March 12, 2024 • 52 mins
En algún momento de nuestra vida hemos escuchado del famoso “Síndrome del impostor” y puede que forme parte de nuestra vida y ni lo sepamos. En este episodio nuestra querida Belkis nos habla de este síndrome, de cómo nos afecta y cómo se manifiesta en nuestras vidas.
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(00:02):
Or a podcast. If you don' t know my name is Fullson Paulino,
along with Fernando Cevedo, who mypartner has been for fourteen years,
and an escort to whom he isn' t. Belkis batista. We talk
every week about serious and often notso serious issues, with the simple idea
of entertaining and educating you at thesame time. That' s possible.
If that' s possible, Belquispsychologist in intervention, in psychotherapy and a
(00:25):
very cheve person that what that kmae Mterst, except you already have you
matrías, berks with what pronoun youidentify her, she perfect Belki and I
have a question. You have amaster' s degree, you study at
the university, you' re apsychotherapist, you' re incriminating yourself in
(00:45):
the elbow. Yeah, I'm, so I' m, although
we have our differences for this rightthere and you think it' s good,
what do I tell you I've had my moments. It'
s been quite a gerr and morealso because I get out of a business
context. I' ve always workedin companies, and about four or five
(01:07):
years ago, I got the light. I want to make you like that
change and from there, like Istarted to experience, like that insecurity of
getting into this unknown terrain, butit' s something that over time I
' ve been working and obviously,with the experiences also like that it'
(01:30):
s something that I' ve beeninternalizing and I already feel much more advanced
in believing it. That, Fernandoand you, what you do with your
life. I paint, I amthe visual puppet before as well as I
think of many things, I studyand do many things for myself with what
it has given me, many insecuritiesthat with the part of visual art,
(01:56):
that I even sometimes forget that Iknow literal, that is whenever I go,
I make a picture, I saywow, how beautiful it is and
when I have to start the othersay honey. I forgot and lied.
But that doubt so there without securitytoo and see why it is that it
costs us so much work, tobelieve in what we do. Sometimes there
(02:16):
' s something every day that wedo every day whatever it takes before you
answer that and you what you doin your life. I do everything,
I do and you' re notalways here. I don' t ask
you, it doesn' t workout. I am here being humble so
that you can feel it can talkabout this problem you have and, in
(02:36):
addition to boasting the achievements that peoplealso cost you a lot. Yeah,
I think that like everything that hasto do with psychology and well you'
re also maybe already getting into theseissues, everything depends on the person.
I don' t like to generalizeand say look at this for this,
but there is a context, forexample, of upbringing where if I was
(02:58):
raised with many expectations, where itwas never enough that if I was finished
ninety- eight, and because Idon' t get a hundred, because
it' s costing me, it' s going to cost me to internalize
when I go well, because lifeisn' t perfect and I' m
not always going to get a hundredat work, I' m not always
going to be perfect, etcetera.It also has much to do with the
(03:19):
social context, at the social level. What is well seen is that I
am humble and in that humility Icannot preach about my achievements or how well
I am doing. In certain things, that can generate a little bit of
suspicion in other people. I don' t want to. Maybe lacerate my
relationships with others, then I kindof save that part a little bit.
(03:40):
I also think it has a lotto do with experiences. If I'
m not exposed to enough experiences,I' m not going to know what
I' m good at or whatI' m good at or what I
' m good at. Maybe ifI don' t have a lot of
knowledge of myself, I' venormalized something that for others can be really
cool. It may be that I, for example, always make people laugh,
(04:01):
but, as always has been,I don' t see it as
a talent until I expose myself Italk to different people and that' s
like they' re highlighting it tome or I' m realizing myself through
the reflection that it' s reallygoing well with me then, like I
think it' s a combination.It depends on many factors, even when
it comes to parenting. It's so fucked up,' cause nothing
(04:24):
else because they' re demanding youtoo much. Also if they ask you
to miss. Also the fact thatthey normalize you that is, that they
demand nothing from you, because you' re bad and you' re never
going to get out of there.That also encourages you to believe it too
and also the fact that, if, for example, when I was little,
they didn' t give me feedback, they didn' t tell me
(04:45):
how good you are at this orhow good you are at writing. I
' m not having as a barometer, I' m not having a meter
of ok Maybe on this side I' m highlighting myself I don' t
have what to measure myself and Igo out into the world and I don
' t have that knowledge yet andmore because of what I said right now,
I don' t have the experience. Then both extremes also affect.
(05:09):
So this situation has a name.In psychology, this set of attitudes that
one perceives of oneself, that is, those insecurities that tell him the disorder
of the impostor, was named after. Yeah, well, impossitant syndrome does.
In psychology one speaks of impostor syndromeor the phenomenon of impostor, which
(05:30):
is when a person does not reacha certain level of success or grows at
a professional level and does not attributehis success to his abilities and competences,
but attributes it to external or incidentalfactors. I did super good with a
job interview, but I got thejob because I got lucky. They gave
(05:54):
me a promotion, but well,they promoted me because there was no one
else. I mean, I don' t recognize that because of my abilities
and abilities, I was able todevelop myself, but I gave it to
factors that don' t have todo with me. You know what I
' ve been reading about about thissituation, about this subject. I read
(06:15):
that eighty- three percent of thepopulation suffers from impostor syndrome. I had
read before that it was like aseventy- fifty, but now size in
an eighty- three and before yousee it was seen more in women than
in men, why it could bethat. Research began on women because in
the 1970s, that is, womenbegan to take more prominence in the labor
(06:38):
industry and so on. Then itbegan to be studied because groups of women
manifested that they felt like a fraudwhen they arrived, like at the height
of their professional success, like theyfelt that they did not belong there,
like I do here, why Iam here, why they gave me this
(07:00):
opportunity, that is, from therebegan to investigate. However, as research
progresses, we realize that the majorityof the population is presented to both women
and eight many minority groups, ie anyone. And I think that'
s even expected, right, ormaybe we could say a natural process that
(07:26):
comes with growth. If I,well, as I told you right now,
have always worked in company and that' s my experience, you put
me in a meeting to do whatI have ten years doing and I won
' t hesitate you, because Ihave a lot of experience doing it.
That doesn' t give me anyinsecurity, no fear, because I'
ve done enough. But if youput me to talk about a psychology topic
(07:46):
that I' m learning, maybethere I get a little bit of that
insecurity, because maybe I still haven' t had enough experience for me to
feel in capacity. So I think, as we grow our career, it
probably happened to you when you startedthis podcast that I' m afraid of
at first, but we' regoing to talk like so a pot you
(08:07):
just had the study to the Clauand you' ve been told, Mom
Dale that I' m doing ithere, because here it already occurs to
you. That doesn' t birddoing a podcast and as you were taking
experiences, gaining experience, like,well, you already do this and you
do it with your eyes groe,nothing happens. So, since I think
it' s part of that gettingout of my comfort zone, expose me
(08:28):
to these new situations that my brainis obviously going to assume as dangerous situations.
Right, like my primitive brain,what he wants is to keep me
safe or secure. So any situationthat gets me out of that comfort zone
is a danger is going to beas much as possible so that I don
' t do it, so Idon' t expose myself, so that
(08:48):
I return to the initial position again. I, then, apart from what
he just told you, there's something like there' s something that
affects this, this, this kindof syndrome, because what I see is
something that can have you at somepoint, but you' re going to
go ahead with something that you don' t assume as yours, but you
(09:09):
' re still normal at work.So, in the end, the syndrome
affects beyond, or it' svery bad to have. There' s
a lot, I mean, Ididn' t know it was that high.
Then eighty- fifty percent of peoplehave it, but it works in
society, has ever in their lives. For now he' s got to
be with that exact person. ThenI wonder it affects on a general level.
Or it' s very bad tohave it, because I see that
(09:31):
society continues to function normally. Iwouldn' t say it' s bad
to have it, because it's something like your growth or your development.
So I see it that way andall perspective, like we do the
story that we don' t createof the things that happen to us.
But yes, it affects you personallyand affects you at work level. Why.
Because if you, for example,start a new position, they promoted
(09:56):
you and you' re questioning whythey gave me this job. I don
' t know anything. I don' t know how to do x hears
something. I don' t knowhow I' m gonna lead this project.
In your head there' s somuch noise that inevitably you or you
' re going to start procastinating,because you don' t want to face
the situation. You don' twant to make mistakes, you don'
(10:18):
t raise your hand, you don' t ask questions, because if you
ask questions, then they' llknow that you don' t know and
they' ll regret the decision andthey' ll go here. So it
' s going to affect you atwork level, because you' re going
to shrink and on a personal levelas well, and well, also forgiveness
at work level can even cause youburnout, because as well, as I
(10:39):
can procastine and stop doing things,too, on the other hand, I
can about working, about getting ready, wanting to make up, doing things
too much, working overtime and alsofeeling that when I come into it with
this mentality that I feel that ifI don' t, I' m
going to get lost. Or I' m going to lose like obviously,
I wear out a lot more,so it can also happen not like that
(11:03):
feeling of bernout, of mental exhaustionand on a personal level. If you
are in a situation where daily youhave these thoughts that generate anxiety, because
maybe you can develop some situation orsome anxiety issue, even this one of
depression, because you begin to questionyour abilities, you begin to question whether
(11:24):
you are really good or good atwhat you do and it is really worth
trying, then it can affect youin both ways also in your personal satisfaction,
life satisfaction or job satisfaction. Idon' t want to go to
work, because every time I goto work, what I' m going
to do I don' t feelgood about my life, because I feel
(11:46):
like I' m not moving forward, I feel like I' m stuck.
I mean, it can affect youin a lot of ways I dream,
that is, I relate it alot to low self- esteem.
I don' t know if that' s right to do it, because
when we talk about the imposter's syndrome, according to what I have
understanding of what we' re talkingabout right now. Yes, to Fernando,
I tell you your paintings are amazing. He could answer me. No.
No. Actually, that was theone that came out like that because
(12:09):
I know and not even I feelthat normal. I' ve seen better
than mine. That' s relatedto a lack of self- esteem or
a self- esteem problem, andthat was an example I put It hasn
' t happened. Yeah, well, maybe I could move self- esteem
as a global issue and impostor syndromeas something circumstantial or you' re going
to put it as well as self- esteem of everything that encompasses. How
(12:30):
I look, How I see whatmy abilities are, how I interpret people
seeing me as what they see ofme. How much I appreciate myself,
how much I cherish myself, howmuch I love myself, and so on.
I mean, self- esteem isglobal, impostor syndrome. We talk
about topics, perhaps or a contextualor situational theme, where in a work
(12:54):
context or in a context where Iset a goal or I am trying to
achieve if your goal begins to feelthat insecurity. But that insecurity does not
necessarily have to manifest in other areasof my life. I mean, I
can, for example, perfectly havethat insecurity in my subjects, following the
(13:15):
same example, in my experience.Well, when I started wow, I
was really scared. I was talkingabout psychology issues. I' m afraid
to expose myself. However, ifyou put me in another context to talk
about other things, I know thatI' m very hard, then I
kind of mean, like they canrelate. But imposter syndrome is more circumstantial
with specific issues. There' ssome benefit to me having drive syndrome.
(13:43):
Well, because we' re talkinga lot about the bad. Yeah,
yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, but I, like I tell you,
the narrative, it' s superimportant to me, and if something
makes you so much noise, it' s because you care. But first
and second is that it can evenserve as a motivator, because there are
people who give it a very goodjob opportunity. However, they fall asleep
(14:07):
in their bay and say hey Iam the best. I' m not
going to learn and I' mnot going to your day, I'
m not doing anything and they caneven lose it. However, if I
have this insecurity that I have tolearn, what it is for me to
practice, what it is for meto expose myself, then I can use
it as an engine for me tomove around and get closer, perhaps to
(14:30):
that ideal state that I want,which is to be an expert on such
a subject, which is to leadwhat kind of project it is can be
a personal challenge. I love myselfhow I know. I want to do
a triathlon, that is, thingsyou say, wow, I' m
not a triathlete or I' mnot the yes or the company, but
I' m going to walk andI' m going to get there if
(14:54):
they gave me the chance, becauseI just kind of get ready until I
can as I say overcome that insecurity. With my experience and with my knowledge,
you know that in the arts,in the creative parts, in the
human aspects, just as you seea lot precisely because people believe from nothing
(15:16):
something that is not and feel doubts. So I feel, I think it
helps a lot for you to doubtyou and to try how to move on
and overcome that because that' sexactly where the teachers come from. A
great teacher is always going to haveopportunities to improve, that is, you
(15:41):
always follow as in constant learning,and I think it comes out that at
first you feel it. Like Iused to say, I always thought it
was me I forgot. Oh,I forgot to paint. However, when
I start I am already at astage where I simply face that new picture,
that new project and I start before, not before. I used to
(16:06):
last you even in depressions, Imean, I started there in psychology,
in therapy. That' s whyimpostor syndrome, i e, I was
super blocked and not that I don' t understand, and obviously, there
were more things in my life thathad to be worked, that also influenced,
(16:26):
but yes I mean it' snot that you forget, it'
s that you stop believing that youcan. However, when you face that,
when you get to that, yourealize that you don' t,
that the hand knows it alone.Yes, and also to ignore feedback,
because I' m sure many peoplehave given you praise for your work.
Yeah, yeah. However, whenyou face this new project that maybe is
(16:48):
a new client, a different clientor I don' t know the context
very well, yours, but it' s something different, you say like
that well, don' t okI forgot everything already, everything that I
did stays aside. Yeah, andnow I kind of don' t know
how to do this, like thiskind of project I don' t know
managed or this kind of project Idon' t know, etcetera. And
something that Ledyga the Great Lady gagasaid that we must also release false humility.
(17:11):
I mean, you also have tobelieve and support your work. If
someone praises your work, you tellhim, yes, I spent a lot
of effort doing that and I likedit very much. Yeah, and I
like that a lot because many timespeople want to help us, that'
s like they want to help usor they don' t even do it
(17:33):
unconsciously, because when people tell youthat wow, that you look good,
they' re not going to doit thinking that maybe you have a insecurity
about it, but for random thingspeople tell you. However, what we
do is question it ay no.The thing is, that day is so
beautiful, not what you know.But instead of one internalizing it and assuming
it and saying pussy it did mesuper good. I did, super well,
(17:55):
I spoke super well, I mean, instead of recognizing it, instead
of accepting the issues. I dowhat I do, I reject it now.
Paradoxically, as well, I rejectpraise. I take any criticism as
it is. That' s oneof the problems that syndrome has so hard
(18:15):
and I take the reviews and takeit to the grave. I mean,
you tell me to look at itwritten in stone. I loved that report,
but the color would have liked itto be different. Oh my God
I don' t take colors aswell as I jumped with that, I
mean, I have very little toleranceto criticism, even if it' s
constructive criticism, so it' slike wow or no, because if we
(18:41):
can say positive criticism and constructive criticism, we' re going to accept criticism.
Let me not ignore positive criticism cand let me just assume negative criticism.
I wanted to ask you if thissyndrome was so big that it had
as a subdivision. And or branchif there are several types of impostor syndrome
or if that is the general syndromeas and is the one used for all
kinds of things that have to dowith that. Yes, it can manifest
(19:03):
in different ways. It can bemanifested of the perfectionist type that I have
to do it Everything perfect, therecan be no mistakes, Everything has to
be a hundred so clear and obviouslythat makes me stop doing things, because
nothing is perfect. Then either procastineor I do it a thousand times to
(19:23):
weariness and I never feel comfortable withthe result. Leave the middle stuff,
I tell you the middle thing becauseI say don' t stress me too
much to do it. So he' s the type of perfectionist. We
also have the superhero guy who saysah no I can do it alone.
I don' t need help,because if I ask people for help,
they' re going to know thatI don' t know anything, or
(19:45):
people are going to find me out, they' re going to know that
I' m a fraud and Idon' t want that we don'
t have this type, I canbreak myself, the perfectionist type, the
(20:08):
soloist type, the natural genius that, for example, I attribute to him
that I learn something fast, simplybecause I learn fast instead of the effort
that it takes me to learn certainsubjects, that is, instead of me
recognizing that maybe I gave him timeto study this. What I say well,
what happens is that I' measy to study. Help me,
I think you have an expert me, the expert who says he has to
(20:30):
know everything that I the expert issuper interesting, because that' s what
he says doesn' t matter,or that' s what he does.
How much I prepare is never goingto be enough. And you see people
studying a lot, learning the topic, looking for such a book, what,
such a book, such a book, and you never throw it because
(20:52):
it says that it still lacks,that it is still not enough. I
' ve already said what the geniusand the natural genius is that was that
I now learn naturally, the roughone missed you. I think you say
tough that they think they don't need anyone' s help, exactly
what I can do alone, thatsuperhero. But that' s to keep
people from knowing that maybe I don' t know something and it' s
(21:15):
completely normal. I mean, looklike right now. You know, Tess
asked me that question, and Isaid, uh, my bottle broke.
What he' s saying is nothing' s wrong. We don' t
have it to know everything. Imean, you' re an expert on
a topic, you know a topic, but things happen and nothing happens,
I mean, not asking questions iseven not bad. On the contrary,
people learn more when they ask clearquestions. When you have a person who
(21:37):
has impostor syndrome and refuses to askfor help and refuses to seek a mentor
and tells you well, look,maybe that' s the first thing we
have to work on, because itmakes your way a lot easier. When
people tell you look, I triedto do, I tried what works,
this shortens your learning curve. Soit' s kind of like maybe doing
(21:57):
the passes with that, too.But if I think those five are the
most relevant. We' re gonnatake a break, guys,' cause
we need money. Because you needsome money. We' re back and
we want to thank Carla Ignatius forbeing a Patreon. Thank you, Carla,
(22:18):
for being Patreon. Thanks also tothe 60 thugs we have today.
If you guys wouldn' t beable to do this. Thank you very
much, if you don' tknow what I' m talking about between
Homeland with Slash Wilfirerland and your cashcontribution, you can help this program continue.
In fact, this is the waythe program continues. Thank you,
Carla. I wanted to ask youif, whatever I mean, it smells
(22:41):
to me, but I want toask you. In your experience working with
the Community, you have seen thissyndrome present in members of the Community.
Yeah, sure, sure, andI' m telling you because I'
m not. We' ve talkeda lot here about the ego, the
doctor about what it' s calledthe hero, no yes, but we
weren' t made up of egoslike the medical profession of everything in there
are many gays that there' sa lot of bird, because birds need
(23:07):
like that valid, that validation,is to make up exactly. Las.
I wanted to ask you if yourexperience working with the Community, if you
have, because I don' tknow how much your work in the Community.
You' ve seen a lot ofthat syndrome or not, yes,
definitely, and I was just preparingfor it, I was seeing if there
were studies as conclusive about the Communityas such, and maybe there aren'
(23:29):
t so many studies, but thereis a correlation between the minority stress that
people in the Community suffer and impostorsyndrome. Why? Because if I,
to study, have to break armsto get to where I am, in
this company, I have to breakarms people telling me people, questioning me
(23:56):
comments of type. Oh, he' s so good, but there'
s the excellent but and having tobe battling with this, either discrimination,
or biased comments, or negative comments, that is, it' s a
very uphill job. Yeah, whenI get to sit at a table with
people, maybe company managers and soon, I' m gonna feel like
(24:18):
a fish down the water. I' m going to say that I do
here, as I came here,so it kind of happens a lot that
questioning and those doubts and more becauseof the same fact that you were talking
about compensation right now, which issomething that is known in the community is
that to make up for that,he' s very good. But we
want to be excellent at everything,at everything and put on a lot.
(24:41):
But, but it' s abird, but it' s clear,
but it' s that today,but exactly then, we want to be
excellent at everything and we put alot of pressure on ourselves and sometimes even
very complex goals and if we don' t reach them, we beat ourselves.
It' s like that part too, like there' s that relationship.
(25:03):
You know Gabriel J. Martin,in his book he wants to have
a lot of faggots. Play thosesongs a little bit and he talks about
not necessarily telling you directly. Butthe fact that you perceive that they are
telling someone that you may understand thatthey have the same living condition as you
already assimilate it as they are tellingyou then the fact that you perceive,
for example, that they are beinghomophobic with another person or they are being
(25:26):
homophobic with you because you associate.So, that' s why I understand
that that' s why in theCommunity there are a lot of people who
need to excel, you need toknow how much for that, to compensate
and be able to have as amattress to say, okay. But I
(25:48):
am such a thing. You understandyourself many times it also happens that and,
well, I don' t wantto get too much out of it,
but that I choose gay jarana isalmost always the one that ends again,
I' m not generalizing, butit happens a lot. It is
the one who ends up caring formom or dad when there is a disease
(26:08):
or when you have to keep thefamily member for economic reasons or what it
is almost always the person in thecommunity, because because if I am causing
so much pain, being gay,I will compensate you by taking care of
you and sometimes we wear out tryingto make up for that fault, which
(26:30):
is not a fault, but theyhave instilled us so much in the head
that it is a fault, thatwe spend trying to compensate that fault at
the family level or in the companies, trying to stand out in our environments.
There is a lot going on,for example, the society from which
people who are transgender or who arefrom how it is from the third gender,
(26:52):
from the third gender, from themany, for example, in Mexico
and also in Indonesia, I thinkthere is a sperit group that they are
people that their job would be tocare for parents. I mean, that
' s expected to happen. There' s also a lot to be expected
from this idea that you' regoing to raise these three families, you
(27:14):
' re going to have children,you' re not going to reproduce.
Then your work focuses on caring Momand Dad who are old, and that
' s what you' re goingto do with your life. I see
him very, very, very,very, very much, very much he
wants to ask you. It's bad to some extent, when,
when you have this kind of syndrome, you can get a little bit ambitious,
like in the kind of syndrome youmentioned right now. It' s
(27:34):
bad for you to be ambitious foryou to achieve your goals in the end,
that is, because it' snot as natural as you think.
I don' t know, yeah. I believe that since everything is neither
bad nor this good, it issimply ambition. We' re ambitious.
I think the problem is how Imanage that ambition, how I manage those
(27:59):
expectations that I have. If Iam ambitious and I am on my ladder
of success, as I said andI am not enjoying it, what is
it worth to me to get tothe top, if I will be all
my relationships. I' m alone, I don' t feel good about
(28:21):
myself, I don' t feelhappy, I don' t feel like
I' ve made an impact,that' s what I' m having
trouble getting to that peak Maybe it' s worth a lot then the issue
isn' t being ambitious about howI manage that ambition and how I manage
my successes, or how I managemy victories something that happens a lot and
(28:48):
good about a concept that I'm thinking about recently because of an experience
that happened to me, is thatall victories feel the same. However,
we think that you are not goingto give as an extra like an ITEV
if I fulfill such a goal ina certain way, if, for example,
you, when you started your podcast, wanted to have a hundred listeners,
when those hundred listeners arrived that victory, that two pamine that rose from
(29:11):
that happiness. It was the samewhen they had a thousand listeners or when
an episode broke records, that is, the same level. You had euphoria
for a couple of seconds and jorthat I feel good. And so,
but in the end, a coupleof minutes later, or a couple of
hours later, that' s outof your mind. What happens when we
have people who are extremely ambitious,who live by moving the goal, I
(29:33):
mean, I set myself a goalof a thousand listeners. I' ve
already reached the thousand you listen toher. I don' t celebrate because
imagine a sonana mile. Anyone hasa thousand, so now I want it
to be three thousand, or nowI want it to be five thousand.
You' re not enjoying that road. Then the only thing you' re
going to add stress to, addpressure to, and you' re going
(29:57):
to miss out on that repetitive feelingyou can have if you' re celebrating
those little wins, either 100 ina hundred out of five hundred. Whatever
it is, then, it's like working that relationship with our ambition.
I don' t want to settledown and stay in one place.
I want to keep going, Iwant to keep growing, but it'
s cloudy or not where I am. I' ve achieved what I once
(30:19):
dreamed I wanted. I mean,right now we' re drinking a dream
that we had years ago that wedidn' t enjoy that, because I
keep moving the goal. If Ikeep moving the goal, I will never
be happy, because the goal canalways move one, can always improve,
can always climb, can always earnmore money, can always move to a
(30:40):
better apartment, can always buy somethingelse. So we kind of waste a
lot of time or waste a lotof opportunities that we have to enjoy that
road and that ladder. The issueof impostor syndrome relates it a lot as
I am now learning with a littleword that kind of reaches my heart and
(31:03):
I want to ask you you arerelated to impostor syndrome with self sabotage.
Sure, because your mind sabotages you, I mean, your mind can'
t celebrate that you were given thatjob your ro mind that says, uh,
you were lucky this one that saysno, but that maybe you don
' t know that much. You' re not as good as that.
That was a chepazo, that carsabotage thing your mind is trying to sabotage
(31:26):
you, you' re sabotaging thatvictory. But now that you' ve
got everything self sabotaged, because Irelate it a lot to personal relationships,
you can have imposture syndrome in arelationship. That' s interesting. I
don' t know what literature says, but it does happen if you'
(31:48):
re going to set an example.Aha I know a person and that person
has a certain attachment already you getso sick talk about that topic. Here
' s an insurance you know related, you communicate you know and I,
who come with my problem patch,I don' t know related. And
like I' m like a fishout of the water, maybe I'
(32:12):
ve taken therapy, like I'm learning, maybe I can feel like
a fraud in front of that newperson who shows me that security and I
' m still working, like withthose unconscious issues that still touch me working.
Then maybe I could see him outthere. But the example I was
going to give you, for examplefriends, when you' re a dad
(32:34):
or mom or a baby, youdon' t have a manual, you
don' t instruct me, youdon' t get a chip and you
say you' re already super superdad or super mom, I mean,
that' s what he had learning. And obviously, when you find yourself
with that role and that baby that' s needing your attention and you'
ll probably have a lot of troublethat you never even imagined. Maybe in
(32:58):
that moment you feel like an impostThere are even parents who say I don
' t know what I' mdoing. No, and worse, the
whole society gets to give you advicethat you' re doing it wrong,
that you' re still not havinga boy. Exactly then what happens and
I' m starting to compare orI' m starting to put a very
high stick on me. I mean, it' s like that too,
like it can generate you, likethat feeling I' ll associate with that,
(33:22):
like, with that feeling that Ifeel inadequate for this tax, or
I feel inadequate for this job.But something, for example, with the
subject of self- sabotage, whichalso seems super interesting to me and I
don' t remember if we talkedabout it a little while ago, but
still worth remembering is that our brainis designed to protect us. So it
' s not so much that Iwant to sabotage cars and then unconsciously,
(33:46):
because I come against that it canhappen, that is, that, because
of my life history context, Ihave that inclination to self sabotage my relationships
I work hard. Yeah, thatcan pass the context of my life story.
But we also have to remember thatour primitive brain. What he wants
(34:07):
is to protect us. Its mainfunction is to protect us. And even
if now the danger is I camea podcast talking to you and that listens
to me a lot of people,the brain does not distinguish between that and
that I was going to get intoa cave and I was exposed to eating
(34:28):
a lion. I mean, thesame danger. The brain simply identifies danger.
So, when I' m gettingout of my comfort zone, my
brain plays wait. We' recoming out here like we don' t
know what' s going to happen, we don' t know I have,
I don' t want to experiencethat negative sensations, I don'
(34:51):
t want to experience criticism, Idon' t want to experience that I
can lose that job, that peopleare going to think less of me,
that I' m going to thinkthat I don' t have the capacity,
that' s all that' sdanger then the brain says don'
t wait, give it back.That work doesn' t go there,
don' t raise your hand,stay studying, stay prepared, that is,
it' s also a natural mechanismof the brain to protect us.
I want to ask what things canhelp us learn to overcome these attitudes that
(35:17):
we understand are harmful to development.There are techniques, there are ways to
do yes, first sorry. AndI also want to ask if there'
s a way for me to identifyhim, because right now, I'
m in that loop and I'm not realizing it. Yeah, well,
to identify it is you seeing yourrelationship or seeing the meaning, seeing
(35:39):
the situation that' s going onand you usually look at you when we
talk about impostor syndrome there' sa lot of self- criticism and low
tolerance for not knowing, low tolerancefor mistakes and low compassion for myself.
Because if I' m facing anew conchale situation it' s already going
(35:59):
to that you' re not whipping, so there' s a lot of
criticism, a lot of pressure anda lot of questioning. So, since
that, that, that question orthat feeling of me, I don'
t deserve to be here. MaybeI' m here for a chepazo,
or maybe this isn' t myplace. I' m not gonna make
(36:20):
it up to you anymore since youstart questioning that. Maybe you can think
about what you' re going throughMaybe you' re going through pose syndrome
Just like what you' re sayingis like a perfect prescription for anxiety.
So, exactly immediately you' restarting to feel that anxiety. That'
s why you' re following maybesit down and question yourself, because there
are times when people are in ameeting and they get the answer out of
(36:45):
something and they don' t raisetheir hands. Why didn' t you
raise your hand? No, becauseI' m scared. Yeah, me
being a fool. That could bea symptom. So it happens often and
you see that they gave you thisnew position and you don' t say
my granddaughter' s mouth at anymeeting if, for example, you see
yourself procastin' things because you wantthem to turn out perfect. Well,
(37:06):
that' s a symptom. Ifyou see that you are never happy with
anything, you don' t wantto ask for help because you feel that
people are going to criticize you,or people are going to judge you,
or people are going to find outthat you really don' t have the
ability. Those are like signs.So I kind of watch the signals or
not. Perhaps here there is oneissue to work on and to start working
(37:29):
on it the first thing is tomake peace, with which that is typical
of my development. Of course,if you don' t want to feel
imposter syndrome, stay doing what you' ve always done. Don' t
move, don' t grow up, don' t do anything. And
that' s the perfect formula foryou not to feel that now. If
you want to grow up, sofirst we have to make the move that
(37:50):
that may be something that' sgoing to happen to you. When a
person, for example, questions hisabilities and abilities, it is recommended that
I carry a blog of feedback andachievements. If I, for example,
had a meeting and they told meWowl that you presented super well. I
write it down, ah Wowl,who looks at that Ppet, who tweets
(38:15):
Ppet for the z- generations ofpower point. That was used before God
changed and here not exactly then andif you get a presentation, I look
cool and more I love colors.Okay, I write it down, I
learned to make a report. Iwrite it down. So as we write
down, we' re giving ourbrain time to internalize those things that I
(38:38):
' m moving on to or thatother people are feedback me into and they
' re giving me as the go- ahead that if I' m doing
it right, I like it tooif and this depends on the person,
there are people who like video games. I think you like video games.
There are people who like to dance, there are people who like exercise.
(39:00):
Then maybe we can do an exerciseconsidering something you like. I' ll
take your video game example and let' s say ok. Imagine that this
new job, this new position,this new project, is a new video
game that you bought and everything thatyou have to do that right now you
don' t know what to do. It' s a new level that
(39:21):
you have to reach. And likeany video game, you' re not
gonna come out all of a sudden, wow and step on level, no,
it' s gonna fail, they' re gonna kill you, they
' re gonna shoot you, that' s what. Then let' s
see it like this instead of puttingso much pressure on it that all of
what I have to do has togo well at first. So, if
we start seeing it as a videogame, we' re going to start
(39:42):
working on one level at a timeto make a list of all those things
that give you insecurity talking in publicpresents with a manager x and z is
scored. Then we say or howwe can work on the first level.
Maybe start at the easiest at theeasiest and work on ex sets. I
never saw myself debit in being perfectwhat resources you have available, you can
(40:04):
search the Internet or the easiest thingfor me, but not everyone sees it
that way is asking a partner.I don' t always work. There
' s someone who' s anexpert on a subject, or become friends
with that person and ask him howI' m going to vote the report
finish. That' s perfect,let' s then go to the next
level and so we' re doingit at level to level. When I
see that I am moving forward,anxiety is going down because I am feeling
(40:28):
capable and in the end, thequestion is not or should not be.
I have to know everything but Ihave the ability to learn. I have
the ability to develop and acquire thisknowledge and to implement it. So,
if I go with that mentality andI' m going slowly, it'
s not that I' m goingto do well at first, but eventually
(40:50):
I' m going to eat thatsense a little bit better. Another thing
is super important is exposure. Hekeeps raising his hand to be aware that
when I am in a meeting andI remain silent. Maybe that' s
my instinct trying to protect me Andsince I have these conversations and since you
come to see, I can sayokay wait, I' m going to
raise my hand and I' mgoing to expose myself, even if I
(41:14):
' m afraid, I' mgoing to do it with fear I raise
my hand and I realize that nothinghappens, that if I ask a question,
I' m just going to answerit and the world is going to
keep turning. Okay And it isalso expected in all companies, and perhaps
this relates a lot to that company, because it is where most, as
these issues are evidenced in companies,it is expected that the person will go
(41:36):
through a learning curve. So ifyou don' t ask a question,
it' s also a problem,because then you' re going to say
I think it' s going tohappen again, you don' t ask
anything. They don' t knowhow to ask questions, realize that the
world isn' t going to endand little by little and I' m
going to expose myself until finally Ifeel good about that, in that task,
(41:59):
in that project. It' sa new role that I laugh at,
because it' s been a longtime, that I' ve worked
with a person in consultation who finally, after a long time working, feels
super good, like they say wow, I had a year working like this
project. And so we have ayear working on the subject. And it
' s like giving it there andpromoting it again and it' s coming
(42:22):
back I prescribed the yes not todo it to you, it' s
like nothing happened, like we haven' t worked anything in the last year.
Then I kind of laugh,'cause it' s like you'
re getting ready to feel better.But eventually the rat you go back will
put you in another situation. Soeither life is putting this, life is
gonna put you like that That's growing up. But already when you
go to a second round, youalso kind of go more prepared, mentally
(42:44):
prepared and you know more or lesswhat to expect. You also know it
' s very important, very important. You' re going to be honest
with yourself. And one first,like you said, realize that if you
' re learning something, you're learning something. You' re not
a master of that and something thatat least worked out a lot for me,
you can get ahead of yourself.I mean, if you have a
new job in all jobs, inall companies you country, you give three
(43:06):
months of testing everything so you don' t even have to vote you vote
without anything, without how to say. The compensation is that there is then
you have responsibility, without responsibility,then it is for that you also have
your three months chance. Sure.Another thing is, if you' re
putting the size on it, you' re gonna be three months. I
mean, loose, that' swhen you get in front of the first
(43:28):
thing you say sorry. I'm new to such a thing And now
and that lightens the burden a littlebit, because precisely you' re letting
people see that you' re learningto vulnerate yourself. And that' s
super important. Again, I don' t want to be the subject,
but in companies it' s superimportant, like creating that psychological security climate
that if someone doesn' t knowsomething, they can raise their hands and
(43:49):
say look. I don' tknow and nothing' s gonna happen.
I mean, there' s nonegative impact and something that happens when we,
we don' t allow ourselves tobe vulnerable, that other people have
the space to make it also clearand often happens that you say wow.
And that' s what I'm saying from my own experience, and
maybe you can also identify that you' re in the middle of something doing
(44:12):
a project. Maybe he is,in the same example, that everything you
say says wow. I don't know anything about what I' m
doing and other people are going tosay I don' t know exactly either.
I' m not just doing itmyself, and it' s like
wow. We can talk about this. We don' t know what we
' re doing, but let's figure it out, let' s
find a way to do it.Then that vulnerability also allows you to connect
with others and not feel like you' re the only person who doesn'
t know what he' s doing. Of course and you' re not
(44:34):
stuck in saying no, I don' t know how to look for it,
because if they hired you, it' s because you have to look
for it, you have the ability. Yes, something that also comes with
the subject of luck is like that, well, when a recruiter hires you.
You' ve already seen enough profiles, i e, many profiles,
(44:57):
depending on the position, but theycan be diema size of fifteen, because
it has to be you of thatkind, I mean, you competed with
a lot of people and in youthey saw those abilities. No one expects
you to know your first job,because even when you move from one company
to another. The different culture,the expectations are different, the tasks are
(45:19):
different. So, even if youknow how to report being the reports you
' re going to be asked forin company, they' re not the
same as I was with you,then it' s hoped that you have
to learn how to manage in thisnew company. So, but it'
s kind of okay, lucky,but it' s really strong. Or
just that you had something that stoodout and that made the difference between the
(45:39):
themes and you know I macro it. You also have to fight a lot
with culture, because the culture ofus, the Latin culture, is that
you have to give that false humilitythat if they praise you, you always
have to be woe, but it' s not that bad. No,
I love it and it hits alot. For example, John Jo that
a friend that we have in common, he is very sure of himself and
(46:01):
sometimes when he says something, hecrashes aha to crash. You stay like
it' s a feature and he' s very envious of him because it
' s like wow, cool thatyou can defend your work that way.
M But precisely we should be morethe way we play. Yeah, sure,
totally yeah, I love him,I love him a lot for that,
(46:22):
and I learn a lot about himbecause of that, too, because
you understand that Juanjo, yes theone who is aspiring to that ruler and
I or class one even for that, for you to throw yourself, I
mean, I was talking like hewas saying old or real. I admire
you so much, not only forwhat you' ve done historically, but
(46:44):
for you to have the ovaries andthe balls to say no, I'
m going to throw myself the ruler. You' ve never been a ruler
in your life, but he's going to throw himself, be a
laughingstock and he' s going tolearn and the tabon to work can be
late. He' s got areally cool proposal. I mean, he
' s prepared a lot. Hestopped doing everything he' s doing to
you just to get ready for that. I mean, that' s admirable
(47:06):
to throw yourself at this audience thatwe already know of cork. I mean,
that deserves, that' s likethat deserves recognition and it takes a
lot of courage to do it.And I can' t, I can
' t speak for him, butI' m sure at some point he
even felt some kind of fear ofinsecurity. He just gave it up to
a point where he doesn' teven remember that he came to feel that
(47:29):
clear waiting for something you want tosay to make us more reliable, that
we' re more like Juanjo wedefend our work, but more shuffled.
Yes, yes and no, andthat if you are praised, it is
more put it on, put iton Today if I choose and I say
yes, I know, thank you, thank you, no, yes,
I know. No. It's not good. What happens is that
false humility to me. I've been fighting it for a while,
(47:51):
and it' s just like that, and I know it' s a
shock. But for one, asat least I feel so for one,
as I fight that background that onehas, that story that one has,
that one has to get way downand down I put myself up. Then
it levels me down. I know, thank you, thank you, thank
you, yes, and that whenyou just say thank you, you also
(48:14):
let the message in, because ifyou, if someone gives you a compliment
and you cut it and say no, but such a thing, such a
thing, in the end what staysin your brain is what you said about
such a thing and such a thingand you don' t internalize that gift
that people give you. It wasa praise, a constructive criticism. Those
are gifts that we internalize and wesay ok that I' m going to
(48:36):
do with that eye, we're not talking about light eye pyropos praise
yes, but it' s agift that people give you. Then it
' s like allowing him in.Later you know you do something else with
it. If you want to saythat it was final to say good,
well, on the subject that don' t run away from Poster Syndrome On
(48:59):
the contrary, embrace it and don' t be afraid to make mistakes,
because the people we most admire inthe world, the people who have done
things the most for the development ofhumanity, the bigger projects, the thing
is more important. The most famouspeople, the people that the brightest minds,
have made a lot of mistakes toget to their final product or whatever
(49:23):
they are doing. So, whoare you, Good Beel, who are
you to think that you don't have to do everything perfect, that
is, please, let' sgo to a little bit of exacting,
so it' s not gozne impositors, yes, exactly, ble que no,
(49:46):
i mean it' s not seeing, and the pressa, which I
like a lot, is better donethan perfect. You, you do,
you learn says OK I liked it. Like you say, I turn it
back and do it or I didn' t like it. I think he
has an area of opportunity. I' ll fix them and I' ll
come back and do it. Andso, little by little, I'
m developing and I' m perfectingmyself in those skills and celebrating ourselves sometimes
as we do very good work incelebrating the positive things that happen to us.
(50:08):
If you think of another message,also another ad. If you think
you were given that position luckily,instead of spending not so much time pre
- questioning. Not what. Notbecause I got it, because there was
no one to walk it. Theydidn' t give it to me because
they didn' t find another candidate. Not because I got lucky, because
(50:29):
they have it all, because okay, let' s say it was lucky,
okay, and what happens. Ifit was lucky you' re already
here, then let' s focusbetter on how you can contribute, how
you can make that place a betterplace, how you can bring your talents
(50:50):
and take that position perhaps from theplace that was to the next level.
I know how you stand out.They' re not left in chon clau
or why they gave it to me, but they already gave it to me.
Perfect. Now that I do withthat, maybe that' s a
better question to ask totally. Iwant to ask you if you have nets,
(51:10):
where we can find you. Ihave nets, I have instagram is.
Belkis batista, Belkis with exact latinathe kistona do not put in a
banagear, please, and in theinstagram also bel Kiso autistic metal gean,
but if you can also write meout there for quotations any questions, any
(51:30):
topics, if they are happening forthis situation, they also need some recommendation.
You can text me that I answeryou there. Thank you Suelki,
Thank you ringing, Thank you forthe invitation and reality that you imagine what
helps us to go to therapy toovercome these kinds of issues. Pretty much
so, keep your time in consultationbecause also, that is not that it
(51:52):
is a topic that you cannot overcome, because through experience and you exposing yourself,
you pull forward. But it's easier, not easier when you
' re accompanied by a person,because you don' t have to be
beating up. So and you egathat also generates a little bit of anxiety,
but you in a guided accompaniment.Perhaps there is more structure and as
(52:15):
you can move forward more effectively,then have the chance to come to perfect
consultation. We' re going tocontinue this conversation or change a ching of
the subject in Patreon. Let's continue whatever you want to keep listening
to. You can keep going topatá a point like Wilferland esclash, and
it' s to continue listening tothis conversation to get your money out,
making your money. There' sstary Tim in the pattern astory to Time,
(52:37):
not selfish. Share that episode.Listen to the podcast not the Microwave,
which is another podcast of the listeningtext family and have a good bye
or podcast k
Or a podcast. If you don' t know my name is Fullson Paulino,
along with Fernando Cevedo, who mypartner has been for fourteen years,
and an escort to whom he isn' t. Belkis batista. We talk
every week about serious and often notso serious issues, with the simple idea
of entertaining and educating you at thesame time. That' s possible.
If that' s possible, Belquispsychologist in intervention, in psychotherapy and a
(00:25):
very cheve person that what that kmae Mterst, except you already have you
matrías, berks with what pronoun youidentify her, she perfect Belki and I
have a question. You have amaster' s degree, you study at
the university, you' re apsychotherapist, you' re incriminating yourself in
(00:45):
the elbow. Yeah, I'm, so I' m, although
we have our differences for this rightthere and you think it' s good,
what do I tell you I've had my moments. It'
s been quite a gerr and morealso because I get out of a business
context. I' ve always workedin companies, and about four or five
(01:07):
years ago, I got the light. I want to make you like that
change and from there, like Istarted to experience, like that insecurity of
getting into this unknown terrain, butit' s something that over time I
' ve been working and obviously,with the experiences also like that it'
(01:30):
s something that I' ve beeninternalizing and I already feel much more advanced
in believing it. That, Fernandoand you, what you do with your
life. I paint, I amthe visual puppet before as well as I
think of many things, I studyand do many things for myself with what
it has given me, many insecuritiesthat with the part of visual art,
(01:56):
that I even sometimes forget that Iknow literal, that is whenever I go,
I make a picture, I saywow, how beautiful it is and
when I have to start the othersay honey. I forgot and lied.
But that doubt so there without securitytoo and see why it is that it
costs us so much work, tobelieve in what we do. Sometimes there
(02:16):
' s something every day that wedo every day whatever it takes before you
answer that and you what you doin your life. I do everything,
I do and you' re notalways here. I don' t ask
you, it doesn' t workout. I am here being humble so
that you can feel it can talkabout this problem you have and, in
(02:36):
addition to boasting the achievements that peoplealso cost you a lot. Yeah,
I think that like everything that hasto do with psychology and well you'
re also maybe already getting into theseissues, everything depends on the person.
I don' t like to generalizeand say look at this for this,
but there is a context, forexample, of upbringing where if I was
(02:58):
raised with many expectations, where itwas never enough that if I was finished
ninety- eight, and because Idon' t get a hundred, because
it' s costing me, it' s going to cost me to internalize
when I go well, because lifeisn' t perfect and I' m
not always going to get a hundredat work, I' m not always
going to be perfect, etcetera.It also has much to do with the
(03:19):
social context, at the social level. What is well seen is that I
am humble and in that humility Icannot preach about my achievements or how well
I am doing. In certain things, that can generate a little bit of
suspicion in other people. I don' t want to. Maybe lacerate my
relationships with others, then I kindof save that part a little bit.
(03:40):
I also think it has a lotto do with experiences. If I'
m not exposed to enough experiences,I' m not going to know what
I' m good at or whatI' m good at or what I
' m good at. Maybe ifI don' t have a lot of
knowledge of myself, I' venormalized something that for others can be really
cool. It may be that I, for example, always make people laugh,
(04:01):
but, as always has been,I don' t see it as
a talent until I expose myself Italk to different people and that' s
like they' re highlighting it tome or I' m realizing myself through
the reflection that it' s reallygoing well with me then, like I
think it' s a combination.It depends on many factors, even when
it comes to parenting. It's so fucked up,' cause nothing
(04:24):
else because they' re demanding youtoo much. Also if they ask you
to miss. Also the fact thatthey normalize you that is, that they
demand nothing from you, because you' re bad and you' re never
going to get out of there.That also encourages you to believe it too
and also the fact that, if, for example, when I was little,
they didn' t give me feedback, they didn' t tell me
(04:45):
how good you are at this orhow good you are at writing. I
' m not having as a barometer, I' m not having a meter
of ok Maybe on this side I' m highlighting myself I don' t
have what to measure myself and Igo out into the world and I don
' t have that knowledge yet andmore because of what I said right now,
I don' t have the experience. Then both extremes also affect.
(05:09):
So this situation has a name.In psychology, this set of attitudes that
one perceives of oneself, that is, those insecurities that tell him the disorder
of the impostor, was named after. Yeah, well, impossitant syndrome does.
In psychology one speaks of impostor syndromeor the phenomenon of impostor, which
(05:30):
is when a person does not reacha certain level of success or grows at
a professional level and does not attributehis success to his abilities and competences,
but attributes it to external or incidentalfactors. I did super good with a
job interview, but I got thejob because I got lucky. They gave
(05:54):
me a promotion, but well,they promoted me because there was no one
else. I mean, I don' t recognize that because of my abilities
and abilities, I was able todevelop myself, but I gave it to
factors that don' t have todo with me. You know what I
' ve been reading about about thissituation, about this subject. I read
(06:15):
that eighty- three percent of thepopulation suffers from impostor syndrome. I had
read before that it was like aseventy- fifty, but now size in
an eighty- three and before yousee it was seen more in women than
in men, why it could bethat. Research began on women because in
the 1970s, that is, womenbegan to take more prominence in the labor
(06:38):
industry and so on. Then itbegan to be studied because groups of women
manifested that they felt like a fraudwhen they arrived, like at the height
of their professional success, like theyfelt that they did not belong there,
like I do here, why Iam here, why they gave me this
(07:00):
opportunity, that is, from therebegan to investigate. However, as research
progresses, we realize that the majorityof the population is presented to both women
and eight many minority groups, ie anyone. And I think that'
s even expected, right, ormaybe we could say a natural process that
(07:26):
comes with growth. If I,well, as I told you right now,
have always worked in company and that' s my experience, you put
me in a meeting to do whatI have ten years doing and I won
' t hesitate you, because Ihave a lot of experience doing it.
That doesn' t give me anyinsecurity, no fear, because I'
ve done enough. But if youput me to talk about a psychology topic
(07:46):
that I' m learning, maybethere I get a little bit of that
insecurity, because maybe I still haven' t had enough experience for me to
feel in capacity. So I think, as we grow our career, it
probably happened to you when you startedthis podcast that I' m afraid of
at first, but we' regoing to talk like so a pot you
(08:07):
just had the study to the Clauand you' ve been told, Mom
Dale that I' m doing ithere, because here it already occurs to
you. That doesn' t birddoing a podcast and as you were taking
experiences, gaining experience, like,well, you already do this and you
do it with your eyes groe,nothing happens. So, since I think
it' s part of that gettingout of my comfort zone, expose me
(08:28):
to these new situations that my brainis obviously going to assume as dangerous situations.
Right, like my primitive brain,what he wants is to keep me
safe or secure. So any situationthat gets me out of that comfort zone
is a danger is going to beas much as possible so that I don
' t do it, so Idon' t expose myself, so that
(08:48):
I return to the initial position again. I, then, apart from what
he just told you, there's something like there' s something that
affects this, this, this kindof syndrome, because what I see is
something that can have you at somepoint, but you' re going to
go ahead with something that you don' t assume as yours, but you
(09:09):
' re still normal at work.So, in the end, the syndrome
affects beyond, or it' svery bad to have. There' s
a lot, I mean, Ididn' t know it was that high.
Then eighty- fifty percent of peoplehave it, but it works in
society, has ever in their lives. For now he' s got to
be with that exact person. ThenI wonder it affects on a general level.
Or it' s very bad tohave it, because I see that
(09:31):
society continues to function normally. Iwouldn' t say it' s bad
to have it, because it's something like your growth or your development.
So I see it that way andall perspective, like we do the
story that we don' t createof the things that happen to us.
But yes, it affects you personallyand affects you at work level. Why.
Because if you, for example,start a new position, they promoted
(09:56):
you and you' re questioning whythey gave me this job. I don
' t know anything. I don' t know how to do x hears
something. I don' t knowhow I' m gonna lead this project.
In your head there' s somuch noise that inevitably you or you
' re going to start procastinating,because you don' t want to face
the situation. You don' twant to make mistakes, you don'
(10:18):
t raise your hand, you don' t ask questions, because if you
ask questions, then they' llknow that you don' t know and
they' ll regret the decision andthey' ll go here. So it
' s going to affect you atwork level, because you' re going
to shrink and on a personal levelas well, and well, also forgiveness
at work level can even cause youburnout, because as well, as I
(10:39):
can procastine and stop doing things,too, on the other hand, I
can about working, about getting ready, wanting to make up, doing things
too much, working overtime and alsofeeling that when I come into it with
this mentality that I feel that ifI don' t, I' m
going to get lost. Or I' m going to lose like obviously,
I wear out a lot more,so it can also happen not like that
(11:03):
feeling of bernout, of mental exhaustionand on a personal level. If you
are in a situation where daily youhave these thoughts that generate anxiety, because
maybe you can develop some situation orsome anxiety issue, even this one of
depression, because you begin to questionyour abilities, you begin to question whether
(11:24):
you are really good or good atwhat you do and it is really worth
trying, then it can affect youin both ways also in your personal satisfaction,
life satisfaction or job satisfaction. Idon' t want to go to
work, because every time I goto work, what I' m going
to do I don' t feelgood about my life, because I feel
(11:46):
like I' m not moving forward, I feel like I' m stuck.
I mean, it can affect youin a lot of ways I dream,
that is, I relate it alot to low self- esteem.
I don' t know if that' s right to do it, because
when we talk about the imposter's syndrome, according to what I have
understanding of what we' re talkingabout right now. Yes, to Fernando,
I tell you your paintings are amazing. He could answer me. No.
No. Actually, that was theone that came out like that because
(12:09):
I know and not even I feelthat normal. I' ve seen better
than mine. That' s relatedto a lack of self- esteem or
a self- esteem problem, andthat was an example I put It hasn
' t happened. Yeah, well, maybe I could move self- esteem
as a global issue and impostor syndromeas something circumstantial or you' re going
to put it as well as self- esteem of everything that encompasses. How
(12:30):
I look, How I see whatmy abilities are, how I interpret people
seeing me as what they see ofme. How much I appreciate myself,
how much I cherish myself, howmuch I love myself, and so on.
I mean, self- esteem isglobal, impostor syndrome. We talk
about topics, perhaps or a contextualor situational theme, where in a work
(12:54):
context or in a context where Iset a goal or I am trying to
achieve if your goal begins to feelthat insecurity. But that insecurity does not
necessarily have to manifest in other areasof my life. I mean, I
can, for example, perfectly havethat insecurity in my subjects, following the
(13:15):
same example, in my experience.Well, when I started wow, I
was really scared. I was talkingabout psychology issues. I' m afraid
to expose myself. However, ifyou put me in another context to talk
about other things, I know thatI' m very hard, then I
kind of mean, like they canrelate. But imposter syndrome is more circumstantial
with specific issues. There' ssome benefit to me having drive syndrome.
(13:43):
Well, because we' re talkinga lot about the bad. Yeah,
yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, but I, like I tell you,
the narrative, it' s superimportant to me, and if something
makes you so much noise, it' s because you care. But first
and second is that it can evenserve as a motivator, because there are
people who give it a very goodjob opportunity. However, they fall asleep
(14:07):
in their bay and say hey Iam the best. I' m not
going to learn and I' mnot going to your day, I'
m not doing anything and they caneven lose it. However, if I
have this insecurity that I have tolearn, what it is for me to
practice, what it is for meto expose myself, then I can use
it as an engine for me tomove around and get closer, perhaps to
(14:30):
that ideal state that I want,which is to be an expert on such
a subject, which is to leadwhat kind of project it is can be
a personal challenge. I love myselfhow I know. I want to do
a triathlon, that is, thingsyou say, wow, I' m
not a triathlete or I' mnot the yes or the company, but
I' m going to walk andI' m going to get there if
(14:54):
they gave me the chance, becauseI just kind of get ready until I
can as I say overcome that insecurity. With my experience and with my knowledge,
you know that in the arts,in the creative parts, in the
human aspects, just as you seea lot precisely because people believe from nothing
(15:16):
something that is not and feel doubts. So I feel, I think it
helps a lot for you to doubtyou and to try how to move on
and overcome that because that' sexactly where the teachers come from. A
great teacher is always going to haveopportunities to improve, that is, you
(15:41):
always follow as in constant learning,and I think it comes out that at
first you feel it. Like Iused to say, I always thought it
was me I forgot. Oh,I forgot to paint. However, when
I start I am already at astage where I simply face that new picture,
that new project and I start before, not before. I used to
(16:06):
last you even in depressions, Imean, I started there in psychology,
in therapy. That' s whyimpostor syndrome, i e, I was
super blocked and not that I don' t understand, and obviously, there
were more things in my life thathad to be worked, that also influenced,
(16:26):
but yes I mean it' snot that you forget, it'
s that you stop believing that youcan. However, when you face that,
when you get to that, yourealize that you don' t,
that the hand knows it alone.Yes, and also to ignore feedback,
because I' m sure many peoplehave given you praise for your work.
Yeah, yeah. However, whenyou face this new project that maybe is
(16:48):
a new client, a different clientor I don' t know the context
very well, yours, but it' s something different, you say like
that well, don' t okI forgot everything already, everything that I
did stays aside. Yeah, andnow I kind of don' t know
how to do this, like thiskind of project I don' t know
managed or this kind of project Idon' t know, etcetera. And
something that Ledyga the Great Lady gagasaid that we must also release false humility.
(17:11):
I mean, you also have tobelieve and support your work. If
someone praises your work, you tellhim, yes, I spent a lot
of effort doing that and I likedit very much. Yeah, and I
like that a lot because many timespeople want to help us, that'
s like they want to help usor they don' t even do it
(17:33):
unconsciously, because when people tell youthat wow, that you look good,
they' re not going to doit thinking that maybe you have a insecurity
about it, but for random thingspeople tell you. However, what we
do is question it ay no.The thing is, that day is so
beautiful, not what you know.But instead of one internalizing it and assuming
it and saying pussy it did mesuper good. I did, super well,
(17:55):
I spoke super well, I mean, instead of recognizing it, instead
of accepting the issues. I dowhat I do, I reject it now.
Paradoxically, as well, I rejectpraise. I take any criticism as
it is. That' s oneof the problems that syndrome has so hard
(18:15):
and I take the reviews and takeit to the grave. I mean,
you tell me to look at itwritten in stone. I loved that report,
but the color would have liked itto be different. Oh my God
I don' t take colors aswell as I jumped with that, I
mean, I have very little toleranceto criticism, even if it' s
constructive criticism, so it' slike wow or no, because if we
(18:41):
can say positive criticism and constructive criticism, we' re going to accept criticism.
Let me not ignore positive criticism cand let me just assume negative criticism.
I wanted to ask you if thissyndrome was so big that it had
as a subdivision. And or branchif there are several types of impostor syndrome
or if that is the general syndromeas and is the one used for all
kinds of things that have to dowith that. Yes, it can manifest
(19:03):
in different ways. It can bemanifested of the perfectionist type that I have
to do it Everything perfect, therecan be no mistakes, Everything has to
be a hundred so clear and obviouslythat makes me stop doing things, because
nothing is perfect. Then either procastineor I do it a thousand times to
(19:23):
weariness and I never feel comfortable withthe result. Leave the middle stuff,
I tell you the middle thing becauseI say don' t stress me too
much to do it. So he' s the type of perfectionist. We
also have the superhero guy who saysah no I can do it alone.
I don' t need help,because if I ask people for help,
they' re going to know thatI don' t know anything, or
(19:45):
people are going to find me out, they' re going to know that
I' m a fraud and Idon' t want that we don'
t have this type, I canbreak myself, the perfectionist type, the
(20:08):
soloist type, the natural genius that, for example, I attribute to him
that I learn something fast, simplybecause I learn fast instead of the effort
that it takes me to learn certainsubjects, that is, instead of me
recognizing that maybe I gave him timeto study this. What I say well,
what happens is that I' measy to study. Help me,
I think you have an expert me, the expert who says he has to
(20:30):
know everything that I the expert issuper interesting, because that' s what
he says doesn' t matter,or that' s what he does.
How much I prepare is never goingto be enough. And you see people
studying a lot, learning the topic, looking for such a book, what,
such a book, such a book, and you never throw it because
(20:52):
it says that it still lacks,that it is still not enough. I
' ve already said what the geniusand the natural genius is that was that
I now learn naturally, the roughone missed you. I think you say
tough that they think they don't need anyone' s help, exactly
what I can do alone, thatsuperhero. But that' s to keep
people from knowing that maybe I don' t know something and it' s
(21:15):
completely normal. I mean, looklike right now. You know, Tess
asked me that question, and Isaid, uh, my bottle broke.
What he' s saying is nothing' s wrong. We don' t
have it to know everything. Imean, you' re an expert on
a topic, you know a topic, but things happen and nothing happens,
I mean, not asking questions iseven not bad. On the contrary,
people learn more when they ask clearquestions. When you have a person who
(21:37):
has impostor syndrome and refuses to askfor help and refuses to seek a mentor
and tells you well, look,maybe that' s the first thing we
have to work on, because itmakes your way a lot easier. When
people tell you look, I triedto do, I tried what works,
this shortens your learning curve. Soit' s kind of like maybe doing
(21:57):
the passes with that, too.But if I think those five are the
most relevant. We' re gonnatake a break, guys,' cause
we need money. Because you needsome money. We' re back and
we want to thank Carla Ignatius forbeing a Patreon. Thank you, Carla,
(22:18):
for being Patreon. Thanks also tothe 60 thugs we have today.
If you guys wouldn' t beable to do this. Thank you very
much, if you don' tknow what I' m talking about between
Homeland with Slash Wilfirerland and your cashcontribution, you can help this program continue.
In fact, this is the waythe program continues. Thank you,
Carla. I wanted to ask youif, whatever I mean, it smells
(22:41):
to me, but I want toask you. In your experience working with
the Community, you have seen thissyndrome present in members of the Community.
Yeah, sure, sure, andI' m telling you because I'
m not. We' ve talkeda lot here about the ego, the
doctor about what it' s calledthe hero, no yes, but we
weren' t made up of egoslike the medical profession of everything in there
are many gays that there' sa lot of bird, because birds need
(23:07):
like that valid, that validation,is to make up exactly. Las.
I wanted to ask you if yourexperience working with the Community, if you
have, because I don' tknow how much your work in the Community.
You' ve seen a lot ofthat syndrome or not, yes,
definitely, and I was just preparingfor it, I was seeing if there
were studies as conclusive about the Communityas such, and maybe there aren'
(23:29):
t so many studies, but thereis a correlation between the minority stress that
people in the Community suffer and impostorsyndrome. Why? Because if I,
to study, have to break armsto get to where I am, in
this company, I have to breakarms people telling me people, questioning me
(23:56):
comments of type. Oh, he' s so good, but there'
s the excellent but and having tobe battling with this, either discrimination,
or biased comments, or negative comments, that is, it' s a
very uphill job. Yeah, whenI get to sit at a table with
people, maybe company managers and soon, I' m gonna feel like
(24:18):
a fish down the water. I' m going to say that I do
here, as I came here,so it kind of happens a lot that
questioning and those doubts and more becauseof the same fact that you were talking
about compensation right now, which issomething that is known in the community is
that to make up for that,he' s very good. But we
want to be excellent at everything,at everything and put on a lot.
(24:41):
But, but it' s abird, but it' s clear,
but it' s that today,but exactly then, we want to be
excellent at everything and we put alot of pressure on ourselves and sometimes even
very complex goals and if we don' t reach them, we beat ourselves.
It' s like that part too, like there' s that relationship.
(25:03):
You know Gabriel J. Martin,in his book he wants to have
a lot of faggots. Play thosesongs a little bit and he talks about
not necessarily telling you directly. Butthe fact that you perceive that they are
telling someone that you may understand thatthey have the same living condition as you
already assimilate it as they are tellingyou then the fact that you perceive,
for example, that they are beinghomophobic with another person or they are being
(25:26):
homophobic with you because you associate.So, that' s why I understand
that that' s why in theCommunity there are a lot of people who
need to excel, you need toknow how much for that, to compensate
and be able to have as amattress to say, okay. But I
(25:48):
am such a thing. You understandyourself many times it also happens that and,
well, I don' t wantto get too much out of it,
but that I choose gay jarana isalmost always the one that ends again,
I' m not generalizing, butit happens a lot. It is
the one who ends up caring formom or dad when there is a disease
(26:08):
or when you have to keep thefamily member for economic reasons or what it
is almost always the person in thecommunity, because because if I am causing
so much pain, being gay,I will compensate you by taking care of
you and sometimes we wear out tryingto make up for that fault, which
(26:30):
is not a fault, but theyhave instilled us so much in the head
that it is a fault, thatwe spend trying to compensate that fault at
the family level or in the companies, trying to stand out in our environments.
There is a lot going on,for example, the society from which
people who are transgender or who arefrom how it is from the third gender,
(26:52):
from the third gender, from themany, for example, in Mexico
and also in Indonesia, I thinkthere is a sperit group that they are
people that their job would be tocare for parents. I mean, that
' s expected to happen. There' s also a lot to be expected
from this idea that you' regoing to raise these three families, you
(27:14):
' re going to have children,you' re not going to reproduce.
Then your work focuses on caring Momand Dad who are old, and that
' s what you' re goingto do with your life. I see
him very, very, very,very, very much, very much he
wants to ask you. It's bad to some extent, when,
when you have this kind of syndrome, you can get a little bit ambitious,
like in the kind of syndrome youmentioned right now. It' s
(27:34):
bad for you to be ambitious foryou to achieve your goals in the end,
that is, because it' snot as natural as you think.
I don' t know, yeah. I believe that since everything is neither
bad nor this good, it issimply ambition. We' re ambitious.
I think the problem is how Imanage that ambition, how I manage those
(27:59):
expectations that I have. If Iam ambitious and I am on my ladder
of success, as I said andI am not enjoying it, what is
it worth to me to get tothe top, if I will be all
my relationships. I' m alone, I don' t feel good about
(28:21):
myself, I don' t feelhappy, I don' t feel like
I' ve made an impact,that' s what I' m having
trouble getting to that peak Maybe it' s worth a lot then the issue
isn' t being ambitious about howI manage that ambition and how I manage
my successes, or how I managemy victories something that happens a lot and
(28:48):
good about a concept that I'm thinking about recently because of an experience
that happened to me, is thatall victories feel the same. However,
we think that you are not goingto give as an extra like an ITEV
if I fulfill such a goal ina certain way, if, for example,
you, when you started your podcast, wanted to have a hundred listeners,
when those hundred listeners arrived that victory, that two pamine that rose from
(29:11):
that happiness. It was the samewhen they had a thousand listeners or when
an episode broke records, that is, the same level. You had euphoria
for a couple of seconds and jorthat I feel good. And so,
but in the end, a coupleof minutes later, or a couple of
hours later, that' s outof your mind. What happens when we
have people who are extremely ambitious,who live by moving the goal, I
(29:33):
mean, I set myself a goalof a thousand listeners. I' ve
already reached the thousand you listen toher. I don' t celebrate because
imagine a sonana mile. Anyone hasa thousand, so now I want it
to be three thousand, or nowI want it to be five thousand.
You' re not enjoying that road. Then the only thing you' re
going to add stress to, addpressure to, and you' re going
(29:57):
to miss out on that repetitive feelingyou can have if you' re celebrating
those little wins, either 100 ina hundred out of five hundred. Whatever
it is, then, it's like working that relationship with our ambition.
I don' t want to settledown and stay in one place.
I want to keep going, Iwant to keep growing, but it'
s cloudy or not where I am. I' ve achieved what I once
(30:19):
dreamed I wanted. I mean,right now we' re drinking a dream
that we had years ago that wedidn' t enjoy that, because I
keep moving the goal. If Ikeep moving the goal, I will never
be happy, because the goal canalways move one, can always improve,
can always climb, can always earnmore money, can always move to a
(30:40):
better apartment, can always buy somethingelse. So we kind of waste a
lot of time or waste a lotof opportunities that we have to enjoy that
road and that ladder. The issueof impostor syndrome relates it a lot as
I am now learning with a littleword that kind of reaches my heart and
(31:03):
I want to ask you you arerelated to impostor syndrome with self sabotage.
Sure, because your mind sabotages you, I mean, your mind can'
t celebrate that you were given thatjob your ro mind that says, uh,
you were lucky this one that saysno, but that maybe you don
' t know that much. You' re not as good as that.
That was a chepazo, that carsabotage thing your mind is trying to sabotage
(31:26):
you, you' re sabotaging thatvictory. But now that you' ve
got everything self sabotaged, because Irelate it a lot to personal relationships,
you can have imposture syndrome in arelationship. That' s interesting. I
don' t know what literature says, but it does happen if you'
(31:48):
re going to set an example.Aha I know a person and that person
has a certain attachment already you getso sick talk about that topic. Here
' s an insurance you know related, you communicate you know and I,
who come with my problem patch,I don' t know related. And
like I' m like a fishout of the water, maybe I'
(32:12):
ve taken therapy, like I'm learning, maybe I can feel like
a fraud in front of that newperson who shows me that security and I
' m still working, like withthose unconscious issues that still touch me working.
Then maybe I could see him outthere. But the example I was
going to give you, for examplefriends, when you' re a dad
(32:34):
or mom or a baby, youdon' t have a manual, you
don' t instruct me, youdon' t get a chip and you
say you' re already super superdad or super mom, I mean,
that' s what he had learning. And obviously, when you find yourself
with that role and that baby that' s needing your attention and you'
ll probably have a lot of troublethat you never even imagined. Maybe in
(32:58):
that moment you feel like an impostThere are even parents who say I don
' t know what I' mdoing. No, and worse, the
whole society gets to give you advicethat you' re doing it wrong,
that you' re still not havinga boy. Exactly then what happens and
I' m starting to compare orI' m starting to put a very
high stick on me. I mean, it' s like that too,
like it can generate you, likethat feeling I' ll associate with that,
(33:22):
like, with that feeling that Ifeel inadequate for this tax, or
I feel inadequate for this job.But something, for example, with the
subject of self- sabotage, whichalso seems super interesting to me and I
don' t remember if we talkedabout it a little while ago, but
still worth remembering is that our brainis designed to protect us. So it
' s not so much that Iwant to sabotage cars and then unconsciously,
(33:46):
because I come against that it canhappen, that is, that, because
of my life history context, Ihave that inclination to self sabotage my relationships
I work hard. Yeah, thatcan pass the context of my life story.
But we also have to remember thatour primitive brain. What he wants
(34:07):
is to protect us. Its mainfunction is to protect us. And even
if now the danger is I camea podcast talking to you and that listens
to me a lot of people,the brain does not distinguish between that and
that I was going to get intoa cave and I was exposed to eating
(34:28):
a lion. I mean, thesame danger. The brain simply identifies danger.
So, when I' m gettingout of my comfort zone, my
brain plays wait. We' recoming out here like we don' t
know what' s going to happen, we don' t know I have,
I don' t want to experiencethat negative sensations, I don'
(34:51):
t want to experience criticism, Idon' t want to experience that I
can lose that job, that peopleare going to think less of me,
that I' m going to thinkthat I don' t have the capacity,
that' s all that' sdanger then the brain says don'
t wait, give it back.That work doesn' t go there,
don' t raise your hand,stay studying, stay prepared, that is,
it' s also a natural mechanismof the brain to protect us.
I want to ask what things canhelp us learn to overcome these attitudes that
(35:17):
we understand are harmful to development.There are techniques, there are ways to
do yes, first sorry. AndI also want to ask if there'
s a way for me to identifyhim, because right now, I'
m in that loop and I'm not realizing it. Yeah, well,
to identify it is you seeing yourrelationship or seeing the meaning, seeing
(35:39):
the situation that' s going onand you usually look at you when we
talk about impostor syndrome there' sa lot of self- criticism and low
tolerance for not knowing, low tolerancefor mistakes and low compassion for myself.
Because if I' m facing anew conchale situation it' s already going
(35:59):
to that you' re not whipping, so there' s a lot of
criticism, a lot of pressure anda lot of questioning. So, since
that, that, that question orthat feeling of me, I don'
t deserve to be here. MaybeI' m here for a chepazo,
or maybe this isn' t myplace. I' m not gonna make
(36:20):
it up to you anymore since youstart questioning that. Maybe you can think
about what you' re going throughMaybe you' re going through pose syndrome
Just like what you' re sayingis like a perfect prescription for anxiety.
So, exactly immediately you' restarting to feel that anxiety. That'
s why you' re following maybesit down and question yourself, because there
are times when people are in ameeting and they get the answer out of
(36:45):
something and they don' t raisetheir hands. Why didn' t you
raise your hand? No, becauseI' m scared. Yeah, me
being a fool. That could bea symptom. So it happens often and
you see that they gave you thisnew position and you don' t say
my granddaughter' s mouth at anymeeting if, for example, you see
yourself procastin' things because you wantthem to turn out perfect. Well,
(37:06):
that' s a symptom. Ifyou see that you are never happy with
anything, you don' t wantto ask for help because you feel that
people are going to criticize you,or people are going to judge you,
or people are going to find outthat you really don' t have the
ability. Those are like signs.So I kind of watch the signals or
not. Perhaps here there is oneissue to work on and to start working
(37:29):
on it the first thing is tomake peace, with which that is typical
of my development. Of course,if you don' t want to feel
imposter syndrome, stay doing what you' ve always done. Don' t
move, don' t grow up, don' t do anything. And
that' s the perfect formula foryou not to feel that now. If
you want to grow up, sofirst we have to make the move that
(37:50):
that may be something that' sgoing to happen to you. When a
person, for example, questions hisabilities and abilities, it is recommended that
I carry a blog of feedback andachievements. If I, for example,
had a meeting and they told meWowl that you presented super well. I
write it down, ah Wowl,who looks at that Ppet, who tweets
(38:15):
Ppet for the z- generations ofpower point. That was used before God
changed and here not exactly then andif you get a presentation, I look
cool and more I love colors.Okay, I write it down, I
learned to make a report. Iwrite it down. So as we write
down, we' re giving ourbrain time to internalize those things that I
(38:38):
' m moving on to or thatother people are feedback me into and they
' re giving me as the go- ahead that if I' m doing
it right, I like it tooif and this depends on the person,
there are people who like video games. I think you like video games.
There are people who like to dance, there are people who like exercise.
(39:00):
Then maybe we can do an exerciseconsidering something you like. I' ll
take your video game example and let' s say ok. Imagine that this
new job, this new position,this new project, is a new video
game that you bought and everything thatyou have to do that right now you
don' t know what to do. It' s a new level that
(39:21):
you have to reach. And likeany video game, you' re not
gonna come out all of a sudden, wow and step on level, no,
it' s gonna fail, they' re gonna kill you, they
' re gonna shoot you, that' s what. Then let' s
see it like this instead of puttingso much pressure on it that all of
what I have to do has togo well at first. So, if
we start seeing it as a videogame, we' re going to start
(39:42):
working on one level at a timeto make a list of all those things
that give you insecurity talking in publicpresents with a manager x and z is
scored. Then we say or howwe can work on the first level.
Maybe start at the easiest at theeasiest and work on ex sets. I
never saw myself debit in being perfectwhat resources you have available, you can
(40:04):
search the Internet or the easiest thingfor me, but not everyone sees it
that way is asking a partner.I don' t always work. There
' s someone who' s anexpert on a subject, or become friends
with that person and ask him howI' m going to vote the report
finish. That' s perfect,let' s then go to the next
level and so we' re doingit at level to level. When I
see that I am moving forward,anxiety is going down because I am feeling
(40:28):
capable and in the end, thequestion is not or should not be.
I have to know everything but Ihave the ability to learn. I have
the ability to develop and acquire thisknowledge and to implement it. So,
if I go with that mentality andI' m going slowly, it'
s not that I' m goingto do well at first, but eventually
(40:50):
I' m going to eat thatsense a little bit better. Another thing
is super important is exposure. Hekeeps raising his hand to be aware that
when I am in a meeting andI remain silent. Maybe that' s
my instinct trying to protect me Andsince I have these conversations and since you
come to see, I can sayokay wait, I' m going to
raise my hand and I' mgoing to expose myself, even if I
(41:14):
' m afraid, I' mgoing to do it with fear I raise
my hand and I realize that nothinghappens, that if I ask a question,
I' m just going to answerit and the world is going to
keep turning. Okay And it isalso expected in all companies, and perhaps
this relates a lot to that company, because it is where most, as
these issues are evidenced in companies,it is expected that the person will go
(41:36):
through a learning curve. So ifyou don' t ask a question,
it' s also a problem,because then you' re going to say
I think it' s going tohappen again, you don' t ask
anything. They don' t knowhow to ask questions, realize that the
world isn' t going to endand little by little and I' m
going to expose myself until finally Ifeel good about that, in that task,
(41:59):
in that project. It' sa new role that I laugh at,
because it' s been a longtime, that I' ve worked
with a person in consultation who finally, after a long time working, feels
super good, like they say wow, I had a year working like this
project. And so we have ayear working on the subject. And it
' s like giving it there andpromoting it again and it' s coming
(42:22):
back I prescribed the yes not todo it to you, it' s
like nothing happened, like we haven' t worked anything in the last year.
Then I kind of laugh,'cause it' s like you'
re getting ready to feel better.But eventually the rat you go back will
put you in another situation. Soeither life is putting this, life is
gonna put you like that That's growing up. But already when you
go to a second round, youalso kind of go more prepared, mentally
(42:44):
prepared and you know more or lesswhat to expect. You also know it
' s very important, very important. You' re going to be honest
with yourself. And one first,like you said, realize that if you
' re learning something, you're learning something. You' re not
a master of that and something thatat least worked out a lot for me,
you can get ahead of yourself.I mean, if you have a
new job in all jobs, inall companies you country, you give three
(43:06):
months of testing everything so you don' t even have to vote you vote
without anything, without how to say. The compensation is that there is then
you have responsibility, without responsibility,then it is for that you also have
your three months chance. Sure.Another thing is, if you' re
putting the size on it, you' re gonna be three months. I
mean, loose, that' swhen you get in front of the first
(43:28):
thing you say sorry. I'm new to such a thing And now
and that lightens the burden a littlebit, because precisely you' re letting
people see that you' re learningto vulnerate yourself. And that' s
super important. Again, I don' t want to be the subject,
but in companies it' s superimportant, like creating that psychological security climate
that if someone doesn' t knowsomething, they can raise their hands and
(43:49):
say look. I don' tknow and nothing' s gonna happen.
I mean, there' s nonegative impact and something that happens when we,
we don' t allow ourselves tobe vulnerable, that other people have
the space to make it also clearand often happens that you say wow.
And that' s what I'm saying from my own experience, and
maybe you can also identify that you' re in the middle of something doing
(44:12):
a project. Maybe he is,in the same example, that everything you
say says wow. I don't know anything about what I' m
doing and other people are going tosay I don' t know exactly either.
I' m not just doing itmyself, and it' s like
wow. We can talk about this. We don' t know what we
' re doing, but let's figure it out, let' s
find a way to do it.Then that vulnerability also allows you to connect
with others and not feel like you' re the only person who doesn'
t know what he' s doing. Of course and you' re not
(44:34):
stuck in saying no, I don' t know how to look for it,
because if they hired you, it' s because you have to look
for it, you have the ability. Yes, something that also comes with
the subject of luck is like that, well, when a recruiter hires you.
You' ve already seen enough profiles, i e, many profiles,
(44:57):
depending on the position, but theycan be diema size of fifteen, because
it has to be you of thatkind, I mean, you competed with
a lot of people and in youthey saw those abilities. No one expects
you to know your first job,because even when you move from one company
to another. The different culture,the expectations are different, the tasks are
(45:19):
different. So, even if youknow how to report being the reports you
' re going to be asked forin company, they' re not the
same as I was with you,then it' s hoped that you have
to learn how to manage in thisnew company. So, but it'
s kind of okay, lucky,but it' s really strong. Or
just that you had something that stoodout and that made the difference between the
(45:39):
themes and you know I macro it. You also have to fight a lot
with culture, because the culture ofus, the Latin culture, is that
you have to give that false humilitythat if they praise you, you always
have to be woe, but it' s not that bad. No,
I love it and it hits alot. For example, John Jo that
a friend that we have in common, he is very sure of himself and
(46:01):
sometimes when he says something, hecrashes aha to crash. You stay like
it' s a feature and he' s very envious of him because it
' s like wow, cool thatyou can defend your work that way.
M But precisely we should be morethe way we play. Yeah, sure,
totally yeah, I love him,I love him a lot for that,
(46:22):
and I learn a lot about himbecause of that, too, because
you understand that Juanjo, yes theone who is aspiring to that ruler and
I or class one even for that, for you to throw yourself, I
mean, I was talking like hewas saying old or real. I admire
you so much, not only forwhat you' ve done historically, but
(46:44):
for you to have the ovaries andthe balls to say no, I'
m going to throw myself the ruler. You' ve never been a ruler
in your life, but he's going to throw himself, be a
laughingstock and he' s going tolearn and the tabon to work can be
late. He' s got areally cool proposal. I mean, he
' s prepared a lot. Hestopped doing everything he' s doing to
you just to get ready for that. I mean, that' s admirable
(47:06):
to throw yourself at this audience thatwe already know of cork. I mean,
that deserves, that' s likethat deserves recognition and it takes a
lot of courage to do it.And I can' t, I can
' t speak for him, butI' m sure at some point he
even felt some kind of fear ofinsecurity. He just gave it up to
a point where he doesn' teven remember that he came to feel that
(47:29):
clear waiting for something you want tosay to make us more reliable, that
we' re more like Juanjo wedefend our work, but more shuffled.
Yes, yes and no, andthat if you are praised, it is
more put it on, put iton Today if I choose and I say
yes, I know, thank you, thank you, no, yes,
I know. No. It's not good. What happens is that
false humility to me. I've been fighting it for a while,
(47:51):
and it' s just like that, and I know it' s a
shock. But for one, asat least I feel so for one,
as I fight that background that onehas, that story that one has,
that one has to get way downand down I put myself up. Then
it levels me down. I know, thank you, thank you, thank
you, yes, and that whenyou just say thank you, you also
(48:14):
let the message in, because ifyou, if someone gives you a compliment
and you cut it and say no, but such a thing, such a
thing, in the end what staysin your brain is what you said about
such a thing and such a thingand you don' t internalize that gift
that people give you. It wasa praise, a constructive criticism. Those
are gifts that we internalize and wesay ok that I' m going to
(48:36):
do with that eye, we're not talking about light eye pyropos praise
yes, but it' s agift that people give you. Then it
' s like allowing him in.Later you know you do something else with
it. If you want to saythat it was final to say good,
well, on the subject that don' t run away from Poster Syndrome On
(48:59):
the contrary, embrace it and don' t be afraid to make mistakes,
because the people we most admire inthe world, the people who have done
things the most for the development ofhumanity, the bigger projects, the thing
is more important. The most famouspeople, the people that the brightest minds,
have made a lot of mistakes toget to their final product or whatever
(49:23):
they are doing. So, whoare you, Good Beel, who are
you to think that you don't have to do everything perfect, that
is, please, let' sgo to a little bit of exacting,
so it' s not gozne impositors, yes, exactly, ble que no,
(49:46):
i mean it' s not seeing, and the pressa, which I
like a lot, is better donethan perfect. You, you do,
you learn says OK I liked it. Like you say, I turn it
back and do it or I didn' t like it. I think he
has an area of opportunity. I' ll fix them and I' ll
come back and do it. Andso, little by little, I'
m developing and I' m perfectingmyself in those skills and celebrating ourselves sometimes
as we do very good work incelebrating the positive things that happen to us.
(50:08):
If you think of another message,also another ad. If you think
you were given that position luckily,instead of spending not so much time pre
- questioning. Not what. Notbecause I got it, because there was
no one to walk it. Theydidn' t give it to me because
they didn' t find another candidate. Not because I got lucky, because
(50:29):
they have it all, because okay, let' s say it was lucky,
okay, and what happens. Ifit was lucky you' re already
here, then let' s focusbetter on how you can contribute, how
you can make that place a betterplace, how you can bring your talents
(50:50):
and take that position perhaps from theplace that was to the next level.
I know how you stand out.They' re not left in chon clau
or why they gave it to me, but they already gave it to me.
Perfect. Now that I do withthat, maybe that' s a
better question to ask totally. Iwant to ask you if you have nets,
(51:10):
where we can find you. Ihave nets, I have instagram is.
Belkis batista, Belkis with exact latinathe kistona do not put in a
banagear, please, and in theinstagram also bel Kiso autistic metal gean,
but if you can also write meout there for quotations any questions, any
(51:30):
topics, if they are happening forthis situation, they also need some recommendation.
You can text me that I answeryou there. Thank you Suelki,
Thank you ringing, Thank you forthe invitation and reality that you imagine what
helps us to go to therapy toovercome these kinds of issues. Pretty much
so, keep your time in consultationbecause also, that is not that it
(51:52):
is a topic that you cannot overcome, because through experience and you exposing yourself,
you pull forward. But it's easier, not easier when you
' re accompanied by a person,because you don' t have to be
beating up. So and you egathat also generates a little bit of anxiety,
but you in a guided accompaniment.Perhaps there is more structure and as
(52:15):
you can move forward more effectively,then have the chance to come to perfect
consultation. We' re going tocontinue this conversation or change a ching of
the subject in Patreon. Let's continue whatever you want to keep listening
to. You can keep going topatá a point like Wilferland esclash, and
it' s to continue listening tothis conversation to get your money out,
making your money. There' sstary Tim in the pattern astory to Time,
(52:37):
not selfish. Share that episode.Listen to the podcast not the Microwave,
which is another podcast of the listeningtext family and have a good bye
or podcast k
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