September 10, 2025 • 46 mins
In this episode of the Wealth Wisdom Financial Podcast, host Brandon Neely welcomes “The Banking Bros” Jeremiah and Jonah, two real-life brothers bringing fresh perspective and family-rooted wisdom to the world of Infinite Banking.
The conversation traces their unique paths from traditional banking and ministry into becoming passionate advocates for the Infinite Banking Concept (IBC). Along the way, they explore how faith, family, and cultural context have shaped their financial philosophies.
Together, they unpack:
- Their journey from conventional careers into Infinite Banking
- Where they agree and disagree with financial voices like Dave Ramsey
- Why true financial independence is more about mindset and education than quick-fix products
- Lessons from history, like how A.G. Gaston used life insurance to fuel civil rights efforts
- The “three cup setup” teaching tool that makes IBC easy to understand
- How families can teach the next generation about money, abundance, and legacy
This isn’t just another conversation about money, it’s about ethics, stewardship, and creating a financial system that serves both families and communities.
👉 If you’re curious about Infinite Banking, wrestling with traditional financial advice, or simply looking for a values-based approach to money, this episode will leave you both inspired and equipped.
0:00 Introduction
0:52 Meet The Banking Bros
2:20 Coffee, Family, and Business
3:50 Getting into Infinite Banking
8:56 Upbringing, Ministry, and Money
14:16 Dave Ramsey’s Influence
16:30 Infinite Banking vs. Traditional Advice
18:56 Mindset, Scarcity, and Abundance
24:14 Ethical Business & Community Impact
31:45 Generational Wealth & Family Banking
35:15 The Three Cup Setup
39:00 Motivation & Mission
43:00 Cash Flow, Freedom, and Family
46:23 Resources & Where to Find The Banking Bros
46:49 Closing Thoughts & Call to Action
Watch on YouTube: https://youtu.be/Bx_qmW3VnCk
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:01):
Hey guys, welcome to the Wealth WisdomFinancial Podcast, YouTube channel,
wherever you're listening to us.
Um, as you know, we've been doinglots, uh, and lots of more interviews,
less of just me and Amanda rambling.
We like to add in other people who.
Actually, they, theymay be smarter than us.
They actually do some of the same,same things that we do or similar.
(00:25):
And today though, I get to interview thebanking bros. So as you guys know, Amanda
and I, um, we've been doing businesstogether, um, and we're still married.
Um, it's been 19 years,uh, and two businesses.
Um, but now I get tointerview two brothers.
Who do the same kind ofindustry that we're in.
(00:49):
Uh, they are the banking bros.
Uh, real life, uh, brothers,Jeremiah and Jonah.
Do they wanna teach people howto save and spend money at the
same time by using something theywere never taught growing up?
I don't know.
Does that sound familiar?
Uh.
At school and at the office.
This is that infinite banking concept.
So we really wanna like, bringin how they found this concept.
(01:14):
Uh, we could talk all day longabout faith, uh, about kids,
about, I don't know, what else?
All kinds of things.
Um, their brother actuallyalso used to, uh, own a coffee
shop or does own a coffee shop.
So, uh, the other one, uh, the next.
Third.
Uh, so anyway, uh, hereis Jeremiah and Jonah.
(01:36):
There you go.
What going on.
Alright, thanks for having,appreciate that intro.
Thank you for having, I know right.
Doesn't he have a coffee shop?
He has, yes.
So we do have a brother between usin terms of lineage and he has been
in the coffee business for a while.
Yes.
Decade or so.
And has had shops and mobile cateringas well for very high end coffee.
(01:58):
I, I, I don't envy him, uh, at all.
Um, you know, being inthat industry and all that.
So kind of the blend between youguys and him is what we are, I
guess my wife and I with coffeeand mocha, what you mean my blend?
Oh, I can go with Mocha.
I would say my favorite drinkand then we'll get into some
(02:19):
of the stuff we called it.
The Spto.
Spto is, uh, spicy hot chocolate.
It's mocha.
With cayenne pepper.
Five.
Five shakes of cayenne pepper, five shakesof cayenne pepper, five shakes of pepper.
I'm not sure I'm drinking this,but keep continue and hazelnut.
Then you have espresso, of course, with,um, coconut milk and 2% milk mixed.
(02:46):
So you can actually, um, steam it.
And that was our signature drink.
The sp it's like a spicy mocha.
Amazing.
Uh, it sounds good to me.
It sounds like something I would like.
It does not sound like somethingI'll be drinking, but, uh, I
appreciate the whole ingredient list.
Now I know what to avoid.
Now you, you're probably like ablack coffee all the way, right?
(03:08):
Uh, no.
I, I actually don't preferthe taste of black coffee.
I do like espresso, which isinteresting 'cause I don't prefer
black coffee, but I do like espresso.
No.
If I'm gonna drink coffee, I'm definitelygonna put some creamer in it, maybe a
little syrups and something like that.
I'm, I want some flavor.
I'm a fuel, I'm a purist.
Uh, if it's coffee, um, youknow, and that, that's just me.
(03:31):
So anyway, we could keep talkingabout coffee, but I want to talk about
like, you know, uh, how you guys.
Um, it doesn't just randomly happen thattwo, two guys end up doing life insurance.
Right.
How did you end up going from, Idon't know, you, Jeremiah and Jonah?
(03:53):
Um, what was life like beforethen and how did, who came?
Who came first?
Like the chicken, the egg.
Like which, which one are you?
The chicken and the egg.
That, that got each other going.
Yeah.
Alright, good.
How question did you convince.
Other person to say, Hey,we should start a business.
'cause you know, this wholething is amazing, but most
(04:13):
people are like, you're crazy.
So this is, uh, theseare all good questions.
You are right.
Nobody grows up planningto be an insurance agent.
Yep.
Nobody.
And, uh, we're the same way.
So, uh, I guess I came first as the egg.
I'm older.
So does the egg eggcome before the chicken?
No, it's the chicken.
(04:33):
Is that what you're saying?
It is.
Okay.
I don't know.
So I'm the older brother,uh, old of all three of us.
Uh, the one who's notin the business as well.
And we grew up in a family thatdidn't talk about money, not because
it was taboo, we didn't talk aboutit 'cause we didn't have anything.
There was nothing to talk about, would'vebeen a pretty short conversation.
Mm-hmm.
So, uh, our parents were involvedin ministry and I know you
(04:53):
have a history in that as well.
And also in military, it was basicallymilitary and ministry type mix.
And we have a stepdad who is stillan active Air force chaplain.
So that was some of our upbringing.
Little bit of moving around transient.
I'm also older than Jonah.
By a kid generation.
(05:14):
So I'm eight years older than Jonah,and uh, we did not get into this space
until we became little p practitionersand clients of somebody who taught
infinite banking, and that was 2016.
So we learned about it late 20 15, 20 16.
So we're very much grown by then.
It's a first generation thing for usand our story about why we decided
(05:36):
to go into business that comes later.
Gotcha.
So, so you got, um, olderbrother taught little brother
saying, I found this cool thing.
Um, so little brother.
What, what, where did you likesay are, you are just crazy.
Like how did.
Well, I'm not sure.
You said older brothertaught little brother.
(05:57):
Maybe that's the wrong phrasing.
Older brother definitely discoveredand was connected to people who could
explain what infinite banking wasfirst, but actually right outta school.
Um, uh, right when I finishedcollege, I actually got a job
working at a conventional bank.
Mm-hmm.
I was there for about twoyears, two and a half years.
It really wasn't for me.
A lot of my colleagues were leavingthe banking industry and going to the
(06:19):
insurance industry, so I followed suit.
And so when, at the time that Iwas seeing infinite banking for
the very first time, my backgroundwas in traditional banking and in
property and casualty insurance sales.
Oh, gotcha.
So, uh, when my older brotherintroduces, Hey, they're using insurance.
I don't really know what's happening,but it's insurance and they're using
(06:40):
it for banks and you gotta comelearn, uh, it was actually some things
that were just right down my alley.
I, I understood.
I knew.
What was happening in that space.
Right.
I, I could, I could, I could, uh, getus further along a little faster just
because of the background I already had.
Right.
Gotcha.
It was, uh, really introduced.
(07:00):
He did introduce me to what wasgoing on, and then from there it was
kind of like a three legged race.
Right.
Uh, at some point we're together inthe middle, but then one of us is
taking the outside and kind of speedingthe group along, that sort of thing.
So.
So it wasn't just one person, it waslike a combined thing and, and like,
almost like a, uh, I don't know, I wannause all the religious language, but
(07:23):
maybe the Holy Spirit or something washappening that, uh, kind of melded this
together, that you're like, oh, wow,there's something, hindsight 2020, right?
You can put the dotstogether going backward.
You cannot put the dotsthere going forward.
So hopefully the Holy Spirit was in it.
I, Hey, greed may have been a part of it.
I'm sick of being broke.
Brandon.
So that's how it may havestarted at the beginning.
(07:46):
And uh, yeah, so to be able to begroomed into a business partnership
that you have with a family member,you're doing the same thing.
Insurance sale.
Like these aren't thingsyou plan out, right?
They really aren't things you plan out.
It's not a secondary generation business.
Our folks don't knowanything about insurance.
We definitely outpace them in allcategories, including property casual.
(08:09):
We just know more things about it.
Money was not a big topic in our house.
There's a lot of ministry focus.
We definitely have servant leadersand lay people in our family.
Mom and dad, were working inchurch style stuff quite a bit
and uh, including the military.
So.
Yeah, we, you know,looking backward Oh yeah.
Seems like a god thing.
(08:29):
Moving forward.
We're out here trailblazing, right.
Pushing westward againstan unforgiving wilderness.
Yeah.
Maybe like more prophetic, if you will.
If you, there you go.
There you go.
Uh, and, and so probably even then,I'm, I'm curious, um, so Dave Ramsey
is, has like a stronghold, uh, in thechurch world, uh, where your family.
(08:53):
Friends, were they like fans of him?
Did they listen to him?
Um, was it not really a thing in yourchurch background or, or where was that?
Where was he at?
Very interesting.
Yes, actually, so 2005, I'mthe one who remembers the
numbers and the dates in 2005.
We live in the northwestcorner called the Upstate.
It's a ten eight county regionor so in South Carolina.
(09:16):
And Dave Ramsey made an appearance at achurch and that church was in our town.
And mom in 2005 saw themarquee at the church.
So then she goes to theradio and then hears him.
So literally Dave Ramsey'smaking appearance at a church.
And this is 2005.
If you guys are not thinking throughthe timeline of Dave Ramsey's
(09:38):
comeuppance, this is not a big church.
This is not an arenastyle mega church at all.
Hmm.
This is a congregation of under500 and he's speaking, this is
before he's got all the books.
He's got two books probably at this point.
So mom discovered the financialawareness in our family first.
(10:00):
I'm in college at that time.
Jonah's still in grade school,and that's where it came from.
So I was very interestedin mom's interest in this.
I didn't like talk radio,so I didn't really love Dave
Ramsey to listen to him per se.
She gave me this book, totalMoney Makeover told me to read it.
I'm in college, I can't read books.
(10:21):
I'm busy in class, and so I didn'tread it till I finished school 2006,
but that was the awakening for me.
And, uh, as you've, uh, seen thiswhole thing of, of the Dave Ramsey,
he's gotten exposure grown, uh,as well as some of us, right.
(10:42):
Where has been some of the collide,I guess you could say, um, in the
principles that, that you have and asyou teach your clients specifically?
Um, I would say, um.
Culturally, probably you have a different,like, I, I was on the south side, right?
And so we're taught, well,there's no money and money's
(11:03):
evil or those kind of things.
And, and how, how has that beenreflective culturally for you guys?
Um, if, if that makes sense.
Sure, I'll jump in for that one.
Uh, you are exactly correct.
Uh, now that we are adults and we have,uh, of course our own agency where we
(11:23):
help people understand the infinitebanking concept, we do combat or, uh,
talk to people all the time who have gota big love for Dave and his teaching.
And, uh, I respect Dave in histeaching, especially when he
talks about getting out of.
Debt.
I think that it is the average Americanabsolutely needs some of those principles,
needs to apply them in their lives.
(11:43):
It's when you get past gettingout of debt that some of his
principles start to fall apart.
And for those who don't realize that, uh,the first part of his information and,
uh, and uh, expertise applies really well,but the second half of his information
and expertise start to fall apart, it'sthose people normally that say, well,
it works so well in the first half.
(12:05):
I don't know if I'm ready to not.
Trust him and believehim on the second half.
Right?
Yeah.
And so some of those things that wehave to combat often are maybe his
most famous lines and phrases, right?
Where he talks about, uh, buyingterm and investing the difference.
Yeah.
We talk to people about that all the time.
Uh, maybe when he talks aboutcash is king, we have a saying
around here that cash is not king.
(12:26):
It's actually cash flow.
Cash flow is key.
Yep, yep, yep.
Uh, he talks a lot about having nodebt, cutting up your credit cards.
People used to get on the internetor get on the, uh, radio Right.
And, uh, scream freedomfrom Braveheart, I think.
Right?
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Uh, and he doesn't use any debt.
Well, of course we coach and teachpeople that, uh, you can use that
to your advantage as leverage.
There's other things that you cando, other things that you could do.
(12:48):
Consider.
Yeah.
And so there's a couple of fundamentalteachings that Dave has that we
combat all the time when it comesto like cultural differences.
Uh, in my opinion, the people that we'veworked with up to this point, it's not.
It's not, uh, like a super vastcultural difference in my opinion.
(13:09):
Uh, of course there are avenuesand areas where it could be and is,
but for most of the, most of thetime, the people that we decide to
work with have absolutely heard of.
Dave heard of his teaching apply,some of it, not, maybe not all of it.
Mm-hmm.
Uh, and it seems likethat's the growing, uh.
Facade with Dave.
We're gonna listen to some things.
(13:29):
Not all, uh, I can verify some things,but this other thing that he said,
like, I know for a fact it can bedifferent, you know, that sort of thing.
And, and we end up running to that a lot.
So hopefully that's, uh, that,that answered your question.
Well, and, and I just, I, I'm againan activist at, at heart and I
think about some of the, uh, systemsthat are in place that keep us,
(13:53):
um, maybe in slavery, if you will.
Um, I am, I'm from the, uh, Chicago,and in Chicago there's the south
side and the north side, and there'sa freeway that divides, um, right.
And, and so there wassystematic oppression.
That that created and, and I believethat part of our job and what your
(14:15):
jobs are is to help us have freedom.
Full freedom, not just economic orpersonal freedom, but, uh, we're, we're
celebrating, uh, as I record this,it's, uh, close to the 4th of July.
Um, and, and just thinking about thatidea of financial freedom and how is,
(14:36):
like for you guys being in this worldof, of infinite banking, uh, how is that?
Changed for you guys thinking, Hey,we're helping people actually be
free, not just yelling, freedom andthen going back into slavery because,
you know, something happened, uh, aclient happened to a client of mine.
(14:57):
Yeah.
But, but staying financially free.
And how have you been able,or are you able to educate?
Your clients and why doesinfinite banking matter so much?
That's a great question and a great pointbecause I will corroborate your message
that when I got out of debt, and this wasstudent loans only, not consumer debt.
(15:17):
I told you I finished collegein 2006, mom handed me the book.
So I've got student loans,but I didn't have a car note.
I didn't have a house mortgage.
Mm-hmm.
We didn't have kids, youknow, things like that.
Uh.
I got to the point I was so frugal,so focused, laser focused on the goal.
Gazelle intensity, if you understandDave's kind of terminology.
(15:38):
Yeah.
I got outta debt, but I wasn'tused to spending any money
and I got to the second half.
Jonah pointed that out.
Didn't know what to do, didn'tknow how to do it, didn't, uh,
my expenses started to skyrocket.
I'm moving toward eventually marriageand kids and things like that.
So.
I didn't know how to handle that.
I just knew how to be frugal.
So you're exactly right.
(15:59):
What?
That's not freedom.
Now I, I'm afraid to go eat at BurgerKing because I've been afraid to eat at
Burger King for the last three years.
So Garrett Gundersontalks about this a lot.
It's a lot easier to get into themindset of frugality or scarcity.
Um, than it is sometimes ofabundance of opportunity.
(16:19):
Yeah.
So what I really needed to be doingwas looking at how do I make more money
in the marketplace rather than, how doI make sure I never look at Netflix?
Right?
That's not really living abundant.
Now you don't need to have.
Netflix to feel abundant.
The point is, I wasn't feeling abundant.
'cause I never spent money.
I didn't know how to, I didn't knowwhat I should go for an opportunity.
'cause I'm like, no, no, no.
You never spend your money.
(16:40):
You just hoard it.
So what we help people understand isthere is the save and spend system.
The money that you make, you needto keep the money that you make, but
you still have to be able to spendleverage and move toward abundance.
Like you said, we think that's abiblical principle as well where, um.
Uh, Jesus talked about, I came togive you life and that abundantly.
(17:02):
So we look at six areas of life.
Often we talk about it sometimesin our stuff, especially in
our one-on-one conversations.
That's how we coach our clients.
Fun, family, friends.
Fitness, financial, and faith.
Those are the six areas.
So we're looking for abundanceand all those things.
And the plans of the diligence leadto abundance, that's also biblical.
So you're exactly right.
(17:23):
What we're trying to help peopleunderstand is what metrics are
we gonna actually look for?
Are we looking for proudnessthat we only eat beans and rice?
Are we looking for how much ofthe money that you made did you
keep in a certain period of time?
And how are your passiveinvestments doing?
Are we moving toward dollars thatcontinue to generate into your life?
(17:45):
Passive residual incomehigher than your bills?
And what if that passive residualincome is also in type income tax free?
So there are different words.
Yeah.
And language we can use aroundmoney while still being.
Not a spender.
Right.
We not being an over over consumer,I don't know what the term is
(18:06):
right there, but not being crazy.
We're gonna be frugal and smart and, but,but it's very, it's very much interesting.
Mm-hmm.
We're talking about thatcultural divide as well.
Our stepdad who is in the AirForce is in ministry, um, he's
from South side Chicago, right?
Robins, yeah.
Robins, Illinois.
So I guess he's on the underside of that.
Freeway.
I don't know.
Yeah.
Um, you know, better than me.
Yeah.
There we go.
So, uh, there's a lot of people whocome from that side of the freeway or
(18:29):
the side of the tracks, or maybe eventhat side of the church congregation.
Mm-hmm.
Hey, we're organ side people, organ sidepeople are broke and piano side people got
a little more money, that type of thing.
So we're trying to helppeople understand that.
But it starts internally andyou're right, it is mental.
It's a cultural shift.
It's a mindset shift.
Yeah.
Before it's actually a money shift.
(18:52):
Yeah.
Um, what would you say?
Uh, I would agree at this point I was,I was gonna jump in and say some more,
but I think he did it well enoughthat, uh, I'm gonna take the next one
and I'm gonna say, uh, that I agree.
Nice.
Um, I, I just want, I don'twant to make sure I'm like, oh
yeah, we're just having, I want.
(19:14):
Of us have a real conversation.
Oh, we can go back and forth.
That's fine.
We, we've, we've, we've been on somany great podcasts with folks who
are colleagues in this business.
We've kind of gotten into the cadence.
Yeah.
Unwritten, like, I'll take one,then you take the next one.
You know, unless somebody callsthis out for something specific.
Well, and, and one of the things I,I've thinking about is why I am in this
is, is it became, I, I'm a. All aboutethical economics and community building.
(19:38):
That's what the coffee shop was.
Um, buying ethical coffee,you can't say that.
Um, I'm gonna set peoplefree and then, um.
Oppress people by buying bad coffee.
That is horrible for other people.
Just because I don't seethem doesn't mean it's, yeah.
You know?
(19:58):
Good point.
And so that was why we got into this andwhy we got into this financial system
and saying, oh my gosh, this thingis built to keep us in, uh, slavery.
You just use credit cards and younever can get out because you.
You know, had a mistake andnow you're 32% interest.
Um, and, and, and people will ask,well, um, if you just have a policy
(20:23):
life insurance, it'll solve it.
So as you've guys have been workingwith clients, how have you worked with
them to say, may, maybe it's not apolicy, maybe it's a mindset thing.
Before we do that, um, how haveyou been able to coach them?
Or what do you do when you know.
They're, they're, they, they'renot ready for it, but I mean,
(20:45):
they maybe have the money.
But they, they need something now.
I don't know.
Does that, does that make sense?
I'm sure.
I'm trying to think through the mindset.
Yeah, it makes sense.
So let me, I'll talk a little bitabout some things that we've talked
about internally, some thingsthat we've done with clients, but
realistically, you're exactly correct.
Buying a whole life insurance policy,specifically one designed to be used
(21:05):
for the infinite banking concept doesnot shift your mentality and make you.
Way wealthier than you werefive minutes ago or last week.
Mm-hmm.
That, that's just not what it is.
And we've had many a conversationsabout how can we turn the people
that we work with from whole lifepolicy owners to infinite bankers
(21:26):
because they're, they're not the same.
Now you might think, well, I boughtthe infinite banking policy, so no,
that makes me an infinite banker.
But no, buying the policy makes youa whole life insurance policy holder.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
There's some mindset things.
There's some actions that you've gottabe comfortable with in order to turn
yourself into an infinite banker.
And infinite banking is what unlocksand unleashes that potential, right?
(21:48):
Infinite banking is what, uh,can provide the cash flow.
Infinite banking is what can providethe mindset shift and, and, and more.
And so there's lots of things thatwe do, but most importantly, we kind
of teach people that it's a process.
This is not something thatyou're just gonna get.
On day one.
Right.
If you, if you just get it onday one or you just buy the
thing and that would change it.
(22:09):
Everybody would own it.
Everybody would buy it.
Yeah.
They'd be working really hard tosave up so they can buy the one
thing that makes everything better.
Right.
It just doesn't work like that.
I talked to a gentleman just afew weeks ago who said, called our
phone, said, I've got X amount ofmoney, few hundred thousand dollars.
My goal is to have passive cash flow ofx. A few thousand dollars a month, and so
(22:32):
I'm looking for the product that'll do it.
That's literally how hestarted the conversation.
And so by the time we were finishedwith the conversation, right, it
was an understanding that this,there's not a magic product.
My, you know, mm-hmm.
Fell.
There's not one.
If there was one, Iwould've bought it first.
Yeah.
And I'd be telling you, it'sthis product, you know, you'd be
able to search on the internet.
What's the product that did that worksso well for all these famous people?
(22:56):
And you'd be able to just buy thatand you'd, you'd have it, right?
It's not the product, it'sactually the mindset shift.
Um.
That particular person is notactually a client of ours.
He's not working with us, and it's.
I probably knew that 30 secondsinto the conversation when he
started the conversation by saying,I'm looking for the quick fix.
Right?
Yeah.
And it's like uhoh, that's notsomebody that's gonna be coachable
(23:18):
and teachable and be willing to walkthrough this process together in
order to actually accomplish the goal.
So I think that's, uh, most importantto the people that we work with.
Just understanding it's a process.
We're here to help you.
We're gonna guide you through it.
We've got all sorts of fun stuff,resources and classes, and,
and live events, and, and youjoin us live and ask questions.
(23:38):
We got all sorts of stuff, butthe important part is that you've
got someone to actually walk youthrough it to actually help you.
And if you've got that and youstick to the plan, then that
plan can become your reality.
Whether it takes you a couplemonths or a couple years, right?
You can make it happen.
That's awesome.
I, again, uh, as people come inand, and as they listen to our
(23:59):
content and your content, it isabout the mindset and the heart.
Um, and not just a, Hey, you buy thisand it'll quick fix, like, solve right?
And that, that's the consumeristic side.
You just buy this and you'll be happy.
Uh, tomorrow.
And, and it, it's a different, um, thing.
(24:21):
Now I wanna go back to, um,some of the civil rights.
I, I was le recently in,um, Montgomery, Alabama.
Uh, it was about a, a year ago, and I,I come across this guy named AG Gast.
Uh, have you ever heard of him?
Yes.
Um, so, so he, he says A portionof all you earn in is free to keep.
(24:43):
Um, I, I've heard it somewhere else too,like, I don't know, profit first, richest
man in Babylon, those kind of things.
And I'm like, oh my gosh.
Um, this guy, uh, I think there'ssome other things he, you know, that,
that he did as far as banking goesand, and formed an insurance company.
But he, but.
Was able to fund theCivil Rights movement.
(25:06):
Um, um, he was one of those people.
Uh, have you guys ever like, thought aboutor heard, I'm sure you've heard about
him, but, but what are your thoughts onwhat that, what happened back in the.
Yeah, it's a great story.
Um, talking about, uh, so I'veread the book, green Power.
Mm-hmm.
So, uh, that book is based on his life.
(25:27):
Mm-hmm.
And during the, uh, civil RightsMovement specifically, he was, he had
made it big at that point and he mm-hmm.
Was able to fund and finance a lotof the things that were going on.
Um, I'm not sure how muchwas going on in Montgomery.
I think he lived inBirmingham, so there was, yeah.
Birmingham.
Okay.
Got it.
So, um, it's all.
Alabama, of course.
(25:48):
Yeah.
But, um, so Birmingham was, if anybodyremembers out there, Birmingham,
Bombingham, this is Bull Connor.
This is the bombing of the 16th StreetBaptist Church and the four little girls.
This is where the, um, March,um, kids March happened.
This is letter from aBirmingham jail, all this stuff.
Mm-hmm.
Birmingham is huge for all thisstuff, and partially because
(26:10):
it was backed by AG Gaston.
So AG Gaston, um, first starteda. Um, burial insurance mm-hmm.
For burial.
Um, and a, a black, a blackper, um, black family.
Um.
Kind of system for, and thesepeople are paying 25 cents a month
for their premiums, you know,in 1910 and things like that.
(26:33):
By 1960, uh, this manhas got a lot of money.
And in the nineties he diedin like 96, I wanna say.
Yeah.
Um.
I don't remember exactly, but he, youknow, he is in our lifetime for sure.
He died and he was estimated tobe the richest black person at
some point in the United States.
Mm-hmm.
So about 140 or so million dollars.
(26:53):
So I remembered a fewthings about his life.
It was just so significant.
And he built it on the backof a life insurance system.
Yeah, yeah.
A life insurance system and, um.
He did so much philanthropicstuff for his community as well.
But what was interesting, uh, abouthim is he came from nothing and
he realized a profitable business.
(27:14):
But kind of like you said.
Look, I don't, I wanna bein an ethical business.
I wanna be in a businessthat helps people.
So if we're gonna, you know, havechild slave labor to get these coffee
beans, I don't wanna be a part of that.
Yeah.
Maybe those are things thathave crossed your plate.
Crossed your mind.
You know, Mr. Beast, he's huge right now.
He's got a chocolate company, andso these are beans that are in the
(27:35):
ground and you realize, man, thereis childhood slavery everywhere.
Mm-hmm.
I don't wanna be involved with that,even though I'm in a chocolate company.
Well, AG Gaston is in abusiness of insurance.
Yeah.
And crazy enough, you think about this,of course we're all going to die one day.
That's an inevitable.
Yeah.
We're all going to pass away.
So there's a loss there.
But outside of that loss, which we know iscoming, that AG Gaston me and you can't do
(27:57):
anything about, no one loses an insurance.
Yeah.
No one loses.
Everyone has made whole.
So by us putting in that quarter,our family can get that a thousand
dollars, you know, 110 years ago.
For the burial, we can be made whole.
The insurance company wins.
The insurance agent wins.
(28:19):
There's commission and the family wins.
Mm-hmm.
Actually, no one loses in this.
We all collectively bear the burden.
Of the person that died, but nobodygets taken advantage of at all.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So all parties win andthat is very interesting.
That's not why we gotin for the community.
(28:42):
We got in because we wanted to usethe system and learned well the
agent that how us out wins, we win.
And the insurance company wins.
And in a mutual company environment,which we use for the infinite banking
concept, there's even dividends.
So there's no outside shareholdersthat need to be, um, answered to
in a mutual environment as well.
(29:03):
So very interesting, um, that theMartin Luther King movement of the
19, late fifties and sixties inBirmingham was financed by the guy.
Who had the insurance company, buthe also had the restaurant and the
motels and things like that so peoplecould stay, you know, when they came
to town and get ready for the march.
We've got MLK takingpictures on that balcony.
(29:24):
We all have seen a few of them andeverybody kind of in the courtyard there
he is talking to the kids or talking tothe adults before the children's march
boom, that's Ag Gaston's Hotel, you know?
And uh, he was able to keep thingsmoving and grooving and going when yeah,
there was obviously disenfranchisement.
Against the black community in Birmingham,in the south for those types of topics.
(29:45):
So they got the money from ag.
And this is something I, I, again,thinking about this stuff and saying,
Hey, we wanna start a movement.
Uh, the, um, with Nelson Nash, youknow, he was, he was there as well.
Yeah, he was in Birmingham, right?
Yeah.
I loved his faith background, Uhhuh,and, um, what, what he says and,
(30:07):
and then just thinking about, um.
What we're doing as a culture and, uh,as even business owners, we, I mean,
we, we sell life insurance, right?
It's crazy that we do this, but, butit's so much fun when people get it and,
and how this will impact communities.
We, we could impact wholecommunities, uh, by introducing them.
(30:30):
Like you guys did this in a, your onebrother telling another brother, right.
And others that, that then changed.
Family.
Right.
And, and that's, I don't know, familybanking, isn't that what it's called?
That is, that's exactly what it's,uh, you know, this week I had a
conversation with a family who, um,is now in a three generation mm-hmm.
(30:53):
Infinite banking structure.
And so grandma and grandpa showed up.
I saw him at a New Year's party,Joan and I presented to them.
They brought.
They hadn't seen a presentation.
They brought 10 people.
Half of them are from their family.
We went down to the Ronald, RonaldMcDonald House, offered us a room,
and they brought people to hearthis for the very first time.
It's been four and a half years.
They've got policies in threegenerations of that family.
(31:16):
Several of them have adopted,several of 'em are slow to understand
what's going on, but now they'rein that capital crunch flip, right?
Their policies are getting to the0.4 years in, or even if they didn't
bank with it, they didn't utilize it.
It's just something that'saccumulating cash value.
They're an owner, but not a banker yet.
They're in the place where now it'srunning efficiently enough that a
dollar goes in and more than a dollarcould come out and they're starting
(31:40):
to ask new questions, but theyalso have 'em in three generations.
So things are going to.
Really change for that family inthe next four and the next 40 years.
It's all different now.
Yeah.
It, it is so fun.
Right.
As you guys have done this andstart seeing this, uh, how long
have you guys been in the business?
It's been almost, uh, eight yearsfor us, seven and a few months.
(32:03):
So I, I just think about this as like, I,I don't know if I'll retire, but like to
be able to, or whatever that word means.
I, I know Nelson didn't like thatword, um, but like thinking about.
Us, you know, we're younger, uh, howthat's going to be 50 years from now.
So, um, what are some things that as, asyou guys have been doing this, seeing this
(32:28):
for eight years, uh, similar to us, thatsome of the things that you're like, oh
my gosh, do I have to fight this again?
Uh, and, and we, you just wanna getover this, I don't know, mindset hump.
What's one of those things that you'rejust like, seriously, I'm so tired of?
Conversation.
Conversation.
Well, uh, that can happen lots ifyou're not in a good mental space.
(32:51):
Right.
But I, I think the importantthing is understanding that you
gotta meet people where they are.
And because of all, a lot of the workthat we do on podcasts like this and,
and YouTube videos and social mediais that we talk to first timers a lot.
Mm-hmm.
And first timers generallyask the same set of questions.
Right.
Little different from person to person,but generally the same set of questions.
(33:12):
Yeah.
And so actually one of the.
Best things that I think you cando in this business is get really
good at answering that first setof questions and not allowing your
brain to play that mental trick onyou to say, oh my gosh, here we go
again with the same question, right?
Mm-hmm.
Uh, that's actually a lot of whereour business impotence started
because we wanted to make videosor resources for people who.
(33:36):
Ask the same question.
Yeah.
Because a little bitof that was true, man.
We just keep answering the same thing.
What if we can make avideo to answer it for us?
You know, that sort of thing.
Um, but, but, but honestly, Imean, talking to people, we talk
to people every single day aboutall stages of infinite banking.
Whether they're introduced to it forthe first time, uh, in the process
of getting their policy started,have just gotten their policy
(33:58):
started, have had their policy fora week or six months or six years.
Uh, we talk to people and generallyspeaking, it's all, almost.
The same set of questions, right?
It just depends on where they are.
Yeah.
And so, uh, one thing for me thatI've really been focusing on is not
to allow my, my brain to play thattrick on me where I'm getting tired or
burnt out 'cause of the same question.
(34:19):
Uh, what's important is to understandthat it's the first time that that
person is asking the question.
And so therefore, I needto be available for them.
Uh, excited for them, uh, happy toanswer and make sure that I help
them in the best way possible.
That's good.
I, I think so.
Uh, also as you talk to peoplemaking sure, like, I guess that
(34:39):
they're teachable, like they wannahear the answers and step into it.
Um, and, and that's one I, Ilike you guys have the cups.
Um, the different, different, um.
Uh, you, I don't remember.
You can explain the, the cup thing,but, um, I, I kind of think about
like, uh, the profit first, the10, 10 10 savings or, um, you know.
(35:05):
Bucketing system, andI think that's similar.
Uh, if you wanna tellpeople what, what is that?
You, you say this all the time,these, this kind of cup idea.
Yeah.
The, so I'll tell you your last questionand this question kind of fit together.
Mm-hmm.
Uh, there was a time where I waschatting with a lot of people, uh,
every single day trying to get them tounderstand, uh, how to use their policy.
(35:27):
So I was in a specific.
Place in our business where I wastalking to all the folks who just
recently started policies, having acall with them to make sure that they
understood and what I realized mm-hmmis people were having a big, big.
Uh, brain, uh, fault leak.
Yeah.
Like a, like leak, A stoppage.
There's a stoppage point when we talkedabout really the difference between
(35:50):
withdrawing money from a system, froma bank account and loaning money.
Mm-hmm.
And they were not putting it together.
And so, uh, I think I was complaininginternally, uh, and maybe complaining to
my brother who says, well, what we shoulddo is make a video or make an example.
Yeah.
And I said, well, this is what I alwayssay, and I've said it 14 times today.
You know, we gotta, we gotta dosomething a little bit better.
(36:12):
And that's really where the,uh, three Cup setup was born.
I'll let Jeremiah jump in to explainexactly what our three Cup setup is.
Yeah.
What happened was people kept notquite understanding that when they take
money from their policy, get money fromthe insurance company, borrow against
their cash value, man, they're notwithdrawing anything like Jonah said.
(36:36):
It's a different bucket and he'sjust, you know, woe is me while being
aggressively complaining after gettingoff a call where I'm sure it was tough.
And I said, well, I mean, I don't know.
Create some video, think of what to do.
He's like, I don't know what to do.
That's the whole point.
That's why I'm complaining.
Like they think it's in the samebuckets in a different bucket.
(36:56):
And I said, well, let's putit in a different bucket.
So that's how the threeCup setup was born.
So we show the three cups setup.
There's three cups anda side of dividends.
There's a small shot glass.
Normally when you look atour stuff, and you can find
this@threecupsetup.com if you wannawatch the video, and we have 'em online.
And, uh, a couple of differentYouTube videos, lots on.
(37:17):
Our social media shortversion stuff as well.
But Cup one is where we givethe insurance company money.
We pay premium, so that'sgonna be the red cup, cup one.
We are going to deposit premiumin this, so we can kind of
combine the idea of paying premiumand putting a bank together.
So we have premium and we have depositssometimes written on the cups, and
that buys us a policy that's cup three.
(37:38):
Actually, it's a blue cup becausewe are guaranteed at death.
To be blue in the face.
Mm-hmm.
And we got a blue cup for that.
So they'll send you money at that point.
There's a big payout, a pool of money.
We've got peace of mindand a big pile of cash.
Everything, of course, is obliteratedbecause we grew a Baptist.
So it's a bunch of P words here so far.
Yeah.
Yeah.
(37:59):
And then cash values.
The equity we have so far, becausewe bought the entirety of the death
benefit day one, they must pay it.
If we died day two, they'd be upsetif they had to pay it that early.
Because they miscalculatedwhen they, when we die.
Yeah, the cash values, how muchof what we bought is equity.
(38:20):
So far, we understand that in realestate, everybody seems to get it
in real estate and life insurance,that we blow our minds away trying
to figure out what is going on.
So cash value's green.
The money's green can be spent,and cash value in cup number
two is ready to be leveraged.
We can borrow against cash values andwe physically take money out of this
cup when we're doing our showmanshipand we're showing people what's up.
(38:43):
So the three cup setup is premium cashvalue and death benefit, and we organize
policies on purpose to be structuredthat there is cash value day one.
Yeah, dividends are a little shotglass that come annually with the right
type of company and the right typeof policy build, and that's a lesser.
Thing to understand at the outsets,but if people can kind of see that
(39:04):
visually and social media offers us theopportunity to take something that took
Nelson an entire book in 20 years and10 hours seminar, well what if we can
put it in two minutes really quickly?
Yeah.
So people can kind of visualize itand watch a hundred of them in a row.
Maybe they'll get it.
Uh, that really was the beginning ofsomething that really changed for us at
a time during COVID where social mediawas spiking in terms of viewership.
(39:28):
On TikTok and Instagram, we got involved.
Jonah complained enough, we thought ofsomething we could do about it and boom,
we now have some sort of kind of flagshipvisual and yeah, set up for people to
understand, whoa, that's what's going on.
Well, now I get the policy I alreadyown, and the next person goes,
(39:48):
oh, well if that's how it works.
Okay, that's easy.
Why didn't the other guy say that?
And we're like, well, it took us fouryears to come up with three cups.
So like give the other guy some credit,even though he shows spreadsheets.
I, I think that, uh, the visual thingand, and why I wanted to bring that
up is 'cause, you know, uh, youngerpeople are more visual and we have
32nd, um, I, we're like squirrels.
(40:11):
Uh, we, we, we can't even likekeep track for 30 seconds, right?
Um, let alone 10 hours.
Uh, and so how do we best position,I don't know whether what our
lizard brains are gonna be like in.
Um, five years from now.
Mm-hmm.
Sure.
We're gonna be like, um,what do we need a cup for?
I don't know how we're gonna do it, but,um, it's gonna be crazier, but I love
(40:34):
that for what, what you guys are doing.
So anything, I know we're,we've been going for a while.
Anything you wanna make sure that weshare or that, that, as you've been
doing this, that, that you wannamake sure that, that you are giving?
You, you maybe the, the bigthing that you're like, Hey,
(40:57):
this is why I do all this.
Yeah.
This is the main reason.
May, maybe it's life insurance.
That's, that's a great thing.
Infinite banking, but, butwhat's the biggest thing that
you're like, I wanna leave?
I think there's an internalmotivation for both of us.
It's very collective.
Even though we're different people, uh,we are brothers and we work together
all the time, there's a very collectivemotivation that there is something
(41:20):
different for our children than we had.
Mm-hmm.
Both of us are dads.
I have four.
He has three.
And both of us often talkabout our kids and how we are.
Training them to understand this, howwe are buying toys and Pokemon cards,
we both have boys and um mm-hmm.
We are doing, uh, thattype of stuff all the time.
So I think for us, being able tohelp families understand, especially
(41:43):
entrepreneurial families, familieslike ours, families who look like
us, families with little kids, beable to shift the conversation that
money is not the root of all evil.
The being in love with it 'causeyou don't understand it and being in
love with it, and so you hoard it andbeing in love with it so you don't
share it, being in love with it.
So you give it all away no matter what.
(42:06):
All of those things are comingfrom a place, from someone who is
not at home and at rest using it.
Yeah, understanding it.
That's what we'd like to change.
So when we ask people on thephone in the first five minutes.
Hey, how much do you makeand how much do you keep?
And whatever.
It's normal conversation in our families.
Yeah, normal conversation with our kids.
(42:27):
I think that's a big motivation for us.
And so being able to help peoplewho want the information and
they want education first.
We're educating here.
We're not selling you one specificthing and there's so many people,
Hey, tell it to me straight beforewe get into whatever pitch you have.
And I'm like.
This is not going to go well.
Kinda like he said, this is not gonnago well because in the end you have
(42:51):
to be convinced you'd like to buy.
And one of our things that we arevery conscious about and we'll
tell people on a free consultationcall about your cash flow is you
need to pick the numbers, not me.
Yep.
That's kind of why I'm going to talkabout cups for 30 minutes because you
are gonna have to pick the numbers.
(43:12):
If you pick some numbers,we'll talk about those.
But until then, I'm just making stuff up.
So we wanna educate first.
That's a big thing for us.
I, I mean, I would echowhat my brother said.
And also just talk a little bit more.
We talked about, at the beginning ofthe episode here, just about cashflow.
Cashflow to me, gives you the freedomto do the things that you love to do,
(43:34):
the things that you wanna do, to spendthe time with the people that you love,
or time doing what you'd love to do.
And so for me, that's a really bigmotivation and a really big piece
that I wanna help lots of people with.
Like, listen, we gotta getyour cash flow in a place.
Where you now have thefreedom to choose, right?
To make those choices yourself about,uh, who to help, who to bless, who
(43:56):
to spend time with, where to go.
And, and that for me is a big, um,man, that's a big internal motivation.
Uh, sometimes I remind folks thatback when I was working in the bank or
at the insurance company, we used tohave some quarterly meetings, right?
And they would say, where doyou see yourself in five years?
And of course, they'relooking for an answer.
A couple steps higher on the corporateladder and still here and Right.
(44:19):
And I used to tell them at home is whereI see my, that's where I want to go.
I want to go home.
That's where I like to be.
Those are the people I like to hang out.
Like I just want to go home.
And that for me, I did not realizeit at the time, but of course get
a little older, realize it now.
It's, it's cashflow thatmakes the decision for you.
You do.
You can do those things if your cashflowis passive, if your cashflow is a
(44:45):
dollar higher than your bills are,if your cashflow can come in without
you having to work for it, right?
Instead of active income, passive income.
And that's possiblethrough infinite banking.
Uh, and so that's what I want to helppeople understand and help people realize.
But like I said earlier aswell, it's a process, right?
Yeah.
It doesn't just happen on day one.
You gotta work for it.
(45:05):
Yep.
I think it's all about that.
When I talk to clients, it'sall about that freedom, right?
And everybody wants financial freedom.
They want to be able to do whatthey want, when they want to do it.
Uh, but it takes work and effortto, to build the the right
cups, build, put in the right.
Uh, things in place.
Um, but our kids, man, my son, he is like,man, I, I just wish money wasn't a thing.
(45:28):
Um, uh, he thinks about that becausehe hears about some people not getting
paid well and other people that are,and he is like, I I don't like that.
That's, that's bad.
Um.
But then he also learnsthe power of compounding.
Uh, he has, don't interrupt mycompounding a t-shirt, and it's, oh, love.
That's, it's up to us as parents and,and you guys, as you listen to be
(45:54):
the, uh, don't just give it to theeducator educators and say, they're
gonna teach me about money, butunderstand how the flow of money works.
And if you don't understand,be around people that.
Are trying to learn that, uh, flowand change that, 'cause that's,
that's how we're gonna change ournext generation, uh, I believe so.
(46:15):
Any, any closing thoughts, um, beforewe leave, we'd love that we were here.
Thank you for the conversation.
If anybody out there in your audienceworld wants to look up our stuff, you
can find us at the banking bros onmost of the platforms that you like.
And you can go straight to a websitecalled save end spend system.com
for a getter getting started videoand kind of how we do our process.
(46:39):
We appreciate it.
Cool.
Awesome.
Well, thanks again for joining us.
Don't forget guys, hit that likesubscribe, share, do all the things
that you do on the social media world.
So, and we will talk to you next time.
Hey guys, welcome to the Wealth WisdomFinancial Podcast, YouTube channel,
wherever you're listening to us.
Um, as you know, we've been doinglots, uh, and lots of more interviews,
less of just me and Amanda rambling.
We like to add in other people who.
Actually, they, theymay be smarter than us.
They actually do some of the same,same things that we do or similar.
(00:25):
And today though, I get to interview thebanking bros. So as you guys know, Amanda
and I, um, we've been doing businesstogether, um, and we're still married.
Um, it's been 19 years,uh, and two businesses.
Um, but now I get tointerview two brothers.
Who do the same kind ofindustry that we're in.
(00:49):
Uh, they are the banking bros.
Uh, real life, uh, brothers,Jeremiah and Jonah.
Do they wanna teach people howto save and spend money at the
same time by using something theywere never taught growing up?
I don't know.
Does that sound familiar?
Uh.
At school and at the office.
This is that infinite banking concept.
So we really wanna like, bringin how they found this concept.
(01:14):
Uh, we could talk all day longabout faith, uh, about kids,
about, I don't know, what else?
All kinds of things.
Um, their brother actuallyalso used to, uh, own a coffee
shop or does own a coffee shop.
So, uh, the other one, uh, the next.
Third.
Uh, so anyway, uh, hereis Jeremiah and Jonah.
(01:36):
There you go.
What going on.
Alright, thanks for having,appreciate that intro.
Thank you for having, I know right.
Doesn't he have a coffee shop?
He has, yes.
So we do have a brother between usin terms of lineage and he has been
in the coffee business for a while.
Yes.
Decade or so.
And has had shops and mobile cateringas well for very high end coffee.
(01:58):
I, I, I don't envy him, uh, at all.
Um, you know, being inthat industry and all that.
So kind of the blend between youguys and him is what we are, I
guess my wife and I with coffeeand mocha, what you mean my blend?
Oh, I can go with Mocha.
I would say my favorite drinkand then we'll get into some
(02:19):
of the stuff we called it.
The Spto.
Spto is, uh, spicy hot chocolate.
It's mocha.
With cayenne pepper.
Five.
Five shakes of cayenne pepper, five shakesof cayenne pepper, five shakes of pepper.
I'm not sure I'm drinking this,but keep continue and hazelnut.
Then you have espresso, of course, with,um, coconut milk and 2% milk mixed.
(02:46):
So you can actually, um, steam it.
And that was our signature drink.
The sp it's like a spicy mocha.
Amazing.
Uh, it sounds good to me.
It sounds like something I would like.
It does not sound like somethingI'll be drinking, but, uh, I
appreciate the whole ingredient list.
Now I know what to avoid.
Now you, you're probably like ablack coffee all the way, right?
(03:08):
Uh, no.
I, I actually don't preferthe taste of black coffee.
I do like espresso, which isinteresting 'cause I don't prefer
black coffee, but I do like espresso.
No.
If I'm gonna drink coffee, I'm definitelygonna put some creamer in it, maybe a
little syrups and something like that.
I'm, I want some flavor.
I'm a fuel, I'm a purist.
Uh, if it's coffee, um, youknow, and that, that's just me.
(03:31):
So anyway, we could keep talkingabout coffee, but I want to talk about
like, you know, uh, how you guys.
Um, it doesn't just randomly happen thattwo, two guys end up doing life insurance.
Right.
How did you end up going from, Idon't know, you, Jeremiah and Jonah?
(03:53):
Um, what was life like beforethen and how did, who came?
Who came first?
Like the chicken, the egg.
Like which, which one are you?
The chicken and the egg.
That, that got each other going.
Yeah.
Alright, good.
How question did you convince.
Other person to say, Hey,we should start a business.
'cause you know, this wholething is amazing, but most
(04:13):
people are like, you're crazy.
So this is, uh, theseare all good questions.
You are right.
Nobody grows up planningto be an insurance agent.
Yep.
Nobody.
And, uh, we're the same way.
So, uh, I guess I came first as the egg.
I'm older.
So does the egg eggcome before the chicken?
No, it's the chicken.
(04:33):
Is that what you're saying?
It is.
Okay.
I don't know.
So I'm the older brother,uh, old of all three of us.
Uh, the one who's notin the business as well.
And we grew up in a family thatdidn't talk about money, not because
it was taboo, we didn't talk aboutit 'cause we didn't have anything.
There was nothing to talk about, would'vebeen a pretty short conversation.
Mm-hmm.
So, uh, our parents were involvedin ministry and I know you
(04:53):
have a history in that as well.
And also in military, it was basicallymilitary and ministry type mix.
And we have a stepdad who is stillan active Air force chaplain.
So that was some of our upbringing.
Little bit of moving around transient.
I'm also older than Jonah.
By a kid generation.
(05:14):
So I'm eight years older than Jonah,and uh, we did not get into this space
until we became little p practitionersand clients of somebody who taught
infinite banking, and that was 2016.
So we learned about it late 20 15, 20 16.
So we're very much grown by then.
It's a first generation thing for usand our story about why we decided
(05:36):
to go into business that comes later.
Gotcha.
So, so you got, um, olderbrother taught little brother
saying, I found this cool thing.
Um, so little brother.
What, what, where did you likesay are, you are just crazy.
Like how did.
Well, I'm not sure.
You said older brothertaught little brother.
(05:57):
Maybe that's the wrong phrasing.
Older brother definitely discoveredand was connected to people who could
explain what infinite banking wasfirst, but actually right outta school.
Um, uh, right when I finishedcollege, I actually got a job
working at a conventional bank.
Mm-hmm.
I was there for about twoyears, two and a half years.
It really wasn't for me.
A lot of my colleagues were leavingthe banking industry and going to the
(06:19):
insurance industry, so I followed suit.
And so when, at the time that Iwas seeing infinite banking for
the very first time, my backgroundwas in traditional banking and in
property and casualty insurance sales.
Oh, gotcha.
So, uh, when my older brotherintroduces, Hey, they're using insurance.
I don't really know what's happening,but it's insurance and they're using
(06:40):
it for banks and you gotta comelearn, uh, it was actually some things
that were just right down my alley.
I, I understood.
I knew.
What was happening in that space.
Right.
I, I could, I could, I could, uh, getus further along a little faster just
because of the background I already had.
Right.
Gotcha.
It was, uh, really introduced.
(07:00):
He did introduce me to what wasgoing on, and then from there it was
kind of like a three legged race.
Right.
Uh, at some point we're together inthe middle, but then one of us is
taking the outside and kind of speedingthe group along, that sort of thing.
So.
So it wasn't just one person, it waslike a combined thing and, and like,
almost like a, uh, I don't know, I wannause all the religious language, but
(07:23):
maybe the Holy Spirit or something washappening that, uh, kind of melded this
together, that you're like, oh, wow,there's something, hindsight 2020, right?
You can put the dotstogether going backward.
You cannot put the dotsthere going forward.
So hopefully the Holy Spirit was in it.
I, Hey, greed may have been a part of it.
I'm sick of being broke.
Brandon.
So that's how it may havestarted at the beginning.
(07:46):
And uh, yeah, so to be able to begroomed into a business partnership
that you have with a family member,you're doing the same thing.
Insurance sale.
Like these aren't thingsyou plan out, right?
They really aren't things you plan out.
It's not a secondary generation business.
Our folks don't knowanything about insurance.
We definitely outpace them in allcategories, including property casual.
(08:09):
We just know more things about it.
Money was not a big topic in our house.
There's a lot of ministry focus.
We definitely have servant leadersand lay people in our family.
Mom and dad, were working inchurch style stuff quite a bit
and uh, including the military.
So.
Yeah, we, you know,looking backward Oh yeah.
Seems like a god thing.
(08:29):
Moving forward.
We're out here trailblazing, right.
Pushing westward againstan unforgiving wilderness.
Yeah.
Maybe like more prophetic, if you will.
If you, there you go.
There you go.
Uh, and, and so probably even then,I'm, I'm curious, um, so Dave Ramsey
is, has like a stronghold, uh, in thechurch world, uh, where your family.
(08:53):
Friends, were they like fans of him?
Did they listen to him?
Um, was it not really a thing in yourchurch background or, or where was that?
Where was he at?
Very interesting.
Yes, actually, so 2005, I'mthe one who remembers the
numbers and the dates in 2005.
We live in the northwestcorner called the Upstate.
It's a ten eight county regionor so in South Carolina.
(09:16):
And Dave Ramsey made an appearance at achurch and that church was in our town.
And mom in 2005 saw themarquee at the church.
So then she goes to theradio and then hears him.
So literally Dave Ramsey'smaking appearance at a church.
And this is 2005.
If you guys are not thinking throughthe timeline of Dave Ramsey's
(09:38):
comeuppance, this is not a big church.
This is not an arenastyle mega church at all.
Hmm.
This is a congregation of under500 and he's speaking, this is
before he's got all the books.
He's got two books probably at this point.
So mom discovered the financialawareness in our family first.
(10:00):
I'm in college at that time.
Jonah's still in grade school,and that's where it came from.
So I was very interestedin mom's interest in this.
I didn't like talk radio,so I didn't really love Dave
Ramsey to listen to him per se.
She gave me this book, totalMoney Makeover told me to read it.
I'm in college, I can't read books.
(10:21):
I'm busy in class, and so I didn'tread it till I finished school 2006,
but that was the awakening for me.
And, uh, as you've, uh, seen thiswhole thing of, of the Dave Ramsey,
he's gotten exposure grown, uh,as well as some of us, right.
(10:42):
Where has been some of the collide,I guess you could say, um, in the
principles that, that you have and asyou teach your clients specifically?
Um, I would say, um.
Culturally, probably you have a different,like, I, I was on the south side, right?
And so we're taught, well,there's no money and money's
(11:03):
evil or those kind of things.
And, and how, how has that beenreflective culturally for you guys?
Um, if, if that makes sense.
Sure, I'll jump in for that one.
Uh, you are exactly correct.
Uh, now that we are adults and we have,uh, of course our own agency where we
(11:23):
help people understand the infinitebanking concept, we do combat or, uh,
talk to people all the time who have gota big love for Dave and his teaching.
And, uh, I respect Dave in histeaching, especially when he
talks about getting out of.
Debt.
I think that it is the average Americanabsolutely needs some of those principles,
needs to apply them in their lives.
(11:43):
It's when you get past gettingout of debt that some of his
principles start to fall apart.
And for those who don't realize that, uh,the first part of his information and,
uh, and uh, expertise applies really well,but the second half of his information
and expertise start to fall apart, it'sthose people normally that say, well,
it works so well in the first half.
(12:05):
I don't know if I'm ready to not.
Trust him and believehim on the second half.
Right?
Yeah.
And so some of those things that wehave to combat often are maybe his
most famous lines and phrases, right?
Where he talks about, uh, buyingterm and investing the difference.
Yeah.
We talk to people about that all the time.
Uh, maybe when he talks aboutcash is king, we have a saying
around here that cash is not king.
(12:26):
It's actually cash flow.
Cash flow is key.
Yep, yep, yep.
Uh, he talks a lot about having nodebt, cutting up your credit cards.
People used to get on the internetor get on the, uh, radio Right.
And, uh, scream freedomfrom Braveheart, I think.
Right?
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Uh, and he doesn't use any debt.
Well, of course we coach and teachpeople that, uh, you can use that
to your advantage as leverage.
There's other things that you cando, other things that you could do.
(12:48):
Consider.
Yeah.
And so there's a couple of fundamentalteachings that Dave has that we
combat all the time when it comesto like cultural differences.
Uh, in my opinion, the people that we'veworked with up to this point, it's not.
It's not, uh, like a super vastcultural difference in my opinion.
(13:09):
Uh, of course there are avenuesand areas where it could be and is,
but for most of the, most of thetime, the people that we decide to
work with have absolutely heard of.
Dave heard of his teaching apply,some of it, not, maybe not all of it.
Mm-hmm.
Uh, and it seems likethat's the growing, uh.
Facade with Dave.
We're gonna listen to some things.
(13:29):
Not all, uh, I can verify some things,but this other thing that he said,
like, I know for a fact it can bedifferent, you know, that sort of thing.
And, and we end up running to that a lot.
So hopefully that's, uh, that,that answered your question.
Well, and, and I just, I, I'm againan activist at, at heart and I
think about some of the, uh, systemsthat are in place that keep us,
(13:53):
um, maybe in slavery, if you will.
Um, I am, I'm from the, uh, Chicago,and in Chicago there's the south
side and the north side, and there'sa freeway that divides, um, right.
And, and so there wassystematic oppression.
That that created and, and I believethat part of our job and what your
(14:15):
jobs are is to help us have freedom.
Full freedom, not just economic orpersonal freedom, but, uh, we're, we're
celebrating, uh, as I record this,it's, uh, close to the 4th of July.
Um, and, and just thinking about thatidea of financial freedom and how is,
(14:36):
like for you guys being in this worldof, of infinite banking, uh, how is that?
Changed for you guys thinking, Hey,we're helping people actually be
free, not just yelling, freedom andthen going back into slavery because,
you know, something happened, uh, aclient happened to a client of mine.
(14:57):
Yeah.
But, but staying financially free.
And how have you been able,or are you able to educate?
Your clients and why doesinfinite banking matter so much?
That's a great question and a great pointbecause I will corroborate your message
that when I got out of debt, and this wasstudent loans only, not consumer debt.
(15:17):
I told you I finished collegein 2006, mom handed me the book.
So I've got student loans,but I didn't have a car note.
I didn't have a house mortgage.
Mm-hmm.
We didn't have kids, youknow, things like that.
Uh.
I got to the point I was so frugal,so focused, laser focused on the goal.
Gazelle intensity, if you understandDave's kind of terminology.
(15:38):
Yeah.
I got outta debt, but I wasn'tused to spending any money
and I got to the second half.
Jonah pointed that out.
Didn't know what to do, didn'tknow how to do it, didn't, uh,
my expenses started to skyrocket.
I'm moving toward eventually marriageand kids and things like that.
So.
I didn't know how to handle that.
I just knew how to be frugal.
So you're exactly right.
(15:59):
What?
That's not freedom.
Now I, I'm afraid to go eat at BurgerKing because I've been afraid to eat at
Burger King for the last three years.
So Garrett Gundersontalks about this a lot.
It's a lot easier to get into themindset of frugality or scarcity.
Um, than it is sometimes ofabundance of opportunity.
(16:19):
Yeah.
So what I really needed to be doingwas looking at how do I make more money
in the marketplace rather than, how doI make sure I never look at Netflix?
Right?
That's not really living abundant.
Now you don't need to have.
Netflix to feel abundant.
The point is, I wasn't feeling abundant.
'cause I never spent money.
I didn't know how to, I didn't knowwhat I should go for an opportunity.
'cause I'm like, no, no, no.
You never spend your money.
(16:40):
You just hoard it.
So what we help people understand isthere is the save and spend system.
The money that you make, you needto keep the money that you make, but
you still have to be able to spendleverage and move toward abundance.
Like you said, we think that's abiblical principle as well where, um.
Uh, Jesus talked about, I came togive you life and that abundantly.
(17:02):
So we look at six areas of life.
Often we talk about it sometimesin our stuff, especially in
our one-on-one conversations.
That's how we coach our clients.
Fun, family, friends.
Fitness, financial, and faith.
Those are the six areas.
So we're looking for abundanceand all those things.
And the plans of the diligence leadto abundance, that's also biblical.
So you're exactly right.
(17:23):
What we're trying to help peopleunderstand is what metrics are
we gonna actually look for?
Are we looking for proudnessthat we only eat beans and rice?
Are we looking for how much ofthe money that you made did you
keep in a certain period of time?
And how are your passiveinvestments doing?
Are we moving toward dollars thatcontinue to generate into your life?
(17:45):
Passive residual incomehigher than your bills?
And what if that passive residualincome is also in type income tax free?
So there are different words.
Yeah.
And language we can use aroundmoney while still being.
Not a spender.
Right.
We not being an over over consumer,I don't know what the term is
(18:06):
right there, but not being crazy.
We're gonna be frugal and smart and, but,but it's very, it's very much interesting.
Mm-hmm.
We're talking about thatcultural divide as well.
Our stepdad who is in the AirForce is in ministry, um, he's
from South side Chicago, right?
Robins, yeah.
Robins, Illinois.
So I guess he's on the underside of that.
Freeway.
I don't know.
Yeah.
Um, you know, better than me.
Yeah.
There we go.
So, uh, there's a lot of people whocome from that side of the freeway or
(18:29):
the side of the tracks, or maybe eventhat side of the church congregation.
Mm-hmm.
Hey, we're organ side people, organ sidepeople are broke and piano side people got
a little more money, that type of thing.
So we're trying to helppeople understand that.
But it starts internally andyou're right, it is mental.
It's a cultural shift.
It's a mindset shift.
Yeah.
Before it's actually a money shift.
(18:52):
Yeah.
Um, what would you say?
Uh, I would agree at this point I was,I was gonna jump in and say some more,
but I think he did it well enoughthat, uh, I'm gonna take the next one
and I'm gonna say, uh, that I agree.
Nice.
Um, I, I just want, I don'twant to make sure I'm like, oh
yeah, we're just having, I want.
(19:14):
Of us have a real conversation.
Oh, we can go back and forth.
That's fine.
We, we've, we've, we've been on somany great podcasts with folks who
are colleagues in this business.
We've kind of gotten into the cadence.
Yeah.
Unwritten, like, I'll take one,then you take the next one.
You know, unless somebody callsthis out for something specific.
Well, and, and one of the things I,I've thinking about is why I am in this
is, is it became, I, I'm a. All aboutethical economics and community building.
(19:38):
That's what the coffee shop was.
Um, buying ethical coffee,you can't say that.
Um, I'm gonna set peoplefree and then, um.
Oppress people by buying bad coffee.
That is horrible for other people.
Just because I don't seethem doesn't mean it's, yeah.
You know?
(19:58):
Good point.
And so that was why we got into this andwhy we got into this financial system
and saying, oh my gosh, this thingis built to keep us in, uh, slavery.
You just use credit cards and younever can get out because you.
You know, had a mistake andnow you're 32% interest.
Um, and, and, and people will ask,well, um, if you just have a policy
(20:23):
life insurance, it'll solve it.
So as you've guys have been workingwith clients, how have you worked with
them to say, may, maybe it's not apolicy, maybe it's a mindset thing.
Before we do that, um, how haveyou been able to coach them?
Or what do you do when you know.
They're, they're, they, they'renot ready for it, but I mean,
(20:45):
they maybe have the money.
But they, they need something now.
I don't know.
Does that, does that make sense?
I'm sure.
I'm trying to think through the mindset.
Yeah, it makes sense.
So let me, I'll talk a little bitabout some things that we've talked
about internally, some thingsthat we've done with clients, but
realistically, you're exactly correct.
Buying a whole life insurance policy,specifically one designed to be used
(21:05):
for the infinite banking concept doesnot shift your mentality and make you.
Way wealthier than you werefive minutes ago or last week.
Mm-hmm.
That, that's just not what it is.
And we've had many a conversationsabout how can we turn the people
that we work with from whole lifepolicy owners to infinite bankers
(21:26):
because they're, they're not the same.
Now you might think, well, I boughtthe infinite banking policy, so no,
that makes me an infinite banker.
But no, buying the policy makes youa whole life insurance policy holder.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
There's some mindset things.
There's some actions that you've gottabe comfortable with in order to turn
yourself into an infinite banker.
And infinite banking is what unlocksand unleashes that potential, right?
(21:48):
Infinite banking is what, uh,can provide the cash flow.
Infinite banking is what can providethe mindset shift and, and, and more.
And so there's lots of things thatwe do, but most importantly, we kind
of teach people that it's a process.
This is not something thatyou're just gonna get.
On day one.
Right.
If you, if you just get it onday one or you just buy the
thing and that would change it.
(22:09):
Everybody would own it.
Everybody would buy it.
Yeah.
They'd be working really hard tosave up so they can buy the one
thing that makes everything better.
Right.
It just doesn't work like that.
I talked to a gentleman just afew weeks ago who said, called our
phone, said, I've got X amount ofmoney, few hundred thousand dollars.
My goal is to have passive cash flow ofx. A few thousand dollars a month, and so
(22:32):
I'm looking for the product that'll do it.
That's literally how hestarted the conversation.
And so by the time we were finishedwith the conversation, right, it
was an understanding that this,there's not a magic product.
My, you know, mm-hmm.
Fell.
There's not one.
If there was one, Iwould've bought it first.
Yeah.
And I'd be telling you, it'sthis product, you know, you'd be
able to search on the internet.
What's the product that did that worksso well for all these famous people?
(22:56):
And you'd be able to just buy thatand you'd, you'd have it, right?
It's not the product, it'sactually the mindset shift.
Um.
That particular person is notactually a client of ours.
He's not working with us, and it's.
I probably knew that 30 secondsinto the conversation when he
started the conversation by saying,I'm looking for the quick fix.
Right?
Yeah.
And it's like uhoh, that's notsomebody that's gonna be coachable
(23:18):
and teachable and be willing to walkthrough this process together in
order to actually accomplish the goal.
So I think that's, uh, most importantto the people that we work with.
Just understanding it's a process.
We're here to help you.
We're gonna guide you through it.
We've got all sorts of fun stuff,resources and classes, and,
and live events, and, and youjoin us live and ask questions.
(23:38):
We got all sorts of stuff, butthe important part is that you've
got someone to actually walk youthrough it to actually help you.
And if you've got that and youstick to the plan, then that
plan can become your reality.
Whether it takes you a couplemonths or a couple years, right?
You can make it happen.
That's awesome.
I, again, uh, as people come inand, and as they listen to our
(23:59):
content and your content, it isabout the mindset and the heart.
Um, and not just a, Hey, you buy thisand it'll quick fix, like, solve right?
And that, that's the consumeristic side.
You just buy this and you'll be happy.
Uh, tomorrow.
And, and it, it's a different, um, thing.
(24:21):
Now I wanna go back to, um,some of the civil rights.
I, I was le recently in,um, Montgomery, Alabama.
Uh, it was about a, a year ago, and I,I come across this guy named AG Gast.
Uh, have you ever heard of him?
Yes.
Um, so, so he, he says A portionof all you earn in is free to keep.
(24:43):
Um, I, I've heard it somewhere else too,like, I don't know, profit first, richest
man in Babylon, those kind of things.
And I'm like, oh my gosh.
Um, this guy, uh, I think there'ssome other things he, you know, that,
that he did as far as banking goesand, and formed an insurance company.
But he, but.
Was able to fund theCivil Rights movement.
(25:06):
Um, um, he was one of those people.
Uh, have you guys ever like, thought aboutor heard, I'm sure you've heard about
him, but, but what are your thoughts onwhat that, what happened back in the.
Yeah, it's a great story.
Um, talking about, uh, so I'veread the book, green Power.
Mm-hmm.
So, uh, that book is based on his life.
(25:27):
Mm-hmm.
And during the, uh, civil RightsMovement specifically, he was, he had
made it big at that point and he mm-hmm.
Was able to fund and finance a lotof the things that were going on.
Um, I'm not sure how muchwas going on in Montgomery.
I think he lived inBirmingham, so there was, yeah.
Birmingham.
Okay.
Got it.
So, um, it's all.
Alabama, of course.
(25:48):
Yeah.
But, um, so Birmingham was, if anybodyremembers out there, Birmingham,
Bombingham, this is Bull Connor.
This is the bombing of the 16th StreetBaptist Church and the four little girls.
This is where the, um, March,um, kids March happened.
This is letter from aBirmingham jail, all this stuff.
Mm-hmm.
Birmingham is huge for all thisstuff, and partially because
(26:10):
it was backed by AG Gaston.
So AG Gaston, um, first starteda. Um, burial insurance mm-hmm.
For burial.
Um, and a, a black, a blackper, um, black family.
Um.
Kind of system for, and thesepeople are paying 25 cents a month
for their premiums, you know,in 1910 and things like that.
(26:33):
By 1960, uh, this manhas got a lot of money.
And in the nineties he diedin like 96, I wanna say.
Yeah.
Um.
I don't remember exactly, but he, youknow, he is in our lifetime for sure.
He died and he was estimated tobe the richest black person at
some point in the United States.
Mm-hmm.
So about 140 or so million dollars.
(26:53):
So I remembered a fewthings about his life.
It was just so significant.
And he built it on the backof a life insurance system.
Yeah, yeah.
A life insurance system and, um.
He did so much philanthropicstuff for his community as well.
But what was interesting, uh, abouthim is he came from nothing and
he realized a profitable business.
(27:14):
But kind of like you said.
Look, I don't, I wanna bein an ethical business.
I wanna be in a businessthat helps people.
So if we're gonna, you know, havechild slave labor to get these coffee
beans, I don't wanna be a part of that.
Yeah.
Maybe those are things thathave crossed your plate.
Crossed your mind.
You know, Mr. Beast, he's huge right now.
He's got a chocolate company, andso these are beans that are in the
(27:35):
ground and you realize, man, thereis childhood slavery everywhere.
Mm-hmm.
I don't wanna be involved with that,even though I'm in a chocolate company.
Well, AG Gaston is in abusiness of insurance.
Yeah.
And crazy enough, you think about this,of course we're all going to die one day.
That's an inevitable.
Yeah.
We're all going to pass away.
So there's a loss there.
But outside of that loss, which we know iscoming, that AG Gaston me and you can't do
(27:57):
anything about, no one loses an insurance.
Yeah.
No one loses.
Everyone has made whole.
So by us putting in that quarter,our family can get that a thousand
dollars, you know, 110 years ago.
For the burial, we can be made whole.
The insurance company wins.
The insurance agent wins.
(28:19):
There's commission and the family wins.
Mm-hmm.
Actually, no one loses in this.
We all collectively bear the burden.
Of the person that died, but nobodygets taken advantage of at all.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So all parties win andthat is very interesting.
That's not why we gotin for the community.
(28:42):
We got in because we wanted to usethe system and learned well the
agent that how us out wins, we win.
And the insurance company wins.
And in a mutual company environment,which we use for the infinite banking
concept, there's even dividends.
So there's no outside shareholdersthat need to be, um, answered to
in a mutual environment as well.
(29:03):
So very interesting, um, that theMartin Luther King movement of the
19, late fifties and sixties inBirmingham was financed by the guy.
Who had the insurance company, buthe also had the restaurant and the
motels and things like that so peoplecould stay, you know, when they came
to town and get ready for the march.
We've got MLK takingpictures on that balcony.
(29:24):
We all have seen a few of them andeverybody kind of in the courtyard there
he is talking to the kids or talking tothe adults before the children's march
boom, that's Ag Gaston's Hotel, you know?
And uh, he was able to keep thingsmoving and grooving and going when yeah,
there was obviously disenfranchisement.
Against the black community in Birmingham,in the south for those types of topics.
(29:45):
So they got the money from ag.
And this is something I, I, again,thinking about this stuff and saying,
Hey, we wanna start a movement.
Uh, the, um, with Nelson Nash, youknow, he was, he was there as well.
Yeah, he was in Birmingham, right?
Yeah.
I loved his faith background, Uhhuh,and, um, what, what he says and,
(30:07):
and then just thinking about, um.
What we're doing as a culture and, uh,as even business owners, we, I mean,
we, we sell life insurance, right?
It's crazy that we do this, but, butit's so much fun when people get it and,
and how this will impact communities.
We, we could impact wholecommunities, uh, by introducing them.
(30:30):
Like you guys did this in a, your onebrother telling another brother, right.
And others that, that then changed.
Family.
Right.
And, and that's, I don't know, familybanking, isn't that what it's called?
That is, that's exactly what it's,uh, you know, this week I had a
conversation with a family who, um,is now in a three generation mm-hmm.
(30:53):
Infinite banking structure.
And so grandma and grandpa showed up.
I saw him at a New Year's party,Joan and I presented to them.
They brought.
They hadn't seen a presentation.
They brought 10 people.
Half of them are from their family.
We went down to the Ronald, RonaldMcDonald House, offered us a room,
and they brought people to hearthis for the very first time.
It's been four and a half years.
They've got policies in threegenerations of that family.
(31:16):
Several of them have adopted,several of 'em are slow to understand
what's going on, but now they'rein that capital crunch flip, right?
Their policies are getting to the0.4 years in, or even if they didn't
bank with it, they didn't utilize it.
It's just something that'saccumulating cash value.
They're an owner, but not a banker yet.
They're in the place where now it'srunning efficiently enough that a
dollar goes in and more than a dollarcould come out and they're starting
(31:40):
to ask new questions, but theyalso have 'em in three generations.
So things are going to.
Really change for that family inthe next four and the next 40 years.
It's all different now.
Yeah.
It, it is so fun.
Right.
As you guys have done this andstart seeing this, uh, how long
have you guys been in the business?
It's been almost, uh, eight yearsfor us, seven and a few months.
(32:03):
So I, I just think about this as like, I,I don't know if I'll retire, but like to
be able to, or whatever that word means.
I, I know Nelson didn't like thatword, um, but like thinking about.
Us, you know, we're younger, uh, howthat's going to be 50 years from now.
So, um, what are some things that as, asyou guys have been doing this, seeing this
(32:28):
for eight years, uh, similar to us, thatsome of the things that you're like, oh
my gosh, do I have to fight this again?
Uh, and, and we, you just wanna getover this, I don't know, mindset hump.
What's one of those things that you'rejust like, seriously, I'm so tired of?
Conversation.
Conversation.
Well, uh, that can happen lots ifyou're not in a good mental space.
(32:51):
Right.
But I, I think the importantthing is understanding that you
gotta meet people where they are.
And because of all, a lot of the workthat we do on podcasts like this and,
and YouTube videos and social mediais that we talk to first timers a lot.
Mm-hmm.
And first timers generallyask the same set of questions.
Right.
Little different from person to person,but generally the same set of questions.
(33:12):
Yeah.
And so actually one of the.
Best things that I think you cando in this business is get really
good at answering that first setof questions and not allowing your
brain to play that mental trick onyou to say, oh my gosh, here we go
again with the same question, right?
Mm-hmm.
Uh, that's actually a lot of whereour business impotence started
because we wanted to make videosor resources for people who.
(33:36):
Ask the same question.
Yeah.
Because a little bitof that was true, man.
We just keep answering the same thing.
What if we can make avideo to answer it for us?
You know, that sort of thing.
Um, but, but, but honestly, Imean, talking to people, we talk
to people every single day aboutall stages of infinite banking.
Whether they're introduced to it forthe first time, uh, in the process
of getting their policy started,have just gotten their policy
(33:58):
started, have had their policy fora week or six months or six years.
Uh, we talk to people and generallyspeaking, it's all, almost.
The same set of questions, right?
It just depends on where they are.
Yeah.
And so, uh, one thing for me thatI've really been focusing on is not
to allow my, my brain to play thattrick on me where I'm getting tired or
burnt out 'cause of the same question.
(34:19):
Uh, what's important is to understandthat it's the first time that that
person is asking the question.
And so therefore, I needto be available for them.
Uh, excited for them, uh, happy toanswer and make sure that I help
them in the best way possible.
That's good.
I, I think so.
Uh, also as you talk to peoplemaking sure, like, I guess that
(34:39):
they're teachable, like they wannahear the answers and step into it.
Um, and, and that's one I, Ilike you guys have the cups.
Um, the different, different, um.
Uh, you, I don't remember.
You can explain the, the cup thing,but, um, I, I kind of think about
like, uh, the profit first, the10, 10 10 savings or, um, you know.
(35:05):
Bucketing system, andI think that's similar.
Uh, if you wanna tellpeople what, what is that?
You, you say this all the time,these, this kind of cup idea.
Yeah.
The, so I'll tell you your last questionand this question kind of fit together.
Mm-hmm.
Uh, there was a time where I waschatting with a lot of people, uh,
every single day trying to get them tounderstand, uh, how to use their policy.
(35:27):
So I was in a specific.
Place in our business where I wastalking to all the folks who just
recently started policies, having acall with them to make sure that they
understood and what I realized mm-hmmis people were having a big, big.
Uh, brain, uh, fault leak.
Yeah.
Like a, like leak, A stoppage.
There's a stoppage point when we talkedabout really the difference between
(35:50):
withdrawing money from a system, froma bank account and loaning money.
Mm-hmm.
And they were not putting it together.
And so, uh, I think I was complaininginternally, uh, and maybe complaining to
my brother who says, well, what we shoulddo is make a video or make an example.
Yeah.
And I said, well, this is what I alwayssay, and I've said it 14 times today.
You know, we gotta, we gotta dosomething a little bit better.
(36:12):
And that's really where the,uh, three Cup setup was born.
I'll let Jeremiah jump in to explainexactly what our three Cup setup is.
Yeah.
What happened was people kept notquite understanding that when they take
money from their policy, get money fromthe insurance company, borrow against
their cash value, man, they're notwithdrawing anything like Jonah said.
(36:36):
It's a different bucket and he'sjust, you know, woe is me while being
aggressively complaining after gettingoff a call where I'm sure it was tough.
And I said, well, I mean, I don't know.
Create some video, think of what to do.
He's like, I don't know what to do.
That's the whole point.
That's why I'm complaining.
Like they think it's in the samebuckets in a different bucket.
(36:56):
And I said, well, let's putit in a different bucket.
So that's how the threeCup setup was born.
So we show the three cups setup.
There's three cups anda side of dividends.
There's a small shot glass.
Normally when you look atour stuff, and you can find
this@threecupsetup.com if you wannawatch the video, and we have 'em online.
And, uh, a couple of differentYouTube videos, lots on.
(37:17):
Our social media shortversion stuff as well.
But Cup one is where we givethe insurance company money.
We pay premium, so that'sgonna be the red cup, cup one.
We are going to deposit premiumin this, so we can kind of
combine the idea of paying premiumand putting a bank together.
So we have premium and we have depositssometimes written on the cups, and
that buys us a policy that's cup three.
(37:38):
Actually, it's a blue cup becausewe are guaranteed at death.
To be blue in the face.
Mm-hmm.
And we got a blue cup for that.
So they'll send you money at that point.
There's a big payout, a pool of money.
We've got peace of mindand a big pile of cash.
Everything, of course, is obliteratedbecause we grew a Baptist.
So it's a bunch of P words here so far.
Yeah.
Yeah.
(37:59):
And then cash values.
The equity we have so far, becausewe bought the entirety of the death
benefit day one, they must pay it.
If we died day two, they'd be upsetif they had to pay it that early.
Because they miscalculatedwhen they, when we die.
Yeah, the cash values, how muchof what we bought is equity.
(38:20):
So far, we understand that in realestate, everybody seems to get it
in real estate and life insurance,that we blow our minds away trying
to figure out what is going on.
So cash value's green.
The money's green can be spent,and cash value in cup number
two is ready to be leveraged.
We can borrow against cash values andwe physically take money out of this
cup when we're doing our showmanshipand we're showing people what's up.
(38:43):
So the three cup setup is premium cashvalue and death benefit, and we organize
policies on purpose to be structuredthat there is cash value day one.
Yeah, dividends are a little shotglass that come annually with the right
type of company and the right typeof policy build, and that's a lesser.
Thing to understand at the outsets,but if people can kind of see that
(39:04):
visually and social media offers us theopportunity to take something that took
Nelson an entire book in 20 years and10 hours seminar, well what if we can
put it in two minutes really quickly?
Yeah.
So people can kind of visualize itand watch a hundred of them in a row.
Maybe they'll get it.
Uh, that really was the beginning ofsomething that really changed for us at
a time during COVID where social mediawas spiking in terms of viewership.
(39:28):
On TikTok and Instagram, we got involved.
Jonah complained enough, we thought ofsomething we could do about it and boom,
we now have some sort of kind of flagshipvisual and yeah, set up for people to
understand, whoa, that's what's going on.
Well, now I get the policy I alreadyown, and the next person goes,
(39:48):
oh, well if that's how it works.
Okay, that's easy.
Why didn't the other guy say that?
And we're like, well, it took us fouryears to come up with three cups.
So like give the other guy some credit,even though he shows spreadsheets.
I, I think that, uh, the visual thingand, and why I wanted to bring that
up is 'cause, you know, uh, youngerpeople are more visual and we have
32nd, um, I, we're like squirrels.
(40:11):
Uh, we, we, we can't even likekeep track for 30 seconds, right?
Um, let alone 10 hours.
Uh, and so how do we best position,I don't know whether what our
lizard brains are gonna be like in.
Um, five years from now.
Mm-hmm.
Sure.
We're gonna be like, um,what do we need a cup for?
I don't know how we're gonna do it, but,um, it's gonna be crazier, but I love
(40:34):
that for what, what you guys are doing.
So anything, I know we're,we've been going for a while.
Anything you wanna make sure that weshare or that, that, as you've been
doing this, that, that you wannamake sure that, that you are giving?
You, you maybe the, the bigthing that you're like, Hey,
(40:57):
this is why I do all this.
Yeah.
This is the main reason.
May, maybe it's life insurance.
That's, that's a great thing.
Infinite banking, but, butwhat's the biggest thing that
you're like, I wanna leave?
I think there's an internalmotivation for both of us.
It's very collective.
Even though we're different people, uh,we are brothers and we work together
all the time, there's a very collectivemotivation that there is something
(41:20):
different for our children than we had.
Mm-hmm.
Both of us are dads.
I have four.
He has three.
And both of us often talkabout our kids and how we are.
Training them to understand this, howwe are buying toys and Pokemon cards,
we both have boys and um mm-hmm.
We are doing, uh, thattype of stuff all the time.
So I think for us, being able tohelp families understand, especially
(41:43):
entrepreneurial families, familieslike ours, families who look like
us, families with little kids, beable to shift the conversation that
money is not the root of all evil.
The being in love with it 'causeyou don't understand it and being in
love with it, and so you hoard it andbeing in love with it so you don't
share it, being in love with it.
So you give it all away no matter what.
(42:06):
All of those things are comingfrom a place, from someone who is
not at home and at rest using it.
Yeah, understanding it.
That's what we'd like to change.
So when we ask people on thephone in the first five minutes.
Hey, how much do you makeand how much do you keep?
And whatever.
It's normal conversation in our families.
Yeah, normal conversation with our kids.
(42:27):
I think that's a big motivation for us.
And so being able to help peoplewho want the information and
they want education first.
We're educating here.
We're not selling you one specificthing and there's so many people,
Hey, tell it to me straight beforewe get into whatever pitch you have.
And I'm like.
This is not going to go well.
Kinda like he said, this is not gonnago well because in the end you have
(42:51):
to be convinced you'd like to buy.
And one of our things that we arevery conscious about and we'll
tell people on a free consultationcall about your cash flow is you
need to pick the numbers, not me.
Yep.
That's kind of why I'm going to talkabout cups for 30 minutes because you
are gonna have to pick the numbers.
(43:12):
If you pick some numbers,we'll talk about those.
But until then, I'm just making stuff up.
So we wanna educate first.
That's a big thing for us.
I, I mean, I would echowhat my brother said.
And also just talk a little bit more.
We talked about, at the beginning ofthe episode here, just about cashflow.
Cashflow to me, gives you the freedomto do the things that you love to do,
(43:34):
the things that you wanna do, to spendthe time with the people that you love,
or time doing what you'd love to do.
And so for me, that's a really bigmotivation and a really big piece
that I wanna help lots of people with.
Like, listen, we gotta getyour cash flow in a place.
Where you now have thefreedom to choose, right?
To make those choices yourself about,uh, who to help, who to bless, who
(43:56):
to spend time with, where to go.
And, and that for me is a big, um,man, that's a big internal motivation.
Uh, sometimes I remind folks thatback when I was working in the bank or
at the insurance company, we used tohave some quarterly meetings, right?
And they would say, where doyou see yourself in five years?
And of course, they'relooking for an answer.
A couple steps higher on the corporateladder and still here and Right.
(44:19):
And I used to tell them at home is whereI see my, that's where I want to go.
I want to go home.
That's where I like to be.
Those are the people I like to hang out.
Like I just want to go home.
And that for me, I did not realizeit at the time, but of course get
a little older, realize it now.
It's, it's cashflow thatmakes the decision for you.
You do.
You can do those things if your cashflowis passive, if your cashflow is a
(44:45):
dollar higher than your bills are,if your cashflow can come in without
you having to work for it, right?
Instead of active income, passive income.
And that's possiblethrough infinite banking.
Uh, and so that's what I want to helppeople understand and help people realize.
But like I said earlier aswell, it's a process, right?
Yeah.
It doesn't just happen on day one.
You gotta work for it.
(45:05):
Yep.
I think it's all about that.
When I talk to clients, it'sall about that freedom, right?
And everybody wants financial freedom.
They want to be able to do whatthey want, when they want to do it.
Uh, but it takes work and effortto, to build the the right
cups, build, put in the right.
Uh, things in place.
Um, but our kids, man, my son, he is like,man, I, I just wish money wasn't a thing.
(45:28):
Um, uh, he thinks about that becausehe hears about some people not getting
paid well and other people that are,and he is like, I I don't like that.
That's, that's bad.
Um.
But then he also learnsthe power of compounding.
Uh, he has, don't interrupt mycompounding a t-shirt, and it's, oh, love.
That's, it's up to us as parents and,and you guys, as you listen to be
(45:54):
the, uh, don't just give it to theeducator educators and say, they're
gonna teach me about money, butunderstand how the flow of money works.
And if you don't understand,be around people that.
Are trying to learn that, uh, flowand change that, 'cause that's,
that's how we're gonna change ournext generation, uh, I believe so.
(46:15):
Any, any closing thoughts, um, beforewe leave, we'd love that we were here.
Thank you for the conversation.
If anybody out there in your audienceworld wants to look up our stuff, you
can find us at the banking bros onmost of the platforms that you like.
And you can go straight to a websitecalled save end spend system.com
for a getter getting started videoand kind of how we do our process.
(46:39):
We appreciate it.
Cool.
Awesome.
Well, thanks again for joining us.
Don't forget guys, hit that likesubscribe, share, do all the things
that you do on the social media world.
So, and we will talk to you next time.
Popular Podcasts
CrimeLess: Hillbilly Heist
It’s 1996 in rural North Carolina, and an oddball crew makes history when they pull off America’s third largest cash heist. But it’s all downhill from there. Join host Johnny Knoxville as he unspools a wild and woolly tale about a group of regular ‘ol folks who risked it all for a chance at a better life. CrimeLess: Hillbilly Heist answers the question: what would you do with 17.3 million dollars? The answer includes diamond rings, mansions, velvet Elvis paintings, plus a run for the border, murder-for-hire-plots, and FBI busts.
Crime Junkie
Does hearing about a true crime case always leave you scouring the internet for the truth behind the story? Dive into your next mystery with Crime Junkie. Every Monday, join your host Ashley Flowers as she unravels all the details of infamous and underreported true crime cases with her best friend Brit Prawat. From cold cases to missing persons and heroes in our community who seek justice, Crime Junkie is your destination for theories and stories you won’t hear anywhere else. Whether you're a seasoned true crime enthusiast or new to the genre, you'll find yourself on the edge of your seat awaiting a new episode every Monday. If you can never get enough true crime... Congratulations, you’ve found your people. Follow to join a community of Crime Junkies! Crime Junkie is presented by audiochuck Media Company.
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.