Brian Thomas with Peter Bronson -- 12/5/25

Brian talks with Peter Bronson about his new book "Magical History Tour."

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:13):
Seven oh six, here Patu about KCV talk station. A
very happy variety to you, even extra special as I
look across the board here and see my dear friend,
brilliant man. He is Peter Bronson. He was with The
Inquirer and he has written a million books. He's got
his own publishing company, Chili Dog Press dot com, which
if you're if you want to published a book, if

(00:34):
you have your own publishing company, makes it really easy.
Peter Bronson. Great to see you man. Good to see you, Brian.
It's always good to be with you. I love talking
with you. I love your books, and I encourage my listeners.
If you want to see all the books he's written,
get a synopsis of them. Just buy them. You're gonna
love each and every one of them. Just go to
Amazon and type in Peter Bronson. We've got a new
one to talk about today, Magical history, tour, Murder mystery,

(00:56):
Buried History. It sounds like a hell of a lot
of fun. I'm sure he had time writing about it.
So we're going to talk about that in a second.
But first, and I know we've always been impacted. Everybody
has been impacted by at least one person in a
life profoundly so and in terms of my education, and
I've given this guy lots of props over the year.
Is Chuck Berkholt, who's my government professor back in high school.
He really motivated you to think and engage. Socratic method

(01:19):
was a lot of what he used in class. He's
one of the reasons, well less than my father, but
one of the reasons I really took a keen interest
in politics. And he asked me to make this announcement
because he lives over in Cleeves. It's the Village of
Cleaves Christmas Walk. It's this Saturday. Starts at eleven am
on South Miami Avenue. Okay, create Cleaves Christmas Walk. There's

(01:40):
gonna be live music all day. Mike Davis who graduated
high school with me at the same class. He does Elvis,
So you have Elvis and perposonator Mike Davis. You got
unique treasures and craft shows. You can take a ride
in the festive horse drawn carriage. Lots of food there
and a chance to get a photo with since Ana
Red mascot, Rosie and Goapper five thirty PM. That'll happen.

(02:01):
So Cleaves is the place to be again. Beginning at
eleven am. Josh Barkols love you man, hope you have
a very successful event now over the Magical History Tour.
I saw the synopsis on this the first time I've
even seen the book. It's in my hand right now.
Thank you Peter for signing my copy. This is five
short stories. Now you've done other books and you elaborate

(02:23):
and you go on at length about some period in history,
early days in Ohio, northern Kentucky. Oh Man, did we
learn a lot about the Civil War?

Speaker 2 (02:31):
It was amazing book. I loved it. Man who saved Cincinnati? This?

Speaker 1 (02:37):
And when I call a book a bathroom book, I
use that as a compliment because you can kind of
pick it up through part of it. You're not writing
an entire novel, and you're done with that segment, so
we can kind of call it this. Maybe the stories
are a little longer than your traditional bathroom book, but
five different stories. So how did you like whittle it

(02:57):
down or how'd you come up with these stories?

Speaker 2 (02:58):
Because they're the the details.

Speaker 1 (03:00):
I have a really fascinating and kind of strange too,
like the first serial killer in Cincinnati, Yeah, who knew?

Speaker 3 (03:08):
That's kind of the theme or the niche I have
is who knew? Who knew that Cincinnati was attacked by Confederates?
Who knew the first serial killer in Cincinnati was a woman,
and in nineteen thirty eight, and she probably killed more
than a dozen people before they caught her. And the
story of her trial is fascinating one of the things
that's a good highlight of how these stories work and

(03:30):
how one leads to another. So while I'm researching her,
I looked at the prosecutor or handled her case. I thought,
this guy sounds kind of interesting, So I dive in
and look at him. His name was Dudley out Cault.
The out Cults were a long time, very well known
group of lawyers. They were active in the party and
the politics and as prosecutors and judges.

Speaker 1 (03:51):
Well, this guy, it turns out, flew with Eddie Rickenbacker
and World War One.

Speaker 3 (03:56):
Oh no, really, yes, And then he was a member
of Rickenbacker pit crew at Indianapolis five hundred races. I mean,
in this you just find one person in Cincinnati history
and I'm going, wow, that could almost be another.

Speaker 1 (04:11):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (04:11):
And then I find out not only that, but his father.

Speaker 3 (04:14):
One day he dropped his father off at his office
where he had a law office, never saw him again.
He vanished from the streets of Cincinnati. This is a
highly respected, well known leader of the Republican Party in
Cincinnati who just kind of gone in an instant, and
for months they had people that thought they saw him

(04:37):
and so forth. It's just another mystery and that's packed
in there. But the main story there is, of course,
the serial killer.

Speaker 1 (04:45):
And this is before the term serial killer existed, right, Yes, yes,
it was never used in relation to her. She was
known as the black Widow.

Speaker 3 (04:55):
I'm told that people who work in the Handling County
Prosecutor's office or the police department many are familiar with
this case because it's one that they point to as
one of the more sensational, interesting cases. And it was
really also one of the first cases in America that
was solved with the aid of medical forensics. Cincinnati was

(05:16):
at the forefront the cutting edge of pairing up with
the University of Cincinnati had a division there, a group
that was interested in medical forensics and trying to solve
cold cases and crimes using medicine, and they did in
this case.

Speaker 2 (05:31):
It's really a fascinating story.

Speaker 1 (05:32):
Now, did that develop into I know we have medical
forensic teams for the police now, but that was this
case instrumental in establishing that as a regular thing.

Speaker 2 (05:42):
Yes, it was. It was.

Speaker 3 (05:43):
It was the first time that they really applied this
kind of science to a murder investigation, and it was
so successful that that continued. So Cincinnati was really paving
the way for what we know today as CSI.

Speaker 1 (05:57):
Well, Harmonica Black would kind of suggest I am mad
and what her modus operandi was, but what she married
guys and then killed them, is that what this is?

Speaker 3 (06:05):
Or she would flirt with them, and her victims were
almost always elderly German men, lonely widows, or men who
never married, who were lonesome, and they would tell their friends, Oh,
I've got this new girlfriend.

Speaker 2 (06:20):
She's really something.

Speaker 3 (06:21):
Before you know it, they've signed over their house, their
savings account, just so sad, and then she would go
cook for them.

Speaker 2 (06:30):
Real is their big mistake.

Speaker 1 (06:33):
Poison was big, killing people way in the back of
the day.

Speaker 3 (06:36):
Absolutely, and you can in her case, she used arsenic,
which is undetectable. You can't smell it, you can't taste
it in food, and so what would happen is these
guys would suddenly.

Speaker 1 (06:49):
Get terribly terribly ill.

Speaker 3 (06:52):
Oh, the worst way to die, just excruciating and horrible,
and then she'd move on to another victim.

Speaker 2 (06:58):
She would have sometimes two victims go at once, no kidding.

Speaker 1 (07:02):
Yeah, And you know you say that, it's almost as
if I just, you know, I'm talking to Dave had
it with a modern scam, because that kind of stuff
goes on today. They just use artificial intelligence and computer
programs and you know, dating.

Speaker 2 (07:13):
Apps to to do this type of thing.

Speaker 3 (07:15):
Yeah, And she would have been undetected had she not
poisoned a man who was a shoe repairman, a shoe
salesman downtown in Cincinnati. He owned his own business, another
elderly German man, and she got talked to him into
going to Denver, Colorado with her, and on the way
out on the train, she poisoned him as well. And

(07:37):
the people in Denver noticed when he got off the
train that she was taking care of him, and then
she later claims she never knew him, so they got interested. Well,
I'm not going to give away more, no, no, no,
it's really a fascinating story of the detective work and
the trial.

Speaker 2 (07:52):
So it's a little bit of a courtroom procedural too.

Speaker 1 (07:55):
All right, and that would be the fourth story in
the book, Big Tom and the Black Wooden. Big Tom
that the lawyer you're referring to.

Speaker 3 (08:02):
No, Big Tom was the detective and he was one
of Cincinnati's most famous detectives. There's probably nobody can touch
him for the number of cases he handled and solved.

Speaker 1 (08:13):
He was just an amazing guy. Tom Ferger, how about that? Well,
learn about Big Tom in the Black Widow. The name
of the book Magical Mystery Tour Murder, Mystery, Buried History,
five short stories by Peter Bronson, My guests in the
studio day, we're going to dive into a little bit
of the surface of the details of some of the
other stories and enjoy this hour in studio seven fifteen.
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(09:20):
five KRC dot com since two thousand and eight. Lender
Center of Hope eighteen coming up a seven nineteen to
fify about KARCD talk station Brent Thomas talking Cars on
the Brick with Peter Brodson, another big car fan. He
oh yeah, car, I love talking about cars, but we
loved I love talking about this magical history tour learning
about his brand new book Murder Mystery Buried History. Uh

(09:43):
Sean mcmah who's covering for the Vacationing Joe's director today,
I put a link to the book Chili Dog Press
there show chilidog press dot com. Yes, he'll put a
link to the book up there, and Peter will send
you a copy when you buy one. And again, a
great Christmas gift for anybody locally or anybody interested in
just some really neat stories. Let's talk about what is

(10:04):
Resurrection Man. That'd be chapter one of the book. Let's
scratch the surface of that little diddy.

Speaker 3 (10:08):
Okay, well, before I do that, just point out if
anybody wants to go to my website to buy, you
can also get it at Amazon and all of our
local bookstories like josepheth and Barnes and Noble. But if
you go to my website, I'm running a special right
now on free shipping. All free shipping, yeah, for Christmas.
So Resurrection Man. One of the things that's fun about
short stories is I got to explore a bunch of

(10:29):
different styles. So I have a courtroom procedural, I have
a murder mystery. I have an adventure in out west
on the Oregon Trail I have and then this one
would be described more like a horror story like Tales
from the Crypt. Literally Tales from the Crypt, no kidding,
because Back in the eighteen fifties and seventies, grave robbery

(10:53):
was a really big problem. People would plunder graves and
in this case, they robbed the grave of John Scott Harrison,
who was the son of William Henry Harrison, our ninth president.

Speaker 1 (11:06):
Okay, so this is a huha, This is someone of significance,
and they yes, they took was this for medical research?

Speaker 2 (11:12):
I know, to do studies.

Speaker 1 (11:14):
It was impossible to get caidavers, so they would rob
the graves and provide them to the medical students.

Speaker 3 (11:19):
And usually they would rob the graves of the what
they called the colored cemetery, or they would go to
the poor people's cemetery and the Potter's Field and they
would take those because most people were too they didn't
have influence ors significance enough to complain and make it stick.

Speaker 1 (11:35):
Or in the case of Potter's Field, no money, but
also maybe no living or available relatives to even make
a claim over the body, so no wrinkles that are
going to follow up.

Speaker 2 (11:43):
Yeah, so they would actually rob these bodies.

Speaker 3 (11:45):
In this case, this was not only the son of
a president, but he was the father of another president,
Benjamin Harrison. So he is the son and the father
of US presidents, and they robbed his grave on the
very night he was buried.

Speaker 1 (11:58):
Well, didn't you have to get him close time to death?
Otherwise you're just bringing in a rotting.

Speaker 3 (12:03):
Exactly, if you're right, They tried to get him fresh,
as they would put it.

Speaker 2 (12:09):
In this case.

Speaker 3 (12:10):
You know, a little side note of this was it
answered a question I've often had when I went through
cemeteries or drove by them about those little mausoleums that
looked like little banks. Oh you had the bars on
the windows and everything. Well that was because of grave robbery.

Speaker 2 (12:24):
Oh wow.

Speaker 3 (12:25):
You know, so you would fortify when you put somebody
to rest, You would try as much as to your
ability to fortify that and make it impossible to steal
the corpse. In this case, they hired the Pinkerton Agency
out of Chicago to try and find out what happened
to John Scott Harrison, and they traced it to a

(12:47):
report that came in in the newspaper that that very night,
around three am, a wagon pulled up in front of
the Ohio Medical School and unloaded a long sheet wrapped object.
So the son of John Scott Harrison goes to the
Ohio Medical School.

Speaker 2 (13:08):
They finally find his body and it's hanging in this
shaft with a winch where they would bring it up
from the ground floor seven stories up, and it's hanging
there on a rope hidden in the shaft.

Speaker 1 (13:21):
Well, okay, he'll be out of this. They did that
and hung him in a shaft for the purpose of
hiding the presence of the body. Yes, there's no other
reason for the seven story Okay.

Speaker 3 (13:32):
So when you go up these stories in the Ohio
Medical College, which is would have been right about next
to the Cincinnatian Hotel it is today and in fact,
well anyway, I don't want to get distracted here, but okay,
So there they find this body hanging in the shaft,
and his own son discovered it, and it was so grizzly.
He had been stripped of his clothes, he had been

(13:54):
bled out, so they had cut his neck and so forth,
and just hanging there. And when they get up to
the seventh floor, I mean, the scene was just appalling
because they would keep thats of these body parts around
and corpses much longer than really was hygienic or safe.

(14:14):
And the stench, oh my gosh, it would knock you
right over. And they described that when they got up
there to find the body, and.

Speaker 2 (14:24):
Those are the conditions that the.

Speaker 1 (14:28):
Decompositions and doctors would work in or surrounded by that stench.
Not horrible.

Speaker 3 (14:34):
Oh, they had lost any kind of respect for the dead, right,
They just abused these corpses and just treated them horribly.

Speaker 2 (14:43):
And that was exposed.

Speaker 3 (14:45):
And you know, during these periods in the eighteen hundreds,
they were not unusual to see riots in big cities
when people would find out that their loved one was
in the medical college without permission. And it happened in
New York City where a man was walking down the
street and they actually doing a dissection in the window
of the medical college there, and it was his wife

(15:05):
who had just died. Oh, my lord, and he found
that and they had a riot and they burned that
medical college. So this was this was outrageous and it
was a huge scandal in Cincinnati. But it's also a
story of this vast network of grave robbery that was
going on in Cincinnati, and they were supplying bodies all
over Ohio, but also up in Michigan to ann Arbor.

(15:28):
The University of Michigan was getting its corpses for their
medical school from Cincinnati.

Speaker 1 (15:32):
So it was a regional organized crime unit designed to
get medical students dead bodies exactly.

Speaker 3 (15:38):
And not only that, the grave robbers would also strip
the bodies, and this is really kind of icky. They
would sell the clothes, so if you went to go
buy bargain clothes, you might be walking around in something
that was only hours before worn by a corpse.

Speaker 1 (15:55):
I read all about it in the name of the
book Magical History Tour. We got more with Bronson in
a studio be right back after I mentioned Colin Electric
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seven four one one two five one three two two
seven four one one two fifty five KRC the talk
station treat a guys seven twenty nine.

Speaker 2 (17:22):
If you've got KERCD talk station.

Speaker 1 (17:24):
Brian Thomas here with Peter Bronson. We're blessed to have
Peter Bronson here in the Greater Cincinnati Aeron Bluss for
his books. They are absolutely wonderful reads, every one of them.
I've read them all Magical history tours what we're talking
about this morning, Murder Mystery, Buried History, plus a little
bonus segment at the end. We're talking about that it's
like some well places where you can go that you

(17:46):
might never heard of the Magical History Tours at the
tail end of the book Ten Places to Discover Cincinnati History.
Get a glimpse at that toward the end of this discussion.
But let's talk about a snake in the garden.

Speaker 2 (17:56):
Peter.

Speaker 3 (17:57):
Oh, that was a lot of fun too. So a
long time ago I visited because I was working at
the Inquirer at the time, I think. And I visited
the Whitewater Shaker Village because they were just then beginning
the restoration of it, and it was fascinating to see
how these people lived. For example, when you go to
their cemetery, which is right down the road from the

(18:19):
village where they live. The Shakers, they had the cemetery
and it's probably i don't know, three acres, two acres.

Speaker 2 (18:25):
It's pretty big cemetery.

Speaker 3 (18:27):
There's only a dozen graves there and You're like, what
is going on here? Well, they believed in celibacy, and
they really didn't think ahead that you don't populate a
cemetery if you don't populate the children in the you know,
in the village.

Speaker 1 (18:44):
I was Communists believed in the celibacy.

Speaker 3 (18:47):
Okay, this is this is an amazing thing. Funny you
should bring that up because in the middle of this
cemetery it says the Whitewater Shaker Cemetery is dedicated to
a community of celibate Christian Communists.

Speaker 2 (18:59):
And yes, and this was.

Speaker 1 (19:01):
Put up in nineteen I had the god, folks, I
did not know that you really said that. Oh you
nailed it back then. See what happens.

Speaker 3 (19:10):
Yeah, Communism kind of meant something else then, because Marx
and Angles were just be kind of catching this contract.

Speaker 2 (19:17):
This was a communal living.

Speaker 3 (19:18):
Like they thought that there would be utopias if everybody
shared everything. So in the Shaker village they really practiced
that along with celibacy. So here's a funny little thing.
In their dormitory they had the women's sleeping arrangements at
the west end or the east end, and the men
at the west end, and just a hallway between them. Well,

(19:41):
you know, you'd think for the trials of celibacy, you'd
at least put them on separate floors.

Speaker 1 (19:46):
But no, it sounds like it invites a panty raid.

Speaker 2 (19:49):
You were gonna go raid the women's Storm tonight.

Speaker 3 (19:52):
Well, it's interesting that one of the rooms in the
Women's Storm had locks on both sides of the door.

Speaker 1 (19:56):
Oh all right, yeah, they anticipated that might happen.

Speaker 3 (20:00):
And there's also a story I found that they used
to spread flower on the floor in the hallway, so
if anybody walked from one dorm to the other, they
would leave tracks and the next morning you'd see which
which bet they went to.

Speaker 1 (20:15):
Well, no wonder they aren't around anymore. Not only you
had the whole celibacy. They're working against them. That's not
exactly a marketing scheme that's going to, you know, bring
in the fellow travelers, as it were.

Speaker 3 (20:25):
But if you take a look at the Shakers, they
were really in a lot of ways during that period,
and especially around the Civil War, they were the only
safety net or social safety net we had because there
was no homes for widows and orphans, there were no
places that no social security, but the Shakers for widows
and orphans and women who had gotten in trouble or

(20:47):
what what what we'd called today back then they would.

Speaker 1 (20:49):
Call violate, violated the celibacy rule.

Speaker 3 (20:53):
Yeah, so they would be taken in by the Shakers.
So whole families were taken in. And there's another fascinating
story about the Millerites, which is a diversion, but it's
in the book. And this was a cult in the
eighteen hundreds that followed a man named Miller who believed
that he knew the exact day and date of Christ's return.

(21:16):
And they sold all of their property, gave away everything,
their farms, their clothes, everything, and they all went out
to a hill. And this happened in Cincinnati. They all
went out to a hill and waited for the second coming,
and waited and waited, and nothing happened. Really, And so
I think I would have read about it if you had.

Speaker 2 (21:35):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (21:36):
So now they are destitute and homeless. So where did
they go? They shaded the Shaker village, suckers. So what's
the snake in the garden part? Well, I don't want
you to be too revealing. No, obviously came up with
this chapter title for a reason. Yes, there's a fascinating
mystery about two women who were banished from the Shaker

(21:59):
village because of failure to observe the celibacy rule, and
they had two together. The two women, it was a
mother and daughter both In all the news stories and
so forth, the accounts at the time remarked that they
were both strikingly beautiful and they had come to Cincinnati
after they were banished from Whitewater Village and after about

(22:23):
a week they were found dead in a hotel room
in downtown Cincinnati. Uh huh, So the mystery around that is, okay,
what happened? Wow, Well, there was a man who was
taken in by the Shaker village who was a drunk,
a total wasttroll, a scoundrel. But he came from a
very wealthy Cincinnati family. And there's your snake in the garden.

Speaker 1 (22:47):
All about that, I was going to charge you try
to draw a Bernie Sanders parallel, because apparently he lived
in an ashram or a commune and he was the
lazy guy that never did anything that they kicked him out.

Speaker 2 (22:57):
Well, that describes this guy too.

Speaker 1 (22:59):
He preaches the hospital of this communal lifestyle. But then
like all communes, it all fails because no one wants
to step up to the plate and pull their weight.

Speaker 2 (23:06):
And there's always communism.

Speaker 3 (23:08):
Yes, and there's always some leech that's just parasite, that's
just riding along.

Speaker 2 (23:12):
H Bernie Sanders. Yeah, well that describes this guy too.

Speaker 1 (23:15):
Except I don't think we could give him credit for
murdering anybody, at least not that I know about. More
with Peter Burns, and I like scratching the surface of
this because this obviously it feeds the curiosity element which
will get books sold. But it's well worth the small
amount of money going to pay get Peter's book and
again the excellent Christmas gift seven thirty five. Right now,

(23:37):
we'll be right back more with Peter Broynch. And after
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Speaker 2 (24:54):
Fifty five KRC seven.

Speaker 1 (24:57):
Thirty nine here fifty five KC DE talk station. Really
having a time talking with Peter Bronson about his new book,
get a copy if you do have Carosey dot com. Sean
McMahon covering for the Vacationing Joe's Director update the web
page put that there Magical History, Tour, Murder Mystery and
Buried History. If you get it from Chili Dog press
dot com, you're gonna get free shipping on that. So
Peter's throwing in the shipping charge. And it has been

(25:18):
a riot talking about the various stories, five different stories,
all based upon local folks or local connections, and then
we find out that some of them extend out west.
You mentioned that earlier when we were talking about that.
Which which chapter is that one?

Speaker 2 (25:33):
Is that? That's the one.

Speaker 1 (25:34):
It's called Rifles at forty Paces.

Speaker 3 (25:37):
Rifles at forty Paces? Good, thank you. Yeah, that's the
story of a man from Wilmington, Ohio who hopped on
the Oregon Trail, which was an incredible life threatening adventure.
Can imagine in itself period indians, disease, deserts parched, starving,

(25:58):
everything you can think of.

Speaker 1 (26:00):
Yeah, and I'm sure it was so comfortable ride in
a Conestoga wagon.

Speaker 3 (26:04):
Well yeah, yeah, oh yeah, yeah. And he led the
wagon train to northern California for the gold rush in
eighteen fifty. So he went out for the gold rush.
He fought an amazing duel against a newspaper editor, which
kind of I thought that was a special a former
editor myself. And this editor just didn't know when to quit.

(26:26):
He kept insulting this guy in his editorials, and he
just kept doing.

Speaker 2 (26:29):
It and doing it.

Speaker 3 (26:31):
It's a political thing, and so this guy becomes such
a heroic figure that he actually the city of Denver, Colorado,
is named after him, and he named the state of Montana.

Speaker 2 (26:48):
Really.

Speaker 3 (26:48):
Yes, he was governor of the Kansas Territory in the
eighteen late eighteen fifties during the time they call Bleeding
Kansas now as a run up to the Civil War.
Bleeding Kansas was like a dress rehearsal. It was all
about abolition.

Speaker 1 (27:03):
Oh I'm serious, old brother.

Speaker 2 (27:06):
I never heard that term.

Speaker 3 (27:07):
Unbelievable, terrible, terrible violence. Okay, here's the Outlaw Josie Wales
the movie.

Speaker 2 (27:12):
Yes, I've seen that. That is about this period.

Speaker 3 (27:15):
And Josie Wales was in the Battle of Bleeding Kansas
that went on for years. So if we look at
Bleeding Kansas and we draw some parallels. I didn't necessarily
do this in the story, but if you wanted to,
you can draw parallels to see what's going on in
our country today. You might say, well, Portland, Oregon kind
of looks like what bleeding Kansas looked like. People were

(27:36):
burning each other's farms, they were raiding, they were killing
each other. They were just completely out of control all
over the issue of slavery. Because Kansas was going to
be a new state, and the abolitionists wanted it to
be a free state, of course, and the people from
Missouri who had already gotten statehood and wanted it to
be a slave state like them. So the Missourians came

(27:59):
up and they fought the abolitionists, and most of the
abolitionists were from northeastern states. And one of those abolitionists
was a man everybody knows about, John Brown, oh sure.
And he was a cold blooded psychopath. He was unbelievable.
He committed massacres and murders like you wouldn't believe, and

(28:20):
people glorified and made him a hero.

Speaker 2 (28:23):
Not unlike what we've done in our own.

Speaker 3 (28:25):
Culture today, with people who are really in many ways despicable,
live a horrible life, and yet because the way they
die in the politics around it, we lift them up
as some kind of mythical hero.

Speaker 2 (28:37):
And that's what happened with John Brown. No kidding, Yeah.

Speaker 4 (28:42):
You know that.

Speaker 1 (28:44):
I guess on some level I can understand. But you know,
the idea of murdering your neighbors over it is a
human rights, of course issue, a profound one, and you know,
understanding and embracing humanity, But that you would go out
and murder someone over this set farms on fire, it's just.

Speaker 3 (29:02):
Well, and you know, we kind of tend to look
back and people like this version of history that's popular
and in schools and colleges now, which is that you know,
abolitions are good guys, Confederates bad guys, and this and that,
you know, it's all very black and white.

Speaker 2 (29:18):
No, it wasn't.

Speaker 3 (29:19):
Some of the abolitionists were the scariest, most brutal people, terrorists,
they were psychopaths.

Speaker 1 (29:27):
Well, okay, let me pose this to you. Fine, they
believe in abolishing slavery. There's a multitude of reasons why
someone might embrace that. Would someone, let's say, John Brown,
embrace that as a philosophy and as a primary motivating
force and factor in their life for the purpose of
an excuse to commit violence. That he's a psychopath.

Speaker 2 (29:51):
Yeah, I think he was.

Speaker 1 (29:52):
Like I believe out there in the world, somebody decided
to go through maybe being becoming a priest because they
could be around little children. If somebody wants to be
a teacher because they can be around little children, it
isn't because they're really truly motivated by the you know,
the Christian doctrine, or because they're motivated to be educators.
They want access to kids. Absolutely, So if they want

(30:13):
to kill, if this guy wants to has passion for
killing people, I'm an anti slavery guy. I'm an abolitionists. Okay,
go ahead and do it well. In this story, the
hero of the story is James W. Denver from Wilmington, Ohio.
City of Denver's named after him.

Speaker 3 (30:26):
His arch rival enemy is a guy who was exactly
what you described he became. He kind of played both sides,
but mainly he was just a bloodthirsty raider. He would
raid and burn farms so that he could take him
for his own property and add him to his political power. Oh,
like the Crusaders, Yes, and so, But there were other people.
I think John Brown was just nuts. I think he

(30:48):
was crazy. He went around killing people in the name
of God. That is just where they struggle with.

Speaker 2 (30:54):
That is nuts.

Speaker 3 (30:55):
And they thought that God was on their side so
they could do anything they please. And both sides were
unbelievably cruel and brutal.

Speaker 2 (31:03):
So it was kind of like the Crusades.

Speaker 3 (31:04):
Yeah, Bleeding Kansas was an unbelievable chapter in our history.
And it's all like this many little set piece dress
rehearsal for the Civil War.

Speaker 1 (31:15):
We'll get back with Peter Bronson. This is great. Plus
some sight seeing you can do right there. Inside Magical
History Tour, Murder Mystery and Buried History Cover Sincy, John Rolman.
Phones were ringing off the hook. He came over to
the Christmas party the other day. John Rouman from Cover Sincy.
Oh my god, phones ringing off hook and it should
be ringing off the hook. You are TikTok, TikTok, running
out of time for your Medicare selections? Do you know

(31:36):
what you're selecting? Part ABCDEFG. However it goes on listen.
If I was in that position, I would want to
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Get in touch with Cover Sincy toll answer your question
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They're wonderful people and for people who are dealing with
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(31:57):
maybe already made the choice. You know there's a better
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(32:21):
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get this process started COVERSINCI dot com or called them

(32:43):
at five one three eight hundred call five one three
eight hundred two two five five fifty five KRC seven
fifty one to seven fifty one fifty Have KRCD talk
to you Before we get back with Peter Brownson, jump
a little bit more into magical history, tour, murder, mystery
and varied issue. We're going to talk to Officer Tivity
Green with the Sincaint Police Department Crime Stoppers Bad Guy

(33:04):
of the Week, Officer Green, Happy Friday to you. Who
are we looking for?

Speaker 4 (33:09):
The Cincinnati Police Homicide Unit is looking for Emory Green.
Mister Green is wanted for selling murder. On September twenty
seventh of twenty twenty four, mister Green was involved in
a physical altercation with John Nichols. As a result of
the physical education, John Nichols sustained like striving injuries is
to come to those injuries. Emmy Green is a mel Black.

(33:31):
He's twenty four years old. He's five seven and one
hundred and sixty pounds. Emmy Green has a history of
felonious assault at aggravated robbery and was last known to
live on Westwood, Northern Boulevard and Westwood. If anyone has
information on where police can find Emory Green, please call
crime Stoppers at five point three thirty five two thirty

(33:52):
forty or submittative online at crime gas Stoppers dot us.

Speaker 1 (33:57):
Got to get this guy off the street and the
information ye tip les and ratio eligible for a cash reward,
to be doing society a favor. And all that activity
criminal activity packed into twenty four short years. That's a
sad thing. Officer Green, thank you very much for what
you do in and out all the day long, and
thanks to this insant police department for their great work.
We'll be looking for him. Officer Green, thanks for much.
Have a wonderful weekend. It's back to Peter Brunts and

(34:20):
magical History Tour, murder mystery and buried history. You know
before rather than maybe go back into one more of
the snippets about these various stories in here, just elaborating
on it. You and I were talking off the break
because you lose sight when you're talking about the wild West,
and you mentioned that, you know, the duels.

Speaker 2 (34:37):
That was all Mike's mic on. Is this Mike on?
It is? Okay?

Speaker 1 (34:44):
There you go, all right. I didn't hear it just
the second ago. Yeah, so it was very common. But
the background on that is there wasn't law enforcement. You know,
they weren't sheriffs necessarily around, and if they were, they
weren't going to stop a duel from happening.

Speaker 3 (34:56):
And this actually came from Europe. There was something called
the Irish Duello and that was a lengthy thing. It's
like thirty different rules and regulations to set up a duel,
all about the courtesy and manners that surround how you
established it.

Speaker 1 (35:12):
Do you murder someone again, you'd properly do it like
the Marcus of Queensbury rules.

Speaker 3 (35:15):
Yeah, I think, well, you know that's funny, you'd bring
that up once again. You nailed it, the Marcus at
Queensbury rules. And boxing was actually introduced in Europe as
a way to settle these disputes without firearms.

Speaker 2 (35:27):
Ah.

Speaker 3 (35:28):
So there was so much dueling going on and so
many young men being killed that they finally got this idea, well,
let's just resort to fisticuffs and settle it that way.

Speaker 1 (35:36):
Apparently a duel could be justified and you just called
somebody a name, oh.

Speaker 3 (35:41):
Yeah, especially if you said something that shed poor light
on his girlfriend, or his mother or his sister. Women
were especially held sacrisank. Now think about this in compare
it to today's society. First of all, they had honor.
People were polite, because if you shot off your mouth
about somebody, you could be challenged and dragged into the

(36:03):
street into a duel. And if you if you were
you know, the kind of person who says, nah, I
don't want to do that. I'm sorry. If you back
down after somebody had challenged you, then you were disgraced.
You were just kind of an outcast from society. So

(36:23):
the the amount of honor that people held it in
high regard at that time, it is just something that
probably most of us really can't relate to anymore because
we see what happens in our society today. People do
the most incredibly dishonorable things and then they just say
let's move on, and nobody challenges them.

Speaker 2 (36:44):
They are not held accountable. I mean, I don't want
to go back to.

Speaker 1 (36:46):
Dulo, He's going to say, veiled suggestion from Peter Brownson,
we bring back dueling.

Speaker 3 (36:51):
Well, the Irish code Duello is still there. I cite
most of the some of the rules of dueling in
my book.

Speaker 1 (36:58):
Learn all about it. Get a copy of Magical History
to a Murder Mystery and Buried History, and let us
talk very briefly here Peter Browns. And you got a
little extra fun and games going on at the tail
end of the book with ten places to discover in
Cincinnati history. I suppose these relate to the individuals and
points you made factually in the five stories you provide.

Speaker 3 (37:18):
Also in my other books, so things like the Man
who Saved Cincinnati. The Low Wallace Study and Museum is
one of those spots. The Pioneer Cemetery is one of
those spots. I didn't even know about that until I
found it down by Lunkin Airport. It's a fascinating little
cemetery where you can find the grave of Major Benjamin Stites,
who was one of the first settlers of Cincinnati in

(37:41):
the seventeen eighties and nineties. And then there's another one
called Congress Green Cemetery, and that's the one where Benjamin Scott,
John Scott Harrison's body was robbed from the grave, and
also the burial place of John Cleeves Simms, who is
sims purchase was all of the land that we stand

(38:02):
on today in Cincinnati.

Speaker 2 (38:03):
How about that?

Speaker 3 (38:05):
And these are not of course, the museum center is fantastic,
The Art Museum is fantastic, all of these things. I
just wanted to find the little places that are kind
of out of the way. Who knew that these were there?
And that you can find out so much about our
history from this book? Man who knew?

Speaker 1 (38:22):
Yeah, Peter Bronson's the man we can thank for now knowing.
If you get a copy of the book, can find
out for yourself. It's available at fifty five care sea
dot com, a podcast page, or you can just go
right now at chilidogpress dot com and Peter will be
happy to ship one out with free shipping. Peter can't
thank you enough for the Iron Studio. I love our
conversations man, me too.

Speaker 2 (38:41):
Wish we could done all the time. Great interview. Thank
you so much. This will be done.

Speaker 1 (38:45):
I swear I'll have this book done in probably twenty
four hours or forty hours, because I got a four
day week and I'm going to start with this when
I get home. Fantastic folks, stick around after Is there
an afterlife? Sebastian Junger reflection on death and what might follow?
He is the keynote speaker Empower you see, are coming
up on the ninth in my time of dying, so
this should be a rather interesting conversation after the top

(39:07):
of the air news. I hope you can stick around me.

Speaker 2 (39:09):
Right back