September 16, 2025 • 46 mins
Do your marketing strategies keep you stuck in the past or position you for long-term growth? In today's episode with Mike Marut, discover how Revenova transformed its marketing approach, moving from outdated outreach and dormant social media into a people-first strategy powered by leadership visibility and authentic content!
You’ll hear how their native AI gives them a true edge in the crowded TMS space, why conferences matter for brand awareness, and how empowering employees to create content fuels confidence and sales!
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Check, check, check.
One, two, one, two, one, two, three, four.
Speaker 2 (00:09):
You are good.
Speaker 1 (00:10):
Okay, great.
Speaker 2 (00:12):
This is the benefit of doing the pre recorded is you can always check everything prior and you get.
Speaker 1 (00:17):
Dude, that's what we do.
Other webinars like it's.
Yeah, for sure.
Speaker 2 (00:21):
All right, we're gonna start in three, two and one.
What is up, ladies and gentlemen?
We are back.
We are not live.
We're doing a nice little pre recorded episode.
And anytime any of you guys are in Phoenix, you to come by and meet in person here you guys, because this is what I love to do is sit down and have conversations with real people who are in the industry.
Like I say before every single show, you guys, this is a show for transportation professionals by transportation professionals.
(00:46):
And marketing is one of those unsung heroes of the industry that are behind the scenes that are happening and really balancing out.
How do you come in and take over an existing brand and incorporate new school methodology?
So I have my good friend Mike Marut in the show today.
Mike, thank you so much for taking the time to join me.
Speaker 1 (01:04):
Chris, always a pleasure.
So glad that I could be here in person.
I'm honestly glad that I'm even in person this week that I could see you here.
Speaker 2 (01:10):
Dude.
I know.
And it's like.
And that's the, you know, every time people are in town, it's you know, like we're located out here in the, we'll call it the Far East Valley.
It's, you know, it's tough and it's like.
And I get it, man, every people come to Arizona to go on vacation.
Not necessarily sit down and work.
But you are working for a few days this week.
Yes, it's on record.
Speaker 1 (01:29):
Yeah.
If my bosses are watching, don't worry, I'm doing some work too.
It's not just vacation out in the sun.
Speaker 2 (01:36):
Dude.
Speaker 1 (01:37):
I might come back a little bit more tan though.
So.
Speaker 2 (01:38):
Yeah, but dude, you're here the right week though, man.
Like there's a cold front coming through so it's only going to be like in the low 90s, which.
Speaker 1 (01:44):
Okay, so I was so excited about that the over the weekend because I got in Thursday night going into Friday morning.
First off, the storm on Thursday night, brutal.
Speaker 2 (01:54):
Oh my goodness.
Speaker 1 (01:54):
Like just crazy.
But then it was like 105, 109, whatever it was over the weekend.
But I love coming down to Arizona.
I'm from the Chicago area originally and when I come down to Arizona, the heat, I love it.
I Love it.
I can totally understand why you live here.
Speaker 2 (02:12):
Yeah.
I mean, being from the Midwest as well.
Like I tell people all the time, I'm like it 30 below zero.
Growing up in northern Wisconsin, bro, it is brutal.
Speaker 1 (02:20):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (02:21):
Up there.
And it's like when you get out, like, I'll take 110 any day of the week.
Like any day of the week because I get to wear shorts 99 of the year.
And even when it's winter out here, it's still 50 degrees out.
So I love it.
I'm in heaven out here.
Speaker 1 (02:34):
I'd rather be hot than cold.
Obviously.
Like, and in Chicago, I mean they call it the Windy City for political reasons, but it is very windy there and the wind is the worst part.
Like, like negative 30.
I could dress for that.
Like, if it ever got to that, like, I could dress for it, but no matter how windy it is, that's getting through my clothes every time.
Speaker 2 (02:53):
Every single time, man.
Speaker 1 (02:55):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (02:55):
So dude, how'd you get your start in this industry?
Like, what brought you in?
Because you have a media background and everything and coming into freight, what brought you in here?
Speaker 1 (03:04):
Yeah, so I used to be a TV reporter and so I was at the local level.
So here in Phoenix that would be the equivalent of Fox 10 or Channel 12.
Right.
Or AZ family.
So I worked at the local level in Clarksburg, West Virginia for about six months.
Medford, Oregon for a little over three years and Austin, Texas for about three years as a news reporter and a multimedia journalist.
(03:33):
I was on tv, right.
So but I was a multimedia journalist which is code for one man bands.
So I'm doing, I'm pitching my stories, I'm doing the interviews, I'm shooting the video, the B roll, writing it for TV broadcast and online, which is two different styles of writing, plus social media content, all that stuff.
Right.
And so I was able to take the skills that I built by being a one man band and doing everything myself, rather than like outsourcing it to a producer or editor, which did happen occasionally.
(04:04):
I'm not gonna say I didn't do that.
Producers and editors are amazing at their job and you absolutely need those people.
But in the jobs that I was in, I was one man band and I was doing it all myself.
And so I was able to take those skills and turn that into marketing.
Because marketing a lot of, especially these days is so much about storytelling.
Speaker 2 (04:23):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (04:24):
And that's what TV reporting is like, you know, not only investigative pieces, you're going to get the data points, you're going to get the hard news and, you know, exposing corruption and all this other stuff.
Right.
But when you really watch that story, you usually start with a person who has been impacted by whatever you're reporting on, because that's what draws the audience in.
(04:48):
And because they can relate.
They're like, oh, I know that person from the Far East Valley who is, you know, battling heat right now or whatever.
Right.
So.
And I tried to take that and bring it into marketing and bring it into supply chain and kind of really using that going forward.
(05:09):
And it's been a great transition for me.
I've been doing this for about two years now, you know, and I've been really happy with being able to make.
Speaker 2 (05:17):
That happen, telling that story.
So, like, you brought up a lot there.
Speaker 1 (05:22):
Yeah, yeah, sorry.
No, no, I can get long winded.
Speaker 2 (05:24):
No, it's perfect, though, because it's like, there's so many parallels between all of this stuff and, you know, a lot of businesses out there, do they just struggle with making content in general.
Speaker 1 (05:35):
Right.
Speaker 2 (05:35):
Because I think, like, that's the one thing where everybody, they're like, how do I start?
And, you know, and now it's like, I mean, that's a question that I used to ask a lot more.
Kind of like when I first started creating content, it was like, oh, I wish I could do that.
I want to do that.
Speaker 1 (05:48):
But.
Speaker 2 (05:49):
And they're like, they're always like, I don't know how.
I don't know what to say.
And I'm like, I didn't know what to say then.
And 99% of the content that I just like, today's interview, complete from the hip.
Speaker 1 (05:59):
Right.
Speaker 2 (05:59):
Like, I'm building off of that.
And that's where it's like, I think a lot of people just need to start posting.
Speaker 1 (06:05):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (06:05):
And, you know, but they're also like, you know, I had a unique experience in the sense of, like, I was creating a brand from scratch.
I wasn't taking over an existing brand.
And so, like, my question is, Mike, is how did you take all of your media experience and then come into a company like Revenova, who's been around for a while, who had an established footprint in the transportation industry and then kind of put your spin on things.
Speaker 1 (06:30):
Yeah.
So Revenova started in 2014.
I joined Revenova in 2023.
So you're right.
Nine years of establishing the brand, going to conferences, like, being a known entity, for lack of a better phrase.
Right.
A standout TMS provider.
When I started, the marketing strategy was primarily trade Shows and referrals and you know, outbound, just like outreach, one offs.
(06:59):
Right.
Which fine strategy, nothing wrong with that.
You know, I would argue that our number two lead generation strategy right now is events and conferences.
Like that's a very important part of what you do from a brand awareness perspective, you know, even more so.
Right.
But when I started, there wasn't really much of a social media presence.
(07:20):
We had the Pages, we had LinkedIn, we had Instagram, we had a few others.
But when I looked at it, nothing had been posted for months, if not years for a variety of reasons, you know, and it just kind of fell to the wayside.
So I started there.
I started with the social media aspect because to your point, at some point you just need to start posting.
(07:44):
And as a tech vendor and as a technology provider, so with my TV background, I love visuals.
I love like engaging with engaging content that's just like, it captures your eye immediately.
Right.
As a SaaS technology platform, nothing is super visually exciting about what we do.
(08:09):
The efficiency is amazing, the product is incredible.
But if you watch it on a video, unless you really know what you're looking at and how powerful that could be, it's not really going to do a whole lot for you.
So what I started with was our people.
I wanted to start with, okay, who are the founders?
Like, who is Mike Horvath, who is Charles Craigmile, Dave Kragmile, Jeff Parisi.
(08:34):
Right.
And what is their story?
How do they get here?
What is their influence on.
Not influence, I'm sorry, what is their expertise when it comes to technology, when it comes to supply chain?
Right.
And leaning into that a little bit more.
And then once were able to establish, I'll call them our characters.
(08:55):
Right.
Then you have them start talking about whatever they're experts on.
Jeff, you've had him on before, expert in sales.
Yeah, he could sell, you know, water to, you know, people in the rainforest or something.
Right.
Mike Horvath, great salesman, super technology minded, just really smart, great storytelling, individual.
(09:20):
I don't know if you've ever sat down with him.
I mean, I know you've had him on, but like outside of this context, sat down with him.
He will tell stories for days.
Speaker 2 (09:27):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (09:27):
And he has that to tell.
And it's just like, it's like you're just enraptured with like whatever he's talking about.
Charles Craigmile.
Right.
One of our, he's our CEO, one of our co founders.
He, his background is brokerage and logistics.
And supply chain.
He was leading the Schneider brokerage for a while.
Right.
And so, okay, let's use his expertise, you know, talking about the market, talking about supply chain as the industry.
(09:52):
Right.
We just came out of the pandemic, which was a huge boom for this industry.
Speaker 2 (09:57):
Massive.
Speaker 1 (09:58):
And.
And now it's depending on who you talk to.
Kind of tight.
Speaker 2 (10:01):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (10:02):
And so, okay, let's use his expertise in that vein.
We've gotten him on like in.
Because we're based in Chicago, we've gotten him on the local news there, talking about the dock workers strike from last year and other things like that.
Dave Craigmile, technological, just genius.
He.
We have a native AI agent.
He built it from scratch, like, and it was like, you know, all the.
(10:25):
We have so many AI vendors out there these days and they have teams of people just like pouring time and energy into building it.
Dave is a one man band.
He's got a small team for sure, but he was primarily doing this native AI agent.
Bill.
Yeah.
And he did it in a matter of months.
(10:46):
And he got it to understand the industry supply chain, you know, rate cons, like literally getting the jargon in there.
So that way it can understand these things.
So I wanted to, when I joined Revenova, I wanted to introduce the people, like the brand, the company, the product, you're right, had been established for a long time.
Unless you were like, I'm not going to say early adopter, but maybe early customer.
(11:11):
Really any of our customers, you would really only know Jeff Parisi because he's in the sales process.
You might know one of the other three guys, but there's also a pretty large chance that you didn't know.
Yeah.
So let's start there.
Let's talk about them and kind of bring them into the conversation.
I was fortunate enough that Revenova as a brand, to your point, had been established.
(11:34):
So I didn't have to just start from scratch with like brand colors and logos and stuff like that.
That was already there for me.
I could just take the pieces and run.
Speaker 2 (11:43):
How so?
I mean, I love that strategy and I think that's what I've probably advised most companies over the years.
I'm like, let your people talk.
Like, let your people, like, because people like, yes, they're going to fall in love with your product, but I feel like they fall in love with your message if they know who's behind the scenes and like what your company stands for.
(12:06):
And I think like a lot of businesses will.
They'll just go back to like the paid Ads and the methods that the advertising agencies sell people on all the time.
But I'm like, does that actually move the needle?
And I feel like we're at a point in time now with social media and podcasting and everything, where it's like you have a unique opportunity to really show behind the scenes what a company actually stands for.
(12:29):
Kind of across the board, right?
Because I feel like in today's day and age, you know, like the progression of where things used to be, like, oh, just take out newspaper ads and do all of that.
That worked back then.
And I feel like there's two schools of thoughts now where it's like, some people are like, no, we're only going to stay in the digital media space.
And then there's the companies like yourself are like, no, we want our people out in front.
(12:51):
Yes, we want that leading the charge.
And we have that much confidence in our product that our product is going to back it up.
Because I feel like fundamentally, when Jeff watches this, he'll probably agree.
And him and I have talked about this.
People buy from people at the end of the day.
Oh, yeah, Because I'm sure you guys have this internal discussion what really makes Revenova different from any other TMS in the space.
(13:13):
And then it's like, it's going to be their connection with your reps, right?
Because I'm sure.
And there's probably people out there who could look at all the TMSs and be like, well, this technical functionality is kind of the same across the board and stuff like that.
There's a lot of parallels out there.
And same thing in the freight brokerage space, right?
Are we all offering the exact same product and service freight?
(13:34):
Fundamentally, yes.
We are all out there cold calling shippers, saying we can do certain things.
But when it boils down to it, people fall in love with a rep, right?
They fall in love with the service that you're providing.
The overall and overarching experience.
Speaker 1 (13:47):
Oh, a thousand percent.
I mean, I talk about this regularly to your exact same point.
All the TMS providers out there, bottom line, providing a pretty similar service, there are going to be different feature functionalities and different, you know, avenues that we're going to be going down.
Like, like I said, we're one of, I think one of maybe two or three TMS providers in the entire space that has a native AI agent built in.
(14:09):
Right.
Everybody else is.
Is integrating with third parties and all this other stuff.
But at the bottom line, you're moving freight using our technology.
Right.
Or.
Or helping you find those efficiencies or whatever phrasing you want to use there.
But I want our people to be highlighted and shown as approachable and that they know what they're talking about.
(14:37):
So now that I've been here for two years, we've expanded beyond Jeff, Charles, David, Mike, to now include our sales team, to now include our product development team.
Getting our VP of product development on podcast like yours to talk about, you know, his expertise is building out a product, right?
(15:01):
Building out the tms.
So let's get him on strategically, on a podcast that is talking about technological development and where the TMS space is going or something like that, right?
Speaker 2 (15:11):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (15:12):
Or let's get our sales reps, who all of them have been brokers at some point.
Like, let's get them on a podcast that is for brokers by brokers.
And that way they can show off that expertise.
Speaker 2 (15:26):
And I think, like, that it's got to make it.
I'm sure you probably have the data about this.
It makes them more approachable at conferences, right.
When people see them in public and they're like, hey, I saw you on that podcast.
I really like what you said at this.
Or, you know, and again, because I feel like a lot of these companies, they go, they spend all these monies at booths, but, like, there's no like, pre or post efforts to like, really get their brand out there.
(15:49):
And I know, like, conferences are great, don't get me wrong, but like, building that familiarity with an audience of people, I. I would only assume that it makes it so much.
Somebody, so much more likely and more comfortable to come up to you or anybody at a conference and be like, hey, man, I saw you on this show.
I just wanted to come up and introduce myself.
And boom, that's the start of something that could lead to more or couldn't.
(16:11):
I don't know.
But I feel like there's.
There's so many people are just kind of missing the mark.
Speaker 1 (16:15):
Right.
Speaker 2 (16:16):
And for me, it's like, they try.
Like on this show, I don't do any preset questions.
If any of my guests come to me and they're like, hey, we need you to ask this.
I'm like, I'm not doing it.
Like, I will.
Speaker 1 (16:26):
It's a hard journalistic of you.
Speaker 2 (16:28):
Yeah, but it's.
Speaker 1 (16:29):
But I do.
Speaker 2 (16:30):
And I tell them, I'm like, you got to trust that the topic of conversation is going to be what you do every day.
You just got to let me flow with it.
And I'm like, people Want that organic conversation.
They don't want the top 10 talking points of a comp that is like listed on these companies websites.
Speaker 1 (16:46):
Right?
Sure.
Speaker 2 (16:47):
They like, they wanted like just have an actual conversation about like do you really know what you're talking about or are you just reading the script?
And I feel like that's where a lot of companies I would love to get your opinion on this, but I wish more companies would kind of like let their people cook.
Like get out there and just run.
Speaker 1 (17:04):
Oh, I, I so Jeff and I have talked about this extensively that like go and talk about what you want to talk about but treat it like Thanksgiving.
Don't bring up politics, don't bring up religion because that gets real dicey real fast.
And that could go in a, it's, it becomes very unpredictable.
Like have like cutting my reps loose or cutting like Danielle Chapin, you've met her before, right.
(17:30):
She is very vocal on social media.
She's super invested in freight fraud and you know, has so much expertise around that these days.
Let it.
And it's to the point where she'll go on a podcast and tell me about it after the fact.
Which like, from the marketing perspective, I'm like love that you went on.
(17:50):
Awesome.
But let me know so we can like promote around it like that.
Like, oh, Danielle is going to be on this podcast.
Go listen in, Go, you know, see what she has to say.
Say.
Because then there's so much that goes into the strategy around that it's not just one conference and you're done.
It's not just one podcast and you're done.
(18:11):
There's got to be some pre event work, the event itself, some post event work.
The I would say because conferences I put.
There's so much brand awareness around that.
Speaker 2 (18:22):
Right.
Speaker 1 (18:22):
Yeah.
Brand awareness is one of the most important things to have and yet one of the hardest things to track.
Speaker 2 (18:28):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (18:29):
In terms of ROI and all that stuff.
Right.
So when I go to a conference and someone says, oh, you're with Revenova.
I, I saw you somewhere.
I, I that to me that's a win.
Speaker 2 (18:41):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (18:41):
Like if they see Revenova somewhere, they know who we are.
I love it.
Like if they know what we do, even better.
They probably know what we do based on how they saw us.
But even better because then it's like, okay, not only is our message getting out, but the brand is getting in front of new people that we have not touched before.
(19:02):
Now I'm not gonna say I've met everybody in the industry that's crazy and it's not true.
But every time I meet new people at a conference or whatever, you know, they'll say, oh, I saw your LinkedIn post.
Oh, I saw your YouTube shorts.
Oh, I saw you guys are everywhere or something like that.
That is our strategy working.
(19:23):
And not to get super technical marketing wise, but like top of funnel, stuff like that.
That's working, dude.
Speaker 2 (19:28):
But I, I think eyeballs is an underutilized currency in today's day and age.
Speaker 1 (19:34):
Really?
Speaker 2 (19:35):
Yeah, I do.
I feel like, you know, they'll invest in getting their brand out there, but it is that old school.
We're just plastering our logo, but there's no message behind it.
Right.
Where it's like those eyeballs of like you saying like, hey, I read your post.
Hey, I saw you on that podcast, or I saw this, you guys were talking about that.
That's a lot different than like, here's the Freight coaches logo and it's on this wall or it's on this promoted post.
(19:59):
But there's like real, no substance behind it.
Right?
Again, it's back to that top 10 corporate talking points that you see out there where it's like, man, if you're gonna like the way I see it, if you're gonna trust your people to make multi million dollar sales for your organization, why aren't you going to trust them to go out there and like kind of be themselves, you know, and I get it, you know, like when it comes down to like politics and religion and stuff like that.
(20:20):
And like with my show, for example, we talk about trucking.
If there's a political spin, will I bring it up?
Yes.
But like, I'm not gonna go out there and just like go off on some rant about who are you supporting.
Speaker 1 (20:32):
In the next election?
Like that.
Speaker 2 (20:33):
Exactly.
Speaker 1 (20:33):
It's got to be relevant.
That's a good point.
Speaker 2 (20:35):
Exactly.
You know, so it's like, for me, but I feel like, you know, you got to use those eyeballs to their fullest extent.
Speaker 1 (20:40):
Right?
Speaker 2 (20:40):
Because it's like you got to get people to buy in to your message at the end of the day, right?
And you like that.
You got to create that, I hate to use the word, the term following and stuff like that, but.
Speaker 1 (20:52):
But it's true.
Speaker 2 (20:52):
Build that following of eyeballs of people who are out there speaking about your brand in the way that you want it and you can go out there and be like, no, we trust our people to go out and do what they want because if we didn't, they wouldn't be representing our company.
And if any capacity, right?
And I feel like a lot of companies out there take the opposite approach that what you guys did, Mike.
They only want the C suite to go out there and talk, right?
(21:14):
And it's like there's value in all of that and I'm not here to discredit it, but like letting your entire organization have a face.
Now I, I look at it from like a followers and everything.
Like, how many, how much more brand exposure do you get when you're a sales rep who used to work at a brokerage and all of their coworkers are now at 4, 40 other brokerages.
They're all connected.
They're like, wait, what's Revenova?
(21:35):
Wait, what is this person doing now?
And it's like.
And that's where the eyeballs are lost because most people stick with a corporate message and they're like, oh, we want our people to do it, but as long as they're inside of this box, right?
Speaker 1 (21:49):
And so I like to.
So whenever we hire a new person who is going to be some sort of public facing individual for the company, I sit down with them for about 45 minutes, just say like, hey, here's what we do as marketing, here's our strategy and here are the guidelines.
I'm not gonna put rules and regulations on them, but at the same time I don't want them just going out there day one and be like, yeah, you know, whatever, right?
(22:13):
Like, let's be thoughtful about how we're sharing this message.
And to your point, the C suite executives only strategy, it works to a degree, but you need to.
There are so many avenues and outlets now for that are better served by people who are not the C suites or the executives, you know, and that there are voices for.
(22:43):
I'm sorry, there are outlets for the middle management voice or for the, you know, I don't, I, I don't want to use bottom of the total poll.
That's not.
I know what you mean.
Speaker 2 (22:56):
Like the frontline workers that are out there.
And like for me, Mike, I look at it like this.
How many times are like, I've seen it like you're at a conference and there's organizations that only let their C suite out there kind of speaking publicly, but they're completely unavailable because they're so busy at these conferences where there is that intimidation factor.
(23:16):
Like I don't care what anybody says.
When you look at a billion dollar organization or a Multi hundred million dollar organization out there that might sell a product or a service.
There's going to be a small startup founder who might be intimidated to go and talk to them.
Speaker 1 (23:30):
Right.
Speaker 2 (23:30):
For whatever reason.
The imposter syndrome.
It doesn't matter because, dude, like, I'm not afraid to admit it.
There's times where I'm like, why the is this person even talking to me, dude?
I'm.
I just, like, I just hit record on my podcast.
I'm talking to the CEO of this company, like, what is this?
But it's, you know, I look at it as.
How much more brand friendly is it to kind of show like, no, these are all of our people.
Speaker 1 (23:52):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (23:53):
And then that, you know, sales rep whose literal job at a conference is to talk to as many people as possible.
Now they know, like, hey, I'm gonna go talk to that person now.
Because I saw him on a podcast.
I feel somewhat of a connection, like, yeah, that's my person there.
The amount of people that I've met over the years, Mike, that they're like, dude, I follow your.
I followed your podcast for years.
I've never commented.
(24:13):
I've never done anything.
But I just wanted to come up and talk to you because I feel like I know you.
How much more has that done for the brand over the years?
I think, like, I'm going to pat myself on the back.
That's what's kept me relevant for over five years at this point.
Speaker 1 (24:26):
So let me ask you this.
Speaker 2 (24:27):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (24:28):
You have been doing the podcast for five years, and do you feel more confident today than you did, let's say, six years ago before you started this?
In talking to executives and talking to founders, in going to a conference and just walking up to somebody, you seem like a social person.
(24:49):
Have you always been that way?
Is really what I'm getting at.
Speaker 2 (24:51):
No, this is actually.
This is going to sound crazy, but it's kind of like an act.
I'm naturally an introvert.
Like, when I'm at home, dude, like, I don't want to talk to anybody.
And.
But like, I. I've curated.
There's this really good book out there called the Alter Ego.
And I had no idea that is what I had done when I created the Freight Coach brand, where it's like, it's a different thing.
(25:13):
Where it's like, that's work, Chris.
When I'm out there and I'm doing stuff like, I don't have any imposter syndrome to, like, walk up and introduce myself to people and.
And go and do it.
But I also have five years of trust now where they con most people know what they're getting when I.
When I come up, right?
Like, one area that I really pride myself on is, knock on wood, I don't have any sound bites of me or screenshots of something I said or commented on a post that was, like, off brand, right?
(25:43):
You know, like, there's no PR campaign out there of, like, oh, Chris didn't mean what he said here.
But the confidence comes from the fact that, like, I've met so many people now.
I put myself out there.
Like, because, dude, early on, it was like pulling teeth to get guests on the show.
Speaker 1 (25:58):
Sure.
Speaker 2 (25:59):
It was so challenging because people are like, yeah, the podcast sounds cool, but.
Speaker 1 (26:02):
Who are you, right?
Speaker 2 (26:03):
Who do you know?
And now it's kind of like the roles have reverse or like, no, dude, I love what you do for the industry.
I'd love to come on your show where it's like, I'm going out there and, like, legitimately my guest spots.
And I do 20 to 22 podcasts in a month, depending on how many working days there are.
I'm booked out for, like, two months at a time now.
Now, you know, and it's because people are like, hey, I want to Come on.
(26:25):
I want to talk.
And it is that the fact that, like, I'm not afraid to.
Like, I spent the early years going to every conference I could putting myself out there to meet as many people as possible early on.
So it's like, there's not any one person in the industry that, like, I would be fanboying over in a sense of, like, God, they don't want to go and talk to me.
(26:46):
And I also look at, like, no, I'm the founder of my company.
No one's going to talk to me unless I put myself out there and talk to everybody that I possibly can.
Speaker 1 (26:53):
So that's what I've been trying to impart to our team overall is, like, the more often you are doing, I'll call them public appearances, whether that's presentations or podcasts or whatever, the more confident you're going to be in your job role.
Like, because I'm thinking about our sales team, every year I try and get every single one of them on at least one podcast or presentation just to flex that muscle a little bit.
(27:23):
And many of them, before they started with us, had never done that before.
And now I'm like, hey, like, this is.
I want you to do this because you're going to get so much whether.
Whether you bomb or whether you do great, you are going to get so much out of it.
And terms of building that confidence up and being able to do it again next year.
Speaker 2 (27:46):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (27:47):
Now, funny enough, like, some of our reps who are super confident, one one doing a presentation, they're.
They flounder a little bit, right?
And it's just like a matter of practice and getting ready for it.
But there's one of our reps in particular who is, you know, he does not love to do these types of things.
(28:07):
I was at a conference with him in person and I was like, hey, let's go over and do this interview.
Five minutes, super easy.
I'll be there the whole time, no sweat.
And I was sitting there and I was far enough away that I didn't hear the whole conversation, but five minutes comes and goes for me as a TV reporter.
(28:28):
I remember how quick that is, right?
He gets done.
He comes out, he's like, mike, I'm so glad you forced me to do this, because it, I just feel so much better about it.
And it was with a podcaster that I could trust to, like, they're not going to put him in a bad spot.
Like, they're going to ask him relatively softball questions because it's five minutes at a conference.
(28:51):
Like, that's not enough time to, like, dig deep into stuff.
Like, that's just an introductory conversation at best, which is important.
It's still important not to take anything away from that.
But, like, doing something like that is that quick.
Helps just build that confidence from the get go.
Speaker 2 (29:08):
Yeah.
And that's the thing, though.
Now it's like, dude, I mean, I, I mean, like, the majority of the content that we do is.
It is like shot from the hip.
Either, like, the topic of conversation is there, but the confidence comes from the fact that, like, done 1300 interviews at this point, right?
Pretty close to that.
I know I've done solo shows and stuff in there, but, like, I've interviewed a lot of people and for me, it's like now it's like I can get somebody talking.
(29:34):
And something like I pride myself on is now like some people because, like, dude, there's a large majority of the guests on that come on my show who've never done any of this before, and they're really nervous about it.
And I tell them, I'm like, listen, you just got to trust the fact that I will get you talking.
And you're.
And trust me, when we're done, you're like, I can't believe that was 30 minutes.
99% of the time they're like, dude, I could have went for like another 30 minutes with you.
(29:57):
And it, to me, it's like a lot of it boils down to the interviewer and then it.
But.
But it is.
It's that confidence of, like, if you truly love what you do.
Speaker 1 (30:05):
Right.
Speaker 2 (30:05):
And you.
And I would love to get your take on this.
How many times did you interview somebody when you were doing that?
Speaker 1 (30:10):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (30:11):
Where you could tell by the tone of their voice how passionate they were about something.
And then you could just hammer in on that and you can get them going for 20 minutes every single time.
Speaker 1 (30:19):
There, there was.
I came out of a.
Because, like, there are supply chain conferences, there are news reporting conferences.
I went to one and I remember coming out of it and one of the takeaways that I had was when.
Because a lot of TV interviews have happen in people's homes.
Everybody offers you water.
(30:39):
Do you want a glass of water?
Do you want to drink?
Or you do pay, whatever.
Right.
It's just like a human nature thing do.
And I came back from this conference and I was instructed like, hey, you went to this conference, you got to kind of teach the team what you learned.
And my big takeaway was if they offer you water, take the water.
Because that is them inviting you into their space where you are a stranger.
(31:04):
They don't know you outside of being on tv, if they watch at all.
So you kind of saying, sure, I'll take a glass of water.
That kind of opens up the door to, okay, this person is open to connecting.
Right.
And that was like, one of my biggest takeaways is, you know, as part of, like, being approachable, understand that as a TV reporter anyway, you don't know what they went through, understand, until you ask and to kind of.
(31:39):
And that takes a, you know, a certain amount of time to get to that point in the conversation.
But it'll go a really long way if you level with them.
And you're like, you know, you present yourself as a human, not just some high in the sky individual that's on tv.
Speaker 2 (31:55):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (31:56):
And I feel it's similar with this too, that like, you just.
When you're going to kind of getting back to our original point, like, about the human connection, like, you want to be someone that the other person enjoys interacting with.
Enjoys, like, whether you're trying to make a sale right now or not, you just want to be able to be talked.
Like, you want to be able to Talk, dude.
Speaker 2 (32:16):
And like bringing out that comfort level in the person that you're interviewing and showing that you're a real person, I think like, that's probably one of the best compliments I, I think I've been given over the years is like, dude, you're the exact same person in person as you are on your show.
Speaker 1 (32:32):
So important.
Speaker 2 (32:33):
And you know, it is, man.
And, and I look at it as, it's like, I mean, I, I take what I do very seriously, you know, and it's like, I, I, I know some people maybe podcasting, they don't think it's that big of a deal and stuff like that.
But like, I look at it is like a, like I built a real business out of this.
You know what I mean?
And when I have commitments that are out there from advertisers and stuff like that, like, I mean, dude, if you would have asked me five years ago, do you think you would have had advertisers and everything?
(33:03):
I would have said no.
I'm like, I don't even know what the hell that is.
And sure, now I have like a real business behind it.
And it's like, and people view content in podcasts is their go to source for information.
And again, like I, like were talking about with the company Swag and stuff like that.
Like, I want people to think view my show is quality no matter what.
Speaker 1 (33:23):
Oh yeah.
Speaker 2 (33:24):
And I, and then there's businesses that have come to me to become, to be like, be on the show.
And they're like, what does it cost?
And I'm like, it doesn't cost anything to come on the show.
And they're like, wait, really?
And I'm like, no, it doesn't.
And furthermore, like, we're going to edit this out for you.
We're going to give you clips, we're going to do all of that for you.
Because to me, it's like I want to build that comfort and that pro, like that level of quality out there in the market.
(33:46):
Because, like, how do I get in touch with more and more people?
And it's like the more people I interview, I want just that word of mouth to kind of go out there.
And then I want them to know, like, there's nothing that you see that goes on is like superficial or pretentious or anything.
It's just real people having real conversations about jobs that we do day in and day out.
(34:07):
And I love it because it's like, man, everybody's got A story to tell Mike.
Speaker 1 (34:10):
Right?
Speaker 2 (34:11):
Everybody's got a unique experience, a unique path inside of this industry in particular, that story needs to be highlighted.
It's not just a. I only want to talk to a large logo CEO and there's a time and a place for a lot of that, don't get me wrong.
But I look at it as is like 90 some percent of this industry is small business.
(34:31):
The, you know, I always go back and I tell this story often like my dad owning his company.
You know, he's an owner out for 40 years.
He never went to any of these conferences and it was because he a couldn't afford to shut his business down for a week to go to these shows.
We should use the platforms that are at our disposal now to put this information out there.
(34:53):
Because what if this episode here, somebody's going to watch this Mike and it's gonna, they're gonna be able to help them make the one decision that takes their business to the next level.
Speaker 1 (35:01):
Right?
Speaker 2 (35:02):
And it's like, and that's what I look at with this.
So it's like I take this seriously because they're people, there are real business owners and real people who are one decision away from possibly losing everything.
And it's like they might hear something, whether it's on my show or others that are like, no, you know what, I'm going to go try it this way and then it's going to work and it's going to keep them in business.
So it's like it's that rip, the butterfly effect that comes on and it's like, and that's why it's like, it's so important for me to like stay on task, not fall into the clickbait that can be social media.
(35:32):
And I'm sure you probably see it all the time out there.
And it's like.
And then, you know, there's a lot of hot button issues that come out in transportation.
I have taken the professional stance to wait three to four days before I talk about it.
Because you working in media for as long as you have, if it reads, if it bleeds, it reads right.
(35:52):
A lot of people will put out a lot of information right away for the clicks, but then they have to redact everything four or five days later because all of this other information came out and it's like, and that's why it's like, I've just taken that standpoint where it's like, I'm going to wait a little bit because more information Tends to come out and then that could change my opinion on something, right?
Speaker 1 (36:14):
Oh yeah, for sure.
And to kind of get back to the very beginning of this, if there are people come up and say, oh, I'm so nervous.
Like what do I say?
Like when I'm marketing, how do I even start?
It's easy to say, just start, just post.
But I would say it's more along the lines of if you know what you want to say, you are the expert.
(36:43):
You know, your own experience.
Kind of going back to, I was saying about when you're being interviewed, like you know what you're talking about.
That's why whoever is interviewing you came to you to talk about it.
I mean, theoretically, right?
Speaker 2 (36:56):
No, absolutely.
Speaker 1 (36:57):
And so you know, if people, if there are company owners, executives, sales like you know, frontline employees or face to company individuals or even, you know, back of house people.
Right.
And they're like, hey, like I want to, I have something to say about this.
Like have an idea of what you want to say for you.
Say it.
Because if you're just gonna go out and just like you know, regurgitate information that's, and it's incoherent, that's not really going to help.
(37:24):
But if you can get to, if you can find what you want to say, how you want to say it.
And then to the, before we even start recording, were talking about this being consistent posting.
Even if you just start once a week, that's fine.
And then you can, as you get more comfortable, increase that, you know, get that frequency up to twice a week.
(37:44):
Three, four, five.
Like right now our social media strategy is posting every single day.
Yeah.
Because there are so many tools at your fingertips not only to create content, but to schedule content.
Buffer.
Speaker 2 (37:57):
We use buffer inside of our organization for that.
Speaker 1 (38:00):
And so we schedule content regularly because I don't want my people working on the weekends.
They're working 9 to 8 to 5 at the lunch break.
Yeah, right.
And that's it.
Like go home.
I've done the, you're on all the time sort of thing.
Right.
And there's a time and a place for that for sure.
But like if you're, if you've got your job and you know, you're just in your role, do what you need to do and then don't worry about working on the weekends.
(38:30):
If that's, if that's, you know what you're doing.
Where, if, maybe if you're like the founder of a company, it's a little bit different, but if you're, you know, a frontline employee who, you know, was just hired or something like that, unless it's like a super early stage startup, you might not be expected to work on the weekends, like, and as long as you're kind of within the rules of engagement with your company and all that stuff too.
Speaker 2 (38:51):
Yeah, I think we're at a time and a place though, Mike, where you can create the, you know, because like, just like with anything, man, like you'll go through creative blocks and stuff like that.
Or you know what, you can go in and you can create a bunch of content and schedule it out and it looks like you're posting all the time.
The most savvy individuals out there pre schedule a lot of their content.
(39:13):
I mean that's something that we do is we schedule stuff out because like, we pay attention to algorithms, we pay attention to a lot of that stuff.
And there are more eyeballs on certain platforms at certain times.
Speaker 1 (39:24):
Right.
Speaker 2 (39:24):
Like, I've come to find out, like LinkedIn during the day, that's the best time to post there.
Anything after hours, not so much.
But if you're on TikTok, YouTube, Instagram, Reels after hours, flip the dude.
And that's the thing, right?
So it's like you can go and just get a ton of exposure out there if you're willing to work for it and if you're willing to start, right?
Because you know, again, you know, you're talking about the hardest part is starting and consistency and everything.
(39:48):
But like, and what you said there about just post once a week or twice a week, choose a metric, start there and build up off of it.
And I say the same thing with sales calls, because everybody's like, oh, I want, I need to make more calls.
I need to make more calls.
All right?
Start with a manageable number and do it every single day for two straight weeks.
And then once you see like, hey, the time it took me to do it decreases, then add more on and then all of a sudden you're making 40, 50, 60 cold calls a day.
(40:14):
And just like with content, before you know it, you're posting every single day because you find your flow, your rhythm.
You're like, man, I actually got a lot more to talk about than I ever thought.
Speaker 1 (40:22):
Right, exactly.
And, and as far as like the tools that are at our fingertips here, like, of course you're going to have like chat GPT be able to create, post copy or canva to create AI generated images or something.
Like that chat.
GBT does that too.
But whatever, I would say those are great tools.
Tools to start.
(40:44):
I kind of treat them as.
And I heard this from another marketing person in this industry.
In fact, it was kind of, I think it was one of our competitors said this, that treat them like an intern.
It's a great starting point.
It'll save you hours of time, but it's gonna make mistakes.
It doesn't know your brand the way you do and it doesn't know your audience the way you do.
(41:08):
So you like put in a prompt and see what it spits out and then tweak from there.
Right.
And we do.
We have four different product releases a year.
Every year.
I'm sorry, every quarter I will interview our product development team and say, hey, tell me about this feature.
Tell me about that feature, what you worked on.
(41:29):
How's it gonna help?
Right.
Previously, I would have to go in line, listen to the 10, 15 minute interview for each of them, pick out the best sound bites, you know, write it up into a press release and then put it out on the website.
It would, it would take me hours and hours of work.
Now I have a transcription service that just like puts it, like puts everything into writing.
(41:51):
Okay, then I'll put it into something else to get.
All right, what are the main talking points here?
I'll check against it.
Like, I'm not just going to trust it blindly, but check against it and then, okay, let's turn these two or three points into a paragraph or two paragraphs or whatever.
And what used to take me seven, eight hours now takes me two.
Speaker 2 (42:14):
Yeah, three.
Speaker 1 (42:15):
Like the time savings there on being able to use the tools and technology that's available to us as marketers is awesome.
I mean, it's not going to be a cure all.
It's not going to like solve all my problems.
Problems.
There's absolutely a human element in marketing and if there's not, I think that's a problem.
Yeah, but that doesn't mean that technology can't help you.
Speaker 2 (42:36):
No, I'm right there with you, man.
And I think like there's a lot of, it's very cost effective to do a lot of this stuff if you're out there and you're finding quality.
And I think like, that's what, that's what hangs up a lot of people as well.
So like, oh, it's going to be too expensive.
I think like cumulatively between the hosting sites and everything, we are anywhere from 5, 50 to $700 a month is what we spend from, like, a production standpoint of, like, the technology to, like, use transcribers, you know, scheduling, stuff like that.
(43:09):
Canva.
Like, we use Canva and other things to kind of help out with our graphics and stuff like that.
But again, man, like, I started on my cell phone, you know, I started on.
On a laptop and everything, and then I used Adobe Premiere Pro, and I taught myself how to edit all of that stuff.
So it's like, I feel like there's.
There's a lot of people who want to do it.
They're just.
I mean, I think ultimately they're afraid just to kind of, like, put themselves out there.
(43:31):
But trust me, as somebody who's been creating content for five years and have done a lot, nobody remembers you.
Like, you remember you and the stuff that you do and say out there.
Speaker 1 (43:41):
And say, you're your own worst critic.
Speaker 2 (43:43):
Dude, it stops so many people.
But, Mike, I appreciate your time today, man.
Speaker 1 (43:48):
Dude, thank you so much for having me on again.
I've always seen your stuff online.
It's so nice and refreshing to see you in person, dude.
Speaker 2 (43:55):
Absolutely, man.
I appreciate it.
Mike, thank you so much for joining me today.
Speaker 1 (43:57):
Absolutely.
Oops.
Speaker 2 (43:58):
Yeah, it's all good.
Hand cut, dude.
45 minutes, man.
Speaker 1 (44:05):
Dang.
Hell, yeah.
Check, check, check.
One, two, one, two, one, two, three, four.
Speaker 2 (00:09):
You are good.
Speaker 1 (00:10):
Okay, great.
Speaker 2 (00:12):
This is the benefit of doing the pre recorded is you can always check everything prior and you get.
Speaker 1 (00:17):
Dude, that's what we do.
Other webinars like it's.
Yeah, for sure.
Speaker 2 (00:21):
All right, we're gonna start in three, two and one.
What is up, ladies and gentlemen?
We are back.
We are not live.
We're doing a nice little pre recorded episode.
And anytime any of you guys are in Phoenix, you to come by and meet in person here you guys, because this is what I love to do is sit down and have conversations with real people who are in the industry.
Like I say before every single show, you guys, this is a show for transportation professionals by transportation professionals.
(00:46):
And marketing is one of those unsung heroes of the industry that are behind the scenes that are happening and really balancing out.
How do you come in and take over an existing brand and incorporate new school methodology?
So I have my good friend Mike Marut in the show today.
Mike, thank you so much for taking the time to join me.
Speaker 1 (01:04):
Chris, always a pleasure.
So glad that I could be here in person.
I'm honestly glad that I'm even in person this week that I could see you here.
Speaker 2 (01:10):
Dude.
I know.
And it's like.
And that's the, you know, every time people are in town, it's you know, like we're located out here in the, we'll call it the Far East Valley.
It's, you know, it's tough and it's like.
And I get it, man, every people come to Arizona to go on vacation.
Not necessarily sit down and work.
But you are working for a few days this week.
Yes, it's on record.
Speaker 1 (01:29):
Yeah.
If my bosses are watching, don't worry, I'm doing some work too.
It's not just vacation out in the sun.
Speaker 2 (01:36):
Dude.
Speaker 1 (01:37):
I might come back a little bit more tan though.
So.
Speaker 2 (01:38):
Yeah, but dude, you're here the right week though, man.
Like there's a cold front coming through so it's only going to be like in the low 90s, which.
Speaker 1 (01:44):
Okay, so I was so excited about that the over the weekend because I got in Thursday night going into Friday morning.
First off, the storm on Thursday night, brutal.
Speaker 2 (01:54):
Oh my goodness.
Speaker 1 (01:54):
Like just crazy.
But then it was like 105, 109, whatever it was over the weekend.
But I love coming down to Arizona.
I'm from the Chicago area originally and when I come down to Arizona, the heat, I love it.
I Love it.
I can totally understand why you live here.
Speaker 2 (02:12):
Yeah.
I mean, being from the Midwest as well.
Like I tell people all the time, I'm like it 30 below zero.
Growing up in northern Wisconsin, bro, it is brutal.
Speaker 1 (02:20):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (02:21):
Up there.
And it's like when you get out, like, I'll take 110 any day of the week.
Like any day of the week because I get to wear shorts 99 of the year.
And even when it's winter out here, it's still 50 degrees out.
So I love it.
I'm in heaven out here.
Speaker 1 (02:34):
I'd rather be hot than cold.
Obviously.
Like, and in Chicago, I mean they call it the Windy City for political reasons, but it is very windy there and the wind is the worst part.
Like, like negative 30.
I could dress for that.
Like, if it ever got to that, like, I could dress for it, but no matter how windy it is, that's getting through my clothes every time.
Speaker 2 (02:53):
Every single time, man.
Speaker 1 (02:55):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (02:55):
So dude, how'd you get your start in this industry?
Like, what brought you in?
Because you have a media background and everything and coming into freight, what brought you in here?
Speaker 1 (03:04):
Yeah, so I used to be a TV reporter and so I was at the local level.
So here in Phoenix that would be the equivalent of Fox 10 or Channel 12.
Right.
Or AZ family.
So I worked at the local level in Clarksburg, West Virginia for about six months.
Medford, Oregon for a little over three years and Austin, Texas for about three years as a news reporter and a multimedia journalist.
(03:33):
I was on tv, right.
So but I was a multimedia journalist which is code for one man bands.
So I'm doing, I'm pitching my stories, I'm doing the interviews, I'm shooting the video, the B roll, writing it for TV broadcast and online, which is two different styles of writing, plus social media content, all that stuff.
Right.
And so I was able to take the skills that I built by being a one man band and doing everything myself, rather than like outsourcing it to a producer or editor, which did happen occasionally.
(04:04):
I'm not gonna say I didn't do that.
Producers and editors are amazing at their job and you absolutely need those people.
But in the jobs that I was in, I was one man band and I was doing it all myself.
And so I was able to take those skills and turn that into marketing.
Because marketing a lot of, especially these days is so much about storytelling.
Speaker 2 (04:23):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (04:24):
And that's what TV reporting is like, you know, not only investigative pieces, you're going to get the data points, you're going to get the hard news and, you know, exposing corruption and all this other stuff.
Right.
But when you really watch that story, you usually start with a person who has been impacted by whatever you're reporting on, because that's what draws the audience in.
(04:48):
And because they can relate.
They're like, oh, I know that person from the Far East Valley who is, you know, battling heat right now or whatever.
Right.
So.
And I tried to take that and bring it into marketing and bring it into supply chain and kind of really using that going forward.
(05:09):
And it's been a great transition for me.
I've been doing this for about two years now, you know, and I've been really happy with being able to make.
Speaker 2 (05:17):
That happen, telling that story.
So, like, you brought up a lot there.
Speaker 1 (05:22):
Yeah, yeah, sorry.
No, no, I can get long winded.
Speaker 2 (05:24):
No, it's perfect, though, because it's like, there's so many parallels between all of this stuff and, you know, a lot of businesses out there, do they just struggle with making content in general.
Speaker 1 (05:35):
Right.
Speaker 2 (05:35):
Because I think, like, that's the one thing where everybody, they're like, how do I start?
And, you know, and now it's like, I mean, that's a question that I used to ask a lot more.
Kind of like when I first started creating content, it was like, oh, I wish I could do that.
I want to do that.
Speaker 1 (05:48):
But.
Speaker 2 (05:49):
And they're like, they're always like, I don't know how.
I don't know what to say.
And I'm like, I didn't know what to say then.
And 99% of the content that I just like, today's interview, complete from the hip.
Speaker 1 (05:59):
Right.
Speaker 2 (05:59):
Like, I'm building off of that.
And that's where it's like, I think a lot of people just need to start posting.
Speaker 1 (06:05):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (06:05):
And, you know, but they're also like, you know, I had a unique experience in the sense of, like, I was creating a brand from scratch.
I wasn't taking over an existing brand.
And so, like, my question is, Mike, is how did you take all of your media experience and then come into a company like Revenova, who's been around for a while, who had an established footprint in the transportation industry and then kind of put your spin on things.
Speaker 1 (06:30):
Yeah.
So Revenova started in 2014.
I joined Revenova in 2023.
So you're right.
Nine years of establishing the brand, going to conferences, like, being a known entity, for lack of a better phrase.
Right.
A standout TMS provider.
When I started, the marketing strategy was primarily trade Shows and referrals and you know, outbound, just like outreach, one offs.
(06:59):
Right.
Which fine strategy, nothing wrong with that.
You know, I would argue that our number two lead generation strategy right now is events and conferences.
Like that's a very important part of what you do from a brand awareness perspective, you know, even more so.
Right.
But when I started, there wasn't really much of a social media presence.
(07:20):
We had the Pages, we had LinkedIn, we had Instagram, we had a few others.
But when I looked at it, nothing had been posted for months, if not years for a variety of reasons, you know, and it just kind of fell to the wayside.
So I started there.
I started with the social media aspect because to your point, at some point you just need to start posting.
(07:44):
And as a tech vendor and as a technology provider, so with my TV background, I love visuals.
I love like engaging with engaging content that's just like, it captures your eye immediately.
Right.
As a SaaS technology platform, nothing is super visually exciting about what we do.
(08:09):
The efficiency is amazing, the product is incredible.
But if you watch it on a video, unless you really know what you're looking at and how powerful that could be, it's not really going to do a whole lot for you.
So what I started with was our people.
I wanted to start with, okay, who are the founders?
Like, who is Mike Horvath, who is Charles Craigmile, Dave Kragmile, Jeff Parisi.
(08:34):
Right.
And what is their story?
How do they get here?
What is their influence on.
Not influence, I'm sorry, what is their expertise when it comes to technology, when it comes to supply chain?
Right.
And leaning into that a little bit more.
And then once were able to establish, I'll call them our characters.
(08:55):
Right.
Then you have them start talking about whatever they're experts on.
Jeff, you've had him on before, expert in sales.
Yeah, he could sell, you know, water to, you know, people in the rainforest or something.
Right.
Mike Horvath, great salesman, super technology minded, just really smart, great storytelling, individual.
(09:20):
I don't know if you've ever sat down with him.
I mean, I know you've had him on, but like outside of this context, sat down with him.
He will tell stories for days.
Speaker 2 (09:27):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (09:27):
And he has that to tell.
And it's just like, it's like you're just enraptured with like whatever he's talking about.
Charles Craigmile.
Right.
One of our, he's our CEO, one of our co founders.
He, his background is brokerage and logistics.
And supply chain.
He was leading the Schneider brokerage for a while.
Right.
And so, okay, let's use his expertise, you know, talking about the market, talking about supply chain as the industry.
(09:52):
Right.
We just came out of the pandemic, which was a huge boom for this industry.
Speaker 2 (09:57):
Massive.
Speaker 1 (09:58):
And.
And now it's depending on who you talk to.
Kind of tight.
Speaker 2 (10:01):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (10:02):
And so, okay, let's use his expertise in that vein.
We've gotten him on like in.
Because we're based in Chicago, we've gotten him on the local news there, talking about the dock workers strike from last year and other things like that.
Dave Craigmile, technological, just genius.
He.
We have a native AI agent.
He built it from scratch, like, and it was like, you know, all the.
(10:25):
We have so many AI vendors out there these days and they have teams of people just like pouring time and energy into building it.
Dave is a one man band.
He's got a small team for sure, but he was primarily doing this native AI agent.
Bill.
Yeah.
And he did it in a matter of months.
(10:46):
And he got it to understand the industry supply chain, you know, rate cons, like literally getting the jargon in there.
So that way it can understand these things.
So I wanted to, when I joined Revenova, I wanted to introduce the people, like the brand, the company, the product, you're right, had been established for a long time.
Unless you were like, I'm not going to say early adopter, but maybe early customer.
(11:11):
Really any of our customers, you would really only know Jeff Parisi because he's in the sales process.
You might know one of the other three guys, but there's also a pretty large chance that you didn't know.
Yeah.
So let's start there.
Let's talk about them and kind of bring them into the conversation.
I was fortunate enough that Revenova as a brand, to your point, had been established.
(11:34):
So I didn't have to just start from scratch with like brand colors and logos and stuff like that.
That was already there for me.
I could just take the pieces and run.
Speaker 2 (11:43):
How so?
I mean, I love that strategy and I think that's what I've probably advised most companies over the years.
I'm like, let your people talk.
Like, let your people, like, because people like, yes, they're going to fall in love with your product, but I feel like they fall in love with your message if they know who's behind the scenes and like what your company stands for.
(12:06):
And I think like a lot of businesses will.
They'll just go back to like the paid Ads and the methods that the advertising agencies sell people on all the time.
But I'm like, does that actually move the needle?
And I feel like we're at a point in time now with social media and podcasting and everything, where it's like you have a unique opportunity to really show behind the scenes what a company actually stands for.
(12:29):
Kind of across the board, right?
Because I feel like in today's day and age, you know, like the progression of where things used to be, like, oh, just take out newspaper ads and do all of that.
That worked back then.
And I feel like there's two schools of thoughts now where it's like, some people are like, no, we're only going to stay in the digital media space.
And then there's the companies like yourself are like, no, we want our people out in front.
(12:51):
Yes, we want that leading the charge.
And we have that much confidence in our product that our product is going to back it up.
Because I feel like fundamentally, when Jeff watches this, he'll probably agree.
And him and I have talked about this.
People buy from people at the end of the day.
Oh, yeah, Because I'm sure you guys have this internal discussion what really makes Revenova different from any other TMS in the space.
(13:13):
And then it's like, it's going to be their connection with your reps, right?
Because I'm sure.
And there's probably people out there who could look at all the TMSs and be like, well, this technical functionality is kind of the same across the board and stuff like that.
There's a lot of parallels out there.
And same thing in the freight brokerage space, right?
Are we all offering the exact same product and service freight?
(13:34):
Fundamentally, yes.
We are all out there cold calling shippers, saying we can do certain things.
But when it boils down to it, people fall in love with a rep, right?
They fall in love with the service that you're providing.
The overall and overarching experience.
Speaker 1 (13:47):
Oh, a thousand percent.
I mean, I talk about this regularly to your exact same point.
All the TMS providers out there, bottom line, providing a pretty similar service, there are going to be different feature functionalities and different, you know, avenues that we're going to be going down.
Like, like I said, we're one of, I think one of maybe two or three TMS providers in the entire space that has a native AI agent built in.
(14:09):
Right.
Everybody else is.
Is integrating with third parties and all this other stuff.
But at the bottom line, you're moving freight using our technology.
Right.
Or.
Or helping you find those efficiencies or whatever phrasing you want to use there.
But I want our people to be highlighted and shown as approachable and that they know what they're talking about.
(14:37):
So now that I've been here for two years, we've expanded beyond Jeff, Charles, David, Mike, to now include our sales team, to now include our product development team.
Getting our VP of product development on podcast like yours to talk about, you know, his expertise is building out a product, right?
(15:01):
Building out the tms.
So let's get him on strategically, on a podcast that is talking about technological development and where the TMS space is going or something like that, right?
Speaker 2 (15:11):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (15:12):
Or let's get our sales reps, who all of them have been brokers at some point.
Like, let's get them on a podcast that is for brokers by brokers.
And that way they can show off that expertise.
Speaker 2 (15:26):
And I think, like, that it's got to make it.
I'm sure you probably have the data about this.
It makes them more approachable at conferences, right.
When people see them in public and they're like, hey, I saw you on that podcast.
I really like what you said at this.
Or, you know, and again, because I feel like a lot of these companies, they go, they spend all these monies at booths, but, like, there's no like, pre or post efforts to like, really get their brand out there.
(15:49):
And I know, like, conferences are great, don't get me wrong, but like, building that familiarity with an audience of people, I. I would only assume that it makes it so much.
Somebody, so much more likely and more comfortable to come up to you or anybody at a conference and be like, hey, man, I saw you on this show.
I just wanted to come up and introduce myself.
And boom, that's the start of something that could lead to more or couldn't.
(16:11):
I don't know.
But I feel like there's.
There's so many people are just kind of missing the mark.
Speaker 1 (16:15):
Right.
Speaker 2 (16:16):
And for me, it's like, they try.
Like on this show, I don't do any preset questions.
If any of my guests come to me and they're like, hey, we need you to ask this.
I'm like, I'm not doing it.
Like, I will.
Speaker 1 (16:26):
It's a hard journalistic of you.
Speaker 2 (16:28):
Yeah, but it's.
Speaker 1 (16:29):
But I do.
Speaker 2 (16:30):
And I tell them, I'm like, you got to trust that the topic of conversation is going to be what you do every day.
You just got to let me flow with it.
And I'm like, people Want that organic conversation.
They don't want the top 10 talking points of a comp that is like listed on these companies websites.
Speaker 1 (16:46):
Right?
Sure.
Speaker 2 (16:47):
They like, they wanted like just have an actual conversation about like do you really know what you're talking about or are you just reading the script?
And I feel like that's where a lot of companies I would love to get your opinion on this, but I wish more companies would kind of like let their people cook.
Like get out there and just run.
Speaker 1 (17:04):
Oh, I, I so Jeff and I have talked about this extensively that like go and talk about what you want to talk about but treat it like Thanksgiving.
Don't bring up politics, don't bring up religion because that gets real dicey real fast.
And that could go in a, it's, it becomes very unpredictable.
Like have like cutting my reps loose or cutting like Danielle Chapin, you've met her before, right.
(17:30):
She is very vocal on social media.
She's super invested in freight fraud and you know, has so much expertise around that these days.
Let it.
And it's to the point where she'll go on a podcast and tell me about it after the fact.
Which like, from the marketing perspective, I'm like love that you went on.
(17:50):
Awesome.
But let me know so we can like promote around it like that.
Like, oh, Danielle is going to be on this podcast.
Go listen in, Go, you know, see what she has to say.
Say.
Because then there's so much that goes into the strategy around that it's not just one conference and you're done.
It's not just one podcast and you're done.
(18:11):
There's got to be some pre event work, the event itself, some post event work.
The I would say because conferences I put.
There's so much brand awareness around that.
Speaker 2 (18:22):
Right.
Speaker 1 (18:22):
Yeah.
Brand awareness is one of the most important things to have and yet one of the hardest things to track.
Speaker 2 (18:28):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (18:29):
In terms of ROI and all that stuff.
Right.
So when I go to a conference and someone says, oh, you're with Revenova.
I, I saw you somewhere.
I, I that to me that's a win.
Speaker 2 (18:41):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (18:41):
Like if they see Revenova somewhere, they know who we are.
I love it.
Like if they know what we do, even better.
They probably know what we do based on how they saw us.
But even better because then it's like, okay, not only is our message getting out, but the brand is getting in front of new people that we have not touched before.
(19:02):
Now I'm not gonna say I've met everybody in the industry that's crazy and it's not true.
But every time I meet new people at a conference or whatever, you know, they'll say, oh, I saw your LinkedIn post.
Oh, I saw your YouTube shorts.
Oh, I saw you guys are everywhere or something like that.
That is our strategy working.
(19:23):
And not to get super technical marketing wise, but like top of funnel, stuff like that.
That's working, dude.
Speaker 2 (19:28):
But I, I think eyeballs is an underutilized currency in today's day and age.
Speaker 1 (19:34):
Really?
Speaker 2 (19:35):
Yeah, I do.
I feel like, you know, they'll invest in getting their brand out there, but it is that old school.
We're just plastering our logo, but there's no message behind it.
Right.
Where it's like those eyeballs of like you saying like, hey, I read your post.
Hey, I saw you on that podcast, or I saw this, you guys were talking about that.
That's a lot different than like, here's the Freight coaches logo and it's on this wall or it's on this promoted post.
(19:59):
But there's like real, no substance behind it.
Right?
Again, it's back to that top 10 corporate talking points that you see out there where it's like, man, if you're gonna like the way I see it, if you're gonna trust your people to make multi million dollar sales for your organization, why aren't you going to trust them to go out there and like kind of be themselves, you know, and I get it, you know, like when it comes down to like politics and religion and stuff like that.
(20:20):
And like with my show, for example, we talk about trucking.
If there's a political spin, will I bring it up?
Yes.
But like, I'm not gonna go out there and just like go off on some rant about who are you supporting.
Speaker 1 (20:32):
In the next election?
Like that.
Speaker 2 (20:33):
Exactly.
Speaker 1 (20:33):
It's got to be relevant.
That's a good point.
Speaker 2 (20:35):
Exactly.
You know, so it's like, for me, but I feel like, you know, you got to use those eyeballs to their fullest extent.
Speaker 1 (20:40):
Right?
Speaker 2 (20:40):
Because it's like you got to get people to buy in to your message at the end of the day, right?
And you like that.
You got to create that, I hate to use the word, the term following and stuff like that, but.
Speaker 1 (20:52):
But it's true.
Speaker 2 (20:52):
Build that following of eyeballs of people who are out there speaking about your brand in the way that you want it and you can go out there and be like, no, we trust our people to go out and do what they want because if we didn't, they wouldn't be representing our company.
And if any capacity, right?
And I feel like a lot of companies out there take the opposite approach that what you guys did, Mike.
They only want the C suite to go out there and talk, right?
(21:14):
And it's like there's value in all of that and I'm not here to discredit it, but like letting your entire organization have a face.
Now I, I look at it from like a followers and everything.
Like, how many, how much more brand exposure do you get when you're a sales rep who used to work at a brokerage and all of their coworkers are now at 4, 40 other brokerages.
They're all connected.
They're like, wait, what's Revenova?
(21:35):
Wait, what is this person doing now?
And it's like.
And that's where the eyeballs are lost because most people stick with a corporate message and they're like, oh, we want our people to do it, but as long as they're inside of this box, right?
Speaker 1 (21:49):
And so I like to.
So whenever we hire a new person who is going to be some sort of public facing individual for the company, I sit down with them for about 45 minutes, just say like, hey, here's what we do as marketing, here's our strategy and here are the guidelines.
I'm not gonna put rules and regulations on them, but at the same time I don't want them just going out there day one and be like, yeah, you know, whatever, right?
(22:13):
Like, let's be thoughtful about how we're sharing this message.
And to your point, the C suite executives only strategy, it works to a degree, but you need to.
There are so many avenues and outlets now for that are better served by people who are not the C suites or the executives, you know, and that there are voices for.
(22:43):
I'm sorry, there are outlets for the middle management voice or for the, you know, I don't, I, I don't want to use bottom of the total poll.
That's not.
I know what you mean.
Speaker 2 (22:56):
Like the frontline workers that are out there.
And like for me, Mike, I look at it like this.
How many times are like, I've seen it like you're at a conference and there's organizations that only let their C suite out there kind of speaking publicly, but they're completely unavailable because they're so busy at these conferences where there is that intimidation factor.
(23:16):
Like I don't care what anybody says.
When you look at a billion dollar organization or a Multi hundred million dollar organization out there that might sell a product or a service.
There's going to be a small startup founder who might be intimidated to go and talk to them.
Speaker 1 (23:30):
Right.
Speaker 2 (23:30):
For whatever reason.
The imposter syndrome.
It doesn't matter because, dude, like, I'm not afraid to admit it.
There's times where I'm like, why the is this person even talking to me, dude?
I'm.
I just, like, I just hit record on my podcast.
I'm talking to the CEO of this company, like, what is this?
But it's, you know, I look at it as.
How much more brand friendly is it to kind of show like, no, these are all of our people.
Speaker 1 (23:52):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (23:53):
And then that, you know, sales rep whose literal job at a conference is to talk to as many people as possible.
Now they know, like, hey, I'm gonna go talk to that person now.
Because I saw him on a podcast.
I feel somewhat of a connection, like, yeah, that's my person there.
The amount of people that I've met over the years, Mike, that they're like, dude, I follow your.
I followed your podcast for years.
I've never commented.
(24:13):
I've never done anything.
But I just wanted to come up and talk to you because I feel like I know you.
How much more has that done for the brand over the years?
I think, like, I'm going to pat myself on the back.
That's what's kept me relevant for over five years at this point.
Speaker 1 (24:26):
So let me ask you this.
Speaker 2 (24:27):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (24:28):
You have been doing the podcast for five years, and do you feel more confident today than you did, let's say, six years ago before you started this?
In talking to executives and talking to founders, in going to a conference and just walking up to somebody, you seem like a social person.
(24:49):
Have you always been that way?
Is really what I'm getting at.
Speaker 2 (24:51):
No, this is actually.
This is going to sound crazy, but it's kind of like an act.
I'm naturally an introvert.
Like, when I'm at home, dude, like, I don't want to talk to anybody.
And.
But like, I. I've curated.
There's this really good book out there called the Alter Ego.
And I had no idea that is what I had done when I created the Freight Coach brand, where it's like, it's a different thing.
(25:13):
Where it's like, that's work, Chris.
When I'm out there and I'm doing stuff like, I don't have any imposter syndrome to, like, walk up and introduce myself to people and.
And go and do it.
But I also have five years of trust now where they con most people know what they're getting when I.
When I come up, right?
Like, one area that I really pride myself on is, knock on wood, I don't have any sound bites of me or screenshots of something I said or commented on a post that was, like, off brand, right?
(25:43):
You know, like, there's no PR campaign out there of, like, oh, Chris didn't mean what he said here.
But the confidence comes from the fact that, like, I've met so many people now.
I put myself out there.
Like, because, dude, early on, it was like pulling teeth to get guests on the show.
Speaker 1 (25:58):
Sure.
Speaker 2 (25:59):
It was so challenging because people are like, yeah, the podcast sounds cool, but.
Speaker 1 (26:02):
Who are you, right?
Speaker 2 (26:03):
Who do you know?
And now it's kind of like the roles have reverse or like, no, dude, I love what you do for the industry.
I'd love to come on your show where it's like, I'm going out there and, like, legitimately my guest spots.
And I do 20 to 22 podcasts in a month, depending on how many working days there are.
I'm booked out for, like, two months at a time now.
Now, you know, and it's because people are like, hey, I want to Come on.
(26:25):
I want to talk.
And it is that the fact that, like, I'm not afraid to.
Like, I spent the early years going to every conference I could putting myself out there to meet as many people as possible early on.
So it's like, there's not any one person in the industry that, like, I would be fanboying over in a sense of, like, God, they don't want to go and talk to me.
(26:46):
And I also look at, like, no, I'm the founder of my company.
No one's going to talk to me unless I put myself out there and talk to everybody that I possibly can.
Speaker 1 (26:53):
So that's what I've been trying to impart to our team overall is, like, the more often you are doing, I'll call them public appearances, whether that's presentations or podcasts or whatever, the more confident you're going to be in your job role.
Like, because I'm thinking about our sales team, every year I try and get every single one of them on at least one podcast or presentation just to flex that muscle a little bit.
(27:23):
And many of them, before they started with us, had never done that before.
And now I'm like, hey, like, this is.
I want you to do this because you're going to get so much whether.
Whether you bomb or whether you do great, you are going to get so much out of it.
And terms of building that confidence up and being able to do it again next year.
Speaker 2 (27:46):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (27:47):
Now, funny enough, like, some of our reps who are super confident, one one doing a presentation, they're.
They flounder a little bit, right?
And it's just like a matter of practice and getting ready for it.
But there's one of our reps in particular who is, you know, he does not love to do these types of things.
(28:07):
I was at a conference with him in person and I was like, hey, let's go over and do this interview.
Five minutes, super easy.
I'll be there the whole time, no sweat.
And I was sitting there and I was far enough away that I didn't hear the whole conversation, but five minutes comes and goes for me as a TV reporter.
(28:28):
I remember how quick that is, right?
He gets done.
He comes out, he's like, mike, I'm so glad you forced me to do this, because it, I just feel so much better about it.
And it was with a podcaster that I could trust to, like, they're not going to put him in a bad spot.
Like, they're going to ask him relatively softball questions because it's five minutes at a conference.
(28:51):
Like, that's not enough time to, like, dig deep into stuff.
Like, that's just an introductory conversation at best, which is important.
It's still important not to take anything away from that.
But, like, doing something like that is that quick.
Helps just build that confidence from the get go.
Speaker 2 (29:08):
Yeah.
And that's the thing, though.
Now it's like, dude, I mean, I, I mean, like, the majority of the content that we do is.
It is like shot from the hip.
Either, like, the topic of conversation is there, but the confidence comes from the fact that, like, done 1300 interviews at this point, right?
Pretty close to that.
I know I've done solo shows and stuff in there, but, like, I've interviewed a lot of people and for me, it's like now it's like I can get somebody talking.
(29:34):
And something like I pride myself on is now like some people because, like, dude, there's a large majority of the guests on that come on my show who've never done any of this before, and they're really nervous about it.
And I tell them, I'm like, listen, you just got to trust the fact that I will get you talking.
And you're.
And trust me, when we're done, you're like, I can't believe that was 30 minutes.
99% of the time they're like, dude, I could have went for like another 30 minutes with you.
(29:57):
And it, to me, it's like a lot of it boils down to the interviewer and then it.
But.
But it is.
It's that confidence of, like, if you truly love what you do.
Speaker 1 (30:05):
Right.
Speaker 2 (30:05):
And you.
And I would love to get your take on this.
How many times did you interview somebody when you were doing that?
Speaker 1 (30:10):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (30:11):
Where you could tell by the tone of their voice how passionate they were about something.
And then you could just hammer in on that and you can get them going for 20 minutes every single time.
Speaker 1 (30:19):
There, there was.
I came out of a.
Because, like, there are supply chain conferences, there are news reporting conferences.
I went to one and I remember coming out of it and one of the takeaways that I had was when.
Because a lot of TV interviews have happen in people's homes.
Everybody offers you water.
(30:39):
Do you want a glass of water?
Do you want to drink?
Or you do pay, whatever.
Right.
It's just like a human nature thing do.
And I came back from this conference and I was instructed like, hey, you went to this conference, you got to kind of teach the team what you learned.
And my big takeaway was if they offer you water, take the water.
Because that is them inviting you into their space where you are a stranger.
(31:04):
They don't know you outside of being on tv, if they watch at all.
So you kind of saying, sure, I'll take a glass of water.
That kind of opens up the door to, okay, this person is open to connecting.
Right.
And that was like, one of my biggest takeaways is, you know, as part of, like, being approachable, understand that as a TV reporter anyway, you don't know what they went through, understand, until you ask and to kind of.
(31:39):
And that takes a, you know, a certain amount of time to get to that point in the conversation.
But it'll go a really long way if you level with them.
And you're like, you know, you present yourself as a human, not just some high in the sky individual that's on tv.
Speaker 2 (31:55):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (31:56):
And I feel it's similar with this too, that like, you just.
When you're going to kind of getting back to our original point, like, about the human connection, like, you want to be someone that the other person enjoys interacting with.
Enjoys, like, whether you're trying to make a sale right now or not, you just want to be able to be talked.
Like, you want to be able to Talk, dude.
Speaker 2 (32:16):
And like bringing out that comfort level in the person that you're interviewing and showing that you're a real person, I think like, that's probably one of the best compliments I, I think I've been given over the years is like, dude, you're the exact same person in person as you are on your show.
Speaker 1 (32:32):
So important.
Speaker 2 (32:33):
And you know, it is, man.
And, and I look at it as, it's like, I mean, I, I take what I do very seriously, you know, and it's like, I, I, I know some people maybe podcasting, they don't think it's that big of a deal and stuff like that.
But like, I look at it is like a, like I built a real business out of this.
You know what I mean?
And when I have commitments that are out there from advertisers and stuff like that, like, I mean, dude, if you would have asked me five years ago, do you think you would have had advertisers and everything?
(33:03):
I would have said no.
I'm like, I don't even know what the hell that is.
And sure, now I have like a real business behind it.
And it's like, and people view content in podcasts is their go to source for information.
And again, like I, like were talking about with the company Swag and stuff like that.
Like, I want people to think view my show is quality no matter what.
Speaker 1 (33:23):
Oh yeah.
Speaker 2 (33:24):
And I, and then there's businesses that have come to me to become, to be like, be on the show.
And they're like, what does it cost?
And I'm like, it doesn't cost anything to come on the show.
And they're like, wait, really?
And I'm like, no, it doesn't.
And furthermore, like, we're going to edit this out for you.
We're going to give you clips, we're going to do all of that for you.
Because to me, it's like I want to build that comfort and that pro, like that level of quality out there in the market.
(33:46):
Because, like, how do I get in touch with more and more people?
And it's like the more people I interview, I want just that word of mouth to kind of go out there.
And then I want them to know, like, there's nothing that you see that goes on is like superficial or pretentious or anything.
It's just real people having real conversations about jobs that we do day in and day out.
(34:07):
And I love it because it's like, man, everybody's got A story to tell Mike.
Speaker 1 (34:10):
Right?
Speaker 2 (34:11):
Everybody's got a unique experience, a unique path inside of this industry in particular, that story needs to be highlighted.
It's not just a. I only want to talk to a large logo CEO and there's a time and a place for a lot of that, don't get me wrong.
But I look at it as is like 90 some percent of this industry is small business.
(34:31):
The, you know, I always go back and I tell this story often like my dad owning his company.
You know, he's an owner out for 40 years.
He never went to any of these conferences and it was because he a couldn't afford to shut his business down for a week to go to these shows.
We should use the platforms that are at our disposal now to put this information out there.
(34:53):
Because what if this episode here, somebody's going to watch this Mike and it's gonna, they're gonna be able to help them make the one decision that takes their business to the next level.
Speaker 1 (35:01):
Right?
Speaker 2 (35:02):
And it's like, and that's what I look at with this.
So it's like I take this seriously because they're people, there are real business owners and real people who are one decision away from possibly losing everything.
And it's like they might hear something, whether it's on my show or others that are like, no, you know what, I'm going to go try it this way and then it's going to work and it's going to keep them in business.
So it's like it's that rip, the butterfly effect that comes on and it's like, and that's why it's like, it's so important for me to like stay on task, not fall into the clickbait that can be social media.
(35:32):
And I'm sure you probably see it all the time out there.
And it's like.
And then, you know, there's a lot of hot button issues that come out in transportation.
I have taken the professional stance to wait three to four days before I talk about it.
Because you working in media for as long as you have, if it reads, if it bleeds, it reads right.
(35:52):
A lot of people will put out a lot of information right away for the clicks, but then they have to redact everything four or five days later because all of this other information came out and it's like, and that's why it's like, I've just taken that standpoint where it's like, I'm going to wait a little bit because more information Tends to come out and then that could change my opinion on something, right?
Speaker 1 (36:14):
Oh yeah, for sure.
And to kind of get back to the very beginning of this, if there are people come up and say, oh, I'm so nervous.
Like what do I say?
Like when I'm marketing, how do I even start?
It's easy to say, just start, just post.
But I would say it's more along the lines of if you know what you want to say, you are the expert.
(36:43):
You know, your own experience.
Kind of going back to, I was saying about when you're being interviewed, like you know what you're talking about.
That's why whoever is interviewing you came to you to talk about it.
I mean, theoretically, right?
Speaker 2 (36:56):
No, absolutely.
Speaker 1 (36:57):
And so you know, if people, if there are company owners, executives, sales like you know, frontline employees or face to company individuals or even, you know, back of house people.
Right.
And they're like, hey, like I want to, I have something to say about this.
Like have an idea of what you want to say for you.
Say it.
Because if you're just gonna go out and just like you know, regurgitate information that's, and it's incoherent, that's not really going to help.
(37:24):
But if you can get to, if you can find what you want to say, how you want to say it.
And then to the, before we even start recording, were talking about this being consistent posting.
Even if you just start once a week, that's fine.
And then you can, as you get more comfortable, increase that, you know, get that frequency up to twice a week.
(37:44):
Three, four, five.
Like right now our social media strategy is posting every single day.
Yeah.
Because there are so many tools at your fingertips not only to create content, but to schedule content.
Buffer.
Speaker 2 (37:57):
We use buffer inside of our organization for that.
Speaker 1 (38:00):
And so we schedule content regularly because I don't want my people working on the weekends.
They're working 9 to 8 to 5 at the lunch break.
Yeah, right.
And that's it.
Like go home.
I've done the, you're on all the time sort of thing.
Right.
And there's a time and a place for that for sure.
But like if you're, if you've got your job and you know, you're just in your role, do what you need to do and then don't worry about working on the weekends.
(38:30):
If that's, if that's, you know what you're doing.
Where, if, maybe if you're like the founder of a company, it's a little bit different, but if you're, you know, a frontline employee who, you know, was just hired or something like that, unless it's like a super early stage startup, you might not be expected to work on the weekends, like, and as long as you're kind of within the rules of engagement with your company and all that stuff too.
Speaker 2 (38:51):
Yeah, I think we're at a time and a place though, Mike, where you can create the, you know, because like, just like with anything, man, like you'll go through creative blocks and stuff like that.
Or you know what, you can go in and you can create a bunch of content and schedule it out and it looks like you're posting all the time.
The most savvy individuals out there pre schedule a lot of their content.
(39:13):
I mean that's something that we do is we schedule stuff out because like, we pay attention to algorithms, we pay attention to a lot of that stuff.
And there are more eyeballs on certain platforms at certain times.
Speaker 1 (39:24):
Right.
Speaker 2 (39:24):
Like, I've come to find out, like LinkedIn during the day, that's the best time to post there.
Anything after hours, not so much.
But if you're on TikTok, YouTube, Instagram, Reels after hours, flip the dude.
And that's the thing, right?
So it's like you can go and just get a ton of exposure out there if you're willing to work for it and if you're willing to start, right?
Because you know, again, you know, you're talking about the hardest part is starting and consistency and everything.
(39:48):
But like, and what you said there about just post once a week or twice a week, choose a metric, start there and build up off of it.
And I say the same thing with sales calls, because everybody's like, oh, I want, I need to make more calls.
I need to make more calls.
All right?
Start with a manageable number and do it every single day for two straight weeks.
And then once you see like, hey, the time it took me to do it decreases, then add more on and then all of a sudden you're making 40, 50, 60 cold calls a day.
(40:14):
And just like with content, before you know it, you're posting every single day because you find your flow, your rhythm.
You're like, man, I actually got a lot more to talk about than I ever thought.
Speaker 1 (40:22):
Right, exactly.
And, and as far as like the tools that are at our fingertips here, like, of course you're going to have like chat GPT be able to create, post copy or canva to create AI generated images or something.
Like that chat.
GBT does that too.
But whatever, I would say those are great tools.
Tools to start.
(40:44):
I kind of treat them as.
And I heard this from another marketing person in this industry.
In fact, it was kind of, I think it was one of our competitors said this, that treat them like an intern.
It's a great starting point.
It'll save you hours of time, but it's gonna make mistakes.
It doesn't know your brand the way you do and it doesn't know your audience the way you do.
(41:08):
So you like put in a prompt and see what it spits out and then tweak from there.
Right.
And we do.
We have four different product releases a year.
Every year.
I'm sorry, every quarter I will interview our product development team and say, hey, tell me about this feature.
Tell me about that feature, what you worked on.
(41:29):
How's it gonna help?
Right.
Previously, I would have to go in line, listen to the 10, 15 minute interview for each of them, pick out the best sound bites, you know, write it up into a press release and then put it out on the website.
It would, it would take me hours and hours of work.
Now I have a transcription service that just like puts it, like puts everything into writing.
(41:51):
Okay, then I'll put it into something else to get.
All right, what are the main talking points here?
I'll check against it.
Like, I'm not just going to trust it blindly, but check against it and then, okay, let's turn these two or three points into a paragraph or two paragraphs or whatever.
And what used to take me seven, eight hours now takes me two.
Speaker 2 (42:14):
Yeah, three.
Speaker 1 (42:15):
Like the time savings there on being able to use the tools and technology that's available to us as marketers is awesome.
I mean, it's not going to be a cure all.
It's not going to like solve all my problems.
Problems.
There's absolutely a human element in marketing and if there's not, I think that's a problem.
Yeah, but that doesn't mean that technology can't help you.
Speaker 2 (42:36):
No, I'm right there with you, man.
And I think like there's a lot of, it's very cost effective to do a lot of this stuff if you're out there and you're finding quality.
And I think like, that's what, that's what hangs up a lot of people as well.
So like, oh, it's going to be too expensive.
I think like cumulatively between the hosting sites and everything, we are anywhere from 5, 50 to $700 a month is what we spend from, like, a production standpoint of, like, the technology to, like, use transcribers, you know, scheduling, stuff like that.
(43:09):
Canva.
Like, we use Canva and other things to kind of help out with our graphics and stuff like that.
But again, man, like, I started on my cell phone, you know, I started on.
On a laptop and everything, and then I used Adobe Premiere Pro, and I taught myself how to edit all of that stuff.
So it's like, I feel like there's.
There's a lot of people who want to do it.
They're just.
I mean, I think ultimately they're afraid just to kind of, like, put themselves out there.
(43:31):
But trust me, as somebody who's been creating content for five years and have done a lot, nobody remembers you.
Like, you remember you and the stuff that you do and say out there.
Speaker 1 (43:41):
And say, you're your own worst critic.
Speaker 2 (43:43):
Dude, it stops so many people.
But, Mike, I appreciate your time today, man.
Speaker 1 (43:48):
Dude, thank you so much for having me on again.
I've always seen your stuff online.
It's so nice and refreshing to see you in person, dude.
Speaker 2 (43:55):
Absolutely, man.
I appreciate it.
Mike, thank you so much for joining me today.
Speaker 1 (43:57):
Absolutely.
Oops.
Speaker 2 (43:58):
Yeah, it's all good.
Hand cut, dude.
45 minutes, man.
Speaker 1 (44:05):
Dang.
Hell, yeah.
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