12-23-25 The Mo Egger Radio Show

On Tuesday's show, Mo discussed the ascension of the Bengals' 2023 draft class, the frustration of the UC football season, and he meant to discuss the Reds possibly trading for Luis Robert but didn't have time.

Also....Paul Dehner Jr. on the Bengals, Dan Clasgens on fantasy football, and Bill Rabinowitz on the Buckeyes.

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Listen to the show live weekday afternoons 3:00 - 6:00 on ESPN1530.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:01):
That's us. Good afternoon.

Speaker 2 (00:03):
It's four to sixteen. This is ESPN fifteen thirty one.
O Eggar, thank you so much for joining as Lee
are on the air later than usual, obviously because of
UK basketball coverage. The Wildcats finishing up non conference play
with a home victory over Bellerman. Cason Williams a big
day twenty six points, made eight threes, and the Wildcats

(00:25):
knockoff Bellerman ninety nine to eighty five at Rupp Arena.
A long break for the Wildcats before conference play begins
a week from Saturday, a road game against Alabama. It
is a Kentucky team that has a different feel. It
is a Kentucky team that seems to have a little
bounce at its step. Didn't play great today, maybe on
the defensive end, but that team is more whole. That

(00:47):
team looks and feels different than it did in the
weeks leading up to the Indiana game and propelled I
think dramatically. Even though Jadan Quainton's didn't have a major
impact on today's game like you did against Say John's.
They feel more whole and they play great in the
second half against the Red Storm, and so things are
looking looking up for the Wildcats.

Speaker 1 (01:06):
They win today ninety nine to eighty five.

Speaker 2 (01:08):
We have to cram three hours of amazing sports talk
radio content in about an hour and forty minutes. We
are at as we are every Tuesday, Oakley Greens, where
it is like sixty four degrees outside. I've got shorts
on today. It feels like spring. It feels like late March.
It feels like we should be getting ready for like

(01:29):
Opening Day or the NBA playoffs or something. It feels
great outside, but that doesn't mean because it doesn't feel
like Christmas outside today, it feels like Christmas in here.

Speaker 1 (01:40):
It is festive.

Speaker 2 (01:41):
And you could tell you got folks who aren't like us.
You know, this week we work in radio, it's twenty
four seven, three sixty five. You got a lot of
folks who've screw that. It's Christmas week. We're done posted
up here at Oakley Greens. We've got a bowl game on.
Louisville's taking on Toledo in the Boca Raton Bowl. UCLA
is playing u See riverside right now. I'm sure Mick

(02:02):
Cronin is complaining about having to play a game during
the day on a Tuesday, because they could pretty much
play the game at any point, Mick's going to complain
about it. So you can watch sports here obviously, as
you look ahead to the college football Playoff the Bengals
this weekend, Tons going on, tons of TVs. The setup
here is terrific, It is festive. It's great for your

(02:22):
uh let's say today's your last day before Christmas, as
it is for me and Druby, my onsite producer. I'll
pop off to Oakley Greens, get a pre Christmas cold
one and start your holiday festivities with us. We have
a lot of ground to cover. Paul Dayner Juniors usually
with me on Tuesdays here at Oakley Greens. He is
going to join us for a segment on the phone

(02:43):
at five o'clock and our friend Bill Rabinowitz. Bill has
been on this show many times talking about Ohio State sports.
The Buckeyes are getting set for their College Football Playoff
quarterfinal game against Miami a week from tomorrow. He is
awesome when it comes to covering the Buckeye He's also
written a great book. If you're an Ohio State fan,
could be could be a last, last last minute Christmas

(03:06):
gift for yourself or perhaps for another Buckeye fan, Bill's
gonna join us coming up at five thirty three, and
our friend Dan Klaskins on Fantasy Football at four forty five.
We have Christmas Day games on Thursday to talk about
Championship week for most Fantasy Football league. So there's a
lot to get to between now. At six o'clock we
are gonna step away. I've got reasonably good news if

(03:28):
you're a Bengals fan. I'll get to coming up in
just a few minutes on ESPN fifteen thirty, Cincinnati Sports Station.
We are broadcasting from Oakley Greens and having fun doing so.
It's our last show before Christmas, and we're having a blast.
Dan Klaskins is gonna join us in just about twenty
minutes to talk fantasy football as we get set for

(03:49):
championship weekend of fantasy football.

Speaker 1 (03:50):
You know, you have a lot of folks coming.

Speaker 2 (03:51):
To Oakley Greens and maybe they're typically not here on
a Tuesday afternoon at this time, and so I am
enjoying the looks on their faces as they walk past
and see us doing what we're doing. That's that's always
a lot of fun.

Speaker 1 (04:03):
You know.

Speaker 3 (04:03):
Uh.

Speaker 2 (04:04):
The Bengals won the game on Sunday against the Miami Dolphins,
and and that is you know, it's it's it's made
people wonder like what do we do with this? Like
what do we do with the fact that they won?

Speaker 1 (04:14):
Should it? Should I be happy? Like if you want
to be happy, be happy? Far be it for me?

Speaker 2 (04:18):
And if you want if if if you want to
not watch or listen, that's that's okay too. I do
understand the fear that it may it may impair their
decision making if they have some some late seasons success. Uh.
I'm not using that game as as a reason to
suddenly pivot to this just you know, mode of unending optimism,

(04:39):
but I will I will say this. We've criticized Duke
Tobin for a lot of things and and a lot
of things that he frankly deserves criticism for. And one
of those things is the recent track record in the
draft has not been awesome. But like the game on

(05:01):
Miles Murphy again played well and they're getting a Pro
Bowl caliber season from DJ Turner and Chase Brown had
an awesome game on Sunday, and Chase Brown has long
established himself as a building block on this team.

Speaker 1 (05:19):
And you know, Jordan Battles played better recently.

Speaker 2 (05:21):
And you know, also on the team is Andrea Yoshavas,
And those are all dudes who were taken in the
twenty twenty three draft class. Now, let's let's let's let's
stop short of saying that boy Duke really nailed it
in the twenty twenty three draft. Let's acknowledge that the
guy at the top of that class that has taken

(05:42):
him way too long to start to play consistently well.

Speaker 1 (05:46):
But this team needs pieces next year. This team needs
building blocks. This team has a.

Speaker 2 (05:52):
Lot of work to do, so much work to do
that I think it's a good thing every time you
could look at a guy who's on this show year's
team and say, we want him on next year's team,
and maybe we want him to be a guy we
invest in moving forward. Like they're gonna have to find
NFL established NFL starting caliber players at a myriad of positions,

(06:17):
right Like they need a starting caliber three technique, they
need a starting caliber edge guy, they need a starting
caliber linebacker.

Speaker 1 (06:25):
They could use some help at corner.

Speaker 2 (06:27):
They obviously they've got to replace Geno Stone, and yeah, man,
you're gonna use the draft, but they've got tons of
money to spend. They've got cap space. They got to
go get guys who could play and guys who have
played at a reasonably high level to play those positions.
But that undertaking, which is pretty significant, is a little

(06:48):
bit easier if you're comfortable with some of the built
in building blocks. I'm comfortable. I don't know about you.
I'm comfortable with Miles Murphy being on next year's team.
I'm comfortable with them picking up fifth year option. Should
he be your best pass rusher next year?

Speaker 1 (07:03):
Maybe not, But.

Speaker 2 (07:06):
They are starting to get the play from him that
they thought they were going to get when they drafted
him two and a half years ago. And who doesn't
want Dj Turner here long term? And who doesn't love
what Chase Brown brings to the table. And you know,
Jordan Battle might not be a player that I don't
find an upgrade for, like you should be looking for
upgrades at every position. Are there possibly safeties better than

(07:30):
Jordan Battle, Sure, but that doesn't mean there's not a
role for him on the team. Are there better options
to be a three the number three wide receiver than
Andre Yoshabas, Yes, yes, that doesn't mean there's not a
role for him on the team, and so I think
to a degree, like we've talked endlessly about this decade's
draft classes and how they haven't worked out, and one

(07:50):
of the major reasons why this team has gone through
what it's gone through the last couple of years is
they just haven't had enough guys defensively in particular, but
really in draft classes as a whole, established themselves as
guys you want to build around, or guys you want
to keep, or guys you want to reinvest in. That
twenty twenty three class draft class has some of those

(08:10):
guys this off season overhaul, this off season of work,
which hopefully, hopefully results long term in this team competing
for a championship. It's got to start from a foundation.
The biggest part of the foundation are the offensive pieces,
but part of that foundation can be some of those
guys from the twenty twenty three draft class, some of

(08:32):
whom have ascended later than we would like, many of whom, though,
look like guys that you certainly want here next year
and perhaps even beyond four thirty espn. Fifteen thirty. We
are not gonna have a ton of room for phone
calls today. I will just get that part out of
the way right now, because you know, I don't I

(08:52):
don't want to say hey, call in and then we're
gonna talk to like four stra guests starting at four
forty five. But what you can do is send a tweet.
As you know. I had a New Year's resolution that
I stuck to. I was gonna spend less time just
mindlessly looking at my phone on Twitter, and I was
gonna involve myself in almost no correspondence with anonymous people

(09:16):
on Twitter.

Speaker 1 (09:17):
And I think I've accomplished that.

Speaker 2 (09:20):
Like my my goal for twenty twenty five was like,
if if you're not gonna tell me anything about you, like,
thanks for following I just if you're gonna get something
from me, tell me a little bit about yourself and
those who have you know, pay closer attention to I
have stuck to that new Year's goal. Congratulations me. I'll
buy myself a beer. Sports headlines are coming up. We're

(09:41):
at Oakley Greens till six o'clock on ESPN fifteen thirty
Cincinnati Sports Station. Sports Headlines are a service at Kelsey
chev Line Home up lifetime powertrain protection and guarantee credit
approval from their family. The Yours for Life kelseychev dot com.
Jamar Chase voted to the AFC squad for the twenty
twenty six Pro Bowl Game, which involve like tug of

(10:01):
war and fantasy football and flag football and a bunch
of other stuff. They don't actually try to play a
game anymore, but Jamar gets a chance to go to that.

Speaker 1 (10:08):
Good for him. He deserves it.

Speaker 2 (10:10):
Bengals and Cardinals on Sunday at one Pregame coverage from
the Grail begins at nine o'clock on Sunday morning. College
hoops from earlier today, it was Kentucky beating Bellerman ninety
nine to eighty five. Ohio State knocked off Grambling earlier
today eighty nine to eighty three. The Boca Raton Bowl
is happening right now, Louisville versus Toledo in a Battle
of Cities from which i've dated women twenty one to three.

Speaker 1 (10:33):
Cardinals, early fourth quarter over the Rockets.

Speaker 2 (10:35):
We'll talk fantasy football with Dan Klaskins next, all right,
nineteen away from five o'clock.

Speaker 1 (10:43):
This is ESPN fifteen to thirty.

Speaker 2 (10:45):
We are broadcasting from Oakley Greens because that's where we
broadcast from every single Tuesday now, typically on Thursdays, we
talk fantasy football with our friend Dan Klaskins, host of
Fantastics Insider Football on Serious Exempt Fantasy. Thursday is Christmas,
and as much as Dan loves fantasy football, he didn't
want me to call him on Christmas to talk fantasy football. Also,

(11:06):
but we have a best of show running on Christmas,
and so I won't be here. But because it's championship
weekend in fantasy football and we had to put a
boat on our season together, Dan is with us. Now
follow him on x at Dan Klaskins. How you doing, sir?

Speaker 4 (11:22):
Mo? What is up? What is up? My friend? And
I'm trying to pair o.

Speaker 5 (11:26):
How they just jam a best of showing in just
three hours with the Baggers.

Speaker 6 (11:30):
Show out man.

Speaker 4 (11:32):
Yeah.

Speaker 5 (11:32):
Usually when they say.

Speaker 1 (11:35):
Yeah, that's it.

Speaker 2 (11:36):
Usually when they say hey we have a best of show,
I ask like, how long is it going to be?

Speaker 1 (11:40):
Can we get an hour? And they this year they're like, no,
we three three hours.

Speaker 2 (11:43):
We need three hours the best of I don't know
if I would call it a best of as much
as I would just call it a rerun.

Speaker 5 (11:49):
Oh man, Well, happy holidays seeing my friend.

Speaker 4 (11:52):
Thanks again, a great season.

Speaker 5 (11:54):
It's championship week in fantasy and any of our listeners
are still.

Speaker 1 (11:58):
Alive, Yes, I am not.

Speaker 2 (12:00):
But every fantasy football season provides lessons, and I think
regardless of whether you have a team playing this weekend
or if you're like me and you were eliminated weeks ago,
there are some things we can learn about fantasy football
that we can apply to next year based on things
on how things unfolded this year.

Speaker 4 (12:19):
No doubt about it.

Speaker 5 (12:20):
I'm an old dude and I've been.

Speaker 4 (12:22):
Playing it for a long time.

Speaker 5 (12:23):
Every year new lessons, and I'll pay the biggest lessons
this year not placing valuable draft picks on injured players.
I mean, whether it was Brandon Ayu, Joe Mixon. I mean,
these guys are going in the seventh.

Speaker 6 (12:34):
Tenth round.

Speaker 5 (12:35):
They never even played all season, and with all the
injuries we have going on every single week, you can't
afford to start with a dude that's already hurt. Rookie
running backs they tell them deliver on that early round hype. Either,
whether it was Ashon Genty is a top ten pick
of Maryon Hampton, trade On Henderson, r J. Hardy, None
of those dudes delivered. If you wait, you got to
be patient. Well, I'm still waiting on quarterbacks next year too.

(12:56):
I mean Drake, Nate, Matthew Stafford, Trevor Lawrence, Justin Hurt,
Caleb Webs, Jan Darnold, all these guys outside the top
twelve and draft all given QB one production and you
got to get a running back in the first thirty picks.
I tried to get cute in a few leagues. It
was a disaster. Running Backs are hard to come by.
You can't scrape the waiver wire. You need a RB one.
And finally, if you're playing a lot.

Speaker 4 (13:16):
Of leagues, you know, mix it up a little bit.

Speaker 5 (13:18):
Don't do the same strategy in every league like I
did it like a bonehead of many of my big
leagues this year going premium tight end and George kittleprock Boweryes,
they got hurt and I didn't have guys at other positions.
So well, just a few of the lessons I learned.
I'm sure others heads on the heads.

Speaker 4 (13:33):
Of the list.

Speaker 2 (13:34):
Uh yeah, don't auto draft if you're if you're if
you're busy, right, if you're like you got to do
bedtime for the kid and you're doing an online draft,
don't think you know what, I'll let the computer handle
two or three of these picks.

Speaker 1 (13:47):
Don't do that. I will never do that again.

Speaker 2 (13:49):
My kid will stay up past the draft and be
cranky at school the next day if we have to
do that. Auto draft killed me this year in the
rounds that I had to use it.

Speaker 5 (13:59):
There you go, and why you care to kid cranky?

Speaker 4 (14:01):
It's cool. Next day you don't be at school.

Speaker 5 (14:02):
You won't have to deal with.

Speaker 1 (14:04):
It's a very very good point.

Speaker 2 (14:05):
It's a very very good point, one that I will
apply to the fantasy football draft next year. All right,
let's take a look at some injuries going into Week seventeen.

Speaker 4 (14:16):
Yeah, let's start a quarterback.

Speaker 5 (14:17):
I mean Lamar Jackson as you saw out Sunday night
with that back issue.

Speaker 4 (14:21):
I don't know, we'll have to see.

Speaker 5 (14:23):
I'd be surprised if he plays the Ravens season online,
though he may tough it out Tyler Unley if he doesn't.
Jordan Love, he's in concussion protocol. Malik Willis got a
little banged up in that Saturday night affair, so we'll
hope Love can get back to Packers are big contest
they play on Saturday versus the same Raven JJ McCarthy.
He's out though, is Max Brosmer for the Vikings, Marcus

(14:44):
Mario Mariota Trendon out for that Christmas matchup for the Commanders,
that would be Josh Johnson. So I think I read
today twelve backup quarterbacks starting this week, So I mean
it's during Week seventeen fantasy games that is a challenge.
Travon Henderson, he's protocol. I don't think he's going to
play it. They'll meet him against the Jets, so you

(15:04):
might have to deal without him. Rookie running back qush
On Junkins, he's out for the season five months to
six months with a broken leg. What he Mark Smiths
last week with an ankle. See if the Texans can
get him back. I don't think you can trust him
in line as we've got DK Metcalf obviously suspended two
games appealing. It may get dropped though game. We may
find that out today, but either way likely not to
be available.

Speaker 4 (15:24):
For the championship game.

Speaker 5 (15:25):
And Devonte Adams, Rossi, Rice rome O'didney, Luther Burton all
players that miss last week. That status is very much
still in doubt here for Week seventeen.

Speaker 2 (15:34):
Dan Klaskins is with his fantastics Insider Football on Sirius
XM Fantasy one more time for twenty twenty five. Give
me your weekly studs, duds and sleepers.

Speaker 4 (15:46):
Yeah, let's start with Dak Press.

Speaker 5 (15:48):
Got a little Christmas stud for you on Christmas Day
and twenty five plus fantasy points in four of his
last five match verst the Commanders. He's broken twenty and
five of his last six overall.

Speaker 4 (15:59):
I think he gets.

Speaker 5 (16:00):
To that on Thursday. Chris Olave my other stud at receiver.
Here at Tennessee, the Titans are seeding the ninth most
fantasy points the wide out in the season. I really
like the way a Lave and Tyler Schuck are connected.
Sixteen catches, twenty five parties, two undred and thirty three yards,
three scores over the last three weeks.

Speaker 6 (16:15):
He is on fire.

Speaker 5 (16:16):
And then Dudge Jarrick Goff no team giving up fewer
fantasy points to the Vikings. And you look at golf
five career starts at Minnesota's this one game where he's
managed one or more touchdown passes. Minnesota's only allowed one
quarterback to get above that this season. At home games
where you go daddles on my bench list.

Speaker 4 (16:32):
That dud.

Speaker 5 (16:33):
He has it found the end zone in the last
five games. He hasn't broken fifty eight yards on the
ground at sixth straight. He's split in time with Chubah.
I've he's got to play the Seahaws. None of that's
good meal And finally a couple of sleepers. We got
to go against the Bengals defense. We've been doing it
all season. Agains what it's been working. So Michael Carter
inside my top twenty running back. The Users wasn't great
last week, but clearly Arizona's leadback. Cincinnati a defense allowing

(16:54):
the most fantasy points to running backs twenty three running
backs if they double did a PPR points against the
Bengals fourteen of that for fourteen plus. That's where I
got Carter this week. And finally Troy Franklin, my sleeper
wide out Pat Bryant went down.

Speaker 4 (17:07):
I think he's going to.

Speaker 5 (17:08):
Get back to their eighth to nine targets that made
him that they play in October. He's picking up steam
of late fifteen point seven PPR points average over his
last two mark again, I think he'll get to on
Sunday against the Chiefs.

Speaker 2 (17:20):
I love having you every single g that's right, Yeah,
I love having you every single week. I'm just gonna
go ahead and get this out of the way. And
you know, usually early August, late July, I sheepishly send
you an email. Hey you I need to do another
year of fantasy football. Can I just like book it
now so I don't have to send that email.

Speaker 4 (17:38):
Oh, let's book it now. Let's book it. Brother. Always
appreciate it. Definitely fun to do and like helping people.

Speaker 5 (17:44):
But so remember if you're playing this week, just we
have a wide slate of games here.

Speaker 4 (17:49):
They're gonna have to be dialed in for a few days.

Speaker 5 (17:52):
Pay attention to the weather, and stick to the process.
Don't overthink it. Bring on those titles. No, only one
person win the league, so there's eleven losers in every league.

Speaker 4 (18:00):
You gotta keep that in mind.

Speaker 2 (18:01):
Yes, yes, yes, and it's been I've been reminded in
one league I've never won. In the other league, I
haven't made a serious run since twenty eighteen, So I
have the next nine months to do some serious serious
self examination. Dan will talk next something man. Thank you
as always, all right, looking forward to it.

Speaker 4 (18:20):
Enjoy your holiday moo and thanks a lot, buddy.

Speaker 1 (18:23):
Likewise, you're the best.

Speaker 2 (18:24):
Dan Klaskins Fantastics Insider football on Sirius XM Fantasy. Hit
him up on Twitter at Dan Klaskins. He has been
He has been doing this show, whether it's been me
or prior to me, Lance McAllister for I think like
twenty five years and is awesome to talk with and
helps a lot of people with their fantasy football teams.

Speaker 1 (18:46):
This year, despite his help, I was atrocious, but nobody cares.

Speaker 2 (18:52):
We're here at Oakley Greens until six o'clock. Coming up
in the next hour, Paul Danner Junior is going to
join us at five oh five. Our guy Sean said
Stats and Scheme newsletter. At five point twenty, if you
are an Ohio State football fan, we are going to
talk about the buck Eyes and their college football playoff
chances with the great Bill Rabinowitz, who, look, I'm not

(19:14):
an Ohio State fan. I think that's well established, but
his book about last year's Buckeye team is terrific.

Speaker 1 (19:20):
And so Bill's going to.

Speaker 2 (19:21):
Join us to talk about this year's team and the
Miami game and then last year's team and really what
a difference a year makes. Think about it a year ago,
Ryan Day, they had, I guess, had just beaten Tennessee
in a game where folks are like, ah, it's going
to be filled with Tennessee fans up there in Columbus,
and the fans are gonna boo and Ryan Days coaching

(19:42):
for his job, and he lost to Michigan again to
a year later, the dude's won a national title. The Buckeyes,
despite the Indiana loss, are still the odds on favorite
to win the College Football Playoff. And the team that
beat him, that school, that program, Michigan is in tatters.
I was watching Biff Pogy's press conference today where he

(20:03):
said he thinks he should be the guy for the job,
and maybe he did say that his goal in life
before he kills himself smoking cigars, is to fix the
Michigan football program. And that's kind of the perspective you
would expect from a guy named Biff Pogy. But we'll see.
But a year ago, it was boy, Michigan owns Ryan Day,

(20:25):
and he's going to win the national title to save
his job. To he may win his second and the
dude who beat him in that game last year, Sharon Moore,
has a bigger problems than the Ohio State Michigan rivalry.
So anyway, Bill Rabino, it's coming up at five thirty five.
You know, I was talking about twenty minutes ago about
the Bengals in the twenty twenty three draft. I share

(20:49):
everybody's hesitancy to get too wrapped up in any late
season success, and for what it's worth, I think they're
gonna win against Jacoby Brissett and the Cardinals on Sunday.

Speaker 1 (21:01):
If it's me, I wouldn't.

Speaker 2 (21:02):
I still wouldn't play Burrow in these last two games,
but all right, he's gonna play. I certainly wouldn't play
them against Miles Garrett a week from Sunday. But I
think the Bengals are gonna feast on those two excuse me,
those two quarterbacks to Kobe Brissett, should or Sanders, and
I think they'll win those football games if they do.
Who knows how late season's success is going to impact

(21:24):
decision making, but they do have a lot of key
decisions to make this offseason, to identify which free agents
are worth going after, which free agents they may be
willing to overpay, what Plan B is for a handful
of players they may target in free agency if they
don't get them. The process of making your team better

(21:46):
is always easier if there are some pieces from inside
that you want to build around. And I do think
that here in the second half of the season, as
maddening as it has been, as disheartening as it has been,
Start with the offensive line. Bengals have a decent offensive line,
not great. I know what a great offensive line looks like.

(22:08):
They had one in twenty fifteen. It is I think
easily the best offensive line Joe Burrow has played behind.
There are some pieces there. A Marius Mims has been terrific,
Dylan Fairchild looks like he's going to be a very
good bro Dalton Reisner is definitely a player worth at
least exploring bringing back. They could use more depth. Maybe
a long term solution presents itself for Orlando Brown's place,

(22:29):
and maybe that's Marius Mims, and they need a long
term answer at right tackle. But for the first time
in a while, offensive line isn't this huge glaring? Just
absolutely prioritize it hole that it has been for a
very long time. How many times over the last nine

(22:52):
years have you gone into the offseason thinking Bengals are Okay,
in the offensive line, I can't think of one there
now like that. That's a really good place to start.
And so again it's not that you ignore the offensive line,
but they have a lot of pressing issues. But that's
not a pressing issue. And so there's one less than

(23:12):
I think we thought there would be back in September.
At October a month and a half ago, you looked
at him on defense and it was like, huh, keep
Shamar Stewart. I guess keep DJ Turner, sign him long term?
Then what Now it's a little bit easier if you
could say, okay, Miles Murphy, we can count on him

(23:33):
next year to play better. Is it gonna be an
all pro calimber guy? Is he ever gonna play like
a first round pick?

Speaker 1 (23:38):
I don't know.

Speaker 2 (23:39):
But instead of a completely empty cupboard, there are a
few items. Murphy, Dax Hill, DJ Turner, admittedly not a
ton like admittedly not a ton.

Speaker 1 (23:53):
Jordan Battle I think as one of them.

Speaker 2 (23:54):
Jordan Battle when not his presence on the team would
not preclude me from taking a safety in round one.
And I know the apple of everybody's eye right now
is Caleb Downs, but Jalen Battle or Jordan Battle. Being
on the team next year is not a bad thing,
and I think over the course of the last few
weeks there have emerged some pieces that you're at least
okay being a part of the team next year. Five

(24:17):
away from five o'clock, Tony Pike and I yesterday on
the Tony and Mo Football Show took a college basketball
detour and spent a lot of time on the Bearcats.
It is remarkable to me. And Uce does have one
more non conference game remaining, It's against Lipscombon on Monday,

(24:37):
and then conference play is going to begin. And I
don't think you need me to read you the Ken
Palm rankings or the net rankings of all the teams
they're going to play in the Big Twelve. What they
have in front of them is incredibly difficult. It is
amazing to me that we are midway through the third

(24:58):
season of the Big Twelve, fifth season of West Miller's
tenure in Cincinnati, and they have a basketball team that
it's impossible to imagine playing in the NCAA tournament. Like
we went into the season saying it's gonna be tournament
or bust, right, gotta make the tournament. Got to have
your name on selection Sunday. It is beyond sobering to

(25:22):
me and unfortunately a painful indictment against I think what's
what's gonna happen is it relates to the head basketball
coach at the end of the season that it's Christmas,
it's two days before Christmas, and whether it be looking
at their record or watching them play and then combining

(25:43):
it with the schedule, it's pretty much impossible to imagine
them making the NCAA tournament. You know, we talked about
this before the season. Chad Rendell joined me to talk about,
you know, NCUBAA tournament or bust. And his response to
that was, well, I need to see what it looks like.
And like I do agree that there was probably a

(26:05):
world where they don't make the tournament, but you know,
they kind of got job by the committee or they
were on one of the first four out and you know,
they played great down the stretch and just that the
committee just snubbed him. They're not in a position to
be snubbed, and they're probably not going to be in
a position to be snubbed. They've played for six, seven
weeks whatever it's been since the first game on November third.

(26:29):
You're not watching a team that feels or looks any
better than the team that took the floor for the
first game, and they've played twelve. Offensively, I don't know
what you can hang your hat on Defensively, I'm not
sure what you can hang your hat on against really
good teams. I don't know how this gets better.

Speaker 1 (26:47):
And so.

Speaker 2 (26:49):
It is so remarkable to me that we are going
into year five of this and pretty much everybody he
has understandably so already pretty much assume they're not going
to make the tournament. And I don't know how you.
I don't know how you. I don't know how you

(27:10):
don't do anything but that, And so we have months
to discuss it. I feel like we can ye yell
and scream about how Wes Miller should be let go.
I don't know that that's going to have to happen
if this continues, because I think it's gonna, unfortunately be
a little bit of a foregone conclusion. Paul Danner Junior
joins us. Next, I want to spend a few minutes

(27:31):
with Paul on Jay Morrison. In addition to the Bengals,
We're at Oakley Greens on ESPN fifteen thirty.

Speaker 1 (27:36):
We got to get right.

Speaker 2 (27:37):
We're at Oakley Greens Still six o'clock, thrilled to be here,
blub life, five o'clock Happy. How Paul Danner, Junior Frump,
The Athletic and the Growler podcast is with us. Paul awesome.
We have a lot to talk about. First of all,
Merry Christmas.

Speaker 7 (27:50):
Merry Christmas. How are you doing?

Speaker 1 (27:52):
Though? I'm doing well.

Speaker 2 (27:55):
I'm you know, I'm doing better than expected, especially because
this Bengals season has been miserable. Here's what I'm excited about.
I get a couple of days away, and you do
as well. From doing the psychoanalysis of Joe Burrow, and
that's what Sunday's win provided.

Speaker 1 (28:10):
A respirate from psychoanalysis.

Speaker 3 (28:13):
Yes, we don't have to take the temperature of how
Joe Burrow is feeling, which is happiness scale today and
we can just kind of enjoy a day where everybody
was definitely happy. Everything looked the way that you would
expect it to look. They played like an offense that

(28:33):
is built to win a lot of games, even though
it hasn't won many this year, and you can just
sort of accept that for what it is, right, now.

Speaker 2 (28:40):
So what is the best way to process Sunday? Is it,
you know, bittersweetness, This is what it could have been,
this is what it can be. Is it they're going
to use late season success to cloud their decision making.
Is it they're going to screw up their draft positioning?
How should I process Sunday?

Speaker 3 (29:00):
Well, I think there's different aspects to all of that.
The drafts isitioning thing you can miss me with that
I don't really like. First of all, the draft is
not that great in the top ten anyway, so you're
going to be seeing a lot of similar prospects in
the middle and come on, man, these guys need to
go win games.

Speaker 7 (29:15):
There's too many. I'm not doing that, But I will.

Speaker 3 (29:19):
Say I think the lens it is bittersweet because this
is what it was supposed to look like. I mean,
the Bengals, even in their best times, haven't eviscerated teams
like that. I mean, that is the way they played offense, defense.
Special to all of it together is the way it's
supposed to look on a team that is capable of making.

Speaker 7 (29:40):
A run in January, and here they are at the.

Speaker 3 (29:42):
End of December looking like a team capable of making
a run in January, but none of it matters because
everything that happened over the course of the season, and
that is bittersweet and that's a little hard to swallow,
But I will say this, I don't think it's meaningless.
You do worry. What you mentioned is the biggest concern
of all of this is that, and it's like, well,
I see all of these players playing, well, they're coming along.

(30:04):
We're just gonna bet on them next year and run
run the whole thing back. I mean, I think there's
very clear positions linebacker, defensive line that have to have significant,
you know, a raising of the boats happening there. Like
there's got to be some higher level play veterans brought

(30:25):
in that can be reliable and bring you some juice
and let the players that are currently here either find
a way to play above them or be role players,
which is probably kind of where they sit. They just
need a couple more starting level players in there. That said,
this entire year was going to be based on the

(30:45):
development of all of these young defensive players, and it
had to happen at some point, and here we are.

Speaker 7 (30:54):
It didn't happen fast enough.

Speaker 3 (30:56):
Everything that happened in the first ten games of the
season or whatever happened.

Speaker 7 (31:00):
There's no way around that.

Speaker 3 (31:02):
But I think the important element to look at it is, look,
you're seeing these young pieces start to actually look like
they are individually developing and taking a next step. And
that's not just from one game, that's from a continued
trend this whole second half of the season.

Speaker 2 (31:19):
Did Duke Tobin actually oversee a successful twenty twenty three draft.

Speaker 7 (31:26):
It's like you're reading my notebook right now.

Speaker 3 (31:28):
I have a whole story, a whole story that is
I'm about about to have published for tomorrow on the
success of the twenty twenty three draft and more importantly,
the opportunity to affords the Bengals to change how they
operate and to look at things differently. Yes, they absolutely
had a successful twenty twenty three draft. I mean, if

(31:50):
you're talking about what constitutes a good draft, you're talking
about what you want to get three starters out of it,
and it's like, man, it's a good draft. You know,
that's just the way that. However, you got to find
a way to do that. They have far more than that.
I mean you're talking Miles Murphy, DJ Turner. I mean
they look like real, solid level pieces. Jordan Battle is

(32:13):
a part of this team's future. Certainly he seems undeniably
going to be a starter for them next year. Chase
Brown is a top running back in this league. Andre
Josbasi is a solid three or four receiver, however you
want to view him. Like to find those pieces that's
real value. I mean, that is a good draft. It

(32:36):
took till year three. Sometimes it takes to year three
for guys to come around, but yeah, I think you
look at that way.

Speaker 7 (32:44):
But now they're extension eligible. Now you're gonna see this.
How are they gonna do this?

Speaker 3 (32:49):
Is it gonna look like t Higgins and Jesse Bates
and the Jamar Chase stuff That was all the off
field drama and trade requests and bickering over how good
they actually are or are we going to see an
Eagle style early investment in some of these guys.

Speaker 7 (33:06):
These are hits. They look to be coming together, like
you're seeing that.

Speaker 3 (33:11):
Go out and pay these guys before next season starts
and get those done and avoid all of the bickering
and off field stuff that happens. I think what we
have now is an opportunity for them to say, hey, look,
we are doing.

Speaker 7 (33:23):
Some things differently. Now, will that happen?

Speaker 3 (33:26):
I'm probably not holding my breath on a lot of it,
but I do think it's a great.

Speaker 7 (33:30):
Opportunity to do some of the things that maybe.

Speaker 3 (33:33):
Joe Burrow is referencing, do things a little differently, be
a little more creative. This would seem to maybe be
an opportunity to do some of that with a couple
of these guys from that draft.

Speaker 2 (33:41):
Yeah, man, you know, to me, this certainly doesn't let
Duke Tobin off the proverbial hook. Whatever amount of criticism
he has gotten, I believe he is deserved. I certainly
believe his role with the organization should be examined. But
I'm also a believer in giving credit words to and
admittedly it's taken Miles Murphy longer than a lot of
us would like. It's taking Jordan Battle longer than a

(34:01):
lot of us would like. I certainly wouldn't use him
as you know somebody that, hey, we're not going to
take a safety because we have Jordan Battle. But he's
played well. Chase Brown is terrific. DJ Turner should be
a pro bowler. Andre Yoshabas for a sixth rounder from
Princeton was an excellent pick or all five of those
guys players that could still be here in twenty twenty seven.

Speaker 7 (34:26):
I you know that to be seen, I think it's possible.

Speaker 3 (34:30):
You get I mean, you get into the dynamics of
can you pay everybody, how much do they want? Is
there going to be a franchise tag decision of all
of those things, Jill Miles Murphy if your option, there's
a lot of dynamics and ways to go about it,
and so all of them, I mean, yeah, I think
I think a good amount of them.

Speaker 7 (34:50):
I think they've got to find a way.

Speaker 3 (34:52):
To do draft, develop Britain and still be about that
and prove it they're about that and this is the
best way to do it. There's a I mean a
long way to go to get to that, right certainly,
and a lot of things that happened, But I do
think that they have the ability to do it, and
it's a chance for them to prove what they really

(35:12):
want to be about in terms of how they build
their roster by making sure that a vast majority of
those guys are around for the long haul.

Speaker 2 (35:19):
All right, So I read your mind. I know what
you're going to write about. Now I want to talk
about what you did write about. I didn't think and
I you know, the big takeaway for me after the
Denver game, same basic point in the season last year,
though they were playing for something, was T Higgins is
cemented as a beloved figure forever. That's before he signs
in the second contract. That's before we see him do

(35:41):
what he did this past week, culminating with his performance
on Sunday. I think there's a good conversation about whether
or not he should have been out there. That's fine,
But the fact that in the game that had no
bearing on the playoff race and a season that has
gone awry, you have a dude doing everything he can
to get on the field and then contributing and playing
his ass off like this is I've said this before.

(36:05):
I'm not sure there's a more beloved player than T
Higgins and I've had people say really, and I go, dude,
you it's not just.

Speaker 1 (36:10):
That he's good.

Speaker 2 (36:11):
It's dragging himself on the field against Kansas City and
the game they had to have a couple of years ago.
It's willingly playing second banana behind Jamar Chase, which a
lot of guys wouldn't do. It's what we saw this
past week, culminating with his performance against Miami.

Speaker 6 (36:27):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (36:27):
I mean just talking to him afterwards and him discussing
the process and how hard it was, you know, and
I just sort of asked him because I can't imagine
what it's like to be getting on a plane flying
to Pittsburgh knowing that you're about to see a concussion
specialist and wondering what they're gonna tell you, and how
hard that must be to go through, and to go

(36:50):
through it all with the idea of wanting to go
be out there and.

Speaker 7 (36:54):
Playing this seemingly meaningless game.

Speaker 3 (36:57):
And then to go out there and do it like that,
to be thankful to even have been a part of it,
to have played well, and to care about being out
there and being a part of this. These are the
type of guys you invest in. These the type of
guys you want their locker room.

Speaker 7 (37:11):
It's top guys. They don't have probably enough of that.

Speaker 3 (37:15):
The team matters that much, being a good teammate, being accountable,
being available matters that much to Tea.

Speaker 7 (37:24):
And doing it the right way like this was not haphazard.

Speaker 3 (37:27):
I'm going to go out there and try to play
through it, because like I don't want to ever diminish.
It's very murky waters talking about that, but going through
it and making sure everybody and including the top specialists
in that field, has said it's okay, and going out
there and then embracing and saying I want.

Speaker 7 (37:43):
To go do it. Nobody and guys said this afterwards.

Speaker 3 (37:47):
Nobody would have given I would have cared at all
if he would have said, I'm done, I'm done with
this year.

Speaker 7 (37:53):
I've got these concussions.

Speaker 3 (37:54):
I just want to make sure I'm right, and no
one would everyone would totally understand it. But the fact
that he did do it, I think proved how much
he is about this team, how much he does care
about their success, and how much he cares about being
a good teammate, and that wins you games.

Speaker 2 (38:10):
Read Paul's piece on t Higgins in the aftermath of
that game on Sunday The Athletic dot Com. Paul Danner
Junior from The Athletic and the Growler podcast. I am
going to make, admittedly a very clumsy transition to something
that is unfortunately not anywhere close to as fun as
what we have been talking about. You guys on the
Bengals Beat are really close knit and you compete with

(38:31):
each other, but you enjoy each other's company, You help
each other, you do each other's podcasts. It's awesome to
watch and I think we as fans get to benefit
from it. Your podcasting partner and your close friend, Jay
Morrison is going through something right now that Zach Taylor
was classy enough to reference during his press conference yesterday.
And I want to spend a few minutes on Jay

(38:52):
lost his wife and this was totally unexpected. Jay covers
the Bengals for Bengals Talk dot com. He's part of
the Growler podcast with Paul. You guys are kind enough
to let me join you guys, and I don't really
add anything, but it's it's fun to be with you.
Jay is a sweetheart of a human being. I know
fans who read his work and listen and watch listen
to and watch his work our heartbroken for him. You're

(39:15):
very close to him. He's going through an awful time.
This is a long winded preamble into me asking you
to just spend a few minutes talking about Jay and
and what he and his family are going through right now.

Speaker 6 (39:26):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (39:27):
I mean it's I've yeah, I mean I've known Jay
for so long I can't even tell you when I
first met him.

Speaker 7 (39:34):
But when you met him, you knew how in love
he was.

Speaker 3 (39:39):
Like we always you know, there's always like a joke
you could make about you know, you see some couples
out here and yeah they're married, but man, they're they're
faking it right, Like that's not that's not.

Speaker 7 (39:51):
A real one. And and and but that was never
the case with Jay and Nikki.

Speaker 3 (39:55):
I mean these were best friends, partners.

Speaker 7 (39:58):
They did everything to get that.

Speaker 3 (40:00):
They went out, you know, we would always talk about
all the concerts and that became a running gag of
what show they were going to and where they were
because they loved each other's company and they were really
truly there for each other. And so for something like
this unexpected to happen, it's just any time, it's heartbreaking,

(40:21):
but for it to be like this, you just feel
for Jay, who was literally someone who would do anything
for anyone. I mean, this is the guy who will
go and he'll take care of his friends when they're
sick or their moms are cut cut grass, and for
for somebody who can't do it right now, or like
literally anything you would ever need. He would go above

(40:41):
and be on to do anything for you. It just
makes it hurt all that much more. And he's just
such a good dude, and and you just are You're
broken for him.

Speaker 7 (40:52):
We all are.

Speaker 3 (40:54):
It's it's a it hits all of us hard because
we knew Nikki, we knew how much love they were.
So it's it's tough where you know what we we
this is why I love Cincinnati, man.

Speaker 7 (41:08):
We rally around our people, man. And what we have
seen and.

Speaker 3 (41:11):
Heard and the support that has been directed towards Jay
from people just in town, people that are in the NFL,
people that that listen to our program and just feel
connected to it, it has been overwhelming, and I'm so
happy to see it. And I can't wait for us to,
once the dust settles on this, come up with a
way that we can find a way to really support

(41:33):
even further.

Speaker 7 (41:33):
But it's so amazing to see the amount.

Speaker 3 (41:35):
Of support that he has out there, because it is
it's it's just it's it's just awful in every way imaginable.

Speaker 7 (41:42):
Right now.

Speaker 2 (41:43):
Yeah, I hope in some way he's he's comforted by
the outpouring of support and the outpouring of love that
he is getting from folks that he knows and folks
that simply know him. Hope you have a great Christmas.
Thanks for everything, and uh we'll talk next week. Man,
Thanks so much.

Speaker 6 (41:59):
May Chris.

Speaker 1 (42:01):
All right, there you go.

Speaker 2 (42:01):
Paul Danner Junior the Athletic in the Growler podcast. Our guy,
Sean Saya joins us.

Speaker 7 (42:05):
Next Cincinnati's ESPN fifteen thirty Traffic.

Speaker 8 (42:12):
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(42:33):
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Landy Lane and Cooper Road on at Ezelic with traffic.

Speaker 7 (42:43):
This report is sponsor.

Speaker 1 (42:45):
All right, we are way lakers.

Speaker 2 (42:46):
I don't know how to read a clock, Sean say,
it is with us. His Stats and Scheme newsletter is
a must delivered to your inbox twice every single week.
He is with u sumer sports dot com. Sean, it's
awesome to have he was always good after him.

Speaker 6 (43:01):
No, I'm excited to talk.

Speaker 9 (43:02):
You know, we're at the point of the season where,
you know, unfortunately some teams like Carvin Love.

Speaker 5 (43:06):
Bengals are out of the playoff pun but a lot.

Speaker 10 (43:09):
Of fun things happened to see, a lot of fun
things to look forward to seventeen.

Speaker 2 (43:14):
Uh, I'll ask you one question about the Bengals game,
and then there are three teams I want to talk
about that are actually going to play in the playoffs.
Did anything stand out about the Bengals performance on Sunday
that made you go, wow, that's cool.

Speaker 9 (43:25):
I mean, they really beat them down, like it really
was not closed, which is really really nice to see,
and unfortunately just felt like, all right, well, this is
kind of the vision of this team that you could have.
You know, when things are really really going you get
four touchdowns.

Speaker 10 (43:38):
From Joe Burrow, you get the defense.

Speaker 9 (43:40):
Yeah you're gonna let up some explosive plays, but you're
able to get two interceptions and have that defense being
just like a habit kind of mentality so you know,
a little bit of a tough one overall, just like
such a good game and hopefully, I guess you can
take this kind of riding and high as you go
into these last two.

Speaker 2 (43:56):
There are three things the three teams I want to
ask you about that our playoff ban. The first is
the Jacksonville Jaguars with a guy and Liam Cohen, who
has been renowned for his offensive coaching capabilities. For a while,
we've all been waiting for Trevor Lawrence to break out.
This feels like a very good coach QB marriage. What
has Liam done in Jacksonville that those before him couldn't.

Speaker 10 (44:19):
I think he's really been able to streamline things for Trevor.
Where you see it in the you also see it
out of the poor pulling out. He's playing at his
highest funnel right now over the last few weeks.

Speaker 7 (44:30):
That's been really good thing.

Speaker 1 (44:31):
We see it.

Speaker 5 (44:32):
Against the Broncos from in the league.

Speaker 10 (44:37):
That was just a really really good plan to deal
with that.

Speaker 9 (44:40):
And Mo, it's kind of crazy. A lot of this
comes after the trade for Jacoby Meyer, so we go
for a team that really had Ryan Thomas Junior at
the top of a lot of these charts last season,
a lot kind of fell off for him.

Speaker 10 (44:50):
But the way that Cohen is getting Trevor to commit
to attacking that intermediate area of the field at ten
to nineteen yard rand, I think they're just doing a
fantastic job be really good in the red zone, really
good red dune performance last week against the Broncos.

Speaker 2 (45:05):
Uh what has Sean Payton been able to do with
a guy in bow Nicks that it still feels like
just from a from a from a ceiling perspective or
maybe a raw talent perspective.

Speaker 1 (45:13):
The jury seems to be split on.

Speaker 7 (45:16):
I do think that pet doesn't you have down the.

Speaker 10 (45:19):
Shot plays and finding ways where gonna throw it up.
Sometimes it's gonna be complete, sometimes it's gonna be incomplete.

Speaker 9 (45:25):
But collecting information earlier in the game, Hey, this is how.

Speaker 4 (45:30):
You're aligning were.

Speaker 6 (45:33):
And we're gonna have a.

Speaker 4 (45:36):
I do think that this has done it, you know, maybe.

Speaker 6 (45:39):
A little.

Speaker 10 (45:41):
Improving, really being comfortable with Cotlands and on the outside.
I think they're running unfortunates taking a step back.

Speaker 9 (45:47):
They have a really good offensive line, and I mean
with that defense, even though had a real rough day
against the Jaguars, they I mean they could, They could run,
but they could also lose the division.

Speaker 10 (45:56):
If the Charges are able to win that last game
against US.

Speaker 2 (46:00):
If I asked ten football fans prior to the season
about Caleb Williams, I would get ten different opinions. I'm sure,
I'm not sure I'll get one opinion if I ask
all ten. Now, But what has it been about Ben
Johnson's coaching that has helped Caleb Williams have the sophomore
season in the NFL that he's had.

Speaker 10 (46:18):
Ben Johnson is one of the best play callers in
the NFL at making things look exactly the same.

Speaker 9 (46:25):
So overtime was a phenomenal trim about Caleb not taking
my way Philip at all.

Speaker 6 (46:31):
That was the person.

Speaker 10 (46:35):
That first play the game, the first play on the
third quarter.

Speaker 5 (46:38):
They run out times.

Speaker 7 (46:39):
He's always this time over time, we're.

Speaker 9 (46:42):
Gonna run a play action shot, We're gonna have that
middle of field open, We're gonna trust our guys. I
think that Johnson is doing a good job of getting
Caleb into comfortable situations while not constricting his creativity because
Caleb is a special, special athlete, and I think you
know Ben Johnson in Detroit, he certainly didn't have that
same sort of creative to be with Jared. No offensive
course of Jared love Washington, but you is a different

(47:04):
kind of actlete. So Johnthan's like forcing you to color
in the line, but also not being mad when you're
able to color outside the lines as well.

Speaker 2 (47:11):
People are always looking for great deals during the holidays.
There's no better deal than the Stats and Scheme newsletter.
Sean tell folks what they'll get if they subscribe.

Speaker 10 (47:22):
Twice for every game, previews for every game in the playoffs,
for extending some of the data that we're using.

Speaker 6 (47:28):
It's just a.

Speaker 7 (47:29):
Really good way to look exactly.

Speaker 10 (47:31):
You know, you haven't seen these two teams all season.

Speaker 7 (47:33):
This is the profile of the team.

Speaker 6 (47:35):
This is where they're really strong.

Speaker 7 (47:36):
This is where the week maybe this is where they
kind of have issues.

Speaker 6 (47:40):
A third punt.

Speaker 2 (47:42):
Awesome stuff. Suomer sports dot Com. Shawn, You're the best.
Will bother you next week? Man, Thanks so.

Speaker 6 (47:47):
Much, Thanks so much. More.

Speaker 7 (47:48):
Happy holidays to everyone.

Speaker 2 (47:50):
You you too, Sean sayed, Stats and Scheme Newslettersoomer Sports
dot Com.

Speaker 1 (47:54):
Bill Rabinowitz on the Buckeyes. Next headlines are.

Speaker 2 (47:59):
A service of Kelsea Shrever Life, home of lifetime power
train protection and guaranteed credit approval from their family to
yours for life kelseyshev dot com. Jamar Chase has been
voted to the AFC side of the twenty twenty six
Pro Bowl Games. Remember they don't play a really bad
football game anymore. They play tug of war. I think

(48:21):
there's they snap towels on each other. The AFC versus
played dodgeball. It's a lot of fun down there in
over there in San Francisco. So Jamar gets a chance
to do that. Bengals are getting set to play the
Arizona Cardinals with jacobyid. Jacoby Brissette will be appearing in
his one hundredth NFL game on Sunday.

Speaker 1 (48:40):
Good for him.

Speaker 2 (48:40):
One o'clock the game live on ESPN fifteen thirty. College
Hoops Earlier today, case On Williams scored twenty six. Kentucky
knocked off Bellerman ninety nine to eighty five, Ohio State
a winner over Grambling. Maybe Bell Rabinowitz is covering that game,
and he's so deep into covering Ohio State's twenty six
point basketball win over Grambling that he forgot the supposed.

Speaker 1 (49:00):
To be on right now. The book raton ball is
happening right now. They're playing.

Speaker 2 (49:05):
They're in the final two minutes Louisville leeds Toledo twenty
seven to twenty two. In that game where the coach
this is the one where they get to think of
big beans. Right, it's a big beans bowl. Bush's big beans.
They pour beans on the winning coach. Jeff Brom's gonna
have beans pored on them they win this thing.

Speaker 5 (49:22):
Right.

Speaker 1 (49:22):
We're at Oakley Greens, great place.

Speaker 2 (49:24):
For your holiday happy hours and to watch the college
football playoff, to watch the Bengals game. College football play
if you got a game on New Year's Eve night,
and they got three on the first Liberty Bowl on Friday.
Of course, OSU versus Miami is the first quarterfinal game.
And we were hoping to spend a few minutes with
our friend Bill Rebinowitz about the buck Eyes and the

(49:47):
book that he wrote about last year's team. And he's
not answering his phone, and that happens something. Maybe he's busy,
maybe something came up, maybe he's on a better radio show.
I have no idea, but we'll try to track him
down and if not, I'll just do my thing on ESPN.
Fifteen thirty Cincinnati Sports Station. This is this is our

(50:08):
last show before Christmas, and you know things. I didn't
want things to end on a sour note. Fortunately, we
have tracked down our friend Bill Rabinowitz, whose book Buckeye
Brotherhood outlines the inside story behind last year's twenty twenty
four Ohio State National Championship football team. Bill covered Ohio

(50:30):
state sports for years for the Columbus Dispatch, now for
his substack Bill on the Buckeyes. The book is terrific.
Bill is terrific. He's with us now, Hi, Bill, Hello,
how are you. I'm well, it's awesome to have you.
I'm thinking, like fifty three weeks ago, you know, Ryan
Day is getting set to coach in the college football Playoff.

(50:50):
He's just lost to Michigan. It feels like the walls
are closing in. He's coaching for his job, and he
has since won a national title. They're the odds on
favorite to win an other one. He beats Michigan, the
Michigan programs and tatters. What a difference twelve months at
a week make Yeah.

Speaker 11 (51:08):
It is crazy to think how things changed. I mean,
I think everyone went to that Tennessee game thinking you
know which team's going to show up.

Speaker 6 (51:14):
Are they going to mail it in or are they
going to come out inspired?

Speaker 11 (51:17):
And they blew the doors down and then rolled through
the playoffs in one of the great turnarounds in college
football history. I mean, they were as low as a
team can get after losing in Michigan because all those
guys came back primarily to beat Michigan. You know, oh yeah,
they wanted to win the national championship, but that was
the most immediate goal is to beat Michigan. When they
lost that game, inexplicably, they're like, what do we come

(51:38):
back for? Then they had the you know, team meeting.
It's kind of become famous and then they went on
that role and yeah, it's crazy, and you think about
what's happened in Michigan since then, and look, that's it
was kind of in some ways a bit of a
house of cards there right especially.

Speaker 6 (51:55):
After Harball left.

Speaker 11 (51:57):
And it is sad because obviously there's you know, the
human the toll it has taken, but the boy, it's
the programs are on different footings right now.

Speaker 2 (52:06):
I hear about brotherhood and football, and sometimes it can
sound cliche. I actually talked with Patrick Yard, who played
for the Bearcats this year, was on that Ohio State
team and outline just for me, you know how how
legitimate and real that was. That is I think one
of the it's the central theme of your book. You've
been around a lot of Ohio State teams. Was this
the most close knit one?

Speaker 11 (52:28):
I think so, just because they've been through so much together.
You know, they stayed for four years, which is pretty unusual.
And honestly, if you had asked me at the start
of the process of writing the book whether I would
have a title like Buckeye Brotherhood, I probably would have
said no.

Speaker 6 (52:43):
Because it seems like a cliche.

Speaker 11 (52:44):
Right Every team is, oh, we're a family, We're so
close or so this, and usually it's it's kind of
a this is not really the truth.

Speaker 6 (52:51):
But these guys.

Speaker 11 (52:52):
Were, I mean, and and time after time that brotherhood
sustained them. And as I kept doing their research and
writing this, it was obvious that that had to be
the title, because that was that's what it was. I mean,
you can kind of roll your eyes at it, which
is the temptation, but it was real and I think
that's what carried the day for them. That's really what
got him through it. That and the fact they were

(53:14):
really talented too. I mean, don't overlook that they were
really talented.

Speaker 2 (53:18):
That that brotherhood, if you will, It's hard to achieve
in the old way the college football was played. I
think that's what stands out to me, right and in
this era where you're you're seeing coaches across sports have
a hard time, you know, cobbling together teams and building
culture and and and keeping it keeping it going from
one year to the next, I think to me, and
you're much closer to it than I am. Obviously, that's

(53:39):
what made what they had last year stand out.

Speaker 6 (53:43):
Yeah.

Speaker 11 (53:44):
Again, you know, these guys could have gone to the NFL,
could have made you know, look, they got nil money.
It's not like they were, you know, poor, but they
could have in some cases made a considerably uh you know,
bigger amount and gotten closer to the second contract that
every NFL player, every football player once. But they they
just felt like it was unfinished business, that they couldn't

(54:05):
in good conscience leave Ohio State without having beaten Michigan
and making a run at the national championship, and and.

Speaker 6 (54:12):
To have the adversity that they did, to have.

Speaker 11 (54:15):
You know, to have lost to Oregon in October, which
was a tough loss but not devastating, But then to
lose to Michigan was devastating. It was not a good
Michigan team and and they did not expect nobody expected that.
I don't think missig expected, you know, that that outcome.
So yeah, that was that was a big.

Speaker 6 (54:32):
Part of it.

Speaker 11 (54:32):
But also, and I think the heart of the book
is the are the personal stories that I that I
really tried to dig deep and get to ryan days background.
I mean, you know, most people Hooseate fans know that
his father died by suicide when he was eight. You
know just what that impact was on his life. And
and that was kind of the first chapter of the book.
And then there are other players these stories. Jack Sawyer

(54:55):
has a had an arc to his story where five
star guys Pickerington, a suburb of Columbus, and his career
was just kind of okay until the end of his
junior year, then senior year, he wanted to make a
big splash and he was one minute late to a
workout and thought that he had blown his chance to
be a captain, you know, and he obviously makes the

(55:17):
most famous play of the season. That's the cover shot
of the book is the Sawyer scoop and score against Texas.
And I've got a whole chapter on just that one play.
Just what diystect to get from every angle, what he saw,
what coaches saw, what players and coaches and Ross by
York the ad what they experienced watching that play. That's

(55:37):
that's kind of one of the fun chapters of the
book is his people reliving that play. But the heart
of the book is just the stories of these players,
one after the other, who overcame adversity, whether it was
injuries or whether it was not feeling like their career
had gone the way they wanted it to. That was
kind of that's the essence of the book.

Speaker 2 (56:00):
Guy Brotherhood, How Ohio State navigated a new world to
win a national championship. Bill Robinowitz, if if you are
thinking of a very last minute gift for an Ohio
State fan, highly recommend really quick. With the college football
Playoff quarterfinal looming, how much should the performance against Indiana's

(56:21):
defense in the Big Ten title game give folks pauses
they look ahead to next I guess next Wednesday night.

Speaker 11 (56:28):
Well we'll find out, But I do think it could
be a blessing in disguise.

Speaker 6 (56:32):
I think that day that was kind of a weird week.

Speaker 11 (56:35):
It was signing day. They Brian Hartline took the South
Florida job. They had to try to hold onto Chris
Henry Junior, of course, the son of the former Bengal receiver.

Speaker 6 (56:44):
It's weird.

Speaker 11 (56:44):
I covered Chris Henry as a Bengal for the Dispatch
and now recovering Chris Henry Junior.

Speaker 6 (56:51):
And I saw him at a recruiting thing.

Speaker 11 (56:52):
Last year, camping last year, and I told him, man,
he was, oh, man, you're old.

Speaker 6 (56:58):
But kind of a weird week, And uh yes. I
think that they probably they.

Speaker 11 (57:04):
Will probably help them to be humbled some and and
realize that they're not invincible. But they have to fix
some things too. You know, the offensive line did not
play well in that game, and they've got to get.

Speaker 6 (57:15):
Some things sticked.

Speaker 11 (57:16):
But I'm not convinced that Jeremiah Smith or Carnell Tate
was all that healthy in that game. I think it,
you know, we'll see. Look, you'd never know. Last year
all the teams they had to buy lost. Now, some
of those were the teams that probably shouldn't gotten a buy.
But you know, there is that concern, and Miami is
talented enough to beat them. I'm not sure that they

(57:36):
have been consistent enough and they've.

Speaker 6 (57:38):
Got some holes. But but you know, that's going to
be an interesting game. We'll see.

Speaker 11 (57:43):
Look and probably to answer a question you might be thinking,
or somebody might be thinking, no, I do not have
plans to write another book.

Speaker 1 (57:53):
Championship. You write a book. That's how it works.

Speaker 11 (57:57):
It's a little tough, you know, doing a book in
four months with the level of reporting that I that
I do is I don't think mentally or physically I
can do that back to back years, but but I do.
Ohio State fans follow me on substack Bill Rabinowitz dot
substack dot com. That you know, I left the Dispatch
in September on very good terms. It was my decision strictly.

(58:21):
I've just been looking for something different and substack gives
me freedom to write, you know, covered team the way
I've I've always wanted to do it. Yeah, yeah, I
am charging. I mean, you could get a free subscription,
but I obviously you know what pays. The bills are
the paid subscription. So I appreciate if people would do that,
you know, and I want to keep doing what I do.

Speaker 6 (58:40):
And so.

Speaker 11 (58:42):
Yeah, it's been a weird year because they didn't really
have much of a regular season that was that had
any drama. I mean it was Texas at the beginning
and Issue at the end, and not much in the middle.
But now it heats up, you know, now it gets interesting.

Speaker 2 (58:56):
No question, Bill on the Buckeye Substack and Buckeye Brotherhood available.
As we say, Bill, where you get your books. Appreciate
the time, man, have a great Christmas.

Speaker 1 (59:05):
Thanks so much.

Speaker 6 (59:06):
Hi, thanks, No, appreciate it.

Speaker 2 (59:09):
You got it, Bill, Bill Rabinowitz, easy for me to say,
does an awesome job. Got a substack, Buckeye Brotherhood, the
book about last year's national title team, wrote a book
about the twenty fourteen national title team. Wrote a book
about the twenty twelfth team with Urban Meyer in his
first year that went undefeated. We are done, We're way late.
We have to go. Thanks to Drew wester Heidi for
producing on site, Joe Waddell for producing back in Kenwood.

(59:30):
Thanks to the staff at Oakley Greens. Chad Brendle's in
for me tomorrow. I hope everybody has an awesome Christmas
and we'll talk to you next week. This is ESPN
fifteen thirty Cincinnati Sports station