July 11, 2024 • 51 mins
In the decades following the Six-Day War in 1967, anti-Zionism gained momentum in American academia and led to the rise of the boycott, divestment, and sanctions movement on college campuses. Nearly sixty years later, the October 7, 2023, Hamas attacks on Israel, revealed how antisemitism and progressive critiques of Israel’s war in Gaza could find a home in American universities.
Featuring: Rachel Fish, Cary Nelson, Michael Feuer, Alana Mondschein, Adena Kirstein, and Yair Rosenberg
Narrated by Mark Oppenheimer
Written by John Turner and Lincoln Mullen
This series is made possible with support from the Henry Luce Foundation and the David Bruce Smith Foundation.
Antisemitism, U.S.A. is a production of R2 Studios at the Roy Rosenzweig Center for History and New Media at George Mason University.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Mark Oppenheimer (00:00):
Support for Antisemitism, U.S.A. comes from
the Henry Luce Foundation andthe David Bruce Smith
Foundation.
We began developing thispodcast, Antisemitism, U.S.A.,
long before the outbreak of theIsrael Hamas war, before Hamas
(00:24):
killed 1200 people in Israel andtook several hundred hostage,
before Israel's invasion of theGaza Strip led to the deaths of
more than 30,000 mostly civilianPalestinians. And before
protests and campaigns began oncollege campuses across the
United States. So on the onehand, this podcast is a bit
behind the times. On the otherhand, it could hardly be more
(00:48):
timely. After the October 7attack, a survey conducted by
the Harris poll found that aslight majority of Americans
aged 18 to 24, considered theHamas killing of 1200 Israelis
justified because of thegrievances of Palestinians. In
(01:10):
the US, we've watched asprotests against the war, or in
support of Israel, have brokenout on campuses across the
nation. Members of Congress haveaccused university presidents of
not doing enough to combat antisemitism. And some presidents,
like the one at the Universityof Pennsylvania, had to resign
under public pressure. How didit come to this? How could any
(01:35):
significant number of youngadults celebrate the deaths of
civilians as an act ofresistance? How did anti Zionist
and anti Israel ideologiesbecome part of the intellectual
landscape on American collegeand university campuses?
Particularly among politicallyprogressive students? And how
are we to disentangle antiZionism from antisemitism, which
(01:58):
some people say is impossible.These events are still
unfolding, and they will taketime to fully comprehend. But we
can look to the past to begin tomake some sense of our present.
(02:20):
I'm Mark Oppenheimer, and thisis Antisemitism, U.S.A., a
podcast about the history ofantisemitism in the United
States, Episode Nine, David andGoliath. This is a podcast about
history. So let's begin withsome history, not just the
history of conflict between themodern state of Israel and its
(02:41):
neighbors, but the history ofantisemitism and anti Zionist
movements on college campuses.When I was an undergraduate at
Yale in the mid 1990s, there wasreally no concern about
antisemitism at school. And thiswas pretty true on every other
college campus that I knewabout. But then you fast forward
(03:02):
to the early 2020s and you haveon many campuses, Israel
Apartheid Week. You have studentresolutions in favor of BDS, the
movement to boycott, divestfrom, and sanction Israel. You
have anti Israeli andantisemitic tweets from
professors. You had pro IsraelJews feeling unwelcome in
student government or inprogressive student
(03:24):
organizations. And this was allbefore the attacks of October
2023. So how did the Americanacademy and the students come to
understand Israel as anoccupying colonial power? Many
of them would point to thecreation of the State of Israel
in 1948. But that's not the waymost Americans felt when that
(03:47):
small nation was created.
After the Holocaust, much of theworld believed that Jews
deserved and needed a homeland.On November 29 1947, the United
Nations General Assembly adoptedresolution 181, which would give
(04:09):
Jews that homeland by dividingGreat Britain's former
Palestinian mandate into Jewishand Arab states. Each people
would get its own country, whilethe UN would administer part of
Jerusalem. For Jews, this wouldbe the realization of the
Zionist dream, a homeland in theancestral and biblical home of
(04:31):
Judaism. There have always beena small continuous presence of
Jews in the area since ancienttimes. And their numbers had
grown beginning in the 19thcentury, when the Zionist
movement encouraged Jews toreturn to the land. But by now
the land had a large Arabmajority. And the Arabs did not
(04:52):
want a Jewish state in theirmidst. Palestinian Arabs
rejected the UN's arrangementand after months of fighting,
between Jewish and Arabicparamilitary groups, Israel
declared its independence on May14 1948. At that point, armies
from Lebanon, Syria, Iraq, andEgypt invaded to help the
(05:12):
Palestinian Arabs. Israeldefeated those armies. But
during and after the war,hundreds of thousands of
Palestinians fled their homes.Many were forced out, while
others left voluntarily,planning to someday return. For
Palestinians, this defeat anddisplacement became known as the
Nakba, or catastrophe. But thiswas all happening just several
(05:37):
years after the Holocaust. Andmost Westerners were rooting for
Israel, which they saw as a tinyfledgling nation threatened by
the Muslim nations around it.That understanding pretty much
held as consensus until the SixDay War in 1967. What happened
was this. On June 5 1967, aftermonths of heightened tensions
(06:00):
with Egypt, Israel launched apreemptive attack. And that
attack caught Egyptian forces bysurprise. Egypt then closed the
Suez Canal to Israeli shippingand mobilized its military along
its border with Israel. Syriaand Jordan join the war, but
Israel won decisively. And itwas all over on June 10. Rachel
(06:23):
Fish is the co founder ofBoundless Israel, a think tank
dedicated to Israel educationand combating Jew hatred. Here
she explains the ramificationsof the Six Day War.
Rachel Fish (06:34):
Israel actually quickly succeeds in gaining a
lot of territory that it neverhad access to previously. This
territory of the West Bank, orJudea and Samaria is one of
those pieces of territory. Thatterritory, Judea and Samaria, is
(06:55):
really the territory that is theland most discussed in the
tradition of Judaism and in theTorah. It's where many of the
events take place, in terms ofreligious experiences, religious
moments. It is Joshua who entersthe Land of Israel, the land of
(07:15):
Israel is Eretz Israel. There isalso the Gaza Strip, which was
under Egyptian control. There'salso the Golan Heights which was
under Syrian control. There isalso the Sinai Peninsula under
Egyptian control, and also EastJerusalem, which had been under,
again, trans Jordanian control.So that means from 1948 to 1967.
(07:41):
Jews who were living in Israelproper, did not have the ability
to visit the Old City inJerusalem until after the events
of 1967.
Mark Oppenheimer (07:51):
For American Evangelical Christians whom
we've heard about on priorepisodes, this outcome of the
war was a sign of the imminentSecond Coming of Jesus Christ.
But the occupation graduallychanged the way that many other
Americans understood Israel.Many intellectuals in Europe and
the United States began to seethe world through a post
(08:12):
colonialist lens, meaning theysee the world as a struggle
between indigenous populationsand the colonial powers that had
conquered and displaced them
Rachel Fish (08:22):
After the events of 1967, and for sure, by the
period of the early 1980s.Israel is no longer perceived as
the David fighting againstGoliath. And a shift is taking
place in which Israel is nowperceived as the Goliath. And
that shift of Israel beingperceived as the Goliath
(08:46):
ultimately has implications forhow Americans think of, perceive
of Israel, particularly thoseAmericans who are coming from
positions of left of centerpolitics, who frame much of
their worldviews through a postcolonialist lens. And through a
(09:08):
world lens that if you arestrong, you need to be weak and
if you are weak, you need to bestrengthened. And Israel in this
case needs to be weakened intheir perception.
Mark Oppenheimer (09:19):
Then, in 1977, the Israeli government began
building settlements in theoccupied West Bank, the area
that it had seized from Jordan,but never officially annexed to
Israel. Those settlements ofcourse, were seen by many as
further evidence that Israel wasan illegal occupying power. In
(09:42):
1978, Israel and Egypt signedthe Camp David Accords, a
historic peace treaty betweenformer enemies and that laid the
groundwork for future relationsbetween Israel and other Arab
nations. A few years later,Israel returned the Sinai
Peninsula to Egypt, but it keptcontrol of the West Bank and the
Gaza Strip. Negotiationscontinued off and on, as Pro
(10:05):
peace communities in Israel andthe Arab world sought to reach a
final status for these landsthat were not part of Israel,
but didn't have full autonomyeither. Then, in 2000, the
Israeli Palestinian peaceprocess collapsed. That
September, Israeli PrimeMinister Ariel Sharon visited
the Temple Mount in the Al Aqsacompound in East Jerusalem. It's
(10:28):
a holy site for both Jews andMuslims. Sharon's visit led to
protests and riots against theIsraeli occupation of East
Jerusalem, the West Bank, andthe Gaza Strip. These protests
became known as the SecondIntifada, and they lasted for
several years. During the SecondIntifada, Israeli military
operations led to the deaths ofthousands of Palestinians, and
(10:50):
Palestinian rockets and suicidebombers killed and terrorized
Israeli civilians. By thispoint, these territories had
been occupied for many decades.
The following year, the UnitedNations hosted the 2001 World
Conference against racism.Here's Professor Cary Nelson,
(11:14):
author of the book, IsraelDenial: Anti Zionism,
Antisemitism, and the FacultyCampaign Against the Jewish
State.
Unknown (11:22):
That year, United Nations Conference on racism was
held in Durban, South Africa.Number of nations including the
US walked out of the event,because it became an anti
Zionist rally and an antiZionist organizing session.
Instead of an objective analysisof racism worldwide, there's a
(11:43):
lot of racism worldwide. Thatconference would have had a lot
of work to do. But it just setall of it aside to focus on
Israel. And so many of thedelegates said, Well, I don't
need this, we don't need this.This isn't what we signed up for
and walked out. But thedelegates who remained adopted
an infamous resolution, whichwas in the form of an equation,
(12:06):
Zionism is racism, that wastheir resolution. And then they
urged worldwide action toisolate and sanction Israel.
Mark Oppenheimer (12:18):
At the same time, the national
representatives were meeting sowere several nongovernmental
organizations or NGOs. The NGOforum issued a declaration that
referred to quote "Israel'sbrand of apartheid and other
racist crimes against humanity."It also referred to Israeli war
crimes, and it referred to itsrefusal to permit Palestinian
refugees to return to quote"their homes of origin." The
(12:42):
governmental conference inDurban didn't go that far, but
it did refer to quote, "theplight of the Palestinian people
under foreign occupation."
But beyond these declarations,there was an abundance of
antisemitism surrounding theconference. For instance, a
group of protesters marched tothe Durban Jewish Club to
denounce the Jewish state. TheProtocols of the Elders of Zion
(13:06):
was on sale at an exhibitiontent set up for distribution of
anti racist literature. Therewere anti Jewish T shirts,
pamphlets, posters, and shortlybefore the Durban conference,
the Iranian government hadissued a statement denying the
Holocaust. And let's remember,this was a conference in South
Africa, where 20 years earlier,in the 1980s, the US had joined
(13:30):
around two dozen other nationsto impose economic sanctions
against the apartheid regime.The sanctions and other forms of
international pressurecontributed to South African
apartheid's downfall. So byassociating Israel with
apartheid and racism,Palestinians and their allies
hope to apply similarinternational pressure. It was
(13:51):
in this context that BDS theBoycott, Divestment, and
Sanctions Movement really began.Here's Cary Nelson again,
Unknown (13:59):
I think it's first important to say that the BDS
movement was underway before ithad a name. That is the BDS
movement was getting work done,before it was called BDS. It was
really inaugurated by a seriesof events in 2001.
The BDS movement is aninternational effort to apply
(14:20):
diplomatic and economic pressureagainst the State of Israel. And
the movement has a number ofspecific demands.
In 2005, the international BDSwebsite established three
demands, one, ending Israel'soccupation and colonization of
(14:40):
all Arab lands and mounting anddismantling the wall.
Mark Oppenheimer (14:45):
But what are Arab lands?
Cary Nelson (14:47):
That's a hotly debated subject. For many in
Arab countries, the existence ofa Jewish state anywhere in
quote, Arab lands, is anunsupportable affront, it cannot
be tolerated. From thatperspective, Israel was a
colonialist project from thelate 19th century when Jewish
(15:08):
settlement increased. Again, acolonialist entity from the
moment the nation was founded in1948. Many people, of course,
regard the existence of a Jewishstate between the boundaries
established first in 1948, andthen expanded in 1967, as a fait
(15:29):
accompli, it ain't goingnowhere. And so they consider
only the territories occupied inthe 1967 War, namely, the West
Bank, to be effectively Arab orPalestinian lands. But a lot of
the BDS movement regardsPalestinian land as everything.
(15:50):
And that's the message conveyedby the most popular BDS slogan,
Palestine will be free from theriver to the sea. And that's
pretty clearly the river to thesea refers to the Jordan River
to the Mediterranean Sea. And ifthat's everything that quote,
will be free, it will be freebecause Israel is no longer
(16:13):
there.
Mark Oppenheimer (16:14):
The second demand of BDS is full equality
for Arab citizens of Israel. Andthe third demand is the right of
all Palestinian refugees toreturn to their places of
origin.
Unknown (16:26):
And that includes Palestinians who are now
citizens of the US, or citizensof France, or citizens of
Britain and their children. Interms of actual refugees. Well,
we're talking about, we'retalking about 1948. That's over
70 years ago. If you were anadult in 1948, you probably
(16:48):
aren't around anymore. There arevery few actual refugees left.
There are a few people over 100years old, even small children
say 10 years old in 1948. Manyof them are no longer with us.
Mostly these quote refugees arenext generations. I don't know
(17:10):
how many US citizens who are ofPalestinian origin, would want
to return to Israel. But Israelis never going to agree that as
many millions as one can return,you would lose the possibility
that Israel could be a Jewishstate.
Mark Oppenheimer (17:30):
On its website, the BDS movement calls
for boycotts of Israeliinstitutions and businesses,
divestment from such companies,and sanctions on everything from
Israeli trade, to itsparticipation in world soccer
tournaments. Many say that theBDS movement is inherently
antisemitic. Is it?
Unknown (17:51):
If the BDS movement seeks the elimination of the
Jewish state, that's anantisemitic motive. That's an
antisemitic goal. If that's yourcore goal, and it is the BDS
core goal, then it's an antisemitic movement. The
(18:12):
International HolocaustRemembrance Alliance, IHRA,
definition includes severalbullet points that specifically
address the issue of Israel. Andthey say denying the Jewish
people their right to selfdetermination by claiming that
the existence of Israel is aracist endeavor, is antisemitic.
Mark Oppenheimer (18:36):
The International Holocaust
Remembrance Alliance has aworking definition of anti
semitism that is pretty simple.In a nutshell, antisemitism is,
quote, "hatred toward Jews." TheIHRA definition also lists
examples of antisemitism. Someof these examples are
uncontroversial, such as killingor harming Jews in the name of a
(18:59):
radical ideology or an extremistview of religion. Other examples
shouldn't be very controversial,like denying the Holocaust or
accusing Jews of exaggeratingit. But then there are some
examples of antisemitism thatpertain to the State of Israel.
Here's one, quote, "denying theJewish people their right to
(19:19):
self determination, for example,by claiming that the existence
of a state of Israel is a racistendeavor." Now, here, this
definition of antisemitism couldseem to be about just anti
Zionism. There are definitelypeople whose views on the state
of Israel are not motivated byJew hatred. And plenty of people
(19:41):
oppose all forms of nationalism,not just Zionism. So is everyone
who supports the BDS movementantisemitic? Of course not.
There are many supporters of BDSwho do not hate Jews and who
don't think that they arecalling for the elimination of
Israel as a Jewish state. Thereare also a good number of anti
Zionist Jews who support BDS.
Unknown (20:04):
But what if we shift the question a bit? What if we
ask, what has the BDS movementproduced, not in Israel or the
occupied territories, but in theUS. First, it must be said that
whether you support or despiseit, in terms of practical
effect, the BDS movement hasfailed in most sectors of the
(20:25):
United States. It's true thatsome musicians refuse to play in
Israel, and a few companies havealigned themselves with the
movement. But as of April 2024,no universities had divested
themselves of investments inIsrael, or supported boycotts of
Israeli institutions. Mostcompanies that did business with
(20:46):
Israel still do business withIsrael.
Mark Oppenheimer (20:49):
In 2016, the US government adopted the IHRA
definition of antisemitism, youcan find it on the State
Department website. So why allthe turmoil about BDS? Well,
(21:09):
it's because the BDS movementhas gained a foothold in one
influential sector of Americanculture, colleges and
universities.
In December 2013, twoprofessional academic
associations, the AmericanStudies Association and the
Native American and IndigenousStudies Association, voted to
(21:31):
boycott Israeli universities. InNovember 2015. The National
Women's Studies Associationcalled for the Boycott,
Divestment, and Sanctions ofeconomic, military, and cultural
entities and projects supportedby the state of Israel. In 2022,
the Middle East StudiesAssociation followed suit. In
2023, the AmericanAnthropological Association
(21:54):
passed a resolution to boycottIsraeli institutions.
That meant Israeli universitiescouldn't interview candidates at
the organization's annualmeeting, or advertise in its
publications. Some academicsscoff at the idea that these
votes have any real effect onthe Israeli Palestinian
conflict. Again, here's CaryNelson.
Unknown (22:15):
I don't think a lot of Israelis lay in their beds at
night, worrying about whetherthe Modern Language Association
will vote for a boycott. Theydon't always notice that it's
happening. But those votes canhave a lot of impact on
campuses. It can impact theacademy, and the academy
(22:39):
graduate students, thosestudents go into the
professions. They becometeachers, politicians,
ministers, everything. And so ifyou can seed the professions
with passionate anti Zionists,you've accomplished something.
So how do those academicAssociation votes help to do
(23:00):
that? First of all, they givetremendous warrant to a
particular discipline when adiscipline votes for a boycott,
for the faculty members in thatdiscipline to teach anti Zionist
courses. My discipline saysIsrael is a monster. I'm
(23:20):
supposed to say it's a niceplace. I mean, it justifies anti
Zionist teaching.
Mark Oppenheimer (23:28):
Oftentimes, a relatively small number of
scholars have pushed these votesthrough their professional
organizations. Some big academicgroups, like the Modern Language
Association and the AmericanHistorical Association, have
rejected BDS resolutions. Butthe ideas of BDS trickled down
to local academic institutions.Here's Rachel Fish.
Rachel Fish (23:50):
There have been times, particularly on American
college campuses, in whichspecific departments, specific
university leaders, specificuniversity centers or programs
have suggested that they willnot invite Israeli or Zionist
(24:12):
political figures, Israeli orZionist academics. There have
been some examples in whichthere are some universities who
have declared that they will notshare research and engage in
research projects with otherIsraeli academics and Israeli
institutions of higher ed andresearch centers.
Mark Oppenheimer (24:34):
For instance, some departments have ended
study abroad programs in Israel,and they've ended other
partnerships with Israeliuniversities. Critics then ask
why these departments aresingling out Israel for
criticism. Perhaps it's justsympathy for the Palestinians.
But how many of thesedepartments are boycotting China
because of its treatment of theUyghurs? How many are boycotting
(24:56):
Azerbaijan? You'd think theNational Women's Studies
Association would at least wantto boycott Saudi Arabia as well
because of its treatment ofwomen. Why is it just Israel? In
reply, supporters of BDS willoften point to the fact that
America has given so muchmilitary aid to Israel, more
than to any other country sinceWorld War Two. And they say that
(25:19):
that makes Americans complicitin ways that we're not complicit
with the atrocities of othercountries.
Another place where the BDSmovement has achieved victories
is in student governmentresolutions. Starting in 2002,
dozens of student governmentshave passed resolutions in
support of BDS. Now, thesestudent governments often have
(25:43):
no real power, they certainlydon't control University
endowments. But they may berepresentative of student
sentiment at some schools. Whenthese resolutions have been
passed, most universityadministrators have politely
parried BDS resolutions. Someacademic leaders have swatted
them down. In 2002, then HarvardPresident Lawrence Summers
(26:07):
denounced the BDS movement in amemorial chapel address. He
said, quote, "some here atHarvard and some at universities
across the country have calledfor the university to single out
Israel, among all nations, asthe lone country where it is
inappropriate for any part ofthe university's endowment to be
invested. I hasten to say theuniversity has categorically
(26:29):
rejected this suggestion."
Summers was Harvard's firstJewish President. He recalled
that the America of hischildhood had had little
tolerance for antisemitism.Sure, there were still bigots,
but they didn't make noise inthe educational and governmental
spaces where he had studied andworked. But Summers noticed that
(26:50):
something had changed by 2002.He went on to say, quote, "but
where antisemitism and viewsthat are profoundly anti Israeli
have traditionally been theprimary preserve of poorly
educated right wing populists,profoundly anti Israel views are
increasingly finding support inprogressive intellectual
communities. Serious andthoughtful people are advocating
(27:14):
and taking actions that are antisemitic in their effect, if not
in their intent."
And so, in a relatively shortperiod of time, anti Israel
activism found a home in manyacademic spaces, in professional
associations, in studentgovernment councils, in
progressive studentorganizations. Over 20 years,
(27:38):
the intellectual currents ofdecolonialism, merging with the
BDS movement, have shaped theway that progressive and
activist students understandIsrael. And as the response to
the Hamas attacks suggests, ithas shaped the way other young
Americans understand Israel too.They see Israel as a colonial
power occupying Palestinianlands, and oppressing the
(28:01):
Palestinians who live on them.Many see Israel as the white
actor, oppressing people ofcolor, but a majority of
Israelis are not what wetypically think of as white.
Millions come from African andArab lands and are darker
skinned. But that hasn't stoppedthis oversimplification from
sinking in. And there are otherreasons that this line of anti
(28:23):
Israel reasoning appeals to somestudents. They point to the rise
of far right policies in Israel.The fact that the Republican
Party in the US has embracedIsrael so tightly. In 2022,
after many years of debate, theHarvard Crimson student
newspaper endorsed the BDSmovement. In so doing, the
(28:45):
Crimson editorial disavowedantisemitism.
Harvard Crimson (28:48):
We unambiguously oppose and condemn
antisemitism in every and allforms, including those times
when it shows up on the fringesof otherwise worthwhile
movements. Jewish people, likeevery people, including
Palestinians, deserve nothingbut life, peace and security.
Mark Oppenheimer (29:08):
But Harvard's student newspaper argued,
Harvard Crimson (29:11):
It is our categorical imperative to side
with and empower the vulnerableand oppressed. We can't nuance
away Palestinians' violentreality, nor can we let our
desire for a perfect imaginarytool undermine a living,
breathing movement of such greatpromise.
Mark Oppenheimer (29:28):
So has anti Israel and anti Zionist activism
spurred any growth in antisemitism on American college
campuses? We'll take up thatquestion after the break.
(29:49):
In 2021, the Anti DefamationLeague and Hillel International
conducted a survey of Jewishstudents at American colleges
and universities.
Here are some of the findings.About 1/3 of Jewish students
reported a personal experienceof antisemitism, or having
witnessed something antisemiticon campus. That could be a slur
(30:11):
in person or online. It could bea swastika on a poster, it could
be vandalism. Fortunately, veryfew students reported being
physically attacked orthreatened.
15% of Jewish students have felta need to hide their Jewish
identity on campus. They mightchoose not to wear something
that identified them as Jewish.They might avoid mentioning the
(30:31):
fact that they were Jewish.There were some contradictory
results. The survey found thatmost Jewish students reported
that they felt welcome and safe.But out of the students who said
they'd experienced antisemitismon campus, only half reported
feeling welcome and safe. What'sa bit tricky to know or document
is the extent to which antiIsrael activism contributes to
(30:54):
this antisemitism. And lookingat national statistics or
stories in the media doesn'treally help us make sense of the
problem.
There are about 4000 collegesand universities in the United
States and none of them isrepresentative. But we're going
to spend a little time thinkingabout George Washington
University. Because it has twocharacteristics that may give us
(31:18):
insight into recent history.First, GW has a large Jewish
population, some estimate about25% of its total student
population. Second, GW is in thenation's capitol.
Michael Feuer, Dean of GW'sGraduate School of Education and
Human Development, explains howthe university's location shapes
(31:39):
the student body.
Michael Feuer (31:41):
What we like to tell people who are considering
GW is that just think you couldbe living and working just four
blocks from the White House. Andit does actually mean that there
is a certain special quality tothe institution that attracts
(32:02):
people who actually areinterested in public service,
public policy, government, andthe like.
Mark Oppenheimer (32:10):
So GW is full of politically engaged students,
young women and men aiming forcareers in government, politics,
and international affairs. Butthat doesn't mean the campus or
its students are immune fromanti semitic incidents. Alana
Mondschein's experiences help usunderstand how some Jewish
(32:31):
students have encountered antisemitism at GW, and how that's
changed since October 2023.
Unknown (32:38):
Mondschein is a junior at GW majoring in Middle Eastern
Studies. And she's the Copresident of the Jewish Student
Association. She wasn't naiveabout antisemitism on campus. As
a high school student inConnecticut, she experienced
anti semitism and she workedwith the ADL to combat it.
Alana Mondschein (32:55):
Students saluting Hitler in the
lunchroom, drawing swastikas ondesks, drawing swastikas on
walls in the bathroom. A kid randown the hallway and yelled I
hate the Jews. Holocaust jokes.You know, your classic like
What's worse than the Holocaust,6 million Jews, those type of
things.
Unknown (33:12):
When she arrived on campus in the fall of 2022. It
didn't take long for Mondscheinto experience a different sort
of antisemitism.
Alana Mondschein (33:20):
GW for Israel was hosting a speaker, I don't
remember who the speaker was, onthe roof.
Unknown (33:26):
Mondschein isn't a member of GW for Israel. But at
the time, she was a freshmanrepresentative of the Jewish
Student Association.
Alana Mondschein (33:34):
And so I went to Hillel two hours early so I
could work on an essay. And Ihad my air pods and I was
listening to music and all of asudden I heard sirens. So I took
my air pods out and I heardpeople chanting like what's
going on? And so I looked outthe window of the second floor
and I saw all these peoplewaving Palestinian flags and
chanting "GW Hillel you haveblood on your hands".
(33:55):
"Intifada". I was very confused.I didn't know what was going on.
I was very new on campus. Iluckily had Sarah's contact
information. She's our assistantdirector. I sent her a photo and
I said, Hey, there's someprotesters outside the Hillel
building. And I kind of assumedthat that had happened before.
And she texted me back and she'slike stay in the Hillel building
(34:16):
like we're trying to figure itout. I later learned that that
had never happened before. Sothey were yelling Intifada, a
lot of very interesting things.And so I went to the window to
see if they were still there, ifI could leave the building, and
they saw me. And they startedyelling at me "war criminal, war
criminal". And so it justassumed because I was in the
(34:36):
Hillel building, because I was aJewish student, that I supported
the state of Israel's policies,I supported Netanyahu, that I
was a war criminal. And so yeah,that was my experience, my
orientation to anti semitism oncampus. First time experiencing
that type of antisemitism thatwas so focused on Israel.
Mark Oppenheimer (34:56):
Keep in mind, this was fall 2022, a year
before the Hamas attacks onIsrael, and this wasn't the only
incident at GW. Here's a quickrundown of other incidents on
campus before October 7 2023. In2018, the GW Student Senate
(35:17):
passed a resolution calling onthe university to divest itself
from companies that, quote,"provide goods and services to
Israeli military forces used tobomb hospitals in Gaza, bulldoze
Palestinians' homes, constructillegal apartheid walls, and
further suppress and violatePalestinian human rights." The
university rejected that demand.In 2021, a Torah scroll was
(35:42):
ripped apart and covered withdetergent in a GW fraternity
house. Now, the incidentoccurred during a wider act of
vandalism, and it isn't clear ifthe vandals targeted the Torah.
During the fall of 2022,students complained about Lara
Sheehi, a professor ofpsychology at GW. She taught a
(36:02):
required class for first yeargrad students in professional
psychology. And students wereupset by some of her rhetoric in
class as well as a cascade oftweets, in which she expressed
profane rage against Zionism andthe State of Israel. A 2016
report by the Cohen Center forModern Jewish Studies at
Brandeis University identifiedGW as a hotspot of campus
(36:26):
antisemitism. Some studentexperiences, like Mondschein's
encounter with protesters whocalled her a war criminal, seem
to bear out the Cohen Center'sfindings. But other evidence
suggests a more complicatedpicture, at least before October
7 2023. Adena Kirstein is theexecutive director of GW Hillel,
(36:50):
and she's been on campus for 14years. The first time we spoke
to her was October 3.
Adena Kirstein (36:57):
I think that the news likes to harp on college
campuses, but it's a globalproblem we're having. Are there
incidents that are problematic?Absolutely. Do I think GW as a
whole has an antisemitismproblem? Definitely not. If you
talk to an average student thisyear, and you said, Oh, do you
talk about antisemitism a lotwith your friends? Are you
concerned? I can almostguarantee you, none of them
(37:18):
would say yes, it's just not apart of their day to day.
Mark Oppenheimer (37:22):
Then four days later, on October 7, Hamas
terrorists killed 1200 people inIsrael, mostly civilians, and
took about 200 hostages. OnOctober 10, some GW students
gathered at the universitiesKogan Plaza. They came not to
mourn those who lost their livesin the attack, but to honor the
perpetrators.
(37:44):
According to the campus'schapter of Students for Justice
in Palestine, it was "a vigil inhonor of our martyrs." The
organizers told students tocover their faces with masks or
keffiyehs to protect themselvesfrom retribution. In keeping
with messages from Students forJustice in Palestine national
steering committee, GW's chapterdeclared its quote, "full
(38:07):
support of the liberation of ourhomeland, and our people's right
to resist the violent 75 yearlong colonization of our
homeland by any meansnecessary." The chapter also
said "this past weekend wewitnessed them breaking free,
tearing down the prison walls,and making it known to the world
we will be caged no longer." TheGW chapter's statement connected
(38:32):
the Hamas attacks and otherforms of Palestinian resistance
to arguments aboutdecolonization. The group
declared quote, "decolonizationis not a metaphor, and it is not
an abstract academic theory tobe discussed and debated in
classrooms and papers." Instead,the statement continued,
(38:53):
"decolonization is the right ofany oppressed people to pursue
liberation from theiroppressors, including through
armed resistance." GW has morethan 25,000 students and only
about 100 came to the rally. Sowhile only a small percentage of
the student body publiclycelebrated the Hamas attack,
(39:13):
that group did make itselfnoticed. They chanted "Zionism
has got to go," "IntifadaIntifada," and "From the river
to the sea. Palestine will soonbe free."
Protests on campus grew when, inretaliation, Israel launched
missile strikes on targets inGaza and then invaded the
territory. Thousands ofPalestinians would die, many of
(39:35):
them the elderly, women andchildren. On the evening of
October 24 2023, Students forJustice in Palestine projected
slogans in huge letters on theside of GW's Main Library. The
slogan said "Free Palestine fromthe river to the sea." "GW is
complicit in genocide in Gaza.""GW the blood of Palestine is on
(39:57):
your hands," and "glory to ourmartyrs." In March 2024, after
the war had been going on forseveral months, we spoke to
Adena Kirstein again. She sharedher reaction to this protest,
Adena Kirstein (40:13):
When you are calling for the end of a Jewish
state, from the river to thesea, to me, that lens is very
antisemitic. Now I understandand can empathize and try to
understand why some don't see itthat way. But it feels like a
personal attack on Jewishidentity. This terrorist attack
happened on October 7, notbecause it's any country in any
(40:38):
place in the world, it happenedbecause it's the Jewish state.
So what springs from thatincident, that horrible day,
oftentimes reads to me more asantisemitic and me as maybe I
was once willing to say, well,you know, anti Zionism,
antisemitism, they're differentthings. A lot more lands
(40:59):
personally these days. And it'smessy. It's a messy conversation
to have because, you know, youcould talk to five Jews and have
five different opinions on wherethe line is between antisemitism
and anti Zionism. And some, I'msure would call me naive. I
still want to believe a lot ofwhat's happening on campus is
about ignorance, and about alack of willingness to really
(41:22):
unpack and understand where Jewsare coming from.
Unknown (41:26):
For Kirstein, the unwillingness to have messy hard
conversations was evident whenprotesters came into the GW
Hillel building, and tore downposters calling for the release
of Israeli hostages.
Adena Kirstein (41:38):
We had posters that were ripped down on the
inside of the building, I wouldsay that story did not make the
biggest headlines. But in mymind, it was the biggest, I
don't want to say assault. Ithink that's too strong a word.
But the biggest hurtful thingthat happened, because we have
tried to create the safe havenwhere it's the one place that
(41:58):
our students I don't think haveto feel they have to do mental
gymnastics, to talk about thisconflict. And in that space,
someone came inside to take downthese posters. When you come to
bring an anti Israel message toa Jewish base, that's
antisemitic. We're not checkingeverybody's Zionist card at the
door. We don't know when astudent walks in. And we don't
(42:20):
ask them by the way, how do youfeel about the Israel war right
now? How do you feel about BibiNetanyahu? That's not a
conversation we're having. Sowhen you come and say, We're
against a foreign power doingwhat they're doing, and we're
gonna protest you Jewish peopleon campus, it crosses a line.
And I would hope, I would hopethat sane minds would recognize
that. And think about that, asthey're navigating their desire
(42:43):
to meet change in the world.
Unknown (42:48):
The anti Israel protests at GW after October 7,
were highly visible. And forsome, they called into question
the idea of the university as aspace for the safe, free
exchange of ideas.
Mark Oppenheimer (43:03):
Here's Dean Michael Feuer,
Michael Feuer (43:05):
We had one episode where a group had
gathered with what I referred tolater as a form of electronic
graffiti and projected onto thewall of our library, which it
struck some of us as not justironic, but really troublesome
(43:27):
that the place on campus devotedto the opening of the academic
mind becomes the place for somevery potent anti Israel,
antisemitic rhetoric.
Mark Oppenheimer (43:44):
And even when people are willing to have those
tough conversations, there oftenisn't a clear line between when
anti Israel protests are antisemitic and when they aren't.
That line has become evenmurkier as protests over the
Israel Hamas war continue tounfold.
Here's Alana Mondschein again.
Alana Mondschein (44:04):
So I rely a lot on my experience with the
ADL and my familiarity withtheir definitions. So I
personally don't think justsaying the word Intifada is
inherently antisemitic, I thinkit can be used in ways that are
antisemitic, I think that it'snot inherently antisemitic. I
also sometimes have debates withmyself of if river to the sea is
(44:28):
anti semitic. I think the waythat SJP uses it is antisemitic,
because they are calling for thedissolution of the State of
Israel, taking away Israel as aJewish state, and I think that
is antisemitic, because thereason they don't want it to
exist is because it is a Jewishstate.
Unknown (44:44):
Some of that anti Zionist rhetoric is rooted in a
long history of conspiracytheories about Jews.
Alana Mondschein (44:52):
A lot of the statements that SJP released on
our campus was the Zionistdonors are controlling the
university, the Zionist donors,the Zionist money, the Zionist
are controlling. Be a littlecreative, that's antisemitic.
We've heard that before. That isthe Jews control everything.
Jews have all the money, Jewsare super powerful. Definitely
you're not hiding it. I thinkthat if you're calling for an
(45:14):
end to the occupation, if you'rereferring to the end of the
occupation of the West Bank,getting rid of settlements,
ending a lot of the control thatIsrael has surrounding where
Gaza is, that I don't think isantisemitic, that is a
legitimate criticism of theState of Israel. I think that
you can criticize Israel withoutbeing anti semitic. I criticize
(45:35):
Israel. However, when you'retalking about just getting rid
of the Jewish state, becauseit's a Jewish state that is
antisemitic.
Mark Oppenheimer (45:42):
The most important question isn't whether
this or that slogan or action isantisemitic. It's whether anti
Zionist movements have createdspace for anti semitism on
campus. Intentionally or not,they surely have created that
space. They've created anenvironment in which it's
conceivable that a freshmanstudent could be called a war
(46:04):
criminal while writing an essayin a Hillel building.
Yair Rosenberg, a staff writerfor The Atlantic explains,
Yair Rosenberg (46:12):
Brecause there's a certain group of people who
have been around for thousandsof years, right, who I would
argue vastly outnumber peoplewho particularly care about
Israelis and Palestinians andtheir conflict, who are obsessed
with Jews, and Israel has halfthe world's Jews, it's the
mother lode of Jews. So if youare negatively obsessed with
Jews, you are going to be drawnto Israel like a lightning rod.
And if you hear people sayingwe're advocating a total
(46:33):
suffocating boycott of half theworld's Jews. Antisemites are
going to come up to you and say,I want in. They're like, this
sounds like a great party. Iwould like to join. And unless
the people at the door of theparty are carding at the door,
and they say, you know, why doyou want to join this party
where we're engaged in criticismof Israel? Why do you want to
(46:53):
join our movement? They're justgonna let those people in.
Political movements do this allthe time.
Unknown (46:58):
In other words, on a college campus, just like
anywhere else, if you hold aprotest critical of Israel,
you're gonna get a mix of peoplecoming. You're going to get
people who criticize Israel ingood faith. And you're going to
get some people who hate Jews.When thinking about the history
of antisemitism in the US, it'sclear something has changed over
(47:20):
the past 20 years. There is moreovert antisemitism on campus
now.
Mark Oppenheimer (47:25):
What's the reason? Well, multiple factors,
their social media, thepolarization of American
society, and well, anti Zionismis a factor. It's a thread
running through many, if notmost, instances of campus
antisemitism at GW and aroundthe country. The BDS movement
and related anti Israel antiZionist movements have
(47:48):
contributed to an increase inanti semitism. And anti Zionism
has seeped into many politicallyprogressive spaces, which
attract a lot of politicallyengaged Jews. So, in a lot of
ways, the anti Zionist movementsof the early 21st century have
made it difficult for Jewishstudents, many of whom are
Zionists to navigate campuslife.
(48:11):
What should universities do, sothat students - Jewish and
otherwise - feel safe and freeto express themselves? Here
again, is GW's Michael Feuer,
Unknown (48:22):
Those that say anti Zionism is not anti semitism, I
think they're missing the pointabout how some anti Israelism
does, in fact, either come fromor promote antisemitism, and
therefore in a place like auniversity, that would be
something where a lot of openminded people would benefit from
(48:45):
some real engagement on thetopic.
Mark Oppenheimer (48:54):
American university administrators can't
solve problems in the MiddleEast, nor can student activists.
When a crisis arises, like theOctober 7 attacks on the war in
Gaza, universities scramble toestablish policies that regulate
speech. They throw togetherpanels of experts, they try to
craft the right statements. Theytry to figure out which students
to punish, they make mistakes.That's because universities
(49:18):
aren't built for crisismanagement. But they are built
for education. They shouldteach, they should offer
programs and classes in whichstudents explore a range of
perspectives about Zionism andanti Zionism, about the history
of Israel and its present daypolitics. Some universities do
offer these classes, but othersdon't. And that's increasingly
(49:40):
true, because enrollment isplunging in the humanities. Many
people have joked that studentschanting from the river to the
sea often can't name which riveror which sea. And that's not
just a joke. Pro Israelstudents, by the way, are often
just as ill informed as antiIsrael students. There are so
(50:01):
many fewer history majors thanwhen I was in college. So many
fewer students studying foreignlanguages or foreign cultures.
partly as a result, the vastmajority of American college and
university students know verylittle about anti semitism,
Zionism, the modern state ofIsrael, Gaza, the West Bank, any
of it. They don't know how tohave the conversation. And
(50:22):
that's assuming that they evenwant to. And these are problems
that universities might be ableto address.
Thank you for listening toAntisemitism, U.S.A. it's a
production of R2 Studios, partof the Roy Rosenzweig Center for
History and New Media at GeorgeMason University. Visit
(50:43):
R2studios.org for a completetranscript of today's episode
and for suggestions for furtherreading. I'm your host Mark
Oppenheimer. Antisemitism,U.S.A. is written by John Turner
and Lincoln Mullen. Britt Tevisis our lead scholar, Jim Ambuske
is our producer, JeanettePatrick is our executive
producer. We'd like to thank ZevEleff for being our lead advisor
and we'd like to thank ouradvisory board members, Laura
(51:04):
Shaw Frank, Riv-Ellen Prell, andJonathan Sarna. Our graduate
assistants are Rachel Birch andAmber Pelham. Our thanks to
Rachel Fish, Cary Nelson,Michael Feuer, Alana Mondschein,
Adena Kirstein, and YairRosenberg for sharing their
expertise with us in thisepisode. We're able to bring you
this show through the generosityof the Henry Luce Foundation,
the David Bruce SmithFoundation, and many individual
(51:25):
donors like you. Thank you forlistening, and we hope you'll
join us for the next episode.
Support for Antisemitism, U.S.A. comes from
the Henry Luce Foundation andthe David Bruce Smith
Foundation.
We began developing thispodcast, Antisemitism, U.S.A.,
long before the outbreak of theIsrael Hamas war, before Hamas
(00:24):
killed 1200 people in Israel andtook several hundred hostage,
before Israel's invasion of theGaza Strip led to the deaths of
more than 30,000 mostly civilianPalestinians. And before
protests and campaigns began oncollege campuses across the
United States. So on the onehand, this podcast is a bit
behind the times. On the otherhand, it could hardly be more
(00:48):
timely. After the October 7attack, a survey conducted by
the Harris poll found that aslight majority of Americans
aged 18 to 24, considered theHamas killing of 1200 Israelis
justified because of thegrievances of Palestinians. In
(01:10):
the US, we've watched asprotests against the war, or in
support of Israel, have brokenout on campuses across the
nation. Members of Congress haveaccused university presidents of
not doing enough to combat antisemitism. And some presidents,
like the one at the Universityof Pennsylvania, had to resign
under public pressure. How didit come to this? How could any
(01:35):
significant number of youngadults celebrate the deaths of
civilians as an act ofresistance? How did anti Zionist
and anti Israel ideologiesbecome part of the intellectual
landscape on American collegeand university campuses?
Particularly among politicallyprogressive students? And how
are we to disentangle antiZionism from antisemitism, which
(01:58):
some people say is impossible.These events are still
unfolding, and they will taketime to fully comprehend. But we
can look to the past to begin tomake some sense of our present.
(02:20):
I'm Mark Oppenheimer, and thisis Antisemitism, U.S.A., a
podcast about the history ofantisemitism in the United
States, Episode Nine, David andGoliath. This is a podcast about
history. So let's begin withsome history, not just the
history of conflict between themodern state of Israel and its
(02:41):
neighbors, but the history ofantisemitism and anti Zionist
movements on college campuses.When I was an undergraduate at
Yale in the mid 1990s, there wasreally no concern about
antisemitism at school. And thiswas pretty true on every other
college campus that I knewabout. But then you fast forward
(03:02):
to the early 2020s and you haveon many campuses, Israel
Apartheid Week. You have studentresolutions in favor of BDS, the
movement to boycott, divestfrom, and sanction Israel. You
have anti Israeli andantisemitic tweets from
professors. You had pro IsraelJews feeling unwelcome in
student government or inprogressive student
(03:24):
organizations. And this was allbefore the attacks of October
2023. So how did the Americanacademy and the students come to
understand Israel as anoccupying colonial power? Many
of them would point to thecreation of the State of Israel
in 1948. But that's not the waymost Americans felt when that
(03:47):
small nation was created.
After the Holocaust, much of theworld believed that Jews
deserved and needed a homeland.On November 29 1947, the United
Nations General Assembly adoptedresolution 181, which would give
(04:09):
Jews that homeland by dividingGreat Britain's former
Palestinian mandate into Jewishand Arab states. Each people
would get its own country, whilethe UN would administer part of
Jerusalem. For Jews, this wouldbe the realization of the
Zionist dream, a homeland in theancestral and biblical home of
(04:31):
Judaism. There have always beena small continuous presence of
Jews in the area since ancienttimes. And their numbers had
grown beginning in the 19thcentury, when the Zionist
movement encouraged Jews toreturn to the land. But by now
the land had a large Arabmajority. And the Arabs did not
(04:52):
want a Jewish state in theirmidst. Palestinian Arabs
rejected the UN's arrangementand after months of fighting,
between Jewish and Arabicparamilitary groups, Israel
declared its independence on May14 1948. At that point, armies
from Lebanon, Syria, Iraq, andEgypt invaded to help the
(05:12):
Palestinian Arabs. Israeldefeated those armies. But
during and after the war,hundreds of thousands of
Palestinians fled their homes.Many were forced out, while
others left voluntarily,planning to someday return. For
Palestinians, this defeat anddisplacement became known as the
Nakba, or catastrophe. But thiswas all happening just several
(05:37):
years after the Holocaust. Andmost Westerners were rooting for
Israel, which they saw as a tinyfledgling nation threatened by
the Muslim nations around it.That understanding pretty much
held as consensus until the SixDay War in 1967. What happened
was this. On June 5 1967, aftermonths of heightened tensions
(06:00):
with Egypt, Israel launched apreemptive attack. And that
attack caught Egyptian forces bysurprise. Egypt then closed the
Suez Canal to Israeli shippingand mobilized its military along
its border with Israel. Syriaand Jordan join the war, but
Israel won decisively. And itwas all over on June 10. Rachel
(06:23):
Fish is the co founder ofBoundless Israel, a think tank
dedicated to Israel educationand combating Jew hatred. Here
she explains the ramificationsof the Six Day War.
Rachel Fish (06:34):
Israel actually quickly succeeds in gaining a
lot of territory that it neverhad access to previously. This
territory of the West Bank, orJudea and Samaria is one of
those pieces of territory. Thatterritory, Judea and Samaria, is
(06:55):
really the territory that is theland most discussed in the
tradition of Judaism and in theTorah. It's where many of the
events take place, in terms ofreligious experiences, religious
moments. It is Joshua who entersthe Land of Israel, the land of
(07:15):
Israel is Eretz Israel. There isalso the Gaza Strip, which was
under Egyptian control. There'salso the Golan Heights which was
under Syrian control. There isalso the Sinai Peninsula under
Egyptian control, and also EastJerusalem, which had been under,
again, trans Jordanian control.So that means from 1948 to 1967.
(07:41):
Jews who were living in Israelproper, did not have the ability
to visit the Old City inJerusalem until after the events
of 1967.
Mark Oppenheimer (07:51):
For American Evangelical Christians whom
we've heard about on priorepisodes, this outcome of the
war was a sign of the imminentSecond Coming of Jesus Christ.
But the occupation graduallychanged the way that many other
Americans understood Israel.Many intellectuals in Europe and
the United States began to seethe world through a post
(08:12):
colonialist lens, meaning theysee the world as a struggle
between indigenous populationsand the colonial powers that had
conquered and displaced them
Rachel Fish (08:22):
After the events of 1967, and for sure, by the
period of the early 1980s.Israel is no longer perceived as
the David fighting againstGoliath. And a shift is taking
place in which Israel is nowperceived as the Goliath. And
that shift of Israel beingperceived as the Goliath
(08:46):
ultimately has implications forhow Americans think of, perceive
of Israel, particularly thoseAmericans who are coming from
positions of left of centerpolitics, who frame much of
their worldviews through a postcolonialist lens. And through a
(09:08):
world lens that if you arestrong, you need to be weak and
if you are weak, you need to bestrengthened. And Israel in this
case needs to be weakened intheir perception.
Mark Oppenheimer (09:19):
Then, in 1977, the Israeli government began
building settlements in theoccupied West Bank, the area
that it had seized from Jordan,but never officially annexed to
Israel. Those settlements ofcourse, were seen by many as
further evidence that Israel wasan illegal occupying power. In
(09:42):
1978, Israel and Egypt signedthe Camp David Accords, a
historic peace treaty betweenformer enemies and that laid the
groundwork for future relationsbetween Israel and other Arab
nations. A few years later,Israel returned the Sinai
Peninsula to Egypt, but it keptcontrol of the West Bank and the
Gaza Strip. Negotiationscontinued off and on, as Pro
(10:05):
peace communities in Israel andthe Arab world sought to reach a
final status for these landsthat were not part of Israel,
but didn't have full autonomyeither. Then, in 2000, the
Israeli Palestinian peaceprocess collapsed. That
September, Israeli PrimeMinister Ariel Sharon visited
the Temple Mount in the Al Aqsacompound in East Jerusalem. It's
(10:28):
a holy site for both Jews andMuslims. Sharon's visit led to
protests and riots against theIsraeli occupation of East
Jerusalem, the West Bank, andthe Gaza Strip. These protests
became known as the SecondIntifada, and they lasted for
several years. During the SecondIntifada, Israeli military
operations led to the deaths ofthousands of Palestinians, and
(10:50):
Palestinian rockets and suicidebombers killed and terrorized
Israeli civilians. By thispoint, these territories had
been occupied for many decades.
The following year, the UnitedNations hosted the 2001 World
Conference against racism.Here's Professor Cary Nelson,
(11:14):
author of the book, IsraelDenial: Anti Zionism,
Antisemitism, and the FacultyCampaign Against the Jewish
State.
Unknown (11:22):
That year, United Nations Conference on racism was
held in Durban, South Africa.Number of nations including the
US walked out of the event,because it became an anti
Zionist rally and an antiZionist organizing session.
Instead of an objective analysisof racism worldwide, there's a
(11:43):
lot of racism worldwide. Thatconference would have had a lot
of work to do. But it just setall of it aside to focus on
Israel. And so many of thedelegates said, Well, I don't
need this, we don't need this.This isn't what we signed up for
and walked out. But thedelegates who remained adopted
an infamous resolution, whichwas in the form of an equation,
(12:06):
Zionism is racism, that wastheir resolution. And then they
urged worldwide action toisolate and sanction Israel.
Mark Oppenheimer (12:18):
At the same time, the national
representatives were meeting sowere several nongovernmental
organizations or NGOs. The NGOforum issued a declaration that
referred to quote "Israel'sbrand of apartheid and other
racist crimes against humanity."It also referred to Israeli war
crimes, and it referred to itsrefusal to permit Palestinian
refugees to return to quote"their homes of origin." The
(12:42):
governmental conference inDurban didn't go that far, but
it did refer to quote, "theplight of the Palestinian people
under foreign occupation."
But beyond these declarations,there was an abundance of
antisemitism surrounding theconference. For instance, a
group of protesters marched tothe Durban Jewish Club to
denounce the Jewish state. TheProtocols of the Elders of Zion
(13:06):
was on sale at an exhibitiontent set up for distribution of
anti racist literature. Therewere anti Jewish T shirts,
pamphlets, posters, and shortlybefore the Durban conference,
the Iranian government hadissued a statement denying the
Holocaust. And let's remember,this was a conference in South
Africa, where 20 years earlier,in the 1980s, the US had joined
(13:30):
around two dozen other nationsto impose economic sanctions
against the apartheid regime.The sanctions and other forms of
international pressurecontributed to South African
apartheid's downfall. So byassociating Israel with
apartheid and racism,Palestinians and their allies
hope to apply similarinternational pressure. It was
(13:51):
in this context that BDS theBoycott, Divestment, and
Sanctions Movement really began.Here's Cary Nelson again,
Unknown (13:59):
I think it's first important to say that the BDS
movement was underway before ithad a name. That is the BDS
movement was getting work done,before it was called BDS. It was
really inaugurated by a seriesof events in 2001.
The BDS movement is aninternational effort to apply
(14:20):
diplomatic and economic pressureagainst the State of Israel. And
the movement has a number ofspecific demands.
In 2005, the international BDSwebsite established three
demands, one, ending Israel'soccupation and colonization of
(14:40):
all Arab lands and mounting anddismantling the wall.
Mark Oppenheimer (14:45):
But what are Arab lands?
Cary Nelson (14:47):
That's a hotly debated subject. For many in
Arab countries, the existence ofa Jewish state anywhere in
quote, Arab lands, is anunsupportable affront, it cannot
be tolerated. From thatperspective, Israel was a
colonialist project from thelate 19th century when Jewish
(15:08):
settlement increased. Again, acolonialist entity from the
moment the nation was founded in1948. Many people, of course,
regard the existence of a Jewishstate between the boundaries
established first in 1948, andthen expanded in 1967, as a fait
(15:29):
accompli, it ain't goingnowhere. And so they consider
only the territories occupied inthe 1967 War, namely, the West
Bank, to be effectively Arab orPalestinian lands. But a lot of
the BDS movement regardsPalestinian land as everything.
(15:50):
And that's the message conveyedby the most popular BDS slogan,
Palestine will be free from theriver to the sea. And that's
pretty clearly the river to thesea refers to the Jordan River
to the Mediterranean Sea. And ifthat's everything that quote,
will be free, it will be freebecause Israel is no longer
(16:13):
there.
Mark Oppenheimer (16:14):
The second demand of BDS is full equality
for Arab citizens of Israel. Andthe third demand is the right of
all Palestinian refugees toreturn to their places of
origin.
Unknown (16:26):
And that includes Palestinians who are now
citizens of the US, or citizensof France, or citizens of
Britain and their children. Interms of actual refugees. Well,
we're talking about, we'retalking about 1948. That's over
70 years ago. If you were anadult in 1948, you probably
(16:48):
aren't around anymore. There arevery few actual refugees left.
There are a few people over 100years old, even small children
say 10 years old in 1948. Manyof them are no longer with us.
Mostly these quote refugees arenext generations. I don't know
(17:10):
how many US citizens who are ofPalestinian origin, would want
to return to Israel. But Israelis never going to agree that as
many millions as one can return,you would lose the possibility
that Israel could be a Jewishstate.
Mark Oppenheimer (17:30):
On its website, the BDS movement calls
for boycotts of Israeliinstitutions and businesses,
divestment from such companies,and sanctions on everything from
Israeli trade, to itsparticipation in world soccer
tournaments. Many say that theBDS movement is inherently
antisemitic. Is it?
Unknown (17:51):
If the BDS movement seeks the elimination of the
Jewish state, that's anantisemitic motive. That's an
antisemitic goal. If that's yourcore goal, and it is the BDS
core goal, then it's an antisemitic movement. The
(18:12):
International HolocaustRemembrance Alliance, IHRA,
definition includes severalbullet points that specifically
address the issue of Israel. Andthey say denying the Jewish
people their right to selfdetermination by claiming that
the existence of Israel is aracist endeavor, is antisemitic.
Mark Oppenheimer (18:36):
The International Holocaust
Remembrance Alliance has aworking definition of anti
semitism that is pretty simple.In a nutshell, antisemitism is,
quote, "hatred toward Jews." TheIHRA definition also lists
examples of antisemitism. Someof these examples are
uncontroversial, such as killingor harming Jews in the name of a
(18:59):
radical ideology or an extremistview of religion. Other examples
shouldn't be very controversial,like denying the Holocaust or
accusing Jews of exaggeratingit. But then there are some
examples of antisemitism thatpertain to the State of Israel.
Here's one, quote, "denying theJewish people their right to
(19:19):
self determination, for example,by claiming that the existence
of a state of Israel is a racistendeavor." Now, here, this
definition of antisemitism couldseem to be about just anti
Zionism. There are definitelypeople whose views on the state
of Israel are not motivated byJew hatred. And plenty of people
(19:41):
oppose all forms of nationalism,not just Zionism. So is everyone
who supports the BDS movementantisemitic? Of course not.
There are many supporters of BDSwho do not hate Jews and who
don't think that they arecalling for the elimination of
Israel as a Jewish state. Thereare also a good number of anti
Zionist Jews who support BDS.
Unknown (20:04):
But what if we shift the question a bit? What if we
ask, what has the BDS movementproduced, not in Israel or the
occupied territories, but in theUS. First, it must be said that
whether you support or despiseit, in terms of practical
effect, the BDS movement hasfailed in most sectors of the
(20:25):
United States. It's true thatsome musicians refuse to play in
Israel, and a few companies havealigned themselves with the
movement. But as of April 2024,no universities had divested
themselves of investments inIsrael, or supported boycotts of
Israeli institutions. Mostcompanies that did business with
(20:46):
Israel still do business withIsrael.
Mark Oppenheimer (20:49):
In 2016, the US government adopted the IHRA
definition of antisemitism, youcan find it on the State
Department website. So why allthe turmoil about BDS? Well,
(21:09):
it's because the BDS movementhas gained a foothold in one
influential sector of Americanculture, colleges and
universities.
In December 2013, twoprofessional academic
associations, the AmericanStudies Association and the
Native American and IndigenousStudies Association, voted to
(21:31):
boycott Israeli universities. InNovember 2015. The National
Women's Studies Associationcalled for the Boycott,
Divestment, and Sanctions ofeconomic, military, and cultural
entities and projects supportedby the state of Israel. In 2022,
the Middle East StudiesAssociation followed suit. In
2023, the AmericanAnthropological Association
(21:54):
passed a resolution to boycottIsraeli institutions.
That meant Israeli universitiescouldn't interview candidates at
the organization's annualmeeting, or advertise in its
publications. Some academicsscoff at the idea that these
votes have any real effect onthe Israeli Palestinian
conflict. Again, here's CaryNelson.
Unknown (22:15):
I don't think a lot of Israelis lay in their beds at
night, worrying about whetherthe Modern Language Association
will vote for a boycott. Theydon't always notice that it's
happening. But those votes canhave a lot of impact on
campuses. It can impact theacademy, and the academy
(22:39):
graduate students, thosestudents go into the
professions. They becometeachers, politicians,
ministers, everything. And so ifyou can seed the professions
with passionate anti Zionists,you've accomplished something.
So how do those academicAssociation votes help to do
(23:00):
that? First of all, they givetremendous warrant to a
particular discipline when adiscipline votes for a boycott,
for the faculty members in thatdiscipline to teach anti Zionist
courses. My discipline saysIsrael is a monster. I'm
(23:20):
supposed to say it's a niceplace. I mean, it justifies anti
Zionist teaching.
Mark Oppenheimer (23:28):
Oftentimes, a relatively small number of
scholars have pushed these votesthrough their professional
organizations. Some big academicgroups, like the Modern Language
Association and the AmericanHistorical Association, have
rejected BDS resolutions. Butthe ideas of BDS trickled down
to local academic institutions.Here's Rachel Fish.
Rachel Fish (23:50):
There have been times, particularly on American
college campuses, in whichspecific departments, specific
university leaders, specificuniversity centers or programs
have suggested that they willnot invite Israeli or Zionist
(24:12):
political figures, Israeli orZionist academics. There have
been some examples in whichthere are some universities who
have declared that they will notshare research and engage in
research projects with otherIsraeli academics and Israeli
institutions of higher ed andresearch centers.
Mark Oppenheimer (24:34):
For instance, some departments have ended
study abroad programs in Israel,and they've ended other
partnerships with Israeliuniversities. Critics then ask
why these departments aresingling out Israel for
criticism. Perhaps it's justsympathy for the Palestinians.
But how many of thesedepartments are boycotting China
because of its treatment of theUyghurs? How many are boycotting
(24:56):
Azerbaijan? You'd think theNational Women's Studies
Association would at least wantto boycott Saudi Arabia as well
because of its treatment ofwomen. Why is it just Israel? In
reply, supporters of BDS willoften point to the fact that
America has given so muchmilitary aid to Israel, more
than to any other country sinceWorld War Two. And they say that
(25:19):
that makes Americans complicitin ways that we're not complicit
with the atrocities of othercountries.
Another place where the BDSmovement has achieved victories
is in student governmentresolutions. Starting in 2002,
dozens of student governmentshave passed resolutions in
support of BDS. Now, thesestudent governments often have
(25:43):
no real power, they certainlydon't control University
endowments. But they may berepresentative of student
sentiment at some schools. Whenthese resolutions have been
passed, most universityadministrators have politely
parried BDS resolutions. Someacademic leaders have swatted
them down. In 2002, then HarvardPresident Lawrence Summers
(26:07):
denounced the BDS movement in amemorial chapel address. He
said, quote, "some here atHarvard and some at universities
across the country have calledfor the university to single out
Israel, among all nations, asthe lone country where it is
inappropriate for any part ofthe university's endowment to be
invested. I hasten to say theuniversity has categorically
(26:29):
rejected this suggestion."
Summers was Harvard's firstJewish President. He recalled
that the America of hischildhood had had little
tolerance for antisemitism.Sure, there were still bigots,
but they didn't make noise inthe educational and governmental
spaces where he had studied andworked. But Summers noticed that
(26:50):
something had changed by 2002.He went on to say, quote, "but
where antisemitism and viewsthat are profoundly anti Israeli
have traditionally been theprimary preserve of poorly
educated right wing populists,profoundly anti Israel views are
increasingly finding support inprogressive intellectual
communities. Serious andthoughtful people are advocating
(27:14):
and taking actions that are antisemitic in their effect, if not
in their intent."
And so, in a relatively shortperiod of time, anti Israel
activism found a home in manyacademic spaces, in professional
associations, in studentgovernment councils, in
progressive studentorganizations. Over 20 years,
(27:38):
the intellectual currents ofdecolonialism, merging with the
BDS movement, have shaped theway that progressive and
activist students understandIsrael. And as the response to
the Hamas attacks suggests, ithas shaped the way other young
Americans understand Israel too.They see Israel as a colonial
power occupying Palestinianlands, and oppressing the
(28:01):
Palestinians who live on them.Many see Israel as the white
actor, oppressing people ofcolor, but a majority of
Israelis are not what wetypically think of as white.
Millions come from African andArab lands and are darker
skinned. But that hasn't stoppedthis oversimplification from
sinking in. And there are otherreasons that this line of anti
(28:23):
Israel reasoning appeals to somestudents. They point to the rise
of far right policies in Israel.The fact that the Republican
Party in the US has embracedIsrael so tightly. In 2022,
after many years of debate, theHarvard Crimson student
newspaper endorsed the BDSmovement. In so doing, the
(28:45):
Crimson editorial disavowedantisemitism.
Harvard Crimson (28:48):
We unambiguously oppose and condemn
antisemitism in every and allforms, including those times
when it shows up on the fringesof otherwise worthwhile
movements. Jewish people, likeevery people, including
Palestinians, deserve nothingbut life, peace and security.
Mark Oppenheimer (29:08):
But Harvard's student newspaper argued,
Harvard Crimson (29:11):
It is our categorical imperative to side
with and empower the vulnerableand oppressed. We can't nuance
away Palestinians' violentreality, nor can we let our
desire for a perfect imaginarytool undermine a living,
breathing movement of such greatpromise.
Mark Oppenheimer (29:28):
So has anti Israel and anti Zionist activism
spurred any growth in antisemitism on American college
campuses? We'll take up thatquestion after the break.
(29:49):
In 2021, the Anti DefamationLeague and Hillel International
conducted a survey of Jewishstudents at American colleges
and universities.
Here are some of the findings.About 1/3 of Jewish students
reported a personal experienceof antisemitism, or having
witnessed something antisemiticon campus. That could be a slur
(30:11):
in person or online. It could bea swastika on a poster, it could
be vandalism. Fortunately, veryfew students reported being
physically attacked orthreatened.
15% of Jewish students have felta need to hide their Jewish
identity on campus. They mightchoose not to wear something
that identified them as Jewish.They might avoid mentioning the
(30:31):
fact that they were Jewish.There were some contradictory
results. The survey found thatmost Jewish students reported
that they felt welcome and safe.But out of the students who said
they'd experienced antisemitismon campus, only half reported
feeling welcome and safe. What'sa bit tricky to know or document
is the extent to which antiIsrael activism contributes to
(30:54):
this antisemitism. And lookingat national statistics or
stories in the media doesn'treally help us make sense of the
problem.
There are about 4000 collegesand universities in the United
States and none of them isrepresentative. But we're going
to spend a little time thinkingabout George Washington
University. Because it has twocharacteristics that may give us
(31:18):
insight into recent history.First, GW has a large Jewish
population, some estimate about25% of its total student
population. Second, GW is in thenation's capitol.
Michael Feuer, Dean of GW'sGraduate School of Education and
Human Development, explains howthe university's location shapes
(31:39):
the student body.
Michael Feuer (31:41):
What we like to tell people who are considering
GW is that just think you couldbe living and working just four
blocks from the White House. Andit does actually mean that there
is a certain special quality tothe institution that attracts
(32:02):
people who actually areinterested in public service,
public policy, government, andthe like.
Mark Oppenheimer (32:10):
So GW is full of politically engaged students,
young women and men aiming forcareers in government, politics,
and international affairs. Butthat doesn't mean the campus or
its students are immune fromanti semitic incidents. Alana
Mondschein's experiences help usunderstand how some Jewish
(32:31):
students have encountered antisemitism at GW, and how that's
changed since October 2023.
Unknown (32:38):
Mondschein is a junior at GW majoring in Middle Eastern
Studies. And she's the Copresident of the Jewish Student
Association. She wasn't naiveabout antisemitism on campus. As
a high school student inConnecticut, she experienced
anti semitism and she workedwith the ADL to combat it.
Alana Mondschein (32:55):
Students saluting Hitler in the
lunchroom, drawing swastikas ondesks, drawing swastikas on
walls in the bathroom. A kid randown the hallway and yelled I
hate the Jews. Holocaust jokes.You know, your classic like
What's worse than the Holocaust,6 million Jews, those type of
things.
Unknown (33:12):
When she arrived on campus in the fall of 2022. It
didn't take long for Mondscheinto experience a different sort
of antisemitism.
Alana Mondschein (33:20):
GW for Israel was hosting a speaker, I don't
remember who the speaker was, onthe roof.
Unknown (33:26):
Mondschein isn't a member of GW for Israel. But at
the time, she was a freshmanrepresentative of the Jewish
Student Association.
Alana Mondschein (33:34):
And so I went to Hillel two hours early so I
could work on an essay. And Ihad my air pods and I was
listening to music and all of asudden I heard sirens. So I took
my air pods out and I heardpeople chanting like what's
going on? And so I looked outthe window of the second floor
and I saw all these peoplewaving Palestinian flags and
chanting "GW Hillel you haveblood on your hands".
(33:55):
"Intifada". I was very confused.I didn't know what was going on.
I was very new on campus. Iluckily had Sarah's contact
information. She's our assistantdirector. I sent her a photo and
I said, Hey, there's someprotesters outside the Hillel
building. And I kind of assumedthat that had happened before.
And she texted me back and she'slike stay in the Hillel building
(34:16):
like we're trying to figure itout. I later learned that that
had never happened before. Sothey were yelling Intifada, a
lot of very interesting things.And so I went to the window to
see if they were still there, ifI could leave the building, and
they saw me. And they startedyelling at me "war criminal, war
criminal". And so it justassumed because I was in the
(34:36):
Hillel building, because I was aJewish student, that I supported
the state of Israel's policies,I supported Netanyahu, that I
was a war criminal. And so yeah,that was my experience, my
orientation to anti semitism oncampus. First time experiencing
that type of antisemitism thatwas so focused on Israel.
Mark Oppenheimer (34:56):
Keep in mind, this was fall 2022, a year
before the Hamas attacks onIsrael, and this wasn't the only
incident at GW. Here's a quickrundown of other incidents on
campus before October 7 2023. In2018, the GW Student Senate
(35:17):
passed a resolution calling onthe university to divest itself
from companies that, quote,"provide goods and services to
Israeli military forces used tobomb hospitals in Gaza, bulldoze
Palestinians' homes, constructillegal apartheid walls, and
further suppress and violatePalestinian human rights." The
university rejected that demand.In 2021, a Torah scroll was
(35:42):
ripped apart and covered withdetergent in a GW fraternity
house. Now, the incidentoccurred during a wider act of
vandalism, and it isn't clear ifthe vandals targeted the Torah.
During the fall of 2022,students complained about Lara
Sheehi, a professor ofpsychology at GW. She taught a
(36:02):
required class for first yeargrad students in professional
psychology. And students wereupset by some of her rhetoric in
class as well as a cascade oftweets, in which she expressed
profane rage against Zionism andthe State of Israel. A 2016
report by the Cohen Center forModern Jewish Studies at
Brandeis University identifiedGW as a hotspot of campus
(36:26):
antisemitism. Some studentexperiences, like Mondschein's
encounter with protesters whocalled her a war criminal, seem
to bear out the Cohen Center'sfindings. But other evidence
suggests a more complicatedpicture, at least before October
7 2023. Adena Kirstein is theexecutive director of GW Hillel,
(36:50):
and she's been on campus for 14years. The first time we spoke
to her was October 3.
Adena Kirstein (36:57):
I think that the news likes to harp on college
campuses, but it's a globalproblem we're having. Are there
incidents that are problematic?Absolutely. Do I think GW as a
whole has an antisemitismproblem? Definitely not. If you
talk to an average student thisyear, and you said, Oh, do you
talk about antisemitism a lotwith your friends? Are you
concerned? I can almostguarantee you, none of them
(37:18):
would say yes, it's just not apart of their day to day.
Mark Oppenheimer (37:22):
Then four days later, on October 7, Hamas
terrorists killed 1200 people inIsrael, mostly civilians, and
took about 200 hostages. OnOctober 10, some GW students
gathered at the universitiesKogan Plaza. They came not to
mourn those who lost their livesin the attack, but to honor the
perpetrators.
(37:44):
According to the campus'schapter of Students for Justice
in Palestine, it was "a vigil inhonor of our martyrs." The
organizers told students tocover their faces with masks or
keffiyehs to protect themselvesfrom retribution. In keeping
with messages from Students forJustice in Palestine national
steering committee, GW's chapterdeclared its quote, "full
(38:07):
support of the liberation of ourhomeland, and our people's right
to resist the violent 75 yearlong colonization of our
homeland by any meansnecessary." The chapter also
said "this past weekend wewitnessed them breaking free,
tearing down the prison walls,and making it known to the world
we will be caged no longer." TheGW chapter's statement connected
(38:32):
the Hamas attacks and otherforms of Palestinian resistance
to arguments aboutdecolonization. The group
declared quote, "decolonizationis not a metaphor, and it is not
an abstract academic theory tobe discussed and debated in
classrooms and papers." Instead,the statement continued,
(38:53):
"decolonization is the right ofany oppressed people to pursue
liberation from theiroppressors, including through
armed resistance." GW has morethan 25,000 students and only
about 100 came to the rally. Sowhile only a small percentage of
the student body publiclycelebrated the Hamas attack,
(39:13):
that group did make itselfnoticed. They chanted "Zionism
has got to go," "IntifadaIntifada," and "From the river
to the sea. Palestine will soonbe free."
Protests on campus grew when, inretaliation, Israel launched
missile strikes on targets inGaza and then invaded the
territory. Thousands ofPalestinians would die, many of
(39:35):
them the elderly, women andchildren. On the evening of
October 24 2023, Students forJustice in Palestine projected
slogans in huge letters on theside of GW's Main Library. The
slogan said "Free Palestine fromthe river to the sea." "GW is
complicit in genocide in Gaza.""GW the blood of Palestine is on
(39:57):
your hands," and "glory to ourmartyrs." In March 2024, after
the war had been going on forseveral months, we spoke to
Adena Kirstein again. She sharedher reaction to this protest,
Adena Kirstein (40:13):
When you are calling for the end of a Jewish
state, from the river to thesea, to me, that lens is very
antisemitic. Now I understandand can empathize and try to
understand why some don't see itthat way. But it feels like a
personal attack on Jewishidentity. This terrorist attack
happened on October 7, notbecause it's any country in any
(40:38):
place in the world, it happenedbecause it's the Jewish state.
So what springs from thatincident, that horrible day,
oftentimes reads to me more asantisemitic and me as maybe I
was once willing to say, well,you know, anti Zionism,
antisemitism, they're differentthings. A lot more lands
(40:59):
personally these days. And it'smessy. It's a messy conversation
to have because, you know, youcould talk to five Jews and have
five different opinions on wherethe line is between antisemitism
and anti Zionism. And some, I'msure would call me naive. I
still want to believe a lot ofwhat's happening on campus is
about ignorance, and about alack of willingness to really
(41:22):
unpack and understand where Jewsare coming from.
Unknown (41:26):
For Kirstein, the unwillingness to have messy hard
conversations was evident whenprotesters came into the GW
Hillel building, and tore downposters calling for the release
of Israeli hostages.
Adena Kirstein (41:38):
We had posters that were ripped down on the
inside of the building, I wouldsay that story did not make the
biggest headlines. But in mymind, it was the biggest, I
don't want to say assault. Ithink that's too strong a word.
But the biggest hurtful thingthat happened, because we have
tried to create the safe havenwhere it's the one place that
(41:58):
our students I don't think haveto feel they have to do mental
gymnastics, to talk about thisconflict. And in that space,
someone came inside to take downthese posters. When you come to
bring an anti Israel message toa Jewish base, that's
antisemitic. We're not checkingeverybody's Zionist card at the
door. We don't know when astudent walks in. And we don't
(42:20):
ask them by the way, how do youfeel about the Israel war right
now? How do you feel about BibiNetanyahu? That's not a
conversation we're having. Sowhen you come and say, We're
against a foreign power doingwhat they're doing, and we're
gonna protest you Jewish peopleon campus, it crosses a line.
And I would hope, I would hopethat sane minds would recognize
that. And think about that, asthey're navigating their desire
(42:43):
to meet change in the world.
Unknown (42:48):
The anti Israel protests at GW after October 7,
were highly visible. And forsome, they called into question
the idea of the university as aspace for the safe, free
exchange of ideas.
Mark Oppenheimer (43:03):
Here's Dean Michael Feuer,
Michael Feuer (43:05):
We had one episode where a group had
gathered with what I referred tolater as a form of electronic
graffiti and projected onto thewall of our library, which it
struck some of us as not justironic, but really troublesome
(43:27):
that the place on campus devotedto the opening of the academic
mind becomes the place for somevery potent anti Israel,
antisemitic rhetoric.
Mark Oppenheimer (43:44):
And even when people are willing to have those
tough conversations, there oftenisn't a clear line between when
anti Israel protests are antisemitic and when they aren't.
That line has become evenmurkier as protests over the
Israel Hamas war continue tounfold.
Here's Alana Mondschein again.
Alana Mondschein (44:04):
So I rely a lot on my experience with the
ADL and my familiarity withtheir definitions. So I
personally don't think justsaying the word Intifada is
inherently antisemitic, I thinkit can be used in ways that are
antisemitic, I think that it'snot inherently antisemitic. I
also sometimes have debates withmyself of if river to the sea is
(44:28):
anti semitic. I think the waythat SJP uses it is antisemitic,
because they are calling for thedissolution of the State of
Israel, taking away Israel as aJewish state, and I think that
is antisemitic, because thereason they don't want it to
exist is because it is a Jewishstate.
Unknown (44:44):
Some of that anti Zionist rhetoric is rooted in a
long history of conspiracytheories about Jews.
Alana Mondschein (44:52):
A lot of the statements that SJP released on
our campus was the Zionistdonors are controlling the
university, the Zionist donors,the Zionist money, the Zionist
are controlling. Be a littlecreative, that's antisemitic.
We've heard that before. That isthe Jews control everything.
Jews have all the money, Jewsare super powerful. Definitely
you're not hiding it. I thinkthat if you're calling for an
(45:14):
end to the occupation, if you'rereferring to the end of the
occupation of the West Bank,getting rid of settlements,
ending a lot of the control thatIsrael has surrounding where
Gaza is, that I don't think isantisemitic, that is a
legitimate criticism of theState of Israel. I think that
you can criticize Israel withoutbeing anti semitic. I criticize
(45:35):
Israel. However, when you'retalking about just getting rid
of the Jewish state, becauseit's a Jewish state that is
antisemitic.
Mark Oppenheimer (45:42):
The most important question isn't whether
this or that slogan or action isantisemitic. It's whether anti
Zionist movements have createdspace for anti semitism on
campus. Intentionally or not,they surely have created that
space. They've created anenvironment in which it's
conceivable that a freshmanstudent could be called a war
(46:04):
criminal while writing an essayin a Hillel building.
Yair Rosenberg, a staff writerfor The Atlantic explains,
Yair Rosenberg (46:12):
Brecause there's a certain group of people who
have been around for thousandsof years, right, who I would
argue vastly outnumber peoplewho particularly care about
Israelis and Palestinians andtheir conflict, who are obsessed
with Jews, and Israel has halfthe world's Jews, it's the
mother lode of Jews. So if youare negatively obsessed with
Jews, you are going to be drawnto Israel like a lightning rod.
And if you hear people sayingwe're advocating a total
(46:33):
suffocating boycott of half theworld's Jews. Antisemites are
going to come up to you and say,I want in. They're like, this
sounds like a great party. Iwould like to join. And unless
the people at the door of theparty are carding at the door,
and they say, you know, why doyou want to join this party
where we're engaged in criticismof Israel? Why do you want to
(46:53):
join our movement? They're justgonna let those people in.
Political movements do this allthe time.
Unknown (46:58):
In other words, on a college campus, just like
anywhere else, if you hold aprotest critical of Israel,
you're gonna get a mix of peoplecoming. You're going to get
people who criticize Israel ingood faith. And you're going to
get some people who hate Jews.When thinking about the history
of antisemitism in the US, it'sclear something has changed over
(47:20):
the past 20 years. There is moreovert antisemitism on campus
now.
Mark Oppenheimer (47:25):
What's the reason? Well, multiple factors,
their social media, thepolarization of American
society, and well, anti Zionismis a factor. It's a thread
running through many, if notmost, instances of campus
antisemitism at GW and aroundthe country. The BDS movement
and related anti Israel antiZionist movements have
(47:48):
contributed to an increase inanti semitism. And anti Zionism
has seeped into many politicallyprogressive spaces, which
attract a lot of politicallyengaged Jews. So, in a lot of
ways, the anti Zionist movementsof the early 21st century have
made it difficult for Jewishstudents, many of whom are
Zionists to navigate campuslife.
(48:11):
What should universities do, sothat students - Jewish and
otherwise - feel safe and freeto express themselves? Here
again, is GW's Michael Feuer,
Unknown (48:22):
Those that say anti Zionism is not anti semitism, I
think they're missing the pointabout how some anti Israelism
does, in fact, either come fromor promote antisemitism, and
therefore in a place like auniversity, that would be
something where a lot of openminded people would benefit from
(48:45):
some real engagement on thetopic.
Mark Oppenheimer (48:54):
American university administrators can't
solve problems in the MiddleEast, nor can student activists.
When a crisis arises, like theOctober 7 attacks on the war in
Gaza, universities scramble toestablish policies that regulate
speech. They throw togetherpanels of experts, they try to
craft the right statements. Theytry to figure out which students
to punish, they make mistakes.That's because universities
(49:18):
aren't built for crisismanagement. But they are built
for education. They shouldteach, they should offer
programs and classes in whichstudents explore a range of
perspectives about Zionism andanti Zionism, about the history
of Israel and its present daypolitics. Some universities do
offer these classes, but othersdon't. And that's increasingly
(49:40):
true, because enrollment isplunging in the humanities. Many
people have joked that studentschanting from the river to the
sea often can't name which riveror which sea. And that's not
just a joke. Pro Israelstudents, by the way, are often
just as ill informed as antiIsrael students. There are so
(50:01):
many fewer history majors thanwhen I was in college. So many
fewer students studying foreignlanguages or foreign cultures.
partly as a result, the vastmajority of American college and
university students know verylittle about anti semitism,
Zionism, the modern state ofIsrael, Gaza, the West Bank, any
of it. They don't know how tohave the conversation. And
(50:22):
that's assuming that they evenwant to. And these are problems
that universities might be ableto address.
Thank you for listening toAntisemitism, U.S.A. it's a
production of R2 Studios, partof the Roy Rosenzweig Center for
History and New Media at GeorgeMason University. Visit
(50:43):
R2studios.org for a completetranscript of today's episode
and for suggestions for furtherreading. I'm your host Mark
Oppenheimer. Antisemitism,U.S.A. is written by John Turner
and Lincoln Mullen. Britt Tevisis our lead scholar, Jim Ambuske
is our producer, JeanettePatrick is our executive
producer. We'd like to thank ZevEleff for being our lead advisor
and we'd like to thank ouradvisory board members, Laura
(51:04):
Shaw Frank, Riv-Ellen Prell, andJonathan Sarna. Our graduate
assistants are Rachel Birch andAmber Pelham. Our thanks to
Rachel Fish, Cary Nelson,Michael Feuer, Alana Mondschein,
Adena Kirstein, and YairRosenberg for sharing their
expertise with us in thisepisode. We're able to bring you
this show through the generosityof the Henry Luce Foundation,
the David Bruce SmithFoundation, and many individual
(51:25):
donors like you. Thank you forlistening, and we hope you'll
join us for the next episode.
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