August 20, 2024 • 49 mins
Paul C. Brunson, is a dynamic Jamaican American television host, author, and professional matchmaker. Learn how Paul transitioned from the high-octane world of investment banking to managing a Turkish billionaire's investments, and ultimately becoming one of the first full-time Black matchmakers globally. Paul sheds light on his motivations for entering the matchmaking industry, underscoring the significant impact single-parent households have on children’s development. He offers invaluable insights into self-worth and common pitfalls people face in their journey to find love and happiness.
Paul’s journey isn't just about love; it’s also a masterclass in entrepreneurship. From selling Coca-Cola at the tender age of 12 to working alongside luminaries like Oprah Winfrey, Paul brings a treasure trove of anecdotes and practical advice. Learn about the importance of social capital in entrepreneurial success, particularly within Black and Brown communities, and the survivalist mindset drawn from his West Indian roots. Discover the critical mistakes multicultural entrepreneurs often make and how Paul's experiences can guide you to sidestep these pitfalls.
Navigating relationships and networks is crucial for success, and Paul offers actionable advice on how to prune your connections for maximum impact. Understand when a relationship is no longer mutually beneficial and how to maintain a productive and inspiring network. Embrace your unique qualities, especially those rooted in your heritage, and leverage them for success. Paul also introduces his platform, Mentor Mondays, as a valuable resource for aspiring entrepreneurs. This episode is a treasure trove of wisdom and practical advice, all wrapped up in Paul's engaging storytelling and rich insights.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:04):
Hello, welcome to another episode of the Carrie on
Friends podcast.
I'm your host, carrie-anne.
Thank you so much for listening.
I'm excited because today'sguest on the podcast is Paul C
Brunson, and if you're notfamiliar with who he is, paul is
a television host, an author, aprofessional matchmaker.
He's appeared as the co-host onOprah Winfrey's network,
(00:26):
lovetown, usa, and, yeah, he'sJamaican.
Now in this episode, I speakwith Paul about making
worthwhile connections in loveand business.
But before we get into theinterview, I'd like you to share
the love on Facebook.
Tell a friend, let me know whatyou think about the show, this
episode.
So I won't keep you waiting anylonger.
Here's my interview with Paul.
(00:46):
Paul, I'm so excited to haveyou on the Carry On Friends
podcast.
Welcome to our community.
How are you today?
Speaker 2 (00:54):
I'm fantastic.
How are you?
Speaker 1 (00:56):
I'm doing well, so excited to talk to you about
making worthwhile connections inlove and business.
I know you're just going togive us a whole bunch of
information and I am ready todive in.
You're ready?
Speaker 2 (01:08):
I'm ready.
I'm ready, let's do it.
Speaker 1 (01:10):
Cool, cool.
So for those who do not knowwho Paul C Brunson is, tell us a
little bit about who you are.
Speaker 2 (01:18):
Wow, most importantly , you know I am a husband of 15
years, I am a father.
I have two great boys.
Kingston is the oldest, he'sfive.
Our youngest is Liam, who's two.
You know, I'm a brother, I'm abrother in law, I'm a son, I'm a
cousin.
You know I'm all those thingsprobably recognize me for being
(01:47):
one of the first, if not thefirst, full-time black
matchmaker in the world, whichis kind of crazy.
So when you think of the reallife Hitch, that truly is me,
and so that's really where my,uh, my kind of career started.
Uh, I've been in investmentbanking.
Uh, I've had a bunch oftelevision shows.
Matter of fact, right now Ijust picked up a deal where I
have a big primetime show comingout on ABC yeah, coming up
(02:09):
later in the year.
I host a syndicated show.
It's a weekly show for BlackEnterprise called Our World,
where we look at big storiesimpacting the African-American
community, and so there's a lotthat I do, but most importantly,
I'm a husband and a daddy.
Speaker 1 (02:29):
Yes, those are the important roles.
A teacher of mine who I knew Iknow you had on your mentor
Mondays, julian Gordon, says youknow he's, his roles as father
and husband are first, you putlife first, then everything else
in terms of work comes after.
So, yes, and if yes, you reallyhave a whole bunch of jobs,
(02:51):
like a Jamaican.
Speaker 2 (02:52):
So yeah, although I will tell you this is you know.
So my grandfather, he'sJamaican, he's passed away.
But before he passed away, youknow, he sat down and he asked
me, so this was just maybe aboutfive years ago.
He was like how many jobs doyou have?
And I said you know, you know,grandpa, I'm working on about
three or four.
And he was like you're lazy.
Speaker 1 (03:13):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (03:14):
He called me lazy.
Speaker 1 (03:15):
Yes, you know another .
I was just speaking to someoneand you know, as a Caribbean
American, we in our heads,having multiple jobs is just
something we have to do.
Otherwise, like Grandpa said,you know you're lazy, so let's
let's talk about how you gotinto being a professional the
first African-Americanprofessional matchmaker.
(03:38):
How does that come about?
Speaker 2 (03:40):
Sure, sure.
So you know there's.
There's different ways to youknow, get into any industry and
I think the way that I got in isa little bit different than how
most people do with matchmaking.
So around 2008, I was workingfor a Turkish billionaire.
You know I had a great job.
I was managing all of hisinvestments in the United States
, and my deal with him is that Iwould I would work for him, but
(04:02):
he would also allow me to havea moonlighting job.
I was being Jamaican.
I had another job, and that wasa nonprofit organization that
helped to prepare low-incomekids, or kids from low-income
households, to get into college,and so we would give them
science and math and Englishprep.
And so the summer of 2008, I'mrunning a summer camp for these
(04:25):
kids.
We had 100 kids in our camp andI had to check all the kids in,
and so one of the questions Iwould ask is how many parents
live in your household?
And out of 100 of thesestudents, not one had two
parents in the household.
They all live with mom orgrandma or big sis.
Like very few of them even livewith men in the household, and
(04:49):
it just so happened that theywere all African-American, you
know, african Caribbean, latino,black and brown kids.
And it was that moment where Ithought to myself here we are
trying to do test prep, you know, here we are trying to, you
(05:10):
know, teach them math, butfundamentally, they're missing a
lot at home.
Right, and we saw how nothaving mother and father in the
household impacted themacademically, how it impacted
them socially, and that was themoment where I said I wanted to
do something.
That was the problem that Iwanted to really create a
solution around, and that's howI got into matchmaking.
Speaker 1 (05:32):
Awesome, awesome.
And so, as you've done, howlong have you been doing the
matchmaking?
Speaker 2 (05:39):
That was 08, you know .
So it's about six years now,Wow.
Speaker 1 (05:42):
Yeah, and as you've done this over the years, what
are the top three mistakes yousee when you are trying to match
people together?
What mistakes do you findpeople are making in their
pursuit of love and happiness?
Speaker 2 (06:00):
The first is just not having the belief that someone
can love them or will love them.
That's big, you know.
Belief truly is our reality.
So if you believe that there'sno one out there for you or that
you're unlovable, then no oneis out there for you.
Speaker 1 (06:16):
Right.
Speaker 2 (06:17):
You really are unlovable.
So that's number one.
Number two is just simply notdoing things differently.
You know, I always say thatladies have the dream that Aegis
Elba is just going to comeknock on their door.
He's going to come knock ontheir door, right that's.
Mulder and look like I'm here,exactly exactly, and fellows
(06:38):
think you know that Zoe Saldanaor somebody's going to knock on
their door and that's just notthe case, and so if you want
different results, you need todo things differently and not
doing things differently.
That's probably number two.
And then number three isplaying games.
So there's this whole notionthat love is a game, right, and,
(07:01):
like you know, if I like you,I'm not going to call you back
or I'm not going to text youback or I'm going to, you know,
act like I'm hard to get orwhatever.
Like this whole notion thatthere's games, and what I've
found is that when you findsomebody who's truly in love
with you, they don't want toplay any games, and games just
add walls and it adds frictionand a lot of people end up
(07:22):
losing other great people byplaying games.
So I think those are the topthree issues that I see.
Speaker 1 (07:28):
Right, right.
So how, how do you what?
What advice would you have?
So cause playing games.
Sometimes it seems you've beendoing it so long that it seems
normal.
You don't know how to undothese behaviors because they've
been just so rooted in yourwhole dating experience, however
(07:49):
long that started.
What's one tip that you havethat someone could start today
to kind of correcting orredirecting?
You know, any one of thosebehaviors?
Speaker 2 (08:01):
So when you think about a bad habit, you know
habit or bad behavior, it'sreally just simply a decision, a
conscious decision that youmake over and over and over
again.
And I want to emphasize it's aconscious decision, so you have
control over that.
So the best way to curb badhabit or bad behavior is to know
(08:23):
that you are the one making thechoice to do that, and so it
all starts with self.
Now, the best advice I couldgive around that is to get
around people who are going tohold you accountable.
You know a lot, of, a lot ofissues that people have in their
romantic relationships, intheir platonic relationships, in
(08:44):
their business relationships,is because they're surrounded
with other people who have poorrelationships themselves.
They're surrounded by peoplewho have low standards.
They're surrounded by peoplewho don't even share their.
You know your values, and themore that you surround yourself
around people who are trulymediocre, the more mediocre you
(09:08):
become and the less successfulyou'll be in all your
relationships.
So the best way to startcurbing habit or should I say
bad habit and the best way toreally just be the best that you
can be is surround yourselfwith people who are literally
better than you.
Speaker 1 (09:23):
Right, surround yourself with people who are
literally better than you.
Right, you acknowledge thebehavior and you change your
surroundings, or thesurroundings that encourage the
continuance of that behavior.
That's awesome, I believe TDJakes maybe not the same way,
but he was giving the analogywith the giraffe and the turtle.
And the turtle is going to giveadvice based on his level,
(09:43):
right down there in the grass,and the giraffe is like seeing
the treetops.
And if you, you really can'ttake advice for someone who
cannot see at your level oraren't at the level that you
want to be, so I, I, I, I thinkthat's something worthwhile, and
not only in romanticrelationships but in business
relationships.
So it's switching gears alittle bit.
(10:05):
Let's talk about some of themistakes that you, before we get
to the mistakes I know you doMentor Mondays.
I've watched it.
It's awesome.
It's like a packed crowd onSpreecast.
Lively discussions there yes,lively.
Speaker 2 (10:19):
And some of them tilt to the after dark.
Yes, lively and some of themtilt to the after dark, but very
lively discussion.
Speaker 1 (10:37):
Yes.
So how did you make thetransition from or?
Well, you didn't quitetransition, which is which is
also something that you do verygreat in terms of you know what
you, what you do, you, you are amatchmaker, but you also have
this passion for teachingentrepreneurs and creating
resources for them.
We Can Start Up is somethingthat I know you did recently,
right.
Speaker 2 (10:50):
Yes, we Can.
Start Up is a big initiativethat we've done.
We have several planned for2016.
Speaker 1 (10:56):
Awesome.
I can't wait to hear them.
How did you get into focusingor supporting entrepreneurs in
their endeavors?
How did that come about?
Speaker 2 (11:07):
You know, I'm Jamaican.
Speaker 1 (11:08):
Yes, again, let's go back Jamaican.
Speaker 2 (11:11):
That's it, that's the answer, you know.
But there is truth to beingWest Indian, or to being an
immigrant, or being from animmigrant family, and and and
realizing that fundamentally,there's this need to survive,
and really thriving inentrepreneurship is being and
(11:34):
realizing that there's a needfor you, you know, to survive.
So, uh, you know it goes wayback, like literally goes back
to you know me being 12 yearsold, selling cans of Coca-Cola
on the street to constructionworkers.
You know it.
You know I've always had jobs,yeah, and I've always had my.
Well, I shouldn't say I'vealways, because I've worked in,
(11:57):
like Wendy's, I was a cashierand, you know, worked in
different restaurants, but forthe most part, I've always
created my jobs, created myopportunities, and so it's been
a part of I think it's just apart of my DNA.
Now, when I graduated fromcollege, I had a great job.
I worked in an investment bankand it was, you know, sweet job.
(12:20):
It was the coveted job, but Iquit and I launched my own
business.
I raised money.
Matter of fact, it was asoftware company that I started.
This is way back.
This is like 2003, 2002,actually, when I did this, and
that was really the beginning ofme getting a taste of
(12:44):
entrepreneurship at a totallyhigh level, but then it was the
most pivotal experiences for mewas working for Enver Yücel, who
I mentioned he's the Turkishbillionaire and Oprah Winfrey.
Speaker 1 (12:55):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (12:56):
I worked for Oprah and Enver collectively for eight
years and watching these twopeople, who are really two great
entrepreneurs, two of thegreatest entrepreneurs to ever
walk the face of the earth youknow, working directly for them,
I was able to observe that theyhad these habits, and the
(13:17):
habits is what allowed them tobe successful.
It wasn't because they were,you know, geniuses or they had,
like, the highest IQ or theywere the most charismatic, and
you know, that was what led me.
And so having all of thoseexperiences you know, I went to
business school.
That was another one so havingall of those experiences like
(13:37):
culminated in me knowing, inaround 2008, that, you know, I'm
an entrepreneur and I just needto own that.
Speaker 1 (13:45):
Right, Right, you know, stepping back a little bit
because you know we really haveto talk about the whole
Caribbean and West Indian thing.
Right, my first experience withentrepreneurship is with my
grandparents.
Right, Because back in Jamaicathey sell almost everything.
Right, and like you said, it's asurvival thing, you know I.
So, growing up, I don't knowanything different.
You know, for me, I need to bedoing something, creating my own
(14:09):
opportunities.
So I, like you said, it's DNA,it's just built in.
We have to do this.
And so so, in terms of thehabits that you've noticed that
are critical for success as anentrepreneur, you know,
particularly for entrepreneursin, you know, black and brown
communities, we don't have theopportunities to get around
(14:30):
billionaires, so so I canimagine how much resources,
because I tell you, those mentorMonday sessions, I'm like Lord,
you need to, like I, so many,like really, really incredible
information.
And so tell me what are the topthree mistakes you see, you
(14:50):
know black, brown entrepreneurs,budding entrepreneurs, are
making when it comes toentrepreneurship, or making
connections as they pursue theiryou know their dreams pursue
their you know their dreams.
Speaker 2 (15:08):
You know, this is something that I think about
often, a matter of fact, I meanquite honestly, I probably think
about this every day.
You know, to the point whereI've just recently launched I've
been working on a new company.
Like this is to really show youI'm Jamaican.
Speaker 1 (15:17):
This is now my fifth job.
Speaker 2 (15:19):
Yeah, a new company that I'm launching with my
brother.
We already have a team of sevenpeople.
We've been working on this forthe last year.
Our beta comes out soon, butessentially, the company is
geared towards solving theproblem that you just asked, and
that is what is the problemthat multicultural entrepreneurs
have, and I'll sum it up bysaying one thing it is our lack
(15:43):
of social capital.
Speaker 1 (15:48):
Oh, yes, let me do a tamar, because I want to use
myself as an example.
Social capital is huge, um,because for me, um, as we said
in the the, the call thepre-chat.
You know, as a caribbeanamerican from the caribbean, you
have, you have two extremes youeither hold your head down and
work, or, and you despise theperson who front up the boss and
(16:10):
chat, chat and not doing theirwork.
And you know there's no,there's no middle ground there,
and it should exist.
So I find myself included, we,I have challenges, you know,
creating the social capitalbecause I'm thinking, I work
hard.
You know I work hard becauseI'm Jamaican, so why is my hard
(16:32):
work not being, you know,acknowledged?
How am I not getting further?
And you said it the socialcapital.
So how do we, you know, how dowe build our social?
Speaker 2 (16:44):
capital, yeah, you know.
So with social capital, I'msure a lot of people listening
right now are thinking there,you know, there's a lot of
different definitions for it,right?
So the way that I look atsocial capital is it's who you
know and who they know plus theresources that those people have
, right?
That's really what socialcapital is, and the reason why
(17:07):
social capital is a problem formulticultural entrepreneurs more
than any other entrepreneurs isbecause there are other
entrepreneurs.
So let's take the Irish guy wholives in the Irish background
but lives in the United States,right?
His ability or his probabilityof growing up going to school,
(17:29):
having family friends who areknowledgeable in business, who
have resources to startbusinesses, who have access to
deals and partnerships, etcetera, are probably going to be
much higher than me growing upJamaica Queens, like that kind
of thing right.
And so, as a result, when youplay that out over the years of
(17:53):
someone's life and then overgenerations, we multicultural
entrepreneurs, we have a smallersocial capital network.
Right, we have less socialcapital.
So the key, the number onething that we want to be focused
on, is growing our socialcapital.
Now, how do we do that isreally.
The simple answer is we connectwith people who are very
(18:17):
knowledgeable and have lots ofresources.
But, just like you said earlier, it's like OK, paul, you know,
but how do we connect with Oprah, right, how do we connect with,
like, an, enver Ugel?
Yeah, and my response is thatthis is the reason why we're
creating this company, right,because it's hard to do it, but
the quick answer is that socialmedia is what allows us to do
(18:39):
that.
Speaker 1 (18:39):
Absolutely.
Speaker 2 (18:40):
Social media connects us, and I'll give you a real
life example of this is you know, I don't have all the social
capital in the world, right, butit just so happens that I
actually know severalbillionaires.
You know, a matter of fact,there was a project that I've
been working on called thebillionaire project, where I
interview billionaires, like Iinterviewed Michael Lee Chin
right Billionaire from Jamaica,um, and so I know these people
(19:03):
right now.
This is the beauty of socialmedia.
Anyone listening to thispodcast right now could
literally send me an email orsend me a tweet and I will
respond to them and we cancreate a rapport.
We can literally create arapport Within a week.
We can create a rapport, andonce we've created that rapport,
I now am in your network.
(19:26):
You now are in my network, andso that means that Michael Lee
Chin, oprah and all these peopleare now in your network.
You now are in my network, andso that means that Michael Lee
Chin, oprah and all these peopleare now in your network, and
that's how quickly it happens.
Now, here's where a lot ofentrepreneurs not just
multicultural entrepreneurs, buthere's where a lot of
entrepreneurs get it wrong, andhere's the secret to really
building the network is thattypically, entrepreneurs have an
(19:48):
idea of what they need, and sowhen they connect with someone,
they will just make their askright out the gate.
Speaker 1 (19:54):
Ah, that was.
Oh, I know it, I know it, Iknow it.
That's a question I knew wasgoing to.
I had for you, because how doyou know when to ask for what
you want?
It's like what's the time whenyou build the relationship,
(20:15):
because that's a question peopleask.
It's like an awkward situation.
I met you Can you do thispodcast?
And now what happens next?
It's really awkward and I thinkthat's the challenge.
So we just ask for what we want.
Speaker 2 (20:23):
So here's the thing I wrote a blog post called it's
not called using, it's callednetworking.
And I use the example of Oprah,because you know meeting Oprah.
I mean, she's one of the mostrecognized people in the world
and whenever someone Googles mybio and they see that I've
worked with her, immediatelythey will send me a message and
(20:45):
they'll say, hey, paul, can youpass this on to Oprah?
Or you know, hey, paul, can youpass this on to Oprah.
Or you know, hey, paul, can youintroduce me to Oprah?
Or I've got a show idea, canyou send this over to the Oprah
Winfrey Network?
And I always think to myself dothey really think that I don't
even know them and I'm going tosay, oh, yeah, sure, hold on for
a second.
Yeah, oprah Winfrey, Oprah,take a look at this.
(21:05):
Like, do they really think that, because there's no way in the
world I or anyone should do that?
Because if I did that and thatperson is subpar, you know, a
half ass person or whatever theybe it's going to reflect badly
on me and it will damage myrelationship with her.
Speaker 1 (21:52):
And so, at the end of the day, what we have to
realize is it's not using.
Speaker 2 (21:54):
I mean it's not using , it's networking.
So how do you network?
How you network is you simplydo the following you meet
someone and then you listen towhat that person needs and then
you give, you give, you give,you give, you give, you give.
And then you ask Right, and theproblem is most entrepreneurs
will ask or, what they'll do isthey'll do a real simple give.
You know, like, what is a give?
A give is anything that addsvalue to the person you're
trying to build a relationshipwith, right.
Let me break that down more.
What does that mean?
Adding value?
(22:15):
Adding value means you aredoing something to help further
that person along their way to agoal that they have.
So some people who have beenphenomenal with me over the last
year, 2015,.
I met a guy named Joshua Porter.
He's a member of the MentorMonday community.
He's now attended weekendstartup schools, et cetera.
(22:36):
How did he build a relationshipwith me?
He now I consider him mybrother, like he could text me
right now and say hey, paul, I'mstuck at the Metro and I would
say okay, as soon as I'm donewith this podcast, I'm going to
go pick you up.
Now, how did that happen?
(22:56):
It happened because when I methim.
He truly listened to me.
He followed me on on on socialmedia.
You know he saw what I projects, that I was working on.
He knew what some of my needswere.
Based on that and then, afterhe met me, he would then help to
further my goals.
How do we?
How did he do that?
He would send me information onevents that were upcoming in
the area that could bebeneficial to me.
He would refer people to methat he thought would be
(23:19):
beneficial for you know, aMentor Monday guest, you know he
would send me.
He knew that I liked I would.
Sometimes I talk about the suitsthat I wear.
He knew that.
So he he was like hey, paul,did you know that you can get
your suit for 20% off at thisone place on this one day?
I was like word, you can, youknow.
So he continued to add value,and this is not over a week or
(23:41):
over four weeks, this was overmonths.
He bought into all of theweekend startup schools and
attended all of them.
He would then dap me up at theweekend startup schools.
He built a real relationshipwith me.
He gave, he gave, he gave, hegave, he gave, he gave, he gave,
he gave, he gave.
And then he made an ask andwhat did I do?
(24:04):
I immediately did it yeah,right, yeah.
Speaker 1 (24:08):
And so this is the key, and I think that this is
how we build social capital, andthis is truly the success to
becoming a success, because yoursocial capital is indicative
of't there a piece whereexisting entrepreneurs kind of
(24:30):
have to be more visible and kindof share some of what they know
so that they're an expertise,Because then you know, not
everyone knows it's also whoknows that you know, that you
really know what you're doing.
Right.
That plays into it a little bit.
Speaker 2 (24:47):
Sure, sure, I mean, I agree with you and I think
that's a function of branding.
You know we're we're at a we'reat a we're in a different
economy right now.
You know we're in an economythat's drastically different
than just five, six years ago,where it was to your benefit not
to talk up what you're doing.
Right, it was to your benefitto not have to stand on a
(25:09):
platform and say, hey, everybody, you know, this is the project
that I'm working on or this iswhat I'm doing.
But now we're at a point wherethere's so much content that's
created now.
You know, on Eric Schmidt,chairman of Google, former CEO
right, said that over a 48 hourperiod right, two day period
(25:31):
that more content is created nowthan was created from the
beginning of time.
Speaker 1 (25:36):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (25:37):
Right, you heard that all the way to 2003.
Speaker 1 (25:39):
Yes, I've heard that I work in the legal industry,
where I have to process some ofthis data for litigation, so
yeah, I know it for sure.
Speaker 2 (25:47):
It's crazy, but if you think of it conceptually,
you will see that that meansthat there is more data, there's
more noise than ever before,and so we have to be the signal
to the noise.
And how you are the signal, howyou stand out, is that you have
to realize that you have totalk yourself up, because, at
(26:10):
the end of the day, no one cansell you better than you.
Speaker 1 (26:14):
Yeah, yeah, absolutely so.
Take how we connected.
So we my friend Michaela and Iwe went to Blogalicious and you
were on the panel and you talkedabout all your jobs like a
Jamaican.
And you were on the panel andyou talked about all your jobs
like a Jamaican, and thenafterwards we approached you and
, you know, I personally findthat you are so personable and
(26:37):
approachable and not everyone islike that but you know,
michaela and I came up to youand this is how we end up having
this podcast.
Now, in terms of moving forward,I've gotten your advice, which
is give, give, give, and I guessthat's the approach that we
have to do in terms of makingconnections.
But then, at what point do youmake a decision as to whether
(27:02):
maybe the person you're tryingto connect with is not the right
person you should connect with?
Because, like you said, we havethis idea in our head of, oh, I
just need to connect with thatperson.
At what point do you realizethat maybe this is I don't want
to say this is not a connectionyou should make but when do you
kind of say well, this is a goodperson to know, but maybe not
(27:24):
what I thought in terms ofbigger goals in terms of making
connections, or do we make thatdistinction?
Speaker 2 (27:30):
Right Now.
This is a really importantquestion.
This is like not what yourquestion is, not basic
networking or networking 101.
That was more of like agraduate level networking
question.
So I love that, I love that.
So here's the thing is that youthink about a relationship.
What is a relationship?
A business, platonic, you know?
Love, what?
(27:51):
What is it?
Relationship is aboutreciprocation.
That's what makes it arelationship.
So, for example, I've beenmarried for 15 years.
So that means that in the 15years, what's happened is that I
have given to my wife and mywife has given to me.
If, over the 15 years, I onlygave to her, well, it would be a
(28:17):
one-sided relationship, whichmeans it's not a relationship.
So it's the same thing when itcomes to business or networking
is that you want to seereciprocation.
If you don't see reciprocation,that's the first sign that
you're not in the rightrelationship with someone Right.
(28:37):
So, for example, we if, if,after, uh, you know, when we met
at blogalicious and you werelike, hey, paul, you know, um,
would you, would you got, wouldyou like to be on this podcast?
And I was like sure, and then Inever committed to a date or
time with you.
Speaker 1 (28:53):
Right.
Speaker 2 (28:54):
Right, and you followed up.
You know, and some people,sometimes people are busy, so
that's fair.
You know, sometimes you have tofollow up two, three times, but
let's say you followed up seventimes and I still didn't commit
to the date or time.
Well, that is a clear signalthat I'm not reciprocating and
therefore I'm probably not thebest person to be in a
relationship with you Right now.
(29:15):
As the relationship continues,here's the here's, the here's
where it begins for a lot ofpeople to get difficult, but
this is what the most successfulpeople do.
And here's what happens is thatrelationships are all and now.
This is just my opinion, this ismy opinion, is, or should I say
the vast majority ofrelationships are terminal.
(29:37):
They're truly terminal, andwhat that means is there is an
endpoint that will come to mostof the relationships that you
have, because you simply can'tpsychologically Right, you
simply can't maintain all therelationships that you rack up
through your life.
(29:58):
Thing called the Dunbar theory,right who?
He came out with some greatresearch that basically states
that the, the the maximum numberof people that we could truly
be friends with is 150.
Speaker 1 (30:10):
Yeah, yeah, I heard that.
Speaker 2 (30:12):
And so, at the end of the day, what this means is
that let's take the two of us,for example right, we, we, now,
we're doing, we're doing thispodcast, right, so we've, now,
you know, I've reciprocated now,right, so?
Speaker 1 (30:26):
so this isn't me asking anything, but I'm just,
you know, throw this out, I'mgoing to ask you anyway after we
get off the podcast, like howcan you help the?
Speaker 2 (30:32):
person Right.
The key is to be such a greatlistener of the person that you
already know what they're tryingto do, and then you just give.
Speaker 1 (30:53):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (30:54):
Right, you just give.
And so the key is so.
So you know you're so.
You know, over the course ofthe next couple of months,
you're going to give and, um,you know, do I reciproc?
The next couple of monthsyou're going to give and you
know, do I reciprocate on thatgiving, right, yeah, and then
that's going to continue on andon and on.
But there's going to be a pointin our life, whether it's in
(31:15):
one month, whether it's in oneyear, whether it's in 10 years,
that chances are there's, no,there's, there's nothing further
that I can do to help furtheryou along on your goals, and
there's nothing that you coulddo to help further me along on
my goals.
And and now here's thedifference between successful
(31:36):
and unsuccessful people inbusiness the unsuccessful people
will say you know what, there'snothing else that you can do.
And they know you know whatthey do's nothing else that you
can do.
That's cool.
And they know, you know whatthey do.
They just let that personlinger in their network.
They just let them linger,right, the most successful
people know how to fire friends.
And that sounds socontroversial, it sounds so bad,
(31:58):
but it's the truth.
It's the truth.
So you think you have 150 realfriends that you can have, so
that and your opportunity comesfrom all of those friends, right
?
And so what that means is thatyou have to continually be
pruning your network.
You have to continually bepruning, and it doesn't mean
(32:21):
that you burn a bridge, itdoesn't mean that you abruptly
kick somebody out, but what itdoes mean is that you are
attentive to your network,knowing that your girlfriends,
your boyfriends, everything isgoing to come from your network.
(32:45):
So you want to tend that likeyou're pruning a fine tree.
And so successful people.
They know how to prune thenetwork.
They know how to fire friends.
Speaker 1 (32:55):
You know, there was this video that I saw on
Facebook I'm sure you've seen itwhere all these soldiers were
trying to get over this wall andthey were all helping each
other up and at the end the lastperson just kind of ran up the
wall and everyone shares thisvideo.
And I said, you know, this isgreat that they could all help
each other up over this wall,but I guarantee you that it took
a couple of tries for them toget it together and it's moving
(33:18):
different people in and out ofroles.
Who's going to go over first?
And I think the challenge wehave is, you know, we keep
friends because they've beenfriends for a very long time or
they've helped us to a certainpoint and they should this thing
of obligation.
And you know, maybe and this iswhy people then come to say
(33:40):
maybe you shouldn't go intobusiness with friends and so
talk a little bit about thatit's okay to maybe start a
venture with a friend, but howdo you know when it's time to
prune that relationship?
Speaker 2 (33:52):
Yeah, most people who start businesses with friends,
those have a higher failure ratethan any other business, you
know.
So it's typically not a goodidea to do that.
You know what you want to do isyou want to start businesses
with people who add value inareas that you, you know, add
(34:13):
skills that you don't have.
You know the good thing about afriend is that they share your
values.
Right, that's I always advocatethat for for a business
relationship.
But you also, you know you needthem to add skills.
So, like you know, you'restarting a tech company and
you're non-technical, well, youneed someone who's technical,
you know, like bottom line, andso that's the you know.
(34:34):
That is really the key in termsof the firing of the friend and
knowing when to fire the friend.
It's really when one of twomajor things happen.
Either A, it's clear that thatperson doesn't share your values
.
Now, values is something thattypically doesn't change much
(34:54):
once we become adults, but itdoes change for people, you know
.
And so if you have someone whodoesn't share your values, it
means that you play life bydifferent rules.
It means that you see thingsdifferently.
What you consider to be good,they could consider to be bad.
You know, and that's notsomeone who's healthy to be
around, and so that's one.
(35:15):
The second is that and this isgoing to sound like you know,
you know like an I'm anopportunist here but the second
is when that person can'tinspire you anymore and you
can't inspire them anymore.
Right, and that's really whatit's about, because if they, you
know, we have to constantly bechanging right.
(35:37):
You know, if we are not changingand we are not- evolving we're
stagnant, we're dead, we're dead, and so, if you are and, by the
way, everything that I'm saying, this is for ambitious people-
yes, we are ambitious people.
Speaker 1 (35:54):
Listen to the podcast , by the way.
Speaker 2 (35:55):
Yeah, I mean because you know if you are at a place
in your life where you know likeso, for example, and by the way
, you could value ambition.
But you can just be in a placein your life where you know like
so, for example, and by the way, you could be, you could value
ambition, but you can just be ina place where it's not
necessary.
You know, my father, forexample, is retiring next year.
He's retiring right.
He's at a place now where he nolonger needs to prune his
(36:19):
network like he was previously.
He's at a totally differentstage in his life and so, even
though he may now be with peoplewho are not as inspirational,
right, it's not.
It's not to the same degree ashe being, you know, a younger
man, 40 years, you know ago,coming up.
(36:42):
So you know, a lot of thisdepends on stage and values, but
if that person is no longerinspiring you and you are no
longer inspiring them, then thenwhat's the point of them taking
up a spot in a you know apressure spot in your network,
whereas someone else could bethere who's moving you further?
(37:03):
You're moving them and you'remaking a bigger impact in the
world.
Speaker 1 (37:07):
Yeah, that is so awesome.
I mean, I'm here jotting stuffdown so I'm just like you know
what.
I'm going to listen to thereplay because this is just like
so awesome, Because this issomething that I as much as I
have the podcast.
I struggle with making theconnections and the pruning part
is so important.
But if I'm not totally engagingor listening to what my network
(37:31):
wants and just kind ofproviding that, I do that within
a certain level of comfortlevel.
But once I have to reachoutside my immediate circle and
that comfort level, that's whenI kind of get insecure and I'm
not sure and I just kind of stepback and end up not doing
anything.
So I really, really appreciateall this information because I'm
(37:52):
telling you 2016, I call it mybust out year and I'm just
busting out of all of the thingsor the messages I've told
myself that no longer apply.
So I know that we live in adigital world where I have to,
you know, rise above the noise,I have to brand myself and you
(38:12):
know, holding my head down atwork, I said my work speaks for
itself.
It doesn't apply now.
So I don't have an excuse, butI kind of hold on to those as
excuses to keep me safe.
So this is so awesome because Iknow some of my other friends.
We have the same issues.
I'm really glad that you arejust oh my God, this is such
good stuff connections.
When it comes to the point ofpruning the relationships
(38:36):
because, again, we're notburning bridges Like your book
says.
It's complicated but it doesn'thave to be how do we don't make
(38:58):
it so complicated or awkwardthat we're now kind of moving
away from where the relationshiponce is?
How do you that we're now kindof moving away from where the
relationship once is?
How do you kind of maintainsome kind of you know, your core
?
I don't think people dobreakups well, whether it's
business or personal.
So how do you kind of, how doyou walk away in a mature, adult
(39:20):
way?
Speaker 2 (39:21):
Yeah, great question, cause it applies to every
relationship that we have.
Yeah, the, the, the best.
So you know, I'll give you aquick, quick, quick story is uh,
you know, the first televisionshow I did was with Oprah.
It was called a show calledlove town.
Speaker 1 (39:34):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (39:34):
And in the show there was, uh, you know, there was
this gentleman who was trying tobreak it off with his
girlfriend and he was like so hecame to me and he was like Paul
, you know, I don't know how todo it.
And so, you know, I gave himsome suggestions and then I see
him like a week later, and I waslike, did you break up with her
?
He was like, yeah, I broke upwith her and I said how'd you do
(39:55):
it?
He said, well, you know, I juststopped calling her.
And it turns out that that isthe number one way that people
quote unquote break up withother people, not just
romantically, but even inbusiness.
It's what I call fade to black.
Is that they just assume thatbecause I've stopped calling you
(40:17):
, because I've stoppedcontacting you, that you should
get the hint and realize thatit's over, because I've stopped
contacting you, that you shouldget the hint and realize that
it's over?
But that is a punk move, thatis the move of a third grader,
right.
That is the move of someone whois not going to be successful
later in life?
Wow, right, because what makesyou successful is when you can
(40:41):
own who you are.
Right, you own who you are andyou own your actions.
That's what makes you mature,right, mature people have mature
action, and so my point to himand you know my answer to you is
that you specifically outlinewhat you're doing and why and it
(41:05):
seems hard, but that's what youdo.
So my advice to him was to tellhis girlfriend the reason why
he's breaking up with her, andthe real reason why is because
he excuse me he was in love withsomebody else.
You know he was seeing somebodyelse.
Speaker 1 (41:29):
You know he was seeing somebody else, and so is.
Speaker 2 (41:31):
And so you know, if we can just like if this world
would be so much more efficientif we could just stop the BS,
yeah, and that is even inbusiness.
And so you know, let's betruthful to the situation, and
then you know we'll be able tosever relationships better.
And then you know we'll be ableto sever relationships better.
Now, the last thing I'll say onthis is not to overdo it,
because a lot of people will say, ok, well, let me give you the
(41:51):
reason, and then they'll spendthree hours on what the reason
is of the breakup or theseparation of the business or
the partnership or that kind ofthing.
The best thing to do andactually Harvard Business Review
did this whole study around howbosses should fire their
employees right, and this iskind of the same thing, right,
(42:13):
breakup.
And what they found is the mosteffective way to fire an
employee or you know just anyoneis to do it quickly and to
leave the conversation with whatyou're doing.
So you would say you know what,carrie Ann, I'm going to have
to let you go today.
And the reason why I'm going tohave to let you go is because
(42:34):
you have, you know, not done A,b and C, and it's been
documented and, as a result,what we're going to do is we're
going to give you one month, etcetera, but it's been documented
and, as a result, what we'regoing to do is we're going to
give you one month, et cetera,but it's quick and it's abrupt.
Speaker 1 (42:46):
It's not.
Speaker 2 (42:47):
Oh, yeah, you know what.
Come on, sit down.
Yeah, how are you doing?
Yeah, how's your family?
Yeah, like no.
No, it's abrupt and it's thesame way in every relationship.
Speaker 1 (42:56):
You want to be upfront you want to be truthful
and you want to be succinct.
Oh my gosh, paul, I tell you,that's why you are the teacher,
because you know, sometimes it'sa simple thing, but sometimes
we really need the simple truths, you know, because it's like
(43:17):
it's not that complicated, it'sjust, we just have to
communicate better, which is theunderlying thing, the way we
communicate with each other, andyou know, we just keep doing it
the wrong way.
Oh my goodness.
Thank you, paul.
This has just been so.
So there's just so muchinformation here.
I know that you're going tohave a lot of quotables, so when
you see it on Instagram and Itag you, it's going to be crazy.
(43:41):
But you know, on a final note,because this is a podcast that
is, for you know, focuses onbusiness and career for the
Caribbean American and, beingfrom a Caribbean American
background, you know one thing,the one thing that you have as
an advice to us CaribbeanAmerican entrepreneurs because
(44:01):
we're out there, we're just notas visible.
So what's the one thing you'dlike to see this community do
differently, to kind of bust outfor 2016?
So people know that, like you,with all the jobs, like a
Jamaican, we're all out heredoing what we need to do.
So what do you want us as agroup and as an audience to do?
To kind of rise to the occasionas a group and as an audience
(44:22):
to do, to kind of rise to theoccasion.
Speaker 2 (44:23):
Wow, that's such a big question, you know, I think
it's probably two different setsof advice, depending on the
mentality of the personlistening.
So a lot of folks that I knowfrom the Caribbean realize that
you know I'll take Jamaica, forexample is it's this small
island, but yet, while it's sucha small island, it's such a
(44:45):
small country, we have, you know, some of the best athletes.
We've had the best businesses.
We've had the most beautifulwomen.
Like you know, we have impactedthe fashion industry like we've
had a disproportionate impacton the world.
Speaker 1 (45:01):
Right.
Speaker 2 (45:01):
Right, and a lot of people that I know from the
Caribbean or, in this example,from Jamaica, they know this and
they're so proud of that thatthey believe that everyone
should recognize that.
And that's enough.
And that's enough, right?
I'm Jamaican.
Speaker 1 (45:19):
Yeah, give me the job , yeah.
Speaker 2 (45:22):
But it doesn't work like that.
Yeah Right, it doesn't worklike that.
So there's, there's, there's,there's, you know, I think, a
group that's that way.
But then there's another groupthat I know from, like Jamaican
this example, where they'll sayyou know, I'm from, you know
this little island, you know how, how, how can I, how am I going
to, you know, do big thingsbecause I'm from such a small
(45:44):
place.
And what I always like to sayis that those of us who have
come from small places, sothat's, if you've come from the
Caribbean, you've come from asmall place.
If you've come from a smallplace, it means that you've come
from a place unlike most peoplein the world.
That means that you have comefrom a unique place.
(46:06):
Yes, uniqueness is where yourpower lies, the fact that you
are unique.
And if you can embrace thatfact, fully understand that fact
, embrace that fact, you'll doincredibly well.
Right, the most successfulpeople in the world, the
(46:27):
billionaires of the world, whatthey've been able to do the
self-made billionaire, should Isay.
They've been able to figure outthe things that make them
different than everyone else andthey have been able to
capitalize on those things.
And so my homework, to everyonelistening, especially if you're
from the Caribbean, is tofigure out what makes you
(46:49):
different than the masses.
Right, you know the massesaround the world.
What makes you different?
Also, what makes you differentfrom even the people that are
from you know, back home, andwhatever those things are those
one, two, three little things,those little things.
That is where your power lies,in those little things.
Speaker 1 (47:11):
You know, and that is such that, as simple as that
exercise is, that assignment is,it's hard because a lot of
times we discredit what makes usunique because we're like, oh,
that's just nothing, there'snothing that we, just we push it
to the side.
So, you know, don't discreditwhat makes us unique because
we're like, oh, that's justnothing, there's nothing that we
, just we push it to the side.
So, you know, don't discreditanything.
Anything that you find comeseasy or you don't think it's a
(47:31):
big deal, write it down, becausea lot of times, and also what
people tell us, you know whatthe world mirrors back to us,
that's something that we shouldcapture.
And I'm learning this because Ijust I'm like, oh, you know,
people say, carrie, you're soorganized and you could break
things down.
I'm like, but that was easy.
But I don't see it that wayBecause, again, it came easy to
(47:52):
me.
So, really, really greatassignment.
Paul, thank you.
I cannot say thank you enoughbecause this was just so amazing
, so chock full, and I can'twait to hear more about when
your new projects are coming out.
I'll definitely keep thecommunity informed as to what
you're doing, what's happening.
I get the emails every weekMentor Monday it's happening,
(48:17):
this is what's going on and Iget the recap emails that say
this is what happened.
But definitely check out MentorMondays.
It's a wealth of information,different entrepreneurs and
maybe sometimes it's just Pauljust like shooting the breeze
with his red stripe.
Speaker 2 (48:33):
Yeah, absolutely, and I will say I'm still looking
for that red stripe endorsement.
If somebody wants to add valueto me, they will connect me with
red stripes so I can get thatsponsorship.
Speaker 1 (48:46):
True story.
Growing up, my grandfatherworked at the DNG factory in
Hopewell it's like the westernpart of Jamaica, a little bit
outside of Mobe, and it was justlike I used to love going to
the factory just to see how theymake everything.
So you know I don't have thatconnection anymore, but I'll
keep my ear out to see ifthere's a Red Stripe endorsement
(49:08):
coming soon.
Speaker 2 (49:09):
All right, all right, all right, but I appreciate it.
Thank you for having me.
You know, it's always apleasure to have a platform to
be able to share what you know,and I really appreciate it.
So thank you very much.
Speaker 1 (49:19):
Thank you, thank you, thank you, everyone listening.
I'll have a recap on the show.
I'll have every informationthat I have for Paul and what
he's doing and, you know,connect with him on Twitter,
facebook and follow him onInstagram.
He has a lot of stuff on there.
So until next time, folks walkgood.
Hello, welcome to another episode of the Carrie on
Friends podcast.
I'm your host, carrie-anne.
Thank you so much for listening.
I'm excited because today'sguest on the podcast is Paul C
Brunson, and if you're notfamiliar with who he is, paul is
a television host, an author, aprofessional matchmaker.
He's appeared as the co-host onOprah Winfrey's network,
(00:26):
lovetown, usa, and, yeah, he'sJamaican.
Now in this episode, I speakwith Paul about making
worthwhile connections in loveand business.
But before we get into theinterview, I'd like you to share
the love on Facebook.
Tell a friend, let me know whatyou think about the show, this
episode.
So I won't keep you waiting anylonger.
Here's my interview with Paul.
(00:46):
Paul, I'm so excited to haveyou on the Carry On Friends
podcast.
Welcome to our community.
How are you today?
Speaker 2 (00:54):
I'm fantastic.
How are you?
Speaker 1 (00:56):
I'm doing well, so excited to talk to you about
making worthwhile connections inlove and business.
I know you're just going togive us a whole bunch of
information and I am ready todive in.
You're ready?
Speaker 2 (01:08):
I'm ready.
I'm ready, let's do it.
Speaker 1 (01:10):
Cool, cool.
So for those who do not knowwho Paul C Brunson is, tell us a
little bit about who you are.
Speaker 2 (01:18):
Wow, most importantly , you know I am a husband of 15
years, I am a father.
I have two great boys.
Kingston is the oldest, he'sfive.
Our youngest is Liam, who's two.
You know, I'm a brother, I'm abrother in law, I'm a son, I'm a
cousin.
You know I'm all those thingsprobably recognize me for being
(01:47):
one of the first, if not thefirst, full-time black
matchmaker in the world, whichis kind of crazy.
So when you think of the reallife Hitch, that truly is me,
and so that's really where my,uh, my kind of career started.
Uh, I've been in investmentbanking.
Uh, I've had a bunch oftelevision shows.
Matter of fact, right now Ijust picked up a deal where I
have a big primetime show comingout on ABC yeah, coming up
(02:09):
later in the year.
I host a syndicated show.
It's a weekly show for BlackEnterprise called Our World,
where we look at big storiesimpacting the African-American
community, and so there's a lotthat I do, but most importantly,
I'm a husband and a daddy.
Speaker 1 (02:29):
Yes, those are the important roles.
A teacher of mine who I knew Iknow you had on your mentor
Mondays, julian Gordon, says youknow he's, his roles as father
and husband are first, you putlife first, then everything else
in terms of work comes after.
So, yes, and if yes, you reallyhave a whole bunch of jobs,
(02:51):
like a Jamaican.
Speaker 2 (02:52):
So yeah, although I will tell you this is you know.
So my grandfather, he'sJamaican, he's passed away.
But before he passed away, youknow, he sat down and he asked
me, so this was just maybe aboutfive years ago.
He was like how many jobs doyou have?
And I said you know, you know,grandpa, I'm working on about
three or four.
And he was like you're lazy.
Speaker 1 (03:13):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (03:14):
He called me lazy.
Speaker 1 (03:15):
Yes, you know another .
I was just speaking to someoneand you know, as a Caribbean
American, we in our heads,having multiple jobs is just
something we have to do.
Otherwise, like Grandpa said,you know you're lazy, so let's
let's talk about how you gotinto being a professional the
first African-Americanprofessional matchmaker.
(03:38):
How does that come about?
Speaker 2 (03:40):
Sure, sure.
So you know there's.
There's different ways to youknow, get into any industry and
I think the way that I got in isa little bit different than how
most people do with matchmaking.
So around 2008, I was workingfor a Turkish billionaire.
You know I had a great job.
I was managing all of hisinvestments in the United States
, and my deal with him is that Iwould I would work for him, but
(04:02):
he would also allow me to havea moonlighting job.
I was being Jamaican.
I had another job, and that wasa nonprofit organization that
helped to prepare low-incomekids, or kids from low-income
households, to get into college,and so we would give them
science and math and Englishprep.
And so the summer of 2008, I'mrunning a summer camp for these
(04:25):
kids.
We had 100 kids in our camp andI had to check all the kids in,
and so one of the questions Iwould ask is how many parents
live in your household?
And out of 100 of thesestudents, not one had two
parents in the household.
They all live with mom orgrandma or big sis.
Like very few of them even livewith men in the household, and
(04:49):
it just so happened that theywere all African-American, you
know, african Caribbean, latino,black and brown kids.
And it was that moment where Ithought to myself here we are
trying to do test prep, you know, here we are trying to, you
(05:10):
know, teach them math, butfundamentally, they're missing a
lot at home.
Right, and we saw how nothaving mother and father in the
household impacted themacademically, how it impacted
them socially, and that was themoment where I said I wanted to
do something.
That was the problem that Iwanted to really create a
solution around, and that's howI got into matchmaking.
Speaker 1 (05:32):
Awesome, awesome.
And so, as you've done, howlong have you been doing the
matchmaking?
Speaker 2 (05:39):
That was 08, you know .
So it's about six years now,Wow.
Speaker 1 (05:42):
Yeah, and as you've done this over the years, what
are the top three mistakes yousee when you are trying to match
people together?
What mistakes do you findpeople are making in their
pursuit of love and happiness?
Speaker 2 (06:00):
The first is just not having the belief that someone
can love them or will love them.
That's big, you know.
Belief truly is our reality.
So if you believe that there'sno one out there for you or that
you're unlovable, then no oneis out there for you.
Speaker 1 (06:16):
Right.
Speaker 2 (06:17):
You really are unlovable.
So that's number one.
Number two is just simply notdoing things differently.
You know, I always say thatladies have the dream that Aegis
Elba is just going to comeknock on their door.
He's going to come knock ontheir door, right that's.
Mulder and look like I'm here,exactly exactly, and fellows
(06:38):
think you know that Zoe Saldanaor somebody's going to knock on
their door and that's just notthe case, and so if you want
different results, you need todo things differently and not
doing things differently.
That's probably number two.
And then number three isplaying games.
So there's this whole notionthat love is a game, right, and,
(07:01):
like you know, if I like you,I'm not going to call you back
or I'm not going to text youback or I'm going to, you know,
act like I'm hard to get orwhatever.
Like this whole notion thatthere's games, and what I've
found is that when you findsomebody who's truly in love
with you, they don't want toplay any games, and games just
add walls and it adds frictionand a lot of people end up
(07:22):
losing other great people byplaying games.
So I think those are the topthree issues that I see.
Speaker 1 (07:28):
Right, right.
So how, how do you what?
What advice would you have?
So cause playing games.
Sometimes it seems you've beendoing it so long that it seems
normal.
You don't know how to undothese behaviors because they've
been just so rooted in yourwhole dating experience, however
(07:49):
long that started.
What's one tip that you havethat someone could start today
to kind of correcting orredirecting?
You know, any one of thosebehaviors?
Speaker 2 (08:01):
So when you think about a bad habit, you know
habit or bad behavior, it'sreally just simply a decision, a
conscious decision that youmake over and over and over
again.
And I want to emphasize it's aconscious decision, so you have
control over that.
So the best way to curb badhabit or bad behavior is to know
(08:23):
that you are the one making thechoice to do that, and so it
all starts with self.
Now, the best advice I couldgive around that is to get
around people who are going tohold you accountable.
You know a lot, of, a lot ofissues that people have in their
romantic relationships, intheir platonic relationships, in
(08:44):
their business relationships,is because they're surrounded
with other people who have poorrelationships themselves.
They're surrounded by peoplewho have low standards.
They're surrounded by peoplewho don't even share their.
You know your values, and themore that you surround yourself
around people who are trulymediocre, the more mediocre you
(09:08):
become and the less successfulyou'll be in all your
relationships.
So the best way to startcurbing habit or should I say
bad habit and the best way toreally just be the best that you
can be is surround yourselfwith people who are literally
better than you.
Speaker 1 (09:23):
Right, surround yourself with people who are
literally better than you.
Right, you acknowledge thebehavior and you change your
surroundings, or thesurroundings that encourage the
continuance of that behavior.
That's awesome, I believe TDJakes maybe not the same way,
but he was giving the analogywith the giraffe and the turtle.
And the turtle is going to giveadvice based on his level,
(09:43):
right down there in the grass,and the giraffe is like seeing
the treetops.
And if you, you really can'ttake advice for someone who
cannot see at your level oraren't at the level that you
want to be, so I, I, I, I thinkthat's something worthwhile, and
not only in romanticrelationships but in business
relationships.
So it's switching gears alittle bit.
(10:05):
Let's talk about some of themistakes that you, before we get
to the mistakes I know you doMentor Mondays.
I've watched it.
It's awesome.
It's like a packed crowd onSpreecast.
Lively discussions there yes,lively.
Speaker 2 (10:19):
And some of them tilt to the after dark.
Yes, lively and some of themtilt to the after dark, but very
lively discussion.
Speaker 1 (10:37):
Yes.
So how did you make thetransition from or?
Well, you didn't quitetransition, which is which is
also something that you do verygreat in terms of you know what
you, what you do, you, you are amatchmaker, but you also have
this passion for teachingentrepreneurs and creating
resources for them.
We Can Start Up is somethingthat I know you did recently,
right.
Speaker 2 (10:50):
Yes, we Can.
Start Up is a big initiativethat we've done.
We have several planned for2016.
Speaker 1 (10:56):
Awesome.
I can't wait to hear them.
How did you get into focusingor supporting entrepreneurs in
their endeavors?
How did that come about?
Speaker 2 (11:07):
You know, I'm Jamaican.
Speaker 1 (11:08):
Yes, again, let's go back Jamaican.
Speaker 2 (11:11):
That's it, that's the answer, you know.
But there is truth to beingWest Indian, or to being an
immigrant, or being from animmigrant family, and and and
realizing that fundamentally,there's this need to survive,
and really thriving inentrepreneurship is being and
(11:34):
realizing that there's a needfor you, you know, to survive.
So, uh, you know it goes wayback, like literally goes back
to you know me being 12 yearsold, selling cans of Coca-Cola
on the street to constructionworkers.
You know it.
You know I've always had jobs,yeah, and I've always had my.
Well, I shouldn't say I'vealways, because I've worked in,
(11:57):
like Wendy's, I was a cashierand, you know, worked in
different restaurants, but forthe most part, I've always
created my jobs, created myopportunities, and so it's been
a part of I think it's just apart of my DNA.
Now, when I graduated fromcollege, I had a great job.
I worked in an investment bankand it was, you know, sweet job.
(12:20):
It was the coveted job, but Iquit and I launched my own
business.
I raised money.
Matter of fact, it was asoftware company that I started.
This is way back.
This is like 2003, 2002,actually, when I did this, and
that was really the beginning ofme getting a taste of
(12:44):
entrepreneurship at a totallyhigh level, but then it was the
most pivotal experiences for mewas working for Enver Yücel, who
I mentioned he's the Turkishbillionaire and Oprah Winfrey.
Speaker 1 (12:55):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (12:56):
I worked for Oprah and Enver collectively for eight
years and watching these twopeople, who are really two great
entrepreneurs, two of thegreatest entrepreneurs to ever
walk the face of the earth youknow, working directly for them,
I was able to observe that theyhad these habits, and the
(13:17):
habits is what allowed them tobe successful.
It wasn't because they were,you know, geniuses or they had,
like, the highest IQ or theywere the most charismatic, and
you know, that was what led me.
And so having all of thoseexperiences you know, I went to
business school.
That was another one so havingall of those experiences like
(13:37):
culminated in me knowing, inaround 2008, that, you know, I'm
an entrepreneur and I just needto own that.
Speaker 1 (13:45):
Right, Right, you know, stepping back a little bit
because you know we really haveto talk about the whole
Caribbean and West Indian thing.
Right, my first experience withentrepreneurship is with my
grandparents.
Right, Because back in Jamaicathey sell almost everything.
Right, and like you said, it's asurvival thing, you know I.
So, growing up, I don't knowanything different.
You know, for me, I need to bedoing something, creating my own
(14:09):
opportunities.
So I, like you said, it's DNA,it's just built in.
We have to do this.
And so so, in terms of thehabits that you've noticed that
are critical for success as anentrepreneur, you know,
particularly for entrepreneursin, you know, black and brown
communities, we don't have theopportunities to get around
(14:30):
billionaires, so so I canimagine how much resources,
because I tell you, those mentorMonday sessions, I'm like Lord,
you need to, like I, so many,like really, really incredible
information.
And so tell me what are the topthree mistakes you see, you
(14:50):
know black, brown entrepreneurs,budding entrepreneurs, are
making when it comes toentrepreneurship, or making
connections as they pursue theiryou know their dreams pursue
their you know their dreams.
Speaker 2 (15:08):
You know, this is something that I think about
often, a matter of fact, I meanquite honestly, I probably think
about this every day.
You know, to the point whereI've just recently launched I've
been working on a new company.
Like this is to really show youI'm Jamaican.
Speaker 1 (15:17):
This is now my fifth job.
Speaker 2 (15:19):
Yeah, a new company that I'm launching with my
brother.
We already have a team of sevenpeople.
We've been working on this forthe last year.
Our beta comes out soon, butessentially, the company is
geared towards solving theproblem that you just asked, and
that is what is the problemthat multicultural entrepreneurs
have, and I'll sum it up bysaying one thing it is our lack
(15:43):
of social capital.
Speaker 1 (15:48):
Oh, yes, let me do a tamar, because I want to use
myself as an example.
Social capital is huge, um,because for me, um, as we said
in the the, the call thepre-chat.
You know, as a caribbeanamerican from the caribbean, you
have, you have two extremes youeither hold your head down and
work, or, and you despise theperson who front up the boss and
(16:10):
chat, chat and not doing theirwork.
And you know there's no,there's no middle ground there,
and it should exist.
So I find myself included, we,I have challenges, you know,
creating the social capitalbecause I'm thinking, I work
hard.
You know I work hard becauseI'm Jamaican, so why is my hard
(16:32):
work not being, you know,acknowledged?
How am I not getting further?
And you said it the socialcapital.
So how do we, you know, how dowe build our social?
Speaker 2 (16:44):
capital, yeah, you know.
So with social capital, I'msure a lot of people listening
right now are thinking there,you know, there's a lot of
different definitions for it,right?
So the way that I look atsocial capital is it's who you
know and who they know plus theresources that those people have
, right?
That's really what socialcapital is, and the reason why
(17:07):
social capital is a problem formulticultural entrepreneurs more
than any other entrepreneurs isbecause there are other
entrepreneurs.
So let's take the Irish guy wholives in the Irish background
but lives in the United States,right?
His ability or his probabilityof growing up going to school,
(17:29):
having family friends who areknowledgeable in business, who
have resources to startbusinesses, who have access to
deals and partnerships, etcetera, are probably going to be
much higher than me growing upJamaica Queens, like that kind
of thing right.
And so, as a result, when youplay that out over the years of
(17:53):
someone's life and then overgenerations, we multicultural
entrepreneurs, we have a smallersocial capital network.
Right, we have less socialcapital.
So the key, the number onething that we want to be focused
on, is growing our socialcapital.
Now, how do we do that isreally.
The simple answer is we connectwith people who are very
(18:17):
knowledgeable and have lots ofresources.
But, just like you said earlier, it's like OK, paul, you know,
but how do we connect with Oprah, right, how do we connect with,
like, an, enver Ugel?
Yeah, and my response is thatthis is the reason why we're
creating this company, right,because it's hard to do it, but
the quick answer is that socialmedia is what allows us to do
(18:39):
that.
Speaker 1 (18:39):
Absolutely.
Speaker 2 (18:40):
Social media connects us, and I'll give you a real
life example of this is you know, I don't have all the social
capital in the world, right, butit just so happens that I
actually know severalbillionaires.
You know, a matter of fact,there was a project that I've
been working on called thebillionaire project, where I
interview billionaires, like Iinterviewed Michael Lee Chin
right Billionaire from Jamaica,um, and so I know these people
(19:03):
right now.
This is the beauty of socialmedia.
Anyone listening to thispodcast right now could
literally send me an email orsend me a tweet and I will
respond to them and we cancreate a rapport.
We can literally create arapport Within a week.
We can create a rapport, andonce we've created that rapport,
I now am in your network.
(19:26):
You now are in my network, andso that means that Michael Lee
Chin, oprah and all these peopleare now in your network.
You now are in my network, andso that means that Michael Lee
Chin, oprah and all these peopleare now in your network, and
that's how quickly it happens.
Now, here's where a lot ofentrepreneurs not just
multicultural entrepreneurs, buthere's where a lot of
entrepreneurs get it wrong, andhere's the secret to really
building the network is thattypically, entrepreneurs have an
(19:48):
idea of what they need, and sowhen they connect with someone,
they will just make their askright out the gate.
Speaker 1 (19:54):
Ah, that was.
Oh, I know it, I know it, Iknow it.
That's a question I knew wasgoing to.
I had for you, because how doyou know when to ask for what
you want?
It's like what's the time whenyou build the relationship,
(20:15):
because that's a question peopleask.
It's like an awkward situation.
I met you Can you do thispodcast?
And now what happens next?
It's really awkward and I thinkthat's the challenge.
So we just ask for what we want.
Speaker 2 (20:23):
So here's the thing I wrote a blog post called it's
not called using, it's callednetworking.
And I use the example of Oprah,because you know meeting Oprah.
I mean, she's one of the mostrecognized people in the world
and whenever someone Googles mybio and they see that I've
worked with her, immediatelythey will send me a message and
(20:45):
they'll say, hey, paul, can youpass this on to Oprah?
Or you know, hey, paul, can youpass this on to Oprah.
Or you know, hey, paul, can youintroduce me to Oprah?
Or I've got a show idea, canyou send this over to the Oprah
Winfrey Network?
And I always think to myself dothey really think that I don't
even know them and I'm going tosay, oh, yeah, sure, hold on for
a second.
Yeah, oprah Winfrey, Oprah,take a look at this.
(21:05):
Like, do they really think that, because there's no way in the
world I or anyone should do that?
Because if I did that and thatperson is subpar, you know, a
half ass person or whatever theybe it's going to reflect badly
on me and it will damage myrelationship with her.
Speaker 1 (21:52):
And so, at the end of the day, what we have to
realize is it's not using.
Speaker 2 (21:54):
I mean it's not using , it's networking.
So how do you network?
How you network is you simplydo the following you meet
someone and then you listen towhat that person needs and then
you give, you give, you give,you give, you give, you give.
And then you ask Right, and theproblem is most entrepreneurs
will ask or, what they'll do isthey'll do a real simple give.
You know, like, what is a give?
A give is anything that addsvalue to the person you're
trying to build a relationshipwith, right.
Let me break that down more.
What does that mean?
Adding value?
(22:15):
Adding value means you aredoing something to help further
that person along their way to agoal that they have.
So some people who have beenphenomenal with me over the last
year, 2015,.
I met a guy named Joshua Porter.
He's a member of the MentorMonday community.
He's now attended weekendstartup schools, et cetera.
(22:36):
How did he build a relationshipwith me?
He now I consider him mybrother, like he could text me
right now and say hey, paul, I'mstuck at the Metro and I would
say okay, as soon as I'm donewith this podcast, I'm going to
go pick you up.
Now, how did that happen?
(22:56):
It happened because when I methim.
He truly listened to me.
He followed me on on on socialmedia.
You know he saw what I projects, that I was working on.
He knew what some of my needswere.
Based on that and then, afterhe met me, he would then help to
further my goals.
How do we?
How did he do that?
He would send me information onevents that were upcoming in
the area that could bebeneficial to me.
He would refer people to methat he thought would be
(23:19):
beneficial for you know, aMentor Monday guest, you know he
would send me.
He knew that I liked I would.
Sometimes I talk about the suitsthat I wear.
He knew that.
So he he was like hey, paul,did you know that you can get
your suit for 20% off at thisone place on this one day?
I was like word, you can, youknow.
So he continued to add value,and this is not over a week or
(23:41):
over four weeks, this was overmonths.
He bought into all of theweekend startup schools and
attended all of them.
He would then dap me up at theweekend startup schools.
He built a real relationshipwith me.
He gave, he gave, he gave, hegave, he gave, he gave, he gave,
he gave, he gave.
And then he made an ask andwhat did I do?
(24:04):
I immediately did it yeah,right, yeah.
Speaker 1 (24:08):
And so this is the key, and I think that this is
how we build social capital, andthis is truly the success to
becoming a success, because yoursocial capital is indicative
of't there a piece whereexisting entrepreneurs kind of
(24:30):
have to be more visible and kindof share some of what they know
so that they're an expertise,Because then you know, not
everyone knows it's also whoknows that you know, that you
really know what you're doing.
Right.
That plays into it a little bit.
Speaker 2 (24:47):
Sure, sure, I mean, I agree with you and I think
that's a function of branding.
You know we're we're at a we'reat a we're in a different
economy right now.
You know we're in an economythat's drastically different
than just five, six years ago,where it was to your benefit not
to talk up what you're doing.
Right, it was to your benefitto not have to stand on a
(25:09):
platform and say, hey, everybody, you know, this is the project
that I'm working on or this iswhat I'm doing.
But now we're at a point wherethere's so much content that's
created now.
You know, on Eric Schmidt,chairman of Google, former CEO
right, said that over a 48 hourperiod right, two day period
(25:31):
that more content is created nowthan was created from the
beginning of time.
Speaker 1 (25:36):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (25:37):
Right, you heard that all the way to 2003.
Speaker 1 (25:39):
Yes, I've heard that I work in the legal industry,
where I have to process some ofthis data for litigation, so
yeah, I know it for sure.
Speaker 2 (25:47):
It's crazy, but if you think of it conceptually,
you will see that that meansthat there is more data, there's
more noise than ever before,and so we have to be the signal
to the noise.
And how you are the signal, howyou stand out, is that you have
to realize that you have totalk yourself up, because, at
(26:10):
the end of the day, no one cansell you better than you.
Speaker 1 (26:14):
Yeah, yeah, absolutely so.
Take how we connected.
So we my friend Michaela and Iwe went to Blogalicious and you
were on the panel and you talkedabout all your jobs like a
Jamaican.
And you were on the panel andyou talked about all your jobs
like a Jamaican, and thenafterwards we approached you and
, you know, I personally findthat you are so personable and
(26:37):
approachable and not everyone islike that but you know,
michaela and I came up to youand this is how we end up having
this podcast.
Now, in terms of moving forward,I've gotten your advice, which
is give, give, give, and I guessthat's the approach that we
have to do in terms of makingconnections.
But then, at what point do youmake a decision as to whether
(27:02):
maybe the person you're tryingto connect with is not the right
person you should connect with?
Because, like you said, we havethis idea in our head of, oh, I
just need to connect with thatperson.
At what point do you realizethat maybe this is I don't want
to say this is not a connectionyou should make but when do you
kind of say well, this is a goodperson to know, but maybe not
(27:24):
what I thought in terms ofbigger goals in terms of making
connections, or do we make thatdistinction?
Speaker 2 (27:30):
Right Now.
This is a really importantquestion.
This is like not what yourquestion is, not basic
networking or networking 101.
That was more of like agraduate level networking
question.
So I love that, I love that.
So here's the thing is that youthink about a relationship.
What is a relationship?
A business, platonic, you know?
Love, what?
(27:51):
What is it?
Relationship is aboutreciprocation.
That's what makes it arelationship.
So, for example, I've beenmarried for 15 years.
So that means that in the 15years, what's happened is that I
have given to my wife and mywife has given to me.
If, over the 15 years, I onlygave to her, well, it would be a
(28:17):
one-sided relationship, whichmeans it's not a relationship.
So it's the same thing when itcomes to business or networking
is that you want to seereciprocation.
If you don't see reciprocation,that's the first sign that
you're not in the rightrelationship with someone Right.
(28:37):
So, for example, we if, if,after, uh, you know, when we met
at blogalicious and you werelike, hey, paul, you know, um,
would you, would you got, wouldyou like to be on this podcast?
And I was like sure, and then Inever committed to a date or
time with you.
Speaker 1 (28:53):
Right.
Speaker 2 (28:54):
Right, and you followed up.
You know, and some people,sometimes people are busy, so
that's fair.
You know, sometimes you have tofollow up two, three times, but
let's say you followed up seventimes and I still didn't commit
to the date or time.
Well, that is a clear signalthat I'm not reciprocating and
therefore I'm probably not thebest person to be in a
relationship with you Right now.
(29:15):
As the relationship continues,here's the here's, the here's
where it begins for a lot ofpeople to get difficult, but
this is what the most successfulpeople do.
And here's what happens is thatrelationships are all and now.
This is just my opinion, this ismy opinion, is, or should I say
the vast majority ofrelationships are terminal.
(29:37):
They're truly terminal, andwhat that means is there is an
endpoint that will come to mostof the relationships that you
have, because you simply can'tpsychologically Right, you
simply can't maintain all therelationships that you rack up
through your life.
(29:58):
Thing called the Dunbar theory,right who?
He came out with some greatresearch that basically states
that the, the the maximum numberof people that we could truly
be friends with is 150.
Speaker 1 (30:10):
Yeah, yeah, I heard that.
Speaker 2 (30:12):
And so, at the end of the day, what this means is
that let's take the two of us,for example right, we, we, now,
we're doing, we're doing thispodcast, right, so we've, now,
you know, I've reciprocated now,right, so?
Speaker 1 (30:26):
so this isn't me asking anything, but I'm just,
you know, throw this out, I'mgoing to ask you anyway after we
get off the podcast, like howcan you help the?
Speaker 2 (30:32):
person Right.
The key is to be such a greatlistener of the person that you
already know what they're tryingto do, and then you just give.
Speaker 1 (30:53):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (30:54):
Right, you just give.
And so the key is so.
So you know you're so.
You know, over the course ofthe next couple of months,
you're going to give and, um,you know, do I reciproc?
The next couple of monthsyou're going to give and you
know, do I reciprocate on thatgiving, right, yeah, and then
that's going to continue on andon and on.
But there's going to be a pointin our life, whether it's in
(31:15):
one month, whether it's in oneyear, whether it's in 10 years,
that chances are there's, no,there's, there's nothing further
that I can do to help furtheryou along on your goals, and
there's nothing that you coulddo to help further me along on
my goals.
And and now here's thedifference between successful
(31:36):
and unsuccessful people inbusiness the unsuccessful people
will say you know what, there'snothing else that you can do.
And they know you know whatthey do's nothing else that you
can do.
That's cool.
And they know, you know whatthey do.
They just let that personlinger in their network.
They just let them linger,right, the most successful
people know how to fire friends.
And that sounds socontroversial, it sounds so bad,
(31:58):
but it's the truth.
It's the truth.
So you think you have 150 realfriends that you can have, so
that and your opportunity comesfrom all of those friends, right
?
And so what that means is thatyou have to continually be
pruning your network.
You have to continually bepruning, and it doesn't mean
(32:21):
that you burn a bridge, itdoesn't mean that you abruptly
kick somebody out, but what itdoes mean is that you are
attentive to your network,knowing that your girlfriends,
your boyfriends, everything isgoing to come from your network.
(32:45):
So you want to tend that likeyou're pruning a fine tree.
And so successful people.
They know how to prune thenetwork.
They know how to fire friends.
Speaker 1 (32:55):
You know, there was this video that I saw on
Facebook I'm sure you've seen itwhere all these soldiers were
trying to get over this wall andthey were all helping each
other up and at the end the lastperson just kind of ran up the
wall and everyone shares thisvideo.
And I said, you know, this isgreat that they could all help
each other up over this wall,but I guarantee you that it took
a couple of tries for them toget it together and it's moving
(33:18):
different people in and out ofroles.
Who's going to go over first?
And I think the challenge wehave is, you know, we keep
friends because they've beenfriends for a very long time or
they've helped us to a certainpoint and they should this thing
of obligation.
And you know, maybe and this iswhy people then come to say
(33:40):
maybe you shouldn't go intobusiness with friends and so
talk a little bit about thatit's okay to maybe start a
venture with a friend, but howdo you know when it's time to
prune that relationship?
Speaker 2 (33:52):
Yeah, most people who start businesses with friends,
those have a higher failure ratethan any other business, you
know.
So it's typically not a goodidea to do that.
You know what you want to do isyou want to start businesses
with people who add value inareas that you, you know, add
(34:13):
skills that you don't have.
You know the good thing about afriend is that they share your
values.
Right, that's I always advocatethat for for a business
relationship.
But you also, you know you needthem to add skills.
So, like you know, you'restarting a tech company and
you're non-technical, well, youneed someone who's technical,
you know, like bottom line, andso that's the you know.
(34:34):
That is really the key in termsof the firing of the friend and
knowing when to fire the friend.
It's really when one of twomajor things happen.
Either A, it's clear that thatperson doesn't share your values
.
Now, values is something thattypically doesn't change much
(34:54):
once we become adults, but itdoes change for people, you know
.
And so if you have someone whodoesn't share your values, it
means that you play life bydifferent rules.
It means that you see thingsdifferently.
What you consider to be good,they could consider to be bad.
You know, and that's notsomeone who's healthy to be
around, and so that's one.
(35:15):
The second is that and this isgoing to sound like you know,
you know like an I'm anopportunist here but the second
is when that person can'tinspire you anymore and you
can't inspire them anymore.
Right, and that's really whatit's about, because if they, you
know, we have to constantly bechanging right.
(35:37):
You know, if we are not changingand we are not- evolving we're
stagnant, we're dead, we're dead, and so, if you are and, by the
way, everything that I'm saying, this is for ambitious people-
yes, we are ambitious people.
Speaker 1 (35:54):
Listen to the podcast , by the way.
Speaker 2 (35:55):
Yeah, I mean because you know if you are at a place
in your life where you know likeso, for example, and by the way
, you could value ambition.
But you can just be in a placein your life where you know like
so, for example, and by the way, you could be, you could value
ambition, but you can just be ina place where it's not
necessary.
You know, my father, forexample, is retiring next year.
He's retiring right.
He's at a place now where he nolonger needs to prune his
(36:19):
network like he was previously.
He's at a totally differentstage in his life and so, even
though he may now be with peoplewho are not as inspirational,
right, it's not.
It's not to the same degree ashe being, you know, a younger
man, 40 years, you know ago,coming up.
(36:42):
So you know, a lot of thisdepends on stage and values, but
if that person is no longerinspiring you and you are no
longer inspiring them, then thenwhat's the point of them taking
up a spot in a you know apressure spot in your network,
whereas someone else could bethere who's moving you further?
(37:03):
You're moving them and you'remaking a bigger impact in the
world.
Speaker 1 (37:07):
Yeah, that is so awesome.
I mean, I'm here jotting stuffdown so I'm just like you know
what.
I'm going to listen to thereplay because this is just like
so awesome, Because this issomething that I as much as I
have the podcast.
I struggle with making theconnections and the pruning part
is so important.
But if I'm not totally engagingor listening to what my network
(37:31):
wants and just kind ofproviding that, I do that within
a certain level of comfortlevel.
But once I have to reachoutside my immediate circle and
that comfort level, that's whenI kind of get insecure and I'm
not sure and I just kind of stepback and end up not doing
anything.
So I really, really appreciateall this information because I'm
(37:52):
telling you 2016, I call it mybust out year and I'm just
busting out of all of the thingsor the messages I've told
myself that no longer apply.
So I know that we live in adigital world where I have to,
you know, rise above the noise,I have to brand myself and you
(38:12):
know, holding my head down atwork, I said my work speaks for
itself.
It doesn't apply now.
So I don't have an excuse, butI kind of hold on to those as
excuses to keep me safe.
So this is so awesome because Iknow some of my other friends.
We have the same issues.
I'm really glad that you arejust oh my God, this is such
good stuff connections.
When it comes to the point ofpruning the relationships
(38:36):
because, again, we're notburning bridges Like your book
says.
It's complicated but it doesn'thave to be how do we don't make
(38:58):
it so complicated or awkwardthat we're now kind of moving
away from where the relationshiponce is?
How do you that we're now kindof moving away from where the
relationship once is?
How do you kind of maintainsome kind of you know, your core
?
I don't think people dobreakups well, whether it's
business or personal.
So how do you kind of, how doyou walk away in a mature, adult
(39:20):
way?
Speaker 2 (39:21):
Yeah, great question, cause it applies to every
relationship that we have.
Yeah, the, the, the best.
So you know, I'll give you aquick, quick, quick story is uh,
you know, the first televisionshow I did was with Oprah.
It was called a show calledlove town.
Speaker 1 (39:34):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (39:34):
And in the show there was, uh, you know, there was
this gentleman who was trying tobreak it off with his
girlfriend and he was like so hecame to me and he was like Paul
, you know, I don't know how todo it.
And so, you know, I gave himsome suggestions and then I see
him like a week later, and I waslike, did you break up with her
?
He was like, yeah, I broke upwith her and I said how'd you do
(39:55):
it?
He said, well, you know, I juststopped calling her.
And it turns out that that isthe number one way that people
quote unquote break up withother people, not just
romantically, but even inbusiness.
It's what I call fade to black.
Is that they just assume thatbecause I've stopped calling you
(40:17):
, because I've stoppedcontacting you, that you should
get the hint and realize thatit's over, because I've stopped
contacting you, that you shouldget the hint and realize that
it's over?
But that is a punk move, thatis the move of a third grader,
right.
That is the move of someone whois not going to be successful
later in life?
Wow, right, because what makesyou successful is when you can
(40:41):
own who you are.
Right, you own who you are andyou own your actions.
That's what makes you mature,right, mature people have mature
action, and so my point to himand you know my answer to you is
that you specifically outlinewhat you're doing and why and it
(41:05):
seems hard, but that's what youdo.
So my advice to him was to tellhis girlfriend the reason why
he's breaking up with her, andthe real reason why is because
he excuse me he was in love withsomebody else.
You know he was seeing somebodyelse.
Speaker 1 (41:29):
You know he was seeing somebody else, and so is.
Speaker 2 (41:31):
And so you know, if we can just like if this world
would be so much more efficientif we could just stop the BS,
yeah, and that is even inbusiness.
And so you know, let's betruthful to the situation, and
then you know we'll be able tosever relationships better.
And then you know we'll be ableto sever relationships better.
Now, the last thing I'll say onthis is not to overdo it,
because a lot of people will say, ok, well, let me give you the
(41:51):
reason, and then they'll spendthree hours on what the reason
is of the breakup or theseparation of the business or
the partnership or that kind ofthing.
The best thing to do andactually Harvard Business Review
did this whole study around howbosses should fire their
employees right, and this iskind of the same thing, right,
(42:13):
breakup.
And what they found is the mosteffective way to fire an
employee or you know just anyoneis to do it quickly and to
leave the conversation with whatyou're doing.
So you would say you know what,carrie Ann, I'm going to have
to let you go today.
And the reason why I'm going tohave to let you go is because
(42:34):
you have, you know, not done A,b and C, and it's been
documented and, as a result,what we're going to do is we're
going to give you one month, etcetera, but it's been documented
and, as a result, what we'regoing to do is we're going to
give you one month, et cetera,but it's quick and it's abrupt.
Speaker 1 (42:46):
It's not.
Speaker 2 (42:47):
Oh, yeah, you know what.
Come on, sit down.
Yeah, how are you doing?
Yeah, how's your family?
Yeah, like no.
No, it's abrupt and it's thesame way in every relationship.
Speaker 1 (42:56):
You want to be upfront you want to be truthful
and you want to be succinct.
Oh my gosh, paul, I tell you,that's why you are the teacher,
because you know, sometimes it'sa simple thing, but sometimes
we really need the simple truths, you know, because it's like
(43:17):
it's not that complicated, it'sjust, we just have to
communicate better, which is theunderlying thing, the way we
communicate with each other, andyou know, we just keep doing it
the wrong way.
Oh my goodness.
Thank you, paul.
This has just been so.
So there's just so muchinformation here.
I know that you're going tohave a lot of quotables, so when
you see it on Instagram and Itag you, it's going to be crazy.
(43:41):
But you know, on a final note,because this is a podcast that
is, for you know, focuses onbusiness and career for the
Caribbean American and, beingfrom a Caribbean American
background, you know one thing,the one thing that you have as
an advice to us CaribbeanAmerican entrepreneurs because
(44:01):
we're out there, we're just notas visible.
So what's the one thing you'dlike to see this community do
differently, to kind of bust outfor 2016?
So people know that, like you,with all the jobs, like a
Jamaican, we're all out heredoing what we need to do.
So what do you want us as agroup and as an audience to do?
To kind of rise to the occasionas a group and as an audience
(44:22):
to do, to kind of rise to theoccasion.
Speaker 2 (44:23):
Wow, that's such a big question, you know, I think
it's probably two different setsof advice, depending on the
mentality of the personlistening.
So a lot of folks that I knowfrom the Caribbean realize that
you know I'll take Jamaica, forexample is it's this small
island, but yet, while it's sucha small island, it's such a
(44:45):
small country, we have, you know, some of the best athletes.
We've had the best businesses.
We've had the most beautifulwomen.
Like you know, we have impactedthe fashion industry like we've
had a disproportionate impacton the world.
Speaker 1 (45:01):
Right.
Speaker 2 (45:01):
Right, and a lot of people that I know from the
Caribbean or, in this example,from Jamaica, they know this and
they're so proud of that thatthey believe that everyone
should recognize that.
And that's enough.
And that's enough, right?
I'm Jamaican.
Speaker 1 (45:19):
Yeah, give me the job , yeah.
Speaker 2 (45:22):
But it doesn't work like that.
Yeah Right, it doesn't worklike that.
So there's, there's, there's,there's, you know, I think, a
group that's that way.
But then there's another groupthat I know from, like Jamaican
this example, where they'll sayyou know, I'm from, you know
this little island, you know how, how, how can I, how am I going
to, you know, do big thingsbecause I'm from such a small
(45:44):
place.
And what I always like to sayis that those of us who have
come from small places, sothat's, if you've come from the
Caribbean, you've come from asmall place.
If you've come from a smallplace, it means that you've come
from a place unlike most peoplein the world.
That means that you have comefrom a unique place.
(46:06):
Yes, uniqueness is where yourpower lies, the fact that you
are unique.
And if you can embrace thatfact, fully understand that fact
, embrace that fact, you'll doincredibly well.
Right, the most successfulpeople in the world, the
(46:27):
billionaires of the world, whatthey've been able to do the
self-made billionaire, should Isay.
They've been able to figure outthe things that make them
different than everyone else andthey have been able to
capitalize on those things.
And so my homework, to everyonelistening, especially if you're
from the Caribbean, is tofigure out what makes you
(46:49):
different than the masses.
Right, you know the massesaround the world.
What makes you different?
Also, what makes you differentfrom even the people that are
from you know, back home, andwhatever those things are those
one, two, three little things,those little things.
That is where your power lies,in those little things.
Speaker 1 (47:11):
You know, and that is such that, as simple as that
exercise is, that assignment is,it's hard because a lot of
times we discredit what makes usunique because we're like, oh,
that's just nothing, there'snothing that we, just we push it
to the side.
So, you know, don't discreditwhat makes us unique because
we're like, oh, that's justnothing, there's nothing that we
, just we push it to the side.
So, you know, don't discreditanything.
Anything that you find comeseasy or you don't think it's a
(47:31):
big deal, write it down, becausea lot of times, and also what
people tell us, you know whatthe world mirrors back to us,
that's something that we shouldcapture.
And I'm learning this because Ijust I'm like, oh, you know,
people say, carrie, you're soorganized and you could break
things down.
I'm like, but that was easy.
But I don't see it that wayBecause, again, it came easy to
(47:52):
me.
So, really, really greatassignment.
Paul, thank you.
I cannot say thank you enoughbecause this was just so amazing
, so chock full, and I can'twait to hear more about when
your new projects are coming out.
I'll definitely keep thecommunity informed as to what
you're doing, what's happening.
I get the emails every weekMentor Monday it's happening,
(48:17):
this is what's going on and Iget the recap emails that say
this is what happened.
But definitely check out MentorMondays.
It's a wealth of information,different entrepreneurs and
maybe sometimes it's just Pauljust like shooting the breeze
with his red stripe.
Speaker 2 (48:33):
Yeah, absolutely, and I will say I'm still looking
for that red stripe endorsement.
If somebody wants to add valueto me, they will connect me with
red stripes so I can get thatsponsorship.
Speaker 1 (48:46):
True story.
Growing up, my grandfatherworked at the DNG factory in
Hopewell it's like the westernpart of Jamaica, a little bit
outside of Mobe, and it was justlike I used to love going to
the factory just to see how theymake everything.
So you know I don't have thatconnection anymore, but I'll
keep my ear out to see ifthere's a Red Stripe endorsement
(49:08):
coming soon.
Speaker 2 (49:09):
All right, all right, all right, but I appreciate it.
Thank you for having me.
You know, it's always apleasure to have a platform to
be able to share what you know,and I really appreciate it.
So thank you very much.
Speaker 1 (49:19):
Thank you, thank you, thank you, everyone listening.
I'll have a recap on the show.
I'll have every informationthat I have for Paul and what
he's doing and, you know,connect with him on Twitter,
facebook and follow him onInstagram.
He has a lot of stuff on there.
So until next time, folks walkgood.
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