11/4/25 - The Mo Egger Radio Show - Mo Egger

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Now your chance to win one thousand dollars. Enter this
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Speaker 2 (00:08):
You found Cincinnati's ESPN fifteen thirty.

Speaker 3 (00:12):
We half what's up to afternoon, mallegor ESPN fifteen thirty.

Speaker 4 (00:15):
Thanks for listening today.

Speaker 3 (00:17):
Hopefully we're having like the most awesome Tuesday of all time.

Speaker 5 (00:20):
It is gorgeous out.

Speaker 3 (00:21):
We're at Oakley Greens, which is where we are every
single Tuesday.

Speaker 4 (00:25):
We're here till five thirty today.

Speaker 5 (00:27):
Out of the way early. We've got UK basketball coming up.

Speaker 3 (00:30):
The Wildcats beginning year two of the Mark Pope era
against Nichols. Nichols State, I believe says in our scheditule
Nichols tip off at seven o'clock. Bumps us out of
the way with pregame show at five thirty. We have
a lot of ground to cover. The NFL trade deadline
is fifty five minutes away. We'll do some MC Cincinnati

(00:51):
stuff in the four o'clock hour, some college hoops stuff
as well. Show preview is available on Twitter at moegar.
Thanks to share Effects Credit Union, become a member now
at share fact dot org. If you haven't been to
Oakley Greens. Yet I do not know what you're waiting for.
I will say this, it is impressive, you know, like
I hang Christmas lights up in my house and it's
it's me and it's maybe a step stool, and it's

(01:13):
not that big of a production. We have like an
entire crew here. There's ladders coming out, there's a big van,
there's stringing the lights out in the parking lot. Like
it is gonna be impressive here by the time they're
done and so cold. You can have a holiday party,
a holiday happy hour, you know, the holiday season. One
might argue it's already here. I would combat that a
little bit, but it's certainly coming. You could do your

(01:35):
holiday party in one of these cabanas if the weather allows,
or you could just post up inside. You can get
a game of mini golf in, you can get dinner.
We've got an outdoor bar and indoor bar. You cannot
beat Oakley Greens. It's in Oakley, so keep that in
mind when you punch it in your GPS. Oakley Greens,
we thank them for having us awesome for watch parties.
You could have a Bengals free Sunday and watch all

(01:57):
the good teams play and see teams that when they
score forty points win the football game. Chances are pretty decisively.
Could watch all those games at Oakley Greens. You can
watch FC Cincinnati on Saturday in the playoffs against Columbus.
A great time will be head at Oakley Greens. A
great time has always had When our friend Paul Danner
Junior joins us. He is busy, he's on trade deadline,
Watchtheathletic dot Com, the Growler podcast.

Speaker 5 (02:20):
You have a lot going on. I'm thrilled that you're here.

Speaker 4 (02:22):
Yeah, I'm happy to be here. This is always one
of my favorite ones every year where I'm like, please
don't make me work during this. But I mean, but
I'm ready. I'm ready. I'm ready. In most years, i'm
just already under the assumption that the ship has sailed
and that and and I've kind of thought I would
feel that way today. But when things start happening like

(02:44):
they have today, you kind of throw all pretty conceived
notions out for a minute and say, Okay, the NFL
is doing crazy things. Yeah, so maybe a crazy thing
could happen, but I'm not counting on it right now.
But the NFL is a little unhinged at the moment.

Speaker 5 (03:00):
Well, Logan Wilson has gone, yeah, that did happen.

Speaker 3 (03:03):
He's been traded by the Cowboys to the or by
the Bengals to the Dallas Cowboys. So he goes from
one awful defense to another slightly less awful defense. Bengals
get a seventh round pick in exchange for Logan. The
barometer for any Bengals trade, or any Bengals maneuver where
they cut a player is whether or not on the
press release there's a quote from somebody and Logan got

(03:23):
a quote from Zach Taylor.

Speaker 4 (03:24):
At what level did this come from? This wasn't gonna
be a Mike Brown. No, the Mike Brown is top
of the line. Uh yeah, you know, I'm still I'm not.
It's certainly not surprising when you consider his situation. It
is surprising when you consider the Bengals breaking from history. Again.

(03:46):
You know, we've never really seen them, you know, do
many in season trades, trades hardly at all. Then this year,
not only did they for the first time trade with
the Browns and go get the quarterback in Joe Flacco,
but now, for the first time ever, they trade away
someone who could help them this year that hadn't sort
of blown up their way out of town. I don't know,
however you view the trade request issued by Logan. I

(04:08):
didn't feel like it was anything. It's certainly in the
vicinity of Carlos Dumbmap or Carson Palmer, but I think
it's a recognition of this might be just an addition
by subtraction. And I don't mean that as Logan is
not a good player. It's look, they've chosen to go
down this road. We're going down this road with Barrett

(04:28):
Carter and Demetrius Knight. And I actually felt like Zach
Taylor essentially announced this trade at the press conference on
Monday when he went onto a long spiel about Sam
Hubbard and the analogy about Sam Hubbard not really feeling
able to put himself out there and really become a
leader early in his career because Carlos and Gino were

(04:50):
in the room with him, and who is he to
speak up? And even though he had a lot of
respect and people understood who he was and he worked
hard and he was everything they wanted to be about
going forward, he could read the room and see, that's
not my place to say anything. You gotta get those
guys out of there for the if you want the
young people to then grow up. And and I feel
like the benching was the beginning of this, and now

(05:12):
this trade is the finalization of this, of saying, we
just want these guys to be our future, and we
think leadership traits is part of that. And you know,
I talked to Barrett today and he said, you know,
to that idea, to that question, the idea of like, yeah, yeah,
I did feel like I need to read the room.
I you know that guy loves Logan Wilson, right, I

(05:32):
mean her, He professed that openly today. Is like it's
gonna be for life what he did for me, and
he was the first person to text him, and so
many things, A ton of respect you. I had so
much respect you. I'm not gonna step on that guy's toes. Yeah,
you you feel a little bit of a need to
go and now you can more fill that space. I

(05:52):
also thought he said the right thing with that of like,
but it starts with playing better, Like you have to
play better. And the truth is, no one's fotollowing anybody
that plays terribly anywhere. Okay, so until that starts, until
they start actually playing better, none of this other stuff matters.
But you know, maybe that if they're hoping that they'll
start playing better and then they'll feel a little bit

(06:14):
more open to let the other stuff start to show
a little more.

Speaker 3 (06:17):
Well, and if you could add a seventh round pick
obviously to the arsenal of selections the Bengals will have
next year, it's just it's just more damage they can
do in the draft.

Speaker 4 (06:26):
It's something yeah, right, yeah, let's let's go down the
what's your favorite seventh round pick?

Speaker 3 (06:31):
Right, let's go down not Kyle Manogi or right, I
mean a guy how do we say his name? Manangay, Manangay,
Thank you, Kyle Manangai. That that's my least favorite seventh
round pick of all the time.

Speaker 4 (06:43):
Pretty good, yeah, pretty good. You know it can apparently
run for a lot of yards when they're there available
to them.

Speaker 3 (06:49):
I could run for a lot of yards against this defense.
So we'll tap the brakes on that just a little bit.
But there's my least the round pick. Yeah, that's that's
that's fair. You were an oudentate guy at one point.
No I was not no, no I I was a T. J.
Hushman zaa guy he was a seventh round packs.

Speaker 4 (07:05):
I think that's a lot of people's favorite seventh round paper.

Speaker 5 (07:09):
So the deadline is forty nine minutes away.

Speaker 3 (07:12):
By my calculation, you have done Tuesday with me for
eleven years. I think that's accurate. Yeah, it's eleven years,
So that's eleven trade deadline Tuesdays. Usually we barely mention it. Yeah,
I detect from you a little pensiveness, Yeah, a little
bit the deadline, like a little bit.

Speaker 5 (07:31):
Maybe something could happen.

Speaker 4 (07:33):
Maybe, I don't know, Like I just think the the
nature of today in the NFL keeps me a little
bit more on edge, in the fact that teams are
hunting and calling about Trey Hendrickson.

Speaker 3 (07:45):
I had.

Speaker 4 (07:46):
The Bengals have been pretty resolute. I've never gotten the
feeling during this and I've written it that they were
ever gonna do that. Yeah, but I think that's because
they knew their asking price would continue to be the
same number that no one has ever been willing to meet.
And so if the league is now doing things where
people are throwing around first round picks, then maybe maybe

(08:08):
that could you could see a desperation move come from somebody,
and we knew anybody that is close to this team
knows that that was the only thing that was gonna happen.
Here would be a desperation a desperation move where the
Bengals feel like they would be pretty big winners in
a deal. Because here's the thing, and I've said this
a million times and why this has never made sense
to me, and it would be the all it would

(08:30):
be the ultimate change is they're just not gonna wave
the white flag on the season, whether you think they
should or not. I just don't see a world where
right now they're gonna wave the white flag on this season.
Giving up Trey Hendrickson would be saying it's over, we quit,
we're not trying. That has never been their philosophy. That

(08:52):
has never been something they would ever allow or really
stand for. Yeah, the Logan Wilson thing is like, again
I talked about it, but it's like it's like a
tiny version of the tiniest version of that. That's a
small departure. B It's why they've never made in season
trades giving up someone who can help them because they're
just not gonna wave the white flag in any capacity.

(09:15):
So for that reason is why it's never really felt
like something was going to happen here because Trey Hendrickson
is the one guy that can actually make things look
different on the defensive side of the ball. If Trey
plays in the second half the last four weeks, they
the last two weeks even they probably win both those games.

(09:38):
He's a closer. It's literally the one still they needed. Yes,
the one skill they made the last two weeks was
what he is, maybe as good at as anybody in football.
Has been here. He has closed out for years. Remember,
you know, Joe Burrow and quarterback, come on Trey, like,
you know what time it is. The last two weeks,
it's been Trey time, and he hasn't been out there.

(09:58):
And they don't have anybody who is remotely like him
or even you know, his New Orleans version of himself.
They don't have anything that looks like that. And so
the games have ended the way they have. I feel
like if they had a full Trey Hendrickson out there,
they would have finished both of those games off and

(10:19):
would be in a different place. They didn't. It doesn't matter.
But if you're talking about, like, how could the second
half look different? I look at the on off splits
this year from Trey Hendrickson when he's on the field
this year and when he hasn't been. And really this
goes back because isn't just the shit, they're just massive.
They're two different, totally different defenses. And so when we

(10:40):
talk about all these historical futility in the second halves
and games in a hole, but certainly in the second halves,
we've seen this over and over again. Trey Hendrickson with
zero second half snaps the last four weeks because he's
gotten hurt in the first half of the two games
he tried to play him. And you see the difference.
You see what's happening, and they just don't have any

(11:00):
answers regardless. No one's saying they'd be great, no one's
saying they'd even be serviceable. But it could be enough
to win when you score forty two, right, and I
just don't see them saying we're gonna take that chance
off the table. That's that's what's felt like the biggest
driver for me in the conversation around him. Before the

(11:22):
last you know, forty.

Speaker 3 (11:23):
Eight hours so we've seen Sauce Gardner get traded by
the Jets to the Colts.

Speaker 5 (11:27):
Two first rounders involved.

Speaker 3 (11:29):
Is that move in particular, the one that is giving
you slight pause as it relates to what they may
do with Trey.

Speaker 4 (11:36):
Yeah, I mean I think both jets. I mean the
Quinn Williams to Dallas, which I have a thought on
at some point if you want to hear it. Yeah,
But like I think that that is the thing that Okay,
teams are out here. You know, there's right, it's the
it's the FM pick's mentality, starry with threads. I think
there's there's lots of the Jags, Like there's just teams

(11:58):
that are just so much more will to say, you
know what, let's go now. It feels accessible. The super
Bowl feels on the table for Seattle, for Indianapolis, for
Dallas at three five and one. You know they're sitting
here saying, let's go for it now. Sauce and Quinn
in The difference for them is they're under contract for

(12:19):
multiple years and Hendrickson is clearly a rental. But if
a team feels like they really want it that, I
think that gives you pause when you see the aggressiveness
level happening. It's a sense around the league that the
Super Bowl can be taken by a team that makes
the right move today.

Speaker 3 (12:36):
Is Trey the only current Bengal that's on your radar
as it relates to a possible deal, Yeah.

Speaker 4 (12:44):
I think so. I mean there are others that I mean,
there's really very few players I wouldn't I mean, I
wouldn't trade DJ Turner. No, and that might be it
on defense, right, like, oh, on defense? That is it?

Speaker 5 (13:00):
Yeah, I'm not The list is DJ Turner. The list
is DJ Turner.

Speaker 4 (13:03):
I'm keeping Uh, that's and that's pretty much you know,
that's probably it I would listen to. I mean, you
would think maybe somebody like Osai or a bj Hill
would have some kind of if anybody was just looking
for depth or whatever.

Speaker 3 (13:17):
Yeah, maybe, I mean McKinley Jackson, our teams beating down
the Bengals not.

Speaker 4 (13:21):
Quite hadn't seen that yet. Look still still still poking around,
though there's still time. We got forty two minutes for
the the Jackson rush.

Speaker 5 (13:31):
Would then this might be a stupid question.

Speaker 3 (13:34):
Would a Cam Taylor Britt or a Dax Hill illicit
interest from a team that's like, you know what, they're
still upside, we can fix them.

Speaker 4 (13:41):
Yeah, I think Dax would. I think there's enough there
with Dax and and maybe maybe someone would look at
Cam and say, give me a shote. Maybe that's where
lou Ana Rumo's conversation started with Chris Ballard in Indianapolis.
He's like, look, I don't know. If you can't get
me Cam, I guess okay, right, like I guess, will

(14:01):
you Google go that way? Maybe that's how that began. Yeah,
I think that there would be I don't know. I
don't think so. I mean, it's it's hard for how
does anybody watch the tape?

Speaker 6 (14:13):
No?

Speaker 4 (14:14):
You know, and it's like, I think that's gonna put
us over the top.

Speaker 5 (14:17):
No, there are none.

Speaker 3 (14:18):
I mean, but I there are times where a move
is made involving a player where you're like, man, that
guy's no good, and the team that acquired to me go, okay,
they must have had a great grade on them, and
they think in a different system they can get more
out of them. And Cam, Taylor, brid and Dax Hill
struck me as players that someone may view through that lens.
But I certainly didn't wake up this morning think they're

(14:40):
gonna trade me one of those guys.

Speaker 4 (14:41):
No, and you know, I mean, you know. The Cam
roller coaster is well documented I think they feel like
maybe they're on one of those good upswings with Cam today.

Speaker 5 (14:51):
A lot of ball to go.

Speaker 4 (14:53):
Yeah, yeah, no, we know what comes up. It's like
when the chain's pulling you up the hill. It's not stopping. Okay,
it doesn't just keep going up into the clouds. We
know that we know what comes on the other side.
But I think that there's a feeling like, Okay, maybe
there's some stability with with dj and and Dax and
if they can start to get CAM back on the

(15:13):
right track at least for right now. But that's all.
That's kind of a separate story.

Speaker 5 (15:18):
Forty one minutes away from the trade deadline.

Speaker 4 (15:20):
Oh, Ken, you need like a clock sounder, a tick sounder.

Speaker 3 (15:24):
In years past, I think we've had Tarren play some
sort of obnoxious you know, horn Blair or something that
we could we can get that, And no, you.

Speaker 4 (15:30):
Don't want I'm not a horn Blair guy.

Speaker 5 (15:32):
No, it has to get people's attention.

Speaker 4 (15:34):
I just think a little clock, there's a little ticking,
that's all.

Speaker 3 (15:37):
Do you want the ticking in the background for the
duration of the top of your I mean maybe going
maybe something in some of your buyers tear little teasers
that you do. Taryn Tarren producing back and Ken We'll
he'll have something ready for us. It is twenty minutes
after three o'clock trade deadline. Is it for Paul Danner
Juniors with us?

Speaker 5 (15:55):
Till then?

Speaker 3 (15:56):
We are here at Oakley Greens until five thirty today,
hanging out on a gorgeous Tuesday afternoon on ESPN fifteen thirty,
Cincinnati Sports Station.

Speaker 2 (16:06):
Cincinnati's ESPN fifteen thirty. Traffic from the.

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(16:32):
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Speaker 2 (16:42):
This report is sponsored by This is Football in the NATI,
brought to you in part by Postman Law and Vice
Skyline Chile on ESPN fifteen thirty to the official home
of the Cincinnati Bengals five after three o'clock.

Speaker 3 (16:59):
This is ESPN fifteen thirty Bulegger with Paul Danner Junior
from the Athletic dot Com and the Growler podcast, which
I get to be a part of tomorrow.

Speaker 4 (17:07):
Yeah, that's fun.

Speaker 5 (17:08):
Tomorrow Trade deadline recap, Yeah, sort of thing. No, just no,
I think.

Speaker 4 (17:13):
Jay and I are are doing live tonight at seven thirty, okay,
and we're gonna do trade deadline stuff and the normal
PD and Jay. So I can watch that on YouTube
to catch up. And now then I'm we're just gonna
see where you and I go tomorrow. That's why those
are my favorite shows. Those are my favorite shows with
you and when when we just sort of turn the
mics on and and just go with a discuss this.

(17:36):
Let's see where this goes.

Speaker 5 (17:39):
So it's Trade Deadline right four o'clock.

Speaker 4 (17:41):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (17:42):
With every passing minute, I see you looking more and
more relaxed.

Speaker 4 (17:45):
I'm getting I'm getting there. I'm getting there. It's always
Nerve racking.

Speaker 3 (17:50):
Who is making the decisions for the Bengals today in
the front office, it's Duke Tobin. Yes, who will be
making the Bengals decisions tomorrow.

Speaker 4 (18:00):
Duke Tobin was making the Vegals decisions. Smile.

Speaker 3 (18:02):
Mike Florio, Pro Football Talk says, quote, there's bubbling up
now the duke Tobin is going to be out, maybe
during the bye week, maybe sooner.

Speaker 5 (18:10):
Heads are gonna roll in Cincinnati. What do I do
with that?

Speaker 4 (18:14):
Well, first, I didn't know it was Floria season already
that we had to go said, Yeah, he's like a
he he's like a winter guy comin.

Speaker 5 (18:23):
Yeah, yeah, you need.

Speaker 4 (18:23):
The first snowfall till it's Floria. It's a little early.
I will say, if there was one person on earth
that would not know this answer, it might be Mike Floria.
But I just you know, I don't think that he
has connections inside of the building that way. I I

(18:47):
do not look that we're in We're in the chaos
times right now. Okay, this is there's a lot going
on in terms of the team. Has we haven't seen
it be in this shape. You know, the last time
it was in this shape. The move was about Marvin
Lewis and they made the move, and you know, it

(19:08):
was sixteen years and so much of that and then
things were it was the good times. It was the
good old days after that, so we haven't really Duke
has never been in the crosshairs like this, and his
role has never really been challenged at any level like this.

(19:30):
In terms of that, I don't, you know, it just
feels that feels like an aggressive thing to say. First
of all, as soon as the bye week is literally
right now, So you're saying this person could be fired
anytime from today to the end of the earth. Okay,
as soon as right now he could be fired, and

(19:57):
then anytime after that. Right, I think that there's Yes,
he's under the microscope. You and I have talked about,
talked about this last week. Yes, So I don't like,
I don't want to have to keep doing this every week.
I understand that we have to right now because of
you know what Mike said, But like I just feel like, yes,
there is more focus. Yes, I think there's more cracks

(20:19):
here than we've ever seen. But it's just would still
be so stunning. He's still part of everything they believe
in as an organization and what he's been such a
central part of everything there. I think everything is on
the table right now because of the nature of we've

(20:40):
just never seen anything quite like this, and you've put
it perfectly I've heard you talk about this multiple times
of look like, this is your job to fix this defense,
and it's just gotten so much worse. It feels so unrecoverable.
And it's all because of so many of these picks
are not panning out. And at what point and the

(21:04):
free agent things that have happened, Like, at what point
does all of this just pile up where it's just
for the betterment of everybody that you try doing something different.
I think the logical side of it is no one
is gonna contend with that. It's just the reality side
of what it actually happened. I'm not buying that just yet.
I'm just not. But you know that anybody can, anybody

(21:29):
can say that things are bubbling up, and no one
will care if they don't, no one will call back
to that.

Speaker 3 (21:35):
I think there's bubbling up amongst US fans. It's bubbling
up that's undeniable. Yeah, there's a pretty sharp difference between
bubbling up here with idiots like me and bubbling up
among people who are in a decision making capacity at
pay Court Stadium. Yes, and there's no distinction in what

(21:56):
Mike is referring to, Like bubbling up is that in Cincinnati,
their mad Duke Tobin.

Speaker 4 (22:00):
Yes, yes, the main roll. Yeah, I don't. People aren't
just gonna come out of this thing unscathed, like obviously,
but who is that? I mean, there's there's levels to this,
as they say, I mean, and and I just think that's, uh,
that's a level that is I mean, it takes unprecedented
times and here we are, right, So so I'm not

(22:22):
I don't want to sit here and rule anything out,
but like it that doesn't it certainly didn't land or
really register with me as something that I feel like
makes a whole lot of sense in this in this
exact way.

Speaker 3 (22:35):
I have a few questions kind of related to this specifically, Okay,
but I do want to get a break and let
me let me ask you this though before we pause.
So last week we talked about it feels like this
is really the first time where Duke Tobin is in
the public's crossairs, and you said, you know, this is
the first time, and I'm paraphrasing here, this is the

(22:57):
first time where it's plausible that maybe they do something,
but still so unlikely that if they did it, it would
be shocking. Would you frame it the same way after Sunday.

Speaker 4 (23:09):
Yeah, I mean, you can only take so many of those. Yeah,
I mean, I still I still think that at at
the end of the day, you know, there is a
a patience and a need to see everything play itself out.

(23:32):
And maybe some people say it played out like we
saw it. You know, this is it. It's it's been,
it's played. But there's that's always that's always, even going
back to Marvin Lewis here, you know, I feel like
it's let's see the whole book. Mike in the family
are let's see the whole book before we judge it,
and let's not go in and so doing it now

(23:54):
before a lot of these young players that they're clearing
the decks for have a chance to show the level
of improvement they're looking for, would be again just crazy,
out of character. And maybe that's what they I mean,
there's a lot of arguments about that's what they need.
I think most people would make those right now, but

(24:18):
I'm trying to speak in the reality of how realistic
I think it is. It would be stunning and out
of characters still even to me, even after even after.

Speaker 5 (24:28):
What happens, it's got twenty seven minutes.

Speaker 4 (24:30):
Counting it down. Where's the ticker? I'm listening. I don't
hear it.

Speaker 5 (24:33):
Terren's working on it.

Speaker 4 (24:34):
He's working on it. He's trying to find that. They're
trying to find the ticker anything on this here internet.

Speaker 5 (24:40):
Well, yeah, you're right. I don't have a joke. But
terrens I'm sure he's working on it.

Speaker 4 (24:44):
Oh, yeah, he's got it.

Speaker 3 (24:45):
Is twenty seven away from four o'clock and the trade deadline.
Paul Danner Junior from The Athletic and the Growler podcast
Live tonight at seven thirty with Jay Morrison.

Speaker 5 (24:56):
There it is.

Speaker 4 (24:56):
Oh, look at that comings. I knew you'd come through, Tarran, Yeah,
I knew it. Man. If that can happen, anything can.

Speaker 3 (25:03):
Happen anything, literally anything. Possibilities are endless. Sports headlines coming
up were in Oakley Greens on ESPN fifteen thirty, Cincinnati
Sports Station.

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Speaker 8 (25:27):
Here at since three sixty, there's no shortage of things
to talk about, whether it's the Bengals search for a quarterback,
the Bearcats Search for Supremacy or the Red Search for Offense.
Listen to since E three to sixty weekdays at noon
on ESPN fifteen thirty.

Speaker 2 (25:44):
Cincinnati's ESPN fifteen thirty Traffic from the.

Speaker 7 (25:49):
a care plan fast meet with a specialist. In today's
call five one three five eight five UCCC. On the
Ohio side of westbound two seventy five, there is a
disabled vehicle on the entrance ramp from seventy one. The

(26:10):
right lane blocked off on the ramp.

Speaker 5 (26:12):
What's their pike?

Speaker 7 (26:13):
Also an accident at Oak Street in slow traffic northbound
seventy five. Mitchell the paddock, I'm atie zelek with traffic.
This report is sponsored by.

Speaker 3 (26:22):
Cheval home of lifetime powertrain protection and guaranteed credit approval
from their family to yours for life, Kelsey chev dot com.
Logan Wilson has been traded by the Bengals to the
Dallas Cowboys, Cincinnati getting him return a seventh round pick
in the twenty twenty sixth draft. Clearly that player will
be a franchise altering acquisition. The trade deadline is in

(26:45):
twenty one minutes. We'll see if Cincinnati acquires any more
draft picks for Duke Tobin to waste. Bengals have a
bye this week. They're in Pittsburgh week from Sunday. Take
on the Steelers on ESPN fifteen thirty. Former UC star
Sauce Gardner traded by the New York Jets to the
Indianapolis Colts, where he gets to be coached by lul Anarumo.
In exchange, indiescends to the Jets a pair of first

(27:07):
round picks. Kentucky Basketball tonight on ESPN fifteen thirty. Kentucky
Battling Nickel State pregame show at five thirty. Tip all
tonight at seven pm right here on ESPN fifteen thirty.

Speaker 4 (27:19):
Who you think won the battle between Duke Tobin and Louannarumo.

Speaker 3 (27:21):
Mo Hemo, This team is seven to two. I know
he gets to coach Sauce Gardner.

Speaker 4 (27:28):
I'm didn't have to.

Speaker 5 (27:29):
Move very far.

Speaker 4 (27:29):
He just keeps getting great players thrown into his laugh.
He's on it. They keep winning.

Speaker 3 (27:34):
They don't have to be great defensively. They can do
lou Anarumo ben but don't break, which statistically they do.

Speaker 4 (27:39):
And then everything you want to happen. When you have
a blow up that leads to you leaving a job
or you get fired, you just want the other place
to be in shambos stress. That's all you want. You
just want your all your former co workers and friends.
You want them to be calling you being like, this
is a disaster. You just want to hear all the
horror story. And so I just you gotta feel like

(28:01):
he just like goes he collects his w cracks open
a cold on the couch. He's like, let's watch some
Bengals highlights, right like, and just sits up every Sunday night. Uh,
and then then waits for the call Chris Ballad to
tell them that they're giving him sauce Gardner. It's just
an embarrassment of riches for for lou over there right now.

Speaker 3 (28:23):
A few more questions about Tobin, okay, and maybe what
it would look like if they did move on. We
haven't had a de facto general manager search.

Speaker 4 (28:33):
What would that look like? I mean, well, I think
you probably in the meantime, you would probably have one
of the three agms would step in, right, You'd have
Trey Brown or Steve Orusivik or Mike Potts, they're they're
there right. Trey has has notably interviewed for GM jobs

(28:53):
across the league. He'd be familiar, Like if you were
doing something like that, you probably would would start there
and then open up. I don't know. I mean, we've
never and it's so this is the heart, it's so gray.
There's so much unknown onto what any of this would

(29:14):
look like. And truthfully too, like, you know, is Mike
gonna be like we need a new guy, like because
there's it's a unique situation there where they like Duke
for the fact that they it's a very tough relationship
to manage with him and the family and the football

(29:36):
aspect and what Mike still does and what he does
and his role and all. It's just all of it
is really hard to step into and have a feel for.
So I I don't know that anybody could sit here
and say they would know what that would actually look like,
you know, because we haven't ever really seen it.

Speaker 3 (29:59):
When this possibility has come up, even when it has
seemed extraordinarily unrealistic, many have countered with who would want
that job? Is that a fair way to look at
it because of what you just outlined.

Speaker 4 (30:15):
I don't know. I think a lot of people would
do you want patients and job security? You know? I
mean do you want? I mean they have when new
head coach like Zach Taylor is coming in, they have
given him rain to do a lot of things that
he wanted to do. They've been willing to make changes.
They have been a bit adaptable as an organization, specifically

(30:36):
comparison to previous times. You have Joe Burrow like it's important. Yeah,
I mean, you have the hard stuff here in place
in a lot of ways, I don't think. And the
biggest problem that many gms in this league face is

(30:57):
feeling like they have to make moves for their jobs
and you don't have to do that here. You can
play the longer game the same way that Baltimore and
Pittsburgh do and and in the success that I think
that those two teams and the Bengals have had in
this division in comparison to like, you know, when you
see the the interchanging that happens with Cleveland or a

(31:18):
lot of other places that are unstable across the league.
Is part of what would make a job like that
one that people would want everybody. Everybody has a challenging
ownership situation in some way, Like there's only so many
openings that happen where it's like, oh, but the ownership
is just clean. It can be no issues there. You're

(31:39):
gonna that's that's that's the NFL man. You gotta you
got it the same way we used to talk about
this with Marvin Lewis and and and the job is
as much about managing up as it is managing down.
You have to be able to make all sides work
and get your vision across, like that's gonna be part
of that here, the same as it would be in
any market that has an NFL team in America.

Speaker 3 (32:02):
One more on this and then I will ask about
other things. So Florio says heads will roll. You don't
disagree with that. So if Duke Tobin's head is not
the most likely to roll, whose.

Speaker 4 (32:14):
Head will be rolling? Well, I mean we know Zach
Taylor is on the seat. You have to be in
some capacity. I mean we talked about this the moment
they let go of a Luannarumo, like you only get
to do this once. And so I think that's clear.
Even with all the things happening offensively that have been good.

(32:38):
You know, he's not gonna to me. We're at the
point where you're not judging him for that as much.
We've established that you can have good offenses, yes, and
you can do it apparently with multiple quarterbacks that both
times he's been given backup quarterbacks besides Joe Burrow. It's
been remarkable what they've been able to do offensively. What
they're doing right now is a masterclass. But the bottom

(33:00):
line is, and you know, I asked about this on
Monday specifically because of this is you know, what are
what are you gonna do to help the defense? And
the answer is that's not my specialty, Like I'm here
to help. And they're building the thing and things that
that that they find tough and challenging as an offense.
At a certain point, as the head coach that this

(33:20):
team has to fix their defense. They have the quarterback,
like you have the quarterback that can that can make
your offense go. You you need people that can figure
out what's going on defensively, and too often, uh, the
defense just hasn't been able to figure itself out in here.
And so if if that's the direction that you're gonna

(33:40):
look at things and say, Okay, let's pair a defensive
head coach with with Joe Burrow. Then maybe then maybe
that's you know, you could see that being a direction
that that you would want to go. That's worked before.
You're thinking Brady Belichick all that type of stuff, right,
and and you can maybe go forward some in that way.
But that's that's part of the conversation. That would be

(34:01):
the heads. I mean, this is what you're where you're
when you reach historical levels, when when every week is
a new set of five or six things, this league
has not seen triangles the sixty six New York Siety
six Giants. Jay had a stat with like the twenty

(34:22):
one like a team I'd never the Takawanda something's I
was like, they didn't even have like a forward pass
at that point, Like when you're when when these are
the comparisons where this is all we can find that
has ever looked like this. Yeah, like everybody of any
importance in the building is under fire. There's there's no doubt.

(34:45):
And that doesn't mean that we know how it's gonna go,
but yeah, it's it's everybody.

Speaker 3 (34:51):
You wrote after the game about going into the locker
room and not a lot of defensive guys wanted to talk.
Some did, and you pointed that out. You reference there
being laughter in certain corners of the locker room. How
sharp of a departure was that on Sunday from other
similar low points with that side of the ball or

(35:12):
even the other side of the ball since you've been
covering the team.

Speaker 4 (35:16):
Uh, A decent amount. I mean, the the the lack
of fire and the lack of seriousness that you felt
over there. They just the guy, the people that you
did see or hear from felt sounded beaten down and demoralized.
And then you had a lot of young players who

(35:37):
just didn't seem to think that they had any real
reason to care about certainly us not they not they
only anything that every time Like, no, this is not
about taking stock, right, But this is about that. It
is about comparing to what it looks like when teams
do pull out of it and not that right. So
my my thing is I felt like and I don't know,

(35:59):
like what with Chase Brown is kind of a separate
story that I I just I wanted to see where
are the players not just Sunday, during this entire downfall
of this defense. That sound like Jamar Chase, that sound
like Chase Brown. I don't care if your emotion comes
out right or wrong. I want to see it. Yes,

(36:22):
where is it where? That's what you usually get right
before it gets to the beaten down, demoralized portion of
the program. You usually see the like dude who wants
everyone to know this ain't me and I hate that
this is where we're at and we got to get
this and maybe they maybe, Man, these players only meetings
are just just tearing the paint off the wall. I don't,

(36:44):
you know whatever, I don't is there gonna be another one?
I mean, I feel like you just keep having bye week.
It was one thing that I that I was looking
for when I walked in the locker room today and
you know exactly what it was, punk table, ping pong table.
I said, no, it was nothing to change the ping
pong table. Maybe next Okay, after the bye week, after
a week of retrospection, they came back and said, we

(37:05):
think we've got it. Ping pong table. Right, Maybe that's
where they go next to it. I mean, but that's
my point is is I feel like you usually see
the blow up, the emotion, the like fire in the
form of some kind of weather. It's anger, even if
it's misplaced, or like guys getting at each other a
little bit more like there just really hasn't been hardly

(37:26):
any of that over there. It's just felt like a
went wrong again. Yeah, we missed the tackles and we
just got to keep working at it and we're gonna
get it right, and we're looking for leaders, and it's
just where's the fire?

Speaker 5 (37:41):
Yeah?

Speaker 4 (37:42):
Where?

Speaker 5 (37:42):
Where?

Speaker 4 (37:42):
Where are seven guys on defense that sound and look
like Jamar Chase and Chase Brown and some of the
other people and and you know, it's just it's not
that that has to be the way out, Like there's
you want to be smarter and more constructive in the
way that you deal with your problems, but it has

(38:03):
to start with the true fire and want to be
better and feeling pushed and driven to just not accept
any of what's happening on your watch as a player,
and that just where is that where is Like I'm
not right, that just hasn't really existed yet to this point.

(38:23):
You want the defense to be as angry as the
offense seems to be.

Speaker 3 (38:27):
What I feel bad about, among a lot of things,
is because there's just so much stuff happening here. We
don't have enough time to examine the difference between the
quarterback ball and the kicking ball.

Speaker 4 (38:38):
Oh I got to see them side by side too. Yeah,
they're like they're from different sports. It's unbelievable, right, how
different they are. I never would have thought that they
really were that different. It looks like if you put
a football next to a rugby ball or whatever. Yeah,
I mean it's they're totally different. They feel different, they
are shaped different, they're the leather, all of it is

(38:59):
like totally rougher and different. Yeah, it's it's unbelievable.

Speaker 5 (39:02):
But the Bengals hosted demonstration for you so they can
make it.

Speaker 4 (39:06):
Yeah, they showed me. They showed me the two side
by side.

Speaker 3 (39:10):
Why why White cut the long snapper, touch it and
go huh? Does the scoring play call a time out?
Are you allowed to do that? I know they once
once the offenses on the field, they put the quarterback
ball in the field, they're not gonna swap out the ball,
but are you allowed to call it out the.

Speaker 4 (39:23):
Discretion of the sideline referee? Weather Because they don't get this.
They don't want to be caught being the ones when
the CA ball has to come in to have to
toss it and want their like referee to be juggling
it and unable to get it. So they make it
their discretion whether they have to restart the play clock
or not. And the last thing they want have to
do is restart a play clock apparently no matter what.

(39:44):
So that includes like not running out there with the
ball and handing it to them or anything like that.
They just say, Nope, not gonna get the CA ball
in and they and they rule it off and you
have to go. You have to go play with it
and unless you unless you do stop the clock or whatever,
and like, uh, this happened with this happened with Tennessee. Yeah,
with this big part of Brian callihan situation. They took

(40:05):
a delay and had to kick a sixty two yard
to get the other ball in there. They're so different now.
The difference is way bigger this year than ever has been.
But I'm like, okay, So the referees don't want to
look dumb, so they make the kicker look dumb right
insteady like, you know, way more the coach look dumb
for having the offense on the field on fourth and
thirteen and then oh you know what, maybe we want

(40:25):
to kick here and that that whole thing was a mess. Yeah,
it was an absolute mess, right, but the bottom line
is like this should not be about this also should
not be about restarting the play clock, like look, get
the get the right ball is yes, you know, and
then to me, can you just have can can will
Wagner have the kick caball under his arm at all
times and be able to go run out there and
hand it to the official.

Speaker 3 (40:46):
He's that should the long you're on the field for
this one play. You have the ball and if you
can't bring the proper ball out then your team suffers
because of it.

Speaker 5 (40:56):
You will handle the CA ball. Yes, we solve this.

Speaker 4 (40:59):
The job job by us.

Speaker 3 (41:00):
Wait again, but we're like out of time, But you
wanted to say something about that, Quinna Williamstrang.

Speaker 4 (41:04):
That's what I would have done if I were the Bengals. Yeah,
I would have traded Trey Hendrickson. Use the compensation you
get back from trading Trey Hendrickson to help fuel a
deal for a real player who's going to be here
for multiple years going forward, and help fix your pass
rush right now and for essentially the same amount of
money that you already have. Trey Hendrickson, Like, if you're
paying him right now, it could help you know you

(41:26):
you have that money available if you ever have done
an extension with him at one point, can you be
the de facto GM. I'll apply. We still come here
on Tuesdays, I'll be I'll be so accessible. I'm gonna
be at the bye week. Then forget the bye weekend.
After the season, every game, I'm here every Tuesday day

(41:47):
from three to four. Yeah, that's it. It's it's GM Tuesdays.
Your bosses will love GM. Yes, all right.

Speaker 3 (41:53):
Tonight seven thirty special Live Growler podcast, Paul and Jay
talking about everything swirling around the team, the Logan Wilson trade,
a trade that may come in the next six minutes.

Speaker 4 (42:05):
Bubbling general, bubbling, general, bubbling. Yeah, we guys have any
bubbling with you? We might, we might We need it
this season at this point I've never needed needed bubbles
in good by week for the bye weekn Yes, I
have right now? All right?

Speaker 3 (42:18):
Check that out tonight seven thirty YouTube and where you
get your podcasts and uh Repauldeathletic dot com.

Speaker 5 (42:25):
We're at Oakley Greens. Paul, thank you so much.

Speaker 4 (42:27):
Pleasure.

Speaker 3 (42:28):
I'm here at all five thirty. We've got a lot
of Bengal stuff to get to. FC Cincinnati is getting
set for Saturday. Sasha question from MLS's a past. Apple
TV is going to join us in just about ten
minutes on ESPN fifteen thirty Cincinnati Sports Station.

Speaker 2 (42:42):
Cincinnati's ESPN fifteen thirty Traffic from.

Speaker 7 (42:47):
The UC Health Traffic Center. The Lung Cancer Rapid Access
Program at the UC Cancer Center is built to give
you a care plan fast meet with a specialist. In
twoday's call five one, three eight five u CCC. On
the Ohio side of westbound two seventy five, there is
a disabled vehicle on the entrance ramp from seventy one.

(43:09):
The right lane blocked off on the ramp. What's their pike?
Also an accident at Oak Street in slow traffic northbound
seventy five. Mitchell the paddock. I'm at e Zelk with traffic.

Speaker 8 (43:20):
This report is Dad's win.

Speaker 2 (43:23):
Enter it now ESPN fifteen thirty.

Speaker 3 (43:26):
No, it's five minutes after four o'clock. This is ESPN
fifteen thirty. Opolegger, thank you so much for listening today.
There is a lot going on here at Oakley Greens
by the way, awesome place on Saturday evening to watch
FC Cincinnati versus Columbus Game three, the final game. FC

(43:46):
Cincinnati could not close out Columbus in Game two on
Sunday night, so pivotal decisive Game three six o'clock is
your kick. You can watch it here on MLS Season
Pass on Apple TV, watch it at home on MLS
Season Pass on Apple TV. And what a great Saturday
of MLS soccer. You're gonna have FC Cincinnati and Columbus

(44:09):
and if the Orange and Blue win, they're gonna take
on either Miami or Nashville. That series has gone to
a Game three that immediately follows the Hell is Real tilt.
So MLS Season Pass is gonna be very busy Apple TV.
The Great Sasha question kind enough to join us to
talk about the series.

Speaker 4 (44:24):
Sasha, it's good to have you.

Speaker 5 (44:25):
How are you?

Speaker 6 (44:26):
And I'm good?

Speaker 4 (44:27):
How you guys doing?

Speaker 5 (44:28):
We are well?

Speaker 3 (44:29):
So FC Cincinnati kind of came on glued on Sunday,
and I think if that's a game in June, you
can do what Pat Noonan said and just kind of
forget it right, burn the tape how much more concerning
was that performance given the stakes of the game.

Speaker 9 (44:46):
Yeah, it was concerning. I think that Columbus came out
and played the game like it could be the last
game of their season, and they fought hard and Cincinnati
didn't match that intensity whatsoever, and so they were sent,
you know, they were sent, you know, to the showers,
I think, with a disgusted.

Speaker 10 (45:05):
Taste in their mouth after the game.

Speaker 9 (45:07):
And I do kind of agree with Pat Noonan that
you just burn the tape and you say, hey, guys.

Speaker 6 (45:11):
Listen to or die time.

Speaker 9 (45:13):
Now, the mentality has got to be better. But also
if you just look up and down the pitch, I
don't think anybody on Cincinnati can say that they gave
everything they had in that game and that they played
up to their usual level.

Speaker 11 (45:23):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (45:23):
I guess that was my takeaway, right.

Speaker 3 (45:25):
Columbus played desperate FC Cincinnati the exact opposite of desperate, which,
like I get it, they had the breathing room of
having a one game to none lead, But this.

Speaker 5 (45:34):
Is the playoffs, it's a rival.

Speaker 3 (45:37):
This trip between these two teams is often not tilted
in FC Cincinnati's direction. In games like this, I walked
away disappointed. From just how it looked. If you compare
the two teams on Sunday.

Speaker 9 (45:49):
Well, I think every FC Cincinnati fan should be pretty
upset and pretty disgusted with the effort.

Speaker 4 (45:56):
You know.

Speaker 9 (45:56):
Obviously, I think when they come back home and play
at TQL State and the fans are going to be
behind the team and there they're going to be that
twelfth man. They're going to be loud, they're going to
be supportive, and I think the Cincinnati players will thrive
off of that. But there were just a lot of
performances up and down the starting eleven that you can
just say that's nowhere near good enough in a game
where you can eliminate your biggest opponent, your biggest rival

(46:19):
in State Darby, and it just was not good enough
at all.

Speaker 3 (46:23):
And it was glaring to me because I thought in
Game one, while it was just a one goal game,
they were in control. You know, Columbus didn't possess the
ball as often as they do. FC Cincinnati didn't feel
like it was helter skelter those final twenty twenty five
minutes once they took the lead, And so the performance
on Sunday was sobering on a number of levels. I
guess the comparison to Game one being one of them. Tactically,

(46:46):
is there an adjustment you'd like to see Pat noon
to make.

Speaker 9 (46:50):
No, I don't think it's tactical. I think it's gonna
end up being personnel decisions for him. Obviously, Kubo is
now suspended, So who plays on the left? You know,
does he go with Angle, who's a little bit more safe,
or does he go with Orishano, who's a little bit
more attacking and gives you a little bit more talent
on the field. Alvis Powell started in that game. I
don't think we see him start again. He was not

(47:11):
very good. So if Hagland is healthy, I would put
him straight back into the lineup. Otherwise then he's got
another decision to make. Us to who plays as his
third center back. If Wobado is healthy and you think
you can get seventy minutes out of it, does he
go back into the lineup. So Pat Newton's got some
big decisions to make personnel lies. But tactically no, I
think in Game one they played very good. They were

(47:33):
totally in control. Like you said, they probably should have
scored two or three more goals in that game. But
they never really seemed threatened.

Speaker 5 (47:42):
The East.

Speaker 3 (47:42):
We have three series coming down to a game three,
beyond Philadelphia closing out Chicago into how do you handicap
the remaining two series in the East beyond FC Cincinnati
and Columbus.

Speaker 6 (47:53):
So Inter Miami.

Speaker 9 (47:55):
I thought going into this series against Nashville they would
wipe the floor with them. But then Nashville played very
good in Game two, also played with a great mentality,
a bunch of fire playing at home, you know, behind
their home fans, and they got themselves back into it.
So I know now going into Game three, I think
Miami is going to have some doubt creeping into their minds.
They're going to think back to last season when they
got eliminated by Atlanta in this same round in a

(48:16):
big upset, So that one's going to be close, But
I do think that Inter Miami is going to prevail.
Then we've got Charlotte against New York City, which is
a tough one to handicap because this game is the
series has been so tight.

Speaker 6 (48:28):
They've played one hundred and eighty minutes.

Speaker 4 (48:29):
And scored one goal.

Speaker 9 (48:31):
It may come down to just a difference maker, and
it's hard to bet against Charlotte FC at home this season.
They've been so good now that Wilfrid Zaha is back,
I give the edge to Charlotte.

Speaker 3 (48:42):
You've got three game threes on Saturday, a game three
on Friday, another one on Sunday. It's going to be
an extraordinarily exciting weekend. Certainly a lot of fun down
at TQL Stadium. FC Cincinnati and Columbus. That game starts
at six o'clock. All the playoff coverage all weekend long
LS season pass, Apple TV. Sasha, we appreciate the time, man, Thanks.

Speaker 4 (49:03):
So much, Thanks so much.

Speaker 9 (49:05):
Talk to you guys soon.

Speaker 5 (49:06):
You got it.

Speaker 3 (49:07):
And you know for FC Cincinnati and Columbus kind of
takes center stage here in Cincinnati. The Bengals don't play,
Bearcats don't play. I think the weather for Saturday should
be pretty good. Six o'clock game, massive party on the
West end of Cincinnati.

Speaker 5 (49:21):
If the Orange and Blue prevail, not so much. I guess.
If Columbus gets the.

Speaker 3 (49:26):
Win six o'clock on a Saturday, you can listen to
that match on Fox Sports thirteen sixty. We are at
Oakley Greens where you can watch that game, where you
could also watch your favorite college basketball team.

Speaker 5 (49:38):
You know, UK plays tonight.

Speaker 3 (49:40):
Last night we had Cincinnati, we had Xavier, we had NKU,
we had Dayton, we had Miami play.

Speaker 5 (49:45):
Last night, Ohio.

Speaker 3 (49:46):
State played a game where the two teams combined for
two hundred and thirteen points. Go watch your favorite college
basketball team here at Oakley Greens. We talk often about
like you could post up and watch football here. You
can a full NFL slate on Sunday minus the Bengals,
all the college football games. But it's a great place
to watch college hoops all season long, indoors or out.

(50:07):
By the way, I have never seen people work harder
to put up holiday lights, like I might hire these
dudes to like do my house because I like having
holiday lights up. I don't like putting them up right.
Number one, everybody in my neighborhood always has an opinion.

Speaker 5 (50:28):
You know, I have a white lines. They didn't get
any blue or red? Is that all you got?

Speaker 3 (50:32):
I just want to hire these dudes to put up
my lights. See if I can contract them out. They
are putting up holiday lights also while we are here,
and now we announced this yesterday. We're excited. This is
gonna last for a little bit more than a month,
we are sut up for the Ultimate Fan Cave Giveaway
thanks to Sim's Furniture.

Speaker 5 (50:49):
Now, this is how this works.

Speaker 3 (50:51):
SIMS Furniture has given us this prize package of a
power recliner fifty five inch television TV console that's got
an electric fireplace so you can put your TV on
it and then turn it on. It'll heat up like
your entire house. You can snuggle up next to it,
an area rug I'm a big area rug guy. And
also an end table with a built in speaker. All

(51:14):
of those things together that's like a three thousand dollars value.
SIMS Furniture has given it to us to give away
while we're doing this Number one. You can go to
any of the five Greater Cincinnati area SIMS Furniture stores
and they'll give you a QR code and you click
on the QR code and you sign up.

Speaker 5 (51:30):
And you're good.

Speaker 3 (51:31):
Or you can come to one of our live broadcasts
like this one here at Oakley Greens hold your phone
up to the QR code. I just show my mom
over the weekend, had to do a QR code as
in Salt Lake City. My mom lives pretty close to
Salt Lake City. And we went to a restaurant where
the menu was a QR code, no idea, So I
had to show her So this would not maybe be
ideal for my mom. Plus he's not eligible. But scan

(51:54):
the QR code. You could do it here at Oakley Greens.
You could do it when we're out at other establishments,
or just go to any Sim's Furniture store. And we're
drawing the winner on December the seventh, so you can't
beat that. And again, like think about it. You can
redo like your entire living room or your basement, your
man cave, if that's what you want to call it.
We thank SIMS Furniture for hooking us up. If you

(52:16):
can't get to Oakley Greens, we'll take it with us
to the next established We broadcast from Thanks to Sim's
Furniture for hooking us up with the Ultimate fan Cave
giveaway fourteen minutes after four o'clock. That was a painful
twenty minutes, by the way, showing not even twenty maybe five,
showing my mom how a QR code works, Like I mean,

(52:39):
you know, she's asking, can I get a paper menu? Like, no,
we don't have paper menus. It's on your phone. I
don't know how to do that, like you literally your camera,
hold it click, you're there, just just a comical display
of trying to think of the right word here age,
we'll call it age. It is a quarter after four.

(53:00):
NFL trade deadline is coming gone and unless there is
something breaking late, Trey Hendrickson is a Bengal, and so
or a whole lot of the other players not name
Logan Wilson. Logan Wilson's been traded. Chances are you know
that Trey hend Logan Wilson's been traded. Trey Hendrickson, to
the best of our knowledge, has not. So status quo

(53:22):
remains for everybody but Logan Wilson. Let's talk about the
guy that we are probably not going to hear from
this week, but we should. Next on ESPN fifteen.

Speaker 2 (53:30):
Thirty, since this is Football in the NATTI, brought to
you by Modern Office Methods, on ESPN fifteen thirty, the
official home of the Cincinnati Bengals.

Speaker 3 (53:44):
Twenty eight minutes after four o'clock. This is ESPN fifteen thirty,
Am Bollwegger. We're broadcasting today from Oakley Greens which is awesome.
It's awesome that we're here Oakley Greens is awesome. Bob
from Bowling Green is awesome. We're gonna talk with him
in just a second, just a quick again. The NFL
trade deadline is coming gone. Logan Wilson traded this morning

(54:05):
to the Dallas Cowboys, who played just.

Speaker 4 (54:07):
Last night on Monday Night Football.

Speaker 3 (54:09):
Sauce Gardner has been sent by the Jets to the
Indianapolis Colts in exchange for a couple of first rounders,
which is an interesting transaction.

Speaker 5 (54:18):
Then there's the story.

Speaker 3 (54:20):
Mike Florio said this on Pro Football Talk that there's
bubbling around the Bengals that has him wondering if Duke
Tobin is going to be employed much longer, and he
says heads are going to roll in Cincinnati. I'm ready
for a fresh start, and I speak, I'm a fan.

(54:41):
I'm ready for a fresh start. I don't love using
a public forum like this to talk about how people
should lose their job. Among all the things in my job,
which is the best, ever, the only thing I really
don't like doing is saying that somebody should be fired
because I would like it, and let's like that. But

(55:03):
I'm just ready for a fresh start, and I think
it's there are times in a in a franchisees evolution
where it just it feels like it's best to hit
the reset button and not do it to punish anybody,
not do it for any vindictive reason, just because what
you're doing isn't working and it just might be time

(55:24):
for somebody else to give it a shot. My guess
is Duke Tobin's going to be employed by the Bengals
at the end of the season. We'll see what that
might mean for Zach Taylor. But this, when it comes
to player acquisition and roster construction isn't working. Does Duke
Tobin have things that work against him because of how

(55:46):
the Bengals just historically have done things, or how the
franchise is structured, or how they maybe don't have the
human resources so to speak, that other franchises have, of course,
but much of that might not change. If you're Duke Tobin.
You have a job with a certain responsibility to get

(56:06):
the job done within those parameters, and if you can't,
then I think you have to give somebody else. This
isn't about punishing. I think sometimes in our business, and
I think sometimes as fans, we just we want bloodlust,
like somebody's got to pay for when something goes poorly.
I am completely uninterested in that. I'm interested in the

(56:26):
Cincinnati Bengals winning a championship while they still have a
dude at the most important position. I'm interested in watching
them not waste what they have. And I just I
have zero faith in the person in charge of the
roster being able to get that done. If he's the
guy next offseason, I certainly hope he does a hell

(56:48):
of a job with the draft, with free agency, with
roster construction. I just don't know how you could look
at the job that he has done in the draft
and the way the team has performed with his roster
over the last couple of years and legitimately feel good
about the direction of the Bengals are going in. If
status quo in the front office remains, that's it. Twenty

(57:10):
three minutes after four o'clock. Uh five three, fifteen thirty
is our phone number. We are actually guest free until.

Speaker 5 (57:18):
Five twenty today.

Speaker 3 (57:19):
We got time drewby right now, Bob and Bowling Green,
thanks for hanging on. You're on ESPN fifteen thirty.

Speaker 6 (57:26):
Hey Mom, how are you well?

Speaker 5 (57:28):
How about yourself?

Speaker 11 (57:30):
Doing good? Doing good?

Speaker 3 (57:32):
Hey?

Speaker 11 (57:32):
I watched you thieve game last night, and speaking of
roster construction, I really like what they've done. The The
only thing that kind of messed me up last night,
mo Is I was watching the game and there was
a dada, a day day and a and a bapa,
and I thought, why don't we get Jelly Jones and

(57:53):
Tuffy Kennedy to show up and we could have a
version of Sestameate Street or something.

Speaker 7 (57:58):
You know.

Speaker 3 (57:58):
It was at one point Dotta fouled Baba, and we
pointed that out in the broadcast last night. Yes, very
international flavor, very international flavor to the Bearcats. I thought
the good outweighed the bad.

Speaker 5 (58:15):
I didn't love.

Speaker 3 (58:16):
I didn't love how Western Carolina held its own on
the glass. I think they had fourteen offensive rebounds. You know,
you recognize at the pace that Wes wants his team
to play, you're gonna have to put up with some slop.
But the fifteen turnovers I thought were a little bit
much because it didn't feel like Western Carolina really forced
many of those turnovers. But Sean Abayah was certainly impressive,

(58:38):
Boba Miller was certainly impressive. At one point, Western Carolina
was trying to initiate its offense, and they had Boba
Miller at six foot eleven guarding the ball, and Western
Carolina was trying to set a ball screen for him,
and had they switched seven foot two, Mustafa Chom was
going to pick up the ball handler. That's not the

(59:00):
sort of scene, the sort of thing we've seen Bearcat
Biggs be able to do in a very long time.

Speaker 6 (59:07):
Oh, that's for sure.

Speaker 11 (59:08):
And actually somebody who's able to take the ball five
figs from the basket and score.

Speaker 3 (59:15):
Yeah, somebody who's been able to take the ball five
feet from the basket. And I think the thing that
was most impressive to me watching Bob Bob Miller especially
was somebody because I thought I thought we'd see Dylan
Mitchell do this last year. Somebody who could grab it
off the glass on the defensive end and then handle
it himself right and bring it up the floor and
initiate the offense and not need a guard to come

(59:37):
circle back to the basketball. They had a sequence also
last night where there was a rebound, two passes without
the ball hitting the floor and a current crease of three.
Now he didn't make the shot. It felt like it
was a little bit rushed, but all off season long,
I think a lot of us have. You know, it's
inevitable you compare what you're doing now to what happened

(59:57):
the previous year. And I think you and I have
talked about this. Last year, it felt like Wes Miller,
they just let's acquire dudes, and we'll figure out who
can do what once they get here.

Speaker 5 (01:00:08):
It feels like this year.

Speaker 3 (01:00:09):
They really went out to build a roster where the
pieces fit and where roles could be a little bit
more clearly defined. And while maybe there's not the kind
of you know, role definition in November that there should
be in January, I do feel like watching last night
you got a sense of who is supposed to do what.

Speaker 11 (01:00:28):
Well, that's true, Mo, and I think more importantly, and
I know we've talked about this. I think at least
with Buck Harris and probably Creasa and maybe some other
guys as well. You got some guys in there that
I think we'll fight a little bit. And I don't
mean physically fight, but yeah, some tough guys.

Speaker 4 (01:00:49):
You know.

Speaker 3 (01:00:49):
We talked about that in the broadcast last night. Kirkriesa
when he was playing at Arizona, I was lucky enough
to fill in for Dan when they played Arizona in
the Maui Invitation, and the Arizona broadcasters told me, by
the end of the night, you're going to hate kerk Crisa,
and they were wrong because it only took about five
minutes before I hated him.

Speaker 5 (01:01:11):
It has been years, It has been years.

Speaker 3 (01:01:14):
Since you see has had that type of player that
the other teams fans love to hate because he gets
under your skin. And I think with Buck Harris, and
I am worried about his wrist because you know, he
came out of the game last night and there was
no real answer as to the severity of it, but
there was a there was a level of competitiveness. I

(01:01:35):
watched him play at West Virginia and then what we
saw last night, there is a level of competitiveness and
tenacity on top of just how good he is guarding
the basketball that they haven't had from an individual player
in quite a while, that they badly could have used
last season, and we saw a little bit of that
last night.

Speaker 11 (01:01:56):
So there's no no word on Harris yet.

Speaker 3 (01:01:59):
No, it was interesting he was holding it. Then he
got fouled on the play where he hurt his wrist.
He shot a free throw and it was an ugly
looking free throw. He then came out of the game,
went to the locker room, came back and sat on
the bench, went back into the locker room. And the
only thing that Wes would really say is, man, I

(01:02:19):
really hope he's okay, because I think he realizes how
important he could be to the team. And then from
my perspective, you just go, okay. You had an injury
during the preseason with Jalen Haynes, and then an injury
in the first game of the season. If that ends
up being the sort of thing that lasts a while,
it's like, you know, we're a game of the year
and you're already down two guys. That's not a good omen.

Speaker 11 (01:02:39):
Hey, well, I'll tell you one thing. The big men
they have coming off the bench, McKinley and the guy
from France last year, they both have.

Speaker 6 (01:02:49):
Been McKinley's case, I didn't.

Speaker 11 (01:02:51):
Know if he had improved, but he's a good ballplayer,
I think, and the other kid has improved a lot.

Speaker 3 (01:02:56):
Yeah, Tyler McKinley's first college basketball game last night. Local
guy who got hurt didn't play last year. By the
end of the season. He was doing full scale workouts,
looked like he knew where to be right, you know,
look like and frankly, that's what you're looking for from
a young big who's going to come off the bench, Right,
does he look like he knows where to be?

Speaker 5 (01:03:18):
And he did.

Speaker 3 (01:03:18):
I thought, by and large, that was a good first game.
I've watched a lot of season openers where it looks disjointed,
and that's you know, during the era where teams brought
back all their players pretty much all new guys except
for two, and it didn't look disjointed.

Speaker 4 (01:03:34):
Last night did not look bad.

Speaker 11 (01:03:37):
Hey Moe, thanks again for your uh for the ability
to speak with you.

Speaker 4 (01:03:41):
I appreciate it.

Speaker 5 (01:03:42):
Bobb. It's always a pleasure to hear from you. Thanks
so much.

Speaker 3 (01:03:46):
Four thirty, ESPN fifteen thirty U see wins last night.
The Bearcats played Georgia's State on Friday, Xavier. It was
a struggle. Richard Patino after the game said he you know,
he wants blowouts. He also talked with us last week
about his how aware he was of the fact that
you couldn't take a victory over Marist For granted, I

(01:04:10):
think it's gonna be a tough year on Victory Parkway.
And I'm not the first or only person to say that.
Rick Brooring was with us last week and it just
it's year one, which is tough. It's it's a roster
that I look at it and I'm not sure who
the best players are supposed to be. They got out
of there with a win last night. Lemoyne coming up

(01:04:31):
on Thursday. We will see and like I'll say that,
and I'm the UC guy, so to be thrown back
in my face as we get closer to the Skyline
Chili Crosstown shootout.

Speaker 5 (01:04:41):
But the consensus is it's going.

Speaker 3 (01:04:44):
To be a tough year for Xavier basketball. I'm not
sure anything last night, anything was done last night to
kind of dissuade anybody from going along with the consensus.
Twenty nine from five o'clock, I want Duke Tobin to
do with a what a former boss of mine once did.
I'll explain next on ESPN fifteen thirty.

Speaker 2 (01:05:03):
You've been listening to football in the NATI on ESPN
fifteen thirty, the official home of the Cincinnati Bengals. Cincinnati's
ESPN fifteen thirty Traffic from the.

Speaker 7 (01:05:21):
UC Health Traffic Center The lung cancer Rapid Access Program
a care plan fast met with a specialist in two days.
Call five one three five eighty five UCCC northbound seventy
one seventy five. The entrance ramp from US forty two
in Florence is shut down due to an accident. Police

(01:05:42):
have also got the right lane blocked off on seventy
one seventy five and on Corby Street. An accident at
Beachmont Avenue on at Eazelic with traffic.

Speaker 2 (01:05:52):
This report is.

Speaker 7 (01:05:53):
Cincinnati's sports station ESPN fifteen thirty headline.

Speaker 3 (01:06:00):
There a service of Kelsey chevro Leigh home of lifetime
powertrain protection and guaranteed credit approval from their family to
yours for life kelseyshev dot com. Logan Wilson traded by
the Bengals to the Dallas Cowboys. That means there's only
one Logan Wilson remaining playing football in Cincinnati. He plays
for the Bearcats. Logan Zach Taylor says, quote, I appreciate

(01:06:24):
everything he's done as a player and as a person
during his time in Cincinnati. He has been a central
part of our defense over the past six years and
He'll be remembered as a leader in our locker room.
I wish him the best moving forward. Good luck to
Logan Wilson in Dallas. Cincinnati gets a seventh round draft
choice in next year's draft. The Colts have acquired former

(01:06:46):
UC star Sauce Gardner from the New York Jets in
exchange for a couple of first round picks. New York
also sending Quinn Williams to Dallas.

Speaker 5 (01:06:57):
What else do we have? College basketball? Tonight?

Speaker 3 (01:07:00):
Kentucky battles at Nickel State, tip off at seven pm.
Pregame coverage at five thirty on ESPN fifteen thirty. Year
or two of the Mark Pope era underway. The Wildcats
lost their second exhibition game to Georgetown last week, twenty
away from five o'clock. I got folks waiting on hold.
Should we talk to those folks or should I give

(01:07:21):
another Innan Duke Tobin take. I teased the Duke Tobin take,
but instead I'll talk with Matt. Matt, you're on ESPN
fifteen thirty. Matt, good afternoon.

Speaker 9 (01:07:30):
How are you kid yourself?

Speaker 3 (01:07:32):
Mam?

Speaker 5 (01:07:33):
I've never been better? What's going on?

Speaker 4 (01:07:36):
So?

Speaker 6 (01:07:37):
I have a question for you?

Speaker 12 (01:07:39):
As a big Cincinnati fan and a lifelong follower. What
job do you think is harder to do or would
be harder being a Reds GM and Nick Krawl and
always having his hands tied financially as he said today
the payroll will be the same next year as it

(01:08:02):
was this year, Or a guy like Duke Tobin, where
we want to get better but we refuse to get better.

Speaker 5 (01:08:11):
Which job do I think is more difficult?

Speaker 3 (01:08:14):
I think the job of baseball general manager is inherently
more difficult than football general manager for the simple reason
that if you're a football general manager, you're you're drafting
guys that I think it's a little bit easier to
tell whether or not. Now again, take this with a
grain of salt, because Duke Tobin recently has failed, but
you're drafting guys for them to help you right now.

(01:08:34):
Baseball general managers, you know, players come through minor league
systems faster than ever before, but you're still really relying
on in many respects on whether an eighteen or nineteen
year old kid is going to end up being a
good mature adult at twenty five.

Speaker 5 (01:08:51):
Does that make sense?

Speaker 3 (01:08:53):
So I just think, like inherently, I think inherently that
job is more difficult now Duke Tobin has Joe Burrow
to build around, and part of what makes like all
the criticism aimed at him, I think very very valid,
is like, Dude, the most significant thing in sports you
have solved. I was talking before the game on Sunday

(01:09:13):
with a Chicago Bears fan cause I was we were
doing the show from the Holy Ground. We were talking
about Caleb Williams, and I'm like, in my adult life,
you've never had like a legit franchise quarterback. Jay Cutler
filled that role for a while and they went to
a super Bowl with Rex Grossman. But from the time
that Jim McMahon got done in Chicago to now, it's

(01:09:35):
been a revolving door of okay quarterbacks, pretty good quarterbacks,
quarterbacks you thought were maybe gonna be the guy. There's
no uncertainty here. Duke Tobin has that, dude, And so
the hardest thing to get, the hardest mystery to solve,
is solved for Duke Tobin. And so I don't know
that such a thing exists in baseball. I don't know

(01:09:55):
that Nick Krawl has that.

Speaker 4 (01:09:56):
So I.

Speaker 3 (01:09:59):
Think Nick's John job is a little bit more difficult
because of the inherent just nature of the job. There
are financial inequities that are in place that you don't
necessarily have to the same degree in the NFL. And
if you have quarterbacks solved as an NFL GM, then
I think half the job is done for you. I
don't think such a thing applies to Nick or any
of his fellow baseball gms.

Speaker 12 (01:10:19):
So as in Duke Jovin's position, why not get rid
of Trey Hendrickson for some draft picks. Instead, you're going
to not pay him next year because you're unlikely to
franchise tag M or could they franchise tag.

Speaker 3 (01:10:34):
Am They could franchise tag them. I don't know at
this stage why you would. I think they set an
asking price that nobody wanted to meet. Like, I don't
know if this was we're not trading trade no matter what,
although if we found out that that came from ownership,
it would be unsurprising. I think they set the asking

(01:10:54):
price too high. I do think it's interesting that we
saw first round picks get moved today. Indy sent two
to New York. I think there would have been teams
they were engaging with teams. I mean, I haven't talked
to anybody who has who has said that the Bengals
just wouldn't talk to teams about Trey Hendrickson. I think
they've been talking with teams about Trey Hendrickson for a while,

(01:11:15):
but there's been an unwillingness to come down from their
asking price. I think you or I would have said, Okay,
we're not getting a one for a guy who's gonna
play half a season and has spent time not playing
because of a hip injury. I would have taken almost
anything for Trey Hendrickson. Duke Tobin and perhaps the people
that he works for obviously do not agree.

Speaker 12 (01:11:36):
First round pick outside of Joe and Jamar that have
actually been worth a thing. I mean I would have
been happy with a couple of twos or threes.

Speaker 5 (01:11:46):
Yeah, I went draft Capital.

Speaker 3 (01:11:48):
I'd have taken Day three picks for him now, I think,
and Paul was talking about this with us before. The
Bengals have always shown an unwillingness. Like in twenty nineteen,
they were at the trade deadline. They had Andy Dalton,
who clearly was not going to be the quarterback moving forward.
They had already benched him. They had Aj Green, who

(01:12:08):
could play, but really was refusing to They still had
Geno Atkins, they still had Carlos dung Laft, They had
a bunch of players that were not going to be
a part of the team. By the next time the
Bengals were good and at Ozho to eight, they didn't
trade any of them. So to me, it's unsurprising that
at three and six the lens they view this through says,
we still have a shot, and as long as we

(01:12:29):
have a shot, we're not trading players that we think
can help us win. I think you and I would say, dude,
watch the team. They can't stop anybody. The defense is
maybe the worst ever. Your schedule is incredibly tough. Over
the next couple of weeks, you're gonna have to finish
six and two just to get to nine wins, and
that certainly doesn't seem possible. But the Bengals historically, much
to my frustration and I'm sure yours, have never viewed

(01:12:53):
things that way. The Duke Tobin has said famously it's
not my job to help other teams, and while there's
certainly some truth to that, I do think it's your
job to be realistic and get a jumpstart on a
future that has to be brighter than your present, which
you're not winning right now. Why not get a jumpstart
on what's next by accumulating as much as much draft

(01:13:13):
capital as possible.

Speaker 12 (01:13:17):
You know, my twelve year old and me watched the game,
and he was so excited the other day when they
hit forty two. I looked right dead in his eyes,
and I said, I looked at Joe Space when they
showed him on the sidelines that he's telling you forty
two is not enough.

Speaker 5 (01:13:31):
Uh huh.

Speaker 12 (01:13:32):
And I said, he's looking at him, he goes, forty
two is not enough, And I'm telling you forty two
isn't enough. And I said, when when do you look
at somebody and say, how is forty two not enough?

Speaker 4 (01:13:42):
Uh huh?

Speaker 5 (01:13:44):
A week after?

Speaker 12 (01:13:48):
Who does that fall more on ownership or does that
fall on the leadership of Duke Cobin and Dat Taylor.
I mean, I don't know whose hands are more to
blame here, and I think everybody's kind of had all that.

Speaker 3 (01:14:02):
Yeah, And so you know, to me, I'm less interested
in blame than I am. What's next. Ownership's not gonna
change right to not selling the team. They're probably not
gonna suddenly shift their their philosophies. Although they have done
some things in recent years that historically don't associate them
with Ownership's not gonna change. Duke Tobin is the person

(01:14:22):
in charge of the roster. Duke Duke Tobin is the
person in charge of player acquisition, trades, the draft. There
are people who work underneath him, and you could certainly
make the argument that Duke would be better equipped if
he had more people working for him, But at the
end of the day, he is in charge of the roster.

Speaker 5 (01:14:38):
I'd come back to the offseason.

Speaker 3 (01:14:40):
They had a terrible defense last year, a defense that
cost them four games where they scored thirty points and
still lost, and they didn't do enough to it. They
haven't drafted players who can make an immediate impact. They
were not that active in free agency.

Speaker 5 (01:14:59):
They they.

Speaker 3 (01:15:01):
Kept a lot of players who I think we looked
at last season and said, not sure if I can
count on that guy. They didn't add a safety, that
position stunk last year. They didn't add a corner. That
position wasn't very good last year. And Duke Tobin, you
talked about the draft. If you look at this decade,
he's it's not like they haven't drafted any good players.
Te Higgins is a good player, Jamar Chase is a

(01:15:23):
good player. Evan McPherson's a good player, Chase Brown's a
good player. None of those dudes played defense. It's been
a whole bunch of Miles Murphy's and Cam Taylor Britz
and Joseph Osie and Dax Hills. Like we're still talking
about guys they drafted years ago waiting to see what
they could do. So now moving forward, Okay, Duke, we're
gonna have to lean heavy into the draft to fix

(01:15:45):
the defense. He hasn't been able to do that yet.
Why should I count on him to do it moving forward?

Speaker 12 (01:15:51):
Is he would be the classic person that I would
say is a definition of insanity doing the same thing
over and over and hoping and get any the same results.

Speaker 3 (01:16:03):
Yeah, and look I will Duke Tobin was the Executive
of the Year a number of years ago and deserved
it because he built that defense that in twenty twenty
one got the team to the Super Bowl. But how
he built that defense was throw money at it.

Speaker 6 (01:16:17):
You know.

Speaker 3 (01:16:17):
People said they overpaid for DJ Reider, and my take
on it was they had to.

Speaker 4 (01:16:22):
They had to.

Speaker 3 (01:16:22):
Overpay to get good players to play here, and Duke
was able to throw money and give Chadobie Woozier and
Von Bell and Mike Hilton and Trey Hendrickson greatest free
agent acquisition ever.

Speaker 5 (01:16:33):
Duke was responsible for that.

Speaker 3 (01:16:35):
If this coming offseason he said, you know what, they're
gonna be able to just throw money at the defense,
I'd say go ahead and let him do it.

Speaker 5 (01:16:41):
But they can't. Now, Joe Burrow's not on a rookie
contract five years ago.

Speaker 4 (01:16:45):
He was.

Speaker 3 (01:16:46):
Jamar Chase is not under a rookie contract five years ago.
He was, same with t Higgins. So the way they
have to build the defense moving forward is the same
way that Duke Tobin has tried to build the defense
over the last couple of years and has failed. Why
would I give somebody repeated opportunities to do something that
they have proven they're not good at.

Speaker 12 (01:17:07):
So, in a fantasy world, one more thing before I
get off, I'm sure you gotta get going. In a
fantasy world. Let's say the Bengals do the right thing.
That is, in a fantasy world, getting rid of Duke
Tobin and getting rid of Zach Taylor. Who would you
look at as a replacement for the two. Do you

(01:17:28):
look outside the organization for both? Do you look at
former players?

Speaker 4 (01:17:34):
No?

Speaker 3 (01:17:35):
What I want to do is I want to mine
the most well run and consistent franchises in the sport
and interview people.

Speaker 5 (01:17:43):
Who work for them.

Speaker 3 (01:17:45):
Like the Baltimore Ravens are always good. They always have
good rosters. Now they have years where they're not very good,
but the cycle doesn't seem to trap them in these
long stretches where they're awful.

Speaker 5 (01:17:57):
The Kansas City Chiefs.

Speaker 3 (01:17:58):
The Kansas City Chiefs didn't suddenly get good when Patrick
Mahomes took the field. They were a playoff team every
single year starting in two thousand and thirteen when Andy
Reid became the head coach. What about that franchise has
allowed them to fix defficiencies, stay relevant, win championships. What
about what they're doing in Detroit where two teams have

(01:18:20):
hired coaches from that organization, They seem to have a
terrific roster. I would look, and it's not guaranteed to
work right because for years people try to hire folks
who are with the Patriots and hey, we're going to
be like New England. But to me, in any if
you're ever hiring right, and you're looking for people to
I don't know, lift your franchise or lift your company to.

Speaker 4 (01:18:43):
Higher heights.

Speaker 3 (01:18:45):
I'm looking for folks who are getting it done or
helping get it done in elsewhere for you know, places
that are what I want my company or my organization
to be.

Speaker 12 (01:18:55):
And I think you've hit the nail on the head
when it comes to that. You need a GM and
a co coach that are on the same page. And
I don't think that that is the case in Cincinnati.

Speaker 5 (01:19:07):
It doesn't feel like it.

Speaker 3 (01:19:08):
I think what would be fascinating, and Matt, thank you
very much for the phone call. I think what would
be what would thank you? I think what would have
been really interesting would be if if you could somehow
get Zach Taylor to speak truthfully about how about how
he has felt about a number of decisions the Bengals
have made in relation to the roster. I also, quite frankly,

(01:19:29):
think it would be fascinating to see what this past
offseason would have looked like had they stuck to their
original plan as it relates.

Speaker 5 (01:19:36):
To t Higgins.

Speaker 3 (01:19:38):
But yes, and I think one of the more interesting things,
like if you want to remove Duke Tobin, which I'm
certainly not opposed to. The new guy is probably gonna
want some say into who is head coaches. You know,
remember when Zach Taylor got hired, the Bengals made a
big deal about how this was Duke Tobin's call. Now,
I do not believe for a second it was one

(01:20:00):
one hundred percent Duke Tobin's call. But if you're going
to hire somebody to be Duke Tobin two point zero,
that person, I'm sure is going to want to hire
his or her own head coach. Seve it away from
five o'clock. We're at Oakley Green's short show today done
at five thirty. UK basketball bumping us out of the
way our guy Sean Sayat's Tats and Scheme podcast. I

(01:20:21):
do want to spend a few more minutes on Duke
Tobin and why I wish he was like a former
boss of mine. Coming up on ESPN fifteen.

Speaker 2 (01:20:27):
Thirty Cincinnati's ESPN fifteen thirty. Traffic from the.

Speaker 7 (01:20:33):
a care plan fast meet with a specialist in two days.
Call five one three five eighty five UCCC northbound seventy
one seventy five. The entrance ramp from US forty two
and Florence closed down due to an accident. Police and

(01:20:55):
tow are there on the scene. Also got an accident
on Beachmont Avenue at five five Mile Road. Police are
over there as well, on that zelk with traffic.

Speaker 10 (01:21:04):
This report is sponsored by Staples.

Speaker 1 (01:21:07):
Your chance to win one thousand dollars. Enter this nationwide
keyword on our website. Money, that's money.

Speaker 2 (01:21:14):
Enter it now ESPN fifteen thirty.

Speaker 3 (01:21:17):
He said, what's up. This is ESPF fifty thirty on
my legs. Thank you for listening, much appreciated. We are
broadcasting from Oakley Greens. We are done thoroughly today. UK
basketball is coming up in twenty five minutes as the
Wildcats take on Nichols.

Speaker 5 (01:21:33):
There's a dog marking.

Speaker 3 (01:21:34):
We've got folks signing up for the SIMS Furniture Ultimate
Fan Cave giveaway, which you could sign up for. You
can you can come see us at any one of
our live broadcasts, which those are better than debt broadcasts.
You could sign up here in Oakley Greens. We're here
every single Tuesday. We love Oakley Greens, which we're gonna
talk about here in just a second. Or you can

(01:21:56):
go to any one of the five Sims furniture stores
in Greater Cincinnati and win a power recliner, a fifty
five inch TV, a TV console with an electric fireplace
and area, rug and end table with built in speakers.
Folks are signing up. It's insane, So get out here
to Oakley Greens. We'll here for another twenty five minutes.
It's also the bud Light five o'clock Happy Hour. Thanks

(01:22:17):
to our friends at bud Light, I've got an ice
cold Bengals branded bud Light can enjoy a cold one
for the duration of the show. And Oakley Greens obviously
is awesome. They are putting up a beer Keg Christmas tree,
which is pretty damn awesome.

Speaker 5 (01:22:36):
And now I want one of those in my house.

Speaker 3 (01:22:39):
Great for holiday parties, you know you're starting to think
about holiday parties. You can rent a cabana, you can
hang out. We're in the outdoor area, but it's heated,
so it feels great. Tons of TVs. You can watch
FC Cincinnati this weekend. You can watch good NFL teams
this weekend because the Bengals aren't playing. Just have a
blast here at Oakley Greens. By the way, you get
food here at Oakley Green, we never talk about food.

(01:23:00):
Sliders at Oakley Greens are top notch. So come on out.
We don't have a ton of time. Sean say Hat
Statson Scheme Podcast and the Stats and Schemes newsletter is
gonna join us from Sumer Sports in just a few minutes.
We'll grab another phone call or two here in just
a second. Bengals have traded Logan Wilson to the Cowboys.
They did not trade anybody else. This is the bye week.

(01:23:23):
There's no game this week, and many will go, well,
you know, this is a good opportunity for Duke Tobin
to speak. And I don't know that Duke Tobin is
gonna say anything that makes any one of us feel better.
I don't know that he could offer an explanation that
is legitimately gonna make any one of us feel like,

(01:23:43):
you know what, things are fine, We're okay here, Trust Duke.
Let him pick the players next year. I don't think
that's gonna happen. But if I were him and Duke
Tobin is made available at the combine, I know some
of the folks who cover the team have have done

(01:24:04):
one on ones with him.

Speaker 5 (01:24:05):
At the Senior Bowl.

Speaker 3 (01:24:07):
I think he's made available during that mock turtle soup
thing they.

Speaker 5 (01:24:10):
Do every July.

Speaker 3 (01:24:11):
And then that's like it. And you know, for the
most part, I have no issue with that doesn't matter
to me. It's not like Duke Tobin when he talks
is some like magical content machine. But on a human level,
if I was Duke Tobin, I would watch my head
coach have to answer questions about the team that I

(01:24:33):
put together. Three times a week during the season. Zach
Taylor has to talk after the game on Sunday, it's
got to talk again on Monday.

Speaker 5 (01:24:42):
He's got to.

Speaker 4 (01:24:42):
Talk again on Wednesday.

Speaker 3 (01:24:45):
He's got to answer questions, and he's gotta answer questions
that he should have to answer, you know, his own
coaching and play calling and personnel decisions during the game
and all that sort of stuff. An NFL head coach
is essentially the spokesperson for a particular franchise. If I
Duke Tobin, I go, you know what, this dude every
week has to answer questions for a roster that I

(01:25:05):
put together, for a roster that is underperforming. And then
you know, to a lesser degree, Al Golden's made available
and say what you want about Al, but he has
made available, and Al is complicit. He's the defensive coordinator.
It's arguably the worst defense of all time. And so
you know, should he be held accountable? Of course he should.
But and I'm watching players. I'm watching Jamar Chase and

(01:25:25):
Chase Brown have to answer questions about a defense that
I put together. If I was Duke Tobin, I go,
you know what, nobody else should have to answer for
this team that I put together, at least for this
defense that I put together.

Speaker 4 (01:25:38):
So you know what I'm gonna do.

Speaker 3 (01:25:39):
It's the bye week here, I am ask away, and
at least for a day, I'm the guy having to
answer questions about the defense that I put together years ago.
And I'm not gonna dive into the deep particulars of this.
Years ago, at the radio station, a popular air personality

(01:26:01):
was taken off the air, and as is usually the
case when that happens, no executive has to go in
front of a microphone. Right, it's usually us, like the
other on air personalities, who have to explain why this
person's no longer there and then hear from angry listeners.

Speaker 5 (01:26:23):
I've had to do it, many of us have. It's
kind of part of the gig.

Speaker 3 (01:26:27):
But this one particular time, this is many, many years ago,
popular on air personality was let go and in the
vacated seat that day, the boss took over and did
the show that day and answered questions from angry listeners

(01:26:48):
and then you know, trying to conduct a normal show,
but at least didn't make anybody else answer questions for
something that they weren't responsible for. And I gained a
whole different level love respect for this guy. I'm like,
you know what, that's cool. I don't know if it
was the greatest radio show ever, but it's like, all right,
this decision was made, the people you're putting on the

(01:27:09):
air are not responsible for it.

Speaker 5 (01:27:11):
Why should they have to answer to it?

Speaker 3 (01:27:13):
And I thought that was cool as hell, and I
gained a level of respect for him doing something that
wasn't necessary. He wasn't told he had to do it,
wasn't really in his job description. I would think it
would be cool as hell if Duke Tobin would do
something similar. Might not make me think that he should
be the guy moving forward, but you know what, all right,

(01:27:34):
I built this roster. This roster is underperforming the part
of the roster that I was supposed to spend the
off season fixing. Not only have I not fixed it,
it's worse. This isn't on my coach, This isn't on
my new defensive coordinator. It's on the players. And the
players are in the locker room with reporters coming in
multiple times a week.

Speaker 4 (01:27:54):
You know what I'm gonna do.

Speaker 3 (01:27:56):
I'm gonna walk down to that interview room, make it
known Thursday at one o'clock, ask away, and at least
for a day, the arrow is pointed at me, and
the tough questions are pointed at me, And then maybe
I'm not really gonna say anything, but there's a level
of accountability there where I'm answering questions about something I

(01:28:17):
am responsible for, not somebody else.

Speaker 5 (01:28:20):
Do I expect Duke Tobin to do that?

Speaker 7 (01:28:23):
No?

Speaker 3 (01:28:23):
Is there a world where Duke Tobin is told he's
not allowed to do that? I suppose Do I think
it would be respectable of him to do that?

Speaker 5 (01:28:33):
Absolutely?

Speaker 3 (01:28:35):
Twelve minutes after five o'clock, Sean said, is gonna join
us in just a few minutes. I cannot believe that
Mike from LA hasn't been on hold since Saturday night,
still basking in the glory, still perhaps drunk, after celebrating
the Dodgers winning a second consecutive World Series in a
remarkable classic Game seven, Mike, congratulations, how are you?

Speaker 4 (01:28:58):
Yeah?

Speaker 13 (01:28:58):
It was.

Speaker 6 (01:29:00):
Thanks mom. It was a tree for everyone to enjoy
this World series. You had the first highest payroll versus
the fourth highest payroll, and it played out to be
a It's the best one I can remember a moment
at least the last twenty years. Come out.

Speaker 3 (01:29:17):
You know, here's one of the reasons that I love sports.
So all I was rooting for was a good series, right.
I wanted a good world so we got a really
good world series. Game three was a classic, Game six
was interesting. Game seven is one of the all time best.
But one of the reasons why I love sports, right
is when you think of the Dodgers, it's Otani, Mookie Bets,

(01:29:42):
Yoshi Yamamoto, Freddie Freeman, all of these stars.

Speaker 4 (01:29:46):
Right, But who won it?

Speaker 6 (01:29:47):
Tell them?

Speaker 11 (01:29:48):
Mo?

Speaker 4 (01:29:48):
Who won it?

Speaker 6 (01:29:49):
The guys that aren't making billions, tell them, MO, tell them.

Speaker 3 (01:29:53):
Miguel Rojas, a thirty six year old second Baseman hits
the game tying home run in the ninth inning and
then makes the play where if I'm a Blue Jays fan,
I'm not going to sleep all winter thinking about the
bang bang play to play now. Will Smith is a
good player hit the game winning home run. But one
of the reasons I love sports, and I think this
presents itself in baseball more than the others, is the

(01:30:15):
unlikely hero right where the Dodgers don't win the World
Series if Mcguel Rojas doesn't hit a home run of
the ninth inning and so yes, it's big pay roll
and all that go ahead.

Speaker 6 (01:30:27):
Andy jumps over the top of Kek to pick that
ball off to a left field fence.

Speaker 3 (01:30:33):
Unbelievable, And I thought Dave Roberts big.

Speaker 6 (01:30:37):
Money guys for the Dodgers, So quit talking about that
all the time.

Speaker 3 (01:30:41):
Yeah, and I thought, I thought Dave Roberts managed a
great game seven. His gut told him to use Miguel Rojas.
He puts paw Hez in the game in the middle
of the inning to have him go and make that catch.
He knew exactly when to bring in Yamamoto new to
stay with him like it was an extraordinarily entertaining World Series.

(01:31:02):
I could understand the agony Toronto fans are dealing with.
You have a three to nothing lead, you had the
wedge ball in the ninth inning of Game six, you
had all those opportunities to win Game three. Your team
bounces back, there's a bang bang play to play. There's
a silly bunt that your manager called that never should
have happened. I mean it was I we've all experienced

(01:31:23):
our team losing. That is a level of losing the
Toronto fans are dealing with right now that I hope
I never again have to relate to. But the Dodgers,
with the story Game seven was awesome. I'm happy for you.

Speaker 6 (01:31:36):
I feel sorry for the Toronto fans.

Speaker 4 (01:31:38):
I really truly do.

Speaker 6 (01:31:39):
Even the players. I feel real sorry for them, guys,
There's no question about it. But I just wanted the
nonsense to be put to bed because Snookie did nothing.
I mean, so you can pay guys, different guys a
lot of money. That doesn't mean you're going to perform.
It doesn't mean it at all. So just click quick

(01:32:00):
picking up on my guys, because oh they got to
the highest payroll, not by much. If you look at
the Phillies and the Yankees and the Mets right and
even Toronto. So anyway, thanks for recognizing that. Wonderful women.
I wanted to talk about football, but you don't have time.

Speaker 5 (01:32:15):
I got like one minute, go ahead.

Speaker 6 (01:32:18):
I think the search for players should be secondary to
the search for a general manager for the Bengals. Someone
of the Roseman ilk, someone of the less snead ilk
from the Rams, someone of the todd light ilk from
the from the Bucks, that you know are going to
perform well in the third, fourth, fifth, sixth, seventh rounds

(01:32:42):
in the draft.

Speaker 3 (01:32:44):
Couldn't agree more? Thought, Yes, No, I could not agree more.
They need new players. I don't know that anybody can
trust Duke Tobin to identify who those new players are.
And all you have to do is look at what
you just talked about. I mean, the most glaring example
for me is you have two third round picks in
twenty twenty four that have done literally nothing for you

(01:33:06):
this year, that never play, that never dress. I don't
know how if you're if you run a football team
and you have a general manager who did that, who's
responsible for that? On top of all of these other
draft whiffs. I don't know how he could sit in
front of you and in a way that saves his
job explain that.

Speaker 5 (01:33:27):
I don't get it.

Speaker 3 (01:33:28):
So I couldn't agree more, Mike, you need somebody as
long as they have the money thrown at the players
who are earning the dough. The way they try to
build this defense is going to be the same way
they've tried to build the defense, the same way that
Duke Tobin has had a crack at it and has failed.
When somebody has failed repeatedly as something, do you give
them unlimited cracks at it?

Speaker 5 (01:33:49):
For me? And I think for you, might answer is.

Speaker 6 (01:33:51):
No, Well, I don't even know what you would start
to do in a search for a general incredible general manager,
do you.

Speaker 5 (01:34:01):
Well? It's interesting.

Speaker 3 (01:34:04):
I mean I would, I would mind the the better
run franchises in the NFL. I would certainly talk to
Troy Brown, who has worked in the in the front
office now for a while here. But I think it's
what makes it fascinating. I asked Danner this in the
first hour. We have no idea what a de facto
general manager search would look for, Mike. I got a
run awesome to hear from Yashan Sayed Stats and Scheme Newsletter.

Speaker 2 (01:34:26):
Next Cincinnati's ESPN fifteen thirty Traffic from.

Speaker 7 (01:34:32):
The UC Health Traffic Center. The Lung Cancer Rapid Access
Program at the UC Cancer Center is built to give
you a care plan fast meet with a specialist in
two day's call five one, three, five eighty five UCCC
northbound seventy one seventy five. The entrance ramp from US
forty two and Florence closed off due to an accident.

(01:34:53):
Also got a crash on way Cross Road at Hanover
Road and one more accident on Beachmont Avenue at five
Mile Road that he sound like with traffic.

Speaker 2 (01:35:03):
This report is ESPN fifteen thirty.

Speaker 3 (01:35:07):
You know our one of our most loyal listeners is
a woman by the name of Mary from Mount Washington.
I think she's top candidate. If the Bengals removed to Tobin,
I would interview her first. Mary from Mount Washington A
lot of work. Mary, and I have your hands full.
We're done in six minutes because we have UK basketball.

(01:35:27):
So let's get to our guest, our guy, Sean Saya,
the Stats and Schemes newsletter Summer Sports dot Com joins
us every single Tuesday to ride the Hamster wheel that
is talking about the Bengals defense and schemes and how
they fix it and Sean, it's good to have you
as always.

Speaker 5 (01:35:43):
How are you.

Speaker 4 (01:35:44):
Oh, it's great.

Speaker 13 (01:35:46):
Every week, you know, it feels like the Bengals come
up with something new. It's not always positive, but yeah,
I do want to start with saying I like watching
DJ Turner play football, so I want to make sure
I said something positive on the radio by this time.

Speaker 3 (01:36:00):
You know what, But put DJ Turner on film for me.
Tell me what you like about him.

Speaker 11 (01:36:05):
Yeah.

Speaker 13 (01:36:05):
I think he's a he's a good corner. He's competitive
at the catch point. I think you can put him
in multiple schemes, whether you're playing that deeper cover three,
while you're playing that kind of in the cornerback space
sort of cover.

Speaker 10 (01:36:16):
Two type look and look. He's improved, I think in
his years in the league so far. So it's nice
to see. You know, you can take.

Speaker 13 (01:36:23):
Something positive away when I look at all the grades,
and then when I go at the film, it's like,
all right, well, you can remember early in the game
against the Bears, you have that nice pass deflection on
a throat to Caleb Williams's left, so look at us,
just feeling good and fine on this Tuesday.

Speaker 4 (01:36:37):
Right.

Speaker 3 (01:36:37):
Yeah, so there's a building block. There's a building block.
The problem is it's it's building blocks singular and not plural.
They traded Logan Wilson, they didn't trade anybody else. We're
not surprised because this is sort of how the Bengals
do things. But put a GM head on reasonably, what
would you have given the Bengals for Trey Hendrickson.

Speaker 10 (01:36:57):
Well, it's probably good. It's gonna be a shorter thing.

Speaker 13 (01:37:00):
I think you you you start the call at a three. Uh,
and then the obviously the Bengals say absolutely not that.

Speaker 10 (01:37:07):
Give me a one. No, I would I would get
say maybe a two. You could talk me into throwing
a second round pick.

Speaker 4 (01:37:13):
You're away.

Speaker 10 (01:37:13):
But I have to assume there.

Speaker 13 (01:37:15):
Were conversations about it. I think just giving them the
benefit of the doubt there. But yeah, it did feel like,
all right, well, you're at a point in your season
where I don't ever want to be like, oh, you know,
you're tanking the season, it's all over. But you have
a resource that you can get a bunch of draft
capital for. You know, what kind of move can you make?
So you look at the Jalen Phillips trade, for example,

(01:37:36):
with the Eagles, where that pulls a third round pick,
and I think that's like the absolute worst that you
do in that situation. I think you should look at
Hendrickson as a full step of from Philip. So you know,
I had to feel like at least a second round pick.
I think a first round pick would have been unreasonable,
even though obviously that would have loved for that to
happen for the Bengals.

Speaker 3 (01:37:53):
You could be honest on this show, Sean, It's it's over.
You could you could say it here, We're not gonna
give it's it's three and six. They couldn't stop you
and ten of your buddies.

Speaker 4 (01:38:02):
It's over.

Speaker 13 (01:38:04):
It's like, it's funny because you look at it, and
when I watch the defensive film, it's like, all right, well,
I could criticize and be like, all right, well this
scheme is kind of simple overall.

Speaker 10 (01:38:13):
Damn football is the game of blocking and tackling. It
really really is.

Speaker 13 (01:38:16):
That is what it is, and it is a game
where the Bengals have not been great at tackling. I
think they missed like fifteen tackles and then there was
like over one hundred yards that the Bears were able
to have after those mistackles.

Speaker 10 (01:38:27):
So you drop whatever you want on a whiteboard, Mel.

Speaker 13 (01:38:30):
If you're not able to tackle in the NFL, it's
unfortunately going to be a pretty long day.

Speaker 3 (01:38:34):
Exactly Like I've talked about this this week. The problem
is there's no nuance to it, right, Like I'd love
to explore things that Al Golden can do with his
personnel that can amplify the pass rush or help them
in coverage right, or bring out some area of their
defense make them better against the run. They're bad at everything, right,

(01:38:55):
and they're bad at the basics. They're bad at tackling.
And so when there's there's only one building block and
every unit has deficiencies, and they're not good at anything
and they can't master the basics like bringing the ball
carrier to the ground. I bring you on to talk schemes,
I it's.

Speaker 4 (01:39:13):
I don't know.

Speaker 5 (01:39:13):
I don't know where you start.

Speaker 3 (01:39:14):
And that's that to me is the frust I like
talking about strategies and personnel and the nuance of football.

Speaker 5 (01:39:20):
There is no nuance to this.

Speaker 13 (01:39:23):
Yeah, no, But other than that, other than all of them,
I look forward to say, you know, like the rest
of the season, like, well, what are your building blocks?

Speaker 10 (01:39:32):
Like Turner? I feel good about where Turner is.

Speaker 13 (01:39:35):
Now, let's look at the younger guys, like what are
you getting from Osai, from Stewart, from Hill? Just as
you go through the rest of the way, Like, you know,
you have to decide are your young linebackers? But these
the guys you're gonna go forward with? Or is it
you know next year we're gonna kind of be in
the spot again because you know, the clock's ticking a
little bit on this whole entire organization. It feels like

(01:39:55):
I hate the idea that I got to sit and
watch that awesome Joe Burrow Super.

Speaker 10 (01:39:59):
Bowl on and say, this is awesome. This is a wildcard.

Speaker 13 (01:40:03):
I think it was a wildcard team right that made
that Like are they going to be able to get back?
And if the answer is no, that I mean it's
gonna be heartbreaking, like it really is when you consider
all the talent on this team. Obviously, Now do I
think this is a situation where hey, go be the
Jets and literally sell every single thing you have and
just stop pile picks and really run this kind of
experiment to the end. No, it's obviously not like that, right,
like there is light at the end of the tunnel.

(01:40:23):
But I'm sure you know everyone is getting a little
bit tired of saying, oh well next year, oh well
next time. Oh if this guy stays healthy, maybe things
will be a little bit different.

Speaker 3 (01:40:32):
Yeah, music says the clock is ticking on us. Sean.
I'll send folks to the Stats and Scheme newsletters. Subscribe
at suomer sports dot com sumer and maybe sumer Brain
has a solution to what ails this franchise.

Speaker 4 (01:40:45):
I don't know.

Speaker 3 (01:40:46):
It's awesome to have you as always. I'm sorry to
cut our time short, but well, well I'll have something
to complain about next there's no game. Maybe we'll talk
about good teams since good teams played this weekend.

Speaker 10 (01:40:55):
That would be fun. Appreciated bull talk soon.

Speaker 3 (01:40:57):
All right, that's our guy, Sean say its Stats and
Schemes newsletter. Thanks to our friends at Oakley Greens for
having us. Thanks to Drew West Heidi for producing on site.
Taron Blandback and Kenwood. UK basketball is next on ESPN
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