April 3, 2025 • 21 mins
Derek Jackson shares his journey from Air Force jet engine mechanic to OSI special agent, revealing the intense personal and professional challenges of federal law enforcement, and how these experiences inspired his crime thriller novel "Shadow One."
• Starting as an enlisted jet engine mechanic before getting recruited to OSI
• Discussing the reality of FLETC (Federal Law Enforcement Training Center) and the demanding training process
• Transitioning from mechanic to criminal investigator and the mental shift required
• Balancing investigative work with personal life and relationships
• Using music to inspire creative writing and developing characters
• Exploring how traumatic cases affect agents psychologically
• Turning real-life experiences into a crime thriller novel
• Finding the courage to follow your own path despite others' doubts
Find Derek Jackson's book "Shadow One" on Amazon, Barnes & Noble, Books A Million, and Walmart online.
Make sure to check out Jason on IG @drjasonpiccolo
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:12):
Hey, welcome to the protectors podcast.
We have Derek Jackson on today.
Retired air force OSI.
You know that's like the.
I like to say it's the.
It's the Hilton version of NCIS.
Ncis, you know that's like youknow Motel 8 and you know it's
(00:34):
the Navy.
You know you're never going tobe able to stay in anywhere nice
.
But Air Force man, that's likethe good digs.
Actually, I should say it'slike the four seasons.
Hey, welcome to the showbrother.
Hey, jason, thanks a lot forthe invitation, looking forward
to a great conversation.
Yeah, bro, so you started outenlisted, right?
Speaker 2 (00:53):
And then you got, from what I understand, you got
recruited in OSI Right.
So I enlisted in the Air Forceright after high school.
Initially I was a jet enginemechanic, so my first three
bases I was working on transportaircraft and then I wound up
working F-15 fighters at TyndallAir Force Base.
And then it was at Tyndallbecause for a few years, you
know, the law enforcement bugwas kind of following me around
(01:15):
and I was interested in federallaw enforcement and there was an
opportunity within the AirForce, since I couldn't in my
enlistment excuse me, I couldn'tin my enlistment at that moment
.
The opportunity was with theOffice of Special Investigations
, the OSI.
I didn't know a lot about whatthey did, you know, to me at the
time I thought they were verysecretive, to be honest with you
(01:38):
, but I thought it was kind ofcool.
I just wanted to learn a littlebit more about it at least.
So I went over and introducedmyself, asked for a briefing
because you know I thought I maybe interested in joining, and
what I learned about the agency,I fell in love with it.
I put in my package that tookabout six months, you know the
(01:58):
background investigation, thenthe suitability investigation.
You know, just because you canget a top secret clearance, it
doesn't mean that they're goingto want you to come work with
them.
So that's the importance ofthat suitability investigation.
But after about six months thatwas all approved, good to go
Went to, I think, five to sixmonths of training at the
(02:18):
Federal Law Enforcement TrainingCenter in Georgia, fleet Tech
brother, fleet Tech man.
I've been there center ingeorgia.
Speaker 1 (02:27):
Fleetech brother, fleetech man, I've been there.
Yeah, you know what let's?
Let's talk about fleetech.
One of my friends hit me.
One of my friends hit me uptoday.
They're like do you saw apicture of the chow hall food?
I'm like food it.
Was it really food?
Speaker 2 (02:35):
it was.
It was so-called chicken breastevery day with cheese on it
exactly the chicken breast.
Speaker 1 (02:40):
It is like in a pan and it was like.
It was just like a pan of hotwater.
Speaker 2 (02:49):
So if anybody, does yeah.
Speaker 1 (02:50):
If anybody doesn't know, the federal law
enforcement training center, akaflea tech, is in Brunswick,
georgia, and if you're a federalagent outside of, like DEA and
FBI, you go there and it'sanywhere.
Like me, I was there for borderpatrol, I was there for the
1811 course, I was there forfollow-on courses.
Speaker 2 (03:06):
I think I spent like two years in that place, man
that's a very long time yeah,unfortunately, the first time I
went was during the summer andoh, you can imagine how hot it
was oh, I remember that firsttime for me was january for the
border patrol and the secondtime was May for testing.
Speaker 1 (03:24):
Yeah, I started Then the follow-on courses were in
January.
I was like ooh, thank you.
Speaker 2 (03:27):
Yeah right.
Speaker 1 (03:29):
So you went through the regular 1811 course right as
an Air Force OSI.
Speaker 2 (03:34):
Yep.
So we had to go through two.
Of course, the criminalinvestigator training program
which, as she mentioned, 1811course, kind of like a police
academy for federal agents.
1811 course, kind of like apolice academy for federal
agents.
You know your basic training.
Right after that we started theAir Force basic investigations
course at the same location.
So that's another two, two anda half months of specific Air
(03:55):
Force investigative training.
Speaker 1 (03:56):
And that must have been cool.
You know, you come from such adiverse background I mean from
mechanic to criminalinvestigator and now you're
learning this.
You've built a whole newidentity, Right, and now you've
got to get into that mindset.
Ok, now you've got to go and dothe investigation.
So that must be a really coolfeeling, man.
Speaker 2 (04:11):
It was.
It was quite a transition, tobe honest with you.
You know the first 12 months.
You know all agents start outon probation and it's
challenging for everyone.
You're learning, you know, abrand new career field.
So much responsibility isplaced on you and most people
struggle with that timemanagement because you're not
working set hours.
Okay, nine to five, I'm goinghome.
(04:32):
No, you go home, you know, atthe end of the day, but it's
probably not going to be aneight-hour shift, I can
guarantee you that.
And so a lot of people strugglewith that time management,
being able to understand, okay,what is my investigation about
and how do you know when you'vereached the end of it.
Because some people can digthemselves into holes and, you
know, follow the shiny objectsthat lead them away from what
(04:56):
they should be focusing on.
So I was like everybody else.
I struggled my first, you know,12 months as a probationary
agent, not just with the cases,but there was so much, you know,
that they put on you inadditional duties.
You know I had to manage theweapons program, the ammunition
program and coming off of youknow the flight line working.
You know F-15s.
That was completely differentthan what I was used to.
(05:16):
It was a completely differentmindset, and when you go out and
you meet people in the base andin the area, they don't care
that you've only been on the jobfor two weeks, you know you.
You're an agent, so you'resupposed to know everything on
day one.
So it was quite challenging andyou know, ultimately I kind of
got up to speed where I neededto be and then my career kind of
took off from there.
Speaker 1 (05:36):
That's really cool, man.
And then you did that for acareer, wise, and, and you're
going to come back on a showWe've already talked about that
because I want to get into likea little long form with you
today, but I do want to talkabout your book and I want you
know to kind of get into that alot more than like your career,
because there's so much tosomeone that doesn't fit into a
20, 25 minute podcast or even anhour.
Speaker 2 (05:56):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (05:56):
So let's talk about it.
You retire and then like, wheredid this writing bug come from?
Speaker 2 (06:02):
Honestly, it was a complete surprise to me.
So after I retired from the AirForce, took a job in corporate
security and then that's when Ihad the nine to five job I had
so much free time after that andthe things that we were
investigating compared to beingan OSI agent.
Now I'm investigating companypolicies Great people that I
(06:23):
work with.
You know I really appreciate it.
The pay was a lot better.
You know there was a letdown.
You know I didn't feel asfulfilled as I did when I was an
agent.
But I was thinking okay, thisis the transition, it's time for
this.
And I found myself with a lotmore free time than I did when I
was on active duty.
And so that's when I initiallyhad the idea that I would start
(06:46):
writing a book and I startedworking on it probably for about
a month and I stopped.
We had a restructuring at mycompany at the time.
I decided I need to kind offocus on something else besides
writing a book.
But then things kind of calmeddown for me in my work life and
I came right back to it.
(07:07):
I just had this story that Ifelt that I needed to tell and
initially I wrote the screenplayand you know I got some
feedback on the screenplay thatyou know I had a really good
story but that I needed to getmore attention and the way to do
that was to turn the screenplayinto a book.
So, yes, I absolutely did itbackwards, because usually you
(07:27):
would write the book first.
But you know I had to take it.
You know, take my own routehere and I started writing the
book.
The hardest day was the firstday when I'm looking at the
blank screen and that cursor isjust sitting there, blinking,
daring me to write something,sitting there blinking, daring
me to write something.
But once I finally found thenerve to go ahead and get
started, you know the story kindof took on.
(07:50):
You know what it wanted tobecome.
I had a structure that I kindof wanted to follow and I
thought I knew what the storywas going to be as I started
writing.
But as I started to develop thecharacters even more and give
them more background than whatthey had initially in the
screenplay, the story kind oftook, you know, its own route
and shaped itself and I'm reallyproud of, you know the the
(08:11):
final outcome of it yeah, I'venoticed I've talked to a lot of
authors and I talked a lot ofmilitary authors and a lot of
them.
Speaker 1 (08:19):
They don't have a linear route.
They don't have, okay, this,this protagonist is going to go
from a to b to c to d to e to f,and then they have it all
mapped out in their head andthey have these big link charts
and everything.
A lot of it is really justwriting on the go and using your
imagination and you know, keepthe baseline.
You know.
So you got, you know the bigpicture but overall the action,
sequences and everything thatgoes with it, right?
Speaker 2 (08:41):
you know, for me, you know I will sit there.
Ok, I want to go from.
I'm writing a certain scene andI want to go from A to Z, but I
wasn't wasn't exactly sure howI was going to get there.
You know, what was thetemperature of this scene?
What's what's the vibe, what'sthe emotion?
And early on I kind ofstruggled a little bit, to be
honest with you, and I wrote alittle bit and didn't really
(09:04):
like what I had put down, didn'tthink it was good enough.
And then what I started torealize was that as I was
listening to music, certainsongs, you know, unintentionally
at first certain songs wouldremind me of certain scenes that
I needed to write for the book.
And as I just listened to thatsong over and over and over, the
(09:24):
scene started to write itselfand I was able to take the
emotion that I received from themusic and put that into the
writing.
Speaker 1 (09:32):
Isn't it crazy how music is such an integral part?
You were the first person I'vetalked to who mentioned
listening to tunes.
Speaker 2 (09:41):
Oh, it's huge.
It's huge man.
Speaker 1 (09:43):
Oh, it's huge man, like today, like my protagonist
song is like.
So I watched a TV show,daredevil, and they had this
scene at the end of the theseason where, um, uh, one of the
episodes where there's it's TVon a radio staring at the sun,
and that's like my protagonistsong now.
So anytime I'm doing anythingwhere there's a gym or anything,
I'll put that thing on and I'mlike you know what this is cool?
Now I'm thinking like when Iwrite, you put the protagonist
(10:05):
songs on.
So you kind of get into thefield Because, think about it.
When you put like you know yougot Hans Zimmer or one of those
guys and you're like you knowyou're watching one of these
movies and all of a sudden, likethe music is such an integral
part and can you imagine likenow you're doing it, writing,
and you're the first person Iknow that's actually talked
about that.
Speaker 2 (10:24):
Yeah, it was a very big part of my book.
Again, I didn't set out tolisten to certain music.
It's just, you know, as songswere playing and, to be honest
with you, as I was getting boredand scrolling on TikTok,
certain songs would jump out atme and I was like, hmm, let me
listen to that again.
Then I would end up downloadingthe song and then it would take
(10:45):
me to places in my writing thatI didn't think I was going to
go.
You know, I dare say, eventhough this book, you know it's
got human trafficking, it's gotdrugs, it's got murder, you know
sexual assault, all the thingsthat you would expect from a
crime thriller it has anoverarching romantic story that
(11:05):
goes along with it.
And you know our main characterhas to make a decision early on
in the book whether or not he'sgoing to follow his dreams to
become a federal agent or staywith the person that he's been
in love with and that he's beenplanning to spend the rest of
his life with, because she wantsnothing to do with law
enforcement at all, she doesn'twant to be around it, she
(11:26):
doesn't even want to take apicture of it, she wants nothing
to do with it and she's reallyupset that he does so.
You know, they come to acrossroads in their relationship
and I guess you can kind oftell which direction he went,
being that the book is based onhim being an agent.
But that relationship betweenthose two kind of follows along
throughout the book.
That relationship between thosetwo kind of follows along
(11:47):
throughout the book and I wantedto tell not only the story of
the investigations and how someof the tactics were carried out,
but I wanted to tell the storyof the people who were actually
doing the job, to look behindthe curtains and kind of expose
a little bit to how the jobactually affects the people who
are doing these things, how theytake it home, how it affects
(12:07):
their personal lives and howtheir personal lives, you know,
inadvertently get carried backinto their job.
You know, in a job like thisand I'm sure you can relate when
you're talking to people everyday who have experienced the
worst day of their life you know, in the Air Force and I guess
in every branch, there are a lotof sexual assaults.
I don't care who you are, howtough you are at some point when
(12:32):
you're making someone relivethat type of trauma, down to the
smallest detail.
What were you thinking whenthis happened?
Yeah, you know what.
What was going through yourhead.
What did you tell him?
What did he say to you?
Were you making that personrelive that in order to be able
to to bring justice for them?
It takes a toll on you, youknow and I'm not comparing, you
(12:56):
know, what I felt to the personwho actually went through that.
But you know, day after day,month after month of going, you
know, putting yourself in theirshoes, it kind of has an effect
on you.
And that's kind of what I wantedto show, because the main
character in this book and Iwill tell you it is kind of
based off true events from mylife.
(13:17):
It's a fictional story but youknow there's a lot of truth into
it.
We can see how this characterkind of goes down a dark spiral
because he's trying his best tobe a really good agent, but
every time he tries to dosomething proactive it kind of
bites him in his rear end, evenwhen he's just out trying to
(13:38):
meet people, trying to introducehimself.
The people know who he is, buthe has no idea who they are.
And that comes to a headtowards the end of our book here
, when the hunters become thehunted and he has to figure out
okay, is this really what I wantto do?
Because ever since I picked upthis badge, there's been nothing
(13:58):
but heartache and drama in mylife.
And he starts to think, man,did I really make the right
decision?
And he has to find it withinhimself, the strength to
continue on.
Speaker 1 (14:07):
That is the key to all this world.
Man, how many people were youat the academy with and this and
that who become 1811s?
And they have that loved one.
That's like you know they'rethere, but then the career takes
over, and the career takes over.
And the career takes overbecause you want to prove
yourself, you want to prove yourmettle in the first few years
(14:29):
and then you're all of a suddenyou're into this like different
world, and you're like did Imake the right decision?
Speaker 2 (14:37):
Because on day one your life was never going to be
the same.
It can't be the same.
You have to present yourselfdifferently.
You have to carry yourselfdifferently.
Speaker 1 (14:59):
The responsibility that you have is tremendous and,
like I said earlier, whenpeople see you they don't care
how long you've been on the job,they just know that you're on
the job.
That's a job series 1811, or ifyou're Air Force OSI enlisted,
your job title is criminalinvestigator, so they look at
anybody who has that title as anexpert.
It doesn't matter if you're anexpert in anything, but you are
an expert in everything.
Speaker 2 (15:17):
Exactly.
Speaker 1 (15:17):
So yeah, you're the jack of all trades and people
don't realize that.
A lot of times it takes time tospecialize it does.
Speaker 2 (15:24):
A lot of times it takes time to specialize.
It does, and that's one of thethings I really liked about OSI.
Usually after your probationaryyear there's so many other
areas that you could go into.
For me I kind of went.
It wasn't really a specialty,but it kind of turned into that.
I went into counterintelligence.
There are some people who gointo counterespionage or
(15:47):
polygraph.
Some people get more intoforensics.
So there are other avenues thatyou can get into other than
just criminal investigations.
But there's nothing wrong withcriminal investigations either.
Speaker 1 (15:57):
No, not at all.
So tell us about the book.
Give us the thousand footoverview of the book.
Speaker 2 (16:02):
Yeah, so the main character, devin, he is a jet
engine mechanic.
He is stationed in Hawaii atthe moment and, as I mentioned,
he gets called and says hey, theopportunity of a lifetime has
been presented to you.
You put your package in severalmonths ago and you got approved
.
You have the opportunity tobecome an OSI agent.
And he is so excited to go andtell his girlfriend, who he
(16:26):
assumes will soon be his fianceand it doesn't go well.
Like I said, she doesn't wantanything to do with the police
and that night they have tofigure out are they going to
stay together or is he going tofollow his dreams?
And he makes that decision andit kind of haunts her for a very
long time because it seems likeshe turned her back on him.
(16:49):
So he leaves, goes off totraining and, as I mentioned,
really struggles the first year.
You know he put us to some verylight situations but doesn't
really have a mentor to help himalong.
So at about the one year markhe finds himself being stationed
at Osan Air Base and this iswhen he finds the mentors that
(17:09):
he's been looking for, thelike-minded co-workers who don't
want to just sit at the deskwaiting for the phone to ring.
Those type of people that say,hey, let's get up, let's go make
it happen introduced themselvesto some people who were engaged
(17:29):
in an international drugsmuggling ring, who also had
ties to an international humantrafficking ring.
And so when they introducedthemselves, not realizing who
they're talking to, the bad guyskind of think that one of them
has become a rat and sold themout to OSI, so they have to take
care of the rat within to OSI,so they have to take care of the
rat within, and then they'relooking to see who they can take
(17:50):
care of at OSI.
And our characters have a reallystrong friendship, you know, at
work and out of work.
It's really fun to see howpeople you know not only the
agents but just enlisted peopleinteract with each other, how
they spend their downtime, howthey have different type of
romances.
That's going on and they beginto question if one of the
(18:13):
members of their team isactually working with this crime
syndicate who is involved withthis human trafficking, because
some of the things just aren'tadding up.
He's not where he's supposed tobe, he's making some statements
that seem a little bitquestionable, and it has to be
one of my best friends in thebook and it's going to be
interesting to see what happenswith him.
(18:34):
Can the team stay together,especially when the bad guys
start targeting them?
And they're going to have tofind a way to put their team
back together and find thestrength to continue out their
mission.
Speaker 1 (18:45):
I this book a lot just because of my background
with Fletchian as a specialagent.
I like books that are rooted inreality.
Speaker 2 (18:53):
Yeah, yeah.
And yeah, yeah, they say that'sa part, uh, beginning of the
second chapter where he does histraining at Fletchian.
I didn't want to go too too farinto it because you know there
are people that are stilltraining, but I touched on it a
little bit and I think you'll befamiliar with some of it,
especially the searches and someof the work at the shoot houses
(19:16):
.
Speaker 1 (19:17):
Oh yeah, it's going to be fun.
Man, that place has changed,but it hasn't changed over the
past 20-something years.
I mean it's crazy.
Speaker 2 (19:24):
I hope the food has changed.
Speaker 1 (19:27):
Oh no, the food has not changed at all, I'm sure.
Okay, last question for you andthis is what I'm starting to
ask on every podcast is what isthe best piece of advice you
have ever been given been given,and why?
Speaker 2 (19:42):
The best piece of advice I've ever been given is
to believe in yourself, and ifyou have to march to the beat of
your own drum.
When I was 17 and I, I toldpeople that I was going in the
Air Force.
Grown men who had my bestinterest in mind told me don't
go in the Air Force, dosomething else.
(20:02):
You shouldn't.
There's no place for you in theAir Force, and I felt that
that's where I needed to be.
When I made the decision that Iwanted to cross train and become
a special agent, people thatcared a lot about me really
tried to convince me not to dothat.
You really need to think aboutthis thing.
I'm not sure this is what youwant to do, but it was in me to
(20:23):
do it.
And I heard some of the samevoices when I said, hey, I'm
going to write a book, andpeople kind of looked at me a
little bit strangely, didn'tthink I was really going to be
dedicated to it, until they readthe book.
And then they realized well,they were wrong about me going
in the Air Force, they werewrong about me joining OSI.
And once they read the book,they realized they were wrong
(20:45):
about me writing a book.
So the best advice I would giveanyone is follow your heart and
go where you think you need togo.
Speaker 1 (20:52):
I like that.
You have to follow your mission, your own personal mission, and
you have to find and, like inthis book says, you have to find
a partner who's going to followthat mission with you.
Speaker 2 (21:00):
Exactly, exactly.
Speaker 1 (21:03):
Well, brother, everybody, the book is Derek
Jackson's Shadow One.
It's out now on Amazon and Ibelieve Barnes Noble as well,
right, yes, Barnes, Noble BooksA Million, and also online at
Walmart.
Speaker 2 (21:14):
Oh, very cool man.
Hey, welcome to the protectors podcast.
We have Derek Jackson on today.
Retired air force OSI.
You know that's like the.
I like to say it's the.
It's the Hilton version of NCIS.
Ncis, you know that's like youknow Motel 8 and you know it's
(00:34):
the Navy.
You know you're never going tobe able to stay in anywhere nice
.
But Air Force man, that's likethe good digs.
Actually, I should say it'slike the four seasons.
Hey, welcome to the showbrother.
Hey, jason, thanks a lot forthe invitation, looking forward
to a great conversation.
Yeah, bro, so you started outenlisted, right?
Speaker 2 (00:53):
And then you got, from what I understand, you got
recruited in OSI Right.
So I enlisted in the Air Forceright after high school.
Initially I was a jet enginemechanic, so my first three
bases I was working on transportaircraft and then I wound up
working F-15 fighters at TyndallAir Force Base.
And then it was at Tyndallbecause for a few years, you
know, the law enforcement bugwas kind of following me around
(01:15):
and I was interested in federallaw enforcement and there was an
opportunity within the AirForce, since I couldn't in my
enlistment excuse me, I couldn'tin my enlistment at that moment
.
The opportunity was with theOffice of Special Investigations
, the OSI.
I didn't know a lot about whatthey did, you know, to me at the
time I thought they were verysecretive, to be honest with you
(01:38):
, but I thought it was kind ofcool.
I just wanted to learn a littlebit more about it at least.
So I went over and introducedmyself, asked for a briefing
because you know I thought I maybe interested in joining, and
what I learned about the agency,I fell in love with it.
I put in my package that tookabout six months, you know the
(01:58):
background investigation, thenthe suitability investigation.
You know, just because you canget a top secret clearance, it
doesn't mean that they're goingto want you to come work with
them.
So that's the importance ofthat suitability investigation.
But after about six months thatwas all approved, good to go
Went to, I think, five to sixmonths of training at the
(02:18):
Federal Law Enforcement TrainingCenter in Georgia, fleet Tech
brother, fleet Tech man.
I've been there center ingeorgia.
Speaker 1 (02:27):
Fleetech brother, fleetech man, I've been there.
Yeah, you know what let's?
Let's talk about fleetech.
One of my friends hit me.
One of my friends hit me uptoday.
They're like do you saw apicture of the chow hall food?
I'm like food it.
Was it really food?
Speaker 2 (02:35):
it was.
It was so-called chicken breastevery day with cheese on it
exactly the chicken breast.
Speaker 1 (02:40):
It is like in a pan and it was like.
It was just like a pan of hotwater.
Speaker 2 (02:49):
So if anybody, does yeah.
Speaker 1 (02:50):
If anybody doesn't know, the federal law
enforcement training center, akaflea tech, is in Brunswick,
georgia, and if you're a federalagent outside of, like DEA and
FBI, you go there and it'sanywhere.
Like me, I was there for borderpatrol, I was there for the
1811 course, I was there forfollow-on courses.
Speaker 2 (03:06):
I think I spent like two years in that place, man
that's a very long time yeah,unfortunately, the first time I
went was during the summer andoh, you can imagine how hot it
was oh, I remember that firsttime for me was january for the
border patrol and the secondtime was May for testing.
Speaker 1 (03:24):
Yeah, I started Then the follow-on courses were in
January.
I was like ooh, thank you.
Speaker 2 (03:27):
Yeah right.
Speaker 1 (03:29):
So you went through the regular 1811 course right as
an Air Force OSI.
Speaker 2 (03:34):
Yep.
So we had to go through two.
Of course, the criminalinvestigator training program
which, as she mentioned, 1811course, kind of like a police
academy for federal agents.
1811 course, kind of like apolice academy for federal
agents.
You know your basic training.
Right after that we started theAir Force basic investigations
course at the same location.
So that's another two, two anda half months of specific Air
(03:55):
Force investigative training.
Speaker 1 (03:56):
And that must have been cool.
You know, you come from such adiverse background I mean from
mechanic to criminalinvestigator and now you're
learning this.
You've built a whole newidentity, Right, and now you've
got to get into that mindset.
Ok, now you've got to go and dothe investigation.
So that must be a really coolfeeling, man.
Speaker 2 (04:11):
It was.
It was quite a transition, tobe honest with you.
You know the first 12 months.
You know all agents start outon probation and it's
challenging for everyone.
You're learning, you know, abrand new career field.
So much responsibility isplaced on you and most people
struggle with that timemanagement because you're not
working set hours.
Okay, nine to five, I'm goinghome.
(04:32):
No, you go home, you know, atthe end of the day, but it's
probably not going to be aneight-hour shift, I can
guarantee you that.
And so a lot of people strugglewith that time management,
being able to understand, okay,what is my investigation about
and how do you know when you'vereached the end of it.
Because some people can digthemselves into holes and, you
know, follow the shiny objectsthat lead them away from what
(04:56):
they should be focusing on.
So I was like everybody else.
I struggled my first, you know,12 months as a probationary
agent, not just with the cases,but there was so much, you know,
that they put on you inadditional duties.
You know I had to manage theweapons program, the ammunition
program and coming off of youknow the flight line working.
You know F-15s.
That was completely differentthan what I was used to.
(05:16):
It was a completely differentmindset, and when you go out and
you meet people in the base andin the area, they don't care
that you've only been on the jobfor two weeks, you know you.
You're an agent, so you'resupposed to know everything on
day one.
So it was quite challenging andyou know, ultimately I kind of
got up to speed where I neededto be and then my career kind of
took off from there.
Speaker 1 (05:36):
That's really cool, man.
And then you did that for acareer, wise, and, and you're
going to come back on a showWe've already talked about that
because I want to get into likea little long form with you
today, but I do want to talkabout your book and I want you
know to kind of get into that alot more than like your career,
because there's so much tosomeone that doesn't fit into a
20, 25 minute podcast or even anhour.
Speaker 2 (05:56):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (05:56):
So let's talk about it.
You retire and then like, wheredid this writing bug come from?
Speaker 2 (06:02):
Honestly, it was a complete surprise to me.
So after I retired from the AirForce, took a job in corporate
security and then that's when Ihad the nine to five job I had
so much free time after that andthe things that we were
investigating compared to beingan OSI agent.
Now I'm investigating companypolicies Great people that I
(06:23):
work with.
You know I really appreciate it.
The pay was a lot better.
You know there was a letdown.
You know I didn't feel asfulfilled as I did when I was an
agent.
But I was thinking okay, thisis the transition, it's time for
this.
And I found myself with a lotmore free time than I did when I
was on active duty.
And so that's when I initiallyhad the idea that I would start
(06:46):
writing a book and I startedworking on it probably for about
a month and I stopped.
We had a restructuring at mycompany at the time.
I decided I need to kind offocus on something else besides
writing a book.
But then things kind of calmeddown for me in my work life and
I came right back to it.
(07:07):
I just had this story that Ifelt that I needed to tell and
initially I wrote the screenplayand you know I got some
feedback on the screenplay thatyou know I had a really good
story but that I needed to getmore attention and the way to do
that was to turn the screenplayinto a book.
So, yes, I absolutely did itbackwards, because usually you
(07:27):
would write the book first.
But you know I had to take it.
You know, take my own routehere and I started writing the
book.
The hardest day was the firstday when I'm looking at the
blank screen and that cursor isjust sitting there, blinking,
daring me to write something,sitting there blinking, daring
me to write something.
But once I finally found thenerve to go ahead and get
started, you know the story kindof took on.
(07:50):
You know what it wanted tobecome.
I had a structure that I kindof wanted to follow and I
thought I knew what the storywas going to be as I started
writing.
But as I started to develop thecharacters even more and give
them more background than whatthey had initially in the
screenplay, the story kind oftook, you know, its own route
and shaped itself and I'm reallyproud of, you know the the
(08:11):
final outcome of it yeah, I'venoticed I've talked to a lot of
authors and I talked a lot ofmilitary authors and a lot of
them.
Speaker 1 (08:19):
They don't have a linear route.
They don't have, okay, this,this protagonist is going to go
from a to b to c to d to e to f,and then they have it all
mapped out in their head andthey have these big link charts
and everything.
A lot of it is really justwriting on the go and using your
imagination and you know, keepthe baseline.
You know.
So you got, you know the bigpicture but overall the action,
sequences and everything thatgoes with it, right?
Speaker 2 (08:41):
you know, for me, you know I will sit there.
Ok, I want to go from.
I'm writing a certain scene andI want to go from A to Z, but I
wasn't wasn't exactly sure howI was going to get there.
You know, what was thetemperature of this scene?
What's what's the vibe, what'sthe emotion?
And early on I kind ofstruggled a little bit, to be
honest with you, and I wrote alittle bit and didn't really
(09:04):
like what I had put down, didn'tthink it was good enough.
And then what I started torealize was that as I was
listening to music, certainsongs, you know, unintentionally
at first certain songs wouldremind me of certain scenes that
I needed to write for the book.
And as I just listened to thatsong over and over and over, the
(09:24):
scene started to write itselfand I was able to take the
emotion that I received from themusic and put that into the
writing.
Speaker 1 (09:32):
Isn't it crazy how music is such an integral part?
You were the first person I'vetalked to who mentioned
listening to tunes.
Speaker 2 (09:41):
Oh, it's huge.
It's huge man.
Speaker 1 (09:43):
Oh, it's huge man, like today, like my protagonist
song is like.
So I watched a TV show,daredevil, and they had this
scene at the end of the theseason where, um, uh, one of the
episodes where there's it's TVon a radio staring at the sun,
and that's like my protagonistsong now.
So anytime I'm doing anythingwhere there's a gym or anything,
I'll put that thing on and I'mlike you know what this is cool?
Now I'm thinking like when Iwrite, you put the protagonist
(10:05):
songs on.
So you kind of get into thefield Because, think about it.
When you put like you know yougot Hans Zimmer or one of those
guys and you're like you knowyou're watching one of these
movies and all of a sudden, likethe music is such an integral
part and can you imagine likenow you're doing it, writing,
and you're the first person Iknow that's actually talked
about that.
Speaker 2 (10:24):
Yeah, it was a very big part of my book.
Again, I didn't set out tolisten to certain music.
It's just, you know, as songswere playing and, to be honest
with you, as I was getting boredand scrolling on TikTok,
certain songs would jump out atme and I was like, hmm, let me
listen to that again.
Then I would end up downloadingthe song and then it would take
(10:45):
me to places in my writing thatI didn't think I was going to
go.
You know, I dare say, eventhough this book, you know it's
got human trafficking, it's gotdrugs, it's got murder, you know
sexual assault, all the thingsthat you would expect from a
crime thriller it has anoverarching romantic story that
(11:05):
goes along with it.
And you know our main characterhas to make a decision early on
in the book whether or not he'sgoing to follow his dreams to
become a federal agent or staywith the person that he's been
in love with and that he's beenplanning to spend the rest of
his life with, because she wantsnothing to do with law
enforcement at all, she doesn'twant to be around it, she
(11:26):
doesn't even want to take apicture of it, she wants nothing
to do with it and she's reallyupset that he does so.
You know, they come to acrossroads in their relationship
and I guess you can kind oftell which direction he went,
being that the book is based onhim being an agent.
But that relationship betweenthose two kind of follows along
throughout the book.
That relationship between thosetwo kind of follows along
(11:47):
throughout the book and I wantedto tell not only the story of
the investigations and how someof the tactics were carried out,
but I wanted to tell the storyof the people who were actually
doing the job, to look behindthe curtains and kind of expose
a little bit to how the jobactually affects the people who
are doing these things, how theytake it home, how it affects
(12:07):
their personal lives and howtheir personal lives, you know,
inadvertently get carried backinto their job.
You know, in a job like thisand I'm sure you can relate when
you're talking to people everyday who have experienced the
worst day of their life you know, in the Air Force and I guess
in every branch, there are a lotof sexual assaults.
I don't care who you are, howtough you are at some point when
(12:32):
you're making someone relivethat type of trauma, down to the
smallest detail.
What were you thinking whenthis happened?
Yeah, you know what.
What was going through yourhead.
What did you tell him?
What did he say to you?
Were you making that personrelive that in order to be able
to to bring justice for them?
It takes a toll on you, youknow and I'm not comparing, you
(12:56):
know, what I felt to the personwho actually went through that.
But you know, day after day,month after month of going, you
know, putting yourself in theirshoes, it kind of has an effect
on you.
And that's kind of what I wantedto show, because the main
character in this book and Iwill tell you it is kind of
based off true events from mylife.
(13:17):
It's a fictional story but youknow there's a lot of truth into
it.
We can see how this characterkind of goes down a dark spiral
because he's trying his best tobe a really good agent, but
every time he tries to dosomething proactive it kind of
bites him in his rear end, evenwhen he's just out trying to
(13:38):
meet people, trying to introducehimself.
The people know who he is, buthe has no idea who they are.
And that comes to a headtowards the end of our book here
, when the hunters become thehunted and he has to figure out
okay, is this really what I wantto do?
Because ever since I picked upthis badge, there's been nothing
(13:58):
but heartache and drama in mylife.
And he starts to think, man,did I really make the right
decision?
And he has to find it withinhimself, the strength to
continue on.
Speaker 1 (14:07):
That is the key to all this world.
Man, how many people were youat the academy with and this and
that who become 1811s?
And they have that loved one.
That's like you know they'rethere, but then the career takes
over, and the career takes over.
And the career takes overbecause you want to prove
yourself, you want to prove yourmettle in the first few years
(14:29):
and then you're all of a suddenyou're into this like different
world, and you're like did Imake the right decision?
Speaker 2 (14:37):
Because on day one your life was never going to be
the same.
It can't be the same.
You have to present yourselfdifferently.
You have to carry yourselfdifferently.
Speaker 1 (14:59):
The responsibility that you have is tremendous and,
like I said earlier, whenpeople see you they don't care
how long you've been on the job,they just know that you're on
the job.
That's a job series 1811, or ifyou're Air Force OSI enlisted,
your job title is criminalinvestigator, so they look at
anybody who has that title as anexpert.
It doesn't matter if you're anexpert in anything, but you are
an expert in everything.
Speaker 2 (15:17):
Exactly.
Speaker 1 (15:17):
So yeah, you're the jack of all trades and people
don't realize that.
A lot of times it takes time tospecialize it does.
Speaker 2 (15:24):
A lot of times it takes time to specialize.
It does, and that's one of thethings I really liked about OSI.
Usually after your probationaryyear there's so many other
areas that you could go into.
For me I kind of went.
It wasn't really a specialty,but it kind of turned into that.
I went into counterintelligence.
There are some people who gointo counterespionage or
(15:47):
polygraph.
Some people get more intoforensics.
So there are other avenues thatyou can get into other than
just criminal investigations.
But there's nothing wrong withcriminal investigations either.
Speaker 1 (15:57):
No, not at all.
So tell us about the book.
Give us the thousand footoverview of the book.
Speaker 2 (16:02):
Yeah, so the main character, devin, he is a jet
engine mechanic.
He is stationed in Hawaii atthe moment and, as I mentioned,
he gets called and says hey, theopportunity of a lifetime has
been presented to you.
You put your package in severalmonths ago and you got approved
.
You have the opportunity tobecome an OSI agent.
And he is so excited to go andtell his girlfriend, who he
(16:26):
assumes will soon be his fianceand it doesn't go well.
Like I said, she doesn't wantanything to do with the police
and that night they have tofigure out are they going to
stay together or is he going tofollow his dreams?
And he makes that decision andit kind of haunts her for a very
long time because it seems likeshe turned her back on him.
(16:49):
So he leaves, goes off totraining and, as I mentioned,
really struggles the first year.
You know he put us to some verylight situations but doesn't
really have a mentor to help himalong.
So at about the one year markhe finds himself being stationed
at Osan Air Base and this iswhen he finds the mentors that
(17:09):
he's been looking for, thelike-minded co-workers who don't
want to just sit at the deskwaiting for the phone to ring.
Those type of people that say,hey, let's get up, let's go make
it happen introduced themselvesto some people who were engaged
(17:29):
in an international drugsmuggling ring, who also had
ties to an international humantrafficking ring.
And so when they introducedthemselves, not realizing who
they're talking to, the bad guyskind of think that one of them
has become a rat and sold themout to OSI, so they have to take
care of the rat within to OSI,so they have to take care of the
rat within, and then they'relooking to see who they can take
(17:50):
care of at OSI.
And our characters have a reallystrong friendship, you know, at
work and out of work.
It's really fun to see howpeople you know not only the
agents but just enlisted peopleinteract with each other, how
they spend their downtime, howthey have different type of
romances.
That's going on and they beginto question if one of the
(18:13):
members of their team isactually working with this crime
syndicate who is involved withthis human trafficking, because
some of the things just aren'tadding up.
He's not where he's supposed tobe, he's making some statements
that seem a little bitquestionable, and it has to be
one of my best friends in thebook and it's going to be
interesting to see what happenswith him.
(18:34):
Can the team stay together,especially when the bad guys
start targeting them?
And they're going to have tofind a way to put their team
back together and find thestrength to continue out their
mission.
Speaker 1 (18:45):
I this book a lot just because of my background
with Fletchian as a specialagent.
I like books that are rooted inreality.
Speaker 2 (18:53):
Yeah, yeah.
And yeah, yeah, they say that'sa part, uh, beginning of the
second chapter where he does histraining at Fletchian.
I didn't want to go too too farinto it because you know there
are people that are stilltraining, but I touched on it a
little bit and I think you'll befamiliar with some of it,
especially the searches and someof the work at the shoot houses
(19:16):
.
Speaker 1 (19:17):
Oh yeah, it's going to be fun.
Man, that place has changed,but it hasn't changed over the
past 20-something years.
I mean it's crazy.
Speaker 2 (19:24):
I hope the food has changed.
Speaker 1 (19:27):
Oh no, the food has not changed at all, I'm sure.
Okay, last question for you andthis is what I'm starting to
ask on every podcast is what isthe best piece of advice you
have ever been given been given,and why?
Speaker 2 (19:42):
The best piece of advice I've ever been given is
to believe in yourself, and ifyou have to march to the beat of
your own drum.
When I was 17 and I, I toldpeople that I was going in the
Air Force.
Grown men who had my bestinterest in mind told me don't
go in the Air Force, dosomething else.
(20:02):
You shouldn't.
There's no place for you in theAir Force, and I felt that
that's where I needed to be.
When I made the decision that Iwanted to cross train and become
a special agent, people thatcared a lot about me really
tried to convince me not to dothat.
You really need to think aboutthis thing.
I'm not sure this is what youwant to do, but it was in me to
(20:23):
do it.
And I heard some of the samevoices when I said, hey, I'm
going to write a book, andpeople kind of looked at me a
little bit strangely, didn'tthink I was really going to be
dedicated to it, until they readthe book.
And then they realized well,they were wrong about me going
in the Air Force, they werewrong about me joining OSI.
And once they read the book,they realized they were wrong
(20:45):
about me writing a book.
So the best advice I would giveanyone is follow your heart and
go where you think you need togo.
Speaker 1 (20:52):
I like that.
You have to follow your mission, your own personal mission, and
you have to find and, like inthis book says, you have to find
a partner who's going to followthat mission with you.
Speaker 2 (21:00):
Exactly, exactly.
Speaker 1 (21:03):
Well, brother, everybody, the book is Derek
Jackson's Shadow One.
It's out now on Amazon and Ibelieve Barnes Noble as well,
right, yes, Barnes, Noble BooksA Million, and also online at
Walmart.
Speaker 2 (21:14):
Oh, very cool man.
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