Why I‘ll Never Make It

Why I‘ll Never Make It

The actor’s journey is one of occasional highs and frequent lows. It is a path riddled with self-doubt and frustration as we question our career choices, wondering if we’ll ever really ”make it.” But it is those few moments of glory on stage or screen that can sustain us through all the setbacks and challenges. On this award-winning podcast, New York actor Patrick Oliver Jones invites fellow creatives to share three stories that offer a behind-the-scenes look at the creative life rarely seen in the glitz and glam of this industry. These conversations remind us we’re not alone in this often bumpy and winding journey of the performing arts.

Episodes

Jennifer Apple Turns Setbacks Into Artistic Growth and Community

September 12, 2025 • 60 mins
A serious back injury could have ended her career before it really began. Instead, it became the turning point that led to new opportunities—earning an MFA at ACT in San Francisco, training in Italy, and finding fresh ways to grow as a performer. In this episode, we talk about resilience, artistic reinvention, and how those setbacks eventually inspired the creation of the Empowered Artist Collective, a community and podcast suppor...
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FINAL FIVE: Patricia McGregor, Artistic Director of New York Theater Workshop

September 5, 2025 • 18 mins
Patricia McGregor’s first steps into the world of professional theater were marked by a sense of awe and a drive to make every moment matter. From performing under Orlando’s bright lights as a child to taking on demanding roles and responsibilities backstage in New York, Patricia learned early how powerful a single theatrical moment could be—sometimes just a gasp in the audience, or a split-second splash of stage blood. These forma...
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Patricia McGregor on Making Bold, Tough Choices and Shaping the Future of Theater

August 29, 2025 • 52 mins
Patricia McGregor’s journey to becoming artistic director of New York Theatre Workshop has been anything but linear. Growing up in the Virgin Islands, she and her sister created performances wherever they could, laying the foundation for a lifelong devotion to storytelling. Later, in New York, Patricia faced tough choices, financial struggles, and unexpected opportunities that tested her resolve but also expanded her vision as an a...
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FINAL FIVE: Sònia Victoria Werner, Co-Founder and CEO of Lighthouse Ladies

August 22, 2025 • 15 mins
In the previous episode, Sònia Victoria Werner and I dove into her background as an artist and the creation of Lighthouse Ladies, and while that was such an insightful conversation, there’s still so much more to explore! That’s why I’m thrilled to have Sonia back here with me for the Final Five Questions. These are where we get a little more personal—uncovering lessons learned, hopes for the industry, and a deeper look at what driv...
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Sònia Victoria Werner Is Reshaping the Arts By Making Space For Women

August 22, 2025 • 59 mins
From childhood improv classes to building a women-led production company, Sònia Victoria Werner has carved out an artistic path that’s as bold as it is inspiring. An actor, writer, producer, director, makeup artist, content creator, and entrepreneur, she thrives on telling authentic stories that cross cultures and push boundaries. You’ll soon hear her voice in a highly anticipated Netflix animated reboot and an upcoming AAA video g...
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FINAL FIVE: Joseph Zellnik, Musical Theater Composer and Author

August 5, 2025 • 17 mins
Joseph Zellnik is back for a candid and insightful bonus conversation about his journey as a writer and composer in the world of musical theater. Through these five final questions, Joseph shares personal stories from his early career including the lessons learned from his first professional show and the challenges of trying to resonate with an audience. He opens up about the evolution of his writing style how he now defines succes...
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Joseph Zellnik Combines Murder, Mystery, and Musical Theater

August 1, 2025 • 58 mins
Joseph Zellnik is a musical theater composer, and along with his playwright brother David they are best known for their 2010 musical, Yank! This Off-Broadway production picked up Best Musical nominations from the Drama Desk Awards, the Outer Critics’ Circle, and the Lucille Lortel Foundation. Beyond that, Joseph has also written mystery novels, including The Sound of Murder, the first in his "Musicals Are Murder" series, which clev...
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FINAL FIVE: Nick Rashad Burroughs, Broadway Actor in Kinky Boots and King Kong

July 25, 2025 • 16 mins
 In the previous episode, we explored Nick Rashad Burroughs' journey from Alabama to Broadway. And now we're getting even more personal. Join us as Nick answers the Final Five questions, revealing key lessons he's learned, his hopes for the performing arts industry, and what truly drives him as an artist.Why I’ll Never Make It is an independent production of WINMI Media and Patrick Oliver Jones. To support the ongoing efforts of th...
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Nick Rashad Burroughs Embraces His True Self and Finds a Path to Broadway

July 18, 2025 • 63 mins
Think Alabama isn't a breeding ground for Broadway stars? Think again! This week, we're joined by the phenomenal Nick Rashad Burroughs, who defies expectations and proves that talent truly knows no geographical bounds. From his early life in a deeply religious family in Birmingham, Alabama, Nick's sports-focused journey took an unexpected turn with an accidental audition that led him away from sports and the idea of becoming a past...
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Theater Tol Takes Performing Arts to New Heights - Hannah Snow and Benjamien Lycke

July 4, 2025 • 81 mins
Theater Tol was founded in 1998 by Lot Seuntjens, and this international company became known for its multidisciplinary performances, using images, drama, music, amd hardly any spoken text. And while they do perform all over the world, They don't use conventional theaters, instead preferring “unusual” locations: the site of an old factory, a park, a market square, a beach or the banks of a river. Whether its summer or winter, perfo...
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FINAL FIVE: Ravi Jain & Miriam Fernandes, Artistic Directors of Why Not Theatre in Toronto

June 27, 2025 • 15 mins
In the previous episode, Ravi Jain and Miriam Fernandes shared the winding paths that led them to co-lead Why Not Theatre, and how they’ve forged careers on their own terms. It was an incredibly honest and inspiring conversation—but there’s still more ground to cover. That’s why I’m so glad to have them both back with me for the Final Five Questions. This is where we get a little more personal—digging into the lessons they’ve lear...
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Ravi Jain and Miriam Fernandes Push the Bounds of Theater and Keep Asking Why Not

June 20, 2025 • 77 mins
Toronto is home to the third-largest English-speaking theatre district in the world—and at the heart of its thriving independent scene is Why Not Theatre, co-led by Ravi Jain and Miriam Fernandes. In this episode, they share their winding and deeply personal journeys through an industry that often made them question whether there was a place for artists like them. Ravi opens up about balancing the security of institutional roles w...
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FINAL FIVE: Aubie Merrylees, Actor in BOOP! and a Theater Coach

June 13, 2025 • 19 mins
Now in his third Broadway show, Aubie answers five final questions about his career and theater journey.In this bonus episode, Aubie Merrylees returns to answer the Final Five—a set of questions I ask every guest to close out their time on the podcast. From memories of his first professional show to the lessons he’s still learning today, Aubie opens up about what success means to him and the kind of change he hopes to see in the in...
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Aubie Merrylees on the Joys of BOOP! and the Disappointments of KPOP

June 6, 2025 • 68 mins
With Boop! The Musical earning three Tony nominations this year—including Best Choreography, Best Costume Design, and Best Leading Actress for Jasmine Amy Rogers—I’m joined by cast member Aubie Merrylees for a conversation that goes beyond the awards buzz. We talk about the fun and energy of Boop!, but also the moments that shaped his career long before this Broadway run. From a season of missed opportunities that led him to grad ...
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Tony Winner J. Harrison Ghee Finds Joy and Freedom in Theater and in Life

May 23, 2025 • 29 mins
Every June, Broadway’s biggest night reminds us just how thrilling and transformative live theater can be. The Tony Awards don’t just celebrate excellence—they spotlight the stories, the voices, and the people who are shaping the stage and pushing it forward. Since 1947, the Tonys have been honoring some of Broadway’s best, and this year is no exception, with Buena Vista Social Club, Death Becomes Her, and Maybe Happy Ending leadin...
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SPOTLIGHT: Stephanie Torns Brings Broadway to EPIC Players

May 9, 2025 • 31 mins
This is a special presentation of The Spotlight Series, which highlights organization making a difference in the arts and beyond... Stephanie Torns is a Broadway actress known for her standout roles in the Broadway hits like Wicked and Waitress. Over the past decade she has shown incredible dedication and stamina, bringing some of Broadway's favorite characters to life night after night. But Stephanie's impact goes way beyond just...
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Closing Night - Anthony Rapp Almost Makes His Broadway Debut

May 2, 2025 • 39 mins
Back in 2022, I had the chance to talk with Anthony Rapp—which, for me, was both a thrill and a bit surreal. I’d been following him on Instagram for a while, and one day as I was leaving an audition here in New York I happened to walk right past him. I stopped for a second, unsure if I should say anything. But then I thought, "when am I ever going to run into him again? "So I introduced myself and mentioned that I had a podcast—and...
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FINAL FIVE: George C. Heslin, Actor, Director and Producer.

April 25, 2025 • 20 mins
In our last episode, George Heslin shared some incredible stories about founding the Origin Theatre Company and his work as an Irish actor coming to New York. But as always, there’s more to discover. And these Final Five Questions are where we really get to know George, from personal lessons and thoughts on the future to offering some advice for those just starting out. We also debate one of my favorite topics to rant about: the go...
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George C. Heslin Helps Bring Irish Theater to New York City

April 18, 2025 • 48 mins
George Heslin came to New York in the mid-‘90s, but it wasn’t quite his idea to come here. So when he landed in the city he didn’t exactly hit the ground running. Instead, he spent four years as a struggling actor trying to find his footing, but mostly feeling lost and lonely. But with the help of a legendary acting teacher, out of that struggle came something remarkable. In 2002, George founded the Origin Theatre Company—literall...
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Bret Shuford Turns Broadway Lessons into Guidance for Others (REWIND)

April 4, 2025 • 55 mins
Bret Shuford has spent his career balancing two passions—performing on Broadway and helping others achieve their creative goals. From The Little Mermaid to Paramour, he built a successful stage career while also becoming a sought-after coach for actors and artists. But finding that balance wasn’t always easy. In this rewind episode from 2019, Bret shares how he navigated the highs and lows of the industry, the importance of authent...
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