September 16, 2025 • 37 mins
"Every community has different values, and every community should have different choices. And that's why local food is so important so that local communities and local farmers can decide what's most important to them and how they want to connect the people who grow our food with the people who are seeking nourishment." —Andy Naja-Riese
"The health of our Farmers Market is really dependent upon the health of our farmers." —Tanner Keys
Wonder why local food sometimes costs more, or if it’s really worth the effort to shop there? The real story behind farmers' markets is more complicated—and more important—than you might think.
Andy Naja-Riese, CEO of the Agricultural Institute of Marin, and Tanner Keys, Cooperative Agreement Manager for the Islands of Remote Areas Regional Food Business Center, have spent years on the front lines of food access. Their work in California and Hawaii gives them a unique view on what it takes to make local food affordable, how certification and regulations shape what you see at the market, and why these markets matter for everyone.
Listen in for honest talk about food prices, local farming, organic rules, food as medicine, and how farmers' markets are working to make healthy food available to all. You’ll get practical insights, real solutions, and a fresh look at what’s possible in your own community.
Meet Andy:
Andy Naja-Riese brings 17 years of experience in community food systems, public health, and food equity programs & policy. As Chief Executive Officer, he leads AIM's major programs, partnerships, strategic planning, advocacy, and fundraising, including a capital campaign for AIM’s Center for Food and Agriculture in collaboration with AIM’s Board of Directors. Andy joined AIM in 2018 after spending 10 years working for the Federal government, including the U.S. Department of Agriculture’s Food and Nutrition Service.
Andy is currently the Co-Chair of the Marin County Healthy Eating Active Living (HEAL) Collaborative, serves on the Steering Committees of the Marin Carbon Project and Marin Community Health Improvement Plan, sits on the National Farm to School Network's Advisory Board, and represents AIM on the California Food and Farming Network & Food and Farm Resilience Coalition. He received the 2022 CVNL Heart of Marin Award for Excellence in Leadership and the 2023 Farmers Market Champion of the Year award from CAFF. He earned his master’s degree from the T.H. Chan Harvard School of Public Health and his bachelor’s degree from Cornell University’s College of Agriculture and Life Sciences.
He lives with his husband and dog in Sonoma, where he enjoys backyard gardening, cooking farmers market hauls, eating bagels, and enjoying Northern California’s natural beauty
Meet Tanner:
Tanner Keys grew up in an agricultural community & lifestyle that has instilled a passion for food & land. He has served in various roles with the Hawaiʻi Good Food Alliance (HGFA) beginning in 2022, helping the organization in its beginning years and later leading a project of HGFA, the Hawaiʻi Farmers Market Association. Before that, he served as the Team Leader to the FoodCorps Inc., an AmeriCorps program, from 2019 to 2021. Tanner has a B.S. in Business Administration from the University of Oregon, and it was his service in the Peace Corps (Timor-Leste ʻ16-ʻ18) that led him back to the path of supporting agriculture & food security.
Connect with Hawai’i Good Food Alliance
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Justine Reichman: (00:00):
Good morning, and welcome to Essential
(00:15):
Ingredients. I'm your host,Justine. Today with me, I have
some new friends, some oldfriends. And of course, our
community of friends, and I'mreally excited for this
conversation. We brought Andyback from Agricultural Institute
of Marin. He is not a new face,but he's got lots of to share.
We're so excited to hear what'sgoing on with you, all the new
(00:36):
things that we can be excitedabout. And equally, learn a
little bit more about what yourgoals are. And learn from
Tanner, equally, who are new tome. But equally really excited
to have you here to be part ofthis conversation, to learn how
the different places in theworld around the continent are
(00:56):
looking at food accessibility,access and business. So I'm
going to kick it off with Andy.And Andy, if you would just
reintroduce yourself to thoselisteners and viewers that are
tuning in that maybe it's theirfirst time, or they just need a
little reintroduction.
Andy Naja-Riese: (01:16):
Well, thanks for having me back, Justine. I'm
Andy Naja-Riese, the CEO of theAgricultural Institute of Marin.
We're a non profit organizationbased in the Bay Area, and we
operate Farmers Markets foodaccess, education and policy
work to create a healthier, moreequitable, earth friendly, local
(01:37):
and regional food system.
Justine Reichman: (01:38):
Tanner is new to the community here, and I had
a little chance to talk toTanner before, and what an
amazing background. I was veryintrigued from the get go, so
I'd love for you, Tanner, if youwould, to just introduce
yourself, a little bit aboutyour initiative, and what you're
doing in Hawaii?
Tanner Keys: (01:58):
Sure. I'm currently the Cooperative
Agreement Manager for theIslands of Remote Areas Regional
Food Business Center. We workedwith Robbie in Alaska, the US
Pacific islands, otherterritories US Virgin Islands,
as well as Puerto Rico. We werefocusing on three key areas,
(02:19):
coordination, technicalassistance. I managed the Hawaii
Farmers Market Association for acouple years. And during that
time, also as the President of alocal Farmers Market fence
security project in HawaiiIsland. And I came to Hawaii
initially to work on anAmeriCorps project. I was
naturally based. It's kind ofreplacement size over the years.
(02:43):
It's just kind of my foodsecurity, kind of tribe started
when I was in that Peace Corps,and that's when I found out
about food corners, and justbeen one thing after the next
until the day.
Justine Reichman: (02:52):
Awesome. Well, that's great. Al the
backgrounds lead us to theFarmers Market here. What's
different, though, is ourgeography, different levels of
affordability in differentplaces, utility, etcetera. And I
really would just love for us tobetter understand the landscape
and what that means in all thesedifferent parts around the
(03:12):
country. I'd love to just startoff talking about the different
geographic locations and howthat impacts your access to
create access to these betterfree foods, the organic farms
and and all of that, and whatthat looks like? What the
landscape looks like?
Andy Naja-Riese: (03:31):
Sure. I'm happy to go first. I can speak
to our experience in California,and what makes California unique
in some ways is that we actuallyhave what are called, it's a
statewide program calledCertified Farmers Markets. And
in the 1970s, California createdstate regulations that would
(03:55):
essentially allow farmers tosell their products without
having to go through standardpacking, labeling and
distribution requirements. Sothis created a model known as
Certified Farmers Markets wherethe farmers who sell their
products at a Farmers Markethave to get a certificate from
(04:16):
the California Department ofFood and Agriculture and their
County Agricultural Commission.And on the certificate, they
list all the crops that they'regrowing. Or if they have eggs or
honey, they would identify thattoo. So in California, we
actually define local as withinCalifornia, and we have a large
state with 58 counties anddifferent growing regions. And
(04:40):
there's about in the state, Ithink there's over 600 Certified
Farmers Markets. And at AGInstitute of Marin, we run nine
Certified Farmers Markets. So wehave seven that are year round
markets across Marin, SanFrancisco and Alameda counties.
And then we have two seasonalmarkets. And I think what makes
it really special in Californiais that we have the year round
(05:02):
growing season, and people canshop the seasons and get a
variety of different produce inthe winter months versus the
summer months. And we also havevery different growing regions
as well, based upon differentclimate conditions and micro
climates. So having apples fromthe North Bay where I live,
those types of apples are verydifferent than apples from El
(05:25):
Dorado County and Apple Hill.There's different climate
conditions, different soil.Likewise, with a product like
avocados. We have avocados inSouthern California, but we also
have avocados as far north asthe Hayward hills, and the
varietals are very different aswell. So we really focus a lot
on year round access. And thenalso, California has a lot of
(05:50):
regulations. That's one of thethings California is known for
is a very large regulatoryenvironment, which can be a
challenge for small farmers. Butit also helps, we believe, to
create a level playing field. Sothat way, when you show up to
the Farmers Market, you knowthat you're buying from the
farmer that grew the product, tomake sure that's not coming from
(06:10):
a wholesaler. So some of thethings about California.
Justine Reichman: (06:13):
Awesome. I appreciate you sharing that. And
it's interesting because I camefrom the East Coast, and the
produce that we got there wasvery different. Union Square
market was very different. Theaccessibility to those different
produce was very different. Andthe focus on local was not quite
as prevalent as it here, in myexperience, because it just
(06:34):
didn't have the same accesscounter, if you would. Tell us a
little bit about Hawaii, theclimate there, or the access
there, and maybe some of thesimilarities that you can find
from California or Hawaii, orthe differences.
Tanner Keys: (06:48):
Yeah. I was just thinking about the elements. I
think both Hawaii can kind ofshare with between California
and Alaska, is that we obviouslyhave a year round climate. So
year round growing. But same asAlaska is that we do really face
the challenges of logistics.Inter Island shipping is
difficult. There used to be abarge. There's no longer a
(07:11):
barge. But something that hasbeen a big conversation,
especially with our larger foodhubs and food producers is, how
do we improve? Basically, interIsland logistics, inter Island
commerce, especially aroundagriculture, because each of
these islands is incrediblyunique to their Farmers Markets
(07:32):
needs. Each of our each county,or each island has its own. If
you're trying to get a certainfact that they have, each county
has a different approach to it.So there's a lot of sovereignty
for each of the counties and howthey manage their Farmers
Market's. Thinking about access,and even now, there's a lotof, I
guess you could call graymarket, unregulated Farmers
(07:54):
Market, just gatherings ofpeople selling food. And that's
been completely fine. In Oahu,there's a lot more people the
city and county saw a need tocreate something a little bit
more formal. And so back in the70s, they had created the
people's open market, which wasa city and county ran kind of
Farmers Market. And that wasreally successful for decades.
(08:15):
It was where people, whetherit's vegetables, fruits, but you
could also get live shellfish,live fish. It was very much, and
this was facilitated in the cityand county parks. That was until
recently died down. We reallyhad to analyze what are the big
changes in the past 5 to 10years, why these people's open
(08:37):
markets have declined? And Ithink it's part of a larger
scope of the changingenvironment in Hawaii. All of
these Farmers Markets are goingto be smaller, and we've been
working with a lot of them tomake it more accessible for food
because we have some of thehighest food prices. At the end
of the day, that food is goingto be cheaper at a grocery
(08:58):
store. Local food tends to bemore expensive. And so we've
been working with a lot ofFarmers Markets to open up that
access just because at the endof the day, the demand is so
much higher than the supply. Wefaced a challenge for farmers
that have access to land to beable to produce as much, to be
able to produce at scale. And sowe work at implementing SNAP,
(09:20):
implementing WIC, our DoubleBucks program. And so local
food, you're able to get halfoff. And so we're just trying to
find ways of opening it up forhow do we subsidize our farmers,
basically. Those have beenefforts of the past couple of
years. But I think a uniquething to Hawaii is, and maybe I
think Alaska experiences thistoo, is the impact of the
(09:42):
tourist industry on FarmersMarket's. And what is the
culture around Farmers Marketfor the community versus
tourism? Because there's areally strong distinction. And
so Oahu obviously gets the mosttourists, and so that you can
definitely see over the pastyears, especially, what markets
(10:03):
have been established andsupported for the tourist
industry versus how to find andfunnel local food while making
accessible. It's having snapwicker and double box is huge
and hugely impactful tocommunities. We have some of the
highest snap usage becausefood's so expensive, and so
(10:25):
that's been going on the pastcouple years. We were, I think,
one of the first states to takeon WIC at Farmers Market. And so
that's utilizing it so FarmersMarket's can actually use WIC
cards at the market.
Justine Reichman: (10:38):
I want to go back to something, and I really
appreciate all of what youshared about the geography, the
location, the differences, andeven the access using WIC and
SNAP. But before we move on, Iwant to go back to something
that Andy had mentioned aboutbeing certified and the organic
role, because I don't want toglaze over it. And I think it's
(11:00):
interesting, and I think it'simportant. And I know Andy, you
had talked a little bit aboutwhat we have here in California
that there's a lot ofregulations around that, so
maybe you could just touch onthat, and then we can hear from
Robbie and Tanner on what thatlooks like for them, and what
role it plays in the FarmersMarket's.
Andy Naja-Riese: (11:20):
So California, we have the Certified Farmers
Market program, and FarmersMarket's need to become
certified by the CountyEnvironmental Health and County
Agricultural Department, as wellas by the state. And then again,
the farmers that want to sell atthe market would have to receive
a certified producer certificatelisting all of the products that
(11:42):
they're selling by location. Andso there's a lot of paperwork
that goes into this process, andthe certification piece is
different than the organiccertification. So certified
Farmers Market means that theproducer, you have two or more
farmers gathering at the samelocation to sell their produce
(12:02):
to the public, being distinctfrom the organic certification.
So in California, the lastestimate, I think about is 5 to
7% of farmers are go through athird party certification to
become organic. And so meetingcertain requirements that's set
by the National Organic Program.We do find that among smaller
(12:24):
farmers, and including farmersthat sell at Farmers Market's,
we do see a higher likelihood ofthem being certified organic as
well. And so as an example, atAmes markets, we find that about
50% of the farmers are eithercertified organic or they're in
the process of going through athree year transition period. So
(12:46):
it takes three years to meet theorganic requirements to actually
have the organic label. And sothat's something that I think
has been largely in response tothe consumer demand for organic
within our community. There areother producers that may use
organic practices. But if theydon't go through the
(13:06):
certification, they actuallycan't say that they are organic.
Likewise, these requirementsalso apply to value added
producers or food makers. Theyneed to have certified that
they're doing organic productionin a certified organic kitchen.
So with all that said, there's alot of paperwork, there's a lot
of requirements, but it doeshelp producers from a marketing
(13:27):
standpoint where they can saythat they're certified organic,
and it does respond to a demandfrom local chefs or local
shoppers. In the Bay Area atleast, we do see a large demand
among consumers for certifiedorganic produce, and we do see
this across income levels aswell. So across different
(13:50):
shopping groups that there is ahigh demand for organic,
California also has set a goalto double the amount of farmland
that's certified organic as akey to climate mitigation
strategy. So we're seeing morefarmers getting certified
organic, and there's differentprograms that help farmers to
(14:11):
transition from conventional tocertified. But again, you don't
need to be certified organic tosell at a certified Farmers
Market, but it is something thatcan help you increase your
sales. Maybe offer a premium,and that additional sale can
then be put back into yourpractices, farm worker housing,
things like that.
Justine Reichman: (14:32):
And Tanner, I'm curious, where do you guys
fall into all this?
Tanner Keys: (14:36):
I'm trying to think of a lot of organic
growers who are certified, butgetting people to fly out here
to do it, a lot of folks,majority of Hawaii's farmers are
in five acres or less. Asignificant portion. So a lot of
them are small farmers, andadding to the scale. And most
folks that they are going tohave any sort of certification,
(14:57):
they're also in the grocerystores. They have multi channel.
Example, they're accessing themarket, and they've scaled to
that point where it makes sensefor them. But yeah, the
conversation, people will say,no spray. I think the term local
is really is the incentive tobuy just because it is difficult
to buy local food. That is thechallenge. The challenge is to
(15:19):
also find affordable, localfood. And so I think in addition
to that, these Farmers Marketare in communities, and food is
such a big part of the, I sayHawaiian culture, not only just
like native Hawaiian culture,but it's a big part of the
(15:40):
culture of Hawaii. It's veryingrained. So the way that
people relate to food is likethe way that they relate to
their farmers. And so if they'regoing to a Farmers Market,
they've made that choice, thatthey're going to have a
different relationship to food.And that is a decent population
of people. And so I would sayit's great. And usually they can
say, we do this organically, orwe do no spray. Non GMO is a
(16:03):
really, really big thing becausewe have Monsanto out here with
quite a few plots, and so peopleare familiar with GMOs. They're
just like, we don't want GMOfood. However, I liked the idea
of certification. And we'vetalked about it with a few
different folks at a state levelof developing our own
(16:25):
certifications, especially ifit's primarily regenerative, or
if it's primarily grown, if it'sa product, if it's a value added
product, like 60% of thatproduct is made here in Hawaii.
And so there's been definitelytalks of, how can we create
certification program that iscommunicated well within Hawaii
(16:48):
so that we have control over,that we can actually make it
feasible?
Justine Reichman: (16:53):
And I'm curious about the produce in
Hawaii. I know Andy expressedthat while we have a lot of
options to think, California isreally big. We've got a lot of
different micro climates. So wehave a lot of different fruits
and vegetables that come up.What would you say are the top
ones for Hawaii that are grownthere that when people are
shopping locally, you'd wantthem to know about, or that they
(17:15):
do know about?
Tanner Keys: (17:16):
The normal type of banana. We have all sorts of
different varieties bananashere. We have apple bananas. We
have native wine cookingbananas. We have all these
different varieties that youjust like, when you just eat a
(17:36):
cavendish here, it's like, Ican't eat a normal banana
anymore. Opportunities likethat, we have what are called
white pineapples, which are justway sweeter. Very, very
different from pineapple thatyou get. Those are really
seasonal and pretty well guardedby the people that have them. I
would say, local things that youcan get here that are unique to
(17:57):
it, those are little treasures.But it is tough because, great,
I see all this fruit. I'm goingto assume it's from here. And
you're like, we grow lots oftress, and so that's a really
big thing to check in with. It'slocally grown fruit. But bananas
are actually a really huge crophere. You can see a lot of it
(18:18):
grown, replacing a lot of whatused to be sugar cane areas.
People who tend to do whitepineapples are also much more
diversified. The thing is that alot of folks here, most of them
are going to be diversifiedfarmers, like really diversified
farmers. Very few folks aredoing single to two different
(18:38):
crops. Very few people do that.
Justine Reichman: (18:40):
How does that compare to California and
Alaska?
Andy Naja-Riese: (18:44):
Well, I would say in California, everything's
at a different scale. But inCalifornia, more than 80% of our
farmers are considered smallfamily farms, and so they're
generally growing less, fewerthan 180 acres. But Farmers
Market farmers, we have farmersgrowing products on two acres,
(19:05):
three acres, up to 10 acres. Itall depends upon the crop. But
we're definitely seeing similarto what Tanner saying, more
diversified farming operations.So when I mentioned that we have
these certified producercertificates, so the variety of
products that farmers aregrowing has really continued to
(19:26):
change over time, and we'reseeing more integration of crop
systems with livestockoperations as well. And the
other thing too that we'reseeing is more, I would say,
vegetable farmers also growingflowers, which is really helping
for pollinators, and it alsohelps as part of your
diversification. But it alsohelps our farmers in the winter
(19:49):
months when it is a slowergrowing season to have more
crops available for sale. Ithelps to create more jobs, too.
But the thing that's interestingand I would say with California
is, or even here locally wherewe are in the North Bay, so in
Marin and Sonoma, our topcommodity after hay is milk. So
(20:12):
organic milk and poultry, thoseare our top products. And
actually, we produce half of thestate's organic milk in Marin
and Sonoma County, so it's quitea large production within our
region. We're home to StraussFamily Creamery, which works
(20:33):
with about a dozen small organicfamily farms. And there's a lot
of challenges impacting thedairy industry right now.
Especially the organic dairy,there's been an oversupply of
organic milk, and that'simpacted the pricing. So there's
a lot of challenges, I think,with respect to the dairy
industry right now. But I thinkthe other piece too, what's been
(20:55):
really important is withinCalifornia, because we're such a
diverse state as far asgeographies and cultural
backgrounds. So even within ourFarmers Market's, so at AG
Institute in Marin, we have ninemarkets, and our markets in
Marin County are very differentthan the markets in San
Francisco or the East Bay. Andour markets in our East Bay have
(21:18):
a much larger concentration offarmers that are Southeast
Asian, Hmong, Laotian.California, especially the
central valley after Minnesota,has a very large Hmong
population, and there are manymulti generational Southeast
Asian farmers that are growingtraditional crops like bitter
(21:41):
melon, bok choy, moringa thatthey do sell at the Farmers
Market. And what might work bepopular at one geographic
community might not be aspopular at a different
geographic community. And Ithink, like for me, the thing
that I feel like there's so muchsimilarity between all of us is
that each community shoulddefine what's relevant to them.
(22:03):
So every community has differentvalues, and every community
should have different choices.And that's why I think local
food is so important so thatlocal communities and local
farmers can decide what's mostimportant to them. And how do
they want to connect the peoplewho grow our food with the
people who are seekingnourishment.
Justine Reichman: (22:21):
to get back to you and hear what it's like
for you in Hawaii. Are there anyother resources that Tanner or
you, Andy, have that you tapinto?
Tanner Keys: (22:30):
We connect a lot with Washington State Farmers
Market Association. They hadbeen in existence since the 70s,
really talking to folks of whatthey've done. It does change
just when you come up togovernment compliance and
support, and that does changethe ball game a little bit. But
in determining differentprojects and how to do things,
(22:52):
it really was conversations withother associations or states. We
were doing the wicket FarmersMarket's. We were in the first,
but we work in conversation foryou with who else was doing.
Justine Reichman: (23:02):
It exciting to at least get the conversation
going to what's next for theFarmers Market's there, and then
equally learn about what youguys are doing, respectively,
Robbie and Tanner, and to seewhere it aligns, where you guys
are going differently, and whatwe can learn from each other to
implement in different placesaround the country? Because I
know that when we last spoke,you were in a different phase.
(23:24):
So we probably talked aboutRollin' Root, we talked about
some of those things. But if youwould just give us a high level,
maybe just the impact you'rehoping to generate from doing
this, and what it's taking alittle bit about that journey?
Andy Naja-Riese: (23:40):
So I think for us, we want to make sure that
small farmers and food makerscan keep doing what they do best
on the farm and in the kitchen,and Farmers Market's are so core
to their livelihood. We alsoknow that not everyone can
access Farmers Market's, and wewant to make sure we can
overcome those transportationand affordability barriers. So
(24:04):
we did launch a mobile FarmersMarket the Rollin' Root, and we
currently serve 14 differentcommunities across San Francisco
and Marin County where peoplemight be living in assisted
living, or a low income seniorhousing sites, or places with
limited access to food where wework with our local growers to
(24:26):
help facilitate direct access totheir produce at these different
sites. That's been reallyimportant, along with Tanner and
Robbie said, programs like SNAPand WIC. We have in California,
we call it market match. So wematch, we double people's bucks
through market match, and that'sa jointly funded program through
(24:47):
the state government and federalgovernment. I would say that the
two things that I think arereally important for us is,
number one, protecting thesevital programs like SNAP, WIC
and Market Match from cuts thatare happening left and right. We
know that the federal governmenthas been looking for ways to
(25:09):
reduce costs, but they're alsolooking for ways to make people
healthy and connect farmers withlow income communities. And
programs like SNAP, WIC andMarket Match are really
essential. It's the way thatwe're doing that and helping
people to stay healthy. So inCalifornia, aim and our
(25:31):
partners, through we have analliance called the Alliance of
California Farmers Market, andwe're really trying to do as
much advocacy as possible. We'vehelped to secure state funding
to keep the market match programgoing. But I think, we, in
California, and I thinknationally as a Farmers Market
and local food community, willhave to really speak up for
(25:52):
Farmers Market's and low incomefood assistance programs. The
second thing that I'm reallyexcited to share is that we've
been running Farmers Market's,and our largest market has over
200 spaces for producers, andwe've been doing this in a
parking lot at the Civic Centerfor years without any permanent
(26:14):
infrastructure for 42 years, andwe're just weeks away from
signing a 40 year leaseagreement where we'll have
access to a permanent site forour Farmers Market's that will
provide overhead protection. Sorain protection in the winter,
and shading in the summer, alongwith permanent amenities to
(26:35):
really demonstrate the dignityfor our farmers, and food
makers, and communities toaccess local food for future
generations, and it will be apermanent Farmer's Market
combined with a learning center.So alongside the permanent
market amenities that we'llhave, we'll also have teaching
kitchen, classroom anddemonstration garden, so we can
(26:57):
teach community members,children, backyard gardeners
about how to cook with localfood, and how to grow food. And
also train farmers in ways toremain competitive in local
sales and marketing. So we'rereally excited for building our
Center for Food and Agriculture.And one of the things in
California is there was aclimate bond that was passed by
(27:20):
the voters proposition 4 in the2024 ballot, and we were able to
get funding in this ballotmeasure as part of sustainable
agriculture for permanentinfrastructure for Farmers
Market's. So we're really amazedthat we were able to obtain
funding. It will becompetitively awarded to benefit
the entire Farmers Marketcommunity to pay for everything
(27:43):
from overhead canopies torestrooms, to traffic
management, to cookingfacilities to help support our
large scale local food systemwithin the state. So really
excited about that.
Justine Reichman: (27:55):
Thank you for sharing that. And for me, I know
that that's real inspiration,because I think that it takes
things to the next level. Itmakes it a formal structure. It
can't be moved anymore.Nothing's going to displace you.
And the farmers are going tohave a place to go sell their
food, and the consumers aregoing to have a place to go get
their food as well as learn moreabout it. I don't know about you
(28:18):
guys, I find that inspiring. ButI'm also curious in your parts
of the country, where are youguys going with your Farmers
Market's? What are you hoping toachieve? Maybe Tanner, you want
to kick it off in Hawaii and letus know?
Tanner Keys: (28:31):
Yeah. I think there's two really large things
that are looming over theculture of farmers markets. I
want to go back to theexplosion, at least for us,
explosion of food hubs and theniche that they've served.
Because we had a lot of farmersmarkets close because of the
(28:51):
pandemic, and a good portion ofthem did not open back up. And
for a lot of folks, the accessto local food has been a big
push by my organization, but wehave a lot of food nonprofits in
the state that are trying tofigure out, how do we deliver
and open up access to localfood? And the food hubs, they've
(29:14):
had huge fundraising efforts,and the capacity has just
exponentially increased over thepast couple of years. The health
of our Farmers Market's reallydependent upon the health of our
farmers, and that's been areally big question for us.
Because whether it's amendments,whether it's access to land,
access to water, I'm sureCalifornia understands water
(29:37):
rights issues. There's a lot ofchallenges for the farmer.
Justine Reichman: (29:41):
Tanner, can I just ask you as you go more into
this? You've mentioned food hubsa lot and some of, and I'm sure
we're familiar with the term,but I want to make sure that
when we're talking to ouraudience, we make sure that
they're in the loop. And if youcould distinguish between a food
hub versus a Farmers Market sothat everyone know what we're
talking about?
Tanner Keys: (30:01):
I think at least in our scope, we're seeing food
hubs as small food aggregators.You think about a food
processor, maybe you've seenthem, especially on the
continent, you'll probably seelarge processing factories,
where they're making value addedproducts. For us, let's say one
of our food hubs buys 300 poundsof bananas from four different
(30:24):
farmers, then they make bananachips. So they're able to take a
lot of those overhead costs fromfarmers, whether it's marketing,
distribution, compliance, andkind of loop it all into one
thing, and they kind of servespecific areas. But especially
on Oahu, they're able to servethe entire island, but it does
take a lot of that burden off ofthe farmers, so they can focus
(30:47):
on farming. And for a lot offarmers, even going to the
Farmers Market, that's a day offof work. And so they've had a
really strong impact of openingup time and capacity to engage
customers, to engage differenttypes of customers. Especially
institutions, which is reallybig for Hawaii of like, okay,
(31:08):
we're these food hubs, farmersmarket or one single farmer may
not be able to engage a hospitalor a school, but these food hubs
are able to. And that createskind of that a better price,
usually for those farmers tosell to these food hubs because
they have more consistent andforward contracting. The next
(31:28):
thing I was talking about isgrowing food is medicine
movement here in Hawaii, andreally working with hospitals
and insurance, and especiallyMedicaid to basically get
prescriptions for food,especially local food. And so
getting that Medicaid, gettingthose federal dollars to
basically pay for local food,and it's been a challenge,
(31:51):
especially with the news aboutMedicaid recently. But when
we're talking about folks whoneed nutritious local food--
Justine Reichman: (32:00):
That speaks to me, and I get excited when I
hear something like that.Because I believe that food and
nutrition is fundamental to howwe live, but healthfully and
happily, and I think it mattershow your food is grown. I think
it matters that you're eatingthings that have certain
nutritional aspects, so I lovethat you guys are doing that.
Andy Naja-Riese: (32:20):
So in California, there's actually a
statewide food as medicinecoalition. And so they're
working with a few differentgroups, like the series
community project and full wellto really help link federally
qualified health centers withlocal food and medically
tailored meals. So there's a lotof work that's happening. Like
(32:41):
Tanner mentioned, there's a lotof uncertainty with Medicaid
funding and what's going tohappen, but there's definitely a
movement that's taking place inthe state. The other thing too
that we do, so we work with oneof our local partners, fresh
approach. They're in ContraCosta County, and they run a
program called Veggie Rx. Andit's pretty cool the way it
(33:02):
works. So they work with anumber of hospitals, and
patients at the hospitals willgo through a series of cooking
and nutrition education classes.And then at the end, they
actually receive a prescriptionfor fruits and vegetables, which
they can redeem at our FarmersMarket's or Rollin' Root mobile
market. So I think it's a reallyimportant way to help introduce
(33:24):
people to local food and freshproduce, try to shift our
healthcare system away from thereliance on traditional
pharmaceuticals, to help thinkabout ways to change people's
diet. But I think we can do evenmore with this, but I am
concerned about what will happenwith state funding and federal
(33:46):
funding with Medicaid. Becausefor a lot of people, if we want
them to get access to healthyfood, someone has to pay for it.
It would be the Medicaidprogram, but there's definitely
more opportunity.
Justine Reichman: (33:57):
And as you're talking about this, I'm thinking
about something, and I'mthinking that I've heard so many
times that people say, going tothe Farmers Market's so
expensive, or it's moreexpensive. I completely agree
with that. I know that I go andbuy corn or tomato, and I think
they're less than when I go tomy local shop, my local grocery
store. And I've heard often thatwhen you're going to the Farmers
(34:21):
Market, I'm going directly tothe farm, and I'm paying him.
And so therefore, he gets agreater share. That resonates
with me, but I also am pathetic.I'm aware if somebody says, wow,
well, it's just so much moreexpensive. Can you guys talk to
that a little bit?
Andy Naja-Riese: (34:39):
Yeah. I can start. That's something that
comes up quite a bit. Well,number one, it's really
important to focus on, peopleare looking for high quality
produce from their local farmer.I think that's really essential.
And oftentimes, if I hearsomeone say, like, why is that
so expensive? The counter islike, well, why is that other
(34:59):
thing so cheap? Because cheapfood, there's a cost whether
it's your health, the planetaryissues, exploitation of low wage
workers, people of color. So Ifeel like there's a lot of those
challenges that are associatedwith cheap food, but I think
that we've done some looking atcomparing grocery store prices
(35:21):
to Farmers Market prices. Andactually, we just had a group of
students. They did their seniorproject from Marin Academy, and
they compared for five organicproducts at the Farmers Market
compared to local grocerystores. They actually found that
the products at the farmersmarket were cheaper than what
(35:41):
was for sale at the grocerystore.
Justine Reichman: (35:43):
This is a great start for our
conversation, and I hope thatthose listening today, we've
been able to answer some oftheir questions and give them
some greater insights. So I justwant to thank you guys all for
tuning in. So for those thatwant to learn more, can we
include your websites so thatpeople can float around, dig in
a little deeper to get moreinformation? Andy, how about
you?
Andy Naja-Riese: (36:03):
So we encourage you to visit our
website,agriculturalinstitute.org,
Justine Reichman: (36:09):
Perfect. And Tanner?
Tanner Keys: (36:12):
Our organization is hawaiigoodfoodalliance.org.
Justine Reichman: (36:18):
We'll make sure to put those in the show
notes as well. And again, I justwant to thank our guests and our
listeners for tuning in, becausethis community is so amazing.
They're so curious, and theywant to make more informed
changes, and it's folks likeyourselves that come on that
help us give them access to thatinformation, so I'm just very
grateful. So I want to thankeveryone for tuning in. For
(36:40):
those that are watching thepodcast today or listening to
the podcast, I should say, it'savailable on Spotify, or iTunes,
or wherever you listen topodcasts at Essential
Ingredients. It's available onYouTube, on the Essential
Ingredients channel. And forupdates and access to some
little behind the scenes andadditional information, you can
follow us on Instagram atessential.ingredients, so look
(37:03):
forward to seeing you here againnext week. Thanks again.
Good morning, and welcome to Essential
(00:15):
Ingredients. I'm your host,Justine. Today with me, I have
some new friends, some oldfriends. And of course, our
community of friends, and I'mreally excited for this
conversation. We brought Andyback from Agricultural Institute
of Marin. He is not a new face,but he's got lots of to share.
We're so excited to hear what'sgoing on with you, all the new
(00:36):
things that we can be excitedabout. And equally, learn a
little bit more about what yourgoals are. And learn from
Tanner, equally, who are new tome. But equally really excited
to have you here to be part ofthis conversation, to learn how
the different places in theworld around the continent are
(00:56):
looking at food accessibility,access and business. So I'm
going to kick it off with Andy.And Andy, if you would just
reintroduce yourself to thoselisteners and viewers that are
tuning in that maybe it's theirfirst time, or they just need a
little reintroduction.
Andy Naja-Riese: (01:16):
Well, thanks for having me back, Justine. I'm
Andy Naja-Riese, the CEO of theAgricultural Institute of Marin.
We're a non profit organizationbased in the Bay Area, and we
operate Farmers Markets foodaccess, education and policy
work to create a healthier, moreequitable, earth friendly, local
(01:37):
and regional food system.
Justine Reichman: (01:38):
Tanner is new to the community here, and I had
a little chance to talk toTanner before, and what an
amazing background. I was veryintrigued from the get go, so
I'd love for you, Tanner, if youwould, to just introduce
yourself, a little bit aboutyour initiative, and what you're
doing in Hawaii?
Tanner Keys: (01:58):
Sure. I'm currently the Cooperative
Agreement Manager for theIslands of Remote Areas Regional
Food Business Center. We workedwith Robbie in Alaska, the US
Pacific islands, otherterritories US Virgin Islands,
as well as Puerto Rico. We werefocusing on three key areas,
(02:19):
coordination, technicalassistance. I managed the Hawaii
Farmers Market Association for acouple years. And during that
time, also as the President of alocal Farmers Market fence
security project in HawaiiIsland. And I came to Hawaii
initially to work on anAmeriCorps project. I was
naturally based. It's kind ofreplacement size over the years.
(02:43):
It's just kind of my foodsecurity, kind of tribe started
when I was in that Peace Corps,and that's when I found out
about food corners, and justbeen one thing after the next
until the day.
Justine Reichman: (02:52):
Awesome. Well, that's great. Al the
backgrounds lead us to theFarmers Market here. What's
different, though, is ourgeography, different levels of
affordability in differentplaces, utility, etcetera. And I
really would just love for us tobetter understand the landscape
and what that means in all thesedifferent parts around the
(03:12):
country. I'd love to just startoff talking about the different
geographic locations and howthat impacts your access to
create access to these betterfree foods, the organic farms
and and all of that, and whatthat looks like? What the
landscape looks like?
Andy Naja-Riese: (03:31):
Sure. I'm happy to go first. I can speak
to our experience in California,and what makes California unique
in some ways is that we actuallyhave what are called, it's a
statewide program calledCertified Farmers Markets. And
in the 1970s, California createdstate regulations that would
(03:55):
essentially allow farmers tosell their products without
having to go through standardpacking, labeling and
distribution requirements. Sothis created a model known as
Certified Farmers Markets wherethe farmers who sell their
products at a Farmers Markethave to get a certificate from
(04:16):
the California Department ofFood and Agriculture and their
County Agricultural Commission.And on the certificate, they
list all the crops that they'regrowing. Or if they have eggs or
honey, they would identify thattoo. So in California, we
actually define local as withinCalifornia, and we have a large
state with 58 counties anddifferent growing regions. And
(04:40):
there's about in the state, Ithink there's over 600 Certified
Farmers Markets. And at AGInstitute of Marin, we run nine
Certified Farmers Markets. So wehave seven that are year round
markets across Marin, SanFrancisco and Alameda counties.
And then we have two seasonalmarkets. And I think what makes
it really special in Californiais that we have the year round
(05:02):
growing season, and people canshop the seasons and get a
variety of different produce inthe winter months versus the
summer months. And we also havevery different growing regions
as well, based upon differentclimate conditions and micro
climates. So having apples fromthe North Bay where I live,
those types of apples are verydifferent than apples from El
(05:25):
Dorado County and Apple Hill.There's different climate
conditions, different soil.Likewise, with a product like
avocados. We have avocados inSouthern California, but we also
have avocados as far north asthe Hayward hills, and the
varietals are very different aswell. So we really focus a lot
on year round access. And thenalso, California has a lot of
(05:50):
regulations. That's one of thethings California is known for
is a very large regulatoryenvironment, which can be a
challenge for small farmers. Butit also helps, we believe, to
create a level playing field. Sothat way, when you show up to
the Farmers Market, you knowthat you're buying from the
farmer that grew the product, tomake sure that's not coming from
(06:10):
a wholesaler. So some of thethings about California.
Justine Reichman: (06:13):
Awesome. I appreciate you sharing that. And
it's interesting because I camefrom the East Coast, and the
produce that we got there wasvery different. Union Square
market was very different. Theaccessibility to those different
produce was very different. Andthe focus on local was not quite
as prevalent as it here, in myexperience, because it just
(06:34):
didn't have the same accesscounter, if you would. Tell us a
little bit about Hawaii, theclimate there, or the access
there, and maybe some of thesimilarities that you can find
from California or Hawaii, orthe differences.
Tanner Keys: (06:48):
Yeah. I was just thinking about the elements. I
think both Hawaii can kind ofshare with between California
and Alaska, is that we obviouslyhave a year round climate. So
year round growing. But same asAlaska is that we do really face
the challenges of logistics.Inter Island shipping is
difficult. There used to be abarge. There's no longer a
(07:11):
barge. But something that hasbeen a big conversation,
especially with our larger foodhubs and food producers is, how
do we improve? Basically, interIsland logistics, inter Island
commerce, especially aroundagriculture, because each of
these islands is incrediblyunique to their Farmers Markets
(07:32):
needs. Each of our each county,or each island has its own. If
you're trying to get a certainfact that they have, each county
has a different approach to it.So there's a lot of sovereignty
for each of the counties and howthey manage their Farmers
Market's. Thinking about access,and even now, there's a lotof, I
guess you could call graymarket, unregulated Farmers
(07:54):
Market, just gatherings ofpeople selling food. And that's
been completely fine. In Oahu,there's a lot more people the
city and county saw a need tocreate something a little bit
more formal. And so back in the70s, they had created the
people's open market, which wasa city and county ran kind of
Farmers Market. And that wasreally successful for decades.
(08:15):
It was where people, whetherit's vegetables, fruits, but you
could also get live shellfish,live fish. It was very much, and
this was facilitated in the cityand county parks. That was until
recently died down. We reallyhad to analyze what are the big
changes in the past 5 to 10years, why these people's open
(08:37):
markets have declined? And Ithink it's part of a larger
scope of the changingenvironment in Hawaii. All of
these Farmers Markets are goingto be smaller, and we've been
working with a lot of them tomake it more accessible for food
because we have some of thehighest food prices. At the end
of the day, that food is goingto be cheaper at a grocery
(08:58):
store. Local food tends to bemore expensive. And so we've
been working with a lot ofFarmers Markets to open up that
access just because at the endof the day, the demand is so
much higher than the supply. Wefaced a challenge for farmers
that have access to land to beable to produce as much, to be
able to produce at scale. And sowe work at implementing SNAP,
(09:20):
implementing WIC, our DoubleBucks program. And so local
food, you're able to get halfoff. And so we're just trying to
find ways of opening it up forhow do we subsidize our farmers,
basically. Those have beenefforts of the past couple of
years. But I think a uniquething to Hawaii is, and maybe I
think Alaska experiences thistoo, is the impact of the
(09:42):
tourist industry on FarmersMarket's. And what is the
culture around Farmers Marketfor the community versus
tourism? Because there's areally strong distinction. And
so Oahu obviously gets the mosttourists, and so that you can
definitely see over the pastyears, especially, what markets
(10:03):
have been established andsupported for the tourist
industry versus how to find andfunnel local food while making
accessible. It's having snapwicker and double box is huge
and hugely impactful tocommunities. We have some of the
highest snap usage becausefood's so expensive, and so
(10:25):
that's been going on the pastcouple years. We were, I think,
one of the first states to takeon WIC at Farmers Market. And so
that's utilizing it so FarmersMarket's can actually use WIC
cards at the market.
Justine Reichman: (10:38):
I want to go back to something, and I really
appreciate all of what youshared about the geography, the
location, the differences, andeven the access using WIC and
SNAP. But before we move on, Iwant to go back to something
that Andy had mentioned aboutbeing certified and the organic
role, because I don't want toglaze over it. And I think it's
(11:00):
interesting, and I think it'simportant. And I know Andy, you
had talked a little bit aboutwhat we have here in California
that there's a lot ofregulations around that, so
maybe you could just touch onthat, and then we can hear from
Robbie and Tanner on what thatlooks like for them, and what
role it plays in the FarmersMarket's.
Andy Naja-Riese: (11:20):
So California, we have the Certified Farmers
Market program, and FarmersMarket's need to become
certified by the CountyEnvironmental Health and County
Agricultural Department, as wellas by the state. And then again,
the farmers that want to sell atthe market would have to receive
a certified producer certificatelisting all of the products that
(11:42):
they're selling by location. Andso there's a lot of paperwork
that goes into this process, andthe certification piece is
different than the organiccertification. So certified
Farmers Market means that theproducer, you have two or more
farmers gathering at the samelocation to sell their produce
(12:02):
to the public, being distinctfrom the organic certification.
So in California, the lastestimate, I think about is 5 to
7% of farmers are go through athird party certification to
become organic. And so meetingcertain requirements that's set
by the National Organic Program.We do find that among smaller
(12:24):
farmers, and including farmersthat sell at Farmers Market's,
we do see a higher likelihood ofthem being certified organic as
well. And so as an example, atAmes markets, we find that about
50% of the farmers are eithercertified organic or they're in
the process of going through athree year transition period. So
(12:46):
it takes three years to meet theorganic requirements to actually
have the organic label. And sothat's something that I think
has been largely in response tothe consumer demand for organic
within our community. There areother producers that may use
organic practices. But if theydon't go through the
(13:06):
certification, they actuallycan't say that they are organic.
Likewise, these requirementsalso apply to value added
producers or food makers. Theyneed to have certified that
they're doing organic productionin a certified organic kitchen.
So with all that said, there's alot of paperwork, there's a lot
of requirements, but it doeshelp producers from a marketing
(13:27):
standpoint where they can saythat they're certified organic,
and it does respond to a demandfrom local chefs or local
shoppers. In the Bay Area atleast, we do see a large demand
among consumers for certifiedorganic produce, and we do see
this across income levels aswell. So across different
(13:50):
shopping groups that there is ahigh demand for organic,
California also has set a goalto double the amount of farmland
that's certified organic as akey to climate mitigation
strategy. So we're seeing morefarmers getting certified
organic, and there's differentprograms that help farmers to
(14:11):
transition from conventional tocertified. But again, you don't
need to be certified organic tosell at a certified Farmers
Market, but it is something thatcan help you increase your
sales. Maybe offer a premium,and that additional sale can
then be put back into yourpractices, farm worker housing,
things like that.
Justine Reichman: (14:32):
And Tanner, I'm curious, where do you guys
fall into all this?
Tanner Keys: (14:36):
I'm trying to think of a lot of organic
growers who are certified, butgetting people to fly out here
to do it, a lot of folks,majority of Hawaii's farmers are
in five acres or less. Asignificant portion. So a lot of
them are small farmers, andadding to the scale. And most
folks that they are going tohave any sort of certification,
(14:57):
they're also in the grocerystores. They have multi channel.
Example, they're accessing themarket, and they've scaled to
that point where it makes sensefor them. But yeah, the
conversation, people will say,no spray. I think the term local
is really is the incentive tobuy just because it is difficult
to buy local food. That is thechallenge. The challenge is to
(15:19):
also find affordable, localfood. And so I think in addition
to that, these Farmers Marketare in communities, and food is
such a big part of the, I sayHawaiian culture, not only just
like native Hawaiian culture,but it's a big part of the
(15:40):
culture of Hawaii. It's veryingrained. So the way that
people relate to food is likethe way that they relate to
their farmers. And so if they'regoing to a Farmers Market,
they've made that choice, thatthey're going to have a
different relationship to food.And that is a decent population
of people. And so I would sayit's great. And usually they can
say, we do this organically, orwe do no spray. Non GMO is a
(16:03):
really, really big thing becausewe have Monsanto out here with
quite a few plots, and so peopleare familiar with GMOs. They're
just like, we don't want GMOfood. However, I liked the idea
of certification. And we'vetalked about it with a few
different folks at a state levelof developing our own
(16:25):
certifications, especially ifit's primarily regenerative, or
if it's primarily grown, if it'sa product, if it's a value added
product, like 60% of thatproduct is made here in Hawaii.
And so there's been definitelytalks of, how can we create
certification program that iscommunicated well within Hawaii
(16:48):
so that we have control over,that we can actually make it
feasible?
Justine Reichman: (16:53):
And I'm curious about the produce in
Hawaii. I know Andy expressedthat while we have a lot of
options to think, California isreally big. We've got a lot of
different micro climates. So wehave a lot of different fruits
and vegetables that come up.What would you say are the top
ones for Hawaii that are grownthere that when people are
shopping locally, you'd wantthem to know about, or that they
(17:15):
do know about?
Tanner Keys: (17:16):
The normal type of banana. We have all sorts of
different varieties bananashere. We have apple bananas. We
have native wine cookingbananas. We have all these
different varieties that youjust like, when you just eat a
(17:36):
cavendish here, it's like, Ican't eat a normal banana
anymore. Opportunities likethat, we have what are called
white pineapples, which are justway sweeter. Very, very
different from pineapple thatyou get. Those are really
seasonal and pretty well guardedby the people that have them. I
would say, local things that youcan get here that are unique to
(17:57):
it, those are little treasures.But it is tough because, great,
I see all this fruit. I'm goingto assume it's from here. And
you're like, we grow lots oftress, and so that's a really
big thing to check in with. It'slocally grown fruit. But bananas
are actually a really huge crophere. You can see a lot of it
(18:18):
grown, replacing a lot of whatused to be sugar cane areas.
People who tend to do whitepineapples are also much more
diversified. The thing is that alot of folks here, most of them
are going to be diversifiedfarmers, like really diversified
farmers. Very few folks aredoing single to two different
(18:38):
crops. Very few people do that.
Justine Reichman: (18:40):
How does that compare to California and
Alaska?
Andy Naja-Riese: (18:44):
Well, I would say in California, everything's
at a different scale. But inCalifornia, more than 80% of our
farmers are considered smallfamily farms, and so they're
generally growing less, fewerthan 180 acres. But Farmers
Market farmers, we have farmersgrowing products on two acres,
(19:05):
three acres, up to 10 acres. Itall depends upon the crop. But
we're definitely seeing similarto what Tanner saying, more
diversified farming operations.So when I mentioned that we have
these certified producercertificates, so the variety of
products that farmers aregrowing has really continued to
(19:26):
change over time, and we'reseeing more integration of crop
systems with livestockoperations as well. And the
other thing too that we'reseeing is more, I would say,
vegetable farmers also growingflowers, which is really helping
for pollinators, and it alsohelps as part of your
diversification. But it alsohelps our farmers in the winter
(19:49):
months when it is a slowergrowing season to have more
crops available for sale. Ithelps to create more jobs, too.
But the thing that's interestingand I would say with California
is, or even here locally wherewe are in the North Bay, so in
Marin and Sonoma, our topcommodity after hay is milk. So
(20:12):
organic milk and poultry, thoseare our top products. And
actually, we produce half of thestate's organic milk in Marin
and Sonoma County, so it's quitea large production within our
region. We're home to StraussFamily Creamery, which works
(20:33):
with about a dozen small organicfamily farms. And there's a lot
of challenges impacting thedairy industry right now.
Especially the organic dairy,there's been an oversupply of
organic milk, and that'simpacted the pricing. So there's
a lot of challenges, I think,with respect to the dairy
industry right now. But I thinkthe other piece too, what's been
(20:55):
really important is withinCalifornia, because we're such a
diverse state as far asgeographies and cultural
backgrounds. So even within ourFarmers Market's, so at AG
Institute in Marin, we have ninemarkets, and our markets in
Marin County are very differentthan the markets in San
Francisco or the East Bay. Andour markets in our East Bay have
(21:18):
a much larger concentration offarmers that are Southeast
Asian, Hmong, Laotian.California, especially the
central valley after Minnesota,has a very large Hmong
population, and there are manymulti generational Southeast
Asian farmers that are growingtraditional crops like bitter
(21:41):
melon, bok choy, moringa thatthey do sell at the Farmers
Market. And what might work bepopular at one geographic
community might not be aspopular at a different
geographic community. And Ithink, like for me, the thing
that I feel like there's so muchsimilarity between all of us is
that each community shoulddefine what's relevant to them.
(22:03):
So every community has differentvalues, and every community
should have different choices.And that's why I think local
food is so important so thatlocal communities and local
farmers can decide what's mostimportant to them. And how do
they want to connect the peoplewho grow our food with the
people who are seekingnourishment.
Justine Reichman: (22:21):
to get back to you and hear what it's like
for you in Hawaii. Are there anyother resources that Tanner or
you, Andy, have that you tapinto?
Tanner Keys: (22:30):
We connect a lot with Washington State Farmers
Market Association. They hadbeen in existence since the 70s,
really talking to folks of whatthey've done. It does change
just when you come up togovernment compliance and
support, and that does changethe ball game a little bit. But
in determining differentprojects and how to do things,
(22:52):
it really was conversations withother associations or states. We
were doing the wicket FarmersMarket's. We were in the first,
but we work in conversation foryou with who else was doing.
Justine Reichman: (23:02):
It exciting to at least get the conversation
going to what's next for theFarmers Market's there, and then
equally learn about what youguys are doing, respectively,
Robbie and Tanner, and to seewhere it aligns, where you guys
are going differently, and whatwe can learn from each other to
implement in different placesaround the country? Because I
know that when we last spoke,you were in a different phase.
(23:24):
So we probably talked aboutRollin' Root, we talked about
some of those things. But if youwould just give us a high level,
maybe just the impact you'rehoping to generate from doing
this, and what it's taking alittle bit about that journey?
Andy Naja-Riese: (23:40):
So I think for us, we want to make sure that
small farmers and food makerscan keep doing what they do best
on the farm and in the kitchen,and Farmers Market's are so core
to their livelihood. We alsoknow that not everyone can
access Farmers Market's, and wewant to make sure we can
overcome those transportationand affordability barriers. So
(24:04):
we did launch a mobile FarmersMarket the Rollin' Root, and we
currently serve 14 differentcommunities across San Francisco
and Marin County where peoplemight be living in assisted
living, or a low income seniorhousing sites, or places with
limited access to food where wework with our local growers to
(24:26):
help facilitate direct access totheir produce at these different
sites. That's been reallyimportant, along with Tanner and
Robbie said, programs like SNAPand WIC. We have in California,
we call it market match. So wematch, we double people's bucks
through market match, and that'sa jointly funded program through
(24:47):
the state government and federalgovernment. I would say that the
two things that I think arereally important for us is,
number one, protecting thesevital programs like SNAP, WIC
and Market Match from cuts thatare happening left and right. We
know that the federal governmenthas been looking for ways to
(25:09):
reduce costs, but they're alsolooking for ways to make people
healthy and connect farmers withlow income communities. And
programs like SNAP, WIC andMarket Match are really
essential. It's the way thatwe're doing that and helping
people to stay healthy. So inCalifornia, aim and our
(25:31):
partners, through we have analliance called the Alliance of
California Farmers Market, andwe're really trying to do as
much advocacy as possible. We'vehelped to secure state funding
to keep the market match programgoing. But I think, we, in
California, and I thinknationally as a Farmers Market
and local food community, willhave to really speak up for
(25:52):
Farmers Market's and low incomefood assistance programs. The
second thing that I'm reallyexcited to share is that we've
been running Farmers Market's,and our largest market has over
200 spaces for producers, andwe've been doing this in a
parking lot at the Civic Centerfor years without any permanent
(26:14):
infrastructure for 42 years, andwe're just weeks away from
signing a 40 year leaseagreement where we'll have
access to a permanent site forour Farmers Market's that will
provide overhead protection. Sorain protection in the winter,
and shading in the summer, alongwith permanent amenities to
(26:35):
really demonstrate the dignityfor our farmers, and food
makers, and communities toaccess local food for future
generations, and it will be apermanent Farmer's Market
combined with a learning center.So alongside the permanent
market amenities that we'llhave, we'll also have teaching
kitchen, classroom anddemonstration garden, so we can
(26:57):
teach community members,children, backyard gardeners
about how to cook with localfood, and how to grow food. And
also train farmers in ways toremain competitive in local
sales and marketing. So we'rereally excited for building our
Center for Food and Agriculture.And one of the things in
California is there was aclimate bond that was passed by
(27:20):
the voters proposition 4 in the2024 ballot, and we were able to
get funding in this ballotmeasure as part of sustainable
agriculture for permanentinfrastructure for Farmers
Market's. So we're really amazedthat we were able to obtain
funding. It will becompetitively awarded to benefit
the entire Farmers Marketcommunity to pay for everything
(27:43):
from overhead canopies torestrooms, to traffic
management, to cookingfacilities to help support our
large scale local food systemwithin the state. So really
excited about that.
Justine Reichman: (27:55):
Thank you for sharing that. And for me, I know
that that's real inspiration,because I think that it takes
things to the next level. Itmakes it a formal structure. It
can't be moved anymore.Nothing's going to displace you.
And the farmers are going tohave a place to go sell their
food, and the consumers aregoing to have a place to go get
their food as well as learn moreabout it. I don't know about you
(28:18):
guys, I find that inspiring. ButI'm also curious in your parts
of the country, where are youguys going with your Farmers
Market's? What are you hoping toachieve? Maybe Tanner, you want
to kick it off in Hawaii and letus know?
Tanner Keys: (28:31):
Yeah. I think there's two really large things
that are looming over theculture of farmers markets. I
want to go back to theexplosion, at least for us,
explosion of food hubs and theniche that they've served.
Because we had a lot of farmersmarkets close because of the
(28:51):
pandemic, and a good portion ofthem did not open back up. And
for a lot of folks, the accessto local food has been a big
push by my organization, but wehave a lot of food nonprofits in
the state that are trying tofigure out, how do we deliver
and open up access to localfood? And the food hubs, they've
(29:14):
had huge fundraising efforts,and the capacity has just
exponentially increased over thepast couple of years. The health
of our Farmers Market's reallydependent upon the health of our
farmers, and that's been areally big question for us.
Because whether it's amendments,whether it's access to land,
access to water, I'm sureCalifornia understands water
(29:37):
rights issues. There's a lot ofchallenges for the farmer.
Justine Reichman: (29:41):
Tanner, can I just ask you as you go more into
this? You've mentioned food hubsa lot and some of, and I'm sure
we're familiar with the term,but I want to make sure that
when we're talking to ouraudience, we make sure that
they're in the loop. And if youcould distinguish between a food
hub versus a Farmers Market sothat everyone know what we're
talking about?
Tanner Keys: (30:01):
I think at least in our scope, we're seeing food
hubs as small food aggregators.You think about a food
processor, maybe you've seenthem, especially on the
continent, you'll probably seelarge processing factories,
where they're making value addedproducts. For us, let's say one
of our food hubs buys 300 poundsof bananas from four different
(30:24):
farmers, then they make bananachips. So they're able to take a
lot of those overhead costs fromfarmers, whether it's marketing,
distribution, compliance, andkind of loop it all into one
thing, and they kind of servespecific areas. But especially
on Oahu, they're able to servethe entire island, but it does
take a lot of that burden off ofthe farmers, so they can focus
(30:47):
on farming. And for a lot offarmers, even going to the
Farmers Market, that's a day offof work. And so they've had a
really strong impact of openingup time and capacity to engage
customers, to engage differenttypes of customers. Especially
institutions, which is reallybig for Hawaii of like, okay,
(31:08):
we're these food hubs, farmersmarket or one single farmer may
not be able to engage a hospitalor a school, but these food hubs
are able to. And that createskind of that a better price,
usually for those farmers tosell to these food hubs because
they have more consistent andforward contracting. The next
(31:28):
thing I was talking about isgrowing food is medicine
movement here in Hawaii, andreally working with hospitals
and insurance, and especiallyMedicaid to basically get
prescriptions for food,especially local food. And so
getting that Medicaid, gettingthose federal dollars to
basically pay for local food,and it's been a challenge,
(31:51):
especially with the news aboutMedicaid recently. But when
we're talking about folks whoneed nutritious local food--
Justine Reichman: (32:00):
That speaks to me, and I get excited when I
hear something like that.Because I believe that food and
nutrition is fundamental to howwe live, but healthfully and
happily, and I think it mattershow your food is grown. I think
it matters that you're eatingthings that have certain
nutritional aspects, so I lovethat you guys are doing that.
Andy Naja-Riese: (32:20):
So in California, there's actually a
statewide food as medicinecoalition. And so they're
working with a few differentgroups, like the series
community project and full wellto really help link federally
qualified health centers withlocal food and medically
tailored meals. So there's a lotof work that's happening. Like
(32:41):
Tanner mentioned, there's a lotof uncertainty with Medicaid
funding and what's going tohappen, but there's definitely a
movement that's taking place inthe state. The other thing too
that we do, so we work with oneof our local partners, fresh
approach. They're in ContraCosta County, and they run a
program called Veggie Rx. Andit's pretty cool the way it
(33:02):
works. So they work with anumber of hospitals, and
patients at the hospitals willgo through a series of cooking
and nutrition education classes.And then at the end, they
actually receive a prescriptionfor fruits and vegetables, which
they can redeem at our FarmersMarket's or Rollin' Root mobile
market. So I think it's a reallyimportant way to help introduce
(33:24):
people to local food and freshproduce, try to shift our
healthcare system away from thereliance on traditional
pharmaceuticals, to help thinkabout ways to change people's
diet. But I think we can do evenmore with this, but I am
concerned about what will happenwith state funding and federal
(33:46):
funding with Medicaid. Becausefor a lot of people, if we want
them to get access to healthyfood, someone has to pay for it.
It would be the Medicaidprogram, but there's definitely
more opportunity.
Justine Reichman: (33:57):
And as you're talking about this, I'm thinking
about something, and I'mthinking that I've heard so many
times that people say, going tothe Farmers Market's so
expensive, or it's moreexpensive. I completely agree
with that. I know that I go andbuy corn or tomato, and I think
they're less than when I go tomy local shop, my local grocery
store. And I've heard often thatwhen you're going to the Farmers
(34:21):
Market, I'm going directly tothe farm, and I'm paying him.
And so therefore, he gets agreater share. That resonates
with me, but I also am pathetic.I'm aware if somebody says, wow,
well, it's just so much moreexpensive. Can you guys talk to
that a little bit?
Andy Naja-Riese: (34:39):
Yeah. I can start. That's something that
comes up quite a bit. Well,number one, it's really
important to focus on, peopleare looking for high quality
produce from their local farmer.I think that's really essential.
And oftentimes, if I hearsomeone say, like, why is that
so expensive? The counter islike, well, why is that other
(34:59):
thing so cheap? Because cheapfood, there's a cost whether
it's your health, the planetaryissues, exploitation of low wage
workers, people of color. So Ifeel like there's a lot of those
challenges that are associatedwith cheap food, but I think
that we've done some looking atcomparing grocery store prices
(35:21):
to Farmers Market prices. Andactually, we just had a group of
students. They did their seniorproject from Marin Academy, and
they compared for five organicproducts at the Farmers Market
compared to local grocerystores. They actually found that
the products at the farmersmarket were cheaper than what
(35:41):
was for sale at the grocerystore.
Justine Reichman: (35:43):
This is a great start for our
conversation, and I hope thatthose listening today, we've
been able to answer some oftheir questions and give them
some greater insights. So I justwant to thank you guys all for
tuning in. So for those thatwant to learn more, can we
include your websites so thatpeople can float around, dig in
a little deeper to get moreinformation? Andy, how about
you?
Andy Naja-Riese: (36:03):
So we encourage you to visit our
website,agriculturalinstitute.org,
Justine Reichman: (36:09):
Perfect. And Tanner?
Tanner Keys: (36:12):
Our organization is hawaiigoodfoodalliance.org.
Justine Reichman: (36:18):
We'll make sure to put those in the show
notes as well. And again, I justwant to thank our guests and our
listeners for tuning in, becausethis community is so amazing.
They're so curious, and theywant to make more informed
changes, and it's folks likeyourselves that come on that
help us give them access to thatinformation, so I'm just very
grateful. So I want to thankeveryone for tuning in. For
(36:40):
those that are watching thepodcast today or listening to
the podcast, I should say, it'savailable on Spotify, or iTunes,
or wherever you listen topodcasts at Essential
Ingredients. It's available onYouTube, on the Essential
Ingredients channel. And forupdates and access to some
little behind the scenes andadditional information, you can
follow us on Instagram atessential.ingredients, so look
(37:03):
forward to seeing you here againnext week. Thanks again.
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