Beyond the Basket: The Secret Ingredient to Building a Regenerative Community with Wen-Jay Ying
Episode Description:
“It's having a genuine interest in your consumers, not just a transactional experience— That is the best way to build community.” —Wen-Jay Ying
Building a thriving community takes more than just a shared interest— it requires genuine connections, a sense of belonging, and a shared vision for a better future. In an age of impersonal online interactions, the power of face-to-face relationships and supporting local businesses has never been more important. Discover how one entrepreneur is redefining the way we think about community through the lens of food.
Wen-Jay Ying is the founder and CEO of Local Roots, a community-driven and minority-owned company in New York City. With over 14 years of experience in the local food movement, Wen-Jay continues to innovate and find new ways to connect people to their food sources.
Tune in as Justine and Wen-Jay share insights on traditional and online marketing strategies, operational models, the evolution of the local food movement, overcoming common entrepreneurial challenges, reflections on closing the business, and building community and customer relationships.
Meet Wen-Jay:
Wen-Jay Ying is the founder and CEO of Local Roots, a community-driven and minority-owned company in New York City. Wen-Jay started Local Roots in 2011 with the goal of making high-quality local and organic ingredients more accessible and convenient for New Yorkers. Under her leadership, Local Roots has grown into a trusted source for seasonal, regeneratively-grown produce and other local food products.
Wen-Jay is passionate about education, transparency, and empowering consumers to make better food choices. With over 14 years of experience in the local food movement, Wen-Jay continues to innovate and find new ways to connect people to their food sources.
Connect with NextGen Purpose:
Episode Highlights:
01:51 Local Roots: Modernized CSA
04:15 Initial Marketing a Community Building
09:26 Operational Model and Customer Experience
14:37 The Evolution of the Local Food Movement
18:11 Overcoming Financial, Structural, and Operational Challenges
25:01 The Emotional Process of Closing a Business
32:03 Tips on Building a Community
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Justine Reichman: (00:12):
Good morning, and welcome to Essential
Ingredients. I'm your host,Justine Reichman. With me today
is Wen-Jay. She is the Founderand CEO of Local Roots in New
York City. Local Roots is acommunity driven and minority
owned company building, amovement towards supporting a
(00:33):
regenerative community. We're sopleased to have you here.
Wen-Jay, welcome.
Wen-Jay Ying: (00:38):
I love that introduction. I feel like it's
the most concise that someone'sgiven me.
Justine Reichman: (00:42):
Thank you. I appreciate that. I actually ask
guests to introduce themselvesbecause I like to hear what
guests have to say, but I wantto give people the 360 view. So
as we dip into the conversationso they know what we're talking
about, and we can continue byasking you more in depth
(01:03):
questions to go deeper and learnmore about your company, and why
you started it. What's changed?How you're pivoting, if you're
pivoting? And what people canexpect for the future? Because I
know that businesses, when westart them as an entrepreneur,
we have to be open to change.And I think it's really
important to share those storiesand talk about how the
(01:26):
environment, the world,education supports us to create
change for the better. And to beable to say that we didn't
succeed at what we were doing,it's not that it wasn't right.
It was right in that moment. Butnow, we've learned more. I'm
excited to hear your story,We.-Jay, so tell me about Local
(01:46):
Roots, and what inspired you tolaunch that?
Wen-Jay Ying: (01:51):
So I started Local Roots in 2011. It has been
for the past nearly 14 years,essentially like a modernized
CSA. So that stands forCommunity Supported Agriculture.
People don't know that it'sessentially like a subscription
based farmers market. And mygoal was really to make the
(02:11):
access in New York to the bestquality ingredients from local
farms easier, more convenient,more fun, more playful. At that
time in 2011, this was not athing people did, really. There
was a very small niche of peoplethat went to the Farmers
Market's or joined CSA's. And meas someone who did not look like
(02:35):
most people that were in thoseareas in that community, it was
also important for me to showpeople like, if you want to eat
well, healthy, organic andlocal, it doesn't matter what
you look like. So that's how Istarted. That's why I started
Local Roots, essentially. Andessentially, it was also because
that's my dream job, which wasto create CSAs for my life for a
(02:59):
living, denying this anywhere inthe world. And the only way I
could have my dream job wasessentially just to make it my
own, and start my own business.So that's really where and why I
started my company. And itwasn't really an idea to start a
business. I knew that I wantedto be a small business instead
(03:21):
of a nonprofit. And the reasonfor that was I had been at a
nonprofit previously throughAmeriCorps. And through a
nonprofit, the process is likea little slower. I think you
have to go through the board,you have to get things approved
a lot more. And for me, I liketo make quick change. So to me,
(03:42):
it was important to be a smallbusiness, and also not depend
completely on donors and grants.So that's why I chose a small
business as a nonprofit. Buteven though I had an LLC name
and filed as an LLC, I reallydidn't process that. It was a
business until four years in.And even now, it's kind of funny
(04:02):
to think about because I'm not abusiness person to consider this
a business. It really does feellike a movement that needs to
make money to keep it funded.
Justine Reichman: (04:15):
And when you started this, it sounds like you
didn't see people that lookedlike yourself. It wasn't
available, and it was somethingthat you really wanted to create
on a personal level. And whatwas your process in terms of
going out there to see how thisidea resonated with other folks?
What was the feedback you got?
Wen-Jay Ying: (04:35):
I didn't do any surveys like that. I didn't even
think about it, honestly. Ididn't think like, are people
gonna like this? I didn't oncequestioned it. It was like you
said, I wanted access to betterquality food. I wanted New
Yorkers that had better accessto quality food. There weren't
enough people that looked likeme that felt comfortable in
(04:56):
those spaces at the time.There's a quote that David Chang
had said in a book. And also thehe also, I think, read through
Steve Martin quote was that, ifI knew how hard it was going to
be, I never would have done it.So I didn't really put that much
thought into it in thebeginning. I just did it because
I wanted to do it. And also, Iwas really missing community. I
(05:18):
was playing in a lot ofunderground music scenes, and
that's where my community wasbuilt in New York City. And when
gentrification happened, a lotof those establishments that
hosted these underground musicconcerts closed down. I didn't
have community, so it really wassomething I was just very
intrinsically and innately drawnto. I was also at an age where I
felt like I had, I was 25 think.Like all the time in the world.
(05:42):
I didn't think about it. Butwhat I did was I started my LLC,
came up with a business namewith some friends and very
grassroots. I put flyerseverywhere. And it wasn't like,
are you interested in this? Itwas like, we're open for
business. Join the CSA. I putflyers up every single day for
years throughout theneighborhoods. I would have my
(06:03):
friend who worked at her office,like she would print out
hundreds of flyers from me forfree so I didn't pay for
anything. The only thing I waspaying for was tape in my time.
And I learned that from playingin a band, if you want to
promote your music, again, thisis really hard to imagine
because of how intense socialmedia is now. But back then,
(06:25):
which wasn't that long ago.2011, you literally advertised
your band's show with the flyer,right? Or maybe like a MySpace
post, but that was pretty muchit. So that's the only way I
knew how to advertise, andthat's really the only way to
advertise outside. Like puttinga newspaper ad out.
Justine Reichman: (06:46):
It seems like those days of putting up flyers
almost seems like a distantmemory in this moment in time
with everything that's going onwith social media. How does that
translate today? Does it stillwork this way? Or have you had
to evolve with social mediataking such a large presence?
Wen-Jay Ying: (07:06):
Yeah, I really think flyers is like a lost art
form. I still love going to acafe and looking at the
Community Board. Because it doesmake it feel more of a community
when you see this person'sadvertising piano lessons, this
person who can walk your dog. Sowe still do flyers. I still
think they're important, becauseI think people are tired of
(07:27):
seeing things on their phone.And it's just like another way
of seeing something. I'vehonestly never been big into
ADS. I don't really know if thelittle money I would put into
would actually be effective. Somaybe have made like one
Instagram ad in 14 years. Imaybe have boosted a post like
(07:50):
five times, and I put like 20bucks into it. I think the way
that I use social media isreally just like education. So
it's like, this is what thisvegetable looks like, and this
is what it tastes like. Orhere's how to cook this thing.
Or this is what your farm lookslike. Or here's on my own
personal page. It's very muchlike, here's this food topic
that when I tell you about it,it'll help you feel more
(08:13):
connected to your food, orcreate more transparency around
the products at the grocerystore that you're looking at. So
I use social media as a way ofeducation. Which, I think is
also a tool of marketing in theend.
Justine Reichman: (08:26):
And a really dig now. People are choosing to
educate, as opposed to dotraditional advertising.
Wen-Jay Ying: (08:35):
Yeah. And the problem with that, though, is I
don't know how much researchpeople do before they educate
people. There's so muchmisinformation on the internet
that it dilutes the people whoare really trying to have an
authentic voice. And that, Ithink, is dangerous thing.
Instagram, I think, when itfirst started was an amazing
tool for small businesses. Now,I actually don't think it's
(08:57):
effective. I don't know, I thinkit creates a world where people
value the instant gratificationof an Instagram post versus the
quality of a product or service.And that, I think, creates a
downfall of small businesses orbusinesses in general.
Justine Reichman: (09:14):
Yeah. So now, with that being said, would you
say that education is at theforefront of your marketing
initiatives as a way to educate,sell and develop community?
Wen-Jay Ying: (09:27):
It is. And I don't know if that's technically
from a business standpoint, themost effective way. But being
seen as a company that peoplecan trust, and people viewing me
as an expert in my field is veryimportant to me, because I don't
ever cut corners for money. Iwill always be authentic to the
(09:51):
kinds of farms we work with, theways that we speak with our
customers. So that reputation isreally important to me. And that
education, to me, is veryconnected to that reputation.
And in the end, again, not themost business savvy part of what
I do. But in the end, I sell aproduct that feels kind of weird
(10:12):
to charge people floodingbefore. Theoretically, everyone
should have access to reallyhigh quality, local, clean,
regeneratively growningredients. The government
should make it a way for that tobe free. That will never happen.
In that moralistic value of whatI believe it, I'd rather have
people have the knowledge andthe education around how to make
(10:33):
better food choices. Even ifit's not buying products from
Local Roots, especially becausewe are hyper local. We only
serve the New York Citydemographic region. I think it
does a disservice to the worldif someone from California or
Seattle doesn't have thatknowledge just because they're
not a consumer of ours.
Justine Reichman: (10:55):
How far out do you go to the farmer? So
what's the radius to which youwork within?
Wen-Jay Ying: (11:00):
Usually within two hours of New York.
Justine Reichman: (11:02):
And so when people order these boxes, I
would imagine, is it seasonal?
Wen-Jay Ying: (11:08):
It goes all year round, and everything's based on
the seasons.
Justine Reichman: (11:14):
Do people know what they're getting? Is it
a surprise? Can you choose howcustomizable are they?
Wen-Jay Ying: (11:21):
It's kind of like a hybrid. So meaning, you can
customize the categories offood. Meaning like, vegetables,
mushrooms, fruit. But you can'tcustomize what you're getting in
that selection. So if it'svegetables, I'm going to be
curating. I'm the one thatpersonally curates what five
items you're getting from thefarm that week, and which kind
(11:42):
of mushrooms you're getting thatweek. But I know that I put a
lot of thought into how tocurate that for people.
Justine Reichman: (11:48):
How do you choose those five items? What
are your benchmarks, or yourparameters for making that
choice?
Wen-Jay Ying: (11:55):
I think about it as from the standpoint of a home
cook in New York. So can thisfit in my fridge? Because we
have small fridges and kitchensin New York, and then a balance
of things like fruit,vegetables, leafy greens,
alliums like onions and garlic,and color, because different
colors have different nutrientsin it. So if we can diversify
(12:15):
the colors that we're giving,purple carrots to obviously like
rainbow swiss chard, you're alsoable to provide something that's
more nutritious to the consumer.
Justine Reichman: (12:25):
And so are people ordering this weekly,
biweekly, bimonthly?
Wen-Jay Ying: (12:31):
People get their Local Roots harvest box every
single week, and they can put iton hold whenever they want. New
Yorkers often traveling. Or ifthey're super busy at work, they
can put their order on hold,which is a great thing. Because
with the original CSA model, onerestriction is that it is a
(12:51):
commitment, and there's no wayto put that thing on hold. So if
you can't pick up your CSA box,you usually just have a neighbor
pick it up for you, and you justdonate it is one of those two
options. But this gives peoplemore flexibility in terms of
that subscription model.
Justine Reichman: (13:06):
How accessible are they to pick up?
It's not delivery, you'resaying. So it's not going to end
up at my apartment on 60 WallStreet or whatever?
Wen-Jay Ying: (13:17):
It could. So if you were a consumer, you go
through our website, you selectwhich kind of Harvest Club box
you want. I want veggies andfruit. I want veggies fruit and
mushrooms. And then you cancheck out opting either home
delivery or pickup. So homedelivery, there is a charge.
We're not in Amazon. Peopleshould remember that we are
small business. We're not goingto do free delivery. That's not
actually economical for anysmall business. It's also
(13:39):
economical for Amazon. They'rejust losing a lot of money
intentionally for that. Or youcan do pickup where it's just
free. We have a couple pickuplocations in different bars and
cafes throughout New York City.So say that you would go to the
local coffee shop you partnerwith, and you'd pick up your box
there. The reason why we partnerwith neighborhood bars and cafes
(14:00):
is, one, support those smallbusinesses, but it's also to
create a different experience ingrocery shopping. So instead of,
I used to have a CSA, I pickedup at a church. But you can't
really talk to people at achurch because you have to
church. You feel like you haveto be quiet. So I wanted to be
the place that was already asocial setting for people that
was part of their weeklylifestyle, and that's where you
(14:23):
can pick up your food. And thenwe also sometimes offer recipes.
So we'll give you ideas of whatto cook, or I handle the
Instagram. So if you're like,what is this thing? I don't know
how to use it. I'll message youback some ideas.
Justine Reichman: (14:37):
So as you were building this business,
when you first kicked it off,you said CSAs were not really a
thing there. It was not quitethe same as it is today. How
have you seen the industry grow,and your role in it?
Wen-Jay Ying: (14:51):
Yeah. Just to clarify. CSAs were introduced to
New York City or introduced toAmerica, I think, in
Massachusetts where they firstcame to. Massachusetts in the
80's, and so we have had CSAs inNew York for a while. It's more
that it used to be very much asubculture. There weren't as
many people that were likeyounger or even minorities being
(15:16):
feeling, I think, approachablein those situations in those
communities. But local andorganic was not really a thing.
Meaning, you couldn't just go tothe grocery store and find these
products there. There wasn't aWhole Foods in every borough.
That's when it was not owned byAmazon. So buying local
(15:42):
ingredients by thinking aboutorganic was not as commonplace
in people's mind. And it'sreally crazy. I was talking to a
friend about this yesterday whoI know through like the local
food world, and we were justtalking about how much he was
reminding me of how much it haschanged, and how different it
was when I started this. Andwhich is the reason why I didn't
started my company, and how Iprobably had a hand in change of
(16:07):
the industry. I'm not someonevery much to have an ego or brag
about what I have accomplished.But all I know is that this was
not a thing people, like mostpeople, thought about, and now
it is right. We've had thousandsof thtousands of customers come
through local roots. All thosepeople were essentially, like
(16:32):
some of them, their firstintroduction to the worlds of
local food, many of them knowwhat the word regenerative is
because I talk about it all thetime. A lot of the education I
have, I've had customers for 14years, every single week as
customers, and they're like, oh,yeah. I remember when you talked
about making a veggie scrapbroth six years ago. And I still
(16:53):
do that. I remember a friendthat worked at a large fashion
brand telling me, we were in ameeting and we had a mood board
of how we want the brand to befor next year. And Local Roots
is actually up there, part ofthe mood board.
Justine Reichman: (17:06):
Wow, that's amazing.
Wen-Jay Ying: (17:08):
Which is amazing to hear. I was like, are you
sure that was me? But yeah, Ithink it is cool to think about
how my mission to make this morecommon place has been
accomplished after 14 years. Andit's this weird. It's just kind
Justine Reichman: (17:20):
What role do you think Farmers Market's play
of funny catch playing too. Youhelped grow the movement. Part
of me is like, it's not justselling the organic, local food,
right? It's also making it fun.It's making it sexy. It's like
making it playful, where it ispart of your social life. And
(17:42):
now I think organic and local islike that. And yeah, it's like
you create the world where it'smore mainstream, but that also
means you're essentiallycreating your own competitors.
We're in a place where I don'twant to have to compete with a
Whole Foods, which isimpossible. So it's kind of like
(18:03):
this ironic situation of beingone of the first game changers
in an industry of where itplaces you in that.
for you as a business?
Wen-Jay Ying: (18:20):
I love Farmers Market's. I think I view our
businesses to actually to be so,I think they complement each
other. Meaning, a lot of farmerswill diversify the way they sell
their vegetables or food.Farmers Market's are great
because you can have that directconnection with your own
consumers. Every single week,normally. But in a Farmers
(18:43):
Market situation, if it'sraining that day, no one shows
up, and then you have all foodwaste. Or people will still
select the things they want, andthey probably always pick the
most familiar things. And so ifyou have a massive crop of like
rutabaga, and most people don'tknow how to cook rutabaga New
York, you're going to be wastinga lot of that product. So I view
(19:08):
Farmers Market's, and it's kindof funny because I view them
being convenient in differentways. So a Farmers Market is
very convenient in the sense of,you can pick what you want, you
have a larger selection offarmers to talk to. You have a
larger window usually from themorning until whatever, 3:00 pm.
With Local Roots and the CSAmodel, the reason why I think
(19:30):
it's convenient is thatsomeone's hand curating it for
you so you don't just thinkabout what you're going to buy.
I like that as it diverse, it'sdifferent items every single
week so it forces you todiversify your nutrients and
what you're cooking every singleweek. I cook things based of
what's in season. I never cookthings based as a recipe. I'll
never go buy a vegetable justfor my recipe. It's like, all
(19:54):
right, I have these items in myfridge from the farmers, I want
to make something with this. Ifind that to me to be more
convenient the way I cook. Andit is within your schedule.
You're not having to take thesubway to go to the Farmers
Market. I can go two blocks downto my bar, grab a drink with a
friend, and also pick up myvegetables, fruits, meats and my
(20:17):
cheese. And also, I'm not at allthrowing shade to Farmers
Market. It is just good to thinkabout how not every vendor at a
Farmers Market is organic, or is100 and grass fed. There's a lot
of different kinds of growingpractices happening at the
Farmers Market. So unless you'redoing your own research, and
(20:38):
unless you know what to lookfor, it's just more effort, I
think, versus I spend so muchtime for Local Roots finding
farmers that really hit thehighest sustainability growing
practices on a farm.
Justine Reichman: (20:52):
If you look at other cities, New York is
unique, right? Because you wantto stay within your area when
you're going grocery shopping. Idon't want to schlep all the way
to the Upper East Side to go getsomething, or the Upper West
Side. It take you like an hour,right? You got to carry it in a
bag. I remember having ashopping cart, but that was only
to go a block or two. Youremember those little carts for
(21:15):
your groceries? And I thinkabout where I live today. I live
in Marin County where there is aFarmers Market every single day
of the week in one of the townshere, locally. Which is not
something that every county has.Unusual success. And I remember
living in New York where I wouldgo to the Union Square Market,
(21:35):
because I live near UnionSquare, and I would pick up my
things that I had my vendors,and that I would do the rest
from, oh, my god, Fresh Direct.I'm like, going back a while.
But you didn't have that sameconnection with the farmers and
the ranchers that you do, oreven the connection like you're
providing. And it doesn't giveyou the way to focus on locally
(22:01):
sourced, locally grown products.I remember it really just being
about whatever I wanted to eat,I would make because it's always
available. But I think thisreally supports a more
regenerative, organic, localculture. I think you really did
have a hand in building that inNew York area. Because I moved
(22:21):
out here, and it was like secondnature. But back then when I
lived in New York, it was kindof Farmers Market's, there's one
on the Upper West Side, therewas one in Union Square. They
were there. They weren't there,kind of thing. And I really
think the movement and thecommunity has really connected
with what you and others havebrought to the community, and
(22:42):
allowed us to change thenarrative, and really empower
people to make more informedchoices.
Wen-Jay Ying: (22:47):
Yeah. I appreciate you saying that. When
you're talking about that, I wasthinking about, when I keep
talking about people gettingproducts that they wouldn't
Justine Reichman: (22:54):
I'd like to go back to the community that
normally pick out, like therutabaga, it's not just that
it's better for you nutrition todiversify what you're eating.
It's better nutritionally forthe farm also. So if a farmer
knows that, like regenerative,organic, local vegetables, part
of growing those growing patchesmeans that they have diverse
(23:15):
crops growing on a farm. Thedifferent kinds of vegetables,
varieties, the different kindsof root systems will all affect
and enhance the soil nutrition,which makes your vegetable more
nutritious and more flavorful.Now imagine if you have to grow
diverse vegetables and crops,but you can't sell half them
because they're just notpopular. Then you're wasting so
(23:37):
much money. But in the world ofa CSA, you're able to educate
and introduce people to thesevarieties that help a farm, and
you would never have a thing tobuy it yourself. But then you're
like, oh, my god, I loveromanesco. This is the coolest
vegetable. I love rutabaga, it'slike a potato. And I do have a
lot of customers in thebeginning that were really like,
(24:00):
this reminds me so much. I'm sohappy you guys exist in New
York. I just moved here. Thisreminds me so much of
California, upstate New York,Europe, and I can't find
you've built, and maybe if youcould give us like three things,
anything else like this in NewYork. And I think that is really
cool. And now that we do homedelivery, it is literally like
you don't have to even leaveyour door, and you get
three ideas for those founderstuning in that would really be
(24:21):
everything sent to you. And Iused to live in North Hollywood,
and there was a Farmers Marketthere, but it just didn't have a
large, different Farmers Market.The Union Square is massive, and
you can go to a small, like twovendors. And if they don't have
the growing practices you want,or they don't have the most
flavorful products, I wouldalways drive to either the one
(24:44):
in Santa Monica or the one inHollywood because it was a lot
bigger, and they had amazingfarmers there. So yes,
sometimes, more isn't alwaysbetter. It is, more is better in
terms of access. More FarmersMarket is easier to get to, but
doesn't always mean thequalities is the same.
(25:13):
useful for them as they'retrying to build their community.
Because building community isreally challenging, and you've
done such a great job. So if youcould just maybe share a few
things?
Wen-Jay Ying: (25:26):
There's really no formula for building community.
And if you think about it justin the sense of, I need to build
community to have a goodbusiness. It's just never gonna
work. It's a very slow process.But a lot of people, I think,
were loyal customers, and areloyal customers to me for 14
years every week. And I think alot of that is the connection
(25:48):
they have to me. It's like, Isupport this business, because I
support the business owner. Andthat really comes down to like,
for the first 10 years or so, Iwas at every Local Roots pickup.
Meaning that I created everysingle customer every single
week in every neighborhood wewere in. In every single borough
(26:10):
we were in when we first starteddoing home deliveries, I was the
one to deliver them so I knoweveryone's scheduled in terms of
like, when they're coming backfrom. If they're gonna open the
door and like they're in theiryoga pants because they just
came back from yoga class, orthey just came back from work.
And it really is just likethinking about your consumers as
your friends. Checking in onthem, remembering things like,
(26:34):
how is that worth meeting youhad last week? We were talking
about it. It's just having agenuine interest in your
consumers, and it's not thistransactional experience. And
that, to me, is the best way tobuild community. I think just
having your space there.
Justine Reichman: (26:51):
Because it becomes personal then, right? I
like you. I want to support you.I like your choices. I like how
you educate me. I like theproducts you bring. I think it's
the intersection of you and yourproducts, and where they come
together because they've nowbecome to trust you for picking
the right things, and givingthem the information, and
(27:12):
establishing a rapport. Now itfeels like it's attainable, and
you're accessible, as is thefood. The winning combination,
right? So as we look forward,because that was like the last
13 years, where are you todaywith the business? And what are
you looking to do as you see theindustry changing?
Wen-Jay Ying: (27:35):
The industry has changed so much. Not just the
food industry and organicindustry, but the industry is
just being, a business haschanged so much that I am moving
away from that farm box CSAprogram we've been doing for 14
years. And it feels as if we'realmost closing the company down
(27:55):
and then letting it regrow tosomething else. So there's
definitely a lot of transitionhappening at Local Roots. But
the ones that always stay thesame is that focus on whatever
I'm doing. Whatever Local Rootsis doing is always going to be
focused around connecting peoplecloser to their food, creating
more transparency around food,and really empowering people and
(28:17):
getting them excited about alocal food system.
Justine Reichman: (28:20):
What impact did you to make this change to
close that down and now look fora new way to evolve?
Wen-Jay Ying: (28:28):
A more thorough answer is on my Instagram, but I
will mention a couple thingsfrom that post I made on
Instagram. One thing is theoverhead and expenses. Post
Justine Reichman: (28:38):
Is this a hard decision for you to make?
pandemic are just so high. Ihave survived so many things as
a business owner. From day one,we had Hurricane Irene hit
upstate New York, which hit alot of farmers. There's always
something big to get over. Wehustled and worked our asses off
(29:01):
during the pandemic, which wasthe hardest time as a business.
And a very hard time asessential workers also, and we
survived that. And then postpandemic is a world that a lot
of people probably can'tunderstand, that it's how
different it is. Unless you'reprobably a business owner,
everything is higher. Insurancerates are higher, obviously
(29:23):
rental increases. That's to beexpected. All these things keep
adding up. The city keeps addingmore different kinds of taxes,
whatever they can throw at you.All of that is just like,
obviously, one, it's not evenfinancially viable anymore for
me. But also it's like, I don'teven want to deal with those
(29:46):
things anymore. I have tried.I've had to overcome so many
challenges in 14 years that I'mjust exhausted with it. And if I
can achieve my goal of, likeeducating people more about
their food and their foodsystems, and I can do it in a
way that isn't so operationallyheavy. That's what I'm trying to
do. The kind of work I domaintains so much. It's just so
(30:10):
much everything. You're managingcars, doing deliveries, and a
million things can go wrong. Ina route in New York, you're
dealing with a very largeexpensive walking cooler, and
your warehouse, lots of staff.And I want to do things in a way
that's a little easier now thatI'm getting older and I don't
feel like working every singleday. I think it's expected for
(30:34):
business owners to always haveto go into work on the day off,
or be all the time. I don'tthink that's really fair, and I
don't think that has to happen.I don't want to live a lifestyle
where that's expected for meanymore. I did that for so long,
I don't enjoy it anymore. Ididn't mind it for the first 10
(30:55):
years. Now I'm like, NO, I getto also have a day off. So
that's a huge part. And the waysthat I and the consumers
interact with the product isreally different. Now also, we
used to have these super DieHard Local Food People who love
learning about the farmers. Andthere was more, I think,
(31:17):
understanding and compassionaround the local food system.
And I'm not saying that all mynew customers are like this past
post pandemic, but there is adifferent. I think the Amazons
of the world have really changedwhat consumers expect. I was
like trying to reference beforefree delivery where you can
deliver product almost anywherein this country overnight is now
(31:38):
Effectively, this is your baby.You've grown it for 14 years,
what we all expect. But it's notsomething realistic for most
businesses to do, but we'reexpected to do that.
and you developed it. Was ithard for me to make that call?
Wen-Jay Ying: (32:03):
Yeah. I think I write about this because there's
a lot of stages of closing downa company emotionally. There's
the acceptance of it, and thedeep sadness. It's not just a
business to me or even like apassion. And it was my life. I
have such a strong connection tothose customers and to our
(32:25):
farmers. So I had a period of,once I decided to do this, I was
very, very sad and nostalgic. Ispent so much energy and time
building this, and it'ssomething I'm so proud of. It's
such a special thing to be ableto do something like this. I've
realized that I created my ownfood system, which sounds crazy.
Who else gets to create theirown food system? It's insane. So
(32:48):
I had the sadness feeling. I hada different kind of sadness
like, oh, my God. Am I afailure? Did I not do a good
job? And the reason why we'reclosing is because I couldn't
figure it out, will I be good inanything? What am I gonna do
now? And then there's thefeelings of, wait, I'm a badass
because I did all this stuff andthat was really hard. And people
(33:10):
don't realize how hard it is,and they probably will never
realize how hard it is. And thenthere's also feelings now of
excitement. Everything has atime and place. You're saying
when I started this, that Istarted because this didn't
exist anywhere in the world.This kind of business and this
kind of job. And now that I'veestablished that, and now that I
have so much more knowledge inthis field, now I can take all
(33:32):
that and move on to somethingelse, and innovate and create
something else new. And that isalso what I'm excited about. The
idea of constantly innovatingnot just myself, but also
innovating the industry, isexciting to me. So, yeah,
there's a lot of like,everything.
Justine Reichman: (33:53):
It's a hard decision to close down a company
that you've worked so hard formany years, and you've innovated
and inspired, and people havegrown to rely on. So for those
founders, I always like to askfor researchers, or innovators,
or people out there that havebeen running something for years
(34:14):
and are toying with, should Icontinue? Or how do I know when
the right time to pivot or moveon? What tips might you give
them? Maybe you could throw outthree tips of things that they
could look for.
Wen-Jay Ying: (34:27):
Don't let your ego come into it. I think a lot
of people hold on to theirbusinesses because of pride, or
they just don't want to thinkthat they just didn't do a good
job at something. If it's notserving you and you're not happy
doing it anymore, there's nopoint of doing it. You just
close it. And I think it's alsoimportant to think about like,
(34:50):
what skill sets you have gainedand enhanced through this job,
through your business? Becausethere is a world where you, some
people are okay working forsomeone else. Like, I'm not sure
if I'm the best at that. Butyeah, not everyone is. But some
business owners are really goodat that, and actually don't like
(35:11):
the pressure of making everysingle decision for themselves.
So you just make a list of like,okay, these are all the tasks
that I would do in a day, and Imust be pretty good at them if a
whole business was operatingwith me doing them. And that's a
really a great way to find yournext part of life. And that
makes them more okay to closedown your company of knowing
that there is another careerpath for yourself. And I guess
(35:36):
the third point is, I reallylooked to closed my business
down as I really looked at theoutline, the blueprint of what
mattered the most to me. I wouldsay that I don't need to be
having the business where I'mordering the food, talking to
the farmers, packing the food,delivering the food, doing the
customer service. I'm literallystill the one doing a lot of the
(35:58):
deliveries. I'm still doing alot of those things. I'm doing
the social media. If my goal inthe end, if my largest large
means zoom out the most. My goalis, I want people to have the
knowledge, or have a better wayto get to have higher quality
food. That's very wordy. Butwhat is another way I can do
(36:20):
that is a little easier, that isa little cheaper, that can
operate a little smoother thatdoesn't have a million different
moving parts? So I think you canstill find joy in closing down
your business. Maybe startingsomething new. Maybe can be a
little easier, and you're stillserving your mission. But it
(36:42):
doesn't have to be specificallyin the same exact way you were
doing it.
Justine Reichman: (36:46):
That makes sense. Did you think about
selling the business?
Wen-Jay Ying: (36:51):
I literally just don't know how to do that.
Justine Reichman: (36:54):
Okay. Well, maybe there's somebody listening
today that hears your story, andmaybe you can share some
insights. So we can ask ourguests and our listeners, that
if you guys have any idea ondirection to share with Wen-Jay
about how to sell her business,how could they reach out to you?
Wen-Jay Ying: (37:10):
It would be great if they reached out to me on
LinkedIn .Or better yet,actually an Instagram. It's my
first and last name, so it'sW-E-N-J-A-Y-Y-I-N-G. And yeah, I
would love to hear people'sstories about selling their
business, because it is 14 yearsof building this up. I would
(37:31):
like to hear stories about howto monetize that 14 years of
experience in ways that areethical too, right? Because my
customers are very important tome, and I would never want to
lose that trust in them.
Justine Reichman: (37:46):
Awesome. Wen-Jay, thank you so much for
tuning in today and for sharingyour stories. And we'll continue
to follow you as you pivot,change and continue to educate
and support your community.
Wen-Jay Ying: (37:58):
Thank you, and thank you for wearing a mogul
with pink color.
Justine Reichman: (38:02):
I do my best. I didn't imagine. I want to
thank our guests for tuning intoday. We have our episodes here
every Tuesday. They are newevery week. If you're watching
us on a videogram, you'reprobably watching us on YouTube,
but do know that you can listento us on a podcast, wherever you
listen to podcasts, at EssentialIngredients. Don't forget to
(38:23):
follow us on Instagram to hearclips and insights from our
guests about what is coming upnext. Our Instagram handle is
@essential.ingredients. See younext week. Bye, bye.
Good morning, and welcome to Essential
Ingredients. I'm your host,Justine Reichman. With me today
is Wen-Jay. She is the Founderand CEO of Local Roots in New
York City. Local Roots is acommunity driven and minority
owned company building, amovement towards supporting a
(00:33):
regenerative community. We're sopleased to have you here.
Wen-Jay, welcome.
Wen-Jay Ying: (00:38):
I love that introduction. I feel like it's
the most concise that someone'sgiven me.
Justine Reichman: (00:42):
Thank you. I appreciate that. I actually ask
guests to introduce themselvesbecause I like to hear what
guests have to say, but I wantto give people the 360 view. So
as we dip into the conversationso they know what we're talking
about, and we can continue byasking you more in depth
(01:03):
questions to go deeper and learnmore about your company, and why
you started it. What's changed?How you're pivoting, if you're
pivoting? And what people canexpect for the future? Because I
know that businesses, when westart them as an entrepreneur,
we have to be open to change.And I think it's really
important to share those storiesand talk about how the
(01:26):
environment, the world,education supports us to create
change for the better. And to beable to say that we didn't
succeed at what we were doing,it's not that it wasn't right.
It was right in that moment. Butnow, we've learned more. I'm
excited to hear your story,We.-Jay, so tell me about Local
(01:46):
Roots, and what inspired you tolaunch that?
Wen-Jay Ying: (01:51):
So I started Local Roots in 2011. It has been
for the past nearly 14 years,essentially like a modernized
CSA. So that stands forCommunity Supported Agriculture.
People don't know that it'sessentially like a subscription
based farmers market. And mygoal was really to make the
(02:11):
access in New York to the bestquality ingredients from local
farms easier, more convenient,more fun, more playful. At that
time in 2011, this was not athing people did, really. There
was a very small niche of peoplethat went to the Farmers
Market's or joined CSA's. And meas someone who did not look like
(02:35):
most people that were in thoseareas in that community, it was
also important for me to showpeople like, if you want to eat
well, healthy, organic andlocal, it doesn't matter what
you look like. So that's how Istarted. That's why I started
Local Roots, essentially. Andessentially, it was also because
that's my dream job, which wasto create CSAs for my life for a
(02:59):
living, denying this anywhere inthe world. And the only way I
could have my dream job wasessentially just to make it my
own, and start my own business.So that's really where and why I
started my company. And itwasn't really an idea to start a
business. I knew that I wantedto be a small business instead
(03:21):
of a nonprofit. And the reasonfor that was I had been at a
nonprofit previously throughAmeriCorps. And through a
nonprofit, the process is likea little slower. I think you
have to go through the board,you have to get things approved
a lot more. And for me, I liketo make quick change. So to me,
(03:42):
it was important to be a smallbusiness, and also not depend
completely on donors and grants.So that's why I chose a small
business as a nonprofit. Buteven though I had an LLC name
and filed as an LLC, I reallydidn't process that. It was a
business until four years in.And even now, it's kind of funny
(04:02):
to think about because I'm not abusiness person to consider this
a business. It really does feellike a movement that needs to
make money to keep it funded.
Justine Reichman: (04:15):
And when you started this, it sounds like you
didn't see people that lookedlike yourself. It wasn't
available, and it was somethingthat you really wanted to create
on a personal level. And whatwas your process in terms of
going out there to see how thisidea resonated with other folks?
What was the feedback you got?
Wen-Jay Ying: (04:35):
I didn't do any surveys like that. I didn't even
think about it, honestly. Ididn't think like, are people
gonna like this? I didn't oncequestioned it. It was like you
said, I wanted access to betterquality food. I wanted New
Yorkers that had better accessto quality food. There weren't
enough people that looked likeme that felt comfortable in
(04:56):
those spaces at the time.There's a quote that David Chang
had said in a book. And also thehe also, I think, read through
Steve Martin quote was that, ifI knew how hard it was going to
be, I never would have done it.So I didn't really put that much
thought into it in thebeginning. I just did it because
I wanted to do it. And also, Iwas really missing community. I
(05:18):
was playing in a lot ofunderground music scenes, and
that's where my community wasbuilt in New York City. And when
gentrification happened, a lotof those establishments that
hosted these underground musicconcerts closed down. I didn't
have community, so it really wassomething I was just very
intrinsically and innately drawnto. I was also at an age where I
felt like I had, I was 25 think.Like all the time in the world.
(05:42):
I didn't think about it. Butwhat I did was I started my LLC,
came up with a business namewith some friends and very
grassroots. I put flyerseverywhere. And it wasn't like,
are you interested in this? Itwas like, we're open for
business. Join the CSA. I putflyers up every single day for
years throughout theneighborhoods. I would have my
(06:03):
friend who worked at her office,like she would print out
hundreds of flyers from me forfree so I didn't pay for
anything. The only thing I waspaying for was tape in my time.
And I learned that from playingin a band, if you want to
promote your music, again, thisis really hard to imagine
because of how intense socialmedia is now. But back then,
(06:25):
which wasn't that long ago.2011, you literally advertised
your band's show with the flyer,right? Or maybe like a MySpace
post, but that was pretty muchit. So that's the only way I
knew how to advertise, andthat's really the only way to
advertise outside. Like puttinga newspaper ad out.
Justine Reichman: (06:46):
It seems like those days of putting up flyers
almost seems like a distantmemory in this moment in time
with everything that's going onwith social media. How does that
translate today? Does it stillwork this way? Or have you had
to evolve with social mediataking such a large presence?
Wen-Jay Ying: (07:06):
Yeah, I really think flyers is like a lost art
form. I still love going to acafe and looking at the
Community Board. Because it doesmake it feel more of a community
when you see this person'sadvertising piano lessons, this
person who can walk your dog. Sowe still do flyers. I still
think they're important, becauseI think people are tired of
(07:27):
seeing things on their phone.And it's just like another way
of seeing something. I'vehonestly never been big into
ADS. I don't really know if thelittle money I would put into
would actually be effective. Somaybe have made like one
Instagram ad in 14 years. Imaybe have boosted a post like
(07:50):
five times, and I put like 20bucks into it. I think the way
that I use social media isreally just like education. So
it's like, this is what thisvegetable looks like, and this
is what it tastes like. Orhere's how to cook this thing.
Or this is what your farm lookslike. Or here's on my own
personal page. It's very muchlike, here's this food topic
that when I tell you about it,it'll help you feel more
(08:13):
connected to your food, orcreate more transparency around
the products at the grocerystore that you're looking at. So
I use social media as a way ofeducation. Which, I think is
also a tool of marketing in theend.
Justine Reichman: (08:26):
And a really dig now. People are choosing to
educate, as opposed to dotraditional advertising.
Wen-Jay Ying: (08:35):
Yeah. And the problem with that, though, is I
don't know how much researchpeople do before they educate
people. There's so muchmisinformation on the internet
that it dilutes the people whoare really trying to have an
authentic voice. And that, Ithink, is dangerous thing.
Instagram, I think, when itfirst started was an amazing
tool for small businesses. Now,I actually don't think it's
(08:57):
effective. I don't know, I thinkit creates a world where people
value the instant gratificationof an Instagram post versus the
quality of a product or service.And that, I think, creates a
downfall of small businesses orbusinesses in general.
Justine Reichman: (09:14):
Yeah. So now, with that being said, would you
say that education is at theforefront of your marketing
initiatives as a way to educate,sell and develop community?
Wen-Jay Ying: (09:27):
It is. And I don't know if that's technically
from a business standpoint, themost effective way. But being
seen as a company that peoplecan trust, and people viewing me
as an expert in my field is veryimportant to me, because I don't
ever cut corners for money. Iwill always be authentic to the
(09:51):
kinds of farms we work with, theways that we speak with our
customers. So that reputation isreally important to me. And that
education, to me, is veryconnected to that reputation.
And in the end, again, not themost business savvy part of what
I do. But in the end, I sell aproduct that feels kind of weird
(10:12):
to charge people floodingbefore. Theoretically, everyone
should have access to reallyhigh quality, local, clean,
regeneratively growningredients. The government
should make it a way for that tobe free. That will never happen.
In that moralistic value of whatI believe it, I'd rather have
people have the knowledge andthe education around how to make
(10:33):
better food choices. Even ifit's not buying products from
Local Roots, especially becausewe are hyper local. We only
serve the New York Citydemographic region. I think it
does a disservice to the worldif someone from California or
Seattle doesn't have thatknowledge just because they're
not a consumer of ours.
Justine Reichman: (10:55):
How far out do you go to the farmer? So
what's the radius to which youwork within?
Wen-Jay Ying: (11:00):
Usually within two hours of New York.
Justine Reichman: (11:02):
And so when people order these boxes, I
would imagine, is it seasonal?
Wen-Jay Ying: (11:08):
It goes all year round, and everything's based on
the seasons.
Justine Reichman: (11:14):
Do people know what they're getting? Is it
a surprise? Can you choose howcustomizable are they?
Wen-Jay Ying: (11:21):
It's kind of like a hybrid. So meaning, you can
customize the categories offood. Meaning like, vegetables,
mushrooms, fruit. But you can'tcustomize what you're getting in
that selection. So if it'svegetables, I'm going to be
curating. I'm the one thatpersonally curates what five
items you're getting from thefarm that week, and which kind
(11:42):
of mushrooms you're getting thatweek. But I know that I put a
lot of thought into how tocurate that for people.
Justine Reichman: (11:48):
How do you choose those five items? What
are your benchmarks, or yourparameters for making that
choice?
Wen-Jay Ying: (11:55):
I think about it as from the standpoint of a home
cook in New York. So can thisfit in my fridge? Because we
have small fridges and kitchensin New York, and then a balance
of things like fruit,vegetables, leafy greens,
alliums like onions and garlic,and color, because different
colors have different nutrientsin it. So if we can diversify
(12:15):
the colors that we're giving,purple carrots to obviously like
rainbow swiss chard, you're alsoable to provide something that's
more nutritious to the consumer.
Justine Reichman: (12:25):
And so are people ordering this weekly,
biweekly, bimonthly?
Wen-Jay Ying: (12:31):
People get their Local Roots harvest box every
single week, and they can put iton hold whenever they want. New
Yorkers often traveling. Or ifthey're super busy at work, they
can put their order on hold,which is a great thing. Because
with the original CSA model, onerestriction is that it is a
(12:51):
commitment, and there's no wayto put that thing on hold. So if
you can't pick up your CSA box,you usually just have a neighbor
pick it up for you, and you justdonate it is one of those two
options. But this gives peoplemore flexibility in terms of
that subscription model.
Justine Reichman: (13:06):
How accessible are they to pick up?
It's not delivery, you'resaying. So it's not going to end
up at my apartment on 60 WallStreet or whatever?
Wen-Jay Ying: (13:17):
It could. So if you were a consumer, you go
through our website, you selectwhich kind of Harvest Club box
you want. I want veggies andfruit. I want veggies fruit and
mushrooms. And then you cancheck out opting either home
delivery or pickup. So homedelivery, there is a charge.
We're not in Amazon. Peopleshould remember that we are
small business. We're not goingto do free delivery. That's not
actually economical for anysmall business. It's also
(13:39):
economical for Amazon. They'rejust losing a lot of money
intentionally for that. Or youcan do pickup where it's just
free. We have a couple pickuplocations in different bars and
cafes throughout New York City.So say that you would go to the
local coffee shop you partnerwith, and you'd pick up your box
there. The reason why we partnerwith neighborhood bars and cafes
(14:00):
is, one, support those smallbusinesses, but it's also to
create a different experience ingrocery shopping. So instead of,
I used to have a CSA, I pickedup at a church. But you can't
really talk to people at achurch because you have to
church. You feel like you haveto be quiet. So I wanted to be
the place that was already asocial setting for people that
was part of their weeklylifestyle, and that's where you
(14:23):
can pick up your food. And thenwe also sometimes offer recipes.
So we'll give you ideas of whatto cook, or I handle the
Instagram. So if you're like,what is this thing? I don't know
how to use it. I'll message youback some ideas.
Justine Reichman: (14:37):
So as you were building this business,
when you first kicked it off,you said CSAs were not really a
thing there. It was not quitethe same as it is today. How
have you seen the industry grow,and your role in it?
Wen-Jay Ying: (14:51):
Yeah. Just to clarify. CSAs were introduced to
New York City or introduced toAmerica, I think, in
Massachusetts where they firstcame to. Massachusetts in the
80's, and so we have had CSAs inNew York for a while. It's more
that it used to be very much asubculture. There weren't as
many people that were likeyounger or even minorities being
(15:16):
feeling, I think, approachablein those situations in those
communities. But local andorganic was not really a thing.
Meaning, you couldn't just go tothe grocery store and find these
products there. There wasn't aWhole Foods in every borough.
That's when it was not owned byAmazon. So buying local
(15:42):
ingredients by thinking aboutorganic was not as commonplace
in people's mind. And it'sreally crazy. I was talking to a
friend about this yesterday whoI know through like the local
food world, and we were justtalking about how much he was
reminding me of how much it haschanged, and how different it
was when I started this. Andwhich is the reason why I didn't
started my company, and how Iprobably had a hand in change of
(16:07):
the industry. I'm not someonevery much to have an ego or brag
about what I have accomplished.But all I know is that this was
not a thing people, like mostpeople, thought about, and now
it is right. We've had thousandsof thtousands of customers come
through local roots. All thosepeople were essentially, like
(16:32):
some of them, their firstintroduction to the worlds of
local food, many of them knowwhat the word regenerative is
because I talk about it all thetime. A lot of the education I
have, I've had customers for 14years, every single week as
customers, and they're like, oh,yeah. I remember when you talked
about making a veggie scrapbroth six years ago. And I still
(16:53):
do that. I remember a friendthat worked at a large fashion
brand telling me, we were in ameeting and we had a mood board
of how we want the brand to befor next year. And Local Roots
is actually up there, part ofthe mood board.
Justine Reichman: (17:06):
Wow, that's amazing.
Wen-Jay Ying: (17:08):
Which is amazing to hear. I was like, are you
sure that was me? But yeah, Ithink it is cool to think about
how my mission to make this morecommon place has been
accomplished after 14 years. Andit's this weird. It's just kind
Justine Reichman: (17:20):
What role do you think Farmers Market's play
of funny catch playing too. Youhelped grow the movement. Part
of me is like, it's not justselling the organic, local food,
right? It's also making it fun.It's making it sexy. It's like
making it playful, where it ispart of your social life. And
(17:42):
now I think organic and local islike that. And yeah, it's like
you create the world where it'smore mainstream, but that also
means you're essentiallycreating your own competitors.
We're in a place where I don'twant to have to compete with a
Whole Foods, which isimpossible. So it's kind of like
(18:03):
this ironic situation of beingone of the first game changers
in an industry of where itplaces you in that.
for you as a business?
Wen-Jay Ying: (18:20):
I love Farmers Market's. I think I view our
businesses to actually to be so,I think they complement each
other. Meaning, a lot of farmerswill diversify the way they sell
their vegetables or food.Farmers Market's are great
because you can have that directconnection with your own
consumers. Every single week,normally. But in a Farmers
(18:43):
Market situation, if it'sraining that day, no one shows
up, and then you have all foodwaste. Or people will still
select the things they want, andthey probably always pick the
most familiar things. And so ifyou have a massive crop of like
rutabaga, and most people don'tknow how to cook rutabaga New
York, you're going to be wastinga lot of that product. So I view
(19:08):
Farmers Market's, and it's kindof funny because I view them
being convenient in differentways. So a Farmers Market is
very convenient in the sense of,you can pick what you want, you
have a larger selection offarmers to talk to. You have a
larger window usually from themorning until whatever, 3:00 pm.
With Local Roots and the CSAmodel, the reason why I think
(19:30):
it's convenient is thatsomeone's hand curating it for
you so you don't just thinkabout what you're going to buy.
I like that as it diverse, it'sdifferent items every single
week so it forces you todiversify your nutrients and
what you're cooking every singleweek. I cook things based of
what's in season. I never cookthings based as a recipe. I'll
never go buy a vegetable justfor my recipe. It's like, all
(19:54):
right, I have these items in myfridge from the farmers, I want
to make something with this. Ifind that to me to be more
convenient the way I cook. Andit is within your schedule.
You're not having to take thesubway to go to the Farmers
Market. I can go two blocks downto my bar, grab a drink with a
friend, and also pick up myvegetables, fruits, meats and my
(20:17):
cheese. And also, I'm not at allthrowing shade to Farmers
Market. It is just good to thinkabout how not every vendor at a
Farmers Market is organic, or is100 and grass fed. There's a lot
of different kinds of growingpractices happening at the
Farmers Market. So unless you'redoing your own research, and
(20:38):
unless you know what to lookfor, it's just more effort, I
think, versus I spend so muchtime for Local Roots finding
farmers that really hit thehighest sustainability growing
practices on a farm.
Justine Reichman: (20:52):
If you look at other cities, New York is
unique, right? Because you wantto stay within your area when
you're going grocery shopping. Idon't want to schlep all the way
to the Upper East Side to go getsomething, or the Upper West
Side. It take you like an hour,right? You got to carry it in a
bag. I remember having ashopping cart, but that was only
to go a block or two. Youremember those little carts for
(21:15):
your groceries? And I thinkabout where I live today. I live
in Marin County where there is aFarmers Market every single day
of the week in one of the townshere, locally. Which is not
something that every county has.Unusual success. And I remember
living in New York where I wouldgo to the Union Square Market,
(21:35):
because I live near UnionSquare, and I would pick up my
things that I had my vendors,and that I would do the rest
from, oh, my god, Fresh Direct.I'm like, going back a while.
But you didn't have that sameconnection with the farmers and
the ranchers that you do, oreven the connection like you're
providing. And it doesn't giveyou the way to focus on locally
(22:01):
sourced, locally grown products.I remember it really just being
about whatever I wanted to eat,I would make because it's always
available. But I think thisreally supports a more
regenerative, organic, localculture. I think you really did
have a hand in building that inNew York area. Because I moved
(22:21):
out here, and it was like secondnature. But back then when I
lived in New York, it was kindof Farmers Market's, there's one
on the Upper West Side, therewas one in Union Square. They
were there. They weren't there,kind of thing. And I really
think the movement and thecommunity has really connected
with what you and others havebrought to the community, and
(22:42):
allowed us to change thenarrative, and really empower
people to make more informedchoices.
Wen-Jay Ying: (22:47):
Yeah. I appreciate you saying that. When
you're talking about that, I wasthinking about, when I keep
talking about people gettingproducts that they wouldn't
Justine Reichman: (22:54):
I'd like to go back to the community that
normally pick out, like therutabaga, it's not just that
it's better for you nutrition todiversify what you're eating.
It's better nutritionally forthe farm also. So if a farmer
knows that, like regenerative,organic, local vegetables, part
of growing those growing patchesmeans that they have diverse
(23:15):
crops growing on a farm. Thedifferent kinds of vegetables,
varieties, the different kindsof root systems will all affect
and enhance the soil nutrition,which makes your vegetable more
nutritious and more flavorful.Now imagine if you have to grow
diverse vegetables and crops,but you can't sell half them
because they're just notpopular. Then you're wasting so
(23:37):
much money. But in the world ofa CSA, you're able to educate
and introduce people to thesevarieties that help a farm, and
you would never have a thing tobuy it yourself. But then you're
like, oh, my god, I loveromanesco. This is the coolest
vegetable. I love rutabaga, it'slike a potato. And I do have a
lot of customers in thebeginning that were really like,
(24:00):
this reminds me so much. I'm sohappy you guys exist in New
York. I just moved here. Thisreminds me so much of
California, upstate New York,Europe, and I can't find
you've built, and maybe if youcould give us like three things,
anything else like this in NewYork. And I think that is really
cool. And now that we do homedelivery, it is literally like
you don't have to even leaveyour door, and you get
three ideas for those founderstuning in that would really be
(24:21):
everything sent to you. And Iused to live in North Hollywood,
and there was a Farmers Marketthere, but it just didn't have a
large, different Farmers Market.The Union Square is massive, and
you can go to a small, like twovendors. And if they don't have
the growing practices you want,or they don't have the most
flavorful products, I wouldalways drive to either the one
(24:44):
in Santa Monica or the one inHollywood because it was a lot
bigger, and they had amazingfarmers there. So yes,
sometimes, more isn't alwaysbetter. It is, more is better in
terms of access. More FarmersMarket is easier to get to, but
doesn't always mean thequalities is the same.
(25:13):
useful for them as they'retrying to build their community.
Because building community isreally challenging, and you've
done such a great job. So if youcould just maybe share a few
things?
Wen-Jay Ying: (25:26):
There's really no formula for building community.
And if you think about it justin the sense of, I need to build
community to have a goodbusiness. It's just never gonna
work. It's a very slow process.But a lot of people, I think,
were loyal customers, and areloyal customers to me for 14
years every week. And I think alot of that is the connection
(25:48):
they have to me. It's like, Isupport this business, because I
support the business owner. Andthat really comes down to like,
for the first 10 years or so, Iwas at every Local Roots pickup.
Meaning that I created everysingle customer every single
week in every neighborhood wewere in. In every single borough
(26:10):
we were in when we first starteddoing home deliveries, I was the
one to deliver them so I knoweveryone's scheduled in terms of
like, when they're coming backfrom. If they're gonna open the
door and like they're in theiryoga pants because they just
came back from yoga class, orthey just came back from work.
And it really is just likethinking about your consumers as
your friends. Checking in onthem, remembering things like,
(26:34):
how is that worth meeting youhad last week? We were talking
about it. It's just having agenuine interest in your
consumers, and it's not thistransactional experience. And
that, to me, is the best way tobuild community. I think just
having your space there.
Justine Reichman: (26:51):
Because it becomes personal then, right? I
like you. I want to support you.I like your choices. I like how
you educate me. I like theproducts you bring. I think it's
the intersection of you and yourproducts, and where they come
together because they've nowbecome to trust you for picking
the right things, and givingthem the information, and
(27:12):
establishing a rapport. Now itfeels like it's attainable, and
you're accessible, as is thefood. The winning combination,
right? So as we look forward,because that was like the last
13 years, where are you todaywith the business? And what are
you looking to do as you see theindustry changing?
Wen-Jay Ying: (27:35):
The industry has changed so much. Not just the
food industry and organicindustry, but the industry is
just being, a business haschanged so much that I am moving
away from that farm box CSAprogram we've been doing for 14
years. And it feels as if we'realmost closing the company down
(27:55):
and then letting it regrow tosomething else. So there's
definitely a lot of transitionhappening at Local Roots. But
the ones that always stay thesame is that focus on whatever
I'm doing. Whatever Local Rootsis doing is always going to be
focused around connecting peoplecloser to their food, creating
more transparency around food,and really empowering people and
(28:17):
getting them excited about alocal food system.
Justine Reichman: (28:20):
What impact did you to make this change to
close that down and now look fora new way to evolve?
Wen-Jay Ying: (28:28):
A more thorough answer is on my Instagram, but I
will mention a couple thingsfrom that post I made on
Instagram. One thing is theoverhead and expenses. Post
Justine Reichman: (28:38):
Is this a hard decision for you to make?
pandemic are just so high. Ihave survived so many things as
a business owner. From day one,we had Hurricane Irene hit
upstate New York, which hit alot of farmers. There's always
something big to get over. Wehustled and worked our asses off
(29:01):
during the pandemic, which wasthe hardest time as a business.
And a very hard time asessential workers also, and we
survived that. And then postpandemic is a world that a lot
of people probably can'tunderstand, that it's how
different it is. Unless you'reprobably a business owner,
everything is higher. Insurancerates are higher, obviously
(29:23):
rental increases. That's to beexpected. All these things keep
adding up. The city keeps addingmore different kinds of taxes,
whatever they can throw at you.All of that is just like,
obviously, one, it's not evenfinancially viable anymore for
me. But also it's like, I don'teven want to deal with those
(29:46):
things anymore. I have tried.I've had to overcome so many
challenges in 14 years that I'mjust exhausted with it. And if I
can achieve my goal of, likeeducating people more about
their food and their foodsystems, and I can do it in a
way that isn't so operationallyheavy. That's what I'm trying to
do. The kind of work I domaintains so much. It's just so
(30:10):
much everything. You're managingcars, doing deliveries, and a
million things can go wrong. Ina route in New York, you're
dealing with a very largeexpensive walking cooler, and
your warehouse, lots of staff.And I want to do things in a way
that's a little easier now thatI'm getting older and I don't
feel like working every singleday. I think it's expected for
(30:34):
business owners to always haveto go into work on the day off,
or be all the time. I don'tthink that's really fair, and I
don't think that has to happen.I don't want to live a lifestyle
where that's expected for meanymore. I did that for so long,
I don't enjoy it anymore. Ididn't mind it for the first 10
(30:55):
years. Now I'm like, NO, I getto also have a day off. So
that's a huge part. And the waysthat I and the consumers
interact with the product isreally different. Now also, we
used to have these super DieHard Local Food People who love
learning about the farmers. Andthere was more, I think,
(31:17):
understanding and compassionaround the local food system.
And I'm not saying that all mynew customers are like this past
post pandemic, but there is adifferent. I think the Amazons
of the world have really changedwhat consumers expect. I was
like trying to reference beforefree delivery where you can
deliver product almost anywherein this country overnight is now
(31:38):
Effectively, this is your baby.You've grown it for 14 years,
what we all expect. But it's notsomething realistic for most
businesses to do, but we'reexpected to do that.
and you developed it. Was ithard for me to make that call?
Wen-Jay Ying: (32:03):
Yeah. I think I write about this because there's
a lot of stages of closing downa company emotionally. There's
the acceptance of it, and thedeep sadness. It's not just a
business to me or even like apassion. And it was my life. I
have such a strong connection tothose customers and to our
(32:25):
farmers. So I had a period of,once I decided to do this, I was
very, very sad and nostalgic. Ispent so much energy and time
building this, and it'ssomething I'm so proud of. It's
such a special thing to be ableto do something like this. I've
realized that I created my ownfood system, which sounds crazy.
Who else gets to create theirown food system? It's insane. So
(32:48):
I had the sadness feeling. I hada different kind of sadness
like, oh, my God. Am I afailure? Did I not do a good
job? And the reason why we'reclosing is because I couldn't
figure it out, will I be good inanything? What am I gonna do
now? And then there's thefeelings of, wait, I'm a badass
because I did all this stuff andthat was really hard. And people
(33:10):
don't realize how hard it is,and they probably will never
realize how hard it is. And thenthere's also feelings now of
excitement. Everything has atime and place. You're saying
when I started this, that Istarted because this didn't
exist anywhere in the world.This kind of business and this
kind of job. And now that I'veestablished that, and now that I
have so much more knowledge inthis field, now I can take all
(33:32):
that and move on to somethingelse, and innovate and create
something else new. And that isalso what I'm excited about. The
idea of constantly innovatingnot just myself, but also
innovating the industry, isexciting to me. So, yeah,
there's a lot of like,everything.
Justine Reichman: (33:53):
It's a hard decision to close down a company
that you've worked so hard formany years, and you've innovated
and inspired, and people havegrown to rely on. So for those
founders, I always like to askfor researchers, or innovators,
or people out there that havebeen running something for years
(34:14):
and are toying with, should Icontinue? Or how do I know when
the right time to pivot or moveon? What tips might you give
them? Maybe you could throw outthree tips of things that they
could look for.
Wen-Jay Ying: (34:27):
Don't let your ego come into it. I think a lot
of people hold on to theirbusinesses because of pride, or
they just don't want to thinkthat they just didn't do a good
job at something. If it's notserving you and you're not happy
doing it anymore, there's nopoint of doing it. You just
close it. And I think it's alsoimportant to think about like,
(34:50):
what skill sets you have gainedand enhanced through this job,
through your business? Becausethere is a world where you, some
people are okay working forsomeone else. Like, I'm not sure
if I'm the best at that. Butyeah, not everyone is. But some
business owners are really goodat that, and actually don't like
(35:11):
the pressure of making everysingle decision for themselves.
So you just make a list of like,okay, these are all the tasks
that I would do in a day, and Imust be pretty good at them if a
whole business was operatingwith me doing them. And that's a
really a great way to find yournext part of life. And that
makes them more okay to closedown your company of knowing
that there is another careerpath for yourself. And I guess
(35:36):
the third point is, I reallylooked to closed my business
down as I really looked at theoutline, the blueprint of what
mattered the most to me. I wouldsay that I don't need to be
having the business where I'mordering the food, talking to
the farmers, packing the food,delivering the food, doing the
customer service. I'm literallystill the one doing a lot of the
(35:58):
deliveries. I'm still doing alot of those things. I'm doing
the social media. If my goal inthe end, if my largest large
means zoom out the most. My goalis, I want people to have the
knowledge, or have a better wayto get to have higher quality
food. That's very wordy. Butwhat is another way I can do
(36:20):
that is a little easier, that isa little cheaper, that can
operate a little smoother thatdoesn't have a million different
moving parts? So I think you canstill find joy in closing down
your business. Maybe startingsomething new. Maybe can be a
little easier, and you're stillserving your mission. But it
(36:42):
doesn't have to be specificallyin the same exact way you were
doing it.
Justine Reichman: (36:46):
That makes sense. Did you think about
selling the business?
Wen-Jay Ying: (36:51):
I literally just don't know how to do that.
Justine Reichman: (36:54):
Okay. Well, maybe there's somebody listening
today that hears your story, andmaybe you can share some
insights. So we can ask ourguests and our listeners, that
if you guys have any idea ondirection to share with Wen-Jay
about how to sell her business,how could they reach out to you?
Wen-Jay Ying: (37:10):
It would be great if they reached out to me on
LinkedIn .Or better yet,actually an Instagram. It's my
first and last name, so it'sW-E-N-J-A-Y-Y-I-N-G. And yeah, I
would love to hear people'sstories about selling their
business, because it is 14 yearsof building this up. I would
(37:31):
like to hear stories about howto monetize that 14 years of
experience in ways that areethical too, right? Because my
customers are very important tome, and I would never want to
lose that trust in them.
Justine Reichman: (37:46):
Awesome. Wen-Jay, thank you so much for
tuning in today and for sharingyour stories. And we'll continue
to follow you as you pivot,change and continue to educate
and support your community.
Wen-Jay Ying: (37:58):
Thank you, and thank you for wearing a mogul
with pink color.
Justine Reichman: (38:02):
I do my best. I didn't imagine. I want to
thank our guests for tuning intoday. We have our episodes here
every Tuesday. They are newevery week. If you're watching
us on a videogram, you'reprobably watching us on YouTube,
but do know that you can listento us on a podcast, wherever you
listen to podcasts, at EssentialIngredients. Don't forget to
(38:23):
follow us on Instagram to hearclips and insights from our
guests about what is coming upnext. Our Instagram handle is
@essential.ingredients. See younext week. Bye, bye.
Popular Podcasts
On Purpose with Jay Shetty
I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com