June 26, 2025 • 38 mins
Your brand is your reputation - and in today’s digital world, it’s your most valuable business asset.
In this episode of From Crisis to Justice, Parag Amin sits down with Liana Zavo, founder of Zavo Media PR Group, to unpack what it really takes to build a credible, authentic, and powerful personal brand that drives real business results.
With over 15 years of PR and media experience across 12 countries, Liana has helped thousands of business owners, entrepreneurs, and thought leaders turn their story into visibility, authority, and opportunity.
Whether you're trying to recover from a crisis, step into the spotlight, or simply reach more of the right audience - this conversation breaks down what you need to know.
Topics include:
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Crisis Management: How to take control of your narrative before someone else does.
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Thought Leadership vs. Influencing: Why business owners should always lead with substance.
-
Branding Mistakes to Avoid: Why “performance over perfection” should be your new mantra.
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The ROI of PR: What business owners need to understand before they invest.
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Building a Public Image: How to get media-ready and position yourself with confidence.
This is a must-listen for any founder, CEO, or executive ready to elevate their business through a powerful and profitable personal brand.
🔗 Guest Links:
Website: https://www.zavomedia.com
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/lianazavo
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lianazavo
🔗 Learn More About Parag:
Law Firm: https://www.lawpla.com
Personal Website: https://www.paraglamin.com
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/paragaminesq
TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@paragaminesq
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/parag-l-amin-5504449
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/lawplapc
Newsletter Signup: https://tinyurl.com/LawPLAsignup
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Hi, I'm Parag Amin.
Welcome to my podcast.
From Crisis to Justice.
As a lawyer and entrepreneur, I'mpassionate about helping small business
owners successfully navigate situationsthat can kill a business.
As a kid, I watched my dad's dreamsof being an entrepreneur were destroyed
by an unethical businessman, and I don'twant that to happen to you or your family.
(00:22):
That's why I started my law firm.
I want to protect and defend businessowners and their legacies from crisis.
Welcome to From Crisis to Justice.
Welcome back, everybody.
To the From Crisis to Justice podcast.
I'm your host, Parag Amin,and I'm joined today by a special guest.
(00:46):
Liana Tsavo.
Liana is the founder of her own PR company
and she is the CEO of TsavoMedia PR Group, a globally recognized
agency helping founders and organizationsbuild powerful, lasting personal brands.
She has over15 years of entrepreneurial experience
(01:07):
and a client networkspanning 12 countries.
She's become a trusted strategistin public relations and media authority.
Her epic method has helpedthousands of entrepreneurs
break through the noise,get featured and grow with purpose.
She's a passionate advocatefor women in business and a contributor
(01:28):
to Forbes and entrepreneur magazines,and her mission is clear
to help leaders turn their storyinto their greatest asset.
Rihanna,thank you so much for joining me today.
Thank you for having me, Parag.
I am so excited to get into the details.
Let's do it.
So so look, how did youhow did you end up in PR?
(01:49):
I had this grit.
I knew that I had to become a publicist,even though I am a college dropout.
But there are so many thingsthat were just pointing me
in the right directionthat I need to tell other people's stories
and uplift their personalitiesand inspire audiences.
It all started with my grandmother.
She was a journalist in Russia,a political journalist, and her telling
(02:10):
stories of how she navigated,you know, a lot of personalities.
I was just so amazed and inspired
that I wanted to I aspire to be like her.
So I knew that it's in my DNA.
But just a lot of things happenedin my life where I got married young.
I had my son at 19, so my son is incollege and it's just so much happened
(02:32):
and I had to find a way to get into PR,not the traditional route, even
though I did go and get my certificate,I hired a lot of mentors.
I think thatwhen you don't have the traditional route
and you don't have a degree,I think you need to double down
so much more because there'sso much more expected of you.
And so I'm still learning.
You're always a student of this craftthat the landscape is always evolving.
(02:56):
And so here I am doing what I love.
I love it.
That's great being passionate about you.
What you do is so critical,and I think it makes a world of difference
in terms of the resultsyou get in the way clients even feel
when they're working with you.
Absolutely. It's the energy, right?
It's what you you can be.
(03:18):
There's so many publicist pride.
I always say that
there's so many PR companies,but how you deliver the message
and how you make your clients feel,how I hold their hand
through the whole process.
That's what really sets me apartfrom my competitors.
Yeah, 100%.
So, you know, as a part of your work,I'm sure you've helped
entrepreneurs navigateboth personal and professional crises.
(03:41):
So when somebody's brand is under fire,
where do you advise
clients to begin to rebuild or reposition?
Because, you know, ultimately I think
your brandis is in a way an extension of yourself
and your business is in a wayan extension of yourself.
And when something you've builtand it's so close to you is under fire
(04:04):
or under attack,whether it's a negative review
online or somebody saying something
that is damaging to your reputation,it very much
feels like a personal attacks of somebodygoing through something like that.
What recommendations or advice
do you have for businessowners and entrepreneurs?
(04:24):
Absolutely.
And so being a crisis managerand I help navigate your story.
So, first of all, I got to tell you,the ten years of being in this business
and seeing firsthandthat every business will have crisis.
There's no way that you'renot going to face some sort of crisis.
So it can be from small to big,but it's all about how do you bounce back?
(04:45):
How do you bounce backfrom falling into this crisis?
Numberone thing I would highly recommend is to
just come up and be authentic, right?
Transparent with your audience.
This is what happenedand I would like to address it.
You want to hold controland be in control of your narrative.
Don't let someone else take take,take control of your narrative.
(05:06):
Right. This number one thing.
Take accountabilityfor what has gone wrong
and make sure that you speak about itfirsthand.
A lot of timesthat attorneys would say to their client
to not talk about it,can not talk about it in public right now.
Make sure you hold off.
That in itself will createmore of a crisis because it's time.
Time is of the essence.
(05:26):
When something happens,you have to address it right there
and then and make sure that you come offvery authentic and admit to your mistake.
Apologize. This is what happens.
And if you were to turn, what I do for
my clients is I say, okay, well,this is what happened to you.
How can we mitigate this and findanother approach to your personal brand
(05:49):
so that you can come out in the limelightand highlight and spotlight you?
Well, we have to find ways out.
Perhaps find a charity.
Let's give back.
You know,you need to find ways in order to come up
as a positive image in the public eye.
That's the whole purpose of PR as well.
When you are in a crisis, what can we do
to find ways to correctwhat has gone wrong?
(06:12):
So give you a small exampleof when a client is,
you know, sounding like someone else.
Their story doesn'tstay true to someone like themselves
and they kind ofcopying and copyrighting others
people's posts and they're soundinglike someone else in their industry.
And so that in itselfcreated a huge crisis.
And so you need to stop feeling like
(06:36):
you can be the faceand the voice of your brand.
You need to step up,be the voice, because you are different.
You might think your message resonateslike someone else is saying What?
They're saying the same thing, right?
Another attorney is saying the same thingas you are, for example.
But that shouldn't stop youfrom expressing yourself
and actually building your brand
because you have a different wayof delivering the message.
(07:00):
So always think abouthow do you deliver the message?
It's your tonality, it's your energy,it's your presence.
So stop sounding like everyone else.
Everyone else is taken. Be yourself.
Yeah, I love that.
And you know, it's interestingbecause I give very similar advice
to clientswhen they're going through litigation.
I think a lot of times, you know,there's a there's a feeling
(07:23):
or maybe a fear of
just being transparent about what'sgoing on and feeling vulnerable.
But, you know, at the end of the day,when it comes to litigating cases or maybe
even PR from from what I'm understanding,you say
it comes down to being authentic
because at the end of the day,when people try to hide the reality,
(07:44):
when people try to hide the truth,I think inevitably the truth comes out.
And then ultimately the person who triedto hide the truth looks way worse.
So it's much better to embrace,I think, the bad facts, at least
as it comes to litigation and disputes,rather than try to hide them.
And it sounds like.
Is that what you're saying about PRas well as learn how to embrace them?
(08:08):
Absolutely.
They learnhow to actually be ahead of the game.
So you know that you messed upand it has come, you know, already there.
So instead of having journalistsknocking on your doors
and saying, can you give us a statement,what went wrong?
Avoid that avoided at all.
Cause just come out and say what happenedso that you won't be pulled
(08:28):
in so many directions to give a statement.
Yeah, I agree with that.
And look, I mean, part ofthis is maybe, maybe ironically,
in the age of social media,I feel that people are shyer than ever
and a little bit more introvertedthan ever in the sense of
and even with the growth of social media,a lot of personal interaction
(08:50):
does have decreasedreal time in-person interactions.
And so I think people feel a little bitmore insecure than ever before as well.
So what advice do you have for businessowners who are maybe not as extroverted
or as confident as they'd like to be about
being on camera,being out there, giving statements?
(09:14):
You know,
that's the best part of my careerand what I do, my profession.
I think that me preparing youand helping you with your confidence
and unleash that story, it's likereally unveiling those those parts of you.
It's like taking an onion apart.
There's so many layers to you.
So the very first thing that I help withmy clients is the confidence.
It's 80% is mindset.
(09:35):
How you telling your storyreally stems from that.
And then I wrote a book about it.
It's the epic methodthat I teach my entrepreneurs,
my professionals I work with.
It's the 80% of beliefthat your story matters, that you're
actually going to make a differencewith your story and personal brand, right?
That's where it stems from.
If you don't have a personal brandand you feel that,
(09:57):
you know, I'll just kind of have mymy professional brand speak for itself
and my company speak for itself.
But right now, you know,social media is so personal.
We want to know who you areon a personal level.
So if you if you are strugglingto tell your story and a lot of attorneys
to have that problem,they're very risk adverse,
you know, for them to come onand actually get their story.
(10:19):
You know, it takes a lot of courage.
So what I do is, first of all,I have my challenge that I do with my
my attorneys.
What we do is we have this 21 daysof where I hone in on your messaging.
I make sure that you are actually speakingand conveying your message accordingly.
And we go through that.It's it's the whole process.
And the number one thing I would sayis, what are you trying to do?
(10:42):
What is the impactyou're trying to make? Right.
As a as a thought leader, everyone hasto be a thought leader in their industry.
People will come to youonly if they are seeking advice.
Right.
And they're seeking advicenot from influencers but thought leaders.
So are you a thought leader in a business?Yes, you are.
So then what are your insights?
How can people learn from you?
Are you a business thought leader?
(11:03):
So that is what I create.
I turn leaders into thought leadersand the number one thing I would say,
well, if I were to come to you,what insights will I learn from you?
What are the key takeawaysthat lead with that?
If you can start leading with your keytakeaways, your insights, how you can,
what you can teach the audience,what is the value you're bringing, right?
Because a personal brand standson three pillars.
(11:23):
It's the purpose,
the value proposition, What is the purposeyou're bringing right to your audience?
How consistent are you with that messageand how authentic are you?
So you have to leadwith authenticity, consistency
and then yourpurpose, which is your value.
Yeah.
And when it comes to consistencyand value.
Do you, do you recommend that
(11:44):
people have oneor maybe a few specific taglines
or positionsthey have that they continue to repeat?
Or is it really based more aroundlike fundamental type core values around
what that person specifically valuesand then speak from those?
Or is it something completely differentthat I haven't mentioned the meaning?
(12:05):
It's an either one of those. It'ssomething completely different.
Yeah, it's actually all of that,plus more.
So when you're speaking about
we don't want to hear just about youas a professional, it gets boring.
We want to know about your experiences,unique qualities,
what sets you apart, your personality.
That's what a personal brand is.
How are you as a team player?
(12:25):
What kind of collaborations are you?
You know, are you into?
So that showcases who you areon the inside perhaps, you know,
they spend with your kids,get a little bit more personal
you know key takeawaysfrom from being with your kids all day,
for example, or something that kind ofis like a conversation starter.
And also we can get to know you personallybecause remember, at the end of the day,
(12:49):
people want to connect with youon an emotional level, right?
People want to buy from other people,whether they're products or services,
when they're emotionallyconnected with you.
And how can people be emotionallyconnected with you?
Not on the surface level,but on the very authentic level, right?
You want to get them into your life,into your story.
I mean,
(13:10):
and then the question that comes up, well,how raw can you get with your audience?
How much do you let them into your life?
Well, you know, get as as raw as possible,I would say, and authentic as possible
so that you can they can feelthat they can be relevant to you.
Right. That there is a resonance there.
Are they finding relevance relevant?
So if they find relevance and resonance,I think that in itself,
(13:33):
he did a great job bringing the audienceto find out more about you.
So a personal brand, a professional brandstems on being personal,
which is your unique value propositionin your experience?
Is your personality.
What sets you apart?
Your personality essentiallyis what really makes you different
from another attorneyand litigation, correct?
So, you know, that in itselfwill definitely,
(13:55):
you know, help people helpyou stand out from a crowded marketplace.
Yeah.
And what would you sayto the people who think that they don't
have a great personalityor that it's not a personality
worth following? They don't.
I think everyone hasan amazing personality.
You just have to dig deeper, right?
And that's where I come in as a personalbranding expert and a public relations
(14:18):
specialist and a strategist, I make surethat we hone in on that messaging.
And then you're like,Oh, wow, that's the aha moment.
That's like the light bulb went off.
Oh, I didn't know.
I have to take this approachto hone in on my messaging.
And then we take your messagingand then we go a step further.
Let's now make sure that relatability,which is your personal brand,
where you're relatingto others on social media, Right.
(14:41):
And how you take presenting yourselfin front of the audience.
Now we taking a step furtherwhere I'm saying, okay, now it's time
to take you and get youan exclusive interview.
Let's get you an exclusive interviewand talk to your publication.
Now, that's the credibility.
Let's get you recognizedbecause you're credible.
Now, relatability on social mediais one thing.
You're relatable.
(15:01):
It's great when crisis happens,especially,
you want to go into press right away.
We have to take you into pressbecause that in itself is third party
that actually validates your story.
So who's validating your story?
Who's actually speaking about youbeing highlighted and spotlighted?
So that's a misconception.
Oh, I'm on social media. I post.
That's good enough.
(15:22):
That's not at all, actually, becausethat's just that's the surface level.
Like who else is speaking about you?
So that's another part of finding waysto mitigate your crisis as well.
And not even crises just
to build your strong online reputationand just statistically proven,
82% of people will Googleyou before stepping
foot in your location, signing a contractor even getting on a call with you.
(15:45):
So that's a big percentage.
So if you don't have anything
that's credible on your social meet,I mean, in your online presence,
which is your online reputation,they're going on to the next one, right?
So you need to make surethat not only all your communication,
your social media is being cohesive,Right.
It's following, but also you taking thatand then having PR done for you
(16:05):
and then perhapsmarketing later on. Advertising.
But the two most importantthings is personal branding and PR,
right? Yes.
And, you know, Ithink a big part of this is with a lot of
maybe smaller businesses don't realizeand something that I learned
as I started taking on biggerand more and more
(16:26):
either important or more valuable cases,
especially with celebrity clientsand that kind of thing,
I think a lot of people don't realizehow many people are behind the scenes.
It's not just one lawyer, it'snot only multiple lawyers.
Usually it's a teamas well as other people on the team,
which which typically includes a publicistor PR person.
(16:47):
And many timesit's a combination of people
who are helping craft the messaging,helping
ensure it gets out to the right audience,to the right publications
that the right interviewsare strategically done and placed,
and a lot of mediapreparation that goes into it. So
let me ask you this.
I think it's made sense, at least
(17:09):
when I've seen it,when when we've got clients
who are celebrities,who are in the public spotlight
and a news story breaks and it gets intotwo major publications, But
I don't know exactly when it makes sense.
If it's let's say it's
a smaller business or a smaller companyor somebody doesn't have
the same type of following or the mediaisn't naturally kind of reporting on it
(17:34):
because it doesn't naturally come upis almost like gossip about a celebrity.
So what are your thoughts, Ileana, on
how big should a company bewhen they really kind
of consider hiring a publicistor someone like yourself
relating to whether it's a lawsuitor some kind of crisis?
So, yeah, this is a twofold question.
(17:55):
So first of all,I one thing that I've been working
with over and overis that it's not just No.
One to dispelthis myth. It's not for big companies.
This PR I even work with SolopreneurPR is also
and I don't workwith when you said the story breaks and
I don't work with entertainment,I only do corporate PR.
(18:17):
So if you tell mehow can I get this, the story itself
right in PR will get as much buzzas possible on a corporate level.
Right.
So I'm going to get you into Bloomberg,for example.
Forbeson Forbes Entrepreneur Magazine, Inc.
And as small as like one personwanting the company
to a Fortune 500, that'sI can't tell you, Parag,
(18:39):
that it's only meantfor X amount of employees working for you.
It really depends how much you wantto invest in your business.
How do you want to be you know, howdo you want to be different from others?
Are you setting yourself apart?
So when it comes to entertainmentPR, it's totally different.
I know you work with a lot of celebrities,like you said,
(18:59):
but I don't work with celebrities.
I work solely like yourself, attorneyswho want to get thought leadership,
thought, leadership is totally differentthan, you
know, creating a whole like media buzz.
We are getting you outthere as a thought leader
because we want you to stand outfrom other thought leaders.
So that's that's a difference.
And when it comes to thought, leadership
(19:20):
even solopreneur uswho are just starting their firm.
And it's very rare to see that.
But I work with one person before,but mostly, you know,
there's athere's a team, a little team behind them.
A press
release is great to start with, you know,but I like to work on a yearly basis.
So that just to go back to your question,I think it's important to understand that
how much of an investment andwhat is the best promotional tool for you?
(19:43):
There's marketing does advertise saying,but what is more credible
and gives you the most,which is going to be the ROI,
which is the most costeffective promotional tool is PR
because PR is it createstrust with the audience, right?
We are creating trust that you are the goto industry expert for them to work with.
(20:05):
Marketing doesn't do thatand advertising will never do that.
So when a third party validates you,such as a Forbes magazine, for example,
your story, that's PRSo you know what I can say.
It's all about how much you want to investand and PR is not even that expensive,
to be honest with you. It'svery affordable.
Yeah. So. So what does that mean?What does that mean?
(20:25):
Dollars incentivize realistically,what what can someone spend
and what kind of numbersprobably make sense for
for various kinds of sized businessesor maybe based on the type of reach
and audience and appearancesthey want to get?
You know, it's tailored to each one,like you just said, what you want.
(20:49):
What are you looking toget on podcast, for example?
Because I also have a network network.
Are you looking to you know,we also help with like LinkedIn as well.
Like if you want to just startwith your personal brand
and get your thought leadership onLinkedIn and then move into publications.
We do that as well.
So a pricewise, I started with a retainer,a $5,000 per month,
and I curate that dependingon what we're getting you.
(21:11):
And it goes all the way up to 2015to $20000 a month,
really, depending on what I'm getting foryou almost in 12 countries.
Do you want to go global?
Do you want global recognition?
So we get you in a different partnershipstrategically into this.
Not only that, I'm
getting into publications,I get you on to the TED talk, for example.
We help you with that,getting you on stages,
executive positioningus, speaking opportunities.
(21:34):
At the end of the day, as a thoughtleader, you also speaker, right?
You want to speak in differenton different conferences.
So how are you being positionedto all of that?
I would take into consideration,yeah, absolutely.
And you know,what's interesting as well is
I think a lot of people don't realize that
many times there's
invitations that thatthat get provided to speakers.
(21:55):
But then there's very much and I, I wouldguess just based on what I've seen,
that it might even be the majorityof these conferences, that it is very much
a pay to play, meaning
like you have to pay generallyto to be able to speak or present.
Can you talk at all about that in terms ofis that accurate, Is that not accurate?
And and when should somebodyreally be thinking about, hey, look, I
(22:19):
this makes sense as an investmentfor me to pay
to speak at a conference versusnow it doesn't make sense to do this.
Well I'll be honest with youI have conferences I do summits
every four months myself from my audience,from my clients, and everyone that
speaks of anywhere from 8 to 10 panelistsevery time I have a summit.
And that's about three times a year.
(22:39):
So all my panelists,they are sponsors as well.
So what does that mean?
They will be featuredto have credibility aspect of that.
They'll be featured on like a stepand repeat.
They'll be in the press, in the media,
because the whole point of the summit ishow do you position yourself right?
And so if you are investing in yourself,
so then that is a way for youto step into the limelight, right?
(23:01):
For me to give you that ability to speakat my summit, you need to also invest
into your personal brandand into your online reputation.
If I see you don'thave an online reputation and you
you really have never position yourself,then yes,
you will have to invest in orderfor you to speak on my panel.
But then again,if you have done immense work
and you are incredible,you still need something.
(23:24):
I think there's always a press release.
There's always somethingthat you can kind of work on, but
there's always so many other a speakingopportunities you don't need to pay for.
Maybe there's smaller.
Also, if you have a big following,a huge following
and you have a lot of impact,you're making a big impact.
I think that in itself
speaks volumes and youperhaps don't even need to pay for it.
(23:45):
Right?
But if I'm talking about like panelist
who have no online reputation,then they need to invest in themselves.
Right? So it really dependswhere you're speaking.
And also depends because LinkedIn rightnow, as you know, it's huge, right?
It's bigger than Instagram,Facebook, LinkedIn,
because now they incorporatedvideos and video and it's all right.
(24:08):
89% of founders are alignedwith video content
when it comes to aligning themselveswith brand values.
Right?
So if I don't seeany videos on your LinkedIn, I don this.
I don't understand your messaging becauseas I mentioned, 89% is a big number.
It's a huge statistic.
So you have to startgetting videos out there.
(24:28):
And once you start doing that,you're already creating
a very compelling narrativeand that in itself will help you attract
different opportunities, right?
You'll have people knocking on your socialmedia door like, can you speak here?
Can you get on my TV show?
But up until that time,I think you should definitely find a team
that can help you do that.
Yeah, absolutely.
(24:48):
And part of this is what's goodwhen it comes to branding
because you've helped so many peopleand companies brand
What's what's a branding mistakethat you've seen throughout?
Like eventhe best founders have made this.
And if people could just get this thing
right, this one thing, if you had to pickone thing, it would help.
(25:08):
Then tremendous early,
like just just build their brand better
consistency.
I've seen that they would do one videothey will slack
Oh, I'll get to it tomorrow or even like
answer these questions.
Can you just answer these questions?We need to get you into a publication.
We need this rightright away For the look.
(25:30):
When you signing up to do PR, you have tounderstand that it is going fast.
We are having deliverablesafter deliverables and so
if you're not answering those questions,if you're don't have time for us, don't
even think about PRbecause PR is an investment in yourself.
Right?
And so we're honingin, we're polishing off your messaging,
making sure that you're positionedas the authority in your industry.
(25:51):
So the number one thing I thinkwhat I've seen is that I don't have time
right now.
This is too much for menot being consistent.
And then once you're not consistent,then it's taking a toll on us.
And, you know, I can have that, you know,then all the agreements
that I've done with the journalists, like,can you get this one here?
Can you feature this?
Or a client right. With their messaging?
(26:12):
It's just going to fall behind
because you're just not doingyour work as well, right?
LeonaAbsolutely, Because, you know, I think
I think pretty much everything requireseither
a commitment of time, of money or both.
So when it comes to PR or,
(26:33):
you know, we talked a little bit about
the financial investmentcomponent of things, but
can you touch a little bit on time?
Like realistically, how much time shouldsomebody who's thinking about investing in
this really put asideper week or per month
to to do it right?
Yeah.
So starting off, I would say anywhere from
(26:54):
like 3 to 5 hours a week,
that means I would getting on a strategycall every week,
sometimes twice a week to make surethat strategy has to be there.
Right. The foundation has to be laid out.
So 45 minutes to an hour right there.
And then you have another hour to answer,maybe questions, kind of.
So maybe 3 hours to begin with.
(27:17):
And then it kind of stacks on that
gets more and more, dependingif you want to get featured on TV,
if I'm getting you interviewedon major national TV stations.
So it really depends.
So I need to get to media training.
You know, all of that takes a lot of time.
So but, you know, that in itselfis such a reward because there's
nothing like PR and a lot of peopledon't understand the essence of PR.
(27:40):
It's always like, oh, is this marketingnow two different animals, right?
Marketing goeshand in hand with PR, right?
Once we get you featured on TV,then we marketing to kind of distributed
get the buzz going.
But the essence right,the credibility source is PR.
You can't do marketingwithout that credibility. Source.
What is that?
(28:00):
How am I positioning you?
And when it comes to the wordPR or public relations,
I think there's there's different conceptsof how people think of it.
So, you know, what what do you thinkis the right way to think about PR?
What is PR?
PR Is your public image.
(28:22):
How are you being perceived?
A positive public image, Right?
And so it can be PR is in person,PR is online
way before you know,it was all about in person.
Correct.
Before any of these publicationscame out online, it was all about
how are you navigating your story?
How are you speaking to the audience,making sure that it resonates,
(28:45):
your message resonates.
So writing your speeches,all of that is PR, right?
It just depends how we are looking at it.
And so I think that PR is all abouthow are you coming?
How is your persona in the limelight?
Is it positive public image
and how are you being sound nowespecially you need to be sound.
(29:08):
It's it's about recognition.
How are you being trusted?
You're being trusted based on one thing,your credibility and your recognition.
Right? And so that is your positive image.
So if you tell me, well, I amI have a million likes on LinkedIn
or Instagram, that is not yourthat's not the official public image.
(29:30):
The public image is when I Google you,which is the digital real state.
What shows up in your digital real estate?
That is your PR?
Mm Yeah, that's, that's,that's a great way to think about it.
So you know in terms of
your PR
while still scaling,
(29:50):
what are some lessons that you've learnedabout leading a team and staying
true to your visionduring especially high growth phases?
Or if your vision
like to the extent that making sure
your team is sharing your visionand growing with your vision.
When I started hiring my team,I was all of that perfection.
(30:13):
I make sure that the PR campaignshave the perfect
and that was something that actually heldmy company and the deliverables weren't
coming out right away as it supposed to,because perfection is not the answer.
It's performance.
So now it's about performance overperfection.
Let's get this out asquickly as possible because
(30:36):
we are not
living in perfection andI don't want you to be perfect as well.
Whoever I I'm working with my client,I want them to
get on that camera without thinking, Well,I'm not really camera ready.
I'm not perfect. Look.
So as long as your hair doesn't look likeyou just woke up and you have a little
and you look presentable and you haveyour message, just start speaking.
Because perfection is stagnationat its paralysis.
(30:58):
Right? It will paralyze you.
So I always teach my team in orderfor us to be successful.
There is no perfection in this company.
We have to have performanceover perfection.
I love that.I've never heard that phrase before.
Did you? Did you come up with that?
Yes, I did, because I supportedhas enjoyed my growth a lot
because we wanted to be perfect.We have to make sure this.
(31:21):
But it's all about especially New York,especially in America.
We have to go, go, go.
It's not about, oh, you know,
the journalists didn't get back to us
because we're still kind of tryingto make sure their stories are perfect.
Who has time to wait months and outlike two months pass and there's no
deliverables for them, A publicistor PR company, Can you imagine?
(31:43):
You're paying a retainer
and there's no deliverables for a monthbecause the story's not perfect.
We didn't really understand.
So we need to performance performanceright away, get it out.
It's just you need to chase the momentum.
You have to make surethe momentum is there.
And then consistency and then perfection.
I mean, one way or anotherit will be there,
but there's never a perfectionlike the word itself.
(32:05):
Like I hate the word perfection, right?
Because I think that in itself,like it really holds a lot of people back.
I'm not perfect right now.
I'm going to wait till tomorrow.
My messaging is not perfect.I'll wait till tomorrow.
I don't have the investments right now.
Like you need to just go with it.
Right? Keep the ball rolling.
Yeah, absolutely.
You know,because the word perfect or perfection is
(32:27):
just kind of like a unicorn, meaning it.
It describes something that doesn'tactually exist in reality,
but people use it as this metric
and excuse of why things aren't done,why things aren't sent out.
So I 100% agree with you.
Yeah. What do you think if
(32:49):
if somebody is looking to get startedtoday, you know,
of course they could reach out to you
and hire you
to talk to you about the various servicesyou could provide.
And I'd like you to maybe mention
and talk a little bitabout how they could do that.
And if you could maybe just touch on alsoif somebody is not quite ready
(33:11):
to reach out to you yet,what's something they can do right now?
What's something that they can do today?
Yeah, absolutely.
So I have my 21 daypersonal brand building challenge,
which is on November, right,which is 21 days.
You'll have me in your cornerand we'll work together.
That gives you a taste of whatPR does for you and it gives you a taste
(33:31):
of what personal branding can do for youwith honing in on your messaging.
So it's no commitment. 2500 right there.
I think it's a great way
just to understand the essenceand significance, what it can do for you.
And they can get in touch with me.
I mean, I have my social media handles,so if you can go on LinkedIn,
actually can book an appointmentthere too.
Gives you anywhere from 15 to 20 minutes.
(33:52):
We'll give you an online
audit of the strategy,what you can do to day to start working.
Because I think that any timeyou get on a call with me,
I want you to walk away with value.
So we'll walk.
You'll walk away with a lot of nuggets
of how to navigate your,you know, your compelling story,
what you should have,what you shouldn't have.
So we'll go through that.
And, you know,
I'll tell you then on a date,not everyone is qualified for PR, right?
(34:14):
Really, I'll be honest with you,
if you have a lot of losses pendingagainst you, that's crisis management.
So we need to do crisis firstand then get into PR.
So there's a lot there's a lot thatwe need to kind of see what's going on.
So I just had this case recently.
He's like, Listen,I really want you to do PR for me.
And then when I Googled his name,I'm like, You just came out of prison.
(34:36):
You were five years in prison,like, And again, I really, you know,
I need to change my image.
I am a CFO now.
I was in real estate.
I mean, it was
You see, I need to make sure that noteverybody can do PR right away.
We need to start with crisis management.Right.
And then kind of easing into PR so noteveryone is qualified right away for PR?
(34:58):
Yeah, absolutely.
You know, it like most thingsit's it's a gradual process.
There are multiple stepping stonesto making that progress
and there's a lot of various piecesthat go into it.
And I will say, look,I think a big part of this is
it is difficult to try to piece togetherand figure out on your own.
That's another thing is
pretty much everybody who's got a bigfollowing
(35:21):
has peoplewho help them with these aspects.
They have professionals who coach them,guide them, even though from the outside
looking in, there is an there'san aspect of it seeming
like it's effortlessand they just figured it out on their own.
I don't think that really any of themfigured out out on their own.
Do you agree with that?
(35:42):
Absolutely. It's timeless. It as essence.
But if you really take yourself seriously,you will delegate.
If you really take your businessseriously, delegate who has time for this.
You can I mean, don't get me wrong,you can go right now, today
and start pitching your storyto journalists.
Go on LinkedIn, find a journalist thatperhaps a New York Times find a journalist
(36:02):
who is in your post and say,Hey, can you get me a story on this?
Guess what's going to happen?
Crickets, Crickets? Crickets.
Do you know how much they get bombardedwith different pitches?
Now you have a publicist who has thisRolodex of foster relationships.
Who makes your life easier?
Who says, okay, well,your story is going to go right here?
Because I already know this journalist
(36:24):
and I'm sure I'm going to get it therein about three weeks.
You're going to get into that publication.
So that is a time that I'm saving for you.
If you're really seriousabout growing who you are
and making more money for yourself, Right.
It's all about ROI.
That's right.
Yeah, I agree with you.
And you know, it's interestingbecause we actually
look at things like thatinternally as well at my law firm.
(36:47):
So, you know, my background is in finance.
We always look for ways that we can createin our life for our clients,
which I think unfortunately is ais a very unique way of looking at things.
And I say unfortunately,because I think that more lawyers
should look at it that way.
You know, ultimatelyyou've got a client who's paying you
and whether it's hourly, monthly,whatever the arrangement is,
and they want to return, you know,and if they're spending more on attorney's
(37:10):
fees and they're getting back in resultsor in recovery,
then ultimately you're going to havean unsatisfied or dissatisfied client.
So, you know, at the end of the day,
our allies,the name of pretty much every game.
Absolutely.
And that's why
performance over perfection of that,you have to get the get this out.
And that's that'swhy I pride myself on this.
(37:31):
I know that I'm so good at what I do.
I love it.
I appreciate it.
And I appreciate you being on today
and sharing these golden,golden nuggets of wisdom.
I know I've learned a lot.
And yeah, and look to the listeners.
I hope you all learned a lot.
Liana charges a, you know, good moneyfor four for her time.
(37:55):
And I think that she's she'sgiven a lot of wisdom and knowledge and,
you know,
this is stuff that it takes yearsand years and many, many hours to learn.
So Liana, I very much appreciate, again,you being on
and sharing some of this wisdomwith with all of us and
to the listeners,if you found this helpful and useful,
feel free to reach out to Lianaif you want to work with her.
(38:17):
And if you like the podcast,make sure you like and subscribe
so you know when the next podcast isis airing.
Selena, thank you again for being on.
Thank you so much.
This was fun.
Hi, I'm Parag Amin.
Welcome to my podcast.
From Crisis to Justice.
As a lawyer and entrepreneur, I'mpassionate about helping small business
owners successfully navigate situationsthat can kill a business.
As a kid, I watched my dad's dreamsof being an entrepreneur were destroyed
by an unethical businessman, and I don'twant that to happen to you or your family.
(00:22):
That's why I started my law firm.
I want to protect and defend businessowners and their legacies from crisis.
Welcome to From Crisis to Justice.
Welcome back, everybody.
To the From Crisis to Justice podcast.
I'm your host, Parag Amin,and I'm joined today by a special guest.
(00:46):
Liana Tsavo.
Liana is the founder of her own PR company
and she is the CEO of TsavoMedia PR Group, a globally recognized
agency helping founders and organizationsbuild powerful, lasting personal brands.
She has over15 years of entrepreneurial experience
(01:07):
and a client networkspanning 12 countries.
She's become a trusted strategistin public relations and media authority.
Her epic method has helpedthousands of entrepreneurs
break through the noise,get featured and grow with purpose.
She's a passionate advocatefor women in business and a contributor
(01:28):
to Forbes and entrepreneur magazines,and her mission is clear
to help leaders turn their storyinto their greatest asset.
Rihanna,thank you so much for joining me today.
Thank you for having me, Parag.
I am so excited to get into the details.
Let's do it.
So so look, how did youhow did you end up in PR?
(01:49):
I had this grit.
I knew that I had to become a publicist,even though I am a college dropout.
But there are so many thingsthat were just pointing me
in the right directionthat I need to tell other people's stories
and uplift their personalitiesand inspire audiences.
It all started with my grandmother.
She was a journalist in Russia,a political journalist, and her telling
(02:10):
stories of how she navigated,you know, a lot of personalities.
I was just so amazed and inspired
that I wanted to I aspire to be like her.
So I knew that it's in my DNA.
But just a lot of things happenedin my life where I got married young.
I had my son at 19, so my son is incollege and it's just so much happened
(02:32):
and I had to find a way to get into PR,not the traditional route, even
though I did go and get my certificate,I hired a lot of mentors.
I think thatwhen you don't have the traditional route
and you don't have a degree,I think you need to double down
so much more because there'sso much more expected of you.
And so I'm still learning.
You're always a student of this craftthat the landscape is always evolving.
(02:56):
And so here I am doing what I love.
I love it.
That's great being passionate about you.
What you do is so critical,and I think it makes a world of difference
in terms of the resultsyou get in the way clients even feel
when they're working with you.
Absolutely. It's the energy, right?
It's what you you can be.
(03:18):
There's so many publicist pride.
I always say that
there's so many PR companies,but how you deliver the message
and how you make your clients feel,how I hold their hand
through the whole process.
That's what really sets me apartfrom my competitors.
Yeah, 100%.
So, you know, as a part of your work,I'm sure you've helped
entrepreneurs navigateboth personal and professional crises.
(03:41):
So when somebody's brand is under fire,
where do you advise
clients to begin to rebuild or reposition?
Because, you know, ultimately I think
your brandis is in a way an extension of yourself
and your business is in a wayan extension of yourself.
And when something you've builtand it's so close to you is under fire
(04:04):
or under attack,whether it's a negative review
online or somebody saying something
that is damaging to your reputation,it very much
feels like a personal attacks of somebodygoing through something like that.
What recommendations or advice
do you have for businessowners and entrepreneurs?
(04:24):
Absolutely.
And so being a crisis managerand I help navigate your story.
So, first of all, I got to tell you,the ten years of being in this business
and seeing firsthandthat every business will have crisis.
There's no way that you'renot going to face some sort of crisis.
So it can be from small to big,but it's all about how do you bounce back?
(04:45):
How do you bounce backfrom falling into this crisis?
Numberone thing I would highly recommend is to
just come up and be authentic, right?
Transparent with your audience.
This is what happenedand I would like to address it.
You want to hold controland be in control of your narrative.
Don't let someone else take take,take control of your narrative.
(05:06):
Right. This number one thing.
Take accountabilityfor what has gone wrong
and make sure that you speak about itfirsthand.
A lot of timesthat attorneys would say to their client
to not talk about it,can not talk about it in public right now.
Make sure you hold off.
That in itself will createmore of a crisis because it's time.
Time is of the essence.
(05:26):
When something happens,you have to address it right there
and then and make sure that you come offvery authentic and admit to your mistake.
Apologize. This is what happens.
And if you were to turn, what I do for
my clients is I say, okay, well,this is what happened to you.
How can we mitigate this and findanother approach to your personal brand
(05:49):
so that you can come out in the limelightand highlight and spotlight you?
Well, we have to find ways out.
Perhaps find a charity.
Let's give back.
You know,you need to find ways in order to come up
as a positive image in the public eye.
That's the whole purpose of PR as well.
When you are in a crisis, what can we do
to find ways to correctwhat has gone wrong?
(06:12):
So give you a small exampleof when a client is,
you know, sounding like someone else.
Their story doesn'tstay true to someone like themselves
and they kind ofcopying and copyrighting others
people's posts and they're soundinglike someone else in their industry.
And so that in itselfcreated a huge crisis.
And so you need to stop feeling like
(06:36):
you can be the faceand the voice of your brand.
You need to step up,be the voice, because you are different.
You might think your message resonateslike someone else is saying What?
They're saying the same thing, right?
Another attorney is saying the same thingas you are, for example.
But that shouldn't stop youfrom expressing yourself
and actually building your brand
because you have a different wayof delivering the message.
(07:00):
So always think abouthow do you deliver the message?
It's your tonality, it's your energy,it's your presence.
So stop sounding like everyone else.
Everyone else is taken. Be yourself.
Yeah, I love that.
And you know, it's interestingbecause I give very similar advice
to clientswhen they're going through litigation.
I think a lot of times, you know,there's a there's a feeling
(07:23):
or maybe a fear of
just being transparent about what'sgoing on and feeling vulnerable.
But, you know, at the end of the day,when it comes to litigating cases or maybe
even PR from from what I'm understanding,you say
it comes down to being authentic
because at the end of the day,when people try to hide the reality,
(07:44):
when people try to hide the truth,I think inevitably the truth comes out.
And then ultimately the person who triedto hide the truth looks way worse.
So it's much better to embrace,I think, the bad facts, at least
as it comes to litigation and disputes,rather than try to hide them.
And it sounds like.
Is that what you're saying about PRas well as learn how to embrace them?
(08:08):
Absolutely.
They learnhow to actually be ahead of the game.
So you know that you messed upand it has come, you know, already there.
So instead of having journalistsknocking on your doors
and saying, can you give us a statement,what went wrong?
Avoid that avoided at all.
Cause just come out and say what happenedso that you won't be pulled
(08:28):
in so many directions to give a statement.
Yeah, I agree with that.
And look, I mean, part ofthis is maybe, maybe ironically,
in the age of social media,I feel that people are shyer than ever
and a little bit more introvertedthan ever in the sense of
and even with the growth of social media,a lot of personal interaction
(08:50):
does have decreasedreal time in-person interactions.
And so I think people feel a little bitmore insecure than ever before as well.
So what advice do you have for businessowners who are maybe not as extroverted
or as confident as they'd like to be about
being on camera,being out there, giving statements?
(09:14):
You know,
that's the best part of my careerand what I do, my profession.
I think that me preparing youand helping you with your confidence
and unleash that story, it's likereally unveiling those those parts of you.
It's like taking an onion apart.
There's so many layers to you.
So the very first thing that I help withmy clients is the confidence.
It's 80% is mindset.
(09:35):
How you telling your storyreally stems from that.
And then I wrote a book about it.
It's the epic methodthat I teach my entrepreneurs,
my professionals I work with.
It's the 80% of beliefthat your story matters, that you're
actually going to make a differencewith your story and personal brand, right?
That's where it stems from.
If you don't have a personal brandand you feel that,
(09:57):
you know, I'll just kind of have mymy professional brand speak for itself
and my company speak for itself.
But right now, you know,social media is so personal.
We want to know who you areon a personal level.
So if you if you are strugglingto tell your story and a lot of attorneys
to have that problem,they're very risk adverse,
you know, for them to come onand actually get their story.
(10:19):
You know, it takes a lot of courage.
So what I do is, first of all,I have my challenge that I do with my
my attorneys.
What we do is we have this 21 daysof where I hone in on your messaging.
I make sure that you are actually speakingand conveying your message accordingly.
And we go through that.It's it's the whole process.
And the number one thing I would sayis, what are you trying to do?
(10:42):
What is the impactyou're trying to make? Right.
As a as a thought leader, everyone hasto be a thought leader in their industry.
People will come to youonly if they are seeking advice.
Right.
And they're seeking advicenot from influencers but thought leaders.
So are you a thought leader in a business?Yes, you are.
So then what are your insights?
How can people learn from you?
Are you a business thought leader?
(11:03):
So that is what I create.
I turn leaders into thought leadersand the number one thing I would say,
well, if I were to come to you,what insights will I learn from you?
What are the key takeawaysthat lead with that?
If you can start leading with your keytakeaways, your insights, how you can,
what you can teach the audience,what is the value you're bringing, right?
Because a personal brand standson three pillars.
(11:23):
It's the purpose,
the value proposition, What is the purposeyou're bringing right to your audience?
How consistent are you with that messageand how authentic are you?
So you have to leadwith authenticity, consistency
and then yourpurpose, which is your value.
Yeah.
And when it comes to consistencyand value.
Do you, do you recommend that
(11:44):
people have oneor maybe a few specific taglines
or positionsthey have that they continue to repeat?
Or is it really based more aroundlike fundamental type core values around
what that person specifically valuesand then speak from those?
Or is it something completely differentthat I haven't mentioned the meaning?
(12:05):
It's an either one of those. It'ssomething completely different.
Yeah, it's actually all of that,plus more.
So when you're speaking about
we don't want to hear just about youas a professional, it gets boring.
We want to know about your experiences,unique qualities,
what sets you apart, your personality.
That's what a personal brand is.
How are you as a team player?
(12:25):
What kind of collaborations are you?
You know, are you into?
So that showcases who you areon the inside perhaps, you know,
they spend with your kids,get a little bit more personal
you know key takeawaysfrom from being with your kids all day,
for example, or something that kind ofis like a conversation starter.
And also we can get to know you personallybecause remember, at the end of the day,
(12:49):
people want to connect with youon an emotional level, right?
People want to buy from other people,whether they're products or services,
when they're emotionallyconnected with you.
And how can people be emotionallyconnected with you?
Not on the surface level,but on the very authentic level, right?
You want to get them into your life,into your story.
I mean,
(13:10):
and then the question that comes up, well,how raw can you get with your audience?
How much do you let them into your life?
Well, you know, get as as raw as possible,I would say, and authentic as possible
so that you can they can feelthat they can be relevant to you.
Right. That there is a resonance there.
Are they finding relevance relevant?
So if they find relevance and resonance,I think that in itself,
(13:33):
he did a great job bringing the audienceto find out more about you.
So a personal brand, a professional brandstems on being personal,
which is your unique value propositionin your experience?
Is your personality.
What sets you apart?
Your personality essentiallyis what really makes you different
from another attorneyand litigation, correct?
So, you know, that in itselfwill definitely,
(13:55):
you know, help people helpyou stand out from a crowded marketplace.
Yeah.
And what would you sayto the people who think that they don't
have a great personalityor that it's not a personality
worth following? They don't.
I think everyone hasan amazing personality.
You just have to dig deeper, right?
And that's where I come in as a personalbranding expert and a public relations
(14:18):
specialist and a strategist, I make surethat we hone in on that messaging.
And then you're like,Oh, wow, that's the aha moment.
That's like the light bulb went off.
Oh, I didn't know.
I have to take this approachto hone in on my messaging.
And then we take your messagingand then we go a step further.
Let's now make sure that relatability,which is your personal brand,
where you're relatingto others on social media, Right.
(14:41):
And how you take presenting yourselfin front of the audience.
Now we taking a step furtherwhere I'm saying, okay, now it's time
to take you and get youan exclusive interview.
Let's get you an exclusive interviewand talk to your publication.
Now, that's the credibility.
Let's get you recognizedbecause you're credible.
Now, relatability on social mediais one thing.
You're relatable.
(15:01):
It's great when crisis happens,especially,
you want to go into press right away.
We have to take you into pressbecause that in itself is third party
that actually validates your story.
So who's validating your story?
Who's actually speaking about youbeing highlighted and spotlighted?
So that's a misconception.
Oh, I'm on social media. I post.
That's good enough.
(15:22):
That's not at all, actually, becausethat's just that's the surface level.
Like who else is speaking about you?
So that's another part of finding waysto mitigate your crisis as well.
And not even crises just
to build your strong online reputationand just statistically proven,
82% of people will Googleyou before stepping
foot in your location, signing a contractor even getting on a call with you.
(15:45):
So that's a big percentage.
So if you don't have anything
that's credible on your social meet,I mean, in your online presence,
which is your online reputation,they're going on to the next one, right?
So you need to make surethat not only all your communication,
your social media is being cohesive,Right.
It's following, but also you taking thatand then having PR done for you
(16:05):
and then perhapsmarketing later on. Advertising.
But the two most importantthings is personal branding and PR,
right? Yes.
And, you know, Ithink a big part of this is with a lot of
maybe smaller businesses don't realizeand something that I learned
as I started taking on biggerand more and more
(16:26):
either important or more valuable cases,
especially with celebrity clientsand that kind of thing,
I think a lot of people don't realizehow many people are behind the scenes.
It's not just one lawyer, it'snot only multiple lawyers.
Usually it's a teamas well as other people on the team,
which which typically includes a publicistor PR person.
(16:47):
And many timesit's a combination of people
who are helping craft the messaging,helping
ensure it gets out to the right audience,to the right publications
that the right interviewsare strategically done and placed,
and a lot of mediapreparation that goes into it. So
let me ask you this.
I think it's made sense, at least
(17:09):
when I've seen it,when when we've got clients
who are celebrities,who are in the public spotlight
and a news story breaks and it gets intotwo major publications, But
I don't know exactly when it makes sense.
If it's let's say it's
a smaller business or a smaller companyor somebody doesn't have
the same type of following or the mediaisn't naturally kind of reporting on it
(17:34):
because it doesn't naturally come upis almost like gossip about a celebrity.
So what are your thoughts, Ileana, on
how big should a company bewhen they really kind
of consider hiring a publicistor someone like yourself
relating to whether it's a lawsuitor some kind of crisis?
So, yeah, this is a twofold question.
(17:55):
So first of all,I one thing that I've been working
with over and overis that it's not just No.
One to dispelthis myth. It's not for big companies.
This PR I even work with SolopreneurPR is also
and I don't workwith when you said the story breaks and
I don't work with entertainment,I only do corporate PR.
(18:17):
So if you tell mehow can I get this, the story itself
right in PR will get as much buzzas possible on a corporate level.
Right.
So I'm going to get you into Bloomberg,for example.
Forbeson Forbes Entrepreneur Magazine, Inc.
And as small as like one personwanting the company
to a Fortune 500, that'sI can't tell you, Parag,
(18:39):
that it's only meantfor X amount of employees working for you.
It really depends how much you wantto invest in your business.
How do you want to be you know, howdo you want to be different from others?
Are you setting yourself apart?
So when it comes to entertainmentPR, it's totally different.
I know you work with a lot of celebrities,like you said,
(18:59):
but I don't work with celebrities.
I work solely like yourself, attorneyswho want to get thought leadership,
thought, leadership is totally differentthan, you
know, creating a whole like media buzz.
We are getting you outthere as a thought leader
because we want you to stand outfrom other thought leaders.
So that's that's a difference.
And when it comes to thought, leadership
(19:20):
even solopreneur uswho are just starting their firm.
And it's very rare to see that.
But I work with one person before,but mostly, you know,
there's athere's a team, a little team behind them.
A press
release is great to start with, you know,but I like to work on a yearly basis.
So that just to go back to your question,I think it's important to understand that
how much of an investment andwhat is the best promotional tool for you?
(19:43):
There's marketing does advertise saying,but what is more credible
and gives you the most,which is going to be the ROI,
which is the most costeffective promotional tool is PR
because PR is it createstrust with the audience, right?
We are creating trust that you are the goto industry expert for them to work with.
(20:05):
Marketing doesn't do thatand advertising will never do that.
So when a third party validates you,such as a Forbes magazine, for example,
your story, that's PRSo you know what I can say.
It's all about how much you want to investand and PR is not even that expensive,
to be honest with you. It'svery affordable.
Yeah. So. So what does that mean?What does that mean?
(20:25):
Dollars incentivize realistically,what what can someone spend
and what kind of numbersprobably make sense for
for various kinds of sized businessesor maybe based on the type of reach
and audience and appearancesthey want to get?
You know, it's tailored to each one,like you just said, what you want.
(20:49):
What are you looking toget on podcast, for example?
Because I also have a network network.
Are you looking to you know,we also help with like LinkedIn as well.
Like if you want to just startwith your personal brand
and get your thought leadership onLinkedIn and then move into publications.
We do that as well.
So a pricewise, I started with a retainer,a $5,000 per month,
and I curate that dependingon what we're getting you.
(21:11):
And it goes all the way up to 2015to $20000 a month,
really, depending on what I'm getting foryou almost in 12 countries.
Do you want to go global?
Do you want global recognition?
So we get you in a different partnershipstrategically into this.
Not only that, I'm
getting into publications,I get you on to the TED talk, for example.
We help you with that,getting you on stages,
executive positioningus, speaking opportunities.
(21:34):
At the end of the day, as a thoughtleader, you also speaker, right?
You want to speak in differenton different conferences.
So how are you being positionedto all of that?
I would take into consideration,yeah, absolutely.
And you know,what's interesting as well is
I think a lot of people don't realize that
many times there's
invitations that thatthat get provided to speakers.
(21:55):
But then there's very much and I, I wouldguess just based on what I've seen,
that it might even be the majorityof these conferences, that it is very much
a pay to play, meaning
like you have to pay generallyto to be able to speak or present.
Can you talk at all about that in terms ofis that accurate, Is that not accurate?
And and when should somebodyreally be thinking about, hey, look, I
(22:19):
this makes sense as an investmentfor me to pay
to speak at a conference versusnow it doesn't make sense to do this.
Well I'll be honest with youI have conferences I do summits
every four months myself from my audience,from my clients, and everyone that
speaks of anywhere from 8 to 10 panelistsevery time I have a summit.
And that's about three times a year.
(22:39):
So all my panelists,they are sponsors as well.
So what does that mean?
They will be featuredto have credibility aspect of that.
They'll be featured on like a stepand repeat.
They'll be in the press, in the media,
because the whole point of the summit ishow do you position yourself right?
And so if you are investing in yourself,
so then that is a way for youto step into the limelight, right?
(23:01):
For me to give you that ability to speakat my summit, you need to also invest
into your personal brandand into your online reputation.
If I see you don'thave an online reputation and you
you really have never position yourself,then yes,
you will have to invest in orderfor you to speak on my panel.
But then again,if you have done immense work
and you are incredible,you still need something.
(23:24):
I think there's always a press release.
There's always somethingthat you can kind of work on, but
there's always so many other a speakingopportunities you don't need to pay for.
Maybe there's smaller.
Also, if you have a big following,a huge following
and you have a lot of impact,you're making a big impact.
I think that in itself
speaks volumes and youperhaps don't even need to pay for it.
(23:45):
Right?
But if I'm talking about like panelist
who have no online reputation,then they need to invest in themselves.
Right? So it really dependswhere you're speaking.
And also depends because LinkedIn rightnow, as you know, it's huge, right?
It's bigger than Instagram,Facebook, LinkedIn,
because now they incorporatedvideos and video and it's all right.
(24:08):
89% of founders are alignedwith video content
when it comes to aligning themselveswith brand values.
Right?
So if I don't seeany videos on your LinkedIn, I don this.
I don't understand your messaging becauseas I mentioned, 89% is a big number.
It's a huge statistic.
So you have to startgetting videos out there.
(24:28):
And once you start doing that,you're already creating
a very compelling narrativeand that in itself will help you attract
different opportunities, right?
You'll have people knocking on your socialmedia door like, can you speak here?
Can you get on my TV show?
But up until that time,I think you should definitely find a team
that can help you do that.
Yeah, absolutely.
(24:48):
And part of this is what's goodwhen it comes to branding
because you've helped so many peopleand companies brand
What's what's a branding mistakethat you've seen throughout?
Like eventhe best founders have made this.
And if people could just get this thing
right, this one thing, if you had to pickone thing, it would help.
(25:08):
Then tremendous early,
like just just build their brand better
consistency.
I've seen that they would do one videothey will slack
Oh, I'll get to it tomorrow or even like
answer these questions.
Can you just answer these questions?We need to get you into a publication.
We need this rightright away For the look.
(25:30):
When you signing up to do PR, you have tounderstand that it is going fast.
We are having deliverablesafter deliverables and so
if you're not answering those questions,if you're don't have time for us, don't
even think about PRbecause PR is an investment in yourself.
Right?
And so we're honingin, we're polishing off your messaging,
making sure that you're positionedas the authority in your industry.
(25:51):
So the number one thing I thinkwhat I've seen is that I don't have time
right now.
This is too much for menot being consistent.
And then once you're not consistent,then it's taking a toll on us.
And, you know, I can have that, you know,then all the agreements
that I've done with the journalists, like,can you get this one here?
Can you feature this?
Or a client right. With their messaging?
(26:12):
It's just going to fall behind
because you're just not doingyour work as well, right?
LeonaAbsolutely, Because, you know, I think
I think pretty much everything requireseither
a commitment of time, of money or both.
So when it comes to PR or,
(26:33):
you know, we talked a little bit about
the financial investmentcomponent of things, but
can you touch a little bit on time?
Like realistically, how much time shouldsomebody who's thinking about investing in
this really put asideper week or per month
to to do it right?
Yeah.
So starting off, I would say anywhere from
(26:54):
like 3 to 5 hours a week,
that means I would getting on a strategycall every week,
sometimes twice a week to make surethat strategy has to be there.
Right. The foundation has to be laid out.
So 45 minutes to an hour right there.
And then you have another hour to answer,maybe questions, kind of.
So maybe 3 hours to begin with.
(27:17):
And then it kind of stacks on that
gets more and more, dependingif you want to get featured on TV,
if I'm getting you interviewedon major national TV stations.
So it really depends.
So I need to get to media training.
You know, all of that takes a lot of time.
So but, you know, that in itselfis such a reward because there's
nothing like PR and a lot of peopledon't understand the essence of PR.
(27:40):
It's always like, oh, is this marketingnow two different animals, right?
Marketing goeshand in hand with PR, right?
Once we get you featured on TV,then we marketing to kind of distributed
get the buzz going.
But the essence right,the credibility source is PR.
You can't do marketingwithout that credibility. Source.
What is that?
(28:00):
How am I positioning you?
And when it comes to the wordPR or public relations,
I think there's there's different conceptsof how people think of it.
So, you know, what what do you thinkis the right way to think about PR?
What is PR?
PR Is your public image.
(28:22):
How are you being perceived?
A positive public image, Right?
And so it can be PR is in person,PR is online
way before you know,it was all about in person.
Correct.
Before any of these publicationscame out online, it was all about
how are you navigating your story?
How are you speaking to the audience,making sure that it resonates,
(28:45):
your message resonates.
So writing your speeches,all of that is PR, right?
It just depends how we are looking at it.
And so I think that PR is all abouthow are you coming?
How is your persona in the limelight?
Is it positive public image
and how are you being sound nowespecially you need to be sound.
(29:08):
It's it's about recognition.
How are you being trusted?
You're being trusted based on one thing,your credibility and your recognition.
Right? And so that is your positive image.
So if you tell me, well, I amI have a million likes on LinkedIn
or Instagram, that is not yourthat's not the official public image.
(29:30):
The public image is when I Google you,which is the digital real state.
What shows up in your digital real estate?
That is your PR?
Mm Yeah, that's, that's,that's a great way to think about it.
So you know in terms of
your PR
while still scaling,
(29:50):
what are some lessons that you've learnedabout leading a team and staying
true to your visionduring especially high growth phases?
Or if your vision
like to the extent that making sure
your team is sharing your visionand growing with your vision.
When I started hiring my team,I was all of that perfection.
(30:13):
I make sure that the PR campaignshave the perfect
and that was something that actually heldmy company and the deliverables weren't
coming out right away as it supposed to,because perfection is not the answer.
It's performance.
So now it's about performance overperfection.
Let's get this out asquickly as possible because
(30:36):
we are not
living in perfection andI don't want you to be perfect as well.
Whoever I I'm working with my client,I want them to
get on that camera without thinking, Well,I'm not really camera ready.
I'm not perfect. Look.
So as long as your hair doesn't look likeyou just woke up and you have a little
and you look presentable and you haveyour message, just start speaking.
Because perfection is stagnationat its paralysis.
(30:58):
Right? It will paralyze you.
So I always teach my team in orderfor us to be successful.
There is no perfection in this company.
We have to have performanceover perfection.
I love that.I've never heard that phrase before.
Did you? Did you come up with that?
Yes, I did, because I supportedhas enjoyed my growth a lot
because we wanted to be perfect.We have to make sure this.
(31:21):
But it's all about especially New York,especially in America.
We have to go, go, go.
It's not about, oh, you know,
the journalists didn't get back to us
because we're still kind of tryingto make sure their stories are perfect.
Who has time to wait months and outlike two months pass and there's no
deliverables for them, A publicistor PR company, Can you imagine?
(31:43):
You're paying a retainer
and there's no deliverables for a monthbecause the story's not perfect.
We didn't really understand.
So we need to performance performanceright away, get it out.
It's just you need to chase the momentum.
You have to make surethe momentum is there.
And then consistency and then perfection.
I mean, one way or anotherit will be there,
but there's never a perfectionlike the word itself.
(32:05):
Like I hate the word perfection, right?
Because I think that in itself,like it really holds a lot of people back.
I'm not perfect right now.
I'm going to wait till tomorrow.
My messaging is not perfect.I'll wait till tomorrow.
I don't have the investments right now.
Like you need to just go with it.
Right? Keep the ball rolling.
Yeah, absolutely.
You know,because the word perfect or perfection is
(32:27):
just kind of like a unicorn, meaning it.
It describes something that doesn'tactually exist in reality,
but people use it as this metric
and excuse of why things aren't done,why things aren't sent out.
So I 100% agree with you.
Yeah. What do you think if
(32:49):
if somebody is looking to get startedtoday, you know,
of course they could reach out to you
and hire you
to talk to you about the various servicesyou could provide.
And I'd like you to maybe mention
and talk a little bitabout how they could do that.
And if you could maybe just touch on alsoif somebody is not quite ready
(33:11):
to reach out to you yet,what's something they can do right now?
What's something that they can do today?
Yeah, absolutely.
So I have my 21 daypersonal brand building challenge,
which is on November, right,which is 21 days.
You'll have me in your cornerand we'll work together.
That gives you a taste of whatPR does for you and it gives you a taste
(33:31):
of what personal branding can do for youwith honing in on your messaging.
So it's no commitment. 2500 right there.
I think it's a great way
just to understand the essenceand significance, what it can do for you.
And they can get in touch with me.
I mean, I have my social media handles,so if you can go on LinkedIn,
actually can book an appointmentthere too.
Gives you anywhere from 15 to 20 minutes.
(33:52):
We'll give you an online
audit of the strategy,what you can do to day to start working.
Because I think that any timeyou get on a call with me,
I want you to walk away with value.
So we'll walk.
You'll walk away with a lot of nuggets
of how to navigate your,you know, your compelling story,
what you should have,what you shouldn't have.
So we'll go through that.
And, you know,
I'll tell you then on a date,not everyone is qualified for PR, right?
(34:14):
Really, I'll be honest with you,
if you have a lot of losses pendingagainst you, that's crisis management.
So we need to do crisis firstand then get into PR.
So there's a lot there's a lot thatwe need to kind of see what's going on.
So I just had this case recently.
He's like, Listen,I really want you to do PR for me.
And then when I Googled his name,I'm like, You just came out of prison.
(34:36):
You were five years in prison,like, And again, I really, you know,
I need to change my image.
I am a CFO now.
I was in real estate.
I mean, it was
You see, I need to make sure that noteverybody can do PR right away.
We need to start with crisis management.Right.
And then kind of easing into PR so noteveryone is qualified right away for PR?
(34:58):
Yeah, absolutely.
You know, it like most thingsit's it's a gradual process.
There are multiple stepping stonesto making that progress
and there's a lot of various piecesthat go into it.
And I will say, look,I think a big part of this is
it is difficult to try to piece togetherand figure out on your own.
That's another thing is
pretty much everybody who's got a bigfollowing
(35:21):
has peoplewho help them with these aspects.
They have professionals who coach them,guide them, even though from the outside
looking in, there is an there'san aspect of it seeming
like it's effortlessand they just figured it out on their own.
I don't think that really any of themfigured out out on their own.
Do you agree with that?
(35:42):
Absolutely. It's timeless. It as essence.
But if you really take yourself seriously,you will delegate.
If you really take your businessseriously, delegate who has time for this.
You can I mean, don't get me wrong,you can go right now, today
and start pitching your storyto journalists.
Go on LinkedIn, find a journalist thatperhaps a New York Times find a journalist
(36:02):
who is in your post and say,Hey, can you get me a story on this?
Guess what's going to happen?
Crickets, Crickets? Crickets.
Do you know how much they get bombardedwith different pitches?
Now you have a publicist who has thisRolodex of foster relationships.
Who makes your life easier?
Who says, okay, well,your story is going to go right here?
Because I already know this journalist
(36:24):
and I'm sure I'm going to get it therein about three weeks.
You're going to get into that publication.
So that is a time that I'm saving for you.
If you're really seriousabout growing who you are
and making more money for yourself, Right.
It's all about ROI.
That's right.
Yeah, I agree with you.
And you know, it's interestingbecause we actually
look at things like thatinternally as well at my law firm.
(36:47):
So, you know, my background is in finance.
We always look for ways that we can createin our life for our clients,
which I think unfortunately is ais a very unique way of looking at things.
And I say unfortunately,because I think that more lawyers
should look at it that way.
You know, ultimatelyyou've got a client who's paying you
and whether it's hourly, monthly,whatever the arrangement is,
and they want to return, you know,and if they're spending more on attorney's
(37:10):
fees and they're getting back in resultsor in recovery,
then ultimately you're going to havean unsatisfied or dissatisfied client.
So, you know, at the end of the day,
our allies,the name of pretty much every game.
Absolutely.
And that's why
performance over perfection of that,you have to get the get this out.
And that's that'swhy I pride myself on this.
(37:31):
I know that I'm so good at what I do.
I love it.
I appreciate it.
And I appreciate you being on today
and sharing these golden,golden nuggets of wisdom.
I know I've learned a lot.
And yeah, and look to the listeners.
I hope you all learned a lot.
Liana charges a, you know, good moneyfor four for her time.
(37:55):
And I think that she's she'sgiven a lot of wisdom and knowledge and,
you know,
this is stuff that it takes yearsand years and many, many hours to learn.
So Liana, I very much appreciate, again,you being on
and sharing some of this wisdomwith with all of us and
to the listeners,if you found this helpful and useful,
feel free to reach out to Lianaif you want to work with her.
(38:17):
And if you like the podcast,make sure you like and subscribe
so you know when the next podcast isis airing.
Selena, thank you again for being on.
Thank you so much.
This was fun.
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