March 17, 2025 • 61 mins
We delve deep into the reality of battling depression, challenging the stereotypes and exploring practical approaches for navigating mental health struggles.
• Depression is an invisible force that can affect anyone regardless of external success or appearance
• First step to healing is recognizing and admitting you're struggling
• Treatment requires multiple approaches—medication, therapy, exercise, meditation
• Recovery isn't linear—setbacks happen and that's normal
• Building a "Strong Enough List" can help restore confidence during difficult times
• Finding activities that require full presence (like painting or horseback riding) helps manage depression
• Healing from trauma doesn't mean it disappears, but learning better ways to respond to triggers
• The difference between making decisions from your head versus your heart
If you're struggling with depression, make a commitment today to take one small step. Whether it's researching therapists, starting a daily walk, or reaching out to a friend - every positive action creates momentum toward healing.
Make sure to check out Jason on IG @drjasonpiccolo
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:16):
hey, welcome back to protectors podcast.
My good friend and fellowpodcaster and fellow court tv
guest expert, uh, claudia King,is back on the show, claudia,
welcome.
Speaker 2 (00:29):
Jason, it is amazing to be here and we have gotten
really close in the last year orso and it has been awesome.
I think you are an amazing guyand so I'm stoked to chat with
you a little bit today in a waywhere everybody else can hear us
, because you know we do a lotof private chatting.
But this will be great.
Speaker 1 (00:49):
We are always chatting, and that is a great
thing about having good friends,Cause sometimes you just need
those, those texts, you needthose, you need people in your
corner.
One thing right before I recordis it just it hit me because I
was telling you that story aboutone of my friends the other day
said you don't look like youhad depression.
And it's so crazy because Iremember and her, she's going to
(01:13):
come back and she's going tocome on a show with me as well,
and and we're going to talkabout depression.
But I want to tell people likeyou can't judge a book by its
cover.
I've, I've been battling andit's a battle.
You know.
Some days are a lot better thanothers and some days are rough.
There's, there's ways to remedyit and I think I'm learning
(01:34):
them.
But depression, you can't judgeanybody, and that's the same
thing with you is like you can'tjudge you by what you see on TV
.
You have these smiley, happyfaces.
You have the social media, youhave this, you have that, but
people are still struggling.
They're struggling with it, andso many people that we see, our
(01:58):
friends included.
We never know.
We never know, and I do want tocaveat that just because you
have depression does not meanyou are suicidal.
It means like you're justfighting against this thing that
people don't understand, and Idon't think a lot of people do
understand it.
Speaker 2 (02:12):
No, I think you're right, and to me it feels like
this invisible force that keepsyou from being able to will
yourself to do things.
And what I mean by that is whenI'm really in it, I can't get
out of bed.
I want to get out of bed.
There's nothing physicallykeeping me from getting out of
(02:35):
bed, but my brain just can't getthere and I really isolate
myself and I really isolatemyself.
So I'm not suicidal, as yousaid.
You know, I just can't makethose chemicals in my brain work
the way that I want them to.
And I'll be the one to say Iused to judge people and think
(02:57):
that medication for depressionor anxiety was silly and that
you know we can.
We can will ourselves to doanything.
And then God said oh, is thatwhat you think?
Well, let me really show you,and now I understand it.
It literally is is a chemicalimbalance in our brains that
make these things happen, andthere are ways to make it better
(03:20):
.
But admitting it kind of is thefirst step, because until you
reach out and get help, you'regoing to be battling that
invisible force all by yourselfand you can't do that.
Speaker 1 (03:33):
It's, it's a, it's a battle.
It is like, and when you knowpeople don't realize when you go
into battle you have to bringeverything, you have to fight
with everything you have To me,just cause my, my life has
transitioned so much over thepast few months.
I mean, it's been going on fora very long time but the final
(03:53):
transition into this new part ofmy life, you know, coming out
of a very, very long thing, I'llleave it at that you know, a
30-year thing and it's andsomething new is starting.
I mean, and it's so weird, likeyou think you're ready to take
(04:13):
that next step, you think you'reready and then all of a sudden
it hits you like a brick, likeWhoa, this is your new reality,
this is your new life, this isthe new you, this is the old
Jason is completely gone.
And then that depression kindof it seeps in.
And if you don't like recognizeit right away, there could be,
(04:34):
there could be those days whenyou're stuck in bed.
I've been, I've been on thislike kick where and it's not
even a kick anymore, it had tobe a lifestyle change where,
like I've got to work and dosomething every day to move my
body, whether it's a gym,walking, both, biking, anything
to keep my body moving, cause mybody needs it needs that.
I've been slacking a lot, butI've been doing transidential
(04:57):
meditation.
I need to not do it just once aday, I need to do it twice a
day, cause I need that.
I need a new therapist.
So I'm recognizing, as we'retalking here, the things that I
need to have done in order tokeep going.
My therapist and I hit a wallwhere really she was able to get
me to this point in my lifewhere I'm at now, but now I need
someone else to work on this.
(05:19):
My next battle is to completelywork on the depression.
I don't want these dark days.
Today is to completely work onthe depression.
I don't want these dark days.
Today was almost one of them.
I got up and I had some newsand I was like, huh, it hit me a
little bit different and then Iwas like I got to get out of
bed and I got to move.
I got to move and I got to getto the gym.
I got to look at the positivesand you could have the best life
(05:41):
in the world.
I mean, you can.
I have two incredibly amazingchildren that bring me so much
joy in life.
And even if you have them, it'sstill the depression hits you.
Speaker 2 (05:54):
Yeah, it hits everybody or it can hit
everybody, and it doesn't matterwhat you have or who's in your
life, or how much money you haveor where you travel.
It doesn't discriminate in thatregard.
And I love what you saidearlier about taking kind of all
your tools into battle, becauseI've always said, you know, if
(06:17):
there's ever a fight to thedeath, I'm going to win.
You know, that was kind of mymantra as a police officer,
because you got to be ready forthat at any time.
And this is the same thing Ifthis is a fight to the death,
I'm going to win.
I will beat depression, I willbeat anxiety, I will take all
the tools into that battle withme and it will not win.
(06:39):
And that's the attitude thatyou have to have.
I do want to say those dark daysmay still hit, and that's okay.
Um, because it's.
It's not a linear path, youknow it's it.
There can be ups and downs,hills and valleys, and that's
okay, that's part of our journey.
(07:00):
And we have to not beatourselves up when that happens
and think well, I had a bad day,so I guess I'm not, I don't
have depression kicked.
You're going to have those baddays and that's all right.
Speaker 1 (07:15):
You know, I'm glad you said that, because setbacks
happen all the time and it'sjust being able to.
I always call it the foothold.
You need to get a foothold outof it and whether that
depression is this huge mountainthat you have to get out of,
you have to get out of it.
I used to call my depression.
Like everybody has differentfeelings, but mine was always
(07:35):
like I have this like sponge inmy head and you know, when you,
when you clean your your dishesand you have a clean sponge,
it's like, ah, it's clean, youcan clean everything.
But mine was always like thisdark sponge, filled with just
darkness that I couldn't.
I couldn't.
It's in my head and if I couldjust get rid of that sponge out
of my head, all the negativitywould be gone.
(07:57):
And now I'm realizing that Ineed the depression to be
considered a battle.
It's like a constant warfare Inorder to get out of the sponge.
I need to take that step and Ireally hope this kind of
resonates with the audience,because a lot of the people we
know are fighting it and itmight not be massive depression.
It might not be depressionwhere you need medication.
(08:19):
You might just need to talk topeople.
You might need to vent.
You might need to vent, youmight need to just get away from
it, but you have to recognizeit first.
I think that is the first step.
Speaker 2 (08:33):
It definitely is, and it's hard, especially for
people like us who have verystrong exteriors and have been
in careers that requireindependence and assertiveness
and dominance.
In some regard, it's hard toadmit that there's something
that we can't even see, that istrying to beat us down and, on
(08:56):
some days, is a littlesuccessful.
So admitting it really is thefirst step and it is the most
difficult step, in my opinion aswell.
Speaker 1 (09:07):
Once you admit it, that's when the work begins.
That is like sit, listen, I'm52 years old, I've, I'm done,
I'm done letting this control mylife.
I'm done letting a lot ofthings control my life.
And now you have to really sitdown and think about it, make a
plan and execute.
(09:28):
I mean, a lot of us are a lotof people who listen to this
have been in the military,they've been in law enforcement,
they've been in any job whereyou had to make a decision.
And the decision is you have tolook at it as like, okay, well,
I could change my diet and thatcan help one part of it, but
then it's the whole picture.
It's like, okay, I could changemy diet and that can help one
part of it, but then it's thewhole picture.
It's like, okay, I could changemy diet, I could limit or get
rid of alcohol, and then I couldwork out, I could walk, I could
(09:52):
move my body, I could lift.
And then it's like surroundyourself by positivity and also
find a therapist.
And if you don't find, you know, one of my friends is going
through something right now,horrible, horrible thing going
on in her life a differentfriend and they're.
(10:16):
They're like hey, I you knowI'm trying to find a therapist
to talk to.
Speaker 2 (10:27):
But the one I went to I didn't like it takes.
It may take you four or fivedifferent people to get an idea
of who you want to talk to.
I have said many times on mypodcast it's okay to date your
therapist, and I don't meanliterally like go out on a date
with them, but what I mean isit's okay to try out different
people until you find the onethat you click with, because you
may not click with that firstperson, just like dating.
And I think a lot of people usethat as an excuse.
You know they are hesitant tosee somebody in the first place.
(10:51):
So they go see one therapist.
It doesn't work out and theysay see, it's not my fault, I
tried, but that therapist didn'twork.
So now I'm not trying any otherones.
And I applaud you for saying youneed a new therapist.
So it wasn't even that yourtherapist didn't work.
You said she got you to thepoint where you are, but there's
(11:15):
more to conquer and you needsomebody new.
Because, again, a lot of peoplein that position would say well
, she got me this far and that'sgood enough.
And I applaud you forrecognizing that that's not good
enough and you need to searchfor the right person for this
(11:35):
next chapter.
Speaker 1 (11:42):
I remember, geez, probably a couple of decades ago
, going to marriage counseling,and this happens to so many
people I know that go tomarriage counseling is, they go
to one and it doesn't, you don'tclick.
You don't click as a couplegoing to it and it just doesn't
work.
And then you just say you knowwhat, I think we're done, I
don't need to go to counseling,We'll figure it out on our own.
And you know, that's one of thethings is you always wonder
(12:04):
you're like huh, I wonder if youstick it out, if you could have
found the right counselor.
But at the end of the day youknow that's one of the topics I
want to get into is today islike maybe that person you're
with trying to get marriagecounseling with, isn't the right
one.
That's going to defeat yoursoul.
Speaker 2 (12:22):
Absolutely Date your therapist Again?
Not really.
But try out different peoplebecause, just like friends,
other relationships, we don'tclick with everybody.
So why would you just assumethat you could click with this
first therapist and they'regoing to be the end, all be all
and the perfect person to helpyou?
It's great if that's what youfind I was lucky enough to have
(12:46):
that but that's not always thecase and I do think people use
that as an excuse.
They're scared anyway andtherapy is scary.
You have to get reallyvulnerable and really raw if you
want to get better.
Now, if you just want to glossover things, you can do that,
(13:08):
but what's the point?
You know, if you're going toput the time and effort and
money into it, then you got todo it right.
And that is hard and that isscary because you got to let it
all out there and you have tobear the things that are the
deepest and darkest thingsinside of you and the scariest
(13:28):
to reveal.
But that's what you have toreveal to those people to get
better and that's why it is soimportant that you find the
right one.
Speaker 1 (13:38):
When you find the right one, don't you, like you
said, you can pick apart whythey're, why they are bad for
you, why this is not a good,good person to go and see and
talk to, and then you startmaking excuses.
So when you recognize that,like, for this sense, we're
going to and we're going to getinto other topics today, today.
But when you recognize that youhave something wrong with you,
(14:00):
or there is something wrong withyou because I don't want it to
be, like, oh my gosh, I'm broken, I'll never get over this.
But when you recognize that youcan't keep making excuses, you
have to, like, make a likededicated plan.
Like today, as soon as we getoff of here, I need to like, I
need to research, I need to finda new therapist.
I haven't put it off for a week.
(14:20):
I've made excuses about that,saying, well, I don't have time,
I don't do this.
Everything else is kind ofshifting into place.
But this is something else.
It's like stop making excusesfor trying to heal yourself,
because once you start healingyour mind, everything else falls
into place.
Once you start seeing apositive light and you start
(14:41):
moving and you start doingthings, then everything else
your relationships will getbetter.
You will get better.
You'll want to move your body,you'll want to do things.
You want to see life with likesunlight, you know.
Think about it Like the cloudydays really are cloudy days and
like it's just once you startseeing it then you really do
burst through it.
(15:01):
I know it's cliche, but it'strue.
Speaker 2 (15:02):
Once you start seeing it, then you really do burst
through it, I know it's cliche,but it's true, it is true and
you know that's what they say.
Things are cliche orstereotypes, because ultimately
they are true and you're totallyright.
You got to stop making excusesand I think a lot of people
today like to live in victimhoodand people might get mad at me
(15:25):
saying that, but sometimes thetruth hurts is it's easier to
sit in that place where we havebeen wronged or our brain isn't
working correctly and we'redepressed or something else bad
happened to us.
It's easier sometimes to sit inthat space of victimhood and
(15:48):
gather that attention and thepity and the sorrow, and so a
lot of people sit there, I think, and they don't look inward and
do the hard work.
And that's what I think a lotof people struggle with is they
don't want to do the hard work.
It's easier to sit in the spacethey're in and say poor,
(16:10):
pitiful me, then go out and dothe hard stuff.
Speaker 1 (16:15):
I am so glad that you brought that up, because we all
know people who are habitualvictims and it's horrible.
You have to do the work, listen.
The reason I say that isbecause I've been there myself.
I've been.
Oh my gosh, how many times havepeople said woe is me.
(16:37):
Oh, you're so, woe is me.
How many people ignore youbecause you become the victim
and that's all you talk about isbeing a victim.
It and, believe me, some peopleare are real victims, but we're
.
We're not talking about likethat.
We're not talking about likesomeone who, like, completely
like their life, got gutted andripped out by some violent,
(17:00):
horrific thing or anything.
We're talking about, yeah,victimhood.
Speaker 2 (17:06):
Yeah, and well, here's the thing, too, on the
real victims is, you're notresponsible for what happened to
you, but you're responsible forhealing yourself and moving
forward.
Things happen to all of us andsome are more horrific than
(17:26):
others.
And I said to you earlier,before we started recording you
know, if people had been througha third of what I'd been
through, a lot of them would becrying in the corner.
But I did the work.
You know I'm not responsiblefor those things that happened
to me, but once they happened,it became my responsibility to
(17:47):
heal myself.
So I think, yes, there are realvictims out there, but once
that happens, they still have totake the necessary steps to get
better and to move forward youhave to recognize it, though you
.
Speaker 1 (18:04):
You have to recognize that you are you.
Something bad happened to you.
It could be the the yourrelationships broke up.
You may have felt like, um, thelife hasn't been fair to you
and that everybody else has itbetter than you and you and you
and you're like well, I can'tcrawl out of this hole.
(18:25):
So then you just keep lettingeverything.
You're in this hole and it'slike someone above you is like
just shoveling dirt into it andyou don't want to climb out.
But someone offers you a ladderto climb out right away.
But you're like I don't know,it doesn't look good and that
ladder is.
Every rung of that ladder is adecision you're making to make
(18:47):
yourself better.
So maybe that's like okay, I am, life is killing me right now.
But if I take that first step,I'm going to and that first step
could be okay this morning I amgoing to eat better, I'm going
to do something, cause whenyou're eating better and stuff
like that, your body starts tofeel better.
Your body feels better, yourmind feels better.
(19:07):
After that, the next rung isI'm going to go for a walk
around the block.
Okay, boom, that's something, avictory.
Boom, I always say that victorything.
The third one is like, okay, Iknow things aren't that good
right now, I need to talk tosomeone.
So you get therapy and therapy.
Or you get a hold of a friendwho you could talk to, but not
bitch and not vent.
But you get hold of that friendand say, okay, well, how do I,
(19:28):
how do I help myself out of this?
Fourth is you just you.
You plan, you, you look forthose ways that you could find
the victories that aren't thattrauma, that aren't that thing
that's holding you back, and Ishouldn't say trauma, but that
thing that's holding you backthat's making you the victim and
keep rising up that damn ladderbecause there's always going to
(19:49):
be shit, there's always goingto be shit shoveled at you and
you know that's what it reallyis.
It's not dirt, it's just peopleare just going to keep trying
to put you down unless you pullyourself up.
Speaker 2 (20:00):
You know, the other thing too is sometimes we have
people in our lives that likewhere we're at.
They like us in that hole, theylike us having the dirt
shoveled upon us, because thatallows them to maybe be our
savior or to be that one friendthat will always be there to
(20:24):
listen.
So you got to make sure toevaluate the people around you
because a lot of times, as we doget better, some people don't
like that and they're againstthat and they start to battle.
Well, do you really need to gowalk today, Jason?
You don't really need to findthat new therapist.
I think you're fine.
(20:44):
So you got to battle that ontop of everything else to get
out of the hole.
So it's important to really bemindful that when you're making
positive steps, sometimes peopleare going to rally against that
, and that's okay.
But you got to keep going upthat ladder.
Speaker 1 (21:05):
I am glad you brought that up, because that's one
thing I wanted to talk to youabout today too, was
relationships and finding.
So you're on this ladder and alot of us out there we're.
We're in different situationsin our life where we may not
have uh partners, we may just bealone.
We may, you know, just havecome off relationships or or
maybe we had relationships inthe past that just didn't work
(21:27):
out.
And now you're, you're like you, for instance, you have a
partner that's going to identifyyour traumas, that's going to
identify what's holding you back, and it's going to identify
like when you're having a roughday.
And I believe me, I'm not arelationship coach, because God
knows I'm not good at that stuff, but but now I'm, I'm learning
(21:50):
about all these things.
You know, I'm reading this damnbook attached, um, all these
other things that try toidentify my, my styles and stuff
, and that with you is you foundsomeone, someone's going to
identify, that someone's likeyears later you're still
enjoying life with.
Speaker 2 (22:08):
Yeah, and that's what it boils down to.
The one piece of relationshipadvice that I will give all day
long is find somebody that youlike and that you enjoy doing
things with.
Because my husband and I havebeen together it'll be 20 years
(22:28):
this December and there aretimes that we have done things
to one another that maybeweren't the best, and you're
annoyed with that person andyou're like gosh, do I even love
them anymore?
I'm not sure.
But if you like them, that iswhat will carry you through,
because in the times when I wasangry or felt rejected or
(22:54):
whatever the case may have been,I still wanted to be around him
because I liked him, and so Ithink that really is the key is
to find somebody that you like.
And then I also want to say youknow, you said sometimes people
are alone, we don't have anybody, and I know that a lot of
(23:16):
people you know talk about thenegativity of social media and
other things like that, but theone thing that that has given us
is the ability to connect withpeople that aren't right next
door.
So you have the ability andreally no excuses to not have
somebody in your corner.
(23:37):
They might not be in yourcorner, literally right beside
you, but you can find people whoare a text message or a phone
call away.
And that's the beauty of socialmedia and texting and the
phones that we have now isyou're not limited to the four
(23:57):
square miles around you, youhave the whole world.
So there really is no excuse tonot find somebody that you can
support and who will support you.
Speaker 1 (24:08):
And by support you mean support, not commiserate.
Speaker 2 (24:11):
Correct.
Speaker 1 (24:13):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (24:13):
Commiserating is easy , but, yes, actually support,
and we need people in our livesthat will call us on our
bullshit.
That matters because now thatyou said I've been putting off
finding a new therapist and nowI've got to do it, I'm going to
hold you accountable and I'mgoing to be texting you later
(24:34):
and saying did you do that?
What steps did you take todayto make that happen?
So, yes, sometimes it's hard tohear, but you need the friends
in your life who will be honestwith you and who will call you
and say hey, Jason, that'sbullshit.
Like, let's step back and let'sreally evaluate what's going on
(24:58):
.
Speaker 1 (25:00):
The accountability is like.
I think that is key tofriendship.
Speaker 2 (25:04):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (25:05):
It's so key Like, real like and be brutally honest
.
Because, believe me, I'mbrutally honest with friends now
.
I mean, and they might not likeit, but believe me, if you tell
me that you want to fix yourbody and you need to work out,
but then the next day you'resaying, oh man, you know, I
(25:25):
don't really feel like it.
Or if we go out to dinner orsomething like that, or lunch,
and you're like, huh, I thinkI'm going to have that big juicy
burger that's 3000 calories,I'm like, well, you don't want
to tell, it said you wanted to.
It's just being brutally honestand I think that's the best
part of like.
Real friendship is to that.
Today you told me that you likeyou lost 40 pounds and I was
like I didn't.
(25:46):
You know, that's the thing aboutsocial media is you really
can't recognize, because a lotof us take pictures with good
angles right and um, and I'm I'mvery I'm excited for you
because there are setbacks and,like you, had injuries and this
and that, but tell us about that.
That's one thing I want tolearn about.
How did this all like?
Go back, because me, me, I'm inthis, I'm in this transition
(26:07):
period now too, where I want to,I've got another.
I'm actually only got like 25more pounds to go and I'm good.
Speaker 2 (26:14):
Which I don't see, but I believe you, um, cause
you've been crushing it as well.
For me, um, I have alwaysstruggled with body dysmorphia.
So, no matter what I look like,I think I'm fat.
But I really was.
Maybe I wasn't fat.
I mean I was 40 pounds morethan I am now, so I was heavier
(26:36):
and it came about a because Iwas injured.
I had a back injury that Iliterally didn't see the
downstairs of my own house forat least three months because I
could not walk up and down thestairs.
So that definitely affected me,and then you sort of get into
comfort eating.
(26:56):
But I also was on somemedication that apparently was
affecting my ability to loseweight, apparently was affecting
my ability to lose weight.
And the only way that I wasable to figure that out was by
being open and honest with mydoctor and saying Sammy,
something's going on, I don'tknow what to do.
And we started evaluatingmedications and she says, well,
(27:22):
this is a downer, this is adowner, this is a down.
You know, like what are wedoing here and changing some
things up?
So I still have the regulationthat I need for depression and
anxiety and PTSD, but it helpedme to lose that weight and I
(27:42):
started eating better.
So I do eat cereal almost everynight.
I heard somebody recently saycereal goes in a different
stomach.
Maybe that's true, I don't know.
But I started eating better, Istarted moving, like you said,
and the weight literally juststarted to come off.
I didn't do anything special.
(28:03):
I know people hate to hear that.
Just started to come off.
I didn't do anything special.
I know people hate to hear that, but I didn't do anything
special.
I just feed myself when I want.
I try to eat good things.
I don't restrict myself.
I'm going to have that beer,but to all that point, I still
feel fat.
Point, I still feel fat.
(28:29):
When I look at myself in themirror, I feel fat.
And I was packing last night fora cruise and I held up these
shorts that are mine and Ilooked at them and I'm like who
thought I could fit in these?
Like this is ridiculous.
And I held them up to Lee and Isaid what is this?
And he was like that's whatsize you are.
Put them on.
And I put them on and they didfit.
(28:52):
But that's the struggle that Ideal with.
So again, that goes back tohaving that person who will call
balls and strikes to say you'renot fat, you don't look like
that.
I understand that's what yousee, but I'm going to be honest
with you.
And so that's where that comesin again, that honesty and that
(29:15):
brutal honesty, as you say.
Now I'm not saying, if I gainedfive pounds for him to shuffle
on over and say, hey, tubby, layoff the ice cream, but you know
that person who's going to bereal with you.
Speaker 1 (29:31):
I I posted this thing on YouTube today and it was
like I took my kids to thedentist this morning and my
daughter looks at me and shegoes you look smaller, and not
like muscularly smaller, butlike and you know what I mean by
smaller.
She's like my big gut.
Like it doesn't.
(29:51):
It's not there, like you know,and that was the most like.
It's still.
It's been four hours now andI'm still thinking about it,
cause I'm like someone that Inever expected to be like like
that.
You know you expect people that, like friends and stuff, say
hey, bro, you're killing it orthis or that, or, but when your
(30:12):
daughter you know, your 14 yearold daughter looks at you and
says that it, it really hit meand it was a victory for me, and
I talk about these littlevictories every day.
It's it's like the reason I amso consistent and so dedicated
to this right now is to be thebest dad that I possibly can.
(30:33):
I don't want relationships.
I don't want anything except tobe the best dad.
I want my kids to look at meand go wow, he's got it going on
.
You know he has got it going on.
Wow, he's got it going on, hehas got it going on and I want
them to look up to me, becausethere's a reality about being 52
and having almost 15 and almost17-year-old.
(30:55):
They didn't see me when I wasSpecial Agent Piccolo on the
street or Infantry CaptainPiccolo, they see me as the dad.
So now I'm at this point whereI'm like okay, I want them to
see me as the best dad that Ican be, and that's just not
(31:16):
being physical, it's being thereto support them, it's being
there for the games and beingthere to pick them up and being
there to talk to them whenthey're going through some
battles, because we know teensgo through battles too um, so
it's just different.
So that's why that like hurtyou saying that like really just
, I don't know, it's hard toexplain you know.
Speaker 2 (31:40):
What else that says to me, though, is that she's
watching, so she is seeing daddo those positive things, and
what changes are occurring.
So, just in that regard, you'restill making that positive
impression on your kids.
And who else is watching?
(32:02):
You know, you're on socialmedia, you're, you're on TV.
You got a lot going on in allkinds of good things.
So who's watching you and whoelse is going to be positively
affected by the things thatyou're doing?
That's big.
Speaker 1 (32:20):
Well, that's like you and I.
The reason we do 90% of thethings we do is because lessons
learned.
You've had trauma in your pastand you know what.
I was going to get into ittoday, but I don't want to.
I don't because you've talkedabout it in the past and
everybody look up Claudia.
She's had some horrific thingsin her past Horrific.
But I think today is going tobe about like, okay, you're out
(32:45):
of that hole.
You're literally out of thathole and the things that keep
you out of that hole areeverything that you're doing.
That includes being involvedwith other people, coaching
other people and helping people.
Trauma happens for a reason.
It's horrible when it happens,I mean it's horrific.
(33:06):
But if you get to this pointwhere you could help other
people out, it's part of yourhealing.
So I know you've been coachingpeople for a while.
Let's talk about that.
Speaker 2 (33:18):
Yeah, and that's why I started doing it.
I don't know if you'rereligious, but I am, and for me
I do believe that everythinghappens for a reason, and I
believe that God put me in someof the trauma that I went
through for a couple reasons.
One was to be able to speak upand get people out of positions
(33:43):
so they wouldn't hurt otherpeople.
But then the other reason is tohave that strength to help
others, and I love that.
So I have some uncanny abilitythat I can sit with somebody for
about an hour asking some toughquestions and I can figure out
(34:04):
way back when what made you whoyou are today, what event kind
of surrounds some of the thingsthat you do.
You know 30, 40, 50 years laterin your life, and then we start
to address that.
So my coaching is not easy,sometimes it's not fun, but it's
(34:29):
to put people back in astronger and more beautiful way
than they were before.
Are you familiar with Kintsugi,the Japanese art?
Speaker 1 (34:40):
No.
Speaker 2 (34:41):
So they have this art called Kintsugi and it's where
a bowl or a cup will get brokenand they'll put it back together
and they use this very specificgold glue and they believe that
when they put it back togetherit's stronger and more beautiful
than it was before it wasbroken.
(35:02):
And I believe that's us, and Ibelieve everybody has that
capability.
So everybody that I can helpput back together and be
stronger and more beautiful,then that's what I'm here to do.
You know that's my mission andthat's what God has put me on
the earth.
To do is to be an example andsay you can get through this,
(35:26):
even if you'll you'll stick justa fingernail out of that hole,
cause there were days that wasall I could scrape up was a
fingernail out of the hole.
I couldn't even make it to theladder.
But if you can give me thatmuch, then we can put you on a
path to heal.
I do primarily work with women,just because of what I've been
(35:49):
through, but I like working withmen too.
It's a little more difficultbecause you guys are a little
more challenging sometimes, butthe, the building blocks are all
the same and the work is allthe same and it's really about
not being thinking that you willheal from your trauma and then
(36:11):
it's gone and you put it on ashelf in a box and you never
have to open it up again.
That's just not the case andthat's the unfortunate truth.
My trauma still surfaces.
Sometimes Triggers will happen.
That put me in a place ofhaving a panic attack, but
that's okay, because healing isnot linear.
(36:33):
It's this twirly, windy roadthat has ups and downs and all
that does is make you a strongerperson.
So that's what I help otherpeople kind of work through and
realize is that we're not atpoint A and then we're going to
get to point B and everything'sgreat.
We'll get to point B, but thattrauma still occurred and
(37:00):
there's still going to betriggers.
Speaker 1 (37:01):
But we're going to talk about how to deal with them
in a better way and once youidentify them, once you deal
with them, like you can startworking on the other things
Cause, a lot of times, whathappens when something happens
in your life that's really notgood is your confidence is
shattered, your confidence onwho you are and who you were.
I I tell you what I've.
I lost my identity a milliontimes over the years.
(37:23):
I forgot who I was.
I'm finally starting to realizewho I am now, and I'm not
saying this is trauma, informed,or this is trauma, but when you
do go through something, youlose your identity, and a lot of
times when you lose youridentity.
Speaker 2 (37:41):
You lose your confidence Absolutely.
I can tell you about nights Ilaid on my kitchen floor crying
because I was worthless in mymind.
I wasn't that strong personthat I believed I was or that I
had built myself to be.
I lost all of that confidence,all of that self-esteem, but
(38:07):
what I realized is I was givingsomeone else power over what's
inside me, and that's bullshit.
That person cannot take away myconfidence and my esteem and
the things that I have built inmy life.
Those are mine and I'm notgiving them away.
(38:28):
So that's what I realized.
That helped me see that I amstill a badass, and that person
tried to make me not a badass,but I am.
And one of the things I willsuggest to people, if I may, is
to do what I call a strongenough list.
(38:48):
So I literally on my phone andmy notes and Android people I
don't know maybe you can draw acrayon on your phone or
something.
I'm kidding Android peopledon't hate me but in your notes
app, start making a list of thethings that you have
accomplished in your life, andit can be anything from you know
(39:11):
high school sports to making iton court TV, to having a
podcast to beating an illness,whatever it is.
You start that list and then,any time your confidence feels
shaken, you get out your phoneand you look at that list, feel
(39:34):
shaken.
You get out your phone and youlook at that list Because what
happens in your brain is, as youlook at those items, you start
to feel how you felt when thosethings occurred.
So when I look and see you werethe 800 meter state champion I
feel that you know when I readit and I'm like I sure was, like
I remember crossing that finishline and I remember this, that
and the other, and so thatbuilds up your confidence
(39:55):
because your brain relates backto that moment.
So make your strong enough list, add to it constantly, like
mine still grows because you'restill doing amazing things in
your life.
But that's the one thing that,for me, has been able to keep my
confidence up in those momentswhen you feel shaken.
Speaker 1 (40:19):
I really love that idea.
I use the notes app all thetime, but for different things,
just to make sure I don't goback into situations that I
don't want to go back to and toremember who I am.
But I like the idea of doing itpositive because I don't go
back into situations that Idon't want to go back to and to
remember who I am.
But I like the idea of doing itpositive because I don't want
to ruminate in negative thoughtsanymore.
I need to ruminate in positivestuff and, believe me, everybody
(40:43):
has something positive to sayabout themselves.
So many.
Speaker 2 (40:46):
And if you can't think of anything to start with,
ask your friends and family.
They will tell you.
They will say don't youremember the time you did X?
Or hey, what about when you didY?
Those are all positives.
So if you can't start your ownlist, ask the people around you.
(41:07):
You know what are some coolthings I have done and that will
start your list for you.
I forgot that I carried theOlympic torch until.
I started making my list and Iwas like holy shit, I did do
that.
I carried the Olympic torch.
So it's like you will rememberthings that had gone from the
memory because they happened somany years ago.
(41:29):
It's so crazy Like very heavyby the ago it's so crazy.
Speaker 1 (41:33):
Very heavy by the way it's very heavy.
Wow, I can only imagine it's acool experience.
It's tough.
You forget about the positives.
Speaker 2 (41:44):
A lot of times.
Speaker 1 (41:45):
You do because you get in your day-to-day monotony
and you're like, well, today waspositive, I did this today, but
you forget about your past.
Um, you know, I'm trying tothink about my consciousness,
like how long I could rememberback to.
There's something positive.
You could always think back tosomething negative.
(42:07):
Right now I want to startthinking about okay, when I 12
or 10, what did I do that waspositive, you know, and like to
me, like my weight has alwaysbeen a yo-yo, always, and I
always forget that the work thatI put into.
So when I was in eighth grade, Iwas a chub dub, really super
(42:27):
chubby, and I remember Icouldn't get on a football team
because I was so the localfootball team, because I was so
chubby, chubby.
And I remember I couldn't geton a football team because I was
so the local football team,because I was so chubby.
And I remember between myeighth grade and ninth grade, I
I was walking all the time, Iwas running, I was doing
everything I could, and then Iwas like super fit in ninth
grade, like, if you saw apicture of me in eighth grade,
be like, oh, that dude's chubby.
And then in ninth grade, like,oh, what happened to him and
(42:47):
it's like, and it's like, but Iforget.
You know, you forget aboutthings like that.
You always think about, like Ididn't make the football team
because I was chubby, but thenyou forget that you did the work
, so when you're a freshman,that you could do all this stuff
, and that you weren't, you know, overweight with and stuff.
So it's like, yeah, you got toalways forget.
Speaker 2 (43:07):
That's the shift that you need to make in your brain
is, instead of dwelling on thosenegatives and I will tell you,
we often also over exaggeratethe negatives Like, for example,
I remember one of the firstpodcasts I recorded and I kind
of lost my train of thought inthe middle of it and in my mind
(43:30):
I had done all this weird likearm flailing and stuttering, and
so when I sent it to my editorI was like hey, like I had this
complete moment of stupidity.
Please, like cut that wholething out.
And so then he contacts me andhe's like I have no idea what
you're talking about.
I watched the episode threetimes.
(43:50):
I cannot find what you'retalking about.
And so now I'm thinking he's anidiot.
So I go back in and watch it andit was a momentary, maybe half
of a second lapse of a thought,but in my mind I had made it
this ridiculous thing.
I was so embarrassed and itdidn't really even happen that
(44:12):
way.
So that's what our brains do.
They trick us sometimes andmake those negatives even worse.
So if you can flip to thepositive side and instead of
thinking I didn't make footballbecause I was chubby, and
turning that to, I worked reallyhard for a year so that I could
(44:33):
become fit enough and made thefootball team.
That's a total shift in yourbrain.
Speaker 1 (44:40):
You know I'm trying to.
I probably have to scroll backa long time now, but I think
when you first did Cork TV, youmight've said something like
that.
But it's TV.
You're only on there for a fewminutes and you, you think that
you made this big, grand gesture, grand gesture.
But then you're like oh no,nobody recognized that I do that
all the time.
I'm like because a lot of timesyou're just, you're thinking on
the fly.
You know you're trying to makea decision, but I'm almost
(45:00):
positive you did the same thingon one of your first appearances
.
I did Like you texted me.
I'm like no, I didn't noticethat at all.
What are you talking about?
Speaker 2 (45:10):
I did.
I was like, oh my God, they'renever going to call me back.
That was horrible.
And you were like I didn't seeanything.
And yes, it is on the fly.
I just want people to know.
Sometimes they change our topicin the commercial.
Literally in the commercial.
They're like oh yeah, what wesaid earlier, it's not that
anymore.
Now it's this other thing thatyou've never heard of.
Good luck talking about itintelligently in two minutes.
Speaker 1 (45:32):
Yeah, live TV.
Never heard of good lucktalking about it intelligently
in two minutes.
Yeah, live tv now think aboutthis is like did the old claudia
think she would ever be on tv?
Did you ever think you'd have apodcast?
Did you ever think you'd beopen?
This much about you'd be anopen book?
Speaker 2 (45:48):
never.
I was always very closed off uh, and a lot of that was from
other trauma when I was youngerbut I was very closed off.
I was terrified of publicspeaking.
I would avoid it at all costs.
And even like raising my handto answer something in school
(46:09):
Absolutely not.
That was public speaking to me,so that was never going to
happen.
So to see where I am today isamazing.
So, yeah, if I looked back atyou know 13 to 20 year old me,
she'd be like no way you'relying.
(46:29):
This is not true.
But that's how we evolve aspeople and that's how we can
take our traumas and ourchallenges and grow instead of
letting them keep us in thatsame spot.
I could still be that personwho's terrified to speak up.
I could still be that personwho just wants to sit in the
(46:51):
corner, who refuses to shareanything.
But who is that helping?
It's not helping me and it'snot helping anybody else either.
So growing into who you'remeant to be is what God, or
whatever you believe in, wantsyou to do.
Speaker 1 (47:11):
It makes me think because I'm like okay, so we
talked about before how you goin wants you to do.
It makes me think cause it'slike okay, so we talked about
before how you go from point Ato point B, and it doesn't look
like anything you can imagine.
It's not a straight line.
How did you start building yourconfidence that you could do
these things, and why?
Speaker 2 (47:28):
So I took a public speaking class in college, which
was horrifying.
But for me my real shift cameas a police officer, because the
other thing that I struggledwith was I never wanted to be a
leader, I never wanted to be incharge of anything because I
(47:52):
didn't want to mess up.
I didn't want to make the wrongdecision and be responsible for
messing people up.
And in rookie school that's notreally an option, because you
learn that you have to makedecisions in the blink of an eye
that really are sometimes lifeand death.
So I had to do it.
(48:14):
I was kind of forced into it andlearning that if I'm able to
take the information in front ofme and make a decision that I
can confidently defend, thenthat's all I can do.
And so once I started doingthat, more and more I became
(48:35):
confident in myself and I becameable to say I can speak up, I
can talk in front of people, Ican lead a group and make
decisions for the good ofeverybody, and I'm not always
going to make the rightdecisions, but I can explain to
you why I did what I did andthen learn and move forward.
(48:57):
So for me it was that publicspeaking class that was
terrifying, but it was reallythe career shift that I made and
wanting to be the best cop thatI could be, and to do that I
was going to have to get outsidemy comfort zone.
Speaker 1 (49:16):
You know, the big step was the public speaking
class and that's like the thingis like not everybody's going to
go become a cop, noteverybody's a cop, right, but
when you want and we're not justtalking about public speaking
here, now, we're talking aboutanother topic which is like if
you want to better yourself anddo something that's different,
like, let's say, you may be kindof introverted but you want to
(49:37):
get into public speaking, so youtake a public speaking speaking
class.
Let's say you want to become apilot.
Let's say you want to do this,you want to do that.
Take little baby steps, learnabout it.
Learn baby steps, learn aboutit, learn a little bit, function
about it.
You know, but you have to, like, start learning.
Don't say something that's trysomething new, try something you
(49:58):
always wanted to find a passion.
Speaker 2 (49:59):
Yeah, yeah, that's.
That's the key.
We we like to sit in our littleboxes, and I get it.
Our boxes are comfortable, youknow.
It's it's fun to be here andit's safe and secure.
But there's so much world outthere outside of our little
boxes and if you just take thatfirst step out, like you said,
(50:20):
learn.
You know there's something thatinterests you.
Learn a little about it.
Take an online class, you knowyou don't even have to really
put yourself out there per se.
You don't even have to reallyput yourself out there per se.
There's all kinds of siteswhere you can, either for free
or pay like 20 bucks and do acourse all on your own.
Speaker 1 (50:47):
So those are the baby steps that every single one of
us can do to get to your bestself.
Part of that also I wanted totalk about today was it doesn't
always have to be aboutbettering yourself as far as
like, and what I mean by that isnot bettering yourself to get
the next job or do the new thingor the new income stream or
this or that.
A lot of times it's betteringyourself just to be a better
(51:08):
person.
So I have my routine Work outin the morning, I come back and
I do paint my numbers.
Right now I'm doing this bigthing.
It's called the Everglades,it's like a picture of the
Everglades and I do one numbereach day and it's teaching me
patience, because we're so usedto scrolling, we're so used to
instant gratification and itdidn't just click until right
(51:29):
now.
I do it so my mind could take abreak and I could just focus on
trying to color paint inbetween the lines.
And I'm not doing it so I couldsell anything.
I'm not doing it to be like, oh, look at me, I'm the greatest
artist in the world.
No, I'm doing it because I needto slow down.
I need to like just accomplishsomething as little as getting
one number done a day, so itdoesn't always have to be about
(51:52):
the next next thing in your life.
Speaker 2 (51:55):
Absolutely.
You know I am working onimproving my Spanish.
I don't have any need for thatreally, but it's just something
that I want to do for myselfbecause it will make me feel
better and it's expanding mybrain, it's challenging me and
that's why I'm doing it, youknow, not so I can go on deport
(52:19):
days or whatever, but just tohave it for myself.
So I love that you brought thatup, because doing things just
to better yourself or just toimprove your knowledge or your
skill set, as in your patience,those are good things.
(52:40):
I think a lot of times we aretaught that doing something just
for yourself is selfish, andthat's not true.
We have to do things just forourselves.
We have to take care of us.
If you don't, that's when youcan't take care of anybody else,
because you're not better,you're not well.
(53:01):
So I love that you brought thatup and I totally agree with you
.
And it's not selfish to takethat time for you.
And I love paint by numbers.
That's amazing.
Speaker 1 (53:11):
It's literally like 20 minutes a day, but that 20
minutes is like, it's so nice,it's like, uh, there's a.
There's this other thing I dolike and I haven't done it in
like three years and it'sdriving me nuts, I'm gonna do it
this year is like my buddy hasan amateur racing.
I mean racing cars yes it'slike endurance.
It's uh, you know you drive twohours at a time and it's, it's
(53:31):
the most incredible experienceever.
And it's like endurance.
It's you know you drive twohours at a time and it's the
most incredible experience ever.
And it's like real racing.
You know you got thefire-returning suit on, you got
this and that and for that twohours you're in the cockpit and
you're driving.
Nothing matters except what'sin your mirrors and in front of
you and behind you.
Nothing matters, nothingmatters.
(53:57):
You've got to find a, a solace,a peace for yourself, because I
swear, if you do something foryourself that could calm you,
it's gonna help all of yourrelationships out a hundred
percent.
Speaker 2 (54:06):
I used to go to a horse rescue and I don't anymore
because I moved, so I couldprobably find another one.
But if you haven't been aroundhorses, they require all of your
attention.
And horses apparently like theycan kind of sense when you're
unfocused and they won't listento you and they'll do their own
(54:30):
thing.
You really have to be in thatmoment, in that space, with the
right mindset to deal with yourhorse and make them, you know,
run the obstacle course orwhatever you're doing.
And that was kind of one of thefirst things I did to really
learn how to shut everythingelse off, because I am one of
(54:54):
those people that's always on myphone, I work from my phone.
I can literally have my laptopin front of me and then work on
my phone at the same time.
So I have tried to do thingsthat helped me put my phone down
, and that horse time was thebest If you have the opportunity
to do that, because they willknow I don't know how they know,
(55:15):
but they know if you are notfully engaged and present with
them and they won't listen toyou.
So that was big for me to learn.
Speaker 1 (55:28):
They are so intuitive .
They are, oh my gosh.
So just find, find out who youwant to be, find out who you are
.
It's so easy to say, hey, justfind out who you are and find
out who you are, but really itjust comes down to just little
little things every day to tofigure out who you are and it'll
come.
(55:48):
It'll come quick, um, a lotquicker than you think once you
start.
Speaker 2 (55:54):
Once you start paying attention, you know, look at
the things that you see, thatinterest.
You Look at what TV that youwatch.
You know, like I watch allkinds of true crime.
I have been watching that sinceI was little.
So that told me you know youwant to be somehow involved in
(56:15):
crime, not committing it, but onthe other side.
But you know, maybe you love towatch baking shows, so maybe
get out the stand mixer and tryto bake yourself.
You know, just pay attention tothe little cues in your life
and that will lead you to whoyou are and who you want to be.
Speaker 1 (56:38):
Find your hobby Something outside of like the
norm that everybody you know.
And a hobby to me is like Ilove shooting, I love shooting,
I love doing all this and stufflike that.
It's not really a hobby, it'slike it's something I've enjoyed
doing, but it's not like yeah,I don't even know how to explain
it.
It's something different.
(56:58):
Photography for me now is likemy new I can't even say it's new
.
I've always wanted to do it.
Find something that juststimulates you, that you enjoy
that you enjoy.
Speaker 2 (57:17):
I totally agree I used to do those little diamond
paintings.
Do you remember those?
It's kind of like the paint bynumber, where it required that
focus.
So for me, yes, I don't want tobe a painter, nor does anybody
else want me to be a painter, Ipromise that.
But it allowed me that time tomyself to relax and to have that
(57:37):
patience.
I used to cross stitch littlethings like that.
It's that time for me just tosit by myself.
A lot of people areuncomfortable with that, I tell
you alone.
Speaker 1 (57:53):
Loneliness, it's a new thing.
There's a difference betweenbeing alone and being low and
having loneliness.
But, sometimes, when you haveloneliness, you need to find
those things that can kind ofget you out of it.
It's okay to be alone, I meanit is.
Just don't get back to what wefirst initially started this
conversation with was aboutdepression.
(58:15):
It's about okay, I'm alone.
It's not the end of the world.
There are positive things Icould do to get me out of it so
I don't get depressed by beingalone.
Speaker 2 (58:28):
Exactly, exactly.
And because the last thing youwant to do is rush into a space
where you are no longer alonebecause you were afraid to be
alone.
So obviously in a relationshipcontext, you know and I'm guilty
of that years ago of kind ofrushing into that next thing
because I was afraid to be alone.
(58:49):
And now being alone, I don'twant to say it's my favorite
thing, it's not.
But I enjoy the peace that Ican experience by myself and
that comes with practice and theability to look inward and
understand yourself and not beafraid of yourself, yourself and
(59:14):
not be afraid of yourself, notbe afraid of the thoughts in
your head, not want to alwayspush them away.
So I'm cool with me now and Iwasn't for a time, but I like me
and I wouldn't always have beenable to say that.
Speaker 1 (59:25):
I love that.
That's a good point.
To get to our last questionthis is something new is like
point to get to our lastquestion this is something new.
I'm stealing this from anotherpodcast what is the best piece
of advice that you were givenand why Someone else gave you
this advice?
Speaker 2 (59:41):
Oh, wow.
Speaker 1 (59:43):
It's a tough one, huh .
Speaker 2 (59:44):
It is, I'm going to say, decisions of the head
versus decisions of the heart.
So when you're making decisions, where are they coming from?
And you need to be able todifferentiate.
So if you're making a decisionof the head, that's, that's well
(01:00:10):
thought through and understood,that's okay.
But we can get in trouble whenwe make decisions of the heart,
when we let our emotions takecontrol and we don't think of
the consequences or thepotential outcomes and we just
make that decision purely basedon that emotion.
(01:00:30):
That's where we can get intotrouble.
So I think that's the bestpiece of advice I have ever
gotten is to not let emotionscontrol us, because that's
really easy to do sometimes.
But we've got to take that stepback and breathe and know that
there's a rational piece of usin there and we need to bring
(01:00:53):
that in before we do somethingthat might not be in our best
interest.
Speaker 1 (01:00:59):
That is excellent advice, and I'm going to learn
it myself.
Well, claudia, I appreciate youcoming on.
Speaker 2 (01:01:05):
Thank you, jason.
Always a pleasure, and we'llhave to do this again.
Speaker 1 (01:01:10):
Absolutely.
hey, welcome back to protectors podcast.
My good friend and fellowpodcaster and fellow court tv
guest expert, uh, claudia King,is back on the show, claudia,
welcome.
Speaker 2 (00:29):
Jason, it is amazing to be here and we have gotten
really close in the last year orso and it has been awesome.
I think you are an amazing guyand so I'm stoked to chat with
you a little bit today in a waywhere everybody else can hear us
, because you know we do a lotof private chatting.
But this will be great.
Speaker 1 (00:49):
We are always chatting, and that is a great
thing about having good friends,Cause sometimes you just need
those, those texts, you needthose, you need people in your
corner.
One thing right before I recordis it just it hit me because I
was telling you that story aboutone of my friends the other day
said you don't look like youhad depression.
And it's so crazy because Iremember and her, she's going to
(01:13):
come back and she's going tocome on a show with me as well,
and and we're going to talkabout depression.
But I want to tell people likeyou can't judge a book by its
cover.
I've, I've been battling andit's a battle.
You know.
Some days are a lot better thanothers and some days are rough.
There's, there's ways to remedyit and I think I'm learning
(01:34):
them.
But depression, you can't judgeanybody, and that's the same
thing with you is like you can'tjudge you by what you see on TV
.
You have these smiley, happyfaces.
You have the social media, youhave this, you have that, but
people are still struggling.
They're struggling with it, andso many people that we see, our
(01:58):
friends included.
We never know.
We never know, and I do want tocaveat that just because you
have depression does not meanyou are suicidal.
It means like you're justfighting against this thing that
people don't understand, and Idon't think a lot of people do
understand it.
Speaker 2 (02:12):
No, I think you're right, and to me it feels like
this invisible force that keepsyou from being able to will
yourself to do things.
And what I mean by that is whenI'm really in it, I can't get
out of bed.
I want to get out of bed.
There's nothing physicallykeeping me from getting out of
(02:35):
bed, but my brain just can't getthere and I really isolate
myself and I really isolatemyself.
So I'm not suicidal, as yousaid.
You know, I just can't makethose chemicals in my brain work
the way that I want them to.
And I'll be the one to say Iused to judge people and think
(02:57):
that medication for depressionor anxiety was silly and that
you know we can.
We can will ourselves to doanything.
And then God said oh, is thatwhat you think?
Well, let me really show you,and now I understand it.
It literally is is a chemicalimbalance in our brains that
make these things happen, andthere are ways to make it better
(03:20):
.
But admitting it kind of is thefirst step, because until you
reach out and get help, you'regoing to be battling that
invisible force all by yourselfand you can't do that.
Speaker 1 (03:33):
It's, it's a, it's a battle.
It is like, and when you knowpeople don't realize when you go
into battle you have to bringeverything, you have to fight
with everything you have To me,just cause my, my life has
transitioned so much over thepast few months.
I mean, it's been going on fora very long time but the final
(03:53):
transition into this new part ofmy life, you know, coming out
of a very, very long thing, I'llleave it at that you know, a
30-year thing and it's andsomething new is starting.
I mean, and it's so weird, likeyou think you're ready to take
(04:13):
that next step, you think you'reready and then all of a sudden
it hits you like a brick, likeWhoa, this is your new reality,
this is your new life, this isthe new you, this is the old
Jason is completely gone.
And then that depression kindof it seeps in.
And if you don't like recognizeit right away, there could be,
(04:34):
there could be those days whenyou're stuck in bed.
I've been, I've been on thislike kick where and it's not
even a kick anymore, it had tobe a lifestyle change where,
like I've got to work and dosomething every day to move my
body, whether it's a gym,walking, both, biking, anything
to keep my body moving, cause mybody needs it needs that.
I've been slacking a lot, butI've been doing transidential
(04:57):
meditation.
I need to not do it just once aday, I need to do it twice a
day, cause I need that.
I need a new therapist.
So I'm recognizing, as we'retalking here, the things that I
need to have done in order tokeep going.
My therapist and I hit a wallwhere really she was able to get
me to this point in my lifewhere I'm at now, but now I need
someone else to work on this.
(05:19):
My next battle is to completelywork on the depression.
I don't want these dark days.
Today is to completely work onthe depression.
I don't want these dark days.
Today was almost one of them.
I got up and I had some newsand I was like, huh, it hit me a
little bit different and then Iwas like I got to get out of
bed and I got to move.
I got to move and I got to getto the gym.
I got to look at the positivesand you could have the best life
(05:41):
in the world.
I mean, you can.
I have two incredibly amazingchildren that bring me so much
joy in life.
And even if you have them, it'sstill the depression hits you.
Speaker 2 (05:54):
Yeah, it hits everybody or it can hit
everybody, and it doesn't matterwhat you have or who's in your
life, or how much money you haveor where you travel.
It doesn't discriminate in thatregard.
And I love what you saidearlier about taking kind of all
your tools into battle, becauseI've always said, you know, if
(06:17):
there's ever a fight to thedeath, I'm going to win.
You know, that was kind of mymantra as a police officer,
because you got to be ready forthat at any time.
And this is the same thing Ifthis is a fight to the death,
I'm going to win.
I will beat depression, I willbeat anxiety, I will take all
the tools into that battle withme and it will not win.
(06:39):
And that's the attitude thatyou have to have.
I do want to say those dark daysmay still hit, and that's okay.
Um, because it's.
It's not a linear path, youknow it's it.
There can be ups and downs,hills and valleys, and that's
okay, that's part of our journey.
(07:00):
And we have to not beatourselves up when that happens
and think well, I had a bad day,so I guess I'm not, I don't
have depression kicked.
You're going to have those baddays and that's all right.
Speaker 1 (07:15):
You know, I'm glad you said that, because setbacks
happen all the time and it'sjust being able to.
I always call it the foothold.
You need to get a foothold outof it and whether that
depression is this huge mountainthat you have to get out of,
you have to get out of it.
I used to call my depression.
Like everybody has differentfeelings, but mine was always
(07:35):
like I have this like sponge inmy head and you know, when you,
when you clean your your dishesand you have a clean sponge,
it's like, ah, it's clean, youcan clean everything.
But mine was always like thisdark sponge, filled with just
darkness that I couldn't.
I couldn't.
It's in my head and if I couldjust get rid of that sponge out
of my head, all the negativitywould be gone.
(07:57):
And now I'm realizing that Ineed the depression to be
considered a battle.
It's like a constant warfare Inorder to get out of the sponge.
I need to take that step and Ireally hope this kind of
resonates with the audience,because a lot of the people we
know are fighting it and itmight not be massive depression.
It might not be depressionwhere you need medication.
(08:19):
You might just need to talk topeople.
You might need to vent.
You might need to vent, youmight need to just get away from
it, but you have to recognizeit first.
I think that is the first step.
Speaker 2 (08:33):
It definitely is, and it's hard, especially for
people like us who have verystrong exteriors and have been
in careers that requireindependence and assertiveness
and dominance.
In some regard, it's hard toadmit that there's something
that we can't even see, that istrying to beat us down and, on
(08:56):
some days, is a littlesuccessful.
So admitting it really is thefirst step and it is the most
difficult step, in my opinion aswell.
Speaker 1 (09:07):
Once you admit it, that's when the work begins.
That is like sit, listen, I'm52 years old, I've, I'm done,
I'm done letting this control mylife.
I'm done letting a lot ofthings control my life.
And now you have to really sitdown and think about it, make a
plan and execute.
(09:28):
I mean, a lot of us are a lotof people who listen to this
have been in the military,they've been in law enforcement,
they've been in any job whereyou had to make a decision.
And the decision is you have tolook at it as like, okay, well,
I could change my diet and thatcan help one part of it, but
then it's the whole picture.
It's like, okay, I could changemy diet and that can help one
part of it, but then it's thewhole picture.
It's like, okay, I could changemy diet, I could limit or get
rid of alcohol, and then I couldwork out, I could walk, I could
(09:52):
move my body, I could lift.
And then it's like surroundyourself by positivity and also
find a therapist.
And if you don't find, you know, one of my friends is going
through something right now,horrible, horrible thing going
on in her life a differentfriend and they're.
(10:16):
They're like hey, I you knowI'm trying to find a therapist
to talk to.
Speaker 2 (10:27):
But the one I went to I didn't like it takes.
It may take you four or fivedifferent people to get an idea
of who you want to talk to.
I have said many times on mypodcast it's okay to date your
therapist, and I don't meanliterally like go out on a date
with them, but what I mean isit's okay to try out different
people until you find the onethat you click with, because you
may not click with that firstperson, just like dating.
And I think a lot of people usethat as an excuse.
You know they are hesitant tosee somebody in the first place.
(10:51):
So they go see one therapist.
It doesn't work out and theysay see, it's not my fault, I
tried, but that therapist didn'twork.
So now I'm not trying any otherones.
And I applaud you for saying youneed a new therapist.
So it wasn't even that yourtherapist didn't work.
You said she got you to thepoint where you are, but there's
(11:15):
more to conquer and you needsomebody new.
Because, again, a lot of peoplein that position would say well
, she got me this far and that'sgood enough.
And I applaud you forrecognizing that that's not good
enough and you need to searchfor the right person for this
(11:35):
next chapter.
Speaker 1 (11:42):
I remember, geez, probably a couple of decades ago
, going to marriage counseling,and this happens to so many
people I know that go tomarriage counseling is, they go
to one and it doesn't, you don'tclick.
You don't click as a couplegoing to it and it just doesn't
work.
And then you just say you knowwhat, I think we're done, I
don't need to go to counseling,We'll figure it out on our own.
And you know, that's one of thethings is you always wonder
(12:04):
you're like huh, I wonder if youstick it out, if you could have
found the right counselor.
But at the end of the day youknow that's one of the topics I
want to get into is today islike maybe that person you're
with trying to get marriagecounseling with, isn't the right
one.
That's going to defeat yoursoul.
Speaker 2 (12:22):
Absolutely Date your therapist Again?
Not really.
But try out different peoplebecause, just like friends,
other relationships, we don'tclick with everybody.
So why would you just assumethat you could click with this
first therapist and they'regoing to be the end, all be all
and the perfect person to helpyou?
It's great if that's what youfind I was lucky enough to have
(12:46):
that but that's not always thecase and I do think people use
that as an excuse.
They're scared anyway andtherapy is scary.
You have to get reallyvulnerable and really raw if you
want to get better.
Now, if you just want to glossover things, you can do that,
(13:08):
but what's the point?
You know, if you're going toput the time and effort and
money into it, then you got todo it right.
And that is hard and that isscary because you got to let it
all out there and you have tobear the things that are the
deepest and darkest thingsinside of you and the scariest
(13:28):
to reveal.
But that's what you have toreveal to those people to get
better and that's why it is soimportant that you find the
right one.
Speaker 1 (13:38):
When you find the right one, don't you, like you
said, you can pick apart whythey're, why they are bad for
you, why this is not a good,good person to go and see and
talk to, and then you startmaking excuses.
So when you recognize that,like, for this sense, we're
going to and we're going to getinto other topics today, today.
But when you recognize that youhave something wrong with you,
(14:00):
or there is something wrong withyou because I don't want it to
be, like, oh my gosh, I'm broken, I'll never get over this.
But when you recognize that youcan't keep making excuses, you
have to, like, make a likededicated plan.
Like today, as soon as we getoff of here, I need to like, I
need to research, I need to finda new therapist.
I haven't put it off for a week.
(14:20):
I've made excuses about that,saying, well, I don't have time,
I don't do this.
Everything else is kind ofshifting into place.
But this is something else.
It's like stop making excusesfor trying to heal yourself,
because once you start healingyour mind, everything else falls
into place.
Once you start seeing apositive light and you start
(14:41):
moving and you start doingthings, then everything else
your relationships will getbetter.
You will get better.
You'll want to move your body,you'll want to do things.
You want to see life with likesunlight, you know.
Think about it Like the cloudydays really are cloudy days and
like it's just once you startseeing it then you really do
burst through it.
(15:01):
I know it's cliche, but it'strue.
Speaker 2 (15:02):
Once you start seeing it, then you really do burst
through it, I know it's cliche,but it's true, it is true and
you know that's what they say.
Things are cliche orstereotypes, because ultimately
they are true and you're totallyright.
You got to stop making excusesand I think a lot of people
today like to live in victimhoodand people might get mad at me
(15:25):
saying that, but sometimes thetruth hurts is it's easier to
sit in that place where we havebeen wronged or our brain isn't
working correctly and we'redepressed or something else bad
happened to us.
It's easier sometimes to sit inthat space of victimhood and
(15:48):
gather that attention and thepity and the sorrow, and so a
lot of people sit there, I think, and they don't look inward and
do the hard work.
And that's what I think a lotof people struggle with is they
don't want to do the hard work.
It's easier to sit in the spacethey're in and say poor,
(16:10):
pitiful me, then go out and dothe hard stuff.
Speaker 1 (16:15):
I am so glad that you brought that up, because we all
know people who are habitualvictims and it's horrible.
You have to do the work, listen.
The reason I say that isbecause I've been there myself.
I've been.
Oh my gosh, how many times havepeople said woe is me.
(16:37):
Oh, you're so, woe is me.
How many people ignore youbecause you become the victim
and that's all you talk about isbeing a victim.
It and, believe me, some peopleare are real victims, but we're
.
We're not talking about likethat.
We're not talking about likesomeone who, like, completely
like their life, got gutted andripped out by some violent,
(17:00):
horrific thing or anything.
We're talking about, yeah,victimhood.
Speaker 2 (17:06):
Yeah, and well, here's the thing, too, on the
real victims is, you're notresponsible for what happened to
you, but you're responsible forhealing yourself and moving
forward.
Things happen to all of us andsome are more horrific than
(17:26):
others.
And I said to you earlier,before we started recording you
know, if people had been througha third of what I'd been
through, a lot of them would becrying in the corner.
But I did the work.
You know I'm not responsiblefor those things that happened
to me, but once they happened,it became my responsibility to
(17:47):
heal myself.
So I think, yes, there are realvictims out there, but once
that happens, they still have totake the necessary steps to get
better and to move forward youhave to recognize it, though you
.
Speaker 1 (18:04):
You have to recognize that you are you.
Something bad happened to you.
It could be the the yourrelationships broke up.
You may have felt like, um, thelife hasn't been fair to you
and that everybody else has itbetter than you and you and you
and you're like well, I can'tcrawl out of this hole.
(18:25):
So then you just keep lettingeverything.
You're in this hole and it'slike someone above you is like
just shoveling dirt into it andyou don't want to climb out.
But someone offers you a ladderto climb out right away.
But you're like I don't know,it doesn't look good and that
ladder is.
Every rung of that ladder is adecision you're making to make
(18:47):
yourself better.
So maybe that's like okay, I am, life is killing me right now.
But if I take that first step,I'm going to and that first step
could be okay this morning I amgoing to eat better, I'm going
to do something, cause whenyou're eating better and stuff
like that, your body starts tofeel better.
Your body feels better, yourmind feels better.
(19:07):
After that, the next rung isI'm going to go for a walk
around the block.
Okay, boom, that's something, avictory.
Boom, I always say that victorything.
The third one is like, okay, Iknow things aren't that good
right now, I need to talk tosomeone.
So you get therapy and therapy.
Or you get a hold of a friendwho you could talk to, but not
bitch and not vent.
But you get hold of that friendand say, okay, well, how do I,
(19:28):
how do I help myself out of this?
Fourth is you just you.
You plan, you, you look forthose ways that you could find
the victories that aren't thattrauma, that aren't that thing
that's holding you back, and Ishouldn't say trauma, but that
thing that's holding you backthat's making you the victim and
keep rising up that damn ladderbecause there's always going to
(19:49):
be shit, there's always goingto be shit shoveled at you and
you know that's what it reallyis.
It's not dirt, it's just peopleare just going to keep trying
to put you down unless you pullyourself up.
Speaker 2 (20:00):
You know, the other thing too is sometimes we have
people in our lives that likewhere we're at.
They like us in that hole, theylike us having the dirt
shoveled upon us, because thatallows them to maybe be our
savior or to be that one friendthat will always be there to
(20:24):
listen.
So you got to make sure toevaluate the people around you
because a lot of times, as we doget better, some people don't
like that and they're againstthat and they start to battle.
Well, do you really need to gowalk today, Jason?
You don't really need to findthat new therapist.
I think you're fine.
(20:44):
So you got to battle that ontop of everything else to get
out of the hole.
So it's important to really bemindful that when you're making
positive steps, sometimes peopleare going to rally against that
, and that's okay.
But you got to keep going upthat ladder.
Speaker 1 (21:05):
I am glad you brought that up, because that's one
thing I wanted to talk to youabout today too, was
relationships and finding.
So you're on this ladder and alot of us out there we're.
We're in different situationsin our life where we may not
have uh partners, we may just bealone.
We may, you know, just havecome off relationships or or
maybe we had relationships inthe past that just didn't work
(21:27):
out.
And now you're, you're like you, for instance, you have a
partner that's going to identifyyour traumas, that's going to
identify what's holding you back, and it's going to identify
like when you're having a roughday.
And I believe me, I'm not arelationship coach, because God
knows I'm not good at that stuff, but but now I'm, I'm learning
(21:50):
about all these things.
You know, I'm reading this damnbook attached, um, all these
other things that try toidentify my, my styles and stuff
, and that with you is you foundsomeone, someone's going to
identify, that someone's likeyears later you're still
enjoying life with.
Speaker 2 (22:08):
Yeah, and that's what it boils down to.
The one piece of relationshipadvice that I will give all day
long is find somebody that youlike and that you enjoy doing
things with.
Because my husband and I havebeen together it'll be 20 years
(22:28):
this December and there aretimes that we have done things
to one another that maybeweren't the best, and you're
annoyed with that person andyou're like gosh, do I even love
them anymore?
I'm not sure.
But if you like them, that iswhat will carry you through,
because in the times when I wasangry or felt rejected or
(22:54):
whatever the case may have been,I still wanted to be around him
because I liked him, and so Ithink that really is the key is
to find somebody that you like.
And then I also want to say youknow, you said sometimes people
are alone, we don't have anybody, and I know that a lot of
(23:16):
people you know talk about thenegativity of social media and
other things like that, but theone thing that that has given us
is the ability to connect withpeople that aren't right next
door.
So you have the ability andreally no excuses to not have
somebody in your corner.
(23:37):
They might not be in yourcorner, literally right beside
you, but you can find people whoare a text message or a phone
call away.
And that's the beauty of socialmedia and texting and the
phones that we have now isyou're not limited to the four
(23:57):
square miles around you, youhave the whole world.
So there really is no excuse tonot find somebody that you can
support and who will support you.
Speaker 1 (24:08):
And by support you mean support, not commiserate.
Speaker 2 (24:11):
Correct.
Speaker 1 (24:13):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (24:13):
Commiserating is easy , but, yes, actually support,
and we need people in our livesthat will call us on our
bullshit.
That matters because now thatyou said I've been putting off
finding a new therapist and nowI've got to do it, I'm going to
hold you accountable and I'mgoing to be texting you later
(24:34):
and saying did you do that?
What steps did you take todayto make that happen?
So, yes, sometimes it's hard tohear, but you need the friends
in your life who will be honestwith you and who will call you
and say hey, Jason, that'sbullshit.
Like, let's step back and let'sreally evaluate what's going on
(24:58):
.
Speaker 1 (25:00):
The accountability is like.
I think that is key tofriendship.
Speaker 2 (25:04):
Yes.
Speaker 1 (25:05):
It's so key Like, real like and be brutally honest
.
Because, believe me, I'mbrutally honest with friends now
.
I mean, and they might not likeit, but believe me, if you tell
me that you want to fix yourbody and you need to work out,
but then the next day you'resaying, oh man, you know, I
(25:25):
don't really feel like it.
Or if we go out to dinner orsomething like that, or lunch,
and you're like, huh, I thinkI'm going to have that big juicy
burger that's 3000 calories,I'm like, well, you don't want
to tell, it said you wanted to.
It's just being brutally honestand I think that's the best
part of like.
Real friendship is to that.
Today you told me that you likeyou lost 40 pounds and I was
like I didn't.
(25:46):
You know, that's the thing aboutsocial media is you really
can't recognize, because a lotof us take pictures with good
angles right and um, and I'm I'mvery I'm excited for you
because there are setbacks and,like you, had injuries and this
and that, but tell us about that.
That's one thing I want tolearn about.
How did this all like?
Go back, because me, me, I'm inthis, I'm in this transition
(26:07):
period now too, where I want to,I've got another.
I'm actually only got like 25more pounds to go and I'm good.
Speaker 2 (26:14):
Which I don't see, but I believe you, um, cause
you've been crushing it as well.
For me, um, I have alwaysstruggled with body dysmorphia.
So, no matter what I look like,I think I'm fat.
But I really was.
Maybe I wasn't fat.
I mean I was 40 pounds morethan I am now, so I was heavier
(26:36):
and it came about a because Iwas injured.
I had a back injury that Iliterally didn't see the
downstairs of my own house forat least three months because I
could not walk up and down thestairs.
So that definitely affected me,and then you sort of get into
comfort eating.
(26:56):
But I also was on somemedication that apparently was
affecting my ability to loseweight, apparently was affecting
my ability to lose weight.
And the only way that I wasable to figure that out was by
being open and honest with mydoctor and saying Sammy,
something's going on, I don'tknow what to do.
And we started evaluatingmedications and she says, well,
(27:22):
this is a downer, this is adowner, this is a down.
You know, like what are wedoing here and changing some
things up?
So I still have the regulationthat I need for depression and
anxiety and PTSD, but it helpedme to lose that weight and I
(27:42):
started eating better.
So I do eat cereal almost everynight.
I heard somebody recently saycereal goes in a different
stomach.
Maybe that's true, I don't know.
But I started eating better, Istarted moving, like you said,
and the weight literally juststarted to come off.
I didn't do anything special.
(28:03):
I know people hate to hear that.
Just started to come off.
I didn't do anything special.
I know people hate to hear that, but I didn't do anything
special.
I just feed myself when I want.
I try to eat good things.
I don't restrict myself.
I'm going to have that beer,but to all that point, I still
feel fat.
Point, I still feel fat.
(28:29):
When I look at myself in themirror, I feel fat.
And I was packing last night fora cruise and I held up these
shorts that are mine and Ilooked at them and I'm like who
thought I could fit in these?
Like this is ridiculous.
And I held them up to Lee and Isaid what is this?
And he was like that's whatsize you are.
Put them on.
And I put them on and they didfit.
(28:52):
But that's the struggle that Ideal with.
So again, that goes back tohaving that person who will call
balls and strikes to say you'renot fat, you don't look like
that.
I understand that's what yousee, but I'm going to be honest
with you.
And so that's where that comesin again, that honesty and that
(29:15):
brutal honesty, as you say.
Now I'm not saying, if I gainedfive pounds for him to shuffle
on over and say, hey, tubby, layoff the ice cream, but you know
that person who's going to bereal with you.
Speaker 1 (29:31):
I I posted this thing on YouTube today and it was
like I took my kids to thedentist this morning and my
daughter looks at me and shegoes you look smaller, and not
like muscularly smaller, butlike and you know what I mean by
smaller.
She's like my big gut.
Like it doesn't.
(29:51):
It's not there, like you know,and that was the most like.
It's still.
It's been four hours now andI'm still thinking about it,
cause I'm like someone that Inever expected to be like like
that.
You know you expect people that, like friends and stuff, say
hey, bro, you're killing it orthis or that, or, but when your
(30:12):
daughter you know, your 14 yearold daughter looks at you and
says that it, it really hit meand it was a victory for me, and
I talk about these littlevictories every day.
It's it's like the reason I amso consistent and so dedicated
to this right now is to be thebest dad that I possibly can.
(30:33):
I don't want relationships.
I don't want anything except tobe the best dad.
I want my kids to look at meand go wow, he's got it going on
.
You know he has got it going on.
Wow, he's got it going on, hehas got it going on and I want
them to look up to me, becausethere's a reality about being 52
and having almost 15 and almost17-year-old.
(30:55):
They didn't see me when I wasSpecial Agent Piccolo on the
street or Infantry CaptainPiccolo, they see me as the dad.
So now I'm at this point whereI'm like okay, I want them to
see me as the best dad that Ican be, and that's just not
(31:16):
being physical, it's being thereto support them, it's being
there for the games and beingthere to pick them up and being
there to talk to them whenthey're going through some
battles, because we know teensgo through battles too um, so
it's just different.
So that's why that like hurtyou saying that like really just
, I don't know, it's hard toexplain you know.
Speaker 2 (31:40):
What else that says to me, though, is that she's
watching, so she is seeing daddo those positive things, and
what changes are occurring.
So, just in that regard, you'restill making that positive
impression on your kids.
And who else is watching?
(32:02):
You know, you're on socialmedia, you're, you're on TV.
You got a lot going on in allkinds of good things.
So who's watching you and whoelse is going to be positively
affected by the things thatyou're doing?
That's big.
Speaker 1 (32:20):
Well, that's like you and I.
The reason we do 90% of thethings we do is because lessons
learned.
You've had trauma in your pastand you know what.
I was going to get into ittoday, but I don't want to.
I don't because you've talkedabout it in the past and
everybody look up Claudia.
She's had some horrific thingsin her past Horrific.
But I think today is going tobe about like, okay, you're out
(32:45):
of that hole.
You're literally out of thathole and the things that keep
you out of that hole areeverything that you're doing.
That includes being involvedwith other people, coaching
other people and helping people.
Trauma happens for a reason.
It's horrible when it happens,I mean it's horrific.
(33:06):
But if you get to this pointwhere you could help other
people out, it's part of yourhealing.
So I know you've been coachingpeople for a while.
Let's talk about that.
Speaker 2 (33:18):
Yeah, and that's why I started doing it.
I don't know if you'rereligious, but I am, and for me
I do believe that everythinghappens for a reason, and I
believe that God put me in someof the trauma that I went
through for a couple reasons.
One was to be able to speak upand get people out of positions
(33:43):
so they wouldn't hurt otherpeople.
But then the other reason is tohave that strength to help
others, and I love that.
So I have some uncanny abilitythat I can sit with somebody for
about an hour asking some toughquestions and I can figure out
(34:04):
way back when what made you whoyou are today, what event kind
of surrounds some of the thingsthat you do.
You know 30, 40, 50 years laterin your life, and then we start
to address that.
So my coaching is not easy,sometimes it's not fun, but it's
(34:29):
to put people back in astronger and more beautiful way
than they were before.
Are you familiar with Kintsugi,the Japanese art?
Speaker 1 (34:40):
No.
Speaker 2 (34:41):
So they have this art called Kintsugi and it's where
a bowl or a cup will get brokenand they'll put it back together
and they use this very specificgold glue and they believe that
when they put it back togetherit's stronger and more beautiful
than it was before it wasbroken.
(35:02):
And I believe that's us, and Ibelieve everybody has that
capability.
So everybody that I can helpput back together and be
stronger and more beautiful,then that's what I'm here to do.
You know that's my mission andthat's what God has put me on
the earth.
To do is to be an example andsay you can get through this,
(35:26):
even if you'll you'll stick justa fingernail out of that hole,
cause there were days that wasall I could scrape up was a
fingernail out of the hole.
I couldn't even make it to theladder.
But if you can give me thatmuch, then we can put you on a
path to heal.
I do primarily work with women,just because of what I've been
(35:49):
through, but I like working withmen too.
It's a little more difficultbecause you guys are a little
more challenging sometimes, butthe, the building blocks are all
the same and the work is allthe same and it's really about
not being thinking that you willheal from your trauma and then
(36:11):
it's gone and you put it on ashelf in a box and you never
have to open it up again.
That's just not the case andthat's the unfortunate truth.
My trauma still surfaces.
Sometimes Triggers will happen.
That put me in a place ofhaving a panic attack, but
that's okay, because healing isnot linear.
(36:33):
It's this twirly, windy roadthat has ups and downs and all
that does is make you a strongerperson.
So that's what I help otherpeople kind of work through and
realize is that we're not atpoint A and then we're going to
get to point B and everything'sgreat.
We'll get to point B, but thattrauma still occurred and
(37:00):
there's still going to betriggers.
Speaker 1 (37:01):
But we're going to talk about how to deal with them
in a better way and once youidentify them, once you deal
with them, like you can startworking on the other things
Cause, a lot of times, whathappens when something happens
in your life that's really notgood is your confidence is
shattered, your confidence onwho you are and who you were.
I I tell you what I've.
I lost my identity a milliontimes over the years.
(37:23):
I forgot who I was.
I'm finally starting to realizewho I am now, and I'm not
saying this is trauma, informed,or this is trauma, but when you
do go through something, youlose your identity, and a lot of
times when you lose youridentity.
Speaker 2 (37:41):
You lose your confidence Absolutely.
I can tell you about nights Ilaid on my kitchen floor crying
because I was worthless in mymind.
I wasn't that strong personthat I believed I was or that I
had built myself to be.
I lost all of that confidence,all of that self-esteem, but
(38:07):
what I realized is I was givingsomeone else power over what's
inside me, and that's bullshit.
That person cannot take away myconfidence and my esteem and
the things that I have built inmy life.
Those are mine and I'm notgiving them away.
(38:28):
So that's what I realized.
That helped me see that I amstill a badass, and that person
tried to make me not a badass,but I am.
And one of the things I willsuggest to people, if I may, is
to do what I call a strongenough list.
(38:48):
So I literally on my phone andmy notes and Android people I
don't know maybe you can draw acrayon on your phone or
something.
I'm kidding Android peopledon't hate me but in your notes
app, start making a list of thethings that you have
accomplished in your life, andit can be anything from you know
(39:11):
high school sports to making iton court TV, to having a
podcast to beating an illness,whatever it is.
You start that list and then,any time your confidence feels
shaken, you get out your phoneand you look at that list, feel
(39:34):
shaken.
You get out your phone and youlook at that list Because what
happens in your brain is, as youlook at those items, you start
to feel how you felt when thosethings occurred.
So when I look and see you werethe 800 meter state champion I
feel that you know when I readit and I'm like I sure was, like
I remember crossing that finishline and I remember this, that
and the other, and so thatbuilds up your confidence
(39:55):
because your brain relates backto that moment.
So make your strong enough list, add to it constantly, like
mine still grows because you'restill doing amazing things in
your life.
But that's the one thing that,for me, has been able to keep my
confidence up in those momentswhen you feel shaken.
Speaker 1 (40:19):
I really love that idea.
I use the notes app all thetime, but for different things,
just to make sure I don't goback into situations that I
don't want to go back to and toremember who I am.
But I like the idea of doing itpositive because I don't go
back into situations that Idon't want to go back to and to
remember who I am.
But I like the idea of doing itpositive because I don't want
to ruminate in negative thoughtsanymore.
I need to ruminate in positivestuff and, believe me, everybody
(40:43):
has something positive to sayabout themselves.
So many.
Speaker 2 (40:46):
And if you can't think of anything to start with,
ask your friends and family.
They will tell you.
They will say don't youremember the time you did X?
Or hey, what about when you didY?
Those are all positives.
So if you can't start your ownlist, ask the people around you.
(41:07):
You know what are some coolthings I have done and that will
start your list for you.
I forgot that I carried theOlympic torch until.
I started making my list and Iwas like holy shit, I did do
that.
I carried the Olympic torch.
So it's like you will rememberthings that had gone from the
memory because they happened somany years ago.
(41:29):
It's so crazy Like very heavyby the ago it's so crazy.
Speaker 1 (41:33):
Very heavy by the way it's very heavy.
Wow, I can only imagine it's acool experience.
It's tough.
You forget about the positives.
Speaker 2 (41:44):
A lot of times.
Speaker 1 (41:45):
You do because you get in your day-to-day monotony
and you're like, well, today waspositive, I did this today, but
you forget about your past.
Um, you know, I'm trying tothink about my consciousness,
like how long I could rememberback to.
There's something positive.
You could always think back tosomething negative.
(42:07):
Right now I want to startthinking about okay, when I 12
or 10, what did I do that waspositive, you know, and like to
me, like my weight has alwaysbeen a yo-yo, always, and I
always forget that the work thatI put into.
So when I was in eighth grade, Iwas a chub dub, really super
(42:27):
chubby, and I remember Icouldn't get on a football team
because I was so the localfootball team, because I was so
chubby, chubby.
And I remember I couldn't geton a football team because I was
so the local football team,because I was so chubby.
And I remember between myeighth grade and ninth grade, I
I was walking all the time, Iwas running, I was doing
everything I could, and then Iwas like super fit in ninth
grade, like, if you saw apicture of me in eighth grade,
be like, oh, that dude's chubby.
And then in ninth grade, like,oh, what happened to him and
(42:47):
it's like, and it's like, but Iforget.
You know, you forget aboutthings like that.
You always think about, like Ididn't make the football team
because I was chubby, but thenyou forget that you did the work
, so when you're a freshman,that you could do all this stuff
, and that you weren't, you know, overweight with and stuff.
So it's like, yeah, you got toalways forget.
Speaker 2 (43:07):
That's the shift that you need to make in your brain
is, instead of dwelling on thosenegatives and I will tell you,
we often also over exaggeratethe negatives Like, for example,
I remember one of the firstpodcasts I recorded and I kind
of lost my train of thought inthe middle of it and in my mind
(43:30):
I had done all this weird likearm flailing and stuttering, and
so when I sent it to my editorI was like hey, like I had this
complete moment of stupidity.
Please, like cut that wholething out.
And so then he contacts me andhe's like I have no idea what
you're talking about.
I watched the episode threetimes.
(43:50):
I cannot find what you'retalking about.
And so now I'm thinking he's anidiot.
So I go back in and watch it andit was a momentary, maybe half
of a second lapse of a thought,but in my mind I had made it
this ridiculous thing.
I was so embarrassed and itdidn't really even happen that
(44:12):
way.
So that's what our brains do.
They trick us sometimes andmake those negatives even worse.
So if you can flip to thepositive side and instead of
thinking I didn't make footballbecause I was chubby, and
turning that to, I worked reallyhard for a year so that I could
(44:33):
become fit enough and made thefootball team.
That's a total shift in yourbrain.
Speaker 1 (44:40):
You know I'm trying to.
I probably have to scroll backa long time now, but I think
when you first did Cork TV, youmight've said something like
that.
But it's TV.
You're only on there for a fewminutes and you, you think that
you made this big, grand gesture, grand gesture.
But then you're like oh no,nobody recognized that I do that
all the time.
I'm like because a lot of timesyou're just, you're thinking on
the fly.
You know you're trying to makea decision, but I'm almost
(45:00):
positive you did the same thingon one of your first appearances
.
I did Like you texted me.
I'm like no, I didn't noticethat at all.
What are you talking about?
Speaker 2 (45:10):
I did.
I was like, oh my God, they'renever going to call me back.
That was horrible.
And you were like I didn't seeanything.
And yes, it is on the fly.
I just want people to know.
Sometimes they change our topicin the commercial.
Literally in the commercial.
They're like oh yeah, what wesaid earlier, it's not that
anymore.
Now it's this other thing thatyou've never heard of.
Good luck talking about itintelligently in two minutes.
Speaker 1 (45:32):
Yeah, live TV.
Never heard of good lucktalking about it intelligently
in two minutes.
Yeah, live tv now think aboutthis is like did the old claudia
think she would ever be on tv?
Did you ever think you'd have apodcast?
Did you ever think you'd beopen?
This much about you'd be anopen book?
Speaker 2 (45:48):
never.
I was always very closed off uh, and a lot of that was from
other trauma when I was youngerbut I was very closed off.
I was terrified of publicspeaking.
I would avoid it at all costs.
And even like raising my handto answer something in school
(46:09):
Absolutely not.
That was public speaking to me,so that was never going to
happen.
So to see where I am today isamazing.
So, yeah, if I looked back atyou know 13 to 20 year old me,
she'd be like no way you'relying.
(46:29):
This is not true.
But that's how we evolve aspeople and that's how we can
take our traumas and ourchallenges and grow instead of
letting them keep us in thatsame spot.
I could still be that personwho's terrified to speak up.
I could still be that personwho just wants to sit in the
(46:51):
corner, who refuses to shareanything.
But who is that helping?
It's not helping me and it'snot helping anybody else either.
So growing into who you'remeant to be is what God, or
whatever you believe in, wantsyou to do.
Speaker 1 (47:11):
It makes me think because I'm like okay, so we
talked about before how you goin wants you to do.
It makes me think cause it'slike okay, so we talked about
before how you go from point Ato point B, and it doesn't look
like anything you can imagine.
It's not a straight line.
How did you start building yourconfidence that you could do
these things, and why?
Speaker 2 (47:28):
So I took a public speaking class in college, which
was horrifying.
But for me my real shift cameas a police officer, because the
other thing that I struggledwith was I never wanted to be a
leader, I never wanted to be incharge of anything because I
(47:52):
didn't want to mess up.
I didn't want to make the wrongdecision and be responsible for
messing people up.
And in rookie school that's notreally an option, because you
learn that you have to makedecisions in the blink of an eye
that really are sometimes lifeand death.
So I had to do it.
(48:14):
I was kind of forced into it andlearning that if I'm able to
take the information in front ofme and make a decision that I
can confidently defend, thenthat's all I can do.
And so once I started doingthat, more and more I became
(48:35):
confident in myself and I becameable to say I can speak up, I
can talk in front of people, Ican lead a group and make
decisions for the good ofeverybody, and I'm not always
going to make the rightdecisions, but I can explain to
you why I did what I did andthen learn and move forward.
(48:57):
So for me it was that publicspeaking class that was
terrifying, but it was reallythe career shift that I made and
wanting to be the best cop thatI could be, and to do that I
was going to have to get outsidemy comfort zone.
Speaker 1 (49:16):
You know, the big step was the public speaking
class and that's like the thingis like not everybody's going to
go become a cop, noteverybody's a cop, right, but
when you want and we're not justtalking about public speaking
here, now, we're talking aboutanother topic which is like if
you want to better yourself anddo something that's different,
like, let's say, you may be kindof introverted but you want to
(49:37):
get into public speaking, so youtake a public speaking speaking
class.
Let's say you want to become apilot.
Let's say you want to do this,you want to do that.
Take little baby steps, learnabout it.
Learn baby steps, learn aboutit, learn a little bit, function
about it.
You know, but you have to, like, start learning.
Don't say something that's trysomething new, try something you
(49:58):
always wanted to find a passion.
Speaker 2 (49:59):
Yeah, yeah, that's.
That's the key.
We we like to sit in our littleboxes, and I get it.
Our boxes are comfortable, youknow.
It's it's fun to be here andit's safe and secure.
But there's so much world outthere outside of our little
boxes and if you just take thatfirst step out, like you said,
(50:20):
learn.
You know there's something thatinterests you.
Learn a little about it.
Take an online class, you knowyou don't even have to really
put yourself out there per se.
You don't even have to reallyput yourself out there per se.
There's all kinds of siteswhere you can, either for free
or pay like 20 bucks and do acourse all on your own.
Speaker 1 (50:47):
So those are the baby steps that every single one of
us can do to get to your bestself.
Part of that also I wanted totalk about today was it doesn't
always have to be aboutbettering yourself as far as
like, and what I mean by that isnot bettering yourself to get
the next job or do the new thingor the new income stream or
this or that.
A lot of times it's betteringyourself just to be a better
(51:08):
person.
So I have my routine Work outin the morning, I come back and
I do paint my numbers.
Right now I'm doing this bigthing.
It's called the Everglades,it's like a picture of the
Everglades and I do one numbereach day and it's teaching me
patience, because we're so usedto scrolling, we're so used to
instant gratification and itdidn't just click until right
(51:29):
now.
I do it so my mind could take abreak and I could just focus on
trying to color paint inbetween the lines.
And I'm not doing it so I couldsell anything.
I'm not doing it to be like, oh, look at me, I'm the greatest
artist in the world.
No, I'm doing it because I needto slow down.
I need to like just accomplishsomething as little as getting
one number done a day, so itdoesn't always have to be about
(51:52):
the next next thing in your life.
Speaker 2 (51:55):
Absolutely.
You know I am working onimproving my Spanish.
I don't have any need for thatreally, but it's just something
that I want to do for myselfbecause it will make me feel
better and it's expanding mybrain, it's challenging me and
that's why I'm doing it, youknow, not so I can go on deport
(52:19):
days or whatever, but just tohave it for myself.
So I love that you brought thatup, because doing things just
to better yourself or just toimprove your knowledge or your
skill set, as in your patience,those are good things.
(52:40):
I think a lot of times we aretaught that doing something just
for yourself is selfish, andthat's not true.
We have to do things just forourselves.
We have to take care of us.
If you don't, that's when youcan't take care of anybody else,
because you're not better,you're not well.
(53:01):
So I love that you brought thatup and I totally agree with you
.
And it's not selfish to takethat time for you.
And I love paint by numbers.
That's amazing.
Speaker 1 (53:11):
It's literally like 20 minutes a day, but that 20
minutes is like, it's so nice,it's like, uh, there's a.
There's this other thing I dolike and I haven't done it in
like three years and it'sdriving me nuts, I'm gonna do it
this year is like my buddy hasan amateur racing.
I mean racing cars yes it'slike endurance.
It's uh, you know you drive twohours at a time and it's, it's
(53:31):
the most incredible experienceever.
And it's like endurance.
It's you know you drive twohours at a time and it's the
most incredible experience ever.
And it's like real racing.
You know you got thefire-returning suit on, you got
this and that and for that twohours you're in the cockpit and
you're driving.
Nothing matters except what'sin your mirrors and in front of
you and behind you.
Nothing matters, nothingmatters.
(53:57):
You've got to find a, a solace,a peace for yourself, because I
swear, if you do something foryourself that could calm you,
it's gonna help all of yourrelationships out a hundred
percent.
Speaker 2 (54:06):
I used to go to a horse rescue and I don't anymore
because I moved, so I couldprobably find another one.
But if you haven't been aroundhorses, they require all of your
attention.
And horses apparently like theycan kind of sense when you're
unfocused and they won't listento you and they'll do their own
(54:30):
thing.
You really have to be in thatmoment, in that space, with the
right mindset to deal with yourhorse and make them, you know,
run the obstacle course orwhatever you're doing.
And that was kind of one of thefirst things I did to really
learn how to shut everythingelse off, because I am one of
(54:54):
those people that's always on myphone, I work from my phone.
I can literally have my laptopin front of me and then work on
my phone at the same time.
So I have tried to do thingsthat helped me put my phone down
, and that horse time was thebest If you have the opportunity
to do that, because they willknow I don't know how they know,
(55:15):
but they know if you are notfully engaged and present with
them and they won't listen toyou.
So that was big for me to learn.
Speaker 1 (55:28):
They are so intuitive .
They are, oh my gosh.
So just find, find out who youwant to be, find out who you are
.
It's so easy to say, hey, justfind out who you are and find
out who you are, but really itjust comes down to just little
little things every day to tofigure out who you are and it'll
come.
(55:48):
It'll come quick, um, a lotquicker than you think once you
start.
Speaker 2 (55:54):
Once you start paying attention, you know, look at
the things that you see, thatinterest.
You Look at what TV that youwatch.
You know, like I watch allkinds of true crime.
I have been watching that sinceI was little.
So that told me you know youwant to be somehow involved in
(56:15):
crime, not committing it, but onthe other side.
But you know, maybe you love towatch baking shows, so maybe
get out the stand mixer and tryto bake yourself.
You know, just pay attention tothe little cues in your life
and that will lead you to whoyou are and who you want to be.
Speaker 1 (56:38):
Find your hobby Something outside of like the
norm that everybody you know.
And a hobby to me is like Ilove shooting, I love shooting,
I love doing all this and stufflike that.
It's not really a hobby, it'slike it's something I've enjoyed
doing, but it's not like yeah,I don't even know how to explain
it.
It's something different.
(56:58):
Photography for me now is likemy new I can't even say it's new
.
I've always wanted to do it.
Find something that juststimulates you, that you enjoy
that you enjoy.
Speaker 2 (57:17):
I totally agree I used to do those little diamond
paintings.
Do you remember those?
It's kind of like the paint bynumber, where it required that
focus.
So for me, yes, I don't want tobe a painter, nor does anybody
else want me to be a painter, Ipromise that.
But it allowed me that time tomyself to relax and to have that
(57:37):
patience.
I used to cross stitch littlethings like that.
It's that time for me just tosit by myself.
A lot of people areuncomfortable with that, I tell
you alone.
Speaker 1 (57:53):
Loneliness, it's a new thing.
There's a difference betweenbeing alone and being low and
having loneliness.
But, sometimes, when you haveloneliness, you need to find
those things that can kind ofget you out of it.
It's okay to be alone, I meanit is.
Just don't get back to what wefirst initially started this
conversation with was aboutdepression.
(58:15):
It's about okay, I'm alone.
It's not the end of the world.
There are positive things Icould do to get me out of it so
I don't get depressed by beingalone.
Speaker 2 (58:28):
Exactly, exactly.
And because the last thing youwant to do is rush into a space
where you are no longer alonebecause you were afraid to be
alone.
So obviously in a relationshipcontext, you know and I'm guilty
of that years ago of kind ofrushing into that next thing
because I was afraid to be alone.
(58:49):
And now being alone, I don'twant to say it's my favorite
thing, it's not.
But I enjoy the peace that Ican experience by myself and
that comes with practice and theability to look inward and
understand yourself and not beafraid of yourself, yourself and
(59:14):
not be afraid of yourself, notbe afraid of the thoughts in
your head, not want to alwayspush them away.
So I'm cool with me now and Iwasn't for a time, but I like me
and I wouldn't always have beenable to say that.
Speaker 1 (59:25):
I love that.
That's a good point.
To get to our last questionthis is something new is like
point to get to our lastquestion this is something new.
I'm stealing this from anotherpodcast what is the best piece
of advice that you were givenand why Someone else gave you
this advice?
Speaker 2 (59:41):
Oh, wow.
Speaker 1 (59:43):
It's a tough one, huh .
Speaker 2 (59:44):
It is, I'm going to say, decisions of the head
versus decisions of the heart.
So when you're making decisions, where are they coming from?
And you need to be able todifferentiate.
So if you're making a decisionof the head, that's, that's well
(01:00:10):
thought through and understood,that's okay.
But we can get in trouble whenwe make decisions of the heart,
when we let our emotions takecontrol and we don't think of
the consequences or thepotential outcomes and we just
make that decision purely basedon that emotion.
(01:00:30):
That's where we can get intotrouble.
So I think that's the bestpiece of advice I have ever
gotten is to not let emotionscontrol us, because that's
really easy to do sometimes.
But we've got to take that stepback and breathe and know that
there's a rational piece of usin there and we need to bring
(01:00:53):
that in before we do somethingthat might not be in our best
interest.
Speaker 1 (01:00:59):
That is excellent advice, and I'm going to learn
it myself.
Well, claudia, I appreciate youcoming on.
Speaker 2 (01:01:05):
Thank you, jason.
Always a pleasure, and we'llhave to do this again.
Speaker 1 (01:01:10):
Absolutely.
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