1/5/25 - The Tony & Mo Football Show - Mo Egger

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Fifteen thirty, Cincinnati Sports Station.

Speaker 2 (00:04):
This is the Tony and Mo Football Show, live from
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Speaker 3 (00:46):
Bengals for the final time the twenty twenty five Bengals season.
It's the Tonyamo Football Show on ESPN fifteen thirty. We
are broadcasting today from Twin Peaks in Florence. Right off
Ive seventy five. Join us for the season finale. We
are here until six o'clock. A great place to eat,
great place to watch. Think about this. You got five

(01:08):
consecutive nights of playoff football Thursday Friday the College Football
Playoffs semi Finals. Then you've got the NFL Playoffs, two
games on Saturday, three on Sunday, then one a week
from tonight. So what you can do is basically spend
five consecutive days at Twin Peaks. You can watch some
of the games here in Florence. You can watch some
of the games at the Westchester location, but we would

(01:30):
love it if you were here between now and six o'clock.
Great staff, full bar, awesome food, and we are here
until six o'clock tonight.

Speaker 4 (01:40):
Shout out to college football for just getting it. Yes,
don't try to make the games on the weekends. Understand
it's wild card weekend.

Speaker 3 (01:47):
Yep.

Speaker 4 (01:47):
You take Thursday, you take Friday, dominate those days and
then usher in the NFL.

Speaker 3 (01:53):
And everybody gets a week off. Yep. Right, you either
played on Wednesday or Thursday of last week, and so
it works out great. It's gonna lead to a great
five day of football. We want to thank the staff
here at Twin Peaks in Florence and the one in
Westchester for having us all season long. We have a
lot to discuss. If you're wondering, Zach Taylor does have
a press conference today at four point thirty. We're gonna

(02:14):
go ahead and err a live because pretty significant news.
The Bengals made the official announcement today Mike Brown himself
from his desk. From his desk, I'm sure he sent
the tweet.

Speaker 4 (02:25):
Do you think he penned it, typed it.

Speaker 3 (02:28):
I'm gonna guess he dictated it. Okay, made the announcement
that both Zach Taylor and Duke Tobin will return in
twenty twenty six. I guess my first question would be this,
and I asked it to you guys during quick Hits.
I kind of took that as Mike, you're telling me
what I already knew.

Speaker 5 (02:46):
Now.

Speaker 3 (02:46):
I think there's something significant about the owner announcing it.
I think there's something telling about the owner announcing it
that tells you that I think, at least whether or
not to move on from Zach or Duke we're under
discussion by the people who run the franchise. So I
think the announcement itself is significant for those reasons. I
watch a lot of folks on social media do it

(03:07):
chimalm with social media, But I watch a lot of
folks on social media who are outraged to the degree
that it makes me wonder did they actually think that
the possibility existed? Sure that the Bengals were going to
move on from Zach or Duke or both.

Speaker 4 (03:21):
Right, I think we did get a little bit of
a change. We're gonna hear from Duke Tobin on Friday.
We are, which is far different than in your face.
And yeah, credit to the Bengals and Duke Tobin whoever
made that possible.

Speaker 3 (03:31):
That should be a new thing every year.

Speaker 4 (03:32):
It should be that should be the bare minimum.

Speaker 3 (03:35):
And it should be something that happens on occasion during
the season and throughout the off season. Right correct. At
the bye week, at the very least.

Speaker 4 (03:42):
Mike Brown talked about, you know, getting back to work
on how to write this, how to get this fixed.
You know, I'm gonna be very interested on Friday to
hear what the steps are to getting there, because you know,
we've highlighted mo The inability to do anything seemingly other
than DJ Slaton this offseason blew up in this team's face,

(04:03):
and I thought, you know, as the year went on, Yes,
I've questioned Zach as the play color openly for a
couple of years now. Never have I taken personally more
heat off of Zach and put it on Duke. In
my opinion, that's kind of where I'm at of you know,
the the personnel, as we've talked about at the end

(04:24):
of the year for three consecutive years now, doesn't seem
to match the scheme in which they're trying to deploy.
That happened they moved on from lou Narumo Al Golden
was brought in. That didn't work, So, you know, I
want to know what's going to change. I want to
know how they can get this fixed. But the thought
of ever tuning in today and hearing that Zach or

(04:46):
Duke or both were out of a job would have
been an absolute shock to me. That never was on
the table. It was always going to be them running
it back. It's how they run it back to me
is going to be pivotal if they're going to be
in a different position on this day now year.

Speaker 3 (05:00):
So it's it's the question that defines the offseason, right,
how do you make changes with the same people? How
do you enact change by by by not firing folks,
by not bringing in people from the outside. And so
I guess the the the one at the top of
the list for me would be will they ignore the
obvious like he was on display yesterday at the end

(05:20):
of the game. One more painful reminder to the degree
that a season ending loss that sends your record to
six and eleven can be painful, but one more painful
reminder that your defense, every time it was asked to
get a stop, could not.

Speaker 4 (05:36):
And I think this more so now than a lot
of years past mo because you don't see mahomes Lamar
Allen in the playoffs. You know what, I see a
lot of young coaches that have made an immediate impact
on their organization, a lot of gms that have made
an immediate impact on the organization. Look what Mike McDonald,
McDonald's dumba Seattle, I asked you yesterday. I watched that

(06:01):
game the other night. I don't recognize any names on
that defense. They're phenomenal. What Liam Cohen has done in
year one with the Jacksonville Jaguars. People don't talk a
lot about Sean Payton. It's his second year in Denver
with a rookie quarterback. What he's been able to do
go up and down the list, Mike Mike Rabel, like
Drake May's awesome. Not a ton of other names on
that team, and that roster was awful. Last year and

(06:23):
they've turned it around to be the number two seed
in the NFL. Ben Johnson in year one is a
two seed. We know about San Francisco and Kyle Shanahan,
we know about Sean McVay, Can Allison in Carolina. I
know it's not pretty, but they're way ahead of schedule.
Every team in the playoffs you can look and say,
Demiico Ryans goes under the radar. So no more now

(06:46):
than ever does the coaching matter when the stars you
think of quarterback are not participating in this year's playoffs.
And then I think to what I always go back
on a lot of these teams. You look at Denver,
you look at Seattle, of the way they're instructed personnel
perfectly matches scheme.

Speaker 3 (07:03):
Mm hm.

Speaker 4 (07:03):
It's something we've harped on now for three plus years.
Duke Tobin's been here, what twenty seven years now. I
don't think they've ever been more disconnected on the types
of players they're bringing in versus what they want.

Speaker 3 (07:12):
To do on the field. Yeah, And so for me,
that's we talk about alignment, alignment between the coach and
the front office. Like I'm interested and I don't think
we're gonna get this answer. I don't think we're gonna
get this answer today. I don't think we're gonna get
this answer when Duke Tobin talks on Friday. I would
really wonder how much were Duke and Zach and Mike

(07:33):
on the same page sure with relation to how the
offseason last year was gonna unfold. And so I'm kind
of curious, is everybody really on the same page? And
I'm curious, and I'm not sure my curiosity is ever
going to be satisfied. I'm looking for are they going
to address the obvious? The obvious is historically bad defense,
a defense that, more than anything else, including Joe Burrow

(07:56):
getting hurt, cost this team a chance to play in
the postseason. Why open postseason? I'm curious as to whether
or not you and I talked about this yesterday with
Ken Rue the evaluation of college players. What's gonna take
priority the stuff on film or the sheet of paper
with how tall you are, how fast to run, and
how much you can bench?

Speaker 4 (08:16):
But that part, to me is the interesting part. You
know we talked about yesterday. I got Zach Taylor pounding
the table in excitement for Jermaine Burton Jermaine Burton was
supposed to originally replace t Higgins, Miles Murphy, Joseph Osai,
Samar Stewart, We're all supposed to replace Sam Hubbard and
Trey Hendrickson. At some point they have had a luxury
because of roster build in the last couple of years

(08:38):
to draft for development. You don't get that luxury anymore
no more? Can you say? Do you see what that
guy ranas Fortyan? You see the explosivenitch, you see his
broad jump? What I want to hear them talk about
production at the college level. Right when I turn on
a film, Does the guy jump off the page?

Speaker 3 (08:55):
Yep?

Speaker 4 (08:56):
Not as athleticism or man. He was close to the
quarterback a lot, He sacked the quarterback a lot. Did
he score a lot of touchdowns? Did he make a
lot of tackles?

Speaker 3 (09:04):
Yeah?

Speaker 4 (09:05):
You know, say what you want?

Speaker 3 (09:05):
Could he cover?

Speaker 4 (09:07):
And I used this reference last time we talked about it.
You could find a lot of scouts, a lot of
professionals that looked at Luke Keikley and said, ah, he's
just not as fast as we want, not as explosive.
His measurables don't jump off the table. He's a first ballot,
probably Hall of Famer, one of the best to ever do.
It wasn't the most athletic ever, But you watched his
tape at Boston College, I'll watch it at Saint X.

(09:30):
You knew he could make plays because he was all
over the field. So no more do I want to
be interested in leading up to the draft of Well,
look at this player could become. This could be a steal.
I think at the grade and look where we're getting
him at. Now. I need the players that can play
now because you got a quarterback who's going to be
thirty next year. They've missed the playoffs three straight years.
There's no more time to just develop and sit on

(09:52):
your hands.

Speaker 3 (09:53):
No more red shirt seasons.

Speaker 4 (09:55):
Nope.

Speaker 3 (09:56):
The tenth overall pick and who they take in round
two and who they taken round three. Those players must contribute,
not just play. Help Barrett Carter play this year, Dimitrius
Knight played this year. They must not only play, they
must contribute. Yep, they they must make this team better
this coming season. I do not trust Duke Tobin to

(10:18):
find three players at the top of the draft in
the first three rounds. Say what you want about rounds
four through seven, I do not trust, and I'm not
sure most Bengals fans wouldn't agree with me. I do
not trust Duke Tobin when it comes to identifying and
drafting players that that can come in and help week.

Speaker 4 (10:38):
One, and I think that's the week one. I think
that's the worry and the pushback from the announcement today. Yes,
it's not as much about Zach right, it is man
he's been twenty seven years.

Speaker 3 (10:48):
Also, it's it's not like with Shamar Stewart. Draft a
player knowing he's showing up. Yeah, but Chamar may still
end up being a great player. Fine, but what they
went through this offseason with him was comical. So do
your homework and make sure when you draft a guy
you know there's gonna be no drama as it relates

(11:11):
to the contract, the language. He's gonna show up for
all the offseason workouts, he's gonna be here for mini camp.
He's not gonna blast the organization in the locker room
when training camp starts. Do that kind of homework. Like
it's Shamar Stewart. They may have drafted the wrong guy
when it comes to what he didn't put on film,
but it kind of felt like that they drafted the

(11:31):
wrong guy because they weren't ready for what he put
them through.

Speaker 4 (11:33):
Well, maybe taking a step forward, maybe draft a guy
that remembers talking to you before the draft.

Speaker 3 (11:38):
That would be maybe important.

Speaker 4 (11:39):
Maybe draft the guy that you visit with at the
combine and Pro day, you know, build a relationship, get
to knowing these players. Think about this mode. Two years ago,
Jermaine Burton was drafted and one of the greatest, if
not the greatest, college football coach of all time, sat
up on the podium and said, what, yeah, there's some
issues there.

Speaker 3 (11:58):
Uh huh.

Speaker 4 (11:59):
Shamar Stewart was drafted. Shamar Stewart after the draft said
he didn't even remember beating with the Bengals, right, and
then you have the contract problem that comes up after that.
That's the last two drafts players you're drafting to be
relied on, and one never saw the field. You could
argue McKinley, Jackson and Chris Jenkins, and we could go
down the list of all.

Speaker 3 (12:19):
The players, but I haven't been good picks. They've not
been good picks.

Speaker 4 (12:21):
And let alone, it didn't even feel like you did
your research and your homework because you've got Nick Saban
up on stage questioning you. And then you've got Shamar
Stewart after he was pick saying I've never even met
with the Bengals, so I didn't know this was coming.

Speaker 3 (12:32):
Yeah. What I wonder is, is there gonna be somebody
in the room and will their voice matter? If you're
gonna pick Jermaine Burton that raises his hand and goes, look,
I've got a guy who might not be as fast,
might not be his athletic, maybe he didn't play in
the SEC, but he's really damn good and we can
count on him, and so we're gonna take him instead,

(12:53):
Take him instead? Right? Is there gonna be somebody in
the room that says, hey, look, Shamar Stewart, man, when
you put the tape measure up to him, he's awesome.
But I've got a guy here who look what he
does on film. Is there gonna be somebody in the
room who says that, and will their voice be heard?
And will they have a say in what they do
in the draft and otherwise?

Speaker 4 (13:13):
But I sat there this year and I watched last
year Notre Dame football, and I thought, Bengals need a safety.
Here's one that was coached by Al Golden. Oh, by
the way, Savior watch third or fourth right now when
it comes to defensive Rookie of the Year voting. But
all I heard was measurables, Yeah, step slow, and I'm
sitting there. He played under your defensive coordinator at a

(13:37):
high level on a team that played for a national championship.
He's available when you're making your selections and you pass.
So my question is how much of us, say, did
Al Golden have well?

Speaker 3 (13:49):
Also with that? In particular, when the draft came and went,
we all thought, okay, they're taking the safety yeah, right, Okay,
they've got a plan be in safety. Plan B was
asking Gino Stone to take a pay cut, yeah, and
letting him play seventeen games. When does that?

Speaker 4 (14:02):
When does Gino's contract get announced at this point in
the offseason.

Speaker 3 (14:07):
I that would be my tipping point.

Speaker 4 (14:12):
I think I think that's a lot of people.

Speaker 3 (14:13):
That would be my tipping point.

Speaker 4 (14:14):
But I have I've watched Xavier Watson. I listened to
all the negatives on Xavier wats, but I'm like, hey,
just played for Al Golden, right and he played at
a high level.

Speaker 3 (14:23):
It's like, if if you don't take him, fine, what
else you got correct, and what else they had was
Geno Stone, who is terrible all season awful, yep, awful.
It is nineteen minutes after three o'clock where its Twin
Peaks and Florence, Tony NMO Football Show Here till six o'clock.
Duke Tobin and Zach Taylor both back for the twenty
twenty sixth season. We have a lot of offseason issues
to discuss. We'll talk briefly about the game yesterday. We'll

(14:46):
get to the AFC North title till last night between
Baltimore and Pittsburgh. Spent some time on the NFL playoffs
this weekend, the college football playoff. I don't know, Tony,
if we're gonna have time for a college basketball detour.

Speaker 4 (14:57):
It wouldn't bother me. Okay, do you want to talk
about tipping points?

Speaker 3 (15:04):
It is nineteen after three here told Sex Tonya MO
Football Show Twin Peaks in Florence on ESPN fifteen thirty,
Cincinnati Sports.

Speaker 1 (15:12):
Station, Cincinnati's ESPN fifteen thirty.

Speaker 5 (15:17):
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(15:39):
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Speaker 3 (15:49):
Twenty five after three o'clock. This is the Tony and
Mo Football Show. We're at Twin Peaks and Florence today
on ESPN fifteen thirty. On the day we found out
that indeed Zach Taylor will be back as the team's
head coach in twenty twenty six. In this offseason, Duke
Tobin will be the de facto general manager for the
four hundred and sixth consecutive season. I don't know that

(16:10):
we have to spend a ton of time on yesterday's game,
but to me, it was the perfect storm if you
wanted them to. If you were concerned that late season
results were going to cloud anybody's judgment, yeah, then you
wanted something to go wrong, and what needed to go
wrong was the defense This team this season has been

(16:32):
defined for me, at least by so many times in
the fourth quarter the Bengals defense needing a stop either
to win the game or give the offense a chance
to win the game, and they have failed pretty much
every single time, including yesterday.

Speaker 4 (16:47):
The result of yesterday never mattered. No, but I heard
last Monday Zach Taylor say Joe Burrow is going to
play because winning matters. Joe Burrow dropped back thirty nine
times yesterday. Of those thirty nine attempts, only three to
one over fifteen yards. At one point in the game,
Cleveland lost both starting corners, and for three series the

(17:07):
Bengals operated without any understanding or knowledge that the corners
were out. In my opinion, they didn't try to win
the game yesterday because that's not the game plan you
would use to beat Cleveland.

Speaker 3 (17:18):
They looked like they were trying to get the game
over with as quickly.

Speaker 4 (17:21):
Jump fine with fine, But I watched Dallas the whole
second half sit Dak Prescott. I watched other teams bench
their starting quarterback. My only question, and it's not as
impactful today because we are into the offseason mode and
Joe Burrow's healthy. The only question I had is. I
heard Joe's gonna play because winning is the most important thing.

(17:43):
It never felt like they tried to truly win that
game yesterday, which makes me ask, if not, why is
he playing?

Speaker 3 (17:50):
Sure?

Speaker 4 (17:50):
That was the only thing I came away with, and
again he made it through healthy. A couple little bit,
a couple of scares here and there. But when I
watched how they played and how the game unfolded, my
immediate question was, why is he still in the game
in the second half.

Speaker 3 (18:05):
We talked about it leading up to it. I wouldn't
have played him to begin with. As the game went on,
I kept wondering, if this is how you're gonna play,
what's the point? What's the point in having him drop
back thirty nine times? And but oh, I viewed yesterday
as Burrow came out of it healthy.

Speaker 4 (18:20):
So they won, And there was the one thing fourth
and one on Cleveland's forty five, and they did the
thing to try to draw him off side. I hated
so much. And then in a week eighteen game that
didn't matter when Chase Brown was running the ball well,
they took a delay a game and punted I. It

(18:40):
was weekend and I went into the game. I'm like,
I'm not gonna get mad about anything today. I'm just
gonna kind of want I was furious. Yes, it's week eighteen.
Even the announcers were like, what are you doing? You
got nothing to lose on the final week of the year,
when you're playing for nothing. It's fourth and like half
a yard and you try to get him to jump.
I just would I mean, Joe fly, I got a
two yard quarterback sneak today?

Speaker 3 (19:01):
That not again? Right?

Speaker 4 (19:03):
They took that delay a game and I got lost
my mind.

Speaker 3 (19:07):
Do you think Joe Burrow took a dive on Miles
Garrett's record breaking sack.

Speaker 4 (19:10):
I think he realized he was going to go down
and that was the easiest way to go down.

Speaker 3 (19:14):
I have no problem with it all.

Speaker 4 (19:15):
I would rather that than him getting like grabbed and
slung down and bouncing off his head.

Speaker 3 (19:19):
Yeah, okay, you're gonna get you where I am. Here's
your sack history. Zach Taylor and Jamar Chase were winding
after the game about the fact that the game was
paused very pree careless. I couldn't care less. I guess
here's what I would say, I asked. I think I
was talking to Ken off air before during the breaks
of one of the breaks of our show yesterday, and
I said, I wonder if he gets it, if they'll

(19:40):
pause the game, oftentimes to Drew Brees, Dan Marino, a
handful of others. I can recall them briefly pausing the game.

Speaker 4 (19:48):
Now, I think you could push back a little bit
if the Bengals are playing for a number one seed
or yeah, there's playoff implications on the line.

Speaker 3 (19:56):
They didn't they didn't drive out of Corvette and erect
a stage, you know, I mean, send the teams to
their locker rooms. It was a minute maybe, right, So
I guess my thing is yesterday I asked Ken, like,
I wonder if they're gonna do anything. If I'm wondering
it before the game, sure shouldn't the coach where you
just go, look if he gets at what's gonna happen? So,

(20:17):
you know, so you could tell your team.

Speaker 4 (20:19):
I mean hisach's response of you know, we're trying to
win a game and we're.

Speaker 3 (20:22):
Fighting for our lives. Come on, I understand not liking
the pause. You're in rhythm, you're trying to play, you're
trying to like, I get it, But if you know
it's coming, you can prepare for it. You can't prepare
for it if you don't know it's coming, and you're
not gonna know it's coming if you don't ask, Like
you can blame the officials, sure, but how is that

(20:44):
not one of the things you ask going into the game. Hey,
if he gets that sack, is there anything out of
the ordinary that's gonna happen? And at that point you
could at least prepare your team and prepare yourself as
a play caller. Here's what's gonna happen if he gets
the sack?

Speaker 4 (21:00):
Right?

Speaker 3 (21:00):
Ain't that hard? Yeah?

Speaker 4 (21:01):
That's another reason I would have second half. I'm taking
Joe out because you could feel the pressure mounting. Uh huh,
Like Miles Garrett's gonna do whatever he has to do
to get this sack.

Speaker 3 (21:08):
Hey, we're putting them everywhere.

Speaker 4 (21:09):
I'm good, Yes, Like I don't need to see anything else.
Speaking of that, the Michael Strahan comment about straight hand
did in sixteen games, Miles Garrett did in seventeen Any
problem with that?

Speaker 3 (21:21):
It's context? Yeah, I mean it's you know, it's it's
Roger maher Is hitting sixty one in one hundred and
sixty two games versus Babe Ruth hitting sixteen one hundred
and fifty four. It's still an awesome accomplishment. Sure, but
I haven't looked at pass rush snaps, right, that's straight hand.
I haven't looked at that. I I apparently don't care.
It's the sack record. But if you want to apply
context and say, look this, dude did it in sixteen.

(21:43):
We used to play. We used to play twelve games.
We used to play fourteen games. I mean, we're gonna
play eighteen here soon, so you're you're gonna have more
and more of this.

Speaker 4 (21:52):
What do you make of after the game? Jamar being
asked about any changes to the staff, did you get it,
make anything out of it, or just Jamar Jamar knows
what he's doing.

Speaker 3 (22:00):
Yeah, jams Jamar knows what he's doing.

Speaker 4 (22:03):
We always talked about Joe and count. Jamar is not
stupid either.

Speaker 3 (22:07):
No. Yeah, I guess what I would ask Jamar is
if you lack confidence in the coaching staff, what changed
from when you signed your contract less than a year ago.
Was it simply this year went awry? Yeah? Like what

(22:27):
a year ago when you signed that contract? That for
about five minutes major the highest paid non quarterback in
the NFL. Did you have the utmost confidence coming off
a non playoff year? Did you have the utmost confidence
in the coaching staff and the organization? And was it
simply this year that took it from Hey, I'm uber
confidence and now I don't have as much.

Speaker 4 (22:49):
The most fascinating thing, Wait, the answer is yes, I understand. Yeah,
the most fascinating thing that will come out of this
year is what happens next year, no doubt, because never
has there been more boiling points I feel like with
the organization, with the coaches, from a fan point of view,
and even a locker room point of view. Yeah, I
mean we talked a ton about Joe Burrow and the
psychology of what he was doing in Jamar Chase. This

(23:12):
becomes just a blip in the radar. If you're back
on schedule next year, if you're in the same situation
next year, you go from what it is this year,
it'll be double that next year, if not worse.

Speaker 3 (23:23):
So the Joe Burrow era is going to be defined,
however long it is, whether it's a decade, whether it's fifteen,
whatever it is, will be defined by do they win
a championship. Now once they win one. If they do,
then you can talk about well winning two, winning three,
et cetera. But he was drafted number one overall to

(23:45):
win a championship. So if, if ultimately this offseason proves
to be what puts the Bengals in a position to
win a championship, then I think we'll look back on
twenty twenty five as a fortunate at the time. Sure,
but okay, yeah, they bounced back. I think this offseason,

(24:05):
if they win a title with Joe's quarterback, he's under
contract for four more years. I think this offseason is
going to be the reason why. And if they don't,
then this offseason is going to be the reason why.
I think it's it's It's that cut and dry for me.

Speaker 4 (24:17):
Is that is how massive this offseason is.

Speaker 3 (24:19):
If in the next four years they win a title,
it will be because players they acquired from outside, whether
it's in the draft or and free agency, and perhaps
some philosophical shift in the front office put this team
in a position to win a title over the next
four years. Yep. And if they failed, then this offseason
will probably prove to be a disaster.

Speaker 4 (24:38):
Correct.

Speaker 3 (24:40):
It is twenty six from four o'clock. Zach Taylor talks
in just under one hour on ESPN fifteen thirty. Cincinnati
Sports Station.

Speaker 1 (24:49):
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(25:14):
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Speaker 3 (25:31):
Sports Headlines are a service at Kelsey Chevrolet, home of
lifetime powertrain protection and guaranteed credit approval from their family
to yours for life kelseychev dot com. Mike Brown, the
owner of the Bengals, announced today from his desk from
his desk that both Duke Tobin and Zach Taylor will

(25:51):
resume We're continuing their roles. I should say as to
facto general manager and head coach, respectively. Bengals winding down
their season with a six and eleven record yesterday, falling
to the Browns at home. Cincinnati out of the playoffs
for a third consecutive year. There are NFL teams changing coaches.
The Browns have blacked Kevin Stefanski, the Raiders are moving

(26:13):
on from Pete Carroll, and the Cardinals fire Jonathan Gannon.
Rahe Morris last night, Rae Morris, last night you had
the coach of the Falcons. College basketball, the Miami RedHawks
up to thirtieth in the AP Top twenty five Men's poll.
Travis Steele's team winning over the weekend, remained undefeated over
Akron u l Louisville is twentieth. Ohio State takes on

(26:37):
Nebraska tonight. You like college basketball coaches shows, this is
your evening, Mark Pope Show, Richard Patino Show.

Speaker 4 (26:45):
Louisville takes on Duke tomorrow at the Center. Had another
weekend out inside of North Carol, North Northern Kentucky and
Miami Kentucky got trouns at Alabama. Xavier loses that to
Paul and of course, the Bearcats lost to Houston.

Speaker 3 (27:00):
Over turnover, turnover, two miss free throws, turnover, end of game,
desperation three in the final three minutes and fifty two seconds.
Ye have those reucs last six possessions? Yep. We'll maybe
spend more time on that a little bit later on.
Does Joe Burrow have a problem with balls being bat
at than the line of scrimmage?

Speaker 2 (27:18):
No.

Speaker 4 (27:19):
I think it is a little bit, since he's been
back of just trying to get the ballot quicker to
avoid the hits, And I think there's a fine line
in between holding on to it too long and getting
rid of it too quick. I think defensive lines adjusted
to the fact that you know they are getting the
ball out quick to protect Joe Burrow Moore. So instead

(27:41):
of the hard pass rush, you've had some more controlled
pass rush and guys getting their hands up. That's a
different blocking technique that takes different scheme and how you're
going to handle guys like that. So I think it's
just a small adjustment they need to make.

Speaker 3 (27:55):
Evan McPherson had a good season. Yeah, he missed two
pats yesterday, was at all troublesome.

Speaker 4 (28:01):
A little bit. I don't think you want to go
into an off season in a negative way like that.
For such a good year, to go into an off
season missing two extra points, it is not the biggest
sign of confidence moving forward. But I think bigger picture,

(28:21):
I think McPherson had a really good year.

Speaker 3 (28:22):
Duke Tobin is going to meet with the media on Friday.
This is significant because this is not the sort of
thing that typically happens. Right, We've talked about it all
year long. Normally Zach Taylor has his season ending press
conference and that's it. Zach's gonna talk at four thirty.
Duke is usually made available at the Combine and then

(28:43):
he's there for media Day, Mock Turtles Soup Day, when
Mike Brown actually talks. Is there anything that Duke Tobin
could say on Friday that would make you feel good
about him returning in his role and the direction the
Bengals are poised to go.

Speaker 4 (29:00):
No, nothing, because everything at this point is you need
to see it. Be great to hear it. Yeah, he's
always gonna say what's he gat Come out and say, well,
we're gonna we hope to be able to fix the defense.
Come out and said we're going to fix the defense. Now,
I'd love if he gives more details. I'd love if
he goes into a little bit of the draft evaluation
process and how they're evaluating free agents. I think that

(29:22):
would be key.

Speaker 3 (29:23):
I think it would be interesting to hear his side
of why this didn't go well? Right, and again, he's
coming back. Everybody expected him to. But Duke, this was
your team, Yeah, and decisions you made this offseason, some
of which were good, right, Dalton Reisner was signed late,

(29:44):
that's a good acquisition. Sure, the Joe Flacco thing in
season that worked out. But I think it would be
interesting to hear his side of why this team so
dramatically underperformed. Yeah, why did your class not performed to
the level that you said prior to the draft it

(30:05):
needed to. If you could go back, what would you
have done differently as it relates to free agency? Were
you expecting some of the positions that you left to
go unaddressed? Are you surprised that things unfolded so poorly
at those spots?

Speaker 6 (30:21):
Like?

Speaker 3 (30:21):
I think getting his perspective on the season that just
happened would be interesting. I'm not sure there's anything he
could say about what's next. Yeah, that would make anybody
feel good about where they go from.

Speaker 4 (30:31):
Here, and also like how far back are you going
to go with him? You gotta talk about Jermaine Burton
at all. That draft pick you're gonna talk about, you know,
Chris Jenkins and McKinley Jackson talk about where you know what?
How do you evaluate where the linebacker room is right now?
How are you evaluating safety going forward? You know, all
of those things I think would be fascinating, But to me,
it's more about what's the plan in place on the

(30:54):
changes they're gonna make. We heard or we read the
statement from Mike Brown and kind of looking at how
this offseason is going to be handled, how do you
envision that happening. I'm still fascinating in the working relationship
between Zach Taylor and Duke Tobin. I'm fascinated in the
evaluation process and how they compare measurables to actual film

(31:15):
work when looking at talent. And we've already alluded to this.
You want to make a statement, if you're Duke Tobin,
or you're Mike Brown, or you're this team, get the
Dalton Reisner deal done yes, and say hey, we're putting
this one in the in the in the rearview mirror.
We don't have to worry about this going forward. This
is done. Don't let him get to the market, don't
let another team overpay for him. Dalton Reisner said after

(31:37):
the game, this is where I want to be. I
want to play next to MEM's. I want to play
next to Karas. I like Scott Peters. I like this team.
It's not gonna it's not gonna break the bank. This
is the type of move that you get done now
and then okay, let's focus on the next thing. We
waited last year until the Higgins and Chase Steels got done,
and then it was like, okay, now the off season starting,

(31:59):
get this done now you As of now, they draft
tenth and they have a projected seventy seven point eight
million dollars in tap space. That's the seventh most in
all of football. They've got the money to spend. Yes,
how are you gonna go about doing it?

Speaker 3 (32:13):
The Riisner thing to me is one of two true
litmus tests. I'll get to the other one in the
four o'clock hour. But the Reisner thing for me is
we say all the time, like make your layups. This
is a layup Yep. Here's a guy who played well,
who has stated publicly on multiple occasions, I want to
play here and I don't want to get to March. Hey,
Duke Tobin, go ahead and get it done. Like this

(32:33):
is of all the hard things Duke Tobin has on
his plate this offseason, this is the easiest one.

Speaker 4 (32:40):
It'd be nice to go to that press conference Friday
too and be able to talk about, you know, hey,
we got this done.

Speaker 3 (32:44):
I would invite Dalton Reisner and say, you want to
talk about coming back to Cincinnati, since here's the contract
we're gonna have you sign. Ye. Like, if you can't
do the easy, then you can't do the hard, right.
They have a lot of hard work in front of them.
This could not be easier, and then you at least
go into the off season going our offensive line is set.

Speaker 4 (33:03):
Yep.

Speaker 3 (33:04):
You can find depth pieces, maybe a long term replacement
for Orlando Brown. I get it. But the five guys
we had play on the offensive line of the second
half of the season, that's gonna be our offensive line. Yep.
Like make your layups. Dalton Reisner is giving you the
ball under the rim. Make the layup. This is simple.

Speaker 4 (33:23):
Dunket shoot a floater.

Speaker 3 (33:25):
Yeah, talking about the working relationship between Zach and Joe,
and it's why I cut Zach a little slack. I
would be willing to bet that if you said to
Zach Taylor going into last offseason, what do you want
to do on defense? He wouldn't say TJ Slayton oron
Burks and draft some guys. I'm gonna guess, if you,

(33:49):
as Zach Taylor he had no interest in watching the
Trey Hendrickson drama unfold again for another offseason, I'm gonna guess,
if you, as Zach Taylor, the unending tract issues that
this team has been wrestling with for years, I would
be willing to bet like he wants those things resolved
as quickly as possible. And so there, to me is

(34:09):
where the alignment comes from. Right. It's not they're gonna
have disagreements on which players to draft, They're gonna have
disagreements on which players to sign keep and all of that.
But like some of the stuff that makes the coaches
job more difficult, like that stuff I just outlined, I
there's where the alignment comes in. Yep, Hey, Duke, Mike, Katie,

(34:30):
you guys ensure that when I'm coaching my team, I
don't have to deal with side shows. I don't have
to deal with distractions. I don't have to deal with
the questions I will get about a player you haven't signed.
That to me is where the alignment comes in.

Speaker 4 (34:46):
Yeah, and again I would also bring up to Duke
the distractions, as you mentioned, like how do you go
into this offseason making sure you avoid those distractions? You know,
because last year it was a distraction with Shamar Stewart,
it was a distraction with Trey Hendrickson, say what you
want we were down there at camp. That became a
distraction every single day because you're answering the same questions

(35:08):
once you know, the lead up to Jamar and t
getting done and then what's going to happen next? Nothing
really did. That became more of a talking point what
can this organization do, Duke to avoid those distractions?

Speaker 3 (35:22):
And I think you have to look at the players
in that twenty three class that are up for extensions
a year left on their deal. Is there a player
of there that, if they don't get theirs right, becomes
a hold in or a hold out or goes on
to posture publicly the way Trey Hendrickson did. Maybe the
answers are no. But among those players that include DJ

(35:45):
Turner and Chase Brown and Andrea yoshavas that twenty twenty
three class, is there a player that if you don't
sign now it becomes a problem. And if the answer
is yes, then a the problem.

Speaker 4 (36:00):
Could you imagine early on Reisner gets done and you
get Chase Brown and a team friendly deal. Awesome, and
you now say to your offense, what's great start, Maybe
maybe we'll address wide receiver three. Outside of that, we're good. Yeah,
Now let's hone in on the defensive side of the ball.
And not only good, you'd be good for three or
four seasons now going forward, at least if.

Speaker 3 (36:23):
They got the Dalton Reisner thing done and then you know,
if you want to add Chase Brown to it, what
a luxury like? That's the thing. I know this is
not the first time I've talked about this, but there's
a lot of gms or gms who will be hired.
But eighteen general managers have to take teams that didn't
make the postseason and find a way to turn them

(36:45):
into postseason teams next year. How many of them on
one side of the ball are set, right, I'm guessing.

Speaker 4 (36:53):
One mean, how many out of the coaching jobs that
are vacant now, right? Are are you looking at to
an We're good there.

Speaker 3 (36:58):
I mean, get Dalton Reisner back in the fold, and
again you'll draft for depth on the offensive line, and
there's a good conversation about the third wide receiver and
if they don't bring Noah Fan back, maybe somebody who's
the twenty twenty six version of him. But you are set,
You are good. Like, there's a lot of gms who

(37:19):
failed this year who have to get to work on
next year starting today, and their roster is a mess,
or they don't know who their quarterback is going to be.
None of them have a side of the ball that
you could legitimately leave untouched and be okay.

Speaker 4 (37:33):
Yeah, I mean look at like, look across teams that
are no longer playing this year going into next year.
So even the Kansas City Chiefs have massive questions on
both sides of the.

Speaker 3 (37:42):
Ball, including their quarterback's health.

Speaker 4 (37:44):
Correct, Yeah, you know Lamar and the Ravens massive questions. Yeah,
on both sides of the ball. You can go up
and down the list. It's not that case here. It's
a simple deal with Dalton Reisner, and you don't have
any questions on that side of the ball.

Speaker 3 (37:58):
Nine minutes away from four o'clock, I think Dalt Reisner
is one of the litmus tests that will prove whether
or not things are different. I think there's another one
we'll get to in the four o'clock hour. We're here
at Twin Peaks in Florence till six. The final Toni
and Mo Football Show of twenty twenty five s last
twenty six on ESPN fifteen thirty Cincinnati Sports.

Speaker 1 (38:17):
Station Cincinnati's ESPN fifteen thirty.

Speaker 5 (38:23):
Traffic from the UC Health Traffic Center u See Health's
Call five one three nine three nine two two sixty three.
That's nine thirty nine two two sixty three southbound seventy five.
It is an accident blocking the contraflow lane that's approaching
Norwood Lateral. Another crash northbound on Houston Road that's at

(38:46):
Thoroughbred Boulevard and northbound seventy five. Traffic is stop and
go between Mitchell and Town a five to ten minute delay.
I'm at Ezelic with traffic this report.

Speaker 3 (38:56):
About a minute here where Twin Peaks in Florence, Tonia,
moh Football show, Steelers win the AFC North. Fourth quarter
of that game last night was an absolute blast. Tyler Loop,
the Ravens rookie kicker misses a field goal that would
have given the Ravens the AFC North title. My issue
was Lamar Jackson had some moments in the fourth quarter

(39:17):
in that game. I was rooting for Baltimore because I
can't stand the Steelers. Yeah, I wanted Lamar to have
a chance to throw the ball on the end zone
before they kick the field goal.

Speaker 4 (39:26):
I don't even care about end zone. But you got
Zay Flowers who had went off in the fourth quarter,
you got Mark Andrews, Isaiah likely just made an awesome catch.
Give someone else a chance to maybe take it from
a forty four yarder to a thirty five yarder. You know,
I'm sitting there and I'm like, in my mind, I'm
doing the man like that's still like a forty five
yard field goal. A gimme And they line up and
they just kind of do the center of the ball,

(39:47):
and I'm like, You've got to time out, go like
stay aggressive, Yeah, do not put it on again. It's
it's historically not the easiest stadium to kick in. Wins
always kind of swirls and I'll just miss one forty four,
get another ten yards. Yeah, it just and if it's
not there, you throw it away and then you do
the same thing you just did.

Speaker 3 (40:07):
I just Lamar helped put them in a position to win.
I am gonna run as many plays as I possibly
can and say what you want about how he had
played in the first three quarters. He was terrific in
the fourth. Yep, that's my two time MVP, right it.
I want more plays with him, and I'll kick the
field goal as basically a last resist.

Speaker 4 (40:29):
And I know that he's taken some heat this year
and and I think rightfully so at times. But without
DK Metcalf, they've got Adam Thielen. They just mixed in
Austin Is catching touchdown passes. I thought Rogers made some
of his best throws of the year in that second
half last night, specifically on third downs when they needed
it the most. That third down throat of fire mouth,

(40:50):
the third down throw to to Feeling, that was.

Speaker 3 (40:53):
The throw to Friarmuth was vintage at that time.

Speaker 4 (40:55):
Vintage Jaron Rodgers. I still don't know why.

Speaker 3 (40:57):
Having shout Oba he was a fall down helps.

Speaker 4 (40:59):
Yeah, I don't know still why they didn't try it
all to pressure him because he's essentially a statue at
this point in his career. Yeah, in the pocket, but
made it. Rogers made some good plays. They'll get DK
Metcalf back. I still don't think they beat the Texans,
but they have won twenty three straight home Monday Night
football games.

Speaker 3 (41:17):
They have, and we'll see if.

Speaker 4 (41:20):
They can shut out Mike Tomlin pound in his chest
after the missed field goal, But first of.

Speaker 3 (41:26):
All, like when they took the lead, he was celebrating
like they had won. Yeah. Steelers looking for their first
postseason victory since the twenty sixteen season. They will host
the Texans on Monday Night Football as three and a
half point dogs, an offseason litmus test for the Bengals.
Next Tony and Mo Football Show, ESPN fifteen thirty, Cincinnati
Sports Station.

Speaker 1 (41:46):
To your ESPN fifteen thirty.

Speaker 2 (41:49):
This is the Tony end Mo Football Show, Live from
Twin Peaks, brought to you in part by on Core Technologies.
Was it on Core dot Tech end Station East Ohst
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(42:12):
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the Cincinnati Bengals.

Speaker 3 (42:33):
That's us the middle hour of the four o'clock hour
of the Tony Imo Football Show here at Twin Peaks
in Florence on ESPN fifteen thirty. Thank you so much
for joining us. It is the season finale. Unfortunately, just
once one more time. I want to go back to
doing these shows in late January, maybe in February, that
would be awesome.

Speaker 4 (42:49):
That was fun.

Speaker 3 (42:49):
It was a lot of fun. We're having fun today
till six o'clock. If you have not been to Twin Peaks,
then you have not been to one of our shows,
and well that's on you. We are winding down our
sixth year here at Twin Peaks. The staff is always amazing. Yes,
the food is terrific. I got the meatball skillet, went
back to my roots. Meatball skillet. You had the pot roads.

Speaker 4 (43:11):
Sometimes you got to go back to go forward.

Speaker 3 (43:13):
You do, you do, and so I did that today.
Here at Twin Peaks, awesome place to watch all the
playoff games this weekend pro and college college basketball as well.
We are here until six o'clock. Zach Taylor is scheduled
to talk at four thirty. We'll carry that for you
live on the day we found out that he is
coming back, and Duke Tobin is going to maintain his

(43:33):
current role as well. You mentioned the Dalton Reisner thing
as being a layup, and it is right. If you
want to do the hard, then do the easy first.
And doing the easy for me is you have a
player who has helped, who is not that expensive, who
has stated publicly a desire to stay here and not

(43:56):
even hit free agency. Yep, go ahead and get that done.
That is a litt If things are truly different, they
go ahead. This doesn't get to march. This is done
this week. The other litmus test for me is this,
they obviously need defensive upgrades. I find it hard to
believe they're not going to go find some in free agency.

(44:16):
I think they'll find or try to get a three technique,
certainly can make a case for a pass rusher. We'll
see what they do with Joseph Osai. My guess is
they find some help in the back end as well,
specifically at safety. To me, the ultimate litmus test that
will prove that things are changing with the same people,
or that not only has the status quo remain ing,

(44:38):
but some of the things that they typically do will
remain will be at linebacker. I am really curious if
they look at Demetrius Knight and Barrett Carter and go,
you know what, they were rookies, they piled up experience
and they're automatically going to be better, or if they go,
maybe those guys are good NFL players one day, but

(44:59):
we can't take a chance ants We're gonna go find
established starters at that position. That to me is the
true litmus test as to whether or not they're really
gonna be aggressive this offseason what they do at linebacker.

Speaker 4 (45:11):
Yeah, because if you want to be considered a true
title contender, can you genuinely say you are if those
two started linebacker, right The answer is no. Again, unless
they take the biggest jump we've ever seen from year
one to year two. It's not gonna happen. Demitrius Knight
also not a twenty year old with a ton of upside.
He's already kind of established he is what he is

(45:32):
at this point. Barrett Carter I just didn't see it.
From the start of the year to the end of
the year. There wasn't much improvement though. There wasn't progression,
There wasn't development. If this is genuinely different, then you say,
you know what, hand up, we made the mistake. We
can't afford to run it back again. That needs to

(45:53):
be addressed. And if Demetrius Knight's all you all of
a sudden you're third linebacker and Barrett Carter is a
fourth and is a great special teams contributor, awesome. Yeah,
but if you're serious about winning a championship, you're you're
serious about who's playing linebacker on your defense.

Speaker 3 (46:11):
To me, if you're seriously proactive in the quest for
a championship, you don't simply go, well, you know what,
with another season of seasoning, another training camp, a full offseason,
those guys will be better. You go find players who
are upgrades. You go find established players who are upgrades
at that position. And so to me, that's gonna be
the most telling one. If we get to training camp

(46:32):
and we're talking to ourselves back into Knight and Carter
being significantly better as second year players as starters, something
in my opinion will have gone wrong.

Speaker 4 (46:42):
But that's the thing, Like, here we go, there's already
a handful of guys on defense that I can confidently say.
If we get to next year and we're at training
camp and we're watching this player, then how can they
be serious about winning? Like and again, in no way
do I think it could happen, because I do think
it'd be the break point for a lot of Bengal fans.
There's no path in which you can convince anyone that

(47:04):
Genostone should be on this team.

Speaker 3 (47:05):
So I've got the list of players who are due
to be free agents. I have him on the list
because due diligence. Sure, there's no way in hell right
you can't.

Speaker 4 (47:14):
Can you imagine the pushback? Can you imagine the back.

Speaker 3 (47:18):
Life I can in a lifetime of being disappointed by
this franchise. I don't know that I would have reached
a tipping point that I would reach. If we found
out that Genostone is coming back to play for this team,
a player they asked to take a pay cut, yep,
who was genuinely bad this season. I don't know how

(47:38):
you do it, yep. So I will assume that Genostone
plays elsewhere next season. Hey better, All right, let's run
through some of these guys. Trey Hendrickson, now listed on
NFL dot com, is the second best available free agent
this offseason. Nope.

Speaker 4 (47:53):
I After what I saw this year from Trey Hendrickson,
or what I didn't see from Trey Hendrickson, and what
we witnessed in the offseason in the circus that went
around that, I'm good.

Speaker 3 (48:02):
Move on, no franchise tag, no Joseph Osai.

Speaker 4 (48:05):
That's the hardest one, I think. I think on defense,
that's the hardest one, because I think fair market value
is gonna put him thirteen fourteen million dollars on a
defense that you can't miss on that still feels like
a gamble.

Speaker 3 (48:22):
Joe Flacco, Yes, I agree, no offense. I'm good.

Speaker 4 (48:29):
If I got to watch another one of his fumbles
return for a touchdown, three return for touchdowns all the
same way, Yeah, I'm good And especially if I know
and and hopefully the progression of Eric Hall is on
the right track.

Speaker 3 (48:44):
Well, man, I like Eric all and he looked a
part when he was healthy. I can't count on that,
but I feel like there's always a version of Noah fan.
Yes there, you're gonna find that. There's hay urst Yep,
right there. There's always a version of Noah fan out
there who hopefully doesn't fumble. Cam Taylor Britt.

Speaker 4 (49:04):
If it's a slot team friendly deal, I guess I'm
not paying him to be an outside guy anymore. There
was a time two years ago he was gonna be
your number one, and then this year he's gonna be
the number two. Play outside. He couldn't do either of those.
There's there's just too much noise around it. I would
prefer to move on.

Speaker 3 (49:23):
In consecutive years he has been benched.

Speaker 4 (49:26):
T Hudson, I think there's a value for him.

Speaker 3 (49:29):
I agree Cam Sample.

Speaker 4 (49:34):
If if Cam Sample is your fifth guy, I'm good
with it.

Speaker 3 (49:40):
Jake Browning, No, I'm good. I mean you kind of
answered that.

Speaker 4 (49:44):
When would you take I saw this today, Joe Flaccill
bring him back? Would if there's a prospect six or
seventh round would you bring in a quarterback? Somebody called
him today and said, like, where you take him? Your
storm on the third third team? Flacco hangs it up

(50:06):
after their year or so, and then you get a
back up.

Speaker 3 (50:08):
I guess it would be Drew Aller or who else?
And can who else help me win next year? Now?
In the sixth rounds? Right? You know, keep in mind
what you're getting for sure, But can that pick be
used on a player who helps me win football games?
Because if I take a quarterback, that player is not
helping me win football games in twenty twenty six. Not

(50:29):
that you shouldn't be thinking about the quarterback position, specifically
the backup spot, even because of history. Flacco is going
to be forty one years old in the week and
a half and Joe's been hurt. Like, I understand it,
But it is there a player that I'm saying no
to that has a better chance of helping me this year? Sure,

(50:50):
but you know there's a case that can be made
for your long term backup, for a Jake Browning type
that you kind of stashed for a while, get up
to speed and then he's the guy. Sure you would
just hope that the next time he's has to play.
He's better than Jake Browning. Yes, all right, quarter after four.
We're gonna give out some pretend hardware in a five
minutes in award season, Zach Taylor in fifteen minutes award season,

(51:14):
awards season. Yes, we one day we should come up
with real awards. Vote of confidence tail players. Yeah, yeah,
Zach Taylor ain't going anywhere.

Speaker 4 (51:22):
I saw that Orlando brown got like the media award today.

Speaker 3 (51:24):
I did see that. Yeah, good for him. Uh, we're
at the Twin Peaks location in Florence. This is the
Tony in Moments.

Speaker 4 (51:31):
For being nice to the media on.

Speaker 3 (51:34):
Cincinnati Sports Station Cincinnati's ESPN fifteen thirty.

Speaker 5 (51:40):
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Weight Loss Center offers surgical and medical obesity care and expertise.
Called five one three nine nine two two sixty three.
That's nine three nine two two sixty three southbound seventy five.
It's an accident in the contra flow lane that's approaching
Norwood Lean Cruise have also got the center lane blocked

(52:02):
off on southbound seventy five in the year town that
we vehicles behind that crash in the contra flow Lane
can get out of there at Ezelic with traffic.

Speaker 2 (52:12):
This reported your official home for the Cincinnati Bengals, ESPN
fifteen thirty after four.

Speaker 3 (52:19):
This is ESPN fifteen thirty. We are, if he's on time,
nine minutes away from an Zach Taylor presscommence that we
will carry for you live on ESPN fifteen thirty. I
want to hand out some pretend hardware. Love it all right,
very good? Let's go Defensive Rookie of the Year.

Speaker 4 (52:40):
Um, This, to me, I think is pretty easy. I
think it's Schweizinger from the Cleveland Browns. I think he's
gonna run away with it. I do think though, that
as the year came to a close, I think I
dual Carter played better down the stretch for the Giants
as well. It's crazy when you look at like the

(53:00):
the list and and people receiving votes. A lot of
players that we talked about leading up to the draft.
John Campbell, James Pierce is on that list. A couple
of the Bengals that that we talked about leading into
the year. Demetrius Knight will not make the list.

Speaker 3 (53:17):
No, nor will Bearon Carter. No Offensive Rookie of the Year.

Speaker 4 (53:22):
This to me, like when the season started or when
the season was, like midway through, I thought this was
easily uh Abuca and he has just completely fallen off.

Speaker 3 (53:35):
I would have I would have thought midway through the
season to be Tyler Warren.

Speaker 4 (53:38):
Yeah, he kind of fell off too. So I think
coming on as of late uh and and what he
was would mean to them making the playoffs. McMillan coming
out of Arizona with the Carolina Panthers, I think him
and Bryce Young have created something really, really good and
I think they're gonna build on that with the Panthers.

Speaker 3 (53:57):
You gotta comeback Player of the Year.

Speaker 4 (54:00):
You put Christian McCaffrey in there.

Speaker 3 (54:02):
Yeah, I would go Hutchinson. Yeah, I mean if I
get injury, Lions Fizzle still had his career high in sacks. Yeah.

Speaker 4 (54:11):
I just think McCaffrey was awesome this year. Like, there
are cases you can make about him being the MVP.
I know he won't. You can make a case for
Offensive Player of the Year. There's a comeback player I
think is there.

Speaker 3 (54:21):
There's a case for Christiana Lobby as well. Yeah. Good year.
Coach of the Year. This is the most difficult one.

Speaker 4 (54:29):
Take your pick. I looked at the odds earlier. Demico
Ryans isn't even on the list in the top six.
Sean Payton, two years in, has taken a rookie and
Bow Knickson is the one seed in the AFC, he's sixth.
Kyle Shanahan and what he's done with that San Francisco
team and being depleted with injuries a lot of the

(54:50):
year is fifth. He would get it if I was
Liam Cohen. I mean, Jacksonville was playing for the number
one seed yesterday. Mike McDonald, what he's done in Seattle,
one seed in the NFC. Ben Johnson has mage the
Bears a two seed in his first year. I still
give it to Rabel. I look at how how far
away that team seemed last year and who they are now.

(55:13):
I think Vrabel's mine, But I I you can legitimately
make a case for seven coaches, and if you say.

Speaker 3 (55:19):
McVeigh, if you say Zach Tayman, we'll keep it at eight.
Defensive Player of the Year Miles Garrett. I like his chances.
Offensive Player of the Year.

Speaker 4 (55:32):
Oh Man uh Poka Nakua leads the NFL in receptions.
Jackson Smith and Jigba is the best player on the
best team in the NFC. I will give it to
JSN because of just how consistent he was, and I
think it says more about him doing it with Darnold. Yes,

(55:54):
Pookah fantastic. In all likelihood, the MVP is going to
be Matt Matthew Stafford, That's who was throwing him the ball.
I'll give it to JSN MVP.

Speaker 3 (56:04):
I think Stafford is going to win it.

Speaker 4 (56:05):
I think Stafford Jenner. I think if the votes led
all the way up through the finish of the playoffs,
it might be Drake May.

Speaker 3 (56:11):
I think it should be Drake May.

Speaker 4 (56:12):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (56:13):
People are going to talk about in New England's schedule,
understandably so. But when the Rams and Patriots, when you
when you hold up their performances against common opponents, May
was better. Yeah.

Speaker 4 (56:25):
Do you know who I think should quietly get more votes?
Trevor Lawrence agreed just for another phenomenal year and has
been really good and consistent for Jacksonville. Yeah, without Hunter
and Brian Thomas Junior hasn't been fantastic for him.

Speaker 3 (56:40):
Right, That's the thing about their team, right, They draft
Travis Hunter and the play that I remember from him
most this year was the questionable best interference call against
the Bengals. Sure he had no major impact on their season,
which if you would have told me the Jacksonville Jaguars
are going to win the division, Yea, there's no way

(57:01):
it happens without Travis Hunter having some impact on one
side of the ball.

Speaker 4 (57:04):
At least they went and got Jacobe Myers has been grateful. Yes,
their mid season acquisitions and a really good defense.

Speaker 3 (57:10):
All right, you're gonna hear Zach Taylor's press conference if
he's on time when we come back on ESPN fifteen
thirty Cincinnati Sports.

Speaker 1 (57:17):

Speaker 5 (57:22):
Traffic from the UC Health Traffic Center. U SEE Health's
Weight Loss Center offered surgical and medical obesity care and expertise.
Called five one three ninety three nine two two sixty three.
An accident now cleared out approaching Norwood Lateral that was
in the contraflow lane. They've also reopened the center lane

(57:45):
over near Town Street, but traffic is still heavy, up
to a fifty minute delay back from Shepherd Lane. I'm
at ezelic with traffic.

Speaker 2 (57:53):
This report is for the Cincinnati Bengals ESPN fifteen thirty.

Speaker 3 (57:58):
Exactly four thirty. This is the SPN fifteen to thirty
b Tony and Mo Football Show from Twin Peaks in Florence.
We are here till six o'clock. We are now on
standby for Zach Taylor his season ending the press conference.
While we have a second while we wait for Zach,
shout out to Mike from Independence Man. We got T

(58:20):
shirts Tony and Mo football shirtastic shirt. We'll spend time
on that in a second. Right now, Zach Taylor meeting
with the local professional football media.

Speaker 7 (58:34):
And he said that both of you are leaders that
this team needs moving forward. What does it mean to
you to have the owner come out and say such positive.

Speaker 8 (58:44):
I'm appreciative of that, you know.

Speaker 9 (58:46):
And again I think when you're you're aligned and you
get together like we get together and won the same page.
I don't need those things said about me, but but
it's certainly helpful as we move forward and provides clarity.

Speaker 8 (58:58):
And so again, appreciative of that.

Speaker 6 (59:01):
Did you need that?

Speaker 3 (59:02):
No? I didn't.

Speaker 8 (59:02):
I didn't need that. I felt I've had plenty of conversations, so.

Speaker 7 (59:07):
I didn't even why did you feel secure given how
the season went?

Speaker 9 (59:13):
I guess that more so I don't need to I
didn't need a statement, but I'll just continue my job.

Speaker 8 (59:19):
But I do appreciate him doing that. But I just
feel like we.

Speaker 9 (59:23):
Are on a path to really good things next year.
And I think everybody that exit this building today feels
that players, coaches, everybody involved with this thing, and that
this season was a disappointment. It didn't go the way
we wanted. But I'm already re energized. You're working on
twenty twenty six and get back to work. Doesn't mean
I won't take a couple of days, but I just
feel like the energy of this group and the talent

(59:45):
we have and the progress a lot of these guys made,
that we've got a chance to be back in the
conversation of where we belong these last couple of years
and have fallen short of that. And so I'm excited
and I feel the e sivente of all our players
and coaches to get back to all.

Speaker 6 (01:00:00):
The meetings you've had in discussions with specifically, do you
think needs to happen to change to get to that?

Speaker 9 (01:00:06):
I think we have to just continue to grow, you know,
I think this is bigular that if you look at
just our season this year, the last thing I left
with our team is just the turnover differential. Where we
lost games. We weren't good enough on either side of
the ball, and that was taking the ball away from
teams in the games we lost, that was scoring points

(01:00:26):
for the team on our offense. You know when we
give up nine touchdowns on our offense this year. So
there's things as simple as that. If you look at
some of these one score games where we just we
didn't do enough just possessing the ball and taking the
ball away to win the game, and it was as
simple as that. That doesn't mean that fundamentally, that doesn't
mean that scheme will continue to evolve and our players
will continue to grow. But just something simple as the
turnovers is a big key on why we weren't a

(01:00:48):
successful as we shouldn't.

Speaker 6 (01:00:49):
Do you think you had enough talent on the roster?

Speaker 8 (01:00:51):
I do? How do you value evaluate yourself as a
head coach at the end of every season.

Speaker 4 (01:00:55):
How do you go back and look at whether you
were successful in our Personally.

Speaker 9 (01:00:58):
I do critical about myself on decisions I made and
ways that can help other people. And very open to
the feedback, you know, as we do the exit interviews
with the players, so as a part of it is
how can I help you be a better player, So always.

Speaker 8 (01:01:15):
Open to that.

Speaker 9 (01:01:15):
I really feel like I don't have an ego that way,
I'm open to criticism. I give myself criticism part of
myself for decisions you make in games, harder decisions you
made on personnel, decisions you made during the season, all
that kind of stuff, and and UH just want to
improve and be better and so just continue to work
on that.

Speaker 3 (01:01:33):
What's the best thing that's.

Speaker 8 (01:01:36):
A hard one? I'd have to kind of process.

Speaker 9 (01:01:38):
You go through about forty something of them today, So
I don't have that answer quite ready for you. Your
exit interview with Joe, what's that your exit interview that'll
be later this week.

Speaker 3 (01:01:47):
As you went through why this season went the way
it did with their games, moments, trends that really stuck
with you.

Speaker 8 (01:01:54):
It's what game? What game you want to talk about?
It was it was a different reason for every game,
it felt like, and that is frustrating because we've got
to be able to put our finger on that.

Speaker 9 (01:02:04):
And I just feel like we have the talent in
this building that's going to continue to grow. I think
if you look at our defense, you look at all
those guys that played yesterday, and I've played these last
couple of weeks, let's punch of young talent, you know, first,
second year or third year guys with a couple of
better and fixed in there. But all those guys continue
to grow and get better. And the confidence they're going
to have going into the next season playing the scheme

(01:02:24):
for second year, being around these coaches for second year,
being around each other for a second year, I think
the chemistry and outside of the ball was I mean,
they've got a lot of confidence right now coming out
of these last couple of games, and so I'm really
excited about that. Offensively, you know, we've got everybody under
contract for the most part. That is a big part
of this thing, and so I just feel really strong
that we'll have a good offseason and make a lot

(01:02:46):
of waves going into the next season.

Speaker 6 (01:02:48):
Do you anticipate making any changes to the staff?

Speaker 8 (01:02:50):
I do not.

Speaker 3 (01:02:51):
Over the years, when we ask players about you today included,
they'll say you're a player's coach.

Speaker 9 (01:02:56):
Why is that your philosophy? Well, I think that I
don't always know what that definition means. There's a part
of this job where you've got to make decisions that
are hard decisions that are not popular with everybody on
a team. But at the same time, when guys have
my respect in his decisions, where I don't feel like

(01:03:17):
it's got to be my way of the highway, I
want the input on those from those guys, And so
I do like to open that up to players in
ways that they can they can feel ownership of this thing,
because I think that's the best way to get the
most out of them. And they enjoy walking in the
locker room every single day. They don't dread walking in
this building when they feel like they've got ownership and
what we're doing schematically, how they're going as a player,

(01:03:41):
what we're doing from a schedule standpoint.

Speaker 8 (01:03:43):
And that's not the Pece said I make.

Speaker 9 (01:03:44):
I make a lot of those decisions myself, because you
got to You got to make those decisions. But I
got a lot of guys that I've been around for
a long time as players that I value their opinion
and I think they're going to help me make educated decisions,
and so I think maybe that's where some of it
stems from. I like to think I'm very honest with
these guys, and there's hard conversations I've had with a
lot of these guys over the course of the season
that I think we both grew from. I think those
guys appreciate that there may be hard at the time

(01:04:07):
for both of us, but after the fact, we both
grow from it, our relationship becomes stronger.

Speaker 8 (01:04:12):
And maybe that's where part of that simsum as well.

Speaker 6 (01:04:16):
How much coach, do you think the out coming is
kind of a new scheme? I mean, how much of
that do you think that was a bigger impact to
mean your thought was.

Speaker 8 (01:04:29):
Going to move.

Speaker 6 (01:04:31):
The need to give them?

Speaker 9 (01:04:33):
Yeah, No, I think I think we utilize a lot
of different people, and ouside of the ball can get
a coaching staff that came in and they worked really
hard this offseason the summer to get together that really
none of them have worked together before. So I was
really pleased with the growth of that side of the ball,
and I'm excited. I mean, it's I'm excited about the
direction we're headed. And so I don't think anybody's pleased

(01:04:53):
with our record this year and how it all ended.
But that doesn't mean that there's not a lot of
excitement from our coaching staff and our players going forward
to future.

Speaker 6 (01:05:00):
How can you better take advantage of continuity? You have
a rare continuity here and it hasn't paid off as
much in recent years. How can we guys do a
better job of taking advantage that.

Speaker 9 (01:05:12):
I think this will be. You knows as much continuity
going in this offseason as we've had. I think there's
a role for all these guys that played for us
this year. And it doesn't mean we won't add in
free agency in the draft to make ourselves better. But
I'm excited about a lot of these guys coming back
and and this being a bitter sweet feeling, this enter

(01:05:32):
not a bitter sweet better feeling as we ended the season,
And so I'm just I'm excited for the off season.
I'm excited to get these guys back in April already.
They're probably sick of me here right now, but I'm
excited to get back to work with these guys.

Speaker 6 (01:05:44):
I mean, how can you find better?

Speaker 3 (01:05:51):
We lose we lose the feed? Do we we lose
Zach Taylor? We lost the feed? Oh man? Wow? Anyway,
you just heard seven minutes he's back let's let's finish
off the press conference. Oct Taylor talking with it.

Speaker 9 (01:06:05):
I'm excited about a lot of these guys coming back
and and it's being a bittersweet feeling that center not
a bitter sweet, bitter feeling as we ended the season.
And so I'm just I'm excited for the offseason. I'm
excited to get these guys back in April already. They
they're probably sickon with me right now, but I'm excited
to get back to work with these guys.

Speaker 6 (01:06:23):
I mean, how can you find I'm.

Speaker 9 (01:06:25):
Excited for the offseason. I'm excited to get these guys
back in April already. They they're probably sick with me
right now.

Speaker 3 (01:06:29):
But where the press conference is over? Okay, great, there
you go, there's Zach. They lost the feed.

Speaker 4 (01:06:34):
Feed the finale. We couldn't even get the feed.

Speaker 3 (01:06:37):
The fitting end of the season, fitting into a frankly
mostly miserable season. We lose the feed from the venue
originally known as Paul Brown Stadium. So Zach Taylor doesn't
for see any staff changes. No, no staff changes, but
he's really excited. Can't wait to get the guys back
in uh in April. The the exit meeting with Joe
Burrow is gonna happen later this week. He's heard from

(01:06:58):
a bunch of players. So there you go. Off to
the off season for Zach.

Speaker 4 (01:07:03):
Yeah, you know, defense showed some stuff over the last
few few weeks. We're already laying the groundwork. You know,
we are already laying the groundwork. Can you imagine year
two in our golden system for Barrett Carter and Demitrius nine.
Can you imagine?

Speaker 3 (01:07:18):
That was my biggest fear.

Speaker 4 (01:07:19):
Can you imagine one more chance for Gino Stone, genostone,
he had to go with from an Arrumo to al Golden.
He was better down the stretch. He'll be much better
in year two. We don't want to pull the plug
on guys just yet.

Speaker 3 (01:07:34):
I am going to guess that Geno Stone is not here,
But I am very fearful that we are going to
spend the entire off season hearing about how hey, you
know they invested draft picks and Demetrious Knight and Barrett Carter,
and you know, with a normal off season for those
players and first real off season as NFL players, you know,

(01:07:55):
those guys are going to build upon the experience they
accumulated and they're going to be so much better this year. Well,
that is my biggest fear.

Speaker 4 (01:08:02):
Think about it, and Ken brought this up yesterday. You
think about in baseball, up the middle is where you
gotta be strong. Think about what they've used in the
draft up the middle, Chris Jenkins, McKinley, Jackson, right, Demetrious Knight,
Barrett Carter, Jordan Battle reinvested in genostone like the middle

(01:08:23):
of your defense they've missed.

Speaker 3 (01:08:26):
Like you can even tell me that, like Demetrious Knight
or Barrett Carter are gonna be better as second year players.

Speaker 4 (01:08:35):
Okay, you cannot tell me both will that's fine? Can
they be second year players that are three and four
on the depth chart, fine by me, because if they're
one and two on the depth chart, you're not serious
about winning a champion.

Speaker 3 (01:08:47):
You're not and you're not changing correct because the way
we expect the Bengals to do things is, Hey, we
drafted those players continuity, more time in the system. We're
gonna be good with those guys. That's what you expect.
If things are different, they say, you know what, it
didn't work as rookies, It may work down the road.
There's roles for those players on the team, but they're

(01:09:07):
not gonna be starters. We are gonna find better linebackers,
whether it's in free agency or the draft, or a
combo of the two. That to me is the litmus
test again. Like I would imagine they're gonna go find
a defensive tackle. I would imagine they're gonna address edge
rusher in some way, shape or form. I'm gonna imagine
they address safety. I would be unsurprised if they said,

(01:09:30):
you know, we're gonna run it back with these two
guys and let them, let them build upon the experience
they built up in twenty twenty five.

Speaker 4 (01:09:38):
You can't again. If if you take Mike Brown's letter
from his desk today worth anything, it is that they
are going to reassess and change how they operate going
forward to get competitive teams back on the field. If
you're going to do that, then you don't have time
to wait anymore. No, you don't have time to take

(01:09:59):
the guy in the dry that had three and a
half sacks in college and say, well, he's gonna develop
there's an upside. You got to take the guy that
had eighteen sacks in college, that did it at every level,
even if he's a half step slow. You got to
take the guy that had the interception production, the linebacker
that made tackles in open space, the guys that actually produced,
not the guys that you're taking off sheer upside and athleticism.

Speaker 3 (01:10:21):
And by the way, with Demetrius Knight, you know you
talk about his age, he's twenty six years old. They
drafted him because well, he's.

Speaker 4 (01:10:28):
Ready now pretty much a finished You said it yesterday too,
It's at this point it's awesome that Miles Murphy has
finished the year the way he has. You can no
longer wait three years for a first round draft pick
to show anything. And if you do, say goodbye to
the Super Bowl window, because you're probably saying goodbye to

(01:10:50):
Joe Burrow in a couple of years.

Speaker 3 (01:10:51):
It's not a development league this.

Speaker 4 (01:10:53):
Joe Burrow has time to wait for guys to develop.

Speaker 3 (01:10:55):
No, this is a league that's all about immediate dividends
for your cheap talent from your cheap labor. I mean,
we sometimes talk about the draft and look, there are
late bloomers and Miles Murphy. I'm excited to see what
he can do next season. Sure, but you're right, your
first round pick. Your first three picks next year cannot

(01:11:18):
take red shirt seasons. Your first three picks next year
must contribute. They don't have to be stars, they don't
have to be Rookie of the Year candidates. You have
to get positive production regardless of what positions they play.
And so the twenty twenty three draft class has rounded
in the form nicely. It's taken three years. I can't

(01:11:39):
have in twenty twenty eight. The twenty twenty six draft
class round in the form. I need players who can
play Game one, the first game of the season, play
and help affect win.

Speaker 4 (01:11:52):
Have an impact, Yes, have an impact on the twenty
twenty six football season.

Speaker 3 (01:11:56):
Yes, like you look around this league rookies making an impact.
I'm telling Fairchild had a nice year. Give me a
couple more guys at their positions.

Speaker 4 (01:12:05):
Tame they played yesterday. Yes, littered with rookies. Yes, across
the field right, So it happens, And it doesn't just
have to be the top five draft picks. There are
late first rounders, second rounders, third rounders, fourth rounders that
are starting and playing meaningful snaps for playoff teams right
now that are trying to win a championship.

Speaker 3 (01:12:26):
Sixteen away from five o'clock. It's the Tony and Mo
Football Show. I have another question for this offseason that
is more rhetorical than anything else. We'll get to that
coming up in the five o'clock hour. We'll look ahead
to a wild card weekend in the NFL playoffs. Spend
a few minutes on the Liberty Bowl talking about the Bearcats.
Life after Brendan Sorosby, who's headed sex Tech.

Speaker 4 (01:12:47):
He's got a billboard on Time Square today.

Speaker 3 (01:12:49):
So much more on ESPN fifteen thirty Cincinnati Sports Station.

Speaker 1 (01:12:54):
Cincinnati's ESPN fifteen thirty.

Speaker 5 (01:12:57):
Traffic from the UC Hill Traffic Center. U See Helps
Called five one three nine three nine two two sixty three.
An accident now cleared out approaching Norwood Lateral that was
in the contraflow lane. They've also reopened the center lane

(01:13:20):
over near Town Street, but traffic is still heavy, up
to a fifty minute delay back from Shepherd Lane. I'm
at Ezelic with traffic. This report he sponsored from five o'clock.

Speaker 3 (01:13:31):
This is ESPN fifteen thirty. It is the Tony Moo
Football Show. The day after the Bengals season came to
an end, Cincinnati falling to the Cleveland Browns in the
irregular season finale. The season finale they'll wind up the
last game of the twenty twenty five season. Bengals finish
uh six and eleven after falling to the Browns twenty

(01:13:53):
to eighteen. Lots more on the Bengals coming up here
in just a bit. Spend a few minutes on the
college WAB player.

Speaker 4 (01:14:00):
And shout out to Mike. Yeah t shirts.

Speaker 3 (01:14:02):
We we did not finish. Our got some cool shirts made,
some custom made Tonia look to and football Show.

Speaker 4 (01:14:09):
It's look good. I don't know, only took eleven years
of us doing this together to have a shirt.

Speaker 3 (01:14:13):
You know what I liked about what he did here?
Uh he didn't use any trademarks, so we can't get
in trouble for wearing them.

Speaker 4 (01:14:21):
Nothing and uh just cartoon versions of ourselves.

Speaker 3 (01:14:25):
Cartoon versions of ourselves.

Speaker 4 (01:14:27):
I think my beard and mustache looks fantastic along with
my hair.

Speaker 3 (01:14:31):
It does.

Speaker 4 (01:14:31):
You've got an awesome what looks to be victory cigar.
Uh huh kind of looks like a scarlet and gray
hatcher wearing though, which is a little worrisome. Outside of that,
it does look like a scarlet and gray It is spectacular.

Speaker 3 (01:14:44):
Thank you, Mike. Thanks thank you to Mike for the
for the T shirts. We'll be stealing that logo here soon.
Speaking of the scarlet and gray Ohio State pushed around
by Miami on Bully Evening Bullied. What's interesting to me
is Ryan Day, who I think is an easy guy
to root for, but he goes out of his way
to talk about how tough Ohio State is. Yeah, you

(01:15:05):
get it all the time. Remember he got mad at
Lou Holtz a couple of years ago when they beat
Notre Dame and went off on him, questioning the Buckeyes toughness.
He goes out of his way to tell you toughness, toughness, toughness.
And yet on a handful of occasions in big games,
I've watched them get pushed around, and they got pushed.

Speaker 4 (01:15:24):
Around Doctor Beck games against dominating the trenches Indiana in Miami.
Here's what I don't understand, and I've not been able
to find an answer, and I've asked for one multiple times.
Heartline takes the USF job, I get it, but is
allowed to still coach in the bowl game. Yeah, now,
OLDE receivers. Old Miss has the same thing going on. Yeah,

(01:15:45):
Old Miss has coaches that are gonna be leaving to
go to LSU when their season eventually comes to an end.

Speaker 3 (01:15:49):
And they have coaches who will not coach them in
the next game. Correct against Miami, who did coach them
against Georgia.

Speaker 4 (01:15:54):
But Heartline takes the USF job and they say, Okay,
we still want to have you coach in the ball game,
but we don't want you to call plays anymore. Right, that,
to me was a miss. You had the same voice
calling plays all year, the same feel for the game.
You let him coach in the game, but you took
away that responsibility and you brought him down from the
booth onto the field.

Speaker 3 (01:16:14):
Right.

Speaker 4 (01:16:15):
They looked lost on offense, it did. They looked disjointed
on offense. And I'm not trying to put all the
blame on Ryan Day, but if you're gonna allow him
to stick around and coach the bowl games, let him
call the plays like he has all year.

Speaker 3 (01:16:27):
I just don't understand why he couldn't. Like I get man,
your your days are full, and your play is sleep.
I like, I get it. Yeah, when you're trying to
get the USF program and your regime off the ground
and you're trying to work at Ohio State like that,
there's a lot too there.

Speaker 4 (01:16:47):
I would understand now unless he came and said, I'll coach,
but I don't want to call the plays.

Speaker 3 (01:16:51):
Yeah, but then it's like, dude, you have the play
caller all side and what what are you doing here?
Why can't you call the plays? Right? See?

Speaker 4 (01:16:57):
I think that was a huge mess.

Speaker 3 (01:16:59):
I wondered that watching the game, why can't it call players?

Speaker 4 (01:17:02):
They got bullied, and all year we heard about the
defense and when the defense needed to get a stop
and you knew what was coming, Miami.

Speaker 3 (01:17:09):
Still did what they wanted.

Speaker 4 (01:17:10):
Yeah, And I don't say that to discredit Miami because
they were awesome and they've been on that. You want
to talk about their path at Texas A and m
taking on Ohio State, they've been extremely, extremely impressive. But
all I heard all year was hands down, it's the
best Ohio State team. It's the best defense they've had,
and back to back games they got dominated in the trenches.

Speaker 3 (01:17:35):
I wasn't that surprised that Indiana beat Alabama with eaves.

Speaker 4 (01:17:39):
S was a little bit surprised.

Speaker 3 (01:17:41):
I'm not going to tell you that I thought they
were gonna win by five touchdowns. Yeah, but I wasn't
stunned that they won the game with the ease they won.

Speaker 4 (01:17:49):
The only thing I'm surprised at is how easy it was,
Like I could see them winning. But outside of Indiana,
you take two years of the twelve team playoff, the
team with the first round bys or one and seven,
like Indiana is the only team that has won. And
I credit Signetti with more of that than anything else. Sure,
and probably a little bit of Alabama if we're being honest.

(01:18:10):
Alabama and Oklahoma were both not very good teams. But
look what happened to Georgia, Look what happened to Ohio State,
Look what happened to Texas Tech. Look what happened last
year to the top seeds. I still think there's something
to be said. I don't know what the answer is
or if there is a fix. I don't know if
you allow those those first four teams to pick if
they want to play or not. I don't know if
you move the second round let.

Speaker 3 (01:18:31):
Them play home games.

Speaker 4 (01:18:32):
That's what I think. I think the second round should
be on site for those teams. I think that is
a good enough reward for what they've been able to do.

Speaker 3 (01:18:40):
And I've seen people say, well, then you know what
happens to all these heritage bowl games? Who cares?

Speaker 4 (01:18:45):
Name it the same thing?

Speaker 3 (01:18:47):
Who cares? Right? And I who cares? Those bowl games?
Are these independent entities? Let them figure it out? Yep?
Why do they have to be beholden to the Fiesta
Bowl the Orange bit off?

Speaker 4 (01:18:59):
Are you going to see teams make different decisions at
the end of the year? Maybe you know how much
is the conference championship?

Speaker 3 (01:19:04):
Now?

Speaker 4 (01:19:04):
Help you?

Speaker 3 (01:19:05):
I think you have to move the schedule up and
go ahead and play those first round games a week earlier,
and have the quarterfinal games played before Christmas, and play
those games at campus site. And you could still play
the Rose Bowl in a semifinal or the Orange Bowl
in a semifinal. I who cares? Right? I just I
couldn't even tell you which of those quarterfinal games were

(01:19:27):
at which bowls. I know Ole Miss played in the
Sugar because they weren't too far from Lane Kiffin and
Baton Rouge and I know I you played in the
Rose Bowl because the Rose Bowl's cool. Beyond that, man
like who cares? Yep play those games on campus sites.

Speaker 4 (01:19:43):
Yeah, that to me is the fix for it.

Speaker 3 (01:19:47):
The Bengals have a lot of money to spend. They
don't have to spend it blindly. They don't have to
spend it irresponsibly.

Speaker 4 (01:19:56):
Seventy seven point eight so far.

Speaker 3 (01:19:58):
But they need to find six guys. We'll get to
that coming up at five oh five on ESPN fifteen thirty.
Cincinnati Sports Station.

Speaker 2 (01:20:07):
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ESPN fifteen thirty, the official home of the Cincinnati Bengals.

Speaker 3 (01:20:50):
One more hour the Power Hour of the Tony and
Moo Football Show, Twin Peaks in Florence, the season finale.
On the day the Bengals lose their season finale to
the Cleveland Browns. On the day we find out that indeed,
Zach Taylor and Duke Tobin will return for the twenty
twenty six season. Duke is going to speak publicly. Maybe

(01:21:13):
the feed won't cut out for that. Yeah, we'll see.
Duke is going to talk on a time Friday. Just
like the Bengals defense can finish games, Bengals can finish
press conferences. That's how it works. We're here till six
o'clock Twin Peaks in Florence. We love this place. The
staff is awesome, the food is great. Beer selection is
plentiful and very easy to get to. Right off I

(01:21:33):
seventy five. We hope to be back in Twin Peaks
next year. We will see those things are those are
above us?

Speaker 4 (01:21:40):
Yes, we.

Speaker 3 (01:21:43):
Are here till six o'clock. Duke and Zach are back.
This to me wasn't surprising. I do think it was
notable that Mike Brown issued a statement about both which
tells you that either they are aware of the conjecture
around those two men, or that they at least gave

(01:22:04):
some thought to replacing one or both. For what it's worth,
Zach Taylor at the press conference that didn't finish made
mention of the fact that he doesn't anticipate any coaching
staff changes, So status quo for twenty twenty six.

Speaker 4 (01:22:17):
Yeah, you know, as the season rolled on, it didn't
feel like to me that this was more about Zach
Taylor as it was about Duke Tobin agreed, because we've
and I've I've openly talked about my thoughts of Zach
as the play caller, which hasn't changed, right. I think
if you look at how this team plays and the
struggles they've had, burning timeouts, delay a games, decision making,

(01:22:41):
just the overall clunkiness at times of getting to play
in I think he's a little overwhelmed. Yes, I think
it would bode better for everyone if someone else called
the plays and Zach Taylor's a head coach. To me,
this turned on its head more this year to Duke
Tobin because the personnel is just not good enough. It
wasn't good You used Lewenna, didn't work, tried al Golden,

(01:23:02):
didn't work, doesn't matter who you parade in there, it's
not going to work because the talent just isn't there.
They've not done a good job in identifying the talent.
And you are coming up on arguably the most pivotal
off season of the Joe Burrow era in Cincinnati. If
you follow along with how Joe Burrow acted and what
he said this year and what you have now going

(01:23:24):
into next year missing the playoffs three years in a row,
this to me today was more about is there any
chance Duke is not the guy? Those questions were answered
very quickly, So now it becomes what in the world's
going to be different?

Speaker 3 (01:23:39):
Right? And I think with Duke Tobin for me, like
they've had bad teams, and they've had rosters that weren't great,
and they've had draft picks that didn't work out. What
it was for me are the continual failure of draft
classes to make an immediate impact. At some point that
becomes who you are as a personnel person. But also

(01:24:01):
it's ignoring the obvious. We sat here Tony here a
year ago. Bengals had just finished the season, won the
last five games, but on the outside, looking into the playoffs,
we sat in the room we're in right now, and
we talked about overhauling the defense. We talked about all
the different ways that they had to get better. In

(01:24:22):
both free agency and the draft. They signed one free
agent that started orin Burkes didn't. He joined the team
as well. I recalled nothing that he did this season.
But they signed TJ. Slayton and that was it in
free agency. So you could say, hey, look, they're gonna
fix it this offseason, are we sure? Because last year

(01:24:43):
it couldn't have been more abundantly clear what they had
to fix, and they didn't and they didn't even really try.

Speaker 4 (01:24:48):
They added TJ.

Speaker 3 (01:24:50):
Slayton.

Speaker 4 (01:24:50):
What else did they do the defensive line? They added
Jamar Stewart, who didn't even remember meeting with the Bengals,
went through the circus of training camp in the offseason,
got on the field most of the year doing an injury.
Jerry's still out. Trey Hendrickson was a distraction all offseason.
They finally paid him, they franchised tagged him. Trey wasn't
an impact player this year because he wasn't available for

(01:25:11):
this team this year. Go to the next position. Oran
Burks is coming, got Logan Wilson, Logan Wilson's gone. Oran
Burks wasn't a factor. Two rookie linebackers didn't really factor
in as well, McKinley Jackson and Chris Jenkins, two guys
you thought would be future parts of that interior part
of the defensive line nowhere to be found. At the

(01:25:31):
start of the year, Cam Taylor Britt was going to
be your number two. Saw how that worked. That was
a failure. You asked your safety to take a pay cut.
He stinks, So every single thing that they did was
a failure. The only thing I didn't like from Mike
Brown's letter today was how he started it. We came
into the season with high expectations coming off four straight

(01:25:52):
winning seasons. No, no, no, no, no no. The expectation
is not a winning season, correct, So don't throw that enough.
Our expect high because we had a winning season last year.

Speaker 3 (01:26:02):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (01:26:02):
No, you won five games down the stretch, most meaningless
against bad competition to get over five hundred. Yeah, and
you missed the playoffs.

Speaker 3 (01:26:08):
And you wasted an MVP Calimber player.

Speaker 4 (01:26:12):
So right away to that, I'm like, ah, wait a second,
because it kind of feels like we're we're acknowledging that
we were accepting the winning season last year when that
should have been the bar of that's not good enough.
So high expectations because you came off four straight winning
seasons and and you go back and you kind of
rest on the Super Bowl in the back to back
AFC title games. But now it's our focus, this is

(01:26:34):
the quote. Our focus is on building a team that
can consistently compete at the highest level with the goal
of winning championships. That should be the goal every year. Yes,
like that's the bare minimum of every off season, especially
when Joe Burrows the guy of saying we're going to
attack this offseason to put a team together that can
win a championship. That's nothing new. That should be the

(01:26:57):
case every off season. The question for me now become,
how if we just heard from Zach, don't expect any
changes to the staff, don't expect any changes with Zach
Taylor and Duke Tobin. So tell me how it's going
to be different. Tell me why, because that's why you
get the reaction so many have had today. H everyone's

(01:27:18):
seen this, they've heard this.

Speaker 3 (01:27:19):
Well. The thing is like they reference the four winning
seasons in a row and the way we talk about
the two appearances in the AFC Championship Game in the
Super Bowl, it makes it sound like those are the
norm they need to be. This team has missed the
playoffs in eight out of the last ten years.

Speaker 4 (01:27:36):
Correct, that's the story, right, Duke Tobin.

Speaker 3 (01:27:38):
Has been here for a very long time now. Joe
Burrow wasn't here prior to twenty twenty, Zach Taylor wasn't
here prior to twenty nineteen. But the Cincinnati Bengals for
a decade have failed to make the postseason in eight
of those ten years, and in many years like this year,
they haven't come close. So what's the outline? The outlier

(01:28:01):
are the two seasons. Now, Duke Tobin gets and deserves
a lot of credit for what he did to build
those teams, and Zach Taylor gets and deserves, maybe deserves
more than he gets, I think, credit for his fingerprints
being all over those two teams and the way he
coached them. But like you kind of miss me with
the you know what, this is just a speed bump,

(01:28:22):
and it's a little bit bigger of a speed bump
than we would like. It's been three years, but you know, hey,
we were in the super Bowl. That's cool. The super
Bowl season and the year after it when they went
twelve and four, those are outliers. In Duke Tobin's last
ten attempts to build a playoff team, he's failed eight times. Yeah,
that is a miserable hit rate.

Speaker 4 (01:28:41):
And I think it's fair to acknowledge that over the
course of the ten years, from the top of the organization,
things have changed. They've changed how they've decided to spend money.
They've spent more on free agents. They've opened up the
check book and said, Okay, we'll look at how we
structure contracts. We'll look at how we do the draft.
We'll talk about upgrading the state, we'll add the Ring
of Honor, We'll do all these things that we as

(01:29:03):
an organization need to do. And oh, by the way, Duke,
if it is Duke, you have more money to spend.
These are decisions you have to make. Like it gets
caught up sometimes with just the same old, same old.
I feel like at the top of the organization they
have tried to change things up. They have spent more money,
they have guaranteed deeper into contracts than what they've wanted
to do in years past. All of that being said,

(01:29:25):
that's to me, while I resort back to Duke Tobyn,
it's your job if you're given to the same way
we talk about Nick Kral, what you're given, what you
have to spend, and what you have to work with.
How can you make that work. They've given guys money,
they've made decisions on draft picks that haven't worked out.
Someone has to be accountable for that.

Speaker 3 (01:29:44):
Yeah, you know, I go back to the twenty twenty
off season. They signed DJ Reader, they acquired Trey Hendrickson.
Prior to the twenty twenty one season, they went and
got should Obe Woozie, And I'm kind of talking about
a two year stretch twenty and twenty one where they
were really active in free agency in some cases overpaid, right,

(01:30:07):
Like they overpaid people, said DJ Reader. And they got
Mike Hilton, they got Larry Ogunjobi. Basically this offseason, Ken
Bruce said it to us, Yes, daid, well, they're not
gonna spend wildly. They don't need to. They need to
spend smartly. So spending wildly means, you know, you pay
top dollar for the best guys. I'm not opposed to superstars,

(01:30:29):
but was Trey hendricks In. A household name when the
Bengal signed him was Chadobia Woozie. A household name when
the Bengals signed him was Larry Ogan Jobe. A household
name when the Bengals acquired him was Mike Hilton. A
household name when the Bengals acquired him was von Bell.
A household name when the Bengals acquired him was DJ Reader.

(01:30:50):
A superstar, a star, a Pro Bowl player. When the
Bengals acquired him. They didn't get him via free agency.
They got him in a trade, but bj Hill was
Beach a Hill of Star, the household name. So like,
it's not about spending wildly. You may have to overpay
here or there to get a guy that you really want.
It's about efficiently and it's about identifying the right players

(01:31:14):
in free agency who maybe aren't stars, but are worth
signing here for multiple years.

Speaker 4 (01:31:19):
It is It is the decisions and the ramifications with
those decisions that you have to live with. You could
it's easy to do it now. They should have paid
Jesse Bates. They spent more money trying to replace Jesse
Bates than the would have paid him in a contract.

Speaker 3 (01:31:32):
They're still trying to replace them.

Speaker 4 (01:31:33):
Still trying to replace Jesse Bates. That was a miss. Like,
you have guys in house, you got to hit on it.
You got to know when to re up. You gotta
know when to spend that money. They've missed more times
than not on the guys that they had in the
building from draft outside of Burrow and Chase right, no
one's gonna let him walk. But the guys that they

(01:31:53):
should have held onto, that they drafted, that were in
house probably moved on from too quick or didn't want
to re up into another deal. Now they're paying for
the ramifications of that. But I equate it again, and
I know Mike McDonald is a whole different animal. How
many superstars are on Seattle's defense, not a ton. They
all know what they're doing, they all know the scheme,

(01:32:16):
they all know how they fit into that piece of
the puzzle, and they play well together. You don't need
the superstar Like, yes, is it a luxury to have Hendrickson?
Is it a luxury to have Miles Garrett and TJ.

Speaker 3 (01:32:28):
Watt?

Speaker 4 (01:32:29):
What if the Browns also done, They're gonna have the
rookie of the year at linebacker, Mason Graham's a good
up and coming player. Denzel Ward. Like, they have talent everywhere,
but they've also done well to build around their superstar,
Miles Garrett. You can't just land a superstar on a
defense and say all right, that side of the ball
is done. You gotta keep building around it. And that's
why I think the approach you're talking about is more

(01:32:52):
conducive to what the Bengals need to do of I
don't need the top dollar guy, but can I get
six or seven guys that are gonna have an immediate
an impact. Yeah, and they're gonna they're gonna mesh well together.

Speaker 3 (01:33:03):
And if you believe in Al Golden, then there's lots
of reasons for us to not believe in Al Golden.
But if you believe in Al Golden, you think he
can do what Luenarumo did well.

Speaker 4 (01:33:11):
I want to know if Al Golden has the ability
to do that, right, Like, to be quite honest, right,
I want to know if Al Golden can go in
there and say hey, I need this, this, this and this,
and if they say, okay, let's talk about prospects or
let's talk about free agents, or is it these are
the guys we're gonna get Genuinely, I want to know
that the relationship between Al and Zach and Duke. I

(01:33:32):
want to know when you hired when you hired Al Golden,
was it you gotta make it work with what we
have or you're gonna take it. Because I can't fathom
a world where Al Golden would have wanted Xavier Watts.
I'll just call it.

Speaker 3 (01:33:45):
What it is.

Speaker 4 (01:33:46):
Right, He's a he's a he's a great safety. He's
third or fourth and rookie of the year on the
defensive side of the ball, and he played at Notre
Dame Withol Golden. Right if Al Golden on draft day
was like, I need I want, I want Xavier Wats.

Speaker 3 (01:33:57):
We need a safety.

Speaker 4 (01:33:58):
Let's go get the guy that knows my sin better
than anything else and they said, now we're good. Or
does he even have the ability to have that conversation.

Speaker 3 (01:34:05):
What they have to get good at long term not
so much this year, but what they have to get
good at long term is replacing the players who do leave.
Because if if you have a lot of good players,
are going to lose some. You know, the Jesse Bates thing.
We're not talking about it. If the plan to replace
him worked. It hasn't that Dax Hill may stick as

(01:34:26):
an outside corner. That's taken forever. But the idea they
drafted him was he's gonna play safety when Jesse Bates
leave and he gets a red shirt year. It took
him forever to replace Andrew Whitworth. The plan to replace
Trey Hendrickson didn't work out so much, so they brought
Trey Hendrickson back this past season instead of trading him.
The plan to replace t Higgins didn't work out. Tremaine

(01:34:49):
Burton was a failed pick, and so they had to
sign t Higgins. Now, I think we're all cool with that,
but still their plans to replace players don't work. We're
gonna enjoy sustained success, real sustained success where they're in
the playoffs pretty much every single year. That's got to change.

Speaker 4 (01:35:07):
Yeah, it can't just be well, they hit on a
draft for a year. You gotta stack them together. You
got to build draft after a draft after draft if
you want to be viewed as a successful team. It's
why the Rams are in the position they're in and
they've had limited draft picks. Man, they've hit on them.
They've found ways to connect on them, and they've built

(01:35:28):
around and they've had them. They've made tough decisions too.
They've moved on from Cooper Cup, they've moved on from
main players on that roster, and in that organization, they
had to replace Aaron Donald. Now you're not gonna replace
Aaron Donald. But they've done a good job of revamping
that defensive line. Yes, without Aaron Donald in the middle
of it.

Speaker 3 (01:35:46):
They're not still talking about not having Aaron. Donnal said
this for you. You're still talking about not having Jesse
b We've.

Speaker 4 (01:35:52):
Said this five times this year. You go back to
that Super Bowl and if I would tell you that
the Rams would be closer in three or four years
to getting back to a Super Bowl and the Bengals,
you'd have called me crazy because they had mortgaged everything
it seemed like to go there.

Speaker 3 (01:36:07):
They had won five and twelve season. Yeah, and I
think they've been back to the post.

Speaker 4 (01:36:10):
And right back on top. Like whatever draft picks, how
it doesn't matter. We're gonna build how we need to build.
And you want to talk about teams that have openings,
they're one of the six teams ahead of the Bengals
in money to spend so they've done it the right
way since the Super Bowl, and I guess you mentioned.
We're still here today, twenty twenty six talking about not

(01:36:33):
re signing Jesse Bates. That's insane, the money they've spent
and the dedication they've put to that position to still
come up empty.

Speaker 3 (01:36:44):
It is twenty minutes after five o'clock. We're in Twin
Peaks in Florence. We have a lot of ground to cover.
The Liberty Bowl. You see post sowresby, the NFL playoffs
and if we have time college basketball tour.

Speaker 4 (01:37:00):
We never know the closs are going.

Speaker 3 (01:37:01):
You never know.

Speaker 4 (01:37:02):
This breaks are a little bit longer.

Speaker 3 (01:37:03):
It is a football show.

Speaker 4 (01:37:05):
Yeah, we always stick to that.

Speaker 3 (01:37:07):
These t shirts don't say Tony and mal basket.

Speaker 4 (01:37:09):
We usually stick to football on this show.

Speaker 3 (01:37:12):
It is a twenty minutes the basketball show after five o'clock.
I would love to do the Tonium. I would too.
This is ESPN fifteen thirty, Cincinnati Sports Station.

Speaker 1 (01:37:22):
Cincinnati's ESPN fifteen thirty Traffic from.

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(01:37:48):
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Speaker 10 (01:37:57):
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Speaker 3 (01:37:59):
TONI all showed the bud Light five o'clock Happy Hour
ESPN fifteen thirty dr here till six o'clock when the
Mark Pope Radio show tapes over Toentucky basketball losing to
Alabamah on Saturday. Uh, you want to spend a few
minutes on the NFL playoffs? Sure of these six wildcard
round games, which one is the best or the one

(01:38:21):
you're most looking forward to?

Speaker 4 (01:38:23):
Jacksonville Buffalo I think is extremely interesting, more so because
I think of the pressure on Josh Allen without Mahomes,
Burrow and Lamar Jackson in the playoffs, Josh Allen, this
is the year he's supposed to do it. The AFC
is wide open. I don't know the staying power New
England because of their strength of schedule, but the Chargers
are just so banged up. Yeah, Pittsburgh has won twenty

(01:38:45):
three straight home Monday night football games. Houston's defense is
a different animal. That Jacksonville Buffalo game, to me is
extremely extremely interesting. I also don't know how you can
go away Chicago green.

Speaker 3 (01:38:58):
Bay r That's my answer.

Speaker 4 (01:39:01):
That that at Soldier Field, That to me is it. It
opened up. Green Bay was a slight favorite. Now I
think it's swung to Chicago. That to me is going
to be fascinating.

Speaker 3 (01:39:12):
Yeah, that's the game for me, that rivalry Saturday night
Soldier Field. The Packers at time this year, at times
this year have been terrific and here down the stretch
they've been anything. But the Bears are a fun story
and a good team. They've won so many weird games

(01:39:33):
late that I'm always a little bit wary of a
team like that counting on them in the postseason when
the games get hard. What our luck maybe runs out?
What was Philadelphia doing yesterday trying not to win?

Speaker 4 (01:39:45):
Why that?

Speaker 3 (01:39:47):
I have no idea.

Speaker 4 (01:39:48):
If you're Philly, would you rather play Green Bay or
San Francisco?

Speaker 3 (01:39:52):
I would rather play Green Bay me too.

Speaker 4 (01:39:54):
San Francisco.

Speaker 3 (01:39:55):
That's a.

Speaker 4 (01:39:56):
I don't know that that's one of those teams too,
because you get a coaching advantage with Shanahan, you get
at most times you have the best player on the
field and Christian McCaffrey. I just I think that is
a I think it was a mistake for Philly to
not try to win that game yesterday.

Speaker 3 (01:40:16):
If you had to wager an amount of money that
matters to you on the Super Bowl matchup, what would
you pick?

Speaker 4 (01:40:23):
I still think it's the Rams, and in the AFC,
I'll take Denver.

Speaker 3 (01:40:30):
So that's my pick.

Speaker 4 (01:40:31):
I just don't know, Like I think Jacksonville is really good,
and in saying that, I'm going against a team in
Jacksonville who's won eight straight and Houston who's won nine straight,
which is incredible, right, But like you could convince me
Jacksonville wins out or Buffalo wins at But Buffalo at
its best is fantastic. But I've seen them at their
worst a lot, and I don't know the consistency that

(01:40:54):
they have. I think, just by process of elimination, I
go Denver and I went with the Rams for a
long time now. Yeah, I think Seattle's had a great year.
I think if there's one team that they probably wanted
to avoid in that second round. It would be the Rams,
and that's who they would see, assuming that the Rams

(01:41:14):
can go to Bank of America Stadium.

Speaker 3 (01:41:16):
Tough place to play, you know those two teams. Panthers
played the game in Charlotte earlier this year. That was
a blast. It's a fun game. Yeah for Denver. You
just said process of elimination. That's kind of what it
was for me.

Speaker 4 (01:41:29):
Yeah, very good defense, Stay at the home field advantage, you.

Speaker 3 (01:41:32):
Know, like, is I sort of handicap it. I always
start with the team that has to play the fewest
number of games, and that's obviously Denver with the with
the first round by and then I think of their
biggest fatal flaw against everybody else's biggest fatal flaw. I
think they have a good home field advantage, They have
a championship caliber defense, bow Knicks is good enough, and
I just I don't know what's the biggest question with

(01:41:54):
them offensive consistency overall.

Speaker 4 (01:41:56):
Offense scores on them? Can they win a shootout style
game if.

Speaker 3 (01:42:01):
They have to play the sort of game where they're
down fourteen to nothing and now you've got to mount
a little bit of a comeback, yeah, Or defensively it's
just not taking shape and you've got a score for
score yeah yeah, yeah. I wonder about that with them,
but I think their defense is good enough that it's
going to keep them from having to be able to
do that. I think with the AFC, Chargers have so

(01:42:21):
many injuries, including obviously with the two tackles on the
offensive line. The Patriots don't rush the quarterback all that well.
They're not great defensively. There are questions about who they've played.
I think there's a fatal flaw there. The Texans offense
is so maddeningly inconsistent. They're bad up front. As great

(01:42:43):
as their defense has been, it hasn't been awesome down
the stretch. Wasn't great against India yesterday. Steelers just don't
have a very good offense. I think maybe the second
most bankable team in the AFC is Jacksonville, and had
they gotten the one, that'd be my pick. You know.

Speaker 4 (01:43:01):
The thing the only thing that wears me with the
Rams they've lost that they lost that ability when they
head to head against Seattle to have the home field,
that offense in a dome completely different than what the
Weather could be in Seattle. Yeah, you know, two weekends
from now, or Chicago or Philly or any of those
teams that are ahead of them. Those That's my my

(01:43:23):
question with the Rams with that passing attack, and that's
not taking away because Kyri Williams and an offense can
run too, But does Weather become a factor because they
missed out on the one seat?

Speaker 3 (01:43:33):
And then with with La with the Rams, you got
to win three games at some point, you got to
win a close one. To win a close one, you
can't have special teams mistakes. Their special teams has been
terrible all season.

Speaker 4 (01:43:43):
Yeah, fire coordinator midseason they did.

Speaker 3 (01:43:45):
But if I will make this wager because it's fun,
I'll go Denver La. I haven't looked at the odds,
but I'm the Rams have the second shortest odds to
win the Super Bowl in there a five seat yep.

Speaker 4 (01:44:01):
It just to me looking at it as one of
the most wide open fields, it is like there's not
that there's the powerhouse.

Speaker 3 (01:44:09):
I just think of. For most of this century, the
one Seeds have always felt like are wrong above everybody else,
whether it's been the Patriots for years, the Chiefs for
a number of years, that doesn't feel like the case
right now. And again like just look no further than

(01:44:30):
the Vegas odds. The Rams will open on the road
as a five seed and they have these second shortest
odds in the entire field to win the whole thing. Yeah,
that speaks to how wide open it is. Twenty eight
away from six o'clock. We were both in Memphis for
the Liberty Bowl. We'll spend a few minutes on that
and life posts swersby for the Bearcats coming up. Tony

(01:44:50):
and Moe Football Show Twin Peaks in Florence, ESPN fifteen thirty,
Cincinnati Sports.

Speaker 1 (01:44:55):

Speaker 5 (01:45:00):
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Speaker 10 (01:45:33):
This report is sponsored by Sports.

Speaker 3 (01:45:36):
Headlines Are a service of Kelsey Chevrolet, home of lifetime
powertrain protection and guarantee credit approval from their Families Views Life,
kelseyshev dot Com. Mike Brown, owner of the Bengals, announced
today that Zach Taylor will be the team's head coach
in twenty twenty six, and Duke Tobin will be the
Director of Player Personnel and Situations and Things are whatever

(01:46:00):
his title is, it's not GM. Bengals finishing the season
with a home loss to the Browns yesterday to wind
up six and eleven, their worst record since twenty twenty. Meanwhile,
in Vegas, the Raiders Ninado coach Pete Carroll whacked. In Cleveland,
the Browns have fired Kevin Stefanski. I'm not sure he'll
be out of work very long. Nope. Who else do

(01:46:22):
we have? The Atlanta Falcons, after their win yesterday, announced
that they had fired Raheem Morris. He's gone see you, Raheem.
Jonathan Jonathan Gannon Arizona thank you. Also let go by
the Arizona Cardinals. College basketball Miami RedHawks up to thirtieth
in the AP Top twenty five pole. Travis Steel's team

(01:46:42):
remains unbeaten. Ohio State battles Nebraskas and I by the Way,
Louisville is a twentieth Coaches shows this evening, The Mark
Pope Show at six on ESPN fifteen thirty, The NKU
Coaches Show is at seven pm on ESPN fifteen thirty,
and the Richard Patino Radio Show is that's seven o'clock
on fifty five k rc UH. And congratulations go out

(01:47:06):
to the Cowboy Jeff Brantley, who has been named the
Let's Go National Sports Media Association Ohio Sportscaster of the Year.
Well done, well done, no question about that. The Cowboy.
Red's also announced their lineup for Reds Fest. Kyle Schwarber
will not be at Reds Fest, even though he's from here,
even though he's from here, he could come as a fan,

(01:47:27):
and even though they kind of sort of tried to
get him, Yeah, he's not coming to.

Speaker 4 (01:47:30):
Pay the Reds fan growing up. Maybe once to go
see some of the folks that'll be there.

Speaker 3 (01:47:34):
Do you think it would be odd if he showed
up at Reds Fest as fan?

Speaker 4 (01:47:40):
Give us something else to talk about. What the Kyle
Schwarber Sweepstakes, Redsfest returns. This, JJ going to be there.

Speaker 3 (01:47:47):
Uh here, I'll look at JJ JJ Blade will be there.

Speaker 4 (01:47:52):
There we go, Here we go.

Speaker 3 (01:47:55):
So will alumni That includes Bronson Arroyo, Tucker Barnhardt, Marty
brennanman Sean Casey, Todd Frazier, Danny Graves, Austin Kerns, Larry Luber's, Larry,
Devin Mezerako, Dave Miley, Sam Leck here, Chris Welsh and
Doug bhar all Right, Doug, I like Reds Fest. Reds
Fest is a good time. Love Reds Fest. Yeah, love

(01:48:17):
Reds Fest. What do we have?

Speaker 5 (01:48:20):
Uh?

Speaker 3 (01:48:21):
We were at the Liberty Bowl.

Speaker 4 (01:48:23):
Got lost.

Speaker 3 (01:48:24):
They did anything else? They had no chance of winning
that football game. No, I they did. Dan. You and
Dan talked about this on the broadcast. I am I
am a big proponent of a lot of the changes
that we've had in college sports. I hate how these

(01:48:45):
games unfold like you want to go, Well, they're meaningless.
Who cares that's but if you're going to have them,
I did.

Speaker 4 (01:48:54):
They They played hard.

Speaker 3 (01:48:55):
The players who played played hard. And the defense Tyson
invite the defensive coordinators off to pay State to be
the linebackers coach. I thought defensively they did about as
well as you could expect. Yeah, and credit to Navy,
And look, Navy's not a team you want to play
because they're gonna have no opt outs. Service academies have
won eight consecutive Bowl games. I just I hate that
those games end up not being representative of what a

(01:49:19):
team has been all season long. Now, the Bearcat season
fizzled out, there's no getting around it. Extraordinarily disappointing, But
in so many cases, you will put a team on
the field that is not representative of what you have
been all year. And that two a degree took place
on Friday night.

Speaker 4 (01:49:37):
You know, if you want to talk about x's and
o's in the game twenty one to seven, U see
bust a thirty eight to thirty nine yard run. They're
in Navy territory. They tried to reverse flea flicker pass disaster.
Felt like the game ended then and again the players
that played played hard. This is the system. It's that
it is right now. Yeah, I have found myself since

(01:49:58):
the game ended, becoming increasingly worried about how they bring
and run this back next year. You look at this year,
Jake Golday and Devin teknastar on the All American list.
They had an offensive line that gave up what three
sacks all year?

Speaker 3 (01:50:14):
Was really good all season.

Speaker 4 (01:50:15):
Good running game average second the nation and yards.

Speaker 3 (01:50:17):
Per carry five million dollar quarterback.

Speaker 4 (01:50:19):
Yeah, second the nation, yards per carry fifth in the nation,
yards per play, a quarterback who was viewed by many
experts as the top player in the portal that just
got five or five plus million dollars to go to
Texas Tech. A wide receiver and a wide receiver in
Cyrus Allen who tied Marcus Barnett's single season record. Joe
Royer is going to play on Sundays. They have offensive

(01:50:42):
line Gavin gerhard WoT have a chance to play on Sundays.
Dante Corleone will play on Sundays.

Speaker 3 (01:50:48):
They had better special teams.

Speaker 4 (01:50:49):
Jake Golday will play on Sundays, and Twine Peak Junior
had a really good year. They are decimated at say
at secondary level right now. Special teams were better and
they won seven and lost their five yeah, last games,
Like I wonder with all of those players and then

(01:51:10):
moving on, how you piece it back together well, which
is the job of a lot of teams.

Speaker 3 (01:51:17):
No, no doubt about it. But it's an easier pill
to swallow if you're coming off a year where you went,
we had all those guys in won ten games, or
had all those guys in won nine games? Like I
put this on social media after the game, that that
result would have been a lot easier to swallow had
they just taken care of business in two games they
should have won, yep, which were Arizona and BYU. And
then you go, okay, they went nine and three.

Speaker 4 (01:51:37):
Yep.

Speaker 3 (01:51:37):
The Bowl game was what it was instead of just
to a degree, felt like an extension of the way
the season ended. It's funny when if you knew nothing
about this team, and you knew nothing about how the
season ended, but you heard somebody talk about all the
players they have to replace, either dudes who graduated or
guys who have hit the portal. Yeah, you would think
it was an eleven win team and.

Speaker 4 (01:51:57):
Major portal players. Like I said, yes, highest rated portal.
Yes was your quarterback?

Speaker 8 (01:52:02):
Right?

Speaker 3 (01:52:03):
I just Keagan Nickoson wrote about this after the last
regular season game, and I think it was a fair
assessment on one hand, and Scott Saderfield talked about after
the game against TCU, Hey, we won seven games. Its progress,
it is, but it felt like last offseason was building
to something bigger and better than seven wins and five

(01:52:26):
straight losses.

Speaker 4 (01:52:26):
And seven and one felt like a chance to play
in Dallas for a big twelve title.

Speaker 3 (01:52:30):
And if you understand the college football is year to year, right,
it's year to year in terms of your roster. If
you have to replace a lot of players who are
either gonna play in the NFL or get paid more
money to go elsewhere, that's cool. You gotta do better
than seven wins.

Speaker 4 (01:52:45):
All they had to do last year was revamped the
wide receiver room. Yeah, and they did, to their credit.
But they didn't have to worry about running back. They
have to worry about.

Speaker 3 (01:52:53):
Quarterback, offensive line, linebacker.

Speaker 4 (01:52:55):
They do now. They gotta worry about allo positions. They
gotta worry about Dante Corleon being gone, Jake Golde being gone.
They got to worry about a new defensive coordinator and
a new system. Their system was built around to three
three five? What's the new defensive coordinator bring? How many
players would a coordinator his name say, Nah, this isn't
my system. I'm out now Like this is they now

(01:53:17):
have a tall, tall task to tackle this offseason. Yeah,
and they've had coaches that have been plucked away, They've
had scouting department personnel guys that have been plucked away.
There's a lot that they've got to do.

Speaker 3 (01:53:30):
It's there's a lot right about the program except in
the win total. Yeah right, that's not making excuses for him.
The win total is what matters the most, and that's
why this season was so frustrating. So you look at
next year and go, Okay, we're going to take a
step back. To me, a step back season should be
seven wins. Yeah, right, that's the step back season. Hey,

(01:53:51):
you know what, we're still Bowl eligible. We're still winning
more than we're losing. Now you hear step back from what?
Step back from? Seven wins?

Speaker 4 (01:54:00):
And it's what bowl? Boston College who didn't win a
game this year? Yeah, Western Carolina, Miami of Ohio at
pay Corps. Those are your three non conference and I
don't have it in front of me, but I do
believe that their home slate is very winnable. Yes, outside
of the Texas Tech does come to town. Outside of that,
it's Kansas State it's Colorado and I'm missing one of

(01:54:24):
the other ones that come to Nippert.

Speaker 3 (01:54:25):
If you give me a second, I will I will
pull this up.

Speaker 4 (01:54:28):
Difficult road trips. Utah comes to town, they go to BYU.
I think they go to Iowa State, who's replacing their
head coach. So yeah, based on the schedule alone, seven
would start at the bare minimum.

Speaker 3 (01:54:44):
Yeah, like, are they're gonna have to take a step back?
You go, Okay, step back if you're coming off a
ten win year, fine, eleven win year college football playoff? Ye,
which would be the goal? Okay, cool? Seven wins, they'll
be competitive. We're talking about taking a step back from
a seven win season. Yeah. Brendan Soresby goes to Texas Tech.
He's gonna get reportedly five maybe six million dollars. I'm

(01:55:06):
happy for him. Good guy. Is the twenty twenty six
quarterback currently on the roster. I don't think so. Samas
Jones did not distinguish.

Speaker 4 (01:55:17):
Himself, no, not as a passer, And a worry would
be if a Sowresby is getting five or six million,
the type of quarterback like they obviously needed more than
what swords Be gave him this year. You can't spend
no offense. You're not gonna be able to spend six
on this roster on just a quarterback. Right, how do

(01:55:37):
you go about finding your quarterback?

Speaker 3 (01:55:39):
Right?

Speaker 4 (01:55:39):
And what can you pay that guy?

Speaker 3 (01:55:40):
Right?

Speaker 4 (01:55:42):
I mean that's you say what you want. Player could
come in and love meetings, Scott Soudderfield could love the
city of Cincinnati. At the end of the day, he's
gonna say what can you give me financially? That's gonna
be what the decision is based on. So that's the question.

Speaker 3 (01:55:57):
I like Brendan soars by a lot. I hope he
does well Texas Tech. Except when they played Cincinnati. He
is being talked about and written about like somebody who
had an incredible season that you see. And while he
was good Mount Rushmore type season, some would say, like,
I didn't see it. Sorry, I just didn't see it.

Speaker 4 (01:56:19):
My problem was in the biggest games they played, I
didn't see it.

Speaker 3 (01:56:21):
Right.

Speaker 4 (01:56:22):
Five and two two years ago, Yeah, chance to make
a run. They lost five games in a row down
the stretch, he announces he's coming back. They open up
the season on the road at Nebraska. They had thirty
eight thirty nine passing yards going into the final drive
of the game, he throws a pick. Then he he
heats up no offense against teams that warn is good
as the other opponents. And then down the stretch you

(01:56:43):
tall BYU Arizona, TCU. Better defenses didn't show up as much.

Speaker 3 (01:56:49):
What I'm really interested in is when he goes to
Texas Tech, does he throw the ball to his tight end?

Speaker 4 (01:56:54):
Huh?

Speaker 3 (01:56:54):
His tight end I betched against the Bearcats next season gains.

Speaker 4 (01:56:57):
Like eleven targets, nine catches a buck thirty two two tutters.

Speaker 3 (01:57:04):
Tarren, How are we on time? How much sun do
we have left? Six minutes? It's time for the college
basketball Detour Okay. On Saturday against a top ten team,
the reigning national runner up, the UC Bearcats tied the
score at sixty on a dunk by Mustapha Cham with

(01:57:27):
three minutes and fifty two seconds remaining. Those would not
only be UC's last points, that would be their last
field goal attempt until the closing seconds and a desperation
heave desperation three with the team with the game out
of reach in between five turnovers ye if I'm not

(01:57:48):
miss I'm sorry. No four turnovers and two miss free
throws and so I badly want to look at that
game and go, you know what, they hung in there
against U and if they just play that way, they're
gonna be five in the Big twelve. But two things
about it. Number One, the game followed a painfully familiar script. Yep.

(01:58:10):
For a while now, they just haven't been able to
make the play down the stretch or plays. They haven't
been able to get stops, they haven't been able to
get buckets when the games have been hanging in the balance.
Number Two, they have six losses. Like if they lose
that game and it's lost number two or lost number three, easy.

Speaker 4 (01:58:31):
To swallch What if they beat Michigan and Xavier right when.

Speaker 3 (01:58:33):
You're eight and six? Yeah, it's it's it's it's less
about how you play and more about do you win.

Speaker 4 (01:58:40):
If then they didn't win, if the non conference losses
were to Clemson and Georgia, fine, and you played Houston
that way, Yeah, I feel pretty good about where things
are at. Yeah, here here's I start. I hate when
people say, well, they played hard, that's the prerequisite, that's
a given, like that should be easy. You don't say,

(01:59:00):
you know what, these guys are playing hard. Many that's
that's every like, if you're not playing hard, what are
you doing? And I agree, if they'd have played with
that effort against EATERN Michigan, they'd beat him by thirty.
If they'd have played with that intensity against Savior, that
he went to the Cintas Center and won, that's true,
but that can't be something you celebrate in close games. Oh,
we played hard efforts, implied. The in game stuff itself

(01:59:23):
is maddening. Dayde Thomas went on a twelve zero run
before the end of the first half. Couldn't get an
easy look in the second half. Have seen that before.
You've got a guy who's red hot.

Speaker 3 (01:59:33):
Then what.

Speaker 4 (01:59:35):
Another team gets a guy that's red hot, do you
do anything to take him away? It's two players down
the stretch for Houston. You couldn't do anything to get
the ball on their hands. You held a manual sharp
to two points on the day, lost the game at
one point. I don't know what the time was. It
felt like ten minutes when Bien was four to four.
You held them before, but you only scored four. Yeah,
so many missed opportunities. The ten point lead that evaporated

(01:59:58):
so quick in the second half, and then down the stretch.
It felt people I'm at the game with. There were
two or three times in the last six minutes, coming
out of a break, I said, this is a must
score possession. Whatever your best play is this year, you
got to do it now. And it was a shot
clock violation or a buck Harris end of the shot clock.

Speaker 3 (02:00:19):
Three.

Speaker 4 (02:00:20):
They were down five at one point with around fifty
seconds left, and you think, okay, come get an easy
quick bucket, go down and play defense, get a stop.
They couldn't get an easy bucket. It's that's who they've
been and that's the unfortunate side. It's not a one off.
I'm done celebrating. If a team plays hard, you're supposed
to play hard every year you're at Cincinnati. That's that's
the prerequisite. Yes, that's where I'm at. I can't celebrate

(02:00:45):
close losses anymore. I can't celebrate a team playing hard.

Speaker 3 (02:00:48):
It's about execution. It's about execution, and.

Speaker 4 (02:00:50):
Due's about a marquee win.

Speaker 3 (02:00:52):
It's about Yes, it's about execution and winning games that
are there for the taking. And maybe the game was
a lot closer than a lot of folks anticipated. That's
certainly fair. I guess for me, like watching that game.
You watch the Bearcats go through their offense in the
half court, and there's a lot of just dribbling, and

(02:01:12):
there's a lot of just whipping the ball around the perimeter,
and not enough moves toward the basket, not enough guys
cutting without the ball to be in a position to score.
They take a lot of time off the clock and
don't get anything good. You watch Houston, Yeah, they take
a lot of time off the clock. What happens at
the end of almost everything good looks, get a good look,

(02:01:32):
and if the guy misses it. In the second half,
it's you.

Speaker 4 (02:01:34):
Know, it drove me offensively, Reba. When they call a play,
I feel like it takes eight seconds to get in
the play. Yes, it feels like they get set up
for like six seconds. I'm like, let's go right, get
to the play, and then it's like where they're positioned.
There was like five times in the second half there
was a good pass made to the quarter for a
jumper and Buck Carrott caught it.

Speaker 3 (02:01:52):
Yeah, why is he there? Why is he the gout?

Speaker 4 (02:01:54):
He can't catch and shoot from there, and you have
to build the roster around that. They're just deficient in
a lot of areas. And yeah, they played hard, but
they should play hard every game.

Speaker 3 (02:02:06):
They don't execute. No, we we're done. I hate to
end the year on that kind of note, but well,
we are only one way to go from here. Beat
West Virginia.

Speaker 4 (02:02:19):
Beat West Virginia.

Speaker 3 (02:02:20):
Tomorrow.

Speaker 4 (02:02:21):
You can probably watch it at Twin Peaks.

Speaker 3 (02:02:23):
If you weren't, you probably can. Maybe I will. We
have had a blast doing this show the last eighteen weeks,
both at west Chester and in Florence. The staff at
both locations is tremendous. Cannot recommend Twin Peaks enough. Back
in studio tomorrow. Thanks to Tarren Bland for producing this

(02:02:43):
show and Ken.

Speaker 4 (02:02:43):
Are you wearing your shirt?

Speaker 3 (02:02:45):
I might?

Speaker 4 (02:02:45):
You wear your shirt tomorrow?

Speaker 3 (02:02:46):
I might, all right? And thanks to Mike Mills and
Joe Streker for producing on site Mark Pope Show. The
Mark Pope Radio Show is next. Have a great night.
This has been the Tony and Mill Football Show on
ESPN fifteen thirty Sintesport.

Speaker 1 (02:03:00):

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Speaker 10 (02:03:41):
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