Episode 235 | Kenny Phillips - Corie Sheppard Podcast

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:16):
Welcome, mr Kenny Phillips.
How are you going, sir, I'mgood, I'm good, you're good.
Yeah, kenny, I have someproblems here.
I tell you before we start.
I say, boy, I never take enoughtime to do research for this,
and I feel like them UE examswhere you study just before you
go in and every time I look upsomething I see something
different.
So you know, tell me you'regoing.
Today we recorded when Trinidadplayed in Jamaica in this Unity

(00:37):
Cup.
Right, you carrying that on WAC?
You're going to sort that outnow, not on WAC, they just want
me to carry it on to TFA andwherever, but to stream for them
.
Yeah, well, they say they get alink Right, so I have to just
pull the link.
I mean, I just get a call Right, so I myself don't even know, I
just know I have to take thestream and send the stream.

(00:57):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
So that's something you've beendoing more and more of, like a
lot of the things I saw duringcovid.
A lot.
Well, I guess everything wentto the social, everything was,
everything was remote, it was.
You know, everything was not inperson.
Yeah, everything was masked.
So you end up being the manbehind the scenes for a lot of
them, things that we enjoyedduring covid.
Yeah, well, I remember thattime the government was paying

(01:20):
everybody a five thousanddollars, right for two years,
for For the creators, like wow,and you get stretched.
That is one month grocery workup to you.
So I, before I had decided, justbefore the COVID, I was
watching it and I said, look, Ihave a conference room there
that may like the meetings,right, so let me gut the

(01:43):
conference room, put up a, athing on the wall, right, a
thing looking like a curtain in,like a like a nappa or a sappa
curtain, right, and let me singsome songs in front of it.
And boom, covid happened.
And I was already setting thatup.
So it, it went fast, yeah, Ican imagine.
So you, you jump started thething.

(02:04):
Then you was there, yeah, over500 shows, right, serious.
Since then, well, during theCOVID, oh, during COVID alone,
yeah, all and everything thatwas gravy 500, brother, wow,
every week was something and weasked for donations.
In fact, I was using FundMeTNT,correct, and they were the

(02:27):
portal, the e-commerce portal,right.
So, and eventually I bought itand put that e-commerce portal
onto my own website, correct.
So that was, that's thebeginning of that, and that is
not only donations butpay-per-view, et cetera, et
cetera.
Okay, donations, butpay-per-view, etc.
Okay, I was not going to ask youhow you make money, because
5,000 by 500 shows, it issomething like much per show.
You know if that's what thegovernment giving you, but

(02:49):
you're making the moneyotherwise.
No, no, no, the government wasgiving it's like a grant.
Yeah, a grant.
Oh, I see, I see.
So when we we used to do ourshows, like one of and she made
$24,000 in an hour and a half,nice, in donations, right, so
they say like something happened, but it depends on the artist,

(03:11):
depends on the song, depends onthe performance I'm running on
super made real money.
That's how people I had blacksa few times, blacks about three
times.
I had singing Sandra, I hadDennis Plummer and what it is by
saying that I have these peoplebefore they pass.

(03:31):
Of course I have, you know,because a lot of people, some
youngsters, don't even know themand I have it.
So I say, well, this is thisone and this is that one.
Yeah, important part of thething to me, because you're
talking to people who sometimesI was telling Eddie Charles when
he was here, I said, eddie,people, younger people, know you
as a soca parang man.
They don't know who he wasdoing.
I hear somebody ask you if he'sa guitarist recently.

(03:52):
I say in what was a goodinterview, you know, I like her
interviews a lot, but it justshows that we had a.
Young people don't know me,yeah, and they think I'm a radio
man right here, far from thetruth.
Radio radio by force.
Yeah, I am, I'm a guitar player.
Let me start there.
That's it.
That's why I know your father.

(04:14):
Uh-huh, yeah, I was inchandelier.
I was in chandelier when he wasin song rap, right.
In fact I was in majors beforechandelier, right.
So majors was one of yourearliest bands.
You had said well, walter,school of music.
First I played in the bandthere, not in the school, but in
the in Majors before Chandelier, right.
So Majors was one of yourearliest bands.
You had said, right, well,walter's, school of Music.
First I played in the bandthere, not in the school, but in
the band Right.
And then from Walter's Schoolof Music I went to Majors and
then from Majors to Chandelier.
From Chandelier I think I didCarl and Carol Jacobs when you

(04:40):
joined.
Um, carl, how's Carl now Carl?
And that's always.
Every carnival used to bring aguy from Antigua, mm-hmm, um,
and you used to have little leadsingers in between, right,
ronnie used to come forward fromKnocking Iron, uh-huh and sing
them rapping songs, andeventually he became a big lead
singer.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's whereyou start rhythm section.

(05:02):
Yeah, I saw that evolution, youknow.
Yeah, you see a lot.
Because I keep looking at thisthing and I say, but all right,
well, can you come and let me gothrough some of your
discography and I tell myselfI'm doing something wrong,
because when I see some of thesesongs I say something ain't
right.
Kitchener, kitchener, this 80s,early 80s kind of thing I play

(05:24):
about 8 or 9 years Straight forKitchener Recording studio.
Yeah, I used to work withLeston.
Leston is my my mentor.
Leston, teach me A lot.
You had to say Leston Paul,right, for people who don't,
leston, mr Leston Paul, thegreat Leston Paul.
Yeah, he probably had the mosthits of anybody in the soccer

(05:47):
industry, probably followed notso closely or closely by Frankie
McIntosh, pelham, goddard,right, dizey Mende, uh-huh,
leston Pelham, frankie.
Yeah, yeah, I don't think I haveany other name.
Yeah, you don't know, it'sanother name, right, I don't
think you have any other name?
Yeah, you don't know, it'sanother name.
Right, and I am a far foot.

(06:08):
Yeah, far foot, I am just, I'mjust happy to be called in the
same sentence as these guys.
Right, that's fair.
That's fair Because I am a bitlucky, because I'm a guitarist.
These guys are keyboard players,so there was a disparity.
You know, you are guitarists.
You know guitarists will reallybe arrangers and producers, you

(06:29):
know.
But I follow in the footstepsof Nile Rodgers.
Right, you know, nile Rodgers,of she?
Yeah, I heard you telling astory about that.
Yeah, so somebody was here andthey were talking about that
opening.
Like you're playing, I'm feelingit one of the most iconic
pieces of music.
You know, like some soccer,they have a signature to them,

(06:50):
they hook, good, they take.
But instrumentalists you mightbe the one who could boast of
many, many of them things, butfeeling it was one of them,
special ones, it was special.
Yeah, it was very special.
We didn't know how it happened.
We just play Leston, say youstart yeah, yeah, and that's it.

(07:10):
So you just play where you feelit.
Yeah, I was feeling it.
Yeah, but you have a good senseof Barron here with Leston.
Long time, by that point, Iknow Barron before Leston.
I know Barron from Bamu Village.
Yeah, you understand Mm-hmm,bamu, mind you, back in the days

(07:30):
I used to be a band zombie,right.
So I used to go through SanFernando, even Separia, and look
for bands just to listen tobands, because it's something I
was into.
You go down, go down, where'sthat street boy Down behind?
Where Wacky's there that bandpracticing I don't know if it

(07:51):
was Solid 7 or some one of thembands and stand up and listen.
Used to go Laramie and use thatone called Free Soil Straight,
you know, and I used to likethat.
We used to go to Separia.
I had ago Separia had this boykeyboardist, incinus.
Stephen Incinus had a bandcalled I think it was, heat Wave
Up.
There's a time I went up to thatplace on Superior Street and

(08:13):
checking a band and a manplaying a Vibes on a big silver
vibraphone, right, andrew Tanker.
I see, and I knew nothing ofnothing and I just bouncing up
on the six, I look in, we stillrun down band.
So you strap up a guitar whenyou're going, no, no, no, or
you're just going to listen.
I was nobody, I just going toMako.
Oh, so this before you werereally playing.

(08:33):
Yeah, and I was into it.
I was into it.
So what led you to be so into?
I found out.
Found out very late, from myfather, I thought I was in my
forties.
My father say my, my motherused to teach piano.
You know, I'm like what manyou're now telling me that After

(08:58):
40 years, I only tell my thingas a home child.
Why are you now telling me that, yeah, and was confirmed by his
.
My aunt, who was down here theother day, she was confirming
some things, yeah, his, hismother, but she died young.
She used to teach piano.
I see, so I realized, oh, thisthing really, the lineage is is

(09:23):
pure.
Yeah, it's in you.
I'm watching my granddaughtertaking one of these bottles and
she's sitting on the ground withher pot spoon and she's not two
yet you know what I'm sayingWhoa and enjoying herself and
she's good for a while.
So I realize it's there, like Ihear in family.

(09:44):
You see.
So I realized it.
You know it there.
It there Like I hear family.
You see, your sister gets highas well.
You start off with it as youfirst pick up.
Yeah, boy, like you knowNapriwa girls.
You know prestige school thing.
You know, up top, yeah, youknow.
So you have to buy a recorder,right, and you a recorder, and

(10:06):
you have to buy a guitar andyou're going to school.
So my sister, have all of that,me, now a rebel, watch the
guitar, hey, so she show me fourchords and I like that, I like
this, I like it, I like it, butdo not touch my guitar anymore,
that's it, do not.
And she going to sleep, put theguitar up on the cover and if

(10:27):
you see a boy sneaky, let's go.
Take the guitar and, you know,stick it in pong.
Yeah, real movie thing.
You know, go on downstairs and,mm-hmm, shove away, move the
bridge.
Yeah, and I really wasinterested in this, this.
I didn't know how to tuneanything, I was just playing.
I would move the bridge andwhen I finished I'd go and play

(10:50):
it back.
Easy, you forget to go back tothe bridge Next morning.
Mommy, talk to Kenny, now thebridge is all over the place.
And I'd say you get your ownguitar.
You know, I said all right,alright, and I got my own guitar
and went classes and the firstday, the first, the opening of

(11:12):
the book, um, I was by a guynamed Mr Gaskin, and the first
day I finished the book, thewhole book.
When he realized, oh, okay,alright, and we turned till we
end up till the down the wholebook.
When he realized, oh okay, allright, and we turned till we end
up to the down in the end ofthe lessons and thing, me and Mr
Gaskin used to just be jamming,you know, playing music.

(11:34):
No, it wasn't teacher, I thinkit was.
We was jamming.
He used to get hot.
He's one man.
When you play like it's thelast time you'll ever play, you
give all.
When you're playing, when youget hot, you take your guitar,
turn it over and start to beatit.
It was real, real vibes, realvibes, real vibes.
It teach me vibes.

(11:54):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, it teach mevibes, you know.
So you're going through thatthing in learning.
But with the four chords thatyou know, there's plenty song,
yeah, so the four chords thatyou know, there's plenty of song
.
Yeah, yeah, so you're playingdifferent genres, you're playing
anything at that point in time,yeah, it was real fun.
Those were the days.
People who learn it or peoplewho could play an instrument
might understand how hard it isto finish that book.
Most people on that first pageare sweating.

(12:15):
No, but I, when I realized whenI go in and do this book and I
gone, you know I really enjoyedthat.
I just sleep in the guitar inmy bed, my book.
My mother bought me my firstreal guitar, but I mean I had a,
I had a acoustic guitar and Ihad a old buggy which I still do

(12:37):
.
I still have it.
I don't even know I have a fewguitars.
Well, and the old buggy was theold buggy.
Right, when I say old buggy, itwas a green guitar, it was
electric.
At this point, yeah, that wasthe first electric.
And I actually went by MrGaskin who was a carpenter and
he started it all and he make itthe sunburst, nice, it was an
old buggy.

(12:57):
Now, to get in the game you haveto have an instrument To play
in the studio, you have to havea studio instrument, an
instrument to play in the studio, you have to have a studio
instrument.
And I mean I've been studyingthe thing.
My dream is to be a studio rat.
So my friend, another one of myteachers, jamie Brown, he's
come down every year and playingin Kaiser House and you know,

(13:20):
and this is we're talking reallyyears ago he brought a guitar
and I bought it from him.
I think it was 5,000, 6,000.
It was just big money.
Back in the day, my mother wentand take a loan and I put part,
she put part and you know, andshe said, tola, your father's
sin, whoa.
And after some months and thingand thing a day, one day he

(13:48):
passed, my father passed, andyou walked past him.
Were you gonna?
You know something?
I would.
I just don't answer.
I've lived to see the day thathe said my son is a guitarist.
You know my son is a musician.
I've lived to see the day thathe said my son is a guitarist.

(14:09):
You know my son is a musician.
I'm like, yeah, becausenormally musicians it's not a
job that you want for yourchildren.
Even back then, yeah, yeah, youwant to be a doctor, lawyer,
police a job, a real job, yeah,but musician, musician was not.
I want to be a musician.
My father said you want to stop?

(14:30):
Yeah, yeah, you know thingshave changed.
Well, let me say that I made itwork for me.
Right, to make a living out ofmusic wasn't easy, mm-hmm, it
wasn't easy.
It wasn't like.
I see a plan in this and I'mgoing to do that.
I cut in the part.

(14:51):
I don't know where, butsomewhere it's going to go.
I'm a musician.
I left the bank for salary.
Leave the bank.
Daddy must be worried.
No, but at that time, at thattime, I was making more money
home than in the bank.
Daddy must be worried.
No, no, but at that time, atthat time, I was making more
money home than in the bank.
I ain't going to leave.
Yeah, just so you know.
But everybody said you're madman, but you leave the bank.

(15:15):
The bank used to be paying, youknow, I think it was $7,000 a
month, which was big.
Yes, good money, by the way,good money.
No, but in recording and stuffyou could make five thousand
dollars a day.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, if you're, ifyou're really mercenary, you
could make, you know.
So it really.
Yeah, it wasn't a hard decision, gotcha, but I was own way and

(15:39):
miserable.
So, like I would go to work andhave ideas.
I always have ideas, alwayshave ideas, and I'm watching the
line.
I was the customer servicerepresentative and I'm watching
the line.
You know montan and penal rightand everybody who had to give
thumbprint and them kind ofthing, and I'm watching the line

(16:00):
.
I see why don't we do the oneline and have the person as they
do now.
They go to wherever cashier youwant to go to, but you have one
line.
So I was the CSR, so I, that'smy call.
So I changed the thing and Ifixed it up early in the morning

(16:20):
and when the accountant, theboss, come in like who changed
this?
Who did this?
I said I do it.
I said we could try it todayand see, no, no, you can't do
that, jaisal.
You're like no, put it back.
I'm like really, yeah, me,mm-hmm, Jaisal, jaisal, all

(16:50):
that's all.
And I go upstairs I hear myresign.
You're taking this thingserious?
No, no, I, I.
I hold reverence to my ideas.
If these things don't come now,everybody's have them.
So when you have a, let's trythis and let's see if it could
work, let's do this.
Give me a little something now,mm-hmm, don't just.
No, we can't do that.
We're no reasoning, of course.

(17:11):
No, not today, let's dotomorrow.
Nothing like that.
Yeah, zero, no, mm-hmm, likeyeah, yeah, yeah.
You know I do entrepreneurshipclasses, right, and they talk
about that entrepreneurship, butthat is when a man goes on his
own.
But they have a thing calledentrepreneurship where you stay
in the business, yeah, but youuse that innovation and ideas to

(17:33):
help the business.
The business always wants it.
No, I find it's something thatpeople feel threatened.
Sometimes you have to bebecause you're changing the
whole status quo.
You know people just want ideas, but they don't want to change.
So how you could want ideas andnot want to change?

(17:55):
Yeah, and I was sure that'sproblem.
You know they want people withinnovative out of the box, right
, but you're putting them in thebox to stay in the box.
Don't come.
No, no to the box.
Stay in that box.
This is how it has been working, this is how it's gonna go, but
it's not working.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, we do acceptthat.
No, it's not working.
You realize it's not working.
We like the expression of ideas,we like to talk about ideas.

(18:18):
I don't know if we really liketo see ideas become things.
You know, sometimes it's just,and the thing is nobody trying
to show you up, nobody trying to.
You're just trying to getsomething better.
It's to make this thing betterand, oh, my brother, it's a war.
Well, you're in the heart of it.
You're in the heart of the war.
So, as you bring up the idea ofmonetizing and making money out

(18:38):
of the, out of the culture orthe music we are going and start
being a studio.
That's where you first startmaking money.
Right, how you get into astudio to record, you just hang
around and name us out Fromplaying in Walter's School of
Music.
From playing in Walter's Schoolof Music again, I was miserable

(18:59):
.
We were a little band in SanFernando, used to play on the
promenade regular, play a coverband, play pop song, play, you
know, and we found that we wasgood, we feel we was good.
Right, we was a nice littleband, really a nice good
sounding band.
This be before big PA systemand all that kind of thing.
It's amps and right, nicelittle band.

(19:22):
Yeah, somebody, somebody hearus and say, hey, I want to hire
Olya to do a party in Mondiablo.
Right, what, we get a party, goahead, we get a party boy.
The party just happened to beon, I think it's Olya's night in

(19:42):
Mondiablo Right.
And New Year's Day, walterSchool of Music had a running
show that they shoot for TTT,showing the students playing
here comes Santa and jinglebells and whatnot.
Right, the guitar violin.
So they shoot that show inHilton Right Every New Year's

(20:10):
Day and here we have now a partyall night.
I said, no problem, that's cool.
We from the party we go toHilton and to me, I always want
to be a musician who touring,and you're going from gig to gig
, so you're living for that Isay, nice, good, right, mistress
Walters, come down and say youall know we have that shoot.

(20:33):
And da, da, da, da, da.
And I'm like, yeah and no, wecan't do it.
I say what do you mean?
You can't do it?
We leave from there and we gohere.
We hire a taxi, maxi, whatever,and we go here.
Musicians do that all the timeand I'm trying to.
You know, this is now we get in.
That yeah, she said no, no, youcan't do it.

(20:53):
I say I joined this band.
Now I can't be disrespected, ofcourse.
I joined this band to be amusician.
Here I am getting theopportunity to be a musician and
you are telling me, no, no, wecannot do it.
I said, well, thank you, thisis, this is here for me.

(21:15):
I done and I size up and I'dsay, well, I done, I done.
I forget that the amp I play inis not one of them, little
Fender Twin, it's one of thetall six back in the day.
So, hear me, I done, I done.
Let me, curtis, help me carrythis amp up.
You can't stop.

(21:35):
This is the bank again, pick upmy amp on this.
You know, like, sometime I, youknow, like sometimes I say,
curtis, we can't.
Yeah, curtis, remember that.
But I, I left.
I left the band then andimmediately I got a.
Well, while I was with the bandwe did a Rolls Royce gig and

(21:58):
the guys some majors heard me oh, this is sorry, get into the
studio, keep me on track.
So they heard me and they comeand say you know you sound good,
you know you want to come andplay with us.
I said, okay, play with Olefa,with this band.
That's me, I'm with this band,unless something happened.
Alright, and then somethinghappened, yeah, so I ended up in

(22:21):
majors, and in majors they werethe ultimate.
I ended up in majors, and inmajors they were the ultimate
cover band.
They were the Michael Jackson.
Oh gotcha, they had a fro.
I didn't have no fro, I had afrightened fro.
So so we played and thing Iplayed, for I was in majors for
three years.

(22:42):
I met Leston Paul.
Leston used to gig, leston usedto gig with majors.
Thank you, man.
Yeah, every so often, whenevera big show, they pull in Leston
Right, and I bounce up Leston,and you say you, you, you, you
about playing in the studio.
I'm like, no, that's where Iwant to go.
He said, all right, meet me, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so

(23:06):
, so, so, so, mm-hmm, I'm likehuh, so at this time he's a
ranger, he known and all thatListen man Less than was I.
We got his break at 19.
Mm-hmm, doing Duke, yeah, hopsof gold.
He gonna be so young then.
Yeah.
So this is in the studio and Icould play, but I didn't

(23:30):
necessarily read and play Right,and Fortuner is at the point me
through every Bar by bar, barby bar, and repeat yeah, yeah.
And I met him in a funeral.
I met him in O funeral.
I met him in Old Rodney,fortuna, reese.
I met him in Old Rodney'sfuneral.
I said you remember, youremember helping me that first

(23:51):
gig?
No, I said you don't know thatyou changed my life, you don't
know that you changed the soundof Soka music forever too.
I won't go so far, but I mean Icannot fail, of course.
I've seen I won't go so far.
I won't go so far, but I mean Ikind of feel.
Of course.
I've seen situations in thestudio where men could not and
fail.
They say, all right, brother,check me the next time.

(24:11):
You know that kind of way.
I've been in situations where Ifailed already too, and the
embarrassment is so, so big.
You go home and you're anymoney to go back there?
Yeah, so I no, no, no, it's notabout fun or work, right, you
know what I'm saying.
So that was and that's how Igot into the studio.
Yeah, but mind you from beingin the studio now and playing in

(24:35):
the studio it was KH at thetime.
It was KH and went to Choral.
Where were the?
Where were the studio, the?
Where are those studios?
I've been in Sealerts, I'vebeen in the one up in the
mountains, shark.
When they come outside they seemonkeys and what not.
So those are the major studiosSealerts, shark, that one down

(24:56):
is it Ryson Road?
I think I played there once ortwice, can't remember his name,
but Stalin used to record there.
So I've done so.
I've been in the studio and frombeing in that studio and
watching technology, I say I'mgoing to open my own studio now.
And Leston and Eric Michaudroll on the ground laughing at

(25:20):
me when you say that they sayyou effing mother, you go out of
my studio and I turn it,because you know the machine was
a big two inch machine with 24tracks.
That is the standard Tape Taperolling Big.
But here I am, going out of mystudio with a quarter inch tape.

(25:41):
I see Eight tracks, eighttracks alone, right, so the
maths was what it is Eighttracks, eight tracks alone,
right.
So the maths was, you thinkseven tracks, and on the eighth
track you put a sync code and onthat sync code now you could
push to a live sequencer, right,so the sequencer now plays the
drums, the keyboards, whatevercould sequence.
Right, so whatever can sequenceyour recording tape Voice,

(26:05):
guitar, bass, background vocals.
So before you, even before youeven start to record, before you
even start to hear the music,you have to now calculate, yeah,
what would go on the 8 tracks,or 7?
Yeah, 7.
Oh, right.
So you have to now figure out,okay, right, so you had to now

(26:25):
figure out.
Okay, if I do, if I do, um, sixtracks of background vocals and
I bounce it down to two, yourmaths had to be, it had to be
real and it wasn't easy.
Yeah, so for people who.
You're talking physical, nowcut on, yeah, yeah.
So I was just telling my sonthis the other day you're
watching, and he wasn'tunderstanding the cut copy paste
, right, and I said I bring himback to a video of a fellow who

(26:45):
was doing movies and I said whenthem men say cut copy paste,
they mean cut physically.
And when they say on thecutting room floor is a real
thing, you know what I mean.
Back in them days cutting.
Was you cut the tape at theangle triangle, see, so that the
next triangle will seamlessly.
So you're hearing the sound ofthis one into the sound of this

(27:07):
one, so you don't miss.
So you'll cut it and you'lltake that tape and hang it up so
you'll have.
Look the verse here, right,jesus, the chorus.
Okay, and we will.
You know how you used to dothat on cassette and all.
Yeah, do that little tip.

(27:27):
I remember giving.
I remember giving one of myediting blocks to a youngster.
Check this story.
This lady bring her son by meand say my son like this thing
boy.
That's getting emotional when Italk this story.
She like this thing boy.
So see what you could do now.
See, that's bringing him aproblem.
This little rasta boy come.
I say, all right, you like thisthing, all right, just watch

(27:49):
and ask questions.
I was doing the Lamo orsomething at the time because he
remembered the song I didn'tremember and I gave him an
editing block to fool around andwe talking and we laughing and
yeah, nice, and this little boyleft and went abroad to school.
Fast forward 15 years.

(28:11):
I am in St Lucia doing St Luciajazz.
I did St Lucia jazz as a bandfor like about four years
straight.
I used to back up people andstuff and stuff and stuff.
And I got a call while I'm onstage song checking.
Can I Say, hey, who's this?

(28:31):
Deki boy?
I said Deki, all right, what'shappening?
I'm on the stage here on theGrammy stage, collecting a
Grammy, and I said to call youand tell you thanks, like sure,
yeah, who's this?
Okay, cool, nice.
Can I grab me and I start tocall you and tell you thanks,
like sure, yeah, who's this?
Well, okay, cool, eh, nice.
I didn't believe him, I didn't.
I didn't even know who it was,I didn't remember.

(28:57):
Boom, a few months after, thisman comes by me with the Grammy.
He say look, it was you.
I say, boss, take that andcarry it to your mother's house.
What's wrong with you?
Your mother see that every day,of course.
Yeah, she ought to be proud ofthat.
Do you know that that boybecame the number one engineer

(29:21):
in the world?
He was engineering.
He got his break doing theBoy's Mind from Monica and
Brandy.
He engineered Destiny's Child,beyonce, michael Jackson, you
name it.
Yeah, his name is DexterSimmons.
You name it.

(29:46):
Yeah, his name is dextersimmons.
You do not know, when you showsomebody something or tell
somebody something, you don'tknow where that is gonna go.
So you always give them yourbest.
I have some people around mewho does hide and when I say hi,
they would not show you thisand they will not show you that
and they will keep this from mebecause, whatever I just give it

(30:07):
, I just give it.
Yeah, because they are not me,I'm not them, their part is not
mine.
You know if, even if your teethare, that's one walk, you know
I mean.
I mean it's much more.
I will be me, you will be you.
So I will tell you.
Sometimes I'm telling peoplethings, I'm telling my boys

(30:28):
things, hey, and they don't takeme on.
They don't take me on at all,and then come back the next day
and say you know this thing, butisn't that what I told
yesterday?
Yeah, but you didn't say so.
People just get a message whenthey're ready to get it.
Sometimes their brain not ready, they're not ready for it.
So I have.
I am Dexter has been a I don'tknow a mentor of my.

(30:54):
He's my mentor.
I was his mentor back then.
Yeah, you showed him the way.
Yeah, but some things Iremember bringing him down for a
course, a course cost.
The course costed over $90,000.
I was the acting president ofRiot Recording Industry

(31:15):
Association.
I said we have to do thisbecause here we have one of ours
who has made it, whoengineering the global sound,
and we're here fighting up inTrinidad how to make it
international.
So the name of the course wasEngineering the Global Sound,

(31:36):
why they sound like that and whywe sound like this.
And we brought him down.
I didn't know where I wasgetting money from.
I asked the government.
I said we're doing this and itwas in Armour Studio.
We brought him for two weeks.
It's two weeks probably.
Yeah, men flying from St Luciamy son, that was.

(31:59):
I saw my big son, that was.
I saw my big son Casey.
I saw when he nubbed turn.
I hear the switch go clicks andCasey started to see and hear
differently.
You understand, he became atechie.

(32:19):
I mean, he was always in it.
But this man turned a switchand Casey became this guru.
What age you to be done?
You know what I mean 12 to 15,somewhere there, right, I mean
started to discuss frequenciesand discuss things and discuss
things.
That age, whoa Different, whoa,what's happening here?

(32:42):
But this guy, the first thingwe always discuss, you know that
kick drum, why them kick drum,the song, so on, why we just say
and this man show us somethingwith the kick drum, he say I
don't use compression, it's juststraight kick drum.
And everybody's like what.
And when he finished explainingthe thing, my partner from

(33:04):
Solution said Gaston, I'm goinghome.
I said, I said I'm going home.
This is the first thing heexplained to me.
I'm done, I'm going home.
Make him question everythingyou know already.
No, no, the techniques we justdidn't know.
Back in them days there was nointernet to Google.
No, no, no.

(33:25):
So even when you say you'regoing around looking for bands,
only people understand you.
You got to just ask around,show up somewhere.
Yeah, you got to have a band byyourself.
There's no Google, there's nomaps, you just go in.
Yeah, you just figure it out asyou go along.
Listen, I was so enthused bytechnology.
I used to be on bulletin boards.

(33:51):
You know some computer bulletinboards.
The screen was blue and it wasjust text, right, and you used
to hear the dial-up.
You know that.
You know that sound right.
And when at the end of themonth you get a bill for $20,000
.
Them days you're paying forinternet.
By the hour I paid to learn.

(34:13):
All of us, everybody, peoplemust remember that Back in the
days they didn't have magazines,magazines used to be all
internet.
So I used to have guitar player, mix, magazine, subscribe and
once a month kind of thingwhenever they come, because the
stores didn't used to bring itlike regularly, like they would
bring Cosmopolitan and Redbook,yeah, any kind of whatever thing

(34:35):
, like music or tech.
So you always look in, youalways.
You know what I mean.
That's how it was, yeah, butthat you have a defiant spirit.
Kenny the bank manager tell you, put back the thing here.
And what the thing.
Imagine Leston Paul telling youto laugh.
That's something that couldbreak our next mind If somebody
like that say you can't do astudio.
Yeah, some I don't know, mostpeople might say it's true, okay

(34:56):
, okay.
So where's that in you todecide that men laughing, and
you know what you're going to do?
But if I'm feeling it in myspirit, if I've seen it, I'm
feeling it, this could be done,this could be done, I could do
this, who are you to tell me Ican't do it and you'll never do
it?
You never try it, you never do.
Walk them steps.

(35:16):
How you could tell me it can'tbe done.
How you know, well, them steps.
How you could tell me it can'tbe done.
How you know, well, you did itand you fall down and it and I,
I have lived to see less thanhave a home studio, mm-hmm.
When he, after he laughed at meyeah, that's like I, I went, I
told them I'm going to do aradio station playing local

(35:37):
music.
Again, the chairman, or thepresident, chairman, of the
TTPBA, trinidad and TobagoPublishers and Broadcasters,
said to me, quote, unquote youfeel people want to hear that
music?
24, 7, 365?
You have to be a wacko.

(35:58):
I said WACO, okay.
You just waited for somebody totell you that Okay, waco,
w-a-c-o.
We are culture crazy.
So every day, every single day.
I stick it to that man.
Yeah, let him know he's a WACO,waco, living People just call

(36:20):
him hey, know he's a Waco, waco,living people just call hey,
I'm a Waco.
And it has now.
It's a cult, it's a movement,it's a following, it's a our
music thing.
You were here for years.
Yeah, you might say who want tohear that music like?
Yeah, I think the problem is hewas kind of Caucasian to us so

(36:41):
that would have been worse.
Yeah, that was worse.
It hit your spirit.
Yeah, that was one of we.
I said, yeah, my diagnosis, thatmusic about the front ring, the
music I do in my, my whole life.
You are telling me that nobodywant to hear this mm-hmm.
Okay, all right, yeah, yeah,yeah, that's me, okay, evidently

(37:03):
Okay, all right.
And you're proving it to them.
So, going into the spaces likeLeicester, because you're
talking about an era where localmusic was not dominating the
airwaves, if it was played a lotat all You're only making music
that's not being played inmainstream radio.
Yeah, that's all.
You're only making music that'snot being played in mainstream
radio, yeah, so I remember whenit clicked to me that I had to

(37:25):
have a radio station.
I was sitting down in a smallstudio and Kes Kes, kes's mother
, was singing a contemporarysong.
Kes and I used to live likesome streets away if I'm honest,
born in a different town, indifferent towns right,
contemporary song, kes and themused to live like some streets
away.
The problem is, bunny,different talent and different
talents, right.

(37:46):
And she came to sing and shewas singing.
She used to sing like my mother.
My mother used to do them Todream, the impossible dream and
them kind of thing, contemporarysongs, and the lady singing.
I said like wait, sir, where arewe playing this?
Who playing this music?
The lady's singing, good, butwhere they would not accept it.

(38:10):
Is it outlet?
I understand, where can I playthis?
If it was a kai.
So then I would say, would youguess and play Carnival?
Right, if it was a sookai wecould jump up.
But a contemporary and I, I wasdoing it all the time everybody
used to be recording and I'mlike where are we playing this
music?
We gotta find our place, yeah,we gotta make our place, yeah.

(38:31):
So that's what you see plantedfor you from that and I
organized and did a license anddropped it in the the minister
at the time is it publicadministration?
A license and drop it in theminister at the time, is it
public administration?
One of them because they didn'thave a like how they have a
communications or anything, ithad to be public utilities or
something like that was RalphMaraj, okay, and he was my

(38:52):
teacher from Naparimo, oh, okay,okay, okay.
So I feel well, yeah, he's aman of the culture too, he's a
cultural man too.
I went home by him.
Nice man of the culture too,he's a cultural man too.
Went home by him and drop itand I give him it.
I say, right, we inside Oneyear pass, two year pass, five
year pass.

(39:14):
And I say you know, I have anapplication inside.
You know, I think, think, think.
And I was, you know, I was onall kind of committees and
boards and whatnot.
I was doing the wrongs and Irealized doing the wrongs trying
to do things intranet and I wasthe vice president of the court
.
So I know the airplay situation.

(39:35):
I know a dire a bad.
We are under 4% local airplay,intranet Across radio stations,
across all, and it was at a direa bad.
We are under 4% local airplane,train add and all across radio
stations Across all, and it wasat that time.
No, it's 40.
At that time it wasn't 40.
It would have been about itmight have been 12 or somewhere
around there.
40 was our jump Right, right,it went from 12 to 40.

(39:57):
Mm-hmm, or 39, from 12 to 40 or39, actually, right, okay, and
I see, but this thing, yeah, andthen it was 4%.
Even taking Carnival intoconsideration, it still is 4%.
Yeah, right now it still is 4%of all the music played.
It is well, I guess.
Yeah, I guess it is becausedance and hip hop and all them
things we listen, everything Imean, these days are different,

(40:19):
you know, playing the music alittle more, but it still is.
For I suppose it's true becauseI think in urban stations, but
when you think of all the otherstations, all kind of thing,
everything, everything we playin everything we belong to
everybody else but ourselves,you know.
So Back to the story.
Yes, boss, that lady was myfriend.
From being in all those meetingsand stuff, I met a lady who was

(40:43):
working Kent House up Maravalthe roundabout, in a little nook
there there was a governmentministry there.
I know the place.
She calls me and says MrPhillips, are you still
interested in your radio station?
I say, yeah, I'm waiting on acall.
And this is are you stillinterested in your radio station
?
I said, yeah, I'm waiting on acall.
And there he is, I'm waiting ona call.

(41:03):
Well, I just wanted you to know.
I'm looking at a lot of stuffin a dump here.
They're dumping a lot of stuffand your application is in it.
Are you still interested?
I said it's because she knowsme.
I said yeah, nobody ever calledme and said, well, nothing,
they were dumping it.

(41:24):
She picked it up and put itback in.
That is how we get it.
Then I called her sometimerecently, after our radio being
in existence for 15 years.
I called her to tell her thanks, you know, it's because of you,
because that in the dump wouldhave been gone.

(41:44):
That would be the end of that,the end.
And then Joan New Williams,because when we marched the road
for local content and we wantedthem to legislate 50%, okay,
okay, that happened.
They wasn't doing that.
Yeah, she was Minister ofCulture at the time.
She said you know we can't dothe legislation, but what I'll
do, I'll give three of y'alllicenses.

(42:06):
Oh, I see, and she gave me,which was a cradle, iowa, oh, 91
.
At the time it was 91.9,sukaba-schmidt and Solomon, and
he was 91.9.
Yeah, well, .1 or .9,.
Yeah, right, he was 91.1, whichwas before he was 91.1.

(42:27):
Mm-hmm, and we got communitylicenses, meaning I was .16
kilometers from point, so hewasn't supposed to reach Sandow.
I was Sandow.
Nothing was supposed to reachCoover and he was.
The next one was um, right here, um, kirip, right, kirip.

(42:47):
So they used to do communitylicense separate from a national
license.
That was the first set ofcommunity license ever drafted.
But I was just happy to get alicense, right.
I was just happy like, eh,we're inside, and then our
people would be here Well, we'renot here and our people would
be here getting their Warninglicenses.
Every time you look at theother people who had licenses,

(43:08):
it wasn't us, right, yeah, itwasn't us.
It would be French, creole,chinese, of course, all the
Indian stations in India, right,but
none of us.
And what year this is About?
And what year this is aboutwhat time?
Well, my radio station is 20years old, okay, okay, so 20
years ago.
So we start, iwa start first,but Iwa always first, busy, busy

(43:30):
, busy, busy, busy.
And he start and he say Kenny,I can't do this point 14 thing.
Now I go in Iwa, put upreceiver and shy snitter all the
way to tongue.
You go into that community tall, I'm like Iowa, what are you

(43:52):
doing?
They are walking from me, I.
So Iowa was big and bad andgreat, yeah, yeah, yeah me.
I start probably the followingyear in my little space, in my
little 16 kilometers.
I started my antenna on SanFernando Hill, right, whenever
anything break down, I had torun up San Fernando Hill and fix
it Yourself.

(44:12):
Oh boy, was that true?
And you're not even supposed tobe hearing in town.
Right, and Solomon started andhe was doing alternative rock,
anything alternative.
So he wasn't local, local rock,alternative.
Everything was local.
I was local at the time, soka,but I was 91.9, 91.9, 91.9.

(44:43):
Solomon was 92.1.
Remember, he's the communityhere, I was 91.9 and he's all
here.
So the two of them are upin a rango.
I called two of them to ameeting by me, solomon and Iwa,

(45:05):
two of them fighting one another.
I said, hey, look at this, lookat us.
Why are we fighting one another?
And we have a whole, we have abattle to fight out there.
We can't be fighting here.
Let us.
We need to band together untilwe can survive.
Man said we need to bandtogether and
till we can.
He survived and say that manfeel it too big and da, da, da.

(45:26):
And I'm like yo, yo, stopfighting, let me go fight the
battle out there now Mm-hmmCourt and all kind of thing, and
one thing into the next, one isgone and one remains.
Yeah, okay, gotcha, youunderstand, and they won't go
into all that detail.
Yeah, but you're fighting thewrong battles.

(45:46):
These men and them fight in thewrong battles.
You don't need to fight oneanother or they cannot reason
that out.
Yeah, reason that behind thescenes and go again.
Yeah, but it iswhat it is.
So that was the advent of thecommunity and we have since gone
national.
Okay, we're full national.
You officially changed yourlicense, right, but it didn't
make sense because we wentimmediately.

(46:09):
We went online.
So 20 years now we'reonline, we're online.
When TSTT didn't even have thebandwidth for we to go online,
they didn't have nothing.
Bandwidth for me to go online,they didn't have nothing.
There was 512k.
Yeah, remember that You'restreaming and it's like You're
sounding, like you're underwater.

(46:29):
We've beenthrough some days.
I remember a man called us inthe earlys from Iraq.
I said but this is making nosense, why are you blocking me
at 16km?
And a man called me from Iraq.
I said but this is making nosense, why are you blocking me
at 16 kilometers?
And a man coming from Iraq?
It makes no sense.
So the thing changed.
It changed we.

(46:49):
Actually I said this the otherday we could be WAC and I, to
some degree, could be the reasonor the end or the demise of
pirate radio in New York.
So, yeah, they're listening toyou more than anybody else
Because pirate radio they usedto have a geographical span.

(47:12):
You hit a corner here, gone.
Hit a corner there, come back,and you know the FCC was looking
for them, shut down.
You know, I wonder how the FCCfeeling now that men can go
online on the computer?
Yeah, that would have done.
Yeah, they look for other waysfighting only men and things.
But maybe the bandwidth, yeah,but now anybody open up a laptop

(47:35):
, I can open up a laptopnow and broadcast.
Same thing you say about thestudio, because now everybody,
every artist, have a studio.
Their home studio is a manrecording in their car.
Yeah, it's pretty much anywhere.
I did a TV show one time.
I don't even know that, butcalled building the beats
because everybody me with myideas, everybody have a laptop

(47:59):
as a producer, right, of course.
And you go to the producer andthey me with my ideas.
Everybody have a laptop as aproducer, right of course.
And you go to the producer andsay, have a song.
He say no, no, you have to singto this beat.
I said, but that's not aproducer, that's
a beat builder.
So I said, alright, let's do acompetition of beat builders,
okay, and how to teach thesebeat builders to be a producer?
So every week there's achallenge, like the very first

(48:24):
challenge was we give them.
We give them a sample.
We give them a sample of chokas, chuba, dubai, a sample of
sparrow, ude, ude, ude, then hisplumber, what is this?
We give them samples ofeverybody and then build a beat,
chop it up, slice it, dowhatever, but build a beat

(48:47):
incorporating this sample Rightand halfway through the beat we
say, oh, by the way, halfwaythrough the beat, while they're
building, we bring in now theyounger samples, integrate this
younger sample into your beat,and everybody get like bungee
going.
Now they're going.
What was I saying?
You know the younger people.
So that was challenge numberone and the winner of

(49:12):
challenge number one.
The winner of challenge numberone in that episode was Mikkel
Teja.
Serious, look at him now.
He was 14 or 15 years old.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I was talkingto, I think it's Mohamed from
Free Tongue.
Yeah, and I was telling himMikael Teja, them fellas and

(49:34):
them was here before.
When I listened to hisinterpretation also his
interpretation of classicsplenty of people try to
interfere I said in the episodehe was actually with the guitar,
trying to record any guitar onthe laptop.
He didn't have a mic.
I see, I had to see that therewas.

(49:57):
There was a challenge.
There was a challenge in one ofthose, because my idea is to
teach these youngsters is youhave to interpret the person's
music, not put the rhythm andsay
sing to that.
A producer is a producer, not abeat builder.
Right, that was my whole thing.
Right, and I carried them inBagua and Sings.
I say make music from onlywhat's on the shelves of Bagwan

(50:21):
Sings, no guitar, no bass, no,nothing, only what's on the
shelves.
That was the best episode.
Yeah, because listen to that.
The man takes some tiles andsmashes it and recording that
and running through the hardware.
It was good, fun If you hearthe music they produce.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, because itwas unconventional, of course.

(50:42):
Of course you had to check it.
I would say because, now that Ibring that up, the building of
beats and the rhythm thing, likeI keep asking artists about
that and maybe we could hearyour perspective on it.
Because when you build a andyou ask an artist, the vocalist
must have the least flexibilityout of all the instruments,

(51:02):
right?
So you're asking an artist tocome in and write on the bit,
write on it, record and so on.
I wonder if sometimes itconstricts the creativity of the
artistor the other.
The counter argument is that,okay, it makes it a little
easier for some people to getthrough.
It's easy to just, you know,you have boong boong, boong,
boong, boong, boong, boong,boong, boong, boong, boong,

(51:26):
boong, boong, boong boong is themelody or the music or whatever
you know.
Okay, so I have no problem withit.
It's just it's overdonesometimes, right, sometimes I

(51:47):
have too much people on onerhythm.
You know it'snot special anymore.
That special part is the onethat my father and I we always
back and forth with this,because Byron has a signature
style and sound and even lookand all that right, and all the
artists, kitchener, all the menyou work with, superfluous
Marshall, and now you see itwith Teja and them.

(52:10):
I'll admit that they'redifferent.
But I wonder if we went throughan era where everybody kind of
just gets the same, yeah, justso similar.
Yeah, one is because they don'thave most of their own songs.
When you're on a rhythm, you'renot special.
Your song might be good, thenext song not that good, da da,
da, da, um.
And if you, you realize thateverything making it double back

(52:33):
and it's coming back to Kaizo.
Yes, you know, this year, thebig rhythm with um, big rhythm
With Marshall Betme, yeah, oldKaizo, old Kaizo Rhythm, and I
love that.
It's making the circle.
Just now I'll become Relevantagain.
Yeah, I just wantto Relevant again.
I have another question On that.

(52:54):
Builders understand Producers.
What is the arranger?
Because long time you used tohear A lot of people say
Somebody's arranger, and now wehear producer more.
What's the difference?
All right, the arrangeractually scores or directs the
arrangement of the song.
It would be the horns, theguitar.
You know this is the key.
This is the chord structure.

(53:15):
You'll put this progressionhere.
You know you write all themusic.
Only this is when they used towrite music.
You write all the music and youknow people will come in and
read and that's the arranger.
That's what I knowarranger to be.
The producer is a man who usedto be the executive producer
spends the money.
The producer is a man who saysplay it in this style, I want it

(53:39):
in this style, I want it ingospel, I want it in chutney, I
want it to.
You know, he shapes the music.
The arranger scores it.
He can just arrange it and handit to the producer and go, and
you know that You're singingthat in a bad way.
You have to sing it like this.
I like that.
He now shapes the whole thing.
Gotcha Right and what again?
He asks Beat.

(54:00):
The whole thing.
Gotcha right and what again?
He asks beat.
He will understand.
The beat builder, right, yeah,but I understand
no way more.
I used to be a beat builderback in my days.
I used to.
Well, I was a drum machine man,right.
So I used to do drum machinefor a guy called Kenny Wallace
on a ranger and we did allspring garden and fire and inez
and and red plastic bag and yeah, whenever they come in, I used

(54:21):
to be the man on the on the onthe rhythm machine, serious,
yeah, and all the toms and thenI'll play.
Yeah, I was a beat builder, youknow, yeah, yeah, you walk
all the road.
So at that point in time, goingback to your studio experience,
let's say I.

(54:41):
So at that point in time, goingback to your studio experience,
let's say they've been tellingyou what to play, or by that
time you're playing what youfeel.
No, at the beginning they hadto tell me what to play Right,
and it was like I have no idea.
I mean, I have my style Right,but you play like this, play
like that.
But eventually you getcomfortable and you become
you're confident Ah, this songis like this.

(55:02):
It's only if it's totallyagainst what happened, you say
na na na, na na na Do so, so, so, so, so.
But when you develop yourselfyou can just play yeah, yeah,
yeah.
So other little people who youwork with.
But it might be easier to askyou who you ain't work with,
because when I see Kitchenercome, that gave me the things
shocked.
I was like, oh yeah, thiscould have been.
You had to be real youngplaying them things in studio.
I was in the early twenties andfrom then you're playing studio

(55:25):
but they go into tents and playwith a different band and that
kind of thing.
I didn't do the tent thing, soa man had to try to replicate
what you do bassline's, sosignature.
You can't drift from it ifyou're going to play.
You play so much riffs that youcan't play feeling it if you
don't hear that.

(55:45):
You know that I.
You know Iused to be.
I used to be in the band inChandelier and feeling it come
out, and I was the leadguitarist in Chandelier, not the
rhythm guitar, gotcha.
So the rhythm guitar had tofigure that out.
Yes, the rhythm guitar wasrobbing the man, sir.
Oh yeah, it's true, I used tobe in the back grinding Jingle,

(56:07):
jingle, jingle.
It's king time.
Nobody know I play that.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Everyone go think it's robbing.
Listen whenever that thing playthe.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
If you want to think it'srubbish, listen whenever that
thing play.
The crowd go.
And I look at this man boy,this man tip him on my shine.
Boy, that was.

(56:29):
That was good, yeah, yeah, yeah, you, you, you put me in that
I'm going to learn yourstyle after today.
Whenever a song play, I'll belike, okay, yeah, boy, yes, good
, try, good try.
Even this guy did the beginningof High Mass, tony Voz.

(56:53):
Right, yeah, tony Voz.
And up to now people, somepeople can't play that.
They can play something like it, but it's not that.
Yeah, and up to now people,some people can't play that.
They can play something like it, but it's not that.
Yeah, but there's a particularway how to play that riff, for
it to be true, of course youknow, of course, yeah, you come
from Walter's School of Music.
All those riffs should betaught to people in school.

(57:15):
You gotta come good, yeah,that's the song.
You knowwhat I mean.
Like I saw a performanceMarshall was doing somewhere in
New York I'm not sure if it'sthe Madison Square Garden show,
one of them shows.
He was listening to that band.
It wasn't his band, so I'm notsure what the show was, but the
band was playing, too Young toSuck it and he was trying to get
them to play and the band can'tfind it, boy, and I always

(57:38):
remember him saying Ole's a band.
This is iconic music fromiconic artists, and Ole don't
know these phrases.
I wonder how much people knowit now.
Because the thing, even in theproducing and arranging argument
, I could see now, when youdescribe it, why they just use
the word loosely producer forwhoever, because everything
happened on a computer, whereasOle was't got nobody to produce.

(58:02):
I remember Leston.
Leston did I'm Too Young ToSoak, I play guitar on that and
those days the rest are score,the score is there, but the vibe
, the feel, play it like that orplay
it like this.
Give me this kind of strum dothis, do this, while let's do
this, do this.
I'll give my riff in betweenhere.

(58:24):
And you know, shape the music,shape it.
You know you're molding it likeclay so that at the end you
have a hey, you have a nicesculpture here, but now press a
button.
Yeah, cut face.
I saw a guy saying that.
You know, nowadays music ithave no life because you do a
verse and you stick that versein the trumpet.

(58:44):
Repeat, repeat, repeat, samething.
I stand my bass man.
I say yeah, but play whateveryou feel, give me the riff, give
me the riff of what I want, butafter that, play, play, enjoy
it.
I will cut it and move it theway I want, so it mustn't sound
like as though it's justdun, dun, dun.
The man who's scoring the musiccan say Kenny boy can't score

(59:05):
that bass line at all, but it'sall over the place.
I see you here.
Just take the first verse andthat's the basic pattern.
But just for the sound you hearthe first verse already you
want to make was here.
Yes, I'm there.
Oh, that nice, that's thethings you
hold on to.
Yeah, like colin was talking,colin lucas was saying the
stories in music gone missing.
Yeah, and I feel like thestories in the music itself, not

(59:27):
just the lyrics.
Yeah, because so too young tosoak up.
For instance, right, um, youturn out to be iconic song in
the moment.
I know how much you knowbecause he had to be very new
when he come into the studio torecord that.
He's not Marshall Montana thatwe're seeing today.
Right, he's a little boy comingto record a song.
No, he was a little precociouslittle boy.
Oh, yeah, people, you know he'sspecial then.

(59:48):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, serious.
Yeah, he was special, mm-hmm,he and I didn't even
get that story.
No, we hear he called me theother day when he did the.
When he did the not the Madison, not the Apollo, he did his

(01:00:08):
birthday or something, right,right, and he went through all
his music.
So he calls me after that.
It's not in Barclays, noKennedy Center, okay, big
something.
He said hey, boy.
And we used to call one anotherMacarine, right, right.
He used to say I's the Macarineboy, i's the Macarine.

(01:00:29):
So he said Macarine, when weplay that, your song, boy,
people scream, you know.
I said what's that boy?
He said by all means, boy.
When we play that, the peoplego, ah.
He said I didn't know, it hadso much juice in that song and
we laugh, we talk themkind of shit.
But that song I was my shirtused to work with Leston Pelham,

(01:00:55):
the big boys.
Even Frankie McIntosh reallydid used to work with them.
When he came out it was Lestonright, and then you know him and
after Too Young to Soak,rayleigh and Julie had decent
songs, but no mega hit.
Yeah, it took some time.
So he was always saying thatthe Asta records pack up.
You know they just had to printrecords,

(01:01:17):
yeah, I guess.
So when he was he went andstudied studio engineering and
stuff in Ohio.
And he said, when he finishedthe course, he said I got a
placement in a studio in ClubMed which is Bahamas, right,
that's a fantastic place.

(01:01:38):
So like, okay, I go in and Iretire.
And I say what's the trouble isyou talking about?
He's 19 years old.
I can't retire at 19.
You see, but Kenny the um, themoney spending and nothing
happened.
You know what I mean, becauseall them days he was fighting
for airplay.
He didn't have airplay like howhe'd have it for some people.

(01:02:01):
Now he said I've got a hit, mytipi have a hit, you know.
I said, but you went witheverybody.
You never gave me a chance.
I do your Christmas song, socaSanta, I do Soca Santa, I do
the ecstatic medleys.
By that time, soca Santa, youproducing a song, you're doing
it as a producer or just playingProducer, producer, okay.
So I said, well, let me producea song for you.

(01:02:24):
And he told me plain me already, like your style, you know.
I said, well, no problem, youknow, when you challenge me like
that, you know he can't tellyou no, that's a problem.
No, no, I mean I registered, Ilike my style, okay.
So you and me talking aboutshit, mine, you know, we in the

(01:02:46):
kicks.
So I said all right, and westarted looking for songs and
somebody found this song.
People used to bring cassetteswith songs to the place and we
got a song calledBase it Down.
That was the side A, actuallyBasie Dong, and the flip side
was by all means, it is time toparty and we going down and by

(01:03:10):
all means, pa pa, pa, pa, pa, pa, pa, pa, pa pa, you know post
racing, pa pa, pa, pa pa.
And then remember they bringall the puppets.
Listen, go on, go on, go on.
I did Marshall for three yearsstraight.
By all means, left, right back,push, take a Barope back

(01:03:38):
tomorrow.
Right at that time, there Iintroduced them to my son.
That was it.
That was it right.
That was it.
That was it.
I think he did Big Truck theyear after that.
So I did those three years, butthen my little son was in the
free.
How old were you?

(01:03:59):
You would be in Big Truckers,97, I believe.
My little son started producingat 10.
Um, my big, my big son, I sayhe started producing at 10, tc,
and the first production was atIowa.
Iowa, george, Irun the party.
I run the party, I run theparty.
I, I run the party, I run theparty, I run the party.

(01:04:24):
I say I say Iwa Casey going tohandle this session and
everything right, kenny, thatlittle boy, boy, you sure you
can handle it.
I say yeah, yeah, throw him in.
And I throw him in.
But I didn't throw him in.
He was yeah, yeah, yeah, see,he done bad
already, take over.
You know, when he was in Pampas, when we did Jump and Wave,

(01:04:50):
preacher, yeah, he was chuckingand chucking and chucking Right,
and you know, preacher was myson pulled out a plug To make
that stop.
Jesus Christ, nah, nah, serious, listen to me, you know my

(01:05:22):
posture, listen to me, you knowmy posture, listen to me.
Jesus Christ, men, tell me one,that jumping wave is too fast.
You can't play that speed,that's too fast.
I said no, that will never play.
No, no, no, no, two.
You see that stop, it willnever play past that stop, that

(01:05:44):
stop too long.
No, no, two.
You see that stuff, it willnever play past that stuff, that
stuff too long.
I said what?
Just leave me, let me do mything, please.
The rest is history.
Therest is history.
I have pictures of my littleson in Pampas.
In the studio.
I have a picture of my son, mybig son.
Well, the little one is thesame thing, now Worse, I can't

(01:06:05):
get him in the studio right now.
Oh, he's here, he's here, yeah,okay, okay, okay, I tell you,
okay, say about eight roadmaps.
Right, kyle had two Mm-hmm Kyle, yeah, come on, kyle have two
road matches.
So you're saying that's all.
He dominates as a family.
I know all of that fromthe early 80s.
I heard that talk.
I want to be the one to say it.

(01:06:26):
If you're going to say it.
I heard that I don't know ofwhat you're saying because we
have to give people context.
When you say you're giving um,you're letting Casey handle Iowa
and Iowa respond.
That way is because, long time,bum bum time First song I ever
do wasbum bum time.
Oh, as a producer, first song Iever produced in my studio.

(01:06:49):
Listener, I had nothing.
I had a 12 channel board.
I had a sequencer.
I had a Commodore 64.
That was the sequencer,commodore 64.
Mm-hmm, that was the sequencer,right,
commodore 64.
Mm-hmm.
Right had the tape and he hadthe stripe, the track eight,
yeah, and you know, do the maths, mm-hmm and I, when I done do

(01:07:10):
this song, I call Frank Agarath,right, you know Frank Agarath,
yeah, I lost, I don't know whatI'm doing.
We called him for help.
What?
Frank is the kind of guy whowould come, frank, just leave

(01:07:34):
recording on a 72-channel SSLboard, right With two-inch tape,
in a big plantation in Barbados.
You understand Eddie Grant,right, and Frank would come and
sit on my little 12 channelboard.
I like no difference.
No difference in the attitude.

(01:07:54):
The attitude is like, okay,let's go, 12 channel, stupid
board.
And Frank is like, okay, real,professional.
And he mixed that first songfor me.
We had nothing.
The brass was an sonicsynthesizer
and Iwa came.

(01:08:14):
The song was Amita Indian inSouth, running up she mouth.
She said, you know, like man,why me and she long, long for
the caravan in Italy Festival.
That was the song, that was it.
Oh, that's all I heard.
That's all I heard.
I said I want no man, you needmore, you need more, you need
more.
If the boom, boom, big, boom,boom small, we afraid of matter,

(01:08:39):
boom, boom, big, boom, boom,small, I put in my sandal.
Why did I that?
Make the song Listen.
That's why I thought a producerwould do, I'd bring hooks,
bring things.
That's why I knew, and that'swhat I was doing.
I ran into real trouble withthat.
Yeah, real, real trouble.
Some men say you interfere inmy song.

(01:09:02):
Oh, okay, gotcha, but I'm awork, I'm a job.
You know my job is to make Asong a hit.
Find a way To make a song a hitAnyhow.
And that was the first songby that man.
Imagine Carnival TuesdayNewspaper.
I was, george, way ahead In theroad match race.
I said what, yeah, inside what?

(01:09:27):
You gonna talk to me?
You can't talk to me.
But boom Ash Wednesday, dukeand Ellis, sean and on is
collectingthe road match.
I'm like what happened?
Something went wrong.
Yeah, just to again contextit's not on Facebook, no,
nothing.
I had to wait till the nextmorning for paper.

(01:09:48):
I was like it's thunder, ifonly it's not.
I like I remember this song.
When that song in boom boomtime play is only dust in
Skinner Park.
I'm like what happened here?
What really happened?
That is what I understand inthe politics.
Sonny, of course, yeah, iowawas.
What is that?
Iowa, george?
Yeah, I guess at that pointIowa, iowa now coming on the

(01:10:11):
scene too with you.
Yeah, people don't know it wasa song,
nobody knows him.
And we jump up to battle thesong.
I mean, everybody play the song, but you can't, just, you can't
just go and win this.
No, no, no, no, no, you mightnot.
So, yeah, I won Kenny, just so,just
so, just so.
Listen, people used to get ourrecords in the radio station and
treat it as where this comefrom, the guy in South.

(01:10:46):
Granted, we wasn't good, itwasn't that good, right, but it
was good enough, and we wouldn'tknow how good we are unless we
hate, of course.
Oh, okay, we need to do that,we need and always improve.
But no, listen, when I got intothe business, it didn't have.
No, you have to be a Lord, thisor or or you know, like Lord
Laro or Lord Kitchener or or amighty or mighty somebody.
I say no,no, no, no.

(01:11:08):
When I come in there, I wasGeorge Ricky, jai, marshall,
montano, drooper T.
You understand, I put normalnames, I, because you have to go
New York.
You just have to record it andgo New York.
You used to have to record hereand go New York to mix.
That was it.
That was it, you know, put yourtape under your arm and go New
York.

(01:11:28):
I said, nah, I can't affordthat.
I cannot afford that.
We gonna make this thing happenright here.
And I boom, yeah, change thegame.
So I wasat that time.
You just, you know, you knowhim, you're a partner from a
wrong hole.
He just appeared by my houseyeah, so you know you're doing
music.
And he come, yeah, I tell myman doing music and ting, ting,

(01:11:48):
ting, like how you went by thebands, yeah, I look in, I look
in Best of all, that Preacherand Superblue, best of all.
Yeah, preacher and Superblue,that era, just to work to that
Preacher.
Thatwas so special.
I have to tell you I like alittle boy in St James Another
thing I used to argue with Daddy.
I tell him wrong like hell.

(01:12:09):
Every time I argue with him,just like you, tell me about
your sons, but I was telling himbefore we started.
He used to tell he going againand this is 2010 kind of time.
And when you grew up in StJames, you wrote March is not a
nice thing Because you're beatenwith a song oh Lord, over and
over Every trap.
That passed All day.

(01:12:29):
Yeah, and I remember when SuperBlue was doing things like back
in our time and themthings.
It was.
You just heard it here and it'shere and it gets to be a jump
and wave here you say, but youdon't want to hear no jump and
wave.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
But when that preacher come,it's the opening, you know, yeah
, it's the opening.
And it's the same thing I wassaying about feeling it and all
this fascinating.
It's that song, iconic Openings, and I want to do a program on

(01:12:53):
that iconic opening, please,please.
It's like Spice them kind, themkind of thing.
Yeah, they give me the thing,they give me the thing that just
takes you somewhere, themthings will be planned.
You know, sugar bum, bum too.
You know, that's so long.
Just stay in a groove there forso long before you say anything

(01:13:14):
.
Almost a minute and a half,yeah,
of just music.
I can't believe you played ittoo.
Huh, you played it too.
I wasn't.
I'm too, I'm too young for that.
I was making show.
You know what I mean, but Ihave played.
I have played in the kitchen.
Yeah, see, I've circled thatover the years, but you know,
it's one of them too.
Like Johnny here, come insideof this party.
Yeah, the signature of who weare, that beautiful, happy music

(01:13:40):
that we have, you know, thatdoes something to you.
People outside don't understandit, but we, this is our thing,
this is us.
I always feel if we stayauthentic to that, they will
start to understand it.
I feel sometimes when we strayto it to match something else,
well, that was the otherthing with Shorty.
I work with Shorty too.
Right, watch out my children,watch out my children.

(01:14:03):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, I likehow you just say these things in
passing.
I worked with Shorty too.
He had the greatest life.
Let me tell you this story.
This is a good one.
I pick up my whole machine itwas a 16-track machine at the
time Right, big big machine, bigreels.
Pick up that machine, put it inmy car and carry it up to

(01:14:29):
Buck's Calypso tent, down on theforeshore.
Shorty is performing.
So we plug up from the mixingboard and take all the channels
in so I have Shorty'sperformance,
a whole performance.
It wasn't just a one song, butWatch Out my Children was one of
the songs.
Then take back the thing, goback in the studio, go back in
the studio and then we do overthis, we do over that, we do

(01:14:50):
over drum, we do over this, wedo over everything and we build
Watch Out my Children.
Produce that Now.
Shorty.
Produce that Now, shorties arenot that easy man, you know,
when he come in, he consumes theplace.
Presence, yeah, yeah.
So you have to deal with that.
And hey, boom, mix, watch outmy children.
And it it even have it, evenhave, with all the tag and

(01:15:13):
everything, down to the endwhere he was.
People, right, so your boy.
So he's saying I like to tank,I like to tank.
Um, who is the engineer?
Tony, is it?
Tony?
Is his name right, right, right?
And I like to tank this one,I'd like to tank that one.

(01:15:33):
And then he say so, remember, Ipick up my holes too.
I like to thank the man who'sresponsible for me being here
tonight.
Without this man, I wouldn't behere.
So my boy started my maxidriver, matthew Alvordi what,

(01:15:54):
you're right, he would not behere.
Well, you see why I had to comehere, so I could get all the
credit, all the credit that Imissed.
No, he eventually said he'sgoing to reach you tonight
eventually.
It's funny, that was real funny.
Yeah, yeah, yeah,that was good.

(01:16:15):
I was asking you when I wastalking about Shorty too, with
Shorty taking the chances hetook.
You know, they talk about thefounder and creator of Soka,
like the youths.
Now they talk about MountRushmore, who's the foreheads of
Soka, whoa, and they talk abouthim a lot.
Let me hear you, mount Rushmore.
Now what?
No, you want me to tell youabout Shorty,
what he tried.
Shorty was believing of this,this integration of the indo and

(01:16:39):
the african right, the albumsbefore the indrani and the sweet
soka and whatnot he had.
He had done some mad things.
He was singing kaiso, kaiso,kaiso, kaiso, and inside the
kaiso, what you're thinking,shorty, bring a dulac and a
danta inside and a Dantel inside.
He I was at Cloak and Dagger, awhole, a whole album of Kaizo

(01:17:07):
with Dantel and Tolak, right,and everybody saw this man mad,
this man crazy.
And that one hit song, to me,one hit song, came out of it and
it was a chutney, which wouldbe K-Loji Bulbul.
That, because that meshed.
But the rest of them it wascrazy.
It was crazy like what is hedoing?

(01:17:30):
But he was finding something,you know, trying to find his way
until he got to the sweet musicand he enjoyed it.
And he, you understand, becausewhat had got to the sweet music
?
And he enjoy, and he only, yeah, you understand, because what,
what happened, what had happenedwas
what had happened.
Um, when you took those records, our calypso records, to new
york and tried to play it in theclubs, we had no, we had no

(01:17:54):
real.
We had a kick, but we had nosnare.
So we didn't have no.
So it'd be that's the kitesailthen.
So right, so we didn't have no,we didn't have no snare, no
pulse.
That was kitesail.
Yeah, shortywanted a pulse.
Now, mind you, shorty was notthe only man working on kitesail

(01:18:16):
to bring it to Soka at the time.
It had King Wellington, right,it had Frankie McIntosh, it had
Eddie Grant, it had PelhamGoddard and Ed Watson.
A lot of them were doing thework, trying to find the way
Shorty happened to name it.
If you name it, you claim it.
King Wellington was my realpartner.

(01:18:39):
He had it.
It was called Russo Funk, russofunk, sing, russo funk, but not
too hard.
You know what I'm saying.
Yeah, I guess it's catchyenough.
You know Edwardson was doing it.
And if you listen back to theSukkot early Sukkot at that time
they wasn't sure if the Sukkotwas If you're listening to
somebody beat you, you hearthis cowbell going.

(01:19:02):
If that was the soaker, whatwas the soaker in the soaker?
Everybody had their own.
Ed Watson had his groove, yeah,bad groove.
Errol Ashey, yeah, you know,but Shorty named it Right, so he
claimed it and it was S-O-K-A-8.
I remember, yeah, so iteventually now became S-O-C-A,

(01:19:27):
but Shorty named it, yeah,s-o-c-a and solar eclipse, right
, brandingis everything Branding.
He named it so, like, like someof the things that you used to
tell me, I said but you did this, I just put a name to what I
was doing, right, you know, butme, I don't go out there saying
I you're mad, you should.
Because I want to ask you aboutthat, because I was asking you

(01:19:49):
finishing a mount rushmore.
No, I want to have you more.
You want rushmore?
No, I don't have a mount.
Well, who's there for before?
What top?
Yeah, and the facesof soaker creators.
Creators, because what theargument now is when you look at
who they would have put on thewrong mount rushmore in the us,
they have four people, if youcould credit with the greatest

(01:20:10):
soca artists of all time.
And, uh, one of the argumentsis shorty must be there because
he's a creator, and some peoplesay but it?
You could say wellington, youcould say nelson, you could say
so many different.
If you're creators creators ofit, it wouldn't be performers,
it would be creators.
I would put Shorty, I would putKing Wellington, I would put

(01:20:32):
Frankie McIntosh, I willdefinitely put Edwardson and I
would put Pelham Pelham,yeah, I suppose.
So some of you had to scrunchthem up, make them fit.
Yeah, make them.
They were, they were working onit.
Even though some people claimEddie Grant is claimed, you know
, he's always claimed, yeah,he's always claimed.

(01:20:55):
But no, no, because he used tobe here.
He used to be here, he used tobe here a lot and you know,
remember, he had that wholedance party and California style
.
He was in it.
Yeah, that's it.
Yeah, that's it.
Yeah, that's it.
Yeah, that's it.
It's like most of the things,when you talk about Pan, who
could invent Pan?
It's never be one person.

(01:21:17):
Right, men were working onthings in silos.
Spree Simon was the man whoactually make it happen, even
though somebody was doing itthere, and that was amazing.
What them do in their laymanbrains, what Spree Simon and the
next one, anthony Williams, doin a layman brain yeah, just

(01:21:40):
figuring it out as you go, I'mgoing to put this in thoughts.
What, how you figure that out?
Yeah, yeah, yeah, youunderstand, that's not a layman
brain.
That'sa scientific brain.
We underestimate our own people, that's for sure.
You check the last budget, likewhat culture and everything
there?
Did you check the last budget?

(01:22:00):
Like what culture andeverything?
There's really no last one,it's
where it is.
I have this saying that we dothings right.
And if we take you know, we'resupposed to take the watchwords
of the country discipline,tolerance, production as the
watchwords of Trinidad andTobago, right, we need to change

(01:22:22):
them watchwords.
Yeah, we do things in spite ofI need to put it this way In
spite of.
We do things.
It's a handle.
We're going to do it In spiteof all your blockages.
Yeah, we do it.
We're going to make it happen.
We're going to make it happen.
We learned that about you today.
If you're going to make ithappen, we learned that about
you today.
If there's anything anybody'sgoing to take away here, don't
tell Kenny, he can't dosomething.

(01:22:44):
It's a problem.
I want to point to you, too,that when you talk about Chutney
Soaker, I do it and I read itand I listen to it and I want to
say but you create this ChutneySoaker thing.
You say that, not me, okay, um,when in now, mind you, I work
with Sunar Poo, right, I workwith Harry Mahabir, um, they

(01:23:07):
were, they record in the studio,I think.
Right, I work with them, so Iknow them.
Um, drupatiRamgunai, she was.
If Iowa was the first, drupatimight have been the second or
the third hit.
Oh, okay, it would have beenIowa, drupati or Rash Hottieye,

(01:23:28):
then Ricky Jai Show Me Emotionand them kind of things, right
and well, I'm talking about hitsof the year, right, because
Drupati came second in roadmatchups for me.
Oh yeah, I didn't know that Ihave a few seconds, well enough,
oh boy, super Bowl beat me sobad.
The only place Super Bowl beatme is under my foot.
You know it was an ongoingbattle at the time between Eric

(01:23:55):
Grant, eric Grant's studio andSuper Right, and we me preachers
, yeah, you coming down, wecatch them only one year, one
year, unstoppable.
But I came second a few times.
Drupati was second, I think,ricky Jai was second and Ashok
O'Donkey O'Donkey was second.
O'donkey is you too?
You see what I'm saying.
Yeah, have a few seconds, havea few seconds, right, right.

(01:24:19):
So, anyway, we talking aboutwhat were we talking about?
No, we talking about that.
We're talking about Drupal T,right,
so, drupal T.
I used to work in a bank, right, husband used to collect salary
in the bank, right.
So we get to talking and he sayhis wife, she's want to record,

(01:24:44):
he want to record these.
This wasn't chuck me.
It was indian songs, right,indian songs with a soca calypso
beat.
A calypso beat wasn't soca.
Yeah, I said, yeah, problem.
That's why let's do accordingto sprang along.
This is what we does.
It was no problem.
Um, cool.
And we started we work and wedid songs and I had to.
I did the music like I normallydo for calypso or something.

(01:25:05):
It was you do the music forthese Indian songs.
Now Jawa, and we do the wholealbum and thing, thing, thing,
and they put it on the cassetteand nice, that done, good.
Then he come and say will weput English to one of them?
I said because it's all ready,guys.

(01:25:28):
So, yeah, it's all right.
And then there's an Indianradio station, those things
playing on radio and things.
I think they had always anIndian radio station.
Oh, they did Always.
Oh, I didn't know that.
Always, always, or or segments.
Okay, gotcha, right, but theyhad their cassette market,
gotcha, I see they had theirmarket.
Yes, I see.
So, like when you're going inthe market and people, you hear,
yes, okay, right, they hadtheir place.

(01:25:48):
And we say okay, and I callKali, because that's my batch
day, if you're going to write asong, it's me.
And Kali, I said let me go.
So there we go now.
And he actually Pinned thewords Chutney Soaker, it's
Chutney Soaker, it's ChutneySoaker,
it's that way.
I'm a whining, don't so?

(01:26:09):
Wow, is that one?
I don't even remember that.
Wow, so Chutney Soaker.
That was the first time Iheard those words.
Put together Eccle Jacobs, yeah, and we, we went with that.
And it was together EccleJacobs, yeah, and we, we went
with that.
It was a big song.
So theycreated a genre.
I didn't say that, I just askedhim.
I didn't say that I whatever,because I know if I say, yeah,

(01:26:33):
boy, you know, you know, youknow it coming, you know it
coming.
We feel he is, I not saynothing, we really, yes, I'm not
saying nothing.
We just hate to ask, we justhate to clarify.
I tell you what I do.
I don't know who was doing.
You know everybody's doingsomething.
Of course I did what I did, youknow, I mean, and mr b says so
that was coming right after her.
No, well, yeah, actually that'sdoing because she did the album

(01:26:56):
, yeah, and then when she singthat English song, it's like,
okay, let me do it the real part.
You know, cass man, wayneMcDonald, say I have a song.
You know, I say let me go.
It has always been a problem tome Mixing the tasa with

(01:27:23):
the African drums.
They sound good for a fewminutes, a few seconds, and then
this one went to Poland.
That one went to Poland.
It started to make a mishmash.
To keep it together is a hardwork.
It's a hard work.
So doing this was was a was ajob.

(01:27:45):
Yeah, because it's also played.
You know it's gone.
Yeah, it's been takento my production.
Hold it, hold it, hold it, holdit, talk about it, because it
is turned to nutty air and it'sprobably is an indication of the
society and you know, go anydirection.

(01:28:07):
You know who in charge, wholead in.
Yeah, yeah, you know what Imean.
But we held it together andactually the only other person
well, the only two people whoplayed on that was the bass man.
I think the bass man was eitherneil lillock or punky boines

(01:28:31):
and carl and carol, I think,sing chorus, and
that was it.
I think I played everythingelse.
Yeah, I had my guitarsynthesizer so I used to play
like all that line ba da, da, da, da, da, ba da dee, do do boo,

(01:28:53):
do, do do.
It was that kind of shit.
Um, ocarina kind of tone wouldmake it sound East Indian-ish
and you know, that was that was.
That was interesting.
He used to talk about thesethings in that kind of way like
boy, listen, like how.
When I put the clip here, yousee what I mean, right, he just
put these things in passing.
So, ricky, jai, how'd that comeabout?

(01:29:13):
That was sometime.
No, it was the next year.
Oh, that was right after.
That was not.
So, only going into the show inorder to only create a deep
dive in, right, good, rickywould have heard Troopity, and
well then, he talk, it's, thatis the,
that is the.
Of course, ricky came out ofKaiso, written by GB Sumintra

(01:29:39):
ping, ping, ping, ping, ping,ping ping, you know, but that
was Kaisu Sumintra, born in ashocking day.
So but we put the elements.
You know I like to mix theelements.
I love a Dulac or a Tabla in aReggae or a Kaisu.
It's like shorty yeah,beautiful it.

(01:30:00):
It's like shouting yeah,beautiful, it mixes Once it's
overbearing and it starts topull you on.
Did you hear Ricky Giai's songthis year?
Yeah, the Calypso, you do that.
Yeah, who writes it?
Kurt?
Oh, it's Kurt.
Yeah, I wish Kurt was here lastweekend.
I know, I know.
Oh man, that's a bad song.

(01:30:21):
Kurt is a machine.
Bad, bad song.
That's called Kurt Chat GPT.
I seeyou tell Kurt.
I say, boy, a man now comessecond In the thing.
The next time you see him yousay we're going to Loss again.
I say, boy, it's a little lesscool, you get a chance To catch
yourself.
You can't even win acompetition, boy, one little
competition.
You can't say that because yousay you win one road match.

(01:30:43):
But now you confess that it'sreally Casey when you're in a
road match.
No, no, no, the road match, thepicture.
No, casey, casey, it's notCasey pulling out the plug.
No, no, but it's the plug.
The plug is when you're no,that is stuff,
that is stuff.
But the horns, that, yeah, butthat opening, that opening is
one of them.
Listen that, that came from theguitar ding-a-ding, ding-a-ding

(01:31:06):
, ding-a-ding, ding-a-ding.
I see, hey, that bad boy.
And the blades on the horns,yeah, this one.
I'm just talking about thesethings
like they're normal.
So before, before you go backto Ricky, ricky coming the first
song, he now coming out of thegate, yeah, yeah, some intro,
yeah, and that that opening isagain, and the opening line with
some intro born in Ashwaq andDavid and his parents, from

(01:31:27):
India and walking, just soTrinidadian it's.
Oh man, they paint the picture.
Chibi is a yeah, chibi is afantastic writer.
He's, he's, he's have a number.
Yeah, yeah, good, all right,he's something else with
writing.
Yeah, yeah.
And then Ricky and them wentand do a video on San Francisco.
Yeah, that was Alison Ayers andRicky Jai, yeah, and the girl,

(01:31:50):
um, there was, just that wasbefore it's time doing that kind
of video on that kind of thing.
I Before it's Time, yeah, youknow.
And then after that, ricky didShow Me a Motion, yeah, boy,
yeah, and that was a cartoon.
Oh, yeah, it's true, it's trueBefore it's Time.
Yeah, I guess Ricky was doingthat kind of thing Long before,

(01:32:11):
yeah, long before.
So you continued over themtimes contributing to it.
Can you have a hard-out to it?
Because people who arerecording now Trinidad playing
Jamaica today, as I start withright, and I know you had to go,
and so, yeah, yeah, you alsotell me you play Road to Italy
for Superblue.
Yeah, we produced that.
That was.
Alice Nails came with that songand Superblue was the man

(01:32:32):
Dribble Dongli.
Yeah, like Colin was talking,more football dance.
They had football dance.
They had Road to Italy,lancelot laying the wood.
Yeah, a lot, a lot.
Yeah, hoping we were real.
What went on with that?
Like Soca Warriors with Maximusand them 2006.
Even before that, as a matterof fact, we did a lot of songs,
yeah, songs.
You know you look at theelection just going how much

(01:32:54):
songs they had for this party.
We do songs.
We do songs to support and topush Right.
You know, like I did, there wasa year in the election I did
every party theme song PNM, ner,nnv I can't remember what UNC

(01:33:18):
was calledat the time.
Whatever it was called, I did asong Right and I used to.
I did a song Right and I usedto sit down and watch it.
That's funny.
No, sit back and watch yourwork.
Yeah, I can imagine.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, nice,oh, what could I do this year?
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
So plenty of government.
Get.
Bring them right in all yourroom.

(01:33:38):
That is so true.
That is government.
Get, bring them right in onlyroom.
That is so true.
That is so true.
I mean people might think, oh,you're being egotistical, but
it'strue.
The song.
They start the ball rollinglike there was a time.
Shouldn't give this story,should not give this story.
How could say this?
There was a time a particularcalypso came with a parang.

(01:34:00):
How could say this?
There was a time Mm-hmm, aparticular Calypsoanian Mm-hmm,
came with a parang and his sonwas saying hello, john Yule, I
keep calling you like a foolMm-hmm, but since, since all the
wind, you change all thenumbers, I can't find all the
Mm-hmm right.
And the Calypsonian was astaunch, staunch, staunch PNM

(01:34:23):
and he's complaining on PNM,saying that they've left me.
I was there with youand they're gone.
And the well I know, june, juneNewlillings, was responsible
for me having my radio license,so I know her.
So I would call her and sayTanti Joan, I'm going to have a

(01:34:45):
song here.
It's singing.
I think you need to talk tothis man Because if this song
come out and it was a year whenthe party wasn't looking so good
and the election didn't call,yet it was to call and she say
send him to me, send him to me,ding, ding, ding, ding ding and

(01:35:05):
she pay off that song and killthat song right in the post.
Serious, yeah,because it happens.
The songs, the music does it.
It start See Kurt's song thisyear that start the movement.
You know, I was telling himthat and I like how it reference
.
For instance, you say you callEric Duffy, you call Chambers

(01:35:28):
Duncey, that's them songs.
Chambers Duncey, he never, hejust stay Duncey.
Actually he wasn't Duncey, no,he wasn't.
But did we make him Duncey?
Of course yeah, there, we makeit on C.
Of course yeah.
There are a lot of things Likethey say somebody's a rumble and
they drink, and that is thepicture we paint on C and it
stays.
Of course it stays, it stays,so the

(01:35:50):
song does it.
That's why I like what Oli'sdoing with the Curto's Talking
Body series.
He's doing with coming up withtopics and coming.
He do that puck thing last timewith Donald Trump and that just
keep unfolding, like that storygetting worse every week with
his attitude towards me.
Just keep going bad, bad, bad.
And even when I look back atsome of the monarchs, like

(01:36:11):
Krookroo in particular when hedid common entrance, corruption,
common entrance, it's like thesociety know how to pay
attention to what the thing is.
But you've seen that beforewe see it.
You remember there was a genrewe interfere with that we call
political parang.
Yeah, I want a wedding, a doglawedding.

(01:36:35):
Yeah, remember that that wascrew crew, some parang we do,
but that's our next genrecreator again.
And you also create ragasukatoo.
I just accident me, girl.
I know that the first ragasuka,to your recollection, is what.

(01:36:56):
The first ragasuka, actual thefirst raga suka, went in
actually to be raga suka was apreacher called Wine Up Right,
but they had raga in a calypso.
That became a kind of raga suka.
It wasIowa as well.

(01:37:17):
The flip side of the boom boomtime was time hard.
Yeah, hold tight when you'reselling cigarettes on the rungs
about, don't ever forget them.
Like daddy always used to tellme when he was playing in
Ketchum and he said Iowa camewith that.
He said that was the song hedid to.
That was the A side.
No, he said that was the A side.
Boom boom time was B side.

(01:37:38):
Yeah, remember, back in themdays, them kind of speed, and
that kind of thing wasn't thenorm.
You know, mm-hmm, he was.
There was a kaiso, you know.
Oh, we too.
You have to work a littleharder and we bring in Papa
Percy what's he chant?
Man, the Rudy chant, yeah, yeah, I used to like how they chant

(01:37:58):
back then too.
Yeah, that chanting, we pullthat for a while.
Yeah, so I'm talking about it'scalled ragga because there are
ragga man chanting in the songon the kaiso or the soka or
whatever.
So, alright, so he created thattoo with a question mark at
the end, right.
So he tells, he tells Iow, withthat tune, hand out the shit,

(01:38:19):
music and thing on the plate andkitchen them.
Say alright, you're inside,kitchen.
Pretend.
They say this is men, sayyou're inside and then he sort
of hand out thing and these mensay, well, what you doing?
You're inside already and thatturn out to be boom, boom time.
Yeah, but boom boom time cameup after fast, real fast.
Even though they tell us thisain't gonna work.
Well, they can't tell you thatwe established that that could

(01:38:44):
be a problem.
Can use plenty of things we hadto talk about with WAC too.
We need a next day to talkabout it, we need a whole next
day to talk about now and thatwhole, because you had said in
person about the protesting forlocal music.
Can we talk a little bit moreabout that?
What was the organization?
That was RIAT, the RecordingIndustry Association of Trenton,
tobago, right?
Well, I tell you, it's under 4%.

(01:39:06):
And yet everybody working,everybody in studio, everybody
doing music, it's only 4%playing, right.
So we say, well, we needlegislation, because everywhere
else has Canada has, you know,canada has 50% legislation.
Australia, everybody legislatesto protect their industry.
Trinidad is one of the onlyplaces to have it.

(01:39:27):
Even America has legislation.
They don't need it but theyhave it.
Well, we have legislation toprotect some industries, some,
not the rightones, but some.
So we decided we protested, doa march it was a march about
three times.
We do a march from WoodfordSquare, right, and I ended up
being the acting president atthe time, so I charge.

(01:39:49):
So we marched down WoodfordSquare and we come back up by
legal affairs and drop off aletter, say you know, request,
and then we say we're going downby the number one radio station
in the country, down the roadand going down St James Way and
we're going to deliver theletter by 96.1.
To this big march I'm talkingabout big, they write song on

(01:40:13):
the spot and they're singing andvibes.
We're down the road.
We're going to deliver thisletter.
So I am in charge, I have todeliver the letter and I feel in
honor.
All right, I am the army.
When it's time to hand deliverthe letter, I feel in my army,

(01:40:36):
with me.
You're right here, you'restrong, you could talk to me,
you could talk to me and I walkin to deliver this letter.
Letter, and I started to feellight.
I look back, the arm is stilland I alone, I alone, went by

(01:40:58):
the security guard and had thisletter.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
I said feeling.
Well, you know, hey, brother,let me
tell you this.
I was subsequently banned offof that radio station, any
musical Number one radio stationin the country, the radio
station that makes the hits.
Yeah, for the youths too.

(01:41:18):
That was the spot it was so badPreacher came to me.
No, this is after I went roadmarching, right, okay, after I
went road marching, banned, andnobody say we banning you.
You know, you just banblacklist, blacklist.
But I, I was always a rebel andalways don't forget to open my

(01:41:41):
mouth and say what I say.
So I had to survive throughthat period.
This is it's like I'm a taxidriver and, you see, you cannot
drive on the road.
You know, sir, how you gonna.
This is like I'm a taxi driverand you see, you cannot drive on
the road.
You know what I'm saying.
How are you going to do?
You have to find a way and Ifound a way.
I used to produce for KMC AllSoul on Fire and all them kind

(01:42:02):
of things KMC was, I used to bethe engineer.
All the KMC hits, all the BrandNew Old Bear man, all them
things.
That's Maximus, yeah, maximus,that was a KMC rhythm.
Alright, it's true, it's true,all them things, all them things
, all them things.
And that's how we survived.
But life is funny.

(01:42:24):
Life is so funny.
I have lived to see the daywhere people who banned me come
to my radio station for airplay.
Yeah, look at that.
And I'm like, yeah, it's nottrue.
No, yeah, you, I can't do thesame.
I can't do the same thing.
If I do the same thing, I'll bejust as, of course, yeah, just

(01:42:45):
like them.
Yeah, yeah,yeah, yeah, yeah.
And then work out, but fastforward into today again before
we wrap up.
You responsible for when youtalk about Ricky J.
I said before you come hereKarina, shake all.
So you still responsible for alot of these songs that would go
into the Calypso arena.
Calypso and Kaizo yeah, well, Iused to do Kaizo.
I am not a soccer man.

(01:43:05):
No, my sons is a soccer man.
Right, I is the soccer man.
Mm-hmm.
Right, I cannot do that.
What I'm doing there, yeah, youknow, can't do it.
I will do songs, I will dosongs.
I will dosongs For me.
Right now in my life, I need todo something that has meaning
and has sense, and you know somore than likely.
I'm not saying that they don'thave enough.
You know, right, casey and Kyleyeah, man, they will come here

(01:43:32):
at some point.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I will sendyou the clash, the clash between
me and them, a song of that badalready.
Listen, oh man, listen.
That was amazing At that time,kyle only had two songs, but he
did yeah, he'scoming with bombs.
Yeah, he has bombs now.
So, yeah, so that's what I was.
But you, yeah, you say you'recoming with bombs, yeah, you're
bombs now.
So, um, so, yes, what I wastelling him before we went down

(01:43:55):
there um, the Calypso, I will,we will find songs for people
and actually produce, like, ifwe see you a good artist, and
then we say, hey, we have a songfor you, okay, and we produce
you and we take a percentage ofthe winnings if you, if you win,
we take a position.
If you don't win, we all lose.
I see, right.
So, like for this season goinghere, we had about six people in

(01:44:15):
the six or seven, six people inthe semis and three people in
the finals.
Ah Right, the six in the semiswere Pharaoh Twiggy, Kareem Asha
no, sorry, kareem Spascal, notKareem Asha Kareem Sp Pascal,
kurt Allen, ricky Jai andsomebody else I can't remember.

(01:44:38):
I can't remember the name.
Somebody else.
And from that going to thefinals, we had Kurt, ricky and
Tricky.
So when we home I get into oneanother on social media, let's
do all the songs.
So when we home, again with oneanother on social media, let's
do all the songand we fight.
No, the song is the song.
You know what I mean?
I find there's a research on itin the last few years.
I was talking to Kurt aboutthat too.

(01:44:58):
Yeah, there is Same thing inthe rhythms and the effects.
The calypso has done this andthe soca has done this, mm-hmm
merging into the calypso.
In fact, I have a sessiontonight with some soaker
men doing horns.
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, we missthat boy.
Yeah, we miss nobody.
Bring it back now.
Yeah, you hear it a lot thisyear, this year, last year.

(01:45:19):
You start to see the change.
Yeah, but horns does it,horns does it.
Yeah, yeah, there was a pointin time that the Baj in the
production that he wasn't doingit.
They just slowed down the musicand sweetened up the music, but
we was going back to the hellspeed, yeah, yeah, yeah, it went
a different way.
Yeah, but the tent was suchlike the backbone of the

(01:45:40):
competitions at the PoisonZymocity Tent.
Yeah, is it something you feelwe could see come back to life?
Yeah, but it had tohave some changes.
The tent can't operate how itoperates now as long as songs
that and too muchpartner-partner singing anything
.
You know, when you sing, I goin the bathroom.
No, everybody who sings has tohave a killer song.

(01:46:00):
Right, I have 20 years serviceand I say no Qualify.
You know we belittle it by putyou in an easy treasure or
putting no qualify with a goodsong and let people get good
entertainment.
Yeah, don't bring down the show.
You know, I wish I had my waywhere I could fire some of them.

(01:46:23):
Yeah, because some of them needfire so they could go back home
and work, come again.
It's hard part now is to go tothe tents, the they could go
back home and work, Come again.
It's hard.
Apart Now, we still go to thetents, the auditions and stuff
and watch and say, wait, that'sa good idea.
You know, if you only finishthat song, the man singing so
yeah, no, I like the art form.
Right, I love a great calypsoand sometimes you have a good

(01:46:45):
idea and it's so.
They didn't finish it and someof them can't take.
Hey, what, who's you?
Who's you?
Okay, you know what I mean.
Yeah, finish your song.
That song, that's a great idea.
Finish your song,yeah, you know.
You know, mary Ashby wastalking about that a little bit
when he was here.

(01:47:06):
He was saying that because youcould do everything home,
they're not going through thefilter, people like yourself.
Yeah, they could tell you, andyour whole family tell you that
good boy.
What do you mean if your familywould tell you you're a big
artist, that good boy, all right, good, and when you get bottled
up you're like nobody will tellme.
Everybody say you're good, ofcourse, brother, brother, listen

(01:47:27):
, I want to see that game later.
I don't watch it by use, Idon't like to watch it.
Yeah, watch it, but listen,this was a pleasure.
This was a pleasure.
I feel like we only touched thetip of the iceberg when you
realized Iwas toting feelings.
I said this man is interviewingeverybody and he called me boy.
What can I tell you?
Ask Conrad, I said Conrad.
Boy, tell me.
I said boy, kenny Phillips, Iwonder if he'll come up the road

(01:47:50):
.
Boy, he said Kenny, welcome,whatever, I'll be here.
That's what he told me.
That's what he told myunderestimated fellow space.
Herethey have everybody.
I came to look at this space.
I said let's see what I couldteach.
And then the chief you knowwhat I mean.
No, I like how he developedsomething from nothing.

(01:48:10):
Yeah, you understand, thank you.
Well, yeah, okay, I ain't comehere for you to be giving me all
these credits and thing thing.
You'll be.
No, you'll be no.
Pom-pom gilder, what do youmean?
That's me the first timesomebody told me Kenny Phillips,
play, because I know the namein salt radio and all them
things and I know he has aproducer and them kind of thing.
But somebody's telling me Imust see Daddy.

(01:48:31):
He said but you know who playedthat thing.
It's Kenny who played thatthing.
I say,I say what?
And from then, one of theblessings I find we have today
is when you go on YouTube,sometimes people just put up the
record.
So on the record you could seewho you know Lou Lyons from.
Very well, he, he's read themrecords and that's why I tell

(01:48:52):
you, I'm unprepared Guys watchLou all the time, all his
episodes.
I told him, I tell him we haveto talk About this thing.
I like what you're doing,please.
Yeah, that would be great.
The problem is, you see, likeyou, you went far back.
Some men, let's go from whenthey know.
Yeah, let's go from where theyknow.
You know they had to go realdeep.
He going deep.
And that's where I end up introuble, because I just watching

(01:49:13):
the episode last week and hesay and Kenny Phillips play the
guitar.
I said what?
And I think it was a muchansong.
He's a guitar freak, he's aguitar jumbie.
So he's asking me, like youknow what guitar you use and
where we talk guitar talk.
You know what I mean?
I was telling this story withwhat's his name, niall Rogers.
It was such an important storyto me.

(01:49:34):
Just tell it.
Now.
You're here.
I know you're going now.
Yeah,I'm going now.
When I went up to New York andof course I went looking for
equipment and I was looking forsomething from a guitar song.
I always want my song to be asong, a sound, right.
So I go into some action thingand I look I see an Ibanez Ultra
Harmonizer which would dosomething, something.
So I say ah boy, and I reachfor the Ultra Harmonizer.

(01:49:57):
And I'm on, reach for the UltraHarmonizer Same time with me.
I'm like yo man, you say okay,go ahead, man.
You go ahead.
And I look up Nile Rodgers fromChic.
You see you buying that.
I say yeah, you say I'm comingfor that too, man.
Isay right, man.
And I realize we, because inthem days they didn't have no

(01:50:19):
internet, no, so you used to diein a magazine.
You had to work that out inyour brain.
So we worked that out, thatthis is going to do this.
You wouldn't have even heard it.
You just know this is what youwanted to do, this is the
motivation you want and that wasthe sound on feeling it, that

(01:50:39):
effect that should be taught inschools.
Now.
Anybody learning guitar shouldlearn that.
I will put that past you.
And Nile Rodgers has some ofthe most iconic guitar guitar
and Diana Ross I'm coming out.
Yeah, when you hear the two youcould see, ah, something
happened, something happened,yeah.
But, brother, thanks, I'm gladyou
made the trek.
The time was short.

(01:50:59):
I'm going to check my list andmake sure there's nothing else
to ask.
That's all I'm going to ask.
I think I did.
I have a random question foryou.
We could pay it in or not?
Merchant you playing them too?
That Build a Nation together?
No, playing that guitar Build aNation was Junior Warwood.
In fact, junior Warwoodproduced that.
I should have figured that shitout.
That real bad.
You know that.

(01:51:19):
Junior Warwood and Tony Vozier,yeah, responsible for me to get
some licks in school.
What do you mean?
Let me tell you something.
Last story, and I'm going.
Yeah, don tell you something.
Last story, I'm not going.
Yeah, don't keep mehere no longer.
I was in Naprema College Mm-hmm.
Naprema College by the hospital, right, right there, mm-hmm.
The promenade is right there.
They used to have bandstandcalypso, right, calypso on the

(01:51:44):
bands, on the police band.
Mm-hmm.
Tony playing.
Junior Ward was playing.
So them boys in school, hey,band on the bandstand, kaiso,
da da da.
We gone Lunchtime.
We run down there and end upnow holding on to the railings.
The people come and consume theplace and we did tambu singing

(01:52:05):
and this one singing and thatone singing, I quote Kaiso.
But time gone, lunchtime goneand Kaizo playing.
We can't leave.
We proud to take, we can't comeout and we watching the time
going down andsomeone is busting.

(01:52:26):
When they're done now say allright, make the trek back up the
hill a whole bag away.
You know what, going up thehill in naps, and the dean comes
and says you all line up there,every man jack line up.
And there was so much of themyou couldn't really distribute

(01:52:48):
the amount of licks you wantedto.
So all he do is come.
So pow, pow, pow, pow, pow, pow.
Everybody got double everybody.
I like that.
I got licks, boy, I got licksokay.
So, boy, I'm glad you continuetaking licks.
We appreciate the licks you'retaking us with.
I could come now and say youshape a whole era and then make

(01:53:09):
Sun Tzu shape a whole era.
I could pull a lifting out ofthis.
I know what I'd do.
This was fun, though we laughed.
Outro Music.

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Episode 235 | Kenny Phillips

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Episode 235 | Kenny Phillips