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February 5, 2025 12 mins
Evan Cohen is one of the hosts of Unsportsmanlike on ESPN Radio. He joined us from the Super Bowl to discuss Joe Burrow, quarterbacks, and why one of his co-hosts keeps knocking Joe Burrow.

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Transcript

Episode Transcript

Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
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(00:28):
fifteen thirty. You here on Sportsmanlike from six to ten.
Obviously getting set for the super Bowl on Sunday in
New Orleans. Which man, that's an early wake up call
for New Orleans. Evan Cohen, Shell Smallman and Chris Canty.
It's good to have Evan with us this afternoon. Evidence.

Speaker 2 (00:46):
It's good to have you, man. What's going on?

Speaker 3 (00:49):
How are you? How's everything?

Speaker 1 (00:50):
Everything's really good. I want to know when you guys
sit down to map out your show, is there just
a Joe Burrows segment every morning you build the show around.

Speaker 2 (00:57):
How does that work?

Speaker 3 (00:59):
Well? This has become such a huge thing for us,
and I don't it's obviously not on purpose. Model You've
been a part of this for so many years on
national radio. It's like, you know you play the hits. Obviously, Yes,
I don't know. I know that any of us knew
the level of hits that Joe Burrow would be. I
could sit here a you know, small than I have

(01:21):
a lot to do with this. We have nothing to
do with this. This is all CC and his Chris
Canty and his analysis of Joe Burrow. Here's what I'll say, Okay,
And I understand that Cincinnati may not love him right now,
I mean can'ty Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:35):
I love you.

Speaker 3 (01:36):
But but but he's been right about a lot of it,
not all, but a lot. He wrote the Bengals off early.
He was right about that. He wrote Burrow off in
terms of the playoffs early. He was right about that.
He said he was not an MVP candidate relative to winning.
He was right about that. Where I think the debate

(01:59):
certainly comes in, it's so whether or not he's elite,
which I vehemently disagreed with CC on that because I
think bro is in that conversation. But long answer to
a short question, but this has become a lightning rod
on our show as you know.

Speaker 1 (02:12):
Yeah, and we cannot thank you enough for doing it
because we get a lot of content out of it.
I've had folks call my show based on the stuff
Chris Canty says on your show, which I'm not sure
it's supposed to work that way, but I'll take it nonetheless, Well.

Speaker 3 (02:29):
That is definitely our goal, and that's why, that's not
why he's doing it. But like, let's be honest, Like
what's going on with you guys in Cincinnati is massive, right,
we understand like your station is one of the biggest
stations in the country, and so if we have legit
takes on your teams that then could trigger other conversations

(02:52):
for other shows. Well, that is doing our job. That
is the biggest compliment you can give me. And not
so thank you, no.

Speaker 1 (02:59):
And you're you're making you're making my job a lot easier.
It is interesting, and I've we've we've we've played the audio.
Your staff is nice enough to send it to me
and I hear it most mornings. I what what I
don't understand with with Joe Burrow as it relates to
this conversation specifically, is it feels to me like you know,
Joe has five postseason wins. You could talk about how

(03:22):
this season he's on the outside looking in as it
relates to Lamar Jackson and Josh Allen.

Speaker 2 (03:26):
That's fine, Like those guys made the postseason.

Speaker 1 (03:29):
Those guys are Their MVP odds are better than Joe's
even though he's a finalist. We know Joe's not going
to win it, but I think the way he frames it,
he does so in a way that would make you
think that Lamar Jackson and Josh Allen have achieved in
the postseason what Joe Burrow hasn't, when in fact the
opposite is true. He has broken through and made a

(03:50):
Super Bowl. He's not Patrick Mahomes. Of course, he still
has yet to win one, and until he does, you
know he's he's kind of included in this conversation about
who is and who is an elite, But he's one
of things in the postseason that those other two guys
you always gets slumped into the conversation with haven't done Yeah.

Speaker 3 (04:06):
And I understand that, And I think, to me, you
may have an easier argument against Josh Allen than you
do against Lamar because of the fact that Lamar has
the two Maybe three MVPs. Let's see if a few
wins the MVP this week, obviously, because that's gonna be
a huge part of this. But if we're gonna go
based on postseason wins without an MVP and a postseason

(04:29):
win against the greatest of this era, well, then if
Jalen Hurts wins on Sunday, though he's above Joe Burrow
based on that logic that you just presented.

Speaker 1 (04:39):
Yeah, but I guess there's different ways of measuring it,
like the eye test. I could watch on film and
go you want Jalen Hurts or Joe Burrow. I don't
think there's many personnel people that would take Jalen Hurts
as as terrific as the player as he has been,
as much as he is on the cusp of accomplishing
something that everybody in Cincinnati wants him to accomplish. So yeah,
in terms of what they have done, Look, Brad Johnson

(05:00):
won a Super Bowl, Joe Burrow has THEMS. Brad Johnson
gonna end up as a better quarterback than Joe Burrow.

Speaker 3 (05:04):
Gret No, But I think, like, so here's here's the
way I've always looked at it. I've always looked at
it as you graduate into US caring about rings. Brad Johnson,
Trent Dilfer. These are not nick Foles. These are not
players that have graduated into US caring about rings. Joe Burrow,

(05:26):
Jalen Hurts, Lamar Jackson, Josh Allen. I believe I graduated
into US caring about rings, and I'll put MVPs because
I think those are the two most important stats, not stats,
but two most important honors. Let's say, top of the
resume for a quarterback. So I just look at Jalen
Hurts's career, and you could say, well, no coach would

(05:47):
take Jalen Hurts over Joe Burrow and isolated as an
individual player, you are probably right. But if I say again,
we're playing at that moment as if there's a win
on Sunday right by the Eagles, and hypothetical, and I'm
picking the seats, so I understand I'm playing both sides here,
But if Darius will win on Sunday, the question I

(06:07):
will pose back to you if I gave you a
roster where eleven starters on defense were B level players
be as in boy which is pretty good, or be
as in Bengals in this case, and ten starters on
offense are B level players, and I gave you one
quarterback and you had to win a Super Bowl that year.

(06:29):
So basically, I'm telling you have good players everywhere if
you want Jalen Hurtz or Joe Burrow.

Speaker 1 (06:34):
I watched Joe Burrow drag a terrible offensive line behind
a terrible offensive line. I watched him get to a
Super Bowl. Now, look, his defense was awesome that year,
specifically in the postseason, they were very opportunistic. I'm taking Joe.
I'm taking the A list quarterback. I'm taking the guy
who won a nine to eighteen put up MVP numbers.
I like Jalen Hurts again, he has a chance to

(06:55):
put on a ring on his finger and then he's
in the club, right, I understand that, But like, I
don't know, he's got Saquon Barkley. Is he the best
player in his own team? It's the best player in
his own backfield. I mean, I still, I.

Speaker 3 (07:09):
Mean, I love Joe Burrow. But again, I'm just playing here.
Here's the point of why I'm doing this. I think
they're more equal than people realize, and so I'm just
going to play the other side of what you just said,
and I happen to love. Remember I'm the one who
hear the borough right right right, I am the also
the Jalen Hurts guy. To be fair, So as based

(07:30):
on your logic, which is fair, right of, I'm not
sure that Jalen Hurts are the best player in his offense.
Has Joe Burrow ever been the best player in his offense? On? Yeah?
I mean he's never played without Jamar Chase or Justin Jefferson.

Speaker 2 (07:46):
His rookie year.

Speaker 1 (07:49):
Say again, his rookie year he didn't have Jamar Chase,
and he played fine his rookie season, which was interrupted
by Okay.

Speaker 3 (07:56):
So the point is, I think what you and I
have done is a fair back and forth where it
is more than logical, fair and thoughtful for you to
take Joe Burrow. I also, period next sentence, believe with
a win on Sunday, it could be fair for me
to take Jalen Hurts. What I think at this point

(08:17):
is really not arguable is we have a top five
in the league. It's Mahomes one, and it's Lamar Jackson,
Josh Allen, Joe Burrow, Jalen Hurts and whatever order you
want to put those guys in if he wins on
Sunday and there's your top five, Jayden Danos phenomenal. CJ.
Shroud phenomenal. But that's your top five. How I look
at it in the NFL right now.

Speaker 1 (08:38):
My take on the conversation itself is that the conversation
itself has to include Joe Burrow, and that is a
reflection of his organization and his team, because look, the
reality is, until he wins one, until they win one,
the who is an elite quarterback conversation has existed my
entire life in yours as well. I used to hear

(08:59):
people have on sports talk radio about John Elway, like
I get it, so until he gets one, when we're wondering, okay,
who are the elite guys?

Speaker 2 (09:07):
Who are the absolute upper tier dudes?

Speaker 1 (09:10):
Like once once you once you've won one, if you're
doing cool stuff, statistically you're in that mix.

Speaker 2 (09:16):
You're there. It's not really debatable.

Speaker 1 (09:18):
What I hate is the fact that the debate even exists,
which is not a reflection of Joe Burrow.

Speaker 3 (09:24):
Yeah, and I understand that, So I think you know
where we go back to this was c She looked
at the word Chris Canty Unfortunately, he looks at the
word elite as the metal count gold, silver, bron Okay, fine.
Other people look at it as like the Mount Rushmore.

(09:45):
Other people look at it as you can't be elite
without a super Bowl title, like when you're talking about
the Lway thing. That's obviously when he went to the
Super Bowl and lost before. Ironically, if we're gonna bring
up the other player thing before Terrell Davis is there
and then he won a couple in no way shape
or for my crediting, Terrell Davis more than John Elway.
Terrell Davis without John Elway is whatever. John Alway without

(10:07):
Terrell Davis is MVP super Bowl, right, Like not super
Bowl MVP, but MVP and a super Bowl. Right. So
I think we're going to go in circles on this.
I think the reality is I disagree vehemently with Kanty
that Burrow is not elite. I do agree with the
concept that kill Burrow maybe five and not four and

(10:28):
not three and not two. Now, Cincinnati, right now, whether
it's you know your listeners, but there are a lot
of them. The boss man DJ Hat's gonna text me,
So look at the playoffs, fats and all that.

Speaker 2 (10:39):
Kind of stuff actually actually sitting in studio. You wanted
to hear this firsthand.

Speaker 3 (10:44):
Well, okay, because he and I have had this conversation
in person, We've had it on the phone and text everything,
and he goes back to and he knows this stuff.
He goes back to the playoff wins again, How then
do you want me to rank Jalen Hursts if we're
going to go back to the playoff wins, because if
he wins on Sunday, that's another one. And listen. The
other thing that I think is it's both factual and frustrating,

(11:10):
is that we always go back to the fact that
Joe Burrow beat Patrick Mahomes. But that was a long
time ago and they didn't win the Super Bowl the
year he beat Patrick Mahomes. So how much am I
supposed to weigh that.

Speaker 2 (11:19):
With each passing year?

Speaker 1 (11:20):
Admittedly less and less, but that's still something those other
two dudes in the AFC haven't done.

Speaker 2 (11:27):
I can't thank you enough.

Speaker 1 (11:28):
Enjoy the rest of the week, and I hope we
can do it again before next year super Bowl.

Speaker 3 (11:34):
I will come on with you every day if you want.
I just don't think you'd want me every day. I'm
bored of myself, So how can you not?

Speaker 1 (11:41):
Not only would would everybody prefer you be on with
me every day, they might just prefer I rerun your
show in the afternoon, So I mean, don't don't open
that Pandora's box. Enjoy the big easy Man. Thanks so much, well,
thank you the best. I appreciate it all right.

Speaker 2 (11:53):
There you go.

Speaker 1 (11:54):
Evan Cohen on Sportsman Like six to ten every weekday
morning on ESPN fifteen thirty. Rick Brooring on the Musketeers
and the Nors and this week's assignment.

Speaker 3 (12:05):
Next Cincinnati's ESPN fifteen thirty.

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Speaker 2 (12:44):
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