August 20, 2025 • 61 mins
In This Episode of the Wealth Wisdom Financial Podcast, host Brandon Neely sits down with Bruce Wehner, Chief Cash Flow Strategist at e3 Wealth and co-host of The Money Advantage Podcast. With decades of experience in education, entrepreneurship, and advanced wealth strategies, Bruce brings a rare blend of real-world grit and financial acumen to the table.
From running a trapping business in high school to managing an automotive shop, and now advising high-net-worth clients, Bruce’s journey is anything but ordinary. He shares how those early lessons in cash flow management became the foundation for helping families and entrepreneurs achieve financial clarity, stability, and confidence.
In this value-packed conversation, you’ll discover:
- Why cash flow, not net worth, is the real measure of wealth security
- How the Infinite Banking Concept can transform the way you think about money
- What it means to operate with a “family office model” without needing ultra-wealthy status
- The biggest financial blind spots Bruce sees in entrepreneurs, and how to fix them
- How to build a lasting legacy that outlives you
Bruce isn’t just sharing theory; he’s a real estate investor and active practitioner of Infinite Banking in his own life. You’ll hear how he applies these principles daily, the role technology and AI are playing in the financial industry, and why long-term thinking is more important than ever.
If you’ve ever worried about running out of money, making costly financial mistakes, or leaving an incomplete legacy, this episode offers practical steps and inspiring perspective to help you move forward with confidence.
00:00 Welcome to the Wealth Wisdom Financial Podcast
00:58 Introducing Bruce Wehner: Chief Cash Flow Strategist
01:39 The Infinite Banking Concept and Its Challenges
09:47 Real Estate Investors and Policy Loans
13:06 The Importance of Cash Flow in Business
27:18 Podcasting Journey and Industry Changes
32:13 Nelson’s Legacy and Industry Pushback
33:20 The Value of Wisdom and Experience
34:56 Infinite Banking Policy in Action
37:49 Embracing Technology and AI
44:55 Human Element in Financial Services
48:31 Building a Strong Team and Future Vision
55:46 Long-Term Goals and Financial Responsibility
58:55 Final Thoughts and Contact Information
🌱 Tune in for an honest, practical, and eye-opening look at how to take control of your cash flow, minimize taxes, and build wealth that truly lasts.
Watch on YouTube: https://youtu.be/vVtLLks6UNw
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:01):
Hey guys, welcome to the Wealth WisdomFinancial Podcast, YouTube channel.
Um, all the things, you know, Ihope, I hope we're everywhere.
We're trying to be.
Um, I don't, not omnipresent, but, butyou know, we're, we're, we're in different
platforms and stuff, so, so this, uh,summer we are doing interviews and if
you've been listening to us, uh, for awhile, you know, we love Amanda and I
(00:25):
love to do, uh, dialogues with each other.
We, we write a lot of content.
I'm there for colorful commentary, uh,because she's a. She likes to write
and I like to make fun of her writing.
I don't know, something like that.
Um, but today I get to do moreof what I am skilled at and
that's doing live interviews.
(00:46):
Um, and I am love that I get to interviewpeople that I look up to in the industry,
uh, people that I've been following.
So, so, I'm.
Gonna be interviewing today.
Bruce, uh, Weiner, who is aChief Cashflow strategist.
Uh, he runs the Money Advantage podcast.
(01:07):
I've been listening to this podcastsince, I think they started in 2017.
I probably startedlistening to them in 2016.
Just kidding.
Um, but, uh, they've been, uh,having this, and it's helped me to
articulate and, and understand even.
And I, I love that, uh, Bruce and his,um, people on his team really come
(01:31):
to it and dialogue about it becausethere's a lot of hype out there in the
social media world, uh, especially now.
Infinite banking is becomingpopularized, I guess you could say.
And there's a lot of, um.
Uh, fakeness out there.
Uh, he is one of the OGs in the IBCWorld Infinite Banking World, uh, and
(01:52):
helps, uh, make sure that we are, uh,doing the right things right, because
there's a lot of people who come in.
Take the book and theydon't become practitioners.
They just use it for their benefits.
Uh, so, uh, Bruce ensures thatall aspects of your financial
life are considered resulting in awell-rounded and personalized plan
(02:13):
to help you achieve your goals.
Uh, he's committed to.
Cultivating, uh, long-termpartnership with his clients.
Again, you'll see why I like him, uh,as an advisor, uh, he'll be there to
provide ongoing support and guidancethrough your financial journey.
Uh, and he's also the co-host, again,of the Money Advantage podcast.
(02:34):
Uh, and he's been doingthis for how many years?
Uh, 17.
He was 17 years as an educator and,uh, varsity head coach, probably
being in the coaching world.
That's he's taking what he is learnedon the, uh, field of coaching in
varsity to the, the field of finance.
(02:56):
Uh, and so, uh, I could keepgoing on with all kinds of stuff,
but let's just bring, uh, Bruce.
Online, uh, here.
So thanks for having us, Bruce.
I probably missed a bunch of things there.
Uh, you've been around in this industryfor a while and you're, you probably have
a bunch of arrows in your back becauseyou've been in, since, you know, with
(03:21):
the Dave Ramsey world and, and all thisstuff that you, you've been arguing
or talking about this for a while.
Yeah.
Well, let's, we can go even, even furtherto the Al Williams, uh, uh, world way
back in the seventies, um, when AlWilliams started, then it became Prime
America and developed the buy termand invest the difference, uh, yeah.
(03:45):
Mantra.
And, um, a lot of people don't knowwhere that came from, but it came from
a l Williams whose father died and, uh,his father actually had a whole life.
Contract.
And, um, his son, Al Williams, um,really was bothered by that fact because
he said the, the insurance agent, ifhe would've sold him a term policy, he
(04:08):
could have got a lot more death benefit.
And of course, that that was really amore of a selfish thing because that
meant he would've gotten more money.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And so then he made it his life'smission to replace every term or
every whole life, uh, policy onthe planet with an army of people.
(04:28):
Um, and I could, and he tried to dothat in the late seventies, early
eighties when I first got into thebusiness in approximately 1987.
And, uh, ran, ran intothose people all the time.
Okay.
Were you, uh, I, were you likerelated or connected to them?
'cause you saw them likethe brother or the son?
(04:50):
Um, I feel like I heard thisstory that, that No, I wasn't, I
wasn't re I wasn't related at all.
But what happened, what actually happenedwas I was working part-time, I was still
in education, I was working part-time forFranklin Life and, uh, with another person
and another practitioner, uh, Mark Benson.
And he and I would go to appointmentsat night and we, a couple of times were
(05:11):
actually, um, ambushed by one of ourclients who actually had a Al Williams
representative with them when we cameto the meeting and basically were
calling us liars and shysters becausethey had convinced them, they had
convinced the couple by using the story.
(05:32):
See, all they're trying to dois sell you this whole life.
They don't really care howmuch death benefit you have.
You know, so and so forth.
And, uh, from that point on, mark,and I wanted to know everything at
what there was about that particularconcept and to then better explain it.
Um, our positioning on it.
We've gotten better, betterBrandon, over the years.
(05:54):
Just like you've got, you've gottenbetter and better over the years because
now we talk about human life value.
At the time we were actuallyjust talking about, well, what
could you afford to put away?
And it wasn't infinite bankingthen, because Nelson, this we're
talking the eighties here, you know?
Yeah.
I mean, Nelson still hadn'twr, uh, written his book,
uh, and in the year 2000.
(06:16):
So we were just trying to, uh,show people the benefits of whole
life insurance, not only for, um,protection, the death benefit, but also
for tax free income into the future.
We weren't talking aboutbanking at that that time.
It wasn't until.
The 2008 financial crisis, when, uh,we decided that we were going to figure
(06:41):
out what went wrong and which, uh,which, uh, financial entities actually
caused this, that we went to the Nightof Clarity in Nashville, Tennessee.
Mark and I did.
And that was hosted by CarlosLara, current current board
member at NNI and Bob Murphy, um,who's former board member at NNI.
(07:06):
And, uh, we were just astounded aboutfractional reserve banking at that time.
So at that time, we decided we weregonna pivot and we were gonna become
a part of the Nelson Dash, um mm-hmm.
Think tank.
And we went to several think tanks.
And then, you know, your listenersprobably don't need to know all this,
the entire, uh, uh, schedule of events.
(07:27):
But then a few yearslater, Nelson decided to.
He wanted to start a practitioner'sprogram because as you mentioned
at the, at the beginning, it'sbecome the wild, wild west with
the infinite banking concept.
Yeah.
Where people are, are usingit as a marketing tool.
If you ever read the book, and Nelsonhimself said, this is not a, this
(07:48):
is a book for the general public.
Yeah.
This is not, this is not a marketing tool.
But now people have justused it as a marketing tool.
They've bastardized the entireconcept and it, and that's why the
practitioners program was put in place.
Yeah.
And, and something I've,um, seen as, um, well.
(08:09):
Our old business name wasGrandma's Wealth Wisdom.
And the tagline was, uh, sometimesintelligence skips a generation.
Um, because basically if youwatched like, what was that, that
movie, it's a wonderful life.
Mm-hmm.
Like their equity theyhad was in life insurance.
Yes.
Right.
And that was the savings.
(08:30):
And that's what we did.
And then we became investors and, andthen, uh, I, I don't know if you think
this or not, but I'm like, huh uh, themarket has gone up, up into the right.
Poverty is, is getting harder and, and itfeels like we are, aren't being safers.
(08:51):
Um, and why I love the, the policies.
Is, it's almost like a forced savings,but we can still have control of the
funds if we need it for emergencies,business development, other things.
Um, what are some of the cool waysthat you've seen somebody maybe
(09:12):
use a policy to their advantage?
And then what are some of the waysthat you're like, man, this is good.
They totally wrecked it.
Yeah.
Okay.
So the, the big one and, and thehot topic right now is I, I'll
start with the wrecking part of it.
Yeah, yeah.
Okay.
Because the wrecking part, I, I tryto stay positive, but I, as you know,
(09:33):
from, from the Money Advantage podcastthat we do, we try to take, we try to
take the position that we're gonna tell.
Most people are intelligent.
They need to know the pros andthe cons of everything, and then
they can make their own decision.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So, you know, real estate investorsusing the infinite banking concept as a
way to either fund a property Totally.
(09:56):
Or fund the down payment of it.
The, the reason they've wrecked it is,in my, in my opinion, is they don't
understand that if you build thesepolicies and design these policies where
you have too much of A-S-P-U-A, youdo actually get a lot of, or even if
it's not SPUA, if it's just a, a lightbase and a heavy PUA, there's nothing,
(10:19):
I'm not saying there's anything wrongwith it, but if you do not realize that
if you're borrowing against this, andthis is from my career, I've seen this.
Mm-hmm.
Even before, even before infinite banking,people are like, oh, this is free money.
You know, I can just borrow itand there's no consequences.
'cause that's what you hear all the time.
You never have to pay it back.
And technically by contract, I alwaystell people by contract, that's true.
(10:42):
But what, what they mean by that isthere's nobody gonna knock on your door.
There's nobody gonna take a lienagainst any of your property.
There's no creditor gonna come andsay, Hey, you gotta pay us back.
But that doesn't mean that yourpolicy's going to perform or even
stay in enforce by doing that.
Yeah.
So, so both things are true.
You never have to pay it back, but it alsodoesn't mean it's what's best for you.
(11:05):
Yeah.
So, so these real estate investors,this is what I've seen, uh,
where they've actually overborrowed and then not pay it back.
'cause they tend to also havethis, this mentality, I gotta
keep my, my money in motion.
I gotta keep my money.
So when they get, when they get alarge chunk, they don't pay back
the loan, they just go put itin another piece of real estate.
(11:27):
And they keep repeating this andrepeating this and repeating this.
And then I'll, I'll give youanother one little quick.
Um.
Story about real estate investor.
I had two um, clients,one in Texas, excuse me.
He moved from Texas to Mississippi.
One in Mississippi, one in Hawaiithat were both real estate investors.
But they got, they thought, they gotsmart and said, wait a minute, a policy
(11:50):
loan is 5% interest, but I could, I couldactually assign my policy to the bank
and they're only charging 3.5% interest.
So look how smart I am.
What they forgot is, isthey've lost control now.
Yep.
So now they have to, they have topay back on the terms of the bank.
(12:12):
And it was a variable rate loan,which outpaced the variable
rate of the insurance company.
So now it went from steadily, from3.5%, it went up to 6.5%, where
the insurance loan was still 5%.
Yeah.
And, and so they went to the bankand said, Hey, we'd like to pay off
this loan so we don't have this,um, this six and a half percent.
(12:37):
They said, okay, pay it off.
They go, well, we need ourcash value to pay it off.
And they're like, well, we're not givingyour cash value until you pay it off.
Yeah.
And so they were, they were stuckbecause they could pay it off at any
time, but the, the collateral couldnot be exercised until it was paid off.
And so they were stuck and, uh,they learned a valuable lesson.
(13:00):
So those are kind of the, the bad things.
Now what are the good things that you,you asked me people have used it for?
Well, um, the best ones I've seenare business transactions where
people have started a business.
Yeah.
And, and for a couple reasons.
One, you know, they're improvingtheir, their lives, they're
taking control of their own lives.
(13:21):
But you could see the pride.
That they've had by startingsomething of their own and talking
'em through that, it's, it's not easy.
It's difficult a lot of times.
Yeah.
But, but them feeling that pride, I savedthe money and now I'm deploying the money
on something that I have control on.
'cause I always tell, I tell peopleall the time, you, you said, I'm
(13:42):
a cash flow strategist from, forE three Wealth here in St. Louis.
And what I've told people is, is if youcan figure out cash flow and you wanna
retire, that's the most important thing.
It's not, it's not building this bigpile of money because everybody wants
to big build a big pile of money.
(14:03):
But what they really say is, I want thecash flow off of that pile of money.
Yeah.
Yeah.
'cause they're, they're notwhittling away the pile.
They're not chippingaway the pile every year.
They're hoping the.
Pile makes some more money andthen they flow that cash flow.
Well, that's what a business does.
A business actuallyproduces you cash flow.
So then I say to them,well, are you gonna retire?
(14:25):
And people are saying, well,yeah, I'd like to retire.
I'd like to, I'd like to, to uh,sell my business, get this big pile
of money and then live off of it.
Yeah.
And I'm like, well, that's cash flow.
That's the same thing.
Yeah.
So why don't you just keep yourbusiness actually put procedures in
place and people in place where youcan step away from your business
(14:49):
but still provide that cash flow?
Because people don't realize thebusinesses are returning cash flow.
If it's run well, 20, 25, 30 3% ofwhatever the business valuation is.
But if you sell it and now goput it in another investments,
you're hoping to get 10%.
Yeah.
(15:09):
So that's not the, that'snot the same cash flow.
So we we're constantly talking about cash.
Cash flow.
Cash flow, cash flow.
Yeah.
And I think that's, uh, Ihear some knocking behind you.
I don't know if that'ssomebody, I'm sorry.
They're doing, they'redoing the roof today.
Oh, yeah.
So, so guys, if you're listening, uh,he's not kicking his desk at the bottom.
No.
Uh, somebody, somebody's, uh,uh, roofing of course, but yeah.
(15:32):
Um, I, I got a story aboutroofers, that's for sure.
So, so I love that on cash flow.
And, and when people talk to meand, and, you know, as a, we wrote
our book, uh, five Oo Stones, andit was kind of the reverse of, you
know, what do I want to give my son?
Mm-hmm.
Right?
(15:53):
And how do I want to, um, educate him?
He's seven.
But, and, and knowing the principlesof how many works is important.
For a 7-year-old.
However, if I don't have cash flow in abusiness or if I'm not profitable in my
business, uh, or the business is in thered, uh, well, uh, who cares what I wrote?
(16:18):
Uh, yeah.
It's, it's, it doesn't matter because it'sa, I'm not gonna give anything to them.
Uh, and so that's, uh, why I love ProfitFirst and why I love combining profit
first with the infinite banking concept.
But what, what people want us to dois to say, well, tell me what to do.
(16:40):
You, you tell me everythingthat, that I need to do.
And Wall Street said, okay, I'll takecare of it for you for a price and for us.
I don't want to abdicatethat responsibility.
I'm gonna educate you.
Here's the 10% versus 40%, or whateveryou want to do, but give them the
numbers to help them make the wise.
Move to start, um, but then, uh,being in their, their court, if
(17:08):
you will, every six months, uh,as your, your, uh, coach, right?
That's, that's kind of, Hey, let's,let's see where the game is changing.
Um, and I love that.
That's why I feel likewe could talk for hours.
Yeah.
Because cashflow strategist, even premiumamount differs depending on cashflow.
And that's why probably why youhave multiple policies, right?
(17:30):
Yeah.
And, and, um, you know, I'm notsaying that everybody that does is a
practitioner or even a insurance agentneeds to be a investment advisor.
Mm-hmm.
Or a, or a tax strategist, or understandsocial security, or understand
Medicare or understand property andcasualty insurance, or understand,
(17:53):
understands the state, uh, implications.
But I'm telling you, when you, whenyou talk to clients about all these
things in an intelligent manner oryou have outside resources that can
help you pull the together the entirefinancial picture, what you can do is
actually help them find premium thatthey can actually put into policies.
(18:16):
And I'll just give you, I'll justgive you a, a couple of examples
from the last couple of weeks.
Um, we were talking about the differencebetween net worth and cash flow.
Well, I have a, uh, potential client.
They were in, they were referred to meup in, um, well, you, you're Chicago guy.
They were just, uh, southof Bloomington, Illinois.
(18:38):
Yeah.
Yeah.
And, and they owned about$15 million worth of farming.
Uh, their acreage wasworth about $15 million.
They had the opportunity, they hadthe opportunity to buy an additional
$2.6 million of their neighbor's farm.
Which by the way, they hadbeen farming for years.
(19:00):
Yeah.
And, and what's interesting, Brandon, isthe reason the neighbor had to sell the
farm is because, and we, I, we probablydon't have time to get into all this,
but, um, that was just a small partof their total estate and the estate
went over the, the federal, uh, yep.
Estate exemption.
(19:20):
And they owed 40% federal and,and I forgot what the estate
amount was in Illinois taxes.
And they were illiquid.
They don't have any money becausethey're all on their land, so
they have to sell the land.
Oh, and by the way, they have tosell the land in a discount because
everybody knows they have to sell.
So they lost out, uh,$1,500 per acre on all this.
(19:43):
And so, but the farmer that'sbuying it is also illiquid.
So we looked at their stuff and,and, um, I finally figured out that,
you know, they have a Roth IRA.
Which they didn't think, they didn'tthink it made sense to, to actually
cash that in 'cause they didn't realizethis is how ignorant people are.
(20:05):
And, and, and I think ignorant,ignorance's the right word.
'cause it just, they ignorantmeans you don't know.
Yeah.
Um, they were afraid they're gonnahave to be taxes on the Roth.
So nobody explained that to 'em.
And then they had cash valued lifeinsurance where they had $456,000 in cash.
Valued life insurance that they weregoing to use for estate planning.
(20:27):
Yeah.
No.
Nobody had told 'em aboutthe liquidity of that.
So suddenly they needed a down paymentfor this and we figured it out from
those two places that they wouldable to, to easily get the 400, I
think they needed $470,000 of Yeah.
Down payment for it.
And so it's just those kind of things thatif as an example of having cash valued
(20:49):
life insurance, that they were able to.
Nelson talked about this all the time.
Opportunities find cash.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So, so they found this great opportunityat $1,500 less per acre because they
had the ability to find the cashthrough the cash valued life insurance,
and they were able to purchase it.
(21:10):
So that was another exampleof how you can use that.
So, so here's, here's one of thethings that as I, as I do analysis
for people, I, I ask for a lot.
Like a full analysis to build up the plan.
And they're like, Hey, could youjust tell me 20,000 or, or sell this?
And I know people in the, in theworld of IPC, that, that just
(21:32):
sell a policy, uh, or whatever.
But I, I want to do a full analysis.
I wanna know your dreams, goals,uh, assets and liabilities.
Um, because, um, using thepolicies or annuities might be
a, a, a, a strategy depending.
Um, but I'm also married to ACFP, so then that helps, uh,
(21:55):
see things that I don't see.
Uh, I'm not a tax person.
Even though a lot of financial, alot of clients think that A-A-C-P-A
is a, a, a financial professional.
They're, they're, they justmaybe file taxes, right?
And to see how these thingsinterconnect is really important.
(22:18):
Right.
And I'm a, what I would say, andyou are as well as the heart surgeon
in this part, but if you understandhow the heart works, you can
affect the other parts of the body.
Um, and so doing a fullanalysis, sometimes they're
like, oh, that's a lot of work.
I'm like, well, because I don'twanna create a monster or too small
(22:41):
of a policy, too big of a policy.
We wanna build the right size andbe able to think strategically
of the different companies orwhatever else we might work on.
Because, you know, you, you workwith some of the same companies.
Some of them are easierto work than others.
Mm-hmm.
Some of them, um.
(23:03):
Uh, well with the marijuana thing, therewas some that are a little more liberal.
Uh, and so understanding that as aspecialist, um, have you had pushback
where you're, they wanna just sellyou, they want you to just build
a policy and you're like, oh yeah,I'm gonna do an analysis full thing.
Yes.
And I, and, and, and I think thetheme of this show is, is basically
(23:25):
the sensationalism that's outon the internet, social media.
And that is one of my biggest petpeeves is where, you know, a person
will meet somebody for five toseven minutes and ask 'em, well, how
much you wanna put into a policy?
And they tell 'em, they say, okay,I'm gonna send you some illustrations.
Get back to me.
You know, it's, there's no analysis ofwhether they can sustain that, that they
(23:46):
have an understanding of the flexibility.
If there's no talk aboutthe protection aspect of it.
And I actually use thedoctor example all the time.
Also, when a person says,well, do I really have to talk
about my tax return with you?
And do I actually really haveto show you my cash flow?
And I'm like, well, letme ask you this question.
(24:06):
If you go to the doctor andyou have a, a headache Yeah.
And the doctor says, okay, I'mgonna listen to your heart.
Do you go, oh no, doc, I I don'twant you to touch anything.
Just fix my head.
And he, he says, well, Ineed to draw some blood.
Oh no doc, I don't wanna do anything.
Just fix my head.
I said, that's the same thingyou're asking us to do in this
intertangled web of money.
(24:28):
I said, can you really think that you cando anything, this world without money?
You know, we always talk about,well, money's not that important.
I'm gonna live a great life.
Try living one day without money.
I mean, it's just mm-hmm.
It's just not possible.
And so that's what, and mostpeople are amiable to that.
If they're not, they'rejust not good for me.
They can go somewhere else.
(24:48):
I'm sure you have the same way.
Yep.
Somebody else will do this for you.
I'm not going to do it.
Because those people end upnot taking responsibility.
They end up, um, you're chasingthem for premium every year.
Where's your premium?
Mm-hmm.
We talked about this, youknow, so on and so forth.
So I just try to stay away from that, um,simplify to actually make it more complex.
(25:13):
And, um, what I'm talking about issimplify your procedure so that they can
understand the more complex later on.
So, yeah, I, I see that all the time.
And matter of fact, a lot of people,and I'm sure you have the two.
People come to us after they've goneto one of these situations and say,
I can't talk to those people again.
They won't return my call.
(25:34):
I don't know what, what happened to them.
Can you explain this to me?
Uh, and, and part of why we even wrote ourbook, five Smooth Stones was because, um,
as I've worked with lots of clients, I'masking, what are your dreams and goals?
And they're like, that's a great question.
And I'm like, uh, that'snot a big question.
(25:54):
Like, do you have dreams and goals?
And, and, uh, married couples that I'mtalking to and they're like, I didn't
even, we haven't even talked about that.
I'm like, here, date night question,you know, or various things.
But our, our, in our book, fiveSmooth Stones, we have set your
sights, track your in and out.
Inspect your progress.
(26:15):
Look for 1% and livedeliberately living deliberately.
A policy can fit intothat if it's done right.
Right.
Um, but our need for financingbanking, it's everywhere.
Um, and we have to understand that.
And whenever I can even with, again,profit first, separate from the policy,
(26:36):
I might be able to see, hey, theseguys are, are literally running a
business at 22% interest and, but thenthey're funding in a 401k at whatever.
And you're like, maybe youjust need to stop that part.
Right.
Take care of this part.
Yes.
Um, and, and it gets, it's,it's interesting that people are
(26:58):
like, oh, that's, that's genius.
And I'm like, it, it's just math.
Um, and I'm not that great at math,but my, my wife is, but, but I'm
like, for me, I'm like red and blackon a p and l. We don't like red.
We like black, let's move intothe black as simple as that.
Um, now, now one of the cool thingsis you guys have been doing podcasting
(27:26):
before podcasting was even popular.
Um, I think you started in 2017,I think podcasts or even a thing.
They were starting to be a thing.
Yeah.
What have you seen as you guys havebeen in that world, has changed in
how you guys do podcasting or that noweverybody even they get a license now
(27:50):
they're infinite banking, this or that.
How's that affected you guys?
Yeah, I would say, uh, it was amazing.
First of all, I'll just tellyou the story real quickly.
Uh, I, I met, uh, Rachel and LucasMarshall in 2014 at an event that we
held in St. Louis for insurance agents.
(28:11):
Called the Freedom Advisor, uh, theFreedom Advisor Conference, and we
were trying to help struggling agentsfind more freedom in their lives.
Mm-hmm.
Free freedom of money, freedom ofrelationships, freedom of time,
and, uh, we were just tryingto make the industry better.
Very similar to whatNelson was trying to do.
(28:34):
Yeah.
Um, Nelson was just trying to make theindustry better 'cause he felt like
if we made the industry better, thenit would be better for the consumer.
So we invited a bunch of people, andI think one of them that you, you may
also know James and Ery was there.
Yeah, yeah.
Um, Tom O'Connell was there, so, um, thoseguys were there and Lucas, and Rachel
(28:54):
was referred to come to this becausethey were doing some life insurance,
but mainly just providing it for.
Uh, 'cause they had a, a health insuranceand Medicare supplement insurance agency.
Mm-hmm.
And so afterwards, they, theywere wonderful people and they,
they asked me if they could, youknow, ask me some more questions.
(29:15):
I started mentoring them.
Every once in a while they'dcall, they'd ask some questions.
And then in, in, uh, early 2000,the spring of 2017, Lucas calls
me and says, Hey, I think thispodcasting stuff is gonna take off.
But, um, Rachel, she's prettyconfident on the infinite banking
(29:36):
concept, but she's not that confident.
We just need somebody that canbe the co-host that can answer
all the difficult questions.
Yeah.
And I said, well, listen, I'lldo it under one condition.
All I have to do is show up and talk.
I don't wanna prepare.
And so that, that wasthe condition and our.
(29:57):
You know, at first all we did was onpodcasting and, you know, apple to
iTunes, Brandon, I don't even know 'causeI don't do any of that stuff, you know?
Yeah.
I'm sure you, you know,a lot more than I do.
And our listenership started takingoff and then we started doing it on
YouTube, and then all of a suddenour YouTube subscribers took off.
But then as it, it started to becomea thing, when I, when I say become
(30:20):
a thing, I'm, I'm talk You saidit earlier, it became mainstream.
Mm-hmm.
I, BBC became, became mainstream.
Then we started to level off and I, andwe started to try to figure out why.
And I think it's because we tendto have a, uh, a one hour show.
Yep.
And the sensationalizedpeople are using the tiktoks.
(30:42):
The Snapchats and my understandingis, you know, they're very limited.
'cause people, they just, like you said,you said earlier, just tell me what to do.
They just want, they justwant this quick, quick fix.
So people started moving away fromus to these sensationalized things.
And frankly, Brandon, I'm okay with it.
Yeah.
Because I don't want, I don't wannadeal with those people anyway.
(31:03):
And I'm not saying that as beingharsh, but Simon Sinek, the great
marketer once said something thatstuck with me and says, he said, you
don't wanna do business with everybodythat needs your goods and service.
You wanna do business with peoplethat believe what you believe.
And when that happens, you get greatsynergy to it and you get great energy.
(31:24):
And that energy allows youto, to put out great content.
It's not Dr. A drudgery for it.
So it's, it's kind of flattened outand now it's all, it's starting to flat
out flatten out more because I justrecently, uh, found out that more people,
the la the first quarter of this yearwent to, to different AI like chat GPT.
(31:46):
Mm-hmm.
And they actually, you're using that fortheir search engine rather than Google.
Yeah.
So now we're, we're gonna have tofigure out how, you know, we're gonna
be able to attract people to, youknow, um, our channels because we're
not in the search engine optimizationof what Google is producing for you.
(32:07):
Yeah.
This is, this is about being in business.
You know, you, you haveto, you have to adjust.
And so it's, it, it has changed a lot.
And Nelson saw it changing.
That's why he put thepractitioners program in.
And there was a lot ofpushback in the industry.
Well, Nelson, you're notgonna tell us what to do.
Yeah.
And Nelson was a good southerngentleman and he goes, you're right.
(32:30):
I can't tell you what to do, but whatI can tell you is this is intellectual
property that's been trademarked andcopyrighted, so you can't use that.
Now, when Nelson died in 2019, uh,David Sterns, his son-in-law, who
was a partner, took over the businessand he really struggled keeping
up with the legal aspect of it.
(32:52):
'cause Nelson used was helping him.
Nelson worked till theday he was, he died.
Yeah.
And a lot of people, lot ofpeople think that's tragic.
And actually that's what Nelson wanted.
'cause Nelson, as you remember,hated the word retirement.
Yeah.
Um, he would often quote, you lookup retirement in the dictionary
and it says to take out a service.
He goes, why do you wannabe taken outta service?
(33:15):
He goes, just our societyneeds people like you.
And so, right.
He, I think it would also, he, he,like, he was still working 'cause he was
like, Gandalf, like, I mean, uh, whenyou can be that weight wise, uh, sage
and people pay you to give them adviceon things that you like, man, I did
(33:39):
that when I was 20 and that was stupid.
Right.
And then you're, you're now teachingthem what to do differently.
Why wouldn't you want, why wouldn'tyou, why would you stop that?
Like, I don't, the amount of,I, I don't know if you said this
earlier about, or maybe before weeven went on about wisdom mm-hmm.
(33:59):
The amount of wisdom thatleaves a corporation mm-hmm.
Every year from retirementis just astronomical.
Mm-hmm.
You know?
And so if you can find a way to keepthose people around, you're not constantly
reinventing the wheel when somebodysays, oh, I think we should do this.
(34:19):
And, uh, that person that, well, I'vebeen here for 20 years and we tried that
back then and this is what happened.
I just wanna make you aware of that.
Yep.
That actually has walked out thedoor, and so you have to reinvent the
wheel again, reinvent the wheel again.
And so, um, wisdom is actually applyingthat knowledge that you've already had.
(34:39):
Yeah.
Those mistakes that you've made.
So, and, and I do think, uh, forus, we're younger, but I think you
can learn wisdom and, and buildit even as a young age, right?
Oh, sure.
Some, some kids are wise,um, in certain aspects.
And, and one of the cool things thatI share is being a business owner,
(35:02):
former with the, the coffee shop.
Um, the reason I was able to, um, actuallysell the business, not close the business.
And why I ended up in this industry wasbecause of my infinite banking policy.
Right?
Because I was able to, or, uh, whole lifepolicy that's, you know, the concept,
(35:22):
you know, uh, people, people say that,but, but I was like, I use that to,
uh, take a loan to overcome the flood.
Like literally the roofwas being worked on.
Hopefully there's no rain in yourforecast, but the roof was taken
off and then it rained, which isnot a good thing to happen, right.
(35:45):
Uh, when you have no roof.
And so our coffee shop was flooded.
I get called by the staff and throughthat whole situation, we had also
found out that we were pregnant.
Uh, other things that I'm almost like,Hmm, I wanna sell this, but it's because I
had my policy that I was able to do that.
That's some wisdom for me that I'm, Ishare with people saying, you don't know
(36:08):
when both an opportunity or a stupidflood is gonna happen that you need it
for not, not for growing your wealth,but just per preserving it and making
sure you don't, uh, have to close.
Mm-hmm.
Um.
That was, um, wisdom.
I learned that, you know, now I don'twant anybody to experience that,
(36:31):
but Yeah, you're absolutely right.
You don't have to, you don't haveto be old to have wisdom, but you
do have to have experiences mm-hmm.
Yeah.
That you draw for.
And younger people do and, andfrankly, every day I ask younger people
about technology in, in our office.
Yeah.
You know, I'm like, just this,just this morning I'm doing it.
I'm like, Hey, thisdoesn't make any sense.
What do you?
And they go, oh, well you justhave to click here, here and here.
(36:53):
And it's like, oh, okay.
It's not that they were smarter than me,although I think they're smarter than me.
It's just that they've had thatexperience, you know, as a, the guy I'm
talking about was 20 years old, you know?
Yeah.
He's had that experience whereI haven't had that experience.
Um, so Oh, wow.
You.
Yeah.
Your, well, your thing went all weird.
(37:14):
That was weird.
That is really never seen thatbefore, but congratulations.
Um, um, I, I, I didn't touch anything.
I don't know what happened.
That's, but that was interesting.
Yeah.
So, um, yeah, that, that's, I wasthinking about that with my wife, like
she's, um, a few years younger than me.
Technology is her, likelanguage, uh, more.
(37:37):
And so she does things thatI'm like, oh, I was working on
this, trying to figure it out.
And she did in two seconds.
Right.
Um, now we have chat GBT that doesit in one second in some regards.
And I, and I'm, well, I, here's a questionI'm, I'm curious of, where do you think.
Uh, this whole chat world and,and chat, GPT is is, is here.
(38:01):
It's not going away.
No.
Um, it is being used inthe insurance companies.
It's being used in all of our companies.
Where is, where do we fit and how do westay human while engaging in technology?
That might be a hard one, but I'vebeen thinking about that a lot.
(38:22):
Well, I've been thinking about,I've been thinking about it too.
So one of the things that I dobelieve in is that man, and, and I
learned a lot of this from Nelson,that man does have some human
behaviors that causes them to be lazy.
Mm-hmm.
And, and it's, you know, we're gonnado the, we're gonna do, and we're, I,
(38:43):
you know, Brandon, we always have tobe careful about speaking in absolutes,
but we're talking about in general, um.
Because man is going to do theleast amount possible to get the
maximum benefits that they want.
Okay.
Um, and that's, so I will, before weget there, just just remember what
(39:04):
he, what he said, because we were toldthat with our 4 0 1 Ks and do the least
amount to get the maximum results.
And how did that workout for a lot of people?
I'm curious.
Our term insurance is another one.
Yeah.
By term best rest, pay or, or buy the,buy the most you can for the least
(39:25):
amount of dollars, but they don'ttell you that the time when you really
need it, it probably won't be aroundor it'll be astronomically expensive
so you don't get the whole picture.
So I'm, I'm a big believer thoughthat in of, of what we, we do,
'cause I'm a biologist by nature,so I believe in a evolution.
(39:47):
I, uh, um, you know, Iwas a biology teacher.
A science teacher foryears and years and years.
And so I believe that man has theability to overcome any kind of
obstacles that they're gonna overcome.
And I do believe that, uh, artificialintelligence will cause some obstacles.
It will eliminate some jobs, but wewill also find out that there's gonna
(40:08):
be other jobs that are gonna be createdbecause of artificial intelligence.
And I don't know exactly what those are.
It may be career counselingmay have a, a big uptick.
Yeah.
Because people are like, I lost my job.
Well, let's see how we can, uh,get you, uh, thinking differently.
I think also entrepreneurshipmight actually take off more now
(40:31):
because people are like, I wannatake more control of my life.
And not have myself being, uh, replaced.
My wife is actually a brand marketer andyou know, she, she was actually using it
to write copy, which I'm sure you do too.
Mm-hmm.
And, and, and we do atthe Money Advantage.
And so copywritersaren't as needed anymore.
(40:51):
So I do believe though, thatwe will adjust because I just
believe that's man, mankind.
As a survivor, I actually asked Chad GPTthis the other day, and I'm gonna quiz
you because I think you'll find this.
Uh, yeah.
Interesting.
How many people is it estimated thathave actually been on the earth, uh,
(41:12):
that have been born on the earth since?
Uh, man, man has been on the Earth?
Oh man, maybe, um, because there'sabout eight, there's about 8 billion.
There's about 8 billion now.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So I would say maybe.
(41:32):
Uh, a hundred billion.
Oh, very good.
They, they estimate between eightand a hundred billion people.
Yeah.
8 billion.
Yeah.
That's how eight.
Eight between 80, I'm sorry, 80and a hundred billion people.
They estimated.
Okay.
Yeah.
To me.
And that was kind of surprising to me.
I actually thought thatwas a very large number.
Mm-hmm.
Um, but then you gotta start thinkingabout how many, you know, babies
(41:55):
die at a very, um, you know, youngage because of lack of advancements.
Um, you know, 1935 when social securitycame in, and we, I don't want to
go down that rabbit hole, but, uh,you know, a social security full
retirement age was 65 and that wasalso life expectancy in 1935 was 65.
(42:17):
Yeah.
And now we're up around 78, 78and a half, so and so forth.
Um, so man, man did becomemore and more mortality rate.
Um, got less and expect Rexigot, so a lot of people did
probably, well, no, not probably.
A lot of people did die at veryyoung ages, um, which caused
(42:38):
that number to be pushed up.
Yeah.
So I do believe that the, thestructure of evolution will continue
to help us, um, manage this ai.
You know, we've said this, Brandon,over and over again, you know, I, I
I'm quite a bit older than you, butwhen the calculator came out Yeah.
(42:58):
In, in the, in the late sixties andthen became more readily available
in the seventies when I was in juniorhigh, you know, everybody just thought
this was gonna ruin kids, you know?
Yeah.
They, you can't use a calculator.
You gotta think through this.
You're never gonna be ableto go, go anywhere in life.
Well, that was not, that was thefurthest thing from the truth.
(43:18):
It was actually a tool.
And, and I do think it's, it'smoving in that and leverage.
And, and one of my, uh, friends,actually, I was talking to him recently
because, uh, he knows what I do.
And he wrote, um, the book, um,80 20 Sales and Marketing and, uh,
his name's, uh, Perry Marshall.
(43:39):
And, um, with that, um, idea wasthe, what happened in 96 to 2000,
uh, revolutionized everything.
And we be, we now have the computersand we can talk through these things.
What's happening now with AI islike that except a little bigger.
(43:59):
Mm-hmm.
Um, now will it change us?
Yes.
Uh, will it change?
Hopefully APSs, uh, uh, what I, I hope so.
Yeah.
Uh, APSs, if you guys don't know, is theattending physician statements that you
can never find, uh, in the medical world.
Um, it is, it is.
(44:19):
It's a pain, uh, to do, you know, uh, but,but we, it'll help make things faster.
Now, at the same time, uh, aswe switch how we overcome that.
Now, as I was talking to Perry onthis, uh, I had mentioned what I
do, and he mentioned that, um, justhaving, uh, other people that have
(44:42):
helped him, but then they disappeared.
Uh, they weren't around in the industry.
And, um, and so he had connected withsomebody else for tax and legal, and then
they, they were not, they didn't help him.
They, um, what I've learned inthis is like the human element.
Of, of what we do is being present forthe six month reviews, annual reviews,
(45:06):
um, not just selling a policy and, andthen disappearing, but also educating,
even though that was a high income earnersaying, Hey, how are we using this?
How's your tax situation?
Oh, by the way, it's yourresponsibility to pay taxes.
Um, not just the tax person to file them.
(45:27):
And I, I think a lot of times inour financial world, we're just,
I'll just, I have a guy, they'lldeal with it, and then we don't take
responsibility, uh, for what we did.
And so, um, I think that there'sthat human element Oh yes.
And aspect that even if Bruce.
(45:49):
Me or my wife or or his team,Rachel, over there, uh, helps you.
It's your responsibilityto, um, fund a policy.
And if you take a loan and you don'tpay it back, Nelson says, don't steal
the peas from your grocery store.
That's your responsibility to have that.
(46:11):
Not, I mean, I, I'm gonna educate andhelp, but, but that's so important and
we cannot just abdicate our financialwellbeing to somebody else, including us.
Um, and don't just think AI isgonna solve that for you either.
Right.
Uh, and so, uh, just wanted to leave thatwith you guys as, as you're navigating,
(46:32):
'cause you guys are all navigatingAI in your perspective industries.
We are.
Um, but the.
People part is really important.
Yeah.
If you remember our goodfriend Richard Canfield mm-hmm.
He always points out to, uh, his clients.
The book is calledBecoming Your Own Banker.
Yeah.
(46:53):
And so you're the banker.
You have to take responsibilityfor whether it's a good, it's good
to take a loan out and what theterms are of the repayment are.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So, um, that's the part, part thatactually, frankly, because of my
desire to do tremendous customerservice with our clients, that
I've kind of enabled them too much.
(47:15):
And I'm trying to swing thependulum back the other way.
Because we will, we will, um, actuallyhave 'em call our service center and
we will to help 'em take policy loans.
We don't have 'em, you know,take it through the portal.
Uh, we don't have 'em payback through the portal.
You know, we have, we have 'emactually send us checks or,
or we set up the a CH for 'em.
Yeah.
We're actually, we're actually starting totransition to where they do more of that
(47:38):
on their own to take more responsibility.
I mean, and you've been inthis industry for, uh, what,
little bit longer than I have.
Um, and, and so I'm sure your sixmonth reviews and annual reviews,
uh, are extensive meeting wise.
Um, how do you balancefollow up paperwork?
(47:58):
'cause, uh, because I know dealingwith some of these carriers, uh, the
headaches for client services can be.
A challenge.
Yep.
Um, understatement sometimes.
Uh, and, and also like creatingcontent and doing the things.
What, what brings Bruce Joy as he'shelping other people, and where do you
(48:24):
want to see your, you not necessarilyyour firm, 20 years, 10 years from now?
So I was actually mentoredby really good people, and I
actually became a, a disciple ofStrategic Coach by Dan Sullivan.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
And, um, you know, uh, the, the thingthat, you know, Jason Low, who you
(48:48):
also, you know, very well, you know,it's, it's, uh, how not who mm-hmm.
I'm sorry.
Who?
I'm sorry, who not how.
Mm-hmm.
And I was always trying tofigure out how to do it.
And so when I started figuringout who could do it instead of how
you do it, that was a lot better.
And I tell people likeyourself, this all the time.
And they're absolutelyamazed when I say this.
(49:09):
I haven't taken an application in15 years and I don't even know if I
could take an application anymore.
So we figured out who actuallyenjoys taking applications.
Mm-hmm.
I don't understand why they enjoy doingit, but we have, we have one person in
our firm that, for 15 years now, that's,she does applications for 15 years now.
(49:33):
She follows up with the underwriter'sgetting those APSs for 15 years.
Now when a client wants to take apolicy loan, she sets that up, policy
repayment loan, she sets that up.
So you can't do that overnight, you know?
Mm-hmm.
It's, it's, it's not something that youcan build a business overnight and you
probably need to know each aspect of thebusiness, but it, it should be, in my
(49:58):
opinion, you're gonna get more energyon the stuff that you really like to do.
So Brandon, what I liketo do, and this is where.
I'm working on.
Um, this is, I just wannashow up to meetings and do the
strategies with the people.
I don't wanna do anything else.
I had a meeting, I had a meetingwith the 20-year-old today.
(50:18):
He was with, he was on threemeetings with me yesterday.
And I said, okay, Ryan, uh, what dowe have to do as far as follow up?
I had no idea.
And he goes, okay, for this client,we're gonna do this, this, and this.
So I get on, okay, and I shootoff an email and I do this.
Okay, what's the next one?
And I, I can flow fly throughthose and it gives me energy.
(50:41):
We then sat down with the strategy.
What did they want again?
Okay, they want this, this, and this.
Okay, all right.
I'm gonna look at their financial picture.
Okay, I think we should presentthis, see what they feel like
on this, so on and so forth.
So that's, that's where I, and I'mbuilding a team around me, Brandon, that
is different than most the, the, um.
(51:03):
The, what do you call it?
The experience of most people?
Yeah.
I have a, I have a 46-year-old,I have a 38-year-old.
I have a 31-year-old.
I have a 27-year-old, I have a24-year-old and I have a 20 that
actually are really good workers.
Yeah.
And most people, most people saythese young people don't wanna work.
(51:23):
I don't know what happened.
I think you put it out to theuniverse and you get the same,
that, that same kind of vibe back.
I have tremendous people that workwith me and um, so I just see myself
continuing to give them more andmore, and then I will just work on
the things that I really wanna workon and, and I'm not gonna retire.
It's so weird because, you know, yeah.
(51:45):
I belong to a country club and Ilike to play golf in my free time.
And people know I'm a financialadvisor and an insurance agent.
Well, what does a financialadvisor normally do?
They help people retire.
Right?
So, so they're always askingme, when are you gonna retire?
And I say, I have no intentions to retire.
(52:05):
And I know what they're thinking.
Well, that's weird, you know?
Yeah.
Uh, why wouldn't you wanna retire?
I, and I, I say this, and youcan use, you can use this on your
client's, um, anytime you want.
I say, if I can remove thethings from your job or career
that you don't like, yeah.
Would you retire?
(52:26):
And what's interesting is people can'teven get outta their own way on that.
They say, oh, even if you coulddo that, I still wanna retire.
Yeah.
And I, and I tell them, no, no.
Listen again, what I just said,if I can remove everything you
don't like from your financial.
Career or your job, why would you retire?
(52:48):
And it's just amazing that peoplejust can't grasp that concept.
But that's what I'm trying to do.
And that's all because of Dan Sullivan.
Uh, and I, I think that's for us.
And, and with the Perry MarshallGroup and listening to Dan, uh, a lot.
Is that unique?
What's unique to you?
Understanding yourself if you don'tknow your dreams and goals and
(53:12):
where you want to go or who you are.
As an individual.
Like I've taken Myers-Briggs, I'vetaken the Enneagram, taken all the
tests, and even I've plugged it into,uh, chat GPT and said, okay, make what
do, who am I and what brings me joy?
And it, and it spits back saying,this is what you should do,
this is what you should not do.
(53:32):
Thank God I'm married.
'cause she likes thingsthat I don't like or likes.
Yeah.
Other parts.
And then we build a team and we're, we'reseven years in, but I have a staff of, uh,
let's see, three and a half, three and ahalf or four, um, that are support staff.
'cause there's things I hate doing.
(53:53):
I like doing what you do, showing upand, and then I'm like, I don't know
where the heck it goes after that.
Um, and if we understand ourself andthen the financial system, again,
understanding that, don't abdicate thosethings, but where your lane is, uh, again.
Knowing green and bread ispretty easy for, for me.
(54:17):
Um, we should understand that, butthen live it living in the place that
we, and what I love is, man, we get,we get to choose our own adventure.
Uh, we don't get to, as businessowners, we can choose our heart.
Uh, and I just like that my heart is easy.
(54:37):
It's easy to me, maybe hardfor somebody else, right?
Um, and so my, and, and that's what's funis if you understand your who you are.
Um, that's powerful.
So I, I really, I was, I was inspired bythat because that's where we're at going
and saying, okay, what do we wanna do?
Well, thank 10 minutes from now.
Thanks.
Thanks for that tip.
(54:57):
I'm gonna put all my personality.
Profiles into chat, GPT and see, uh,and try to hone my, hone my vision too.
It is amazing what it tells you.
And then you say, write me a dayon this and, and then you're like,
okay, here's what you don't like.
Okay.
Then you have a, a job descriptionon all the things you don't
like that somebody else likes.
(55:18):
Mm-hmm.
Um, and that's the power of, of community.
Um, so, uh, Bruce, anythingyou wanna leave our listeners
with, uh, before we wrap up?
And again, don't forget, hitthat like button as, as you guys
listen to all these IBC people.
There's a lot out there.
(55:39):
Just remember the long approachis really helpful for you.
Great.
That's, that's actually what Iwas gonna leave people with is
that, uh, don't get caught up inany kind of get rich quick scheme.
Um, there's a reason whythat is under a vernacular.
In our society get rich quick schemebecause it is a, it is a scheme.
(56:04):
I'm not saying that therearen't people that accidentally
all of a sudden get rich.
Um, but that is theanomaly in the situation.
Most people that actually become rich,whatever that means, with which means,
uh, whatever freedoms you want mm-hmm.
Personal relationship, freedoms, freedomswith your, your family, freedoms, with
(56:28):
your time freedom, that money can buy.
Whatever that is, thatdoesn't happen overnight.
And if, if you can't overcome thehuman conditions, uh, that nor Nelson
talks about in his book, then you'regonna ha you're gonna struggle.
Really, really mightly.
Um, and the best way not tostruggle is to think long term.
(56:49):
Uh, Dan Sullivan withhis dos question, um.
Dangerous opportunities.
I'm sorry, it's Ractor question, whichen entail, en entitles, excuse me,
entails the dos, dangerous opportunitiesand strengths, where he says, if we're
sitting here three years from now andwe're looking back on those three years,
what would have to happen in your life?
(57:10):
Well, personally and professionally foryou to feel good about your progress?
He says three years.
Okay.
He doesn't say at the end of this month.
Yep.
You know, or the, evenat the end of this year.
And he actually wanted to actuallygo out further because then he read,
he, then he started writing books tosay 90 day, um, 90 day, uh, 90 day
(57:36):
vision, but a 20, 25-year-old goals.
Yeah.
Because he knew you had toconstantly be changing these.
So that would be the message I'dlike to, to just to share with
people as we end here, is that, hey.
You've gotta write your goals down.
The goals can change, but you gottahave a vision where you want to be and
(57:57):
it can't be in the next 30 days thatyou're gonna be, solve all your problems.
'cause it took you literallydecades to cause all your problems.
Yeah.
And I, and I would, and, and I wantyou to share your, um, information,
but, um, while working with Bruce orme or or somebody like us like that,
(58:19):
or us really, I mean, I know what I'mdoing here, uh, and is you have to
do the work of what is the vision.
We are just the scribes that helpput the, maybe the tools in place
to help implement that vision.
But, but it's up to you and ifyou're coming to us as, as agents
to help you figure out your vision.
(58:42):
Uh, you're coming to the wrong place.
Yeah.
Um, and, and I think that, um,that's a challenge that we have
to face, but, um, be the writerof your, um, your own destiny.
Um, so Bruce, how can they find you?
Well, you can reach out athello@themoneyadvantage.com and,
(59:05):
uh, you can always go through themoney advantage.com and you can get
us, you know, get us through there.
Click this button.
You guys know how it all works.
You know, you click this.
Yes.
Um, if you have questions more about, uh,financial questions that you want to get
straightened out are estate planning orsocial security or taxes, you can email me
(59:26):
directly at B-W-E-H-N-E-R at e, the numberthree wealth.com, b waner@e3wealth.com.
Uh, because I get forwarded stufffrom the Money Advantage, um, website
to, to my own personal email account.
(59:47):
And you know what?
Brandon's great.
I've read his book.
Um, you know, I, I found it very helpful.
Mike Mitz, who he's praising,we've had him on our podcast twice.
We, we practice Profit First andthe Money Advantage Business.
I've been practicing that personallyfor years and years and years.
It's just good common sense.
(01:00:08):
And so we are, we are in alignment.
So Brandon's gonna be able to help youprobably just as much as I can help
you, but if you want to hear it froma different lens or, or, or something
like that, we can, we can talk.
And, uh, if I can help you,I'll, you know, we'll help you.
Awesome.
Well, Bruce, thanks.
Uh, I knew that we'd have a lot to talkabout 'cause we are like, like minds
(01:00:30):
and, and, uh, I really appreciate yourleadership in our lives, even from afar.
Uh, I don't know if you noticed,but you were mentoring us for five
years and, and, uh, for every, uh,at least once a week at the gym.
Um, so in 2017 at LA Fitness.
Well, well, I think, I think I wouldlike to say Nelson was mentoring you
(01:00:53):
because Nelson mentored me personally.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
And I never met.
And, and that, that's one of the thingsis as you guys are, are learning and
growing, uh, reach out to the peoplethat, that you look up to, like ask
them to be a part of their lives.
I never got to meet Nelson.
He changed our life.
Uh, I watched the Banking withLife documentary and that's
(01:01:15):
what led us into this world.
Um, and it was just an amazing,and I, I said, you know.
I can follow that guy.
Mm-hmm.
Um, and so that was what led us here.
So thanks for joining us guys.
Don't forget, hit that like, subscribe.
I think if I do this,it'll pop up something.
I don't know.
It doesn't do it.
It only does it for you.
I tried.
(01:01:36):
I know.
I saw that.
I saw that.
Oh, what the heck?
Doesn't work now.
I don't know.
Uh, anyway, um, thanks for being hereand we will see you guys next time.
Hey guys, welcome to the Wealth WisdomFinancial Podcast, YouTube channel.
Um, all the things, you know, Ihope, I hope we're everywhere.
We're trying to be.
Um, I don't, not omnipresent, but, butyou know, we're, we're, we're in different
platforms and stuff, so, so this, uh,summer we are doing interviews and if
you've been listening to us, uh, for awhile, you know, we love Amanda and I
(00:25):
love to do, uh, dialogues with each other.
We, we write a lot of content.
I'm there for colorful commentary, uh,because she's a. She likes to write
and I like to make fun of her writing.
I don't know, something like that.
Um, but today I get to do moreof what I am skilled at and
that's doing live interviews.
(00:46):
Um, and I am love that I get to interviewpeople that I look up to in the industry,
uh, people that I've been following.
So, so, I'm.
Gonna be interviewing today.
Bruce, uh, Weiner, who is aChief Cashflow strategist.
Uh, he runs the Money Advantage podcast.
(01:07):
I've been listening to this podcastsince, I think they started in 2017.
I probably startedlistening to them in 2016.
Just kidding.
Um, but, uh, they've been, uh,having this, and it's helped me to
articulate and, and understand even.
And I, I love that, uh, Bruce and his,um, people on his team really come
(01:31):
to it and dialogue about it becausethere's a lot of hype out there in the
social media world, uh, especially now.
Infinite banking is becomingpopularized, I guess you could say.
And there's a lot of, um.
Uh, fakeness out there.
Uh, he is one of the OGs in the IBCWorld Infinite Banking World, uh, and
(01:52):
helps, uh, make sure that we are, uh,doing the right things right, because
there's a lot of people who come in.
Take the book and theydon't become practitioners.
They just use it for their benefits.
Uh, so, uh, Bruce ensures thatall aspects of your financial
life are considered resulting in awell-rounded and personalized plan
(02:13):
to help you achieve your goals.
Uh, he's committed to.
Cultivating, uh, long-termpartnership with his clients.
Again, you'll see why I like him, uh,as an advisor, uh, he'll be there to
provide ongoing support and guidancethrough your financial journey.
Uh, and he's also the co-host, again,of the Money Advantage podcast.
(02:34):
Uh, and he's been doingthis for how many years?
Uh, 17.
He was 17 years as an educator and,uh, varsity head coach, probably
being in the coaching world.
That's he's taking what he is learnedon the, uh, field of coaching in
varsity to the, the field of finance.
(02:56):
Uh, and so, uh, I could keepgoing on with all kinds of stuff,
but let's just bring, uh, Bruce.
Online, uh, here.
So thanks for having us, Bruce.
I probably missed a bunch of things there.
Uh, you've been around in this industryfor a while and you're, you probably have
a bunch of arrows in your back becauseyou've been in, since, you know, with
(03:21):
the Dave Ramsey world and, and all thisstuff that you, you've been arguing
or talking about this for a while.
Yeah.
Well, let's, we can go even, even furtherto the Al Williams, uh, uh, world way
back in the seventies, um, when AlWilliams started, then it became Prime
America and developed the buy termand invest the difference, uh, yeah.
(03:45):
Mantra.
And, um, a lot of people don't knowwhere that came from, but it came from
a l Williams whose father died and, uh,his father actually had a whole life.
Contract.
And, um, his son, Al Williams, um,really was bothered by that fact because
he said the, the insurance agent, ifhe would've sold him a term policy, he
(04:08):
could have got a lot more death benefit.
And of course, that that was really amore of a selfish thing because that
meant he would've gotten more money.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And so then he made it his life'smission to replace every term or
every whole life, uh, policy onthe planet with an army of people.
(04:28):
Um, and I could, and he tried to dothat in the late seventies, early
eighties when I first got into thebusiness in approximately 1987.
And, uh, ran, ran intothose people all the time.
Okay.
Were you, uh, I, were you likerelated or connected to them?
'cause you saw them likethe brother or the son?
(04:50):
Um, I feel like I heard thisstory that, that No, I wasn't, I
wasn't re I wasn't related at all.
But what happened, what actually happenedwas I was working part-time, I was still
in education, I was working part-time forFranklin Life and, uh, with another person
and another practitioner, uh, Mark Benson.
And he and I would go to appointmentsat night and we, a couple of times were
(05:11):
actually, um, ambushed by one of ourclients who actually had a Al Williams
representative with them when we cameto the meeting and basically were
calling us liars and shysters becausethey had convinced them, they had
convinced the couple by using the story.
(05:32):
See, all they're trying to dois sell you this whole life.
They don't really care howmuch death benefit you have.
You know, so and so forth.
And, uh, from that point on, mark,and I wanted to know everything at
what there was about that particularconcept and to then better explain it.
Um, our positioning on it.
We've gotten better, betterBrandon, over the years.
(05:54):
Just like you've got, you've gottenbetter and better over the years because
now we talk about human life value.
At the time we were actuallyjust talking about, well, what
could you afford to put away?
And it wasn't infinite bankingthen, because Nelson, this we're
talking the eighties here, you know?
Yeah.
I mean, Nelson still hadn'twr, uh, written his book,
uh, and in the year 2000.
(06:16):
So we were just trying to, uh,show people the benefits of whole
life insurance, not only for, um,protection, the death benefit, but also
for tax free income into the future.
We weren't talking aboutbanking at that that time.
It wasn't until.
The 2008 financial crisis, when, uh,we decided that we were going to figure
(06:41):
out what went wrong and which, uh,which, uh, financial entities actually
caused this, that we went to the Nightof Clarity in Nashville, Tennessee.
Mark and I did.
And that was hosted by CarlosLara, current current board
member at NNI and Bob Murphy, um,who's former board member at NNI.
(07:06):
And, uh, we were just astounded aboutfractional reserve banking at that time.
So at that time, we decided we weregonna pivot and we were gonna become
a part of the Nelson Dash, um mm-hmm.
Think tank.
And we went to several think tanks.
And then, you know, your listenersprobably don't need to know all this,
the entire, uh, uh, schedule of events.
(07:27):
But then a few yearslater, Nelson decided to.
He wanted to start a practitioner'sprogram because as you mentioned
at the, at the beginning, it'sbecome the wild, wild west with
the infinite banking concept.
Yeah.
Where people are, are usingit as a marketing tool.
If you ever read the book, and Nelsonhimself said, this is not a, this
(07:48):
is a book for the general public.
Yeah.
This is not, this is not a marketing tool.
But now people have justused it as a marketing tool.
They've bastardized the entireconcept and it, and that's why the
practitioners program was put in place.
Yeah.
And, and something I've,um, seen as, um, well.
(08:09):
Our old business name wasGrandma's Wealth Wisdom.
And the tagline was, uh, sometimesintelligence skips a generation.
Um, because basically if youwatched like, what was that, that
movie, it's a wonderful life.
Mm-hmm.
Like their equity theyhad was in life insurance.
Yes.
Right.
And that was the savings.
(08:30):
And that's what we did.
And then we became investors and, andthen, uh, I, I don't know if you think
this or not, but I'm like, huh uh, themarket has gone up, up into the right.
Poverty is, is getting harder and, and itfeels like we are, aren't being safers.
(08:51):
Um, and why I love the, the policies.
Is, it's almost like a forced savings,but we can still have control of the
funds if we need it for emergencies,business development, other things.
Um, what are some of the cool waysthat you've seen somebody maybe
(09:12):
use a policy to their advantage?
And then what are some of the waysthat you're like, man, this is good.
They totally wrecked it.
Yeah.
Okay.
So the, the big one and, and thehot topic right now is I, I'll
start with the wrecking part of it.
Yeah, yeah.
Okay.
Because the wrecking part, I, I tryto stay positive, but I, as you know,
(09:33):
from, from the Money Advantage podcastthat we do, we try to take, we try to
take the position that we're gonna tell.
Most people are intelligent.
They need to know the pros andthe cons of everything, and then
they can make their own decision.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So, you know, real estate investorsusing the infinite banking concept as a
way to either fund a property Totally.
(09:56):
Or fund the down payment of it.
The, the reason they've wrecked it is,in my, in my opinion, is they don't
understand that if you build thesepolicies and design these policies where
you have too much of A-S-P-U-A, youdo actually get a lot of, or even if
it's not SPUA, if it's just a, a lightbase and a heavy PUA, there's nothing,
(10:19):
I'm not saying there's anything wrongwith it, but if you do not realize that
if you're borrowing against this, andthis is from my career, I've seen this.
Mm-hmm.
Even before, even before infinite banking,people are like, oh, this is free money.
You know, I can just borrow itand there's no consequences.
'cause that's what you hear all the time.
You never have to pay it back.
And technically by contract, I alwaystell people by contract, that's true.
(10:42):
But what, what they mean by that isthere's nobody gonna knock on your door.
There's nobody gonna take a lienagainst any of your property.
There's no creditor gonna come andsay, Hey, you gotta pay us back.
But that doesn't mean that yourpolicy's going to perform or even
stay in enforce by doing that.
Yeah.
So, so both things are true.
You never have to pay it back, but it alsodoesn't mean it's what's best for you.
(11:05):
Yeah.
So, so these real estate investors,this is what I've seen, uh,
where they've actually overborrowed and then not pay it back.
'cause they tend to also havethis, this mentality, I gotta
keep my, my money in motion.
I gotta keep my money.
So when they get, when they get alarge chunk, they don't pay back
the loan, they just go put itin another piece of real estate.
(11:27):
And they keep repeating this andrepeating this and repeating this.
And then I'll, I'll give youanother one little quick.
Um.
Story about real estate investor.
I had two um, clients,one in Texas, excuse me.
He moved from Texas to Mississippi.
One in Mississippi, one in Hawaiithat were both real estate investors.
But they got, they thought, they gotsmart and said, wait a minute, a policy
(11:50):
loan is 5% interest, but I could, I couldactually assign my policy to the bank
and they're only charging 3.5% interest.
So look how smart I am.
What they forgot is, isthey've lost control now.
Yep.
So now they have to, they have topay back on the terms of the bank.
(12:12):
And it was a variable rate loan,which outpaced the variable
rate of the insurance company.
So now it went from steadily, from3.5%, it went up to 6.5%, where
the insurance loan was still 5%.
Yeah.
And, and so they went to the bankand said, Hey, we'd like to pay off
this loan so we don't have this,um, this six and a half percent.
(12:37):
They said, okay, pay it off.
They go, well, we need ourcash value to pay it off.
And they're like, well, we're not givingyour cash value until you pay it off.
Yeah.
And so they were, they were stuckbecause they could pay it off at any
time, but the, the collateral couldnot be exercised until it was paid off.
And so they were stuck and, uh,they learned a valuable lesson.
(13:00):
So those are kind of the, the bad things.
Now what are the good things that you,you asked me people have used it for?
Well, um, the best ones I've seenare business transactions where
people have started a business.
Yeah.
And, and for a couple reasons.
One, you know, they're improvingtheir, their lives, they're
taking control of their own lives.
(13:21):
But you could see the pride.
That they've had by startingsomething of their own and talking
'em through that, it's, it's not easy.
It's difficult a lot of times.
Yeah.
But, but them feeling that pride, I savedthe money and now I'm deploying the money
on something that I have control on.
'cause I always tell, I tell peopleall the time, you, you said, I'm
(13:42):
a cash flow strategist from, forE three Wealth here in St. Louis.
And what I've told people is, is if youcan figure out cash flow and you wanna
retire, that's the most important thing.
It's not, it's not building this bigpile of money because everybody wants
to big build a big pile of money.
(14:03):
But what they really say is, I want thecash flow off of that pile of money.
Yeah.
Yeah.
'cause they're, they're notwhittling away the pile.
They're not chippingaway the pile every year.
They're hoping the.
Pile makes some more money andthen they flow that cash flow.
Well, that's what a business does.
A business actuallyproduces you cash flow.
So then I say to them,well, are you gonna retire?
(14:25):
And people are saying, well,yeah, I'd like to retire.
I'd like to, I'd like to, to uh,sell my business, get this big pile
of money and then live off of it.
Yeah.
And I'm like, well, that's cash flow.
That's the same thing.
Yeah.
So why don't you just keep yourbusiness actually put procedures in
place and people in place where youcan step away from your business
(14:49):
but still provide that cash flow?
Because people don't realize thebusinesses are returning cash flow.
If it's run well, 20, 25, 30 3% ofwhatever the business valuation is.
But if you sell it and now goput it in another investments,
you're hoping to get 10%.
Yeah.
(15:09):
So that's not the, that'snot the same cash flow.
So we we're constantly talking about cash.
Cash flow.
Cash flow, cash flow.
Yeah.
And I think that's, uh, Ihear some knocking behind you.
I don't know if that'ssomebody, I'm sorry.
They're doing, they'redoing the roof today.
Oh, yeah.
So, so guys, if you're listening, uh,he's not kicking his desk at the bottom.
No.
Uh, somebody, somebody's, uh,uh, roofing of course, but yeah.
(15:32):
Um, I, I got a story aboutroofers, that's for sure.
So, so I love that on cash flow.
And, and when people talk to meand, and, you know, as a, we wrote
our book, uh, five Oo Stones, andit was kind of the reverse of, you
know, what do I want to give my son?
Mm-hmm.
Right?
(15:53):
And how do I want to, um, educate him?
He's seven.
But, and, and knowing the principlesof how many works is important.
For a 7-year-old.
However, if I don't have cash flow in abusiness or if I'm not profitable in my
business, uh, or the business is in thered, uh, well, uh, who cares what I wrote?
(16:18):
Uh, yeah.
It's, it's, it doesn't matter because it'sa, I'm not gonna give anything to them.
Uh, and so that's, uh, why I love ProfitFirst and why I love combining profit
first with the infinite banking concept.
But what, what people want us to dois to say, well, tell me what to do.
(16:40):
You, you tell me everythingthat, that I need to do.
And Wall Street said, okay, I'll takecare of it for you for a price and for us.
I don't want to abdicatethat responsibility.
I'm gonna educate you.
Here's the 10% versus 40%, or whateveryou want to do, but give them the
numbers to help them make the wise.
Move to start, um, but then, uh,being in their, their court, if
(17:08):
you will, every six months, uh,as your, your, uh, coach, right?
That's, that's kind of, Hey, let's,let's see where the game is changing.
Um, and I love that.
That's why I feel likewe could talk for hours.
Yeah.
Because cashflow strategist, even premiumamount differs depending on cashflow.
And that's why probably why youhave multiple policies, right?
(17:30):
Yeah.
And, and, um, you know, I'm notsaying that everybody that does is a
practitioner or even a insurance agentneeds to be a investment advisor.
Mm-hmm.
Or a, or a tax strategist, or understandsocial security, or understand
Medicare or understand property andcasualty insurance, or understand,
(17:53):
understands the state, uh, implications.
But I'm telling you, when you, whenyou talk to clients about all these
things in an intelligent manner oryou have outside resources that can
help you pull the together the entirefinancial picture, what you can do is
actually help them find premium thatthey can actually put into policies.
(18:16):
And I'll just give you, I'll justgive you a, a couple of examples
from the last couple of weeks.
Um, we were talking about the differencebetween net worth and cash flow.
Well, I have a, uh, potential client.
They were in, they were referred to meup in, um, well, you, you're Chicago guy.
They were just, uh, southof Bloomington, Illinois.
(18:38):
Yeah.
Yeah.
And, and they owned about$15 million worth of farming.
Uh, their acreage wasworth about $15 million.
They had the opportunity, they hadthe opportunity to buy an additional
$2.6 million of their neighbor's farm.
Which by the way, they hadbeen farming for years.
(19:00):
Yeah.
And, and what's interesting, Brandon, isthe reason the neighbor had to sell the
farm is because, and we, I, we probablydon't have time to get into all this,
but, um, that was just a small partof their total estate and the estate
went over the, the federal, uh, yep.
Estate exemption.
(19:20):
And they owed 40% federal and,and I forgot what the estate
amount was in Illinois taxes.
And they were illiquid.
They don't have any money becausethey're all on their land, so
they have to sell the land.
Oh, and by the way, they have tosell the land in a discount because
everybody knows they have to sell.
So they lost out, uh,$1,500 per acre on all this.
(19:43):
And so, but the farmer that'sbuying it is also illiquid.
So we looked at their stuff and,and, um, I finally figured out that,
you know, they have a Roth IRA.
Which they didn't think, they didn'tthink it made sense to, to actually
cash that in 'cause they didn't realizethis is how ignorant people are.
(20:05):
And, and, and I think ignorant,ignorance's the right word.
'cause it just, they ignorantmeans you don't know.
Yeah.
Um, they were afraid they're gonnahave to be taxes on the Roth.
So nobody explained that to 'em.
And then they had cash valued lifeinsurance where they had $456,000 in cash.
Valued life insurance that they weregoing to use for estate planning.
(20:27):
Yeah.
No.
Nobody had told 'em aboutthe liquidity of that.
So suddenly they needed a down paymentfor this and we figured it out from
those two places that they wouldable to, to easily get the 400, I
think they needed $470,000 of Yeah.
Down payment for it.
And so it's just those kind of things thatif as an example of having cash valued
(20:49):
life insurance, that they were able to.
Nelson talked about this all the time.
Opportunities find cash.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So, so they found this great opportunityat $1,500 less per acre because they
had the ability to find the cashthrough the cash valued life insurance,
and they were able to purchase it.
(21:10):
So that was another exampleof how you can use that.
So, so here's, here's one of thethings that as I, as I do analysis
for people, I, I ask for a lot.
Like a full analysis to build up the plan.
And they're like, Hey, could youjust tell me 20,000 or, or sell this?
And I know people in the, in theworld of IPC, that, that just
(21:32):
sell a policy, uh, or whatever.
But I, I want to do a full analysis.
I wanna know your dreams, goals,uh, assets and liabilities.
Um, because, um, using thepolicies or annuities might be
a, a, a, a strategy depending.
Um, but I'm also married to ACFP, so then that helps, uh,
(21:55):
see things that I don't see.
Uh, I'm not a tax person.
Even though a lot of financial, alot of clients think that A-A-C-P-A
is a, a, a financial professional.
They're, they're, they justmaybe file taxes, right?
And to see how these thingsinterconnect is really important.
(22:18):
Right.
And I'm a, what I would say, andyou are as well as the heart surgeon
in this part, but if you understandhow the heart works, you can
affect the other parts of the body.
Um, and so doing a fullanalysis, sometimes they're
like, oh, that's a lot of work.
I'm like, well, because I don'twanna create a monster or too small
(22:41):
of a policy, too big of a policy.
We wanna build the right size andbe able to think strategically
of the different companies orwhatever else we might work on.
Because, you know, you, you workwith some of the same companies.
Some of them are easierto work than others.
Mm-hmm.
Some of them, um.
(23:03):
Uh, well with the marijuana thing, therewas some that are a little more liberal.
Uh, and so understanding that as aspecialist, um, have you had pushback
where you're, they wanna just sellyou, they want you to just build
a policy and you're like, oh yeah,I'm gonna do an analysis full thing.
Yes.
And I, and, and, and I think thetheme of this show is, is basically
(23:25):
the sensationalism that's outon the internet, social media.
And that is one of my biggest petpeeves is where, you know, a person
will meet somebody for five toseven minutes and ask 'em, well, how
much you wanna put into a policy?
And they tell 'em, they say, okay,I'm gonna send you some illustrations.
Get back to me.
You know, it's, there's no analysis ofwhether they can sustain that, that they
(23:46):
have an understanding of the flexibility.
If there's no talk aboutthe protection aspect of it.
And I actually use thedoctor example all the time.
Also, when a person says,well, do I really have to talk
about my tax return with you?
And do I actually really haveto show you my cash flow?
And I'm like, well, letme ask you this question.
(24:06):
If you go to the doctor andyou have a, a headache Yeah.
And the doctor says, okay, I'mgonna listen to your heart.
Do you go, oh no, doc, I I don'twant you to touch anything.
Just fix my head.
And he, he says, well, Ineed to draw some blood.
Oh no doc, I don't wanna do anything.
Just fix my head.
I said, that's the same thingyou're asking us to do in this
intertangled web of money.
(24:28):
I said, can you really think that you cando anything, this world without money?
You know, we always talk about,well, money's not that important.
I'm gonna live a great life.
Try living one day without money.
I mean, it's just mm-hmm.
It's just not possible.
And so that's what, and mostpeople are amiable to that.
If they're not, they'rejust not good for me.
They can go somewhere else.
(24:48):
I'm sure you have the same way.
Yep.
Somebody else will do this for you.
I'm not going to do it.
Because those people end upnot taking responsibility.
They end up, um, you're chasingthem for premium every year.
Where's your premium?
Mm-hmm.
We talked about this, youknow, so on and so forth.
So I just try to stay away from that, um,simplify to actually make it more complex.
(25:13):
And, um, what I'm talking about issimplify your procedure so that they can
understand the more complex later on.
So, yeah, I, I see that all the time.
And matter of fact, a lot of people,and I'm sure you have the two.
People come to us after they've goneto one of these situations and say,
I can't talk to those people again.
They won't return my call.
(25:34):
I don't know what, what happened to them.
Can you explain this to me?
Uh, and, and part of why we even wrote ourbook, five Smooth Stones was because, um,
as I've worked with lots of clients, I'masking, what are your dreams and goals?
And they're like, that's a great question.
And I'm like, uh, that'snot a big question.
(25:54):
Like, do you have dreams and goals?
And, and, uh, married couples that I'mtalking to and they're like, I didn't
even, we haven't even talked about that.
I'm like, here, date night question,you know, or various things.
But our, our, in our book, fiveSmooth Stones, we have set your
sights, track your in and out.
Inspect your progress.
(26:15):
Look for 1% and livedeliberately living deliberately.
A policy can fit intothat if it's done right.
Right.
Um, but our need for financingbanking, it's everywhere.
Um, and we have to understand that.
And whenever I can even with, again,profit first, separate from the policy,
(26:36):
I might be able to see, hey, theseguys are, are literally running a
business at 22% interest and, but thenthey're funding in a 401k at whatever.
And you're like, maybe youjust need to stop that part.
Right.
Take care of this part.
Yes.
Um, and, and it gets, it's,it's interesting that people are
(26:58):
like, oh, that's, that's genius.
And I'm like, it, it's just math.
Um, and I'm not that great at math,but my, my wife is, but, but I'm
like, for me, I'm like red and blackon a p and l. We don't like red.
We like black, let's move intothe black as simple as that.
Um, now, now one of the cool thingsis you guys have been doing podcasting
(27:26):
before podcasting was even popular.
Um, I think you started in 2017,I think podcasts or even a thing.
They were starting to be a thing.
Yeah.
What have you seen as you guys havebeen in that world, has changed in
how you guys do podcasting or that noweverybody even they get a license now
(27:50):
they're infinite banking, this or that.
How's that affected you guys?
Yeah, I would say, uh, it was amazing.
First of all, I'll just tellyou the story real quickly.
Uh, I, I met, uh, Rachel and LucasMarshall in 2014 at an event that we
held in St. Louis for insurance agents.
(28:11):
Called the Freedom Advisor, uh, theFreedom Advisor Conference, and we
were trying to help struggling agentsfind more freedom in their lives.
Mm-hmm.
Free freedom of money, freedom ofrelationships, freedom of time,
and, uh, we were just tryingto make the industry better.
Very similar to whatNelson was trying to do.
(28:34):
Yeah.
Um, Nelson was just trying to make theindustry better 'cause he felt like
if we made the industry better, thenit would be better for the consumer.
So we invited a bunch of people, andI think one of them that you, you may
also know James and Ery was there.
Yeah, yeah.
Um, Tom O'Connell was there, so, um, thoseguys were there and Lucas, and Rachel
(28:54):
was referred to come to this becausethey were doing some life insurance,
but mainly just providing it for.
Uh, 'cause they had a, a health insuranceand Medicare supplement insurance agency.
Mm-hmm.
And so afterwards, they, theywere wonderful people and they,
they asked me if they could, youknow, ask me some more questions.
(29:15):
I started mentoring them.
Every once in a while they'dcall, they'd ask some questions.
And then in, in, uh, early 2000,the spring of 2017, Lucas calls
me and says, Hey, I think thispodcasting stuff is gonna take off.
But, um, Rachel, she's prettyconfident on the infinite banking
(29:36):
concept, but she's not that confident.
We just need somebody that canbe the co-host that can answer
all the difficult questions.
Yeah.
And I said, well, listen, I'lldo it under one condition.
All I have to do is show up and talk.
I don't wanna prepare.
And so that, that wasthe condition and our.
(29:57):
You know, at first all we did was onpodcasting and, you know, apple to
iTunes, Brandon, I don't even know 'causeI don't do any of that stuff, you know?
Yeah.
I'm sure you, you know,a lot more than I do.
And our listenership started takingoff and then we started doing it on
YouTube, and then all of a suddenour YouTube subscribers took off.
But then as it, it started to becomea thing, when I, when I say become
(30:20):
a thing, I'm, I'm talk You saidit earlier, it became mainstream.
Mm-hmm.
I, BBC became, became mainstream.
Then we started to level off and I, andwe started to try to figure out why.
And I think it's because we tendto have a, uh, a one hour show.
Yep.
And the sensationalizedpeople are using the tiktoks.
(30:42):
The Snapchats and my understandingis, you know, they're very limited.
'cause people, they just, like you said,you said earlier, just tell me what to do.
They just want, they justwant this quick, quick fix.
So people started moving away fromus to these sensationalized things.
And frankly, Brandon, I'm okay with it.
Yeah.
Because I don't want, I don't wannadeal with those people anyway.
(31:03):
And I'm not saying that as beingharsh, but Simon Sinek, the great
marketer once said something thatstuck with me and says, he said, you
don't wanna do business with everybodythat needs your goods and service.
You wanna do business with peoplethat believe what you believe.
And when that happens, you get greatsynergy to it and you get great energy.
(31:24):
And that energy allows youto, to put out great content.
It's not Dr. A drudgery for it.
So it's, it's kind of flattened outand now it's all, it's starting to flat
out flatten out more because I justrecently, uh, found out that more people,
the la the first quarter of this yearwent to, to different AI like chat GPT.
(31:46):
Mm-hmm.
And they actually, you're using that fortheir search engine rather than Google.
Yeah.
So now we're, we're gonna have tofigure out how, you know, we're gonna
be able to attract people to, youknow, um, our channels because we're
not in the search engine optimizationof what Google is producing for you.
(32:07):
Yeah.
This is, this is about being in business.
You know, you, you haveto, you have to adjust.
And so it's, it, it has changed a lot.
And Nelson saw it changing.
That's why he put thepractitioners program in.
And there was a lot ofpushback in the industry.
Well, Nelson, you're notgonna tell us what to do.
Yeah.
And Nelson was a good southerngentleman and he goes, you're right.
(32:30):
I can't tell you what to do, but whatI can tell you is this is intellectual
property that's been trademarked andcopyrighted, so you can't use that.
Now, when Nelson died in 2019, uh,David Sterns, his son-in-law, who
was a partner, took over the businessand he really struggled keeping
up with the legal aspect of it.
(32:52):
'cause Nelson used was helping him.
Nelson worked till theday he was, he died.
Yeah.
And a lot of people, lot ofpeople think that's tragic.
And actually that's what Nelson wanted.
'cause Nelson, as you remember,hated the word retirement.
Yeah.
Um, he would often quote, you lookup retirement in the dictionary
and it says to take out a service.
He goes, why do you wannabe taken outta service?
(33:15):
He goes, just our societyneeds people like you.
And so, right.
He, I think it would also, he, he,like, he was still working 'cause he was
like, Gandalf, like, I mean, uh, whenyou can be that weight wise, uh, sage
and people pay you to give them adviceon things that you like, man, I did
(33:39):
that when I was 20 and that was stupid.
Right.
And then you're, you're now teachingthem what to do differently.
Why wouldn't you want, why wouldn'tyou, why would you stop that?
Like, I don't, the amount of,I, I don't know if you said this
earlier about, or maybe before weeven went on about wisdom mm-hmm.
(33:59):
The amount of wisdom thatleaves a corporation mm-hmm.
Every year from retirementis just astronomical.
Mm-hmm.
You know?
And so if you can find a way to keepthose people around, you're not constantly
reinventing the wheel when somebodysays, oh, I think we should do this.
(34:19):
And, uh, that person that, well, I'vebeen here for 20 years and we tried that
back then and this is what happened.
I just wanna make you aware of that.
Yep.
That actually has walked out thedoor, and so you have to reinvent the
wheel again, reinvent the wheel again.
And so, um, wisdom is actually applyingthat knowledge that you've already had.
(34:39):
Yeah.
Those mistakes that you've made.
So, and, and I do think, uh, forus, we're younger, but I think you
can learn wisdom and, and buildit even as a young age, right?
Oh, sure.
Some, some kids are wise,um, in certain aspects.
And, and one of the cool things thatI share is being a business owner,
(35:02):
former with the, the coffee shop.
Um, the reason I was able to, um, actuallysell the business, not close the business.
And why I ended up in this industry wasbecause of my infinite banking policy.
Right?
Because I was able to, or, uh, whole lifepolicy that's, you know, the concept,
(35:22):
you know, uh, people, people say that,but, but I was like, I use that to,
uh, take a loan to overcome the flood.
Like literally the roofwas being worked on.
Hopefully there's no rain in yourforecast, but the roof was taken
off and then it rained, which isnot a good thing to happen, right.
(35:45):
Uh, when you have no roof.
And so our coffee shop was flooded.
I get called by the staff and throughthat whole situation, we had also
found out that we were pregnant.
Uh, other things that I'm almost like,Hmm, I wanna sell this, but it's because I
had my policy that I was able to do that.
That's some wisdom for me that I'm, Ishare with people saying, you don't know
(36:08):
when both an opportunity or a stupidflood is gonna happen that you need it
for not, not for growing your wealth,but just per preserving it and making
sure you don't, uh, have to close.
Mm-hmm.
Um.
That was, um, wisdom.
I learned that, you know, now I don'twant anybody to experience that,
(36:31):
but Yeah, you're absolutely right.
You don't have to, you don't haveto be old to have wisdom, but you
do have to have experiences mm-hmm.
Yeah.
That you draw for.
And younger people do and, andfrankly, every day I ask younger people
about technology in, in our office.
Yeah.
You know, I'm like, just this,just this morning I'm doing it.
I'm like, Hey, thisdoesn't make any sense.
What do you?
And they go, oh, well you justhave to click here, here and here.
(36:53):
And it's like, oh, okay.
It's not that they were smarter than me,although I think they're smarter than me.
It's just that they've had thatexperience, you know, as a, the guy I'm
talking about was 20 years old, you know?
Yeah.
He's had that experience whereI haven't had that experience.
Um, so Oh, wow.
You.
Yeah.
Your, well, your thing went all weird.
(37:14):
That was weird.
That is really never seen thatbefore, but congratulations.
Um, um, I, I, I didn't touch anything.
I don't know what happened.
That's, but that was interesting.
Yeah.
So, um, yeah, that, that's, I wasthinking about that with my wife, like
she's, um, a few years younger than me.
Technology is her, likelanguage, uh, more.
(37:37):
And so she does things thatI'm like, oh, I was working on
this, trying to figure it out.
And she did in two seconds.
Right.
Um, now we have chat GBT that doesit in one second in some regards.
And I, and I'm, well, I, here's a questionI'm, I'm curious of, where do you think.
Uh, this whole chat world and,and chat, GPT is is, is here.
(38:01):
It's not going away.
No.
Um, it is being used inthe insurance companies.
It's being used in all of our companies.
Where is, where do we fit and how do westay human while engaging in technology?
That might be a hard one, but I'vebeen thinking about that a lot.
(38:22):
Well, I've been thinking about,I've been thinking about it too.
So one of the things that I dobelieve in is that man, and, and I
learned a lot of this from Nelson,that man does have some human
behaviors that causes them to be lazy.
Mm-hmm.
And, and it's, you know, we're gonnado the, we're gonna do, and we're, I,
(38:43):
you know, Brandon, we always have tobe careful about speaking in absolutes,
but we're talking about in general, um.
Because man is going to do theleast amount possible to get the
maximum benefits that they want.
Okay.
Um, and that's, so I will, before weget there, just just remember what
(39:04):
he, what he said, because we were toldthat with our 4 0 1 Ks and do the least
amount to get the maximum results.
And how did that workout for a lot of people?
I'm curious.
Our term insurance is another one.
Yeah.
By term best rest, pay or, or buy the,buy the most you can for the least
(39:25):
amount of dollars, but they don'ttell you that the time when you really
need it, it probably won't be aroundor it'll be astronomically expensive
so you don't get the whole picture.
So I'm, I'm a big believer thoughthat in of, of what we, we do,
'cause I'm a biologist by nature,so I believe in a evolution.
(39:47):
I, uh, um, you know, Iwas a biology teacher.
A science teacher foryears and years and years.
And so I believe that man has theability to overcome any kind of
obstacles that they're gonna overcome.
And I do believe that, uh, artificialintelligence will cause some obstacles.
It will eliminate some jobs, but wewill also find out that there's gonna
(40:08):
be other jobs that are gonna be createdbecause of artificial intelligence.
And I don't know exactly what those are.
It may be career counselingmay have a, a big uptick.
Yeah.
Because people are like, I lost my job.
Well, let's see how we can, uh,get you, uh, thinking differently.
I think also entrepreneurshipmight actually take off more now
(40:31):
because people are like, I wannatake more control of my life.
And not have myself being, uh, replaced.
My wife is actually a brand marketer andyou know, she, she was actually using it
to write copy, which I'm sure you do too.
Mm-hmm.
And, and, and we do atthe Money Advantage.
And so copywritersaren't as needed anymore.
(40:51):
So I do believe though, thatwe will adjust because I just
believe that's man, mankind.
As a survivor, I actually asked Chad GPTthis the other day, and I'm gonna quiz
you because I think you'll find this.
Uh, yeah.
Interesting.
How many people is it estimated thathave actually been on the earth, uh,
(41:12):
that have been born on the earth since?
Uh, man, man has been on the Earth?
Oh man, maybe, um, because there'sabout eight, there's about 8 billion.
There's about 8 billion now.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So I would say maybe.
(41:32):
Uh, a hundred billion.
Oh, very good.
They, they estimate between eightand a hundred billion people.
Yeah.
8 billion.
Yeah.
That's how eight.
Eight between 80, I'm sorry, 80and a hundred billion people.
They estimated.
Okay.
Yeah.
To me.
And that was kind of surprising to me.
I actually thought thatwas a very large number.
Mm-hmm.
Um, but then you gotta start thinkingabout how many, you know, babies
(41:55):
die at a very, um, you know, youngage because of lack of advancements.
Um, you know, 1935 when social securitycame in, and we, I don't want to
go down that rabbit hole, but, uh,you know, a social security full
retirement age was 65 and that wasalso life expectancy in 1935 was 65.
(42:17):
Yeah.
And now we're up around 78, 78and a half, so and so forth.
Um, so man, man did becomemore and more mortality rate.
Um, got less and expect Rexigot, so a lot of people did
probably, well, no, not probably.
A lot of people did die at veryyoung ages, um, which caused
(42:38):
that number to be pushed up.
Yeah.
So I do believe that the, thestructure of evolution will continue
to help us, um, manage this ai.
You know, we've said this, Brandon,over and over again, you know, I, I
I'm quite a bit older than you, butwhen the calculator came out Yeah.
(42:58):
In, in the, in the late sixties andthen became more readily available
in the seventies when I was in juniorhigh, you know, everybody just thought
this was gonna ruin kids, you know?
Yeah.
They, you can't use a calculator.
You gotta think through this.
You're never gonna be ableto go, go anywhere in life.
Well, that was not, that was thefurthest thing from the truth.
(43:18):
It was actually a tool.
And, and I do think it's, it'smoving in that and leverage.
And, and one of my, uh, friends,actually, I was talking to him recently
because, uh, he knows what I do.
And he wrote, um, the book, um,80 20 Sales and Marketing and, uh,
his name's, uh, Perry Marshall.
(43:39):
And, um, with that, um, idea wasthe, what happened in 96 to 2000,
uh, revolutionized everything.
And we be, we now have the computersand we can talk through these things.
What's happening now with AI islike that except a little bigger.
(43:59):
Mm-hmm.
Um, now will it change us?
Yes.
Uh, will it change?
Hopefully APSs, uh, uh, what I, I hope so.
Yeah.
Uh, APSs, if you guys don't know, is theattending physician statements that you
can never find, uh, in the medical world.
Um, it is, it is.
(44:19):
It's a pain, uh, to do, you know, uh, but,but we, it'll help make things faster.
Now, at the same time, uh, aswe switch how we overcome that.
Now, as I was talking to Perry onthis, uh, I had mentioned what I
do, and he mentioned that, um, justhaving, uh, other people that have
(44:42):
helped him, but then they disappeared.
Uh, they weren't around in the industry.
And, um, and so he had connected withsomebody else for tax and legal, and then
they, they were not, they didn't help him.
They, um, what I've learned inthis is like the human element.
Of, of what we do is being present forthe six month reviews, annual reviews,
(45:06):
um, not just selling a policy and, andthen disappearing, but also educating,
even though that was a high income earnersaying, Hey, how are we using this?
How's your tax situation?
Oh, by the way, it's yourresponsibility to pay taxes.
Um, not just the tax person to file them.
(45:27):
And I, I think a lot of times inour financial world, we're just,
I'll just, I have a guy, they'lldeal with it, and then we don't take
responsibility, uh, for what we did.
And so, um, I think that there'sthat human element Oh yes.
And aspect that even if Bruce.
(45:49):
Me or my wife or or his team,Rachel, over there, uh, helps you.
It's your responsibilityto, um, fund a policy.
And if you take a loan and you don'tpay it back, Nelson says, don't steal
the peas from your grocery store.
That's your responsibility to have that.
(46:11):
Not, I mean, I, I'm gonna educate andhelp, but, but that's so important and
we cannot just abdicate our financialwellbeing to somebody else, including us.
Um, and don't just think AI isgonna solve that for you either.
Right.
Uh, and so, uh, just wanted to leave thatwith you guys as, as you're navigating,
(46:32):
'cause you guys are all navigatingAI in your perspective industries.
We are.
Um, but the.
People part is really important.
Yeah.
If you remember our goodfriend Richard Canfield mm-hmm.
He always points out to, uh, his clients.
The book is calledBecoming Your Own Banker.
Yeah.
(46:53):
And so you're the banker.
You have to take responsibilityfor whether it's a good, it's good
to take a loan out and what theterms are of the repayment are.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So, um, that's the part, part thatactually, frankly, because of my
desire to do tremendous customerservice with our clients, that
I've kind of enabled them too much.
(47:15):
And I'm trying to swing thependulum back the other way.
Because we will, we will, um, actuallyhave 'em call our service center and
we will to help 'em take policy loans.
We don't have 'em, you know,take it through the portal.
Uh, we don't have 'em payback through the portal.
You know, we have, we have 'emactually send us checks or,
or we set up the a CH for 'em.
Yeah.
We're actually, we're actually starting totransition to where they do more of that
(47:38):
on their own to take more responsibility.
I mean, and you've been inthis industry for, uh, what,
little bit longer than I have.
Um, and, and so I'm sure your sixmonth reviews and annual reviews,
uh, are extensive meeting wise.
Um, how do you balancefollow up paperwork?
(47:58):
'cause, uh, because I know dealingwith some of these carriers, uh, the
headaches for client services can be.
A challenge.
Yep.
Um, understatement sometimes.
Uh, and, and also like creatingcontent and doing the things.
What, what brings Bruce Joy as he'shelping other people, and where do you
(48:24):
want to see your, you not necessarilyyour firm, 20 years, 10 years from now?
So I was actually mentoredby really good people, and I
actually became a, a disciple ofStrategic Coach by Dan Sullivan.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
And, um, you know, uh, the, the thingthat, you know, Jason Low, who you
(48:48):
also, you know, very well, you know,it's, it's, uh, how not who mm-hmm.
I'm sorry.
Who?
I'm sorry, who not how.
Mm-hmm.
And I was always trying tofigure out how to do it.
And so when I started figuringout who could do it instead of how
you do it, that was a lot better.
And I tell people likeyourself, this all the time.
And they're absolutelyamazed when I say this.
(49:09):
I haven't taken an application in15 years and I don't even know if I
could take an application anymore.
So we figured out who actuallyenjoys taking applications.
Mm-hmm.
I don't understand why they enjoy doingit, but we have, we have one person in
our firm that, for 15 years now, that's,she does applications for 15 years now.
(49:33):
She follows up with the underwriter'sgetting those APSs for 15 years.
Now when a client wants to take apolicy loan, she sets that up, policy
repayment loan, she sets that up.
So you can't do that overnight, you know?
Mm-hmm.
It's, it's, it's not something that youcan build a business overnight and you
probably need to know each aspect of thebusiness, but it, it should be, in my
(49:58):
opinion, you're gonna get more energyon the stuff that you really like to do.
So Brandon, what I liketo do, and this is where.
I'm working on.
Um, this is, I just wannashow up to meetings and do the
strategies with the people.
I don't wanna do anything else.
I had a meeting, I had a meetingwith the 20-year-old today.
(50:18):
He was with, he was on threemeetings with me yesterday.
And I said, okay, Ryan, uh, what dowe have to do as far as follow up?
I had no idea.
And he goes, okay, for this client,we're gonna do this, this, and this.
So I get on, okay, and I shootoff an email and I do this.
Okay, what's the next one?
And I, I can flow fly throughthose and it gives me energy.
(50:41):
We then sat down with the strategy.
What did they want again?
Okay, they want this, this, and this.
Okay, all right.
I'm gonna look at their financial picture.
Okay, I think we should presentthis, see what they feel like
on this, so on and so forth.
So that's, that's where I, and I'mbuilding a team around me, Brandon, that
is different than most the, the, um.
(51:03):
The, what do you call it?
The experience of most people?
Yeah.
I have a, I have a 46-year-old,I have a 38-year-old.
I have a 31-year-old.
I have a 27-year-old, I have a24-year-old and I have a 20 that
actually are really good workers.
Yeah.
And most people, most people saythese young people don't wanna work.
(51:23):
I don't know what happened.
I think you put it out to theuniverse and you get the same,
that, that same kind of vibe back.
I have tremendous people that workwith me and um, so I just see myself
continuing to give them more andmore, and then I will just work on
the things that I really wanna workon and, and I'm not gonna retire.
It's so weird because, you know, yeah.
(51:45):
I belong to a country club and Ilike to play golf in my free time.
And people know I'm a financialadvisor and an insurance agent.
Well, what does a financialadvisor normally do?
They help people retire.
Right?
So, so they're always askingme, when are you gonna retire?
And I say, I have no intentions to retire.
(52:05):
And I know what they're thinking.
Well, that's weird, you know?
Yeah.
Uh, why wouldn't you wanna retire?
I, and I, I say this, and youcan use, you can use this on your
client's, um, anytime you want.
I say, if I can remove thethings from your job or career
that you don't like, yeah.
Would you retire?
(52:26):
And what's interesting is people can'teven get outta their own way on that.
They say, oh, even if you coulddo that, I still wanna retire.
Yeah.
And I, and I tell them, no, no.
Listen again, what I just said,if I can remove everything you
don't like from your financial.
Career or your job, why would you retire?
(52:48):
And it's just amazing that peoplejust can't grasp that concept.
But that's what I'm trying to do.
And that's all because of Dan Sullivan.
Uh, and I, I think that's for us.
And, and with the Perry MarshallGroup and listening to Dan, uh, a lot.
Is that unique?
What's unique to you?
Understanding yourself if you don'tknow your dreams and goals and
(53:12):
where you want to go or who you are.
As an individual.
Like I've taken Myers-Briggs, I'vetaken the Enneagram, taken all the
tests, and even I've plugged it into,uh, chat GPT and said, okay, make what
do, who am I and what brings me joy?
And it, and it spits back saying,this is what you should do,
this is what you should not do.
(53:32):
Thank God I'm married.
'cause she likes thingsthat I don't like or likes.
Yeah.
Other parts.
And then we build a team and we're, we'reseven years in, but I have a staff of, uh,
let's see, three and a half, three and ahalf or four, um, that are support staff.
'cause there's things I hate doing.
(53:53):
I like doing what you do, showing upand, and then I'm like, I don't know
where the heck it goes after that.
Um, and if we understand ourself andthen the financial system, again,
understanding that, don't abdicate thosethings, but where your lane is, uh, again.
Knowing green and bread ispretty easy for, for me.
(54:17):
Um, we should understand that, butthen live it living in the place that
we, and what I love is, man, we get,we get to choose our own adventure.
Uh, we don't get to, as businessowners, we can choose our heart.
Uh, and I just like that my heart is easy.
(54:37):
It's easy to me, maybe hardfor somebody else, right?
Um, and so my, and, and that's what's funis if you understand your who you are.
Um, that's powerful.
So I, I really, I was, I was inspired bythat because that's where we're at going
and saying, okay, what do we wanna do?
Well, thank 10 minutes from now.
Thanks.
Thanks for that tip.
(54:57):
I'm gonna put all my personality.
Profiles into chat, GPT and see, uh,and try to hone my, hone my vision too.
It is amazing what it tells you.
And then you say, write me a dayon this and, and then you're like,
okay, here's what you don't like.
Okay.
Then you have a, a job descriptionon all the things you don't
like that somebody else likes.
(55:18):
Mm-hmm.
Um, and that's the power of, of community.
Um, so, uh, Bruce, anythingyou wanna leave our listeners
with, uh, before we wrap up?
And again, don't forget, hitthat like button as, as you guys
listen to all these IBC people.
There's a lot out there.
(55:39):
Just remember the long approachis really helpful for you.
Great.
That's, that's actually what Iwas gonna leave people with is
that, uh, don't get caught up inany kind of get rich quick scheme.
Um, there's a reason whythat is under a vernacular.
In our society get rich quick schemebecause it is a, it is a scheme.
(56:04):
I'm not saying that therearen't people that accidentally
all of a sudden get rich.
Um, but that is theanomaly in the situation.
Most people that actually become rich,whatever that means, with which means,
uh, whatever freedoms you want mm-hmm.
Personal relationship, freedoms, freedomswith your, your family, freedoms, with
(56:28):
your time freedom, that money can buy.
Whatever that is, thatdoesn't happen overnight.
And if, if you can't overcome thehuman conditions, uh, that nor Nelson
talks about in his book, then you'regonna ha you're gonna struggle.
Really, really mightly.
Um, and the best way not tostruggle is to think long term.
(56:49):
Uh, Dan Sullivan withhis dos question, um.
Dangerous opportunities.
I'm sorry, it's Ractor question, whichen entail, en entitles, excuse me,
entails the dos, dangerous opportunitiesand strengths, where he says, if we're
sitting here three years from now andwe're looking back on those three years,
what would have to happen in your life?
(57:10):
Well, personally and professionally foryou to feel good about your progress?
He says three years.
Okay.
He doesn't say at the end of this month.
Yep.
You know, or the, evenat the end of this year.
And he actually wanted to actuallygo out further because then he read,
he, then he started writing books tosay 90 day, um, 90 day, uh, 90 day
(57:36):
vision, but a 20, 25-year-old goals.
Yeah.
Because he knew you had toconstantly be changing these.
So that would be the message I'dlike to, to just to share with
people as we end here, is that, hey.
You've gotta write your goals down.
The goals can change, but you gottahave a vision where you want to be and
(57:57):
it can't be in the next 30 days thatyou're gonna be, solve all your problems.
'cause it took you literallydecades to cause all your problems.
Yeah.
And I, and I would, and, and I wantyou to share your, um, information,
but, um, while working with Bruce orme or or somebody like us like that,
(58:19):
or us really, I mean, I know what I'mdoing here, uh, and is you have to
do the work of what is the vision.
We are just the scribes that helpput the, maybe the tools in place
to help implement that vision.
But, but it's up to you and ifyou're coming to us as, as agents
to help you figure out your vision.
(58:42):
Uh, you're coming to the wrong place.
Yeah.
Um, and, and I think that, um,that's a challenge that we have
to face, but, um, be the writerof your, um, your own destiny.
Um, so Bruce, how can they find you?
Well, you can reach out athello@themoneyadvantage.com and,
(59:05):
uh, you can always go through themoney advantage.com and you can get
us, you know, get us through there.
Click this button.
You guys know how it all works.
You know, you click this.
Yes.
Um, if you have questions more about, uh,financial questions that you want to get
straightened out are estate planning orsocial security or taxes, you can email me
(59:26):
directly at B-W-E-H-N-E-R at e, the numberthree wealth.com, b waner@e3wealth.com.
Uh, because I get forwarded stufffrom the Money Advantage, um, website
to, to my own personal email account.
(59:47):
And you know what?
Brandon's great.
I've read his book.
Um, you know, I, I found it very helpful.
Mike Mitz, who he's praising,we've had him on our podcast twice.
We, we practice Profit First andthe Money Advantage Business.
I've been practicing that personallyfor years and years and years.
It's just good common sense.
(01:00:08):
And so we are, we are in alignment.
So Brandon's gonna be able to help youprobably just as much as I can help
you, but if you want to hear it froma different lens or, or, or something
like that, we can, we can talk.
And, uh, if I can help you,I'll, you know, we'll help you.
Awesome.
Well, Bruce, thanks.
Uh, I knew that we'd have a lot to talkabout 'cause we are like, like minds
(01:00:30):
and, and, uh, I really appreciate yourleadership in our lives, even from afar.
Uh, I don't know if you noticed,but you were mentoring us for five
years and, and, uh, for every, uh,at least once a week at the gym.
Um, so in 2017 at LA Fitness.
Well, well, I think, I think I wouldlike to say Nelson was mentoring you
(01:00:53):
because Nelson mentored me personally.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
And I never met.
And, and that, that's one of the thingsis as you guys are, are learning and
growing, uh, reach out to the peoplethat, that you look up to, like ask
them to be a part of their lives.
I never got to meet Nelson.
He changed our life.
Uh, I watched the Banking withLife documentary and that's
(01:01:15):
what led us into this world.
Um, and it was just an amazing,and I, I said, you know.
I can follow that guy.
Mm-hmm.
Um, and so that was what led us here.
So thanks for joining us guys.
Don't forget, hit that like, subscribe.
I think if I do this,it'll pop up something.
I don't know.
It doesn't do it.
It only does it for you.
I tried.
(01:01:36):
I know.
I saw that.
I saw that.
Oh, what the heck?
Doesn't work now.
I don't know.
Uh, anyway, um, thanks for being hereand we will see you guys next time.
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