February 4, 2025 • 41 mins
Paul Dehner Jr. of The Athletic and The Growler Podcast joined us to talk about what Joe Burrow wants, and what might happen if Joe Burrow doesn't get what wants.
Plus...Will they trade for Cooper Kupp? What about Myles Garrett? What do we make of some of the stuff Duke Tobin has said recently?
And what do we make of Sunday's NFL title tilt?
Podcasts of The Mo Egger Radio Show are a service of Longnecks Sports Grill.
Listen to the show live weekday afternoons 3:00 - 6:00 on ESPN1530.
Listen Live: ESPN1530.com/listen
Get more: https://linktr.ee/MoEgger
Follow on X: @MoEgger
Instagram too: @MoEgger
Plus...Will they trade for Cooper Kupp? What about Myles Garrett? What do we make of some of the stuff Duke Tobin has said recently?
And what do we make of Sunday's NFL title tilt?
Podcasts of The Mo Egger Radio Show are a service of Longnecks Sports Grill.
Listen to the show live weekday afternoons 3:00 - 6:00 on ESPN1530.
Listen Live: ESPN1530.com/listen
Get more: https://linktr.ee/MoEgger
Follow on X: @MoEgger
Instagram too: @MoEgger
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Win a thousand dollars. Enter this nationwide keyword on our website, bills.
Speaker 2 (00:04):
That's bills.
Speaker 3 (00:06):
Enter it now you found Cincinnati's ESPN fifteen thirty.
Speaker 2 (00:11):
Well, sure you have. What's up? Get afternoon on my legger.
This is ESPN fifteen thirty. Thank you for listening. We uh,
we got a short show today done early. UK basketball
takes over at five thirty. Wildcats battling old mess tonight.
Both teams trying to bounce back. Both teams have have
struggled recently. We'll put it to you that way. So
(00:34):
two and a half hours to get in, three hours
worth of stuff. Solomon Wilcott's We're gonna do a Radio
Row interview with Solomon Willcotts at four oh five. And
by Radio Row interview, you know what that means. It
means Sally's gonna come on for eight minutes. It was
gonna come on for ten minutes. For eight minutes, we're
gonna talk about the Bengals, and we're gonna talk about
the time he saved the broadcast the last time the
Super Bowl was in New Orleans. And then we have
(00:56):
to spend two minutes talking about prosthetic legs or something
I'm not really sure, but anyway, that is coming up tough.
I just I like to let the audience know in advance,
here's what's gonna happen. We're gonna take this weird pivot
from the NFL and the Bengals and the upcoming off
season or the off season and the super Bowl itself,
and then we're going to talk about something that is
(01:17):
of no major interest to our audience. So you have
that coming up in just about an hour. I have
a question for UC fan another question for UC fans
based on the a poll question we had yesterday. I
have a question for Joe Burrow. And we have more
more Reds off season speculation to a touch on as well.
(01:39):
Full Show Rundown is available on x thanks to Emery
Federal Credit Union your credit union with Hart since nineteen
thirty nine. Go to EMORYFCU dot org. But first and
foremost most importantly, Paul Danner Junior's here.
Speaker 1 (01:51):
What's up? How we doing?
Speaker 4 (01:53):
I'm doing great, It's just good. I'm just lucky to
watch a master in his craft right now. Yeah, you're
doing five things. Once you know, you're like, you're getting
the camera going, You're getting the back going, you've got
like you're working on the paper. I mean, I'm just impressed,
and you're talking through it the whole time. And if
I I it was radio at like most people listening
home wouldn't even know how multi talented you are.
Speaker 2 (02:15):
Right now, I am a disorganized mess. I think is the.
Speaker 1 (02:22):
Pulling it off.
Speaker 2 (02:23):
I am a complete and total disorganized mess. What's good
to have you here? What's going on?
Speaker 1 (02:28):
Not much?
Speaker 4 (02:28):
You know, just you know, it's like, normally this is
supposed to be the slow down time, and it just
feels so not slow. It's just everything is is very
I the word that I keep coming back to, and
(02:49):
I say, well, it's not that, and then I'm like,
well maybe it is.
Speaker 1 (02:52):
Everything feels very quietly volatile.
Speaker 4 (02:55):
Yeah, you know, it just feels like, man, everything's simmering
below the surface, waiting for these looming deadlines, and it's
so much big, important stuff happening, and.
Speaker 2 (03:06):
It's just you've got comments.
Speaker 4 (03:09):
You're parsing through comments from the Pro Bowl, this big,
happy fun time with these silly games, and guys are
over here jumping into foam pits, and meanwhile, Joe burrows
like they better pay all my guys. Why can't we
pay all my guys. We're gonna be able to do that,
and we're doubling down on that again. There's just a
(03:30):
lot of the fun, happy time stuff that you maybe
would think is happening right now.
Speaker 2 (03:35):
I have fatigue.
Speaker 1 (03:36):
Yeah, I'll admit no doubt. I'm ready. It's just figured out.
Speaker 2 (03:39):
And I, like any Bengals fan, I love Joe Burrow,
I have Joe Burrow makes headlines. Fatigue.
Speaker 1 (03:46):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (03:47):
Like I said this on our show yesterday, It's like
when my daughter and I go to King's Island. She
wants the blue ice cream. She tells me on the
drive up, I want blue ice cream. She tells me
on the walk in, I want blue ice cream. She
tells me as we're going in, I want blue ice cream.
She tells me. After the first couple of rides, I
want Like, I get it. We're going to get blue
ice cream. I heard you the first nineteen times, and
(04:08):
it's maybe not the most fair comparison, but Joe, you
want tea here? Yeah, I get it. So I don't
know where this goes next, but it's it's gonna be
at least a little while until we get some answers.
Speaker 4 (04:20):
Yeah, I you know, I don't. I don't mind it.
It's not I mean the fact that it gets blown
up every time. He's mostly just answering questions yes, And
I don't feel like he's going out of his way.
Speaker 1 (04:36):
I mean he could. He could soft handed this.
Speaker 2 (04:39):
Someone someone asked him a question. It's less with Joe,
and it's more like we take the same thing that
he says and we create new content out of it.
And I'm guilty of it too. I mean, I'm as
guilty of it as anybody.
Speaker 1 (04:49):
That's that's what I'm saying.
Speaker 2 (04:50):
I don't think this is a a Joe thing, and
I don't think this is a Bengals thing. I think
this is a NFL machine thing.
Speaker 4 (05:00):
But it's necessary, it is important, it is notable, like
and that's why that time December ninth and Dallas was
a huge deal because like, oh, he's going down this path.
Now we know he's going down. We know the path,
the lines. You can't draw them any clearer than they've
been drawn. This is what it is, like.
Speaker 2 (05:18):
We know what he wants, we know that there will
be a decision of whether they're going to give him.
Speaker 4 (05:22):
What he wants or not. It's all out in the
public domain, so we'll see what happens. But the need
to be like Joe said it again, he did another thing.
It's like, I honestly have a hard time keeping up
with how many times this has happened at the exact point,
because it just kind of keeps happening or patily for
those that have been paying attention, and maybe to some
(05:42):
it's new, but you know, it is starting, it's getting
closer to coming to a head at least, and so
we have that going for us.
Speaker 2 (05:49):
So I'm not even sure where to start because there
are so many things out there. Let me begin with that.
So Joe keeps saying the same thing, and we keep
making a big deal out of it. Let's say that
Joe doesn't get what he wants, then.
Speaker 4 (06:06):
What I mean, that's the question that has no answer,
And that's the one that I would like to ask
Joe Burrow. And we haven't really had a chance to
since the season ended, and probably should have maybe at
that point whenever, whenever we did last talk to him.
But you know, and that is what it. You know,
this is this could be perceived as threats. Now you're
(06:27):
you're saying this is a need Why can't we get
this done? Obviously, Duke says, he's talked to you. So
if that's if all those facts are true, and you're
saying what you're saying now, so what happens if they
go a different direction, because it feels very much like
you're saying, well, I won't agree with this, and you
now I said this on who they lied on Friday.
(06:49):
He is basically family now in the power that they
have given to him.
Speaker 1 (06:56):
Do you know how uneasy that makes them? Like?
Speaker 4 (07:00):
They they have given him this power and he's kind
of out there holding it.
Speaker 1 (07:06):
He's kinda he's you know, we talk about this in
other ways.
Speaker 4 (07:09):
It's your daughter walking with the cereal across the kitchen
to go take it over.
Speaker 1 (07:13):
The milk's starting to splash?
Speaker 2 (07:15):
How much do I trust this?
Speaker 4 (07:16):
And and now you're just saying, well, what happens if
it goes good?
Speaker 1 (07:21):
I don't think we know. Yeah, I don't think we know.
Speaker 4 (07:24):
If this is like it's going to come out as well,
I get it because of X, Y and Z or
it's going to be I told them that I was
not going to stand for this, that we could do it,
and they should have done it, and now I feel
this way, and you start going down and you now
you flip the calendar on the like the Carson Palmer calendar.
Speaker 2 (07:45):
That people keeping their head right, like, where are we at?
Where were you worry about that from?
Speaker 4 (07:50):
You know, everyone's always worrying about that, And so I
just think that is what does this mean? Does this
mean you flip the calendar or does this mean you say, ah,
wish we could have gotten that done?
Speaker 1 (08:00):
Nobody really knows but Joe, right, And that's.
Speaker 2 (08:04):
That's where I am with this, Like, Okay, we understand
the cases for and against giving t Higgins what he's
looking for. We understand the difficult financial decisions they have.
We understand the caliber of players we are talking about.
You wrote about Trey Hendrickson earlier this week, and that's
that's a dynamic that you have to consider when talking
about tea. And it feels like with the public discourse,
(08:27):
we're now folding understandably so training to the conversation about tea,
which has been taking place for a couple of months.
But what I'm most fascinated by is, let's say, when's
the league year start March?
Speaker 1 (08:38):
Yeah, this is technically Wednesday. That Wednesday yeah, ten twelve.
Speaker 2 (08:42):
Right, So let's say within twenty four hours of the
new league year starting, we're in the early tampering period.
We find out t Higgins is an LA Charger or
a Green Bay Packer or god forbid, playing for an
AFC team that we don't want him to play for. Okay,
then what right? Then what from a roster? But then
what from because it's it's still gonna be months, I'm
(09:04):
guessing before Joe talks to you guys, it's gonna be
a long time before Joe has any sort of there's
no radio row that he's gonna be bouncing around at
like he's I'm guessing radio silence. And then so we're
all gonna be waiting to wonder, Okay, what's Joe's take
on this, what's the reaction and what is the possible fallout?
Speaker 4 (09:23):
Yeah, and and I think that's something that and I
would expect, knowing you know what you know of Joe,
that something that he will very carefully think about how
he wants to frame his opinion coming out of that,
and and we'll all.
Speaker 1 (09:36):
Kind of find out at the same time.
Speaker 4 (09:39):
The thing is like, that's what this has become for me,
This isn't about actually replacing t Higgins the football player
at all anyway, Right, Like, I we've kind of talked
about the pros and cons on both sides enough, like
I can see a path either way, sure, like letting
te goes using that money in other ways, putting a
solid number two draft another receiver, you know, Jamar's the man,
(10:03):
you know, Like that's that's a viable strategy that that
no one should really have a problem with on the surface.
Speaker 2 (10:09):
Yeah, I'm not I want Tea here. Yeah, I'm not
gonna burn a bunch of Bengals gear if he's not.
And I still think there's a very clear path that
the Bengals could take that puts us in a place
where in early September we're talking about them having a
chance to win the whole thing.
Speaker 4 (10:24):
Yeah, I mean, you know we talked about when you
looked at the AFC Championship game, it was kind of
a takeaway from me. I mean, this is a team
that traded Stefon Diggs and supposedly was rebuilding because they
just had a bunch of young receivers. You had Kansas
City that notably traded Tyreek Hill and didn't have her
sheet Rice and had a bunch of young guys that
had stepped up for their offense and built strong defenses
and good offensive lines, and like, these are the teams
(10:45):
you got to go beat and look how they've done
it right, there's there, you know, there's nothing wrong with
doing it that way when you have the franchise quarterback.
There's there's proven models there. So it's about the reaction
of the quarterback. Now, it's it's it's a about the
reaction of what does this really mean for how Joe feels?
You know, And that's uncomfortable to feel like you're in
(11:08):
that place because you'd like to think that he you
would feel like he would be in lockstep with everybody
else in understanding why they're taking certain paths forward and
maybe it will come out at the end that he
does come out that way. So I don't want to
put that over him right now because we could be projecting.
This is a scarred fan base. Yeah, so there's projecting
(11:28):
going on there with some of it. Well, we have
to talk about it.
Speaker 2 (11:31):
And I tried to do that a little bit last week,
and I'm I'm as I'm as unqualified to do that
as anybody, but I'm like, all right, there is looming
over all of this. What we saw Carson Palmer do.
That was an extreme reaction to what was going on
with the Beg an extreme. You might have blamed him,
(11:52):
you might have thought what he did was fine, but
it was an extreme reaction. That's the extreme is never
the most likely outcome. Right, So could I see Joe
being skeptical, hurt, pissed, curious? Could I see him being accepting?
I could see him being all those things. But the
least likely is he's so angry that suddenly he goes
(12:14):
scorched earth and decides to maneuver an exit that involves
him threatening to retire, right.
Speaker 4 (12:22):
Right, Yeah, and that's that's that's all the way to
the end. But there's or just starts starts becoming frustrated. Sure, right,
and and you know, because before it didn't feel like
it would get that way. I mean it was Kumbai yah,
they're winning, They're all these things. And oh remember when
people said that stuff about don't go there. Ah, man,
that's right, Carson's wrong. It's changed. Everything's different.
Speaker 2 (12:44):
Now.
Speaker 4 (12:44):
Look you proved it, right, Well, this is the point
where the rubber meets the road on that where where
those people right or wrong, whether that success happened early
on or not, because it's it's easy to say things
went right when you have the advance of a franchise
quarterback on a rookie contract. It's not easy to go
(13:04):
out there and do it when that guy is getting paid.
And I think that's sort of, you know, the knock
against this franchise. Can you go out there and do
it when the guys when that guy's getting paid, and
work the outside edges to make the roster work for him.
I think that there should be more faith than probably
is given to this front office that they can do that.
They probably don't get enough credit for the things that
(13:25):
they were doing around Joe Burrow to build that team in.
Speaker 1 (13:28):
The first place.
Speaker 4 (13:30):
That said, the criticism is warranted and real, and it
doesn't really matter what we think.
Speaker 1 (13:36):
It really matters what Joe thinks.
Speaker 4 (13:39):
And nobody knows, and nobody knows there's no way to know.
I don't like, I don't know if Joe really knows.
I mean, Joe has largely got what he wanted here
at almost every turn, Like he's gotten them to break
every rule that mattered to him. He's gotten them to
do things in terms of the way they build the roster,
the way they spend on free agent, that's the way
(14:00):
they do guaranteed money with their star. All of these
things that have changed around him, and he's rewarded them
with great play and so many things. But like, on
the other side of that, I mean, there's a lot,
There's a lot that's on the other side of it.
Speaker 1 (14:16):
You know what I mean?
Speaker 2 (14:17):
You do you know what I mean? Yeah, but I
totally know what you mean. And so that's what I've
been stuck on. Okay, if it's mid March and we
are reconciling ourselves with the reality that t Higgins is
playing for any one of the other thirty one teams,
we're all going to sit there and wonder. Okay, what's
next as it relates to Joe Burrow's reaction specifically, not
(14:37):
what's next for the roster. They'll go find a number
two wide receiver somewhere. Yeah, like the guy might be
as good, might not be as good, might not work,
may work. I have no idea. But what is Joe
thinking and what is going to be the public response
to what Joe is thinking? And what is the fallout?
Can it be. Will there be any threats? Will there
be this visibly frustrated guy from a dude who last
(15:00):
year was at times visibly frustrated. What is all that
gonna look like? And I think there's a tremendous fear
that that's that's not gonna that's not gonna be fun.
Speaker 4 (15:09):
And how does that land with your fan base in
the fact that more than maybe any player ever and
I mean we probably I bet if you went back
and went I'd love to go back to some of
your shows in two thousand and five, in two thousand
and six, where Carson Palmer was this untouchable.
Speaker 2 (15:23):
I wasn't on the air then, but that's all people were.
In my mind, you were ye for other people doing this, Yeah,
far better by the way.
Speaker 4 (15:31):
In my mind you were at least talking to somebody
about this. But I think that the attitude was different, right,
and I and and but then it changes. I feel like,
I mean, in Burrows case, like he's as beloved and
untouchable as any player in the history of this franchise
in the terms that fans will always side with him. Yes,
there's a big group. And granted a lot of it
was because of the whole retirement how it ended thing.
(15:53):
But before that, even there was a there was a
groundswell of people that were like, Eh, Carson, man, I
don't know what's going on with him with the interceptions
and complaining whatever. I have a hard time seeing it
going that direction with Burrow and in the unless a
ton of new stuff happened in terms of this fan
base not always looking at a situation insiding with nine
(16:15):
over the team. Yeah, and that can poison your base
a little bit if your quarterback is saying things that
you know that that send them feeling a certain direction.
Speaker 2 (16:24):
Well, it's funny because as you were saying that, I remember,
I mean I was on the air, you know, I
started doing this show in two thousand and seven, which
was the year Carson led the league in picks, and
then the next year he got hurt, missed a bunch
of time, and then the next year he was okay,
but they you know, it's Cedric Benson and a great defense,
and then the next year the bottom fell out. But
I remember when when Carson did what he did in
(16:45):
January of eleven, My response was like, okay, yeah, like
they could save a lot of money and get a
quarterback who's almost as good, Like, I mean, it just
wasn't whereas if Joe Burrow did that, right, right, let's
take the franchise, move it to Toronto, right. So it's
a little bit different because Joe just wrapped up a
(17:05):
season where he would be MVP at the Bengals maybe
one one more game.
Speaker 4 (17:08):
Sure, and it was so clearly everything else around him
that was at fault. Yeah, right, and who is irresponsible
with that other than the people that put those people
out there? So but yeah, I mean again, I guess
that's the long winded way of saying quietly volatile. It
just feels like it's just kind of this this unknown
that hovers around all of it, of how is this
(17:29):
all going to come together? And what will it mean
for the most important people in the building.
Speaker 2 (17:32):
It's kind of like the first time you get into
like a disagreement with your wife or your girlfriend, you're
not sure.
Speaker 4 (17:38):
Yeah, how's this going to go? Yeah, we've never had one,
like you're a fight like this? What's this going to be?
Speaker 2 (17:43):
Like?
Speaker 1 (17:43):
Yeahright?
Speaker 2 (17:44):
And so maybe maybe that's where we are, all right,
we are very late twenty two minutes after three o'clock.
He's Paul Danner Junior covering the Bengals four at the
Athletic dot Com. He does a podcast, The Growler Podcast,
The Charlie's Clicker, the most recent one, Charlie's Talkboard, Charlie's Charlie's.
Speaker 4 (18:01):
Chocolate Factory, Charlie writes Charlie's Chalkboard on substance. People subscribe
to its. Fore you get it to you, we just
do rewatch reaction. I know there's so many names track
of I can write them all down for you if
you want. There's too many, or I can actually be
a pro and I'm comfortable with you just calling at
the Growlary.
Speaker 1 (18:20):
It's totally for you. Don't You don't need to go individual.
Speaker 2 (18:23):
It's like I lose track between the CSI and n cis.
Speaker 1 (18:27):
Oh yeah, kind of becoming that yeah cop show. Yeah, sadly, yeah,
kind of going all right.
Speaker 2 (18:32):
Twenty three minutes after three o'clock, Paul's here till four,
We're here till six. This is ES over here to
five thirty. Actually, this is ESPN fifteen thirty Cincinnati Sports.
Speaker 3 (18:39):
Station Cincinnati's ESPN fifteen thirty.
Speaker 5 (18:44):
Traffic from the UC Health's Traffic Center Heart Disease is
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Innovative and Personalized heart care. Expect more at U seehelp
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It's an exodent on the right shoulder, a couple of cars.
(19:05):
They're waiting off on the right burm for a tow
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he's like with traffic this week.
Speaker 2 (19:17):
We're gonna be short here because we were late. Let
me hitch you with a couple of things really quick.
Are the Bengals gonna trade for Cooper Cup No? Are
the Bengals gonna trade for Miles Garrett? No, Trey Brown
is going to interview with the Jaguars. Who's that?
Speaker 1 (19:31):
Who's Trey Brown?
Speaker 4 (19:32):
Yeah, he's an executive on the in the Bengals personnel.
So he's been He's got a bunch of history, I
mean with the Patriots and with the Eagles, and then
he'd been here for a while now though it was
a big part of building the Super Bowl teams. And
he's a really integral part of their personnel department. I
mean they all are, but you know, he certainly is
is very well respected and that's why he's gotten a
(19:53):
ton of interviews lately. So we'll see. He's kind of
the one. He is the one name that when these
GM interview cycles keep happening, He's the one Bengals name
that does keep getting interviews and showing up there. So
that would be a loss for them if.
Speaker 2 (20:09):
If they if they did lose to the Jacks, no
Cooper Cup, no Miles Garrett, Yeah, and maybe no Trade Brown.
Speaker 4 (20:16):
I mean there were there were a number of there
were a number of names. Yeah, there were a number
of names on that list. So yes, yeah, maybe all right.
Speaker 2 (20:22):
Uh, Paul Danner Junior with us for another thirty minutes.
Speaker 1 (20:26):
I was quick, you said he was. I was just
trying to keep it as a good job.
Speaker 2 (20:29):
You're we're looking at me like, really, we're already gonna
break because we went likes long the last time. Yeah,
that's okay. Other stuff I can't.
Speaker 1 (20:36):
Given it out. I can we'll do with with averages.
I can do it very nice.
Speaker 2 (20:39):
It's three thirty Sports Headlines and More with Paul next
on ESPN fifteen.
Speaker 3 (20:43):
Thirty, Sincy three sixty with Tony Pike.
Speaker 1 (20:47):
I don't want to move on. We don't have to
keep going. And Boston Elmore, I think you should continue
to let me keep going there.
Speaker 3 (20:52):
Sincey three sixty tomorrow which twelve News on ESPN fifteen
thirty Cincinnati's e ESPN fifteen thirty Traffic.
Speaker 5 (21:03):
From the UC Health Traffic Center. Heart disease is the
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(21:26):
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Speaker 2 (21:36):
Of Kelsey Chevro light home of lifetime powertrain protection and
guaranteed credit approval from their family to yours for life
kelseyshev dot Com. Bengals today signed wide receiver Mitchell Tinsley
to a reserve future contract who the hell is at
I don't know.
Speaker 1 (21:53):
I saw it and I was like, I don't think
I'm even gonna tweet this.
Speaker 2 (21:56):
Well, I'll tell you who he is.
Speaker 1 (21:58):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (21:58):
He is a six foot one, two hundred five five
pound wide receiver who will be a second year player
in twenty twenty five. Originally a college free agent signee
out of Washington or of Washington in twenty twenty three,
played in two games for the Commanders in twenty three
no stats, was active DMP in fifteen games, and then
this past year he was on the Commander's practice squad.
He played collegiately at Hutchinson Community College, Western Kentucky and
(22:22):
Penn State.
Speaker 1 (22:23):
Well there you go.
Speaker 2 (22:24):
So this is the T. Higgins air apparent Right there,
there you go? Fixed, What else do we have? You
See has announced it's twenty twenty five schedule. We knew
the first three games Nebraska in Kansas City, Bowling Green
and Northwestern State. U See will go to Kansas home
for Iowa State home for UCF at ok State home
for Baylor, at Utah Arizona BYU here and at TCU.
(22:51):
If you want more details, you know where to get at.
Reds have signed to minor League contracts and invited a
spring training ian Jabbo, Joels Soursa and lefty Wade Miley.
He's back college basketball tonight. Xavier's hosting Georgetown at eight
thirty on seven hundred WLW, both teams five and six
in the Big East. Kentucky's at Ole Miss tonight at
(23:13):
seven o'clock on ESPN fifteen thirty. Also tonight, Miami's at
Central Michigan. Dayton host Davidson and IU is at Wisconsin.
The NKU Coaches Show is at six on Fox Sports
thirteen sixty, and then they'll flip it to Buffalo, where
the Columbus Blue Jackets, owners of the last wildcard spot
in their conference, will take on the Sabers. I almost
(23:35):
said Bills. It's twenty two from four o'clock. They're not
playing the Bills. Tonight, Paul Danner Junior from the Athleticas.
Here your Bengals media peer Kelsey Conway did a Q
and A with a Duke Tubin. Looks like we were
gonna say something. No, No, I'm waiting, curious where you're
gonna go next. I'm just on that on pins and
needles here. Okay, So he was asked a lot of
(23:57):
questions about players who may depart they may do. Did
you have an overarching takeaway from that Q and A. Yeah,
I mean that Duke's not so sure. I mean, is
that fair to say that all this is as possible
as people.
Speaker 4 (24:14):
Maybe want to think that it is, and that maybe
it has been suggested that maybe it is, you know,
like oh this can we can get all this done right?
Which has sort of been the theme from one side
and the other side is down on lane.
Speaker 1 (24:26):
I don't know.
Speaker 4 (24:27):
I thought the you know, we need engagement from your
camp thing that that you know, oh no, are we
blaming the agent again?
Speaker 2 (24:35):
Yeah, like you only get how many times can you
play that card once?
Speaker 4 (24:40):
Once?
Speaker 2 (24:40):
Yeah?
Speaker 4 (24:41):
So he drops the old agent an noo, it's the
new agent. And now we're hearing again about engagement from
from the other side. But that so, that was the
stuff I think that stood out to me was of,
you know, a hesitancy. Now did I expect him to
come out and be like we're going to give him
whatever they want or whatever, But you'd like to feel
like it was in a little bit better place place
(25:02):
when you hear you know, conversations about how they're going,
you know, well, you know, it's it's we're hopeful and
working with we're working with them, and we're thinking that
we can make it happen. And I think that they
there's some of that there, But you know what stands
out is the side where it's like, well, you know,
if we don't get any help from them, you can,
you can. It's like the ground the groundwork being laid
(25:26):
for when the bad thing happens. And so but it's
like all these negotiations in a lot of ways. I mean,
they all a lot of times they sound like this
and then next thing, you know, oh it's done. Yeah,
you know, So that's all just gonna be part of it.
Speaker 2 (25:38):
The one thing that sort of stood out to me
was and asked when he was asked about Jamar Chase,
he used the word framework three times. Do you think
Jamar Chase cares about that framework?
Speaker 4 (25:50):
No, because I assume the framework he was referring to
is that of Justin Jefferson and Ceedee Lamb, and that
is irrelevant.
Speaker 5 (25:55):
M h.
Speaker 4 (25:56):
It was relevant last year, right, but there the Triple
Crown framework. I don't know that that exists, and it's
certainly different than you know, So if you think it's
going to be copy and paste, you know, or find
and replace Justin Jefferson for Jamar Chase.
Speaker 1 (26:15):
No, I don't think and I think that's fair on
Jamar's side.
Speaker 2 (26:19):
Justin never did this right and and change the framework
has changed, and so I think that's going to be
where you know.
Speaker 4 (26:27):
Where the negotiation lives is. Okay, what is what is
Justin Jefferson? What is the difference between Justin Jefferson's deal
and what Jamar Chase's deal should be? Now at this point,
how different is this year's price from last year's price?
Speaker 1 (26:42):
And you know, I'm sure, I'm sure that'll go well,
I don't see anyway.
Speaker 2 (26:47):
But that's the thing that I talked about this a
little bit after I read Kelsey's Q and A. I
think there's been this assumption that with all these different
balls that the front office has to juggle, that this
will be easy. Right, hey, just cup, where you get left,
where you left off, here's the pen, here's the contract. Cool,
let's take a picture, Let's go get a steak. And
I'm going no, no, no, no no no. Like if
(27:08):
i'm Jamar, we're kind of starting from square one, which
doesn't necessarily suggest that this is gonna be easy.
Speaker 4 (27:17):
No, you're you're exactly right. I mean, I don't think
it's gonna be easy at all. I think, you know,
everybody always wants to do it now it's it's not
gonna get done now.
Speaker 1 (27:29):
I don't. I don't.
Speaker 4 (27:30):
There's too much there. There's too much other stuff happening too.
And I think the framework element where I think there's
a positive to that is there's a point of we
we know basically where we're gonna have to go with that,
so we can do the other things without having to
deal with this first, because that's very complicated. You just
I've said it many times. You just don't want Jamar
(27:51):
in the hat on the first day camp or not
there on the first day camp standing next to tree
hand and also in a hat, you know, holding a
calf or something, you know, whatever. You just don't want
it to go there, get it done. You know, on
the same timeframe that Justin's was done last year, in
(28:11):
the middle of the summer, you know, happy time there.
Everybody you show up for camp ready to go and
attack the season. That's the one thing and to me,
that's the part of this timeline that's just so important
not not getting it done now and putting Tea and
Jamar out there together and before free agency here, before
the draft or any of that stuff. Get it done
(28:32):
before camp starts. And I think you're okay with it.
You'd rather earlier is the better on every way imaginable,
but get it done by then.
Speaker 2 (28:41):
You and I talked toward the end of the season,
or maybe right when the season ended, about how one
of the goals this year should be for a quiet camp,
a quiet preseason, not a lot of off season noise.
And yet we've talked about multiple topics here that could
create a lot of noise. Whether it's maybe the Joe
not having a positive reaction to not getting what he wants,
the Jamar Chase leaking in the camp, possibly, the Jamar
(29:03):
Chase contract extension leaking in the camp again, Possibly if
they don't extend Trey Hendrickson and don't trade him and
he's playing on a one year deal and he's not
happy about it. Could that And I just I've arrived
at a place where I assume now, if you have
good players, a peaceful camp.
Speaker 4 (29:19):
Is almost impossible. Yeah, And when when you have three
players up for major awards and one on top of that,
who is the number one free agent on the market.
It's just wildly complicated, right, you know, it's I've been
sort of calling it, it's the Jigsaw puzzle from hell
right now.
Speaker 1 (29:38):
Like they just you have a bad team and four
stars to deal with, you know what I mean?
Speaker 4 (29:43):
Like that's just like you know, you have so many
other things you have to figure out, and so that Yeah,
there's that's the NFL. I mean, that's around the league.
I mean you go, you go around in the last year,
how many of these things were happening at camps. I
mean everybody was hold ins and holdouts, right, I mean,
that's fine, that's part of it.
Speaker 1 (30:01):
You just you just don't want to be every year, no,
you know, and I just.
Speaker 2 (30:04):
I have assumed that this is just part of the
reality of having a team that has good players. And
it might not be every single year, but this idea
that you know, we're gonna be the sort of franchise
that never has this. You are unless you.
Speaker 1 (30:18):
Do oh, I don't know.
Speaker 4 (30:20):
Let's take it a perfect example playing on Sunday, Philadelphia Eagles.
Stay ahead of it, pay the guys early, invest in
your guys, and do it and before they even maybe
think that they're going you're going to right. We've seen
the Eagles do this time and time and time again,
and it has paid off for them a lot. And
they've probably had a few that didn't totally live up,
(30:40):
but they've far out, you know, gaining what they've saved
by doing the right ones that went right early, right,
you know. And this franchise has done that. And there
was a time where I believe that they always would
do that. I don't know that I feel that way
as much as anymore because they've proven otherwise lately. But
like I always thought that was kind of the core
of what the best English model was trying to be was,
(31:03):
you know, draft, develop and then and retain early, you know,
and and you don't end up in this mess as much.
But there, you know, when when it looks like when
it goes like this, and you push, when all these
cans get kicked down the line to the very end.
You know, you did the one year extension, you got
Jamar up against it, now you got Tea up again.
Everything's been kicked. Eventually you got to pay the bills
(31:25):
and uh, you know, it's it's time to pay.
Speaker 2 (31:27):
Your colleague Diana Russini said on her on her podcast,
and we played this audio yesterday that he's quote, he's
trying to figure out and his representation is as well,
who's going to pay the most amount of money for
T Higgins, essentially saying that's what he wants to know.
That's not going to be the Bengals. No, the question
that he is going to So if that's if that's
(31:48):
what this is hinging on, let's assume he's not going
to be.
Speaker 4 (31:50):
Back, but that might not be what it's hinging on.
He wants to be back, sure, and and and I
get the sense that he is. I mean, everybody is
gonna have their price, and when you put two numbers
next to each other, it's hard when there's a when
there's a certain gap, he has to figure out what
that gap is for him to continue to be a
(32:12):
place that he's obviously wants to be in terms of
playing with Joe and Jamar and being a part of
something special here like that does matter to him. It's
the reason he changed agents, like it's it's why we're
at this spot right now. The question is if he's
getting offered thirty one million dollars per year from the
(32:33):
New England Patriots and twenty five from the Bengals. Is
that money so sizeable that you'd say I'm gonna I mean,
I'm just gonna go play in New England? Or would
you say, I know what I have here in terms
of happiness, quarterback, chance to win, this is more than
enough money for me. That's a question that he has
to answer for himself when I think what Diana was
(32:54):
hinting at there is that he's gonna have to decide,
is what is that price that he willing to stay
in Cincinnati four because of happiness with the people he
plays with and the place that he's at and all
the comfort things of having a great quarterback throwing to
you all the time.
Speaker 1 (33:10):
Yeah, and how much is it? Well, that's a lot
of money.
Speaker 2 (33:13):
On the Trey Hendrickson thing and the Duke Tobin thing.
In the same Q and A, he talked about Trey
Hendrickson and what their options are, but he also acknowledged
we hung onto players too long who were a part
of the Super Bowl run in twenty twenty one, and
you and I have talked about players that they've in
the past, going back before they won or went to
(33:34):
the Super Bowl players that they gave another deal to
didn't hit the EJEC button on. So I mean to me,
if you're gonna say we held onto guys a little
bit too long, who are here in twenty twenty one,
and Trey Hendrickson is one of those players and he's
under contract for one more year, those comments don't add
up to being that excited about giving him what he
wants in a longer term deal.
Speaker 3 (33:54):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (33:55):
And I think some of the comments you know in
there as well about you know, how how attainable is
it to get to the number that he's comfortable with?
Speaker 1 (34:04):
You know, like what is that?
Speaker 4 (34:05):
And to be determined? Right, a phrase that stood out
pretty clearly, I think in that I didn't think that
was as much about Trey, and I just think that
was more about guys that really covered, you know, that
defensive roster last year.
Speaker 1 (34:19):
It was about Sam Hubbard, it.
Speaker 2 (34:21):
Was about Von Bell, you know, it was about and
I don't know, it began a number of guys that
you saw that were that were held held onto from
from those teams.
Speaker 4 (34:31):
And it's sort of like I thought, in a lot
of ways without saying and again, this is me, this
is my interpretation not necessarily what he's saying, but like
it certainly seems like it's like, we gave Lou one
more chance with this with his guys, right, Like twenty
three was an aberration. Your guys that know your system,
Let's get your system back in here and reignite the magic, right,
(34:54):
keep your guys, let's improve it, and and that thing
went sideways. And so when Lou leaves that there's an
emission that everybody there probably held on one beat too
long onto everything that was happening defensively, and without saying, look,
this league, you, especially on defense, you have to constantly
be churning and hitting the reset and reinventing yourself every
(35:18):
single year. It just demands it on that side of
the ball specifically, and so you can't behold I mean,
we would talk about for years. Hear them holding on
to players, you know, trying to hold on to twenty thirteen,
hold on to twenty fifteen, and we're gonna bring that back,
and Michael Johnson's coming back and Pat Sims and like
(35:38):
you know, it's like, all, well, it was every year
it was a bringing this guy back from that team,
and it was like there is a certain point where
that just becomes you can't do that. You have to
you have to trust your drafts, your valuations, and the
confidence and how you reset things every single year and
view every team as a new team and not as
(35:59):
a recreation of an old team.
Speaker 2 (36:01):
And I think that was probably the lesson that he was,
you know, trying to say there. I think Philadelphia should
be favored in this game on Sunday, Like Philly, I'm
with you. I think it's silly to bet against Patrick
every time you say this, right, and they're like.
Speaker 1 (36:16):
Wait, are we doing it again?
Speaker 2 (36:18):
Are we betting against Patrick Mahomes again? I like this
Philly team. I like their defense roster versus roster. Okay,
just forget history. Mahomes three pete roster versus roster. Philly's better. Yes,
and don't I don't want to say it's not close.
There are Super Bowl teams and the spread is is
pretty thin, but I like, I don't think it's that close.
Speaker 4 (36:43):
Well, but the the you know, it's Mahomes again, it's
the super Bowl. But I go back to Jalen Hurts
played unbelievable in that Super Bowl cup. You're not worried
about him on that stage right, I would. I mean,
if I'm Philly, I don't care what's happened this year
when they're passing, and that's taken a lot of heat
in Philadelphia obviously, But like, I'm not worried about Jalen
(37:05):
Hurts on the big stage because I've seen that show
and it was a heck of a show, and so
I'm not worried about that. I love their defense. Their
defense is in such a better place. It's the perfect
example when we talk about things through the Bengals lens
of get young. Put a bunch of dudes up front
that are young and aggressive and get after the quarterback
and just let it go and believe in your youth.
(37:26):
Quinyan Mitchell and Jalen Carter and Jordan Davis and Nolan Smith,
like it's all dudes that have just been premium draft
picks to broad in there and go and go do it.
And they reset that from what it was a couple
of years ago, where it was a lot of older
guys that were chasing Patrick Mahomes around. And I think
that is where you could see it payoff on something.
Speaker 2 (37:43):
I you know, look, I'm a Bengals fan. I'm supposed
to root against Kansas City, but there's a part of
me that wants the Chiefs to win the title on
a bad call.
Speaker 1 (37:54):
For your content sake.
Speaker 2 (37:55):
The lines won't turn off. My favorite team in the
NFL is the Cincinnati Bengals. My second favorite team in
every sport is chaos and content.
Speaker 1 (38:04):
Yes, so there is nothing.
Speaker 4 (38:06):
There's no button you could push right now right that
would create more castle.
Speaker 2 (38:11):
I want some sort of like egregious It's it's fourth
and seven, Maholmes is you know, about to fling it
out of bounds and the game is about to be
over and they get a reprieve from the guys in
stripes like something like that. Some sort of egregious just
you know, feed the conspiracy sort of call that just
(38:32):
tilts this in favor of Kansas City would bring about
the sort of chaos that I am a huge fan of.
You think the did you see the statement made by
the like head of officiating about Ugh can't believe I'm
having to address conspiracy theories.
Speaker 4 (38:46):
It's ridiculous. How much is he dritting that? Ron Torbert
is the officiales It's like, look, I quit this statement.
Put my face out there. Man, I made a statement
about this whole thing and now we got to count
on Ron to get its right.
Speaker 2 (39:00):
Yep, good luck. But I don't know in the history.
I mean, look, there's always an immense amount of pressure
on any NFL officiating crew, even more so in the
Super Bowl. In this one, though, I'm not sure an
officiating crew has ever had more pressure on it because
if you're the league, like you just the last in
a season where a lot of great games, I mean
think Cincinnati Baltimore, the road game, the great game, and
(39:22):
the next day all we do is talk about one
call at the end of the game. There's been a
lot of games like that this year. You don't want
that in your Super Bowl, but you definitely don't want
that in a Super Bowl where Kansas City benefits from it, Like,
you don't want that. So a lot of pressure on
this crew.
Speaker 1 (39:35):
There's a lot of pressure.
Speaker 2 (39:36):
There's a lot of pressure on every crew. That's just it.
Speaker 4 (39:39):
It's so hard. Yes, but man, you messed this one up,
and it's just gonna be feeding the entire offseas and
you know we're gonna hear about it, Like, I mean,
these aren't even full time employees. Are you gonna pay
they need more training and more overrated trope than make
them full time employee. You think that they all of
a sudden won't make bad call because they in the
(40:01):
summer they sat around and you know, took training sessions
instead of their insurance sales job.
Speaker 2 (40:06):
Wait a minute, My primary vocation is going to be
a job where if I make one mistake, you want
me out? Yeah, hard, pass on that it'll it'll stay
my side. Gig. We're good and a well paying one. Paul,
thank you, no problem. The Growler podcast. I takes many
iterations and readthathletic dot com. Follow Paul on x at
Paul Danner Junior. We we'll see you next week. Looking
forward to it.
Speaker 1 (40:26):
I can't wait. No officials talk next week. We won't.
We won't know.
Speaker 2 (40:29):
Let's need to I hope not.
Speaker 1 (40:30):
No, you do, though, yeah, I kind of do.
Speaker 2 (40:33):
It's five minutes away from four o'clock. Solomon Wilcotts is
going to join us in about ten minutes on ESPN
fifteen thirty Cincinnati Sports.
Speaker 3 (40:41):
Station Cincinnati's ESPN fifteen thirty traffic from the UC.
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(41:11):
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Speaker 1 (41:18):
This report is sponsored by Rapid Radios.
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Speaker 2 (00:04):
That's bills.
Speaker 3 (00:06):
Enter it now you found Cincinnati's ESPN fifteen thirty.
Speaker 2 (00:11):
Well, sure you have. What's up? Get afternoon on my legger.
This is ESPN fifteen thirty. Thank you for listening. We uh,
we got a short show today done early. UK basketball
takes over at five thirty. Wildcats battling old mess tonight.
Both teams trying to bounce back. Both teams have have
struggled recently. We'll put it to you that way. So
(00:34):
two and a half hours to get in, three hours
worth of stuff. Solomon Wilcott's We're gonna do a Radio
Row interview with Solomon Willcotts at four oh five. And
by Radio Row interview, you know what that means. It
means Sally's gonna come on for eight minutes. It was
gonna come on for ten minutes. For eight minutes, we're
gonna talk about the Bengals, and we're gonna talk about
the time he saved the broadcast the last time the
Super Bowl was in New Orleans. And then we have
(00:56):
to spend two minutes talking about prosthetic legs or something
I'm not really sure, but anyway, that is coming up tough.
I just I like to let the audience know in advance,
here's what's gonna happen. We're gonna take this weird pivot
from the NFL and the Bengals and the upcoming off
season or the off season and the super Bowl itself,
and then we're going to talk about something that is
(01:17):
of no major interest to our audience. So you have
that coming up in just about an hour. I have
a question for UC fan another question for UC fans
based on the a poll question we had yesterday. I
have a question for Joe Burrow. And we have more
more Reds off season speculation to a touch on as well.
(01:39):
Full Show Rundown is available on x thanks to Emery
Federal Credit Union your credit union with Hart since nineteen
thirty nine. Go to EMORYFCU dot org. But first and
foremost most importantly, Paul Danner Junior's here.
Speaker 1 (01:51):
What's up? How we doing?
Speaker 4 (01:53):
I'm doing great, It's just good. I'm just lucky to
watch a master in his craft right now. Yeah, you're
doing five things. Once you know, you're like, you're getting
the camera going, You're getting the back going, you've got
like you're working on the paper. I mean, I'm just impressed,
and you're talking through it the whole time. And if
I I it was radio at like most people listening
home wouldn't even know how multi talented you are.
Speaker 2 (02:15):
Right now, I am a disorganized mess. I think is the.
Speaker 1 (02:22):
Pulling it off.
Speaker 2 (02:23):
I am a complete and total disorganized mess. What's good
to have you here? What's going on?
Speaker 1 (02:28):
Not much?
Speaker 4 (02:28):
You know, just you know, it's like, normally this is
supposed to be the slow down time, and it just
feels so not slow. It's just everything is is very
I the word that I keep coming back to, and
(02:49):
I say, well, it's not that, and then I'm like,
well maybe it is.
Speaker 1 (02:52):
Everything feels very quietly volatile.
Speaker 4 (02:55):
Yeah, you know, it just feels like, man, everything's simmering
below the surface, waiting for these looming deadlines, and it's
so much big, important stuff happening, and.
Speaker 2 (03:06):
It's just you've got comments.
Speaker 4 (03:09):
You're parsing through comments from the Pro Bowl, this big,
happy fun time with these silly games, and guys are
over here jumping into foam pits, and meanwhile, Joe burrows
like they better pay all my guys. Why can't we
pay all my guys. We're gonna be able to do that,
and we're doubling down on that again. There's just a
(03:30):
lot of the fun, happy time stuff that you maybe
would think is happening right now.
Speaker 2 (03:35):
I have fatigue.
Speaker 1 (03:36):
Yeah, I'll admit no doubt. I'm ready. It's just figured out.
Speaker 2 (03:39):
And I, like any Bengals fan, I love Joe Burrow,
I have Joe Burrow makes headlines. Fatigue.
Speaker 1 (03:46):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (03:47):
Like I said this on our show yesterday, It's like
when my daughter and I go to King's Island. She
wants the blue ice cream. She tells me on the
drive up, I want blue ice cream. She tells me
on the walk in, I want blue ice cream. She
tells me as we're going in, I want blue ice cream.
She tells me. After the first couple of rides, I
want Like, I get it. We're going to get blue
ice cream. I heard you the first nineteen times, and
(04:08):
it's maybe not the most fair comparison, but Joe, you
want tea here? Yeah, I get it. So I don't
know where this goes next, but it's it's gonna be
at least a little while until we get some answers.
Speaker 4 (04:20):
Yeah, I you know, I don't. I don't mind it.
It's not I mean the fact that it gets blown
up every time. He's mostly just answering questions yes, And
I don't feel like he's going out of his way.
Speaker 1 (04:36):
I mean he could. He could soft handed this.
Speaker 2 (04:39):
Someone someone asked him a question. It's less with Joe,
and it's more like we take the same thing that
he says and we create new content out of it.
And I'm guilty of it too. I mean, I'm as
guilty of it as anybody.
Speaker 1 (04:49):
That's that's what I'm saying.
Speaker 2 (04:50):
I don't think this is a a Joe thing, and
I don't think this is a Bengals thing. I think
this is a NFL machine thing.
Speaker 4 (05:00):
But it's necessary, it is important, it is notable, like
and that's why that time December ninth and Dallas was
a huge deal because like, oh, he's going down this path.
Now we know he's going down. We know the path,
the lines. You can't draw them any clearer than they've
been drawn. This is what it is, like.
Speaker 2 (05:18):
We know what he wants, we know that there will
be a decision of whether they're going to give him.
Speaker 4 (05:22):
What he wants or not. It's all out in the
public domain, so we'll see what happens. But the need
to be like Joe said it again, he did another thing.
It's like, I honestly have a hard time keeping up
with how many times this has happened at the exact point,
because it just kind of keeps happening or patily for
those that have been paying attention, and maybe to some
(05:42):
it's new, but you know, it is starting, it's getting
closer to coming to a head at least, and so
we have that going for us.
Speaker 2 (05:49):
So I'm not even sure where to start because there
are so many things out there. Let me begin with that.
So Joe keeps saying the same thing, and we keep
making a big deal out of it. Let's say that
Joe doesn't get what he wants, then.
Speaker 4 (06:06):
What I mean, that's the question that has no answer,
And that's the one that I would like to ask
Joe Burrow. And we haven't really had a chance to
since the season ended, and probably should have maybe at
that point whenever, whenever we did last talk to him.
But you know, and that is what it. You know,
this is this could be perceived as threats. Now you're
(06:27):
you're saying this is a need Why can't we get
this done? Obviously, Duke says, he's talked to you. So
if that's if all those facts are true, and you're
saying what you're saying now, so what happens if they
go a different direction, because it feels very much like
you're saying, well, I won't agree with this, and you
now I said this on who they lied on Friday.
(06:49):
He is basically family now in the power that they
have given to him.
Speaker 1 (06:56):
Do you know how uneasy that makes them? Like?
Speaker 4 (07:00):
They they have given him this power and he's kind
of out there holding it.
Speaker 1 (07:06):
He's kinda he's you know, we talk about this in
other ways.
Speaker 4 (07:09):
It's your daughter walking with the cereal across the kitchen
to go take it over.
Speaker 1 (07:13):
The milk's starting to splash?
Speaker 2 (07:15):
How much do I trust this?
Speaker 4 (07:16):
And and now you're just saying, well, what happens if
it goes good?
Speaker 1 (07:21):
I don't think we know. Yeah, I don't think we know.
Speaker 4 (07:24):
If this is like it's going to come out as well,
I get it because of X, Y and Z or
it's going to be I told them that I was
not going to stand for this, that we could do it,
and they should have done it, and now I feel
this way, and you start going down and you now
you flip the calendar on the like the Carson Palmer calendar.
Speaker 2 (07:45):
That people keeping their head right, like, where are we at?
Where were you worry about that from?
Speaker 4 (07:50):
You know, everyone's always worrying about that, And so I
just think that is what does this mean? Does this
mean you flip the calendar or does this mean you say, ah,
wish we could have gotten that done?
Speaker 1 (08:00):
Nobody really knows but Joe, right, And that's.
Speaker 2 (08:04):
That's where I am with this, Like, Okay, we understand
the cases for and against giving t Higgins what he's
looking for. We understand the difficult financial decisions they have.
We understand the caliber of players we are talking about.
You wrote about Trey Hendrickson earlier this week, and that's
that's a dynamic that you have to consider when talking
about tea. And it feels like with the public discourse,
(08:27):
we're now folding understandably so training to the conversation about tea,
which has been taking place for a couple of months.
But what I'm most fascinated by is, let's say, when's
the league year start March?
Speaker 1 (08:38):
Yeah, this is technically Wednesday. That Wednesday yeah, ten twelve.
Speaker 2 (08:42):
Right, So let's say within twenty four hours of the
new league year starting, we're in the early tampering period.
We find out t Higgins is an LA Charger or
a Green Bay Packer or god forbid, playing for an
AFC team that we don't want him to play for. Okay,
then what right? Then what from a roster? But then
what from because it's it's still gonna be months, I'm
(09:04):
guessing before Joe talks to you guys, it's gonna be
a long time before Joe has any sort of there's
no radio row that he's gonna be bouncing around at
like he's I'm guessing radio silence. And then so we're
all gonna be waiting to wonder, Okay, what's Joe's take
on this, what's the reaction and what is the possible fallout?
Speaker 4 (09:23):
Yeah, and and I think that's something that and I
would expect, knowing you know what you know of Joe,
that something that he will very carefully think about how
he wants to frame his opinion coming out of that,
and and we'll all.
Speaker 1 (09:36):
Kind of find out at the same time.
Speaker 4 (09:39):
The thing is like, that's what this has become for me,
This isn't about actually replacing t Higgins the football player
at all anyway, Right, Like, I we've kind of talked
about the pros and cons on both sides enough, like
I can see a path either way, sure, like letting
te goes using that money in other ways, putting a
solid number two draft another receiver, you know, Jamar's the man,
(10:03):
you know, Like that's that's a viable strategy that that
no one should really have a problem with on the surface.
Speaker 2 (10:09):
Yeah, I'm not I want Tea here. Yeah, I'm not
gonna burn a bunch of Bengals gear if he's not.
And I still think there's a very clear path that
the Bengals could take that puts us in a place
where in early September we're talking about them having a
chance to win the whole thing.
Speaker 4 (10:24):
Yeah, I mean, you know we talked about when you
looked at the AFC Championship game, it was kind of
a takeaway from me. I mean, this is a team
that traded Stefon Diggs and supposedly was rebuilding because they
just had a bunch of young receivers. You had Kansas
City that notably traded Tyreek Hill and didn't have her
sheet Rice and had a bunch of young guys that
had stepped up for their offense and built strong defenses
and good offensive lines, and like, these are the teams
(10:45):
you got to go beat and look how they've done
it right, there's there, you know, there's nothing wrong with
doing it that way when you have the franchise quarterback.
There's there's proven models there. So it's about the reaction
of the quarterback. Now, it's it's it's a about the
reaction of what does this really mean for how Joe feels?
You know, And that's uncomfortable to feel like you're in
(11:08):
that place because you'd like to think that he you
would feel like he would be in lockstep with everybody
else in understanding why they're taking certain paths forward and
maybe it will come out at the end that he
does come out that way. So I don't want to
put that over him right now because we could be projecting.
This is a scarred fan base. Yeah, so there's projecting
(11:28):
going on there with some of it. Well, we have
to talk about it.
Speaker 2 (11:31):
And I tried to do that a little bit last week,
and I'm I'm as I'm as unqualified to do that
as anybody, but I'm like, all right, there is looming
over all of this. What we saw Carson Palmer do.
That was an extreme reaction to what was going on
with the Beg an extreme. You might have blamed him,
(11:52):
you might have thought what he did was fine, but
it was an extreme reaction. That's the extreme is never
the most likely outcome. Right, So could I see Joe
being skeptical, hurt, pissed, curious? Could I see him being accepting?
I could see him being all those things. But the
least likely is he's so angry that suddenly he goes
(12:14):
scorched earth and decides to maneuver an exit that involves
him threatening to retire, right.
Speaker 4 (12:22):
Right, Yeah, and that's that's that's all the way to
the end. But there's or just starts starts becoming frustrated. Sure, right,
and and you know, because before it didn't feel like
it would get that way. I mean it was Kumbai yah,
they're winning, They're all these things. And oh remember when
people said that stuff about don't go there. Ah, man,
that's right, Carson's wrong. It's changed. Everything's different.
Speaker 2 (12:44):
Now.
Speaker 4 (12:44):
Look you proved it, right, Well, this is the point
where the rubber meets the road on that where where
those people right or wrong, whether that success happened early
on or not, because it's it's easy to say things
went right when you have the advance of a franchise
quarterback on a rookie contract. It's not easy to go
(13:04):
out there and do it when that guy is getting paid.
And I think that's sort of, you know, the knock
against this franchise. Can you go out there and do
it when the guys when that guy's getting paid, and
work the outside edges to make the roster work for him.
I think that there should be more faith than probably
is given to this front office that they can do that.
They probably don't get enough credit for the things that
(13:25):
they were doing around Joe Burrow to build that team in.
Speaker 1 (13:28):
The first place.
Speaker 4 (13:30):
That said, the criticism is warranted and real, and it
doesn't really matter what we think.
Speaker 1 (13:36):
It really matters what Joe thinks.
Speaker 4 (13:39):
And nobody knows, and nobody knows there's no way to know.
I don't like, I don't know if Joe really knows.
I mean, Joe has largely got what he wanted here
at almost every turn, Like he's gotten them to break
every rule that mattered to him. He's gotten them to
do things in terms of the way they build the roster,
the way they spend on free agent, that's the way
(14:00):
they do guaranteed money with their star. All of these
things that have changed around him, and he's rewarded them
with great play and so many things. But like, on
the other side of that, I mean, there's a lot,
There's a lot that's on the other side of it.
Speaker 1 (14:16):
You know what I mean?
Speaker 2 (14:17):
You do you know what I mean? Yeah, but I
totally know what you mean. And so that's what I've
been stuck on. Okay, if it's mid March and we
are reconciling ourselves with the reality that t Higgins is
playing for any one of the other thirty one teams,
we're all going to sit there and wonder. Okay, what's
next as it relates to Joe Burrow's reaction specifically, not
(14:37):
what's next for the roster. They'll go find a number
two wide receiver somewhere. Yeah, like the guy might be
as good, might not be as good, might not work,
may work. I have no idea. But what is Joe
thinking and what is going to be the public response
to what Joe is thinking? And what is the fallout?
Can it be. Will there be any threats? Will there
be this visibly frustrated guy from a dude who last
(15:00):
year was at times visibly frustrated. What is all that
gonna look like? And I think there's a tremendous fear
that that's that's not gonna that's not gonna be fun.
Speaker 4 (15:09):
And how does that land with your fan base in
the fact that more than maybe any player ever and
I mean we probably I bet if you went back
and went I'd love to go back to some of
your shows in two thousand and five, in two thousand
and six, where Carson Palmer was this untouchable.
Speaker 2 (15:23):
I wasn't on the air then, but that's all people were.
In my mind, you were ye for other people doing this, Yeah,
far better by the way.
Speaker 4 (15:31):
In my mind you were at least talking to somebody
about this. But I think that the attitude was different, right,
and I and and but then it changes. I feel like,
I mean, in Burrows case, like he's as beloved and
untouchable as any player in the history of this franchise
in the terms that fans will always side with him. Yes,
there's a big group. And granted a lot of it
was because of the whole retirement how it ended thing.
(15:53):
But before that, even there was a there was a
groundswell of people that were like, Eh, Carson, man, I
don't know what's going on with him with the interceptions
and complaining whatever. I have a hard time seeing it
going that direction with Burrow and in the unless a
ton of new stuff happened in terms of this fan
base not always looking at a situation insiding with nine
(16:15):
over the team. Yeah, and that can poison your base
a little bit if your quarterback is saying things that
you know that that send them feeling a certain direction.
Speaker 2 (16:24):
Well, it's funny because as you were saying that, I remember,
I mean I was on the air, you know, I
started doing this show in two thousand and seven, which
was the year Carson led the league in picks, and
then the next year he got hurt, missed a bunch
of time, and then the next year he was okay,
but they you know, it's Cedric Benson and a great defense,
and then the next year the bottom fell out. But
I remember when when Carson did what he did in
(16:45):
January of eleven, My response was like, okay, yeah, like
they could save a lot of money and get a
quarterback who's almost as good, Like, I mean, it just
wasn't whereas if Joe Burrow did that, right, right, let's
take the franchise, move it to Toronto, right. So it's
a little bit different because Joe just wrapped up a
(17:05):
season where he would be MVP at the Bengals maybe
one one more game.
Speaker 4 (17:08):
Sure, and it was so clearly everything else around him
that was at fault. Yeah, right, and who is irresponsible
with that other than the people that put those people
out there? So but yeah, I mean again, I guess
that's the long winded way of saying quietly volatile. It
just feels like it's just kind of this this unknown
that hovers around all of it, of how is this
(17:29):
all going to come together? And what will it mean
for the most important people in the building.
Speaker 2 (17:32):
It's kind of like the first time you get into
like a disagreement with your wife or your girlfriend, you're
not sure.
Speaker 4 (17:38):
Yeah, how's this going to go? Yeah, we've never had one,
like you're a fight like this? What's this going to be?
Speaker 2 (17:43):
Like?
Speaker 1 (17:43):
Yeahright?
Speaker 2 (17:44):
And so maybe maybe that's where we are, all right,
we are very late twenty two minutes after three o'clock.
He's Paul Danner Junior covering the Bengals four at the
Athletic dot Com. He does a podcast, The Growler Podcast,
The Charlie's Clicker, the most recent one, Charlie's Talkboard, Charlie's Charlie's.
Speaker 4 (18:01):
Chocolate Factory, Charlie writes Charlie's Chalkboard on substance. People subscribe
to its. Fore you get it to you, we just
do rewatch reaction. I know there's so many names track
of I can write them all down for you if
you want. There's too many, or I can actually be
a pro and I'm comfortable with you just calling at
the Growlary.
Speaker 1 (18:20):
It's totally for you. Don't You don't need to go individual.
Speaker 2 (18:23):
It's like I lose track between the CSI and n cis.
Speaker 1 (18:27):
Oh yeah, kind of becoming that yeah cop show. Yeah, sadly, yeah,
kind of going all right.
Speaker 2 (18:32):
Twenty three minutes after three o'clock, Paul's here till four,
We're here till six. This is ES over here to
five thirty. Actually, this is ESPN fifteen thirty Cincinnati Sports.
Speaker 3 (18:39):
Station Cincinnati's ESPN fifteen thirty.
Speaker 5 (18:44):
Traffic from the UC Health's Traffic Center Heart Disease is
the leading cause of death in the US. If you're
at risk, trust the experts at you see help for
Innovative and Personalized heart care. Expect more at U seehelp
dot com to bone two seventy five before Lebanon Road.
It's an exodent on the right shoulder, a couple of cars.
(19:05):
They're waiting off on the right burm for a tow
truck to arrive. Ken Wood Road. Getting reports of traffic
lights working incorrectly at Creek Road. Use caution there that
he's like with traffic this week.
Speaker 2 (19:17):
We're gonna be short here because we were late. Let
me hitch you with a couple of things really quick.
Are the Bengals gonna trade for Cooper Cup No? Are
the Bengals gonna trade for Miles Garrett? No, Trey Brown
is going to interview with the Jaguars. Who's that?
Speaker 1 (19:31):
Who's Trey Brown?
Speaker 4 (19:32):
Yeah, he's an executive on the in the Bengals personnel.
So he's been He's got a bunch of history, I
mean with the Patriots and with the Eagles, and then
he'd been here for a while now though it was
a big part of building the Super Bowl teams. And
he's a really integral part of their personnel department. I
mean they all are, but you know, he certainly is
is very well respected and that's why he's gotten a
(19:53):
ton of interviews lately. So we'll see. He's kind of
the one. He is the one name that when these
GM interview cycles keep happening, He's the one Bengals name
that does keep getting interviews and showing up there. So
that would be a loss for them if.
Speaker 2 (20:09):
If they if they did lose to the Jacks, no
Cooper Cup, no Miles Garrett, Yeah, and maybe no Trade Brown.
Speaker 4 (20:16):
I mean there were there were a number of there
were a number of names. Yeah, there were a number
of names on that list. So yes, yeah, maybe all right.
Speaker 2 (20:22):
Uh, Paul Danner Junior with us for another thirty minutes.
Speaker 1 (20:26):
I was quick, you said he was. I was just
trying to keep it as a good job.
Speaker 2 (20:29):
You're we're looking at me like, really, we're already gonna
break because we went likes long the last time. Yeah,
that's okay. Other stuff I can't.
Speaker 1 (20:36):
Given it out. I can we'll do with with averages.
I can do it very nice.
Speaker 2 (20:39):
It's three thirty Sports Headlines and More with Paul next
on ESPN fifteen.
Speaker 3 (20:43):
Thirty, Sincy three sixty with Tony Pike.
Speaker 1 (20:47):
I don't want to move on. We don't have to
keep going. And Boston Elmore, I think you should continue
to let me keep going there.
Speaker 3 (20:52):
Sincey three sixty tomorrow which twelve News on ESPN fifteen
thirty Cincinnati's e ESPN fifteen thirty Traffic.
Speaker 5 (21:03):
From the UC Health Traffic Center. Heart disease is the
leading cause of death in the US. If you're at risk,
trust the experts at U. See help for innovative and
personalized heartcare expect more at ucehealth dot com. Traffic lights
have now been fixed at Kenwood Road over at Creek
Road on Delhi Avenue, though downed wires at Rosemont Avenue
(21:26):
use caution around there in southbound fourth seventy one closed
off four bridge repairs between seventy one and the Bellevue exit.
I'm at E'zaalik with traffic report.
Speaker 2 (21:36):
Of Kelsey Chevro light home of lifetime powertrain protection and
guaranteed credit approval from their family to yours for life
kelseyshev dot Com. Bengals today signed wide receiver Mitchell Tinsley
to a reserve future contract who the hell is at
I don't know.
Speaker 1 (21:53):
I saw it and I was like, I don't think
I'm even gonna tweet this.
Speaker 2 (21:56):
Well, I'll tell you who he is.
Speaker 1 (21:58):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (21:58):
He is a six foot one, two hundred five five
pound wide receiver who will be a second year player
in twenty twenty five. Originally a college free agent signee
out of Washington or of Washington in twenty twenty three,
played in two games for the Commanders in twenty three
no stats, was active DMP in fifteen games, and then
this past year he was on the Commander's practice squad.
He played collegiately at Hutchinson Community College, Western Kentucky and
(22:22):
Penn State.
Speaker 1 (22:23):
Well there you go.
Speaker 2 (22:24):
So this is the T. Higgins air apparent Right there,
there you go? Fixed, What else do we have? You
See has announced it's twenty twenty five schedule. We knew
the first three games Nebraska in Kansas City, Bowling Green
and Northwestern State. U See will go to Kansas home
for Iowa State home for UCF at ok State home
for Baylor, at Utah Arizona BYU here and at TCU.
(22:51):
If you want more details, you know where to get at.
Reds have signed to minor League contracts and invited a
spring training ian Jabbo, Joels Soursa and lefty Wade Miley.
He's back college basketball tonight. Xavier's hosting Georgetown at eight
thirty on seven hundred WLW, both teams five and six
in the Big East. Kentucky's at Ole Miss tonight at
(23:13):
seven o'clock on ESPN fifteen thirty. Also tonight, Miami's at
Central Michigan. Dayton host Davidson and IU is at Wisconsin.
The NKU Coaches Show is at six on Fox Sports
thirteen sixty, and then they'll flip it to Buffalo, where
the Columbus Blue Jackets, owners of the last wildcard spot
in their conference, will take on the Sabers. I almost
(23:35):
said Bills. It's twenty two from four o'clock. They're not
playing the Bills. Tonight, Paul Danner Junior from the Athleticas.
Here your Bengals media peer Kelsey Conway did a Q
and A with a Duke Tubin. Looks like we were
gonna say something. No, No, I'm waiting, curious where you're
gonna go next. I'm just on that on pins and
needles here. Okay, So he was asked a lot of
(23:57):
questions about players who may depart they may do. Did
you have an overarching takeaway from that Q and A. Yeah,
I mean that Duke's not so sure. I mean, is
that fair to say that all this is as possible
as people.
Speaker 4 (24:14):
Maybe want to think that it is, and that maybe
it has been suggested that maybe it is, you know,
like oh this can we can get all this done right?
Which has sort of been the theme from one side
and the other side is down on lane.
Speaker 1 (24:26):
I don't know.
Speaker 4 (24:27):
I thought the you know, we need engagement from your
camp thing that that you know, oh no, are we
blaming the agent again?
Speaker 2 (24:35):
Yeah, like you only get how many times can you
play that card once?
Speaker 4 (24:40):
Once?
Speaker 2 (24:40):
Yeah?
Speaker 4 (24:41):
So he drops the old agent an noo, it's the
new agent. And now we're hearing again about engagement from
from the other side. But that so, that was the
stuff I think that stood out to me was of,
you know, a hesitancy. Now did I expect him to
come out and be like we're going to give him
whatever they want or whatever, But you'd like to feel
like it was in a little bit better place place
(25:02):
when you hear you know, conversations about how they're going,
you know, well, you know, it's it's we're hopeful and
working with we're working with them, and we're thinking that
we can make it happen. And I think that they
there's some of that there, But you know what stands
out is the side where it's like, well, you know,
if we don't get any help from them, you can,
you can. It's like the ground the groundwork being laid
(25:26):
for when the bad thing happens. And so but it's
like all these negotiations in a lot of ways. I mean,
they all a lot of times they sound like this
and then next thing, you know, oh it's done. Yeah,
you know, So that's all just gonna be part of it.
Speaker 2 (25:38):
The one thing that sort of stood out to me
was and asked when he was asked about Jamar Chase,
he used the word framework three times. Do you think
Jamar Chase cares about that framework?
Speaker 4 (25:50):
No, because I assume the framework he was referring to
is that of Justin Jefferson and Ceedee Lamb, and that
is irrelevant.
Speaker 5 (25:55):
M h.
Speaker 4 (25:56):
It was relevant last year, right, but there the Triple
Crown framework. I don't know that that exists, and it's
certainly different than you know, So if you think it's
going to be copy and paste, you know, or find
and replace Justin Jefferson for Jamar Chase.
Speaker 1 (26:15):
No, I don't think and I think that's fair on
Jamar's side.
Speaker 2 (26:19):
Justin never did this right and and change the framework
has changed, and so I think that's going to be
where you know.
Speaker 4 (26:27):
Where the negotiation lives is. Okay, what is what is
Justin Jefferson? What is the difference between Justin Jefferson's deal
and what Jamar Chase's deal should be? Now at this point,
how different is this year's price from last year's price?
Speaker 1 (26:42):
And you know, I'm sure, I'm sure that'll go well,
I don't see anyway.
Speaker 2 (26:47):
But that's the thing that I talked about this a
little bit after I read Kelsey's Q and A. I
think there's been this assumption that with all these different
balls that the front office has to juggle, that this
will be easy. Right, hey, just cup, where you get left,
where you left off, here's the pen, here's the contract. Cool,
let's take a picture, Let's go get a steak. And
I'm going no, no, no, no no no. Like if
(27:08):
i'm Jamar, we're kind of starting from square one, which
doesn't necessarily suggest that this is gonna be easy.
Speaker 4 (27:17):
No, you're you're exactly right. I mean, I don't think
it's gonna be easy at all. I think, you know,
everybody always wants to do it now it's it's not
gonna get done now.
Speaker 1 (27:29):
I don't. I don't.
Speaker 4 (27:30):
There's too much there. There's too much other stuff happening too.
And I think the framework element where I think there's
a positive to that is there's a point of we
we know basically where we're gonna have to go with that,
so we can do the other things without having to
deal with this first, because that's very complicated. You just
I've said it many times. You just don't want Jamar
(27:51):
in the hat on the first day camp or not
there on the first day camp standing next to tree
hand and also in a hat, you know, holding a
calf or something, you know, whatever. You just don't want
it to go there, get it done. You know, on
the same timeframe that Justin's was done last year, in
(28:11):
the middle of the summer, you know, happy time there.
Everybody you show up for camp ready to go and
attack the season. That's the one thing and to me,
that's the part of this timeline that's just so important
not not getting it done now and putting Tea and
Jamar out there together and before free agency here, before
the draft or any of that stuff. Get it done
(28:32):
before camp starts. And I think you're okay with it.
You'd rather earlier is the better on every way imaginable,
but get it done by then.
Speaker 2 (28:41):
You and I talked toward the end of the season,
or maybe right when the season ended, about how one
of the goals this year should be for a quiet camp,
a quiet preseason, not a lot of off season noise.
And yet we've talked about multiple topics here that could
create a lot of noise. Whether it's maybe the Joe
not having a positive reaction to not getting what he wants,
the Jamar Chase leaking in the camp, possibly, the Jamar
(29:03):
Chase contract extension leaking in the camp again, Possibly if
they don't extend Trey Hendrickson and don't trade him and
he's playing on a one year deal and he's not
happy about it. Could that And I just I've arrived
at a place where I assume now, if you have
good players, a peaceful camp.
Speaker 4 (29:19):
Is almost impossible. Yeah, And when when you have three
players up for major awards and one on top of that,
who is the number one free agent on the market.
It's just wildly complicated, right, you know, it's I've been
sort of calling it, it's the Jigsaw puzzle from hell
right now.
Speaker 1 (29:38):
Like they just you have a bad team and four
stars to deal with, you know what I mean?
Speaker 4 (29:43):
Like that's just like you know, you have so many
other things you have to figure out, and so that Yeah,
there's that's the NFL. I mean, that's around the league.
I mean you go, you go around in the last year,
how many of these things were happening at camps. I
mean everybody was hold ins and holdouts, right, I mean,
that's fine, that's part of it.
Speaker 1 (30:01):
You just you just don't want to be every year, no,
you know, and I just.
Speaker 2 (30:04):
I have assumed that this is just part of the
reality of having a team that has good players. And
it might not be every single year, but this idea
that you know, we're gonna be the sort of franchise
that never has this. You are unless you.
Speaker 1 (30:18):
Do oh, I don't know.
Speaker 4 (30:20):
Let's take it a perfect example playing on Sunday, Philadelphia Eagles.
Stay ahead of it, pay the guys early, invest in
your guys, and do it and before they even maybe
think that they're going you're going to right. We've seen
the Eagles do this time and time and time again,
and it has paid off for them a lot. And
they've probably had a few that didn't totally live up,
(30:40):
but they've far out, you know, gaining what they've saved
by doing the right ones that went right early, right,
you know. And this franchise has done that. And there
was a time where I believe that they always would
do that. I don't know that I feel that way
as much as anymore because they've proven otherwise lately. But
like I always thought that was kind of the core
of what the best English model was trying to be was,
(31:03):
you know, draft, develop and then and retain early, you know,
and and you don't end up in this mess as much.
But there, you know, when when it looks like when
it goes like this, and you push, when all these
cans get kicked down the line to the very end.
You know, you did the one year extension, you got
Jamar up against it, now you got Tea up again.
Everything's been kicked. Eventually you got to pay the bills
(31:25):
and uh, you know, it's it's time to pay.
Speaker 2 (31:27):
Your colleague Diana Russini said on her on her podcast,
and we played this audio yesterday that he's quote, he's
trying to figure out and his representation is as well,
who's going to pay the most amount of money for
T Higgins, essentially saying that's what he wants to know.
That's not going to be the Bengals. No, the question
that he is going to So if that's if that's
(31:48):
what this is hinging on, let's assume he's not going
to be.
Speaker 4 (31:50):
Back, but that might not be what it's hinging on.
He wants to be back, sure, and and and I
get the sense that he is. I mean, everybody is
gonna have their price, and when you put two numbers
next to each other, it's hard when there's a when
there's a certain gap, he has to figure out what
that gap is for him to continue to be a
(32:12):
place that he's obviously wants to be in terms of
playing with Joe and Jamar and being a part of
something special here like that does matter to him. It's
the reason he changed agents, like it's it's why we're
at this spot right now. The question is if he's
getting offered thirty one million dollars per year from the
(32:33):
New England Patriots and twenty five from the Bengals. Is
that money so sizeable that you'd say I'm gonna I mean,
I'm just gonna go play in New England? Or would
you say, I know what I have here in terms
of happiness, quarterback, chance to win, this is more than
enough money for me. That's a question that he has
to answer for himself when I think what Diana was
(32:54):
hinting at there is that he's gonna have to decide,
is what is that price that he willing to stay
in Cincinnati four because of happiness with the people he
plays with and the place that he's at and all
the comfort things of having a great quarterback throwing to
you all the time.
Speaker 1 (33:10):
Yeah, and how much is it? Well, that's a lot
of money.
Speaker 2 (33:13):
On the Trey Hendrickson thing and the Duke Tobin thing.
In the same Q and A, he talked about Trey
Hendrickson and what their options are, but he also acknowledged
we hung onto players too long who were a part
of the Super Bowl run in twenty twenty one, and
you and I have talked about players that they've in
the past, going back before they won or went to
(33:34):
the Super Bowl players that they gave another deal to
didn't hit the EJEC button on. So I mean to me,
if you're gonna say we held onto guys a little
bit too long, who are here in twenty twenty one,
and Trey Hendrickson is one of those players and he's
under contract for one more year, those comments don't add
up to being that excited about giving him what he
wants in a longer term deal.
Speaker 3 (33:54):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (33:55):
And I think some of the comments you know in
there as well about you know, how how attainable is
it to get to the number that he's comfortable with?
Speaker 1 (34:04):
You know, like what is that?
Speaker 4 (34:05):
And to be determined? Right, a phrase that stood out
pretty clearly, I think in that I didn't think that
was as much about Trey, and I just think that
was more about guys that really covered, you know, that
defensive roster last year.
Speaker 1 (34:19):
It was about Sam Hubbard, it.
Speaker 2 (34:21):
Was about Von Bell, you know, it was about and
I don't know, it began a number of guys that
you saw that were that were held held onto from
from those teams.
Speaker 4 (34:31):
And it's sort of like I thought, in a lot
of ways without saying and again, this is me, this
is my interpretation not necessarily what he's saying, but like
it certainly seems like it's like, we gave Lou one
more chance with this with his guys, right, Like twenty
three was an aberration. Your guys that know your system,
Let's get your system back in here and reignite the magic, right,
(34:54):
keep your guys, let's improve it, and and that thing
went sideways. And so when Lou leaves that there's an
emission that everybody there probably held on one beat too
long onto everything that was happening defensively, and without saying, look,
this league, you, especially on defense, you have to constantly
be churning and hitting the reset and reinventing yourself every
(35:18):
single year. It just demands it on that side of
the ball specifically, and so you can't behold I mean,
we would talk about for years. Hear them holding on
to players, you know, trying to hold on to twenty thirteen,
hold on to twenty fifteen, and we're gonna bring that back,
and Michael Johnson's coming back and Pat Sims and like
(35:38):
you know, it's like, all, well, it was every year
it was a bringing this guy back from that team,
and it was like there is a certain point where
that just becomes you can't do that. You have to
you have to trust your drafts, your valuations, and the
confidence and how you reset things every single year and
view every team as a new team and not as
(35:59):
a recreation of an old team.
Speaker 2 (36:01):
And I think that was probably the lesson that he was,
you know, trying to say there. I think Philadelphia should
be favored in this game on Sunday, Like Philly, I'm
with you. I think it's silly to bet against Patrick
every time you say this, right, and they're like.
Speaker 1 (36:16):
Wait, are we doing it again?
Speaker 2 (36:18):
Are we betting against Patrick Mahomes again? I like this
Philly team. I like their defense roster versus roster. Okay,
just forget history. Mahomes three pete roster versus roster. Philly's better. Yes,
and don't I don't want to say it's not close.
There are Super Bowl teams and the spread is is
pretty thin, but I like, I don't think it's that close.
Speaker 4 (36:43):
Well, but the the you know, it's Mahomes again, it's
the super Bowl. But I go back to Jalen Hurts
played unbelievable in that Super Bowl cup. You're not worried
about him on that stage right, I would. I mean,
if I'm Philly, I don't care what's happened this year
when they're passing, and that's taken a lot of heat
in Philadelphia obviously, But like, I'm not worried about Jalen
(37:05):
Hurts on the big stage because I've seen that show
and it was a heck of a show, and so
I'm not worried about that. I love their defense. Their
defense is in such a better place. It's the perfect
example when we talk about things through the Bengals lens
of get young. Put a bunch of dudes up front
that are young and aggressive and get after the quarterback
and just let it go and believe in your youth.
(37:26):
Quinyan Mitchell and Jalen Carter and Jordan Davis and Nolan Smith,
like it's all dudes that have just been premium draft
picks to broad in there and go and go do it.
And they reset that from what it was a couple
of years ago, where it was a lot of older
guys that were chasing Patrick Mahomes around. And I think
that is where you could see it payoff on something.
Speaker 2 (37:43):
I you know, look, I'm a Bengals fan. I'm supposed
to root against Kansas City, but there's a part of
me that wants the Chiefs to win the title on
a bad call.
Speaker 1 (37:54):
For your content sake.
Speaker 2 (37:55):
The lines won't turn off. My favorite team in the
NFL is the Cincinnati Bengals. My second favorite team in
every sport is chaos and content.
Speaker 1 (38:04):
Yes, so there is nothing.
Speaker 4 (38:06):
There's no button you could push right now right that
would create more castle.
Speaker 2 (38:11):
I want some sort of like egregious It's it's fourth
and seven, Maholmes is you know, about to fling it
out of bounds and the game is about to be
over and they get a reprieve from the guys in
stripes like something like that. Some sort of egregious just
you know, feed the conspiracy sort of call that just
(38:32):
tilts this in favor of Kansas City would bring about
the sort of chaos that I am a huge fan of.
You think the did you see the statement made by
the like head of officiating about Ugh can't believe I'm
having to address conspiracy theories.
Speaker 4 (38:46):
It's ridiculous. How much is he dritting that? Ron Torbert
is the officiales It's like, look, I quit this statement.
Put my face out there. Man, I made a statement
about this whole thing and now we got to count
on Ron to get its right.
Speaker 2 (39:00):
Yep, good luck. But I don't know in the history.
I mean, look, there's always an immense amount of pressure
on any NFL officiating crew, even more so in the
Super Bowl. In this one, though, I'm not sure an
officiating crew has ever had more pressure on it because
if you're the league, like you just the last in
a season where a lot of great games, I mean
think Cincinnati Baltimore, the road game, the great game, and
(39:22):
the next day all we do is talk about one
call at the end of the game. There's been a
lot of games like that this year. You don't want
that in your Super Bowl, but you definitely don't want
that in a Super Bowl where Kansas City benefits from it, Like,
you don't want that. So a lot of pressure on
this crew.
Speaker 1 (39:35):
There's a lot of pressure.
Speaker 2 (39:36):
There's a lot of pressure on every crew. That's just it.
Speaker 4 (39:39):
It's so hard. Yes, but man, you messed this one up,
and it's just gonna be feeding the entire offseas and
you know we're gonna hear about it, Like, I mean,
these aren't even full time employees. Are you gonna pay
they need more training and more overrated trope than make
them full time employee. You think that they all of
a sudden won't make bad call because they in the
(40:01):
summer they sat around and you know, took training sessions
instead of their insurance sales job.
Speaker 2 (40:06):
Wait a minute, My primary vocation is going to be
a job where if I make one mistake, you want
me out? Yeah, hard, pass on that it'll it'll stay
my side. Gig. We're good and a well paying one. Paul,
thank you, no problem. The Growler podcast. I takes many
iterations and readthathletic dot com. Follow Paul on x at
Paul Danner Junior. We we'll see you next week. Looking
forward to it.
Speaker 1 (40:26):
I can't wait. No officials talk next week. We won't.
We won't know.
Speaker 2 (40:29):
Let's need to I hope not.
Speaker 1 (40:30):
No, you do, though, yeah, I kind of do.
Speaker 2 (40:33):
It's five minutes away from four o'clock. Solomon Wilcotts is
going to join us in about ten minutes on ESPN
fifteen thirty Cincinnati Sports.
Speaker 3 (40:41):
Station Cincinnati's ESPN fifteen thirty traffic from the UC.
Speaker 5 (40:48):
Health Traffic Center. Heart disease is the leading cause of
death in the US. If you're at risk. Trust the
experts that you see help for innovative and personalized heart care.
Expect more at uelp dot com. Delhi Avenue closed off
due to an accident between Roebling Road and Rosemont Avenue
that crashed, bringing down wires in the roadway eastbound two
(41:11):
seventy five. It's a disabled vehicle that off on the
exit ramp to northbound seventy one. I at ezek with traffic.
Speaker 1 (41:18):
This report is sponsored by Rapid Radios.
Mo Egger News
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