November 17, 2025 • 31 mins
What if the only thing between you and real momentum is the courage to disappoint a few people you love? In this episode, Josh Coats sat down with exceptional entrepreneur Tori Armstrong for a candid, co-hosted conversation on fear, failure, and leadership—tracing how approval, ego, and binary thinking quietly shape business decisions and how to break free.
Tori opens up about releasing the grip of friends’ and family’s opinions so she could actually move. Josh shares how a rigid right-or-wrong upbringing made action feel dangerous until he learned to treat failure as a skill. That single shift—aiming to fail on purpose for a year—compressed a decade of experience and built true confidence. From there we dig into the power of and-thinking: build a business and be a present parent, sell low-ticket and high-ticket, protect momentum and add new plays. Neutral language like head and heart helps reduce emotional charge and stops overthinking from masquerading as wisdom.
We also get painfully honest about our biggest mistakes. Josh explains why killing predictable low-ticket offers nearly stalled a thriving high-ticket certification: momentum and trust were the real engines all along. The takeaway is simple and hard—never shut down what’s profitably working; automate it, don’t annihilate it. Tori reflects on ego traps in leadership, from believing there’s only one correct path to pushing people toward goals they didn’t own. Her proudest moment—reaching the top 1%—felt different because it was shared, team-led, and rooted in growth that honored others’ autonomy.
Expect practical insights on audience trust, pricing ladders, momentum, and the psychology of safety. We talk about luck, calling, and why results meet those in motion—not those waiting for perfect permission. If you’re ready to trade or for and, protect what works, and lead with empathy and clarity, this conversation will meet you where you are and nudge you forward.
Enjoy the first half here, then catch the rest on Totally Tori, at:
https://podcasts.apple.com/sk/podcast/totally-tori-where-wellness-meets-confidence/id1651512639
If this resonated, subscribe, share with a friend who needs it, and leave a quick review to help others find the show.
If you would like to learn more about working with Josh, and the Legacy Leadership Coaching Certification, visit JoshCoats.com!
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
SPEAKER_00 (00:00):
What's up, friends?
My name is Josh.
I'm your push coach, and I havea fun, such a fun episode for
you today.
Um, I decided to do this funlittle co-interview um with one
of my favorite clients, ToriArmstrong.
So half of our we're literallyinterviewing each other.
So I'm gonna ask her somequestions.
She's gonna ask me somequestions, and what we're doing
(00:20):
is we're putting half of theepisode here on my show, your
pushcoach.
Half of the episode is gonna goon her podcast, which is called
Totally Tori, where wellnessmeets confidence with Tori
Armstrong.
So if you want to hear the restof this, you're gonna have to go
over to Tori's podcast.
I'll make sure and link that upfor you in the show notes.
(00:41):
Let's dive in.
Okay, so I'm gonna I'm gonna askfirst, and we're just basically
gonna ask each other the samequestions.
And then again, half of it on myshow, half of it on her show.
Um, Tori, I want to ask younumber one, what's the biggest
lesson you had to learn likeearly on in your entrepreneurial
journey?
SPEAKER_01 (01:00):
Oh, this is a great one.
Uh for me, it is letting go ofwhat other people think, their
thoughts, their opinions, uh,really following my own heart
and my own energy and what Ibelieved in, because I felt
waiting, if you wait on otherapproval, everybody's approval,
what's gonna happen is it'sgonna stop you from moving
(01:22):
forward.
And for me, I found everybodyhad an opinion.
They thought I was crazy.
Did she lose her mind?
Uh, what is she doing?
And some of it had goodintention.
I believe people have sometimescan have a hard time with
change.
And so they felt like maybe theywere protecting me, or they
really thought I lost my mind.
(01:43):
But I knew what I was doing andI believed in it.
So I had to truly let go whatother people thought I should be
doing.
SPEAKER_00 (01:50):
Yeah.
And as you've kind of likelearned in my certification, the
brain is just trying to keep ussafe.
So when other people are likecriticizing what you're doing,
most of the time it is theirsurvival instinct kicking in
that's like afraid for you.
It's it's it's it's less of likea we actually think Tori is a
(02:10):
crazy person, and more of awe're afraid that she's going
down a path that's not good forher.
So we feel the need to try topull her back.
SPEAKER_01 (02:20):
Yes, for sure.
I could totally feel that andsee that now.
I believe before I did yourcertification, I felt them
thinking I was crazy and thejudgment uh felt shameful.
But after going that, I do trulysee that and see it was a
protection mode.
Yeah.
But I really did have to let goand get thicker skin and be okay
(02:41):
and run after what I trulywanted to.
SPEAKER_00 (02:43):
Who were some of the people that you were like
worried about the most?
SPEAKER_01 (02:48):
My closest people, my co-workers, my family, my
friends.
I remember my dad saying, Youwent to college and you did all
of this, and now you're justgonna switch midlife?
What?
So family, and now I see it wasjust a protective mode.
SPEAKER_00 (03:05):
Yeah, yeah.
I love that.
I mean, that's tough, right?
Because like social media, youknow, someone told me yesterday
they were like, I really likeposting on Instagram because
none of my friends and familyare over there.
And and there's nothing wrongwith Instagram.
I got nothing, no problem.
But based on the rest of theconversation we had had, nothing
(03:26):
was happening for her onInstagram.
Like nothing.
And I was just like, Do youthink maybe, just maybe, because
you have so many friends andthings on Facebook that maybe
you'd get like faster traction?
And she was like, I know Iwould, but I'm just like so
afraid of what people are gonnastart saying and thinking.
(03:46):
And I was just like, Okay, butif you're trying to build a
business, like what's moreimportant?
What what people, you know,Facebook friends are thinking
and saying about you, or whatyou want to create for your
family.
And that's a tricky one becauseeverything in life is choosing
what's most important to you.
(04:07):
So, like for me personally, um,being an Enneagram three, I
really care a lot what peoplethink of me.
Like, I just really do, right?
But I had to realize what theythink about me.
Like everyone's thinkingsomething about me.
But that includes like my kids.
And for me, I was like, do Iwant my kids thinking about dad
(04:28):
as the person who won't chasehis dreams or the person who is
like like that opinion is waymore important than Sally on
Facebook, even though I careabout Sally's.
Like, I'm not gonna be one ofthose people who're like, just
don't care.
Like, no, I actually really docare.
I don't like that Sally thinksI'm some weirdo, but I can live
with that if that means my kidslook up to me and see an
(04:52):
example.
I mean, let's be real, my kidsthink I'm an idiot.
They they call me a dork, allthat, but I'm still setting an
example for what they will beable to step into.
SPEAKER_01 (05:01):
Yeah, it's really powerful because I don't believe
you really look at that in thebeginning when you're starting a
journey.
And then once you start goingand you see that and you see how
it starts to uh form yourchildren, how they view you.
Yeah.
So how about you?
Tell me, is uh what's yourbiggest lesson that you've
learned?
SPEAKER_00 (05:19):
So for me, the biggest lesson I had to learn
early on was the power offailure.
Um, I, as most of you on my showknow, grew up in like a
borderline cult.
So everything in life was rightor wrong, good or bad.
It was, you know, like God'swill, or it was evil.
(05:40):
Like it was there was no middleground at all.
It was either exactly what Godplanned and ordained for your
life, or it was total, completeevil, which is such a scary way
to like I think back of myfive-year-old self, and I'm
like, damn, like poor littlefive-year-old, scared to death
of anything in life, you know.
(06:01):
But the real like that's what itwas.
I grew up in such a world offear that I was literally scared
to death of doing the wrongthing with my life.
And when you're scared to deathof doing the wrong thing, you
usually don't do anything.
And so through my 20s, Iactually started and quit like
six different businesses.
(06:21):
Um, I would start it, I wouldget excited, it would get
momentum, and then somethinglike that that fear in me would
kick in and be like, what ifthis isn't the right thing?
Because remember, if it's notthe right thing, it's like evil.
Like you could be evil right nowfor trying to detail cars on the
weekends, like so ridiculous.
And then John Maxwell taught methis powerful lesson that said,
(06:45):
the only way to learn is tofail.
So if there's anything you wantto learn in life or improve in
life, it's gonna come throughgetting something wrong.
And it just completely changedmy entire perspective and
reality about right and wrong.
And it went from, okay, thething that I'm about to do is
(07:06):
going to either win, which meansit was right, or it's going to
fail, which means it was evil.
And instead, I found thisbeautiful place where it was
like, um, if it doesn't work, Ijust got to learn from it so
that I can get smarter.
And so I actually made thiscrazy goal.
My once I learned that my firstyear in business, my only goal
(07:27):
was to fail as many times as Icould so that I could learn the
lessons I needed.
And that's why in year two mybusiness just blew up.
Year one, I didn't make I didn'tI made two sales in a whole
year.
But because I was finallyallowing myself and almost
forcing myself to just tryanything and everything that
(07:48):
could lead to um some knowledgeor some type of experience, I
went into year two with whatfelt like like to this day, I
think if you could go back andsee me coaching and building my
business in year two, you wouldhave thought that I was someone
who had been doing it for 10years.
Because that one year of failinggained me the life experience
(08:10):
that would normally take 10years because people are so
afraid of failing.
SPEAKER_01 (08:14):
Oh wow.
Okay, so I'm curious then, isthis where your and I know I've
been working so closely withyou, and you have one of my
biggest things you've taught meis get rid of the or Tori, get
it out of your vocabulary andfocus on the and.
Um, is this where your andtheory came from?
SPEAKER_00 (08:31):
It's where it started.
Yeah.
I think it's I think it's whereit started, was just uh and life
coaching in general, Tori, isreally, really big on um
everything is neutral until ourbrain gets a hold of it.
So um life coaching in generalis about processing, you know,
instead of from this emotional,irrational place, from this like
(08:52):
logical place.
You know what I mean?
And so yeah, I I think that alot of the things that you'll
like the terminology you'lllearn from me, especially in the
certification, is kind ofcustomized to like how I took
what I've learned and processedit through my childhood trauma,
right?
Like, like the head and theheart is something we talk about
(09:13):
in the certification.
The way I grew up, we would havecalled that evil and good.
But notice how like triggeringthat is to think that something
is evil versus no, that's justmy head.
Like it's not evil, that's justmy animal instinct.
That doesn't make it good or bador right.
So it's about neutralizingthings to not be so emotionally
charged, and and that's what theword and does, right?
(09:36):
If you're like, well, I canbuild a business or I can be a
good mom.
What if we just allowedourselves to build a business
and be a good mom?
Like, what would that look like?
And so I think I think it's acombination of all the the
childhood trauma processingmyself, and then of course,
coaching others where I'mhearing these extremes.
(09:59):
Like, like I I realized it'sit's not that the religion I
grew up in was extreme, it'sthat people are extreme.
Like all of us are to it's justthat we chose that area of our
lives to be extreme, buteverybody's extreme somewhere,
right?
Like everyone at some in somearea of their life is trying to
(10:21):
use or as some type of an escapebecause they're not willing to
just embrace both things atonce.
SPEAKER_01 (10:29):
I know for me it's made a huge difference in my
business because I noticed theand has stopped me from
overthinking.
I felt like I always had tochoose this option or this
option.
If I do this, and then I wouldpause and not move and start
overthinking.
So the and I've uh adopted thatsame saying, and everything is
(10:50):
and and let's focus on the and.
So thank you for that.
SPEAKER_00 (10:54):
You're welcome.
It's it's it's one of myfavorites.
You know, the brain's tricky.
The brain really is trickingthat overthink thinking thing
you were talking about.
It that is kind of the brain'sgoal.
Because if it can trick you intooverthinking, which is a form
and aversion of self-sabotage,you won't leave the cave to look
(11:15):
for food.
And if you don't leave the caveto look for food, you'll be
safe.
You might starve to death, butyou'll be safe.
And and that's what's so trickyabout the human brain, is it is
trying to keep us safe, but welive in a modern day era where
there's not a saber-toothedtiger outside of the cave.
It's just Alabama Fitness onInstagram that might ghost us or
(11:38):
or block us.
Like it's not a saber-toothedtiger, but it feels like it is
because that's what our brainturns it into.
SPEAKER_01 (11:45):
So interesting.
Love that.
Um, so let's move on to the nextquestion.
Um, what is the sorry, should Ilet you do this?
No, go ahead.
I know she I'm like, I don'teven have the question out.
Hang on.
Okay.
Okay, so let's move on to thenext question.
Um, what is one of the biggestmistakes you've made as a uh
(12:07):
coach or leader in yourbusiness?
SPEAKER_00 (12:10):
So I think personally the biggest mistake
I've ever made, and I made lots,okay?
Like I already told you, I madeit a goal to fail as often as
possible.
So, you know, I think that it'simportant to remember that it's
not good or bad, right or wrong,but it's something we can learn
from.
And I think the biggest one thatcomes to always comes to front
(12:31):
of mind, Tori, is um 2020.
We had our first million-dollaryear, and we followed that up in
2021 with another million-dollaryear, but launching our life
coach certification.
And our life coach certificationbecame this like really, really
awesome, you know, high-ticketoffer at that point.
I had been I don't want to saymostly a low-ticket coach
(12:54):
because I had some higher ticketprograms, but they weren't like
my signature programs, if thatmakes sense.
They were just like some upsellson the back end.
This is the first time we werekind of rebranding a signature
program that was high ticket,and it was selling like crazy.
I mean, we sold five spots withour first email that just said,
hey, if you've been listening tome long enough, you know this is
(13:15):
what I've been working on, youknew this was coming eventually.
If you've worked with me enoughto trust that what I'm about to
do is magical because you'vedone enough other things with
me, and you're you want to get$3,000 off.
I'm gonna let the first fivepeople buy$3,000 off with no
agenda, with no itinerary, likewith nothing.
(13:38):
All you know is certification.
And we made five sales at fivegrand within like four hours.
So it was like we just I waslike, holy shit, we just made
$25,000 in like for with oneemail.
It wasn't even like a launchwith a web.
I mean, just a like I was like,I think we're on to something,
and so we kept building on that,and it was working so well that
(14:03):
I made this really dumb mistake,Tori, and you're gonna laugh
because we were just talkingabout the word and not or.
I pulled an or.
And I was like, okay.
I started like looking atnumbers and looking at math and
time and energy and all thesethings, and I was like, I'm
spending let's just pretend Iwork 40 hours a week, okay?
(14:25):
I don't actually know what Iwork, I don't think it's 40, but
let's pretend, okay?
I was spending like 30 hours aweek marketing and teaching and
training for my low-ticketstuff, and then only like 10
hours a week having to marketand train for this high-ticket
stuff.
So in my brain, I was like, thishigh-ticket stuff is so much
(14:48):
more profitable for the time andenergy that I'm putting in.
What if I got rid of thelow-ticket stuff and spent my
whole week doing this?
And it sounds smart.
Sounds like it could be.
Here's where I really missed themark, Tory.
We tore down our low-ticketstuff, which by the way, our
low-ticket stuff was making like$40,000 a month on autopilot.
(15:10):
I mean, I say autopilot.
There was some work that had tobe done, but it was like it had
been performing like that month.
It's very predictable, I guess,is what I should say.
Okay.
We burned those programs down.
And then six months down theroad, I was like, uh, how come
our high-ticket stuff isn'tselling anymore?
(15:31):
Like, what happened?
Like, all of a sudden it's real,like I'm spending 40 hours a
week trying to sell this, and Igot barely any leads for it.
I got barely any excitement.
It feels like I am like back inlike grind mode trying to force
things to work.
And then I finally realized,Josh, the certification doesn't
sell like candy because thecertification is so like in
(15:56):
demand per se.
It's because you'd created somuch momentum with your
low-ticket stuff that you hadthis super high level of trust
with people that they wanted totake next steps with you.
And so I just realized first ofall, I tell my clients all the
time, never shut down, ever shutdown something that's
(16:18):
profitable.
If you need to automate it, ifyou need to systematize it, if
you need to hire someone to runit for you, cool.
But if money is showing up,there's no reason to flush that
down the toilet.
So I forgot a lesson that I toldprobably a hundred other people.
But then I think the second one,Tori, is is maybe a little bit
of ego there.
(16:38):
To where it's like, well, I'mlike the high-ticket guy now.
I don't need to do, I don't needto do these other things.
And I think I see that a lot asyou've heard me talk about with
the four M's.
Sometimes as leaders, we get tothe top of a mountain and we
think that the gritty work thatgot us there is no longer
needed.
And I think it's just thispowerful lesson to remember,
(17:00):
like the gritty work that likepeople always say what got you
here won't get you there.
And I do agree with that.
But I also think that becauseour brains like to pull the or
instead of the and, we forgetwhat got you here won't get you
there, but it will protect themomentum that got you here so
that the next lesson will getyou there.
(17:23):
So it's not about releasing whatwe did to get here to learn a
new thing.
It's about adding on to thething that we did to get here.
So, like if I would have, youknow, we we had a couple years
of struggle where we had to kindof rebuild the low-ticket stuff
and try to re-feed all of thatmomentum and stuff that we had
burned down.
(17:43):
And the reality is if we wouldhave just stayed on the same
course, there is no reason inthe world we wouldn't have
scaled to two million, thenthree million, then four
million, because we had awell-oiled machine, we just kind
of took out the engine.
Does that make sense?
SPEAKER_01 (17:58):
Yeah, that's really interesting.
And to look at it from the angleof what got you there.
And it's and I love that youbrought up ego because that
that's a big one.
SPEAKER_00 (18:09):
I know, I hate my ego.
It's annoying, but it's there.
Can't get rid of it.
It's gotta work with it.
So, what is one of the biggestmistakes that you have made?
SPEAKER_01 (18:20):
Uh, so like I said, I love that you brought up ego
because ego would definitely bemine.
I've learned a lot about the egoover the last few years, and I
feel like that word just soundsnegative anyways.
So I'm I don't have an ego.
I'm a good person.
I don't have that ego.
Uh, but when I look back at myjourney, I have two that really
(18:42):
stand out to me.
And I believe ego was thedriving force there.
And so I'm really grateful forthe awareness of it now.
And I'm always working andimproving on it.
Uh, but I think awareness is thekey with that.
But uh one specifically um wouldbe, you know, moving quickly
(19:02):
through the business and seeingwhat I'm doing is working.
And okay, I'm the leader, peopleare following my lead.
They should do it like me.
They should choose my path.
They should do, okay, I'mtelling them, why aren't they
listening?
Why aren't they doing exactlywhat I said to do?
Because if they do this, they'llhave success.
And something uh that you havetaught me over the last six
(19:25):
months has been if I can do it,you can do it.
I'm guilty.
I know, I know you're cringingright now.
I am so guilty of being thatperson to say that and not only
say it, but truly to my core,believe it.
Like I thought, if I did it onthis path, you can do the exact
same path.
And I've learned that we're notall like that.
(19:47):
And so along the journey, Ibelieve, you know, there gets to
a point too where where the egowould come in, like, well, I did
it.
Almost like I felt like anobligation, but I also felt
important.
Like, yeah, okay, I just showedyou.
Like, why are you not?
And so I would take it in as Idon't know.
I I would take it in a differentway of like maybe they don't
(20:09):
trust me, or maybe um they theyjust don't know.
I know.
So I know that sounds bad.
So that's that's a lot of ego.
So yeah.
Go ahead.
SPEAKER_00 (20:20):
No, no, you're good.
SPEAKER_01 (20:21):
You're um so I'm really just grateful for the
experience of going through thatbecause I've actually just
learned that for leaders togrow, they need space.
They don't have to do it exactlylike me.
And if I allow that space, I'mgoing to learn from them too,
because there's always people tolearn from, and it doesn't have
to be one exact path.
So that would be number onemistake.
(20:42):
And then right up there, this isprobably the worst one I do have
to share this, is pushing peopleto their goals when it's really
not their goals.
And I do think ego comes intothis too because I'm doing it
for me.
It was all about me.
And so I'm I am verygoal-oriented.
I love goals, I love to helppeople hit goals.
(21:03):
And it's truly one of mypassions.
If somebody comes to me and islike, hey, I want this, how do I
do this?
How can I help?
And I love to help show them theway or help guide them.
SPEAKER_00 (21:12):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (21:13):
But what I found early on, and I have one goal
specifically, it was uh headingto the top of the company.
Um, that it was the top 3% atthe time.
And it happened really early onin my business, like four months
into my business.
And it was just like, this isunbelievable.
She's coming in and she's a rockstar.
Again, all about me.
I really wasn't thinking aboutthe team.
And it was like, yes, I'm gonnabreak records.
(21:34):
I'm gonna hit this in fourmonths.
unknown (21:36):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (21:37):
And I remember I, for that goal, I specifically
needed people to hit certaintitles, numbers, things to be
able to hit that.
And there's one girl who nolonger does the business with
me, and I don't blame her.
She's probably why, but I wasthe person who was, come on, you
have till midnight tonight.
You gotta get this in.
And it really was not even hergoal.
(21:57):
Like she could care less.
She ended up hitting because Ithink she felt the pressure from
me.
Yeah.
What happened as a result ofthat?
What should have been one of themost exciting points in my
business actually ended up beingone of the most disappointing.
And I remember my husband comingin the room to celebrate because
he realized that we just hit andhe found me laying on the floor
(22:19):
crying.
I was crying because I was sodisappointed in my own behavior
of pushing somebody to hit sothat I could hit.
And in that moment, I realizedit.
I believe I knew it the wholetime, but when the emotions
kicked in and I I'd love tocelebrate, and that wasn't a
celebration, that was more orless I did that for me.
(22:40):
So I would say that's a hugemistake.
Uh, I taken that and I'velearned it.
I like to have conversationswith people and make sure what
their goal is, and if it's trulytheir will, go after it.
But if not, you know, just beingaware of not doing it for me.
SPEAKER_00 (22:54):
I love that.
Thank you for sharing that.
That's not like it's not fun fora leader to share, you know,
when they have like um made amistake.
Because I think, I thinkhonestly, one of the reasons
people are afraid of leadership,in my opinion, Tori, is because
they're afraid of doing thingslike that and like like feeling
like they hurt someone, right?
(23:17):
And um, I just always try toremind people like you're not
going to help thousands ofpeople without hurting someone.
Because we're all human, right?
We're all gonna mess up andscrew just like as a parent.
For me, I'm always like, man,I'm trying my hardest, but I've
there's probably some trauma I'mcreating for these kids and I
(23:40):
don't even know about it.
You know what I mean?
Because like obviously I havethings I'm unaware of, or I
wouldn't be doing it, right?
And I think it's the same withyour team.
Um, but John Maxwell said thisreally powerful thing one time.
He said, um, he was acting, itwas actually at our like
graduation for the certificationI did with him, and he said,
(24:00):
There's 12,000 people that areon the team.
He's got a little bit bigger ofa team than me.
Uh he said, as you look around,they're not all here, are they?
He said, and I get asked all thetime, John, how can you be okay
with charging people money to doall these things that some
people never do anything with?
(24:21):
And he said, Let me ask youthis.
Are people who work with us andlisten to our trainings and read
our books, are they worse offfor that?
Like, no.
Then I didn't do any harm.
I helped people, they just mightnot have got all of the help
that they could have got if theyleaned in, did more, blah, blah,
(24:44):
blah.
And it was kind of this justlike powerful lesson of like, as
a leader, we have to constantlybe challenging ourselves to be
better and help people more, butalso not wear so much guilt and
shame on our sleeve for when wedidn't know any better.
Like, we just did what wethought we should do with what
(25:04):
we had at the time, right?
That doesn't make anybody a badperson, but it's that fear of
like letting someone down.
And I would just throw this outthere, Tori.
How many hundreds, if notthousands, of lives have you
helped and changed because ofsome of those things you were
willing to do to just moveforward and learn something?
SPEAKER_01 (25:27):
A lot of lives.
And I believe that God continuesto give me a lot of lessons
because I'm not afraid to sharethem.
I am very vocal and open aboutthem.
But I also know the only way Ican help change lives is if I
share my own experiences andthey realize, oh, she's human.
She went through that.
She might be at a specific rankor at the top or looking up to
me and they see that I also hadthe same challenges or similar
(25:49):
challenge.
SPEAKER_00 (25:51):
And that's why I love to ask these questions.
You know, it's fun to be like,what are you doing on Instagram
today?
But I also feel like sometimeswe accidentally glorify
successful people on such a highlevel that it just creates more
limiting beliefs for people whoaren't there yet.
They're like, Well, no one I'mnot successful because I could
never do all of those things.
(26:11):
And instead, it's like, let'stake some time to talk about how
we screwed up so that theaverage person listening can be
like, oh, okay, well, I can thenmaybe I can do this.
SPEAKER_01 (26:21):
Well, and going back to what you said in the
beginning about being willing tofail, the more you're willing to
fail, the more lessons you have,the more qualified you are.
And I think so often we look atit differently.
A lot of people look at it asif, oh, they got lucky, or they
were the right timing.
When in reality, a lot of timesit's us failing a lot to know
(26:43):
and learn.
SPEAKER_00 (26:44):
Which is why we end up getting lucky.
And I like hate that word, butI'm I'm I'm I'm allowing myself
to embrace it lately, as youknow, because of one of the
books that I sent you.
Like, luck, we have like turnedinto this thing that is somehow
means you didn't work for it.
And I think it's the opposite.
(27:05):
I think as you were willing todo the work it actually takes.
And for all of us, every call itluck, call it blessings, call it
whatever you want.
Um, I I would even go as far assaying it's like divine
intervention.
Like I've always said that,like, um for me personally, I
believe that I have a job to dothat God called me to do.
(27:29):
And I believe that God hasordained me in some way to do
that job.
And one of the things that wesaid in the cult that I still I
still hold on to the good partsof the cult because of that
word, and um, one of the thingswe said is that the hand of God
is on our lives.
Um, and and and essentially itwas this idea that his blessing
was like following us everywherewe went.
(27:51):
And so the way I see it is likewe have our part, God has his
part, but too many people removethemselves from the equation are
just waiting for God to do itfor them.
That's the real unhealthy part.
Or instead of considering God'shand, blessings, luck, whatever
you want to call it, they justthink they have to earn it all.
(28:12):
And I see it as this beautifulexchange somewhere in the
middle, where it's like, God'salready done his part, now it's
up to me to do my part to be inposition for the blessings that
are already lined up for me, butI can't get any of them if I'm
just like sitting still doingnothing.
SPEAKER_01 (28:28):
So good.
So good.
SPEAKER_00 (28:29):
So yeah, I know, I know.
I joke a lot about being thecult.
I'm kind of a spiritual personsometimes, it just doesn't
always come out.
Um, next question What's yourmost proud moment as a leader?
SPEAKER_01 (28:44):
So it's kind of funny because my proud moment is
the exact opposite of thatbottom moment.
So I remember hitting the top.
So remember, my last was the uhhitting the 3% in our company,
and I fell icky on the floor.
It was all about me.
When I hit the top 1% in ourcompany, it's called Team Elite,
(29:06):
it was a moment of realizing,yes, the celebration, but
realizing the growth because Iknew what once was and how
different this felt.
And it truly felt like years ofwork on myself all coming
together.
So even though it was hard workand the phone calls and working
(29:28):
with the team, it didn't feelabout me at all.
I remember that day.
I even remember what I waswearing that day, which I have
no idea why I had blue jean bibson, but I had blue jean bibs on
and I had this red bandana andmy daughter had a matching
outfit.
But that's how much it meant tome.
Like I can remember theemotions, like I'm attached to
it.
I can remember what I waswearing.
(29:48):
I remember the people that cameover to celebrate with me.
I remember the phone calls ofthe specific team members that
called me uh hours before I hit.
I had team members calling me,asking me, I know.
You're close.
Where are you?
What can I do?
Is there anything I can do tohelp?
Can my team help in any way?
And it felt like a community ofpeople cheering me on, but it
(30:11):
wasn't, it didn't feel like me.
It truly felt like us.
And it was celebrating ourorganization being a top 1% and
not about me.
And I believe that experience ofthat proudest moment came from
going back to our lessons, beingat a low and realizing, okay,
I've just created somethingcompletely different.
(30:31):
And this is truly what I want.
So that would be my proudestmoment.
And it felt like it was gonna,you know, once that 3% happened,
it was a two-year back and forthall over the place.
And some of my hardest times.
And I remember thinking, I can'twait to get to Team Elite.
I can't wait for thedestination.
And people would always say, Oh,well, just wait.
(30:52):
There's no destination.
There's always another goal,which is very true.
And when I look back, it wasthat middle ground there, the in
between where I really didenjoy.
I didn't think I was enjoying itat the time, but I did.
I was growing, challengingmyself, finding out the new
things.
And so I'm proud of pushingmyself to do that and then
(31:13):
really changing the outcome ofhitting Team Elite and it be a
team thing.
SPEAKER_00 (31:17):
I love that.
I love that.
That's beautiful.
That's that's a beautiful thing.
What's up, friends?
My name is Josh.
I'm your push coach, and I havea fun, such a fun episode for
you today.
Um, I decided to do this funlittle co-interview um with one
of my favorite clients, ToriArmstrong.
So half of our we're literallyinterviewing each other.
So I'm gonna ask her somequestions.
She's gonna ask me somequestions, and what we're doing
(00:20):
is we're putting half of theepisode here on my show, your
pushcoach.
Half of the episode is gonna goon her podcast, which is called
Totally Tori, where wellnessmeets confidence with Tori
Armstrong.
So if you want to hear the restof this, you're gonna have to go
over to Tori's podcast.
I'll make sure and link that upfor you in the show notes.
(00:41):
Let's dive in.
Okay, so I'm gonna I'm gonna askfirst, and we're just basically
gonna ask each other the samequestions.
And then again, half of it on myshow, half of it on her show.
Um, Tori, I want to ask younumber one, what's the biggest
lesson you had to learn likeearly on in your entrepreneurial
journey?
SPEAKER_01 (01:00):
Oh, this is a great one.
Uh for me, it is letting go ofwhat other people think, their
thoughts, their opinions, uh,really following my own heart
and my own energy and what Ibelieved in, because I felt
waiting, if you wait on otherapproval, everybody's approval,
what's gonna happen is it'sgonna stop you from moving
(01:22):
forward.
And for me, I found everybodyhad an opinion.
They thought I was crazy.
Did she lose her mind?
Uh, what is she doing?
And some of it had goodintention.
I believe people have sometimescan have a hard time with
change.
And so they felt like maybe theywere protecting me, or they
really thought I lost my mind.
(01:43):
But I knew what I was doing andI believed in it.
So I had to truly let go whatother people thought I should be
doing.
SPEAKER_00 (01:50):
Yeah.
And as you've kind of likelearned in my certification, the
brain is just trying to keep ussafe.
So when other people are likecriticizing what you're doing,
most of the time it is theirsurvival instinct kicking in
that's like afraid for you.
It's it's it's it's less of likea we actually think Tori is a
(02:10):
crazy person, and more of awe're afraid that she's going
down a path that's not good forher.
So we feel the need to try topull her back.
SPEAKER_01 (02:20):
Yes, for sure.
I could totally feel that andsee that now.
I believe before I did yourcertification, I felt them
thinking I was crazy and thejudgment uh felt shameful.
But after going that, I do trulysee that and see it was a
protection mode.
Yeah.
But I really did have to let goand get thicker skin and be okay
(02:41):
and run after what I trulywanted to.
SPEAKER_00 (02:43):
Who were some of the people that you were like
worried about the most?
SPEAKER_01 (02:48):
My closest people, my co-workers, my family, my
friends.
I remember my dad saying, Youwent to college and you did all
of this, and now you're justgonna switch midlife?
What?
So family, and now I see it wasjust a protective mode.
SPEAKER_00 (03:05):
Yeah, yeah.
I love that.
I mean, that's tough, right?
Because like social media, youknow, someone told me yesterday
they were like, I really likeposting on Instagram because
none of my friends and familyare over there.
And and there's nothing wrongwith Instagram.
I got nothing, no problem.
But based on the rest of theconversation we had had, nothing
(03:26):
was happening for her onInstagram.
Like nothing.
And I was just like, Do youthink maybe, just maybe, because
you have so many friends andthings on Facebook that maybe
you'd get like faster traction?
And she was like, I know Iwould, but I'm just like so
afraid of what people are gonnastart saying and thinking.
(03:46):
And I was just like, Okay, butif you're trying to build a
business, like what's moreimportant?
What what people, you know,Facebook friends are thinking
and saying about you, or whatyou want to create for your
family.
And that's a tricky one becauseeverything in life is choosing
what's most important to you.
(04:07):
So, like for me personally, um,being an Enneagram three, I
really care a lot what peoplethink of me.
Like, I just really do, right?
But I had to realize what theythink about me.
Like everyone's thinkingsomething about me.
But that includes like my kids.
And for me, I was like, do Iwant my kids thinking about dad
(04:28):
as the person who won't chasehis dreams or the person who is
like like that opinion is waymore important than Sally on
Facebook, even though I careabout Sally's.
Like, I'm not gonna be one ofthose people who're like, just
don't care.
Like, no, I actually really docare.
I don't like that Sally thinksI'm some weirdo, but I can live
with that if that means my kidslook up to me and see an
(04:52):
example.
I mean, let's be real, my kidsthink I'm an idiot.
They they call me a dork, allthat, but I'm still setting an
example for what they will beable to step into.
SPEAKER_01 (05:01):
Yeah, it's really powerful because I don't believe
you really look at that in thebeginning when you're starting a
journey.
And then once you start goingand you see that and you see how
it starts to uh form yourchildren, how they view you.
Yeah.
So how about you?
Tell me, is uh what's yourbiggest lesson that you've
learned?
SPEAKER_00 (05:19):
So for me, the biggest lesson I had to learn
early on was the power offailure.
Um, I, as most of you on my showknow, grew up in like a
borderline cult.
So everything in life was rightor wrong, good or bad.
It was, you know, like God'swill, or it was evil.
(05:40):
Like it was there was no middleground at all.
It was either exactly what Godplanned and ordained for your
life, or it was total, completeevil, which is such a scary way
to like I think back of myfive-year-old self, and I'm
like, damn, like poor littlefive-year-old, scared to death
of anything in life, you know.
(06:01):
But the real like that's what itwas.
I grew up in such a world offear that I was literally scared
to death of doing the wrongthing with my life.
And when you're scared to deathof doing the wrong thing, you
usually don't do anything.
And so through my 20s, Iactually started and quit like
six different businesses.
(06:21):
Um, I would start it, I wouldget excited, it would get
momentum, and then somethinglike that that fear in me would
kick in and be like, what ifthis isn't the right thing?
Because remember, if it's notthe right thing, it's like evil.
Like you could be evil right nowfor trying to detail cars on the
weekends, like so ridiculous.
And then John Maxwell taught methis powerful lesson that said,
(06:45):
the only way to learn is tofail.
So if there's anything you wantto learn in life or improve in
life, it's gonna come throughgetting something wrong.
And it just completely changedmy entire perspective and
reality about right and wrong.
And it went from, okay, thething that I'm about to do is
(07:06):
going to either win, which meansit was right, or it's going to
fail, which means it was evil.
And instead, I found thisbeautiful place where it was
like, um, if it doesn't work, Ijust got to learn from it so
that I can get smarter.
And so I actually made thiscrazy goal.
My once I learned that my firstyear in business, my only goal
(07:27):
was to fail as many times as Icould so that I could learn the
lessons I needed.
And that's why in year two mybusiness just blew up.
Year one, I didn't make I didn'tI made two sales in a whole
year.
But because I was finallyallowing myself and almost
forcing myself to just tryanything and everything that
(07:48):
could lead to um some knowledgeor some type of experience, I
went into year two with whatfelt like like to this day, I
think if you could go back andsee me coaching and building my
business in year two, you wouldhave thought that I was someone
who had been doing it for 10years.
Because that one year of failinggained me the life experience
(08:10):
that would normally take 10years because people are so
afraid of failing.
SPEAKER_01 (08:14):
Oh wow.
Okay, so I'm curious then, isthis where your and I know I've
been working so closely withyou, and you have one of my
biggest things you've taught meis get rid of the or Tori, get
it out of your vocabulary andfocus on the and.
Um, is this where your andtheory came from?
SPEAKER_00 (08:31):
It's where it started.
Yeah.
I think it's I think it's whereit started, was just uh and life
coaching in general, Tori, isreally, really big on um
everything is neutral until ourbrain gets a hold of it.
So um life coaching in generalis about processing, you know,
instead of from this emotional,irrational place, from this like
(08:52):
logical place.
You know what I mean?
And so yeah, I I think that alot of the things that you'll
like the terminology you'lllearn from me, especially in the
certification, is kind ofcustomized to like how I took
what I've learned and processedit through my childhood trauma,
right?
Like, like the head and theheart is something we talk about
(09:13):
in the certification.
The way I grew up, we would havecalled that evil and good.
But notice how like triggeringthat is to think that something
is evil versus no, that's justmy head.
Like it's not evil, that's justmy animal instinct.
That doesn't make it good or bador right.
So it's about neutralizingthings to not be so emotionally
charged, and and that's what theword and does, right?
(09:36):
If you're like, well, I canbuild a business or I can be a
good mom.
What if we just allowedourselves to build a business
and be a good mom?
Like, what would that look like?
And so I think I think it's acombination of all the the
childhood trauma processingmyself, and then of course,
coaching others where I'mhearing these extremes.
(09:59):
Like, like I I realized it'sit's not that the religion I
grew up in was extreme, it'sthat people are extreme.
Like all of us are to it's justthat we chose that area of our
lives to be extreme, buteverybody's extreme somewhere,
right?
Like everyone at some in somearea of their life is trying to
(10:21):
use or as some type of an escapebecause they're not willing to
just embrace both things atonce.
SPEAKER_01 (10:29):
I know for me it's made a huge difference in my
business because I noticed theand has stopped me from
overthinking.
I felt like I always had tochoose this option or this
option.
If I do this, and then I wouldpause and not move and start
overthinking.
So the and I've uh adopted thatsame saying, and everything is
(10:50):
and and let's focus on the and.
So thank you for that.
SPEAKER_00 (10:54):
You're welcome.
It's it's it's one of myfavorites.
You know, the brain's tricky.
The brain really is trickingthat overthink thinking thing
you were talking about.
It that is kind of the brain'sgoal.
Because if it can trick you intooverthinking, which is a form
and aversion of self-sabotage,you won't leave the cave to look
(11:15):
for food.
And if you don't leave the caveto look for food, you'll be
safe.
You might starve to death, butyou'll be safe.
And and that's what's so trickyabout the human brain, is it is
trying to keep us safe, but welive in a modern day era where
there's not a saber-toothedtiger outside of the cave.
It's just Alabama Fitness onInstagram that might ghost us or
(11:38):
or block us.
Like it's not a saber-toothedtiger, but it feels like it is
because that's what our brainturns it into.
SPEAKER_01 (11:45):
So interesting.
Love that.
Um, so let's move on to the nextquestion.
Um, what is the sorry, should Ilet you do this?
No, go ahead.
I know she I'm like, I don'teven have the question out.
Hang on.
Okay.
Okay, so let's move on to thenext question.
Um, what is one of the biggestmistakes you've made as a uh
(12:07):
coach or leader in yourbusiness?
SPEAKER_00 (12:10):
So I think personally the biggest mistake
I've ever made, and I made lots,okay?
Like I already told you, I madeit a goal to fail as often as
possible.
So, you know, I think that it'simportant to remember that it's
not good or bad, right or wrong,but it's something we can learn
from.
And I think the biggest one thatcomes to always comes to front
(12:31):
of mind, Tori, is um 2020.
We had our first million-dollaryear, and we followed that up in
2021 with another million-dollaryear, but launching our life
coach certification.
And our life coach certificationbecame this like really, really
awesome, you know, high-ticketoffer at that point.
I had been I don't want to saymostly a low-ticket coach
(12:54):
because I had some higher ticketprograms, but they weren't like
my signature programs, if thatmakes sense.
They were just like some upsellson the back end.
This is the first time we werekind of rebranding a signature
program that was high ticket,and it was selling like crazy.
I mean, we sold five spots withour first email that just said,
hey, if you've been listening tome long enough, you know this is
(13:15):
what I've been working on, youknew this was coming eventually.
If you've worked with me enoughto trust that what I'm about to
do is magical because you'vedone enough other things with
me, and you're you want to get$3,000 off.
I'm gonna let the first fivepeople buy$3,000 off with no
agenda, with no itinerary, likewith nothing.
(13:38):
All you know is certification.
And we made five sales at fivegrand within like four hours.
So it was like we just I waslike, holy shit, we just made
$25,000 in like for with oneemail.
It wasn't even like a launchwith a web.
I mean, just a like I was like,I think we're on to something,
and so we kept building on that,and it was working so well that
(14:03):
I made this really dumb mistake,Tori, and you're gonna laugh
because we were just talkingabout the word and not or.
I pulled an or.
And I was like, okay.
I started like looking atnumbers and looking at math and
time and energy and all thesethings, and I was like, I'm
spending let's just pretend Iwork 40 hours a week, okay?
(14:25):
I don't actually know what Iwork, I don't think it's 40, but
let's pretend, okay?
I was spending like 30 hours aweek marketing and teaching and
training for my low-ticketstuff, and then only like 10
hours a week having to marketand train for this high-ticket
stuff.
So in my brain, I was like, thishigh-ticket stuff is so much
(14:48):
more profitable for the time andenergy that I'm putting in.
What if I got rid of thelow-ticket stuff and spent my
whole week doing this?
And it sounds smart.
Sounds like it could be.
Here's where I really missed themark, Tory.
We tore down our low-ticketstuff, which by the way, our
low-ticket stuff was making like$40,000 a month on autopilot.
(15:10):
I mean, I say autopilot.
There was some work that had tobe done, but it was like it had
been performing like that month.
It's very predictable, I guess,is what I should say.
Okay.
We burned those programs down.
And then six months down theroad, I was like, uh, how come
our high-ticket stuff isn'tselling anymore?
(15:31):
Like, what happened?
Like, all of a sudden it's real,like I'm spending 40 hours a
week trying to sell this, and Igot barely any leads for it.
I got barely any excitement.
It feels like I am like back inlike grind mode trying to force
things to work.
And then I finally realized,Josh, the certification doesn't
sell like candy because thecertification is so like in
(15:56):
demand per se.
It's because you'd created somuch momentum with your
low-ticket stuff that you hadthis super high level of trust
with people that they wanted totake next steps with you.
And so I just realized first ofall, I tell my clients all the
time, never shut down, ever shutdown something that's
(16:18):
profitable.
If you need to automate it, ifyou need to systematize it, if
you need to hire someone to runit for you, cool.
But if money is showing up,there's no reason to flush that
down the toilet.
So I forgot a lesson that I toldprobably a hundred other people.
But then I think the second one,Tori, is is maybe a little bit
of ego there.
(16:38):
To where it's like, well, I'mlike the high-ticket guy now.
I don't need to do, I don't needto do these other things.
And I think I see that a lot asyou've heard me talk about with
the four M's.
Sometimes as leaders, we get tothe top of a mountain and we
think that the gritty work thatgot us there is no longer
needed.
And I think it's just thispowerful lesson to remember,
(17:00):
like the gritty work that likepeople always say what got you
here won't get you there.
And I do agree with that.
But I also think that becauseour brains like to pull the or
instead of the and, we forgetwhat got you here won't get you
there, but it will protect themomentum that got you here so
that the next lesson will getyou there.
(17:23):
So it's not about releasing whatwe did to get here to learn a
new thing.
It's about adding on to thething that we did to get here.
So, like if I would have, youknow, we we had a couple years
of struggle where we had to kindof rebuild the low-ticket stuff
and try to re-feed all of thatmomentum and stuff that we had
burned down.
(17:43):
And the reality is if we wouldhave just stayed on the same
course, there is no reason inthe world we wouldn't have
scaled to two million, thenthree million, then four
million, because we had awell-oiled machine, we just kind
of took out the engine.
Does that make sense?
SPEAKER_01 (17:58):
Yeah, that's really interesting.
And to look at it from the angleof what got you there.
And it's and I love that youbrought up ego because that
that's a big one.
SPEAKER_00 (18:09):
I know, I hate my ego.
It's annoying, but it's there.
Can't get rid of it.
It's gotta work with it.
So, what is one of the biggestmistakes that you have made?
SPEAKER_01 (18:20):
Uh, so like I said, I love that you brought up ego
because ego would definitely bemine.
I've learned a lot about the egoover the last few years, and I
feel like that word just soundsnegative anyways.
So I'm I don't have an ego.
I'm a good person.
I don't have that ego.
Uh, but when I look back at myjourney, I have two that really
(18:42):
stand out to me.
And I believe ego was thedriving force there.
And so I'm really grateful forthe awareness of it now.
And I'm always working andimproving on it.
Uh, but I think awareness is thekey with that.
But uh one specifically um wouldbe, you know, moving quickly
(19:02):
through the business and seeingwhat I'm doing is working.
And okay, I'm the leader, peopleare following my lead.
They should do it like me.
They should choose my path.
They should do, okay, I'mtelling them, why aren't they
listening?
Why aren't they doing exactlywhat I said to do?
Because if they do this, they'llhave success.
And something uh that you havetaught me over the last six
(19:25):
months has been if I can do it,you can do it.
I'm guilty.
I know, I know you're cringingright now.
I am so guilty of being thatperson to say that and not only
say it, but truly to my core,believe it.
Like I thought, if I did it onthis path, you can do the exact
same path.
And I've learned that we're notall like that.
(19:47):
And so along the journey, Ibelieve, you know, there gets to
a point too where where the egowould come in, like, well, I did
it.
Almost like I felt like anobligation, but I also felt
important.
Like, yeah, okay, I just showedyou.
Like, why are you not?
And so I would take it in as Idon't know.
I I would take it in a differentway of like maybe they don't
(20:09):
trust me, or maybe um they theyjust don't know.
I know.
So I know that sounds bad.
So that's that's a lot of ego.
So yeah.
Go ahead.
SPEAKER_00 (20:20):
No, no, you're good.
SPEAKER_01 (20:21):
You're um so I'm really just grateful for the
experience of going through thatbecause I've actually just
learned that for leaders togrow, they need space.
They don't have to do it exactlylike me.
And if I allow that space, I'mgoing to learn from them too,
because there's always people tolearn from, and it doesn't have
to be one exact path.
So that would be number onemistake.
(20:42):
And then right up there, this isprobably the worst one I do have
to share this, is pushing peopleto their goals when it's really
not their goals.
And I do think ego comes intothis too because I'm doing it
for me.
It was all about me.
And so I'm I am verygoal-oriented.
I love goals, I love to helppeople hit goals.
(21:03):
And it's truly one of mypassions.
If somebody comes to me and islike, hey, I want this, how do I
do this?
How can I help?
And I love to help show them theway or help guide them.
SPEAKER_00 (21:12):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (21:13):
But what I found early on, and I have one goal
specifically, it was uh headingto the top of the company.
Um, that it was the top 3% atthe time.
And it happened really early onin my business, like four months
into my business.
And it was just like, this isunbelievable.
She's coming in and she's a rockstar.
Again, all about me.
I really wasn't thinking aboutthe team.
And it was like, yes, I'm gonnabreak records.
(21:34):
I'm gonna hit this in fourmonths.
unknown (21:36):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (21:37):
And I remember I, for that goal, I specifically
needed people to hit certaintitles, numbers, things to be
able to hit that.
And there's one girl who nolonger does the business with
me, and I don't blame her.
She's probably why, but I wasthe person who was, come on, you
have till midnight tonight.
You gotta get this in.
And it really was not even hergoal.
(21:57):
Like she could care less.
She ended up hitting because Ithink she felt the pressure from
me.
Yeah.
What happened as a result ofthat?
What should have been one of themost exciting points in my
business actually ended up beingone of the most disappointing.
And I remember my husband comingin the room to celebrate because
he realized that we just hit andhe found me laying on the floor
(22:19):
crying.
I was crying because I was sodisappointed in my own behavior
of pushing somebody to hit sothat I could hit.
And in that moment, I realizedit.
I believe I knew it the wholetime, but when the emotions
kicked in and I I'd love tocelebrate, and that wasn't a
celebration, that was more orless I did that for me.
(22:40):
So I would say that's a hugemistake.
Uh, I taken that and I'velearned it.
I like to have conversationswith people and make sure what
their goal is, and if it's trulytheir will, go after it.
But if not, you know, just beingaware of not doing it for me.
SPEAKER_00 (22:54):
I love that.
Thank you for sharing that.
That's not like it's not fun fora leader to share, you know,
when they have like um made amistake.
Because I think, I thinkhonestly, one of the reasons
people are afraid of leadership,in my opinion, Tori, is because
they're afraid of doing thingslike that and like like feeling
like they hurt someone, right?
(23:17):
And um, I just always try toremind people like you're not
going to help thousands ofpeople without hurting someone.
Because we're all human, right?
We're all gonna mess up andscrew just like as a parent.
For me, I'm always like, man,I'm trying my hardest, but I've
there's probably some trauma I'mcreating for these kids and I
(23:40):
don't even know about it.
You know what I mean?
Because like obviously I havethings I'm unaware of, or I
wouldn't be doing it, right?
And I think it's the same withyour team.
Um, but John Maxwell said thisreally powerful thing one time.
He said, um, he was acting, itwas actually at our like
graduation for the certificationI did with him, and he said,
(24:00):
There's 12,000 people that areon the team.
He's got a little bit bigger ofa team than me.
Uh he said, as you look around,they're not all here, are they?
He said, and I get asked all thetime, John, how can you be okay
with charging people money to doall these things that some
people never do anything with?
(24:21):
And he said, Let me ask youthis.
Are people who work with us andlisten to our trainings and read
our books, are they worse offfor that?
Like, no.
Then I didn't do any harm.
I helped people, they just mightnot have got all of the help
that they could have got if theyleaned in, did more, blah, blah,
(24:44):
blah.
And it was kind of this justlike powerful lesson of like, as
a leader, we have to constantlybe challenging ourselves to be
better and help people more, butalso not wear so much guilt and
shame on our sleeve for when wedidn't know any better.
Like, we just did what wethought we should do with what
(25:04):
we had at the time, right?
That doesn't make anybody a badperson, but it's that fear of
like letting someone down.
And I would just throw this outthere, Tori.
How many hundreds, if notthousands, of lives have you
helped and changed because ofsome of those things you were
willing to do to just moveforward and learn something?
SPEAKER_01 (25:27):
A lot of lives.
And I believe that God continuesto give me a lot of lessons
because I'm not afraid to sharethem.
I am very vocal and open aboutthem.
But I also know the only way Ican help change lives is if I
share my own experiences andthey realize, oh, she's human.
She went through that.
She might be at a specific rankor at the top or looking up to
me and they see that I also hadthe same challenges or similar
(25:49):
challenge.
SPEAKER_00 (25:51):
And that's why I love to ask these questions.
You know, it's fun to be like,what are you doing on Instagram
today?
But I also feel like sometimeswe accidentally glorify
successful people on such a highlevel that it just creates more
limiting beliefs for people whoaren't there yet.
They're like, Well, no one I'mnot successful because I could
never do all of those things.
(26:11):
And instead, it's like, let'stake some time to talk about how
we screwed up so that theaverage person listening can be
like, oh, okay, well, I can thenmaybe I can do this.
SPEAKER_01 (26:21):
Well, and going back to what you said in the
beginning about being willing tofail, the more you're willing to
fail, the more lessons you have,the more qualified you are.
And I think so often we look atit differently.
A lot of people look at it asif, oh, they got lucky, or they
were the right timing.
When in reality, a lot of timesit's us failing a lot to know
(26:43):
and learn.
SPEAKER_00 (26:44):
Which is why we end up getting lucky.
And I like hate that word, butI'm I'm I'm I'm allowing myself
to embrace it lately, as youknow, because of one of the
books that I sent you.
Like, luck, we have like turnedinto this thing that is somehow
means you didn't work for it.
And I think it's the opposite.
(27:05):
I think as you were willing todo the work it actually takes.
And for all of us, every call itluck, call it blessings, call it
whatever you want.
Um, I I would even go as far assaying it's like divine
intervention.
Like I've always said that,like, um for me personally, I
believe that I have a job to dothat God called me to do.
(27:29):
And I believe that God hasordained me in some way to do
that job.
And one of the things that wesaid in the cult that I still I
still hold on to the good partsof the cult because of that
word, and um, one of the thingswe said is that the hand of God
is on our lives.
Um, and and and essentially itwas this idea that his blessing
was like following us everywherewe went.
(27:51):
And so the way I see it is likewe have our part, God has his
part, but too many people removethemselves from the equation are
just waiting for God to do itfor them.
That's the real unhealthy part.
Or instead of considering God'shand, blessings, luck, whatever
you want to call it, they justthink they have to earn it all.
(28:12):
And I see it as this beautifulexchange somewhere in the
middle, where it's like, God'salready done his part, now it's
up to me to do my part to be inposition for the blessings that
are already lined up for me, butI can't get any of them if I'm
just like sitting still doingnothing.
SPEAKER_01 (28:28):
So good.
So good.
SPEAKER_00 (28:29):
So yeah, I know, I know.
I joke a lot about being thecult.
I'm kind of a spiritual personsometimes, it just doesn't
always come out.
Um, next question What's yourmost proud moment as a leader?
SPEAKER_01 (28:44):
So it's kind of funny because my proud moment is
the exact opposite of thatbottom moment.
So I remember hitting the top.
So remember, my last was the uhhitting the 3% in our company,
and I fell icky on the floor.
It was all about me.
When I hit the top 1% in ourcompany, it's called Team Elite,
(29:06):
it was a moment of realizing,yes, the celebration, but
realizing the growth because Iknew what once was and how
different this felt.
And it truly felt like years ofwork on myself all coming
together.
So even though it was hard workand the phone calls and working
(29:28):
with the team, it didn't feelabout me at all.
I remember that day.
I even remember what I waswearing that day, which I have
no idea why I had blue jean bibson, but I had blue jean bibs on
and I had this red bandana andmy daughter had a matching
outfit.
But that's how much it meant tome.
Like I can remember theemotions, like I'm attached to
it.
I can remember what I waswearing.
(29:48):
I remember the people that cameover to celebrate with me.
I remember the phone calls ofthe specific team members that
called me uh hours before I hit.
I had team members calling me,asking me, I know.
You're close.
Where are you?
What can I do?
Is there anything I can do tohelp?
Can my team help in any way?
And it felt like a community ofpeople cheering me on, but it
(30:11):
wasn't, it didn't feel like me.
It truly felt like us.
And it was celebrating ourorganization being a top 1% and
not about me.
And I believe that experience ofthat proudest moment came from
going back to our lessons, beingat a low and realizing, okay,
I've just created somethingcompletely different.
(30:31):
And this is truly what I want.
So that would be my proudestmoment.
And it felt like it was gonna,you know, once that 3% happened,
it was a two-year back and forthall over the place.
And some of my hardest times.
And I remember thinking, I can'twait to get to Team Elite.
I can't wait for thedestination.
And people would always say, Oh,well, just wait.
(30:52):
There's no destination.
There's always another goal,which is very true.
And when I look back, it wasthat middle ground there, the in
between where I really didenjoy.
I didn't think I was enjoying itat the time, but I did.
I was growing, challengingmyself, finding out the new
things.
And so I'm proud of pushingmyself to do that and then
(31:13):
really changing the outcome ofhitting Team Elite and it be a
team thing.
SPEAKER_00 (31:17):
I love that.
I love that.
That's beautiful.
That's that's a beautiful thing.
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