it's the opposite, it'soh, I'm.
You know I have to go into thissituation.
What is my goal?
What is the way I want this toend right?

(38:48):
What's what am I workingtowards?
Because that helps frameeverything that happens.
The way you perceive everythingis is it has to start there,
because if I don't havesomething specific in mind, then
it's sort of like chaotic right, and so meaning you know,
you're almost like what we'restarting.

(39:09):
Like you said, all right ifwe're going to pick apart
something from the past and sayhow did we get here?
Right that that's easierbecause I can.
I, the facts are already known.
Right, I can look back in timeand gather data, or whatever
right so now, now to projectthat to the future.
it's like well, I have to knowwhere, where would I like this
to go?
What do I want this ending tobe?

(39:31):
And therefore, I'll either know, like the like, I will perceive
the elements that are necessaryto get there, or they won't be
there and I'll be able to go OK,well, that's not going to
happen based on what's happening.
So I need to come up with a newgoal and then reorient myself.
Does that kind of make sense assort of just an overall mental
process?

Speaker 2 (39:51):
That's brilliant, and so let me street it up again.
Driving through the streets ofmetropolitan Detroit on midnight
shift with heater off and mywindows down, even in winter,
what am I listening for?
I'm listening for fences.
I'm listening for somebody tohit a cyclone fence at night.
That's interesting to me.
What am I listening for?

(40:12):
I'm listening for dogs barkingin one area and then barking in
another area.
Is it a possum or is it a B&Eboy?
All of those things that areenvironmentals are out there a
smell, a sound, a feel.
And, brian, the more I get intune with those, the more they
tend to match mental models, myfile folders, or it's something

(40:35):
so nuanced that I haven't seenit before.
And now I know whateverexternal stimulus is creating
this I have to know more about,because this might be a thing
that turns dangerous or turnsopportunistic.
So I have to, and we're back toearly diagnosis, and the idea
is that these things areprobably something more than the
average night, because on theaverage night, because on the

(40:56):
average night, none of themhappen.
And then decisional space.
Brian, you said something Iwant everybody to listen to.
You were talking about not onlythe range of feasible options
or choices available to you.
But you're also talking aboutwhat's the investment.
If I'm with my family, I mayretreat much more quickly, I may
move to cover or just absentmyself from the situation much

(41:18):
more quickly than if I was alone.
But the other thing is look, Idon't want to get clipped
pulling my legal carry gunbecause the cop thinks I'm part
of the robbery.
Okay, so that's part of thatdecisional space, the rehearsal
phase.
The other thing is like whatright do I have to just walk
away?
Well, you don't.
You are your brother's keeper.
I've had thousands of 911 callsgo to dispatch, where I was

(41:43):
listening, where the dispatcherheard something like this hey,
this is probably nothing, butthere's a person out on route
six that's hitchhiking, and it'sdark and they're wearing all
dark clothes and it just didn'tfeel right.
Or I saw these two guys and onewas wearing a camouflage shirt
and one was wearing camouflagepants, and these guys certainly
weren't hunters.
Or I saw this kid and he wasn'trunning for the bus, he was

(42:04):
running from the bus.
Do you know how many calls comein with that partial
information?
And somewhere there's an expertdispatcher going hey, this is
different, this is somehowinteresting to me and sends a
car out or a copper hears thatand goes.
I wonder why those dogs arebarking, I wonder why that guy's
in that backyard.
I wonder why that person'sstill laying on that park bench.
So, brian, your level ofintrigue, your level of interest

(42:28):
, thinking that things areinteresting is the key to
situation awareness.
And the gift of time anddistance is that credit card I
carry with me to make sure I canbuy myself out of a shitty
situation.
You have to have both.
If you don't have both, thenall your decisions are made on
the X, and being on the bubbleis no fucking prize pig.
You get what I'm trying to say.

(42:49):
You want to have you want to beable to back off.
Look, when we see stuff likeBrazilian jujitsu, you able to
back off.
Look, when we see stuff likeBrazilian jujitsu, you're on a
bubble, You're on the X all thetime.
Nobody goes hey, drive me tothe scene.
I'm a Brazilian jujitsu expert.
I'll chase the guy down andthen do my shit.
You see what I'm trying to say.
It's literally calledself-defense for a reason.
So what we're is we're sort ofcountering that by saying the

(43:11):
more intrigue you put to lifeand to events left of the event,
the better you will be atdemystifying it when it comes
time to act or decide and you'retalking about switching from
that sort of defensive mindsetin a sense to an offensive one

(43:32):
is proactive.

Speaker 1 (43:33):
But here's my question about what you brought
up is like how, with with all ofthose perceptions and then
everything else in lifecompeting for my attention,
right, I, I, how do I attend tothe things that matter in a
sense, versus just just bringingin?

(43:54):
Okay, yeah, I noticed the trashon the ground over there and
the smell over here and maybe adog bark there, but like I can't
, as a human being, process allof that in in in my environment
at a time, or if I try to,that's the hyper vigilance
that's, you're just going to gonuts and constantly looking for
something.

Speaker 2 (44:11):
How do I flip that switch?

Speaker 1 (44:13):
Well, yeah, so, so, but, but I but it's a, it's a
mostly unconscious process, buthow can I become more aware of
that, you know, withoutoverwhelming myself and and
having too much competing for myattention?

Speaker 2 (44:28):
That's the perfect question.
But you're riding for a fall ifyou keep thinking down that
direction.
And what I mean by that is youhave to be on the offense
without being offensive, becauseif you're questioning things
all the time, sooner or latersomebody's going to punch you in
the eye or get pissed or throwyou out, or you're not going to
have a job, or your wife or yoursignificant other or your
husband's going to leave youbecause you're spending too much

(44:49):
time on it.
But the idea is this when yougo to turn the ignition in your
car, you understand that aseatbelt is going to save your
life.
You understand that cars werebuilt so good at one point that
when they hit, they killedeverybody in the other car
because the car didn't have acrumple zone.
Okay, you understand that thefaster I drive on inclement

(45:12):
conditions, the greater risk ofhydroplaning and crashing into
something.
So while we understand thatthat science is always at work,
we don't acknowledge it.
So all I'm saying is that inyour day-to-day, what are the
most like?
Look, you remember that BruceWillis in the fifth element, and
he looked through the eye holebefore he walked out into the
hallway and there was a guy withthe hat of the hallway on.
So when he looked out, itlooked just like the hallway,

(45:33):
but when he stepped out, it wasa guy wearing a hat of the
hallway and a guy robbed them.
Okay, so what am I trying tosay?
Well, simple physics will setyou free Before you walk into a
lit room from another lit room,shut off the light in the room
where you're at, because nowyou're not going to have a
backlight when you walk intothat room and your eyes have had
a few nanoseconds to adjustbefore you've got this new

(45:54):
lighting situation.
Okay, that's simple.
Have you walked around yourhouse to listen to where the
creaks are?
So, if you're laying at bed, doyou know what it sounds like
when somebody's walking up ordown your stairs Before you step
outside?
Do you look out the windowbefore you step outside?
Maybe because of the weather,not because somebody's going to
rob you in your neighborhood?
Brian, those are so low on thecalorie conscious level and

(46:17):
those are so easy for everybodyto do.
But if you just did that, if youjust increased a couple of
those things on being moreobservant and priming yourself,
for before I get into the car,I'm going to walk all the way
around the car.
What am I going to do for?
Look for leaks.
I'm going to make sure there'snobody in the back seat.
Make sure my trunk is securedso I don't have to secure that

(46:38):
son of a bitch when I'm on theroad.
You know how many people don'tfind out about burglaries until
they're confronting the burglar.
How the heck did that happen toyou?
So simple things, just like I'msaying fish don't know it's
raining.
So before I go fishing andsomebody goes, oh it's raining
outside, I don't give a damn.
That's how fish eat.
But you know, what I have toknow am that's how fish eat.

(46:58):
But you know what I have toknow what's the water
temperature?
What colors does that fish see?
Is a vibrating lure better thana whatever?
So if I'm doing that forfishing and you see those
Saturday morning shows aroundall the time, then why am I not
doing that before I walk into a7-Eleven?
Why do I not park for just aminute before I put it in?
Park and look, stand.
I guess that would be calling.
And look at the parking lot hey, why is that car backed in and

(47:20):
idling?
I haven't seen a cop in thisneighborhood in the last five
minutes.
Those kind of things will saveyour life.
But we know better, and we knowbetter is that chemical cocktail
that's in our brain saying themore we repeat behaviors and
nothing happens, the more likelythat becomes in the future.
And that's just not true.
Likely that becomes in thefuture, and that's just not true

(47:42):
.
The strength of the argument isgas stations are more dangerous
, driving above the speed limitis more dangerous.
Having too much to drink andstaying in a bar too long is too
dangerous, because you're goingto get punched or you're going
to get robbed or something elseis going to happen, and we know
that.
So science will set us free.
Math doesn't go well sometimes,you know, but we don't want to

(48:02):
listen to that because life ismore fun.
So my argument to you is it'smore fun screwing and drinking
and partying and listening to myloud music than it is being
situationally aware.
But a moderate level ofsituation awareness, and in
other words, operating in a zoneforever, is attainable.
So why wouldn't you want to doit?
But it's hard, it takescalories and, in other words,

(48:24):
operating in a zone forever isattainable.

Speaker 1 (48:25):
So why wouldn't you?

Speaker 2 (48:26):
want to do it, but but it's hard, it takes calories
.
So there's the argument forhumans.
You know, I'm telling you.

Speaker 1 (48:28):
This is better for you.
But why do?
Why do I want to do it?
Cause it's not doing it Well,and you know it's the, the, the,
the small, moderateimprovements over time is a far
better strategy than the let'sdo everything right now.

Speaker 2 (48:41):
Of course you're losing weight or quitting
smoking, or getting the righthusband and wife, or training
your kids, Right, but immediategratification is what we're all
about, Brian.

Speaker 1 (48:55):
And our loins and our limbic system are still in that
loop.
Right, that's a great point.
It's a double edged sword, in asense of how are, how we're
wired and how our unconsciousbrain works.
It's like it can be really,it's wired to be really, really
good for us.
However, it gets hijacked byour emotional state and things

(49:17):
get overwhelmed and then we fallback on survival or you know,
basically.
But you know, you're, you know,and this is why I brought up
the beginning.
It's both a literal and sort ofmetaphorical sense, with this
time distance, because whatyou're talking about is
literally like stop, take a look, you know, look into the window
of the 7-eleven before you walkin to see if there's.

(49:38):
You know someone in there witha gun to the, to the, to the
head of the 7-Eleven before youwalk in to see if there's
someone in there with a gun tothe head of the cash register
and it takes three seconds.
But you know, and that gives.
Well, that's.
The thing is that then we havea lot of other things in our
mind competing for our attentionand we're distracted, and now
we get overwhelmed.

Speaker 2 (49:55):
But what's more important than our own survival.
You see, the problem is that welive in an environment that's
not as dangerous as we're makingit out, and so there's less
consequences, far lessconsequences than early man.
So, therefore, we've lulledourself into the fact that what
are the chances there's going tobe a robbery at the 7-Eleven
that I'm going to today?
Well, there's a fucking deadguy in the cemetery that's

(50:17):
saying the same thing, samething.

Speaker 1 (50:18):
Yeah, it's a balance, isn't it?
It is, and so you're basicallyso kind of what you're saying is
like we don't exercise, wedon't, we aren't forced to use,
we aren't forced to use the giftof time it is, we don't
exercise as much anymore, simplybecause it's like a.
I mean more people, more peopledie today from overeating than
under eating, right?
I mean we're it's just adifferent.
I mean more people die todayfrom overeating than undereating

(50:39):
, right?
I mean it's just a differentworld than what we're wired for.
And so, taking like we now haveto sort of learn this skill set
, but it has to be framed withinsome context that I can use it
in.

Speaker 2 (50:54):
So let me throw this at you, because you have a
daughter that's right in the agerange of these incidents.
So I've been on a number ofincidents too many the, the
asshole range yeah, yeah.
No, I'm not saying that.
I'm talking about the insurgentuh terrorist range, where she's
learning enough about the carthat it ain't an irish car bomb
and and the idea is that whathappens is she's going to go to

(51:16):
a party and it's going to be abirthday party and you're going
to relax because she makes gooddecisions and you know the other
family and everything else.
But I've been on the other endof that, where I have to go and
take the report on.
Well, when was the last timeyou saw her?

Speaker 1 (51:30):
And is it a?

Speaker 2 (51:30):
runaway or was she kidnapped and did this happen
where a predator watched thisand knew and conducted
surveillance?
So, Brian, if you want to avoidthose things that you never see
because you're not in the innerloop, you got to read more, you
got to study more, you got tolook around more.
There was a caper I don't knowif I'm saying these things, if
the places are even still aroundbut it was a homicide at the

(51:52):
Memphis Lounge and I rememberthat dog was on the scene and
was giving me updates from theinformation that were going on,
and the idea was that it wasvery interesting to me that this
person walked in.
They were still doing karaokenight.
I need you to understand that.
And Shell was like hey, can youshut off the music and turn up
the house lights on a homicideat a packed bar.
So what does that tell you?
Right away, However, thatperson shot that other person in

(52:16):
there.
It was very, very discreet.
Why?
Because people would havescreamed, they would have ran
outside, the house lights wouldalready be on, nobody would
still be singing karaoke.
So this is me processing it andI've got another expert that's
on the scene telling me about it.
So I'm at another bar and I seea guy get out of the sled and
he's walking up to the front ofthe bar and he's got both hands
jammed down in the front of hispockets and one of his pockets

(52:36):
is smoking and I go well, that'sinteresting.
And then all of a sudden I'mgoing well, why would this guy's
pocket be smoking?
Well, if he fired the hand gumfrom inside the pocket and I
rolled the guy up and it ends upbeing the right guy.
Now somebody else listeningright now is going oh, you're
just lucky, Right place, righttime.
Nope, going on, and guess whatHistorical perspective.

(53:01):
I was able to use my situationawareness to link that to other
events that it may be importantto.
You know who didn't do that?
Franz Ferdinand, and he's dead.
So the idea, Brian, isabsolutely everything is on
transmit, but if I don't stickmy toe in the pool water, I'm
going to get frozen when I jumpin.
I have to look before I leap, Ihave to consider, I have to
understand that priming occurs.
Even though I'm an expert, Iget primed and I'd sit down for

(53:24):
breakfast and I leave myflashlight and PR24 and
everything else in my scout car.
You see what I'm trying to sayEven the best experts in the
world, we relax too soon in anenvironment.
And I'm not talking about beinggeeked constantly, I'm talking
about looking at those things.
You know one of those familieswhere that girl was missing.
The family had no DNA evidenceso we couldn't help use that.

(53:46):
The family shared a toothbrush,they shared the comb and the
brush in the bathroom.
And you're thinking, well,that's the worst case scenario
that I got to be doing DNA tomatch my daughter's body out of
all the bodies in the morgueyeah, match my daughter's body
out of all the bodies in themorgue yeah.
But if you work far enough leftto bang Brian in almost every
one of those incidents, it'spreventable.
That's why we teach HPPRNA.
We teach you to be a harderperson to capture, a harder

(54:10):
person to kill, to make you moreresilient over time.
And guess what the beauty ofour system is?
The more you do it, the betteryou get.

Speaker 1 (54:19):
Yeah, and then that's our process for gaining time
and distance in a very, you know, methodical, uh way.
That is is process oriented,that allows you to repeatable to
sense making problem solve yeah, of course, and and, like you
said, in in in any, in anycircumstance.
so my, my, my thing is is is youknow what are those and you

(54:43):
you're, you're talking about it,but, like the, you know those
things that I do on a day or, oryou can do on a daily basis,
and you know it really is takingthat second to have that, that,
that foresight of, well, what'smy role, where you know what's
my goal here, where, where do Iwant this to go?
Can I take a second, a minute,an hour, whatever is necessary

(55:06):
to plan something out?
And, and that is not a lot ofpeople think that, well, you
can't take the time you got tomake a decision right now.
And almost my my thing is yourarely ever do right now, like
you, what situation in lifewhere you couldn't take an extra
second?
I know that's what we.
We jam on that, we jam on thatgas pedal I love it and then go

(55:33):
yeah, it's

Speaker 2 (55:33):
like the, the, the, yeah yeah, let me give you
another example.
You remember we were workingwith some of the best trained
DEA operatives ever, ever, andthere was some Bortec and
Borestar people that weresmattered into that training and
we were out in the middle, itwas 120 degrees in the shade and
we were on Conexes with binosand we were watching and the one
guy ran from the ambush that wewere setting up and went around

(55:56):
a building, ran from the ambushthat we were setting up and
went around a building and whatwe taught those folks is to time
it.
How long did it take them toget from here to here?
How long did it take them toget from here to here?
So what's a likely amount oftime that they're going to spend
behind that building?
And then they could figure outwhere that person was likely to
come out and if the personditched some goods behind it,
why?
Because guess what?
They took longer behind thatbuilding than they did between

(56:19):
these other things.
And those guys had that epiphanymoment.
You remember the female and themale agent sitting up there
going, holy shit, never thoughtof that.
So you know what?
That's better than having a dogto go back and find that gun.
It's better that when thatperson spills out into a crowd,
figuring out that, wait a minute, that person came out at the
right time, but they're wearinga yellow shirt rather than a red
.
Go back there and see ifthere's a red shirt.

(56:41):
The idea is that it's a game,brian.
It's like it's like beingSherlock Holmes, you know, and
and and trying to do stuffwithout the Calabash pipe, and
it's fun.
So why wouldn't you want tohave fun every single day?
What's this person telling me?
What's his clothing?
Telling me?
What's a lint in his pocket?
What's the garbage in their car?
What about where they park?
What about if the car isrunning?

(57:01):
All of those things matter, andwe just have created a system
that's much easier for you toquickly address those.
It's no longer like Plinko, andsitting there you know, with
your your, your scratching yourhead.
Now you're looking at asituation and going this is what
I think is happening.
For this to continue happening,the next thing I'm going to see
, sense, smell or taste is goingto be this and if I see that,

(57:23):
then I know what's happening andI can avoid it.
That's magic, and and unlessyou've been to a course and seen
it and unless you've tried iton your own, you won't
understand how cool it is andwhat I mean about fishing.
I keep going back to thefishing metaphor.
There were guys in Iraq andAfghanistan who were trying to
equal my success and you knowwhat they could do.
They could find a V-bit, theycould find a body bomber, but

(57:44):
you know what they couldn't do.
They couldn't pass thatknowledge on to you.
And the difference, the legacythat we've made, brian, is we
can transfer these skills so youcan go out in real time and use
them, no matter where you workand no matter what the
environment is, and that'spretty cool.

Speaker 1 (58:00):
Yeah, so that's kind of a lot on time and distance
and what we mean by thecognitive edge and maybe some
simple exercises to do, and theyaren't, you know.
It's like people go, yeah, okay, I get it, and this seems, you
know, self-evident, or you know,it seems you know, I got it,

(58:22):
but it, unless you're doing somesort of deliberate practice
with it, it's not going to besomething that you do all the
time.

Speaker 2 (58:29):
And you're not going to get better at it.
Right, right, right.

Speaker 1 (58:33):
Right, right, all right.
Well, I don't know anythingelse we need to cover.
Yeah, it's an easy episode.
It's kind of a lot about timeand distance.

Speaker 2 (58:40):
You should give a warning before these episodes.
Take two tiles.

Speaker 1 (58:43):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (58:43):
You know what I'm saying and sit back in the easy
chair Because, basically, whatthis was is an intro to welcome
to the gift of time and distance.
So we need to go deeper, butyou know how we go deeper.

Speaker 1 (58:56):
Folks.
You got to write your questions, feedback, yeah, yeah, I agree
that that's exactly.
It is yeah to to reach out, andthen obviously we always have
more on on patreon and give outexamples and stuff on there.
But but, yeah, okay, that was,that was good.
I kind of wanted to just coverthat with everyone and and talk
about, you know, define what wemean by time and distance and

(59:16):
just how big of a concept itreally is and so, but how?
But also then how you can sortof integrate that onto your, the
daily things that you do.
You know, then, iteratively,over time, you will do it
unconsciously, basically.
At that point, if you get aprep, yeah, you'll, you'll,
you'll, and that's the point isto get it to the point where
you're doing it withoutrealizing you're doing it Right,

(59:37):
and now they are they, they,they definitely.
we all know that habits are hardto break, so why don't you make
it a good habit, All right?
Well, yeah, Appreciate everyonefor tuning in again.
Always reach out to us.
If you have any questions.
You can shoot us an email orhop on Patreon and ask.
But thanks everyone for tuningin and don't forget that
training changes behavior.