June 23, 2025 • 26 mins
The bass is essential to the orchestra just as strong leadership is crucial for a clear organizational vision and positive culture. Bass player and project management expert, Gerald J. Leonard highlights that vision shapes values and those values should be embedded in practice. Gerald explains how.
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Episode Transcript
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Catherine (00:01):
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I'm Catherine, your host ofthis variety show podcast.
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(00:45):
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Gerald J. Leonard (00:49):
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People and their positive actioninspire positive achievements.
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Catherine (01:07):
Well, hello listeners.
My guest today grew up during thechallenging era of the 1960s in America.
He would often sneak into his sister'scloset to play her red guitar, which
absolutely sparked his passion for music.
Well today he is a professionalbass player and an accomplished
(01:31):
expert in project management.
He has authored several books andcleverly has incorporated music
terminology and scenarios, whichfor me, absolutely brilliant.
I particularly enjoyed his work.
In his book, culture is the Base SevenSteps to Creating High Performance Teams.
(01:53):
I absolutely loved it.
One of his quotes really stands out to me.
"Vision drives and develops values".
So indeed, both vision and valuesare essential for fostering a
positive and productive culture.
He serves today as the CEO of TurnberryPremier, and is the founder of the Leonard
(02:16):
Productivity Intelligence Institute.
His expertise has been featuredon NPR and Jack Canfield Show.
Good for you.
Yay.
But I especially loved , his Ted Ex Talk.
Loved it.
Gerald, you are truly remarkable,and I'm thrilled to have you as a
guest today on your positive imprint.
(02:37):
Welcome to the show, Gerald J. Leonard.
Gerald J. Leonard (02:41):
Well, Catherine, thank you so much for having me.
I'm really happy to be here.
I love the intro.
Catherine (02:46):
Oh, yay.
Well, it's you.
It's you.
So, uh, it was
Gerald J. Leonard (02:51):
guitar right behind me.
That's the, that's thelittle red guitar up there.
Oh, it's, it's,
Catherine (03:01):
I loved hearing that story and reading the story,
and I love that it's behind you.
That's fabulous.
Oh, what a remarkable memory.
And to have that and just knowingthat you had something that you love
to do, sneaking in your sister'scloset and playing that guitar.
(03:25):
So again, welcome to the showand we wanna learn all about you.
You have so much to share.
So let's go to that red guitar.
Just write quick while it's on ourplate right here, so, sure, sure.
Gerald J. Leonard (03:42):
So I was actually taking piano lessons, which I did not
like, and my older sister played piano.
Um, mom and dad had it for her.
And um, again, it wasn't somethingI really liked that I enjoyed.
I was, I guess, fascinated with the guitarand, but I didn't own one, my sister did.
So I would sneak in andgrab it and then play.
And I was just kind offiddling around playing stuff.
(04:05):
And, um, as I say in my TEDx, uh, oneday she caught me playing the guitar.
She was never practicing or playing it, soshe let me have it in more ways than one.
You know, she kinda, I'm gonnahave it for taking my guitar,
but here you can have it.
I'm not gonna use it.
And I started like reallypracticing it and playing by ear.
. I had a few friends thatwere musicians, right?
(04:28):
Kids, but one played in churchand he was like, he was younger
than I was, but he was way abovehis years and his ability to play.
I mean, he played like JimiHendrix, and I'm not kidding, he
was a fascinating guitar player.
So I realized we'reputting the band together.
I'm not gonna be the guitar player
sew up.
(04:48):
So I, so I, you know, moved over to thebass and, you know, when you're playing
the bass, you're playing the whole songand you're basically supporting everyone.
So you need to know the beginning, theend, and while everybody else is doing
their thing, you're cooling down thething and you're, you focus on just
keeping the groove and keeping the soundand keeping the music moving forward.
(05:10):
And it was at a time where I grew up inLakeland, Florida, which is in the United
States and Florida, uh, central, uh,between Tampa, and Orlando, uh, and around
1974, when I was about 12 years old,they created the Lakeland Civic Center.
And so it was the first time any majorbands could come into that area.
(05:31):
And at that time it wasn't like nowwhere you got a mortgage or house to
go to a concert, you could actuallydo a couple of lawns, you know,
do some chores and buy a ticket.
And so we would.
, as friends, you know, get tickets andwe would go, and I don't remember if
there was even any seat assignments.
I just remember we, the, the auditoriumor the stadium was so big, we would stand
(05:53):
next to the stage and we saw the BrothersJohnsons, we saw Earth, wind and Fire.
We saw the OJs we saw theCommodores, and we saw them up close.
And I remember just seeingdifferent bass players do things.
And I would go back home and I hadthese, uh, speaker headphones that I'd
put on and the plug into my base so Iwouldn't keep my family up because they,
(06:13):
they, they, they wouldn't allow that.
And, um, I would practice and I wouldprobably stay up to three or four
o'clock in the morning and just playbecause I was so impressed with,
and so I learned a lot from that.
But then I had to, you know, ifI wanted to get better, I had
realized I needed to take lessons.
So I went back to workand made some money.
'cause you know, I wasthe youngest of six.
Right.
(06:34):
And during that time, mom and dadprovided what we needed, right?
And I had a great childhood.
But if I wanted to do all thisextra stuff, I had to kind
of make that happen, right?
And so I was happy that because ofthat I learned the value of working
for lessons, like working and makingmoney to then pay someone else to teach
(06:55):
me something that I needed to know.
And I never forgot that lesson as a kid.
And I think sometimes that's a reallyimportant lesson for kids to learn.
But anyway, that really moved me forward.
You know, I had a band I practiced,and so as I went through life, those
three lessons became , the foundationalprinciples in which I live my life.
(07:17):
Whatever I got into, whetherit was becoming an author,
I would practice writing.
I would look for a coach and I would lookfor a band like who are other writers
that I can go talk to about writing?
I got into project management.
Okay, how do I practiceproject management?
Who can I learn from and whatorganizations are out there
that I could call my band?
(07:38):
As I've become a CEO and a founder, Ihave said, okay, what are the things
that CEOs and founders practice toget really good at, and what are the
critical skills they need to have?
Who should I learn from to be abetter CEO and a better founder?
And who's my band?
What organizations, what programs,where can I go to find people
who are doing what I'm doing?
(07:59):
And so I've literally leveraged thosethree principles I learned as a kid
to help me throughout my entire life.
And that was practice.
Find a coach.
Find a band.
Catherine (08:12):
That's, that's fabulous.
And I love the, the
transformation that thebase provided for you.
But it was when you said thatbasically the base is everything
within the orchestra, you have tothe beginning, the middle, the end.
And you said something, yousaid, and I wanna find that
(08:32):
quote 'cause I wrote it down.
"The base is the foundationof the orchestra".
And for you really, that base becameyour foundation in life with the
practice and then the values and so on.
And you also said, and this, thisis something that I am going to
(08:54):
write out, I'm going to pass out toteachers that I work with and other
community members that I work with.
You said about values,"enshrine them to practice".
Yes, you trying them intopractice and that's how you
lived your life from early on.
Gerald J. Leonard (09:15):
My mom and dad both were pillars in our lives,
and it's definitely in my life.
And I can remember, you know, both of'em are gone now, but I can remember,
, just, just visualizing dad gettingup and he, , he had his own business.
He, , basically poured concrete.
He did construction work fromthat standpoint of, of pouring
the foundation of homes anddriveways and things like that.
(09:37):
And, and he probably did threeor four or five projects a week.
Uh, the phone was always ringing andon Sundays you couldn't touch the
phone because people were calling in.
That's when you had acord next to the phone.
But I remember at five 30 in themorning him always being there and
getting up and always coming home.
And that just that rock of a foundation.
(10:01):
And providing I grew up in thesixties and I learned about all
of the racial things that weregoing on in America in college.
I mean, obviously in high school Iexperienced some of those things, but
where I grew up, and it was a mixed area.
I was so well protected and caredfor that the reality of what was
(10:23):
happening in the world wasn'tmy reality growing up as a kid.
And mom was a seamstress she workedfor very high end stores because if
she made a suit, you couldn't tellif it was something that she made
or something that she bought and
altered.
She had that, that skill and she taughtmy sisters , and so the idea of really
(10:46):
working on being an expert, , carryingyour own, being dependable, , always
being there for your family no matterwhat, uh, showing up, , whatever
skill you go after, become thebest that you can be at that skill.
Those were all things that I learned frommy parents as I watched them, , raise
(11:07):
the six of us during that particulartime when, , a lot of opportunities
and things along that line weren't madeavailable to them, but they made a way
out of, as they would say, out of no way.
And they, but they did itin such a very graceful
and loving manner.
And, , I didn't have any issuesor I feel like, well, why aren't
you guys helping me with this?
I felt honored that, okay, hey, I'mbeing taken care of, but I wanna
(11:31):
play music and if I wanna buy myown instrument or I wanna do this,
I gotta go out and work for it.
And that was the principle,that was the value I learned.
And I used that quote because,the gentleman who wrote Good To
Great Built to Last, jim Collinswrote good To Great Built to Last.
And one of the things he foundabout great companies was that
they had a core set of values
(11:53):
that became the foundationof their organization.
In other words, those valuesweren't plaques on a wall they
were things that they lived.
And, uh, they, when they interviewedpeople, they interviewed people and
they judge them based on those values.
When they work with suppliers, theyjudge them based on their values.
When they focus on their customer service,they looked at their values and say, this
(12:15):
is how we're going to treat our customers.
This is how we're gonnatreat our employees.
And so, as they were growing the business,everyone around them developed those,
those core values, and that reallybecame the three first principles of my
book, vision, values, and then buy-in.
Because you gotta have people thatare gonna buy into those values.
But, you know, having those corevalues are really critical to, to,
(12:38):
uh, family success, to a business'ssuccess, to an organization's success.
It's really, really important to have,uh, strong values that you apply.
Catherine (12:46):
I, I agree.
And I, I loved this book, sobecause, and I know you didn't
like it as much you said that inyour prologue on your third book.
I loved culture is the baseand your seven steps, because
the way you really used music.
So I, I love learning throughcreative different ways, right?
(13:11):
So you bringing in the music and thedifferent instruments and the conductor,
and I love how you, when you werebringing in the vision and trying to
conceptualize, helping the reader toconceptualize that everybody needs to
work on this vision, but it can't always,you can't make it stale, such as the
(13:34):
conductor at the Cincinnati Ballet whenyou were playing bass for the Nutcracker
and the Nutcracker's played all the time.
But how does a conductor makeit interesting and exciting?
And he did.
And they do.
And it's not the same every time.
I think that that was fabulousconceptualization and so let's talk
(13:54):
about how you reshaped your, your bassstrings and went a different direction
Gerald J. Leonard (14:00):
that whole process was something that, uh, evolved over time.
And so here's what happened is,you know, I finished my degree,
uh, my master's in Cincinnati.
I moved to New York.
I played in New York for a while and Ialso was a part of a church and started
really doing a lot of spiritual work.
Um, got married, had a couple of kids,and as I'm going down this process, I
(14:21):
realize, you know, I really miss music.
, full time, but now I have two kids.
And again, go back to my vision ofmy dad, who was what always there.
And so I thought, , I had someopportunities to go on the
road or go here or go there.
And I thought, you know, I'm gonnastay and work locally and I'm gonna
supplement by getting into IT.
And in fact, at the time, if you couldspell the word, IT, they'd let you in.
(14:48):
And so I was able to get in.
And what I realized when I first pickedup the computer, because probably by at
around 1994, I probably couldn't tell youhow to turn on these things on, honestly.
And once I got into it and I had someonementor and coach me again, right?
, and I read a bunch of books around itand I figured out how to practice it.
(15:10):
And I realized that playingmusic all these years had
prepared me for technology.
Because it's, you know, it's kinetic, soyou're typing or you're working with it.
It's, , very, very conceptual because,coding, uh, theory, and then you,
it's visual because you see the, theeffects of the coding on the screen
(15:33):
when , it's when Windows came online.
And so it was, quickly, music quicklyallowed me to connect the dots of
what technology was and how it worked.
And it was very logical.
Just like classical music.
Classical music is extremelylogical in the way everything is
put together, the theory and so on.
So I used that same concept toreally understand technology.
(15:54):
But then as I was doing it, I realizedthat as a musician I was, and especially
as a bass player and working with thebands that I was part of, I was always
the one kind of organizing things.
I was the one that was kindof like, Hey, this is what
we're gonna do in the practice.
This is how we're gonnado things, and so on.
And so I realized that inthe business world project
management was what I was doing.
(16:14):
And I would always also being inan organization, even when I was
in the, doing some of the spiritualthings, if something was chaotic,
I'd come in and go, oh, we gottado this, this, that, and the other.
We gotta put this in place thatin place, and boom, it's all
organized and now let's go.
, it wasn't work for me.
So when I decided to take technology andcombine it with project management, I,
(16:35):
I actually stopped working because nowI'm actually playing, I'm doing what I
love to do and I'm doing something that'svery natural for who I am as a person
and how music played a part of that.
And I just took off.
I, I, again, practice, I found coaches,I got involved with, , enterprise
project management, and I starteddoing projects for the National
(16:58):
Archives and for Geico and for DelMonte and for, , DDOD organizations and
pharmaceutical companies and hospitals.
And, and I was, it was fascinatingbecause I just needed to be the expert
in the project management concepts.
But then I would walk into thedoor and they would go, okay, we
(17:20):
gotta teach you about our business.
So I would have them teach me aboutthe, the business, and then I apply
these concepts to their businessto make their business better.
Again, you know, that was fun for me.
How do we organize it and get itworking and get everybody on the
same page and get every playing,playing the same sheet of music?
And so that, that was what consultingwas for me, and I fell in love with it.
(17:40):
I still, I still have clientswhere I'm on retainer or even what
my company as I'm building out mystrategy and we're starting to go into
the UK and we're going into Canada,and I have visions of us going into
Africa and, and over into Singapore.
I'm using these same principlesand frameworks to kind of create
a strategy and organize thegroup to together and leveraging
(18:02):
technology to make it all happen.
Again, it was a lot ofthe foundation of music.
And the arts that allowed meto take all of that background.
And in fact, when I was incollege, one of my teachers said,
why aren't you a math major?
Yeah.
I said, why?
I'm like, it was an elective.
I'm like, I don't like math.
She goes, but you're so good at it.
And I, and I equated that I go back tomusic because having to read music count,
(18:27):
, process time signatures and so on.
And so that kind of puts me on abandwagon or put me on soapbox,
if you will, when schools.
You know, take music outbecause of economics.
Right.
I think they do a majordisservice to society.
Yeah.
Because there's so much that kidsand even adults can learn and grow
(18:51):
from, from experiencing the arts.
And if you think about some of thegreatest minds out there, you know Albert,
Albert Einstein, Henry Ford, WinstonChurchill, and there's a ton of others.
I'm writing on my third book mynext series is gonna be the
DNA of Growth Strategies.
And we're gonna talk about allthese inventors who were, I
can't say closet musicians, butthey were musicians as well.
(19:14):
Einstein was a violinist.
Henry Ford owned one of the, he wasa violinist and won, owned one of the
largest violin collections in the UnitedStates with all these Italian violins.
Winston Churchill was a prolific painter,and he was in the arts, but that, that
concept allowed them to connect theirright and left brain to together and
developed these principles that theythen were able to take out into the
(19:37):
world and solve real world problemsbecause they had studied the arts.
Catherine (19:43):
Going back to music and that word foundation, , music Yes.
The foundation, it has built you, itbuilt these other, people, so let's talk
about vision drives and develops values.
You and I both have been in places,we've been in schools, we've been
in businesses where you walk in andyou either feel the, oh my gosh,
(20:06):
there's such a negative culture here.
You feel it.
It's not something you have to studyand or you feel the positivity and
you feel the workmanship and thecritical thinking and you feel it
as soon as you walk into a place.
Same with a department store, right?
You don't wanna go back to that departmentstore if you felt that negative culture.
(20:27):
How does leadership buildthat from the foundation?
Gerald J. Leonard (20:32):
Right.
It, it really does have tostart from that foundation.
And it really, it reallystarts with the leader.
If you have a leader that is, . Positiveand open-minded and, , inclusive in
their thinking and looking at, , makinga difference and adding value,
then , their values are gonna be apart of who they are, and you're gonna
(20:53):
feel that expression in them, right?
But if you walk into anorganization where it's cutthroat,
it's all about the bottom line.
It's all about profits,it's all about this.
And then the customer'sreally not, the main thing.
And the, the employees are not treatedproperly, so they're not really happy.
So they're not gonnatreat the customers happy.
And, you know, it's that wholenegative vibe again that was why
(21:15):
I re, I turned my first book.
Uh, culture is the base, right?
Because when you walk and when youlisten to a really good song and you
hear the bass line, you immediatelyknow, oh, that's funk, that's jazz,
that's classical, that's rock,that's r and b, whatever that is.
And you feel, it's like you feel it inyour gut and you feel it in your soul.
(21:35):
But it, but a business's culture ororganization's culture is the same way.
And for most of the times it's,sometimes it's hard to put words to.
And I was able to kind of dissectand do research and find those
seven words that I, that to memade up what culture was all about.
But at the end of the day, all thosewords kind of come together and they
create a vibe or a groove or a feel.
(21:58):
And like you said, when you walk intothat store, you feel, , the vibe of that
store and what you're feeling emotionallyis that culture that's going on.
Catherine (22:11):
Definitely.
, I really took a lot of notes on your book'cause you have so much in it, in the book
and too much for us to discuss and readersneed to go and read your book anyway.
But you have how to acclimate thevalues, your core values, aspirational,
the permission to play, which Ithink needs to really be explained
(22:33):
because that is, I think, a huge, hugevalue that's not practiced enough.
And the other your accidental values,
Gerald J. Leonard (22:43):
well, you know, the, the, the reason I came up with
those is that a lot of companies talkabout their core values, but yet.
, when you bring people in, if you'renot hiring based on your values
and people are bringing differentother attitudes in, then they begin
to bring in other values, right?
So you may say, my core values are we'regonna treat the customer right, we're
(23:05):
gonna do this, we're gonna do that.
And you do the other.
But if you hire some key people andthey're much more just about the
bottom line, then you start gettingthese values from these personalities
creeping into your organization, andthen you have little silos or little
fiefdoms that that, and then youstart seeing that the organization's
(23:26):
actually fighting against itself.
Right?
And, and I always think about it this way.
How, how do you have a,a winning football team?
Well, a winning football team, , inAmerica it's American football.
If you have 11 guys on the field andthey're all thinking the same way, and
they're all moving in the same direction.
. That's when you're gonna have a winningteam and they're emotionally connected and
(23:48):
they're, and as they're moving and, and,but if you have a team where, half of
the guys are running eastward on the fieldand other guys are running westward or
somebody's running southward and they'reall running in different directions,
you're like, that is a chaotic team.
But that's exactly what happensemotionally and culturally
in a lot of organizations.
Imagine your company where you have,you're pointing everyone southward, or
(24:12):
northward and there's the North Star.
That's where we're going.
But you have the finance teams,they're running south, right?
Or the CIO, they're running,they're running westward
or, or the technology group.
And then you really, you, you stepback and you go, wait a minute.
My team's running all over the place.
We're not running in the same direction.
And so when I talk about theidea of these core values and
(24:32):
accidental values and aspirationalvalues, it's all about alignment.
Because if you have a great vision and theCEO or the founder should have a vision
of where he wants his organization to go.
And then it's a matter of sharingyour story over and over and over
again to share where you want to go.
Because when you share stories, youget people's heads, hearts, and hands.
(24:54):
That's why we love movies and so on.
And that's why it's sucha billion dollar business.
It's 'cause we love storiesbecause stories move us.
Right?
And many times if you want to make amovement happen, develop a core story
around it that people can dig into.
Because once they dig intothe story, you got 'em.
(25:15):
You, you got their minds.
And once they understand thestory, you got their hearts.
And once you got their head and theirhearts, you got their hands because
now they're engaged in the process.
And so a big part of this wholeculture and and values piece is also
around the stories that you tell.
And that's why I think it's thethird, the fourth value or the fourth
(25:36):
step in my process, which is vision,values, buy-in and in stories.
Mm-hmm.
That's why that's so important.
Catherine (25:45):
Join me next time for part two with Gerald J. Leonard,
where he shares more about hismusic and living with Vertigo.
Your positive imprint is a free podcast.
If you'd like to buy me a coffee to helpfund the production of this podcast, go
to buymeacoffee.com/yourpositiveimprintand any support you offer
(26:06):
will be greatly valued.
Thank you so much for your support andfor listening to your positive imprint.
Go to my website, yourpositiveimprint.comto learn more about the podcast.
And until next time, enjoy listeningto over 200 episodes of Positive
Imprints Your Positive Imprint.
What's your P.I.?
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I'm Catherine, your host ofthis variety show podcast.
Your positive imprint istransforming how we live today
for a more sustainable tomorrowthrough education and information.
Your own positive actions inspire change.
Follow me on Facebook andInstagram, your positive imprint.
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Visit my website, your positiveimprint.com and learn more about the
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(00:45):
Your positive imprint.
What's your PI
Gerald J. Leonard (00:49):
Your positive, positive, positive imprint, imprint,
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People and their positive actioninspire positive achievements.
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Get ready for your positive imprint.
Catherine (01:07):
Well, hello listeners.
My guest today grew up during thechallenging era of the 1960s in America.
He would often sneak into his sister'scloset to play her red guitar, which
absolutely sparked his passion for music.
Well today he is a professionalbass player and an accomplished
(01:31):
expert in project management.
He has authored several books andcleverly has incorporated music
terminology and scenarios, whichfor me, absolutely brilliant.
I particularly enjoyed his work.
In his book, culture is the Base SevenSteps to Creating High Performance Teams.
(01:53):
I absolutely loved it.
One of his quotes really stands out to me.
"Vision drives and develops values".
So indeed, both vision and valuesare essential for fostering a
positive and productive culture.
He serves today as the CEO of TurnberryPremier, and is the founder of the Leonard
(02:16):
Productivity Intelligence Institute.
His expertise has been featuredon NPR and Jack Canfield Show.
Good for you.
Yay.
But I especially loved , his Ted Ex Talk.
Loved it.
Gerald, you are truly remarkable,and I'm thrilled to have you as a
guest today on your positive imprint.
(02:37):
Welcome to the show, Gerald J. Leonard.
Gerald J. Leonard (02:41):
Well, Catherine, thank you so much for having me.
I'm really happy to be here.
I love the intro.
Catherine (02:46):
Oh, yay.
Well, it's you.
It's you.
So, uh, it was
Gerald J. Leonard (02:51):
guitar right behind me.
That's the, that's thelittle red guitar up there.
Oh, it's, it's,
Catherine (03:01):
I loved hearing that story and reading the story,
and I love that it's behind you.
That's fabulous.
Oh, what a remarkable memory.
And to have that and just knowingthat you had something that you love
to do, sneaking in your sister'scloset and playing that guitar.
(03:25):
So again, welcome to the showand we wanna learn all about you.
You have so much to share.
So let's go to that red guitar.
Just write quick while it's on ourplate right here, so, sure, sure.
Gerald J. Leonard (03:42):
So I was actually taking piano lessons, which I did not
like, and my older sister played piano.
Um, mom and dad had it for her.
And um, again, it wasn't somethingI really liked that I enjoyed.
I was, I guess, fascinated with the guitarand, but I didn't own one, my sister did.
So I would sneak in andgrab it and then play.
And I was just kind offiddling around playing stuff.
(04:05):
And, um, as I say in my TEDx, uh, oneday she caught me playing the guitar.
She was never practicing or playing it, soshe let me have it in more ways than one.
You know, she kinda, I'm gonnahave it for taking my guitar,
but here you can have it.
I'm not gonna use it.
And I started like reallypracticing it and playing by ear.
. I had a few friends thatwere musicians, right?
(04:28):
Kids, but one played in churchand he was like, he was younger
than I was, but he was way abovehis years and his ability to play.
I mean, he played like JimiHendrix, and I'm not kidding, he
was a fascinating guitar player.
So I realized we'reputting the band together.
I'm not gonna be the guitar player
sew up.
(04:48):
So I, so I, you know, moved over to thebass and, you know, when you're playing
the bass, you're playing the whole songand you're basically supporting everyone.
So you need to know the beginning, theend, and while everybody else is doing
their thing, you're cooling down thething and you're, you focus on just
keeping the groove and keeping the soundand keeping the music moving forward.
(05:10):
And it was at a time where I grew up inLakeland, Florida, which is in the United
States and Florida, uh, central, uh,between Tampa, and Orlando, uh, and around
1974, when I was about 12 years old,they created the Lakeland Civic Center.
And so it was the first time any majorbands could come into that area.
(05:31):
And at that time it wasn't like nowwhere you got a mortgage or house to
go to a concert, you could actuallydo a couple of lawns, you know,
do some chores and buy a ticket.
And so we would.
, as friends, you know, get tickets andwe would go, and I don't remember if
there was even any seat assignments.
I just remember we, the, the auditoriumor the stadium was so big, we would stand
(05:53):
next to the stage and we saw the BrothersJohnsons, we saw Earth, wind and Fire.
We saw the OJs we saw theCommodores, and we saw them up close.
And I remember just seeingdifferent bass players do things.
And I would go back home and I hadthese, uh, speaker headphones that I'd
put on and the plug into my base so Iwouldn't keep my family up because they,
(06:13):
they, they, they wouldn't allow that.
And, um, I would practice and I wouldprobably stay up to three or four
o'clock in the morning and just playbecause I was so impressed with,
and so I learned a lot from that.
But then I had to, you know, ifI wanted to get better, I had
realized I needed to take lessons.
So I went back to workand made some money.
'cause you know, I wasthe youngest of six.
Right.
(06:34):
And during that time, mom and dadprovided what we needed, right?
And I had a great childhood.
But if I wanted to do all thisextra stuff, I had to kind
of make that happen, right?
And so I was happy that because ofthat I learned the value of working
for lessons, like working and makingmoney to then pay someone else to teach
(06:55):
me something that I needed to know.
And I never forgot that lesson as a kid.
And I think sometimes that's a reallyimportant lesson for kids to learn.
But anyway, that really moved me forward.
You know, I had a band I practiced,and so as I went through life, those
three lessons became , the foundationalprinciples in which I live my life.
(07:17):
Whatever I got into, whetherit was becoming an author,
I would practice writing.
I would look for a coach and I would lookfor a band like who are other writers
that I can go talk to about writing?
I got into project management.
Okay, how do I practiceproject management?
Who can I learn from and whatorganizations are out there
that I could call my band?
(07:38):
As I've become a CEO and a founder, Ihave said, okay, what are the things
that CEOs and founders practice toget really good at, and what are the
critical skills they need to have?
Who should I learn from to be abetter CEO and a better founder?
And who's my band?
What organizations, what programs,where can I go to find people
who are doing what I'm doing?
(07:59):
And so I've literally leveraged thosethree principles I learned as a kid
to help me throughout my entire life.
And that was practice.
Find a coach.
Find a band.
Catherine (08:12):
That's, that's fabulous.
And I love the, the
transformation that thebase provided for you.
But it was when you said thatbasically the base is everything
within the orchestra, you have tothe beginning, the middle, the end.
And you said something, yousaid, and I wanna find that
(08:32):
quote 'cause I wrote it down.
"The base is the foundationof the orchestra".
And for you really, that base becameyour foundation in life with the
practice and then the values and so on.
And you also said, and this, thisis something that I am going to
(08:54):
write out, I'm going to pass out toteachers that I work with and other
community members that I work with.
You said about values,"enshrine them to practice".
Yes, you trying them intopractice and that's how you
lived your life from early on.
Gerald J. Leonard (09:15):
My mom and dad both were pillars in our lives,
and it's definitely in my life.
And I can remember, you know, both of'em are gone now, but I can remember,
, just, just visualizing dad gettingup and he, , he had his own business.
He, , basically poured concrete.
He did construction work fromthat standpoint of, of pouring
the foundation of homes anddriveways and things like that.
(09:37):
And, and he probably did threeor four or five projects a week.
Uh, the phone was always ringing andon Sundays you couldn't touch the
phone because people were calling in.
That's when you had acord next to the phone.
But I remember at five 30 in themorning him always being there and
getting up and always coming home.
And that just that rock of a foundation.
(10:01):
And providing I grew up in thesixties and I learned about all
of the racial things that weregoing on in America in college.
I mean, obviously in high school Iexperienced some of those things, but
where I grew up, and it was a mixed area.
I was so well protected and caredfor that the reality of what was
(10:23):
happening in the world wasn'tmy reality growing up as a kid.
And mom was a seamstress she workedfor very high end stores because if
she made a suit, you couldn't tellif it was something that she made
or something that she bought and
altered.
She had that, that skill and she taughtmy sisters , and so the idea of really
(10:46):
working on being an expert, , carryingyour own, being dependable, , always
being there for your family no matterwhat, uh, showing up, , whatever
skill you go after, become thebest that you can be at that skill.
Those were all things that I learned frommy parents as I watched them, , raise
(11:07):
the six of us during that particulartime when, , a lot of opportunities
and things along that line weren't madeavailable to them, but they made a way
out of, as they would say, out of no way.
And they, but they did itin such a very graceful
and loving manner.
And, , I didn't have any issuesor I feel like, well, why aren't
you guys helping me with this?
I felt honored that, okay, hey, I'mbeing taken care of, but I wanna
(11:31):
play music and if I wanna buy myown instrument or I wanna do this,
I gotta go out and work for it.
And that was the principle,that was the value I learned.
And I used that quote because,the gentleman who wrote Good To
Great Built to Last, jim Collinswrote good To Great Built to Last.
And one of the things he foundabout great companies was that
they had a core set of values
(11:53):
that became the foundationof their organization.
In other words, those valuesweren't plaques on a wall they
were things that they lived.
And, uh, they, when they interviewedpeople, they interviewed people and
they judge them based on those values.
When they work with suppliers, theyjudge them based on their values.
When they focus on their customer service,they looked at their values and say, this
(12:15):
is how we're going to treat our customers.
This is how we're gonnatreat our employees.
And so, as they were growing the business,everyone around them developed those,
those core values, and that reallybecame the three first principles of my
book, vision, values, and then buy-in.
Because you gotta have people thatare gonna buy into those values.
But, you know, having those corevalues are really critical to, to,
(12:38):
uh, family success, to a business'ssuccess, to an organization's success.
It's really, really important to have,uh, strong values that you apply.
Catherine (12:46):
I, I agree.
And I, I loved this book, sobecause, and I know you didn't
like it as much you said that inyour prologue on your third book.
I loved culture is the baseand your seven steps, because
the way you really used music.
So I, I love learning throughcreative different ways, right?
(13:11):
So you bringing in the music and thedifferent instruments and the conductor,
and I love how you, when you werebringing in the vision and trying to
conceptualize, helping the reader toconceptualize that everybody needs to
work on this vision, but it can't always,you can't make it stale, such as the
(13:34):
conductor at the Cincinnati Ballet whenyou were playing bass for the Nutcracker
and the Nutcracker's played all the time.
But how does a conductor makeit interesting and exciting?
And he did.
And they do.
And it's not the same every time.
I think that that was fabulousconceptualization and so let's talk
(13:54):
about how you reshaped your, your bassstrings and went a different direction
Gerald J. Leonard (14:00):
that whole process was something that, uh, evolved over time.
And so here's what happened is,you know, I finished my degree,
uh, my master's in Cincinnati.
I moved to New York.
I played in New York for a while and Ialso was a part of a church and started
really doing a lot of spiritual work.
Um, got married, had a couple of kids,and as I'm going down this process, I
(14:21):
realize, you know, I really miss music.
, full time, but now I have two kids.
And again, go back to my vision ofmy dad, who was what always there.
And so I thought, , I had someopportunities to go on the
road or go here or go there.
And I thought, you know, I'm gonnastay and work locally and I'm gonna
supplement by getting into IT.
And in fact, at the time, if you couldspell the word, IT, they'd let you in.
(14:48):
And so I was able to get in.
And what I realized when I first pickedup the computer, because probably by at
around 1994, I probably couldn't tell youhow to turn on these things on, honestly.
And once I got into it and I had someonementor and coach me again, right?
, and I read a bunch of books around itand I figured out how to practice it.
(15:10):
And I realized that playingmusic all these years had
prepared me for technology.
Because it's, you know, it's kinetic, soyou're typing or you're working with it.
It's, , very, very conceptual because,coding, uh, theory, and then you,
it's visual because you see the, theeffects of the coding on the screen
(15:33):
when , it's when Windows came online.
And so it was, quickly, music quicklyallowed me to connect the dots of
what technology was and how it worked.
And it was very logical.
Just like classical music.
Classical music is extremelylogical in the way everything is
put together, the theory and so on.
So I used that same concept toreally understand technology.
(15:54):
But then as I was doing it, I realizedthat as a musician I was, and especially
as a bass player and working with thebands that I was part of, I was always
the one kind of organizing things.
I was the one that was kindof like, Hey, this is what
we're gonna do in the practice.
This is how we're gonnado things, and so on.
And so I realized that inthe business world project
management was what I was doing.
(16:14):
And I would always also being inan organization, even when I was
in the, doing some of the spiritualthings, if something was chaotic,
I'd come in and go, oh, we gottado this, this, that, and the other.
We gotta put this in place thatin place, and boom, it's all
organized and now let's go.
, it wasn't work for me.
So when I decided to take technology andcombine it with project management, I,
(16:35):
I actually stopped working because nowI'm actually playing, I'm doing what I
love to do and I'm doing something that'svery natural for who I am as a person
and how music played a part of that.
And I just took off.
I, I, again, practice, I found coaches,I got involved with, , enterprise
project management, and I starteddoing projects for the National
(16:58):
Archives and for Geico and for DelMonte and for, , DDOD organizations and
pharmaceutical companies and hospitals.
And, and I was, it was fascinatingbecause I just needed to be the expert
in the project management concepts.
But then I would walk into thedoor and they would go, okay, we
(17:20):
gotta teach you about our business.
So I would have them teach me aboutthe, the business, and then I apply
these concepts to their businessto make their business better.
Again, you know, that was fun for me.
How do we organize it and get itworking and get everybody on the
same page and get every playing,playing the same sheet of music?
And so that, that was what consultingwas for me, and I fell in love with it.
(17:40):
I still, I still have clientswhere I'm on retainer or even what
my company as I'm building out mystrategy and we're starting to go into
the UK and we're going into Canada,and I have visions of us going into
Africa and, and over into Singapore.
I'm using these same principlesand frameworks to kind of create
a strategy and organize thegroup to together and leveraging
(18:02):
technology to make it all happen.
Again, it was a lot ofthe foundation of music.
And the arts that allowed meto take all of that background.
And in fact, when I was incollege, one of my teachers said,
why aren't you a math major?
Yeah.
I said, why?
I'm like, it was an elective.
I'm like, I don't like math.
She goes, but you're so good at it.
And I, and I equated that I go back tomusic because having to read music count,
(18:27):
, process time signatures and so on.
And so that kind of puts me on abandwagon or put me on soapbox,
if you will, when schools.
You know, take music outbecause of economics.
Right.
I think they do a majordisservice to society.
Yeah.
Because there's so much that kidsand even adults can learn and grow
(18:51):
from, from experiencing the arts.
And if you think about some of thegreatest minds out there, you know Albert,
Albert Einstein, Henry Ford, WinstonChurchill, and there's a ton of others.
I'm writing on my third book mynext series is gonna be the
DNA of Growth Strategies.
And we're gonna talk about allthese inventors who were, I
can't say closet musicians, butthey were musicians as well.
(19:14):
Einstein was a violinist.
Henry Ford owned one of the, he wasa violinist and won, owned one of the
largest violin collections in the UnitedStates with all these Italian violins.
Winston Churchill was a prolific painter,and he was in the arts, but that, that
concept allowed them to connect theirright and left brain to together and
developed these principles that theythen were able to take out into the
(19:37):
world and solve real world problemsbecause they had studied the arts.
Catherine (19:43):
Going back to music and that word foundation, , music Yes.
The foundation, it has built you, itbuilt these other, people, so let's talk
about vision drives and develops values.
You and I both have been in places,we've been in schools, we've been
in businesses where you walk in andyou either feel the, oh my gosh,
(20:06):
there's such a negative culture here.
You feel it.
It's not something you have to studyand or you feel the positivity and
you feel the workmanship and thecritical thinking and you feel it
as soon as you walk into a place.
Same with a department store, right?
You don't wanna go back to that departmentstore if you felt that negative culture.
(20:27):
How does leadership buildthat from the foundation?
Gerald J. Leonard (20:32):
Right.
It, it really does have tostart from that foundation.
And it really, it reallystarts with the leader.
If you have a leader that is, . Positiveand open-minded and, , inclusive in
their thinking and looking at, , makinga difference and adding value,
then , their values are gonna be apart of who they are, and you're gonna
(20:53):
feel that expression in them, right?
But if you walk into anorganization where it's cutthroat,
it's all about the bottom line.
It's all about profits,it's all about this.
And then the customer'sreally not, the main thing.
And the, the employees are not treatedproperly, so they're not really happy.
So they're not gonnatreat the customers happy.
And, you know, it's that wholenegative vibe again that was why
(21:15):
I re, I turned my first book.
Uh, culture is the base, right?
Because when you walk and when youlisten to a really good song and you
hear the bass line, you immediatelyknow, oh, that's funk, that's jazz,
that's classical, that's rock,that's r and b, whatever that is.
And you feel, it's like you feel it inyour gut and you feel it in your soul.
(21:35):
But it, but a business's culture ororganization's culture is the same way.
And for most of the times it's,sometimes it's hard to put words to.
And I was able to kind of dissectand do research and find those
seven words that I, that to memade up what culture was all about.
But at the end of the day, all thosewords kind of come together and they
create a vibe or a groove or a feel.
(21:58):
And like you said, when you walk intothat store, you feel, , the vibe of that
store and what you're feeling emotionallyis that culture that's going on.
Catherine (22:11):
Definitely.
, I really took a lot of notes on your book'cause you have so much in it, in the book
and too much for us to discuss and readersneed to go and read your book anyway.
But you have how to acclimate thevalues, your core values, aspirational,
the permission to play, which Ithink needs to really be explained
(22:33):
because that is, I think, a huge, hugevalue that's not practiced enough.
And the other your accidental values,
Gerald J. Leonard (22:43):
well, you know, the, the, the reason I came up with
those is that a lot of companies talkabout their core values, but yet.
, when you bring people in, if you'renot hiring based on your values
and people are bringing differentother attitudes in, then they begin
to bring in other values, right?
So you may say, my core values are we'regonna treat the customer right, we're
(23:05):
gonna do this, we're gonna do that.
And you do the other.
But if you hire some key people andthey're much more just about the
bottom line, then you start gettingthese values from these personalities
creeping into your organization, andthen you have little silos or little
fiefdoms that that, and then youstart seeing that the organization's
(23:26):
actually fighting against itself.
Right?
And, and I always think about it this way.
How, how do you have a,a winning football team?
Well, a winning football team, , inAmerica it's American football.
If you have 11 guys on the field andthey're all thinking the same way, and
they're all moving in the same direction.
. That's when you're gonna have a winningteam and they're emotionally connected and
(23:48):
they're, and as they're moving and, and,but if you have a team where, half of
the guys are running eastward on the fieldand other guys are running westward or
somebody's running southward and they'reall running in different directions,
you're like, that is a chaotic team.
But that's exactly what happensemotionally and culturally
in a lot of organizations.
Imagine your company where you have,you're pointing everyone southward, or
(24:12):
northward and there's the North Star.
That's where we're going.
But you have the finance teams,they're running south, right?
Or the CIO, they're running,they're running westward
or, or the technology group.
And then you really, you, you stepback and you go, wait a minute.
My team's running all over the place.
We're not running in the same direction.
And so when I talk about theidea of these core values and
(24:32):
accidental values and aspirationalvalues, it's all about alignment.
Because if you have a great vision and theCEO or the founder should have a vision
of where he wants his organization to go.
And then it's a matter of sharingyour story over and over and over
again to share where you want to go.
Because when you share stories, youget people's heads, hearts, and hands.
(24:54):
That's why we love movies and so on.
And that's why it's sucha billion dollar business.
It's 'cause we love storiesbecause stories move us.
Right?
And many times if you want to make amovement happen, develop a core story
around it that people can dig into.
Because once they dig intothe story, you got 'em.
(25:15):
You, you got their minds.
And once they understand thestory, you got their hearts.
And once you got their head and theirhearts, you got their hands because
now they're engaged in the process.
And so a big part of this wholeculture and and values piece is also
around the stories that you tell.
And that's why I think it's thethird, the fourth value or the fourth
(25:36):
step in my process, which is vision,values, buy-in and in stories.
Mm-hmm.
That's why that's so important.
Catherine (25:45):
Join me next time for part two with Gerald J. Leonard,
where he shares more about hismusic and living with Vertigo.
Your positive imprint is a free podcast.
If you'd like to buy me a coffee to helpfund the production of this podcast, go
to buymeacoffee.com/yourpositiveimprintand any support you offer
(26:06):
will be greatly valued.
Thank you so much for your support andfor listening to your positive imprint.
Go to my website, yourpositiveimprint.comto learn more about the podcast.
And until next time, enjoy listeningto over 200 episodes of Positive
Imprints Your Positive Imprint.
What's your P.I.?
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