August 13, 2025 • 42 mins
In this episode of the Wealth Wisdom Financial Podcast, host Brandon Neely sits down with Mickey Curd, a seasoned healthcare operations leader turned full-time real estate investor. After 25 years in logistics and support services for hospitals across the Midwest, Mickey made the bold leap in 2024, leaving his W-2 behind to focus fully on real estate.
But this wasn't a jump without a parachute.
Mickey shares how he restarted his real estate investing journey in 2018 with just two properties, and scaled that into a diverse portfolio of 38 units, including single-family homes, duplexes, and 4-plexes, primarily in the Youngstown/Boardman, Ohio area.
We dive into:
-
Why he chose to re-enter real estate—and what he did differently the second time around
-
The step-by-step growth from 2 to 38 doors in just 5 years
-
How he prepared financially and emotionally to leave his 9–5
-
Tips for managing long-term rentals and Airbnbs without losing your sanity
-
What it really takes to make the leap from employee to entrepreneur
Whether you're just getting started in real estate or wondering if it's finally time to go all in, this episode is packed with hard-earned wisdom and inspiration.
00:00 Welcome and Introduction
00:24 Meet Mickey Curd: Real Estate Investor
01:31 Mickey's Real Estate Journey
02:28 Transition to Full-Time Real Estate
03:45 Understanding Velocity Banking
04:14 COVID and Financial Strategies
06:38 Deep Dive into Velocity Banking
10:30 Tracking Finances with Spreadsheets
17:05 From Velocity Banking to Infinite Banking
21:51 Introduction to Policy Repayment Schedules
22:13 Detailed Breakdown of Loan Payments
23:00 Planning for Taxes and Insurance
23:31 Second Policy Overview
24:15 Leveraging Policies as Assets
26:33 Analyzing Real Estate Investments
27:21 Property Analysis Example
31:01 Cash Flow and Property Management
35:55 Scaling Real Estate Investments
38:28 Final Thoughts and Advice
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:01):
Hey guys, welcome to Wealth Wisdom
Financial Podcast YouTube channel.
You guys are going to love this episode
because I I know you guys love
spreadsheets and if you
are listening just audio version,
we'll try and explain what we're talking
about, but you might want to go to the
YouTube version. For this.
(00:23):
So today I get the
pleasure of interviewing
not just a client. He is a
client of ours. He's also a friend of
ours and a
former neighbor he we we met.
Literally, I think he was doing squats
(00:45):
down the street from us because it was
right after COVID and everybody was
outside. I I bought my house March 13th
of 2020 and met him on
the street and then I told him what I
did. He had moved away and then came and
found me a little bit later. So it's
kind of
(01:05):
well. Hilarious how how that stuff works.
But what I love about this guy's name,
his name is Mickey Curd. He's a
graduate of the University of Mount Union
as a Bachelor's in Business
Administration, a BA 25
years of management experience in
logistics and support services. So. So
(01:26):
he's educated. He's been all over the
Midwest. But but here's what I love.
He is a not just a.
Talk about real estate. He he owns a lot
of properties. He began his real estate
investing in
in 2018 and he's grown his
portfolio from two properties to
(01:49):
38 units over the past
five years. So he owns 6
fourplexes, 2 duplexes, 10
single-family homes. Now here's the thing
I hear. Oftentimes I talk
to clients all the time and they say I
want to do this and they they never
actually do it. But literally as I've
worked with them, I've seen them, well,
(02:11):
go from 2 to 38 right properties. That's
just amazing. And most
of his real estate is in Youngston,
Ohio, and he also has
Airbnbs and
he also manages some other properties. He
left his job in
(02:31):
January of 2024 to focus on real
estate investing full-time. I remember
actually having this conversation a lot
with him. When was the good time to
make the transition?
And what else has he done?And he also has
his real estate license. So this guy has
a lot of stuff, a lot of knowledge to
(02:52):
share. And so,
Mickey, welcome to our show.
I'm excited to have you on here, not
just because we're good friends and
that you own own the policies, but you've
actually done some amazing stuff in the
past three to five years and to see your
journey going from 2 properties.
(03:14):
To what do we say, 38 properties
and how you've been able to manage that
and make a transition. I don't know how
many financial people or not financial
people, but clients I talked to that want
to quit their job and do real
estate full time and and a lot of times
don't have a road, don't they don't have
(03:35):
a road map. You created your road map. I
know you were questioning yourself along
the way many times. And we were like, no,
you you got it, you got this, you have
the numbers. And so today I want
you to run the run the show how
you've went from velocity banking
to infinite banking and how you
(03:57):
basically have moved to from 2 deals to
thirty-eight and done it successfully.
Those are the topics I want to talk about
today, but anything you want
to. Say before we go into all these
spreadsheets. Yeah. So thank
you for having me. If I
do recall
(04:19):
during COVID, everything shut down. I
believe it was March 17th
and that was the last day that the gym
was open because I remember being at the
gym and that was the last time.
And so I think a couple of days later.
You saw me because I was in the driveway
teaching myself how to skip rope.
(04:40):
Yeah, yeah, yeahI
moved in Friday the 13th,
but think when things started shutting
down and I was was moving in
with a big truck on March 13th. And then
I met all my neighbors who were all
outside because they couldn't go to the
gym. So then we're walking around getting
a lay of the land
(05:01):
and you know, you meet your neighbors
when you can't. Do anything else. And
your house is all boxed up, right. So
yeah. And then we met, we we talked
about, I know you were
very familiar with velocity banking and
you probably kind of heard infinite
banking. So take take me to that way back
machine to those COVID
(05:23):
days and we we were having this
conversation about infinite
banking. You had heard about velocity
banking. And then I think you
found me and Denzel on a podcast or
something like that. Yeah. So
Velocity is what I looked at
1st and Denzel
(05:43):
Rodriguez is who I was watching.
So I watched countless hours
of him on the whiteboard basically
preaching that you have to understand
your numbers and the flow of money
and when we met. I remember you gave me
your card and we had a conversation or
two, but I did not put two and
(06:05):
two together. I wasn't
understanding what it is that you did.
And I didn't realize it, I think, until a
year later when I moved away.
And at that point I had been practicing
the velocity for about a year.
And for some reason I I found your card
in my desk drawer and I'm like, wait a
(06:26):
minute, this is what Brandon was talking
about. And so that's what prompted me to
give you a call a year later. And
that's how this whole process started
with the policies.
Now for our listeners, if they've
never heard of velocity banking,
what is it?How does that work?And why
(06:46):
would somebody think about that kind of
system?Very simply
put, it's just your flow of money. It's
so it's understanding all of your revenue
in. Which is your income and
all of your expenses and your bills that
go out. And the difference between those
two is your cash flow. Yeah.
(07:07):
And the velocity of banking is
the concept of using that cash flow to
either pay down a
mortgage, pay down a loan or,
you know, use that cash for savings.
And so the concept.
Can be used only if you understand
where your numbers are, what they are.
(07:29):
You have to know almost to the dollar how
much is being spent and how much is going
to come in or how much is going to be
brought in and that your difference is
going to be your cash flow. So.
So not everybody should be doing velocity
banking if you're not a numbers
person or
understanding how banks. Work.
(07:51):
Is that what you're saying?Like sometimes
understanding the numbers is really
important. I would argue that everyone
has to understand them. And I would say
the majority of people probably do
not. Yeah. And I would even argue that
they probably don't because they don't
want to know. Has
velocity banking, that
(08:12):
concept, has it changed over the past
couple of years due to interest rates
changing?Is that adjusted?
For you, where have you seen it
kind of break down or gotten better
over the past couple years?So that's a
great question. So the
(08:33):
personal line of credit that I use for
this, the interest rate is
about 16%. So it's not that much
different from a credit card. And so if
you're doing the concept properly.
Basically that 16% is basically a
cost of doing the business.
(08:53):
So for me, on average it works out to be
maybe about 85 to $90.00 a month of
interest because you're only
being charged interest on the
daily balance and that daily balance is
going to fluctuate based upon your
banking activity. So
at the beginning of the month when money
(09:15):
is coming in, your balance is going to be
low. And then towards the middle of the
month you start paying bills,
the balance is going to be higher,
therefore your interest rate is going to
be higher. So it's just understanding
the daily amount that you have. And so by
mapping it all out, you can dictate
pretty much what your daily rate is going
(09:36):
to be. Yeah. Now
for our listeners, you're going to be
open and transparent here and share your
real numbers. Now as you guys listen,
there's always room for improvement
as you and this is one of those things
where I'm like, you know, sharing these
(09:56):
kind of things
is being vulnerable and open,
right?And saying this is what's worked
for me. Now understanding your numbers,
what Mickey just said is, is really
important for my business. This is why I
love Profit First. This is why I love.
The policies is because it helps me have
(10:17):
a good framework.
And if you understand how philosophy
banking works and you understand
interest, the way is
it's you can use the banks
to your benefit. So walk us through one
of these spreadsheets, how you
track, because you just said I track
everything. A lot of people don't like to
(10:38):
track anything. But you
do. And that's an important thing to do,
especially if you want to go from 2
properties to 32 properties, right?
You had a goal, right?Your goal was
to leave your W2 job to be able
to do this. So what is this?
I know we're not on the screen, but this
(11:00):
is a lot. This is a big Excel sheet. What
is what's happening here?Yep. So I'm
gonna walk you through this as of where
we are today. So.
It's real time, real time numbers. It's
real. 32 properties,
right. So we're managing a lot. Yes.
So this column over here, column B, this
(11:20):
is going to be the date. Column C
is the type of transaction.
Column D is going to be the deposit,
meaning that is money that is coming in.
Column E is going to be withdrawals.
So that's money that's going to be spent
and going out. Column
F is the interest payment that's going to
(11:41):
be paid, and column
G is the line of credit
balance on that day.
OK, so as of today
I have a
balance
of $5799.04 and so everything in white
above are transactions that have
(12:01):
already occurred and every
transaction that's color-coded down below
are fixed. Transactions that are
going to occur at some point in the
future, and these are easily
trackable because I have rents that
come in and I have mortgages that go out
and I have particular bills that go out.
(12:22):
So I can forecast what's going to
happen. Now, of course, I'm not going to
know absolutely everything because these
things do change daily, but this does
give me an idea of where I'm going to be
all the way out. As far out as
May 1st, 2026.
So the negative number that you see means
(12:42):
that there is a surplus of cash.
So, so negative is good. In this case,
negative is definitely good and your
positive number, the higher that number
is means that's the higher the balance
is. And so just for
reference, I'm going to go off to the top
and practicing this since May
(13:04):
27th. 2020 and the
first experiment that I did, I did
a test transaction just
because I studied this and I
watched it and but then I wanted to put
it into play. And so here's how I did it.
So I had a car loan for $10,733.85
that I was
(13:26):
paying. I believe it was about $525 a
month on. So I took $10,000
out of my line of credit. And I paid that
car off just like that. So as you can see
here, the balance on that day, May 29th,
2020 was
10,793 eighty-five.
And as the month went on, the month of
(13:48):
June, deposits went in, meaning at this
point I didn't have, I had a couple
houses and I had my W2 job.
So income was going in, withdrawals were
going out and then as you can see. That
$10,000 balance, I was able to get all
the way down almost to 0
(14:08):
on January 17th, 2020.
And then it just started from from there.
And so literally I've
tracked 100%
of every transaction I've made for the
last five years and then
that was
(14:29):
January of 2020. When did you start
it?This was this was
May 27th of 2020. Yeah. So
you started in the height of of COVID,
correct?Because at that point in time,
there wasn't a lot going on other than
going back and forth to work. Everything
was closed. And so I immersed
(14:50):
myself into studying this. Yeah,
watching Denzel. Because he
was, he put things in simple terms on
that whiteboard and showed it with real
numbers. That's why I feel like showing
this is beneficial because you can
actually see and you can just see over
time the balance goes down and
(15:10):
then you can see it goes up and it goes
down. And then I've actually
made chunk payments here of
mortgages that I did. So I actually did
it right here. So I actually paid off a
house. I had a I
think a $39,000 balance.
I think right here I did a
(15:33):
$6000 chunk
and a $10,000 chunk. And
again, you're only right here. It's
December 25th of 2021. Yeah.
And then I made another chunk
January 8th of 2021 and I paid this house
off. I
paid off $39,000 within 90 days.
(15:57):
And my balance was only up to here, you
know, 13,000. So you were
able to again by using the
system, I mean again you had the job,
the the W2 job that helped. You're
really setting yourself up to
eventually leave your
job, right?That those were things that
(16:17):
were as your goal, right. So if you see
here, so
6000.
10,010 thousand and the final
payment was right
here, 9000. I literally
paid off a property
(16:37):
within about four months.
Yeah, we've we've been doing it, you've
tracked it and then how many properties
was it at that point in time?
So at that point, I think I had
234,
I think 4. OK, and
(16:59):
now you have 32. So. So
then let's say you're you're doing
velocity banking. How did
infinite banking tie into this?Where were
you like, wait a second, there's
something missing here. This is a really
great tool. Could have done well without
it, but where what was or with it?
(17:19):
And without even infinite banking, but
what was like, hey, I
could tweak this a little more and I
could do something else. What?What drew
you to that?So when Denzel
was talking about that, I really didn't
understand what that was. But
then after we had our
conversation and then I moved away,
(17:41):
I was still learning about it. And then
when I came upon your card, that's when I
realized that that is. The business that
you were in was the whole life
policies. And so that's when I
started to educate myself on how those
worked, because my perception
on what those were was probably the
(18:03):
same as most, where there's really no
cash value upfront and it's
strictly for, you know, death.
Yeah. And so as I started to learn more
about it, I started to understand that it
can be used as a savings tool,
not necessarily an investment, but a
savings tool to
(18:25):
put your excess cash into
to build wealth. And so
that's so over time,
I even transitioned my
401K funds into those
policies. Yeah. So you you
move that cause you're you're
now a a full-time business owner, right?
(18:46):
You have 32 properties, right?So
3038 doors total
and I also manage
3 Airbnbs.
So so you're busy now you don't
even need a full you you needed to
almost leave the day job to be
able to to build this, right?
(19:09):
Yes. And now how
quickly when you started the policies,
you started the infinite banking, you
know this is working, but you you wanted
to have a retirement plan as
well as access to capital. How quickly
did you use the
policies loan provision
(19:30):
when you started?The
Forrester's one was the first one we did
and I'm
trying to think what the first loan. I
took out, it definitely
was to purchase a property. So
basically it's to, it's to get
that 20% down payment
(19:52):
to use it. And so you just have to
factor in the payment of the
loan as well as the payment
of your mortgage and all the other costs
that come with the property as long as
you know your numbers and the math works.
Then it can be done. You just have to
understand the numbers. And why
(20:14):
would you use a policy loan
versus maybe the
line of credit idea?
So the policy loan, cause your money is
still going to be growing as you take out
that loan. But again, it's all,
it's whatever works best for you.
Sometimes it may be better to take out a
(20:36):
loan, yeah. You know, you just, you just
have to understand what the numbers are.
Yeah. And sometimes it's all about the
interest rate, right. So sometimes
if it's 6 or 5%
simple interest versus
17 or you're not gonna
pay that as
(20:58):
fast, right, we might use the policy,
right. And because it is how interest
is calculated is really, really
important. Take us to I think there's
another spreadsheet, right?We have we
have three of them that we're going to
show. This is how
infinite or or velocity banking works
(21:18):
as how how Mickey does velocity
banking and. Tracking
everything is is a very
big deal, right?And so not
everybody likes numbers. So if you like
velocity banking and you don't like
numbers or you think you like velocity
banking but you don't want to do
tracking, maybe that's not the way to go
(21:39):
for you. Yeah. And before I get into this
next one, let me preface this with saying
that I am by no means an expert
on Excel. I I know you just enough.
To get it done. So I'm sure there are
much more fancier ways to do this,
but for the purposes that I'm doing, this
does work pretty well. So what
(22:00):
I'm going to walk you through right now
is 2
policies that I have and this is
going to be the repayment schedule of the
loans that I have on the policies.
So this column here is going to be
your month. And this
is a payment right here that I'm paying
(22:21):
to Security Mutual.
And then here's the withdraws and then
here's my loan balance. So right
here, this loan
today is
$111,000. I make
a $2000 payment on that every month and
then I also take out withdraws that are
(22:43):
very fixed, which means. And those
draw withdraws are going to be property
taxes and homeowners insurance that I
pay. So I can pull out money here,
but I'm paying the money through here and
then over time you can see how that
balance is going to go down.
Why would you save for
taxes in a policy?It's
(23:06):
easier to plan to pay
this in one lump sum rather than.
Put that expense into the other
spreadsheet that I showed you, which was
basically your daily operational costs.
It's just a matter of preference for me
because those are larger dollar costs
and I can plan them out here and I can
(23:27):
see how the balance is going to go
over time. So this column over here,
this is another policy and this is
the payment that I make and then this is
today's balance. So I have a loan
balance of 23,000 here,
111,000 here. I
pay $3500 a month on this one.
(23:49):
And as you can see, as
of January of 2026, this one is scheduled
to be paid off. So I'm going to take
that $3500 and I'm paying over here.
I'm going to move it over here to
then pay $5,500 a month and as you
can see over time. By January of
(24:10):
2027, it will go down to 87,000 and
this is just the loan. What I what I like
to think about too is that they call
this the end asset, right. Meaning
you you said you had about 38 properties,
right?Yes, this these are like two
additional properties that you have. They
just don't happen to be houses. You are
(24:32):
you are the house, right and as you
leverage. You can use that
as a line of credit and it's getting rich
while paying taxes, meaning you're able
to put it through, have something, and
then let's say something happens. I know
you're you have, I think, how many kids?
I have one daughter, one
(24:54):
daughter. If something happens to
you, having that death benefit
to take care of these things is really
important, right?
You know, cause just because we have the
properties, we want to make sure that we
are beginning with the end in mind. So
that's one of the reasons I love the
properties or or the policies is
(25:16):
cause you're able to leverage and use it
and you also have disciplined
times that you're taking a loan, but
you're also, as Nelson Nash says, you're
not stealing the piece from your grocery
store. You are being a
disciplined saver back to your
bank. Exactly.
(25:38):
And I love that you have this. I I share
this all the time with people and I'm
like, you have to figure out what works
for you, but you figured it
out. And I don't know where the Excel
sheet, maybe it was from us, but that
those sheets help you
to then map out the future that
you want. And So what I love
(25:59):
again, Mickey is. You went from the
future you wanted you when we started in
2020, you were like, hey, I want to leave
my day job. I want to do this. And you
actually did the work to do it.
And there's a lot of work, right?It's
it's not easy, but it but it was work to
to have the goals and
(26:22):
and the financial freedom that you want
now. No, I
think I'm good. We're gonna
go to the property
analysis. So this is where I
feel like a lot of people get this
wrong. They hear on Tiktok and YouTube,
they hear on social media
(26:45):
that if they just buy a real estate
property, they'll be rich,
right?That's what that's what I hear all
the time. But you need to analyze the
numbers and not all properties are
good, right?Not
all properties are worth buying
and and a lot of people get in, get
(27:06):
into problems because they didn't do the
math. They didn't do their due diligence.
They were sold something and they're
like, oh, this is going to be great, but
but you in this instance, let me let me
pull this up here. This is
how you analyze a property and
this is a deep dive that you did
(27:28):
on each property before you buy it, right?
Yes. Now I will say I did not create
this. I don't even recall where I got it
from, but it's a
simple one page
and all of the numbers in
blue are what you can change. So
basically I'll I'll walk you through it
(27:48):
so. The tab says
97. So this property here
is for $90,000, OK. And
so interest rate of 7%.
So I can change that number.
So I know that at 20%
down I need to have $18,000. You're
(28:11):
gonna have a loan amount of 72,000.
OK, let's jump to the top.
So. I'm predicting
that I can rent this property out for
$1075. And I know this
because I have properties that are
similar to this one and
this is the rents that I'm getting.
(28:33):
So your annual tax. So you're
using not just hoping you you
have some data to back up, correct?Not
just saying, Oh yeah, well maybe it's
gonna rent this number. Yes, this
number is based upon education
that I currently have and for current
rents that I have that I'm pretty sure
(28:54):
that this property will rent for
1075. So
annually 2
or $12,900 your yearly tax that is a
fixed number. You can go to the county
website to find out what the taxes
currently are on that house. So that
number is going to be fixed. That's true.
(29:16):
Yearly insurance, this one is going
to move around, but I put that number in
based upon again other policies that I
have on other properties that are
similar. So I know that that number is
going to be pretty solid. So
then you have your, it breaks it down by
months. So your tax here by month,
(29:36):
insurance by month, you can factor
in vacancy rate and
your total monthly payment. And so
basically
after you pay your bills, so down here,
I know that I'm going to pay the water
bill. So the tenants are going to pay all
those other costs. Now the way this lease
(29:58):
is going to work is the tenant is going
to pay for gas,
electric and they're going to cut the
grass and they're going to do their own
snow and they're going to pay for their
own trash, so. The only
other cost is the water bill. So when you
Add all those together,
(30:18):
your monthly payment is going to be here
479. After you pay everything out,
your cash flow is going to be 3/29/22.
And then just to restate this whole
thing, I added this down here just to
make it look cleaner. Yeah, yeah,
Principal, your PNI is right here
(30:38):
47902.
Taxes, insurance. Again, we're not
paying electric or gas. We have a water
bill. Total expenses are going
to be 74579.
Your total rent is 1075.
Your cash flow is
(31:00):
$329.21. So based
upon these numbers, I would say that
this could be a potentially a good deal.
What would make it a?Really good
deal. And what would make it a bad deal?
So that's very subjective. I
kind of go
(31:20):
off of the $300.00 a month minimum cash
flow, but that's subject to change
and that's, you know, there's all kinds
of things that are involved in that, but
that's a good first start rule of thumb
to have if you if you're wanting it
for cash flow, then we want to have
cash flow, right?If you're building
(31:40):
for maybe, I don't know, you
overpay your, I don't know, mortgage
and and it's a friend that's staying
there, then there's other
kinds of wealth, right?Maybe that I might
think about. But if you're you're
lowering the rent cause you want to be a
good person to your,
(32:01):
I don't know, somebody, well then that's
gonna cost you, right?Right
So that that's something I like to think
about one of the things to note here. So
up here
your property management, you
know that could be a cost.
If you have to pay that, then your cash
(32:22):
flow is going to be $237.84.
Now the other things that I did not
account for here is I did not account for
repairs and I did not account
for vacancy rate. Because
those things are, you can
have a percentage that you can add in in
there just to be safe. But for the
(32:43):
purposes of just knowing your fixed
costs and your fixed income,
this number is going to be solid. It's
like a back of the napkin kind of
correct kind of thing in that you might
this does not account for vacancy
and the philosophy that I have is
(33:04):
isI want to be 100%
full at all times. My vacancy
rate is very, very low and that's
maybe call for another
story. But you
have to properly vet the people that
you're going to have living in your
houses to make it successful. So that's
(33:26):
that's for another day. But
rule of thumb here, $329 a month,
that's good cash flow. Well, and
again, This is why I wanted when
you were showing me this offline, I
really wanted to share with
our people on on here. And again, if
you're on a podcast, go to the
(33:49):
video because
people always ask how can I get there?
What do I need to do?And you have
right and and you're moving in that
direction, but you. Analyze the
numbers, but also you you just mentioned
there's variables that are people
variables that that
(34:10):
you have to do some
other work maybe to make sure that these
aren't just going to be like, I don't
know, homeless people
squatting in your house or something, you
know
or or
doing all kinds of vandalism or things
(34:31):
like that, so. Yeah, property
management is not for the faint of heart,
but your success is
going to be based upon your ability to
vet and get the right people in
place. Now it's not going to work 100% of
the time, but if you can do a good job of
that, I promise it'll make your life a
(34:52):
lot easier. Yeah. And I
think as as you guys are working, reach
out to Mickey or us, we we have
this little template here
and make it your own, right. But but
these tools are really important.
But if you're going in and saying I want
to be a real estate investor and you
(35:13):
don't do your numbers, you don't do your
due diligence and then you end up
buying a property or you
you hire a property manager who is.
Or or even somebody to fix up your house
and and they can took took your money
and went and spent it on other things.
(35:33):
Well, that's on you, right. And so by
using these kind of tools, you are
the master of your ship. And that's one
of the things that I I think is important
for all of us is
understanding, you knowYour
own numbers and your own goals. So where
(35:54):
do you want to go from here, Mickey?I
mean, you went from 2 properties in five
years to to, what do you say, 38?
Where do you want to go?Do you're gonna,
you're gonna like buy hotels
or or sell sell those and
and I don't know, I'm just thinking
monopoly here. Yeah, I
(36:14):
don't have a really set goal in mind, but
continuing to scale is definitely the
goal. I can
tell you that single-family
properties are always a good deal.
Personally, in the book of business that
I have, I can tell you that the
(36:35):
biggest cash flow is coming from the
single-family properties. And
that's because you know it, right?You
understand single-family.
So maybe somebody else might be like I'm
I like. Duplexes or something else cause
they might know it, right?So yeah,
I have a good mix of fourplexes,
(36:56):
duplexes and and houses, so I'm probably
gonna stick with those. I I would
go bigger. But yeah, the goal is
definitely to keep on scaling.
And if I remember correctly,
you pretty much own a
houses in the same geographic area
or even the same St. So actually
(37:20):
on one St. I own
3 fourplexes, 1
duplex and a single family home
that's on a cul-de-sac. So I
basically have that whole block and then
I own on another St.
two houses. On another St.
(37:40):
I have two fourplexes
and a duplex. And then on another
St. I have a fourplex and a single house.
So I like to keep my properties in
bunches. Yeah. And close, right. You
didn't just buy properties in
another state. You bought it close to
where you're at. So when are they gonna
(38:01):
change the street name to Kurt
Alley or something like that?I'm not. I'm
not sure. I don't know. I was. I was
wondering if they're gonna be like
Mickey Lane or something.
You never know, they might do that.
You're the the mayor of that street,
(38:21):
right?So,
anything you want to leave the
guest today, anything you want to share
about even the the policies or
I've worked with Wealth Wisdom Financial
along the way, anything that you want to
say, hey, I want to make sure I share
this today. If there's one thing that I
(38:42):
want to impress is that
you must understand your numbers.
You must understand all the revenue
coming in, all the expenses going out,
and I would encourage you to map it out
the way that I did so you can forecast
accordingly. Once you
understand your numbers, you're able to
make informed decisions very objectively,
(39:05):
yeah. That is
great. And why I love profit first and
infinite banking and all of those
things and and not just knowing your
numbers, but knowing yourself, what are
your goals?And I think Mickey,
again, we've had countless conversations
about his goals of of
(39:26):
wanting to go from 1015 houses
to the amount that he has now
and having to make that jump. Right. I
remember for you a
couple years back, you were like a little
terrified of saying, hey, is it good?
Should I do this?Or
I I also had the the
(39:49):
conversation and and you were talking
about
buying another business or something like
that. And I was like, man,
you know what you're doing. Know your
lane and and really dive in
into that. And I that's what I'm so proud
of for you is like you've really nailed
(40:11):
in and it shows, right?
Yeah, I mean the the leap to leave the
W2 job is definitely not easy. I was at
the same job for
16 years and the job before that I had
for eight years and so that's what I was
used to. But again. By
planning this out over time, I was able
(40:33):
to map out ahead of time
where I thought I would be based upon
6 numbers that I knew that I could
achieve. And after I saw it on
the spreadsheet, it made it possible
to do it. And then at that point all you
have to do is just take that leap. Yeah,
and and that requires being able to be
(40:55):
strategic and and understanding.
But also at some point you just got to
make the jump and
and that is a hard thing to do,
especially as analytical people of
saying, OK, if everything's perfect
now and it's not always going to be
perfect, things happen, floods happen,
interest rates have gone up, right?
(41:18):
And I'm sure with even your data you'd be
able to say, hey, I want to
refinance a property. You've
probably thought about that and I know
you've talked to our
mortgage guy a few times to
say, hey, is this a good time to do this?
And so always going back in
(41:40):
and tweaking, we're never,
we're never done so. Well, thanks
Mickey for for joining us. You guys
that this was a great treat. I mean
literally seeing the spreadsheets
is is important. And if you want
to break through to a smart, stable
financial future, one is, as Mickey said,
(42:01):
know your numbers. And if you don't know
your numbers, get with people that can
help you know your numbers.
And with that,
thanks again for joining us. Don't
forget, hit that like, subscribe, write
comments in there. If you
like this kind of content, let us know.
We'll try and do more spreadsheets. It's
it is a lot of work to create these
(42:23):
spreadsheets. So that's why it takes
a lot of effort. People are like, yeah,
well, you just need to do more. I'm like,
it's a lot more work than you think, so.
With that, you guys have a great day and
we will see you next
time.
Hey guys, welcome to Wealth Wisdom
Financial Podcast YouTube channel.
You guys are going to love this episode
because I I know you guys love
spreadsheets and if you
are listening just audio version,
we'll try and explain what we're talking
about, but you might want to go to the
YouTube version. For this.
(00:23):
So today I get the
pleasure of interviewing
not just a client. He is a
client of ours. He's also a friend of
ours and a
former neighbor he we we met.
Literally, I think he was doing squats
(00:45):
down the street from us because it was
right after COVID and everybody was
outside. I I bought my house March 13th
of 2020 and met him on
the street and then I told him what I
did. He had moved away and then came and
found me a little bit later. So it's
kind of
(01:05):
well. Hilarious how how that stuff works.
But what I love about this guy's name,
his name is Mickey Curd. He's a
graduate of the University of Mount Union
as a Bachelor's in Business
Administration, a BA 25
years of management experience in
logistics and support services. So. So
(01:26):
he's educated. He's been all over the
Midwest. But but here's what I love.
He is a not just a.
Talk about real estate. He he owns a lot
of properties. He began his real estate
investing in
in 2018 and he's grown his
portfolio from two properties to
(01:49):
38 units over the past
five years. So he owns 6
fourplexes, 2 duplexes, 10
single-family homes. Now here's the thing
I hear. Oftentimes I talk
to clients all the time and they say I
want to do this and they they never
actually do it. But literally as I've
worked with them, I've seen them, well,
(02:11):
go from 2 to 38 right properties. That's
just amazing. And most
of his real estate is in Youngston,
Ohio, and he also has
Airbnbs and
he also manages some other properties. He
left his job in
(02:31):
January of 2024 to focus on real
estate investing full-time. I remember
actually having this conversation a lot
with him. When was the good time to
make the transition?
And what else has he done?And he also has
his real estate license. So this guy has
a lot of stuff, a lot of knowledge to
(02:52):
share. And so,
Mickey, welcome to our show.
I'm excited to have you on here, not
just because we're good friends and
that you own own the policies, but you've
actually done some amazing stuff in the
past three to five years and to see your
journey going from 2 properties.
(03:14):
To what do we say, 38 properties
and how you've been able to manage that
and make a transition. I don't know how
many financial people or not financial
people, but clients I talked to that want
to quit their job and do real
estate full time and and a lot of times
don't have a road, don't they don't have
(03:35):
a road map. You created your road map. I
know you were questioning yourself along
the way many times. And we were like, no,
you you got it, you got this, you have
the numbers. And so today I want
you to run the run the show how
you've went from velocity banking
to infinite banking and how you
(03:57):
basically have moved to from 2 deals to
thirty-eight and done it successfully.
Those are the topics I want to talk about
today, but anything you want
to. Say before we go into all these
spreadsheets. Yeah. So thank
you for having me. If I
do recall
(04:19):
during COVID, everything shut down. I
believe it was March 17th
and that was the last day that the gym
was open because I remember being at the
gym and that was the last time.
And so I think a couple of days later.
You saw me because I was in the driveway
teaching myself how to skip rope.
(04:40):
Yeah, yeah, yeahI
moved in Friday the 13th,
but think when things started shutting
down and I was was moving in
with a big truck on March 13th. And then
I met all my neighbors who were all
outside because they couldn't go to the
gym. So then we're walking around getting
a lay of the land
(05:01):
and you know, you meet your neighbors
when you can't. Do anything else. And
your house is all boxed up, right. So
yeah. And then we met, we we talked
about, I know you were
very familiar with velocity banking and
you probably kind of heard infinite
banking. So take take me to that way back
machine to those COVID
(05:23):
days and we we were having this
conversation about infinite
banking. You had heard about velocity
banking. And then I think you
found me and Denzel on a podcast or
something like that. Yeah. So
Velocity is what I looked at
1st and Denzel
(05:43):
Rodriguez is who I was watching.
So I watched countless hours
of him on the whiteboard basically
preaching that you have to understand
your numbers and the flow of money
and when we met. I remember you gave me
your card and we had a conversation or
two, but I did not put two and
(06:05):
two together. I wasn't
understanding what it is that you did.
And I didn't realize it, I think, until a
year later when I moved away.
And at that point I had been practicing
the velocity for about a year.
And for some reason I I found your card
in my desk drawer and I'm like, wait a
(06:26):
minute, this is what Brandon was talking
about. And so that's what prompted me to
give you a call a year later. And
that's how this whole process started
with the policies.
Now for our listeners, if they've
never heard of velocity banking,
what is it?How does that work?And why
(06:46):
would somebody think about that kind of
system?Very simply
put, it's just your flow of money. It's
so it's understanding all of your revenue
in. Which is your income and
all of your expenses and your bills that
go out. And the difference between those
two is your cash flow. Yeah.
(07:07):
And the velocity of banking is
the concept of using that cash flow to
either pay down a
mortgage, pay down a loan or,
you know, use that cash for savings.
And so the concept.
Can be used only if you understand
where your numbers are, what they are.
(07:29):
You have to know almost to the dollar how
much is being spent and how much is going
to come in or how much is going to be
brought in and that your difference is
going to be your cash flow. So.
So not everybody should be doing velocity
banking if you're not a numbers
person or
understanding how banks. Work.
(07:51):
Is that what you're saying?Like sometimes
understanding the numbers is really
important. I would argue that everyone
has to understand them. And I would say
the majority of people probably do
not. Yeah. And I would even argue that
they probably don't because they don't
want to know. Has
velocity banking, that
(08:12):
concept, has it changed over the past
couple of years due to interest rates
changing?Is that adjusted?
For you, where have you seen it
kind of break down or gotten better
over the past couple years?So that's a
great question. So the
(08:33):
personal line of credit that I use for
this, the interest rate is
about 16%. So it's not that much
different from a credit card. And so if
you're doing the concept properly.
Basically that 16% is basically a
cost of doing the business.
(08:53):
So for me, on average it works out to be
maybe about 85 to $90.00 a month of
interest because you're only
being charged interest on the
daily balance and that daily balance is
going to fluctuate based upon your
banking activity. So
at the beginning of the month when money
(09:15):
is coming in, your balance is going to be
low. And then towards the middle of the
month you start paying bills,
the balance is going to be higher,
therefore your interest rate is going to
be higher. So it's just understanding
the daily amount that you have. And so by
mapping it all out, you can dictate
pretty much what your daily rate is going
(09:36):
to be. Yeah. Now
for our listeners, you're going to be
open and transparent here and share your
real numbers. Now as you guys listen,
there's always room for improvement
as you and this is one of those things
where I'm like, you know, sharing these
(09:56):
kind of things
is being vulnerable and open,
right?And saying this is what's worked
for me. Now understanding your numbers,
what Mickey just said is, is really
important for my business. This is why I
love Profit First. This is why I love.
The policies is because it helps me have
(10:17):
a good framework.
And if you understand how philosophy
banking works and you understand
interest, the way is
it's you can use the banks
to your benefit. So walk us through one
of these spreadsheets, how you
track, because you just said I track
everything. A lot of people don't like to
(10:38):
track anything. But you
do. And that's an important thing to do,
especially if you want to go from 2
properties to 32 properties, right?
You had a goal, right?Your goal was
to leave your W2 job to be able
to do this. So what is this?
I know we're not on the screen, but this
(11:00):
is a lot. This is a big Excel sheet. What
is what's happening here?Yep. So I'm
gonna walk you through this as of where
we are today. So.
It's real time, real time numbers. It's
real. 32 properties,
right. So we're managing a lot. Yes.
So this column over here, column B, this
(11:20):
is going to be the date. Column C
is the type of transaction.
Column D is going to be the deposit,
meaning that is money that is coming in.
Column E is going to be withdrawals.
So that's money that's going to be spent
and going out. Column
F is the interest payment that's going to
(11:41):
be paid, and column
G is the line of credit
balance on that day.
OK, so as of today
I have a
balance
of $5799.04 and so everything in white
above are transactions that have
(12:01):
already occurred and every
transaction that's color-coded down below
are fixed. Transactions that are
going to occur at some point in the
future, and these are easily
trackable because I have rents that
come in and I have mortgages that go out
and I have particular bills that go out.
(12:22):
So I can forecast what's going to
happen. Now, of course, I'm not going to
know absolutely everything because these
things do change daily, but this does
give me an idea of where I'm going to be
all the way out. As far out as
May 1st, 2026.
So the negative number that you see means
(12:42):
that there is a surplus of cash.
So, so negative is good. In this case,
negative is definitely good and your
positive number, the higher that number
is means that's the higher the balance
is. And so just for
reference, I'm going to go off to the top
and practicing this since May
(13:04):
27th. 2020 and the
first experiment that I did, I did
a test transaction just
because I studied this and I
watched it and but then I wanted to put
it into play. And so here's how I did it.
So I had a car loan for $10,733.85
that I was
(13:26):
paying. I believe it was about $525 a
month on. So I took $10,000
out of my line of credit. And I paid that
car off just like that. So as you can see
here, the balance on that day, May 29th,
2020 was
10,793 eighty-five.
And as the month went on, the month of
(13:48):
June, deposits went in, meaning at this
point I didn't have, I had a couple
houses and I had my W2 job.
So income was going in, withdrawals were
going out and then as you can see. That
$10,000 balance, I was able to get all
the way down almost to 0
(14:08):
on January 17th, 2020.
And then it just started from from there.
And so literally I've
tracked 100%
of every transaction I've made for the
last five years and then
that was
(14:29):
January of 2020. When did you start
it?This was this was
May 27th of 2020. Yeah. So
you started in the height of of COVID,
correct?Because at that point in time,
there wasn't a lot going on other than
going back and forth to work. Everything
was closed. And so I immersed
(14:50):
myself into studying this. Yeah,
watching Denzel. Because he
was, he put things in simple terms on
that whiteboard and showed it with real
numbers. That's why I feel like showing
this is beneficial because you can
actually see and you can just see over
time the balance goes down and
(15:10):
then you can see it goes up and it goes
down. And then I've actually
made chunk payments here of
mortgages that I did. So I actually did
it right here. So I actually paid off a
house. I had a I
think a $39,000 balance.
I think right here I did a
(15:33):
$6000 chunk
and a $10,000 chunk. And
again, you're only right here. It's
December 25th of 2021. Yeah.
And then I made another chunk
January 8th of 2021 and I paid this house
off. I
paid off $39,000 within 90 days.
(15:57):
And my balance was only up to here, you
know, 13,000. So you were
able to again by using the
system, I mean again you had the job,
the the W2 job that helped. You're
really setting yourself up to
eventually leave your
job, right?That those were things that
(16:17):
were as your goal, right. So if you see
here, so
6000.
10,010 thousand and the final
payment was right
here, 9000. I literally
paid off a property
(16:37):
within about four months.
Yeah, we've we've been doing it, you've
tracked it and then how many properties
was it at that point in time?
So at that point, I think I had
234,
I think 4. OK, and
(16:59):
now you have 32. So. So
then let's say you're you're doing
velocity banking. How did
infinite banking tie into this?Where were
you like, wait a second, there's
something missing here. This is a really
great tool. Could have done well without
it, but where what was or with it?
(17:19):
And without even infinite banking, but
what was like, hey, I
could tweak this a little more and I
could do something else. What?What drew
you to that?So when Denzel
was talking about that, I really didn't
understand what that was. But
then after we had our
conversation and then I moved away,
(17:41):
I was still learning about it. And then
when I came upon your card, that's when I
realized that that is. The business that
you were in was the whole life
policies. And so that's when I
started to educate myself on how those
worked, because my perception
on what those were was probably the
(18:03):
same as most, where there's really no
cash value upfront and it's
strictly for, you know, death.
Yeah. And so as I started to learn more
about it, I started to understand that it
can be used as a savings tool,
not necessarily an investment, but a
savings tool to
(18:25):
put your excess cash into
to build wealth. And so
that's so over time,
I even transitioned my
401K funds into those
policies. Yeah. So you you
move that cause you're you're
now a a full-time business owner, right?
(18:46):
You have 32 properties, right?So
3038 doors total
and I also manage
3 Airbnbs.
So so you're busy now you don't
even need a full you you needed to
almost leave the day job to be
able to to build this, right?
(19:09):
Yes. And now how
quickly when you started the policies,
you started the infinite banking, you
know this is working, but you you wanted
to have a retirement plan as
well as access to capital. How quickly
did you use the
policies loan provision
(19:30):
when you started?The
Forrester's one was the first one we did
and I'm
trying to think what the first loan. I
took out, it definitely
was to purchase a property. So
basically it's to, it's to get
that 20% down payment
(19:52):
to use it. And so you just have to
factor in the payment of the
loan as well as the payment
of your mortgage and all the other costs
that come with the property as long as
you know your numbers and the math works.
Then it can be done. You just have to
understand the numbers. And why
(20:14):
would you use a policy loan
versus maybe the
line of credit idea?
So the policy loan, cause your money is
still going to be growing as you take out
that loan. But again, it's all,
it's whatever works best for you.
Sometimes it may be better to take out a
(20:36):
loan, yeah. You know, you just, you just
have to understand what the numbers are.
Yeah. And sometimes it's all about the
interest rate, right. So sometimes
if it's 6 or 5%
simple interest versus
17 or you're not gonna
pay that as
(20:58):
fast, right, we might use the policy,
right. And because it is how interest
is calculated is really, really
important. Take us to I think there's
another spreadsheet, right?We have we
have three of them that we're going to
show. This is how
infinite or or velocity banking works
(21:18):
as how how Mickey does velocity
banking and. Tracking
everything is is a very
big deal, right?And so not
everybody likes numbers. So if you like
velocity banking and you don't like
numbers or you think you like velocity
banking but you don't want to do
tracking, maybe that's not the way to go
(21:39):
for you. Yeah. And before I get into this
next one, let me preface this with saying
that I am by no means an expert
on Excel. I I know you just enough.
To get it done. So I'm sure there are
much more fancier ways to do this,
but for the purposes that I'm doing, this
does work pretty well. So what
(22:00):
I'm going to walk you through right now
is 2
policies that I have and this is
going to be the repayment schedule of the
loans that I have on the policies.
So this column here is going to be
your month. And this
is a payment right here that I'm paying
(22:21):
to Security Mutual.
And then here's the withdraws and then
here's my loan balance. So right
here, this loan
today is
$111,000. I make
a $2000 payment on that every month and
then I also take out withdraws that are
(22:43):
very fixed, which means. And those
draw withdraws are going to be property
taxes and homeowners insurance that I
pay. So I can pull out money here,
but I'm paying the money through here and
then over time you can see how that
balance is going to go down.
Why would you save for
taxes in a policy?It's
(23:06):
easier to plan to pay
this in one lump sum rather than.
Put that expense into the other
spreadsheet that I showed you, which was
basically your daily operational costs.
It's just a matter of preference for me
because those are larger dollar costs
and I can plan them out here and I can
(23:27):
see how the balance is going to go
over time. So this column over here,
this is another policy and this is
the payment that I make and then this is
today's balance. So I have a loan
balance of 23,000 here,
111,000 here. I
pay $3500 a month on this one.
(23:49):
And as you can see, as
of January of 2026, this one is scheduled
to be paid off. So I'm going to take
that $3500 and I'm paying over here.
I'm going to move it over here to
then pay $5,500 a month and as you
can see over time. By January of
(24:10):
2027, it will go down to 87,000 and
this is just the loan. What I what I like
to think about too is that they call
this the end asset, right. Meaning
you you said you had about 38 properties,
right?Yes, this these are like two
additional properties that you have. They
just don't happen to be houses. You are
(24:32):
you are the house, right and as you
leverage. You can use that
as a line of credit and it's getting rich
while paying taxes, meaning you're able
to put it through, have something, and
then let's say something happens. I know
you're you have, I think, how many kids?
I have one daughter, one
(24:54):
daughter. If something happens to
you, having that death benefit
to take care of these things is really
important, right?
You know, cause just because we have the
properties, we want to make sure that we
are beginning with the end in mind. So
that's one of the reasons I love the
properties or or the policies is
(25:16):
cause you're able to leverage and use it
and you also have disciplined
times that you're taking a loan, but
you're also, as Nelson Nash says, you're
not stealing the piece from your grocery
store. You are being a
disciplined saver back to your
bank. Exactly.
(25:38):
And I love that you have this. I I share
this all the time with people and I'm
like, you have to figure out what works
for you, but you figured it
out. And I don't know where the Excel
sheet, maybe it was from us, but that
those sheets help you
to then map out the future that
you want. And So what I love
(25:59):
again, Mickey is. You went from the
future you wanted you when we started in
2020, you were like, hey, I want to leave
my day job. I want to do this. And you
actually did the work to do it.
And there's a lot of work, right?It's
it's not easy, but it but it was work to
to have the goals and
(26:22):
and the financial freedom that you want
now. No, I
think I'm good. We're gonna
go to the property
analysis. So this is where I
feel like a lot of people get this
wrong. They hear on Tiktok and YouTube,
they hear on social media
(26:45):
that if they just buy a real estate
property, they'll be rich,
right?That's what that's what I hear all
the time. But you need to analyze the
numbers and not all properties are
good, right?Not
all properties are worth buying
and and a lot of people get in, get
(27:06):
into problems because they didn't do the
math. They didn't do their due diligence.
They were sold something and they're
like, oh, this is going to be great, but
but you in this instance, let me let me
pull this up here. This is
how you analyze a property and
this is a deep dive that you did
(27:28):
on each property before you buy it, right?
Yes. Now I will say I did not create
this. I don't even recall where I got it
from, but it's a
simple one page
and all of the numbers in
blue are what you can change. So
basically I'll I'll walk you through it
(27:48):
so. The tab says
97. So this property here
is for $90,000, OK. And
so interest rate of 7%.
So I can change that number.
So I know that at 20%
down I need to have $18,000. You're
(28:11):
gonna have a loan amount of 72,000.
OK, let's jump to the top.
So. I'm predicting
that I can rent this property out for
$1075. And I know this
because I have properties that are
similar to this one and
this is the rents that I'm getting.
(28:33):
So your annual tax. So you're
using not just hoping you you
have some data to back up, correct?Not
just saying, Oh yeah, well maybe it's
gonna rent this number. Yes, this
number is based upon education
that I currently have and for current
rents that I have that I'm pretty sure
(28:54):
that this property will rent for
1075. So
annually 2
or $12,900 your yearly tax that is a
fixed number. You can go to the county
website to find out what the taxes
currently are on that house. So that
number is going to be fixed. That's true.
(29:16):
Yearly insurance, this one is going
to move around, but I put that number in
based upon again other policies that I
have on other properties that are
similar. So I know that that number is
going to be pretty solid. So
then you have your, it breaks it down by
months. So your tax here by month,
(29:36):
insurance by month, you can factor
in vacancy rate and
your total monthly payment. And so
basically
after you pay your bills, so down here,
I know that I'm going to pay the water
bill. So the tenants are going to pay all
those other costs. Now the way this lease
(29:58):
is going to work is the tenant is going
to pay for gas,
electric and they're going to cut the
grass and they're going to do their own
snow and they're going to pay for their
own trash, so. The only
other cost is the water bill. So when you
Add all those together,
(30:18):
your monthly payment is going to be here
479. After you pay everything out,
your cash flow is going to be 3/29/22.
And then just to restate this whole
thing, I added this down here just to
make it look cleaner. Yeah, yeah,
Principal, your PNI is right here
(30:38):
47902.
Taxes, insurance. Again, we're not
paying electric or gas. We have a water
bill. Total expenses are going
to be 74579.
Your total rent is 1075.
Your cash flow is
(31:00):
$329.21. So based
upon these numbers, I would say that
this could be a potentially a good deal.
What would make it a?Really good
deal. And what would make it a bad deal?
So that's very subjective. I
kind of go
(31:20):
off of the $300.00 a month minimum cash
flow, but that's subject to change
and that's, you know, there's all kinds
of things that are involved in that, but
that's a good first start rule of thumb
to have if you if you're wanting it
for cash flow, then we want to have
cash flow, right?If you're building
(31:40):
for maybe, I don't know, you
overpay your, I don't know, mortgage
and and it's a friend that's staying
there, then there's other
kinds of wealth, right?Maybe that I might
think about. But if you're you're
lowering the rent cause you want to be a
good person to your,
(32:01):
I don't know, somebody, well then that's
gonna cost you, right?Right
So that that's something I like to think
about one of the things to note here. So
up here
your property management, you
know that could be a cost.
If you have to pay that, then your cash
(32:22):
flow is going to be $237.84.
Now the other things that I did not
account for here is I did not account for
repairs and I did not account
for vacancy rate. Because
those things are, you can
have a percentage that you can add in in
there just to be safe. But for the
(32:43):
purposes of just knowing your fixed
costs and your fixed income,
this number is going to be solid. It's
like a back of the napkin kind of
correct kind of thing in that you might
this does not account for vacancy
and the philosophy that I have is
(33:04):
isI want to be 100%
full at all times. My vacancy
rate is very, very low and that's
maybe call for another
story. But you
have to properly vet the people that
you're going to have living in your
houses to make it successful. So that's
(33:26):
that's for another day. But
rule of thumb here, $329 a month,
that's good cash flow. Well, and
again, This is why I wanted when
you were showing me this offline, I
really wanted to share with
our people on on here. And again, if
you're on a podcast, go to the
(33:49):
video because
people always ask how can I get there?
What do I need to do?And you have
right and and you're moving in that
direction, but you. Analyze the
numbers, but also you you just mentioned
there's variables that are people
variables that that
(34:10):
you have to do some
other work maybe to make sure that these
aren't just going to be like, I don't
know, homeless people
squatting in your house or something, you
know
or or
doing all kinds of vandalism or things
(34:31):
like that, so. Yeah, property
management is not for the faint of heart,
but your success is
going to be based upon your ability to
vet and get the right people in
place. Now it's not going to work 100% of
the time, but if you can do a good job of
that, I promise it'll make your life a
(34:52):
lot easier. Yeah. And I
think as as you guys are working, reach
out to Mickey or us, we we have
this little template here
and make it your own, right. But but
these tools are really important.
But if you're going in and saying I want
to be a real estate investor and you
(35:13):
don't do your numbers, you don't do your
due diligence and then you end up
buying a property or you
you hire a property manager who is.
Or or even somebody to fix up your house
and and they can took took your money
and went and spent it on other things.
(35:33):
Well, that's on you, right. And so by
using these kind of tools, you are
the master of your ship. And that's one
of the things that I I think is important
for all of us is
understanding, you knowYour
own numbers and your own goals. So where
(35:54):
do you want to go from here, Mickey?I
mean, you went from 2 properties in five
years to to, what do you say, 38?
Where do you want to go?Do you're gonna,
you're gonna like buy hotels
or or sell sell those and
and I don't know, I'm just thinking
monopoly here. Yeah, I
(36:14):
don't have a really set goal in mind, but
continuing to scale is definitely the
goal. I can
tell you that single-family
properties are always a good deal.
Personally, in the book of business that
I have, I can tell you that the
(36:35):
biggest cash flow is coming from the
single-family properties. And
that's because you know it, right?You
understand single-family.
So maybe somebody else might be like I'm
I like. Duplexes or something else cause
they might know it, right?So yeah,
I have a good mix of fourplexes,
(36:56):
duplexes and and houses, so I'm probably
gonna stick with those. I I would
go bigger. But yeah, the goal is
definitely to keep on scaling.
And if I remember correctly,
you pretty much own a
houses in the same geographic area
or even the same St. So actually
(37:20):
on one St. I own
3 fourplexes, 1
duplex and a single family home
that's on a cul-de-sac. So I
basically have that whole block and then
I own on another St.
two houses. On another St.
(37:40):
I have two fourplexes
and a duplex. And then on another
St. I have a fourplex and a single house.
So I like to keep my properties in
bunches. Yeah. And close, right. You
didn't just buy properties in
another state. You bought it close to
where you're at. So when are they gonna
(38:01):
change the street name to Kurt
Alley or something like that?I'm not. I'm
not sure. I don't know. I was. I was
wondering if they're gonna be like
Mickey Lane or something.
You never know, they might do that.
You're the the mayor of that street,
(38:21):
right?So,
anything you want to leave the
guest today, anything you want to share
about even the the policies or
I've worked with Wealth Wisdom Financial
along the way, anything that you want to
say, hey, I want to make sure I share
this today. If there's one thing that I
(38:42):
want to impress is that
you must understand your numbers.
You must understand all the revenue
coming in, all the expenses going out,
and I would encourage you to map it out
the way that I did so you can forecast
accordingly. Once you
understand your numbers, you're able to
make informed decisions very objectively,
(39:05):
yeah. That is
great. And why I love profit first and
infinite banking and all of those
things and and not just knowing your
numbers, but knowing yourself, what are
your goals?And I think Mickey,
again, we've had countless conversations
about his goals of of
(39:26):
wanting to go from 1015 houses
to the amount that he has now
and having to make that jump. Right. I
remember for you a
couple years back, you were like a little
terrified of saying, hey, is it good?
Should I do this?Or
I I also had the the
(39:49):
conversation and and you were talking
about
buying another business or something like
that. And I was like, man,
you know what you're doing. Know your
lane and and really dive in
into that. And I that's what I'm so proud
of for you is like you've really nailed
(40:11):
in and it shows, right?
Yeah, I mean the the leap to leave the
W2 job is definitely not easy. I was at
the same job for
16 years and the job before that I had
for eight years and so that's what I was
used to. But again. By
planning this out over time, I was able
(40:33):
to map out ahead of time
where I thought I would be based upon
6 numbers that I knew that I could
achieve. And after I saw it on
the spreadsheet, it made it possible
to do it. And then at that point all you
have to do is just take that leap. Yeah,
and and that requires being able to be
(40:55):
strategic and and understanding.
But also at some point you just got to
make the jump and
and that is a hard thing to do,
especially as analytical people of
saying, OK, if everything's perfect
now and it's not always going to be
perfect, things happen, floods happen,
interest rates have gone up, right?
(41:18):
And I'm sure with even your data you'd be
able to say, hey, I want to
refinance a property. You've
probably thought about that and I know
you've talked to our
mortgage guy a few times to
say, hey, is this a good time to do this?
And so always going back in
(41:40):
and tweaking, we're never,
we're never done so. Well, thanks
Mickey for for joining us. You guys
that this was a great treat. I mean
literally seeing the spreadsheets
is is important. And if you want
to break through to a smart, stable
financial future, one is, as Mickey said,
(42:01):
know your numbers. And if you don't know
your numbers, get with people that can
help you know your numbers.
And with that,
thanks again for joining us. Don't
forget, hit that like, subscribe, write
comments in there. If you
like this kind of content, let us know.
We'll try and do more spreadsheets. It's
it is a lot of work to create these
(42:23):
spreadsheets. So that's why it takes
a lot of effort. People are like, yeah,
well, you just need to do more. I'm like,
it's a lot more work than you think, so.
With that, you guys have a great day and
we will see you next
time.
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