POA, 8 Revisit: Nugget of Legitimacy

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:13):
This is episode four hundred and sixty one of Alova
Mora for July nineteenth, twenty and twenty five. Welcome to

(00:38):
another episode of Aloha Mora, the fandom's original Harry Potter
book Club.

Speaker 2 (00:42):
I'm Josh Cook, I'm Sean Mini Willis, and I'm Kat
Miller and I'm very excited to introduce our guests for
this episode, our friend Monica. Hey Monica, thank you so
much for being on the show. We're super excited to
have you.

Speaker 3 (01:00):
I'm super excited to be here. Thank you guys for
having me. It's such an honor.

Speaker 1 (01:04):
Yay.

Speaker 2 (01:04):
Tell our listeners a little bit about yourself.

Speaker 3 (01:06):
I am a huge Harry Potter fan, as you can tell.
So I have actually been following like Muffelnet since I
was like ten, which is back in nineteen nine, two
thousand and four, so it's been really it's been really
cool to be a part of this. And I am
a Harry Potter content creator. I live in Vegas, but
I like to focus my content on magical travels, going

(01:28):
to Harry Potter filming locations, stuff like that.

Speaker 2 (01:32):
Awesome what house are you?

Speaker 3 (01:34):
I am a gryindor.

Speaker 2 (01:35):
Yay, yay, yeah, I'm the lone raven claw today.

Speaker 3 (01:42):
That's great.

Speaker 2 (01:46):
Yeah, so I listeners know this, But I did a
Harry Potter road trip way back in twenty thirteen around
the UK. I think we've visited like seventeen sites over
six days, and I know I have a favorite location.
Do you have a favor location?

Speaker 3 (02:01):
Oh my gosh, it's so hard because we basically did
that too. Where we did like a road trip from
London all the way to Edinburgh in Scottish Highlands. I
guess I would say the Scottish Highlands definitely, like where
the glen Finted Viaduct where the Hogwarts expressed.

Speaker 2 (02:15):
On the train. It's hard to beat the scenery up
there for sure. Mine is Gloucester Cathedral.

Speaker 3 (02:22):
Oh my gosh, so beautiful, yeah.

Speaker 2 (02:24):
Something about it. They were having choir practice when we
were there. It was Caleb and I and our friend
Alexandra who were all a muggle that and Caleb was
a host on the show, and they were having choir
practice and it was just like angelic. I can't even
describe it, but I remember having goosebumps walking through and
just thinking about it makes me really happy.

Speaker 3 (02:46):
That's so awesome. Yeah, it's such a beautiful place.

Speaker 2 (02:49):
Yeah, it was a great spot and I really hope
everybody out there gets there at some point, even if
it's not for Harry Potter related reasons.

Speaker 3 (02:56):
Yeah, you should go.

Speaker 2 (02:57):
It's beautiful. It's like a nice old cathedral cathedral in England.
So anyway, thanks Mona for monic Over being here.

Speaker 3 (03:04):
We're super thanks.

Speaker 1 (03:07):
Nice. Something that really gives me goosebumps is this chapter
Prisoner of Azkaban, chapter eight flat of the Fat Lady.
We had originally talked about this chapter on episode twenty
three Magical Exterminator from February twenty thirteen with Noah, Laura,
Caleb and Michael. That is a that's one of the

(03:27):
double chapters. It this chapter seven and eight of this
so listeners feel free to go back listen to that
episode and one of the few that doesn't have cat
on it from those early days.

Speaker 2 (03:39):
True, it'll be like culture shock going back twelve plus years.
And yeah, I think that was one of the last
double episodes we did too. I think pretty soon after
that we switched to single single chapter episodes.

Speaker 1 (03:51):
Yeah, because it happened in the middle of Prisoner, right,
you didn't wait till yeh yeah.

Speaker 2 (03:57):
Yeah, we were like, we can't talk about two chapters
in two and a half hours. We need to do
a half hours for one chapter. You know, you all
know how it goes.

Speaker 4 (04:07):
Anyway, Well, fun fact, I just started. I went back
and I just started listening to the show from episode one,
like last week, and I definitely recommend going back and
listening to the older episodes. Like you guys sound like babies.
It's like, oh God, sounds like a baby. Oh my gosh.
So definitely recommend, definitely go back and listen to that one.

Speaker 2 (04:28):
I was only thirty when we started the show, no,
because we started in April twenty I was twenty nine
when we started, and I just turned forty three.

Speaker 1 (04:37):
So yeah, I have I have my re I have
my re listen scheduled for June of twenty six, whenever
we are done. I don't listen to anything right now.

Speaker 2 (04:48):
Yeah, I can't believe I've spent my entire thirties podcasting.
Well better than when that loser ex boyfriend of mine.

Speaker 1 (04:54):
Right three, I'm glad. I'm glad we've on the way
to stay friends after the breakup.

Speaker 4 (05:02):
Cat. Yeah, thank you, so proud of you guys. Well,
without our Patreon sponsors, none of us would be here
discussing anything. So we want to thank Bouncy Chill Up
today for sponsoring this episode on Patreon. You're awesome And

(05:25):
just in case you didn't know by now, our Patreon
offers a lot of great perks, including ad free episodes,
monthly meetups with the hosts, and so much more. Our
perks started just three dollars a month, so head over
to patreon dot com slash Alohama to become a sponsor.
And if you're looking for a non monetary way to
support the show, you can subscribe, save and share this
episode or the entire show with all of your friends

(05:46):
and to your favorite Harry Potter communities. We always appreciate
the support of every one of our listeners. However you're
able to do that, and thank you again, Thank you,
thank you. We appreciate you.

Speaker 1 (05:58):
Guys.

Speaker 2 (05:59):
I just did the counting on my fingers and there's
only ten meetups left with the hosts, so and then
they're gone forever, friends, So get on that.

Speaker 1 (06:10):
I'm just saying that depends on how lonely I get
next spring.

Speaker 2 (06:14):
Oh right, yeah, Josh May hold solo ones, Yes.

Speaker 1 (06:17):
Give me give me the email addresses. We'll just send
them out.

Speaker 2 (06:20):
Yeah, we'll make it work. They'll make it work, all right, friends. Well,
let's jump in to Prisoner of Azkaban. And you know what,
I wanted to look this up before we recorded, so
forgive me, I'm going to look it up now because
I think it has been a hot minute since we've
talked about Prisoner of Azkaban. And yep, it's not even
showing up on here. Let me see hang on and

(06:42):
pulling it up. So today's episode four hundred and sixty one.
The last time we talked about Prisoner of Azkaban was
four hundred and forty two. It has been almost twenty episodes,
which means almost four months. That's wild.

Speaker 4 (06:57):
Now, there's been a lot of Goblet in Order lately.

Speaker 2 (07:00):
Yeah, that's because those books are so much longer. We
have a lot of chapters left to cover in those.
But this is a fun one. Let's jump into it.

Speaker 1 (07:10):
Return should do it? Chapter revisit.

Speaker 5 (07:19):
Ask chapter eight, Flight of the fact.

Speaker 1 (07:26):
That the.

Speaker 2 (07:31):
Professor R. J. Lupin is the taste of Hogwarts and
everyone is happy and content, well except for Malfoy, who
is sad and mean. Trelawny bores Harry to death, which
also seems to be hagrid specialty these days. September leaves
and under a page, and October arrives with news of
not only Quidditch and Oliver's last chance at the Cup

(07:52):
and Halloween, but also the very first Hogs made visit
for everyone except Harry. Ho home, Ho Home. Harry walks
around the castle by himself, has a super awkward and
weird confrontation with Filch, only to stumble upon Lupin. They
talk about the Boggart Lord voldemor In de Mentors and
nothing really comes of it. Snape brings in a smoking

(08:15):
potion and nothing really comes of that either, at least
not in this chapter. This odd little chapter anyway. So
this is a this is a fun one flight of
the Fat Lady sort of. What you think happens in
this chapter is not what happens in this chapter. I
think most people think this is the one where you know,

(08:35):
Sirius breaks in and everything it's it's friends. It's not,
Or maybe I'm just the only one who.

Speaker 1 (08:39):
Thought that, but I always at least wait until the
end of the episode to correct you on that.

Speaker 2 (08:45):
Cat you would have let me get that fun.

Speaker 1 (08:48):
Yes, I appreciate that. I tell you, this is a
really interesting chapter because it's it's the first time that
we see a competent defense gets the Dark Art professor,
at least up to this point. Now, granted, we saw
Lupin's practical lesson and in book number were in chapter

(09:08):
number seven, but here in chapter eight, we really see
how the how the student body rallies around somebody that
is competent at their job, especially at this job, this
job that every Gryffindor is dying to learn more about
because they all they want to do is go out
and fight the dark Hearts and all this kind of stuff.

(09:30):
And then I'm sure raven Claws and Hufflepuffs are just
are excited to be able to learn as subject as
well as they're able to learn things like transfiguration and
charms and herbology and all those kinds of things. So,
I mean, with the exception of Slytherin, it's so nice
to see the school body excited.

Speaker 2 (09:53):
About something for a change. YEA, yeah, it's nice.

Speaker 1 (09:56):
So like he's getting all this credit because he does
he does the practical and with with bog arts, with
the with the third years. I'm sure he's doing the
same with with with the other classes as well. Are
practical lessons actually that uncommon in Hogwarts.

Speaker 4 (10:11):
Kind of seems like it because we well, the only
place that we really see practical lessons is transfiguration, and
that's I think, because it kind of has to be right.

Speaker 2 (10:19):
When guardium les charms is practical.

Speaker 1 (10:25):
And that's my point really is that I think most
of the classes are practical except for History of Magic.
Herbology has to be practical.

Speaker 2 (10:33):
Yeah, Oceans is practical, Oations is practical.

Speaker 1 (10:36):
I just you know, like that that's scalt. My thing
is like he's getting a lot of credit for doing
things I feel like the other professors are doing only
because he's a the Ada professor.

Speaker 3 (10:46):
That's true. A lot of the classes are very hands on,
so it's interesting.

Speaker 1 (10:52):
Now. Granted, the difference here is that the bog Art
lesson they are going up against something. They are actually
fighting against something. So when you look at like transfiguration
and charms and things like that, you're really not gonna
be doing that, like there's nothing to like fight against,
I guess, but it's still practical. I do think that

(11:14):
the only real difference is like, no, this is an
actual creature that now we're using a spell against to
protect us. So that's pretty cool. Cat is listeners. You
can't maybe you can't see this. Cat is molling what
she wants to say, harder than I've ever seen.

Speaker 2 (11:31):
That's not true. I mean not harder than you've ever seen.
I am thinking though, I mean yeah. The only subjects
that really aren't practical are like history of magic, maybe rithmancy,
because like that sort of seems like a math equivalent.
Care of magical creatures with the flabber worms like stuffing

(11:53):
let us down their throats, like one, poor flabber worms.
Two practical lesson.

Speaker 1 (12:00):
Astronomy, But you're looking at the stars. At least you're
making us stars. I don't know.

Speaker 2 (12:06):
Maybe I think astronomy is like because it's not like
you're not you're doing something, but you're not, You're just
observing something. I think it has to be like you said, though,
because there's an actual Boggart there, and there's actual beasts
and animals. Although, to be fair, to give Lockhart some credit,
he did bring pesky pixies into the class.

Speaker 1 (12:30):
That he was very very uh prepared for. Well, like
another thing that that that's really coming up through the
the A d A lessons here is is it's not
just bog UARTs. We hear about loop and bringing in
red or learning about red caps and kappus I believe, uh,

(12:52):
and then Grendi Low's and so like, I'm not up
on the on the extra canonical material from you, from
the author or anything like that. I haven't read Fantastic
Meason where the fond them are These are there like
different segments or I guess specific categories that creatures get

(13:14):
put into, because it does seem like these are dark
creatures in the ways that they're described.

Speaker 4 (13:20):
Okay, they do have different categories. I should have grabbed
my book because I have Fantastically somewhere. One of my
children borrowed it and did not return it. So, but yes,
they do have different categories, Okay, depending on how dangerous
they are. Cool, there's like level one, level two, level three.

Speaker 2 (13:36):
Yeah, they're not. They're not splitting into like a genus.
They're not like water creatures and land creatures and whatever.
It's just sort of by their ministry of magic classification,
which one is the one that carries the little lantern
and like lead you in. Is that a hinky punk
that leads you into bogs with the little lantern.

Speaker 1 (13:56):
I'm not I'm not the one for this one.

Speaker 2 (13:58):
Maybe yeah, yeah, I think that's what it is anyway.
I mean, so the narration goes on to say that
Snape has been just awful, just worse than awful, because
everybody knows and everybody has heard about Nevill's bog Art

(14:22):
and whatever. And he also like, we know he's salty
because Lupin is in the school. And I wondered, what
do you all think bugs Snape more Lupin being there,
Neville's Boggart, or is it just a combination of the two.
Is it just Snape? I don't know, what do you think.

Speaker 4 (14:38):
It's for sure all of the above, because my thought
was he I know, he's super embarrassed about that Boggart
and that makes him mad, because you know, some people
get embarrassed to get really upset. I definitely think it's
it's a combination of both. And he's like, if Neville
wasn't here, that would never have happened, and now the

(14:58):
whole school is laughing and awful. Well, he pretends to
be this like don't care attitude guy, I know he's
embarrassed and he cares. He cares that they're talking about
him behind his back.

Speaker 3 (15:09):
What do you think, Monica, I feel like it's pretty
triggering that like Lupid is there for him, because you know,
I'm sure it's like brings back all the memories of
when they were growing up and like all the bullying
that he put him through and everything. So I think
it's like a combination two of both. And taking it
out on Neville is like his way of also getting
back at loop In, and I'm sure it brings back

(15:31):
all the memories and it's just like, ah, this guy's
here again.

Speaker 1 (15:34):
Well yeah, And it's also not just about loop In
either though, Like he's definitely upset that Loopin's back, But
there is this weird combination of this weird circumstance that
has happened where it's Looping is back and Serious has
escaped from Azkaban, so like that's also happening in the
back of Snape's mind. Now, granted, I think that it

(15:56):
only has to do with loop and being back, because
Sea many you said something about like, well, if Neville
wasn't there, it wouldn't have happened. Well, if Lupin wasn't
the professor, this practical lesson wouldn't have happened, and so
then the Boggart couldn't have happened. So I think it
all comes back to Loopen being back at the school.
But you know that it's not just looping. It is

(16:18):
looping and serious are in the world again. And he
does not think that that is a He doesn't think
that's a coincidence.

Speaker 2 (16:29):
Right, well, and we have to remember that Snape hates
Neville because Neville is the other you know that could
have been. And if it had been Neville, then Lily
would be alive, and of course they'd be in love
and have little babies. Right probably not, but you.

Speaker 1 (16:43):
Know, Snap would just be looking through James and Lily's windows.
Tell me How'm wrong.

Speaker 2 (16:49):
It wouldn't be at Hogwarts, that's for her. He would wouldn't.

Speaker 1 (16:52):
He would not be as he would. Yeah, it's hard
to have a full time job when you're stalkering.

Speaker 2 (16:57):
You know, Yeah, for sure, Well.

Speaker 1 (17:02):
Don't have experience.

Speaker 4 (17:04):
Book.

Speaker 2 (17:08):
It is nice to actually see the Narration straight up
call Snape a bully in this chapter, which it does
not happen often, but it's straight up said like Snape
bullying Neville or something, and I really appreciated that. It's
nice to see that being called out as early as
book three. I mean maybe the words are used earlier.
I don't know, but yeah, it's.

Speaker 3 (17:29):
Like not sugarcoating it, and it's like this is bully.

Speaker 2 (17:32):
Yeah finally. Yeah. How do you feel about Snape in general,
Monica Share please?

Speaker 3 (17:39):
Definitely a complicated character, for sure. I do like the
redemption at the end. I know that's like a whole
discussion about Snape in general, but yeah, I mean it's
just so hard. It's just a tragic character. It's like
you grew up like with loving like this this witch,
and then she goes for the guy that ends up

(18:01):
being your like number one hater, and it's just and
then you have to like protect their son like at
the end and do all this for her. It's yeah,
I just feel like it's a very complex character. I
like him. I know, like some people don't, and you know,
they think at the ending he's just a bully and obviously,
like you can really see it in the books, like

(18:21):
how much he bullies the students and you know that's
not right obviously, But I think at the end his
loyalty really really pushed through, especially to Dumbledore and to Lily.

Speaker 2 (18:32):
So yeah, sure, wow, Nuance, I know, I know we
try to bring that into the show, but I think
a lot of listeners would agree with you on that
for the record, but he's he's definitely almost always talked
about character, yeah, on this show anyway.

Speaker 1 (18:52):
Well, the only thing I want to bring up about
Snake Bully and Neville here is that he's bullying Neville
even more because he has stoked so much fear into
Neville from bullying him for two years already. It's just,
you know, you can't I don't know it. It's really

(19:14):
hard for me to go back and say, like he
is a tragic character, but he's also just a jerk too,
you know, Like I don't know, it's being more upset
with someone because you have made them upset in the past. Yeah,
and that's how they dealt with you bullying them, you know.

Speaker 4 (19:35):
I just right, when it comes back to it, it's
his own fault that the Boggart appears like that because
he's such a bitter man child, and we know he
would never take responsibility and be like, oh, maybe I
shouldn't have bullied him, then the bogger wouldn't have turned
into me. You know, he would never see that. But no.

Speaker 2 (19:55):
Yeah, it's almost like people contain multitudes and they can
be more than one thing. Crazy, right, oh crazy? Yeah. Well,
so as we continue into this opening of the chapter,
we're hearing a lot about the teachers and the classes
and whatever. And as Harry is talking about divination and

(20:16):
how much he hates going up there, you know, there's
this line and this little paragraph about Lavender Brown and
Parvadi who both have like become besties with Trelawney and
they spend all their free time up in her tower
and they talk about what like what what are they
what are they talking about? Is Trelawny like giving them

(20:39):
extra credit lessons? I don't think that's the answer, for
the record. I think that they're just like gossiping, like
sharing stories about people and like making up fake predictions.
Everybody has had. I feel like maybe this is a
raven Clonmie. You'll have to tell me everybody has had
like a close relationship with one teacher, right, Okay, everybody's

(20:59):
shake not in their heads.

Speaker 1 (21:00):
Great shout out doctor Hill and Linda Brown as.

Speaker 2 (21:05):
My art teachers. Yeah, like what is going what is
going on in the tower? The three of them very curious.

Speaker 1 (21:15):
Yeah, I mean I think a lot. I think a
lot is said in just in the line. They returned
with annoyingly superior looks on their faces, as though they
knew things the others didn't. And so I think that
they are just powered around with with her learning. I'm
sorry with the divination professor. Uh, it's going to give

(21:38):
me trouble forever. And she should You can say Sybils,
I could say, I could say Sybil. But I think
that she is just giving them prophecies or predictions and
things like that because they're not gonna remember the ones
that don't come true. They're only going to remember the
ones that kind of maybe happen. And if she shouts

(21:59):
also enough, if she says enough of them, something's going
to happen. It's close to it.

Speaker 2 (22:05):
RN Yeah, like Lavender's rabbit, like.

Speaker 4 (22:09):
If you guess enough of the truth, then eventually something
will come true. I wonder if they're like asking her
questions about people that they don't like, or about boys
or what have you, and she's feeding them this bogus
information and they are believing, eating it up I don't know.

Speaker 2 (22:29):
I just learned that there's a thing called Etsy Psychics.
It Etsy or was a pinterest?

Speaker 3 (22:36):
I think I heard about this too.

Speaker 2 (22:38):
Yeah, so like it was a video you saw like
a video or something like there was was it Etsy?
I think it was Etsy. This girl hired an Etsy
psychic to draw her like future husband, and then she
met the perfect guy a week later. Yes, yeah, you
recognize that. And I was like, what like in Etsy Psychic?

(23:00):
I don't know. I sort of feel like maybe that's
what Trelawny is.

Speaker 1 (23:05):
Well, So I don't know. There's also the possibility because
like Lavender has always been written as like not like
an airheaded girl, but like I don't know, like very
like very very girly, and some of that comes in
with like gossiping and that kind of stuff too, So
like Sybil could be could take an extra interest in

(23:29):
them because she's trying to get more information on other
students to make predictions better closer to reality. The more
information that a psychic has, or a defination professor would
have about somebody, which makes Harry Potter very easy because
he's probably going to die terribly, you know, it just
makes her job easier and makes her makes it seem

(23:51):
as though she knows things that she shouldn't.

Speaker 2 (23:55):
Smart, so she's just using them for the gossip.

Speaker 1 (23:59):
Yeah, she's a snake old salesman for sure.

Speaker 3 (24:02):
And I feel like they could be pretty persuaded. So
maybe she like feels like, oh okay, these two girls,
I can say whatever you want and they'll be like
ooh ah and yeah.

Speaker 2 (24:14):
Yeah, they're definitely easy. Yeah, easy to persuade. Yeah, I
think you used the right words. I think you use
the right words.

Speaker 1 (24:21):
So, like, to that point, do we do we want
to talk about Lavender's rabbit now or wait until?

Speaker 4 (24:28):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (24:28):
I mean, let's let's talk about the rabbit like it.
I mean, first off, I guess my question is is
the rabbit a plot device to encourage us to trust
Trelawney and her predictions. I think the answer to that
has to be yes.

Speaker 1 (24:46):
Yeah, I agree nobody. I agree that it's in there
to be a plot device for us to trust Sybil,
but I think that it is immediately taken out because
HERMANI uses logic against it to prove that she's probably wrong.

Speaker 2 (25:02):
M I hear you.

Speaker 1 (25:05):
Thank you, glad. My mic is on.

Speaker 2 (25:09):
Smart But like yes, but as La Luna will say
to Hermione in a couple of books, like I forget
the exact line, I don't want to butcher it, but
something about like you don't believe in things that you
haven't read or haven't seen or whatever, like Hermione log
logics her way out of it. But like, what exactly, Josh,

(25:35):
you've got your book open. What exactly did Trelawny's original
predictions say, Because if she said, like your rabbit will
die on this day, maybe that's maybe that debunks it.
But if it's not that specific, I don't know. I
just feel like, and we've talked about this on the
show before another chapter is is that a lot of

(25:58):
the things Trelannie says end up coming true in a way.
And this has always been one of those wonky ones.
I think for a lot of people.

Speaker 4 (26:08):
It wasn't specific. She just said that thing that you're
dreading will happen on whatever the day. It was like
thish of February, since October that's right? Yeah, Well, I mean,
and that's that's pretty broad because you could be dreading
any number of things, and October is a big month,
so I mean, chances are something that she's dreading will happen.

Speaker 1 (26:31):
It specifically says, thank you, my dear. Incidentally, that thing
you are dreading it will happen on Friday, the sixteenth
of October. And so Lavender opens the letter that says
that her rabbit died on Friday the sixteenth of October,
which means that a thing didn't die.

Speaker 3 (26:52):
I think that's what maybe says, right.

Speaker 4 (26:57):
Was she dreading the death or was she dreading the news?

Speaker 2 (27:00):
I mean, short story. I had a hedgehog a long
time ago, and he developed this is such a silly name,
but it's called wobbly hedgehog syndrome. And I know it
sounds silly, but it's basically the equivalent of MS in hedgehogs, right,
so he I know, yes, that is a correct reaction.
It was very sad.

Speaker 4 (27:20):
It was very sad.

Speaker 2 (27:21):
But he started to lose the ability to walk. He
couldn't use his back legs anymore. And so I was
on a trip because I used to travel for work.
I was like a traveling photographer, and so my partner
ended up having to take him to the vet to
like put him down because it was at the point
where he couldn't walk and he was being hand fed
every single day, and it was just like torture and

(27:43):
painful for him and whatever. And I will say that
I was dreading both of those things. I was dreading
the day that that would have to happen, and then
I was dreading the call that I would be on
a trip when my partner called me and said, today's
the day and you're not here, So I'm gonna go
do it, you know, so I can see. I can
I can see. Granted, Lavender's rabbit was not sick and

(28:07):
was young and was all of those things, but I
could see dreading both of those things. Is my point.

Speaker 1 (28:13):
I'm going throughout a terrible theory that Sybil killed the rabbit.

Speaker 2 (28:17):
Stop is that even possible.

Speaker 4 (28:22):
Like she sent people to knock off this rabbit, or
like this was a self fulfilling prophecy, that she kind
of instilled this fear into Lavender and she made it
happen that way.

Speaker 1 (28:35):
The issue is that we we know that Sybil is
a true seer, so but we only know of two
true prophecies, two or three throughout the series I, and
she doesn't remember those. So the fact that she would
say one that she remembered, even though we have proof

(28:56):
of the true ones that she has she doesn't remember,
means that she's just it's the same thing as before.
She's thrown stuff out there. It's wild that she would
say the sixteenth of October. It's wild that she would
say a specific date.

Speaker 2 (29:11):
Yeah, psychics aren't generally that specific, right, which is why
I think there has to there has to be a
level of credence here. There has to be a little
nugget of legitimacy. Josh is not convinced.

Speaker 1 (29:29):
I'm not. I'm not. I'm not, but like it's I'm
on her money. I'm on her money side. With the
Luna thing later about the crumple horn Stork.

Speaker 2 (29:40):
Act, Wow, I mean, no, wonder we broke up.

Speaker 1 (29:46):
Yeah, I just don't. I mean the crumpled horn storka
act is very bigfoot.

Speaker 4 (29:51):
So like they don't know, you don't know that it's
not out there.

Speaker 1 (29:55):
You don't know, Yeah, but I do, like adult, you know, it's.

Speaker 3 (30:04):
Pretty it's pretty clear.

Speaker 2 (30:07):
Yeah, anyway, I don't know.

Speaker 1 (30:09):
I know, I know we're kind of going around and around,
but like there is there is a specific question about
whether or not Hermione was rot to question Lavender in
this situation. The answer to that is no, Hermione, like
her rabbit, just dies. She's clearly upset. How about we
just shut up and let the girl more.

Speaker 4 (30:32):
Now, Like.

Speaker 1 (30:34):
When I was thirteen, I probably wouldn't have let it
go either, At thirty five, I would. I will let
it go, and I won't say anything to you, but
I want to really badly. I will want I will
want to ask all those questions to be like, are
you sure now? I also don't think that Hermione's doing
it to be mean to Lavender. I think that she

(30:55):
is doing it to kind of call out Sybil on
the Sibyl. Yeah. Sure, it comes off as very very
mean and you know, yeah.

Speaker 4 (31:09):
Yeah, but all her maturity, there are some moments where
Hermione does lack that emotional social intelligence and she's not
reading the room very well right now. Yeah, but this
is not the time for this conversation at.

Speaker 2 (31:25):
All, which is why she's a perfect raven Claw, because
sometimes your logical brain takes over your emotional brain. Yeah,
that happens to me a lot. The amount of times
people have have called me unfeeling is off the charts.
So get to know me, friends.

Speaker 1 (31:44):
It would be really interesting to see Padma Patil in
the situation, like in the room with them, I guess,
because I would really have liked to have seen Padma
to like get over on her money side and be like, yeah,
but like you didn't. Why were you dreading your rabbit dying?
Like she has a point.

Speaker 2 (32:03):
Yeah, I mean, I think it's interesting that the two
of them don't really hang out together at Hogwarts at
all anyway. And I know it's because they're in different
houses and they have different friends, but they're twins, and
I feel like we almost never see them together.

Speaker 4 (32:16):
Except in the movies, which makes me crazy that they
put them in the same house in the movies. And yeah,
every time I see it, I want to scream because
I'm like, that's all right.

Speaker 2 (32:24):
So you know, maybe they'll correct that in the TV
show that I'm not gonna watch. Maybe we'll see, we'll see. Anyway,
let's move on from Trelawney and talk a little bit
about Bianca's favorite character ever, Hagrid. So Ron is lamenting

(32:44):
that they've been like Hagrid has lost all of his
nerve after what happened with Buckbeek and Draco, which don't
get me started on that, but apparently they've been learning
about flobberworms for several weeks now, and I don't want
to give her any credit. But since it is the
opposite book of Prisoner, let's talk for a second about

(33:07):
order and if Hagrid really is able to just sort
of skirt any sort of curriculum or like actually teaching
the kids anything, doesn't umbrage have the tiniest of points
like the like the the again, like a nugget of legitimacy,
like like a sand size nugget. Come on, we gotta

(33:28):
give we gotta give her that.

Speaker 1 (33:29):
It's more than a sand. It's more. I think she
has a boulder of like a small boulder, but still
a boulder.

Speaker 2 (33:41):
That reminds me so much. That reminds me so much.
You have I'm laughing, And it was like I don't
even remember how long ago, but like a police station
or something posted a photo and they were like a
boulder the size of a small boulder felder like rolled
down the side of the mountain is blocking the road

(34:02):
or something I can't even quote.

Speaker 1 (34:04):
It was.

Speaker 2 (34:06):
Amazing, amazing anyway, that's what it just reminded me of.
Why I was giggling. I'm sorry, the boulder the size
of a small boulder.

Speaker 4 (34:17):
Away.

Speaker 1 (34:17):
I'm sorry. I think the Umbergs has a point about curriculum,
about what they need to be learning, and like I
like Snape even brings it up about about Lupin's classes.
Whatever he said when he sets in for for looping
uh in this book about you haven't learned about this yet. Now.
Granted he's talking about were wolves and we know that

(34:38):
he has an ulterior motive there, But my issue more
with Hagrid on his teaching style here is that he
came out so strong with the hippogriff and like so cool.
It is one of the coolest creatures that we see
in the books. Totally would want to get to know
one and and and you learn about them. But he

(35:03):
mouthfully was being an idiot when he got hurt. But
it is still the professor's job to ensure that the
students are protected and that they have they have a
handle on the whole situation. And it is in perfect
contrast to what we see Loopin doing when Lupin is
bringing in these dark creatures that are dangerous but are

(35:27):
Whenever you all read about loopen bringing in Grendy Low's
and Kappa's and Red all these things. Did anyone ever go, oh,
Lupin's not gonna be able to handle that. No, because
he's a fully qualified wizard that can handle himself and
keep control over a class things that Haggard has proven
proven time and time again that he cannot do, and

(35:49):
he's not really interested in doing it.

Speaker 2 (35:51):
Do you think that's because of his lack of training
or just because he's Hagrid.

Speaker 1 (35:56):
I think it's because he's Hagrid. But the dangerous part
of that is that if something, even if he is
paying attention and he's seeing things happen, he's he doesn't
have a proper wand and he what protection can he
provide other than him being half giant, which is which
is a great protection if he can get there, But
you've gotta get there.

Speaker 2 (36:18):
The one thing that that depends on who you ask.
That depends on who you ask. I think it was
Alison that I got in a fight with about. But
I think Hagrid's wand has been fully put together, mended
by the Oh great, everybody's nodding. He got that, Yeah,
he mended by the elder One and lives inside done umbrella. Yes,
so I hear you.

Speaker 1 (36:36):
But he doesn't have it with him and he's not
he doesn't really know how to do it. He says
in the first book that he he's not that great
with magic.

Speaker 4 (36:44):
Right. I'm going to push back though, and say that
that that situation with Malvoy is not completely Haggard's fault,
and it's not totally saying that Hagard can't control the
class because Malfoy's just a jacket and he was going
to do what he was going to do regardless. And
I feel like, yes, there's a little bit more respect

(37:07):
for Lupin and he wouldn't back that way in Lupin's class,
and that they do take advantage of Hagrid because they
don't have any respect for Hagrid. But at the same time,
you can't really say that it happened because because solely
because Hagrid's not trained and he doesn't have a lot.

Speaker 1 (37:26):
I agree with all of that, what it.

Speaker 4 (37:30):
Never happens, but there's a button. But I knew it.

Speaker 1 (37:36):
If if Malfoy was the same amount of jacket, if
it was the same amount of dangerous creature and it
was Lupin instead of Hagrid, Malfoy doesn't get hurt.

Speaker 2 (37:46):
But that's because Lupin would push back harder than Hagrid,
and maybe that's what you're getting at.

Speaker 1 (37:51):
Yeah, thank you, because he's more of.

Speaker 2 (37:53):
A responsible adult.

Speaker 3 (37:54):
Okay, sure, I feel like Hagrid is like a pushover,
you know a bit. And obviously after what happened with
buff Beeek, he definitely got affected, like his confidence. He's
already like so nervous of being a professor that I
feel like after that, you know, attack and everything, it's like,
oh shoot, like now what am I gonna do. I'm
gonna get in trouble and you know, my boy's dad's

(38:15):
gonna hear about this, and yeah, I just feel like
it just affected like his confidence so much that he's like,
you know what, I'm just gonna play it safe and
we're just gonna do this, which is like, you know,
not fair to the students, because of course you still
need to learn something and maybe just doing flobber worms
like for weeks and weeks isn't very helpful, but it's
like the safe route, and he's probably like I just
don't want to like get in trouble or but I

(38:38):
could see both sides.

Speaker 1 (38:39):
Yeah, I think it's I think This is a lot
of confidence stuff too, that he wanted to show the
students something very cool, and he did, and then it
went wrong because he's not responsible enough to do this,
and now he has to like revert back to flobber worms,
and then like doesn't learn his lesson because next year

(39:02):
he brings these screws.

Speaker 2 (39:04):
Out, the animals that he breeded himself. He breeded the screws.
Remember he created that that species illegally braided those crews
illegally braided.

Speaker 4 (39:22):
Correct. Yeah, I mean I get him wanting to play safe,
but like the flower worm. The whole flower worm thing
baffles me because why what are they actually? What is
their function? What are they for?

Speaker 2 (39:35):
Like why you food change?

Speaker 1 (39:37):
Oh?

Speaker 4 (39:38):
Okay, I don't know.

Speaker 2 (39:39):
I say that about like ticks, Why do we need
to have tis?

Speaker 4 (39:42):
Can't we? Just can't we? Just why?

Speaker 2 (39:48):
I mean, I feel like mosquitoes have a more important
function than ticks, but maybe not. I don't know. Mosquitoes
kill more humans than any other creature on earth exactly exactly. Yeah,

(40:08):
I don't know. I don't know what do they even do?
What does fantastic bees say about the flabber worm? Next question,
let's check the lexicon. Let's see flabber worm. Probably nothing.
It's a ten inch toothless brown worm classified as boring
by the Ministry of Magic. No, that's not true. That's
probably I forgot to type in minus ai in my

(40:29):
Google search. Here we go. Okay. According to lexicon, the
flobber worm is a ten inch toothless brown worm which
eats vegetation, preferring lettuce. The mucus exuded by the flabber
worm is sometimes used to thicken potions. So basically they
are just little flabberworms. They're little worms that are exploited
for potions. That's it. So they're like probably so they're

(40:53):
like corn.

Speaker 4 (40:54):
Starch butt worms.

Speaker 1 (41:00):
Yeah, sure you want to if you would like to
make a potion gravy.

Speaker 4 (41:04):
There, okay, got it, squeeze.

Speaker 2 (41:11):
Yeah, I'll stick to the corn starch. Thanks me too. Yeah. Well, Josh,
you may as well just take it from here, because
this is like my least favorite part of the chapter,
Like who cares like blah blah quidditch.

Speaker 1 (41:27):
Yeah, mak, I would love to know your thoughts on
quiddage here since my other hosts don't care for just left.

Speaker 2 (41:39):
Just like ten minutes.

Speaker 4 (41:44):
No, my allergies. My nose was running. I'm so sorry.
My nose was running, and I didn't think you guys
would want to see that.

Speaker 1 (41:51):
You don't, you're allergic, You're allergic to.

Speaker 4 (41:55):
Yes, that's what it is. That's exactly it, all right.

Speaker 1 (41:57):
The only the only thing that I need that would
like to say is that the thing that I don't
that I dislike about quotas of the most is exactly
what Oliver says here. He says that they have never
lost a match that Harry has been in because he
has caught the snitch. Every time a quaff of scorer
is worth ten, a snitch is worth one hundred and fifty.

(42:18):
It's unbelievable. I've talked about strategy, I've talked about all
this kind of stuff before. It makes more sense to
have everybody on the pitch going after the snitch all
at the same time, because whatever this does get corrected,
not like corrected like with the rules, but at least
with I guess different strategies along the way. When and

(42:42):
Goblet of fire Crumb loses the World Cup match even
after he caught the snitch, so like it does go
about like having a really good having excellent excellent chasers
be able to score unbelievably before a snitch gets caught.
But you have to score sixteen times before the snitch

(43:02):
gets caught to be able to win. It's unbelievably stupid.
It also gets fixed too. I think I think in
Order of the Phoenix, after Harry is banned and Jenny
is the seeker, I think she catches the snitch. But
they ended up losing because Ron has been such a
poor keeper that I believe it's huffle Puff, maybe Ravenclaw.

(43:26):
They still won the match even though, But but it
says that he that by Jenny catching the snitch, they
didn't lose by like too many or whatever like that.

Speaker 2 (43:34):
Oh yeah, that's right, because he was doing.

Speaker 1 (43:37):
Is that The most annoying part about it is that.

Speaker 3 (43:40):
The snitch so funny that you say that, because that's
actually like a discussion I had with my husband and
he thinks the same thing. He's like, it's just so
crazy that you catching the snitch. It's like automatically one
hundred and fifty points. It's like the game would just
end then, like, yeah, in a second, they cannot have his.

Speaker 1 (43:55):
Number, because I would love to have someone to talk
to about this. Yeah, sure, the only the only other
person that kids like crap about what I have to
say about about quiddage. And I don't even remember her name.
Cat it was it was that woman that gave the
talk at Chestnut Hill a few years ago that stayed
with you all. But I can't remember her name now. Yes, yeah,

(44:19):
I talked to her way too long after she gave
a seminar. I was like, hello, I'm Josh, and I'm
going to be your friend for twenty minutes.

Speaker 3 (44:29):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (44:30):
And also Alison, but only if you're talking about Oliver.

Speaker 1 (44:32):
Well yeah, right, Well.

Speaker 4 (44:34):
She does make an appearance, so she'd be excited about that.
Him and his uh, his passion, we'll say, and which
I mean. I have to appreciate Oliver's passion here and
his desperation to win, because I think he realizes that
in the off chance that he doesn't go pro that

(44:55):
this is it, Like that's it, Like you play your
last game, you don't win, that's it for you. I
can appreciate that well.

Speaker 1 (45:03):
And he also knows and and he says in this
chapter we should have won the last two years. The
reason that we didn't win the last two years is
because Harry was in the hospital wing, and I guess
they did. They get canceled and Goblet of Fire, not
Goblet of Fire Chamber. They got canceled in chamber, right,
And I think they were going into the last match

(45:24):
whenever it got when when Hermione got attacked and they
canceled that match and things like that, So like he
knows that he should have won, and now he's get
this is this is his last chance, and it was.
He was so close.

Speaker 2 (45:36):
That's why Oliver comes back for the battle at the
Battle of Hogwarts and Deathly Allos because he has a
very personal reason to hate Lord Voldemore, because he didn't
have quidditch trophies because of him.

Speaker 4 (45:49):
It's his fault.

Speaker 1 (45:50):
I love that.

Speaker 3 (45:51):
Yeah, of course.

Speaker 2 (45:54):
Everything is his fault. Yeah, I mean to be real,
not everything, oh my most things, most things. Yeah, all right.
So I think this is the point where the book
transitions from September to October, somewhere around here whatever. They
are sitting in the common room. I think, I swear

(46:16):
I just read this chapter. But it's like you start
talking about stuff and like fuel miff flies out of
your head. But they're all sitting around, Yeah, they're all
sitting around, and there's there's a quote that says Crookshanks
slowly chewed up the spider, his yellow eyes fixed insolently, insolently,
insolently whatever, insolently, thanks on run. And I just needed

(46:41):
to call it out because I live for Crookshanks and
his sass. He knows exactly what he's doing. And I
love this cat. I love this cat.

Speaker 1 (46:51):
You love this part cat, love this cat. Spiders like
this the thing great? I love cats. Not a dog
person love cats.

Speaker 2 (47:04):
I to be fair. My my calico Narcissa, will eat
any bug. I've never seen her eat a spider large
enough that she actually choose it. Okay, It's usually just
like like a couple of licks and like done.

Speaker 1 (47:24):
Okay.

Speaker 2 (47:26):
But now that she's almost yeah she's almost sixteen, she
doesn't eat too many bugs anymore because she sleeps all day.
You've never seen your cat eat a bug? Yes, I
don't believe.

Speaker 1 (47:38):
That, Okay, really, cat, I have I have. I have
lied to you before. I am not lying to you
about my about knowing if my cats eat But yeah,
I didn't know, did not know that cats eat ate spiders?
It makes sense, I guess.

Speaker 2 (47:57):
Yeah, your cat is like, you've never seen your cat
like track a bug on the floor, and then like.

Speaker 1 (48:04):
Yeah, not as spoder.

Speaker 4 (48:05):
How do you know it wasn't a spider? Did you
see it?

Speaker 1 (48:07):
Six legs?

Speaker 2 (48:08):
Now?

Speaker 4 (48:08):
Like, how do you know? Did you see it?

Speaker 1 (48:10):
Did you go? Count them? Every time?

Speaker 2 (48:15):
He has an X ray machine at home specifically so
he can just check to see what the the cat eat. Well, see,
your cat eats bugs. So spiders are different family, but
the same family anyway.

Speaker 1 (48:26):
Anyway, The more important part is that Kirk Shanks knows
enough about Ron to be like, hey.

Speaker 4 (48:34):
You like this, and he knows exactly what he's doing.

Speaker 1 (48:38):
Can't wait to get hold of your rat?

Speaker 2 (48:40):
Yeah, well, speaking of that rat, isn't there something else
that Pettigrew should be doing aside from like sleeping and
just hanging around? I mean the answer is probably know,
But I was thinking about it this time. I know
he's I know he says that he hold up or
maybe Lupin says it, or someone someone says that he

(49:01):
hold up with a wizarding family so that he would
be the first one to hear the news. But if
he is trying to, like, is that all he's doing?
Because I feel like at the end of the book,
the opportunities just line up too easily for him.

Speaker 1 (49:16):
I don't know.

Speaker 2 (49:17):
I just feel like, shouldn't he be doing something else
as well? Like, I don't know, it just feels like
a missed opportunity. Is that silly?

Speaker 1 (49:27):
I'm struggling to find the other thing that he should
be doing now he should be an Azkaban. But okay,
I don't know what you want him to be doing,
because like he has no aspirations to do anything other
than live, And at this point I guess I guess
he thinks that this is his best chance of surviving,

(49:49):
which is kind of ridiculous.

Speaker 2 (49:52):
I mean, if that's the case, then why does he
go I mean, his motivations at the end of the
book line up with that. But also don't like, why
would he go looking for Lord Voltimore if all he
wants to do is live, Because then he could just
run off as a rat and like live as a
rat in the forest for the rest of his life.

Speaker 3 (50:14):
He feels like Voldemort could give him like the ultimate
protection if he run after him, and he just feels like,
I can't live or survive on my own, so I
gotta do this. He's just such a he's such a coward, Like, yeah, I.

Speaker 1 (50:30):
Mean, what if what if he just what if he
knows that his secret as a rat is out and
he doesn't want to live as a rat anymore, and
the only way for him to come back as a
human is to go find Baltimore, because that's the only
that's the only way that he can come out of hiding.
Is that if Voldemort is back in power. Now grant

(50:51):
that's giving as giving Peter a lot of ambition that
I don't think that he has.

Speaker 2 (50:56):
Do you think that's the only way he could come
out of hiding?

Speaker 1 (50:59):
I mean, what if is dead, If Sirius died and
he came out of hiding, what's his story to the ministry?
Because he knows that serious if he was like they
talk about this at the end of the at the
end of the book, like if he were innocent, then
he wouldn't have had to blow himself up. And then
like if Sirius is an Azkaban and he's innocent, then

(51:23):
he could just come back out then then you know
what I mean, Like it's yeah, it's usually the same reasoning.
It's the same reason later after this book as it
lived before the book or after Phoenix.

Speaker 2 (51:36):
I know the answer is plot. But Peter could have
just been like a smarter gryffindor here and just like
gotten on a boat as a rat and gone to
America and then transfigured back into a person and like
lived his.

Speaker 1 (51:49):
Life, right, I mean, we also.

Speaker 2 (51:53):
Here's about Lord Baltimore.

Speaker 1 (51:54):
We you know, we also have a seventeen year old
girl that transfigures on to break in the Green Gods
at the end, So like he could go to America
or Australia or wherever fond a wizard plastic surgeon baraboom,

(52:14):
new face.

Speaker 2 (52:16):
I mean I did say I knew the answer was plot.
I mean, so yeah, yeah. Do you think that that
in this scene or just in general, krook Shanks knows
that Skabbers was a human or simply that something is off,
because clearly, and there's so much evidence that Krookshanks suspects Scabbers.

(52:37):
I know, I don't know if Krookshanks has hooked up
with Sirius yet. I don't think that has happened quite yet.
I think that happens in the second half of the book.
But as you mentioned, krook Shanks is half neasle so
an extraordinary intelligent cat. Do you think that do you
think that he can sense the humanoid part, like that

(52:59):
that rat is an animeagus or just something is strange
about that rat?

Speaker 4 (53:06):
Yes, his stort answer, Yes, I know. I feel like
there's a specific kind of magic that must radiate if
you're an animagus, and like animals pick up on that,
Like you know how they say animals can pick up
on spirits and different kinds of you know, entities or whatever.
Maybe they can pick up on specific types of magic.

(53:29):
And he can tell this is not your average garden rat.
He can tell that it's a person transformed into a rat,
but or not necessarily even a person. He just I
think he can tell there's something different.

Speaker 2 (53:40):
Can sense the magic of the rata.

Speaker 3 (53:42):
I agree, I don't think that necessarily knows that like
he's a human, but that there's just like something off
about him, and like he just maybe he feels like
I feel like you don't want to get caught like
by me, or like just like something he just like
can't put his Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1 (54:00):
I so I'll answer based on what it seems like.
Everyone is under the assumption that Peter never transforms back
to a human. Ever, he's always a rat here. If
he is always a rat, then no, I don't think
that kriok Shanks knows that he is actually an animatous
I think that I think that krik Shank just knows

(54:21):
that something's weird about it, or it's just that it's
a rat and he wants to go get it. I
do think that we're missing a piece of information, though
we know that I don't have I don't have any
receipts for this. Get off my back. I don't think
that it's out of the I don't think that it's
like out of the question that when no one is

(54:44):
in the dormitory when classes are going on, Scabber's doesn't
have to be with Ron that Peter transforms back into
a human, hangs out in the dormitory, and kriok Shanks
sees him being a human. I mean to put yourselves
in put all four of us, put yourself in that situation.
You have to be an animal to hod you have

(55:06):
no reason to hode anymore. I'm going back to being
a human for an hour and then transform him back.
So we can't put that off.

Speaker 2 (55:16):
I think we maybe can, only because only because if
you subscribe to how the movie portrays animegas and imagine
and a megie and imagine, I never say it right
because like in the fifth film, Siri is transformed to

(55:37):
dog to human and like wraps this big coat around himself.
And I've always been under depression that I know Bianca
and I disagree on this, but that when you transform
in and out of an animal like you, you keep
you keep your clothes. But I also feel like Peter's clothes.

(55:57):
He's been a rat for so long. I just feel
like he'd be like in basically nothing, and I don't
know if he'd want to sit and like ratty like
you hanging out in the dormitory. And all I can
think is that he's hanging out in.

Speaker 4 (56:10):
The so like and is it ratty clothes?

Speaker 2 (56:16):
I see what I mean, I mean, out of his
Runnie closed. But yeah, I don't know, I don't know.
I think, I think. I feel like there's something at
the end of the book too, where Lupan says like, well,
you've been living as a rat for twelve years or something.

Speaker 4 (56:30):
Yeah, Like I feel like when they turn him back
into person, that's the first time he's been a person.
In however many years.

Speaker 1 (56:40):
Yeah, I think that we're led that way. I just
don't think that, you know, I just don't think that
we know that for sure. Just I'm just thrown out
with another possibility.

Speaker 2 (56:50):
Yeah, I mean, that's that's fair. That's fair.

Speaker 4 (56:54):
While we're here, can we just talk about I know
it's completely irrelevant to this chapter, but the fact that
he's even allowed to be there, it's always been baffling
to me because in their Hogwarts Welcome Under it clearly
says you can bring an l a cat or toad.
Scabbers is none of the above, So why is he
even allowed to be there? I think he really lucked

(57:15):
out that he's even in the castle at all, and
that has I mean, nothing really is to do with anything,
unless you want to look at if he wasn't allowed in,
then a lot of this wouldn't have happened. But yeah, I.

Speaker 2 (57:26):
Think that's probably a plot oopsy on behalf of the author.

Speaker 4 (57:30):
Well I caught it.

Speaker 2 (57:33):
Oh, oh, darling, you are not the first, the only,
or the last. Fear I fear, But I like in
this situation that Ron is the one who has the
right read on Krookshanks and Harmione doesn't, which is such
a nice change because we see Krikshanks constantly going after Skabbers,

(57:55):
and Ron is like Crookshanks has it out for my
rat and he's like, no, no, no, just case rats, Ronald,
don't be silly. No Ron, Ron knows. I mean he
doesn't know that he knows, but he knows. And I
like giving Ron the uh, I like giving him the
leg up.

Speaker 4 (58:14):
Good job, Ron, Yeah.

Speaker 3 (58:16):
Yeah, I feel like Hermione always you know, wants to
be right. And it's like when finally Ron has his wins.
Sometimes yeah, exactly.

Speaker 2 (58:24):
He deserves the wins.

Speaker 3 (58:25):
Yeah, he deserves.

Speaker 2 (58:27):
He deserves the ones. But so the uh the they
see the first advertisement or whatever for the first Hogs
made weekend and Ron somehow convinces Harry that he needs
to ask McGonagall, which.

Speaker 1 (58:43):
Good luck, Okay, yeah, good luck.

Speaker 4 (58:48):
See I mean I have to have to agree. Okay.
This is where my reckless grubendor comes into play, because
I would ask. I would have been like, hey, I
mean the worst that you can say is no, I'm
gonna go ask. So, I mean, what's really going to happen?
What does he have to lose? Ask her? I kind
of agree with Ron here.

Speaker 1 (59:05):
It's not that he has anything to lose, it's just
such an act of desperation. I guess is more of
of where I'm at with it. I don't think that
it's wrong to ask we everyone knew the answer though.

Speaker 4 (59:18):
But did we?

Speaker 1 (59:18):
Though?

Speaker 4 (59:19):
Did we?

Speaker 1 (59:20):
We? Sure did?

Speaker 4 (59:22):
There's not like some small tent.

Speaker 1 (59:25):
Okay, I am a I am more sure that this
woman was going to say no, that I am about Bigfoot?

Speaker 4 (59:32):
So what if okay, what if serious was not on
the loose? Would they still? Would he still have said?

Speaker 1 (59:39):
No?

Speaker 2 (59:40):
Yes?

Speaker 4 (59:41):
She was like, Is that because she she like she
literally cannot give him permission because of the magical whatever
that's on the parents and guardians had to give permission.
Or is this an ethical thing where she doesn't feel
that it's right for her to tell him, yes, he
can go with his parents and parents didn't say.

Speaker 1 (01:00:01):
So, sewmanie. I would like to introduce you to Minerva McGonagall.
It is ethics. It is only ethics because this doesn't
have to do with quiddage. The only with McGonagall is quick.

Speaker 3 (01:00:16):
That's where she rules a little bit.

Speaker 4 (01:00:18):
Yeah, I mean, I don't know because I kind of
feel like if Sirius was not on the loose, and
there wasn't really there weren't dementors around, there wasn't really
any real threat to Harry. I feel like there could
have been a chance, however small, that she might have
a little bit of mercy on Harry, knowing his home situation,

(01:00:40):
and give him permission for him to go.

Speaker 2 (01:00:43):
Well, the question, I mean, the question also then beggs
is do they have permission slips only because of serious
would they typically have permission slips? Or woul they just
go because Hawksmaide is attached to Hogwarts like it? They're
right there, you know.

Speaker 1 (01:01:00):
I guess we don't know that, do we? Now? Do
we find out in Chamber of Secrets that third years
are allowed maybe the maybe before now it was just
the rule third years are allowed to go, and now
because Harris is out, it takes a permission slip to go.
So that's fair. I like, I really do like that.

(01:01:22):
So let's say permission slips were always required. McGonagall would
have never let Harry go if there weren't. If there
wasn't a signed paper, Dumbledore would though, I think Dumbledore
would break the rule for Harry obviously, So if serious
were not on the if serious, we're not on the loose,
so we're not the mentors, and permission slips were always required.

(01:01:46):
I think Dumbledore would allow Harry to go. He would
over rule McGonagall.

Speaker 2 (01:01:51):
I don't know that Dumbledore. Oh this is so controversial.
I don't know that Dumbledore would care enough about Harry
to make sure he gets to go to the village.

Speaker 1 (01:02:00):
I actually don't think that's controversial. I think whenever I
was saying that, I was like, maybe he wouldn't even
get involved in any of this mess anyway.

Speaker 2 (01:02:09):
Yeah, yeah, I mean listen, I would have forged it.

Speaker 4 (01:02:15):
Yeah, that would have been my first step, Like this
was this was not this was.

Speaker 3 (01:02:20):
Dean offered, right, offer forge it for him.

Speaker 1 (01:02:24):
Yeah, but at that point it doesn't make sense. It
doesn't make sense to forge it after he's already asked menonical.
That's why your first step needs.

Speaker 4 (01:02:32):
To be that's what you should have done first before anything.

Speaker 1 (01:02:35):
As a note to all the children listening to the podcast,
the first instinct should be to lie.

Speaker 2 (01:02:44):
Yeah, circumnavigate, which means to go around the authority in
this situation.

Speaker 1 (01:02:51):
Yeah, we even Okay, So I don't think that the
parchment has any magic on it sea every I think
I think, I think it's really I think it I
think it should. I think it's really smart. Nothing I
think that should. I mean just like.

Speaker 4 (01:03:08):
In the like.

Speaker 1 (01:03:09):
Administrative thing like that makes a lot of sense. That'd
be really cool. Now, I do wonder if it is
possible to do something like a rebellio to see if
a signature was made. I guess like with bad intent.
I don't know, like I don't even almost like a

(01:03:29):
truth telling.

Speaker 2 (01:03:30):
Yeah, maybe the notaries of the wizarding world can use
revellio to determine the signature.

Speaker 4 (01:03:37):
I mean in this case, they wouldn't have anything to
compare it to because they wouldn't have had like signature
or what is her name? Petunia's what's her name? That woman?
That's right, the woman you know? And right?

Speaker 2 (01:03:52):
What what would they have forged? They could have written
any there? I mean when I sometimes when I sign
things at work, because I don't my signature is messy,
I just ride a kN and M so like they
could have just like put a fancy VD on it.

Speaker 1 (01:04:06):
But I get that's kind of what I'm talking more
with like using some type of charm or some type
of whatever to see if it was placed with with
ill intent or were intent to falsify or or whatever
that way. It's like language. Now the person, the person
that wrote this name wasn't the person, you know what

(01:04:28):
I mean?

Speaker 4 (01:04:28):
But then they would have the track who actually signed it.

Speaker 1 (01:04:31):
Yeah, but like that would require special people resources, and
like if Vernon signed this saying he's doing it with
a ballpoint pen, that he bought it. In general, so.

Speaker 2 (01:04:44):
The Wizarding World and Hogwarts doesn't give two f's about
truth or reality or what is fair or correct or
any of those things.

Speaker 1 (01:04:55):
And we know that because ar serum is never used.

Speaker 2 (01:04:57):
Yeah, what do they care? What do they care? What
do they care? But they're like, don't worry, Harry, We'll
bring you back tons of candy. And Harry's like, yeah, gee, thanks,
that makes me feel so much better. It would make
me feel better. I'll the candy. I'll the candy.

Speaker 4 (01:05:12):
I mean like, yeah, I guess in the moment though,
you're kind of like, oh, that's nice and all, but
I wish I was there to get it myself. And
then here comes Percy and opening his big mouth and
carrying on about oh it's really not that great, and
you know it's fine, Harry, it's overrated. Like this is

(01:05:32):
not just the fact that they're going to hogs Me,
Like this is the fact that this is the first
time their class is going to hogs Me and all
his peers will be there. This is the first experience
that they'll never get again when he has to miss
out on this with everybody. And Percy's been there, so
he doesn't get that. But here he comes run in

(01:05:53):
his mouth and it just makes me roll mass it's all.
That's my point here. He should have just kept his
mouth shut. It can't help.

Speaker 1 (01:05:59):
It's very It's very Percy though, because he thinks that
he's helping. He's like he's like trying to downplay like
it's at a big deals whatever. Uh, you know, like
the Sweet Shop it's really great and Zonko's it's like
really dangerous and not really cool, I guess, but like
Streaking Shack, you should always go there. But don't worry
about it, man, Like don't worry. So it's like whatever,

(01:06:22):
Like it's so persy, you know what.

Speaker 2 (01:06:24):
Like I was just talking with someone about they're they're
going on a cruise and they're gonna hit like a
couple places in the Mediterranean. I was like, oh, I
was like, you're really gonna like I think. I was like,
Greece is really cool, like except for this and that
and this and that and that, but like the islands
are you know, I can relate to Percy here. I

(01:06:45):
get it. Sometimes you're just you're just trying to share
your own experience and you then you well, Percy doesn't realize,
but like real people realize, Oh maybe I'm being unhelpful
and maybe a little mean. Yeah yeah. And then I
said to them, I was like, you're gonna have a
great time that the food is really good. I did.
I felt really bad about it.

Speaker 1 (01:07:04):
The food was really good. The experience is really lame.

Speaker 4 (01:07:08):
Listen.

Speaker 2 (01:07:08):
I didn't like Athens, Okay, I didn't like it. It
was smelly and dirty and gross. Yeah, the islands were amazing.
I recommend the islands. That's awful anyway, So everybody leaves
for Hogsmeade, and Harry is just like, poor Harry around

(01:07:28):
the castle by himself. Please, poor Harry. If I went
to that school and I like got to walk around
and be by myself for a few hours.

Speaker 6 (01:07:37):
Bless personally, but oh yeah, I don't know that looking
at everything on a Tuesday, Yeah, I.

Speaker 2 (01:07:48):
Don't know what I would do, probably look around to see, like,
I know, I don't.

Speaker 1 (01:07:52):
Know a portrait. You know, they found like the most
interesting portrait.

Speaker 2 (01:07:57):
It's October, so the weather is still sort of night
in Scotland and October cold but.

Speaker 4 (01:08:03):
Rainy, mayy hang out by the lake, look through the giants.

Speaker 2 (01:08:06):
Or just like have a snooze by the fire in
the common room.

Speaker 4 (01:08:10):
Ooh, a nap I like that. Yeah, yeah, I love
a nap.

Speaker 2 (01:08:15):
Yeah, I love a good nap.

Speaker 4 (01:08:17):
See, but Harry, I suspect, does not love a good nap.

Speaker 2 (01:08:22):
I mean no, because he's coming around the castle.

Speaker 4 (01:08:24):
Like do you think that because earlier Ron had brought
up the invisibility cloak, so I know they were all
lining up to go out the door. I Pilch was
essentially searching everybody, checking making sure nobody was trying to
sneak out. But do you think that he could have
gotten away with putting on the invisibility slipping between Ron
and Hermione, Like Hermione goes, Harry runs out the door

(01:08:47):
and then there's Ron Filch Or do you think by
the time they got to the gates, the dementors would
have been able to sense that there's something else there.

Speaker 1 (01:08:58):
Absolutely, yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:08:59):
I mean, I think Hermione's point about don't you dare
use the cloak with the dementors is the right thing,
and I think Harry really doesn't even remotely consider it
because of that conversation he's about to have with Lupin
about dementors. He is terrified of dementors and he doesn't
want to have to go through that at all. And

(01:09:22):
so I think this is actually the one time that
Harry listens to Hermione, not because Hermione makes a suggestion,
but because he hears it and he goes, yeah, you
know what, You're right. I don't want to experience that
again because I'm terrified of them. I don't want to
hear my mom screaming I'm going to take your advice
and stay in the castle.

Speaker 4 (01:09:40):
What is it that triggers the dementors though, Because if
they're all walking by, and I mean, I assume they
probably have what patternis is or something keeping them at
bay or something like that while the students go by
into hogs Mean, and I know that they're around Hoggs Mean,
But what triggers the dementor to come come after you.

Speaker 2 (01:10:01):
I mean, think about the cabin, you know, the compartment
on the train at the beginning, Like they were all
in there and the only people that were affected were
Harry and Jenny, you.

Speaker 4 (01:10:10):
Know, because there's something about your essence that it's attracted to,
and would it have been able to since Harry's essence
under the clue.

Speaker 1 (01:10:18):
I mean, it's not really even about that. I mean,
dementswords are blonde one like they can't see anyway. The
invisibility cloak does nothing as far as the de mentors concerned.

Speaker 4 (01:10:28):
Right, Yeah, that's more for hiding from the teachers.

Speaker 1 (01:10:32):
Yeah, but like I get the more important part isn't
like what the de mentors can sense the students coming through.
It's the de mentors are over the exiting students. So
like as we saw on the on the compartment, everyone
was affected, but Harry lost it, right, Harry passed up
like did all this stuff, and so like that's what

(01:10:54):
I think. It's what Cat was kind of pointing to,
is like if Harry is leaving and the dements words
are affected him anyway, he's not going to be able
to leave.

Speaker 2 (01:11:05):
H Okay, You're right, related but unrelated. Related but unrelated.
I saw a video online recently and I need to
bring it up. And this is actually sort of the
perfect time someone was talking about and it was like
a podcast. It was two bros. I'm sorry, I don't
remember who it is, but they were saying that they

(01:11:27):
were talking about festerls and dementors and how when Harry
experiences I'm gonna wow, I'm gonna screw this up.

Speaker 1 (01:11:40):
Okay.

Speaker 2 (01:11:41):
At the beginning of this book, when Harry experiences the Dementors,
he hears his mother screaming, right, But Harry doesn't see
a festols until after Cedric dies because he didn't register,
like he wasn't old enough to register his mother's death.
So when he experiences the dements, it's not his memory

(01:12:03):
that is remembering his mother and hearing the scream. It
is Voldemort's memory.

Speaker 1 (01:12:09):
Right.

Speaker 2 (01:12:10):
Oh great? Is that just common knowledge? Cool?

Speaker 1 (01:12:12):
I think it's I think it's common a little more knowledge.

Speaker 2 (01:12:15):
Maybe that it was really me.

Speaker 4 (01:12:20):
That was a new revelation for me here. I've never
you never consider it that.

Speaker 2 (01:12:26):
It's possible that we have talked about that in the
last thirteen years of the show. And I just don't remember,
but I thought it was very interesting and a total
you know, sidetrack.

Speaker 1 (01:12:35):
Yeah, it definitely could have been on an episode that
you weren't on, But I think I think it makes
the most sense, right because because of the festal were
the infestoral information there.

Speaker 2 (01:12:45):
It explains away the plot upsy of the whole does
you know?

Speaker 1 (01:12:49):
Well? And Harry doesn't realize that It's like on the
train the first time he experienced the mentor, he says
something about like who was streaming or whatever, and they
said that it was maybe him. I think I think
you they said it with him, but like that he
didn't hear his own scream. He was hearing his mom scream.
That he didn't know that it was his mom.

Speaker 2 (01:13:08):
Yeah. Well, and the reason that I brought that up
is because you know, Shamani was asking about how the
how do the dementors know? And yes, Lupin says that,
you know, Harry has experienced real horrors in his past
that his classmates couldn't even possibly think of, but he
also has a bit of Lord Voltimore in him, and
you have to assume, you have to assume that the

(01:13:29):
dementors who can read and eat souls are also getting
that energy from Harry, like because Trelawney can read that
energy and feel that energy. She says to Harry, oh,
you were born at the end of December, and He's like, no, yeap,
but she's reading Lord Voldemore's soul.

Speaker 1 (01:13:48):
True.

Speaker 2 (01:13:49):
I have to assume the Dementors can too. And so
Harry is like making a super super super super super
super super smart decision here, like for once, his tiny
little life smart decision.

Speaker 1 (01:14:02):
Well, and he's also heating Dumbledore's warning as well. At
the at the at the welcome feast, Dumbledore says the
mentors are not to be fooled by tricks or disguises
or even invisibility clothes.

Speaker 4 (01:14:15):
Oh yeah, that's right, he did say that.

Speaker 1 (01:14:18):
So, like you have all these things that are staring
at Harry in the face, going, don't do it. Just
don't do it, dude.

Speaker 2 (01:14:25):
Yeah, and thank goodness, dumbled. I'm Harry takes Dumbledore seriously
at this point still, you know.

Speaker 3 (01:14:32):
So yeah, I feel like he's like scared as is that.
It's like, I just don't want to make it even
worse if he were to do He's already breaking the
rules one and then second, Yeah, not.

Speaker 2 (01:14:44):
That Harry has problem breaking the rules, but I hear that.

Speaker 1 (01:14:47):
Well, let's true. You know, it's a really good point
of like what the de Mentors are drawn to, Like, well,
they're definitely drawn the souls, but like we're also told
that they have been given the command to kiss Serious
upon finding him. How does the de mentor know that

(01:15:07):
it's serious? I guess, Like, and then if if that's
the case, do the mentors know that Baltimort is inside
of Harry before anybody else does?

Speaker 2 (01:15:17):
Oh?

Speaker 4 (01:15:19):
Dan, do they have like a soul reader where well.

Speaker 1 (01:15:24):
Well, but like wouldn't that Wouldn't that then make sense?
Why at the end of at the end of this book,
not only do they go to kiss Serious, but they
go to kiss Harry as well, because like they're they
think that they're killing Baltimore.

Speaker 2 (01:15:38):
That's totally plausible, Huh.

Speaker 3 (01:15:41):
I like that totally.

Speaker 4 (01:15:44):
I wonder if like dementors get some kind of a
soul download where they're like they have the wizarding population,
there's like barcodes or something for great soul, go you
scan the person. Nope, that's not serious, not serious.

Speaker 1 (01:16:01):
Sniffing like the mark of the Dementor in time.

Speaker 2 (01:16:07):
Yeah, anyway, I'm entertained. I am fully entertained. You know what, though,
remember Josh, when I told you before we started recording
that I've been up since five thirty, and you're like,
about an hour into the episode, you're gonna start being
really tired. I am like, cannot stop yudo right now,
I'll feel it.

Speaker 1 (01:16:28):
I'm usually about two hours then, but my office starts
to get kind of hot about now, so like my
face gets redder. I'm like, okay, time to go.

Speaker 2 (01:16:37):
Yeah, we're getting there, We're getting there. We're getting there.
Our friend Colin has tracked Harry down because Harry like
it's like, oh, maybe he'll go to the common room.
He's not really sure what he's gonna do, and he
like runs into Colin and he's like, well, I'm oh, sorry, Colin,
I'm gonna go to the library. I like can't hang
out with her right now, sorry, which is just smart
because Colin totally will follow Harry wherever he goes. Anyway.

Speaker 4 (01:17:00):
I think, do you think he would just follow him
to his dorm uninvited? And like I mean yeah, I
mean yeah, I mean it is yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:17:08):
It's always dorm. And Colin's like a little tiny eleven
year old twelve.

Speaker 1 (01:17:12):
Year old, well, yeah he's eleven. No, he's twelve here
this second. Yeah. Yeah, but like you also have to
thank shalmany. Like he never sees Harry by himself. Harry's
always with somebody. So like if you have a fan,
if you are a megafan of someone that is always
around other people and now they're alone, you're.

Speaker 4 (01:17:34):
Like hello, oh stalker behavior number two. So you can't
just be like, hey, I'm gonna go take a nap
or I'm gonna go study or something and just go in.
And I wonder if their doors locked, Like can he
lock the door and like lock him out? Hmm.

Speaker 2 (01:17:51):
A nap would have been an equally good one because
he could be like, oh, I'm tired from quidditch practice, Colin,
I'm gonna go take a nap.

Speaker 3 (01:17:58):
Maybe maybe Harry thought like he's gonna think like I'm
lame being by myself here just sitting in my door,
and like let me do something.

Speaker 4 (01:18:05):
Maybe.

Speaker 2 (01:18:06):
Yeah, so instead of going to the library or maybe
he's going to the library, I don't know, but he's
walking around. He has this really weird encounter with Filch,
which is just I don't what is the point of
this encounter?

Speaker 1 (01:18:21):
I got nothing. I don't I don't even think this
is very gap to me, Like it just doesn't make
any sense.

Speaker 4 (01:18:28):
Filter's just weird.

Speaker 2 (01:18:31):
I was like, I read it and I wrote it down.
I was like, is there a reason that he has this?
Like what does Filter even say? They have a conversation
he says like what are you doing here?

Speaker 6 (01:18:43):
He's as about why he's mean, I mean, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:18:49):
Maybe it's like to make the reader feel more bad
for Harry, like just like he's just trying to mind
his own business. And maybe it's also to highlight the
difference of like how Filch is to Harry versus like
how Loopid is to Harry, like later on in the
chapter and when he's like, oh, what are you doing,
like in a caring way and like what are you doing?

Speaker 1 (01:19:10):
You know? I get I guess like there's there's also
the possibility of just like maybe maybe like because Lupin
is like at his office door, like watching the encounter happen,
and I wonder if I wonder if it's just like
a maybe just a segment to get over to loopen
just have something from common room to Lupin's encounter that.

(01:19:33):
The other kind of stupid one that that I have
is is Filch specifically calls out things that can be
purchased at Zonco's. And maybe it's just some like world
building stuff of like hey, these are fizzing wisby. Uh
is that what it is?

Speaker 2 (01:19:49):
Stink Pellett's belch powder and whizzing worms.

Speaker 1 (01:19:53):
I don't know, that's all. It doesn't make any sense
because like it's not even like Loop and comes to
his rescue or anything rot m M.

Speaker 4 (01:20:04):
Harry keeps walking and he just happens to pass Luken's office.

Speaker 1 (01:20:08):
Yeah that's right. Yeah, and it's just to.

Speaker 4 (01:20:12):
Show some of Philch's paranoia and bitterness. I don't know.

Speaker 2 (01:20:18):
Yeah, it's strange.

Speaker 1 (01:20:19):
It could it could just be like, well what you
were talking about, Kat, Like what would you do if
you were walking around Hogwarts? Like well, if if you
walk around Hogwarts, you know, with no real reason, you
could be questioned just for existing. I guess. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:20:36):
I feel like Filch just doesn't like Harry too, so
it's like some more He's like, what are you doing?

Speaker 2 (01:20:43):
I was gonna say, yeah, all right, so anyway, we
as as Shamani was just saying. You know, Harry walks
by Lupin's office and then was like, hey, bro, come
on in, let's have a chat. Let's have a cup
of tea. And uh, there's the line in the narration
that says he thought he meaning Harry thought for a

(01:21:04):
moment of telling Lupin about the dog he'd seen in
Magnolia Crescent, but decided not to. He didn't want Lupin
to think he was a coward, especially since Lupin already
seemed to think he couldn't cope with a Boggart. Very interesting,
and I love, you know, I love a good what
if question. So let's say in this exact moment, Harry's like, okay,

(01:21:25):
I'm not gonna say it. But then they have the
whole conversation about the Boggart. Harry could have said it then,
and Lupin would have been, oh, oh boy, that was
Sirius black.

Speaker 1 (01:21:37):
Bro.

Speaker 2 (01:21:38):
If you see that dog again, you should tell somebody,
or he keeps it to himself and like tells Dumbledore
or somebody else. I just wish Harry. I don't know
it would have changed anything, but I think it's very
I think it's an interesting question to ponder what would
have happened, you.

Speaker 1 (01:21:55):
Know, well, like Lupin, Lupin should have told Dumbledore about
the animation's way before he did, Like, like Lupin says
at the end of the book, like even whenever he
came to work here, he still never told Dumbledore about
serious whatever yet, So yeah, I just there were so

(01:22:21):
many opportunities. It's it has it has a lot to
do with Harry just not trusting adults, like Harry being
so kind of flabbergasted that an adult is honest with him.
And this is about the dementor question, you know, uh,
because Lupin doesn't deny that he didn't allow Harry to

(01:22:43):
do the Boggart and and Harry really thought that he
was going to so like especially at this point, like
Harry doesn't trust anyone because he's been proving his entire
life that he can't trust any adult especially, And so
I still think that we're in the outstage here, But
Lupin should have done more to build that trust up.

(01:23:06):
Like that's that Lupin doesn't get a pass from me
the way that I feel like that he does, and
the majority of fan circles or you know, comment boards
or podcasts because yes, Lupin's dealing with all a lot
of stuff, but Harry needed you and you were all

(01:23:26):
he had. You could have done more, you could have done.

Speaker 2 (01:23:29):
Something, Yeah, for sure. I mean it is nice that
Harry gets him sort of better late than never. I know,
he doesn't get him for too long because you know,
spoiler he dies what But it's oh no, But it
is nice that Harry finally has like and there are others,
of course, but Lupin is one of like the only

(01:23:52):
adults that actually fesses up to things and is like
transparent with Harry and honest with Harry. Arthur there's another one.
I think McGonagall in her own right is another one.

Speaker 1 (01:24:05):
Well, and and and so it's it's really it's particularly
great seeing like how this conversation plays out to because
the reason that Harry wants to thinks about talking about
the Black Dog is because Loopin has brought up divination.
He says, I dare say that you've had enough of
tea leaves so like thus far talking about divination, and

(01:24:29):
I think that's the spark of divination to the grim
and wanting to talk about that because like, okay, Loopin
is too I mean, this goes directly in contrast to
what I just said. But like I do feel like
Loopen bringing up divination and the tea leaves and things
like that is him trying to build a relationship, Yeah,

(01:24:51):
to try to get on Harry's level. And then that's
the that's the snap of Harry being like, well, maybe
I should bring up the dog, but you already think
I'm scared the cat. So yeah, yeah, do we ever
give any idea what Lupin's experience with divination is, because
like it seems like he has some insider information of

(01:25:13):
what's happening with Harry and divination now, like he doesn't
know anything about Sybil except for right now, like she
wasn't a professor of them. You know, we don't know
anything there.

Speaker 2 (01:25:25):
I only have to assume that it uh because McGonagall
says something like, oh predicted, she always predicts somebody's gonna die,
So I think it's sort of like a McGonagall gossiping.

Speaker 4 (01:25:38):
The teachers talking about it, and you.

Speaker 1 (01:25:41):
Know, yeah, I'm sorry, it's actually McGonagall. Because when he
says that about the tea leaves, Harry looks at him,
asks him how he knows about that, and then Lupin
says Professor McGonagall told me I needed two more lines.

Speaker 2 (01:25:56):
Sorry, yeah, no, it's okay, it's okay. I think there
are I think there are a lot of I agree
with you on Lupin, Josh, for the record, I think
he gets a lot of I think he's a great character.
I think the present day Lupin is like severely depressed,
like stuck in the body of a teenage person. Obviously

(01:26:17):
has his werewolf thing to deal with, and has lost
all his best friends and whatever whatever. But but I
do think in his heart he does the right things
for the right reasons, and he wants to be a
good person. He wants to be better, he wants to
be more supportive, he wants to help, he wants to
do all the good things. However, yes, he should have

(01:26:40):
been there for Harry period. I mean, maybe that was
Dumbledore saying don't do it, don't do it. He could
have been a friendly neighbor. Maybe the Dursley's one of
allowed that. I don't know. I just feel like, figure
out a way to be in this boy's life. An

(01:27:00):
anonymous cake every year, like I don't know, like do something.

Speaker 4 (01:27:06):
An anonymous cake I like.

Speaker 2 (01:27:07):
To see that he's trying to make up for it now,
I guess that's what I'm getting at.

Speaker 3 (01:27:10):
And I feel like he can see like the isolation
that Harry is feeling, especially you know, not being able
to go to Hogg's neat and everything, and can kind
of reflect that on him himself as like Lupin just
like being isolated too, And maybe he's trying to like
kind of build that blond with him in that relationship
and like showing him like empathy. Beca's like I've been there,

(01:27:31):
so this is my way of also trying to have
a relationship with you.

Speaker 2 (01:27:34):
Now.

Speaker 3 (01:27:35):
I do wish he did, like have some type of relationship.
I've always like wish that would have been like a
really cool thing to see, like him growing up and
having some type of someone from like his life in it, so.

Speaker 4 (01:27:50):
Like pen pals at least, that would have been something.

Speaker 2 (01:27:55):
Yeah, it would have been hard because Dumbledore really wanted
him to have such a normal childhood. Who knows, but yeah,
I mean it would have been It would have been nice.
And like I said, Lupin is trying here, so he
gets he gets credit from me for that for sure.

Speaker 1 (01:28:11):
I mean he should also get credit because like he
immediately knows that Harry is lying to him about having
something in his mind he had. You know, Harry wants
to bring up the Graham doesn't talk about it, and
then Lupen immediately asks anything bothering you? Anything you want
to talk about, anything worrying you? Whatever, he says, and

(01:28:32):
Harry laws because he doesn't want to. He doesn't want to. One,
he doesn't want to trust an adult. Two doesn't want
to like seems more of a coward than what he
thinks Lupin already thinks of him as, so like I
don't know, just it says a lot about Lupin's perception
of like something's up with this kid?

Speaker 2 (01:28:52):
Yeah, well, and I think after that conversation Harry almost
like immediately trusts him a little bit more. This whole
conversation is really just the two of them like quickly
and easily learning about each other and like how more
honest and sort of open they can be with each other.
And I think Harry walks out of that feeling like, oh, actually,

(01:29:15):
I've had another really good adult in my life, Like.

Speaker 1 (01:29:17):
Welly, and we we also don't want to forget that
Lupin was best friends with James for ten years before
James's death. So like, over those ten years, Lupin saw
James worried or like have something you wanted to talk
about but not able to talk about, especially in the
last couple of years during the war. So like, if

(01:29:39):
Harry looks so much like James, Loopen is seeing James
worried about something.

Speaker 4 (01:29:44):
Again, like does he have some of the same mannerisms?

Speaker 2 (01:29:48):
Yeah, he must, sure he does.

Speaker 1 (01:29:50):
That's cool, all right. So we've talked a lot about
the Bogart lesson from the last chapter kind of what
was going on. This is where Harry and Lupin really
gets talk about it, because now the cats out of
the bag, like, hey, Lupin, you didn't let me do this?
And Lupin says the reason that he didn't let Harry
participate was because he did not want Lord Voldemort in
the classroom. You know that's great, what a what a

(01:30:15):
smart man. You know what now it is bog Art Boldie,
So like whatever, My question is what form would that
bog Art take if if if it would truly turn
into Voldemort because of Harry, which we know that it wouldn't,
what form what what does that look like standing there,

(01:30:40):
I can provide the options that I have if we
want to go ahead and get it out of the way.
If Monica, if you.

Speaker 2 (01:30:45):
Have no, no, nothing, nothing, yet give it all?

Speaker 1 (01:30:48):
Right? The the the thoughts that I have from or
from Harry's perception or perspective. Book number one is Quirrel
Quirld's Double Fame Book number two teenage Tom Riddle. Or
if we if we want to do what we usually

(01:31:11):
do and bring up the horre trucks, this's inside of
Harry and the thing that makes the dementors so affect him.
Would it be the fallen form of Voldemort? Either it
could either be his body before the fall, or it
could be when it when it says that it was
as if his had been ripped from his body. Whatever

(01:31:34):
I can Yeah, Yet, you're right, it could be the
form of him in Albania, because that is the most
fearful thing that Baltimore had ever experienced.

Speaker 2 (01:31:43):
So it's Harry's buggert mm hm. So I think it's
none of those, Okay, I think it is whatever amalgamation
of what he thinks Voldemorre looks like in his head.
The most likely one, if we're going to pick any
of those is teenage Tom Riddle, because Harry had a

(01:32:03):
one to one conversation with teenage Tom Coral. Yes, with
the thing in the back or whatever. I don't know,
for obviously scary, terrifying, but I think that personal connection
with Tom Riddle, like teenage Tom and the Chamber of

(01:32:23):
Secrets through the diary, like the Hagrid thing, I just
feel like Harry has more of a I would have
more of a mental picture of that Tom, even though
that Tom is not scary. So I don't think it
would be any of them. I think it would be
the Voltemore that Harry dreams about, the one that if

(01:32:44):
you look at concept art, the one would like the
like crazy teeth like yeah, like super white skull, like
just really really scary. Because Voldemort is the unknown for Harry. Yes,
he has encountered him a couple of times, but he
really doesn't He really doesn't know Baltimore, and so I

(01:33:07):
think it's got to be some some imaginary figure that
only appears in his dreams. I don't know.

Speaker 1 (01:33:15):
I think it's Quarrel. I think it's I think it's
the back of Quarrel's head. That's what I think. Of
this because he does have a face to face he
does have like a one on one conversation with Baltimore
in the back of Quarrel's head. It's not as it's
not as long as the one with Tom. But I
don't think that he has any reason to be like
afraid of Tom because he conversed with Tom, the thought

(01:33:36):
the basilisk, he conversed with Baltimore and then thought Quarrel Baltimore.
So I think it's I think it's the Chorrel version.

Speaker 2 (01:33:45):
Okay, Shamany's not sure.

Speaker 3 (01:33:46):
I don't know. Like I it's I agree with josh
On Curl as well, because it's like his first initial
impression of Boldemorre is through in Sorcer of Stone, and
so it's like I feel like that would be just
like in his mind. And yeah, I agree too that

(01:34:09):
like Tom Riddle, it's like even though he did have
like the interaction with him more recently, because it just
happened in the Chamber of Secrets, I just feel like, yeah,
the manifestation that he had in the first one is
like what he imagines, so I could see like it
has to be something that like he has seen, not
or and I agree too, like with the dream too
in his head, so it's kind of hard. I feel

(01:34:30):
like it's tough.

Speaker 4 (01:34:32):
It's kind of like maybe it's the version that he
saw on the back of Quarrel's head, but now that
he has fled Curl's body, now he's imagining Voldemort to
be something much worse because he's on his own. And
you know how they say that your brain can think
of something much more terrifying than what actually is if

(01:34:52):
you've never seen it cool, So he's never seen what
Voldemort looks like outside of Quarrels so maybe he is
imagining the super sary version. Now.

Speaker 1 (01:35:01):
We also know that Bogarts get like confused if there's
too many people because it doesn't know what to turn into.
It's really interesting to think that you can be scared
of Baltimore, but Baltimore has all these different versions of
himself and then it confuses the Bogart and it doesn't
know what to turn into them Like that's really that
that could be a really cool thing. So and then

(01:35:22):
I'll drop it after this, I promise. There was a
few episodes, like I think that we did the the
the chapter of in Sorcerer's Stone when they're in the
forest and they see were you on that episode, Domedy?
I thought that? Okay, So what we talked about with
that was that if Baltimore is in the back of
Quarrel's head and he has to drink unicorn blood, then

(01:35:45):
Quarrel has to crab walk in the forest to like
make Baltimore's face be able to suck the blood. And
so we talked about how creepy it would be to
see a cloak going across that's like what going across
the forest floor and the person's crab.

Speaker 2 (01:36:03):
Walking friends, friends, friends friends. Quarrel drinks the blood for Voldemore.

Speaker 4 (01:36:12):
On that episode, the cloak was on backwards. Voldemore was
the one that was bent over the unicorn and drinking
and coral crab walking through.

Speaker 2 (01:36:21):
Is he doing like a back bend.

Speaker 1 (01:36:25):
Like I'm not I'm not sure, short, I'm not doing video.

Speaker 4 (01:36:31):
He's like like a what is the word a controtionist.
So they've got some kind of spell on him where
he's like hoarded into this weird Okay, Okay.

Speaker 1 (01:36:44):
There you go. There, you know.

Speaker 4 (01:36:48):
That's the one that's it, all right, So cat that's
not convinced.

Speaker 1 (01:36:58):
Something different it's totally.

Speaker 2 (01:37:00):
It's it's an amalgama. It's an amalgam of everything and
it has to be well.

Speaker 1 (01:37:05):
And so like, I think that makes the most like, Okay,
so we know, we know through the throughout the conversation,
Harry then says that the Boggart would have turned into
a dementor does Harry have like true reason to be
scared of Voldemort to the extent to be a to
be his Boggart fear thing? It doesn't really seem like

(01:37:29):
obviously not because he's not.

Speaker 2 (01:37:31):
That's such a hard, such a hard question. Does he
have a reason to fear him? Totally? He does, totally,
he does, But does he actually, I mean, I think
the answer, I mean, we see the answer here is no.
And I think a big part of that is because
Baltimore is not a person to Harry right now. Voltimore

(01:37:55):
is like a weird face on the back of the head,
and he's like a teenage memory that gets blown up
when he like stabs a Voltemore is not a person
to Harry yet he is. He's he's a he's a spirit.
He's a part of his past. But as of now
he doesn't realize he's a big part of his future.

Speaker 4 (01:38:14):
Like he's not a real threat right now.

Speaker 2 (01:38:16):
Yeah, I think Harry's also just a little too young still.
And I know I sound like Dumbledore, but he's still
like a little too young to fully conceptualize what Voltemore
means to him and for him and for his past
and his present and his future. And not that he

(01:38:40):
doesn't get it, but that he doesn't get it. Kids
can understand danger, but they're not always gonna understand the
reason behind the danger, or you know, the political reasons
behind the danger, or any of the any of the
thing beyond the like anxiety, the beating heart, the immediate

(01:39:02):
physical reaction of the danger. And I think that's the
space that Harry's in right now.

Speaker 1 (01:39:07):
Well, and see, I disagree with Lupin whenever he says
that because Harry's Boggart would have turned into a dementtor,
that means that Harry, the thing that Harry fears the
most is fear itself. I don't agree with that. I
think that Harry's Bogart is turned into a dementor the
same reason that Seamus's turns into a banshee. It is

(01:39:29):
something that he is just terrified of and he's terrified
of it for all the reasons of the mentor's kiss
and the way that it affected him, and like the
way that made him feel and like all those things cat.

Speaker 2 (01:39:40):
Your home that he singled out and then he was
singled out none of his friends, I mean other than Jenny,
but you know, yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:39:47):
Yeah, So like is what Lupin says, do we buy
does anyone on the podcast here by that? Because Harry's
Boggart would turn into a dementor, that the thing that
he fears the most is fear itself?

Speaker 2 (01:40:03):
I mean, I get what Lupin is saying, yeah, but
how does a dementor equal fear? Like the full quote
that suggests that what you fear the most of all
is fear? Very wise, Harry, how exactly how because you fear.

Speaker 4 (01:40:24):
The emotions and the effect that the dementor insights. But
that's still yeah, that's not that's not the fear the fear.

Speaker 2 (01:40:39):
Well then, also, I mean, how is it very wise
to fear fear itself? Isn't that just being like, Wow,
the thing that you have anxiety about is anxiety. That's
really smart, Harry, Like you should keep having anxiety about anxiety.

Speaker 1 (01:40:53):
You're anxious about being anxious.

Speaker 2 (01:40:56):
I mean a lot of people are, to be fair,
myself included, but like that's what I mean. It just
it doesn't make sense to me.

Speaker 1 (01:41:06):
If we use for some like circular reasoning on this,
which I think is what it does. A bog art
is is to take on the form of the thing
that you fear. If you are if you fear fear,
the bog art would take on the form of a
bog art, right, Like, you can't turn into anything but fear,

(01:41:26):
and that thing takes on all of your fear, so that,
like I understand, I'm not going to explain this well
because I don't understand it either. Thank you all for
looking at me like I have three heads. No, no,
it's I think that the art that is looking at
someone that fears fear would just be a boggart.

Speaker 4 (01:41:44):
So he fears the concept of fear, but not necessarily fear.

Speaker 1 (01:41:51):
Yeah, yes, because like if you look at all, if
you look at these creatures that that are supposed to
take on emotion, like the mentors with depression or one,
you know, all these things, bogart is just fear. So
if you're scared of fear, then you're scared of the.

Speaker 4 (01:42:09):
Boggart because a boggart represents the concept of fear. I said,
that's why you're afraid of the bogart.

Speaker 1 (01:42:15):
That's where I'm at. It's not it's not good.

Speaker 2 (01:42:18):
I mean, it's not bad.

Speaker 1 (01:42:20):
I agree, thank you.

Speaker 2 (01:42:23):
That quote just doesn't make sense. That suggests that what
you love most of all is love. Very wise, Harry.
It's like, thank you. You can substitute any word and
it's not going to make it better. That suggests that
what you know. I can't use that because that makes
no sense.

Speaker 1 (01:42:41):
What you anger most.

Speaker 2 (01:42:44):
I was gonna say money, because like, what you.

Speaker 1 (01:42:46):
Money most is money itself.

Speaker 2 (01:42:48):
Yeah, yeah, what you value the most is value. I
don't know. It's just such a weird, kind of dumb quote.
The other one that I don't like about Lupin he
is a movie ism, to be fair, but it's that
weird one. He says during the Battle of Hogwarts to Kingsley,
I always forget what it is, but I hate it.

Speaker 4 (01:43:08):
I'm like, what, I'm trying to remember what he said.

Speaker 3 (01:43:12):
I forgot.

Speaker 2 (01:43:13):
Yeah, I don't remember, but I hate it anyway. So
Snape comes in with the the Smoking Goblet, which is
like very spooky and cool, I dig it, But how
did anybody, anybody persuade Snape to make this Wolfspaine potion
for Lupin because Snape would not willingly do it. I'm sorry,

(01:43:35):
he just wouldn't. I mean he is, but he wouldn't.

Speaker 3 (01:43:38):
I feel like Dumbledore like told him, like, hey, can
you do this for me? And he's like okay, Like
I don't know. That's where it comes into, like the loyalty,
Like Dumbledore, that's like if he asks him, like, he's
gonna do it, even if he disagrees.

Speaker 2 (01:43:53):
This is a term of your indentured servitude.

Speaker 3 (01:43:57):
You have to do right, It's part of your contract.

Speaker 1 (01:44:00):
Well, and it could have also been a thing of
like staving off any like maybe maybe Loopen was the
last ditch effort to get a Dada professor in and
if he couldn't, then we have an umbered situation two
books earlier too, So like I mean, it could have
been a situation where Dumbledore goes to Snape and says, hey,

(01:44:24):
I want to bring Looping in to teach Dada. I'm
gonna need you to make wolf Spain and if you don't,
one somebody else could have made it, Like yes, he
is the man is very good and making potions. I
get it. He's also not the only person's capable of
making potions, so whatever Lupin also should probably know how

(01:44:44):
to make it himself. If we're all being fair, I
don't think. I don't care potioneer. You can get good
at one thing. It's baking a cake. I'm not a
good baker. Do you know why I don't bake? I
also don't have to bake a cake to keep me
you alive and from killing over exact. And I can
guarantee you all if it was between me learning how

(01:45:05):
to make a cake and killing somebody, I'm probably gonna
learn how I'm making a pretty bag and good.

Speaker 4 (01:45:10):
Cake, So I agree.

Speaker 1 (01:45:15):
So I do I think it. I think Dumbledore went
to went to Snape, was like, hey, I need you
to do this. You're gonna do it, And that's kind
of it. There's also there's also the side of it
that there is a I can't remember where, I don't
I don't remember what book, but there is a Snape
line that's like, I'm oh, it's it's with Lockhart. Uh.

(01:45:37):
In the previous book, Lockhart says something about brewing up
a potion and loop and uh, Snape says, I'm the
potiononeer in the castle. So like there's there's there's some
pride there too. If something needs done, he's going to
do it. But it's just so annoying. Looping should be
able to do this.

Speaker 2 (01:45:56):
You wanted to make his own wolfs band?

Speaker 4 (01:45:57):
Yes?

Speaker 1 (01:45:58):
Why not? I don't. I don't think that he should
have to. I think that he should be able to if.

Speaker 4 (01:46:04):
Like, what if it's an emergency, like when he's in hiding,
who's making the potion for him? When he's off in hiding?

Speaker 2 (01:46:10):
Maybe he does make his own potion?

Speaker 1 (01:46:13):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (01:46:13):
Did I miss all this when I got up to Peg?
Did you already have this conversation?

Speaker 1 (01:46:18):
All right, Well you can just say, Josh, that was
a great point and we can move on.

Speaker 2 (01:46:23):
That was such a great point.

Speaker 1 (01:46:24):
Thank you.

Speaker 2 (01:46:25):
That was such a great point. Yeah, I've got my
fingers cross.

Speaker 1 (01:46:32):
I don't care. I just care about the words. Cat.

Speaker 2 (01:46:36):
Oh.

Speaker 1 (01:46:37):
So, I don't know how much like persuasion Snape would
have to have because of the pride and all that stuff. Anyway,
my issue is more of like Snape calls out that
he has made an entire cauldron of wolfspain potion for him.
Let's just let's just move that stuff up to Lupin's office.
How about we just move it on up. We keep
it up, we keep a little fire going, we keep

(01:46:58):
it all smoky forever. By that way, we don't forget.
We don't need to worry about Snape bringing it to
him or forgiving to bring it to him. You could
just take it because it's right there by your door.
The smoke covers your handle before you walk out. You
can just take it.

Speaker 2 (01:47:14):
It's great, that's fair. I mean also, because does Lupin
have to take it throughout the whole cycle? So when
he's a wolf, is he also taking it or is
it just leading up to I think, okay, yeah, it
was like because that would be awkward. You're a wolf
under your desk, Like you have your human brain and

(01:47:35):
you're like, I gotta take my wolf's fins, you know,
which he.

Speaker 1 (01:47:41):
Doesn't have much of a human brain. It just really
makes him docile anyway.

Speaker 2 (01:47:45):
No, I think I think the potion helps him keep
his brain. I think that's part of it.

Speaker 4 (01:47:49):
Does it helps him keep himself?

Speaker 3 (01:47:51):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (01:47:53):
Oh he's looking enough.

Speaker 4 (01:47:54):
And believe me, so now I'm picturing like this big
scary werewolf and it's just Lupin's brain inside of the
were wolf. And he's like, hey, guys, it's still me.
I promise, fine, just spurry.

Speaker 1 (01:48:07):
Yeah. So he has to take it, he has to
take it in the weak preceding the full moon, and
he does it does say I keep my mind when
I transform, I'm able to curl up in my own
it's a harmless wolf and wait for the moon to
wane again.

Speaker 2 (01:48:20):
You were right here, sweet, sweet, sweet words.

Speaker 1 (01:48:25):
That must be so weird while we were together.

Speaker 2 (01:48:28):
You should have you should have.

Speaker 4 (01:48:33):
That must be so weird to like knowing you're a
person but you look like a wolf and you can't
just go out and do whatever because well you look
like this that I wonder if they have like the
same feelings when they're and a magie and animus.

Speaker 2 (01:48:53):
And whatever word.

Speaker 4 (01:48:56):
Multiple animal people there we go nice, like, how weird
is it to know that you're a person but you're
inside of an animal body? That's weird.

Speaker 2 (01:49:08):
I think it would be cool. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I
think it'd be really cool. I would do it in
a heart yeah, if I could in a heart beat.

Speaker 4 (01:49:20):
I just I kind of also laugh at this interaction
here where Lupin's trying to be all friendly. He's like
your friendly neighbor, trying to make conversation with Snape and
talking to him about the Grundy low and he's like
oh look, and Snape just like, yeah, okay, whatever, here's
your potion. And he's like the grumpy old man the
get off my lawn, like, I don't want to talk
to you. Here's your potion, Shut up and leave me alone.

Speaker 2 (01:49:44):
This is my life every day with my coworker. I
am Lupin. Hi, good morning, how are you. Did you
have a good weekend? How how was how was your evening? Yeah?
This is this is my life every day, in my life,
every day. So I feel for Lupin here. Sometimes you
just have to kill him with kindness.

Speaker 4 (01:50:05):
He's trying.

Speaker 2 (01:50:06):
Sometimes you just have to. And I think Lupin is
just as I said before, he just wants he just
wants to be happy.

Speaker 4 (01:50:15):
He is.

Speaker 2 (01:50:16):
He wants to be jovial, he wants people to like him,
and he's gonna kiss Snapes, but super duper hard because
Snape knows his secrets well, you know a lot of
his secrets.

Speaker 4 (01:50:28):
And he can slip something in his posion too.

Speaker 1 (01:50:30):
So I mean, I don't think that. I don't think
Snap would do that.

Speaker 4 (01:50:35):
Yeah, I don't know, I don't I don't think that
that would happen. I don't think that's Lupin's motivation for
being nice at all.

Speaker 1 (01:50:41):
Also, I do think that Lupin feels a lot of
guilt from allowing James and Sirius to kind of have
full run.

Speaker 2 (01:50:49):
Yeah. Well, and probably also used as a murderer, I
want to be murderer by his friends, you know, almost
killing Snape. So yeah, guilt, i'd say is definitely an
emotion he's feeling in his life. Yeah, he's also super
duper good at just like ignoring all of Harry's jabs

(01:51:10):
at Snape because Snape hands him the potion and then
leaves the room, and Harry's like, Snape wants the Dark
Arts job.

Speaker 1 (01:51:18):
He's very interested in the Dark Arts. Huh.

Speaker 2 (01:51:21):
Yeah's just like, uh huh.

Speaker 4 (01:51:23):
The way he just blurts it out there.

Speaker 1 (01:51:26):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:51:27):
Yeah, But you have to admire Lupin's restraint here. And
I just wonder, is it, you know, to James too serious?
Is he really just thankful that Snape is making this
for him? I mean, I think it's maybe all of
those things and I also think Lupin, as much as
we've talked about that, he's very truthful with Harry. As

(01:51:49):
Josh just pointed out again, Lupin is guilty, feels guilty
af about everything, and so he's not going to fess
up to it and to his part in it until
he has to. And he doesn't have to right now,
because who is Harry James Potter. He's just He's just
a student right now. He's nothing, you know, until until

(01:52:10):
that the s hits the fan. Harry's really just a student,
right You disagree?

Speaker 1 (01:52:16):
No, I don't. I've just has given Loopen more credit
than I usually like to. I don't like anybody credit
to be fair. But so Ron's also wrote, so you know,
Ron Harmony came back there doing all this stuff. Harry's
like recounting the story to Ron, and Ron is like,
and he drank it. I do like Ron's like hype

(01:52:41):
man mentality to stories. It's just like, I'm going to
give you all the emotion that you need here. I
can't believe he did a snape is unbelievable. Looping may
be dumb.

Speaker 2 (01:52:51):
Yeah, that's I mean, that's Ron's role in the trio, right.

Speaker 1 (01:52:55):
He's yeah, when he's there, when he when he wants to,
when he's not pouting.

Speaker 2 (01:53:03):
When it has nothing to do with him, Harry and
Ron is Harry's Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:53:09):
So yeah, Goomny, would you like to say something about
Ron and Harmoni coming back from Hogsmaide?

Speaker 4 (01:53:16):
Oh, well, well, yes, yes I would. I just think
it was very kind of them to bring back some
treats for Harry, which I mean that speaks a lot
for their friendship that they weren't just there having to
get time enjoying themselves, you know, forgetting about their friend.
They're like, hey, wait, we have to bring something back
for our friend. So I thought that was really sweet. Listen.

Speaker 2 (01:53:35):
I just brought like a bunch of phone chargers to
my coworker because she had been complaining that she couldn't
find phone chargers, and I found a bunch and I
gave them to her. Sometimes, you know, you just gotta
you just got to think of people to try to
make them like you and to like be less grumpy
and to like have conversations. I know that's not what's
happening here, and that's mostly just my personal experience, but yeah,

(01:54:00):
it is very nice that they bring it back, but
they can't bring back the butter beer because that doesn't travel,
not like it does in the Muggal world. We can
bring butter beer home. In the Muggle world, we can.

Speaker 1 (01:54:10):
The best butter beer is the frozen butter beer. Though
I don't really get the hot butter beer. This seems
very UK stuff to me, of like like there is something,
there is something I guess nice about, like a like
a hot butterscotch drink. To me, I guess, but like
wh when I think of butter beer, I want it.

(01:54:32):
I think of beer. I guess. I just want to.

Speaker 4 (01:54:35):
Frosty coles and a classic glass and.

Speaker 2 (01:54:39):
Yeah, listen, the frozen is my favorite. However, when they
used to have the celebration of Harry Potter every January
Universal Orlando Resort, and it was fifty degrees at night,
which is not cold as a Northerner, but as a
Northerner in Orlando, Florida in January, it's a little chilly

(01:54:59):
that butter beer. There is like nothing that hits the
spot better. I'm saying nothing. And when I used to
eat ice cream, the ice cream was my favorite non drink.

Speaker 3 (01:55:13):
The ice cream is so good, so good, it.

Speaker 2 (01:55:17):
Is top not but I hear you. I mean the
frozen is superior unless it's really cold. Then you need
the hot. There's something about the hot that just hits different.
I can't explain it, but I'm sure everybody had.

Speaker 3 (01:55:30):
My first frozen butter beer when I went to the
Chicago store like last month, and I'm like life changing.
I feel like I can't even go back to like
normal cold butter beer, Like I feel like it has
to be frozen now.

Speaker 2 (01:55:43):
Yeah, the cold one is the worst of all the
butter beers. Yeah, in all honesty, and that's like the original. Yeah,
and maybe that they serve some of that at the
Halloween feast. Nothing super duper exciting happens, right, they go,
they eat, they come back. Oh does something happen?

Speaker 1 (01:56:04):
Well, I just I just had a question at the
It's only like a paragraph long. This is probably the
shortest Halloween Feast we've ever had. Yeah, which is interesting
because it does seem like it's a big deal typically,
but not in this book. But Harry said at the
end of that paragraph, it says was he imagining it

(01:56:24):
or were Snape's eyes flickering toward looping more often than
was natural? So like this is right when term has started. Well,
this is October, so this would have been the second
time that Snape has made wolf Spain for looping, and
so I what do we what do we think? What
are you all things happening there? Is it? Is it

(01:56:46):
really a throwaway line because I'm reading too much into it.
But my reading into it doesn't mean anything since it's
the second time that he did it.

Speaker 2 (01:56:56):
I mean, I think it's natural since does know what
lupin is. I think it's very natural for him to
be weary of of Lupin, Like I would accept lupin
and still be like ten percent scared to be around
Lupin on the full moon like period. Snape is clearly

(01:57:18):
confident in his potion brewing skills, but you never really
that's a were wolf at the table, bro Like, no
matter how open or accepting or whatever, that's a little scary,
Like this is I'm gonna make like an like an
allegory here. This is not like a queer person or

(01:57:42):
a trans person that's just sitting there and like you
disapprove of them. This is a person who turns into
a legitimate human being killing animal. That's scary. I don't
know I don't think that's why Snape's looking a him.
I think Snape's looking at him because he doesn't like
him and he's suspicious of him and all the things.
But I know that's why I might be looking at him.

Speaker 1 (01:58:03):
Yeah, but I guess like where I'm at more of
like the fear side of it has to do with
we know that this is the week preceding the full moon.
That's when he has to take it. So like they're
in no real danger because they're still a week out
or like less than a week out, but at least
some type of a week out from the full moon.

(01:58:25):
So like that doesn't make a whole lot of sense.
Where I was going with it was like it is
a complicated potion and it's a relatively new potion too,
Like it was only invented within the last fifteen years.

Speaker 2 (01:58:41):
Something like that. Yeah, I mean, because Lupin Lupin is
canonically like in his fifties.

Speaker 1 (01:58:46):
No, Lupin's needs thirties snaping snaping'.

Speaker 2 (01:58:50):
Oh right, because they were all they were all in
their early twenties when James and lay the door right
like mid thirties.

Speaker 1 (01:58:54):
Yeah, and we know that he didn't have it when
he was a Hogwarts. That's why he had to go
to the streets. Jack. So like ten to fifteen, maybe
twenty years old?

Speaker 2 (01:59:04):
Is this potion you like seventy six is jumping out?
I'm going to look it up while you keep talking.

Speaker 1 (01:59:10):
And so where I was going is that because this
is a complicated potion that loopin even though he's not
a very good potiononeer, he isn't making for himself. It's
something that isn't it's not even in the textbooks like
the Halfwlood Prince textbook that we see later Wolfman can't

(01:59:31):
even be in it because it's not it's not invented whenever.
That is all going on. So where I'm going with
it more is like it's almost like an uncertainty that
Snape has of like I hope I did that right,
Like did I mess something up? Did I? And sorry,
I know I'm talking a lot, I'm sorry, but.

Speaker 2 (01:59:52):
Mid nineteen seventies, so yes, you're you're right about fifteen years.

Speaker 1 (01:59:56):
Ago years so, and then like there's then this other
side of it too, where we have the Half Blood
Prince book that Snape, that teenage Snape has reworked everything
in has has has figured out better ways to brew
the potion, done all this stuff, doesn't use the book
during his classes, all these things, and so now you

(02:00:19):
have this potion that was created by somebody else and
he has to trust that it's going to do its job.
And so I've always I've always kind of read that
line as like Snape isn't one hundred percent sure about
this potion. Oh, and he's like keeping an eye on it.

Speaker 2 (02:00:35):
Because it's not like he makes it all the time.

Speaker 1 (02:00:37):
He doesn't make it all the time, and he probably
hasn't worked it out.

Speaker 3 (02:00:41):
That is a good point me that like, you know,
he's looking at him like did I do it right?
And is there like any side effects? And he say,
don't do it right. And we're in a full room
of students and just never know what can happen.

Speaker 1 (02:00:54):
Yeah, I just I just keep coming back to the
point of like the textbook that they're supposed to use
in the class, Snape has rewritten all of it. And
so now he's taken this other potion that has been
created by somebody else or figured out by somebody else,
and that's in the back of his head of like, well,
this textbook was wrong, maybe this is wrong.

Speaker 2 (02:01:15):
I feel like Laurie Kimway is like clapping for you
in the background, because this is giving This is like
giving Snape another level of like compassion that we don't
typically see from him. So I hear you, and I
think that's great and awesome and like, wow, very good analysis.
I disagree, but very interesting, very interesting.

Speaker 1 (02:01:37):
All right, I will thank you for me giving Snape compassion.
I think it's only has to do with the fact
that Lupin could. I mean, if if Lupin does, he
doesn't care if Lupen does. I don't think he cares
about the the effect on his persona or.

Speaker 4 (02:01:57):
His his reputation.

Speaker 1 (02:01:58):
Reputation as a potiononeer because the potion that he made
killed him. And also and also the werewolf setting.

Speaker 2 (02:02:07):
There, Yeah, crazy where the table friends?

Speaker 4 (02:02:11):
And meanwhile I'm here thinking it's not really any of that.
It's just he's Harry's noticing Snape noticing Loupin because he
knows that Lupin drank the potion that Snap made. So
Harry is just suspicious and paranoid and just happens to
notice the additional books.

Speaker 2 (02:02:29):
So Harry is Harry is just noticing Snape noticing Lupin.

Speaker 1 (02:02:33):
Because he does, because would trust snape.

Speaker 2 (02:02:37):
Okay, he doesn't believe anybody can trust nake.

Speaker 1 (02:02:41):
Okay.

Speaker 2 (02:02:41):
Interesting, I'm sure. I'm sure the listeners will have a
very interesting will have similar thoughts about that. That's that's
that's a good point. I love when we pulled one
line out and we're like, let's talk about it for
twy me. I love it, I really really do. But
they leave the theast and we are closing out the
chapter as the Gryffindors walk up to their portrait and

(02:03:03):
there's like a backlog, and everybody's like, what's going on,
what's going on? Turns out that fat lady, which terrible name,
how about the Gryffindor portrait that guards the entrance to
the common room, That lady is Snappier, was attacked. She's attacked,
the portrait is attacked, and she's gone, gone, leaves a
portrait only to be found where like Filch findes her

(02:03:26):
somewhere right.

Speaker 1 (02:03:27):
Peeve says that the last time that they saw her
was like going across the field, some portrait with a
field in and I think saw her rush the monk.

Speaker 2 (02:03:38):
I'm obsessed with the monks.

Speaker 1 (02:03:42):
He says that he saw her running through the landscape
up on the fourth floor, dodging between the trees, crying
something that dreadful.

Speaker 2 (02:03:51):
There you go, Yeah, listen, it would be so fun
to be a portrait. Like if you get to visit
all the other portraits, what a cool life that is?
For real? Is oh, a portrait cans down, bro, Like

(02:04:11):
you don't have to worry about eating as a portrait.
But if you're a monk and you're like in a
painting that has like grapes and stuff, you probably still
get to.

Speaker 4 (02:04:18):
Eat and you can travel to other portraits with other
food and I.

Speaker 1 (02:04:22):
Mean the Fat Lady gets drunk with violet.

Speaker 2 (02:04:26):
There you go exactly. Way better to be a.

Speaker 3 (02:04:28):
Portrait, the way better to be a portrait.

Speaker 2 (02:04:32):
Yeah, But the thing about portraits is someone has to
paint it before you die, so that then you can
teach your portrait all the cool stuff that you need
to know when you die and then turn into the portrait.
I don't know anyway, the Fat Lady was a text.

Speaker 1 (02:04:47):
So what we So we found out that it's serious
black dunt don spoiler alert, serious black did it? What
did he think was happening? Like? What did he think
was going to happen? By like slashing the portrait, like
he doesn't have the passwords to get in, Like that's why,
because like he doesn't have the passwords, she's not gonna

(02:05:08):
let him in and he slashes. Is it? Is it
just anger? And like if it's just anger, that's fine,
Like I think that's probably what it is. But like,
did he think that anything was gonna happen?

Speaker 4 (02:05:20):
I mean, he should have known from his time in
Griffin Door that she wasn't gonna let him in, So
it's not like it was a surprise.

Speaker 1 (02:05:27):
Yeah, like he knows how this works.

Speaker 4 (02:05:30):
Maybe he thought if he'd destroyed the portrait that that
would unlock the door, but.

Speaker 1 (02:05:35):
Then like a Slytherin would have done it decades ago.

Speaker 2 (02:05:38):
Yeah, yeah, it is a really interesting reaction. And this
is such an unsatisfying answer, and I hate when this
is the answer. But I just don't see how there's
any evidence other than this is trying to make us
more afraid of serious, to make him a more credible threat,

(02:06:00):
because right now, sort of like a human eyed Voltimore,
he's sort of like a nothing, right Like we hear
about him and we see him on the news. Yeah,
he's like he's like a nothing. So oh my gosh,
he's in Hogwarts and he slashed this portrait, so like
he's dangerous because he's got claws. It's like the equivalent

(02:06:21):
of finding somebody with a gun or a knife and
you're like, oh my gosh, I'm really afraid of you.

Speaker 1 (02:06:26):
Now.

Speaker 2 (02:06:26):
I think it's just about the fear factor.

Speaker 3 (02:06:30):
Honestly, Yeah, I agree with that too. Like I feel
like at that moment that he you know, scratched at it,
even though he knows that like, Okay, I'm not going
to get in because you know, I need to know
the passwords. I feel like at that moment, it's just
like it's so angry, like oh man, I'm so close
and like I need to get through this door, and
like it's frustration. Yeah, and it's just like ah, twelve

(02:06:52):
years of it and then you know, yeah, he just
like attack the kid. So that's just it gives.

Speaker 1 (02:06:57):
It gives off. Bro at the bar punches the concrete wall,
you know.

Speaker 4 (02:07:04):
Which throws something across the room, Like yeah.

Speaker 1 (02:07:08):
I don't know. It's because we know what the correct
plage would have been. It would have been I can't
get in. It should have it really should not have
ever been like trying to get into the dorm. But
like I get he just he wants to do it
then because everyone is at the feast and he's trying

(02:07:28):
to get the scabbard, but Peter inside when no one's there,
so like we understand that, I guess.

Speaker 2 (02:07:33):
But while he's hanging out in the common room.

Speaker 1 (02:07:36):
Yeah, just hanging out?

Speaker 2 (02:07:42):
Where was this is an audio only podcast. It's okay,
I can make the hand.

Speaker 1 (02:07:48):
Gesture, but like, I don't know, Scabbarde doesn't seem like
he's ever leaving the the dorm. I guess because I
was gonna say the play would have been I can't
get in. I'm trying to like turn into a dog
and just go like hide in the you know, the

(02:08:09):
past the secret passageway to the honey Dukes and wait
that you know serious isn't exactly the smartest fellow we know.

Speaker 4 (02:08:17):
So what that makes me wonder? What was his plan here?
Was he just gonna go in, snatch the rat, run
out and carry him away, or was he gonna go
in and kill him? Or was he gonna eat? Was
he gonna beat him brickshanks?

Speaker 1 (02:08:36):
Like?

Speaker 4 (02:08:37):
What? What was? What? Was what was the plan here?

Speaker 1 (02:08:39):
I what? I what I would have done is I
would have caught him, forced him to transform in the
Peter like they do in the Streaking Shack, and then
killed him. And that way you're not leaving a dead
rat body. You're leaving Peter Pettigrew's dead body, a.

Speaker 4 (02:08:56):
Dead people body, yes, in the common room. But so
the students come back. But if he's still there, so
then there he is, and then he's guilty all over again.

Speaker 1 (02:09:08):
I think I think they all right, guys, I would
have left dead Peter in the in the dorm, because like,
because then your name gets I would have swam back
to I would have swam back to Azkaban, went back
to my cell and waited to be released. Maybe not

(02:09:28):
that I would have, Probably I would, yeah, But I
would have done everything.

Speaker 2 (02:09:36):
Well because then at that point, let's say he got
away with it. Who knows he's in animagus other than
looping and snape, nobody, and he could just disappear. He
could get on a boat to America, to America, start
a new life.

Speaker 1 (02:09:52):
I think you would have just gone to Dumbledore actlutely,
but I think Dumbledore, yeah, I think, because then Pete,
you have you have Peter's body because I mean Dumbledore
even says at the end of this book, like that's
why they can't do anything because they don't have Peter's body.

Speaker 4 (02:10:08):
Well what if he hadn't killed him? What if he
had just petrified him and then drags off.

Speaker 1 (02:10:14):
Yeah, we saw how that goes.

Speaker 2 (02:10:16):
I mean, like, what does Peter's body have to do
with it? Really, when they've got the memories.

Speaker 1 (02:10:21):
To just we don't we don't talk about that.

Speaker 2 (02:10:24):
No, we don't use that. But it's so dumb. I think, like,
you know, if you get away with a murder, you
just leave. You don't, don't implicate yourself. Still, just like leave.
We are teaching so many on this episode. Just leave. Yeah,
just like move to Fiji. He's loaded, he's got plenty

(02:10:48):
of money. Just like figure out how to take your
money or keep ordering by order by owl because apparently
you can order brooms when you're a convicted felon.

Speaker 4 (02:10:58):
Just mind your business for the rest of your life.
But he wanted he wouldn't have wanted to leave Harry.
I think he would have wanted to have some kind
of a relationship with Harry.

Speaker 2 (02:11:06):
So he does because he's the don't get me going
on serious.

Speaker 1 (02:11:12):
I can't wait for like ten years from now when
my kids are listening to this podcast and they're like, so, Dad,
you wanted everyone to forge you can hate it. That's
gonna be a weird one. Yeah. Yeah, so Sydney, Just

(02:11:33):
so you know, Sydney's not laugh sorry whatever, all right, Yeah.

Speaker 2 (02:11:38):
No, the question is going to be, so could you
remind me how how how you would hide a dead body?

Speaker 1 (02:11:45):
Dad?

Speaker 2 (02:11:47):
You said something on that podcast thing.

Speaker 4 (02:11:50):
That you want.

Speaker 1 (02:11:52):
Telling you right now my babies need to have a
dead body and help them. So all right, you.

Speaker 4 (02:11:59):
Heard it here?

Speaker 1 (02:12:00):
Oh boy?

Speaker 2 (02:12:02):
Evidence, yeah boy, And maybe that's the note we leave
this episode.

Speaker 1 (02:12:07):
Or would you take that one out and way before
all of this would be great, Catherine.

Speaker 4 (02:12:11):
Let's not implicate anyone here.

Speaker 2 (02:12:15):
Okay, So she's going to cut to this after a
long silence and the listeners will just be left with
what were they talking?

Speaker 1 (02:12:23):
It will just be voice, none of you. It's just
me rambling about murderers and Hodden bodies, and that's going
to be.

Speaker 3 (02:12:30):
The blue response.

Speaker 4 (02:12:31):
So there you go.

Speaker 2 (02:12:33):
Yeah maybe anyway. Monica, thank you so so so much
for being here. We hope you had a good time.

Speaker 3 (02:12:39):
Had so much fun. Thank you guys for having me.
It was a great time, great conversation.

Speaker 2 (02:12:45):
Good. We always like when we don't turn people off
from podcasting, so.

Speaker 3 (02:12:48):
That this is fun.

Speaker 1 (02:12:50):
Good.

Speaker 2 (02:12:51):
Please tell our listeners where they can find you online.

Speaker 3 (02:12:54):
Oh yeah, I'm mostly just on Instagram. My handle is
mischief monocat and you can find me on bear. How
do you spell that mischief so and then monic kat
but with an extra sy. It's just like my last
name in there. So m O and I c c at.

Speaker 2 (02:13:14):
Awesome, cool, Thank you, thanks having yeah, Thank you so again.
Thank you so much. You were great.

Speaker 3 (02:13:21):
Thank you.

Speaker 4 (02:13:22):
Well. Our next episode, we are going to be going
back to the Goblet of Fire chapter twenty one, which
is the House Help Liberation Front. So we're taking a
bit of a turn here, a big leap away from
rats Onto Helps and.

Speaker 1 (02:13:39):
Don't forget that. You can follow us on pretty much
any social media outlet at Alohim or MN or on
Facebook at Open the Dumbledore and please remember to subscribe,
save and share this episode with your friends. And with that,
this has been episode sixty one of the final one hundred.
I'm Josh, I'm Shamani.

Speaker 2 (02:13:59):
And I'm Cat. Thank you for listening to episode four
hundred and sixty one of Alohamra.

Speaker 1 (02:14:04):
What are you doing?

Speaker 2 (02:14:06):
I'm just opening the Dumbledore, opening the Dumbledore likely story.

Speaker 5 (02:14:25):
Aloha Mora is produced by Tracy Dunstan. This episode was
edited by Katherine Lewis. Alohamra was co created by Noah
Freed and Kat Miller, and is brought to you by
APWB d LLC.

Speaker 1 (02:14:47):
Likely Store. Sorry, let's do I want it? Because he
says the same thing, so I would like I'll say
opening the Dumbledore as a question and then likely story.

Speaker 2 (02:14:58):
Okay, okay, you can just do your line again.

Speaker 1 (02:15:01):
Oh I can. I can't do that editing. That's crazy,
Monica my first episode ever, how about that

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