December 6, 2024 • 31 mins
In this episode, from 2010, Sasha interviews Beth Smith about buying fleeces.
Mentioned in this episode:
Beth Smith: The Spinner's Book of Fleece
You can find the script for this episode HERE.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:57):
Hi there, beloved Sheepspotter. I'm taking a little break from creating new
episodes right now, but today I am sharing a segment from my very first spinning podcast,
Spin Doctor, for your listening pleasure.
In this episode from 2010, I interview Beth Smith about buying fleeces.
(01:21):
Beth no longer owns the spinning loft, but I do recommend that you pick up her
book, The Spinner's Book of Fleece.
It's an essential for any spinner's library.
I hope you enjoy the episode.
Music.
(01:43):
Next up, our first ever Spin Doctor interview.
For today's episode, I interviewed Beth Smith, the owner of The Spinning Loft
in Howell, Michigan, and an inveterate buyer of fleeces,
you could say it's her job to buy fleeces, on selecting and washing a fleece.
(02:04):
Beth has published articles about spinning in knitty and spin-off,
as well as a pattern in knitty, and is rumored to be working on a book.
You'll find links to her articles and to The Spinning Loft in the show notes.
A couple of notes before I start the interview about things that come up during it.
(02:26):
At one point, I refer to Beth as the Longwool's Avenger.
This is a reference to her avatar on Ravelry and also to her secret identity
as a defender of truth, justice, the American way, and longwool sheep breeds.
In our discussion on washing fleece, she refers to what she calls tulle sausages.
(02:49):
And you can find out more about how to preserve the lock structure while washing raw fleeces.
She wraps them in pieces of tulle in her knitty article on the same topic.
And of course, there will be a link.
Also, I'm not allowed to mention the R word, Rhinebeck, because Beth can't go this year.
(03:12):
So I think that's all you need to know. Here's the interview.
We know that spinners tend to be especially new spinners tend to be a little
attached to the merino yeah yeah so what breeds should people be looking at
(03:39):
for their first fleece for buying their first fleece,
generally people who are buying their first fleece don't have
tools okay and the
tools can be expensive you know hand cards are like 70 between
70 and 80 dollars combs you know can go from 100 and whatever all the way up
(04:02):
to a million right so what i recommend to somebody wants to buy their first
fleece is to get something that they can flick okay so though we do love the long wools,
that's probably not the best place to start because the combs are expensive and you carding,
and flicking are not the best choices for a long wool fleece also i prefer them
(04:31):
to stay away from the very fine stuff.
Merino, Cuomo, just because it's easily nepped and they're kind of a pain to
walk because it takes a lot of washing. Right.
To get really hot water and several
washes and several rinses and then the felting could possibly happen.
(04:53):
I like to go towards something more medium and if you like the fine area then
Corydale definitely is a place to go which almost every spinning teacher is going to say Corydale,
Corydale Corydale's nice you've got that good crimp that you get from the fine wools,
but also it's you know it also felt but it's not as delicate so anything with
(05:19):
a staple length of between three and five inches and anything kind of in the medium range,
and any of the down breeds i love the down breeds suffolk and um uh look they've
left my brain suffolk you know those kind of fleets okay so corydale or one of the down breeds,
(05:45):
yeah something in the middle there i don't you know lots of people get sucked in by the shetland.
But unless you know what you're getting with Shetland,
like Shetland can be a dual coated breed or a single coat.
So there's lots of dual coated ones. Those are the more primitive ones.
(06:06):
Then it's harder to flick because you've got those two coats that you're working
with. It's nicer if you separate it and process the two coats separately.
It's like a whole thing. So dual coated, even though I love Icelandic and Shetland
and those kind of leases, still I'm saying no, don't do it.
(06:29):
Okay. Okay. Well, that all makes sense.
What if they're going to have it commercially processed? Are there other breeds
that, I mean, does that open up more options in terms of breeds?
Yes. Oh, and also a first fleece, a good one is like a Romney type. Is a Romney, okay. Yeah.
(06:50):
If you're going to have it processed, again, with the fine wools, you need to be careful.
Because there are processors that do a really great job with the fine wools
and some that do not do a really great job. or you don't have predictable results.
So Cormo is one that I, the only way I would get that processed at certain places
(07:13):
was if I was going to get combed top.
Because what happens in the carding is you get a huge amount of neps.
In the combing at the end, all those neps are removed. You get all those neps
in a bag. What the crap are you going to do with them?
I mean, you could, there's stuff. You can dye them and put them in bats and
all kinds of things that you can do with those neps but you get a huge amount of waste,
(07:38):
first from the washing and then from the carding
you lose a huge amount and so
for first fleece if you're going to have it processed
hormo uh merino for some
reason doesn't get neppy as easily as kormo but
still can get neppy
so unless you know somebody who knows where
(07:59):
to get a a fine fleece process like you
know you know because you talked to your cornrow
girl and she said oh no don't go here you probably
should go over here because they're better at processing this kind of fleece
so again in the medium range it's good then if you go back to the dual coated
(08:20):
breeds when you blend fibers the final result is only as soft as your coarsest fiber.
Right. So you can't add soft fiber to coarse fiber and think it's going to make it softer.
It'll make it more halo-y. It might add a little bit of a texture that you want,
but you're still getting that coarseness.
(08:42):
So if you take a dual-coated breed that has the coarse guard hairs,
and then that really downy undercoat
that is beautiful, process it all together, you get lopey, right?
I mean, that's lopey yarn. That's what it is, Icelandic. That's processed all together.
(09:03):
So you know you need to think about this when you send
it to the processor maybe you want to get it de-haired you
still get all that you get everything back you
just get two bags one has the soft downy beautiful stuff and the other stuff
you can dye it it's really nice it's strong you can make castles you can make
(09:23):
edgings you can make carpet stuff with it so you can use it all But if you're
looking for something to make a thong out of,
you know, you got to figure out your processing.
Because those knitted thongs are, they're taken off. They're exploding in popularity.
You know, I'm waiting for somebody to make me one.
(09:45):
You know, I don't know if you really want to say that on the podcast because
you'll get a knitted thong. I'm predicting.
Anyway. Well, I think, okay, then I'm going to put this in there.
If somebody's going to make me a knitted thong, though I love long wool,
I don't think I would like one made out of Lincoln.
(10:13):
It would be tiny.
Okay, I'm glad we've established that.
Okay, one more breed question. what about getting long
wools processed a bfl or a wensleydale or talk about those long wools that you
(10:36):
love so well oh long wools avenger i love them i love them so much bfl,
It is going to be a shorter staple than many of them. So, you know,
you can have that process just like everything else.
In the process, you have to decide, do you want this to be top or roving?
(10:58):
The thing is, it's really easy to find BFL top.
So maybe you want to get BFL roving. Maybe you want something that you can spin
a lot fluffier and airier and make this beautiful scarf out of.
That you don't get that same product
(11:18):
out of the top it's hard to find bfl roving so think about that what's available
on the market and what do i really want to do with this i've had wensleydale
processed into roving and it's beautiful it's really nice i mean.
I love spinning worsted i love hand combing
(11:39):
i love spinning off the comb i love
using a diz i love all of that and my
go-to way of spinning is short forward draw but every
long wool that you see that's commercial is top because
that's really the way to go because it's long and if
you have it processed into roving you lose some of
(12:00):
that luster and probably some of
the drape that you like from those heavier wools
so you can go anyway with it
but like if you're going to get like a teeswater or
cotswold fleece lots of times those are really long
right you're buying a fleece that's 10 or 12 inches staple length do not get
(12:22):
that into roving because the carter will just tear it up it'll just it'll be
a mess right so those kind of things i almost always process by hand okay next question,
So independent of the specific breed, what do you look for in a fleece?
(12:44):
What makes your heart go pity pat in a fleece?
And I know it happens because I've seen it happen. them
that's a hard question because
i love them all the
first thing i look for is how long is the.
Lock you know is this something that i'm
(13:06):
going to be able to process by hand or should.
It be sent to the mill i mean some of the shorter shorter fibers
just annoying to process by hand
unless you're going to hand card it all which i like
combing although i'm you know i don't
know i could do it i like it all but i'm
(13:29):
not afraid of vm lots of spinners current
spinners that haven't been spinning very long
i mean i haven't been spinning very long myself only
about 10 years lots of new spinners
though are really focused on getting
the cleanest fleece they're looking for a coated fleece
(13:50):
because they don't want to deal with any of that vm i
am not as concerned about that coat
a coated fleece lots of times will have
um felting at the tips a
bit of a weak tip they're a little bit greasier
than a non-coated fleece and
(14:11):
the sheep is sweating a lot more because he's
got an extra coat on him and so coated fleeces
are not the thing that I run to there are some shepherds who coat their fleeces
but the fleeces are such great quality I buy them every year because I know
the quality of the fleece and I'm not going there just because it's coated I'm
(14:34):
going there because I know that it's.
The fleece that I love and, and they've, they really take care of their sheep.
I make sure there's no breaks or weak spots. And how do you do that?
If you take a lock in your hand, not a huge amount of fleece,
a lock, usually like the thickness of your thumb and, and like snap it.
(14:58):
If you snap it next to your ear, you'll hear like a ping.
If it sounds like a thud, it's not necessarily a strong fiber.
If it pings, that's a good sign. Also, sometimes if you just pull it,
you can hear some ripping.
There could be like you could see a break in it where maybe the sheep got sick.
(15:23):
Maybe she had a lamb and that changes their fleece for a short time.
Maybe the food changed. Maybe there was some weather issue.
Lots of things can affect the
fleece. And they've got this. Most shepherds are shearing twice a year.
So lots of things that can go wrong in like a six to eight month period while that fleece is growing.
(15:48):
And though I'm not worried about VM,
if there's too much, like huge chunks of hay,
sometimes that gets a little tiring to deal with so some bm i don't care lots
of bm where it looks like the shepherd was feeding over the sheep's back and
(16:11):
everything's down in there and.
It's a mess then i kind of will pass by that except.
In certain situations okay there are
certain breeds which are hard to find as
very clean fleeces the down
breeds are one of those down one category
it's hard because most people who
(16:33):
are growing suffet and dorset
and that kind of category of sheep are going
them for meat they're shearing those sheep they're
getting rid of the wool they send them away with the
shearer they don't care about the
fleece so it's not going to be a clean fleece sometimes
there's going to be spray paint on those sheep the thing
(16:54):
is if I'm looking for a specific breed and it's very
hard to find it then you know
I'll I'll take some extra crap in there
and deal with it because I want to
process that one I want to see what that
fleece is like but there's no reason for
the ones that are really popular to deal with a huge
(17:16):
amount of junk in it okay also
i like a fleece that's more skirted
don't buy poop because buying
you're paying by weight so make sure that that's a well skirted fleece don't
be afraid you don't want to mess the fleece up the because usually it's folded
in a certain way in the bag don't just look at what are they showing at the
(17:42):
top anybody who's trying Trying
to sell something is going to put the nicest stuff at the top, right?
Right. And then you get down to the bottom of the bag and you have three pounds of poop.
So, you know, put your hand in there and make sure that everything's clean and feels clean.
Feels all good. So what, when you see a fleece that you think,
(18:03):
oh my God, that is such a fabulous fleece.
What is it about that fleece that's saying that to you?
I mean, is it, is it that it's an extremely good example of a,
of its breed or is there a more generic thing that says excellent fleece to you?
Because each breed is so
(18:26):
different from each other it's hard to that's a hard question because every
single one has something different and with the long wolves I'm looking for
does it have that luster that I love does it have the nice crimp structure and,
Wensleydale, I want it to be silky feeling when I touch it.
(18:50):
And Romney, I want to have that lovely crimp, and I'd like it to be very similar all over the fleet.
What makes you walk away from a fleece? Or actually, what makes you run away from a fleece?
You've sort of gotten an initial look and you think that, oh,
that looks sort of interesting. But then what what can you discover about a
(19:13):
fleece upon closer inspection that's just going to make you think, oh, no way.
Well, you know, like I said, big, big chunks of hay, lots of junk in the fleece.
Just i don't know there's there's something you can see in the fleece and know
(19:38):
whether it was the sheep was well cared for or you know is it just kind of like
they just go throw food at it and walk away,
Yeah, just weak, weak fleece, weak tips is not a big deal because those you
(19:59):
can just pull those off while you're processing.
That's not a huge deal. But any kind of a break in the middle of a lock is kind of a no way.
I had a actually still have an Icelandic fleece and it has this huge break.
And I didn't look close enough before I bought this fleece.
(20:20):
And got it back home and went, oh.
And the reason I bought it was because it was a really beautiful black and white spotted fleece.
And it wasn't anything that I had in the store.
And the lock length was great. And everything about this fleece looked beautiful.
(20:40):
But I didn't take a lock and really look at it before I bought this fleece.
So tell us about washing fleece i
know that you're a published author on this topic so how
do you wash a fleece that where you want to preserve
the lock structure and how do you wash a fleece where you don't care so much
(21:04):
about the lock structure or do you always do you always care about the lock
structure no i rarely care about the lock structure i care about the lock structure
if it's a fine fleece and I'm going to flick it.
So. I got knitty, you know, knitty. I love knitty.
(21:25):
But there's an article and I don't even remember when it was.
Was it last summer? I'll put a link to it. Last spring. I don't remember.
Anyway, it shows about making the tool sausages.
And I just use bridal netting.
Actually i used to be a dressmaker and
i used to make wedding gowns yeah
(21:46):
and so i have this
bolt of bridal tool like bridal
veil stuff but i'm still using that to
wash wool and so you can use that you know the the netting that you use under
dresses like for crinoline that probably works that works just as well and might
even be better because it'll let more of the dirt out easier because it'll breathe
(22:08):
a little better and that stuff is cheap and you can reuse it over and over,
so that i line all the locks up nothing's more
than like an inch thick i don't
do them more than an inch thick and they're you know
i don't know 18 inches long these
sauce roll up the ends and put a pin sometimes
(22:29):
i put a pin in the middle to hold it all together and
i just use for all
of my washing everything i wash
i wash in a dishpan you know
like you know a dishpan dishpan everything i never wash more than a pound at
(22:49):
a time okay the biggest fleeces are generally not more than 10 pounds so you
know you can wash you can go through it pretty fast.
I've done Quarrydale that way, but it's less necessary.
Cormo, Merino are the ones that I really focus on wrapping up that way.
(23:14):
Maybe something like Columbia. The fine, fine crimp fleeces.
Just because those fibers move around a lot and it's just easy to get knots and things.
And I just like to have them all set up. Okay. in sausages otherwise i fill
(23:35):
my dishpan with hot water as hot as i can get it out of the tap,
i can't tell you what the temperature is it's hot
you know i can't stick my hand in it uh-huh i fill
it up i use power scour i've tried every
kind of washing wool soap that there is on the market i've tried them all and
(23:58):
dawn which a lot of people swear by because they say it's cheap the thing with
dawn is it's really sudsy and so you need a lot more rinses right so,
dawn is cheap but you need to put a lot more in than you do of the power scour,
and you have to do a lot more rinses power scour this is a commercial for power
(24:24):
scour This is my experience Because I've tried the kookaburra Which was fine But not my favorite But.
And then other stuff, you know, I've used Soak and Ukulon and all those, but no, they're not.
I mean, they'll work, but more washes then.
Right. So that's what I love about PowerScour is I'm putting a full pump into
(24:47):
the first wash, a half a pump into the second wash, and two rinses and it's done.
Okay. I'm not letting it sit there forever.
Well, sometimes I do, and that's just because I walked away and forgot it was there. but generally.
It's not necessary to let it sit there forever you
(25:08):
know 15 minutes or 20 minutes and then dump
it and put it in the next water because you
don't want the water to get cool because then all
that grease that you just melted off and is in the water
is going to run back to the fibers so it
was kind of a waste of time except you got some dirt off but all
(25:29):
that grease is still back on there so I think one
of the problems that people who are trying this for the
first time have is they let it sit too
long in the water and then you know at
the end when your fleece is dry and you still have that sticky feeling
they just let it sit too long
right like the vinses I don't let it um in
(25:51):
the first rinse it sits
maybe five minutes the last rinse I just put it in
and take it out and it's done because i don't want to spend a lot of time and
i can't imagine they spend a huge amount i'm letting in the mill letting this
leaf sit around in the water trying to soak everything off the other thing is about washing i'm not as,
(26:18):
I want to use a word, but I don't know if it's an appropriate word.
Well, give it a try. I'm not anal.
About making sure that every speck of dirt is out.
Right. So my last rinse is, the water's clear-ish, but not, no, clean, clean water.
(26:44):
Because now it's mostly clean.
Now you're going to spin it you're going to wash it again then you're
going to make something out of it you're going to wash it again so it gets at
least two more washes before anybody's wearing it at least so forget it i'm
not going to wash it and wash it and wash it until the water's completely clear
so and you know i'm an environmentally friendly girl,
(27:11):
well also more stuff is going to come out in the combing and the carding too
and And so there's that as well. I mean, yeah. Yeah.
So I don't worry about that. You could drive yourself crazy with the washing.
You could. And some people who have a tendency to go overboard in situations
(27:32):
like that might think about possibly asking someone else to wash their stuff.
Okay. Okay, listeners. You heard it from Beth Smith.
If you're going to go crazy with the OCD washing, get somebody else to do it for you.
So, Beth Smith, is there anything else you want to tell us about going shopping
(27:56):
for your first fleece, possibly at that place that we won't mention that begins with R?
Because we're not talking about Rhinebeck.
You just said it.
Here's what I have to say about that. This is going to be profound. Okay.
(28:18):
Anybody can give you all the advice that you want. You can ask people all day.
I watch people, sometimes people on Ravelry even, you know, they're going to
this forum and they're going to this forum and they're going to this group and
they're asking all these people the same question over and over.
They're asking 500,000 people.
And here's what I have to say. Just try it for crying out loud because what's the big deal?
(28:42):
You know what? You wash a pound, you felted it, try the next pound and see if you do better.
It's not going to kill anybody nobody's life's stake and the sheep are growing
more so it's fine yeah you know there's going to be more fleece tomorrow the
only thing that will stop the fleece.
Well see i don't even know this if the zombie apocalypse comes do they go after
(29:06):
the sheep i don't know huh if the zombie apocalypse comes do they go after the sheep wow
right i know yeah also
i'll give a little plug for my
store okay it is not necessary
(29:27):
for you to go out and buy a 12 pound kormo fleece
and then worry about what you're gonna do with the
thing because that's like three sweaters worth of wool after you
wash right you know you could come over you
could buy eight ounces from the spinning loft it'll be
a lot less money outlaid you get a lovely shawl you know if you don't have to
(29:51):
go or you know go with your friends and split a fleece because when you it's
so fun to carry that huge bag of fleece out of the fair and then you get it
home and you go oh what am I gonna do.
(30:12):
Yep oh my god i bought a 10 pound fleece
what am i gonna do with it yeah you sound like your experience in that yes i
have i've had that experience of well actually i let when i left maryland i
had bought i picked up a seven pound corydale fleece that i had bought online
that i that I picked up there.
(30:34):
And then I bought another 10 pound Cormo Cory Del Cross.
And so I'm walking around the Maryland Sheep and Wolf Festival with 17 pounds
of fleece and thinking, I'm insane.
You know, it'll take me two years to spend this.
Hi there, beloved Sheepspotter. I'm taking a little break from creating new
episodes right now, but today I am sharing a segment from my very first spinning podcast,
Spin Doctor, for your listening pleasure.
In this episode from 2010, I interview Beth Smith about buying fleeces.
(01:21):
Beth no longer owns the spinning loft, but I do recommend that you pick up her
book, The Spinner's Book of Fleece.
It's an essential for any spinner's library.
I hope you enjoy the episode.
Music.
(01:43):
Next up, our first ever Spin Doctor interview.
For today's episode, I interviewed Beth Smith, the owner of The Spinning Loft
in Howell, Michigan, and an inveterate buyer of fleeces,
you could say it's her job to buy fleeces, on selecting and washing a fleece.
(02:04):
Beth has published articles about spinning in knitty and spin-off,
as well as a pattern in knitty, and is rumored to be working on a book.
You'll find links to her articles and to The Spinning Loft in the show notes.
A couple of notes before I start the interview about things that come up during it.
(02:26):
At one point, I refer to Beth as the Longwool's Avenger.
This is a reference to her avatar on Ravelry and also to her secret identity
as a defender of truth, justice, the American way, and longwool sheep breeds.
In our discussion on washing fleece, she refers to what she calls tulle sausages.
(02:49):
And you can find out more about how to preserve the lock structure while washing raw fleeces.
She wraps them in pieces of tulle in her knitty article on the same topic.
And of course, there will be a link.
Also, I'm not allowed to mention the R word, Rhinebeck, because Beth can't go this year.
(03:12):
So I think that's all you need to know. Here's the interview.
We know that spinners tend to be especially new spinners tend to be a little
attached to the merino yeah yeah so what breeds should people be looking at
(03:39):
for their first fleece for buying their first fleece,
generally people who are buying their first fleece don't have
tools okay and the
tools can be expensive you know hand cards are like 70 between
70 and 80 dollars combs you know can go from 100 and whatever all the way up
(04:02):
to a million right so what i recommend to somebody wants to buy their first
fleece is to get something that they can flick okay so though we do love the long wools,
that's probably not the best place to start because the combs are expensive and you carding,
and flicking are not the best choices for a long wool fleece also i prefer them
(04:31):
to stay away from the very fine stuff.
Merino, Cuomo, just because it's easily nepped and they're kind of a pain to
walk because it takes a lot of washing. Right.
To get really hot water and several
washes and several rinses and then the felting could possibly happen.
(04:53):
I like to go towards something more medium and if you like the fine area then
Corydale definitely is a place to go which almost every spinning teacher is going to say Corydale,
Corydale Corydale's nice you've got that good crimp that you get from the fine wools,
but also it's you know it also felt but it's not as delicate so anything with
(05:19):
a staple length of between three and five inches and anything kind of in the medium range,
and any of the down breeds i love the down breeds suffolk and um uh look they've
left my brain suffolk you know those kind of fleets okay so corydale or one of the down breeds,
(05:45):
yeah something in the middle there i don't you know lots of people get sucked in by the shetland.
But unless you know what you're getting with Shetland,
like Shetland can be a dual coated breed or a single coat.
So there's lots of dual coated ones. Those are the more primitive ones.
(06:06):
Then it's harder to flick because you've got those two coats that you're working
with. It's nicer if you separate it and process the two coats separately.
It's like a whole thing. So dual coated, even though I love Icelandic and Shetland
and those kind of leases, still I'm saying no, don't do it.
(06:29):
Okay. Okay. Well, that all makes sense.
What if they're going to have it commercially processed? Are there other breeds
that, I mean, does that open up more options in terms of breeds?
Yes. Oh, and also a first fleece, a good one is like a Romney type. Is a Romney, okay. Yeah.
(06:50):
If you're going to have it processed, again, with the fine wools, you need to be careful.
Because there are processors that do a really great job with the fine wools
and some that do not do a really great job. or you don't have predictable results.
So Cormo is one that I, the only way I would get that processed at certain places
(07:13):
was if I was going to get combed top.
Because what happens in the carding is you get a huge amount of neps.
In the combing at the end, all those neps are removed. You get all those neps
in a bag. What the crap are you going to do with them?
I mean, you could, there's stuff. You can dye them and put them in bats and
all kinds of things that you can do with those neps but you get a huge amount of waste,
(07:38):
first from the washing and then from the carding
you lose a huge amount and so
for first fleece if you're going to have it processed
hormo uh merino for some
reason doesn't get neppy as easily as kormo but
still can get neppy
so unless you know somebody who knows where
(07:59):
to get a a fine fleece process like you
know you know because you talked to your cornrow
girl and she said oh no don't go here you probably
should go over here because they're better at processing this kind of fleece
so again in the medium range it's good then if you go back to the dual coated
(08:20):
breeds when you blend fibers the final result is only as soft as your coarsest fiber.
Right. So you can't add soft fiber to coarse fiber and think it's going to make it softer.
It'll make it more halo-y. It might add a little bit of a texture that you want,
but you're still getting that coarseness.
(08:42):
So if you take a dual-coated breed that has the coarse guard hairs,
and then that really downy undercoat
that is beautiful, process it all together, you get lopey, right?
I mean, that's lopey yarn. That's what it is, Icelandic. That's processed all together.
(09:03):
So you know you need to think about this when you send
it to the processor maybe you want to get it de-haired you
still get all that you get everything back you
just get two bags one has the soft downy beautiful stuff and the other stuff
you can dye it it's really nice it's strong you can make castles you can make
(09:23):
edgings you can make carpet stuff with it so you can use it all But if you're
looking for something to make a thong out of,
you know, you got to figure out your processing.
Because those knitted thongs are, they're taken off. They're exploding in popularity.
You know, I'm waiting for somebody to make me one.
(09:45):
You know, I don't know if you really want to say that on the podcast because
you'll get a knitted thong. I'm predicting.
Anyway. Well, I think, okay, then I'm going to put this in there.
If somebody's going to make me a knitted thong, though I love long wool,
I don't think I would like one made out of Lincoln.
(10:13):
It would be tiny.
Okay, I'm glad we've established that.
Okay, one more breed question. what about getting long
wools processed a bfl or a wensleydale or talk about those long wools that you
(10:36):
love so well oh long wools avenger i love them i love them so much bfl,
It is going to be a shorter staple than many of them. So, you know,
you can have that process just like everything else.
In the process, you have to decide, do you want this to be top or roving?
(10:58):
The thing is, it's really easy to find BFL top.
So maybe you want to get BFL roving. Maybe you want something that you can spin
a lot fluffier and airier and make this beautiful scarf out of.
That you don't get that same product
(11:18):
out of the top it's hard to find bfl roving so think about that what's available
on the market and what do i really want to do with this i've had wensleydale
processed into roving and it's beautiful it's really nice i mean.
I love spinning worsted i love hand combing
(11:39):
i love spinning off the comb i love
using a diz i love all of that and my
go-to way of spinning is short forward draw but every
long wool that you see that's commercial is top because
that's really the way to go because it's long and if
you have it processed into roving you lose some of
(12:00):
that luster and probably some of
the drape that you like from those heavier wools
so you can go anyway with it
but like if you're going to get like a teeswater or
cotswold fleece lots of times those are really long
right you're buying a fleece that's 10 or 12 inches staple length do not get
(12:22):
that into roving because the carter will just tear it up it'll just it'll be
a mess right so those kind of things i almost always process by hand okay next question,
So independent of the specific breed, what do you look for in a fleece?
(12:44):
What makes your heart go pity pat in a fleece?
And I know it happens because I've seen it happen. them
that's a hard question because
i love them all the
first thing i look for is how long is the.
Lock you know is this something that i'm
(13:06):
going to be able to process by hand or should.
It be sent to the mill i mean some of the shorter shorter fibers
just annoying to process by hand
unless you're going to hand card it all which i like
combing although i'm you know i don't
know i could do it i like it all but i'm
(13:29):
not afraid of vm lots of spinners current
spinners that haven't been spinning very long
i mean i haven't been spinning very long myself only
about 10 years lots of new spinners
though are really focused on getting
the cleanest fleece they're looking for a coated fleece
(13:50):
because they don't want to deal with any of that vm i
am not as concerned about that coat
a coated fleece lots of times will have
um felting at the tips a
bit of a weak tip they're a little bit greasier
than a non-coated fleece and
(14:11):
the sheep is sweating a lot more because he's
got an extra coat on him and so coated fleeces
are not the thing that I run to there are some shepherds who coat their fleeces
but the fleeces are such great quality I buy them every year because I know
the quality of the fleece and I'm not going there just because it's coated I'm
(14:34):
going there because I know that it's.
The fleece that I love and, and they've, they really take care of their sheep.
I make sure there's no breaks or weak spots. And how do you do that?
If you take a lock in your hand, not a huge amount of fleece,
a lock, usually like the thickness of your thumb and, and like snap it.
(14:58):
If you snap it next to your ear, you'll hear like a ping.
If it sounds like a thud, it's not necessarily a strong fiber.
If it pings, that's a good sign. Also, sometimes if you just pull it,
you can hear some ripping.
There could be like you could see a break in it where maybe the sheep got sick.
(15:23):
Maybe she had a lamb and that changes their fleece for a short time.
Maybe the food changed. Maybe there was some weather issue.
Lots of things can affect the
fleece. And they've got this. Most shepherds are shearing twice a year.
So lots of things that can go wrong in like a six to eight month period while that fleece is growing.
(15:48):
And though I'm not worried about VM,
if there's too much, like huge chunks of hay,
sometimes that gets a little tiring to deal with so some bm i don't care lots
of bm where it looks like the shepherd was feeding over the sheep's back and
(16:11):
everything's down in there and.
It's a mess then i kind of will pass by that except.
In certain situations okay there are
certain breeds which are hard to find as
very clean fleeces the down
breeds are one of those down one category
it's hard because most people who
(16:33):
are growing suffet and dorset
and that kind of category of sheep are going
them for meat they're shearing those sheep they're
getting rid of the wool they send them away with the
shearer they don't care about the
fleece so it's not going to be a clean fleece sometimes
there's going to be spray paint on those sheep the thing
(16:54):
is if I'm looking for a specific breed and it's very
hard to find it then you know
I'll I'll take some extra crap in there
and deal with it because I want to
process that one I want to see what that
fleece is like but there's no reason for
the ones that are really popular to deal with a huge
(17:16):
amount of junk in it okay also
i like a fleece that's more skirted
don't buy poop because buying
you're paying by weight so make sure that that's a well skirted fleece don't
be afraid you don't want to mess the fleece up the because usually it's folded
in a certain way in the bag don't just look at what are they showing at the
(17:42):
top anybody who's trying Trying
to sell something is going to put the nicest stuff at the top, right?
Right. And then you get down to the bottom of the bag and you have three pounds of poop.
So, you know, put your hand in there and make sure that everything's clean and feels clean.
Feels all good. So what, when you see a fleece that you think,
(18:03):
oh my God, that is such a fabulous fleece.
What is it about that fleece that's saying that to you?
I mean, is it, is it that it's an extremely good example of a,
of its breed or is there a more generic thing that says excellent fleece to you?
Because each breed is so
(18:26):
different from each other it's hard to that's a hard question because every
single one has something different and with the long wolves I'm looking for
does it have that luster that I love does it have the nice crimp structure and,
Wensleydale, I want it to be silky feeling when I touch it.
(18:50):
And Romney, I want to have that lovely crimp, and I'd like it to be very similar all over the fleet.
What makes you walk away from a fleece? Or actually, what makes you run away from a fleece?
You've sort of gotten an initial look and you think that, oh,
that looks sort of interesting. But then what what can you discover about a
(19:13):
fleece upon closer inspection that's just going to make you think, oh, no way.
Well, you know, like I said, big, big chunks of hay, lots of junk in the fleece.
Just i don't know there's there's something you can see in the fleece and know
(19:38):
whether it was the sheep was well cared for or you know is it just kind of like
they just go throw food at it and walk away,
Yeah, just weak, weak fleece, weak tips is not a big deal because those you
(19:59):
can just pull those off while you're processing.
That's not a huge deal. But any kind of a break in the middle of a lock is kind of a no way.
I had a actually still have an Icelandic fleece and it has this huge break.
And I didn't look close enough before I bought this fleece.
(20:20):
And got it back home and went, oh.
And the reason I bought it was because it was a really beautiful black and white spotted fleece.
And it wasn't anything that I had in the store.
And the lock length was great. And everything about this fleece looked beautiful.
(20:40):
But I didn't take a lock and really look at it before I bought this fleece.
So tell us about washing fleece i
know that you're a published author on this topic so how
do you wash a fleece that where you want to preserve
the lock structure and how do you wash a fleece where you don't care so much
(21:04):
about the lock structure or do you always do you always care about the lock
structure no i rarely care about the lock structure i care about the lock structure
if it's a fine fleece and I'm going to flick it.
So. I got knitty, you know, knitty. I love knitty.
(21:25):
But there's an article and I don't even remember when it was.
Was it last summer? I'll put a link to it. Last spring. I don't remember.
Anyway, it shows about making the tool sausages.
And I just use bridal netting.
Actually i used to be a dressmaker and
i used to make wedding gowns yeah
(21:46):
and so i have this
bolt of bridal tool like bridal
veil stuff but i'm still using that to
wash wool and so you can use that you know the the netting that you use under
dresses like for crinoline that probably works that works just as well and might
even be better because it'll let more of the dirt out easier because it'll breathe
(22:08):
a little better and that stuff is cheap and you can reuse it over and over,
so that i line all the locks up nothing's more
than like an inch thick i don't
do them more than an inch thick and they're you know
i don't know 18 inches long these
sauce roll up the ends and put a pin sometimes
(22:29):
i put a pin in the middle to hold it all together and
i just use for all
of my washing everything i wash
i wash in a dishpan you know
like you know a dishpan dishpan everything i never wash more than a pound at
(22:49):
a time okay the biggest fleeces are generally not more than 10 pounds so you
know you can wash you can go through it pretty fast.
I've done Quarrydale that way, but it's less necessary.
Cormo, Merino are the ones that I really focus on wrapping up that way.
(23:14):
Maybe something like Columbia. The fine, fine crimp fleeces.
Just because those fibers move around a lot and it's just easy to get knots and things.
And I just like to have them all set up. Okay. in sausages otherwise i fill
(23:35):
my dishpan with hot water as hot as i can get it out of the tap,
i can't tell you what the temperature is it's hot
you know i can't stick my hand in it uh-huh i fill
it up i use power scour i've tried every
kind of washing wool soap that there is on the market i've tried them all and
(23:58):
dawn which a lot of people swear by because they say it's cheap the thing with
dawn is it's really sudsy and so you need a lot more rinses right so,
dawn is cheap but you need to put a lot more in than you do of the power scour,
and you have to do a lot more rinses power scour this is a commercial for power
(24:24):
scour This is my experience Because I've tried the kookaburra Which was fine But not my favorite But.
And then other stuff, you know, I've used Soak and Ukulon and all those, but no, they're not.
I mean, they'll work, but more washes then.
Right. So that's what I love about PowerScour is I'm putting a full pump into
(24:47):
the first wash, a half a pump into the second wash, and two rinses and it's done.
Okay. I'm not letting it sit there forever.
Well, sometimes I do, and that's just because I walked away and forgot it was there. but generally.
It's not necessary to let it sit there forever you
(25:08):
know 15 minutes or 20 minutes and then dump
it and put it in the next water because you
don't want the water to get cool because then all
that grease that you just melted off and is in the water
is going to run back to the fibers so it
was kind of a waste of time except you got some dirt off but all
(25:29):
that grease is still back on there so I think one
of the problems that people who are trying this for the
first time have is they let it sit too
long in the water and then you know at
the end when your fleece is dry and you still have that sticky feeling
they just let it sit too long
right like the vinses I don't let it um in
(25:51):
the first rinse it sits
maybe five minutes the last rinse I just put it in
and take it out and it's done because i don't want to spend a lot of time and
i can't imagine they spend a huge amount i'm letting in the mill letting this
leaf sit around in the water trying to soak everything off the other thing is about washing i'm not as,
(26:18):
I want to use a word, but I don't know if it's an appropriate word.
Well, give it a try. I'm not anal.
About making sure that every speck of dirt is out.
Right. So my last rinse is, the water's clear-ish, but not, no, clean, clean water.
(26:44):
Because now it's mostly clean.
Now you're going to spin it you're going to wash it again then you're
going to make something out of it you're going to wash it again so it gets at
least two more washes before anybody's wearing it at least so forget it i'm
not going to wash it and wash it and wash it until the water's completely clear
so and you know i'm an environmentally friendly girl,
(27:11):
well also more stuff is going to come out in the combing and the carding too
and And so there's that as well. I mean, yeah. Yeah.
So I don't worry about that. You could drive yourself crazy with the washing.
You could. And some people who have a tendency to go overboard in situations
(27:32):
like that might think about possibly asking someone else to wash their stuff.
Okay. Okay, listeners. You heard it from Beth Smith.
If you're going to go crazy with the OCD washing, get somebody else to do it for you.
So, Beth Smith, is there anything else you want to tell us about going shopping
(27:56):
for your first fleece, possibly at that place that we won't mention that begins with R?
Because we're not talking about Rhinebeck.
You just said it.
Here's what I have to say about that. This is going to be profound. Okay.
(28:18):
Anybody can give you all the advice that you want. You can ask people all day.
I watch people, sometimes people on Ravelry even, you know, they're going to
this forum and they're going to this forum and they're going to this group and
they're asking all these people the same question over and over.
They're asking 500,000 people.
And here's what I have to say. Just try it for crying out loud because what's the big deal?
(28:42):
You know what? You wash a pound, you felted it, try the next pound and see if you do better.
It's not going to kill anybody nobody's life's stake and the sheep are growing
more so it's fine yeah you know there's going to be more fleece tomorrow the
only thing that will stop the fleece.
Well see i don't even know this if the zombie apocalypse comes do they go after
(29:06):
the sheep i don't know huh if the zombie apocalypse comes do they go after the sheep wow
right i know yeah also
i'll give a little plug for my
store okay it is not necessary
(29:27):
for you to go out and buy a 12 pound kormo fleece
and then worry about what you're gonna do with the
thing because that's like three sweaters worth of wool after you
wash right you know you could come over you
could buy eight ounces from the spinning loft it'll be
a lot less money outlaid you get a lovely shawl you know if you don't have to
(29:51):
go or you know go with your friends and split a fleece because when you it's
so fun to carry that huge bag of fleece out of the fair and then you get it
home and you go oh what am I gonna do.
(30:12):
Yep oh my god i bought a 10 pound fleece
what am i gonna do with it yeah you sound like your experience in that yes i
have i've had that experience of well actually i let when i left maryland i
had bought i picked up a seven pound corydale fleece that i had bought online
that i that I picked up there.
(30:34):
And then I bought another 10 pound Cormo Cory Del Cross.
And so I'm walking around the Maryland Sheep and Wolf Festival with 17 pounds
of fleece and thinking, I'm insane.
You know, it'll take me two years to spend this.
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