The Marsh Appreciation and Restoration Society for Happiness: On The MARSH with its founders

Episode Transcript
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Dr Blake (00:00):
You know, we were just shooting the shit, really
having fun playing, taking atiny micro break from parenting,
and all of a sudden it's like,all right, let's do a cleanup.
Oh, why don't we come up with aname for our group as we clean
up?
And oh, wait a second, whydon't we do a few of these other
things?
And we're doing it as we'reparenting, and so who wants to

(00:24):
parent and look at the world asa piece of shit?
I want my kids to enjoy lifeand to feel joyful and come down
and see this, not feel likewe're all sinking and dying.

AJ (00:43):
What to do when your prominent low-lying coastal city
starts to go underwater.
Nigh on weekly on averagealready, harleston, south
Carolina, is served by the Postand Courier spruiked as the
South's oldest daily newspaper.
It runs a series called theRising Waters Lab and a couple
of months ago it featured astory titled.

(01:05):
The South East's First UrbanEco Corridor Aims to Connect
Fragmented Habitats inCharleston.
Welcome to the Marsh Project.
What started as a personaleffort among three friends to
revitalise and steward an acreof marsh on the peninsula has
grown into a community poweredjuggernaut, and not just to save

(01:28):
a city from flooding or evenjust to restore its incredible
lands and waters.
But the complex history of thisplace means the healing runs
deep.
One of the co-founders of theproject is Joel Caldwell.

Joel (01:41):
So our the MARSH Project is an acronym, it's the Marsh
Appreciation Restoration Societyfor Happiness, and that is the
idea.
It's like we don't want to justbe angry all the time.
You know like the stakes arehigh, yes, but let's not all be
miserable.
You know Like let's have fundoing this, like let's pick up
as much trash as we can untilwe're too tired, and then let's
go eat pizza and drink a coupleof beers.

(02:02):
You know.

AJ (02:03):
You might remember Joel from here in Charleston on episode
227, talking about his new filmfor Patagonia, the Green Buffalo
.
Joel went on to win the ShortFilm Award at the prestigious
Santa Barbara International FilmFestival for that, by the way,
but the film wasn't the half ofwhat Joel's been up to.
It was actually when we leftour friends, renowned authors

(02:25):
Judith Schwartz and partner TonyEprile, up in Vermont that Judy
said we might enjoy meetingJoel and the two Blakes, dr
Blake Scott and Blake Suarez.
When I looked them up onlineand saw the restoration project
they'd instigated on their localmarsh was called the Marsh
Appreciation and RestorationSociety.
For Happiness I knew these wereguys I did want to meet and,

(02:48):
true to the window front, thiswould be no ordinary project.
G'day Anthony James here for TheRegenNarration, your
independent, listener-supportedpodcast exploring how people are
regenerating the systems andstories we live by, with thanks
to generous souls like LindsaySell.
Thanks so much for increasingyour subscription, lindsay.
And thanks to new subscriberson Substack Lisa Sonnenberg,

(03:13):
sarah Winnie and Joanne Danaher.
Little life highlight to haveEssendon Footy Club royalty on
board.
Thanks to you all for makingthis possible.
If you've been thinking aboutjoining this great community
supporting listeners, I'd loveyou to For as little as a dollar
a week, with benefits if youlike, you can help keep the show
on the road.
Subscribe free or paid onPatreon or Substack.

(03:34):
Just follow the links in theshow notes.
With my great gratitude.
As it happens, we arrived inCharleston on a day when the
community was together at themarsh for a cleanup-up event
with beer and pizza afterwards.
So we literally rolled intotown, said hi, headed to the
marsh, put mics on and joinedthem in wondering if anyone
would come to pick rubbish outof mud on a steamy South

(03:57):
Carolina afternoon.
Well, people came fromeverywhere.
We hear from some of them as Iwander alongside Joel and Dr
Blake, an associate professor atthe College of Charleston, to
hear about how this restorationproject has taken off with
increasing support from thecommunity, local students,
designers, private landholdersand corridors of power, to

(04:18):
become something very special tothem and inspirational to the
rest of us.
Let's head out to the marsh.
Okay, heading down to theforeshore here at the marsh
event gathering, see if I canstick a microphone on the hosts.

Collector (04:34):
Hey, what's happening .

Joel (04:35):
Anthony, this is Blake Suarez.

Collector (04:38):
Hey Blake, how you doing man All the way from Perth
.
Wow, just for this cleanup,Just for this.

Joel (04:44):
He's flying home tonight.
No, he's here.
He's already been here for fivemonths.

Dr Blake (04:48):
And this is.

Joel (04:48):
Blake Scott over here with the big beard.
All right, goody.

AJ (04:52):
And who's gonna introduce him?
Is it just you, or is it acombination of you?

Joel (04:55):
Yeah, it'll probably.
Be definitely it'll be Blake.

AJ (04:58):
All right, I'll stick a mic on him too, then.
Eh Okay, cool, I just need tointroduce myself.

Joel (05:02):
Yeah, I already told him you did, yeah.
Hey, what's happening?
The finest people are comingout.
How you doing?
I'm Joel, I'm Avery, inky, inky, nice to meet you.
Here you are, inky, you get agrabber LP.

Collector (05:20):
Nice.

Joel (05:21):
How's everybody doing?
Nice to meet you?

AJ (05:24):
I'm gonna take your trash so it doesn't end up in the marsh
that would be a bad start.

Joel (05:28):
Lp.
How are you?
I'm good.
How are you All right?
Good, it's great to see you.
We got Belvin here, bradford.
Okay, look, they're coming inin droves now, folks, I know.

Dr Blake (05:41):
I almost don't have enough routes for everybody now,
hey, that's good.
The people who don't have aroute would just say go for it.
Yeah, just go.

Joel (05:48):
Come on over, you guys, we're going to get started.
Come on over.
If you haven't signed up yet,you can sign up later.
I'll let them know this is anamazing turnout for the hot sun.

Collector (06:00):
Thanks everybody for coming.
My name is.

Joel (06:01):
Joel.

Dr Blake (06:02):
Caldwell.

Joel (06:02):
I'm one of the founders of the Marsh Project, along with
Blake and the other Blake withthe big beard over there, if you
don't know, we'll do a littlespiel here.
So the Marsh Project is theMarsh Appreciation Restoration
Society for Happiness and we'vekind of adopted this creek here,

(06:24):
halsey Creek, which is one ofthe last unfilled tidal creeks
on the peninsula, and we'rereally interested.
Our kind of main, main idea isthat we want to establish an
ecological corridor east westacross the Charleston Peninsula
here, so through Wagner Terrace,through the north central
neighborhood and over to theeast side.
And yeah, we're interested inpeople planting native plants
that support wildlife andpollinators.
We we're interested in treecanopy, we're interested in

(06:46):
basically a livable city that'sgood for wildlife and good for
the citizens, good for peoplethat live here as well.
We're also just generallyinterested in connecting people
to the salt marsh environmentand the low country and having
an understanding of when youlive here you affect everything
around you.
So let's all be good stewardsbut let's have fun in the
process.
Thank you so much for coming.

(07:07):
I'll hand it off to Blake hereto talk about what we're going
to do today.

Dr Blake (07:10):
This is our fourth annual cleanup in the
neighborhood.
It's part of the annual BeachRiver Sweep with DNR Department
of Natural Resources and SouthCarolina Sea Grant.
They've been doing it since1988.
It's also part of aninternational cleanup.
We've had so much success overthe last four years that my son
can be barefoot now and I feelcomfortable about it because we

(07:32):
remove so much glass andmaterial.
So I really thank you over thelast couple of years.
You're actually going to haveto work harder to find material
now.
So look for microplastics, lookfor little pieces of material
in the marsh.
We've got 10 routes for you allbecause we realize now that
we've done so well in this partof our project.

(07:52):
We want to go more towardsRutledge and King Street, we
want to get to North Central, wewant to get to downtown and
have more and more impacts.
So hopefully that will.
You know it's weird to sayexpand, but I want to expand
that our neighborhoods arecleaner and healthier, not only
for human beings but also forwildlife, for pollinators, for

(08:12):
birds.
Just a few days ago, threemillion birds passed over
Charleston on their waymigrating south.
So we're doing this not justfor us and our families, but
also for other species.
I feel like it's a very fittingplace to do this, because if you
look across the Ashley River,here, that is Charlestown
Landing.
That's where our currentpredicament began in 1670, when

(08:35):
the English settled here alongwith people from Africa and the
Caribbean, enslaved, and soperhaps we can have a new
beginning, starting on the river, perhaps on the other side.
Because of this being part ofthe project with DNR and Sea
Grant, we would like you todocument the trash you find.
So there's data forms on thetable over there everybody's
favorite part.

(08:56):
Yeah, this is not exactly themost exciting part, except for
the person who does the data youknow you're like.
At least you don't have to bendover briefly.
But what we're trying to see ischange over time in these
marshes and and we're seeingthat it is improving and by
doing that we create a recordthat we can go to policymakers,
city officials and say supportthese efforts.

(09:18):
So please try to document whatyou're finding thank you
everybody.

Joel (09:22):
Thank you for coming.
Hi Lily, how are you Good, Iknow gotta watch what I say.
It's funny that we we all havetwo kids under five each of us,
you know so it's just like amadhouse of a time to start

(09:46):
anything.
Okay, they're going to holddown the fort.
I'm paying LP.
You make her earn her money.
Oh, are you really?
That's a great idea.
I'm going to pay her 20 bucksfor an hour.
Oh, should I offer to pay her 20more?
Yeah, would you want to hangwith LP here?
Can I pick you up until Momgets here?
You want to hang with LP here?

(10:07):
Can I pick you up until Momgets here?

AJ (10:09):
Yeah, then we can walk and talk and pick up trash once we
offload.

Joel (10:12):
Maybe don't touch that, okay, because that's Anthony's.
It's kind of fragile, I think.
Find some good trash out there.
Yeah, we found plastic andglass and a lighter.

AJ (10:26):
Hey, all right, we're walking.
I'll chuck this back on youthen, Sure, that's fine.
Yeah, cool, thank you.

Dr Blake (10:29):
I got, I purchased a little bit of time.
Yeah, literally.

AJ (10:36):
We all know what each other's talking about basically.

Dr Blake (10:39):
So this is your regeneration.

AJ (10:41):
Yeah, exactly this one might be less faded.
Oh, I see there we go, you'vegot some good mileage on

Dr Blake (10:46):
there.
Yeah, I was just showing mystudents the other day these
coral reef restoration projectsin the Florida Keys.
Really, because 90% of the reefhas died over the last 30 years
.
No, yeah, it's terrible,absolutely terrible In my
lifetime I grew up diving thereand everything.
It's really sad to see.

AJ (11:02):
I dive on the Australian reefs too, and you know half of
the Great Barrier Reef.
That's sad.

Joel (11:07):
Yeah 90% Half of the Great Barrier Reef.

Dr Blake (11:10):
Yeah, exactly, but they've learned to essentially
farm coral reefs.

Joel (11:14):
But has it been successful ?

Dr Blake (11:15):
They've got a couple acres as a demonstration site
and it's working.

AJ (11:19):
Is that right?

Dr Blake (11:19):
Yeah, yeah, it's really cool, what do you know?
Because they've got like theseChristmas tree skeleton designs
and then the elk horn coralgrows off of it and it's really
beautiful, brilliant.
It's going to happen in ourlifetime.
We're going to figure it out.
It's just how many resourcesare people going to put towards
it?

Joel (11:39):
But does it grow like a more resilient coral, you know?
Because can't those bleachingevents just keep happening as
the water gets?

Dr Blake (11:46):
hotter.
That's a good question.
I think they're trying to pickparticular species.

AJ (11:50):
Gotcha, and there'll be self-selection too.

Collector (11:53):
Nature's adjusting.
It's pretty amazing.

AJ (11:55):
I've seen some things with coral, even where nature's
responding.
Like, there's a reef in thewest Ningaloo Reef and there was
a massive marine heatwave andthis reef doesn't suffer from
agricultural runoff and stuff,so it's doing pretty well all
things considered.
But this particular heatwavewas huge and there was a lot of
fear about it and it held up.
So, yeah, nature's Well, unlesswe really push the ticket.

(12:18):
Yeah, yeah, it's surprising us,as always.

Dr Blake (12:21):
Yeah, and there's a difference between our lifetime
and ecological cycles.

AJ (12:26):
Yeah, that's it, that's it.

Dr Blake (12:28):
We would like to.
We would like to live and seeit.

AJ (12:30):
Yeah, right on.

Joel (12:31):
Yeah, so Blake and I met.
We met maybe three, is it threeyears ago?

Dr Blake (12:37):
It's close to four years now, between three and
four years yeah.

Joel (12:47):
Yeah, so we met four years ago and really just had this,
you know, common interest in.
You know, like I guess hetaught about the environment
through international studies,you know, in the commons and
everything that he's been doing,and I'm, as a journalist and
filmmaker, you know, kind oftelling stories from all over
the place, but we were bothreally very interested in
telling stories locally, youknow, and trying to get involved
in some sort of grassrootseffort, um, and and, just kind

(13:10):
of.
We had a million ideas but wealso had young kids, so we would
start like 50,000 strains ofthought and finish none of them,
as you can see, for good reason.
You know, um, and and, but itwas just kind of immediate.
You know, I think that blakebrought a lot of a lot of the
fire to get this thing off theground, a lot of the energy and

(13:31):
and.
Then we very quickly teamed upwith blake suarez, who's a super
talented graphic designer andhe can make you look legit way
before you deserve to be andso it's kind of a social media
yeah and and so it's kind ofjust been.
And then I think also thisneighborhood, you know, is, uh,
it's in the process of aturnover.
You know, just a lot of youngfamilies are moving, moving in,

(13:54):
and so it's kind of a reallyit's.
It's just kind of a really coolopportunity, because people are
sort of like.
You know, if people are kind oflike, oh, I now bought this
little house and what do I do inmy yard, and they're like, I
guess they're either like well,I can do what my parents did, or
but I'm not necessarily likecommitted to that Some people
are, of course or I can dosomething totally different, you

(14:17):
know.
There we go, which is kind oflike this, the opportunity that
we feel, you know, know that wecan kind of come in and
influence people to Maybe dosomething at a moment that makes
more sense.

AJ (14:35):
You put your thumb out.
That's the way to get it morefun than us.

Collector (14:37):
Yeah, going straight to the wine bar, that's the way
you parent.

Dr Blake (14:44):
We were at Holy City Brewing parenting thanks.

AJ (14:49):
So while we're on that, a bit of that context to the
neighborhood.
What's the historical backdropthat you're perceiving a shift
in now?

Dr Blake (14:58):
well, there's been many waves for this neighborhood
.
Before it was a neighborhood,it was a plantation, it was an
agricultural zone dependent onslavery.

AJ (15:10):
This was a major thoroughfare for that.

Dr Blake (15:13):
There was a main plantation house on 350 acres.
It was called the GrovePlantation and there was quite a
bit of citrus and and uh, nuts,you know.
They had fruit trees and pecantrees, things like that.
It was almost like agentleman's estate, it wasn't.
They weren't like producing awhole lot for commercial

(15:36):
purposes because it was superclose to downtown charleston, so
it was.
You could step outside the citylimits and get fresh air here.

Joel (15:44):
So they had horses, if you were able to go where you
wanted, yeah yeah, if you'reessentially the white person who
owned the plantation.

Dr Blake (15:51):
So there was that history.
For several hundred years itwas indigenous lands.
Before that it was controlledby the Kiowa people until
English colonization and theywere essentially chased out
south.
We have an island named afterthem, but there are no people
who are Kiowa descent there.
And that's the 1600s 1600s, intothe 1700s, between 1670 and

(16:18):
1715, they went through thatentire transformation from being
indigenous to some contactswith european powers mostly
merchants and sailors to being acolonial settler society
depending on slave labor.
Um, and so that was for severalhundred years.
And then the civil war.

(16:39):
The civil war you probablyheard the story begins in
charleston.
The first shots are fired, um,from right, yeah, down at fort
sumter, yeah, just a few milesfrom here.
And this became a militaryencampment during the
confederacy and they had aprisoner of war camp in the
neighborhood and union soldierswere held there and starved to

(17:01):
death.
Wow, there's unmarked graves afew blocks from where we are now
, and many people say it was thesite of the first Memorial Day
in Charleston in May 1865.
Because when the Union soldierscame in in the Massachusetts
54th All Black Regiment, theyhonored the dead and you know it

(17:25):
was the end of slavery for forthe south, but obviously race
and all those issues continued.
And then eventually, boy, thisis a long, this is a long
question.
You know, we've documented allthis story and so let me, let me
take a a pause for a second andsay, joel, and I really believe
, like for people to care abouta place.
They got to know all the layersof the story because then they

(17:46):
can feel the richness and thesignificance like think of all
the people and all the thingsthat have happened here.
This is the story of the worldin one neighborhood it will sit
and so you need to take care ofthat and you know, honor it and
be honest about it.
And be honest, yeah, it's notjust sort of whitewashing it,
but what, yeah, give them givethem some history more recently

(18:06):
yeah.
So then, um, by 1901, 1902, thesouth is trying to rebuild
itself, still out of the civilwar, and there's a lot of
expansion from the united statesinto the caribbean and
charleston wants to be like themain southern port for us
expansion further south into thetropics.
So they organized thisexposition called the South

(18:27):
Carolina Interstate and WestIndia Exposition.
Not unlike what happened inChicago or New York with the
World's Fair, they're going toshow, like all the industry, all
the potential.
And this was not a neighborhoodyet, it was still that
plantation, and they built theexposition in this neighborhood
and there were all these reallyum, what's the right?

(18:49):
Gilded buildings, right, yeah,they were made of, um, this type
of, uh, plaster that was notmeant to last, but they look
like the white house, you know,really yeah, with big pillars,
and there was the agriculturebuilding and the machinery
building and the entertainmentbuilding and restaurants and
there was gondola rides on thecreek.

(19:11):
They dammed the creek andturned it into a lake and called
it lake juanita and theater.
President theodore rooseveltcame here for the exposition and
mark twain came and booker twashington.
There were 600 000 visitors whocame to this exposition and it
lasted a little over six months,and then they tore all the
buildings down really and uhsold off what was left of the

(19:35):
lumber millions of feet oflumber, you know wiped out our
many of our pine forests for us,for this exposition, and then
it sat vacant for another17-something years.
And then they decided to doCharleston's first suburb, which
is the neighborhood we now livein, called Wagner Terrace,

(19:56):
platted out in 1919.
All the streets, the lots, allof our homes are based on that
1919.
And it was originally um animmigrant neighborhood, um, like
middle-class immigrants, greeks, italians, a lot of jews.
Uh, it was a big jewishneighborhood, um, because they

(20:18):
weren't really allowed in theblue blood, you know old school
english, yeah, anglicanepiscopalian circles, so they
had to sort of be on theoutskirts.
You know they weren't black butthey weren't white, yeah so they
had their own neighborhood andit lasted like that for several
decades and it was.
At some point it becamepredominantly jewish and the

(20:39):
first conservative synagogue incharleston is in this was in
this neighborhood and thendesegregation happens in the 60s
and 70s and the jewishcommunity and all those
immigrant communities who arenow like second, third
generation, they go out to thesub, the further suburbs off the
peninsula and this was probablybeing absorbed right into the

(21:02):
city of Charleston kind of atthat point.

Joel (21:03):
Yeah, West Ashley.

Dr Blake (21:05):
More downtown.
Yeah, and downtown became atsome point more predominantly
black.
It was like 70-30 black-white.

Joel (21:12):
So desegregation all over the country.
Right, there's this history ofokay well, if we all have to go
to school together, then we'reout of here, and so the white
flight happens, and so the whitepeople move out like the actual
suburbs and take all the wealthwith them, and usually the
inner city schools fall apart.
And that's also in thephenomenon of okay well, we need
to be able to get to thesesuburbs quickly, so we put in

(21:34):
highways and the interstate isbeing built, and so lots of
times those interstates go rightthrough the middle of thriving
African American neighborhoods.

Dr Blake (21:43):
Yeah, yeah.
So there's not to get too deepinto all that, it becomes an
automobile society.
Yeah yeah, but now we'reexperiencing what some folks
will call gentrification, orurban renewal, and or bad all
the things.

Collector (21:59):
Yeah.

Dr Blake (22:02):
It is not bad or good.
It's good and bad's complicatedright, and so this neighborhood
is now attracting a lot ofyoung families, predominantly
white folks, many of themprogressive ideals, coming from
the north, really, or otherplaces, or the west as the case

(22:24):
may be, yeah yeah, west coast,but also a lot of like new
jersey, new york, massachusetts,ohio, midwest and uh, property
values have skyrocketed in thelast 30 years now.
So we wreck.
We recognize that there's thisenergy and it's not necessarily
engaged with history, nor aboutwith ecology, and so what we're

(22:47):
doing is we're tapping in tothat transformation and trying
to change the values to getfolks to say actually what the
best thing about thisneighborhood, in this area, is
the river and the marsh.
And historically, people turntheir backs on the river and the
marsh.
They use the marsh to throwtrash in it.

AJ (23:02):
Yeah, every generation use the marsh to throw trash in it.

Dr Blake (23:04):
Yeah, Every generation used the marsh to throw trash
in it.
They filled in the creeks tobuild roads and that's where the
houses flood, and so we'retrying to say go ahead.

Joel (23:15):
And Charleston also has.
You know we're literallysurrounded by water, with some
of the most incredible ecologyyou know in North America.
You know we're in the mostincredible ecology you know in
North America.
You know we're in the Atlanticflyway, so birds are migrating
from Antarctica, you know, allthe way up.
You know like all the wayacross the globe.
You see the most incrediblespecies here.
But even though we'resurrounded by that, it's really

(23:37):
hard to access it in Charleston.
Access to the water, I mean youcan.
There's like two or threerestaurants where you can be on
the water and they're all bad.
You know like it's just, it'sthis bizarre sort of inward
facing, I think, kind of like Idon't know, it's, it's, it's,
it's, it's really interesting.
So we're just trying, we justreally want to like encourage
people to, you know, like lookaround and and and and engage

(24:00):
with, with the ecosystem, andespecially at a time when, like
I said earlier, you know,charleston now floods one in
five days on average, and soit's like we really have to
change the way we're doingthings, you know so, yeah, let's
just one in five.

AJ (24:14):
Hang on a minute, one in five days on average.
Now come back to that.
Yeah, so what's happening?

Joel (24:20):
I think when you say that charleston floods one in five
days, you know it's it's, youknow it's a lot of nuisance
flooding it's a lot yeah, yeahpeople have.
Historically, as blake wassaying, you know you build your
houses on what was formerly atidal creek it's always trying
to be a tidal creek again,especially when you if it was
filled a year or 100 years agoor something, when it was filled

(24:41):
with basically organic matter,which is turning into soil, you
know, and things are continuingto settle um.
So a lot of that is just that wehave not respected what is
historically high ground, youknow, and we have thought we can
, just we can.
I don't know if this is aninternational term, but the
united states we talk aboutreclaimed yeah, we do too, but
it's not actually reclaimed,it's just that we're taking,

(25:02):
we're taking land that was issupposed to be underwater, yeah,
and we're making it dry andwe're building upon it.
And so, with increasing stormsurge, with increasingly intense
rainfall and storm events andhurricanes, with rising sea
levels, I mean this is the lowcountry.
There is no elevation.
I mean we're on some of thehighest of it currently.

(25:24):
And it's probably six or sevenfeet above sea level or
something like that.

Dr Blake (25:27):
Yeah, yeah, why don't we go down to the creek?
Yeah?

Joel (25:29):
Yeah, good idea.

Dr Blake (25:30):
Yeah, cool.

Joel (25:31):
So this is another.
You know it's like okay, sowhat do we do?
Do we all just in our backyards?
Do we just keep getting rid ofour plants and paving things,
you know, putting moreimpervious surfaces on and then
just like putting pumps thatshoot the water out on the
street?
Well, if everybody does that,then you can't drive through
these areas, you know.
So we're just trying to getpeople to think about what's

(25:54):
going on and kind of connect toit and see it as an opportunity,
you know, to be like okay,these things are happening.
How do we, you know, how do weembrace the changes that are
happening?
And you know, maybe plant, youknow plants that are that can be
high and dry for several monthsand then can be completely
inundated with water for a weekand they're still totally fine.

(26:14):
You know, these are nativeplants that evolved here for
thousands of years.

Dr Blake (26:18):
There we go.
You know the other thing aboutwhen you got the historical
layers, you quickly realizethings have never stayed the
same.
Right, they've always beenchanging, yes, and we don't
really want to be passiverecipients of what the change is
in the future.
Well said, we want to guide it,you know, steward it or
whatever you want, but influenceit in some way, and to repair

(26:42):
the relationship we have withthe natural environment.

AJ (26:44):
So I'm really curious then how you started it and then how
that path led to such anenormous response from people
and across demographics.

Joel (26:56):
it sounds like, yeah, I mean you know, I think I think
there is kind of a latenteagerness in people of our age.
You know we talk about that.
We felt like there was thiskind of like hunger for
something like this you did feelthat yeah, we did feel like
this and I also think it needsto be.
You know, it kind of has to beand I don't want to knock the

(27:17):
Sierra Club or any of you know,like any of these um, much more
established organizations that Ilove and I'm a financial
supporter of, you know, but likeyou, to reach people my age and
obviously people half my age,you know it kind of it helps if
the message feels like it'scrafted for them, you know, and
so just kind of, I think,especially through our

(27:38):
co-founder, blake Suarez.
You know it's like we can.
We can.
This is about fun.
This isn't about being angryenvironmentalists.
It's not about beingreactionary, this is about, I
mean so our the Marsh Project isan acronym, it's the Marsh
Appreciation Restoration Societyfor Happiness, and that is the
idea.
It's like we don't want to justbe angry all the time.

(27:58):
You know, like the stakes arehigh, yes, but like let's not
all be miserable.
You know, like let's have fundoing this.
Like let's pick up as much trashas we can until we're too tired
, and then let's go eat pizzaand drink a couple of beers, you
know, because, like it's justfun to build community, you know
.
In that regard.
So I think that we maybe justbeing able to craft like a

(28:20):
hopeful, exciting, you know,roll up your sleeves, kind of.

AJ (28:29):
The starting point.
What was the starting point?
We?

Dr Blake (28:31):
went for a walk, really, yeah, and you told
people.
Joel organized it.
He said hey, you know we've hadthese conversations between
parenting.
I want you to meet Blake Suarez.
Let's go down to the creek talkabout some ideas.
We saw a bunch of birds.
You know we were just shootingthe shit.
Really, yeah, just having funplaying, taking know tiny micro

(28:53):
break from parenting.
And all of a sudden it's likeall right, let's do a cleanup.
Oh, and why don't we come upwith a name for our group as we
clean up?
And oh, wait a second, whydon't we do a few of these other
things?
And we're doing it as we'reparenting.
And so who?
Who wants to parent and look atthe world as a piece of shit?

(29:15):
You know I want my kids to enjoylife and to feel joyful and
come down and see this, not feellike we're all sinking and
dying.

Joel (29:24):
That we're just like closing our eyes and not doing
anything.
Yeah, we want this to be.
It's beautiful.

AJ (29:29):
It is beautiful.

Dr Blake (29:31):
And we, you know, yeah , there are.
The sea level is going tocontinue to rise, maybe a foot
over the next couple of decades,maybe more.
But there are things we can doto slow that process and to be
able to stay here.
And to make room for otherspecies as well.

AJ (29:47):
Yeah.

Dr Blake (29:48):
This is a historical marker we got put in.
We had a block party here and abunch of food trucks and uh,
historical reenactment, umreally you guys did that too.

Joel (29:59):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, and that's part of it.
You know, it was like we justwant to be, we want to have
humor.
You know, like we want to like.
You know, like, I think,especially in the face of you
know what seems like long oddsor you know something that's
really kind of overwhelming.
As far as the challenge which,if you look at climate change
directly, I think it can feellike that I feel like people

(30:20):
have always reacted with humor,those that have been successful,
you know, I think that's a bigpart of it.
So you know, yeah, so we, so we, we always try to have like.
So the historical we had thishistorical um reenactment, you
could say, where a guy canoed inon, actually on a bicycle and
was dropped off and he was theEnglish general that had stormed

(30:43):
Charleston during theRevolutionary War.
You know, we're actually in the, we're just kind of beginning
shooting like a mockumentary ofthe Marsh Project, which is
going to be set like 30 years inthe future and we'll all have,
like you know, super gray hairand we'll be, we'll be looking
back about how the marsh projectestablished the ecological
corridor, you know so justtrying to like just to like,

(31:04):
make it fun for ourselves aswell 100.

AJ (31:06):
That's fun, but it's also visionary.
So which is a big part, bigpiece too.
I guess you hold that, thatit's a possibility that you can
see.

Joel (31:15):
Yeah, and that's like telling, telling.
Telling a story, even if it'slike kind of tongue in cheek,
but telling a story as some, howwe did this is, I mean,
subliminally right.
It's like, but it's been doneand it will happen.

AJ (31:27):
You know, I think there's power in that.
That's that story piece, right.

Dr Blake (31:30):
You know and you mobilize it for action, because
this stretch we're on now 10thAvenue this was a trash dump.
People would leave their trashhere, Dog poop everywhere.
It was totally neglected.
We got a sign in Nobody in thecontemporary of the neighborhood
, the contemporaries of theneighborhood, they didn't know
the name of the creek.
So we raised that awareness andnow we're going to do a native

(31:58):
plant walk here and we got thecity to to buy into that.
The neighborhood association'sputting money up, we raise the
funds and so you walk down hereand you'll learn about native
plants and how to regeneratelandscapes so there'll be
interpretive sort of signagelike this be a smaller scale
yeah, yeah, qr codes yeah, learnabout plants that you can put
in your own yard.
There's a lot of things you cando, eh.

Joel (32:14):
Be part of the ecological corridor.

Dr Blake (32:15):
Become a member.

Joel (32:16):
And then we're also.
The guy Michael from Departmentof Natural Resources was here,
but at the mouth of the creekwe're going to do an oyster reef
restoration.

AJ (32:26):
Really.

Joel (32:31):
Yeah, so you can.
They collect you know all theoysters that come through the
restaurants and then you kind ofput them in these wire cages
and you set them out at the reefor at the mouth and spat, you
know, like baby oyster, recruitonto that shell that you've,
that you've reestablished, andthen it grows an oyster reef and
that is like I mean, it'sincredibly, it's like the.

(32:51):
You know it's one of the mostdiverse biodiverse habitats, at
least in this part of the world.
You know it creates, cleans,cleans all of this water.
There's so many positives thatcome from that, as well as
preventing storm surge.

AJ (33:04):
It's one of these like green solutions as opposed to just
building seawalls.

Dr Blake (33:08):
Yes, if we could, if we could restore the health of
this creek and it's not, it'sdoing pretty well, even over the
last couple years of ourefforts.
We can.
We saw a beaver, hey, rosie.
At spoonbills, bald eaglesanimals are coming back, yeah,
um.
And there are a few, very fewtidal creeks left on the
peninsula.
There are only three left thatwere not filled in and and this

(33:28):
is one of them and if we canmake this a pilot project or a
demonstration, we can hopefullysay to other communities and the
city and officials like you,plant native plants, you clean
up the trash, you reduce yourinputs in terms of chemicals and
you can restore these spaces.

AJ (33:46):
Yeah, they come back.

Dr Blake (33:48):
Yeah, it's not rocket science, yeah.

Joel (33:50):
And even if it was rocket science, we'd figure it out.
Everybody benefits, everybodybenefits, right?
Everybody benefits, yeah, sothat's the other thing I'm
interested in the people thathave come in like?

AJ (33:57):
does it reach right into the community?
Are there?
Are there folks missing whatstood out on that front?

Joel (34:04):
yeah, I mean I'm always just, I'm always just amazed at
the, at the support, I mean thepeople that show up on like a
hot afternoon evening like thisto pick up garbage and I don't
know how many people that thatwas.
But I mean there was like wellover 50, that's for sure, yeah,
I mean, I'm just amazed that.
you know we have book clubs, youknow we have people come down
and speak, we have filmscreenings.

(34:25):
You know, like it's people justcome and it's like if you need
somebody, our friends that havea photo studio called silver
hill studio they're like, oh, doit here free of charge, like
come Really.
Yeah, I just feel like thecommunity just supports you know
, really, I feel like the onlylimit is our time because we all
have our day jobs and we haveyoung kids you know this is not

(34:48):
a salaried position.

Dr Blake (34:49):
We're all just volunteering.

AJ (34:51):
Yeah, and so that's the limit limit.
Do more people take someresponsibility on?

Dr Blake (34:55):
yeah, if we walk this way, we can see even some of the
the neighbors who've plantednative plants in their yard.
Hey, um, that's the idea islike.
I feel like joel isparticularly skilled at this and
blake suarez is.
You know, how do you?
How do you tap in to influencepeople to join some sort of
belief or value system?
Right, I do that in theuniversity, but it's very

(35:17):
structured, yes, and I liketheir captured audience where
you're you're you're pretty goodabout like.
I guess that's the reality ofbeing a freelance.
Right, you gotta, you gottafind your audience, yeah right
so we're sort of combining ourskill sets in terms of content.

Joel (35:34):
So the idea here is that this is our first 10th ave here
where we're going to be able todo that native planting.
That's really our firstopportunity to do that on city
land, and so the majority.
If we want to establish acorridor from the Ashley River
to the Cooper River, it's goingto need to be yard by yard right
, and so it's going to have tobe public buying, but also, like

(35:57):
that's how things are,sustainable, right yeah, if it's
like a top-down thing, you canmake some progress of course and
that's and it's that's worthdoing in my opinion, but if you
can actually have theconversations, the kind of tough
conversations, because anytimeyou're asking somebody to change
the way they do things in theirown yard.

Dr Blake (36:12):
Right, that's a very personal thing, is that yeah?

Joel (36:14):
it's a very personal thing , but if you how's it going?

Dr Blake (36:16):
guys, conversations and you finding stuff.
Okay, thank you.
Do you?
What's your next stop?
Do you know?
I think this is our final so goto 10th here, check out that
area, because you'll get a goodsense of the creek and
everything.
And then, uh, if you have time,walk all the way to grafton.
We'll have pizza is that down,yeah racing

AJ (36:39):
king street right yep, exactly hey you guys yeah, I'm
hosting an australian podcast.
Yeah, because this is such acool story.
Can I ask you why you areinvolved in this?

Collector (36:50):
um, I mean, I just like helping, helping out, you
know, I just thought that I meanmy friend, he is in this
environmental studies class andthey're, you know, just doing
this as a little project and heinvited me and I was like, yeah,
that sounds awesome.
And you this is my neighborhood,wagner Terrace.
I live here, so I figured thisclean up trash around here,
trying to make my neighborhoodlook a bit better and also kind

(37:11):
of get to know it better,because I don't really walk
around here too often, I kind ofjust go straight downtown.

AJ (37:15):
so well, apparently it gets me more way of the land.
Yeah, brilliant.
And how did?
How did you find out about it?

Joel (37:21):
the project.
Yeah, yeah, you're in thecollege.

AJ (37:24):
You guys are in the college, all right, yeah this is the
reality of a university.

Dr Blake (37:27):
There's this great line um about universities and
cities and it goes somethinglike if you want to, if you want
to have a great city, build agreat university and wait 200
years.
So I don't know where we're atin that 200 year scale, but
we're getting, we're gettingthere.
You know, there we go becausecollege of charleston has gotten
a lot better over the lastcouple decades and these, all of

(37:48):
them, are students there.

AJ (37:49):
That's brilliant yeah, what was your name?
I'm alex grace.
Great to meet you guys.
Thanks very much.
So it's called the regeneration, that's it.

Collector (37:59):
Thank you, yeah, you bet.

Dr Blake (38:00):
Thank you.
You too, isaiah.
Come join us for pizza.
Take it easy, guys.
Thank you.
Which way are we going?
Blake, let's go back this way,because I got to collect Levi.
Oh, okay, yeah, cool.
But that is the nice thing islike the students they sign up
for classes because they want tolearn, but they don't know what
they don't know quite yet.
So you get to.

Joel (38:21):
You get to choreograph it to a certain degree.
I think so many of us areshaped by a great teacher we had
at some point right I mean Igrew up in a very insular rural
community.
You know, and I had one inparticular amazing teacher in
high school and it just kind oflike made me aware of what's
possible and that was WashingtonState.

AJ (38:42):
Yeah, yeah, it's certainly true for me and similarly it was
.
It was a professor who got outthere in the world.

Collector (38:50):
Right.

AJ (38:50):
Yeah, so I hear that.
What about you, blake?
Did you have someone thattriggered thinking in you, or
even teaching, like someone thatreally stood out in your life,
on your path?
You?

Dr Blake (38:59):
know I grew up in Florida and I didn't really like
being inside very much, yeah,so I was always on a kayak or a
canoe or some sort of boat and Ijust that was my place of peace
, and I sort of lost track ofthat through the hustle and
bustle of you know, trying tostrive for something in life.

(39:22):
But it was always there and Ithink I came back to it.
Hi, how y'all doing we?

Joel (39:28):
have a lot of stuff over there.
Oh look where you've beenNicely done Some diving.
Yeah, there's a lot of stuff.

Dr Blake (39:34):
We were going Ooh, look where you've been.

AJ (39:35):
Nicely done.
Some diving.
Yeah, there's a lot of stuff.
We were going to come back andget it, or?

Joel (39:39):
I guess y'all it's like too much for us to carry Amazing
.

Dr Blake (39:41):
Can we just leave it there for a bit?
Yeah, you can leave it thereand we'll pick it up.

AJ (39:47):
Can I take a photo of you?

Collector (39:48):
Yeah, we found a broken shoe.
What's your name?
I'm Ben Nice to meet you, benAnthony this will go on a
podcast.

AJ (39:57):
That's the name of it.
You're the mud person.
You're the mud person.

Joel (40:03):
Swimming, swimming in the plough mode.
Well done, outstanding.

Collector (40:07):
Look at me, hey yesha .
Only because I fell into themud a couple of times.

AJ (40:15):
But not really familiar I slipped on a log.
Hi Anthony Sally, Hi Sally,nice to meet you, dude, dude,
nice to meet you, nice to meetyou.

Collector (40:23):
You just emerged like a swamp thing Covered in giant
trash yeah.

Joel (40:28):
Just left it all.
We'll come back and get it.
You guys are amazing.

Dr Blake (40:32):
Nice job.

Joel (40:34):
Thank you, how's it going?

Collector (40:36):
Yeah, good.

Joel (40:36):
All right, you're having fun, you're meeting the locals.

AJ (40:39):
Yeah, it is the best way to get around the country, I tell
you.
But yeah, when you watch yourlittle one, embrace it like that
, yeah.

Joel (40:46):
It's so cool that you guys are doing this.

AJ (40:48):
It's just again, we don't have to do anything.
It's just like there you go, goforth, have fun well done same
stuff.

Dr Blake (40:56):
Yeah, but you were saying blake, oh well, I, you
know my academic background orwanting to be like a researcher
and a writer came throughhistory.
I loved, I loved history.
I was raised by my grandmother,who was born in 1913, who would
talk about the great depressionin world war ii and when she
remembered sound and movietheaters.
So I always had like ahistorical feel for things and

(41:18):
so I pursued that in my career.
And then you know, you payattention in the world and I got
into us foreign relations um, alot of latin american,
caribbean history, because ofgrowing up in florida and what
was going on with us foreignpolicy, with 9-11 and you know,
just coming to awareness thatthe United States

(41:39):
had been acting like an empire.
Yeah, nobody told me about this.
Yeah, until until I dug into it, and so I was a researcher and
a writer, like that.
And, um, I think I just got old.
You know, they they say thisthing about you get older and
you all want to be birders.
You know, happened to me, man,so I was always interested in
this changing dynamic betweenhumans and the environment and I

(42:02):
was pretty negative about it,like plantation monoculture and,
you know, overthrowing thedemocratically elected
government of Guatemala forbananas with terrible things.
This is where I used to live,so I can relate to this path.
Yeah, so it was pretty, youknow, negative and I wanted to.
I wanted to think aboutsomething alternatively, you

(42:25):
know, like you could be aware ofall the piles of shit, really,
and then use it to fertilisesomething else.

AJ (42:33):
What are you gonna do?
Yeah, you brought it by yourgrandma.
Come back to that.
How did that happen?

Dr Blake (42:39):
oh well, um, she was widowed pretty young, um, and my
parents were working all thetime, so I was with her almost
all most days and, uh, were yourfolks doing professional?
Yeah, my my, they alwaysbelieved in service.
Uh, my dad was a medical doctor, my mom was a nurse and they

(43:00):
always were committed to, like,doing something for the
community and and so I had a.
It was a high regard foreducation yeah community service
, but I didn't know what thatwas going to look like.

AJ (43:12):
What about your folks, joe?

Joel (43:15):
Yeah, so my dad is well, he's retired, but he was a
pharmacist and he owned one of Idon't know, maybe 10 businesses
in the little town I grew up inin southwest Washington state
Wow, I don't know the exactnumber and my mom, you know,
worked in, worked in thatbusiness as well as being a
school nurse, and I'm one offour, so I spent a lot of time

(43:37):
raising us, you know.
But yeah, I think for me it'sinteresting because I grew up
playing a ton of sports, youknow, spending a ton of time
inside of gyms in a dark, wet,rainforest environment, but grew
up in a logging town, you knowwhere, literally in the bar,
there was a bumper sticker onthe beer cooler that said earth

(43:59):
first will log the other planetslater, you know?
And, and so it certainly is not, you know, it was not like
permeating my community to be anenvironmentalist, that was not
the case.
But then my larger family mymom has seven brothers, and they
had traveled all over the world, you know, on motorcycles and
bicycles and hitchhiking andstuff, and so there was, though

(44:19):
I lived in this, I grew up inkind of this small, insular but
great community.
Um, you know, I did have someidea of what was happening, you
know.
But but I definitely, you know,I grew up in a clear cut.
It had probably been clear cuttwo or three times and I had no
understanding until probablyuntil after college, that like,
oh, forests aren't supposed tobe, or these forests aren't
supposed to be so thick that youcan't walk through them.

(44:41):
It's just that if you cuteverything to the ground all at
once, like you know, it wouldtake I don't know 100 or more
years of succession to make iteven begin to resemble what it
used to look like.
You know.
And so I think, yeah, for me.
I just I was a total latebloomer and it took a long time
and I was lucky enough to beable to continue to pursue what

(45:02):
I was interested in and that hasalways been kind of how we
relate to landscapes, you know,and how it changes the way we
live and, in particular, thiskind of idea of changing
baseline syndrome.
You know the fact that, likeeach generation wakes up, comes
to in this more um, you know,this is kind of this like more

(45:27):
things of the tapestry have beenkind of unwound and we
recognize that as the way thingsare supposed to be and that
dictates the way we love ourlives, when, if you can start,
like through understanding whatthings used to be, also in a
social context, but definitelyan environment, environmental
context right, you can.
You can start to understandthat, you know, and it shouldn't
lead, in my opinion, just tocynicism but you can start to

(45:49):
understand that like, okay, thisis not the way things are
supposed to be.
And then there's such anopportunity for regeneration.
There's such an opportunity forregeneration, there's such an
opportunity for ecologicalrestoration.
You know and so many of thesethings aren't complicated.
You know, Like you just have toslow water and get it to go
down into the ground and buildsoil.
It's good for everybody.
But the barriers, you know, themain barrier, I think, is that

(46:14):
people just aren't interested inchange.
We latch and I see this all thetime as an environmental
journalist, you know we latch onto the way things were, even if
it makes no sense, even if it'snot good for us, and so it's
kind of like a fun game actuallyat this point to try to find
ways to get people to be open topositive change.

AJ (46:34):
Well, this is really interesting then.
So you've got a sort of a macroperspective on resistance to
change, but you've got a microexperience where people have
clamored towards it.
So how do you reconcile whatare?
What's the difference?
How can it be so?
Because this is what I find tooright.
It's so interesting to mebecause if you're watching the

(46:55):
tv or reading the articles, thebig picture you can think oh man
, we're just as many do we'restuffed.

Joel (47:01):
Yeah.

AJ (47:01):
But you get stuck in hands-on on the ground with
people Right and it's adifferent story and I've seen
this all across the States.
Yeah, oh, yeah, so what do youobserve in that paradox?

Joel (47:15):
Yeah, serving that paradox yeah, I think, first and
foremost, it's like stoplistening to the pundits, right.
I mean we need to be, we needto know what's going on.
I'm not saying just like fillour ears full of dirt and don't
pay attention, but like we havesuch an addiction to bad news,
especially in this country.
I mean this is where a lot ofthe news comes from, right?
This is where a lot of themedia is made hollywood right
and it's.
It's all negative primarily.
Yeah, I would guess like 99percent, right even if it's good

(47:36):
, it's negativity bias, exactly.
It's violent, it's, it's, it'syeah, it's just like how do you
grab people and they can't turnaway?
As well, we scare them, I think, essentially, you know.
So first you have to unhookyourself from that.
I'm pretty careful about what Iconsume as far as media and
storytelling, but then, but, but, then, but.
Then I think you, just like I,I have my personal experience is
that I wasn't surrounded byenvironmentalists and there

(47:58):
there is this biophilia, thereis this love of nature, there is
this love, this awe that wefeel, you know, when we're
around it, and I think we canlean into that, you know, we can
lean into, like, our naturallove of of our home planet, you
know.
And so I think that's kind ofwhere it begins, you know.
And then I think, as where therubber hits the road, you know,

(48:19):
is like when people are reallyforced to change, they will
change, people will change, youknow, and I think that they can
change for the better.
And so my storytelling hasreally focused and what we try
to focus on with the MarsProject right, is highlighting
the positives.
You know, we don't want to justand I'm glad there's people out
there policing industry anddoing all that.
That's essential.
We have to do that.
But I find, like my calling andI think our something that we

(48:42):
really want to do is to liketell the hopeful story.
Not hopeful like sit on thecouch with your fingers crossed,
but like let's do things thatcan make a positive change right
here.
Things that can make a positivechange right here.
You know, you can pull up youryard in this subtropical
environment and in one year, inthree months, it can be full of
butterflies and beneficial mothsand you know, I mean like in
your life and you see your kidseyes light up and it can just be

(49:05):
so incredibly positive.
You know it's better foreverybody and and then people
see you enjoy that and itspreads, you know, and so I
think that's like the kind ofstuff that I mean that's.
I mean, that's a very, verymicro level, right, but that's
like how positive change happensit seems to be the theme, isn't
it?

AJ (49:19):
it's get your hands dirty, metaphorically, literally, like
yeah just get involved in lessabstract ways with each other,
because that's the other thing Itake stock of.
Even the young peoplerelatively most of them, anyway
and some very young people thatwe just passed, and
multicultural at that, have comein.

(49:40):
So there's a diverse lot ofpeople in this place with
diverse and sometimes, yeahcomplex histories absolutely
that are animated by this rightyeah, yeah, it gives them agency
.

Dr Blake (49:56):
You know they don't have to wait for somebody else
to change some law or regulation.
They just you go pick up apiece of trash or you plant
something or you read somethingabout your community and that
has tangible implications to it.
Right, you know it's grassroots, you know the roots really
makes sense when you're talkingabout ecological restoration

(50:18):
yeah, the roots yeah yeah, likeyou got to change the grassroots
yeah that's right.

AJ (50:23):
It's almost too obvious to yeah to to realize it's a
breakthrough insight.
Yeah, this is beautiful yeah,that's great.

Dr Blake (50:33):
Yeah, we walk this route all the time, really yeah,
you know where I'm from.

AJ (50:37):
In perth it was similarly reclaimed land.
The whole city was wetland,right into the north where my
family set up, and the river,the swan river, a whole bunch of
that bank, was considered toosmelly and whatever, yeah, for
our sensibilities.
So we filled it in and put a,put a stone wall there, type of
thing, yeah.

(50:57):
So I relate in the sense thatwe've got very little like you
could go, man, we destroyed 95of it.
What are we going to do?
But what's there is there andpeople are taking care of it and
it's it's coming back too.
So, yeah, and inspiration fromyour, the story of how you're
envisaging the connection pieceright to literally come from a

(51:20):
chain of urban dwellings like anurban neighborhood right that
we can do that.

Joel (51:25):
Right, and and one of the cool things about the
connectivity component of thatwhich dr scott talks about is
that you know, if we can make,if we can, if we can get this
idea through to have anecological corridor that's all
about connectivity then there'snot an opportunity to just leave
out the less fortunate people,right?
Because if we need connectionthrough that part of town and so
what we do maybe on the moreaffluent side will be reflected

(51:49):
on the other side, becausethat's the function of the
entire thing, right?
You?

Dr Blake (51:54):
need, you need, you need, uh, continuous tree canopy
cover regardless of onesocioeconomic level.

AJ (51:59):
If it's very interesting, because I was just I've just
been in baltimore and thedisparity in neighborhoods is
off the charts.
Like I'm talking boarded up,broken up houses on the other
side.
That's neglected, yeah, they'rejust left to it.
Here's our co-conspirator, hey,hey.

Joel (52:17):
Hey let's cut, let's remove everything we just were
saying about this guy, how youdoing.

Dr Blake (52:22):
Hi Agnes, Did you see anybody down there?

Collector (52:24):
Yeah, LB Is Levi okay , yeah, he's good Okay all right
, cool that you able to come tothe craft at all.

Dr Blake (52:32):
I don't think so sadly .
Okay, thanks.

Joel (52:35):
Blake's wife's out of town .

Collector (52:36):
So he's solo dad of two.
Yeah, that's for her to.

Joel (52:40):
We found a lot of others, and Harriet and Alice found some
oyster seashells Ooh.

Dr Blake (52:48):
Cool, I draw.
Oh really, this is just my tie,is it okay?

Joel (52:52):
I is just my tie.
No, that's not a tie, it's amicrophone.

Collector (52:55):
Anthony, here's recording us talking.

Joel (52:57):
That's not a microphone.

AJ (53:00):
It's hard to believe, isn't it?

Dr Blake (53:02):
Well, I should probably go relieve LP.

AJ (53:03):
It's really good to meet you guys.

Dr Blake (53:05):
You know, part of the thing about growing up in
Florida was also seeing how muchit was changing Really yeah
like the population more thantripled in my lifetime is
changing really like, yeah, likethe population more than
tripled in my lifetime, soplaces that where we used to go
fish or play in wetlands orforests became suburbs.

Collector (53:19):
That was something, yeah, in perth.

Dr Blake (53:20):
Yeah, and you know that that creates an edge, but
honestly, working in communitycan make you feel more joyful
about what you've, what you'veseen it's something in itself,
isn't it that joy?
Piece.
Yeah, it's very importantbecause it's not easy, um, but
to be a good parent you know,yeah I agree to be a community

(53:42):
member.
Yeah, I don't want to.
You don't want to.

Joel (53:45):
I don't want to be an old person who just looks back in
the world and be like what thehell do we do 100 yeah, yeah,
yeah.

Dr Blake (53:51):
Yeah, be a joyful.
I don't want to say warrior,but in a way it's a battle yeah,
because not everybody's intotal agreement, but we're
getting more and more.

AJ (54:02):
Which is interesting.

Dr Blake (54:02):
Yeah.

AJ (54:03):
And you know if you take a broad view pretty fast.

Dr Blake (54:06):
I'd say it's a big shift.
Yeah, Because I think peoplebegan to.
They tapped into the climatechange narrative.

Collector (54:12):
Yeah, I think people began to.

Joel (54:13):
They tapped into the climate change narrative and
they're like this makes sense,but I can't do anything about
that.
So then they're sort of sittingon their hands, you know
getting mad about it, and thenpeople come and say well, you
can create biodiversity for alivable climate.

AJ (54:30):
You know yeah.

Dr Blake (54:34):
Like that's the main source of carbon sequestration.
Yeah, yeah, it's, it's life,biotic life so it's interesting
you have healthier oceans,healthier waters, healthier
landscapes it's interesting, howthat narrative too is catching
on yeah as opposed to climatesout there yeah, because it was
way too 30 000000.
Yeah, and now it's.
Now it's getting closer.

Collector (54:54):
I'll say oh yeah, what can I?

Dr Blake (54:55):
specifically do besides like reduce your carbon
footprint?

Collector (54:59):
Yeah, which is, which is?

Dr Blake (55:00):
Possible.
Yeah but not always very easy.
Yeah, when you're on a grid.

AJ (55:04):
Well, exactly, yeah, all sorts of grids, all sorts of
social grids that are verydifficult to understand.

Dr Blake (55:09):
Yeah, fine, yeah.

AJ (55:14):
Cool, understand and find points of our action.

Joel (55:15):
Here we go really Viva Cool.

AJ (55:16):
Cool, good to see you, great to meet you, you too, man.
Yeah, kudos to you guys, thankyou.

Joel (55:20):
Yeah, here's your son.

Dr Blake (55:23):
That's good.
I'm glad he's still here.
He's still here boy, phew, heyLevi.

Collector (55:29):
Hey, buddy there we go.

Dr Blake (55:31):
Did you have fun watch the roots?
Good job lp.

AJ (55:36):
Yeah, kid loves the marsh all right, you guys thanks, yeah
, thanks, blake yeah, thank youvery much to you guys for your
interest now let's just talkabout yourself.
That was joel caldwell, r BlakeScott and friends on the marsh
in Charleston.

(55:56):
I can tell you that since wemet they've gone from strength
to strength.
That's why I'd held back onthis episode.
I'd been thinking to add alittle bonus episode, but the
updates just kept coming.
So in the end I'm running itnow and Joel and I will just
pick a time in the next weeksfor an update.
So stand by for that.
In the meantime, I've put abunch of photos on the website

(56:19):
and, of course, various links inthe show notes, including to
Joel's terrific film andsubstack.
As usual, I'll have more forpaid subscribers on Patreon and
Substack soon.
In great thanks for making itall possible.
You can join this generouscommunity of listeners by
heading to the website or theshow notes and following the
prompts.
Thank you so very much.

(56:40):
The music you're hearing isRegeneration by Amelia Barden.
My name's Anthony James.
Thanks for listening.

Joel (56:50):
Thank you.

(57:23):
You should talk to this guythat's doing the podcast.
He's over there with hayley,says.
Anthony has this podcast calledregen narration cool, he's from
perth, um, but they've beentraveling around the United
States.
For those are like authenticAustralians.
Yeah yeah, fucking Brisbane,sydney, east Coast bullshit.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, they're from.
Perth.
Yeah, you're like Mad Max.

(57:44):
Yeah, exactly.

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