February 19, 2025 • 56 mins
Every dog owner needs to watch this for the sake of their pets and the planet.
Can dogs thrive on a plant-based diet!? UnchainedTV is streaming the new movie, Plant Based Pups, where you will find the answer!
https://watch.unchainedtv.com/unchainedtv-video-podcast/events/what-the-vegan-dog-food-study-reveals
If all dogs and cats in the US populated their own country, they’d be the fifth-largest meat-eating country in the world. And, now, our pets are suffering some of the diet-related ailments their human companions experience. UNCHAINEDTV’s Jane Velez-Mitchell gets the lowdown from Darren Middlesworth, the head of V-Dog, the vegan dog food used in the study featured in this short film. Plus, you’ll meet the 2 veterinarians who actually ran the study, Dr. Tonatiuh Melgarejo and Dr. Annika Linde. Produced in conjunction with the Oceanic Preservation Society, Plant Based Pups is directed by Louie Psihoyos who is famous for bringing us The Cove, Racing Extinction, The Game Changers, You Are What You Eat: A Twin Experiment and other blockbuster movies. In fact, the plant based pups mini-doc is an outtake from You Are What You Eat: A Twin Experiment. It’s absolutely fascinating and will change everything you thought you knew about dogs and diet.
About Your Host:
Jane Velez-Mitchell is an award-winning journalist, TV producer and NY Times bestselling author who founded and runs UnchainedTV, the world's premier streaming TV network to promote the plant-based, compassionate, sustainable lifestyle. UnchainedTV offers 2,000 free documentaries, vegan cooking, lifestyle and news shows as part of its nonprofit media network. You can download UnchainedTV for free on any cell phone. You can watch UnchainedTV for free on any TV via streaming devices like Amazon Fire Stick, Roku device and Apple TV device. And, it's on all Samsung TVs. Here's the online portal: https://watch.unchainedtv.com/browse
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
In the form of a brand new study
that has just come out, and you are
actually going to meet the people who did
the study, the two veterinarians, as well as
the head of V-Dog, which was the
dog food used in the study.
So this question, can dogs thrive on a
(00:20):
plant-based diet?
Unchained TV is streaming the hit new movie,
By That Name, where you will find the
answer, you've got to check it out.
Now, here's why it's important.
If all dogs and cats in the U
.S. populated their own country, they'd be the
fifth largest meat-eating country in the world.
And now our pets are suffering some of
the same diet-related ailments their human companions
(00:41):
experience.
Well, now we're going to get the lowdown
from Darren Middlesworth, the head of V-Dog,
which is the vegan dog food that was
used in the study, featured in this short
film.
Plus, you're going to meet two veterinarians who
actually ran the study, Dr. Tona Melgarejo and
Dr. Anika Linda.
Produced in conjunction with the Oceananic Preservation Society,
(01:03):
this movie is directed by Luis Sai Hoyos,
who is famous for bringing us The Cove,
Racing Extinction, The Game Changers, You Are What
You Eat, A Twin Experiment, and other blockbuster
films.
So I am so excited to talk to
the veterinarians who ran the study.
This is information every single dog parent needs
(01:26):
to learn and understand and process.
So without further ado, I would like to
go out to Dr. Tona Melgarejo of Western
University, who led this study.
You're looking at video from the actual mini
-doc about this study.
Tell us, why is this study so very
(01:49):
important to our world, Dr. Tona?
Thank you so much for the invitation, Jane.
When we decided to pursue this study, looked
at the big picture, not just the health
of your friends, your furry friends.
(02:09):
That is very, very important.
But also, we looked at the planetary health.
And when we're looking into that also, the
guardians, and I don't like to say owners,
because we don't own these beautiful souls.
We just guard them.
We just help them to strive.
(02:29):
So we looked at this three-piece equation,
and we decided to actually test something that
it has been going on for decades of
our education.
Dogs are carnivores.
Dogs are carnivores.
And we knew, and I, as an internal
medicine person, I prescribe food as medicine, and
(02:52):
I have seen amazing results.
So this was just to start.
Can dog leaves, clinically healthy dogs live on
a plant-based diet?
And we got our answer.
And the answer is yes.
And that is so important because the truth
is that, as we have mentioned, if U
(03:12):
.S. dogs and cats were their own country,
they would be the fifth largest meat-eating
country in the world.
There's China, there's the United States, there's Russia.
And let's listen to a clip from the
movie that breaks this down.
Absolutely fascinating movie.
And again, you can watch it on Unchained
(03:36):
Television.
It is streaming.
That's Unchained TV right there behind me.
And it's fascinating.
We have about 91 million dogs living in
the United States.
Most of these dogs are eating a meat
-based diet.
The amount of meat that we use for
(03:58):
dogs and cats, it's equivalent to the meat
consumption in the country of Italy.
And if all dogs and cats in the
U.S. had their own country, they would
be the fifth largest meat-eating country in
the world.
Oh, wow.
Well, let me say this.
(04:18):
I was just joined.
Come here, come here, come here.
Guess who decided that she wanted to come
up and be part of this show?
My little dog Wednesday, who is thriving on
a plant-based diet.
And the diet that she is thriving on
is very similar to the diet featured in
(04:39):
the film, V-Dog.
And we are so delighted today to have
the founder and the president of V-Dog
on, Darren Middlesworth, who is seen there with
his mother, Linda, who is really a force
of nature in the vegan movement.
So, Darren, welcome.
Why was it so important to have V
(05:01):
-Dog featured in this study and in this
film?
Thank you so much, Jane, for having me
on.
And also, thank you to Dr. Mel Guarao
and Dr. Linda for allowing V-Dog to
participate in this study in the beginning.
It was something that came about many, many
years ago, and to see it come to
fruition is just really amazing.
(05:21):
It's important for us as a company, as
a brand, to have the science backing up
some of the anecdotal evidence that we've seen
over the years and witnessed over the years
with dogs improving various health conditions and hypoallergenic
conditions.
So, it's a terrific opportunity for us, and
it's really validating and helping us really explain,
(05:43):
from a scientific perspective, things that we have
known and have witnessed and watched happen, but
not really to see these biomarkers coming in
favourably and presented in such an organised, well
-done study.
So, again, when we started this 20 years
ago, in 2005, it was more on hunch
and intuition that this might be a viable
(06:04):
option for dogs, a plant-based option for
canine health.
And so, it's really exciting for us to
see it come full circle and be here
today.
Well, I could tell you that this little
girl, Wednesday, loves her V-Dog.
I'm not doing a commercial for V-Dog.
They just happen to love V-Dog and
eat all the treats and the kibble.
(06:24):
But I'm wondering, in terms of nationally, let's
not even do global, nationally, is the vegan
dog food space growing, or is it something
that is just really extraordinarily rare?
I'll go ahead and step in on that.
What we find happening is awareness is growing.
(06:45):
It's also a trickle-down effect from the
greater plant-based movement on the human product
side and the shift towards plant-based thinking
in terms of the environmental impacts of our
dietary choices.
And that can be extended to your dogs
and canine companions.
So, we're excited to have, again, as an
option.
(07:05):
Some dogs may do better on different formulas
and different types of diets, but we are
finding terrific success with the dogs that are
on our plant-based formulas.
And so, let me ask you a follow
-up.
Is it growing?
Is your company growing?
We are growing.
We're excited to still be here.
(07:26):
COVID was a challenging time period from a
supply chain perspective.
And I know some of the other plant
-based pet food companies globally and in the
U.S. have taken a difficult turn during
those times.
And so, it's made it challenging in the
big scheme of things.
And I won't get too political here.
There are, you know, most of the dog
food companies are owned by very large corporations,
(07:48):
conglomerate-type products that are, you know, largely
or entirely meat-based.
And some of them do have plant-based
spin-offs, which are competitors with us.
So, because of their large volumes and their
supply chain connections and manufacturing connections in the
big food of pet world, pet production, pet
manufacturing, it makes it very challenging for smaller
players to be able to realise margins that
(08:11):
are sustainable in the market.
But we have, over the 20 years, we
have developed some very interesting and important pet
food industry connections, which are allowing us to
open doors and allowing us to access supply
chain and manufacturing opportunities that we otherwise had
not access to in the past.
And so, we're excited about 2025 and some
(08:32):
of our new product pipeline products coming out.
Well, I will say that while it's very
easy to get V-Dog products, which I
order on Amazon, to be honest, it's very
hard to find some of the other products
of like wet dog food.
When I ran out, literally, I was like,
(08:52):
where in Southern California can I get this
vegan wet dog food?
And so, it's a real challenge distribution.
I think V-Dog is doing a great
job getting out there and making it very
accessible, not just your kibble, but also all
of your treats.
So, I want to give you a shout
out for that.
Just as a dog parent, dog guardian of
(09:12):
two vegan dogs, it's pretty easy to get
your products.
So, check it out.
Now, what I thought was really interesting about
this entire subject is that at its core
was kind of an observation that Dr. Tona
made and it was just something like, isn't
this interesting?
And it turned out to spawn this entire
(09:35):
study and the possibility of a new industry
that is a heck of a lot more
sustainable and more compassionate.
I have travelled to some developing countries in
Africa, Asia, and Latin America, and I was
surprised that in some of these countries, dogs
don't even eat meat or dairy because they
don't have the money and the dogs are
(09:56):
perfectly fine.
They're healthy.
So, we wanted to answer the very basic
question.
What happens when you take a clinically healthy
dog and you feed that dog a vegan
diet?
All right.
Well, we found out Dr. Anika Linde is
also a veterinarian who was involved in this
study.
Thank you so much for joining us.
(10:17):
First of all, let's talk about the myth
and the constant drumbeat that we all get
that dogs need meat.
I mean, it seems like every time a
commercial about dog food comes up, that's what
they're hammering home, but is it true?
(10:38):
So, again, thank you.
It's a great question, Jane.
So, I think it shows the power that
marketing has, right?
And we all know that you're being told
a lot when it comes to the commercial
space and we need this, we need that,
and you saw it with people as well,
with the whole campaigns with milk as well,
and we know that couldn't be further from
(10:59):
the truth.
So, dogs need specific nutrients.
They don't need specific ingredients, and I think
that's the best way of really putting it.
So, as long as you have, as we
have already indicated with the study, as we
have said several times in this conversation and
prior conversations, it's really about having nutritionally complete
type of nutritional framework.
(11:21):
So, it is not about having the specific
ingredients in it.
So, dogs can most certainly thrive without consuming
animal-derived products.
That's a very long story short.
So, and that's what we showed with this
study and further studies to come as well
as we're moving forward.
(11:42):
Well, Dr. Linda, tell us a little bit
more about how the study was conducted.
How many dogs?
We know that it was V-dog.
Was it just kibble?
You know, just give us the details on
this study.
Sure.
The very, very brief version that we had
here is that dogs, they served effectively as
their own control.
So, you had, again, clinically healthy domestic companion
(12:05):
dogs, as we're seeing in this short film,
and we're seeing the scenes right now.
So, these dogs living in typical average households
and being fed from the prior diet, which
had been meat-based and then being switched
onto a plant-based, complete, nutritionally complete kibble,
(12:27):
the plant-based formula that we already discussed.
And we have in the study, of course,
indicated the nutritional profile as well, making sure
that it was nutritionally complete.
We had that conducted by a third-party
laboratory to make sure that what you see
on the bag is actually what is in
(12:47):
the food.
So, for this particular study that we have
referenced, we have a kibble.
We have other studies ongoing that have been
both in the past and in parallel as
well moving forward.
Of course, the interest is what about if
we're moving towards the wet food type of
plant-based nutrition.
(13:09):
So, there's a lot of work that still
needs to be done.
And again, as we very well know, all
of this clinical research, it requires a significant
type of research support.
So, that is ultimately the, you could say,
limitation as we're moving forward.
(13:29):
Well, there's a Western University where the study
was conducted.
Very fascinating.
I want to get into the nitty-gritty
because it really, to me, boils down what
types of vegetables can dogs eat.
I recently found out, for example, my Wednesday,
who you just saw, is allergic to apples.
(13:51):
She was scratching like crazy.
I had a test done, and then I
found that, oh, some of the stuff I
was feeding her had apples in it.
I removed that, and she stopped scratching.
So, Dr. Malgorejo, can you break down the
actual products that were fed, the actual ingredients,
and weigh in on what types of vegetables
(14:14):
are good for dogs?
Well, that's a very interesting question and a
very broad question.
What I can tell you is what is
not good for dogs.
Because every time I travel, and I have
been very fortunate to travel in more than
40 different countries, the legumes are different, the
fruits are different, the grains, et cetera, the
(14:37):
cereal is different, and all dogs tend to
live a healthy life.
So, when you're talking about dogs, I think
one thing that you need to avoid is,
for example, grapes, raisins, anything in that family
is toxic for dogs.
And onion, garlic is borderline.
(14:58):
These things are to be avoided.
And then you are going, after that, to
an area that is huge, and it's very
dog-dependent that is called idiosyncrasy.
Your dog was allergic to apples.
I have seen dogs in Italy, in Uruguay,
that they eat apples like there's no tomorrow,
(15:18):
and they're perfectly fine.
So, I think you need to be very
observant with what you give to your dog.
But that is going to be variable as
humans.
I may be allergic to peanuts, or some
people may not.
So, I think it's avoiding the foods that
(15:39):
we know that they are toxic, rather than
recommending something.
I'm going to give you an anecdote.
When I was in Indonesia, I was working
with Komodo Dragons, and I stopped by in
one of the cities in Indonesia, and then
(15:59):
I talked to a breeder, and he had
beautiful, beautiful dogs, and showed dogs.
And he told me, the only thing I
feed my dog is dried alfalfa that is
pretty much chopped to little tiny pieces, and
boiled lentils and potatoes.
That's it.
(16:19):
From pregnant dogs, to puppies, to elderly dogs.
That was an anecdote, but I'm just going
to tell you how variable is the diets
around the world.
So, I think in the time that we
have, this is as much as I can
tell you, Jane.
One thing that is important is that people
(16:40):
say, yes, but vegan diets, they don't have
L-carnitine.
They don't have taurine, and they don't have
the meat.
And that is really misinformation.
All meat-based diets that are commercially available
in the Western world, they are supplemented with
L-carnitine and taurine, because the amount of
(17:00):
carnitine and taurine, it's very variable.
It's impossible to know.
So, other companies that use meat-based diets,
they supplement L-carnitine and taurine.
Well, the vegan industry, they supplement L-carnitine
and taurine, and they are synthetic molecules that
are actually added to that.
So, when people think about meat-based, they
(17:21):
think about a big steak.
And the truth is that it's meat meals.
And meat meals is everything that humans don't
consume.
Tendons and viscera and all these things, they
actually process that, and they make it a
meal.
They put some colourants, flavour enhancers, and that's
the meat.
So, of course not.
We need to make sure that it's a
(17:43):
well-balanced diet.
The carnitine and the taurine is important, but
the other vitamins and minerals that they need
to be present too.
And I'd like to introduce you to another
vegan dog.
This is Sunday.
And guess what?
Not only does she like the vegan kibble,
but she has gotten halfway through.
You can recognise this, right, Darren?
(18:03):
Yeah.
These are the V-dog.
What are the official names of these?
Breastbones.
They're a dental housing dog.
And these are the chewies that she just
absolutely loves.
But you raise a very important question, Dr.
Tona, with people constantly going on and on
about dogs needing meat.
(18:25):
They're carnivores.
A, that's not true, as your study proved.
But B, they do not talk about the
health problems created by eating meat.
So let's play a clip from the film
and discuss that on the other side.
We are seeing dogs with similar health problems
as people have on a diet that is
(18:47):
heavy on animal products, like obesity and certain
cancers.
There are many toxins that can affect the
meat that's used to make dog food.
So if we were to look at substances
like lead, from decades of automotive exhaust that
have polluted the ground near highways and roads,
(19:09):
most of that partitions into organs like the
liver.
And for pet food in particular, we often
use those organ meats as part of the
food that we're putting together for them.
And once again, what you're watching is a
clip from the film, Can Dogs Thrive on
(19:30):
a Plant-Based Diet?
It is streaming on Unchained TV, which is
right behind me, or you can also watch
it on your phone.
In fact, you can download Unchained TV for
free.
Just go to your app store and download
it, and you can have access to that
film immediately, as well as the video that
we're conducting right now.
(19:52):
So break it down, Dr. Linda, a little
bit more in terms of the health problems
that can be caused by dogs eating a
meat-centric diet.
Yeah, I think that's another great and important
question, Jane.
(20:12):
So I think what you, in a short
period of time, probably benefit the most from
is really thinking about the pattern and the
distribution of diseases and what we're seeing of
diseases in the clinical space compared to what
was known years ago.
And I think if you are thinking about
(20:33):
companion dogs, and you're thinking about how much
of parallels you can see between the disease
burden in people and what you're seeing in
dogs, of course, there are some important differences
with regard to cardiovascular health.
But nevertheless, if you're looking at major burdens
of diseases, and you're thinking about what we
saw in the short film as well.
(20:55):
So the obesity epidemic, for sure, we're seeing
with our domestic dogs.
We see some of the same endocrinopathy.
So we're seeing some of the same similar
types of cancers as well.
So we are seeing burdens of diseases that,
for sure, is reflected in the fact that
(21:18):
you have a nutritional framework or dietary frameworks
that just look very different than in the
past.
You're seeing dogs that are not kept at
healthy weight.
You're seeing dogs that, as Dr. Maldonado was
pointing out, and maybe he wants to comment
on further, but that they are consuming these
meat-based ingredients, animal-derived ingredients that are
(21:40):
very far from being healthy and certainly not
promoting a situation where dogs can thrive.
And once you subtract those, and you are
focussing on types of diets that are plant
-based, and they are nutritionally complete for dogs,
then you just have a much better situation.
(22:03):
And you can have a number of different
benefits, both with regard to physical health and
realistically forthcoming studies as we're moving forward.
Again, we need to have all of this
being evidence-based.
So in, you can say, sort of a
larger framework, you really want to also study
(22:23):
these types of diets in comparison for various
types of diseases to really get more specific
data.
But that's a summary.
Now having two vegan dogs, and sometimes they
do have to go to the vet for
whatever reason, even if it's to have their
nails clipped, the veterinarians are often very hostile
(22:44):
or eye-rolling when it comes to my
explanation of my dogs are vegan.
Not always, but it happens.
Where are we in the veterinarian community with
this issue?
Are you getting pushback?
Because first of all, I want to point
out, and this is really important, is this
(23:04):
just wasn't some study that they did off
the top of their heads.
And it has been published in a respected
journal, and you can go and read it.
PLOS One.
I Googled it.
The report came right up, and I didn't
include it because it's a very long link,
but you can just Google PLOS One, plus
(23:25):
one, vegan dog food study.
It comes right up, and it says right
in the headline, domestic dogs maintain clinical, nutritional,
and haematological health outcomes when fed a commercial
plant-based diet for a year.
And you can see Dr. Tona Malgarejo and
Dr. Annika Linda's names in there.
So that gives it credibility.
It's not just two veterinarians saying that this
(23:47):
was a study, an official study done and
published in a respected journal.
That means a lot.
Are you taking this message to other veterinarians,
Dr. Tona?
Of course we are, but it's very important
what you said, Jane, and I am known
to be very clear and transparent, and I
(24:08):
can tell you this study was pretty much
a miracle to finish it.
It was right in the middle of COVID,
and what was very concerning but expected is
that the former administration from my university told
me to stop the study.
One of the administrators told me, you're putting
me in a bad spot.
(24:29):
We get funding from these meat-based companies,
and what you're doing is not good.
Dogs are carnivores, and he wants me to
stop.
Of course, I am a tenured professor, and
I said, this is science, and you're not
going to dictate what to tell, what to
do.
So I continue, and we were punished in
different ways, but we continue, and we finish
(24:51):
the study.
The situation is that probably the majority, 90
plus percent of veterinarians are not aware that
the dog is one of the greatest omnivore
species on earth, and they are just repeating
things that they have heard.
But there are papers published by universities as
(25:12):
reputable as Harvard, MIT, Stanford, where they actually
show that the dog is an omnivore, and
they present cellular and molecular evidence that actually
the dogs pleaded almost 30,000 years ago
from the wolf, and dogs are incredible digesters
of carbohydrates, and the wolves are not.
(25:33):
So it is really a big push, and
it's a big push when we go to
conferences, when we talk to people, but as
I told my students, the way that you
need to deal with that is evidence.
We have the paper, read the paper, and
present the evidence that what I did is
wrong.
This kind of science is difficult, Jane, because
(25:54):
it's extremely expensive.
One of the comments from people that are
not very well versed in clinical research is,
it's a small study.
You know, every time we take a sample
and we analyse absolutely everything that we need
to analyse to make sure that the dog
is healthy, it costs us about $1,500
a sample.
(26:15):
So just multiply the number of samples, the
number of dogs.
This very small study was in the round
of $250,000, $300,000.
So it is easy to move forward to
that.
So we are asking the community to keep
helping us.
We didn't take a penny from the company
that we used the food for, because that's
(26:38):
a conflict of interest.
And when we got the results as an
academician, you need to have the freedom to
say this is the way it is.
We present bad data, wrong data, good data.
Fortunately, it was good data, but we are
here to make science, not to please corporates
to say, okay, you can sponsor us.
(27:00):
So even to the company that we use,
we paid every single pound of food because
we didn't want to receive a penny because,
oh, you're working for this, you're working for
that.
So right now there are studies in puppies.
We are doing studies in the blue zones
with different dogs and longevity, and these studies
are very expensive.
(27:20):
So we are asking you through your amazing
community to please help us because the federal
government is not going to give us money.
The big companies that are billion dollar companies,
they will never give us money.
State money is never going to come to
us.
So this study was done thanks to people
like you that I remember you donated some
(27:44):
money and amazing people in Los Angeles, people
overseas, they came together and they in crowd
funding, they were able to actually do that.
But the studies that are coming are more
expensive, half a million, a million dollars.
So if we want to advance this, it
is imperative that the community gets involved.
We don't take a penny from any company
(28:06):
and we are not going to be told
what to do at the university because this
is where knowledge is born.
If we don't create this knowledge, no one
in the world is going to do it.
So we need your help.
Well, Dr. Tona, and that's I call you,
Dr. Tona Malgarejo, Dr. Malgarejo.
(28:26):
I know that this took a long time
and I was there at the beginning when
you were just having Zoom meetings with people
saying, hey, we want to fund this study.
And of course, given that American dogs and
cats would be the fifth largest meat eating
country in the world if they were their
own country, of course I said, yes, I
would like to help my own little way
(28:46):
and introduce you to people who could help
in a bigger way because we need this
information.
We are countering a basically global, but particularly
American misinformation campaign, both in human food and
in dog food about the necessity of meat.
Now, I've been vegan 29 years.
(29:06):
Prior to that, I was vegetarian.
People are always telling me, you've got too
much energy.
Bring it down, bring it down.
Madam, the clients at the next table at
the restaurant are complaining, too much energy.
So I know that humans could thrive on
a vegan diet.
My dogs are also some of the most
(29:27):
energetic dogs in the neighbourhood.
They're on a vegan diet.
But yet when I run into people, not
just the veterinarians, but sometimes I'm walking on
the street and some other neighbour, well-meaning
with a dog says, oh, can they have
a treat?
No, they're vegan dogs.
And they kind of look at me like,
hmm, huh.
They give me this sideways look.
(29:50):
How do we counteract that?
Because they're brainwashed and they're brainwashed by people
who are making a lot of money off
of a system that is killing the planet,
not helping animals.
And let's not forget the animals who are
killed to be fed to the dogs.
They're cows, they're pigs, they're lambs.
(30:11):
They're just like our dogs and cats.
Let's not leave them out of the equation,
Dr. Linda.
Yeah, it's an important conversation.
And I think education and leading by example
are two things.
But as you're saying, money is driving much
of this.
And you mentioned earlier, the marketing efforts, the
(30:31):
campaign.
So again, more research for sure to show
that this is evidence-based.
That's one aspect.
As we all do, advocating, working in this
space, leading by example, and education being a
very big part of the equation as well.
So we work, we're fortunate to be in
(30:53):
a space at a health science university.
And we work also in interprofessional settings.
And having conversations with future healthcare providers from
the different health professions is a very important
part of that equation.
And of course, moving outside of the usual
comfort zone of where you have most clinician
(31:16):
scientists.
So in addition to the peer reviewed papers,
but also having conversations through media as we're
doing today, the short documentary is incredibly important.
And we're very, very grateful to the Oceanic
Preservation Society and all the team members, as
you also mentioned previously.
So really the outreach, the education, and also
(31:39):
what you might label as edutainment.
So you keep spreading that very, very important
message.
A lot of people just simply don't know
how much is sort of going on, if
you will, behind closed doors in the industrialised
food animal production system.
So really having conversations.
(31:59):
And I think that's why we need to
be sort of investing energy and time.
And a lot of the drumbeat of your
dogs have to eat meat is that, oh,
they have to get this vitamin that's only
available in meat supposedly, or that vitamin that's
only available in meat supposedly.
(32:21):
The film, which is streaming on Unchained TV,
Can Dogs Thrive on a Plant-Based Diet,
really breaks that down and shows that that
is just a complete myth, that plant-based
ingredients have all the vitamins necessary.
Listen.
We collected more than 3,000 parameters in
one year from these dogs.
(32:41):
For example, vitamin D, it's very important for
bone metabolism and also for immunity.
The vitamin D in seven out of these
15 dogs was insufficient.
At the end of the year, all of
them, they were within normal limits.
The vitamin D concentration that they were able
(33:03):
to measure in dogs normalised after more time
on a plant-based diet.
That really is contradictory to common thought.
Because the general consensus is that we get
vitamin D almost exclusively from animal products.
So we saw that dogs that were clinically
healthy maintained health, but looking deeper into these
(33:27):
biomarkers, they were healthier.
Wow.
So that is exciting.
As the parent guardian of two vegan dogs,
it's great to hear that.
But again, I'm so glad you had your
study and that I can point to that
study because there is this myth and fear
of, oh no, you can't do that.
(33:49):
In fact, some people will accuse you of
abusing your dogs if you had them on
a vegan diet.
What are the best arguments, Dr. Mel Garejo,
for counteracting this irrational, just myth-based fear?
Because the more I think about it and
(34:10):
think about the history of dogs, dogs were
one of the first signs of civilisation amongst
humans.
The pack would be around the humans gathered
and they would eat whatever scraps.
Those scraps could be anything.
They ate to survive.
(34:31):
So it wasn't like they were being fed
meat dog food from the beginning.
They clearly were eating opportunistically what would fall
to the ground or what they could get.
Before I try to answer that, Jane, I
like to just make a quick comment about
(34:53):
your question is how can we actually promote
and educate people?
I can tell you the PLOS ONE paper
was published last year in April and I
got good comments, congratulations from some people.
Some companies called me, they wanted to interview,
etc.
But I mean, we have about 5,000
views on the PLOS ONE paper in the
(35:17):
first few months.
So that's the way you make science.
As long as we have only the paper,
everything was just as expected.
As soon as the short documentary came, it
was booming because suddenly it was not just
Dr. Lina and Dr. Mugarejo and the PLOS
paper, it's like they are in Netflix.
(35:39):
That means like a streaming platform gave us
the credibility and the reputation.
So for the general public, I think it's
important to create these documentaries.
And we are actually working really hard to
combine those because now we have seen the
power of filming.
(36:01):
So we are trying to do excellent science.
We would like to publish our results, but
also every time we go, we just went
to Sardinia last summer to look into the
longevity in these blue zones, what happens with
dogs that live with these centenarians.
And we are looking into that.
And there's beautiful opportunities to actually do a
documentary.
So can you imagine if we can publish
(36:23):
a paper about the blue zones, dogs living
longer, healthier?
We have the papers, but also, and more
importantly, we have the documentary so the general
public can understand that.
We have discovered the power of that and
we would like to do it.
Of course, doing a film is expensive and
that's why we need your support.
(36:43):
The question that you're asking me when I'm
in an aeroplane or when I'm talking to
people, that they said, yeah, but dogs need
meat because the protein and everything.
The question is, so can you tell me
what protein is?
They don't know.
They're just like parrots saying, oh, protein, protein,
protein.
Oh, but the amino acid, the L-carnitine.
(37:04):
Okay.
Can you tell me, explain to me please
what is the L-carnitine?
They don't really know.
So they just take it back.
But that I have seen that with a
very short documentary of less than 10 minutes,
it gives you the credibility and also open
a door so they can listen.
We have former students that are part of
the paper and they have very busy clinics.
(37:26):
And just as soon as they were featured
in the paper and in the documentary, all
the clients is like, okay, I like to
go a vegan doctor.
And it was not the paper.
It was not that.
It was the power of social media.
So we need to do a combination nowadays
between people like you, really great, entertained, scientifically
(37:49):
based documentaries and publishing.
So we inform our new generations that dogs
are omnivores, not carnivores.
And your film is so powerful.
It's only seven minutes, guys.
You can watch it like this.
It's so entertaining.
You've seen some clips.
Let's play another clip that really shows, of
(38:09):
course, meat is connected with muscle in the
mind, but we all know the vegan bodybuilders.
I know several, they're ripped beyond belief on
plants.
Kale, for example, has more protein calorie per
calorie than steak.
Let's take another look at a clip from
this incredible mini doc that is streaming on
(38:30):
about that.
The athletic performance that a lot of these
animals can end up with is super high.
And you would not expect that out of
a vegan diet.
We often think of vegan diets as like
these kind of lean, not muscle building kind
of diets.
And these dogs get beefy.
They're strong.
They're healthy, but they're not overweight.
(38:50):
The data is so clear when it comes
to diet and dogs and you need to
present solid cold data.
That's the only way to move this forward.
We are happy to say that the results
of our one year clinical study on plant
-based nutrition in dogs have been published with
open access for everyone.
(39:12):
Yes.
Don't take their word for it.
Go and Google the study plus one and
vegan dog food, and it will pop right
up.
Now, this is my vegan dog Sunday.
I have two vegan dogs and she is
super, super, I would say muscular.
(39:32):
She's muscular and she runs like crazy and
fetches.
That's her whole thing.
She's not a couch potato.
So it's really important to point out that
if the proof's in the pudding, okay, the
proof's in the pudding.
And Sunday here is a very athletic dog
(39:53):
on a 100% plant-based diet.
But I've got to ask you a question.
Okay.
There have been occasions where due to a
babysitter or whatever, she's gotten access to meat.
Like somebody giving her a treat before I
could stop them that has meat.
(40:14):
And I noticed that once they taste that,
it takes a couple of days for them
to, or for her specifically to want to
get back into the vegan food.
Can you discuss that Dr. Linda?
Like, I think that it's kind of, there's
a bit of an addictive component there.
We've got to address that.
(40:37):
Yeah.
I think it's, you said the word right
already.
You say there's individual variations.
So for some dogs, that's going to be
not really much.
They blink and they happily eat the usual
food the day after.
Some dogs might actually have a really bad
episode, maybe some GI upset after getting very,
(41:02):
for them, unusual, atypical type of ingredients, like
someone giving them something meat-based.
And then as you described with Sunday, that
there might be those dogs that have more
maybe of addiction to certain tastes from whatever
those ingredients are in those products.
So you will have a variation.
(41:23):
I think we do know that if it
is products that contain some of these more
addictive properties, and I think what comes to
mind immediately on sort of the human side
is what we know about cheese and anything
that has these casomorphins, these addictive properties.
So I would say probably if you ask
(41:44):
me to guess sort of across most domestic
dogs, they probably will be happy to go
back to the food that they are used
to eating.
And then yes, you will have those cases
like with what you described, and she is
a little bit hesitant perhaps the following day.
So that's what I would attribute to some
individual variations, some preferences.
(42:07):
But again, as you also described, she's very,
very happy on a daily basis eating the
type of nutrition that you're feeding to her.
And I am guessing that there's some variation
in that.
So we had the conversation earlier about what
type of foods to avoid with dogs.
And again, the individual variation of what different
(42:28):
dogs enjoy eating.
Oh, thank you so much for that, Dr.
Linda.
I feel like I'm getting a consultation with
a vet today for myself.
Yeah, I do everything I can to make
sure they get no exposure to meat at
all.
And if somebody tries to give them a
treat, I just say, no, thank you.
(42:48):
My dogs are vegan.
And hopefully that will also register in there.
They see that my dogs are healthy.
And again, we're not talking about the massive
numbers of animals who are just like our
dogs and cats who are killed to be
put in dog food cans to be fed
to dogs when it doesn't even help them.
(43:10):
There's a parallel to what's happening with humans.
We see, you know, horrible health crisis that
has developed in our country with two thirds
of Americans overweight or obese, 43% of
Americans are obese.
And it's a primarily meat and dairy laden
fast food diet that's responsible.
(43:32):
So let me try to go out to
Darren.
Darren, why are you doing this?
Why is this important for you to do?
Well, it's an extension again, to your point,
Jane, of our lifestyle.
And I think our team, our family, our
community choosing a plant-based diet for the
(43:52):
various reasons of adopting plant based for the
environment, for animals, for human health, our own
health, and connecting those pillars of veganism and
extending that to our canine companions, which we
now have even further evidence with the study
to demonstrate the efficacy of plant-based nutrition
for canine health.
And so it's really a coming full circle
(44:15):
for us.
And our goal and our mission as a
company, as a team and as a family
is to continue to innovate and work with
folks, both on the pet food nutrition side
of things, as well as Dr. Medarato and
Dr. Linde on the academic side and connecting
those two different science groups together to bring
novel plant-based ingredients to the pet food
(44:37):
industry and continue to innovate and develop nutritious,
nutritiously balanced products for dogs.
Uh, what I would like to see is
a topper, a topper with, has gravy.
That would be something I would really like
to see because sometimes, uh, it's, it's just,
(44:58):
they're just like people, you know, I don't
want to just eat a slab of tofu.
I'd like to have a little spices and
hot sauce or whatever it is that I,
as a human being want, well, the dogs
are the same way.
So I think we can make, we could
make vegan dog food more attractive.
And I know you're working on that, uh,
V-Dog and very excited to see what
comes down the pike, uh, in terms of,
(45:20):
uh, vegan dog food products.
We know we have a lot of treats,
uh, during this show, I was tempted to
jump to my kitchen and grab some of
those treats to show everybody.
But, uh, I will do that actually, because
I think it's important to, for, for, uh,
people to see.
So Dr. Mel Garejo, will you, for a
(45:42):
minute, take us through how this study was
conducted?
Because when people think of studies involving animals,
they think of animals in cages, animals being
tortured in laboratories, which of course we are
all against.
All we do is work on freeing animals
from laboratories.
Um, can you describe how these dogs were
(46:04):
treated during this study and how long the
study went on?
Of course, um, as you pointed, these are
client owned dogs.
Um, so they were dogs, uh, from students,
staff, and faculty here at Western University.
And there's a big challenge, uh, working with
(46:26):
client owned dogs, because, um, pretty much the
only thing that, the only thing that we
did, uh, the study was the sign that
they needed to be between one year and
10 years of age.
And they needed to be on a meat
based diet, kibble, uh, most of them, um,
uh, for at least one year.
(46:48):
And then we transition, uh, these 15, uh,
dogs, females and males in one week to
a big, uh, uh, a vegan diet.
And then we follow them for a year.
So right there when people say, oh, it's
a, it's a small study.
It's a short study.
Let me just tell you something.
Uh, one year of a dog, it's very
(47:10):
difficult.
There's not a number, but it's equal to
six to eight years on humans.
So if it's like, uh, in this group,
I said, okay, Darren, Anika, uh, Jane and
other people, we are going to put you
on a diet for seven years.
You tell me if that is a short
study, seven years of a human with the
(47:33):
same diet, follow you and then measure more
than 3000 parameters.
That is the significance of this study is
not just a study.
Yeah.
The number of dogs, there were 15 dogs,
but none of them actually show a clinical
science.
And a lot of the dogs and the,
the guardians call me and said, Dr. Mel
(47:53):
Garejo, my dog is smiling.
I didn't know that my dog smiled.
Dr. Mel Garejo, my dog is really full
of energy.
My dog is happy.
My dog is less aggressive.
And you know why?
Because there's now a area that we didn't
know a 10 years ago that is called
the God brain axis.
(48:15):
What you eat is not just what you
are, but it's the way, how you think.
So, and we saw, and we didn't comment
on, on this documentary that actually, or dogs
on a plant-based diet, the tryptophan, one
of the amino acids that are key for
happiness.
They just went all the way up, even
(48:36):
above normal levels.
And the tryptophan is probably the molecule of
the serotonin.
And the serotonin is the molecule that promotes
calmness and happiness.
So this was a very interesting study because
it was 50, 15 dogs, but the time
it was a year and every three months,
(48:57):
we checked the dogs every three months.
And every month we called the guardians and
how is the dog doing?
How are the faeces urinating?
And we check absolutely everything.
We have still data, mega data on the
microbiome, faecal microbiome, urine microbiome, the things that
are going to come later, we hope in,
(49:18):
in publications.
But this was a very interesting study.
I give credit to Dr. Lina because she
designed the study together with a biostatistician from
UC Berkeley.
They were extremely meticulous and strict about what
are we going to do, how we're going
(49:38):
to publish and what statistics techniques are going
to use to prove that even with 15
dogs, this is highly significant.
And I've been doing my own study here
with my little Wednesday.
Okay.
So I want to show you some of
the V-Dog products.
This they go crazy for.
(49:58):
This is like, well, it's equivalent to me
having a chocolate eclair maybe, but a lot
healthier.
So you see this little face.
She loves this.
This is her treat.
Yes, yes, yes.
There's a little Wednesday.
And then this one I just give to
Sunday.
I believe this is when it has a
(50:19):
little apple in it.
And I give this one to Sunday.
She goes crazy for it.
And then we have the breath bone that
they both love.
And those are the dog shoes that I
showed you that they, they love, and they
love that chewy sensation.
And then I keep the kibble.
(50:39):
Hold on a little girl.
I keep the kibble in this, and this
is the kibble.
And I have a little scooper and I
scoop it out.
And that's, that's like a lot of their
diet.
They also have wet food and I also
make them carrots, corn, and potatoes in a
little mix, sometimes with seitan.
(51:01):
So let me try to go back to
Darren and see Darren, what other products are,
can we expect from you in the, in
the future?
Well, thank you, Jane.
Yeah.
We're excited about our current products as well
as some new products in the product pipeline
and with Dr. Gregg on our nutrition side
(51:21):
of things and product development side.
And toppers is on our radar, different versions
of toppers, as well as prebiotic and probiotic
treats and other functional ingredient-based treats.
And on the food side, we are looking
at a couple of different opportunities moving into
a fresh concept that could also double as
(51:43):
a topper.
So again, these are all in the pipeline
and we're working on them currently.
We are, we're a small, you know, family
-owned and operated entity.
So we have to manage our budget carefully
and move cautiously, but we're excited because we
have some great potential opportunities and partnerships in
2025 to launch some new products.
(52:05):
Well, I, again, I want to give you
compliments on making your products very easy to
get.
I order them, they're here the next day
and they love them.
They just absolutely love all the different products.
I think for this little one, she just
goes so crazy over the wiggle biscuits.
(52:25):
The wiggle biscuits are really what, what rocks
her boat.
But let's just have final thoughts, 30 seconds
each.
We're out of time.
Dr. Linda, what's your message?
I think the very short message here is
that we have shown with the study that
(52:46):
this is definitely an option for dogs.
It allows dogs to thrive.
There's no need to be worried about it.
This is nutritionally complete.
So thumbs up and think about us as
we talked about all the important social implications,
ethical implications.
Dr. Tona.
(53:07):
Well, science is built by bricks and we
just put the first brick of a beautiful
castle and we cannot stop now.
One paper doesn't mean very much in the
scientific community.
We need to keep promoting through different documentaries
and we need to produce a lot of
bricks and we need to do it in
(53:28):
a scientifically manner and we need funding to
do that.
As I said, there is no one supporting
us but amazing philanthropists that actually believe in
a better world, planetary health, human health, and
the health of our amazing, beautiful friends.
Well, for us, for Wednesday, Sunday and myself,
(53:50):
I could say that we look forward to
having you come back when you have your
next GoFundMe for your next study.
Nothing would make me happier than to be
a part of that, to donate, to promote
anything we can do.
I want to do because, wow, the clock's
ticking.
We haven't even gotten to the environmental damage
(54:12):
that meat causes.
You're my heroes.
All three of you are my heroes.
I want to thank you so much for
watching Unshained TV.
For those of you who are watching or
listening, go to Unshained TV and watch the
documentary.
It's right there in the featured section.
And as always, what I would suggest is
(54:35):
support Unshained TV.
You can download it.
It's the world's only vegan streaming television network.
So it's a vegan network.
Okay.
That's the craziest thing I've ever heard.
I love Unshained TV.
Unshained.
Unshained TV.
Your life will change.
It's just that easy.
Unshained TV has all sorts of content for
(54:55):
everybody.
Unshained TV changed my life.
Unshained TV is crushing it.
I love Unshained TV.
Unshained TV is my go-to.
Unshained TV.
Who knew?
Unshained, baby.
In the form of a brand new study
that has just come out, and you are
actually going to meet the people who did
the study, the two veterinarians, as well as
the head of V-Dog, which was the
dog food used in the study.
So this question, can dogs thrive on a
(00:20):
plant-based diet?
Unchained TV is streaming the hit new movie,
By That Name, where you will find the
answer, you've got to check it out.
Now, here's why it's important.
If all dogs and cats in the U
.S. populated their own country, they'd be the
fifth largest meat-eating country in the world.
And now our pets are suffering some of
the same diet-related ailments their human companions
(00:41):
experience.
Well, now we're going to get the lowdown
from Darren Middlesworth, the head of V-Dog,
which is the vegan dog food that was
used in the study, featured in this short
film.
Plus, you're going to meet two veterinarians who
actually ran the study, Dr. Tona Melgarejo and
Dr. Anika Linda.
Produced in conjunction with the Oceananic Preservation Society,
(01:03):
this movie is directed by Luis Sai Hoyos,
who is famous for bringing us The Cove,
Racing Extinction, The Game Changers, You Are What
You Eat, A Twin Experiment, and other blockbuster
films.
So I am so excited to talk to
the veterinarians who ran the study.
This is information every single dog parent needs
(01:26):
to learn and understand and process.
So without further ado, I would like to
go out to Dr. Tona Melgarejo of Western
University, who led this study.
You're looking at video from the actual mini
-doc about this study.
Tell us, why is this study so very
(01:49):
important to our world, Dr. Tona?
Thank you so much for the invitation, Jane.
When we decided to pursue this study, looked
at the big picture, not just the health
of your friends, your furry friends.
(02:09):
That is very, very important.
But also, we looked at the planetary health.
And when we're looking into that also, the
guardians, and I don't like to say owners,
because we don't own these beautiful souls.
We just guard them.
We just help them to strive.
(02:29):
So we looked at this three-piece equation,
and we decided to actually test something that
it has been going on for decades of
our education.
Dogs are carnivores.
Dogs are carnivores.
And we knew, and I, as an internal
medicine person, I prescribe food as medicine, and
(02:52):
I have seen amazing results.
So this was just to start.
Can dog leaves, clinically healthy dogs live on
a plant-based diet?
And we got our answer.
And the answer is yes.
And that is so important because the truth
is that, as we have mentioned, if U
(03:12):
.S. dogs and cats were their own country,
they would be the fifth largest meat-eating
country in the world.
There's China, there's the United States, there's Russia.
And let's listen to a clip from the
movie that breaks this down.
Absolutely fascinating movie.
And again, you can watch it on Unchained
(03:36):
Television.
It is streaming.
That's Unchained TV right there behind me.
And it's fascinating.
We have about 91 million dogs living in
the United States.
Most of these dogs are eating a meat
-based diet.
The amount of meat that we use for
(03:58):
dogs and cats, it's equivalent to the meat
consumption in the country of Italy.
And if all dogs and cats in the
U.S. had their own country, they would
be the fifth largest meat-eating country in
the world.
Oh, wow.
Well, let me say this.
(04:18):
I was just joined.
Come here, come here, come here.
Guess who decided that she wanted to come
up and be part of this show?
My little dog Wednesday, who is thriving on
a plant-based diet.
And the diet that she is thriving on
is very similar to the diet featured in
(04:39):
the film, V-Dog.
And we are so delighted today to have
the founder and the president of V-Dog
on, Darren Middlesworth, who is seen there with
his mother, Linda, who is really a force
of nature in the vegan movement.
So, Darren, welcome.
Why was it so important to have V
(05:01):
-Dog featured in this study and in this
film?
Thank you so much, Jane, for having me
on.
And also, thank you to Dr. Mel Guarao
and Dr. Linda for allowing V-Dog to
participate in this study in the beginning.
It was something that came about many, many
years ago, and to see it come to
fruition is just really amazing.
(05:21):
It's important for us as a company, as
a brand, to have the science backing up
some of the anecdotal evidence that we've seen
over the years and witnessed over the years
with dogs improving various health conditions and hypoallergenic
conditions.
So, it's a terrific opportunity for us, and
it's really validating and helping us really explain,
(05:43):
from a scientific perspective, things that we have
known and have witnessed and watched happen, but
not really to see these biomarkers coming in
favourably and presented in such an organised, well
-done study.
So, again, when we started this 20 years
ago, in 2005, it was more on hunch
and intuition that this might be a viable
(06:04):
option for dogs, a plant-based option for
canine health.
And so, it's really exciting for us to
see it come full circle and be here
today.
Well, I could tell you that this little
girl, Wednesday, loves her V-Dog.
I'm not doing a commercial for V-Dog.
They just happen to love V-Dog and
eat all the treats and the kibble.
(06:24):
But I'm wondering, in terms of nationally, let's
not even do global, nationally, is the vegan
dog food space growing, or is it something
that is just really extraordinarily rare?
I'll go ahead and step in on that.
What we find happening is awareness is growing.
(06:45):
It's also a trickle-down effect from the
greater plant-based movement on the human product
side and the shift towards plant-based thinking
in terms of the environmental impacts of our
dietary choices.
And that can be extended to your dogs
and canine companions.
So, we're excited to have, again, as an
option.
(07:05):
Some dogs may do better on different formulas
and different types of diets, but we are
finding terrific success with the dogs that are
on our plant-based formulas.
And so, let me ask you a follow
-up.
Is it growing?
Is your company growing?
We are growing.
We're excited to still be here.
(07:26):
COVID was a challenging time period from a
supply chain perspective.
And I know some of the other plant
-based pet food companies globally and in the
U.S. have taken a difficult turn during
those times.
And so, it's made it challenging in the
big scheme of things.
And I won't get too political here.
There are, you know, most of the dog
food companies are owned by very large corporations,
(07:48):
conglomerate-type products that are, you know, largely
or entirely meat-based.
And some of them do have plant-based
spin-offs, which are competitors with us.
So, because of their large volumes and their
supply chain connections and manufacturing connections in the
big food of pet world, pet production, pet
manufacturing, it makes it very challenging for smaller
players to be able to realise margins that
(08:11):
are sustainable in the market.
But we have, over the 20 years, we
have developed some very interesting and important pet
food industry connections, which are allowing us to
open doors and allowing us to access supply
chain and manufacturing opportunities that we otherwise had
not access to in the past.
And so, we're excited about 2025 and some
(08:32):
of our new product pipeline products coming out.
Well, I will say that while it's very
easy to get V-Dog products, which I
order on Amazon, to be honest, it's very
hard to find some of the other products
of like wet dog food.
When I ran out, literally, I was like,
(08:52):
where in Southern California can I get this
vegan wet dog food?
And so, it's a real challenge distribution.
I think V-Dog is doing a great
job getting out there and making it very
accessible, not just your kibble, but also all
of your treats.
So, I want to give you a shout
out for that.
Just as a dog parent, dog guardian of
(09:12):
two vegan dogs, it's pretty easy to get
your products.
So, check it out.
Now, what I thought was really interesting about
this entire subject is that at its core
was kind of an observation that Dr. Tona
made and it was just something like, isn't
this interesting?
And it turned out to spawn this entire
(09:35):
study and the possibility of a new industry
that is a heck of a lot more
sustainable and more compassionate.
I have travelled to some developing countries in
Africa, Asia, and Latin America, and I was
surprised that in some of these countries, dogs
don't even eat meat or dairy because they
don't have the money and the dogs are
(09:56):
perfectly fine.
They're healthy.
So, we wanted to answer the very basic
question.
What happens when you take a clinically healthy
dog and you feed that dog a vegan
diet?
All right.
Well, we found out Dr. Anika Linde is
also a veterinarian who was involved in this
study.
Thank you so much for joining us.
(10:17):
First of all, let's talk about the myth
and the constant drumbeat that we all get
that dogs need meat.
I mean, it seems like every time a
commercial about dog food comes up, that's what
they're hammering home, but is it true?
(10:38):
So, again, thank you.
It's a great question, Jane.
So, I think it shows the power that
marketing has, right?
And we all know that you're being told
a lot when it comes to the commercial
space and we need this, we need that,
and you saw it with people as well,
with the whole campaigns with milk as well,
and we know that couldn't be further from
(10:59):
the truth.
So, dogs need specific nutrients.
They don't need specific ingredients, and I think
that's the best way of really putting it.
So, as long as you have, as we
have already indicated with the study, as we
have said several times in this conversation and
prior conversations, it's really about having nutritionally complete
type of nutritional framework.
(11:21):
So, it is not about having the specific
ingredients in it.
So, dogs can most certainly thrive without consuming
animal-derived products.
That's a very long story short.
So, and that's what we showed with this
study and further studies to come as well
as we're moving forward.
(11:42):
Well, Dr. Linda, tell us a little bit
more about how the study was conducted.
How many dogs?
We know that it was V-dog.
Was it just kibble?
You know, just give us the details on
this study.
Sure.
The very, very brief version that we had
here is that dogs, they served effectively as
their own control.
So, you had, again, clinically healthy domestic companion
(12:05):
dogs, as we're seeing in this short film,
and we're seeing the scenes right now.
So, these dogs living in typical average households
and being fed from the prior diet, which
had been meat-based and then being switched
onto a plant-based, complete, nutritionally complete kibble,
(12:27):
the plant-based formula that we already discussed.
And we have in the study, of course,
indicated the nutritional profile as well, making sure
that it was nutritionally complete.
We had that conducted by a third-party
laboratory to make sure that what you see
on the bag is actually what is in
(12:47):
the food.
So, for this particular study that we have
referenced, we have a kibble.
We have other studies ongoing that have been
both in the past and in parallel as
well moving forward.
Of course, the interest is what about if
we're moving towards the wet food type of
plant-based nutrition.
(13:09):
So, there's a lot of work that still
needs to be done.
And again, as we very well know, all
of this clinical research, it requires a significant
type of research support.
So, that is ultimately the, you could say,
limitation as we're moving forward.
(13:29):
Well, there's a Western University where the study
was conducted.
Very fascinating.
I want to get into the nitty-gritty
because it really, to me, boils down what
types of vegetables can dogs eat.
I recently found out, for example, my Wednesday,
who you just saw, is allergic to apples.
(13:51):
She was scratching like crazy.
I had a test done, and then I
found that, oh, some of the stuff I
was feeding her had apples in it.
I removed that, and she stopped scratching.
So, Dr. Malgorejo, can you break down the
actual products that were fed, the actual ingredients,
and weigh in on what types of vegetables
(14:14):
are good for dogs?
Well, that's a very interesting question and a
very broad question.
What I can tell you is what is
not good for dogs.
Because every time I travel, and I have
been very fortunate to travel in more than
40 different countries, the legumes are different, the
fruits are different, the grains, et cetera, the
(14:37):
cereal is different, and all dogs tend to
live a healthy life.
So, when you're talking about dogs, I think
one thing that you need to avoid is,
for example, grapes, raisins, anything in that family
is toxic for dogs.
And onion, garlic is borderline.
(14:58):
These things are to be avoided.
And then you are going, after that, to
an area that is huge, and it's very
dog-dependent that is called idiosyncrasy.
Your dog was allergic to apples.
I have seen dogs in Italy, in Uruguay,
that they eat apples like there's no tomorrow,
(15:18):
and they're perfectly fine.
So, I think you need to be very
observant with what you give to your dog.
But that is going to be variable as
humans.
I may be allergic to peanuts, or some
people may not.
So, I think it's avoiding the foods that
(15:39):
we know that they are toxic, rather than
recommending something.
I'm going to give you an anecdote.
When I was in Indonesia, I was working
with Komodo Dragons, and I stopped by in
one of the cities in Indonesia, and then
(15:59):
I talked to a breeder, and he had
beautiful, beautiful dogs, and showed dogs.
And he told me, the only thing I
feed my dog is dried alfalfa that is
pretty much chopped to little tiny pieces, and
boiled lentils and potatoes.
That's it.
(16:19):
From pregnant dogs, to puppies, to elderly dogs.
That was an anecdote, but I'm just going
to tell you how variable is the diets
around the world.
So, I think in the time that we
have, this is as much as I can
tell you, Jane.
One thing that is important is that people
(16:40):
say, yes, but vegan diets, they don't have
L-carnitine.
They don't have taurine, and they don't have
the meat.
And that is really misinformation.
All meat-based diets that are commercially available
in the Western world, they are supplemented with
L-carnitine and taurine, because the amount of
(17:00):
carnitine and taurine, it's very variable.
It's impossible to know.
So, other companies that use meat-based diets,
they supplement L-carnitine and taurine.
Well, the vegan industry, they supplement L-carnitine
and taurine, and they are synthetic molecules that
are actually added to that.
So, when people think about meat-based, they
(17:21):
think about a big steak.
And the truth is that it's meat meals.
And meat meals is everything that humans don't
consume.
Tendons and viscera and all these things, they
actually process that, and they make it a
meal.
They put some colourants, flavour enhancers, and that's
the meat.
So, of course not.
We need to make sure that it's a
(17:43):
well-balanced diet.
The carnitine and the taurine is important, but
the other vitamins and minerals that they need
to be present too.
And I'd like to introduce you to another
vegan dog.
This is Sunday.
And guess what?
Not only does she like the vegan kibble,
but she has gotten halfway through.
You can recognise this, right, Darren?
(18:03):
Yeah.
These are the V-dog.
What are the official names of these?
Breastbones.
They're a dental housing dog.
And these are the chewies that she just
absolutely loves.
But you raise a very important question, Dr.
Tona, with people constantly going on and on
about dogs needing meat.
(18:25):
They're carnivores.
A, that's not true, as your study proved.
But B, they do not talk about the
health problems created by eating meat.
So let's play a clip from the film
and discuss that on the other side.
We are seeing dogs with similar health problems
as people have on a diet that is
(18:47):
heavy on animal products, like obesity and certain
cancers.
There are many toxins that can affect the
meat that's used to make dog food.
So if we were to look at substances
like lead, from decades of automotive exhaust that
have polluted the ground near highways and roads,
(19:09):
most of that partitions into organs like the
liver.
And for pet food in particular, we often
use those organ meats as part of the
food that we're putting together for them.
And once again, what you're watching is a
clip from the film, Can Dogs Thrive on
(19:30):
a Plant-Based Diet?
It is streaming on Unchained TV, which is
right behind me, or you can also watch
it on your phone.
In fact, you can download Unchained TV for
free.
Just go to your app store and download
it, and you can have access to that
film immediately, as well as the video that
we're conducting right now.
(19:52):
So break it down, Dr. Linda, a little
bit more in terms of the health problems
that can be caused by dogs eating a
meat-centric diet.
Yeah, I think that's another great and important
question, Jane.
(20:12):
So I think what you, in a short
period of time, probably benefit the most from
is really thinking about the pattern and the
distribution of diseases and what we're seeing of
diseases in the clinical space compared to what
was known years ago.
And I think if you are thinking about
(20:33):
companion dogs, and you're thinking about how much
of parallels you can see between the disease
burden in people and what you're seeing in
dogs, of course, there are some important differences
with regard to cardiovascular health.
But nevertheless, if you're looking at major burdens
of diseases, and you're thinking about what we
saw in the short film as well.
(20:55):
So the obesity epidemic, for sure, we're seeing
with our domestic dogs.
We see some of the same endocrinopathy.
So we're seeing some of the same similar
types of cancers as well.
So we are seeing burdens of diseases that,
for sure, is reflected in the fact that
(21:18):
you have a nutritional framework or dietary frameworks
that just look very different than in the
past.
You're seeing dogs that are not kept at
healthy weight.
You're seeing dogs that, as Dr. Maldonado was
pointing out, and maybe he wants to comment
on further, but that they are consuming these
meat-based ingredients, animal-derived ingredients that are
(21:40):
very far from being healthy and certainly not
promoting a situation where dogs can thrive.
And once you subtract those, and you are
focussing on types of diets that are plant
-based, and they are nutritionally complete for dogs,
then you just have a much better situation.
(22:03):
And you can have a number of different
benefits, both with regard to physical health and
realistically forthcoming studies as we're moving forward.
Again, we need to have all of this
being evidence-based.
So in, you can say, sort of a
larger framework, you really want to also study
(22:23):
these types of diets in comparison for various
types of diseases to really get more specific
data.
But that's a summary.
Now having two vegan dogs, and sometimes they
do have to go to the vet for
whatever reason, even if it's to have their
nails clipped, the veterinarians are often very hostile
(22:44):
or eye-rolling when it comes to my
explanation of my dogs are vegan.
Not always, but it happens.
Where are we in the veterinarian community with
this issue?
Are you getting pushback?
Because first of all, I want to point
out, and this is really important, is this
(23:04):
just wasn't some study that they did off
the top of their heads.
And it has been published in a respected
journal, and you can go and read it.
PLOS One.
I Googled it.
The report came right up, and I didn't
include it because it's a very long link,
but you can just Google PLOS One, plus
(23:25):
one, vegan dog food study.
It comes right up, and it says right
in the headline, domestic dogs maintain clinical, nutritional,
and haematological health outcomes when fed a commercial
plant-based diet for a year.
And you can see Dr. Tona Malgarejo and
Dr. Annika Linda's names in there.
So that gives it credibility.
It's not just two veterinarians saying that this
(23:47):
was a study, an official study done and
published in a respected journal.
That means a lot.
Are you taking this message to other veterinarians,
Dr. Tona?
Of course we are, but it's very important
what you said, Jane, and I am known
to be very clear and transparent, and I
(24:08):
can tell you this study was pretty much
a miracle to finish it.
It was right in the middle of COVID,
and what was very concerning but expected is
that the former administration from my university told
me to stop the study.
One of the administrators told me, you're putting
me in a bad spot.
(24:29):
We get funding from these meat-based companies,
and what you're doing is not good.
Dogs are carnivores, and he wants me to
stop.
Of course, I am a tenured professor, and
I said, this is science, and you're not
going to dictate what to tell, what to
do.
So I continue, and we were punished in
different ways, but we continue, and we finish
(24:51):
the study.
The situation is that probably the majority, 90
plus percent of veterinarians are not aware that
the dog is one of the greatest omnivore
species on earth, and they are just repeating
things that they have heard.
But there are papers published by universities as
(25:12):
reputable as Harvard, MIT, Stanford, where they actually
show that the dog is an omnivore, and
they present cellular and molecular evidence that actually
the dogs pleaded almost 30,000 years ago
from the wolf, and dogs are incredible digesters
of carbohydrates, and the wolves are not.
(25:33):
So it is really a big push, and
it's a big push when we go to
conferences, when we talk to people, but as
I told my students, the way that you
need to deal with that is evidence.
We have the paper, read the paper, and
present the evidence that what I did is
wrong.
This kind of science is difficult, Jane, because
(25:54):
it's extremely expensive.
One of the comments from people that are
not very well versed in clinical research is,
it's a small study.
You know, every time we take a sample
and we analyse absolutely everything that we need
to analyse to make sure that the dog
is healthy, it costs us about $1,500
a sample.
(26:15):
So just multiply the number of samples, the
number of dogs.
This very small study was in the round
of $250,000, $300,000.
So it is easy to move forward to
that.
So we are asking the community to keep
helping us.
We didn't take a penny from the company
that we used the food for, because that's
(26:38):
a conflict of interest.
And when we got the results as an
academician, you need to have the freedom to
say this is the way it is.
We present bad data, wrong data, good data.
Fortunately, it was good data, but we are
here to make science, not to please corporates
to say, okay, you can sponsor us.
(27:00):
So even to the company that we use,
we paid every single pound of food because
we didn't want to receive a penny because,
oh, you're working for this, you're working for
that.
So right now there are studies in puppies.
We are doing studies in the blue zones
with different dogs and longevity, and these studies
are very expensive.
(27:20):
So we are asking you through your amazing
community to please help us because the federal
government is not going to give us money.
The big companies that are billion dollar companies,
they will never give us money.
State money is never going to come to
us.
So this study was done thanks to people
like you that I remember you donated some
(27:44):
money and amazing people in Los Angeles, people
overseas, they came together and they in crowd
funding, they were able to actually do that.
But the studies that are coming are more
expensive, half a million, a million dollars.
So if we want to advance this, it
is imperative that the community gets involved.
We don't take a penny from any company
(28:06):
and we are not going to be told
what to do at the university because this
is where knowledge is born.
If we don't create this knowledge, no one
in the world is going to do it.
So we need your help.
Well, Dr. Tona, and that's I call you,
Dr. Tona Malgarejo, Dr. Malgarejo.
(28:26):
I know that this took a long time
and I was there at the beginning when
you were just having Zoom meetings with people
saying, hey, we want to fund this study.
And of course, given that American dogs and
cats would be the fifth largest meat eating
country in the world if they were their
own country, of course I said, yes, I
would like to help my own little way
(28:46):
and introduce you to people who could help
in a bigger way because we need this
information.
We are countering a basically global, but particularly
American misinformation campaign, both in human food and
in dog food about the necessity of meat.
Now, I've been vegan 29 years.
(29:06):
Prior to that, I was vegetarian.
People are always telling me, you've got too
much energy.
Bring it down, bring it down.
Madam, the clients at the next table at
the restaurant are complaining, too much energy.
So I know that humans could thrive on
a vegan diet.
My dogs are also some of the most
(29:27):
energetic dogs in the neighbourhood.
They're on a vegan diet.
But yet when I run into people, not
just the veterinarians, but sometimes I'm walking on
the street and some other neighbour, well-meaning
with a dog says, oh, can they have
a treat?
No, they're vegan dogs.
And they kind of look at me like,
hmm, huh.
They give me this sideways look.
(29:50):
How do we counteract that?
Because they're brainwashed and they're brainwashed by people
who are making a lot of money off
of a system that is killing the planet,
not helping animals.
And let's not forget the animals who are
killed to be fed to the dogs.
They're cows, they're pigs, they're lambs.
(30:11):
They're just like our dogs and cats.
Let's not leave them out of the equation,
Dr. Linda.
Yeah, it's an important conversation.
And I think education and leading by example
are two things.
But as you're saying, money is driving much
of this.
And you mentioned earlier, the marketing efforts, the
(30:31):
campaign.
So again, more research for sure to show
that this is evidence-based.
That's one aspect.
As we all do, advocating, working in this
space, leading by example, and education being a
very big part of the equation as well.
So we work, we're fortunate to be in
(30:53):
a space at a health science university.
And we work also in interprofessional settings.
And having conversations with future healthcare providers from
the different health professions is a very important
part of that equation.
And of course, moving outside of the usual
comfort zone of where you have most clinician
(31:16):
scientists.
So in addition to the peer reviewed papers,
but also having conversations through media as we're
doing today, the short documentary is incredibly important.
And we're very, very grateful to the Oceanic
Preservation Society and all the team members, as
you also mentioned previously.
So really the outreach, the education, and also
(31:39):
what you might label as edutainment.
So you keep spreading that very, very important
message.
A lot of people just simply don't know
how much is sort of going on, if
you will, behind closed doors in the industrialised
food animal production system.
So really having conversations.
(31:59):
And I think that's why we need to
be sort of investing energy and time.
And a lot of the drumbeat of your
dogs have to eat meat is that, oh,
they have to get this vitamin that's only
available in meat supposedly, or that vitamin that's
only available in meat supposedly.
(32:21):
The film, which is streaming on Unchained TV,
Can Dogs Thrive on a Plant-Based Diet,
really breaks that down and shows that that
is just a complete myth, that plant-based
ingredients have all the vitamins necessary.
Listen.
We collected more than 3,000 parameters in
one year from these dogs.
(32:41):
For example, vitamin D, it's very important for
bone metabolism and also for immunity.
The vitamin D in seven out of these
15 dogs was insufficient.
At the end of the year, all of
them, they were within normal limits.
The vitamin D concentration that they were able
(33:03):
to measure in dogs normalised after more time
on a plant-based diet.
That really is contradictory to common thought.
Because the general consensus is that we get
vitamin D almost exclusively from animal products.
So we saw that dogs that were clinically
healthy maintained health, but looking deeper into these
(33:27):
biomarkers, they were healthier.
Wow.
So that is exciting.
As the parent guardian of two vegan dogs,
it's great to hear that.
But again, I'm so glad you had your
study and that I can point to that
study because there is this myth and fear
of, oh no, you can't do that.
(33:49):
In fact, some people will accuse you of
abusing your dogs if you had them on
a vegan diet.
What are the best arguments, Dr. Mel Garejo,
for counteracting this irrational, just myth-based fear?
Because the more I think about it and
(34:10):
think about the history of dogs, dogs were
one of the first signs of civilisation amongst
humans.
The pack would be around the humans gathered
and they would eat whatever scraps.
Those scraps could be anything.
They ate to survive.
(34:31):
So it wasn't like they were being fed
meat dog food from the beginning.
They clearly were eating opportunistically what would fall
to the ground or what they could get.
Before I try to answer that, Jane, I
like to just make a quick comment about
(34:53):
your question is how can we actually promote
and educate people?
I can tell you the PLOS ONE paper
was published last year in April and I
got good comments, congratulations from some people.
Some companies called me, they wanted to interview,
etc.
But I mean, we have about 5,000
views on the PLOS ONE paper in the
(35:17):
first few months.
So that's the way you make science.
As long as we have only the paper,
everything was just as expected.
As soon as the short documentary came, it
was booming because suddenly it was not just
Dr. Lina and Dr. Mugarejo and the PLOS
paper, it's like they are in Netflix.
(35:39):
That means like a streaming platform gave us
the credibility and the reputation.
So for the general public, I think it's
important to create these documentaries.
And we are actually working really hard to
combine those because now we have seen the
power of filming.
(36:01):
So we are trying to do excellent science.
We would like to publish our results, but
also every time we go, we just went
to Sardinia last summer to look into the
longevity in these blue zones, what happens with
dogs that live with these centenarians.
And we are looking into that.
And there's beautiful opportunities to actually do a
documentary.
So can you imagine if we can publish
(36:23):
a paper about the blue zones, dogs living
longer, healthier?
We have the papers, but also, and more
importantly, we have the documentary so the general
public can understand that.
We have discovered the power of that and
we would like to do it.
Of course, doing a film is expensive and
that's why we need your support.
(36:43):
The question that you're asking me when I'm
in an aeroplane or when I'm talking to
people, that they said, yeah, but dogs need
meat because the protein and everything.
The question is, so can you tell me
what protein is?
They don't know.
They're just like parrots saying, oh, protein, protein,
protein.
Oh, but the amino acid, the L-carnitine.
(37:04):
Okay.
Can you tell me, explain to me please
what is the L-carnitine?
They don't really know.
So they just take it back.
But that I have seen that with a
very short documentary of less than 10 minutes,
it gives you the credibility and also open
a door so they can listen.
We have former students that are part of
the paper and they have very busy clinics.
(37:26):
And just as soon as they were featured
in the paper and in the documentary, all
the clients is like, okay, I like to
go a vegan doctor.
And it was not the paper.
It was not that.
It was the power of social media.
So we need to do a combination nowadays
between people like you, really great, entertained, scientifically
(37:49):
based documentaries and publishing.
So we inform our new generations that dogs
are omnivores, not carnivores.
And your film is so powerful.
It's only seven minutes, guys.
You can watch it like this.
It's so entertaining.
You've seen some clips.
Let's play another clip that really shows, of
(38:09):
course, meat is connected with muscle in the
mind, but we all know the vegan bodybuilders.
I know several, they're ripped beyond belief on
plants.
Kale, for example, has more protein calorie per
calorie than steak.
Let's take another look at a clip from
this incredible mini doc that is streaming on
(38:30):
about that.
The athletic performance that a lot of these
animals can end up with is super high.
And you would not expect that out of
a vegan diet.
We often think of vegan diets as like
these kind of lean, not muscle building kind
of diets.
And these dogs get beefy.
They're strong.
They're healthy, but they're not overweight.
(38:50):
The data is so clear when it comes
to diet and dogs and you need to
present solid cold data.
That's the only way to move this forward.
We are happy to say that the results
of our one year clinical study on plant
-based nutrition in dogs have been published with
open access for everyone.
(39:12):
Yes.
Don't take their word for it.
Go and Google the study plus one and
vegan dog food, and it will pop right
up.
Now, this is my vegan dog Sunday.
I have two vegan dogs and she is
super, super, I would say muscular.
(39:32):
She's muscular and she runs like crazy and
fetches.
That's her whole thing.
She's not a couch potato.
So it's really important to point out that
if the proof's in the pudding, okay, the
proof's in the pudding.
And Sunday here is a very athletic dog
(39:53):
on a 100% plant-based diet.
But I've got to ask you a question.
Okay.
There have been occasions where due to a
babysitter or whatever, she's gotten access to meat.
Like somebody giving her a treat before I
could stop them that has meat.
(40:14):
And I noticed that once they taste that,
it takes a couple of days for them
to, or for her specifically to want to
get back into the vegan food.
Can you discuss that Dr. Linda?
Like, I think that it's kind of, there's
a bit of an addictive component there.
We've got to address that.
(40:37):
Yeah.
I think it's, you said the word right
already.
You say there's individual variations.
So for some dogs, that's going to be
not really much.
They blink and they happily eat the usual
food the day after.
Some dogs might actually have a really bad
episode, maybe some GI upset after getting very,
(41:02):
for them, unusual, atypical type of ingredients, like
someone giving them something meat-based.
And then as you described with Sunday, that
there might be those dogs that have more
maybe of addiction to certain tastes from whatever
those ingredients are in those products.
So you will have a variation.
(41:23):
I think we do know that if it
is products that contain some of these more
addictive properties, and I think what comes to
mind immediately on sort of the human side
is what we know about cheese and anything
that has these casomorphins, these addictive properties.
So I would say probably if you ask
(41:44):
me to guess sort of across most domestic
dogs, they probably will be happy to go
back to the food that they are used
to eating.
And then yes, you will have those cases
like with what you described, and she is
a little bit hesitant perhaps the following day.
So that's what I would attribute to some
individual variations, some preferences.
(42:07):
But again, as you also described, she's very,
very happy on a daily basis eating the
type of nutrition that you're feeding to her.
And I am guessing that there's some variation
in that.
So we had the conversation earlier about what
type of foods to avoid with dogs.
And again, the individual variation of what different
(42:28):
dogs enjoy eating.
Oh, thank you so much for that, Dr.
Linda.
I feel like I'm getting a consultation with
a vet today for myself.
Yeah, I do everything I can to make
sure they get no exposure to meat at
all.
And if somebody tries to give them a
treat, I just say, no, thank you.
(42:48):
My dogs are vegan.
And hopefully that will also register in there.
They see that my dogs are healthy.
And again, we're not talking about the massive
numbers of animals who are just like our
dogs and cats who are killed to be
put in dog food cans to be fed
to dogs when it doesn't even help them.
(43:10):
There's a parallel to what's happening with humans.
We see, you know, horrible health crisis that
has developed in our country with two thirds
of Americans overweight or obese, 43% of
Americans are obese.
And it's a primarily meat and dairy laden
fast food diet that's responsible.
(43:32):
So let me try to go out to
Darren.
Darren, why are you doing this?
Why is this important for you to do?
Well, it's an extension again, to your point,
Jane, of our lifestyle.
And I think our team, our family, our
community choosing a plant-based diet for the
(43:52):
various reasons of adopting plant based for the
environment, for animals, for human health, our own
health, and connecting those pillars of veganism and
extending that to our canine companions, which we
now have even further evidence with the study
to demonstrate the efficacy of plant-based nutrition
for canine health.
And so it's really a coming full circle
(44:15):
for us.
And our goal and our mission as a
company, as a team and as a family
is to continue to innovate and work with
folks, both on the pet food nutrition side
of things, as well as Dr. Medarato and
Dr. Linde on the academic side and connecting
those two different science groups together to bring
novel plant-based ingredients to the pet food
(44:37):
industry and continue to innovate and develop nutritious,
nutritiously balanced products for dogs.
Uh, what I would like to see is
a topper, a topper with, has gravy.
That would be something I would really like
to see because sometimes, uh, it's, it's just,
(44:58):
they're just like people, you know, I don't
want to just eat a slab of tofu.
I'd like to have a little spices and
hot sauce or whatever it is that I,
as a human being want, well, the dogs
are the same way.
So I think we can make, we could
make vegan dog food more attractive.
And I know you're working on that, uh,
V-Dog and very excited to see what
comes down the pike, uh, in terms of,
(45:20):
uh, vegan dog food products.
We know we have a lot of treats,
uh, during this show, I was tempted to
jump to my kitchen and grab some of
those treats to show everybody.
But, uh, I will do that actually, because
I think it's important to, for, for, uh,
people to see.
So Dr. Mel Garejo, will you, for a
(45:42):
minute, take us through how this study was
conducted?
Because when people think of studies involving animals,
they think of animals in cages, animals being
tortured in laboratories, which of course we are
all against.
All we do is work on freeing animals
from laboratories.
Um, can you describe how these dogs were
(46:04):
treated during this study and how long the
study went on?
Of course, um, as you pointed, these are
client owned dogs.
Um, so they were dogs, uh, from students,
staff, and faculty here at Western University.
And there's a big challenge, uh, working with
(46:26):
client owned dogs, because, um, pretty much the
only thing that, the only thing that we
did, uh, the study was the sign that
they needed to be between one year and
10 years of age.
And they needed to be on a meat
based diet, kibble, uh, most of them, um,
uh, for at least one year.
(46:48):
And then we transition, uh, these 15, uh,
dogs, females and males in one week to
a big, uh, uh, a vegan diet.
And then we follow them for a year.
So right there when people say, oh, it's
a, it's a small study.
It's a short study.
Let me just tell you something.
Uh, one year of a dog, it's very
(47:10):
difficult.
There's not a number, but it's equal to
six to eight years on humans.
So if it's like, uh, in this group,
I said, okay, Darren, Anika, uh, Jane and
other people, we are going to put you
on a diet for seven years.
You tell me if that is a short
study, seven years of a human with the
(47:33):
same diet, follow you and then measure more
than 3000 parameters.
That is the significance of this study is
not just a study.
Yeah.
The number of dogs, there were 15 dogs,
but none of them actually show a clinical
science.
And a lot of the dogs and the,
the guardians call me and said, Dr. Mel
(47:53):
Garejo, my dog is smiling.
I didn't know that my dog smiled.
Dr. Mel Garejo, my dog is really full
of energy.
My dog is happy.
My dog is less aggressive.
And you know why?
Because there's now a area that we didn't
know a 10 years ago that is called
the God brain axis.
(48:15):
What you eat is not just what you
are, but it's the way, how you think.
So, and we saw, and we didn't comment
on, on this documentary that actually, or dogs
on a plant-based diet, the tryptophan, one
of the amino acids that are key for
happiness.
They just went all the way up, even
(48:36):
above normal levels.
And the tryptophan is probably the molecule of
the serotonin.
And the serotonin is the molecule that promotes
calmness and happiness.
So this was a very interesting study because
it was 50, 15 dogs, but the time
it was a year and every three months,
(48:57):
we checked the dogs every three months.
And every month we called the guardians and
how is the dog doing?
How are the faeces urinating?
And we check absolutely everything.
We have still data, mega data on the
microbiome, faecal microbiome, urine microbiome, the things that
are going to come later, we hope in,
(49:18):
in publications.
But this was a very interesting study.
I give credit to Dr. Lina because she
designed the study together with a biostatistician from
UC Berkeley.
They were extremely meticulous and strict about what
are we going to do, how we're going
(49:38):
to publish and what statistics techniques are going
to use to prove that even with 15
dogs, this is highly significant.
And I've been doing my own study here
with my little Wednesday.
Okay.
So I want to show you some of
the V-Dog products.
This they go crazy for.
(49:58):
This is like, well, it's equivalent to me
having a chocolate eclair maybe, but a lot
healthier.
So you see this little face.
She loves this.
This is her treat.
Yes, yes, yes.
There's a little Wednesday.
And then this one I just give to
Sunday.
I believe this is when it has a
(50:19):
little apple in it.
And I give this one to Sunday.
She goes crazy for it.
And then we have the breath bone that
they both love.
And those are the dog shoes that I
showed you that they, they love, and they
love that chewy sensation.
And then I keep the kibble.
(50:39):
Hold on a little girl.
I keep the kibble in this, and this
is the kibble.
And I have a little scooper and I
scoop it out.
And that's, that's like a lot of their
diet.
They also have wet food and I also
make them carrots, corn, and potatoes in a
little mix, sometimes with seitan.
(51:01):
So let me try to go back to
Darren and see Darren, what other products are,
can we expect from you in the, in
the future?
Well, thank you, Jane.
Yeah.
We're excited about our current products as well
as some new products in the product pipeline
and with Dr. Gregg on our nutrition side
(51:21):
of things and product development side.
And toppers is on our radar, different versions
of toppers, as well as prebiotic and probiotic
treats and other functional ingredient-based treats.
And on the food side, we are looking
at a couple of different opportunities moving into
a fresh concept that could also double as
(51:43):
a topper.
So again, these are all in the pipeline
and we're working on them currently.
We are, we're a small, you know, family
-owned and operated entity.
So we have to manage our budget carefully
and move cautiously, but we're excited because we
have some great potential opportunities and partnerships in
2025 to launch some new products.
(52:05):
Well, I, again, I want to give you
compliments on making your products very easy to
get.
I order them, they're here the next day
and they love them.
They just absolutely love all the different products.
I think for this little one, she just
goes so crazy over the wiggle biscuits.
(52:25):
The wiggle biscuits are really what, what rocks
her boat.
But let's just have final thoughts, 30 seconds
each.
We're out of time.
Dr. Linda, what's your message?
I think the very short message here is
that we have shown with the study that
(52:46):
this is definitely an option for dogs.
It allows dogs to thrive.
There's no need to be worried about it.
This is nutritionally complete.
So thumbs up and think about us as
we talked about all the important social implications,
ethical implications.
Dr. Tona.
(53:07):
Well, science is built by bricks and we
just put the first brick of a beautiful
castle and we cannot stop now.
One paper doesn't mean very much in the
scientific community.
We need to keep promoting through different documentaries
and we need to produce a lot of
bricks and we need to do it in
(53:28):
a scientifically manner and we need funding to
do that.
As I said, there is no one supporting
us but amazing philanthropists that actually believe in
a better world, planetary health, human health, and
the health of our amazing, beautiful friends.
Well, for us, for Wednesday, Sunday and myself,
(53:50):
I could say that we look forward to
having you come back when you have your
next GoFundMe for your next study.
Nothing would make me happier than to be
a part of that, to donate, to promote
anything we can do.
I want to do because, wow, the clock's
ticking.
We haven't even gotten to the environmental damage
(54:12):
that meat causes.
You're my heroes.
All three of you are my heroes.
I want to thank you so much for
watching Unshained TV.
For those of you who are watching or
listening, go to Unshained TV and watch the
documentary.
It's right there in the featured section.
And as always, what I would suggest is
(54:35):
support Unshained TV.
You can download it.
It's the world's only vegan streaming television network.
So it's a vegan network.
Okay.
That's the craziest thing I've ever heard.
I love Unshained TV.
Unshained.
Unshained TV.
Your life will change.
It's just that easy.
Unshained TV has all sorts of content for
(54:55):
everybody.
Unshained TV changed my life.
Unshained TV is crushing it.
I love Unshained TV.
Unshained TV is my go-to.
Unshained TV.
Who knew?
Unshained, baby.
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