Stop Motion

Send us your movie recommendations!

Captain and Wilson are back for season 8!

We catch up by learning about the Greenland shark and the Voynich Manuscript. Jay also joins us for the premiere!

This week, we review the 2023 horror film "Stop Motion," directed and written by Robert Morgan. "Stopmotion" combines live-action with stop-motion animation, offering a unique visual experience that enhances its psychological horror elements. 

The film discussion begins around 18:03.

Episode Transcript

Wilson (00:23):
C'est son Marguerite.

Captain (00:25):
Eight.

Wilson (00:26):
What.

Captain (00:27):
How many Cezannes are we in?
Welcome.
This is the new Cezanne Cezanne.
It ain't no Cezanne without alittle Cezanne.
You know what I'm saying, whatyou don't know what season we're
in.

Wilson (00:40):
It's eight.
Did you ever watch the mostpopular girls in school on
YouTube?

Captain (00:47):
Yes, I think you send them to me.

Wilson (00:48):
there's a character named saison marguerite, and
she's like, how you say, bagel,and they're like you just said
it.

Captain (00:57):
It's a good show, though it's been a while I
haven't really uh popped inthere.
Um, how's your break been?

Wilson (01:06):
My break.

Captain (01:06):
Yeah, the break's been good I heard you're going
through withdrawal symptoms fromKona.

Wilson (01:12):
You're right, yeah, so I haven't had, I haven't it's
been a long time since you'vebeen out of.
Kona.
A long time since I've been outof Kona, yeah, so this
podcasting sesh I've just hadSurfside.

Captain (01:25):
Surfside, surfside, surfside.

Wilson (01:29):
I don't know who makes it, but yeah, I can tell you.
Do you have some resources youcan reach out to it's?

Captain (01:38):
Stateside Vodka Stateside Stateside Vodka.

Wilson (01:41):
Yeah, so not a Kona in sight drinking a vodka, self
vodka tea I still have what Iwas um really loving last season
um the bubbles reingeistbubbles I really like them.

Captain (01:56):
Did you want to hear some like fun random facts?

Wilson (01:59):
yeah, I'm like I would see these topics.
I have no idea what they.

Captain (02:03):
Yeah, they're really random, but they've been
uncovered by me recently and Ijust wanted to talk to someone
uncovered you sound like a, likean archaeologist, you like?
Welcome, dug them up um, okay,so this is so random greenland
sharks.
I looked these up or somethingpopped up recently where I was

(02:24):
like this can't be real.
This is 100% real.
There are these sharks thatlive in the Arctic Ocean.
Okay, and they're not seen veryoften and they live like in the
depths.
Okay, but they're especiallyknown for their longevity of
life and they're poorly studieddue to the depth of their
remoteness of their naturalhabitat.
So like we don't know a lotabout them, but from what we do

(02:44):
know they can live estimated tobe somewhere between 250 to 500
years old.

Wilson (02:52):
That is outrageous.

Captain (02:58):
And the reason why they think this is because they did
do a study where they, I think,collected.
I think it was like 12different Greenland sharks they
collected, or it was Arcticfishing expeditions over the
course of the netting that theydid.
There was 12 Greenland sharksthat got caught in the nets and
every time one was caught,scientists would take cells from
those sharks.

Wilson (03:17):
Sure.

Captain (03:18):
And they could decipher that the oldest one was 500
years old and it died in a net.
So not uh, of natural causes,which is crazy.

Wilson (03:32):
Could you imagine being the scientist that was studying
them and they were the cause ofdeath for a 500 year old shark,
I mean we don't know that muchabout him.

Captain (03:40):
Like I, I don't I I would feel bad it was like 12
sharks is like all we've reallybeen able to look at like it's
not that many how deep are like,are you saying?

Wilson (03:49):
arctic depth I don't know what that means.
Are they in the arctic or thearctic depth?
I don't know what arctic depthmeans actual arctic ocean well,
yeah, but they could be likeswimming on the top and be in
the arctic ocean.

Captain (04:02):
They're in the arctic ocean, and they're also on the
floor okay, they're, they'redown not where we would ever be
okay, okay um, and I just waslike blown away by that fact and
like, uh, the idea behind it islike, because they live in this
really really cold environmentthat like they just age very

(04:23):
slowly.
Because of that, it's likealmost cryoreservation.

Wilson (04:25):
Okay, they're like basically sleeping their entire
lives.
They're just like existing Well.

Captain (04:29):
I don't know.
Something else that they foundfrom this thing, where they were
collecting these sharks in thenets, is that they don't believe
that they reach sexual maturityuntil 150 years old.

Wilson (04:40):
Okay, so it's not just the cold, they're like
genetically long-lives.

Captain (04:45):
They're long-life bitches.
Yes, Damn.

Wilson (04:48):
Do they look any different?

Captain (04:51):
They look like animals that would live in the depths.
This is not a good picturebecause it's in the depth of the
ocean.

Wilson (04:58):
Okay, but it looks like a shark with a tiny fin.

Captain (05:01):
Yeah they don't get super, super big, but I was just
blown away by these facts.
That is outrageous.
With a tiny fin, yeah, theydon't get super, super big, but
I was just like blown away bythese facts.

Wilson (05:08):
That is outrageous.

Captain (05:09):
Also it says the longest one that was confirmed
was 21 feet, so pretty longthat's a big boy.
And also sexual maturity, 150years old.
And then they don't.
They believe the gestationperiod.
So the entire time that theyare making pups could be up to
18 years.

Wilson (05:29):
Could you imagine being pregnant for 18 years?

Captain (05:31):
Bro, I am just blown away by how slow these things
age.
It is so weird to me to imaginethat A shark that's 500 years
old was born in the 1500s.

Wilson (05:41):
Yeah.

Captain (05:42):
Isn't that insane.

Wilson (05:42):
That's outrageous, isn't that insane yeah?

Captain (05:44):
Like crazy.
I don't know.

Wilson (05:47):
And that one scientist killed it.

Captain (05:49):
Well, the scientist didn't kill it.
I think it was fishing nets.

Wilson (05:52):
We were fishing Arctic salmon, but they like fished it
to study it.
No, it wasn't to study it, itwas like the fishing If they
ever caught a shark in the net,like like a fisherman, called
yeah, and then they took okay,fine, fine, that's what it was.

Captain (06:09):
It was like hey, we've, we got one in our net do you
want, we killed it, but do youwant it do?
You want it.
Yeah, um, don't quote me onthat.
I'm pretty sure that was whatokay, so like it's maybe
probably mostly true actuallywent to like I don't think it
was the nih, but it was likeanother scientific publication
and I actually looked at thepaper okay, you saw, because I

(06:29):
like, I wanted to know yeah, ohyeah, how do you know this?
yeah, so yeah, um, I justthought that was like crazy cool
that is cool, that is cool andit was super random where I
found out about, okay, the othertopic okay should we like?
I don't know if anyone elsewants to be in here, but I feel
like they might have things theywant to say.

Wilson (06:48):
Well, we should say one it's the season premiere,
welcome.
Did we say that?
Were we excited about it?
Were we hyped?
Okay, we have a guest.
Jazz it up.

Captain (06:56):
Jay welcome back.

Wilson (06:56):
Oh, do you.

Captain (06:59):
Jay, can you confirm or deny that we did already
welcome people to the new seesaw?

Jay (07:04):
it, I think, was mentioned.
Uh, briefly, I don't think itwas did we not say?

Captain (07:09):
seesaw all bunch yeah, I mean.

Wilson (07:10):
We said like I mean, you have all these fireworks set up
.

Jay (07:13):
I don't you haven't lit them off yet yeah, like they're
just back there do you have?

Captain (07:18):
anything to say about the greenland sharks or?

Jay (07:20):
um, it's fascinating for sure.

Wilson (07:22):
I can't imagine waking up for 500 years like bro,
that's such an ugly thing theyprobably like sleep for like
this is a year at a time orsomething like yeah, I don't
know something outrageous,probably.

Jay (07:34):
They probably hibernate a lot.
It's in the arctic, right?
Yeah, that's just a long time,do you think they?

Wilson (07:39):
may be.
Just like what if they justlike accidentally slide into
like a half glacier and thenthey get frozen?

Jay (07:45):
for 30 years and then they wake up.
It's just Avatar Hang, butshark style.

Wilson (07:50):
Yeah, they're not actually any different than any
other shark, they just getfrozen.
Every once in a while.
That actually could be possible.

Jay (07:57):
That would be interesting.

Captain (07:59):
Yeah, they do carbon dating of their actual proteins
in their body.
I would say I'd be pretty salty512 actually was the age of
that 512 did?

Jay (08:09):
was there any signs that he was like, like on, like his
last leg?
Yeah, so then he's like in hisprime and they just don't really
know, they just haven't beenable to look at that, right.
But I'm saying like it could belived to a thousand years old
how does carbon dating work likeLike?

Wilson (08:23):
I don't understand how this is another Tannins, I don't
know.
Yeah, I think I need your best.
I think Uneducated guess theelement of carbon is the basis
of all of the life on earth.

Captain (08:34):
Sure On that page, but I think I think they can look at
your specific carbon.

Wilson (08:46):
Oh God, specific carbon, oh god, and like see how, how
degraded.
So I think you have like, youhave like flaky carbons, like or
like I don't know.
Yours are like kind of wrinklyright, you know how carbon.

Captain (08:52):
I think it's supposed to have.
What four charges?
I could be making that shit up,but maybe you're like the bonds
to your charges.
I could be making that shit uptoo, but like maybe they're on
like medicare.

Wilson (09:00):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, your bonds are on medicare.
I think it's I need to I thinkit's like they do.

Jay (09:06):
I think you're right.
I think it's like they know howfast, like the, the rate at
which carbon degrades, and whatit looks like at each of its
phases, and so they can guess,based on the state you're in,
how long you've been around itsays yeah sorry, I would assume
it's like you cut a tree down.
You see the rings.
You have like little carbonrings, it.
It's like, oh, this guy has tworings, so he's like 20 years
old.

Captain (09:26):
Yeah, it's like the radioisotopes, Ready for that
one Chemistry 300.
Yeah, it should be like carbon12 and carbon 14.
And then the ratio betweenthose charges as radioactive
carbon 14 decays is like, asit's not replaced by the

(09:46):
exchange within the atmosphere,then you can.
You can tell like how old it isbased on that rate what
happened to carbon one through11 14 carbons ago.

Jay (09:54):
Yeah, I know what happened to the first 11 carbons and
we're not scientist in this way,I'm something of a scientist
myself actually okay, thenexplain it.
I need you to tell me well okay, well, um, you know how, cars
have a carburetor all right, andyou know how I like carbs yeah,
you eat carbs, there you go.

Captain (10:15):
That's a carb and dating okay, the other thing I
wanted to talk about is superrandom, but I listened to.
I heard about this on anotherpodcast.
Okay, and it's called theVoynich Manuscript.
Okay, that's the name of thepodcast.
No, that's the name of thething that I was talking about.
I was about to say, like what?
But it's an illustrated codex ofhandwritten in an unknown

(10:37):
script and basically it's beenaround since the 1400s and it
has been endlessly meticulouslyanalyzed and we still, to this
day, do not know what it meansor where or like what it comes
from.
It.
Has these really intricate?

Wilson (10:52):
where do they find it?

Captain (10:54):
it was in somebody's library voynich which is why
it's called the voynichmanuscript, because it was in
his.
He like bought it from somedude and like he had it in his
library for a long time andthat's's the we can kind of date
it back to Based on the here'ssome carbon dating Carbon date
the paper.
Yes, they do.
They dated the paper of thecarbon and they realized it came
from the 1400s, but we don'treally know exactly where it

(11:17):
came from beyond.
I don't think they can trace itsuper far back beyond Voynich,
but anyway it's like has thesecrazy illustrations of it Of
like Women in these like Kind ofbath houses, but like not
exactly, and then like theseflowers that are all throughout
the book, that like they don'tactually look like any flower on
earth and like so, like theylook like hybrids Of like

(11:39):
flowers that you would find Likethroughout the Earth, like
throughout the earth that theylike are weirdly anyway, um, and
the script itself, so likehere's a pic d.
Oh, that looks fun, um, but thescript itself, like the language
, they don't know it they can'tdecipher it they cannot decipher
it.
It's not related to anylanguages that we've ever found,
and there are like wholesubreddits that are trying to

(12:01):
analyze this.
There are people that try that.
I've been trying to analyze itfor hundreds of years.
There are people that haveclaimed that they've um
deciphered it.
So here's like some of thepictures of the women whoa watch
.

Wilson (12:14):
This is like some 14 year old boy yeah it's the
world's oldest, oldest pornosome people are like it's a hoax
.

Captain (12:21):
Some people are like you know it's not real.
Oh, look at this script.
This is the, the script theycan't analyze.
Isn't that so cool?
yeah, I mean it's, it's likeintriguing this manuscript is
currently at the library at yale.
So I was listening to the womanthat um is like the librarian
and she like this is one of herlike main projects is like

(12:43):
trying, you know, you know, uh,making sure that this is like
maintained.
And she like this is one of herlike main projects is like try,
you know, you know, uh, makingsure that this is like
maintained.
And she also like has tried todecipher it and she like um
sometimes will be on thesubreddit and like um arguing
with people's um theories andshe's like, well, that's not
true because of this or that'snot true because of this um, but
I just thought it was likereally interesting.
Um, that is kind of cool howdid you run across this?

Wilson (13:04):
um, it was really interesting.
That is kind of cool.
How did you run across this?

Captain (13:07):
It was a podcast I listened to.

Wilson (13:08):
Oh right.

Jay (13:09):
Yeah, yeah, what do you think it is?

Captain (13:13):
I don't know.

Jay (13:14):
What does your gut tell you ?

Captain (13:15):
A lot of the things that they talk about in the
podcast that I listened to waslike it does seem to be targeted
.
The implication is to betargeted more towards women, and
people think it's.
Some of the theories are thatit's like a codex of um, like
women's health and like umdiseases and like ways that you

(13:39):
can kind of like um, naturallycure women.
Like health issues like um andlike women empowerment, almost
um.
But there's this huge likequestion mark of like why is it
coded?
Like no one can understand,like what in here is so
important that it's coded and wedon't can't decipher, like what
the code is like why is it fromthe 1400s?

(14:00):
Interesting.
You could like you could readwhole books about the Voynich
manuscript.

Jay (14:07):
Do you?

Captain (14:07):
know what region of the world this is.
That is a good question.

Jay (14:12):
They don't think, they even really know, oh, so it's just
somewhere in.

Captain (14:16):
It says the manuscript is indicated that it was
composed in Italy during theItalian Renaissance, supposedly.

Wilson (14:23):
Okay.

Captain (14:25):
And they believe based on the writing, they believe it
was like five different authors,so it's like not even all one
person.
Um, based on like the way thatthe script is all, like the way
it's written, yeah um, I don'tknow, it was just.
It was really cool.

Wilson (14:37):
I was like I feel like there's people that could talk
about this for like a zillionhours, because there are people
that dedicate all their sparetime like on reddit it's like so
I am intrigued, but part of meis like I don't want to even get
into it, because if there's nota clear answer, I don't want to
get really invested insomething there's no answer to
something you can't like.
Verify yeah like all those crimedocumentaries, if there's no

(15:00):
resolution, I'm not going towaste my time hearing about
something that I really want toknow the answer to no different
theories, but you have no way toknow which one's right.

Captain (15:09):
Like look at this, it is a picture of some of the
flowers.
No, some of the flowers andthen the writing around it.
It's very strange.
Anyway, I just thought it wascool.

Wilson (15:20):
It was cool.

Captain (15:21):
And they don't know anything.
And if you also don't want toknow anything, you can look it
up on there if I want to knowmore.

Wilson (15:30):
But nothing.
I'll look into it, thank you.

Jay (15:36):
I wanted to talk about it, no it's interesting, it is
interesting.
What do you think it is?
What do I think the manuscriptis?

Captain (15:44):
I told you some people think it's a hoax, right like
some people think, boy didpulled out 1400 year old paper I
think it's yeah and wrote on itand then so like I was trying
to sell it for a bunch of moneybut they obviously didn't right.

Wilson (15:57):
But, like I, like, I think people still want to know
that the codex right.
Yeah, what do you?
Well, they were.
It was a hoax like.

Captain (16:03):
I want to know what it says well, they thought it was
just like scribbles is itenglish, but?

Jay (16:06):
it's like five it's like a western alphabet, right, no, no,
it's no, you can look it upinteresting.
If one is a is a character, um,I think it's either, like you
said, a hoax, that's like themost you know occam's razor.
The most obvious answer is theone that's most probably.
I mean like probably.

(16:27):
Just, I don't think that's themost obvious answer, but if it's
not that, then I think it couldbe.
Why would you put so much timeinto a hoax?

Captain (16:33):
I would say it could be a group of women.
It's so extensive.

Jay (16:36):
You know, 1400s is not exactly the most.
It's not the easiest time to bea woman, especially an educated
woman who's trying todisseminate information that may
contradict certain organizedreligions and or male scientists
at the time.
So you just code it up, you'relike, hey, I know they're saying
one thing, but we know thedrawings in the book are also

(16:57):
like, very extensive.

Captain (16:58):
It's like if you were trying to make it a secret.
You're putting a lot in there.
Oh, you're saying like, yeah,like you're putting a lot in
there about women.
Men are dumb.

Jay (17:07):
They don't even know.
Very easy to fool it's onrecord yeah, you can fool a bear
, you can fool a man um yeah,that's what I have.

Captain (17:21):
Oh, we already talked about what we were drinking,
right?

Jay (17:24):
No, we didn't.

Wilson (17:25):
We talked about what I'm drinking.

Captain (17:26):
I said I'm drinking Bubbles.

Wilson (17:28):
You said that Uh-huh.
Bubblies.
So I guess we don't know whatJay's drinking.

Jay (17:34):
Oh, it is a bit of a mystery.
It's something called SurfsideRaspberry Tea and Vodka,
something we've never heard ofbefore.
No, never before you haven'theard it in at least 10-15
minutes, because that's whatWilson's drinking.

Wilson (17:50):
So do you want to bop us in?
We can bop.
Bop us into our first episodeof season 8.

Jay (17:56):
Can you actually bip us?

Wilson (17:58):
Yeah, maybe not a bop.

Captain (18:00):
What about a bip bop?

Wilson (18:01):
Buka to Beppo.

Captain (18:03):
Welcome to the 164th episode of the Red Run Podcast,
where we review horror movieswhile enjoying an adult beverage
or two.
And I'm Captain.

Wilson (18:12):
And I'm Wilson.

Captain (18:13):
And this week we're reviewing the 2023 Horror Stop
Motion.
What?

Wilson (18:19):
I said, and I'm Jay, oh sorry.

Jay (18:21):
Hey, jay, it's fine, I'm just like a little recurring
character.

Captain (18:27):
This is directed by robert morgan, not to be
confused with dexter.
Oh my god, original sin weshould have talked about.
Oh yeah, oh, next time.

Wilson (18:37):
Well, okay, I think I think by the next time the our
next episode comes out, whatwe'll see?

Captain (18:42):
like the whole season, oh, so we can just talk about it
from there.

Wilson (18:46):
Oh, and the new season, the new show might be out.

Jay (18:50):
Yeah, about the first half of 2025.
I am super excited about that.
We don't have to get into it,but very excited.

Captain (18:58):
This is just a little flag just for everybody,
including myself.
It's like Original Sin andResurrection.
They got to be on the pod.

Wilson (19:08):
Yeah, we'll get Michael C Hall, just bop him in here.

Jay (19:10):
Or bick him in here.
My boy Mikey, he's still got it.

Wilson (19:12):
Yeah, my boy.

Captain (19:13):
Mike, yeah, I'll bring him in Tonight's the night so.
Robert Morgan is this directorand he hasn't really done a lot.
It's mostly a lot of shortslike this is his I think
directorial debut of a featurelength.

Wilson (19:28):
This one kind of felt like a short, it did kind of
feel that way, yeah I mean, it'sbasically a bunch of little
shorts together well, yeah, Imean, if you're looking at the
subject matter specifically like, stop motion is a bunch of
little shorts um, but he thething that he is that, in my
opinion, would be most known for.

Captain (19:45):
Like he's on some.
Whatever the fuck the cat withhands is, I don't want to see
that shit.
Um, but like he's terrifyingthat I would think he's most
known for is he is in the abcsof death 2 and he did d is for d
loused I.

Wilson (20:00):
I think we saw the first one in college.

Captain (20:03):
Not two.

Wilson (20:04):
No.

Captain (20:05):
Okay, Well, he did.
D is for Deloused, and I'mguessing that has the bugs.

Wilson (20:12):
So I don't want to see it.
Oh yeah, I wonder if that'slike murderous lice.

Captain (20:18):
I don't know what else it'd be Well, damn, I mean right
, I'm sorry.
Oh, it does not sound like that.

Jay (20:25):
Sick burn.

Wilson (20:28):
Oh, I'm skimming it, and that is not lice.

Captain (20:30):
That is not.
The delousing is a randomletter.

Wilson (20:33):
Oh wait, a giant insect becomes small and crawls into
what was once the man's head.
Oh Great, that does sound Okay.

Jay (20:41):
That sounds kind of fun, I'm just going to add this to my
list, but also gross.

Wilson (20:46):
Gross and intriguing.

Captain (20:48):
Okay, so the cast.

Wilson (20:51):
Yes.

Captain (20:52):
We have oh gosh Aisling .

Wilson (20:55):
Aisling, are you saying that right?
Let me look at his name themain girl Aisling Francosi she
looks familiar.
Oh, ciosi, now I know whatshe's.

Captain (21:12):
I don't know, but she plays ella in this movie and
she's best known for her rolesin the nightingale 2018 and then
um, she's leona stock in gameof thrones and she's also in the
fall.

Wilson (21:24):
We've seen her in the fall.
She's in the fall.
We've seen her in the fall.

Captain (21:25):
She's in the fall, which is the one with Gillian
Anderson.
Yeah.

Wilson (21:29):
I think she's the girl that almost gets dead.
Do you know who?

Captain (21:31):
Lyanna Stark is in Game of Thrones.
I believe it's.

Jay (21:34):
Ned Stark's sister.
She would have been a verysmall part.

Wilson (21:38):
Oh yeah, like the whole.

Jay (21:40):
Robert Baratheon was in love with her.

Wilson (21:42):
Yeah, I, robert Baratheon, was in love with her.
Yeah, I guess it's a spoiler,but yeah, she's in there very
briefly Well.
I don't want to spoil it.

Captain (21:47):
I mean.
It's been out my dog it's beenout, but it still would be she
had done, been out.
Aisling has won she done,already, done had hers.
Aisling has won an oh, I lookedit up An ACTA Award, which is
an Australian Academy of Cinemaand Tevelovision.

Wilson (22:06):
Arts Award Tevelovision, tevelovision.
It's like a telenovela and thatwas for Nightingale.

Jay (22:13):
Wait, he directed Nightingale.

Captain (22:14):
No, no, no, Aisling the main girl in this movie.

Jay (22:18):
Oh, okay.

Captain (22:19):
Nightingale is the one with John Kit Harington or no?

Jay (22:23):
No, john Kit Harington or no, john Kit Harington
Nightingale is like someone'sassaulted.
Oh no, no, sorry.

Captain (22:28):
Further in somebody else was in a Kit Harington.
Okay, so that's Ella.
And then Stella Garnet.
It plays Ella's mom, susan, inthis movie, and she's recognized
for her performances in someshit I've never heard of.
Do you know those things?

(22:52):
I mean, don't the house ofelliot and then nicholas
nickleby come on.

Wilson (22:55):
That's a fun name, well, nicholas nickleby is a
household.

Jay (22:56):
Nick nickleby.

Captain (22:57):
Yeah, nick nick yeah um stella's boy, nope, ella's
boyfriend in this movie is Tom,played by Tom.
Tom's done nothing.
He's done some shit I've neverheard of.
And then Tom's sister, polly,is played by I'm sorry, I did it
wrong Therica Wilson Reed.
And then she's appeared in theWitcher as Sabrina Galvestig.

Jay (23:23):
The Witcher is a TV show.

Wilson (23:24):
I watched season one.

Captain (23:26):
Is she in that?
I don't know, sabrina.

Jay (23:29):
I haven't seen the Witcher TV show yet.

Captain (23:30):
I think she's in like 10 episodes.
I think she's like a maincharacter.

Wilson (23:33):
In season one.

Captain (23:34):
I don't know.

Wilson (23:35):
Did you play the?

Jay (23:36):
game?
I did not.
Oh, they just announced thenext game.

Captain (23:39):
Oh Well, that's not for the podcast.

Jay (23:41):
The main character's a woman.

Wilson (23:42):
now, Ow ow no.

Captain (23:45):
That's uninterested.
So, and then, lastly, there's alittle girl.

Wilson (23:48):
Say that name Just titled.

Captain (23:49):
Say that name.
Just titled little girl in thisfilm, but, oh God, played by
what am I supposed to say?
Cowlin?

Wilson (24:00):
Maybe it's just like Kalen.
Let me see.

Captain (24:06):
C-A-O-I-L-I-N-N.
Cowlian I don't know.
Springle Okay, she's been in aKit Harington movie, the Beast
Within.

Jay (24:16):
Didn't that come out this year?

Captain (24:17):
Yeah, and she's in the Midnight Sky, sky which I think
was directed by george clooney,they said, and she was in an
amazon series called citadel,which I think I've heard of um,
apparently it's pronouncedqueelan or keelan queelan is
crazy yeah, it's like an irishoh, that's right, like stars
yeah everyone's, yeah,everyone's saying Quilon or

(24:39):
Quilon.
Quilon.

Jay (24:42):
It's like one of those names like isn't it like a
Shyvana Irish name?

Wilson (24:44):
Shyvana is spelled with a T yeah.

Jay (24:47):
Siobhan Right, yeah, Siobhan, Like you see it and
you're like what?
And then you hear it pronouncedlike I've heard that name a
million times, oh yeah.

Wilson (24:55):
The first time, Siobhan, I had never seen the spelling
so I was like I have no idea howto say that or spell that yeah,
there's a lot of like cilantro.

Jay (25:04):
You see it spelled like Cilantro.
No cilantro.

Captain (25:08):
It's like the Irish bars Like cheers.

Jay (25:12):
It's how they say, cheers, but it's spelled crazy.

Wilson (25:16):
It's like S-L-A-I-N-T-E, n-t-e, yeah.

Jay (25:21):
Right, but it's pronounced slainte.

Captain (25:22):
But I would have never pronounced it that way, unless I
heard someone say it.

Jay (25:24):
It's not slainte, that's what I said.
We actually met at a barearlier when we first got to
know each other and I was like,oh slainte.
And then the bartender lookedat me like they wanted to wring
my neck.

Wilson (25:35):
They they probably get it all the time?

Captain (25:39):
yeah, they probably get it endlessly yeah so that's
kind of our main cast.
I mean that's pretty mucheverybody in the whole movie, to
be honest yeah it's a tightgroup it's a tight knit besties,
so this movie is real artsy.
Just to start off it is we getsome weird snips in the

(26:00):
beginning of like an eggspinning, not on the nips um,
and then she is like dancingwhat you don't remember that?

Jay (26:16):
no, I remember that.

Captain (26:17):
that was like the best part, and then she's like in the
club we all dance in, and thenI don't know, it's really, it's
kind of weird.
It's just her like dancingaround and then that's just like
our what do you call that?
When there's like here's a snipof the middle of the moves,
just for the beginning, just forthe vibes.

Jay (26:38):
That cold open Okay.

Wilson (26:44):
Kind beating just for the vibes that cold open okay,
kind of, but it's not.

Captain (26:46):
You mean, if they like, show a later part.

Wilson (26:47):
It's not like in sequential order.
Oh, you're saying that theyshow.
They show a snip yeah oh, Ididn't think that was out of
order part, or what do you mean?

Captain (26:53):
that wasn't.
Oh, was that that?

Jay (26:55):
was actually.
I think it's in order.
I think it's just showing likea day in her life.
Oh okay, so she's like dancingat night in the club and then
it's disorienting because it'sjust showing like a day in her
life.

Captain (26:59):
Oh okay, so she's like dancing at night in the club and
then it's disorienting becauseit it just kind of starts well,
it's that.

Jay (27:05):
And like it like the first scenes when they're pieced
together.
It's like this makes no sense.
Like she's like working on amovie, but she's in a house and
she goes downstairs.
She's at the bar.
I'm like what, what's?

Captain (27:14):
going on yeah, but yeah she is making like felt puppets
with her mom, basically, andthey're making a stop motion
film.
But, she's helping her mombecause her mom has severe
arthritis so her mom can't doall the movements.

Wilson (27:30):
Her mom is terrible.

Captain (27:31):
And so she has Ella do all of the movements for her.
So her mom's still the director.
Yeah, she's a bitch, she'sscreaming at her daughter.

Wilson (27:39):
I mean I wasn't going to say it, but like she is at
first I was like is she theassistant?

Captain (27:44):
because she's getting treated so poorly yeah but then
you see the scene of them eatingdinner and she's still there
and she's helping to cut hermom's meal and you're like, oh
wait, no, this is not assistantwork.
So then you realize that, likeit's probably, uh, family, yeah
um but you can tell she's likenot that happy doing that.
Um, she does.
Then you see her at night againwhere she we see her meet with

(28:07):
her like artsy friends and herboyfriend and they're having fun
.
And you realize, okay, like,although she's like dressed like
a mormon and working with hermom, like she actually is a
somewhat normal person with alife and a boyfriend, and she
even, like, hangs out with herboyfriend all night and says
like hey, I have to leave andget back to my house before she
wakes up.

Wilson (28:26):
Um, which I was like it's giving teenager and you're
definitely an adult yeah, shegets home, she lays down and her
mom's like all right time forwork yeah, immediately.

Captain (28:35):
Um, but the second day of her working on this movie,
that's when things get realweird, where her mom like
screams at her almost in ademonic way that like don't move
that.

Wilson (28:45):
Like yeah weird thing that she does and then she has a
stroke and faints in thebasement and the lights flicker
or something I don't know what'sgoing on with that, but yeah,
like flickers, her momdisappears and it turns out she
was like on the floor strokingyeah we're having a stroke yeah,
but she was like desperatelytrying to finish this specific

(29:07):
stop motion movie that shewanted to do before she dies and
I think she even, like creepily, whispers something along those
lines in ella's ear, whileshe's

Captain (29:15):
telling ella you cannot move, do not even blink.
Um, it's like really abusive,um?
So her mom's like in a coma,like she's in a coma.
She's com Ella, you cannot move, do not even blink.
It's like really abusive.
So her mom's like in a coma,like she's in a coma, she's
comatose in the hospital andshe's out the movie pretty much
I understand, but this doesaffect Ella severely.

(29:36):
She's sad but she also likedecides that that like she
doesn't want to be like wearythrough life after a day and she
just wants to finish this movielike to honor her mom.
But I don't really understandthe purpose.
Like she, she rents anapartment.

Jay (29:50):
I don't really get that like why they were working in a
space already yeah, but I thinkI think her boyfriend mentions
like you shouldn't have to bethere, and at first he offered
his place and she was like no, Ithink this is fine.
I wasn't sure who's paying forit.
It kind of seemed like he waspaying for it.

Wilson (30:06):
Yeah, I'm pretty sure the description.
I didn't catch this in themovie, but I guess his family or
he owns an apartment buildingand let her use one of them.

Jay (30:16):
Yeah, but she already had the whole thing set up in the
basement.
I don't, yeah, but I think thethe the thing that happened with
her mom, I think just kind ofwas heavy on her being in that
space.
I think wasn't good I guess soalso I just I got the.
I think the impression themovie is giving like she doesn't
like being there in general,well, yeah, kind of her mom

(30:37):
being her mom that comes outlater, yeah, but so I think
that's also lying yeah.

Captain (30:42):
So she gets a separate apartment space to do her work,
she sets it up, but she likequickly, she um meets this like
weird, like little girl thatlives in the building who's like
singing and it's kind of creepy.
But basically she like quicklywants to be involved in the
movie and she even tells ellalike the story that you have is
boring.
I think this is where ellatells her what the story is,

(31:02):
which is a cyclops that umdecides to sacrifice it's one of
its eyes, which now, therefore,it is a cyclops um to see its
future, and then the future thatthey see is just its death,
which is like laid out, I guess,like basically while working.

Wilson (31:19):
I think that story sounds kind of intriguing, but
the little girl said it wasboring.

Captain (31:24):
I think at the moment you hear it it's very meta
because her mom literally workedherself to death and is now in
a coma and she can't even useher fingers anymore because of
her arthritis.
You're like, I know this movieis artsy and I can see it pretty
quickly.
This is just a metaphor for hermom's life.
So like we get it.

(31:44):
But yeah, the little girl'slike that's boring.
And then she presents Ella withthis different story about a
young girl lost in the woods who, like, is being chased by this
entity that is going to come andget her.

Wilson (31:56):
I never would have hung out with this girl.

Captain (31:59):
No, I said.
While we were watching I waslike where's this girl's parents
?
If this was a real girl Because, let's say, ella was a man who
invited this little girl intoher apartment this would have
been looked at way differently.

Jay (32:13):
Yeah, it's kind of obvious that yeah.

Captain (32:14):
So it's pretty obvious that this is not real.

Jay (32:16):
She's there for hours.

Captain (32:18):
It's like real, yeah, yeah like someone should be
looking for you at this pointyeah, um, but yeah, the
conversation they have is kindof funny because, uh, she's like
this is boring and ella's likeokay, well, how would I make it
better?
and she was like the only way tomake it better is to make a
different story, which is alittle kid answer yeah um, so I,

(32:38):
yeah, she tells her about youknow you need to go, you need to
do this scene with this forestthing, um, and then I can't
remember, when, um, like I don'tremember exactly, like what
happens, but she, I think shewhat she starts, she blacks out,
oh yeah, that's right.
She blacks out and she likewakes up.

(32:59):
That's right, she blacks outand she like wakes up to it Like
part of the scene is alreadymade and like the old puppet is
destroyed and the new creepydoll girl is made, right.

Wilson (33:09):
Yeah, this looks so disgusting yeah.

Captain (33:12):
That creepy doll thing of the new little girl in the
woods is horrifying.

Wilson (33:17):
They're so fleshy and like disturbing.

Jay (33:20):
You think they're fleshy now?
Well, yeah, they're not fleshyyet it's disturbing.

Captain (33:27):
And then there's like a scene of her like again, I
think, hanging out with somefriends, or oh yeah, that's
right, tom's a little worriedabout her because she's like
diving deep into this, and Tom'ssister comes to check on her.
Tom's terrible yeah tom's sisterpolly comes to check on her and
sees like what she's doing withthis girl in the forest, but
ella basically kind of likepushes her out, doesn't really

(33:47):
want her there.
Okay, then little girl comesback and she's like you know,
this doll's okay, but it reallyneeds to be made out of meat.
Like it's not good enoughunless it's made out of meat and
it is as nasty as it sounds,has her pull steak from the
trash or something and remakethe doll.
And then we hear the story ofthe Ashman, which is the thing

(34:09):
that's chasing her, and she said, little girl says the Ashman
will come for three nights andhe'll knock on the door for the
one night and then the secondnight he'll see her.

Wilson (34:18):
And touch her.

Captain (34:19):
I think the second night he touches her and touch
her, yeah, and then first, nightsees her second night, that's
her yeah, um, so yeah, she'sdiving in really deep and
eventually little girl says youneed to make these, the ash van,
even fleshier by using a deadfox carcass, um which she brings
her to in the woods, um, and atfirst ellis says no, but that

(34:39):
doesn't last very long.

Wilson (34:41):
And I think around this time they do offer the
boyfriend's sister, offers her ajob or whatever at where the
sister works, which is a stopmotion company.

Captain (34:53):
Yeah, they make commercials or adverts with stop
motion.

Wilson (34:57):
But they told her once she got there she wouldn't
actually be doing stop motion,just like helping with it, right
.
And then she also finds out thesister-in-law took her idea a
little bit towards the, towardsfurther, like further in.

Captain (35:09):
At first, um, she goes to the sister to try to trip on
drugs because she doesn't likethe story of the ashtray and is
like kind of creepy to her andshe like doesn't necessarily
want to do it that way, but sheremembers that she's heard Polly
say like you know, some of mybest stories or my best works
come from me like tripping balls.

(35:29):
So she asks her for some drugsand that's a weird fucking night
with the clown puppets and likethey're in the club but they're
not all fam.
Like it is Right, right it'slike no, it's a.

Jay (35:45):
It's a series of sequences of her assumingly being on drugs
, kind of just drifting througha lot of skin pinching.
Remember she was like, yeah,she has sex with her boyfriend,
but she's like really likemolding his skin.
She's like obsessed withtouching his skin and like she's
almost messing with it, likethe molding play earlier that
she was in the doll.
She's like just really needingit, oh my gosh.

Captain (36:05):
And then there was that guy that got in a bar fight and
was bleeding and she's fullfingers oh, she like stuck her
hands in his head.
Yeah, wilson, we don't have alot, a lot of these like that
I've mentioned, but this is apoor one out this.
This is a poor one out, righthere, the blood, the fingers in.

Wilson (36:22):
I think I texted you I was like I don't think you're
going to like this.

Captain (36:25):
Yeah, and I it's, as it is way weirder than I thought
this movie was going to be Supergross.

Jay (36:33):
The guys just stand there, just like.

Captain (36:34):
We pour one out for that.

Wilson (36:37):
A bad poor one out um.

Captain (36:39):
A bad poor one, not like after this trippy drug
thing, then she's like you knowwhat I do?
Need that fox carcass, fuck meso she like goes in, goes to get
it and she sculpts it um tomake the ash man to make the ash
man which I think around thistime.
You realize, the ash man is likebecoming real, almost.
It's like very meta, like theash man is coming to her doll in
the story and the ashtray isalso like according to her

(37:02):
perception, is like also likecoming after ella in real life
in the apartment yeah, but likeshe's also like kind of tripping
balls, so you're like notreally sure.
She sees like a piece of likean ash man's arm, like coming up
the steps of her apartmentbuilding, um, and red eyes are
like bugging out through thepeople.

Wilson (37:20):
But then you find out that she was like oh, I didn't
actually take the drugs shedidn't even take the drugs.

Captain (37:26):
She wakes up on the floor the next morning with Tom
and she still has the drugs inthe bags.
I was gooped for that.

Jay (37:33):
She's like I didn't even take it and she's like throw it
on the floor.

Captain (37:36):
I literally wrote an on-cop.
She didn't even take the testand the boyfriend's
understandably worried.

Wilson (37:40):
He's like we need to, maybe we like don't do this
Right, and she's like no.

Captain (37:44):
I can do it Also.
A crazy scene is when she goesto sleep that night she has a
nightmare of her girl.
Puppet is opens the bedroom.
She almost has like sleepparalysis.

Wilson (37:56):
Yeah.

Captain (37:56):
And that opens the bedroom, crawls into the bed and
starts touching her and rippingher leg open her skin open
Again pour mine out for that one, horrifying.

Wilson (38:05):
Horrifying.

Captain (38:07):
She goes to see her mom in the hospital again,
basically to tell her likeoopsie poops, I can't finish
your story.
I have this other one that'sgoing well.

Wilson (38:14):
Oh yeah, she destroyed like the whole set of her mom's
movie is more disturbing to me.

Captain (38:19):
In this movie and this is hard, but nothing's more
disturbing to me than she startsto do animation on her coma,
her comatose mother in thehospital.
Did you see that where she waslike moving the hand thing?
oh, yeah, and I was like this isso unnerving this is this
person's not dead, but they'renot alive and you're using them

(38:43):
as an object.
It was so weird and I guessit's like inverted, like almost
revenge, because her mombasically used her as a puppet,
like to do her work, so like Idon't even know if ella realizes
that like she's like doing itin reaction.
I don't know, but I hated.
I hated that I thought it.

Wilson (39:03):
I took it from a different perspective of like,
not in a way of honoring her mom, but like, uh, no, just hang
out with her.
Like I'm just gonna likeanimate you.

Captain (39:12):
I don't know something about that is oh, it's so
unnerving, I really don't likeit.
Um, but yeah, she goes back tolike filming her scene, her
thing with the girl in the woods, um, and she does.
I think the little girl tellsher like the man touches her and
she's like that's, I don't wantto do that for the second night
, but it doesn't really seemlike she has a say, like the

(39:34):
little girl's like no, that'swhat happens um, and there's
also that like you can tell thatElla is like losing her mind, I
guess.

Wilson (39:44):
Oh yeah, she's starting to look kind of bad.
She's looking bad, she's losingtouch with reality.

Captain (39:50):
Like you can tell Tom's worried about her but it's like
her only connection to the realworld.
Like he's it, her set likebecomes the Ash man, which I
thought was a cool thing thatthey did.
Or like her set becomes aliveand like the ash man comes out
of it yeah, and he is like theset um and then he like touches
her and he like she becomes aclay puppet.

Wilson (40:11):
It gets real weird, like crack dreams, but it's not and
then after this is where shebasically ends up in a hospital,
right?

Captain (40:18):
well, yeah, she like, yeah, she like becomes a clay
puppet.
She's like that thing whereshe's hiding in the wall as like
a miniature.
There's like a weird cushionroom.
Um, it's kind of like you knowthe shining where, like, they
open doors and like randomshit's happening and that's kind
of what I was.
I was like it was.
That's where it was bringing meum.
The ash man puts a black likeegg thing in her mouth.

Wilson (40:41):
I don't know um she I did read a theory about all this
.

Captain (40:44):
I did read a theory about this as well, um, she
wakes up in the hospital and tomis like enough with it,
girlfriend, we're destroyingeverything that you have going
on because it's killing you andI'll show you killing and she
was like what, let me destroy itwith you, because I can't deal

(41:05):
with you destroying it byyourself.
But then her mom dies, like inthe same hospital, um, so I
think she like she can't dealwith it anymore.
Like things are her life thatwhich was happening a week ago
is like so different from nowand like things get really
haywire.
Um, I can't even explaineverything that happens, but
like she's digging in her own,she tries to kill the little

(41:26):
girl, choking her out and thelittle girl's like he.

Wilson (41:29):
Do you feel better now, right, yeah, yeah like, like,
like, choking her out, didnothing.

Captain (41:33):
So you like, it's very clear that this is like a little
version of her, like her child,her inner child's voice well,
she agrees with tom to destroyher work.

Jay (41:41):
Then she breaks out of the hospital early so she can go
there without tom.
Yeah, try to finish her projectoh yeah, that's true and then
she's, like, has her finalmoment of like I don't want to
be this way, and tries to killthe little girl who, you know,
is kind of like a manifestationof her inner voice.
I guess we'll talk about thetheories beyond that.

Captain (41:58):
There's like but it doesn't work.

Wilson (42:00):
Weird, she starts digging into her own life
because she's like I need meatto animate yeah, but the tom and
his sister show up and see herdo this right yeah, and it is
horrific.

Captain (42:13):
it's as bad as you would imagine of like digging in
her leg and like ripping atendon out, but she's in pain
the whole time.
So like she's screaming whileshe's doing it.
Yeah, and then Tom and Pollyshow up and girls like they
obviously try to stop her.

Jay (42:30):
Tom's like enough of this shit yeah.

Captain (42:33):
Tom is an incredible person for sticking with her.

Jay (42:35):
Yeah, I mean yeah, he's Well.

Captain (42:38):
I mean he dies her.

Jay (42:42):
Yeah, I mean yeah, he's well.
Yeah, I mean he dies.

Wilson (42:44):
Yes, because they try to basically take her back to the
hospital.

Captain (42:45):
The sister dies too, even though I'm not really that
upset oh, she had that comingthe deaths are are also like,
not simple like she like pauliegets stabbed with the leg of a
police is brutal.
Yeah, isn't that what it was?
It was was like a camera leg.

Wilson (42:58):
Yeah, like right in the throat, pushes it into her
throat, but Tom gets thrown downthe stairs and then, I think,
choked.

Captain (43:04):
His head gets cracked and then he gets choked out.

Jay (43:08):
Yeah, she just suffocates him.

Captain (43:10):
And then she drags those two bodies back to the
apartment so she can use them toanimate stuff, because it's
fresh meat.

Wilson (43:16):
Nasty bitch.

Captain (43:21):
But then like I don't know what's happening and how
real this is now they're likethree foot size puppets yeah.
Using like the flesh from theirbodies yeah but they're like
moving around by themselves andlike the little guy like
basically comes towards her andthen I don't know like eats her
face or something in the closet.
It becomes a full-size ash manthing, I don't really know and
then she ends up being in acabin yeah, like the cabin, yeah

(43:45):
, it's like she's inside the ashman story and she is the little
girl running through the foresthiding from him, um, but uh,
she's like while she walks inthere, it's her as ella, and
then the little girl is in therewatching the movie, like inside
the cabin.
It's very meta again, um, andthe little girl says I love it

(44:06):
and ella like nods at her,climbs into the chest, uh, with
the same like yellow cushionything that, um, we saw earlier
in the movie and it's almostlike a coffin.
She climbs in there, slowly,closes the lid and lays down her
body to die.

Wilson (44:23):
So, yeah, I think that's like I forget who mentioned
that to her earlier in the movie, but I think it was her mom.
But basically she basicallytold her you just do what people
are told.

Captain (44:36):
She said you can't really control this the way you
need to to be a real artist.
And she says you're justbasically like a little puppet.
And then her quote is once thepuppets are played with, they go
back into the box.

Wilson (44:49):
So that's what's happening at the end.

Captain (44:53):
And her mom is actually funny Her mom herself actually
calls her puppet, which usuallyis a pet name, but in this
situation it's actually no, youare objectively literally my
puppet, which is like kind ofcrazy.
I like that they play with thatbecause you know, I never heard
that interpretation of that petname or like used in that way.

Jay (45:11):
Yeah, it's not really a term of endearment.

Wilson (45:14):
No, no, it's just very cold to our clutter.
So what theory did you readabout this?

Captain (45:20):
Well, so there's two main ones that I've seen, but I
think I agree with one of themway more than the other.
Yeah, so one of them's, likeyou know, she was touched by a
little girl, not by her, she wastouched when she was a little
girl.
Very different when she was alittle girl, and this is her
kind of unpacking a trauma fromthat that she like didn't really

(45:42):
get a chance to unpack.
But I think it makes a lot moresense that her mom's an abuser
and the Ash man is a metaphorfor her mom.
So basically, you know, her momhas been her abuser her entire
life.
But also her life is like soblended into her mom's life that
it's almost like one life in,like into one or two lives into

(46:04):
one.
So when her mom goes into thecoma, she like doesn't know how
to cope, she doesn't know how tonavigate because she's like she
even says early in the moviemultiple times she's like I
don't have my own voice,remember, because like they're
asking people are asking liketom, you know he was like why
don't you make your own movie?
Like you don't have to be yourmom's hands.
And she's like I don't have avoice, so like she doesn't know
how to navigate life without hermom and she's like well, I can

(46:27):
dive into her art and try tofind my voice, but like she
doesn't really know how to dothat or how to control it, which
is the words they use in themovie so she like just is really
destructive, almost likechildlike like she doesn't know,
I don't know the right way togo, like go about stuff.
So she's just like destructiveand I don't know, plays with

(46:47):
carcasses I don't know, ends upkilling people like she doesn't
know, she doesn't know how to bea person because she hasn't had
to.
Yeah, and the only person thatshe's interacted with the most
is someone really abusive.
So she like can't do stuff andwhen she has an idea, she'll
just like go with it whereverthat leads, which ends up being
this like girl in the forestgetting chased by the Ashman,

(47:11):
which is like literally hermother.
I liked Jay was saying thatlike what he was kind of reading
was like the black egg that wasbeing pushed into their mouths
is like their mom was like a.
Like her mom was literallyforce feeding her ideas, like
shoving them down ella's throatbecause you know, abuse I heard
a completely different theory soum, that was kind of what that

(47:34):
was.
I was really confused by the eggstuff.
So like that's what I wanted tolike know about um and then the
egg cracking at the end thatlike spinning egg.
We see um is like she's nottaking it anymore.
Basically, I don't know that'swhat.
That's what we were talkingabout after we watched it what
was your theory?

Jay (47:52):
so well, it wasn't with my theory.

Wilson (47:54):
But like what I, what I had read was that she as a child
had been sexually assaulted andthe ash man, like the egg, was
like the seed, like somebodylike sexually assaulted her and
that was like how she like copedwith it.
I thought that was interesting.
I think that's the one that Iguess I more closely think
happened, but I don't, I, Idon't know I just feel like

(48:18):
there's no.

Captain (48:20):
We have no male presence in her life in a
negative light, like Tom isnever seen in a negative light.
So it almost makes to me itmakes more sense to the Ashman
as her mom Cause like that'swhat we see as the audience.
We see nothing else.
That's, you know, a negativeperson to her.
So I just feel like that makessense.

Jay (48:42):
Yeah, early on in the movie she's extremely verbally
abusive to her and you see, evenin like her mom's final moments
, kind of how warped her realityis.
Like her mom is like her voiceis getting demonic when she's
like move the effing doll twomillimeters and it kind of just

(49:02):
kind of exact, accentuates howmuch of a dominating monster she
is in her life.
You know she's like we don'tget a lot of it.
It's like it seems so innocuousin the beginning where she's
like you know, maybe I can dosome ideas.
She's like oh yeah, what ideasdo you have?
And it kind of cuts away fromthat scene.
But then you realize throughoutthe movie as they refer back to

(49:23):
it's like oh, she didn't sayanything.
Like her mom was literally justlike you don't have any fucking
ideas.
Like just shut up and do what Itell you to do.
Like literally I mean notliterally, but like almost
verbatim that's what you toldher to do.
And so the like uh wilson saidI saw that theory was like, hey,
I think it's like a sexualassault thing.
I was like, yeah, that thatdoes make, that does line up
with the imagery that they show.

(49:43):
Like a lot, like it's verycreepy.
And you're like, oh man, thisis gross.
But then the other fear I sawwas just like uh captain said,
where it's like, hey, the ashman's her mom, it's like a
dominating monster in her life.
At one point she's like carvingout her face and feeding it to
the ash man and they said thatlike is, like her like just
giving her entire body to hermom.

(50:06):
Like she, she has to cut up allher steak and feed her.
Like she has to wait on herhand and foot.
It's like.
That's just kind of like herwhole life is being given to
this monster that controls her,um, which I thought was
interesting.
I, you know, watching itwithout any of the.
I always feel weird abouthaving to google stuff I like it
makes me want like roll my eyes.

Wilson (50:26):
Yeah, it's like I have to google.

Jay (50:28):
Yeah, like like she's literally getting into a puppet
box at the end and I'm like II'm like I'm gonna have to look
this up, like I don't know, I'mlike I'm.
I'm kind of lost here, likehonestly Like.

Wilson (50:39):
I clearly missed something major here.

Jay (50:43):
Like you hit the pause button, you're like there's no
more time left.
Like okay, this is it.
I was like, all right, youshould have, I guess, saw this
coming.

Captain (50:52):
I don't remember, like there's a callback, it's like
the same room that she wasgetting chased in and I'm like
what she got in that box and theclosing of the of the top of it
is like very slow, it's like afull 15 seconds and while it was
happening I was like, right,yeah cool, cool, yeah, yeah, the
all the box.
Yes, now it's all comingtogether like I was, just like

(51:16):
annoyed google search.

Jay (51:17):
Yeah, yeah, it's no, I mean , it makes Google search, it
makes sense Either way.
Actually, both theories makesense.
But I didn't really get thatwatching it.
I guess it's on me, but also,again, a lot of these movies
where you question theprotagonist's reality and their

(51:38):
experience and you're trying todigest what's actually happening
, what's not happening.
It kind of makes it hard to tryto like, go back and like oh,
this is pointing back to thescene in act two where it's just
like dude, she just chopped upa woman's throat and turned her
into a meat puppet.
Now she's getting into a boxlike I don't even know.
Evil Mary Poppins.

Captain (52:01):
I'm like right, the ash man coming after her and like
pushing things into her andstuff.
I was like, what am I watching?
It's like is this?

Jay (52:14):
happening.
Yeah, yeah, I, it's not a bad.

Captain (52:15):
No no, no, no, no.
I don't, why can't I just?

Wilson (52:18):
it's not a bad no, no no , no, no it's me, I'm the, and
like that's the harmony.
I just want a straightforward,stupid stop motion.
Back in my day, creepy puppetswere enough.

Jay (52:37):
I don't need no intellectual shit, freaking
dissertation over here Back inmy day creepy puppets were
enough.
I don't need no intellectualshit.
Freaking dissertation over here.

Captain (52:47):
Seriously Okay, but that was basically.
I do want to go to a shortcommercial break now that we
have a sponsor and we'll beright back.

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Wilson (53:49):
All legal fees are not unfriendable and we're back
thanks to our sponsorship.
So for this movie we havesupposedly.

Captain (54:07):
Reportedly the budget was like a million dollars or
less and the box office was ohyeah, it was in certain theaters
for a very small time, like AMCdid show it.
I remember it was in the listwait, you like remember seeing
it.

Wilson (54:20):
I remember seeing it on the AMC app, oh wow, okay, but
it was in the list.
Oh you, wait, you like rememberseeing it listed.
I remember seeing it on the AMCapp oh wow.

Captain (54:22):
Okay, yeah, but it was made at approximately $804,000,
so less than what it would costbasically.

Wilson (54:31):
Yeah, if the budget is, but in any case it sounds like
they didn't really yeah.

Captain (54:36):
It was like barely, it's just really artsy, so like,
if that's not what you're downfor, then I mean it's like it's
a horror movie, because like itis truly disgusting I think like
it, um, it was really close tobeing the type of artsy that
like won a bunch of awards, butit wasn't quite there.

Wilson (54:54):
That's how I view it.
Like it was almost like it hadall the makings of like a really
artsy movie that people wouldlove, but it just like wasn't
there yeah, I know I do get that, um, I mean people do like it.

Captain (55:06):
On rotten tomatoes, the um the critics like it have a
91 because it like it has thosepieces and then, but audiences
of 49 because if you have togoog, points get taken yeah,
they do, they do, they really doum you always have letterbox on
here.

Wilson (55:24):
I mean a 3.1, okay, um I mean that kind of like tracks
with that like um, oh, I didn'tlook at any of the hot goose, is
this?
Uh, there's, there's honestlynot like.
It's kind of they share somethings about the, the filming
process, oh, but nothing's likeum.
So it's like interesting, justread like how they kind of did

(55:46):
it, but none of it's really gossyeah, none of it's really goose
a sling prepared for her roles.

Captain (55:56):
Is there any goss?
Yeah, I don't think so.
Um, she prepared for her roleby training in some stop motion
animation before portraying Ella, and the film has some eerie
enhancements by the practicaleffects of handcraft puppets,
aligning with Morgan'straditionalist.
What is this?
I don't know what that is.

Wilson (56:20):
Who wrote this crap?

Jay (56:27):
I think AI wrote this crap.

Wilson (56:28):
I mean, yeah, I think ai wrote that that's, that's,
that's our boy ghost in the showum wait, what would you rate
this?

Jay (56:32):
oh, that's right.

Captain (56:32):
Um yeah, what's your ratty addy addy I don't know man
, you're ratty addy and you'reraggy aggy okay.
Do you have a raggy aggy?
I think I do have those.

Wilson (56:43):
Yeah, I don't have a specific moment, but I will say
I think the work they did on thestop motion was really good.
Just seeing the stop motiongirl you could see how the doll
was feeling.
They did emotions very well.
I thought they emoted that.

Captain (57:00):
I've never seen a movie like this, where it
incorporates real live actionpeople and stop motion
seamlessly like in a scene itwas kind of weird.
I like something about that Idon't like I don't want to see
it.

Wilson (57:14):
I think the yeah, I would say the stop motion
effects are great captainherself just doesn't like it.

Captain (57:21):
It it freaks me out.
I don't want to see claymationmoving around me fair, real talk
.

Wilson (57:28):
What, what was it?
Do you have a razor glass?

Captain (57:30):
oh, yes, my razor glass actually was a jump scare that
got me.
When she's tripping balls butnot actually tripping balls, um,
she sees like the ash man iscoming in into her life, in her
real life.
There's a there when she looksin her peephole because she
feels like the ash man isoutside her door and she looks
in there and there's like abulging, like bright red eye,

(57:50):
like staring at her, like it's ajump scare and I, we, I like we
, we did jump but you have toknow if we're watching a scary
movie and somebody's lookingthrough a peephole like there's
gonna be a jump scare betterthan when I thought it was gonna
be okay how the movie was goingand I was just one giant angry
eye did you ever raise a glass,jay?

Jay (58:12):
well, I did like that scene um wow remain nameless took
that scene from me, um, and eventhough we agreed privately
before airing this, that scenewould belong to me.
But what another bridge, um,I'm trying to think.
So I do agree with wilson thata lot of the the animation stop

(58:32):
motion work was really good.
Um, as far as, like, scarymoments go, there's a moment
where, early on in the movie, um, the lights are flickering in
her mom's studio her mom's stillalive but like they have like
what looks like the most crazy,dangerous set of wires,

(58:53):
extensions and wires in the backroom.
That's just like literallysparking electricity and
eventually the lights go out andher mom disappears and she
reappears real quickly andscares us, the viewers, before
she dies.
I thought that was pretty good.
It's really on the movie, soyou don't know what you're in
for, but it's kind of fun.
Other than that, I don't.

(59:14):
I did like when that reallyannoying sister-in-law died, I
really hated her.
When she goes to work and she'slike wait a minute, you
recreated my set.
That was I was.
That was so fucked up.

Captain (59:29):
I was like invited there to like get a job and like
not be a crazy psycho in herapartment by herself she's
trying to change yeah, but shedoesn't really actually get to
do the animation, and then whenshe does look at the animation
board, they stole her idea of agirl in the forest and she was
like no, I was just inspired, byit.

Wilson (59:45):
It's like what?

Captain (59:46):
I'm confused as to how you can use that as an advert?
Yeah, but do you?

Jay (59:53):
I guess she's like, well, you passed me up.
It's like, okay, you didn'tsteal the idea, yeah, and then
she just gaslit her for the restof the movie, being like you're
so crazy, honey, you think youneed to Really.
So I was really happy to seewhat she got.
That's fair.

Captain (01:00:10):
I feel bad for Tom.
Tom didn't deserve it.

Wilson (01:00:12):
He's just a good guy.

Jay (01:00:15):
Just a chill guy.

Captain (01:00:17):
Do you know what you would rate this movie before I
go?

Wilson (01:00:21):
Who are you asking who we are?
I give it like a 39.

Jay (01:00:27):
Oof.
Is that lower than lastseason's finale?
It is yeah.

Wilson (01:00:33):
I think a lot of it was done well, but I was just like I
don't want to look up all thisstuff.

Captain (01:00:39):
I know the gooks put so much on it, like knocked it
down, but I don't think it's bad.
I feel like I'm going to givelike the same score I gave last
season for the last movie we did, which everyone remembers.

Jay (01:00:58):
Of course I totally remember.
Don't even go about saying it,because I see it right here in
my mind.

Captain (01:01:04):
I want to say it's like I'll go straight like 50.
I think I'm going to gostraight 50.
It's not bad, the story makessense.
Ish.
The general story, the generalmetaphor story makes sense the
gist of it yeah.
But all of the stuff in themiddle to end is like real crazy

(01:01:28):
.
I don't like it.

Jay (01:01:31):
Yeah, it's extreme, even with the.
I mean, I know it's supposed tobe like, I guess, disturbing,
but like at some point she'spoint towards the very end.
She's literally making herselfa stop motion video and she's
filming herself bleeding out onthe floor, slowly moving, and
then taking pictures.
I'm like this looks kind ofsilly.

Captain (01:01:50):
Yeah, that actually did look really silly.
I was like what are we doing?
That looked really silly.
It looked so ridiculous.
I saw someone interpreted themovie that she had a drug
problem because of thetourniquet that she's using and
then ripping her leg.

Wilson (01:02:02):
It was like a metaphor for a drug addiction.

Jay (01:02:04):
I guess so Interesting.

Captain (01:02:05):
Because we see that part and it's like why would you
have that equipment?

Jay (01:02:10):
But, yeah.
I mean I guess, yeah, thatcould be a theory.
I mean, they came in and sawher and they weren't like what's
happening.
They're like, oh, you need togo back to the hospital.
Yeah, they weren't, they werejust like, oh, back to the
hospital.
I would say my rating I can'tgive it less than a.
I really did not like lastseason's finale movie Damn, I

(01:02:34):
did not care for it.
I'd have the Devil at Christmasmaybe yes, why it takes place
during Christmas.
But looking at a door for 80minutes is not a movie.
Oh yeah, I mean.
Sorry, josh Lowe, if you'relistening to this, I'll give it
slightly better.
I think I gave that movie a 50.
I will give this movie like a60.
But again, I wouldn't recommendit to anyone.

(01:02:58):
I wouldn't be like you have tosee Stop Motion, like I just
watched it, like there are tonsof movies and there are movies
that I think aren't as likecreative as stop motion.
I would still recommend topeople because I think they'd
just be more enjoyable watchlike I don't think the average
person is going to enjoywatching this very much.
If I recommended this to someone, they would be like delete my
number.
Yeah, yeah, if I caught someone, you didn't see this, I think

(01:03:20):
they would be what kind of viewdo you have of me?
Yeah, like what is wrong withyou?

Captain (01:03:28):
I feel like normally stop-motion movies, aren't they
like fun kid movies?

Jay (01:03:32):
Yeah, typically.
What is that man?
Tim Burton?
Yes, yeah, those are all like.

Captain (01:03:35):
Those are all weird movies.
They're dark-ish oh.

Wilson (01:03:37):
Wes Anderson yes.

Captain (01:03:38):
Those are all weird movies.
They're dark-ish.

Wilson (01:03:42):
But they're not like horror I know that's the stop
motion.

Captain (01:03:48):
I want to see the Ari Aston movies.

Jay (01:03:50):
Midsommar Hereditary Very creepy, very dark, still great.

Wilson (01:03:55):
Very mindful.

Jay (01:03:57):
Very mindful, dang it.
Yeah what Wes Anderson, timBurton, we were very mindful,
but dang it who?

Captain (01:04:01):
was what Wes Anderson, tim Burton, what you're thinking
of a specific stop motionartist?

Jay (01:04:10):
there's another like he's not up and coming anymore, but
there was another I thought likereally good horror director
recently.
Besides Ari Aster, I can'tthink of any of the movies.

Captain (01:04:20):
I don't know this podcast.
We never remember anything.

Jay (01:04:23):
Yeah that's true, we mix stuff up.
It's all the kona, big wavegoing a big wave um yeah, oh my
gosh, sorry, I just realized.

Captain (01:04:33):
Do you know what we're doing next time?
Wait, do we have anything elseyou wanted to say?

Jay (01:04:37):
I don't, I wouldn't recommend.
I think the Airbnb we got wascursed, so I'm gonna call
1-800-I-NEED-BJ.

Captain (01:04:43):
Oh my, gosh you found a shrunken doll in there yeah, a
shrunken head, oops, you sure itwasn't mine, or?

Wilson (01:04:51):
we're gonna find out, do you know?

Captain (01:04:54):
what we're doing next time?

Wilson (01:04:56):
what are we doing?
I don't know what we're doingthis time.
Oh my gosh I can tell you youmade it sound like you knew?

Jay (01:05:00):
yeah, I feel like you should be prepared to answer
their you brought up thequestion I was.

Captain (01:05:06):
I was preparing, but then I thought maybe wilson
arnie knows the answer I neverdo but if he doesn't know the
answer, then the movie thatwe're doing, this, this is the
worst.

Wilson (01:05:19):
This is me killing time.
No, no, the last movie that weare doing is I haven't pulled up
Curve, curve, your enthusiasm.
I think I looked it up before.
I'm excited for the movieswe're doing this season.
I took the slime ball off ofthere.
It's still there.

Captain (01:05:41):
Well, I'm taking it off .
Um, this is one about, uh,someone who's a young bride she
curvy, she gets crushed.

Wilson (01:05:49):
Do you guys have a?

Captain (01:05:50):
hitchhiker that she has to play with or escape from.
Um what well?

Jay (01:05:54):
I'm just gonna ask how do you set the roster like, do you
like?
Do you automatically include?

Wilson (01:05:59):
captain does it, sometimes I'll sneak in a movie
or two.
Well, I was gonna ask like doyou like?
Do you automatically includecaptain does it?
Sometimes I'll sneak in a movieor?

Jay (01:06:02):
two, well, I was gonna ask like, do you just like you take
the movies from, like, let's say, 2024 and you're like, okay,
out of these new movies, whatmovies we've seen?

Wilson (01:06:10):
we're gonna okay, no, it's a random, just any that
don't feature a dog death.

Captain (01:06:15):
Yeah, they basically I look up anything that has animal
death and those get mixed okay,okay, get out of here.
Most of the time, Like this onehad a fox carcass, I was like I
think I can deal with a foxcarcass.

Jay (01:06:26):
Yeah, I mean they did do a lot of fox carcass.
There was a lot of fox carcass.

Captain (01:06:30):
I usually try to have a kooky move of the season.

Wilson (01:06:34):
Kooky.

Captain (01:06:41):
So, like you know, night of the or not, David Jesus
, blood and Honey or yeah, or.
Llamageddon or Killer Sofa,like I have a kook and then I
have a Halloween one that's setin Halloween and then I have.

Jay (01:06:49):
Is Night Swim kind of a kooky one?
No, it seems like it should be,but it was a different kind of
kooky.

Wilson (01:06:55):
Yeah, it's on the verge it's on the verge um.

Captain (01:06:58):
Do it's on purge.

Jay (01:06:59):
Do you think we can make this episode longer than the
Night Swim episode?
Wait what?
The Night Swim was a longepisode, it was like 90 minutes.
Oh, sorry, I don't knowanything.

Captain (01:07:08):
Oh, sometimes we do a parrot theme.

Jay (01:07:11):
A parrot?
I thought you said parrot.
I was like what?

Captain (01:07:13):
Okay, sorry, my accent's heavy A paired theme
yeah.
Oh like, oh paired theme.

Wilson (01:07:25):
Yeah, oh like, oh paired yeah like we have a lot of
accidental paired themes.
Yeah, barbarian super host,that was on purpose.

Captain (01:07:28):
Yeah, so um okay, sorry , that's not important.
What we're doing is next timeis we're doing sorry, sorry, and
I do have kooky move of theseason, but I don't want to say
yeah.

Wilson (01:07:35):
Don't say yeah, I'm not gonna say it'll be a surprise
all right, right.

Captain (01:07:39):
Anyway, that's what I have.
Oh no, what do you got for?

Wilson (01:07:42):
me.
What do you got for me Advice?
Oh no, Give me advice.

Captain (01:07:46):
Jay, do you have any advice based on this movie,
based on this movie.

Jay (01:07:49):
Yeah, I think you know you should really learn to speak up,
like be honest, like speak upfor yourself.

Wilson (01:08:00):
Be honest.
Speak up for yourself.

Jay (01:08:03):
Real advice is you should have confidence enough in
yourself to speak your mind andassert yourself in a situation.

Captain (01:08:10):
He's really trying.
My dumb advice is don't playinside your leg wounds.

Jay (01:08:16):
Yeah, that's the only thing that sticks out from this movie
.
Those two things are the reallyfingers out of wounds.
That's the next thing I wasthinking of that final scene
where she's doing that.
It's almost unwatchable.
Fingers don't get pushed inwounds, she's using her fingers.

Captain (01:08:32):
Twice in this movie.

Jay (01:08:33):
Just deep in there.

Captain (01:08:36):
Yeah, that's really the advice.

Jay (01:08:37):
That was tough to watch.

Captain (01:08:40):
It's a common problem.

Jay (01:08:41):
I'm putting my score actually to 50.
I'm sorry.

Wilson (01:08:44):
I forgot that is actually just yeah Gross.

Jay (01:08:48):
I don't like that, that's just gross, sorry.

Wilson (01:08:52):
It's really All right.
That's what I got for advice ofthe week.

Jay (01:08:55):
Yeah, clean your hands.