PS/SS, 2 Revisit: Magical Puberty

Episode Transcript
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(00:17):
This is episode three hundred and seventyfour for Alohamoura from May twentieth, two
thousand and twenty three. Wow,welcome to another episode of Alohama the Phantom's

(00:41):
original Harry Potter Book Club. I'mTracy Dunstan, I'm Alison Singurd, and
I'm Jeff Hutton. And our guesttoday is a familiar one to you if
you hang out in our forums,which you should because some of our best
comments have come from Davy b.Jones. It's David. Hi, David
Bakay, back again for my uhsex episode chart. That is a good

(01:07):
amount of episodes. Happy early Birthday, Ye yes, Happy early birthday,
David. You've done Escape, Order, Goblet audience listener, and then this
so this think this is my verynice roster of episodes. People should go
check those out. So if foranybody who might be a little bit newer
or hasn't heard from you in awhile, why don't you go ahead and
give us your house stats? What'syour house, favorite book, favorite movie,

(01:32):
favorite thing that you've been watching lately. My house has changed over the
years. I started off Griffin Door, then a few years later I changed
the able path. Now riding theplot and I'm going to try again another
two of the years. See whyI get all right? Book collecting all
the House like that. Yeah,my favorite book is of the Harry Potter

(01:56):
sers is a tie between Goblet ofFire and Daffy Hollow. My favorite movie
is Prisoner of Basketban. Very goodas it should be. Yes, Yeah,
recently I've been watching Star Wars visionsbut just recently came out. It's
so good, everybody, if youlike Star Wars, which one is that
it's animated? Shorts start by differentanimation studios from all across the world.

(02:19):
Last time they were all Japanese studio, so they're like Stars anime, and
now this season is just different animationone. So there's one from Spain.
There's the Irish studio behind Academy Awardnominee socol the sees to what it tells,
I think you've got one best tomur that did Kora. You've got

(02:42):
um Studio eighty eight, You've gotsome a ton of different animation studios.
You've got Artiman Animations, Walls inGrommet, and they're all like really good,
very cool. Well, we're gladthat you were here with us.
Today, David, because we aregoing to have a very interesting chapter discussion
about out the second chapter of Sorcerer'sStone or Philosopher's Stone if you prefer the

(03:05):
Vanishing Glass, and talk about ablast from the past. You guys,
we have not discussed this chapter sincethe very first episode of Alohama, episode
number one, Urdle the Turtle.That episode came out on April twenty fourth,
two thousand and twelve. And herehow's this for a host roster Kat,

(03:27):
Noah, Caleb and guest Hope fourg Hello, and welcome to Alohama,
a new podcast brought to you bythe staff of MuggleNet dot com and
Harry Potter fans all over the world. This is episode one. My name
is Noah Friend. I'm a staffmember at MuggleNet dot com for the past

(03:47):
four years. I work on fanart and MuggleNet editorials. And I'm Kat
Miller. I live in Massachusetts andwith MuggleNet just over five years, and
I'm mostly do fan of the Weekand I opened the news and I'm Caleb
Graves. I live in Washington,d C. I'm work on Muggle Matt
Interactive for the past five years,muggole Matt for the past year. So

(04:10):
without further ado, let's let's startthis this week. We're starting with chapters
one, two, three Philosopher's Stone. Are you guys ready, Absolutely so
ready. I remember listening to thatepisode for the first time. That was
I meant to Relsten before we gothere. I failed to do that because

(04:31):
I cannot, for the life ofme remember why it was called Gurdle the
Turtle. Oh, no, Ihad. I listened to it yesterday.
No, I had a whole thingabout. Nay, it would be something
about like turtle abuse or something.I think that. Okay, No,
that makes sense because in that inthat episode, they actually discussed the first

(04:54):
three chapters Stone thing. Yeah that'sright, okay, yeah, poor turtle
that goes through It was amongst thestuff that Harry was yeah doing when he
was like, this is what happenedwhen I was talking my cover. Yeah
yeah. Well, before we getinto our chapter discussion, we need to
thank our Patreon sponsor for this episode, Leah Jamison. Thank you for sponsoring

(05:20):
our episode and also I believe theyare brand new for the month of April
as a patre so we'd love tosee that, So thank you for joining
our team of Patreon supporters and anybodylistening can get an ad free version of
a loo Homa or watch this incrediblycool looking video of our recording if you

(05:41):
head over to Patreon and you becomea sponsor for as little as two muggle
dollars a month, and you cango to patreon dot com slash alo Homra
for more information. And before wejump into our episode, we need to
do our shout out Maxima. Thisis from episode three hundred and seventy two

(06:02):
formal Can't Talk former Beatle current buttonwith those Jeff Grace and Kat and our
comments was, Yeah, that's agreat title. Our comment today comes from
no need to call me Sir,Professor, which is like the Chef's kiss

(06:26):
of user names. And it starteda really great conversation on the thread because
there's so many awesome questions that theyasked. So here's the comment. What
if Lockhart had successfully wiped Harry andRon's memories and written a book about it,
saving students stories by Gildroy Lockhart,Harry and Ron would spend the rest

(06:48):
of their lives in Saint Mungo's.Presumably, would Ron have ever gone to
Egypt. Would would Scabbers appear inthe Daily Prophet? Would Sirius have escaped
Askaban? Would Peter go back toVoldi? Would VOLDI ever return? Would
Bartie Crouch Junior ever be free fromhis father? Could Gildoy Lockhart have inadvertently
saved the Wizarding World by assaulting Harryand Ron and writing a book about it?

(07:11):
Would VOLDI target him since he wasthe conqueror of Harry Potter? What
would happen to diary riddle? Wouldhe come back to life, look for
his present myself and come back twoyears earlier with the help of himself?
Would he still target Harry for kidnapping? Is Harry safe in Saint Mungo's Would
Hogwarts have closed? Would Haggard haveever been released from Askaban? Would anyone

(07:32):
ever find the Chamber of Secrets?Perhaps moaning myrtle would tell the Ministry what
happened? Would the Ministry, whobelieved her I know she saw them enter
the chamber? Would she shared thechamber's location with Dumbledore and Fudge? Would
Lockhart share that information? Could theMinistry take down the basilisk? I'm assuming
Dumbledore could, But would the ministryslash Dumbledore run into diary riddle or would
they be too late? So thankyou for joining us for another episode of

(07:55):
Alohama. Oh my gosh, somany, so many us. Yeah,
I mean it's an interesting point.I mean it's it's a point in the
series where, you know, thankgoodness, things worked out the way that
they did, Thank goodness. Youknow that that bit of foreshadowing was planted

(08:18):
early on in the book, andRon was stuck with this busted one instead
of getting a brand new one likea normal wizard from a normal wizard family.
Whatever that means. Compared Yeah,compared to a lot of people.
Yeah, they probably are. ButI mean their point is well made.
If Lockhart had succeeded in putting thismemory charm on Harry and Ron, there

(08:41):
is one little like when you werereading off this excellent list of things that
never would have been, there wasone little moment that splintered off in my
mind though, what happens when hegets back upstairs and Dumbledore sees a hairy
and Ron that have clearly had amemory charm put on that? Because I
think Dumbledore would recognize that these twokids have had a memory charm put on

(09:05):
them, And that's when I thinkhe would put two and two together and
say, Okay, this guy didsomething to these kids, and I'm going
to vary a serum his butt andfigure out what is going on here.
I think Dolder knows how to reversememory charms. Well see that is that
possible? Well see, that's that'ssomething that I feel like. I've heard

(09:26):
people argue different sides of the factthat the memory charm that Lockhart ends up
putting on himself that he never recoversfrom. Is it because it was done
with a busted wand or is itbecause the memory charm really was that powerful.
Because one of the things that hasalways kind of bugged me, one
of those oh Harry just never thoughtto mention it things, is Lockhart goes

(09:50):
to Saint Mango's, he's there foreverstuck with a memory charm, and Harry
and Ron never think, Hey,we should probably tell somebody that they should
try these people down that he trackeddown and un memory charm them. I
feel like, well, we knowfrom the backstory that Dumbledore knew Lockhart was

(10:11):
a fraud, and so I feellike Dumbledore probably once he had proof of
it, he kind of like sentthe feelers out to take care of that.
It's a metamory charm, not reversiblebecause it's just a good one,
or is it because it backfired?Do we think that Lockhart would be able
to undo the memory charm? Sisters? It was the one who cast it

(10:33):
it? So, do we thinkthat Jumbledore could force Guilderware Lockharts to try
to undo them charm? Like?Could it is possible to reverse the bury
charm by the person who cast it? We've never been given any reason to
think that a memory charm works differentfrom other kinds of magic in that the
only person that can undo it isthe person who did it. That's why

(10:54):
they teach counter charms encounter curses topeople who are going into training to be
something like an orror, because ifyou encounter dark magic in spells that you
have to undo as an orror,but you can't undo certain kinds of magic
unless you're the cast, then that'sgonna limit your ability to be useful in

(11:16):
any way. Yes, So yeah, my thought was is it only because
that spect My original thought of isit only irreversible specifically because that fired?
Or if it had been done correctly? On Harry and Ron would have been
able to be reversible since it wouldn'thave that fired. I think the splintered
one definitely factors into it. Imean, this is why they have books

(11:41):
on magical theory that they used toteach the kids. We know that.
I think there's probably something in magicaltheory to suggest that the type of magic,
the strength of the magic, andthe vessel through which the magic travels
in order to accomplish its task probablyall play some kind of role in the
effect that the magic has. Lockhartused a very powerful spell, but he

(12:03):
used a splintered wand and he wasvery very I almost even wonders with sometimes
of magic, does it matter thatit was close range as opposed to far
away because it doesn't have to travelthrough space, time or any other kind
of energy in order to reach itstarget and have its effect. But Lockhart,
he just coboomed himself right in theface basically. And also, I

(12:26):
mean the broken wand definitely has animpact there, you know, like Ron
should not have been using the wandall year. Yeah, thank goodness when
he like thinking about another example ofmagic use with that kind of wand that
we see, Thank goodness that Rondoesn't end up belt slugs for the rest

(12:48):
of his life. But I mean, making somebody belts slugs seems much much
less potent than a memory charm,because Haggard just throws him a bucket and
says, there's nothing to do,but wait until it stopped. Kids.
Well, it's not even really acharm he does. He just says eat
slugs, which I think is moreakin to like childhood magic, you know
that they do without wands kind ofaccidentally, yeah, which seems to be

(13:13):
easily reversible for the most part,So it just gets that extra kick I
think from having the one to bechanneled through crazy What do you think I
can't agree with what you guys aresaying. I don't have anything really specific,
No, I thought. I thinkthis is a great example of like
the ripple of act basically, andthat really just gets laid out by no

(13:39):
need to call me sir professors.I mean, but that's that's kind of
what makes books fun, you know, in stories applicable to life, Right,
you tweak one little thing, andhow big are the ripple's gonna go?
What's going to change? Butterfly effect? That's yeah, watch the butterfly
effect or or don't because that movieis kind of just just read just read

(14:03):
a Sound of Thunder by Ray Bradberrybecause that's where that phrase comes from anyway,
So just read that story. Doyou want to maybe go through the
list of questions and answer some ofthem directly? I would love to,
but I think we will be hereall night if we do. Yeah.
I was actually about to say.What I think we should do. Is

(14:24):
everybody who is listening to this,who sees this comment on our forums,
pick a thread and tug at it. Choose your favorite what if question from
that whole thought and just tug itthat thread and see where it goes.
Because this basically this has opened upa cornucopia of fan fiction ideas like just

(14:46):
write it out and see where itgoes. I love the way that they
choose to ward things like diary riddleand like House of Boldy, like very
nice, is really good? Well, thank you so much to no need
to call me, sir professor forthat awesome comment. And again, go
visit our website, go add tothe conversation. Um, yeah, pick

(15:11):
one of these things, open thebox, see what's inside. Three guns
should do it? Chapter revisit chaptertwo, get up the vanishing Glass.

(15:33):
No. Ten years have passed sincethe events of chapter one, and we
get our first glimpse of the dreadfulDursleys and their treatment of Harry. We're
also introduced to Harry for the firsttime as well. In this chapter it's
Dudley's birthday and Harry gets tagged alongto the zoo for the day, and
then we get a hint of themagic inside Harry as he manages manages to
unknowingly free a snake at the zoo, causing chaos free the snakes. We

(15:56):
also get a very brief history ofunfortunate incidids, well unfortunate depending on what
side of it you're on, withthis magic that bursts out of Harry.
And it's interesting you always they alwaystalk about how around that age, around
seven, that's when they say magicusually starts to show itself. But I

(16:19):
mean take Neville for instance, lateron in this book, he describes one
singular instance of oh, that wasthe moment that I knew. But with
Harry, we keep getting oh,this keeps happening, and it keeps being
super inconvenient for these people who aretrying to keep it from happening, which
I get it. That's part ofthe comedy of the story. These people

(16:42):
are awful and they don't want magic. So oh, guess what in your
face? Shrunken sweater in your face? I know how to teleport? I
don't know I know how to dothat, but apparently I do know how
to do that. It just itmakes me wonder is it typical with children
one they show they have that magic. Do these things just keep happening and

(17:04):
they can't control it? Or onceyou notice it, is there something about
the nurturing effect of Okay, goodfor you, sweetie, you've just blossomed
into magic. Puberty. Now let'shave the talk before you go to school.
Yes, yeah, puberty was notthe catch Actually, you know what

(17:29):
I was going to say, that'snot the catch word here, but it
might have been. I think Harryactually has more than normal in some ways
because his always comes out as aform of self preservation, you know,
like it's always it's and I thinkwe've we learned that it's usually connected to
high emotions in case, and Harry'sgoes through a lot of things that brings

(17:56):
out high emotions that he's had tolearn over ten years to really suppress and
so I think, Yeah, hiskind of bursts out more than normal,
you know, because it's always thingslike it talks about in this chapter,
that terrible haircut, and he doesn'tsleep that whole night because he's worried about
facing more bullying at school the nextday, and he wakes up in its

(18:18):
back. Right, he doesn't wantto wear yet another ugly hand me down
from Dudley, right, and soit shrinks. Right. It's that strong
emotion that's tied to this abuse he'ssuffering. I mean, he's trying to
escape Dudley's gang, so he triesto jump behind the bins and instead ends
up on the roof. Right.It's always related to these situations for Harry

(18:42):
that are very kind of something he'shad to learn over those truly awful ten
years if you really think about it. Of he's in an abusive situation and
he has to try and survive,and these things start happening at moments where
it can help him to survive whathe's going through, which is so sad.

(19:07):
That was exactly Alison, that wasexactly the answer that I was that
I was in need of. It'sit's the response to the situation that forces
the magic to manifest the way thatit does. But that makes the instance
that we get that forms the titleof the chapter, the Vanishing Glass,
all that more interesting because Harry getslike, with the sweater, it's so

(19:27):
he doesn't have to wear it withthe hair, it's so he doesn't have
to wear it. With the teleportingonto the roof, it's so that he
can't get beat up. But whenDadley pushes him out of the way and
he vanishes the glass, that's notreally defending himself against anything. That feels
more like magical trickery. I thinkthis is one of the first time that
it's because Harry wants something to happenspecifically, Like obviously, yes, it's

(19:51):
tied to the abuse into the fastsituation of that he's in. Well,
I think this is the first timeof him actually wanting specifically to get revenge
and Dudley, And then I disagree. I think it's because he doesn't push
him. Dudley doesn't push him.It says he punches him in the ribs.
Yeah, and so I think there'sthat. And also I think Harry

(20:14):
was bonding with the Boa Constrictor andthen all of a sudden that gets taken
away, right, He had justhad that bonding moment, so I think
that emotion was high plus than thehurt of getting punched in the ribs.
And so yes, it just kindof springs out because again high emotions.
And I think that's also he wantsto free the snake because he identifies with

(20:36):
the snake also being looped up incaptivity as well. Yeah, there's probably
some of that too happening, youknow. And it's it's so interesting because
if we compare these early instances ofHarry's magic with things like, um,
I mean, the first one thatcame to mind was in the Prince's Tale,
we see Lily just like doing funnythings with flowers, right and just

(20:57):
making them move where. You know, magic in that early stages, if
you are living in a safe environment, can be that kind of fun,
silly stuff. But Harry has hadto repress so much and has been so
abused that it does just kind ofburst out to help save him. And

(21:17):
I wonder almost what it would havelooked like if the Dursleys had actually explained
to him. First of all,if they had actually explained to him,
this is the thing we don't wantfrom you, so this is the thing
you have to try to make nothappen, because they are doing a very
poor job of explaining that. Andalso they're trying to squash the magic out
of him by making him miserable,because, in Vernon's words that he uses

(21:41):
in a later book, he wantedto turn him normal, but he never
stopped to consider that it might makeHarry more like them, which is their
idea of normal. If they couldhave tried to show him the benefits of
being more like them and less likehimself, but they don't think that far
ahead. No, And I alsothink that because everything that Dursleys do comes

(22:03):
out of their fear, because theydon't understand anything about magic. It definitely
is the type of fear that's bornout of ignorance. And so I think,
because they have no clue how manyof this works, I think they're
almost trying to, like more squashthe spirit or the personality out of him,

(22:25):
because I think they, I mean, the only wizards they've ever really
known are James and Lily right,and so I think if they're trying to
kind of squash, you know,that very bright, vivacious, spirited type
of personality that James and Lily had. They think that's going to squish the
magic, right. I think they'realso trying to misdirect their anger because they

(22:45):
never Petunia never gets closure on herrelationship with her sister, but Vernon also
never gets the For Vernon closure ishe got the last word? He got
to one up somebody who up TimAnd he's had I think, beef with
James for you know, showing himup and taking the mickey out of him

(23:07):
for some time, and he neverhe never got to Yeah, he never
got to Yeah, yeah, henever he never got his He never got
to have the last laugh with James. So now he takes it out on
Harry. Well back to the glassfor a second. I feel like,
almost like if story wise, Ifeel like this is the author's way of
quickly showing you Harry's personality because Ithink, yeah, almost like this is

(23:30):
his first deliberate spell in a way, so it's like the first spell he
does is trying to help this snakeas opposed to try to help himself.
So I feel like that was thequick little way to be like, it's
a Harry, Harry, such asweet cinnamon role. I love him,
yeah, yeah, And I likeI can buy that if we if if
we can't agree. That was avery unconscious impulse from Harry, like yeah,

(23:53):
get the snake out of here,but then I could buy that.
Yeah. Well, I think that'sone of the first time that's more intense
l then the other stuff, whichthere's intent behind it, but this one
feels like more other than like thejumping on this removes thing. This is
a look of a more active intent. I think it definitely is. I
mean yeah, because I think somewhere, even if he didn't think about it,

(24:18):
Harry was trying to free the snakebecause he didn't want Dudley and Peers
to bother it. Right, theyhad tried to bother it before, and
then they got boards, they walkedaway, and now all of a sudden
they've come back because now it's interesting. And Harry's like, leave this little
thing alone, Like I want youto leave me alone. But that's another

(24:44):
thing. We should probably jump backto the top of the chapter at some
point. This is something that's alwayskind of bothered me. One of my
favorite cartoons when I was growing upwas The Wild Thornberries, because the one
power I would have wanted to havemore than any of the power is the
power to talk to animals. Herewe have a ten year old boy almost
eleven, who is about to findout he is a wizard. He doesn't

(25:08):
know that yet, but he istalking to a snake and the snake is
understanding him. Once you had thatexperience, would you not then try to
go talk to other animals and seewhat would happen. Here's the thing,
I think again that goes back toHarry being abused. Right, so much

(25:30):
of his curiosity has been repressed allhis life because he keeps basically being told
to shut up anytime he asks questions. So I think he very much tries
to just stay to himself, andif there's anything strange or unusual, he
is not going to bring it upto anyone, right, And I think
too, in some regards that thatis just a thing as a kid,

(25:52):
right, Like something happens you don'tquite know how all the world works yet,
and so you're just like, oh, okay, like I guess this
happened, and I don't know why, and I guess we'll just move on.
The first question he asked is whathappened to his parents? And they
won't even tell him that. He'sjust like, I'm just not gonna trying

(26:15):
questions. Remember they told him don'task questions, and then Harry and then
the arison is literally like, don'task questions. That was the first rule
to a quiet life with the Jersey. So he doesn't ask questions because if
you ask a question, they'll tellhim not to ask a question, the
tell shelf, and then they willmaybe lock him in his cupboard or something,
so he doesn't ask any questions.And especially with children adolescent brains,

(26:40):
when you're suffering those kinds of thingsand you're in survival mode, like I
think Harry really is, parts ofyour brain cannot form correctly, right or
not. I'm not going to explainany of this right. Someone who's like
a neuroscientist or like works with this, please explain this better in our comments.

(27:02):
But that can really affect you,know, you're brain functioning. And
I can definitely see that being becauseI mean it's something that even when he
gets Harry doesn't even necessarily question magicever, right, he finds out he's
magical, and he's not like whoahold on? I mean, he's kind
of like, oh, that's whatI can do. But he doesn't have
the like big revelation moment. Ithink a lot of people would because the

(27:29):
Jerseys squashed that out of him.Yeah, I mean they he's had to
repress it and they kind of hasto kind of try and learn now that
throughout the series, and that's oneof the things that eventually leads to him
having such a difficult time in thefund above deathly hollows because he didn't ask
questions and all these questions that heshould have asked because of the Jersey's abuse,

(27:49):
and also and also because well youknow, he's a king, just
a certain things just generally when interesthim as well. But like, yeah,
it all really feeds into that preciousboy, I love him. Let's
go back to the beginning of thechapter. Yeah, the second biggest,
the second biggest time jump that weget this entire we only it's interesting,

(28:11):
it's fun. It's interesting to methat we do this this way. From
the first chapter to the second,we get a jump of ten years.
The only time we get a biggerjump than that, The only time we
jump years again is at the endof the series. Talk about full circle
when you jump from the last chapterto the epilogue nineteen years certally, where

(28:34):
the story begins, isn't it right? Chapter one is kind of a prolog,
you know, I've really thought aboutit that way. It's not called
a prolog because that sets up theexpectation there's going to be a prolog in
an epilogue every book that you're right, But it really is. It really
is a prolog to the actual story. And this is where the story really
kicks off. But even the toneis still slightly a little off, like

(28:56):
it has like I love the wordingof like, I think that one of
the first pages in the chapter,it says, yet Harry Potter was still
there asleep in the moment, butnot for long. It just kind of
has this like fairy tale like stillnot quite the way I feel like the
tone gets on later on in theseries, yeah, or even in the
book. It is almost kind ofa bridge, right, because I feel
like the first chapter feels like thata little bit, you know, has

(29:18):
that kind of fairy tale feel.I mean, apart from really drilling home
just how stuffy and unpleasant the Dursleysare. Like it's very much a chapter
of guess what You're gonna hate thesepeople? Because I know we meet Dumbledore
and McGonagall and Hagrid and they deliverHarry and they talk about you know,
what happened with Voldemort and all theother rumors that are circulating. And I'm

(29:42):
not saying I wish the first chapterdidn't happen. I actually quite enjoy the
first chapter. I'm just saying alot of the vital information we get is
either represented here or represented in otherchapters that come shortly after this. So
in terms of the information you needto take this journey, the book could

(30:03):
have started here. It could have. Personally, I'm a fan of a
prologue. I enjoy a prologue,But I'm just saying it could have started
here. It could have. ButI think then we eliminate some of the
mystery that keeps us reading. Yeah, which is the benefit of the first
chapter, right, is that thefirst chapter really establishes and treats the world

(30:30):
we're going to end up entering inthese books as normal, as kind of
the norm. And then as readersthen all of a sudden, we're here
now from Harry's point of view,and he knows nothing about this, and
so as readers were like, oh, well, he's going to discover it.
Obviously, when how how is thislike? Where the hints of it
about, which I think makes itfun and makes it really compelling as into

(30:53):
my first time ever reading the booksbecause actually, fun fact, this is
the chatter. After that, Iwhen my mom first friend made the books
that I had her stop at becausethere wasn't enough magic. And I wasn't
until like a half a year ora year later that I decided that I
wanted to start reading it again becausethe saw Chamber of Secrets cover in the

(31:17):
book in the library. This isall not enough magic, not enough magic.
We're done. Yeah, I justsome of the suns. It just
wasn't interested. It's like, whyare they going to this? Where isn't
there magic? Because there should bemore magic taught a lot of magic,
but a hindsight, there's actually quitea lot of magic. We already wanted

(31:41):
stuff that Harry does like to likeescape, which was always one of my
favorite which is now finally my favoritepart, one of my favorite parts of
the chapter because yes, like itwas all because of the abuse, but
I find each incident uniquely amusing andcharming. Yeah, especially the way that
they're described, and it's such agives such a good vivid imagination. That

(32:07):
brown sweater with orange like bobbles onit literally lives red free in my head
every time, at any time Isee anything that's like brown and orange,
my mind just goes directly to that, like, oh, terrible combination.
And then when he jumps onto theroof, I kind of want to talk

(32:27):
about this is like, it's kindof interesting to me that the headmass was
a headmaster, headmastress. Well,headmistress, head mastress. We're gonna get
there. We're gonna get there becauseI have a lot to say about that.
But Harry's just woken up and hehas to go to breakfast. They
make him cook, yes, yeah, which is what When I was ten,

(32:49):
my parents did not trust me tocook. They certainly would not have
had me do the cooking. Asa punishment. I did some limited things,
I mean, with some supervision.But I mean, don't you want
your I mean, Vernon Dursley.I'm not shaming anybody, just passing on
information. Vernon Dursley, Strikes andDudley are presented as two characters who like

(33:13):
to eat. I also would imaginethat these are two characters who aren't necessarily
going to be that picky about whatthey eat. But if you cook food
for them that is bad, they'redefinitely going to complain about it. Is
a ten year old boy cooking breakfastreally what they want? Well, I

(33:35):
mean it's probably in part so thatlike Petunia can be participating more in the
Dudley opening his presence stuff, youknow, and that, and I mean
it's also the person who cooks usuallyends up eating last, so that could
be part of it too, solike things aren't fresh and hot, and
you know, even more like afairy tale. You do the cooking,

(33:59):
you do cleaning, you eat last, and and we go to bed.
So I'm loving this Verdieral comparison.And but not to put a gabosh on
this thing, but is Harry reallycooking for breakfast? Because like the only
weekend is I'll have that right here. I want you to look after the
bacon and don't you dare let itburn? So is he It seems to

(34:21):
me like he's not actually cooking itspecifics. It feels more like Inmportunia starts
cooking and it's mostly doing the cooking, and then after she gets it started
up, she's like just watch overthis, but more of like assistant servant
like type thing just sort yeah,more like he's like a soux chef or

(34:42):
something. Yeah. Still, butI could tell I I would definitely have
burnt some bacon, and also Ishould not have been asked to pour coffee.
That was That was something that theychanged in the movie. She doesn't
say look after the bacon. Shesays, why don't you just cook the
breakfast and try not to burn anything. It's very yeah, it's very general.

(35:04):
I do think though, somebody broughtup that this doesn't continue throughout the
books, and I give me theidea. I was like, Oh,
as Harry starts to get more confidentand independent, maybe they were worried he
was going to poison them. Yeah, that was that was. That was
David that brought that up. Thatwas a thought I had that. I
was like, oh, yeah,they're probably terrified he'd do something to the

(35:27):
sore Uncle Vernon. Eat this cupcake. It's got sprinkles. It's fine,
especially for you. Now. Thismountain of presents though that Dudley's working with.

(35:51):
Between that, the fact that they'realways talking about, like there's a
company car that they're admiring loudly.So the neighbors will hear and Dudley's going
to private school and they're shopping fora vacation home if they can get this
big deal with the builder. Inthe next one, I'm wondering, Vernon
Dursley has obviously got stacks on stacksof paper compared to compared to your average

(36:15):
citizen, and I'm wondering now,I'm wondering, does that mean he actually
is wealthy or is he more wealthyin the way that Tom Haverford from Parks
and Wreck is where he's probably justgot mountains of horrendous credit card debt and

(36:36):
he returns everything the next day becauseit's all it's all just for looks.
I'm thinking, how much how muchdoes he actually have in terms of his
net worth? I'm thinking maybe notrich, but like he is like he
seemed like like a managing director orsomething. He's the director of the company.
Yeah, yeah, Is he likethe director of the company or is

(36:58):
he a I want to back.He seems like somebody who would save his
money and kind of have like astockpile. And it's not like he have
friends, like a miser, Likehe's just afraid of being poor, so
he well I mean, if itwere not for Dudley. Dudley seems to
be that That's that's what makes mewonder though Dudley seems to be their one

(37:19):
constant extravagance. They don't mind flauntingsomething if they've got it. So the
neighbors will be jealous because they're tryingto keep up with the Joneses or whatever
the British equivalent of that is.But they clearly they want Dudley to be
happy, so they'll buy him whateverhe wants. They send him to the
private school, not because it's expensive, but because they think it's going to
you'll help boost their status. It'swhere Vernon went, It's where I'm guessing

(37:42):
his family probably went too. SoI had a friend in elementary school who
was spoiled and her parents did somethingsimilar and they were like probably like just
middle class or even lower middle class, and they just spend all their resources
on her just to kind of,yeah, I keep happy. I think
it's a combination of different things.Um. I think they're they're obviously pretty
well off. Um it was alsothe nineties, you know. I definitely

(38:09):
think some of it is just toshow off that they're better off than other
people. Um. You know,real wealth doesn't scream right um, and
private schools in the UK are slightlydifferent. Um, so I don't know

(38:30):
how much the tuition would be necessarilyif that's like the same way as we
look at it in the US.UM. And as for you know,
here we're looking at specifically Dudley's thirtynine presents. I can definitely see um
because some of them are from otherpeople, right. We know that at

(38:51):
least one is from Aunt Marge,and so I can definitely see Petunian Vernon
being the type of people that likepressure they're relatives to send expensive gifts for
every holiday. You know. They'rethe type who like, send out the
email to everyone and are like,Duddy Kins has this list, you must
spend at least fifty dollars on himfor his birthday. You know. Yeah,

(39:15):
no, I did not consider that, but that that's an excellent point.
They probably are the kind of peoplewho pressure other people into buying gifts
for their son, and definitely,like you know, they seem like especially
Vernon seems like he comes from thetype of family that spoils materially and thinks
that's good instead of offering any attentionor affection. Yeah, because the ability

(39:37):
to it's it's an extension of theiridea that the one who can provide is
the one who has value, becauseit means you have means and you use
those means to remind other people throughmaterial things. You have this because I
gave it to you. Yeah.Now I did find one thing. It's

(39:59):
m I've never known how to pronouncethis website, the one that spelled q
u o r A Cora Cora.I repronounced it. But I found a
post that apparently has gotten quite someattention that was written about five years ago
from someone who actually lives in Scotland. Her name is Casey Callahan, and
she was able to shed some particularinsights on how much money they might actually

(40:23):
have. According to Cassie, misterDursley is the director of a company with
an office on the ninth floor,which shows that the company he is the
director of is quite large, albeitprobably not the largest company in the part
of the world where they live.And like I said, this was written

(40:44):
five years ago, but according toCassie, the average company director salary in
the UK as of twenty eighteen wouldhave been about one hundred thousand pounds,
so again not the wealthiest guy,but places him in about the forty percent
tax bracket. And given the housethat they live in which they bought,
I think it says here that theybought it in nineteen seventy seven, do

(41:07):
we know, like from the apocrypha, is that about when they probably would
have bought the house only around there? Yeah, when Dudley was won.
So they've had it since the firstchapter. Yeah, that's it. And
I think it says they bought itafter they got married. Yeah, they
bought it after they got back storyand a house with as many rooms and
as many accommodations and other things thatthey have by comparison, again there's twenty

(41:31):
eighteen. Some things have changed infive years, but at that point it
would have been about two hundred andfifty thousand pounds would have been the value
of these Tory tell me about it, and then he sends it. I
mean, he sends his kid toa private school, and it's like you
said, private schools work a littlebit differently over there. He's not going

(41:52):
to potentially eaten like justin Finch Fletchley. But still you have to pay a
bit at least to send your childto a private school, and this is
a private school that based on howproud of it they are. I don't
think it's just he's going to thesame school that his father went to.
I think there's something about this schoolthat makes it stand out from other private

(42:16):
schools. So I just looked upwhat the dollar equivalent of how much this
post says their house would have costtwenty thirteen. Yeah, I know how
much their house it will cost inUS dollars. Yes, yeah, about
three hundred and sixteen thousand, that'ssee, and it is it. Oh

(42:42):
my gosh. Oh, don't askme what my house is worth. Don't
ask me. We would pay forit three hundred and sixteen Oh my god
for a four bedroom house with afront and a backyard. Granted, UK
houses are usually smaller on average thanlike US houses. We like our sprawl,

(43:04):
they're they're they're a bit cramped togetheras well. I think, still
sad, sad millennial times. Anyway, then just ah, okay, So
to the point, Yeah, Imean the point is Vernon Dursley seems to
me like somebody who might actually havea little bit of a head. He's

(43:29):
probably really they pride themselves on beingnormal in terms of their net worth and
their fiscal responsibility. It seems likeactually this is a pretty good indicator of
how average they actually are. Theyknow how much money they've got, they're
not investing it in trying to becomethe wealthiest, because the spot in life

(43:50):
that they have carved out for themselvesis where they're comfortable. They're not trying
to be high society. They're they'rejust trying to exists in the part of
life that they know. They're verymiddle class exactly, like the middle is
their comfort zone. They don't wantto be high, they don't want to
sink into poverty, which is why, like to Tracy's point, I don't

(44:10):
think Vernon Dursley is a miser becausethe like that typical image, like think
Ebenezer screwed. So that's where thatyou know, term really comes from.
People who acquire vast amounts of wealthand then never they don't spend it on
anything, they don't do anything withit, they're very cheap. Those are
people who want to be wealthy justso that they are never poor. And

(44:34):
I don't think that's what we're dealingwith here. I think this is just
a guy who maybe he doesn't recognizeall the blessings that he has. He
might feel a little bit entitled inthat way, but in terms of the
money that he's got, it's veryit's very average. Yeah. So the
title of the chapter is the VanishingGlass, which is admittedly the biggest like

(44:54):
thing that goes wrong in this chapter. But really, this trip to the
zoo completely falls apart before it evengets started. Oh yeah, like as
soon as we find out we're goingto the zoo. It is because this
trip to the zoo is already offto a terrible start because Missus Fig has

(45:15):
broken her leg. Poor Missus Figis Missus Fig in the chapter, the
previous chapter. She is right inthe next one. Okay, she's in
the next one because Dudley knocks herover right, Okay, So I'm gonna
say it'd be cool, yes forshadowing, we don't, Yeah, we
don't find out any This is theforeshadowing basically for Phoenix. So basically like

(45:39):
there's a ton of foreshadowing and stuffing, like characters that get introduced in this
moment. So we get that,we get missus Fig. Uh I wrote
down a bunch of them. UhSo we get that we get a large
as well. The first mission ofthat, Mrs Miss fig someone added deadlist
Diggles and actually, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yea, yeah,

(46:00):
yeah yeah. Guys, I gotso excited when I figured this out.
N But yes, I got soexcited when I figured this out.
They don't even mention him by namein this moment, but you know who
it is based on future interactions.But what I realized with Deedlest Diggle is
that he is one of the manyexamples of the power of the number seven,

(46:21):
because there are seven specific instances ofDeedless Diggle throughout the series. In
this first book, Oh That's fast, he is mentioned by name in the
first chapter, he is described inthis chapter, and then in the fifth
chapter of this book, Harry meetshim at the Leaky Cauldron. In Order
of the Phoenix, he is amember of Harry's Advanced Guard, and then

(46:45):
he's mentioned again when Moody shows Harrythe picture of the original Order of the
Phoenix that brings us up to five. And then in Deathly Hallows, he
escorts the Dursley's from Private Drive alongwith Hestia Jones, and it is mentioned
by Lupin that his house was burneddown by the Death Eaters. That's seven

(47:06):
also Ring theory one five and sevensay that, so I will say it
for her that fits Ring theory.I mean, I wonder if this was
on purpose or if this was totallyI would I would actually quite like to
find out that this was intentional,because of all the characters to do that

(47:27):
with detis I can see being likeon purpose as a fake out, like
to kind of like a red hair. Yeah, it's Marvin's all over again.
I do think though, since webrought up datalist Diggle, the mention
here this small little detail, Ithink it's fabulous where it mentions these strangers

(47:52):
in the street I mentioned Harry,and the way they're described, you know,
a tiny man in a violet tophat, an old woman dressed all
in green, a bald band ina very long purple coat. And this
was information that came out on originalPottermore that green and purple are the colors
that wizards used to help identify eachother in le society. And I love

(48:16):
that this early on, and Idon't think anybody had even really picked up
on it, you know, beforethat information came out on Pottermore. But
I love that tiny little bit ofworld building that is there, but also
is it there? Yeah, youknow. Um, it's just it's one

(48:37):
of those things that makes it feelso real, which is fabulous. I
also love that each of those descriptionsalso sounds like, um, Count olof
Henchman, that lemonade Nickett decided notyes, yes, that's who it really
is. It's Count all Off iscoming for her. That I would.

(49:00):
I'd love to read that. Yes. Anyway, anyway, are we off
to the zoo yet? Are wethere? Yeah? I think so.
Yeah, I think we're with aDudley's friend, Pierce, who I always
imagine looking like, uh, thatkid from a Christmas store, you know,
the bully. Yeah, that's that'salways I've always I've always imagined Pierce

(49:23):
because at least they mentioned like bratlitand so I don't want to look insult
like the actor because I do notthink they were really brow like, but
like, it just gives off thevibe. Oh no, it's it's fine.
They were cast. They were castto look a specific way, especially
back in the days when they madea Christmas story like, they were very
they were very unafraid of Look,this is a bully character. He needs

(49:45):
to look like a weasel, sothey pick a weasel looking kid. Yeah,
that's how that goes. He remindsme of either a anthropomorphized version of
Templeton from Charlotte's Web, because Ithink he's described as looking like a rat,
or possibly I don't know if there'sany people out there who have read

(50:05):
David Copperfield as many times as Ihave, but you're rye a heap from
David Copperfield just like that, reallylike this. This seems like a oily,
just pointing nosed kid who just getsoff on riding other people's coattails and
never wants to do the work.We don't get to know him well enough

(50:27):
to really be able to make thatmuch of an assessment, But on the
other hand, he does become oneof Dudley's most devoted cronies when his bullying
really starts to escalate, which wesee in the Panics. It's mentioned that
he's the person that holds people's ants, behid their back with all the punches
him. Yeah yeah, yeah,yeah, not not cool, not cool.

(50:50):
Yeah. I just won't get whythey didn't just leave Harry at home
for all the anks, saying theygo through about it. It's just like
I get that he's ten, sothere's that, but they don't think they
care because that'll come back and findthe house in ruins because they remember,
like like I know that he hasreally done an eight magic, but they're
constantly worried that he's going to domagic. So they're probably thinking if we

(51:13):
leave him alone, like in thehouse, maybe he'll do something magic.
Or I wonder if they're worried thatif they leave him alone, some magical
person will show up and take himand tell him the truth, you know
what. I would buy that morethan their excuse of finding the house in
ruins. Although we did establish earlierthat the magic that happens either from or

(51:36):
around Harry is in response to mostof the time him trying to protect himself
against something. And if they aren'tif they notice that, like if they
realize that, then they would actuallyget him at home, would actually be
their go to move because they're theones who upset him and frighten him,
and if they aren't there where heis, he has nothing to respond to

(52:00):
do his magic. And I don'tfeel like it happens enough time to warrant
like the fear because it's what likefour or five times every once in a
while, Like, I really don'tthink that, Like it just seems like
a cop out to me. Iget that she wants to do it for
the plot wise, but it's justlike, just leave him a home that
would make more of sense. SoI so I had a thought. I
had a really good thought of itholding on too. So when you mentioned

(52:23):
that maybe they're worried that someone magicis going to be taking him away in
Tom that he's magic, that actuallymade me think of something because like maybe
that is what they worried about.Because at the end of the chapter,
specifically when he's mentioning all the peoplethat he sees like in the people look
that people seemed to recognize him.Uh, it's specifically the tiny man than

(52:46):
the buller hat exercise the end,Petinia, if you're after asking Harry furiously
if he knew the man, wouldn'tthey want furiously if he knows this man?
So I'm like, maybe they dothink that. Maybe they do think
that because he seems to recognize him. So I think that might be an

(53:08):
actual fear that they have that someonemagic will exist and that if you leave
him alone. Maybe somebody will dothat Intelli's magic, I mean, getting
Harry out of their hair and makinghim no longer their problem would probably be
great. But they also seem tobe stuck on this idea that they can

(53:30):
turn him into not a wizard,because in Goblet of Fire, Harry asked
for permission to go stay with theWeasleys for the rest of the summer and
see the Quidditch World Cup, andit says in the text that Vernon Dursley
is fighting these two instincts, gettingHarry out of the house so he doesn't
have to look at him, orallowing Harry to do something that would make

(53:52):
him happy, which is something thathe has struggled against Harry's entire life.
So which one of those things ismore important? Turning Harry normal or not
having to look at him anymore.I'm thinking their desire to keep Hearing miserable
and beat him down superseds there wanta need to not have him around.
I really I think that's the case. I have a question for you guys.

(54:15):
Yes, have any of you evertried knickerbocker glory? No? No,
but I kind of want to.I've been to the UK a few
times, and I've never seen allthe dessert money for any of the restaurants
that I've specifically went to, soI've never had the chance, interesting Tracy,
have you ever, I've never seenit before. But the fact that

(54:37):
has jelly in it, I don'tknow if that doesn't sound so I feel
like it's the jelly that otherwise lookingat most descriptions, because Knickerbocker glory is
clearly one of those things that,like, you can do your own version
of it, and a lot ofpeople have different recipes for it, but
there is a basic, like acceptedformula that most people would probably agree constitutes

(54:59):
a knicker Locker glory. I feellike if I haven't had one, I've
had something like it. I cantell you Yeah. Knickerbocker Glory is one
of my favorite songs by the bandHawthorne and Holly, and they gave me
permission to do a version of it, which I then did. So when
we play at Misty Con together intwo weeks, we're going to do that

(55:21):
song on stage together in front ofEverybody's fantastic sound cool it is. It
is definitely one of those very verylike brit desserts. They love their layered
desserts, you know, trifle,eaten mess that kind of stuff. Yeah,
I mean, I the jelly doesn'treally throw me off because there's also

(55:42):
fruit in there. I mean youput jam or jelly on things like Victoria
sponge cake and things too, Like, right, what's Victoria's sponge cake?
Oh, Tracy, you've never hadVictoria sponge Oh I never heard of it.
I just made them today. Okay, So it's a vanilla sponge,
right, like a vanilla cake,and then you put buttercream frosting in the

(56:06):
middle, and then you do eitherraspberry or strawberry jam as well. I
will send you pictures because I mademini ones today. I will. I
will send you pictures. It's delicious. It's also like one of mary Berries,
uh like signature recipes. And Ilove that. It's a nass sponge,

(56:27):
is what you're saying. What it'sa nass sponge. Anytime they make
something with sponge cake on, it'ssomething about I think it's more Paul Hollywood
than Mary Berry. But I swearthey both did it. Show that.
Anytime they talk about the consistency ofthe sponge cake, it's always, oh,
that's a nass sponge. Nass sponge. But I got curious. Whenever

(56:52):
anytime this knicker Boker Glory has comeup, or anytime I think of the
song, I always think, Iknow what knick or Boker are. They're
like those short knee high pants,Like, why would you name a dessert
after that? So I looked itup. Some people do say that's what
it's named after, but they can'treally explain why. But a lot of

(57:12):
people also apparently think that it's calledthat because in the early nineteen hundreds there
was a hotel. This is theinteresting part. It wasn't a British hotel.
It was a hotel in Manhattan inthe early nineteen hundreds called the knicker
Bocker Hotel, and it had adistinct pink and cream color and two people
in the area at the time.Apparently this was a bit of a well

(57:37):
known hotel. It closed in nineteentwenty and then some time after nobody knows
who did it, not that Ican find, but there was Eventually this
ice cream dish was created and thecolors of the dish reminded people of the
hotel, so they started calling itknicker Boker Glory, and then they eventually
move over to the United Kingdom.And now what's funny is that the United

(58:00):
Kingdom seems to have knickerbocker glory asa dessert and we don't, because if
it weren't for this book, Inever would have heard of it. I
wonder if maybe another I mean,I've never heard that one, but I
think Knickerbockers used to be striped,so maybe that's part of it, because
it does have a very kind ofstriped good thing. Look. I don't

(58:22):
know. I do have to sayit's very interesting. So I often now
read the UK versions most of thetime, but obviously I grew up with
all the US ones, and I'veread those dozens and dozens of times.
In the US version it specifically saysthat it didn't have enough ice cream and

(58:42):
that's why Dudley throws a fit.But the UK version just says it wasn't
big enough and that's why he throwsthere was something else that I found was
that apparently part of what makes ita Knickerbocker glory is not just that it
has all these layers, but thatit's quite tall, like it has to
be a giant, like if we'rewe mentioned the Great British baking show already
if it's on the Great British BakingShow, like this is going to be

(59:06):
a show stopper. Yeah, atthe end of the episode. This thing
has to be like your knickerbocker glory, must be at least five feet tall,
and it has to stand up andnot melt because we're in a tent.
Oh gosh, don't throw out someoneelse's ice cream. What, Oh

(59:29):
my gosh. Sorry, No,it's okay. I think reference that shocker.
But it's it's always interesting to methese these small little things sometimes that
the US versions do to make theseunfamiliar things that they can't necessarily change.
In these early you know, whenthey were changing specific words, but when

(59:52):
they can't change it, then thethings they do change to make it clear
to a US audience. I thinkthat's just fascinating. I think it's I
think that's also trying to make itclear so that the US ones you can
kind of know what a nip bockerglory is. The note that it has
a stream minute and it's also interessaying the illustrative editions used the UK text.

(01:00:13):
Yes, with the exception, Yeah, with the exception of the still
Clay Sorcerer's still yes, So beforethey get into the zoo, they have
to go into the car. Sowe learned about this like flying medicial dream
that Harry has and the jury isreally really they get really angry at him
about this. So I think that'sjust another uh, it's showing of like

(01:00:36):
then trying to make Harry b relatable. Yeah that really yeah, really,
this chapter is all about making Harryrelatable to the audience. So in addition
to like the abuse we see Harrysoffer, like we get the stuff about
him being bullied and him getting pickedon and him having to like get the

(01:00:57):
handed me down close from Dudley thatI think that a lot of people,
just like younger siblings relate to Irelate to that specifically sometimes, Like I
just think that it's doing a reallygood job of making us really like Harry.
Yeah, I mean, it's itreally, That's one of I think
the purposes of this chapter is becausewe're gonna we're gonna follow him, yes,

(01:01:19):
for the next seven books, Soright away we need to be on
his side, right we need towe need to want to follow him.
I just don't know if I buythat he would remember being in the accident
because you're so young, and notthe accident. I'm sorry his mother dying.
I mean, I feel like itcould be one of those like unconscious

(01:01:40):
almost like repressed memories. Maybe yeah, maybe magical babies work. Maybe magical
memories and babies work a little bitdifferent than buggle Maybe magical people can remember
things a bit earlier than muggle Uhkids can. That's like an entry,
that's that's I mean some people,some people do have vague memories from when

(01:02:02):
they're like two and stuff. Yeah, I would say that, like in
terms of their like their neurobiology.That's one of the things that actually humanizes
because you don't want to go toofar off with things like that with witches
and wizards, because then you're almostimplying that they're a completely different species and
they're not. They're one of thethings that they really drill home, especially

(01:02:25):
in the later books, is youmay be Muggles, we may be witches
and wizards, but we're all humans. So I would think that this would
be one of the things that actuallygrounds Harry in his humanity and reminds you,
yes, he is a wizard boy. He is a boy of destiny.
He has to do all this otherstuff, but he's still a human
boy. Also, I'm wondering ifit might be tied to the Horcrux specifically

(01:02:51):
that he can remember so remember thathe was turned into a horcus. So
I wonder if the Horcrux is kindof tethering him to that, because Voldemort
is probably constantly thinking about this inhis like unbodied form, and maybe during
and potentially oh yeah, potentially duringthis chapter. What if this chapter is

(01:03:15):
around where the time that uh hefinds Quarrel, do you think that it's
possible maybe or or do we thinkthat that happened before? I swear we
put that somewhere in the timeline involume one of The Companion. It's across
the room for me, so Ican't check um, but I swear we

(01:03:39):
had a conversation about that. Okay, yeah, check the Companion. But
we do know that Harry often hearslike flashes of Voldemort's emotions, So maybe
Voldemort is thinking about specifically that nightis how he remembers somelf, So the
green flashes stuff, and like obviouslythat wouldn't like help remember the motorcycle.

(01:04:03):
But I do wonder some of thisis do to Harry happening to do horror
cruts. So maybe it's like normalkids wouldn't remember this, but because he's
especially has a horror cr he remembersit, and you should pay attention to
why he remembers this and what hedid. Yeah. Yeah, the horror
creishness of Harry I would buy asa reason why he can remember this more

(01:04:24):
than the fact that he has adifferent kind of brain because he's a wizard.
Yeah. Yeah, I like thatexplation a lot better too, because
it's less all these wizards are likeso different, because like, and it
really ties it to be more specificto Harry. I like that she's the
main character. Oh man, that'sfascinating. I feel like I have to
like rethink everything now, you know, with all this weird stuff that's happening

(01:04:48):
Harry, I know that it's avery hairy characteristic to not ask follow up
questions or to bring things up lateron down the line that he should probably
bring up again, Like, oh, by the way, Gilderoy Lockhart confess
to all these things he did toother people, y'all might want to look

(01:05:08):
into that. But if I wasa ten year old boy and weird stuff
like what happened to Harry, happenedaround me, and then I find out
I'm a wizard and I can domagic. I would be writing all this
stuff down, and then as soonas I find out I'm a wizard,

(01:05:29):
I'd be busting out the bullet points, like, Okay, so what exactly
does this mean? Like how didI do that? Is this something that
everybody could do? At the veryleast I would ask somebody about the snake
thing, because the other stuff likethe hair growing, maybe the sweater shrinking,

(01:05:49):
sure, the teleportation whatever, butpeople cannot talk to animals. He
talks to a animal, and henever asks an adult wizard. I know
it comes up in the next book, but at no point in this entire
first year of magical education does hethink to ask anybody. Oh, by

(01:06:11):
the way, can you guys talkto animals? Because I can talk to
animals? I think. Apparently hehasn't. Yeah. Yeah, it's tied
to the piece from the Jursdays don'task questions because we see this and like
like two chapters like when with alittle bit like Hagrid, when they're like
doing the boat thing, and here'sa lot of questions, like he's still

(01:06:33):
on that mindset throughout that year ofdon't ask questions, like even with the
school, but he asks tons ofquestions. When he's with Hagrid, he
asks him all kinds of questions.When he gets to school, when he
asks questions, Yeah, but heasks it's it's because all the questions I

(01:06:54):
think he asks to your point,and I think, actually to my point
also, I think it's because Harry'snot afraid to ask questions about other people
or about the world outside of himthat he's trying to connect back to who
he's becoming, but questions about whohe is. He doesn't seem to like
asking those questions because those, specificallyare the questions that he's been taught by

(01:07:16):
the Dursley's not to ask. Don'task about your parents. Because he can
ask some questions obviously, like doyou want me to make bacon or do
you want me to make sausage,they're not going to say don't ask questions
to that. It's questions about hisspecific path that they don't want to answer,
And those are the questions who doesn'twant to ask other people because it

(01:07:38):
always he becomes a wizard ask abouthis parents and I think you're Yeah,
I like your point because I thinkit goes back to he's taught not too.
I think I think some of ittoo, is he's in this first
book, he's kind of drinking froma firehose most of the time, right,
And I think to some extent,well, yeah, and I think
to some extent too, when you'retrying to left, then you get the

(01:08:00):
explanation magic, oh okay, rightlike that, Like I mean not all
kids are like that, but somekids are like that, you know,
like you can say this is theanswer, and they'll just be like,
all right, moving on, likeyou know. And and I think to
some extent to Harry in this firstyear doesn't ask about the snake a because

(01:08:21):
so much else happens to him inbetween and b you know, things are
just happening. And I think itspecifically says in Chamber he like suddenly remembers
when Ron and her mind you're likeyou're a person mouth and he's like,
what, oh, yeah, Idid talk to that snake once, didn't
I that's weird. I think it'slike he only talked to the snake once,

(01:08:43):
yeah, and that and that mightbe why because he might like,
well, probably it's not something thathe'd like forget because like, you know,
it's the kind of like a likea moment, but like it's probably
something that he doesn't think back onbecause it was the snake thing. He
probably remembers the venation thing glass partand thinks about that more than the snake

(01:09:03):
thing. But I think that isan interesting I just remembered though. Speaking
of that moment in Chamber of Secrets, Harry specifically phrases as as oh,
yeah, I once set a boaconstrictor on my cousin, which is really
because that's how they've done it afterthe fact. Yeah, he's so blusse

(01:09:25):
about it. He's just like,oh, yeah, that one time,
you know, set a boa constructoron Dudley whatever. If that's him trying
to make myself sound cooler because he'slike he's becoming a teenager, it's like
kind of No, I think that'sjust Harry. And you know, I'm
not like an expert on snakes oranything, but I mean, the danger

(01:09:45):
of a boa constructor is not necessarilyit's speed, because there are some snakes
who are very very very very fastand very deadly. The danger of a
boa constructor is if it wraps itselfaround you your screws. It can crush
you to death. Yeah, It'sconstrictors are mostly like they just hold on
until you're dead. But like,even somebody as unathletic as Dudley could probably

(01:10:09):
outrun a Boa constructor that's been keptin captivity, right, I mean probably,
But that Boa constrictor in the movie, though, that thing books it
out of there as soon as ithits the ground. It's like it does
no see a suckers, I'm leavingthis Zil. Although Brazil, although we

(01:10:29):
think about the implications of that snakesand almost help them captivity, probably wouldn't
be able to survive in the Yeah, so it's probably so. It's probably
so. It's probably would probably bea good thing for the sake of it
doesn't escape, because it would probablygo into the wall and die if it.
Do you think it ever got toBrazil? Did it or did it

(01:10:49):
get recaptured? I don't think thatthis gets through Brazil. I mean it
to Brazil because like this is likea children's story and stuff like that.
So that's what I want to havehappy for you. Like, does anyone
else think it's a little bit oddthat this snake knows the word amigo.
I think it's only just not getunderstand when the snake is on the way.

(01:11:11):
The only the only actual like wehear we see the snake understanding Harry,
but the only phrase we ever getfrom the snake is Brazil. Here
I come, thanks amigo. AndI'm like, this snake knows that one
word in Spanish, it's the auportune. It's the authors. It's the
author screwing up geography on locations theydon't speak. No amigo. Amigo is

(01:11:35):
Portuguese too. Amigo is also Portuguese. Yeah, yeah, okay, yeah,
okay, I apologize. Is Portuguesethe language that they speak in Brazil.
Yes, yes, but it's likedifferent from um It's different from the
portuge speaking Portugal. It has moresimilarities to Spanish than yeah, Portuguese from

(01:11:58):
Portugal too. It's it's kind oflike difference between like Central America, Latin
America, Spain Spanish, and likeSpain Spanish. Fascinating. But would they
all use the word amigo then,I mean, according to Google, yes,
I could text my friend who speaksport can't really trust Google, Well,

(01:12:18):
you can't really trust Google to translateeverything perfectly, but I think we
can at us trust Google for that. I will say I was just there
and I never heard anyone say amigo. But never I will text my friend
who speaks Portuguese. Right then,is this is this a serious Oh then
by the author that the author thinksthe snake would use the word amigo.

(01:12:41):
I mean, you gotta remember it'son the other side of the world from
her she's writing this. Yeah.But still, if you're going to pride
yourself on somebody who does your researchbefore you write something, then you got
to do your research before you're right. Well, I just I just texted
my friend who speaks some Portuguese,So well, there's a lot of doesn't
actually do research on that quits aboutanyway, let's bring that into it.

(01:13:08):
Fine, But I I I triedto remember, like what year we are
in. I don't think security cameratechnology was that sophisticated in the early nineties.
But I have an answer for theamigo question. Oh yeah, I
texted my friend who speaks Portuguese.Yeah, and she says, yes,
okay, they do use amigo,all right, Okay, And also the

(01:13:30):
author lived in Portugal for a while. True, that is true. That's
true. So she would there yougo, okay, well that solves that
then, Okay, so security camerasand the fact that they are not here,
because if I'm this zoo director andthis instance is described to me,

(01:13:50):
Glass is there one minute, Glassis gone the next minute, I'm gonna
go back and I'm gonna play thattape over and over and over and try
to figure out what the heck happenhappened. I mean, they clearly they
do not have Like I know,I live in Louisville. We have a
zoo here that is quite large andmany people come from a respectable distance to

(01:14:14):
visit it. So they probably havesecurity cameras in their in their snake habitat.
But in the nineties, in thiszoo, I don't know if they
would have necessarily had that. Imean, it's the London Zoo. It's
a pretty big zoo. That's that'sa really famous zoo, though, isn't
it. Yeah, like even inthe nineties, like well you know what,

(01:14:34):
even more so in then, Ifeel like there was probably more maybe
technology wasn't so sophisticated, But wouldyou say that it would probably have been
easier for a zoo to get fundingin the early nineties than it is now.
Yeah, so CCTVs and security cameraswere started first public available according to
GOO in nineteen forty nine nineteen fiftyone. So wow. So I'm not

(01:15:00):
I'm not sure how expensive they wouldbe, but I would assume that they
maybe not pointed at every single cage, but like maybe they would have security
systems of some kind. But also, what are they going to see?
The glass is there and then it'sgone, you know, like I know
they're really they're not going to beable to prove that it was Harry or

(01:15:21):
that any They're not going to beable to isolate it and say, see,
this is proof of something. Butjust if I'm the zoo director,
this is gonna be like the thingthat at the end of every week when
I've got some time to myself,I'm gonna pour myself a whiskey, sit
at my desk, and I'm justgoing to play this tape over and over
for several hours because I'm not goingto be able to get it out of

(01:15:43):
my head. I mean, peopleare pretty good at coming up with explanations
for things that can't be explained,right, So how would you explain this?
Then? If we know. Imean, we're we're the outside observers
here. We know that there's magic, we know Harry has these kind of
accidents all the time. But likeif we didn't know any of that,
and we were just some schmuck whowas running the zoo in the nineties and

(01:16:05):
we saw this happen. Who's runningthe zoo in the nineties. Yeah,
some schmuck who's running the zoo inthe ninety running the zoo in the nineties.
The episode tit No, I stilllike Magical Puberty Betters so far,

(01:16:27):
that's that's that's my favorite. SoFar too is more catching, and it's
like, um, well, doesanybody ever read or watch I'm Charmed with
the old one, not the newone. No, my my wife because
we found it in a used bookstore. We not only do we have the
complete series of Charmed, we havethe book, like I forget what it's

(01:16:48):
called. What's it called the Bookof Shadows? Yes, thank you,
we have. I mean it's abit torn in some places because it was
used, but that doesn't matter.The discs worked just fine. But we
have the complete series in the Bookof Shadows in our bedroom. She's got
that and I've got the Collectors setof the complete series of Game of Thrones.

(01:17:09):
They looked nice watch to each other. So I watched the first episode
of Charmed, and then most ofit is just like watching the movie.
Nights are retrospective on them because theyhave something called the Cleaners, where like
cleaners come back and they'll erase anythingthat happens that exposes magic. Something in
my head makes me feel like someonecame back and was like, let's erase

(01:17:30):
their memories so people don't ask toomany questions, especially because this Harry Potter
who did it too. Oh thatis a that is a really good,
that's tiant, that's brilliant. Theywouldn't know that he did magic because he's
got the trace on him. Yeah, that's fantastic. A great possibility that
the Ministry could go in and wipethe people's and change the people's memories.
Obviously, they're probably not going tochange the memories of They can't change the

(01:17:55):
memories of the doors lays and probablynot hears specifically because of you. And
don't you really remember whether's things waitor the tap? I wonder, yeah,
yeah, or I wonder if there'ssomething like you know in Percy Jackson
there's the mist that like hides thingsfrom mortal eyes. You know, I
wonder if there's something like that.We're it m there's something that makes them,

(01:18:19):
after a certain amount of time,forget about it or leaves their mind,
or I could see the way I'dsee it most likely, since since
you guys brought that up, weknow that there are obliviators working in magical
accidents and fantastrophes at the ministry.The easiest way I see it going down
is if this poor zoo director goesover this tape and decides he's got something
weird on his hands, and hewants to share it with somebody who can

(01:18:43):
either shed some light on it orhelp him get the story out because he
thinks he's got something that's going tomake a good like maybe a BBC exclusive.
Then they're probably going to get stoppedin traffic by an obliviator disguised as
a police officer. Can I seeyour license in registration? Tap? Tap?
And little you know, tiny memorycharm makes him forget where it was
going, erases the tape. Allright, everything's in order, have a

(01:19:05):
good one, sir, And thenhe just thinks, huh, I should
go get some knicker bocker glory andthen he drives off to do that instead.
Can you imagine if that was yourjob, You're like, oh,
some seven year old down in Winchester'sdone something again and we gotta go the
memory charms here we go. Iwould love you know what. Actually,

(01:19:27):
I've always said charms would be mysubject, and then if I was going
to end up taking that path,so many of us have probably described where
you end up teaching at Hogwarts yourselfone day, charms would probably be my
subject, Like that would be myjob. I work in the Department of
Magical Accidents and Catastrophes, and myjob is just casually dressing up as a
Muggle and going out and creating thesescenarios where I have to just gently not

(01:19:51):
not do big memory charms, butjust gently obliviate muggles so that it keeps
the hints of magic from escaping.That's my job. Do you think that
you want to work in the muggleWorthy Excuse department of the Ministry? I
would be a consultant for that department, but my specialty would actually lie and

(01:20:13):
do it. Like I don't mindbeing an advisor for things like that,
but my desire would probably be morein doing real outfield work, like I
like doing very practical things. Allright, Tracy, you had an interesting
note here about the function of thesecond chapter in the first book of the
series. Can you expand on that? Yeah, I was just thinking when

(01:20:36):
I was reading, I was justcurious, like if it was like what
the purpose of a second chapter ina first book series is supposed to do?
And I found something that said thatit's supposed to introduce other characters,
which I think this does introduce asdifferent theory story strade, which is kind
of shown by how it swaps overfrom the like what we were calling the
prologue sort of chapter. Yeah,show why the main character needs to do

(01:20:58):
what they do, which we sortof start to get a little bit of
show with the character values, whichI think they show like Harry's kind of
had that Cinderella background that he valuestaking care of the snake. He you
know, you get a little bitof his personality in this, and then
show us that we're with a winner, which also I think it kind of
does a little bit or at leastit makes you want to root for him

(01:21:20):
because you kind of feel bad forhim because of all the kind of palles
on the Dursley abuse in this chapter. Yeah, because all you really have
to compare him up against. Youget mentions of other characters, you get
brief glimpses at background characters mailing peopleat the zoo. But all the characters
you get to know besides Harry whoare in this chapter with him are making

(01:21:42):
him look good by making themselves lookbad. So not a winner by his
own merits, but a winner bydefault. Perhaps It's also it's also I
mean chapter one is usually like youropening image chapter two, you're really kind
of establishing your status quo, rightyeah, yeah, And so that's what's
really happening here, is especially becauseHarry Potter follows the hero's journey so closely,

(01:22:05):
this is very much establishing our statusquo that in the next chapter,
two chapters it's going to break outof, right. Yeah. It's an
interesting way to think about it.I've never seen it broken down that much,
and I know that after this bookwe're already well into the series.

(01:22:26):
But it's made me think about thesecond chapters of these books just in general,
because I know that we've talked abouthow some of them have prologues and
some of them don't. So forthe ones that have prologus, the second
chapter usually feels like, Okay,we have now reminded people where we've been.

(01:22:46):
We are now back into this universe, and we are joining our characters
in progress. But this thinking aboutthe second chapters with this one, we've
just discussed it at length. Inthe next book. The second chap there
isn't really a prologue. We geta lot of reminders of where Harry has
been and what's happened, and wesee how that has impacted the life he

(01:23:11):
has with the Dursley's now. Butthe second chapter of the second book,
Dobby's Warning is where stuff really startsto go down. So that sets up
the book quite well. Dobby showsup, we find out what house elves
are, he warns Harry not togo back. We get this brief moment
of it looks like Harry might notescape, but then help shows up right

(01:23:32):
at the end of the chapter.So that's an excellent second chapter because it
really sets up not the story thatwe've already told, but it really drives
us head first into this is thestory we're getting into now. Dobby's warning
is more of the inciting incident.Yeah, that's what the second chapter is
also apparently supposed to do, isstart the incisive inciting and yeah, which

(01:23:57):
this kind of does. Yeah,yeah, yeah does. Yeah. And
then in Prisoner it's serious Black escapesseven chapter. It's at Marge's big mistake
is the second chapter, so wewe do find out about serious black but
it doesn't really set that up muchapart. We get more about serious black

(01:24:17):
escaping and why that might matter inyeah, the third chapter than the second
chapter. The more inciting incident inPrisoner is blowing up Aunt Marge and having
to go on the run, becausethat's what pushes Harry out of the status
quo that he's in that book andinto what happens next. Yeah, there's
always from this point forward, there'salways this. Harry never just leaves Privot

(01:24:43):
Drive six. There's always something happens. Harry gets pushed out of Privot Drive.
Because the second chapter of Prisoner ofAzcapan feels very much like the second
chapter of Chamber of Secrets to me, the second chapter of It's it's weird
because we get the prologuing goblet ofFire and then we get this chapter of

(01:25:09):
how would you really describe the secondchapter of Goblet of Fire. It's kind
of more of a first chapter whereit's the opening image right where it leads
us to the opening image of Harrylooking at all of his wonderful birthday presents
and really kind of feeling, Yeah, it's like the whole chapter feels like
it takes place inside Harry's head becauseit's really I'm trying to process this dream

(01:25:30):
he's just had and what he's goingto do about it, imagining where his
friends are just I mean, it'sbecause the Scar, as we all know,
the Scar is very very much connectedto what's inside Harry's head. Because
it feels like the second chapter ofthe fourth book, the whole thing could
easily be inside Harry's mind because hementions things on the outside, but really

(01:25:53):
it's it's him thinking about them becausehe's the only character in that chapter.
He's in his room all by himself. I don't know if we get another
chapter like that in the entire series, even we do, do we get
another chapter, um where he's theonly one the opening the opening of Half
Blood, when he's looking at theDumbledore articles and then he steps on the

(01:26:15):
team that's deathly Hallows. Oh,sorry, Deathely Hallows. That's what I
meant. Oh that good point.Deathly Hallows. He is he is like
that in Um half Blood, thoughhe is alone in his room looking out
the window, waiting for Dumbledore toshow up. Because oh, because the
articles he's reading are he's reading allthe articles about that's chapter three. No,

(01:26:40):
it's not, Yes, it is. Chapter one is the other Minister.
Chapter two is Spinner's end. Oh, that's right, because we get
the like double prologue. Also forskipped Order of the Phoenix, Over the
Phoenix, Chapter two, A packof owels. It's my favorite. It's
weird. It's like they take thewe just talked about how in Chamber of

(01:27:06):
Secrets and Prisoner of Azkaban, thething happens, Harry gets pushed out of
the house. In Order of thePhoenix, the incident goes down in chapter
one, the fallout really seems tofall on Harry in the second chapter,
and then the leaving the house happensin the third chapter. That's what each

(01:27:28):
of those titles is about. Dudleydemented, The thing that happens A pack
of owls, the response to thething that happened, and then the advanced
guard, the thing that gets Harryout of the house that comes afterwards.
Things get tricky as the books getbigger, I think, and they do.
This is one of those things whereyou start and end of chapter is

(01:27:49):
difficult. Like most writers I knowin some ways start and end of chapter
just where it feels right like youyou don't some some writers I know don't
even do chapters until they've written thewhole story, you know, and then
as they're writing then they say,okay, this is probably about the point
where you'd want to end a chapterbecause you want it to end on something

(01:28:13):
that's going to push the reader forwardto keep reading. So trying to determine
chapters should have certain things in themis a really rough science. It's more
of just sections or blocks kind ofnarratively. And then I'll learned this from

(01:28:34):
like people like writing a stune please, But it also applies to books which
just like start the scene as thelatest possible on it as soon as possible,
so that that also really applies tolike the books with the chapters as
well. It applies there too.Writing is fun. Yeah, I say

(01:28:56):
this as I know I'd cover allof the all the chapter who's then is
that that that's out all of them? That's all. We kind of jumped
ahead to Deathly like we we wetalked about um we didn't get actually we
didn't really um get that much intoHalf Blood Prince or Deathly Hallows. Half
Blood Prince chapter two is especially delicious. That's that's like a second prologue.

(01:29:23):
It is a second prologue, whichis one like, that's the only time
we get like a second prologue.And as it has been pointed out by
Rex, who loves this chapter forthat reason, it's one of the only
chapters we get that doesn't have Harryin it. Yeah he's not in it.
He's mentioned, but he's not init. All of these prologues kind
of Harry's out there, Yeah yeah, yeah, Well he's kind of there,

(01:29:46):
and you used to think he's therein Goblet, but that's just the
last sentence. But so it istechnically there. Would you consider the second
chapter then of Deathly Hallows, justto kind of bring that discussion home,
would you consider that a second prologue? Which one is that? Is that
no dark Lord that's in memorial InMemoria, Harry reads the obituary, he

(01:30:13):
looks at the mirror fragment and thenhe reads read a Skeeter's interview, and
that's about to me. A prologueis something that happens, obviously, it
comes before, but it is outsideof the main narrative. And in Memoriam
is definitely a part of the mainnarrative. It is very much establishing that

(01:30:33):
uh, initial image that I talksabout. Um, that's very much what
that chapter is doing. Um.Whereas if you if you look at these
other chapters that we consider prologus,they are in a way disconnected from the
main narrative line. And that Imean, that's really what prologus do,

(01:31:00):
right. They set something up thatin the main narrative our characters will discover
or that will come into play,but they're not part of that full like
story plotline. To bring it toanother book series, Scamera Thrones, the
Song Offer as far as as firealways does that prolog thing with the first
book specifically it's the people Brighter ofthe Wall if I'm being killed by the

(01:31:25):
wat Walkers. The second book itis the Blood Magic with Molassandra. The
third book, I think I don'tremember the third book. One of them
is like this war shape ticker thing, but like, yeah, that also
does them. The one doesn't consistentlyin every book, but this one's like
scattered throughout. But yeah, prologsare products are really interesting like and also

(01:31:50):
sometimes prolos can be overy series thathave really really long prologs as well.
So yeah, I do like theuse of it into Harry Potter books a
lot because I think that it showsup when it when I think it shows
up when it's needed and the serieslike when something like when some huge gigantic
shift is about to occur in thestory online, it's like when Harry Potter

(01:32:14):
typically gets these ones. So whichis why we get in the first one
because it's the first book. Weget it in the fourth book because that's
the one that's going to change.That's like the beginning of the whole transition
with Baltimore coming back. The sixthone is another huge turning point because it
turns onto head like Scapes Allegiance andthe timeth the book is a huge turning
the book is doing. I've gotgoing back to hard words, So I

(01:32:38):
think like the ones that are likekind of like more normal but not necessarily
normal, but like not having thebig, big chifts are the ones that
don't have the products, although Ido think that Order the Things is an
exception to that one, because thatis that that also has a really big
step and that doesn't have a product. And proloms are supposed to You're supposed

(01:33:00):
to be able to not have theprologue and stand the story about it.
Yes. True. Well that's whyI said it somewhere towards the top of
this episode that I think you itmight not be as satisfying in some ways,
but it would be possible to beginthis book with this second chapter and
still be able to follow with what'sgoing on. That makes me I also

(01:33:20):
actually think that I don't think Iwould consider the second chapter I have Prints
to be prologue anymore, even thoughher isn't it, because I don't think,
because I think that scene is reallyintegral the entire structure of the book,
because you need to know, youhave to need you need to know
specifically that Snape or think that Snapeisn't on, don't because that's part of

(01:33:45):
the tension, is that we knowthat Snape is on. VOLTI works side
well, but prologue should be importantto the plot, you know, I
kind of disagree that you should beable to take them out and understand and
because otherwise than what's the point ofhaving them, you know? Um yeah,
so I think, but it isit's it's a tease for what the

(01:34:11):
character will find out later basically.Um or it expands something that will happen
later. Um So, so likeexpand something that it's gonna happen, like
sometimes stuff from Pocus some stuffs tolike way way way way, way,
way way later in a series.Sometimes, like I've very prologues where the
prolog chapter like starts something and thenyou don't get it. We're like,

(01:34:34):
I'm thinking more of like long termlike comic book stuff, Like I've I've
heard prologues that of like estab somethingdoesn't get brought up to like near like
the end of the series as well. So that's something plugs can do is
well, because it is a reallyinteresting way of setting up a book.

(01:34:55):
Definitely prefer epilogs to prologue, likeI think sometimes they're not necessary. My
favorite kind of prologs are ones thatare like, I don't know, they're
kind of like talking to you aboutthe story you're going to hear, you
know. Actually I'm kind of I'mkind of the opposite, Tracy. I'm
actually kind of like actually prefer productsto epilogs because I've found a lot of

(01:35:16):
time epilogs aren't I've been epilogs are, at least in my experience, I
think that they're kind of like lessneeded than the prologs are. But like,
but yeah, I think prologs havea heavier lifting duty than epilogs do,
because the prologus duty is to provideinsight into what you are about to

(01:35:42):
see, give it a context sothat you don't have to follow along as
much before you get what's going onhere, and really to get you excited,
Whereas the purpose of an epilog isto give you closure. With a
prologue, you haven't had anything yet, unless it's a prologue in a book
for a series that is established thathas a little bit of a different set

(01:36:03):
of rules to it. But anepilogue's job is to answer unanswered questions,
to give you an idea of wherecharacters have ended up. Case in point,
the epilogue for this series is very, very polarizing. People still debate
whether or not we even needed tohave it at all. But for some

(01:36:25):
people, some people cannot let goof things until they know, at least
to a certain point, where charactershave ended up in, what situations have
been resolved or not. So somepeople have an easier time letting go with
an epilogue. And that's really ifyou're not going to do that, then

(01:36:45):
you're not going to write an epilogue. So I feel like prologues have more
of their work caught out for themthan an epilogue does. So it's easier
to prefer an epilogue because they areby and large going to be more satisfying
than a prologue will be. Ironically, this story that I'm writing has a
prolog and I but see the one, the one I'm working on is going

(01:37:09):
to be a series and it hasa prologue and it will have an epilogue
right now, so it's gonna writingis fun? Yes, Yes, this
episode nineteen years later? Yes,please, let's let's go ahead and wrap

(01:37:31):
this up before we find something elseto talk about. Well, the first
thing we need to say is weneed to thank David for joining us today,
So thank you so much. Um. Is there any place you want
listeners to visit? Online? Website, business, social media, anything?
I don't really have anything. Idon't know. It is all right,
we will have something next next time. Right now. Well, speaking of

(01:37:56):
next time, we are moving fromSorcerer's Stone, Philosopher's Stone, whatever you
want to call it, into Chamberof Secrets, Chapter sixteen. The title
chapter the Chamber of Secrets. Yay, and make sure that you visit our
website at loohomore podcast dot com andchoose be on the show. Follow those
instructions, send us your audition ifyou want to come join us on that

(01:38:21):
chapter or on any chapter coming up. Follow us on Twitter, Instagram,
YouTube, and Spotify at alohomore atMN, at Facebook at Open the Dumbledore,
or email us at a lohomore podcastat gmail dot com. I am
still waiting for your fan fix thatyou've written based on the many things we've

(01:38:41):
talked about this show. Send themall the things and another reminded to join
our Patreon and thanks again to LeahJamison for sponsor the episode. Like I
said, join our patreon, youcan get add free versions of the show.
You could watch this episode and seeall of our faces. You can

(01:39:02):
head over there at patreon dot comfor a little as two dollars a month
it's um and you get Umbo's Officeepisode sponsoring, and a bunch of other
things. I'm Tracy, I'm Alison, and I'm Cheff. Thank you for
listening to episode three hundred and seventyfour of A Loco Mora. Open the
prolog I mean dumb before such asbut the dumbledoor, dumble door. Go

(01:39:30):
oh, someone must have opened itssub go Aloha. Mora is produced by
Tracy Dunstan and edited by Patrick Muslak. It was co created by Noah Freed
and Cat Miller and is brought toyou by ap WB d LLLC. I

(01:39:56):
gotta I gotta tell you guys this. Okay, So I used to go
to I don't know if you guyshave the YMCA near you. I'm sure
you've probably heard of the YMCA.Okay, So every summer from when I
was a kid, we would alwaysgo to summer camp through the YMCA during
the day. That way, weweren't gone for the whole summer, but

(01:40:18):
we at least had a place tobe during the day while my mom was
at work. And once you getto a certain point, they have all
the camps that go up to theteen years. They have teen Camp and
then sometime after teen camp, whenyou're too young to be an actual counselor,
they have these counselor and training programsthat they would do. I did
counselor in training one summer, andmy first camp assignment. That week we

(01:40:43):
took the kids on a field tripto the zoo. Guess what movie had
just come out? No, Chamberof Secrets had come out. Maybe not
had just come out, but ithad come out very very recently. Oh

(01:41:04):
it gets better, um nor weUm, one of the people who worked
in the reptile house, brought outa snake to do a little show and
tell. And as soon as thesnake handler breaks out the snake, all
the kids are going shows awesome,and the snake candler looks really freaked out

(01:41:29):
because not only are all these kidshissing and spitting, but like they're all
trying to get really really close tothe snake to see if they can control
it. And he's like, oh, okay, okay, okay, you
guys back up. And then afterwardsI heard her talking to the councilor.
He said, I have never seenthat happened before. Usually I bring out
the snake and the kids like eithersit still or like they crowd to the

(01:41:50):
back of the room. Were theytrying to talk to it? That is
so funny as they gave the boywere they ever story? Wow? Hilarious
that ever. Reason. Something thatI really did annoy me about the movies
is that they do not keep theparts of the tongue language consistent between them

(01:42:10):
because it's pronounced one thing and Chamberof Secrets, and then by the time
it shows up again, they completelychanged it, like the like they completely
changed. Consistency was not the nameof the game. You want consistency,
you hire a director you can trustwith the project, and you keep them.
You don't change directors five times.I feel like when they had them,

(01:42:33):
you do open like in like theDeathly House Party, they just had
regret and improvise something. Yeah,we were looking today. We were looking
today because Tracy wanted to do theopen the Dumbledore in partial tongue, and
I discovered that WB for the releaseof Deathly House Part two had created a

(01:42:56):
partial tongue translator. It's down now, like it doesn't exist anymore. But
I was like, dang it,bring this back. Yes, anyway,

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