The Unexpected Truth About Sex, Drugs, and Rock & Roll (ft. Randy Blythe)

Episode Transcript
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(00:00):
What happens when a rebellious teen from small town Virginia
discovers punk rock rises to fame and a globally renowned
heavy metal band battles addiction and then lands in
prison halfway around the world?You might think you've heard
stories of Rockstar excess before, but Randy Blythe's story
is on a whole nother level. It's a master class and turning
chaos into clarity, self destruction and the self

(00:21):
transcendence and one's art intoa way of life.
Randy Blythe is an author, photographer, and the lead
singer of one of the biggest heavy metal bands in the world.
He's toured the world many timesover, singing or screaming, more
accurately, to millions of fans.But Randy isn't just an animal
behind the microphone. He's a thoughtful, intelligent,
philosophical man. And he has the scar tissue to

(00:42):
prove it. Because Randy's life hasn't just
been about sex, drugs and rock'n'roll.
It's been a delicate balancing act of creativity,
responsibility, and sheer perseverance.
So if you've ever felt pulled between your own 2 extremes,
whether it's work and rest, ambition and burnout, darkness
and light stick around. Otherwise, you might miss out on
some of the principles that could very well help you find a

(01:03):
much needed balance. Here are just a few of the
lessons that we're going to unpack in today's episode.
How to reconnect with a sense ofpurpose, even when you're
sitting in a jail cell for something you didn't do in a
country you don't know. Also, how to cope with insane
amounts of pressure, battling your darkest moments when
literally the entire world is watching.
Why the best artwork always starts and ends with yourself.

(01:27):
An audience of one. The unique team building in
leadership lessons from band dynamic that has lasted for
decades, through thick and thin.Some real talk about addiction,
alcohol, heroin, groupies, you name it.
Randy's probably put it up his nose or up his ass.
And why the angriest music is made by the nicest people.
How artwork acts as a form of catharsis for us all.

(01:50):
We'll also talk about how to view life's hardest moments as
simply new material to shape your future self, as though you
were like an existential sculptor.
And if you've ever wondered whatcould possibly shake a man so
deeply that it changes his entire approach to living, well,
you're about to find out. And the answers might just shift
something major in your own lifetoo.
All right, so enough setup. Let's get into it.

(02:12):
This is Randy Blythe. It's the Subtle Art of Not
Giving a Fuck podcast with your host, Mark Manson.
Randy, Mark. So good to have you, man.
Yeah, thanks for coming out, youguys.
I have to say, I mean, you know this, but I, I, I need to say it

(02:33):
for the audience. Lamb of God is probably on my
Mount Rushmore of metal bands. Like Massive Massive fan for a
long time. Very flattering man.
Yeah, so it's been great gettingto know you and meeting you,
hanging out and everything. My 20 year old self is like
quivering with excitement. I want to talk about band

(02:57):
relationships because this is something that I've thought
about quite a bit. You know when.
It's a very hairy, very unsexy marriage without any of the
benefits the the Koi Tool benefit.
Yeah, at least in our band. Yeah, yeah.
Well, I, I've thought about thisquite a bit because, you know,
from probably age 15 to 2122, like my dream.

(03:22):
Yeah, guitar. Was to be a guitarist in a band
like yours. And I think when you're that
young, you kind of have this romantic ideal of what like a
rock band. Being in a rock band is like
you're hanging. You're just like rocking out
with your best friends and like,everything's fun and there's
just parties and girls and all this stuff and.
The 80s are over, bro. Yeah, right.

(03:43):
But like, as an adult, it's beeninteresting as an adult as I've,
I've met a number of musicians and talked to them.
Like, you realize, like these are business partners, They're
creative partners, their roommates.
For. Months at a time, and I imagine
if you've been in a band for decades. 30 years.

(04:06):
Those friendships come and go like, you know, it's, it's
there's probably periods where you're not super close.
There's periods where you're like really close.
Maybe you like lose touch with people and then kind of come
back together. Like, but you still have to work
together. You still have to be
professionals and you still haveto be creative together and,
and, and listen to each other. And like, I actually as an

(04:27):
adult, I look at a band, like the band relationship and I
imagine it's, it's got to be oneof the hardest working
relationships. Like I can't think of an analog,
right? Like, you know, like if you're
on a sports team with somebody, you know, it's only going to
last for a few years. Somebody's going to get traded
or whatever. If you're in a company,
everybody's always kind of shifting and moving around.

(04:48):
Like when you're in a band, it'slike a marriage.
Like the idea is that you do this forever together, even if
the guy pisses you off or farts in his sleep.
And like, you know, I, I don't know, like I'm, I'm just curious
to hear your thoughts on this. Is it?
Is it the hardest relationship possible?

(05:09):
I mean, I think. Professional.
Relationship. I don't know submariners, dudes
who go down underwater. I I grew up in a Navy town in
Norfolk, VA and you'd see them come off the submarine cruises.
We called them bubble heads and they were weird, you know,
they've been they've been underwater way too long playing
D&D together, working it out. So I, you know, that's a pretty

(05:33):
intense relationship. I think the, the, the, the
intensity of probably people whoserve in combat together is, is
much more intense than than our relationship.
And they form these lifelong bonds because they've been
through these horrific experiences together.
But as you're saying, I mean hopefully in most places that

(05:56):
that sort of relationship has its time and its place and its
intensities. Ours is long term.
It's strange to me because it's sort of the, there's very few
bands that last as long as ours and it's strange for me to say
that, you know, we're kind of moving into the legacy sort of

(06:17):
era. It's very strange for me to say
that. But most bands just don't last
as long as ours do because of the personality differences and
so forth. I think with us it, it's because
in so many ways we have become better friends that we're still
here, you know, I mean, like we've gotten in fist fights

(06:39):
together. You know, I like me and my
guitar player Mark famously got in a drunken brawl in in
Scotland. I had adopted a Scottish accent. 00:06:50,480 I was wearing a kilt.
It was a nightmare, you know, And we videoed it and put it out
and we do signings and people are like, you know, I can't
believe you 2 are sitting next to each other like after this

(07:01):
fight because it's this frozen in time moment, you know, it
happens in all bands. We were just stupid enough to
put it out. We got a platinum DVD out of it. 00:07:15,120 But like, Mark and I are
extremely close friends. Extremely.
And we text and talk to each other very often, not just about

(07:24):
band stuff, but about life, you know?
And I think we're very fortunatein that, you know?
Would you compare? It sounds kind of like a almost
like a family like. A it is.
Like a synthetic family, it is that you put together, you know? 00:07:43,400 It is and it's.
And it comes with all the trappings of a family.

(07:45):
Relationship. Oh yes, Oh yes.
And you know, you're talking about this idealistic version
you had of, of being in a band when you were younger.
You know, people seem to think to this day, I mean, we've been
in, I've been in this band almost 30 years.
When I'm at home and I, I'll go to the grocery store or

(08:08):
something, someone will be like,where's Mark?
Where's Willie? I'm like at home with their
wife. You know, we don't like, we
aren't attached at the hip. They're also, you know, even in
Richmond, you know, where I'm from, people are like at the
grocery store. What are you doing here?

(08:29):
Buying produce, man. Yeah, yeah.
I'm a normal human being. Shouldn't you be on tour?
No, I'm I'm allowed to be at home.
So somehow, somehow we have learned how to function better
now than we ever did when we were younger, Very combative
with each other. And I think the only reason why

(08:51):
we didn't break up is because nobody wanted to be the guy that
broke the band up, because that would be defeat.
Yeah, I quit. It's like I hate you.
You know, and you do spend so much time around these guys,
You're like, I hate the way thisguy ties his shoes.
Yeah, yeah. You know, you don't want to be
the guy to crack and like, well,the band could have done great

(09:15):
but it went down the twos 'causeyou know, you wimped out.
Yeah, Yeah. What would you say are like the
biggest lessons you've taken from those band relationships?
Like what have you had, what skills have you had to learn and
develop to like last for 30 years?
I kind of keep on coming back tothe same point.
I think it's remember what the most important thing is,

(09:36):
remember what your primary goal is.
And for us, it's always been to make good music, music that we
like. We're not writing it like we
love our fans. They've provided us a life
beyond my wildest dreams. You know, I never thought I'd
get to go to Japan or whatever, but we write music for five

(10:00):
dudes. Us.
I've said this a million times. And as long as we are happy with
it, then it's a success. And I think the fans respect
that. But the most important thing I,
I really think that you're saying that less, and I think
this would be applicable to relationships in general,

(10:21):
whether working or or familial or or romantic is what do you
want out of this relationship? You know, what do you, what is
the most important thing in thisrelationship and what started
this relationship? If you can remember that, I
think you're going to be successful.

(10:42):
Yeah, that makes sense. As long as the personalities
don't get too divergent. Yeah, you.
Know, in your book, you talk a lot about, I guess I would call
it, like, the punk rock ethos. Yeah.
And how influential it was on you.
Yes. Like how did you get into that
and what appealed to you? About it well, like I I come

(11:04):
from this little tiny paper milltown originally called
Franklin VA on my dad's side of the family.
It's where they were raised. And I was a weirdo, sort of
outcast, nerdy guy, still am proud nerd.
And I couldn't seem to fit into any sort of regular social

(11:27):
group. I wasn't interested in football
or cars or whatever. And I didn't understand why
people didn't accept me for myself, why I was more
interested in, in, you know, reading Lord of the Rings books

(11:47):
or whatever than going to a football game.
Because I was like, I'm a good person.
That's the most important thing,right?
No, but you're young and immature and, and so people
judge you. And so I felt pretty alienated.
And, but since I lived in this little town, there was no record

(12:07):
stores or anything. The only sort of music I heard
was on the radio. And so I liked Black Sabbath,
you know, 'cause I wound up getting a Black Sabbath cassette
and I and I liked the song Shoutat the Devil by Mötley Crüe.
And I went away to a gifted and talented summer camp at the

(12:30):
University of Virginia. And this skateboard, I was also
a skateboarder, you know, this guy was like, what music do you
like? And this guy Jason Smith, shout
out to you if you're ever hear this.
I'm like, wow, I've been listening to this band, Mötley
Crüe. They're pretty aggressive.
He's like, Oh no, dude, you needto check this out.
And hands me this cassette tape.He made me with Never Mind the
Bollocks. Here's the Sex Pistols on it.

(12:51):
And I listened to it. And from the first note of the
first song, Holidays in the Sun,it's like this marching, it was
just aggressive. And I was like, oh, and then
John Lydon came on and started singing, and I could tell he was
pissed off, you know, right fromthe beginning.

(13:12):
And I immediately felt this connection.
And it took me years to understand a lot of what he was
singing about because it was very specific to British culture
during Thatcher's England. But there were definitely
parallels to American culture atthe time being Reagan's America
and all this other stuff. So I, I learned, I, I just heard

(13:35):
this. I'm like, what is this music?
This is punk rock, this is what you need to listen to.
And I'm like, you're right. It is because it felt real.
It wasn't a guy with perfect pitch singing and it wasn't
overproduced. It was just raw and gut feeling. 00:13:52,920 From there, you know, I became
once again through skateboarding, I became more

(13:56):
involved in like the American punk scene and I would go see
bands at these small clubs. Unlike when I my first concert I
ever went to a big one with ZZ Top, right?
I didn't get to meet the dudes in ZZ Top.
I stood in the audience amongst everybody and, and watch them do
their thing and they had a lightshow and it was great at a place

(14:17):
called the Hampton Coliseum. But when I went to go see
Corrosion of Conformity or The Bad Brains or Agent Orange or
the vandals from out here in Southern California, they were
the guys at the merch table afterwards selling stuff.
And, and so I could just talk tothese dudes and meet them and,
and it was sort of a community. And it wasn't, it wasn't just

(14:41):
the music that was speaking to my sort of teenage angst or, or
discontent with the way the world was running.
It was also a feeling of community and and that a
self-sustaining community, whichwas extremely appealing to me
and still is to this day. So that that's how I I became
involved with it. Punk rocks.

(15:01):
Like it's very interesting to meculturally looking back, because
it was, I mean, you mentioned the 80s, like it was clearly
very subversive of everything, right?
It's just kind of fuck the man, fuck the system, you know, put
everybody on the same level, intentionally jarring, like at

(15:25):
times just ugly sounding, not playing their instruments
correctly. Like that's part of the point,
right? And.
Anyone can do it. Yeah, yeah.
And it's, it's interesting to methat that ironically like it
influenced culture in the 90s and 2000s in kind of the like
the subversion became almost mainstream and, and, and like,

(15:50):
like the self-destructive aspectof it became cool.
And I, I just find it so interesting to think about that
these days because today if you think about what is subversive,
it's the opposite of self destruction.
Like being so like the punk rockof today is like quitting drugs

(16:12):
and alcohol and waking up at 4:00 AM and like not dating and
you know, like being a monk basically, you know, right.
And I, I don't know, I look at like, I look at like what's what
Gen. Z is doing today to kind of
quote UN quote, stick it to the man.
And and then I just think back to like our youth, you know,

(16:35):
where I'm just like drinking andsmoking and doing drugs at an
absurdly young age. And it's, it just makes me
wonder like how we've how the pendulum is swung completely in
the other direction. And where it will end up
eventually. Yeah, I mean, part of me thinks
that it just, it probably oscillates back and forth across
the generations, like the I'm sure the young people today look

(16:58):
at our generation and they're just like, man, get it together. 00:17:02,160 Like you guys are a fucking
mess. Just like when we were kids, we
looked at our parents and grandparents and we were like
wow, you guys are a bunch of fucking yuppie uptight.
Squares. Squares, bullshitters, you know,
it's, it's just really, it's really interesting to me.

(17:18):
It is, it is very interesting tome.
I think that the sort of there'sbeen a paradigm shift, I think
in what is cool as it were. And you know, I try not to be
the old man shaking his first atthis guy.
So I think the fact that beyond the obvious problems of like the

(17:42):
opiate opioid epidemic that, youknow, was fed by the Sackler
family, I think that the youth are today are much more
cognizant of the fact that it's not cool to be an alcoholic.
You know, you, you hear the termheroin chic.

(18:02):
You used to hear that a lot more.
And, you know, I, I knew a guy who became a junkie on purpose.
He he's just like, I'm going to be a junkie.
It's cool. No, it's not.
You know, luckily he got out of it eventually, but he had a
rough ride through it. And for me drinking, and then
particularly once I got in a band and eventually that was my

(18:27):
my paying gig, drinking was expected.
It's like, of course you're going to drink your face off.
You're in a metal band, you know, haven't you ever seen the
Pantera home DVDs? Don't you know about Ozzy?
I think kids today are cognizantof the fact that all that is is
bullshit. It's an illusion.

(18:49):
And they don't seem to be as substance driven, I guess.
Yeah, yeah. Or recreationally substance
driven. Why do you think addiction is so
prevalent among musicians and artists in general?
I mean, even going back to like Charlie Bird in the 40s and you

(19:10):
know, like, I mean, it's just. Coltrane.
Yeah, I mean, it's just addicts all over the place, yes.
I think. I think it's because musicians,
artists in general, when we're creating I've, I've sort of come
to this conclusion, at least formy own self and I, I certainly
see parallels and many, many people I know we're trying to

(19:32):
process these out of control feelings.
I think we're trying to express very strong feelings,
particularly, I know in my case about whatever.
And sometimes those feelings canbecome overwhelming,

(19:52):
particularly if they're rooted in anger.
And for me, alcohol and drugs were a way to numb those
feelings. You know, it's it's also there's
a there's once you get a little success like it's a pressure

(20:15):
cooker. I think if you allow X people's. 00:20:21,400 Views of you, if you allow
external how, how people think and view you to affect yourself,
it gets more and more and more pressurized.
So for me, I think, and for a lot of artists and musicians and

(20:37):
and and writers and actors or whatever, numbing those feelings
is a way to function in the world.
And it it works for a while, fora while it does.
And then depending on how far down the road you go, it, it, it
becomes very counterproductive. I know it did in my case, but I

(21:01):
certainly bought into the cultural myth of the hard
drinking musician writer, even even partying like photographer. 00:21:13,400 It it's, it's weird as it is.
And and all the when I one, whenI was younger and I went to
write, I read Bukowski and Hemingway, Yeah.

(21:22):
And Hunter S Thompson, this supremely male Canon of authors,
all of whom were lunatics. Yeah.
And so I wanted to be a writer. So I did a lot of the things the
great writers did. I was drinking my face off.
I did a fair amount of womanizing, you know, and got in
a few fistfights like a writer. I was doing everything that all

(21:47):
those writers I like so much did, except for the writing.
That's the key thing. A lot of the these sort of
people that are held up as thesebrilliant artists that that died
so soon, you know, too soon or, or killed themselves eventually,
such as Hunter S Thompson and Hemingway, Like they're, they're
trying to deal with pain, they're trying to deal with

(22:09):
emotion and they're using these substances to do so.
And then eventually it stops working.
Kurt Cobain, you know, he's frozen this frozen genius in
time to to a certain generation.The dude was obviously in
immense pain. Yeah, you don't, like, blow your

(22:33):
brains out with a shotgun because you have a stubbed toe.
This is an existential pain of amassive scale.
I saw, I don't remember what or where, but I saw like a small
documentary or short documentaryabout him a year or two ago
maybe. And it was interesting because,

(22:53):
you know, as a 90s kid, Kurt waslike, God, it was everything,
you know, like growing up in themid 90s and Nirvana was
everything. And, you know, you kind of
revered. There was again, a romanticism
about his pain and his sufferingand his, and his addiction and
the suicide and everything. And it was interesting watching

(23:15):
this documentary and they had a bunch of old footage and
interviews with his old friends.And I think maybe even Dave
Grohl was in it. And it was just, I, it was
interesting watching it as a 40 year old, how sad and pathetic
it was. Like, it was just, it was
heartbreaking, honestly. Like how weak and fragile and

(23:37):
completely dysfunctional he was,not to mention a lot of the
people around him. And I, I don't know, I just had
this moment of like, I can't believe this guy was like a
cultural icon, you know, like, it's what a strange time.
It was very strange to me at thetime that it was occurring
because I'm a little bit older than you, you know, I'll be 54

(23:59):
next month. When Nirvana broke, I, I didn't
quite understand the whole majorlabel system yet.
It was just like a a dirty word to me major label coming from
the the punk rock world. I so I didn't pay any attention
to it, but I remember I loved their first record bleach.

(24:20):
It's like they recorded it for 600 bucks and a case of beer
supposedly. And they're like these dirt bags
from up above Seattle somewhere like Aberdeen, I think.
And I love that record. And it was it was their their
cool band like, oh, another sub pop band like, you know,
Soundgarden was at the time. But then before Nevermind came

(24:41):
out, I remember going to the record store and seeing posters
everywhere and free Nirvana stickers and Nirvana mobiles
hanging from the ceiling above the cash register.
And I'm like like the dudes fromSeattle, like the guys who who
wear flannel. Why are they, you know, what is
going on? Why do all of a sudden they care
about them? Because their T-shirts that they

(25:02):
wore they, they sold on the 1st like the bleach tour said, smoke
crack and worship Satan or something on the back.
It's like it did not compute, you know?
And then they had that cultural moment when Smells Like Teen
Spirit came out, and I was just baffled by it.
But then years later when Green Day happened, I was like, oh,

(25:24):
this is what's happening, you know, because I knew their first
two records, they were on a small label called Lookout.
And I was like, oh, this is happening to Nirvana.
Thing is happening again, you know.
Yeah. Coming back to the your
experience with addiction, when you got clean, did that change

(25:46):
your relationship with your creativity?
Did it change the process? Yes.
How so? It made it overwhelming at first
because it was. I used to love to take pills and
to write, you know, I'm like, I need, I would tell my ex like,

(26:07):
because I wouldn't be drinking at home for a while because she
had had enough of my drunken nonsense.
But I'd, I'd be like, I need to take some pills because this
will put me in the right mind state.
Really, all I was doing was sitting in my shed listening to
Black Sabbath and nodding out. Just getting fucked up.
Just. Kidding.
And then I'd look at some lines I wrote the next day and just

(26:28):
like, what is, well, I can't even read this shit right.
And so I felt like when I, when I got sober, when I removed all
the substances, it was like I'd been in a hole with a, with a
cover over it for years. And then all of a sudden the
cover was removed and I came outand there's sunlight.

(26:49):
And if you've been in the dark for 20 years, it hurts your
eyes. So I'm like, Oh my God, what is
going on? Everything is bright, bright,
bright. But after that leveled out the
the sort of like dampening filter that alcohol and drugs
had been that had placed over mymy, the creative side of my

(27:10):
brain was removed. And it's just constant ideas.
It's, and it's something that isthe biggest problem with me
today with my creativity is not,is not looking for something.
It's trying to decide what. I have so many different things
I want to do constantly. And it's like, OK, I now I'm

(27:34):
have to focus. I'm, I'm working on this book,
but I want to go do this killer photo shoot.
These people ask me, you know, or, or this guy asked me to be
on his record and I've listened to him since high school.
I got time to squeeze that in. It's a matter of figuring out
how to focus. I think the ideas flow much

(27:55):
faster, much stronger and with more clarity, you know?
But there was like an adjustmentperiod.
Very much so, and I was definitely afraid a bit that
once I got sober the creativity would abandoned me.
It's the opposite. It's a It's funny you mentioned
the the ideas thing. I've I've actually found that I

(28:18):
think the most common question Iget from people who don't work
in a creative industry to me or to other creatives, is where do
you get your ideas? Where do you get that?
Where do you get that? Like I get asked that so many
times and I always thought, I'm like, the ideas are never the
problem. Like it's never, there's never,
I never worry about ideas ever. It's it's always what are the

(28:42):
good ideas exactly? And how do you get the most out
of them? How do you actually execute on
them? I think that's a misperception.
People who do not work in creative field have it's that we
have this idea. I have this idea I'm going to
write a short story about the time I did Mark Manson's podcast
and I sit down at 2:00 PM and I tap tap, tap, tap, tap, tap for

(29:05):
two hours and Chuck Ching there it is.
It's perfect. You know that happens every now
and then. Most of the time it's like
chucking out garbage until you find, you know, the diamond ring
that you accidentally threw in the car bit.
Or you start writing that short story and that reminds you of
the Diamond 2013 where you like did this interview in London and

(29:28):
this crazy thing. So then you start writing that
and then that remind that gives you 2 ideas for fiction stories
and you start writing those. And then it's like, it's like
this tree these like like a decision tree that you follow
absolutely till you get to the. End the important thing, I think
for anyone struggling who's like, I don't know what to do.
I don't want to do to is to start.

(29:49):
Yeah. It's the hardest thing for me as
a writer, putting ass in chair. Yeah.
Start, engage in the process. Thinking about everything is,
you know, we all think all the time.
I forget how many thoughts we have a day.
Bazillions of them. But like, like thinking about
all that you're going to do is never going to get things done.

(30:10):
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That's shopify.com/I DGAF standsfor I don't give a fuck and

(31:18):
start selling today. Coming back to the alcoholism, I
just kind of want to get that full story.
Was there a specific moment thatyou decided to stop or was it
like, Oh yes, OK, yeah, what wasthat?
Do you want me to tell you aboutmy last day drinking?
Sure, let's go, Let's go there. October 17th 2010, Lamb of God

(31:41):
was on tour with a band called Metallica in Australia.
Yeah, you've heard of them? I think most people have, and I
went out with some. We were in Brisbane, Australia
and I started out the evening with some friends.
We had a day off at a pub in on this street in Brisbane, an

(32:01):
Irish pub. I went and saw it like a few
months ago. When it's down there, I'm
sitting there drinking with two of my friends.
And then this fan walks in and he just sits down at the table
and just stares at me. And I'm like, this is really
weird. I'm like, how you doing, dude?
He's like, I'm drinking with youtonight.
And I'm like, oh God, you know, So I get, I'm like, it's nice to

(32:23):
meet you. I get up to go take a leak and I
look at my friends. I'm like, get rid of this guy.
You know, he's just staring at me.
And I come back and he's, he's sitting there and my friends are
like, he, he won't leave. So I'm like, well, all right, if
you're going to you're, you're, you're going to hang out, you're
buying. So I'm like, order some shots,

(32:45):
bro. And he brings some shots and
pints and I'm like again, again,again.
And I am trying. We went to like 3 or 4 different
bars. It was not fun, dude.
I tried to, I burned up every single Australian dollar in that
dude's wallet trying to get him to leave.

(33:07):
And at the end of the night we drank.
I remember. And I was mean to him.
I feel bad about it to this day.He was weird, right?
But like, I was just an asshole to this guy.
I'm like, come on, shot boy, getanother one, you know?
And he would. And it was horrifying, man.
And at the end of the night, we had been, I drank started in the

(33:30):
early afternoon, drank until like midnight or something.
So all day just drinking on thisguy's tab.
The end of the night we walked out of the final bar, my friends
left and this drunk guy is like he can barely walk.
And I remember very clearly him standing under a streetlight
just like weaving. And I, I did not feel drunk at

(33:52):
all. I was mad.
And I looked at him like, go home, dude, go home, it's over.
And I went back to my hotel roomand, and, and left him weaving
and standing on the street. It was just awful.
And I did not feel drunk. And I'd done a bunch of drugs

(34:14):
too that night too, by the way, some sort of Molly or something. 00:34:21,920 And I didn't feel anything.
It had finally stopped. Like there was, there's intense
feelings I had in my head that the alcohol and drugs no longer
numb them. I woke up the next morning on
October 18th, 2010. I walked out on my balcony

(34:37):
because we had like a hotel suite.
It was nice with the balcony. And you've been to Australia?
It's awesome. So I'm in Brisbane and we're one
block away. Down to the left is the Brisbane
Botanical Gardens, which are beautiful and they had, you
know, weird plants and Australian animals, you know,
whatever undetermined nature would things in the trees.

(35:01):
Across the street was one of my favorite bookstores of all time. 00:35:07,560 And then all down the street to
the right where all these great restaurants and I just woke up
and walked out on this sunny balcony and I was like, I do not
want to exist anymore. And I didn't feel suicidal.
I didn't want to kill myself. I just wanted to vanish from

(35:22):
existence, poof. And and I, I was like, Oh my
God, dude, I, I'm in Australia, which is awesome.
I'm opening up for Metallica. I have money in the bank.
I had a wife still. I got a house back at home.
I have a career. We got fans.
And I feel utterly empty. And I looked over, there is a

(35:44):
table on the balcony and I saw all these beer bottles that I
had carefully lined up the nightbefore because I get a little
OCD with things. And all the labels were pointing
the same way and they were linedperfectly up, very neat, all
empty. And I looked at the beer bottles
and I was like, that is a metaphor for my life.

(36:04):
I am in just an empty container to pour alcohol into and on the
outside everything looks well ordered, but all it would take
is just a push and they would fall and break, you know?
So I was like, that's my life. I I don't want to exist anymore. 00:36:29,280 So I thought maybe, just maybe

(36:30):
if I don't drink in two trucks like a maniac, I'll feel a
little better. And so I went to the gig that
night and Hetfield was sober andthere's four, like three or four
other guys on the on their crew that were sober because they had
talked to me because we've been on tour with them for about two

(36:52):
years off and on. And, and it was obvious I was in
rough shape. You know, I many different
continents completely shit faced.
They had kind of mentioned it tome.
So I went to these dudes and I was like, help, help, how do you
do this? And they, they calm me down.

(37:13):
You know that they're like, you just have to worry about today,
man. You don't have to worry about
tomorrow. You can get through this.
And so they, they calm me down abit.
And then I went on stage in front of 14,000 people and
weeping profusely. And my hair was long at the
time, so nobody could see. But I'm like I have my hair down

(37:38):
in my eyes and the band is chunkchunk, chunk, chunk chunk.
Say who caps oh fuck Oh my God. In between Oh my life I know
what is happening. Just weeping.
It run up 14,000 people uncontrollably for 45 minutes.
Oh my God. But somehow I got through it and
that was my last day drinking and my first day sober.

(37:58):
And so since then, you know, thenext day, I just didn't drink
again. I was like, I'm just not going
to drink today. I'm going to try, man.
I'm going to try. And day after day after day
after day. And 14 years later, here I am
with you. How hard was it that initial
stretch? Like when did it start getting
easier or like let where were you like less raw and emotional? 00:38:25,840 It was very strange, like I was

(38:25):
in Australia for the whole firstmonth of my sobriety.
So we had 17 days off and everybody else flew home.
But I stayed there with some friends on a sea island South of
Melbourne called Phillip Island.And I had my own car and it was
just magic. I just drove around and went to

(38:46):
the koala sanctuary or went to the ocean.
We went camping in the rainforest.
It was amazing. And I had this.
Some people refer to it as the pink cloud.
When you get sober, everything has been so horrific.
Now that you're you're sober, everything's, oh, wow, you wake

(39:09):
up, you don't feel like killing yourself.
Isn't that great? I was annoyingly happy to be
sober for the first month or so.I was like, I'm sober.
I was like, this is great. And you know, some guys are
like, maybe you ought to have. I liked you better when you're
drunk. You know, at least you weren't
up my butt so much about how awesome everything is.

(39:30):
And that level of stoke is not sustainable.
So of course, I come home and then about two months into it,
all of a sudden I, I fall into an immense depression.
And intellectually, I knew my life was way better.

(39:51):
I knew that everything was getting better, that I was fine. 00:39:59,280 But emotionally, I, I remember
going into my backyard and just weeping and like being in the
morning, being unable to tie my shoes.
I was like, I can't do it. Just can't looking at my shoes,
like I can't do this. So I talked to a friend who was

(40:13):
sober and he's like, look, dude,ride it out.
If you see if you can make it like six months.
At one point I I went to my family, I was like, y'all are
going to have to lock me up. Something's wrong with me.
I'm not going to drink. But I feel crazy.
And a friend of mine told me he's like, look dude, you drank
and did drugs and IA lot of drugs, a lot of alcohol for 22

(40:36):
years. That changes the neural pathways
in your brain. Shit gets fucked up.
So the synapses were no longer connecting without alcohol.
And he's like, it may take a little while for you to level
out, but see if you can make it 6 months without going on drugs

(40:57):
because a psychiatrist is going to have a hard time accurately
assessing what's wrong with you because you scrambled your brain
for 22 years. You know, sometimes it's just
tough and you got to ride it out.
So I waited, I, I made it to sixmonths and I was still just
overwhelmingly depressed. So then I went to a shrink and

(41:17):
they prescribed me you, you. They explained to me like, look,
you may need a little, your brain need a little kick start
producing serotonin again. You've abused it so long that
the synapses will no longer connect.
And you might not have to be on it forever, but you might just
need a little kick start. So they put me on this drug

(41:40):
called Pristiq at first, which Iit just sounds so posh.
It sounds like a Louis Vuitton handbag or something.
Yeah, exactly. And it's the Louis Vuitton bag
of antidepressants. Right and.
I wasn't depressed, but I felt like I was coming down from
cocaine all the time. Like I was like, this sucks.
So then he put me on this other drug called Lexapro and I was on

(42:04):
that for about a year and a halfand I leveled out and I haven't
had to take it at all. It just like I, you know, that
was the thing you don't think about when you're partying so
much. It's like you are doing very
real, you're altering your brainchemistry, right?
And then when you do it for thatlong, it can have permanent new

(42:27):
permanent pathways get burned. Yeah, I've read that if you, if
you're a chronic drinker for a long period of time from the
time you quit, it can take upwards of a year to even just
for your brain to kind of get back to like default.
Yes yeah, yeah, bro it you know,I believe it.
I was also an acid dealer when Iwas younger so like.

(42:50):
There's a lot of there's. A lot.
There's a lot going on. When I stopped doing that stuff
because I did that, you know, I there's a good gear or two where
I was taking acid all the time. It took me about a year to come
down for for like the, I mean, Iwas functional.
I, I didn't think I was, you know, in on a different planet
or anything, but the floor was still moving and the walls are

(43:12):
still breathing. It took a while for things to
get back to normal. So if you know you put stuff in
your psychoactive substances andyou it's, it's going to mess
with your brain. In your book, you talk about how
you kind of have these two sidesof yourself like this, this
eternally optimistic side and this kind of bleak, nihilistic

(43:34):
side. And how much how much of of the
drug use and abuse was like an attempt to manage balancing
those two sides? And then like, how have you
managed those two sides of yourself since?
Well, I think the drug and alcohol fed both sides,

(43:56):
particularly in the beginning. It fed the optimistic side.
You know, it's like, sure, you don't have any money, but you
have a great buzz and it's a beautiful day and, you know,
you'll figure out how to pay rent later.
Yeah, it's not that big of a deal.
But as it progressed, it more and more and more fed the

(44:20):
depressant side. So for me, being an active
addiction to alcohol, I don't think I ever got strung out on
drugs. I don't know how I avoided that. 00:44:35,000 It wasn't for lack of trying,
you know, But alcohol was was mybaby.
For me, being that it was a constant roller coaster, it was

(44:42):
up and down, up and down, up anddown.
And you know, Buddha talked about the middle path.
That sounded dreadfully boring to me.
Who in the hell wants to walk down the street the straight
narrow down the middle of the road?
But for me, it, it's something I, I have, I've tried to strive

(45:07):
for ever since because the the alcoholic or or drug induced
highs are wonderful. The lows are crushing.
And you don't you can't live your life on a roller coaster.
So now that I've been sober for 14 years, it's a matter of me

(45:28):
self managing those two extremesto the best of my ability.
And it's very much a process forme to this day, if I get angry
or depressed about things, I I really used to kick my own ass

(45:53):
severely. I still do, but I'm, I'd be
like, why are you depressed? Yeah, what's wrong with you,
dude? You know, like your life is
great and, and you're a piece ofshit, which makes you even more
depressed. Now I've tried to come to the

(46:13):
conclusion that hey, dude, this is this is a temporary state and
of course you're going to feel depressed because like the fires
out here, I was talking to you before we started this.
Obviously it was nothing I was experiencing directly.
But the whole time those were going on for about a week, there

(46:34):
was this constant low level hum of anxiety going on.
And the optimistic guy will be like, what are you worried
about? You're, you're in Virginia and
nothing's on fire, you know? And that's not cool either,
right? That's not cool either.
But the, the sort of depressed guy is just like, the world is

(46:57):
ending. And I was constantly, I texted
you to make sure you're OK, likeconstantly contacting all my
friends out here because that was so like anxious to me at
first. I, I, I started kicking my butt
a little bit. You know, I'm like, dude, what,
that you're being counterproductive now.

(47:17):
But then I came to the conclusion like, yes, you're,
you're going to have some anxiety.
You have a lot of people you care about out there, you know,
and you, you shouldn't beat yourself up because you feel
this, that in fact, the fact that you feel anxious shows
shows your humanity that you have some compassion, that you
are not an entirely self-centered asshole.

(47:40):
Entirely right? Partly, but you're not entirely. 00:47:48,280 So I've tried to to learn to
accept both aspects of my naturebecause they can both be useful. 00:47:58,320 I think being too negative when
happy moments come, it's, I don't want to embrace him to the

(48:04):
point that I ignore anything around me, but I should allow
myself to have those happy moments and knowing just like
these sort of negative moments, this too shall pass.
Yeah. And that's why the middle path
is much more appealing to me now.
It's constant work, though. Constant, constant.

(48:24):
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That's IDGA F50 off. You get the point.
It was interesting reading that chapter of your book because it
actually made me think about metal and metal heads.
Because as a lifelong metal head, my observation, and I
think this is true about myself as well, is that metal heads are
actually, I think most non metalheads would be surprised at how

(50:13):
nice and friendly metal heads are.
They're actually, if you go to ametal show and hang out around a
mosh pit, people are actually much more polite than if you go,
I don't know, to like a Taylor Swift concert or something like
that. Like people are incredibly
conscientious and, and aware and, and caring in a way.
And my observation over the years is that I think what draws

(50:35):
a lot of people to meddle is that they are very nice,
friendly, caring people, but they have this darkness in them. 00:50:45,760 But because they're so nice and
friendly, they don't really let themselves access that darkness. 00:50:50,840 And it's like metals like a
socially appropriate format to like access the darkness like I

(50:57):
that definitely. Recognizes reality.
Yeah, like what? That definitely feels true for
myself. Like I I definitely like it's, I
thought for a long time, like the, for me, the appeal of metal
music or just heavy aggressive music in general.
It's like it is, it's a context where it's OK for like my inner

(51:17):
nihilistic asshole shithead demon face person to like come
out briefly in in a very specific venue and format and
then like, OK, now I'm back to like be nice friendly Mark.
Yeah, you know. Absolutely.
And you're 100% correct. Like, I mean, the, I mean the

(51:42):
Satanic panic of the 80s, you know, everybody like Judas
Priest is getting sued and all this crazy shit, you know, and
they're like, these people are evil, evil.
I think there's still a bit of acultural hangover from that.
But my mom has met a lot of, youknow, really well known metal

(52:04):
musicians and people from the hardcore scene as well, that
some of them look pretty freaking scary, you know?
And she's like, honey, your friends are so nice.
And I'm like, yes, yeah, they'regreat dudes, you know, because I
think it's a matter of not having to walk around with this

(52:25):
sort of front that everything isOK all the time.
Right. Yeah.
Because everything isn't OK all the time, you know?
That doesn't mean we have to spiral down into this hit of
despair, but we should recognizeit.
Yeah, I, I love a lot of different types of music, but
there there's something cathartic or like almost
therapeutic about metal, at least for me personally.

(52:50):
I I'm sure. For many people, I'm.
Sure, people feel this way aboutother types of music as well,
but it's like it I I think it's,there's a certain kind of
aggression or anger that it is relieved from you.
Yeah. After a good metal show, yeah.
Absolutely. Yeah.
Everybody walks away. You may walk away with a black
eye, but you'll be smiling, you know, and that's just the way it

(53:12):
is. I think people look at it from
the outside and it, it looks like this violent, chaotic
thing. And it's, there's physical
expression, you know, of those emotions, but.
And there are jerks and, and whatever social, you know.
Yeah. But for the great part, man,

(53:32):
people are so cool. Yeah.
And everybody walks out stoked. Yeah, it's, I guess, I mean, if
you think about the role of music in human culture in
general, like it's probably the help people process and express
emotions that they normally aren't able to like, process and
express. Like that is, that is the

(53:54):
fundamental purpose. You went through a fucking
nightmare situation about 12 years ago I believe.
Yeah, yeah, 1213 years. Czech Republic, yeah.
If you're open to, I'd be curious to like dive into that
story and, and hear a little bitabout those experiences of what

(54:15):
you went through. Well, basically what happened is
we played a show in Prague in 2010.
It was our first show and it wasin a small club.
It was a nightmare. There was they had a barricade
but it was push flush to the stage.
So it's basically a bicycle rack, push, push flush to the

(54:36):
stage, which became a ladder. It was a small club we had
because we have a security agreement with every club that
we play, even the smaller clubs,and our tour manager will go
through what we expect and there's a meeting.
He did all that security showed up and just stood on the side of

(54:56):
the stage and did nothing. So for the whole show, they're
all these kids on for the entireshow coming off on and off the
stage. It was just a nightmare,
dangerous situation. Climbing up and then stage.
Diving, Yeah, within, there's video of most of the show within
15 seconds. Like, there's kids running on
stage and we have equipment everywhere and you can't do your

(55:20):
job. So there was just lots of I, I
should have stopped the show, right?
In retrospect, should have stopped the show.
But then if you stop the show, they get mad.
And, you know, so we got throughit.
It was not fun. And so we split.
And then, you know, everybody's like, that sucked.

(55:41):
And then two years later, we come back to play our next show. 00:55:47,800 We flew from, I believe, Norway
to Prague and landed at the airport in Prague.
And I got off the plane and my band did.
And I was very excited because Prague is a beautiful city and
I'd walked around it the day before and I went to go and, and

(56:04):
go get a coffee and go to go to like some of Kafka's haunts or
whatever. So I'm very excited.
We get off the plane and there this woman is collecting,
looking at people's passports aswe're getting off the plane,
which is kind of weird, but whatever.
And I saw they took, they took my bass players and they were

(56:26):
taking some of our crews and I handed her and they were
diverting me and everybody in our crew into one room.
And everybody else got off the jet bridge.
You know, at the end of the jet bridge to walk into the airport,
they diverted us into one room. I walked into this room and my
bass player was in there 1st. And they were, I think 8 people,
eight or nine people. There was a woman who turned out

(56:47):
to be a detective and like 3 big, like Slavic plainclothes,
like tough guy cops and then like 5-4 or five guys in masks
with machine guns and the whole,yeah, they look like they were
there to get bin Laden basically.
So once they had all of us in there, this woman comes up to me

(57:09):
and and she has my passport in her hand and she says there are
you David Blight. And I'm like, yes, she goes,
this is for you. I need you to gather any
medicines you have or anything you may need.
You have to come with us. And I looked at this piece of
paper and it was in English, kind of broken.
It was a legal document, obviously.
And I was being charged with theCzech equivalent of manslaughter

(57:35):
because after our last show, apparently a young man was on
stage. The charges said that I
purposely threw him from the stage.
He fell, hit his head, went intoa coma, died a month later.
And that had been two years ago.We had zero clue anybody had
been injured, much less someone had died.

(57:59):
So I'm like, what the fuck, you know?
So they put me in a car and carry me off to the jail, the
city jail in Prague. And I was there for three days.
And then they took me to Penn Kratz prison, Remand prison,

(58:21):
which was I think 100 and 27137 years old at the time, this
crumbling prison that the the Nazis had when they had control
of the Czech Republic. And I was there for 30-4 days.
So I was locked up for 37 days total.

(58:41):
They gave me bail, which I paid.It was almost a quarter,
$1,000,000. We, my band paid it.
Jeez. But then unlike America, where
if you pay your bail, it's like,OK, cool, you're out.
Show up at the court date there.The prosecuting attorney
objected. He's like, no, we want to keep

(59:03):
him in prison. So they doubled it.
So you're pushing half $1,000,000 by this time.
Luckily we have some wealthy friends who loaned us the money
he had offered to help us. So I got out after being locked
up in Prague for 37 days. We didn't let the prosecuting
attorney know that I kind of, I kind of snuck out of the country

(59:26):
because he could have objected again and I would have been re
arrested. And I left and flew back to
America and went on stage like 10 days later and not test in
Iowa. Jeez.
And then we had to go and tour because I had to pay for the
five lawyers I had. Six months later, I went back to

(59:49):
Prague for a month, month and a half to stand trial and was
found not guilty. So yeah, it was very sad
situation. The American government had been
contacted by the Czech government after this young man

(01:00:10):
had died. And we're like, we want to
investigate this guy, maybe in connection with this young man's
death, talking about me because there were people saying I'd run
and shoved him off the stage. And the American government
said, yeah, this sounds like nonsense.
No, we won't cooperate with you.But the American government
never let me know. So, yeah, it's not like, oops,

(01:00:32):
she got a parking ticket. Someone died, Right.
You know, And it had I been aware of that fact, I would have
gone there to deal with it. Yeah.
You know, But they didn't let meknow.
So I wound up in prison doing, going through all this nonsense. 01:00:55,000 And I felt compelled to go back

(01:00:56):
to go to trial because they wouldn't have extradited me.
The government would have, the American government would have,
would not have cooperated with that because I felt obligated to
try and provide the family of this young man the answers, any
answers. I had the best of my ability.

(01:01:17):
Once again, it's not like a parking ticket.
All these, these, these poor people that they lost their son,
all they knew is that he had gone to go see my band and it
died a month later. That's very serious.
So also, I wanted to be made aware that if I held any sort of

(01:01:37):
responsibility in this matter, Ineeded to face up to that and be
held accountable because, you know, I hate to tie everything
back to drinking and alcohol, but like, I was and I wasn't
drunk the night of the show. I knew that for a fact.
Yeah. For so long, I ran away from my
problems and my feelings and my issues by putting drugs and

(01:01:59):
alcohol on top of me. So when I was arrested, I've
been sober about a year and a half.
I went to prison sober. I knew that if I did not go back
and do my best to provide these people with some answers, then I
would have just been running from a problem.
And if I can convince myself that I don't need to be held
accountable in this situation, then it's only a hop, skip and a

(01:02:22):
jump until I can convince myselfit's not a big deal.
Take a drink, you know, And thenI would have probably just
killed myself. Yeah.
What was your your state of mindgoing into that prison like?
What did you know? What was going on?
Did you think, how long did you think you were going to be there

(01:02:43):
like? I thought it was all a huge
mistake at first, but the, the weird thing, we've been talking
about ideas and being an artist.The weirdest thing was, is when
they arrested me at the airport,all this happened very quickly.
I can't say exactly how long it took from them handing me this
warrant and then to me getting in the car, but you know, no

(01:03:06):
longer than probably 3 or 4 minutes.
But when it started occurring, time slowed down and I had a
conscious thought. I was like, you need to pay very
close attention to everything that is happening to you right
now. You need to be taking notes.

(01:03:27):
It was like a camera in my brainto start clicking.
Not only because this is important for your well-being,
but this is going to be something you're going to write
about later. And it seems strange and almost
inappropriate to have that sort of thought process going on at
the time I'm being arrested. But that's the way my brain

(01:03:49):
works now. You know, everything comes in
and I'm like, this is something that might potentially be output
in some form or the other artistically later.
So I was very hyper aware of my surroundings and time seemed to
slow down. But it when I went in, I felt,

(01:04:13):
oh man, I don't know. It's it's kind of hard to put
words on the on the feeling. Just, I tried not to have
expectations of this is going tobe resolved in a, in a, a couple
of days, which I thought it would be at first.
But then as time stretched on and I didn't get out of jail and

(01:04:34):
I stayed in prison and they, youknow, looks like your bail isn't
going to work out. I tried really to stop thinking
about leaving and tried to stay really focused and stay in the
moment as to what exactly was happening right there.
And no, I didn't know half of what was going on.

(01:04:56):
Very few people spoke English inthere.
I didn't have a computer, no Internet, no cell phone.
My lawyer, my Czech lawyer wouldcome to see me sometimes.
And there were a few prisoners that spoke English in there, but
not very well. Like we went out to the yard one
day and this prisoner, I remember, he comes up to me and

(01:05:18):
he goes, he's trying really hardto form that, the English words. 01:05:26,640 He's like Ozzy Osbourne.
And I'm like, yeah, I know Ozzy.What about it?
He was, Ozzy Osbourne says good thing for you.
And I'm like, what? He's like Ozzy Osbourne says

(01:05:39):
good thing for you. And I'm like, OK, maybe Ozzy
said something, you know, and, and him and Sharon had and they
had actually written a letter tothe judge that which I still
have a copy of it that said, youknow, we've known this guy since
2004. He's a good dude.

(01:06:01):
And we're not asking you not to charge him, but please just
honor his bail and let him go. And we will come and we will put
on an Oz fest at our expense in,in the Czech Republic.
And you can donate any, all the money to whatever charitable
proceeds you want. Just let this dude go.
Let him get a chance to stand trial.

(01:06:22):
So, you know, there was a lot ofpeople in the music community
speaking out for me, but I had zero clue because I was stuck in
in a, a misfit song. Dude, that's what it was like it
was crazy. It would they they would never
that person would never be allowed to be open today in
America. They'd nuke it and turn into a
Walmart immediately. Like it was crazy.

(01:06:46):
So you really your approach was just try not to have any
expectation, focus on taking it day by day.
Day by day. And.
And to remain grateful for the things that I have in that
moment rather than upset for thethings that I don't have,
including my physical freedom. So I, you know, I'm sitting in

(01:07:06):
prison and I'm like, this sucks.And food was horrible and nobody
speaks the language. And I don't know if someone's
going to try and stab me becauseI don't know how people are
viewing me. Checks are not very outwardly
emotive. So when they're speaking and and
everyone knew I was in there like the first day I walked into
population and I wasn't in some sort of celebrity cell or either

(01:07:29):
I was in population. It was like when the needles on
the record, like everybody looksat me.
Oh, there's the American rock star, you know, and they, the
Czech papers were particularly this one tabloid, which is the
biggest selling paper in the Czech Republic, was paying me as
some sort of like, murderous Viking American guy.

(01:07:51):
You know, like they printed all sorts of nonsense.
Like they said I'd kicked a woman to death or some crazy
shit. It's like, yeah.
To where my lawyers had to threaten to sue them.
So everybody knew, I think more than me at least, what the
external perception of my situation was.
Yeah, it was. I don't know, I really had no

(01:08:15):
choice but to to come to some acceptance and also to remain
grateful because I was like, this sucks, right?
But I'm not in Afghanistan in a Quonset Hut right now with like
AK47 rounds whipping over my head and, and there are guys
going through that, you know, there are men and women
stationed like in those situations.

(01:08:37):
And there's people somewhere going through something much
worse than me. The food sucks, but at least I
have food, you know, And I triedto really keep that in the
forefront of my mind. It helped me immensely.
What lessons? Have you taken away from that
experience? Don't go to prison, Don't go to
prison. It sucks bro.

(01:08:57):
Let's we'll put that in the shownotes in case.
People, it's not clear for it sucks.
I think. For me, you.
Know the the further I stay awayfrom the further the more time
that goes from that until now it's harder to remember.
It's hard to remember like just how bad it was, you know, and

(01:09:22):
yet I somehow amazingly managed to stay relatively calm through
it. So now when I get upset over
something relatively minor and, and the big things in life, like
the, the if a, if a, some sort of catastrophe happens right
now, I'm your guy, right? I'm good, right?

(01:09:45):
We're going to handle it becauseI'm calm and I'm level headed
and might get focused, but if the coffee maker breaks, yeah,
it's all bets are off. It's horrible.
And and I'm like or if I. You know, I can't get my
computer to work and I have to call the AI assistant and it's

(01:10:06):
just like, fuck, fuck, fuck. I'm going to fucking lose my
mind, right? That's the stuff that gets me.
It's the little things and the further I stay away, the further
I move away from this horrible experience I have.
I forget. So I have to remind myself
sometimes like dude, you were inprison.
You are facing 5 to 10. They don't give you time off or

(01:10:29):
good behavior. You could have gotten out two
years ago and you're flipping out over there being no parking. 01:10:39,480 You know, what the fuck is wrong
with you? So I have to really remind
myself of that. And you know, on the bookshelf
beside my writing desk, there's a picture of the prison I went
back and took when I went back for a trial.

(01:10:52):
I took this picture of this clock because there's a clock in
the yard and the paint is all peeling and it's on the cover of
Dark Days. This photo is, that was the only
clock I had for a month, once a day to go out and look at the
time for an hour, you know, And I keep that up there.
I keep this picture up there to remind me you were somewhere

(01:11:14):
real bad. And yes, whatever you're going
through right now sucks. Wouldn't Sometimes it's real
life thing. Sometimes it's inconsequential
bullshit that I let you know, get it and get under my skin.
But you are in prison. Square yourself away, soldier.
Yeah, it's, it's crazy and it and it is so interesting too,

(01:11:37):
cause like the value of keeping.That reminder like.
Front and center, even though itis probably one of the worst
experiences of your. Life you.
Know having that that reminder consistently yeah it's it's also
I'm alive though it. Sets perspective.
I'm alive to to. Remember that.

(01:11:57):
This the family of this young man, their son's gone.
That's horrible. Horrible.
Man, what I went through is nothing compared to that loss,
you know, So I have to be cognizant of that as well, if I. 01:12:18,640 Want to have you know any sort

(01:12:18):
of? Accurate assessment of myself as
an empathetic compassion man with a correctly calibrated
moral compass. I have to keep that first and
foremost in my mind. Totally, totally.
It's an incredible story, man. It's fucking crazy.
So don't go to prison. Yeah, don't go to prison, kids.
Y'all don't. Do stupid shit that'll.
Get you in prison You aren't. A gangster.

(01:12:39):
Trust me. Before we we wrap up here, I'm
curious for anybody, for young people out there who aspire to
maybe have a career in music or as a writer or as photography,
any sort of creative field, likewhat what, what's your go to
advice do? What you want to do, do it.

(01:13:04):
That's the only way. You're going.
To get better at it. For music, it's always been the
same advice for me, it's practice as much as you can.
Practice, practice, practice, practice.
We used to practice six days a week when nobody cared about us. 01:13:25,120 Practice, practice, practice and

(01:13:25):
play as much as possible, anywhere to anyone at any time.
For us, that meant playing someone's basement for three
people, you know, going on tour in a van, playing punk rock
squats or whatever. That's the world we come from.
We did not wait for someone to hand us something.
You know, I think in some ways because the Internet and social

(01:13:51):
media, The Internet existed, butit it was not nearly as
prevalent as it is now. Not everybody had a laptop.
Smartphones didn't exist when westarted doing this kind of
thing. In some ways it's easier to get
your, your stuff out now. And for young people, I think
the democratization of, of recording technology and all

(01:14:15):
that stuff is great. It's easier to get your stuff
out now. But I think there's also in the
younger generation this sort of feeling of constantly being
judged right. And I think it it produces a
sort of anxiousness in them, youknow, and you can't give a fuck

(01:14:38):
about that, right? It's interesting because it's,
you know, you mentioned playing a basement the.
Three people that night if you guys suck that night, the stakes
pretty low because it's only three people are going to know
how how much you sucked whereas today theoretically, if you put
something out and it sucks theoretically you know the whole
world could know tomorrow right but let's look at the reality of

(01:14:59):
the situation here this. Is.
I think that's the sort of the problem with with this feeling
of being judged on the Internet,right?
It's not real. Yeah, It's not fucking real.
You know what is real? Playing in a bar and having a
beer bottle smash against your head?
That's fucking real bro. That happened.

(01:15:21):
You know if I can handle that, If you can handle 50 people
screaming you fucking suck and throwing shit at you or fist
fighting the audience or whatever.
Just total chaos in real life that has real world
consequences. Someone writing you suck on.

(01:15:44):
You know Instagram. Or whatever it is.
That's not reality. They aren't in your house
yelling at you. You're a failure.
They just aren't. You have to be able to
disconnect from that. If, you know, obviously we want
people to like our music and andwe want people to come see us or

(01:16:05):
whatever, but I do not give a flying fuck who doesn't like our
music. If I did, I would never leave
the house. Yeah, you, you can't give a
fuck. I hate to keep saying it, but
you just can't, bro. It's well said, man, It's well
said. What did you do in those moments
with the the people shouting andthe beer bottles breaking?

(01:16:26):
Keep on fucking rocking. Just keep rocking.
Just a big. Middle finger back at the crowd. 01:16:32,440 Very combative man.
Some, I mean, sometimes because it was you're asking, you know,
in the early days, it was just like destroy.
Yeah. Like, that's part of it, you
know? Yeah, yeah.
Someone's going to huck something at you, you know?
I think part of it too, is just make something that you.
Love so much that you're willingto be hated for it?

(01:16:47):
Yeah, absolutely. And if you do.
If you do get some sort of measure of success or
recognition you have to be prepared for people will hate
you for that. Yeah, you pay your bills.
Fuck you. Right.
You pay your bills doing something that you love.
So fuck you, buddy. Yeah.

(01:17:08):
Well, I don't. Yeah.
I think that's where that comes from.
Yeah. You know, a little bit of envy.
Yeah. Or, you know, just, you know, if
you want this, if you want this life, this life as an artist or
a writer or whatever, you have to want all of it.
Yeah. There's no world where you
create something and everybody loves it.
So it's you, you have to get comfortable with the the

(01:17:31):
disapproval as early as possible.
I think. I think that's like a probably a
good piece of advice 100% become.
Accustomed to that? Yeah.
The sooner, the sooner that getscomfortable.
The better off you are, yeah, the more you're going to
continue to focus and. Push and work on what you want
to do, what's important to you. It's well said.

(01:17:52):
All right, Randy. The new book is out.
It's called Just Be on the Light.
Yes, your memoir, Dark Days, also covers some of the stuff
that we talked about that's in bookstores everywhere.
Thank you for so much for comingon, dude.
Thank you so much for having me.It's a blast, man.
It's. Been over the years seeing your
book in, you know, in bookstoresand then finally figuring out,

(01:18:15):
oh wait, there's a connection. It's been a trip.
I have to say the the night we, we.
Hung out at your show seeing howmany metal heads were were fans
of mine was like I it was so it made me so happy, so great.
You dude. Our drummer art was just like.
Oh, he fanboyed to me. Yeah, yeah, he's like.

(01:18:36):
Mark Manson's? Really.
Coming. I'm like, yeah.
And then you were so kind to send him a book, you know,
signed in. Great, dude.
Great dude. Yeah.
You know, it's been a blast, dude.
Certainly. Thank you.
Yep. The Subtle Art.
I'm not giving a fuck, podcast. Is produced by Drew Bernie.
It's edited by Andrew Nishimura.Jessica Choi is our videographer
and sound engineer. Thank you for listening and we
will see you next week.

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